Small Town Murder - #316 - Writing A Murder Journal - Cochranton, Pennsylvania

Episode Date: September 15, 2022

This week, in Cochranton, Pennsylvania, three young women navigate through relationships, with some lingering feelings, and resentments between two the women, who used to be in a relationship. Plans are made for everyone to get together, to move on, and be friends, but it all falls apart, when one of them gets reported as a missing person. No one claims to know anything, until a shallow grave is found, and the unbelievably terrible murder is uncovered. The killers end up being proud of the murder, and writing about their desire to commit more!!Along the way, we find out that county fairs are always weird, that no matter the genders involved, jealously can always be an issue, and that being buried once, is enough for one person!!Hosted by James Pietragallo and Jimmie WhismanNew episodes every Thursday!Donate at: patreon.com/crimeinsports or go to paypal.com and use our email: [e-mail] to shutupandgivememurder.com for all things Small Town Murder & Crime In Sports!Follow us on...twitter.com/@murdersmallfacebook.com/smalltownpodinstagram.com/smalltownmurderAlso, check out James & Jimmie's other show, Crime In Sports! On Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, Wondery, Wondery+, Stitcher, or wherever you listen to podcasts!See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Small Town Murder early and ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. What if you married the love of your life and then stood by them as they developed 21 new identities? What would you do? This Is Actually Happening is a weekly podcast that features extraordinary true stories of life-changing events told by the people who lived them. Listen to the newest season of This Is Actually Happening on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. This week in Cochranton, Pennsylvania, a seeming love triangle takes a very wrong turn and the results are an unthinkably brutal murder and one of the most heartless explanations

ever. Welcome to Small Town Murder. Hello, everybody, and welcome back to Small Town Murder. Yay! Oh, yay indeed, Jimmy. Yay indeed. My name is James Petrigallo. I'm here with my co-host. I'm Jimmy Wissman. Thank you folks so much for joining us today on another wild, crazy edition of Small Town Murder.

And wow, do we have just an insane episode. And they've been crazy lately. We've had twins popping up out of nowhere. We've had cookies involved in murder. It's too much. It's just a lot. And today, even more, quickly quickly before we start thank you for everything you do for us head oh yeah head over to shut up and give me murder.com what's there right now get all your first of all your merchandise there but especially get your tickets to live shows and the virtual live show. Absolutely. October the 27th. Halloween, baby. Halloween week.

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wherever you are in the world we're going to come right to your living room it's just like a regular live show it's the same as going to a live show except only so much easier being in a theater you're going to be in your living room and you can you know get drunk and not have to worry about how you're getting home so there you go do that and also come to regular live shows as well we cannot wait we're in tampa at the tampa improv september 23rd for two shows. Those are two different shows. Come to both if you want. And then Orlando the very next night

September 24th. Orlando Improv two shows that night as well. Get your tickets immediately for those. We're excited to see everybody there. Shut up and give me murder.com Patreon.com is something else you need to be aware of here. Patreon.com slash crime and sports is

where you get all the bonus material here yeah everything for five dollars or above whatever you want to do here you get access to everything we do bonus wise crime and sports bonus small town murder bonus you're going to get over a hundred episodes in the back catalog and two new episodes every other week this week is no different. You are going to get, first of all, for crime and sports, we're going to continue with sex scandals part three. I'm going to finish up the Duke list, and we're going to head into a couple other weird ones.

We're going to finish? Some guys poetry and other guys it's insane. Imagine you have an embarrassing affair, and then not only is it in court because there's something out of it comes out of it that's legal matter. But then all of your bad poetry is read aloud in court. We'll talk about documented. Oh, boy. And then for small town murder, we're going to do something very cool.

We're going to talk about the crossover between the mafia and serial killers. How many through history of these mafia killer guys that we've discussed before. Killer guys. Killer guys. Mob guys are actually just serial killers that happen to be in the Mafia, which is a convenient ploy when it can be business, too. So we're going to talk about that. There's a bunch of guys that did some really gross stuff here. do so we're going to talk about that there's a bunch of guys that did some really gross stuff here that is patreon.com slash crime and sports and you'll of course you'll get a shout out at

the end of the show where we will thank you so much for all that you do for us the disclaimer quickly it's a comedy show everybody we're comedians murders are terrible and these are going to happen and they're going to be awful and they seem to get worse all the time so we're going to keep talking about it but what we don't do we go out of our way to try never to do is we don't make fun of the victims or the victims families yeah why is that because we're assholes uh-huh but but we're not scumbags that's how that works so yeah that sounds good to you then we're gonna have a crazy time if you think that true crime and comedy should never ever ever mix and mix, maybe we're not for you. I don't know. Give it a shot, but no bitching later either way. There it is.

That said, I think it's time to sit back. Everybody clear the lungs wherever you are in your home. Hopefully not too public of a place. And shout, shut up and give me murder. Let's do this, Jimmy. Let's take a ride. Let's go on a trip, shall we? Let's do this, Jimmy. Let's take a ride. Let's go on a trip, shall we? Let's do that.

All right. Coming from our main episode. By the way, if you're not, listen to Small Town Murder Express on Fridays as well. Should definitely do that. We like to say it's like 10 pounds of dynamite in a three-pound bag. That's what we like to say. Holy shit. We don't say it often or we'd have a doubt pound bag that's what we like to say holy shit we don't say it often or we'd have it down better but do you really like it it's insane yeah you got to check

that out so just a shorter story but just as nuts this week we were in north carolina for our main episode last week this week we're going to pennsylvania baby okay on up to pa here uh northwestern pennsylvania cochranton PA is where we're going to. Cochranton. It's about an hour and 20 minutes outside of Pittsburgh. Our last few Pennsylvania ones have been in the express we did in Ambridge. That's over by Philly. That's in the middle by Harrisburg, actually, in central Pennsylvania.

This one is over in the Pittsburgh area. About an hour and 20 minutes to Pittsburgh, about six hours to Philly all the way across the state. Entirely different world. Yeah. Much closer to Cleveland. You're much more Cleveland than Philly in this area. Cause it's like an hour that direction.

And then in about an hour, 15 minutes to Daughtry township, which was the one we did episode two 53 outside of Pittsburgh. I'm going to give you an idea. Yeah. It's been a minute. Yeah, it's been a minute. But we did an express there as well. It was nuts, the bridge one. That was crazy.

This is in Crawford County, area code 814. And this place, very quickly with the history here, because there's a couple of interesting things here. It was made originally, this borough was made up of original land grants of john adams the president yeah and uh thomas cochran who that's who they named the village after rather than the guy who became president um just a guy just this dude it was surveyed by cochran's son joseph who was the first school teacher here in the 1850s. And the 1870s is when it really swelled to about 800 people, this town, really. It started popping.

They got a local newspaper. It started going. They had an agricultural fair. They put a water system in, a natural gas system, replaced the wood sidewalks with concrete and brick. Shit, yeah. Yeah, they put it all together here. And now close by there's a town called Meadville. sidewalks with concrete and brick shit yeah yeah they put it all together here um and now

close by there's a town called meadville and uh we'll kind of talk about that because it all kind of ties together these little towns that are close together you know if you you live here you work there it's that sort of thing they start in meadville they had the talon company which makes zippers oh so you can make zip there's a zipper factory yeah it was there yeah that sounds that was their most crucial industry in this entire area was zipper making yeah levi's came out with 501 button flies and they're like fuck no no they're putting out can that happen yeah anti-button fly propaganda it was mad crazy today that's not there anymore obviously it went ended up going bankrupt there it was bought by textron industries in 1968 and

then eventually they'll move to taiwan the whole thing went bankrupt and uh yeah that's how that worked uh meadville though uh they started tool and dye shop started coming here and it became tool city they called it which really yeah either city full of jerk offs or they make tools there that's it it's something a discount tool shop it really does tool city frame yeah five dollars or less all tools wrenches that snap when you try to twist something. Your sander stops. Where'd you get that, a tool city? It was a tool city? Jesus Christ.

Just garbage. So this started, I guess, in 1886. A blacksmith from the area here began hand-forging tools and selling them from town to town out of the back of a wagon. And that eventually became Champion Bolt and Clipper Company. And then after that, in 1904, they changed. Well, 1904, it was a different company, and now it's Channel Lock. That's who that was. Yeah, it was one guy.

It used to be Champion. Yeah, it used to be that. That's how that works there. The guy started in the back of a wagon that became Channel Lock. In 1886, yeah. Wow. That's pretty fucking crazy, man. So, yeah, it was the Champion de Arment tool company there, and then it later on became Channel Lock.

I guess Sharon— There's a tool that is even like somebody's, hand me the Channel Locks. The Channel Locks, yeah. They're not Channel Locks. They're not, you know— It's the Q-tip of the tool, yeah. There it is. Yeah, the Kleenex of tools. It's a fucking pyre, and we're calling it a channel.

Absolutely. I know that for a fact. Sharon Stone is from Meadville, apparently. No kidding. Yeah, so there you go. Reviews here. Everybody loved you. Yeah, there you go.

Reviews here of this town. We're going to talk. We'll do a couple from here, a couple from Cochranton, and then Meadville, too. Five stars. This is for Cochranton. this is a lovely rural farming community the people are very pleasant and helpful it's a wonderful place to live sure it's it's this is rural by the way we're talking yeah cochranton and outside of there it's it's the woods essentially it's just the woods grass rolls out there grass rolls and woods That's all you're seeing.

Three stars. Cochranton is a small, average town in Pennsylvania. The majority of the population is made up of elderly people. That sounds fun. Although the town is nice, I would like to see more things get updated, renovated. Well, they're happy with it because it's the same shit they've had forever. That's all they remember, and they love it. Leave it alone.

They're thrilled with it. Many buildings and lots are overgrown and old. Well, so are the people, so that's going to happen. Relax. Calm down. Here's a couple from Meadville. Three stars. I've lived in this little town all my life,

and as the years go on, I can honestly say that I'm disgusted by the young adults that are around here. Disgusted by the young adults that are around here. Disgusted by the young adults. I see very few people with very little respect for anything around them. Well, that means that most of the people have a lot of respect. You just double-negative'd yourself, ma'am. Also, give them some time.

They'll grow up and become like you. Kids are shitheads. Again, relax. Old people are grumpy. Kids are shitheads. Again, relax. Old people are grumpy. Kids are shitheads. And in between, we figure it out. That's life. I don't know what to tell you.

It makes me ashamed to say I'm from here. My God. Disgusted. Ashamed. I wish there were better things to do. The activities to do around here are old and tiring. Well, that seems to be a theme. The community needs something new.

The roads to drive on suck, but are in the process, a very slow process, of being fixed. I can honestly say that I'm glad that I'm going to have a chance to see a new place

and have new opportunities. Apparently they're moving, so they're going to leave behind a bad review. Two stars. This is fucking hilarious. Very strange vibe. Unlike any I've ever lived.

A Portland wannabe hipster, old money, nouveau rich, tired old hippies, ultra redneck, angry, uneducated, impatient, coarse, intolerant, and many times impolite simply because they can be cross. Wow. That's a lot. That's exhausting. That's a lot of adjectives, man. Yeah, that's every cliche of every group so all the all the asshole this is asshole town i guess yeah they just they've all been shipped to this one town the one guy in town no one likes they all brought him here

hippies and hipsters no shit lots of poverty and a feeling of decline permeates the air despite lukewarm attempts to counter its post-industrial heritage and a real freak show can be had for the price of a downtown stroll my god i'm actually rooting for this town that's now i am jesus this is crazy i'm mad at these people to include plenty of tweakers other other openly drug addled and extremely unhealthful appearing folks. Very reckless drivers speeding like mad and danger pedestrians and tailgate unlike any place I have experienced for the size of the town. Live near the pet food plant and rejoice in my dog and rejoice in my dog just barfed up his lunch aroma. Smells like dog puke.

Corruption apathy old boys network one bright star in this dark and dreary place is allegheny college but since it basically owns the town it's great greatly impacts task tax costs for real estate soon uh soon to be seen in the rear view jesus christ these are well-written uh yeah they're educated people that are mad. That's someone who went to the college and fucking hates it. Everybody's got big words, and they describe things very, very well. Here's one star. This can't be good. Drugs everywhere.

Not much to do without having money to entertain a family. Wages do not work for the cost of living in Meadville area without living in a dump. That's honest. Schools pick up some of those drugs, dog. Yeah, I mean, there's apparently a lot of drugs to sell to people. Schools are completely terrible with drugs and bullying, and they make a six year old and older walk to school who live under two miles from the school, which have to drive by. You have to pass by dive bars full of drunks early in the morning. Don't bother trying to move to this hole in the ground unless you make great money.

Okay. 1,063 people here. So small town. Almost 55% female. Now, the median age is right at average. So there's a lot of kids and a lot of older people. But most of the people are children and 35 to 44 year olds. So I don't know what that review was all about.

60, almost 61 percent are married. So it's way higher than the average here. Race in this town, 94.7 percent white here. Very white. 0.5 percent black, 1 percent Asian, 2.3% Hispanic. It's rural western Pennsylvania. That's what it is. Religion here, 44% religious, so a little under the average.

And the most of anybody here is obviously going to be Catholic because Catholics are, as we know, the Baptists of the North. There we go. 0.0% Jewish, though. That's not happening here. Yeah. In this county, it's very rural. It's just out there. And in this county, in Crawford County, last election, 30.7% voted Democratic, 67.8% Republican, 1.5% Independent.

The unemployment rate's a little higher than average in in this area here as a matter of fact and the median household income though is right about normal it's about 53 000 a year which is right around the average here so cost of living is a little below average really yeah if 100 is regular here it's 77 so what very% off. Housing of 42. Son of a bitch. That's great. Median home cost $122,400. Oh, and it's ready for a real estate boom.

Well, you know what, Jimmy? If you're ready to start that boom and be at the front of the line, we have for you the Cochranton, Pennsylvania Real Estate Report. Your average two-bedroom rental here goes for about $754, so cheap. That's a little over half the national average. Now, I found a two-bedroom, one-bath here, 1,068 square foot, little ranch-style house. It doesn't have much. It's a starter house.

You buy this, you start out, and you save up for something bigger. Yeah, if you have another kid, it's going to get cramped if you have more than one. $114,500, though, for a livable house that you could start out in. That's very good. Then here we go, this one, six bath 3544 square foot built in 1806 holy shit it's cool it's like an old like a big white kind of farmhouse looking torian style yeah farmhouse kind of deal okay it's very cool no pillars and columns it's got the two but not those round ones it's got the square pillars like it's a farm that's actually holding up the roof it's not for it's not decoration these are doing work yeah you you need definitely to put a

little bit of work into this thing too it's got to be updated it's it's just old there's some old it's not it hasn't been renovated it's a little over an acre $279,000 for that though yeah exactly $6,400 and $35,000 that's incredible that's what I mean unless it's falling it's like the money pit and the stairs are about to fall down on Tom Hanks as he hangs off the second floor

I think it's fine we have weak trees here's a three bedroom three bath second floor. I think it's fine. Seems like a deal. We have weak trees. Here's a three-bedroom, three-bath. There's no square footage, but it looks like a decent-sized house, probably 3,000 square feet. 36 acres it's on, though. Holy shit. And it's a lot of rolling hills there.

It's got the Pittsburgh toilet in the basement. What is that? People have just an open toilet in western Pennsylvania in their basement. What? Just an open toilet, sometimes a shower, too. What? That open toilet is for when the guys would come home filthy from the coal mines or from the steel mill or wherever they were filthy from. They could take a shit down there and take a shower without having to get the whole fucking house filthy basically they take off their gear down there is that a real story absolutely

yeah the pittsburgh oh my god look up a pittsburgh toilet that's what it is it's it's a you'll just see an open basement without even like a fucking curtain around it it's just a toilet in the middle of the room it's in the middle of the room. It's in the middle of the room, too, always. That's the weird part. Like, just near a pipe. You're like, what's the weirdest part? You can go downstairs with your dirty ass. It's got all of that. $320,000 for that, though. Wow. So that's real.

36 acres. 36 acres. With a house on it. Less than what land costs. With any toilet, that's pretty good. You know what I mean? That's impressive. Any toilet at all.

Things to do, we found. We have the Crawford County Fair. i love it you gotta do another small town festivals bonus episode that was a lot of fun everybody loved that one county fairs are great god they're fun this is in meadville so it's right there one of the largest agricultural venues east of the mississippi river and pot this is what they say in the website possibly the oldest county fair in pennsylvania we don't know we don't do research possibly we don't know i don't know how do you know sounds good right it might be tell your friends started in 1812 how do you know you weren't there this uh well it first took place in 1852, apparently. And then in 1946, it became the Crawford, like the renovated, reorganized county fair. They attract a shitload of people here.

Typical fair fair, as they put it. Yeah. For all this shit they have. And all that shit. But they have new stuff. Here's what they have here. A 4-H robotics exposition. I'm impressed.

That's very cool. A baked goods auction goods auction that's nice how hungry are you um i imagine that outbidding people for cookies driving up the price on the fucking cherry pie fuck you i want those cookies like that's that's the only cherry cobbler i'll go broke to get it oh my god harness racing what is that it's something to do with horses, I think. I don't know. I think it's a horse sport. Dogs, man. I have no idea.

You're getting a harness and the horse drags you? Oh, that's when they, yeah, I think that's when they're sitting in like the cart behind like a chariot. Oh, teams of them. Yeah, I'll bet you're right. Like a chariot almost. Yeah. Blade sports competition.

Are they? What? Is that like street knife fighting? What the fuck losers dead or is that hockey and like it's the only blade sport i can think of what other sports require any kind of blades whatsoever a 4-h communications contest is that if you can speak to the livestock because that's what that would be can you get me how to move with words whisper in a cow's ear and then it like sits down and then stands up and lifts one leg and puts it down.

You win. There you go. I communicated with the livestock. If I'm in it, I'm just whispering anything into a pig, and whatever it does, that's what I told them to do. See? It's shitting. I said take a shit right now. It's pretty impressive.

They have midway rides, opening ceremonies, and the crowning of the fair queen. Oh, boy. Oh, boy. Oh, here we go. For music, Darcy Lynn and Friends. That sounds great. And her friends. And her friends.

She's invited. She's got to have that. There's FFA Rabbits Judging. Apparently they're going to judge rabbits. A draft horse youth decorating and showmanship. Does that mean that they're going to decorate a draft horse? Going to feign it. This is getting weirder as it goes.

Froggy radio. I don't know what that is. No idea. Do you make the radio at home? Out of frogs? I don't know. They figured out a way to communicate. Instead of cans, you use frogs.

Swifty swine racing pigs. I'm into that. That sounds interesting. Yeah. Here is Gigi Porter's doing tips and tricks every knitter should know that's important gotta have that um the name sounded familiar right up until it was knitting gg porter didn't she wasn't she in the in uh she was in that band oh no no she wasn't in a punk band she's a western pennsylvania knitter that's a she didn't stomp on

a chicken and throw its parts on the audience no i don't think so no no at a david bowie concert in 1982 i don't think that happened uh zerbini family circus is there oh that's good a whole family could be wiped out in one one sweep here. Families? Pigeon judging. This is just getting fucking weirder and weirder as we go. They were like normal things, and now we're into pigeon judging. Bring any animal. We'll tell you if it's hot or not. If it gets me hard, it wins.

That's how it works. We got one judge. He just nods his head, and we're like, that's a hot rooster right there or a hot pigeon uh i said rooster because there's also a rooster crowing contest and i assume that's not the roosters crowing that is humans probably crowing as roosters and peter pan wins every year if you think that's embarrassing yeah well you haven't heard about the dairy goat dress up contest. This is a myth. Okay.

This is fucking what is happening here. Didn't we have that before where they dressed up? What did they put dresses on? Was it pigs? Something like that. It was goats, right? They dress up goats or do you dress up like a goat? Because that's what I pictured. There's a demonstration called THWw you know what that stands for

i do not the hillbilly way just a man is going to show you the hillbilly way this is my cousin we're going to explain why our love is fine and why it's fine for you too after the hillbilly way comes the rabbit hopping contest that just seems like a disaster rabbit races right or are they trying to see how high they can hop i guess because they're going to go in all different directions as soon as you let them go i would imagine they're not going to follow the lanes or anything run them like the combine and then finally vertical is maybe i think that's what it is get their 40 time we have the the release of beef dairy sheep swine goats saddle and draft horses rabbits and poultry release them i

don't know if that's into the wild or for sale or what the fuck the deal is but that that place sounds awesome this county fair sounds like a trip i gotta go it's not bad wow keep them all together and just open the corral and let everybody go at the end? I'd like to talk about that for about 20 more minutes. That's the sad part. We can't because we have this murder. But Jesus, that's why we got to do it as another bonus. Crime rate here.

What we're interested in this town, property crime, it's low. It's about 20% of the national average. It's like 80% low. It's way low. And then violent crime, murder, rape, course assault the mount rushmore of crime is about one quarter of the national average so this place is so safe it's there's nothing going on it's it's rural it's spread out how do you kill somebody there where are you going you have to go all the way to their house the fair is so long the the next day it's like the elves at Santa's workshop.

You got to start planning for next year. We don't have time to hurt people. And you're exhausted from judging pigeons. So once you've judged pigeons, that takes a while to recuperate from. It takes us all year to go catch all the animals back after we've released them on the last day. Hopefully by the next one if we have all the animals back that's the goal that way it keeps the town busy not only a fair time but all year round keeps them from hurting each other it's like an easter egg hunt the kids

go out looking for dairy sheep or some shit dairy goats is that a goat go get it get it it's oh that's one of them he's got a little ribbon wrapped around his leg. That said, this weird-ass place, let's talk about a murder, shall we? All right, let's do it. Oh, boy. Okay, let's get started. We're going to start out in 2012, so we're not going to go back too far. Pretty modern day. We've been bouncing all around the time periods.

We're going to go to 2012 here, and we're going to talk about a young lady here named Brandy Stevens Rosine. Or Rosini, I think it was probably because she is a member of the Italian club. So I'm going to say she's Italian, and we would say that's Rosini. In Western PA, huh? Or if they anglicized it, it would be, yeah, there's a lot of Italians in Western Pennsylvania. I know, that's my point. Yeah, it's shocking, isn't it? Yeah.

Yeah, someone had to go to those fucking mines. Even in a town of a thousand people, they've got a whole society set up for them. Remember the mine jokes? You've got to stick them down in the mines. Who's greasy enough to get, this hole isn't very wide. We don't want to dig it just in case there's nothing down there. Hey, come here. Hey, Luigi, get over here.

He's greasy. Just stuff him down the hole. There we go. He's got a bottle of olive oil on him. And as a petrogallo, I can make all those jokes I want, and nobody can complain. So Brandy, she's born November 30, 1992. So she's 20 years old in 2012. 19, really, almost 20.

She is from northeastern Ohio, but this area is all the same like we said with northeastern ohio um she is basically half the right between pittsburgh and cleveland in a town called beaver township oh in ohio that's where she's from go get your ladies well yes um and hold that thought jimmy oh boy brandy's real close with her family um she hangs out with her cousins and her you know her whole family a lot she's very italian very family yeah family kid by the time um she loves cats she's into cats she likes her cats much like my daughter music things like that um and uh she's into riding go-karts as well. Sure.

Like go-karts, which, I mean, if you're from kind of this area, this is like four-wheeler go-kart outdoor vehicle country. Well, there's this other thing, James, about if you've ever ridden a go-kart, you also love riding go-karts. And if you haven't ridden go-karts, you also love it, I promise. You look at it with just a longing look on your face as people ride go-karts. They are incredible. They're so much fun. No matter if you've done it or not, you love it. I promise.

Everybody loves a go-kart. She gets into creative writing, too, and music. She's an orchestra member in school for eight years. Okay. So she's into all that yeah part of the band um she's also the part of the teen advisory board for the board of in library so she's she's into like she likes doing things she's a good part of groups yeah she's doing all this shit that i didn't do when i was a kid she's doing all i didn't know where to sign up for any

of this stuff right she's doing very mature shit like reading music yeah things like that and this is all good shit too for college she's getting like extracurricular stuff for college in and all that sort of thing so she's got goals in her life as well um always always liked writing a lot that was one of her main things um she um you know liked to hang out and uh she liked a lot of she liked music she went to see like warp tour and shit like that oh right yeah she's also into country music and rap she liked all music basically she can find something she likes out of any genre much like you yeah yeah you can find a lot of stuff that you like i love everything and i'm as like as growing up i hated the person i'd be like i love everything and i'm as like as growing up i hated the person

i'd be like i love everything but i really do i can find something in there that i'm like this is great i have very pronounced hatreds of things where certain sounds i hit my ears and they make me wince and i'm just like they i give that make that stop please i can't take that guitar is tough to listen oh i hear that i hear that fucking i'm like yeah turn it oh you mean oh no you mean the way they say the sounds everything it's the it's what i mean it's the actual sounds that hit my ears and i physically wince i don't it's not a choice it's yeah like if you taste something and you go and you spit it out that's what my ears do it's not my fault they taste and spit it right back any country music that was made beyond 1977 i i it just it just rejects it i can't

take it not my fault man and anything that i hear that i i can i can viscerally feel a frat boy playing it yeah on the beach in florida trying to get pussy that music i loathe i don't like i've always so much it feels like it feels like audible date rape and i i'm not i'm repulsed i'm not into that shit i always hated like in the 90s i Limp Bizkit and that kind of shit, too. Like, I just couldn't take that kind of shit. That's just bad rap. Yeah. Like, I'm all for, like, aggression and that's all great and everything, but it's got to be, like, smart.

It can't just be, it can't make me feel like I'm stupider after listening to it. That didn't help at all. Somebody heard Fred Durst go, yeah, and they were were like we can sell it what why oh yeah that's that is the noises he would make were awful who did that noise come out of oh that man oh god look at him he's an adonis let's say what this is what no that's what i mean what happened there some blue-eyed dork with his hat on backward and always the same hat like that's what I mean. What happened there? Some blue-eyed dork with his hat on backward and always the same hat? Like, that's his identity, the hat? That's the one, babe.

Fuck that guy. That's very strange. But Brandy is not like that at all. Brandy is a nice person and very unfred Durst-like. Yeah, she can find everything. She can find something that she enjoys and just be a happy person. Yeah, and I know, so I'll save everybody a song. I don't know what Fred Durst has been doing in the last 20 years,

and someone's going to post, he's actually really nice, and show us a thing of him feeding puppies from a dropper. Don't believe it. He's doing that because he's a monster. Who are saved from a wildfire. It's basically going to be, he's doing all the shit Guy Fieri does, and that's all fine. I don't care. We don't care about that at all. That's what we're saying. It's basically going to be he's doing all the shit Guy Fieri does and that's all fine. I don't care. We don't care about that at all.

That's what we're saying. It doesn't matter. It's good. The music was enough. We're good with him. I understand that anybody who's paid attention to the media would have to come to the conclusion that I killed my wife. Hi, my name is Zach Stewart-Pontier.

I'm one of the filmmakers behind the Jinx, and I'm excited to bring you the official Jinx podcast. We'll be revisiting all six episodes of part one and watching along with part two as it airs on max starting April 21st. Bye bye. The official Jinx podcast. Listen on max or wherever you get your podcasts. It's all a lighthearted nightmare on our podcast. Morbid. you get your podcasts. with a touch of humor. I'd just like to go ahead and say that if there's no band called Malevolent Deity,

that is pretty great. A dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit with a little bit of cursing. This mother****er lied. Like a liar. Like a liar. And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal,

or you love to hop in the Wayback Machine and dissect the details of some of history's most notorious crimes, you should tune in to our podcast morbid follow morbid on the wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts you can listen to episodes early and ad free by joining wondery plus and the wondery app or on apple podcasts so she um she also is very much the uh one of those people who everybody has that in a group of friends. There's always the lost puppy finder. Yeah.

The one who finds a lost puppy, not in terms of an actual puppy, but a human being who's a puppy. And they almost, they're just magnetically attracted to those people. Yeah. You know what I mean? And most of them, it's like they feel like they can nurture and correct whatever is wrong there. And a lot of times they do, too, which is fucking crazy. It can be helpful, but sometimes you can't. You never know what people have gone through.

But Brandy's good like that. She's very much has a lot of friends, not in just one group. She's got a lot of different groups of friends, apparently. She's a person who can easily float between groups of friends. And everybody kind of likes her. She's cool. And that's how that goes. groups of friends apparently she's a person who can easily float between groups of friends and everybody kind of likes her she's cool and uh that's how that goes so um uh she wanted to uh she wanted to go to college like we said she after high school brandy enrolls in youngstown state university and brandy was studying psychology and sociology at Youngstown State.

She's also a diabetic as well. Oh, shit. Brandy's, yeah. So there's something to think about there. Brandy's a diabetic. Been living with her grandmother for about the last two and a half years-ish. Been living there. I don't know if that's for school,

if maybe her grandmother's house is an easier access to school. That might be it. But we've talked about Youngstown State, actually, because we've talked about that area for in crime and sports before for crime and sports we've talked about yeah yeah that's what it is now we've talked about it for fucking crime and sports and a lot somebody went there really that area too the youngstown ohio with oh yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah so i know um or brandy's one friend said quote brandy wasn't the type of person to plan brandy just kind of went with it she knew the focus i think but she didn't know exactly where she was going to end up that's kind of the way she went and she was happy to be you know like that her friend said

she used to go on what she would call adventures with friends she's just a young person who's free so she would do that she uh her friend said her one friend uh christy here who we're gonna hear a lot about christy horvath is her name or harvath we'll call her harvath that sounds better she said quote that's what they called them adventures they would just jump in her car and drive wherever and just go that's fun that's what they called them adventures they would just jump in her car and drive wherever and just go that's fun that's fun 19 year old shit like hey yeah i don't have kids and bills let's hop in the car and go have fun that sounds awesome how wouldn't you love to do that that's how i oh my god that's how i mapped out in my head northern arizona i mean i can go

anywhere up there and i know where it is because as a young kid that's what i do all the time and i shit i miss it so much oh yeah having the freedom to go drive around and water bills and road drive around i haven't done it in so long no no god no um also she had a four-wheeler and they said she was a she would definitely she was like a daredevil on the four-wheeler driver that sort of thing also love playing mario party and i'm into social media at that point too in 2012 facebook tumblr yeah that's a big oh the tumblr tumblr yeah my daughter used to love tumblr too so that's a big one that's a big one. She's also a lesbian as well. She likes girls. That's why I was saying Beaver Township. You say that's where you find the ladies. And I was going to say that's where she found the ladies, too. way shape or form she was my daughter and christy who is her friend and who's a little bit older we'll talk about who's brandy's friend um she said christy was there to help her along the way and

guide her she was amazing and christy said i tried to help her through that and tell her it's okay to just be yourself so yeah that's what's going on with brandy she's a seems like a damn nice kid that's all this seems like a nice kid so good for her she tells her uh in 2012 here one day she tells her um her grandmother on may 17th it's a thursday 2012 that she's going to visit her friend riannon who's a close friend of hers who lives nearby so she said i'm going to riannon's. You know, see you later. But she doesn't. That's not the plan, though.

She's not actually going to Rhiannon's. No, she's going to drive somewhere else about 80 miles away. Jesus. Outside of Cochranton, Pennsylvania here. On her way, she's texting with Rhiannon while she's going there. And she said she felt kind of uneasy and she said the text was quote i have a funny feeling this is the address where i'll be so always smart to do that there's never anything wrong you feel weird at all always you should

always tell somebody where you are if you can why not yeah um and especially if you're alone yeah you know why not that's the i i just if i'm uneasy about some place i just fucking don't go yeah yeah we're i'll say true just i don't want to go there i don't go many places i'm super uneasy about where i like sketchy places yeah but when was 19, I did that all the fucking time. Like an asshole. I'm lucky to be alive. How many times when you're 19 are you hanging out with your friends and you like meet some couple people

who are total strangers to you at like a gas station and then 20 minutes later you're at their house. Drinking something they handed me. That's what I mean. How often is that? Like that's what 19 is

that's what being nighttime we met these people and they knew people who were having a party so we hung out with them and we went to this party and then i met these other people and we drove with them and you don't even know where the fuck your car is by three in the morning you've been by eight strangers right 41 year old me's going are you out of your fucking mind don't do that jesus christ don't talk to them don't give them your number you shouldn't drive either at this point getting an uber what are you doing like yeah you ate that why would you do that oh my god you don't know what's in that there could be drugs in there they're gonna rape you they're all gonna rape you that's all you think they're gonna call you

pin cushion stop it as an adult we just know that everything is a plot for rape at this point everybody's it's all it is always somebody out to hurt me everywhere i go that's it so she texts her friend rianne in that anyway she texts her the address of 29558 drake hill road brilliant so yeah here's here's where i'll be just in case feeling weird. Makes you feel a little bit better. It's one of those things that you almost like say people joke around all the time. Like if I'm killed, here's where my body will be. You know what I mean? Like that's what people joke around and say all the time. So she ends up going to see somebody else, though.

She's going to see another young lady who's 19 years old named Jade Nicole Olmsted. O-L-M-S-T-A-D, Olmsted. Now, they had, she's got a history with Jade. This isn't somebody new. This is somebody who has been around a while. They've had some interesting history together. They met on social media, I believe on MySpace, if i'm not mistaken in 2009 and uh in time they started hooking up and got together and were you know girlfriends and uh apparently um even after they

broke up and we'll talk about their relationship brandy was always kind of pining for for jade she always yeah she dug jade she was the one that she's the one she couldn't get out of her head you know what i mean it went a different way yep she's the tune that wouldn't get kept getting stuck in your brain song that never ends one of those um so at one point she had even um she had moved in with uh with brandy at brandy's grandparents home and uh her grandparents didn't approve of this just to because they were too young to be living together they thought it wasn't whatever um she said that quote brandy was hiding her oh so yeah she this is what her friend said christy brandy was hiding her she'd wait for grandma to go to work and then jade would come over and then she'd not be around when grandma got home so that's one way to do it that's a way to do it um she also said jade was one of those girls that

found someone who'd give her attention and take care of her and brandy did that so yeah she looks for lost puppies yeah jade's the type of person who looks for someone to kind of take care of her right the person who likes to find lost puppies is the person perfect person for that so that's kind of how they ended up being together here but for the lost puppy finder those always end in heartbreak is the problem because that person's need they need something and you're not you can never provide all of what that person needs because whatever it is is in them and they haven't found it yet it's not correct you're not going to give it to them you know it's got to be something else going on there so um she uh would help her all the time though anyway even after they broke up

which was crazy jade's family a little different brandy's family nice family everybody loves each other they do things together nobody there's, never any police action or anything like that. It's a house. James. It's right. Yeah. If you got go-karts, that's a happy household for the most part.

It's going well. Unless they're like made from stolen parts, which those are, that's like a, that's a messy household. But if their store bought go-karts, yeah, that's a good household.

Yeah. I wish I grew up in a go-kart house. Oh my God. Oh, remember the kids who had go-kart house oh my god oh remember the kids who had go-kart houses yeah like four-wheelers that weren't literally put together from stolen junk piles right like real ones that were yeah were painted one color you know that carburetor came on that yeah remember that like they'd have like a dirt bike all matching and he'd be like whoa a brand new mossimo clothes i remember thinking you your parents must have it so together like you know i remember thinking that like wow that house must be amazing over there just the kid in my

neighborhood his dad was the photographer for the suns like the floor guy with the big with the big fucking telephoto lens so he'd be out at night being amazing on the floor next to athletes and he'd come home and give the kids things that the athletes gave him and have fucking go-karts and they drive the go-karts in the neighborhood they have pocket bikes pocket bikes james those 60 mile an hour tiny bikes and here's jimmy peeking out the fucking blinds going what do they got today what are they doing out there jimmy's like it's a new dirt bike huh you son of a bitch you need another new dirt bike i'm gonna call the cops if you don't keep it down he's starting to just get

what'd you do with your other one at least give me that oh man what a fucking life man i used to think about that too whenever i'd see those kids, I'd be like, wow. Or the kids that were like 16 and had a car that was made in the last 10 years driving to school, and you were like, whoa, look at that. How'd you do that? Wow, is that like your mom's? That's yours? Whoa. And you'd see they'd have like a fucking Nirvana bumper sticker on it.

And you'd be like, that's theirs. That's not even their mom's. Oh, shit. And they'd take me with them to go to uh like black mountain the bmx bike track and ride their old bike that they that they got a new one they got a new red line so i'm out there on their on their diamond back so mad and they're blazing past me oh i'm sure so hard you don't get a lot of track time though probably because i'm sure that costs money that's the thing but their parents took pity on the poor kid they're like

watch out for that third turn jimmy it's a real bitch as you're in a fucking pile of dust over there they know they're jumping you they're using you as a fucking hazard to jump you see them like sideways with the wheel twisted as they go over top of you going, yeah. Spinning the bars as they jump my shins. Then they stop and like fucking open up a soda and do like a soda commercial pose with like ice dripping off of it. There's air between them and the can. All the liquid hits their tongue. It's a fucking Mountain Dew commercial. I love it so much.

So anyway, Jade's family, family though a little bit different jade's parents are into drinking and drugs so okay a little bit of a not as stable of a family here they also are very unaccepting apparently of jade's sexuality as well they're not into that at all and um yeah so they were they thought that jade wasn't very happy with herself because of that and that's understandable i mean yeah that's that's a fascinating view to have your child when you're a fucking drug you're a mess matter who's not taking care of your kid and you care who they what they're attracted to who she wants to kiss you're kissing a glass dick right now fuck off i don't know what they're into but if you're doing meth you really can't judge anybody you

don't get to tell me you don't get to judge shit like my lifestyle no matter what it is as long as it's not meth should be fine yeah i don't care who you're fingering don't smoke meth there you go that works look at me yeah because guess what straight lifestyle got me that's what i mean smoking meth will get you fingered but in all the wrong places that's the problem Look at me. Yeah. Because guess what? Look what straight lifestyle got me. That's what I mean. Smoking meth will get you fingered in all the wrong places. That's the problem. Without it, you got a chance. So she wasn't very happy.

I mean, no one's happy from that. You're starting in a hole when your family doesn't accept you and they're also a mess. You're starting in a hole that you're going to have to overcome mentally with you know to feel good about yourself some you're in a therapy hole there that's a person who could probably use some therapy so for years it's not going to be an overnight thing no no no that's not a quick one that's not a quickie fix there so brandy's friend christy who like i said we'll talk about a lot she said that about about Jade, quote, When I first met her, I thought that she lacked confidence. I felt like she wasn't comfortable in her own skin. She another friend said that she described Jade is very quiet. But I also know Jade had some issues at home, which kind of contributed to why she was so quiet.

Makes sense. Her friend, Jade's friend, said, quote, Jade really struggled with her parents. She came from a very religious household and then she came out a lesbian. Her parents were not happy about it. So they were religious and into drugs?

Right. That is, you're judging a lot, we'll put it that way, for things, you know what I mean? Like, I'm into drugs, but Jesus said that is not like, well, you deal with your meth shit first and then we'll deal with all the rest of it. That's just that goes first. So she said then she came out a lesbian.

Her parents were not happy about it. They wanted her to change who she was and just flip the switch and not be gay anymore. You can't do that. It doesn't work. I'm just going to say this. I don't know about like guys because I don't know how I don't know the desire for penis. It just doesn't hit me.'t work. I'm just going to say this. I don't know about guys because I don't know the desire for penis. It just doesn't hit me as that. I'm just saying.

For me, I've never been like I really want to touch somebody else's penis. But I will tell you this. When you're into pussy, that doesn't go away. As a man, and Jimmy, can you back me up on this? I feel like it only permeates it's just but you see a gay guy and the way like an out gay guy and the way he behaves you can't you can't put that toothpaste back in the tube that's a gay man and he's a gay man it's just yeah you just do that i just know for desire desire for ladies that's all i know can't change it man it's not it's not gonna

change for me so if she feels the same as me yeah i feel like this is permanent right you know it's a permanent condition yeah the opposite view is how when he when a gay guy looks at pussy he says gross i say the same thing about a dick yeah yeah no thanks there's no thanks it's like if you tried to give me a food i don't like no thanks yeah worse it is gross no thanks. No thanks. It's like if you tried to give me a food I don't like. No thanks. Worse. It is gross. No thanks.

Not even no thanks. Don't want it. Get it away. Well, I mean, I thank you for offering is what I'm saying. I don't care if somebody hands me. You don't even nag us about it? I don't like pecan pie. If someone tries to hand it to me, I don't go, ah, and swat it away. I go, no thanks.

That's all not in the penis thank you like it's a nice nice to offer i guess yeah it's a nice offer right i mean anything offered as i've considered anything offered is really that's you know thanks that's nice yeah you can't be mad at anybody for offering shit so there you go so uh brandy though um she said uh brandy she liked jade and she was very generous with her and a lot of people saw jade as kind of a not really this wasn't an equal relationship they saw jade as just kind of um kind of glomming on to brandy's spirit and her industriousness yeah brandy's dating down yeah it's that's what it feels like what's what her friends think anyway which i mean

there's not another thing about that i've found about women is their friends very rarely will support like any of the guys that you're with no matter who you're dating or guys women anything it's just yeah this doesn't matter so i don't know if that's the same in this situation or not. But, you know, yeah, it's she said this is one of her friends. Brandy told me that Jade didn't want to work. She took care of her a lot. I think that Brandy did a lot of things for Jade and that made Jade feel good. It was rough because I feel like Brandy could do so much better is what her mom said.

It was rough. It was tough because I feel like Brandy could do better. do so much better is what her mom said it was rough it was tough because i feel like brandy could do better um their relationship ended very abruptly as a matter of fact brandy and jade um well uh according to brandy here apparently she was working the late shift at target one night yeah brandy was when she i guess um um jade just stole her iPad, her iPod and $300 cash and snuck out through a window and took off. What the fuck, man? Of the house. Just took off out of the house and she wasn't there later.

Cash and electronics? Yeah, just took her shit that she could use and took off out of the house. I'll call the police. That's what I mean. Well, her friend friend brandy's friend said brandy was angry but she forgave jade she loved her so yeah um her friend also said i think she tried to date other people after that but after a couple dates she was over them and i think it was because she compared everything to jade so yeah um christy her friend christy said brandy

had been in love with jade and they were together about a year before they broke up. Jade then started going with Ashley. But anytime Jade needed anything, Brandy was there. She had even recently driven to Baltimore to give Jade a ride to where she wanted to go. Wow. Cleveland to Baltimore is not a that's not a short ride. That's a day. That's a day.

Yeah. It's over. It's like six hours from Pittsburgh. That's a day. That's all day. It's like six hours from Pittsburgh to Philly, and then from Philly to Baltimore is another, what, three? Two, three hours. So you're talking like a 10-hour trip. That's a work shift, for Christ's sake. Another 50 miles into Ohio, we're talking that's a 10-hour, 11-hour trip. And if that's a turnaround trip, James, forget it.

That's crazy. That's crazy. You got to get a hotel when you go there. Holy shit. So Brandy did anything for Jade, though. Yeah, this was 300 miles away. Jade said, please pick me up in Maryland and bring me back to Ohio. So she did.

She picked her up, brought her all the way there. And then apparently Jade had this Ashley girl and her parents come and pick her up. So why she didn't get Ashley to come get her from fucking Baltimore. But a lot of people think, yeah, she's using Brandy, Jade. For sure. You broke up with her, stole her shit, and now you're getting rides from her? What a fucking, we've all been there. You can't keep calling me after this.

We're done. A lot of us have played that sucker role from time to time, though, all been there. You can't keep calling me after this. We're done. A lot of us have played that sucker role from time to time, though, and it happens. We've agreed to be friends, and friends don't do that shit. No. That's wifey shit. That's the thing. Yeah, you go, oh, don't you have somebody else to deal with? That's like a family matter, it seems like.

That's like breaking up and being like, maybe I can just get anal from you. No, that's like super deep relationship. No, no shit. So Ashley is Ashley Barber. Ashley is Jade's new girlfriend here. And I guess Ashley had dated Jade before Jade met Brandy. And then so that was they were an old flame. And then Jade and Brandy went out

they broke up and then Jade ended up going back with Ashley yeah so that's how that works Jade's friend said quote Ashley was very tough she liked to put it out there that no one could mess with her she was very aggressive that's her style Ashley Ashley Barber is very

aggressive that's that's her whole deal everybody said she's got a kind of a mean vibe to her. Jealous. She's jealous. Yeah, she's jealous. She's a little angry. She's tough. Don't talk to my girl kind of shit.

Oh, absolutely. She's 20 years old, Ashley, as well. Yeah, I guess they had broken up a few times. They had just a contentious relationship here, as you can imagine. And, um, just between an angry person and a person that,

you know, has no self esteem and needs therapy. There's, there's issues with them here. And, um, apparently, apparently when they were a couple,

um, they like during high school, they had also, Jade had moved in with her at one point and then moved out. So Jade kept like leaving her house. She was looking for some way out of her house. It seemed like it sounds like it. One of her.

This is Ashley's mother said Jade this spring had tried to get Ashley to move to Baltimore where her parents are. We didn't want Ashley to go that far from home. So they asked Jade if Jade wants she they told Ashley we'll have Jade come here then if it's that important so that's how she that's how she didn't have any other way to get home but to call Brandy and have Brandy pick her up so she could be brought back to her girlfriend here relocate me please relocate me yeah move me please now their previous relationship Ashley and uh Ashley and Jade, didn't work because it was troubled. Yeah.

They had problems. Sure. Apparently, Ashley at one time got in an argument with Jade and was very aggressive and even confronted Jade's parents at one point. What? And was arguing with them to where they had to call the police, and she was removed from the home by police. It got to that point, and Ashley's mother said, Jade had lied to my daughter and convinced her that she was being abused at home,

and Ashley felt like she had to do something. So that's what Ashley's mother says is that she had told her all these terrible stories. So Ashley went over there to say, to confront them and be like, how fucking dare you don't, you know, you leave her alone. You pieces of shit.

They're not doing this. They're just, they're probably not great people. I don't know. I mean, I don't know. We don't know. We don't know.

We know that, right? We don't even know. That's what that was said. But then other people say they're just religious. So we don't even know what, whatever the upbringing is. They're not, we know that they're not accepting of Jade. Other than that, we don't really know too much about what they are. And also, Jade, you're an adult. Get a're 20 and you were dating a 20-year-old girl and that girl was telling you about abuse she had suffered at home.

She's not living at home. She's living with you. She's telling you about abuse she suffered at home. Would you go to her parents' house to confront them? No. Thank God you're out of that. Yeah. Think about how aggressive of a person you have to be to be like, no, I abide that shit i'm gonna go over there i need vengeance confront them about shit that already

happened yeah that's a lot so that's that tells you a lot about ashley right front about shit that can't happen anymore like yeah you're not there so uh i guess she had told the barbers later on uh after when she got back together with ashley she told jade told ashley's family that brandy stevens had abused her as well oh god and that's very unlikely so yeah it seems like jade might be a tad bit of a liar here um uh yeah and not necessarily lying as like a a reason like she doesn't have anger in her heart to do she's doing it for attention is what it feels yeah oh absolutely she wants people to be on her side it seems like it's like your parents on her aren't on her side so she's gonna get rally the troops you know she missed out so much support in her entire life that she's now trying to reconcile that by getting support for shit that

it's bullshit absolutely man absolutely and she and and Jade would keep in touch with Brandy from time to time as well, which obviously Ashley didn't like, um, her one friend, this is, uh, uh, uh,

Brandy's friend said Brandy and Jade would be in contact on and off. Brandy would go see her sometimes and Jade would be nice to her. Then a couple of days later, Jade and Ashley would be sending her mean messages. What the fuck yeah there's a we'll talk about some mean some nasty social media shit that went on here um at one point brandy said to her friend listen do me a favor and this is like such an old trope that people do like it's it's harder when you have a cell phone but she said I'm taking Jade's number out of my cell phone

nobody remembers numbers once they have a phone I'm taking this number out of my phone I'm going to give it to you in case I want it later but I'm taking it out of my phone because I don't want I don't want to have the temptation to call her but you know if in a few months I change my mind give me the number

but keep it for now so Brandy's trying to just like have her friend kind of help her keep this girl at arm's length, which is a lot of people have done that. You know what I mean? There's a Seinfeld episode where he makes Kramer take the number and he tears it up and Jerry's picking the pieces of the paper up off the floor trying to put it together because he wants to go back out with this chick. And then apparently a few months later, Brandy texted her friend and said, hey, I need that number.

And her friend said, I pretended like I didn't even get her messages. I didn't want her to contact Jade. I knew she was bad news. So somehow, though, Brandy got her number. You could find it. So she found, yeah, it's not hard. She found her number. Or she could have just contacted her on social media too.

That's the other thing and got her number that way. So she was, got in contact with Jade again. And, uh, in March of 2012 is when she brought her home from Baltimore and, uh, all of that. Her friend, Christie, Brandy's friend, Christie said, Brandy loved her. So she did it, but Brandy would have done that for anybody. Nice person. her so she did it but brandy would have done that for anybody yeah nice person so this particular day may 17th 2012 is the day that she tells her grandmother brandy does that she's going to see riannon in reality she's going to see jade text her friend the address that's where we're at now

okay um like i said she'd been keeping in touch with her and it wasn't like and uh jade invited brandy hey why don't you come over and hang out yeah we you know it's pretty cool come you know there's all sorts of cool shit to do and you know whatever yeah so yeah it seemed fine i mean a little weird that this couple would want to hang out with the ex of one of the members but she's like i guess i don't know maybe we'll all be friends you know who knows so um brandy hops in her 2002 kia rio hell yeah there you go and uh takes off to go visit jade and um she told her friend got a you know funny feeling and all that kind of shit she does over an hour drive she does text her friend as well that she stopped to get something to eat because she was she's a diabetic and she her blood sugar felt a little low so she stopped at subway okay one of

those roadside subways and grabbed herself some a little bit of food so she'd feel a little more balanced there so she's heading toward the house this is this is how it's described in a publication quote after winding her way through a maze of roads that led her deep into the woods of Crawford County. That's the beginning of this journey. Took her through acres of isolated back hills indiscriminately sliced into rudimentary sections of dusty, dirty roads. It's trees everywhere. It's the fucking woods. I mean, it's the middle of nowhere.

The middle of nowhere. And that's when she texted her friend like this is kind of weird i'm gonna give you my yeah the address i'm supposed to be at because here's my here's a pin where i'm at fuck the address this is i don't know if 2012 everybody was pinned yet could pin that shit yet but so um now that day her grandmother um as the night comes because she's like it gets dark outside and her grandmother's like, OK, I haven't heard back from her. She was just going to her friend's house. But she noticed that she left.

Her grandmother said that she didn't take her backpack with her that day. She left her backpack. And in her backpack is where she keeps her insulin when she goes out. So she that's she doesn't have her insulin with her. And she's if she's out all night, she's going to need her insulin. So she probably didn't plan to be gone this long if she didn't take her insulin is what that says to her grandmother here. Welcome to the small town of Chinook, where faith runs deep and secrets run deeper. In this new thriller, available exclusively on Wondery Plus, religion and crime collide when a gruesome murder

rocks the isolated Montana community. Everyone is quick to point their fingers at a drug-addicted teenager, but local deputy Ruth Vogel isn't convinced. She suspects connections to a powerful religious group. Enter federal agent V.B. Loro, who has been investigating a local church for possible

criminal activity. The pair form an unlikely partnership to catch the killer, unearthing secrets that leave Ruth torn between her duty to the law, her religious convictions, and her very own family. But something more sinister than murder is afoot, and someone is watching Ruth. With an all-star cast led by Emmy nominee Sanaa Lathan and Star Wars Kelly Marie Tran, Chinook is available exclusively and ad-free on Wondery+. Join Wondery in the Wondery app

or on Apple Podcasts. It's all a lighthearted nightmare on our podcast, Morbid. We're your hosts. I'm Alina Urquhart. And I'm Ash Kelly. And our show is part true crime, part spooky, and part comedy. The stories we cover are well-researched. He claimed and confessed to officially killing up to 28 people. With a touch of humor. I'd just like to go ahead and

say that if there's no band called Malevolent Deity, that is pretty great. A dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit with a little bit of cursing. This mother f***er lied. Like a liar. Like a liar. And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal. Or you love to hop in the Wayback Machine and dissect the details of some of history's most notorious crimes. You should tune in to our podcast, Morbid. Follow Morbid on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts.

You can listen to episodes early and ad-free by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. So her grandmother started calling her cell phone and all the calls started going straight to voicemail. Oh, which off or if you're in a very rural area, it would go straight to voicemail. Especially back then, there was a lot less coverage, and roaming was expensive. Remember roaming? You'd turn that shit off. What a weird thing that was. You're out of range. You're out of fucking range, period.

That's it. So no answer, nothing, no text, no call, no nothing from Brandy. The whole night goes by. She needs her insulin. Why would she leave without her insulin, and the fuck you know what's going on so brandy's grandmother calls brandy's mother and says i haven't heard from brandy have you heard from randy what's going on and she said no so because she is a diabetic yep and doesn have her medication, they're able to call the police and file a missing persons report. That's awesome.

Yeah. Usually it would take longer because she's a 20 year old girl. 20 year old people are the people most likely to just disappear for a couple of days. Right. You know what I mean? And do go do something with their friends, especially if she has a history of going on adventures.

But the fact that she doesn't have her medication makes it like, this is a an issue so they take it they take the they take the report actually and um they say that they're they're trying they don't know where the fuck to find her basically she could be anywhere she said she was going to her friend riannon's her friend riannon said no she's not she texted me this this is all I know so um yeah the the beaver township police chief he said there are always these are always tough cases obviously because a 20 year old girl has the ability to leave and not have people around her looking for her or have people hound her looking for her so yeah they don't they don't suspect anything's awry they just suspect that she probably went out to do some shit with her friends.

On an adventure. Yeah. Phone died. Maybe she doesn't have her charger. She forgot her medication. Maybe she forgot her charger, too. Is that in the backpack? So it's one of those deals.

So her friend, though, said that her friend Christy said that she hadn't been to Ashley Barber's house because that's where Jade was staying, at Ashley Barber's house with her parents, and she said she didn't know that that's where she went. She didn't know anything about it. She had the address that she had texted her other friend, but that's about it. Now, some time goes by here because the whole weekend passes,

and they don't hear from Brandy. So finally, her friend Christy says, quote, I drove to Drake Hill Road, but it was at nighttime and it looked like a dirt road in the middle of nowhere. I couldn't see her car and I couldn't see tire tracks. So I left. Wow. But the police are doing seemingly nothing because this is an investigation that her parents mount and her family mounts and her family goes looking for her, basically, because the police and all of this. I never hear the police found this or the police did this. It's a matter of her family did this.

And then they would tell the police because they took the report. That's all they did. They wrote it down. They sure wrote it down. But that's all they did. They wrote it down. They sure wrote it down. But that's about all. And if it wasn't for her being diabetic, they wouldn't have even written it down. No, no. They'd be like, call us in about a week maybe if you don't hear from her.

Yeah. So she said, this is the Christie, her friend again, said, quote, it was nighttime. It was dark and I didn't realize what I was getting myself into. It was a dirt road and I was looking for tire tracks anything i had lost my signal on my gps and i thought maybe she had too if this is the choice she's retracing her steps she said i didn't see any tire tracks i turned around at the church and i went home and um then christy texted jade uh later on to tell her that she was before this to tell her that she was coming there. Jade's response is this quote.

Be careful. It's no man's land out here and it's bear hunting season. She said she Googled it and she said it wasn't bear hunting season. And then she also said they don't like gay people out here. So be careful. I'm not coming. And then another text she texted. Jade texted.

Are the police doing anything? Which Christie found strange. Like, why would the police? You know, what do you care at that point? So the location is, like we said, 29558 Drake Hill Road. point so the location is like we said 29 558 drake hill road the um people are contacting jade to see if she knows where she is like we said her friends uh brandy's family they're all contacting jade and all jade asks everybody that um you know that jade is trying yeah she's asking everybody if the police are involved and then um she's told several people it's bear hunting season and the local people don't like gay people.

So who knows? Anything's possible. They have big bear guns and, you know, looking for hairy gay guys that they consider bears. Heavy set hairy guys. Yeah. So on Monday morning, finally, Brandy's cell phone pings near a tower. So they get a cell phone ping on her phone near a tower in Meadville, Pennsylvania, which we've talked about. Her family and friends were like, holy shit.

Okay, maybe she, this is good. Maybe she's like, yeah, she could be fucking judging rabbit hopping right now. We don't know. Telling her favorite pigeon. So they had already printed out posters with her picture on it and everything like they were ready to fucking they were launching a full missing person investigation while the police were like i don't know it's a long weekend i mean i got plans on sunday so they said that they headed out went to meadville where the where it pinged and they just they went with the posters and went door to door through the whole town basically uh they went into all the businesses through neighborhoods they broke

up door to door have you seen this you know you've seen her have you seen her have you seen her um which is amazing that's fucking god don't we all wish we had family like that my family's not doing that get a poster and start going door to door before the cops even they'd be like we called the cops i mean yeah what else like, we called the cops. I mean, what more could we do? We trust them. They'll do their best. Will they, Mom?

Really? God damn it. You're retired. Get off your ass. Yeah. Do you have time for this? One of the homes they visited was the Barber family, actually. They had went out there, and Christy said, quote,

Finally, Brandy's mom called Jade and said, I'm coming to talk to you. When we got to the barber home, we stood in the front yard and Jade and Ashley came around the house. Jade was nervous and Ashley was defensive. They said they'd never seen Brandy. They said he didn't make it there. Um, they said that. Yeah. Uh, so they said after that, they said they started to get more afraid. And, you

know, it was kind of weird. And she, her one friend, Brandy's friend said, quote, I think that right around this time was when I reached out to her mom with the messages from Ashley. Now we'll talk about that. Ashley here. Ashley is according to one of Brandy's friends, quote, I think Ashley was very insecure. She couldn't stand the thought of Jade giving attention to someone else. Yeah. She's pretty jealous. And, um,

apparently Ashley had made several really hateful social media messages sent to, um, apparently, you know, they had gotten around. She sent some nasty shit to about Brandy, to her, about Brandy, to Brandy to her friends.

Yeah. What? One of her friends said, quote, she had said, and I hope I get to kill her before her diabetes does. Oh, my God. Yeah. She's nasty, dude. This is nasty. What a thing to say.

Yeah. That's fucking. Yeah. I mean, about a 20 year old girl. What the fuck? I guess when you're when you're pissed off and if you you hate like that, I don't know, yeah. About a 20-year-old girl? What the fuck, man? I guess when you're pissed off and you hate, I don't know, man. I guess we've all said crazy shit about an old ex-girlfriend's new boyfriend or something like that. But that's just, it seems worse when it's written down. If you say it like sitting on a tailgate with a beer in your hand at midnight, nobody cares.

But if you write it down and type it and send it through the context is key too and sarcasm doesn't come across and it's bouncing off satellites yeah once you're bouncing it off satellites the whole thing it's another connotation sarcasm gets lost four towers ago oh it got lost somewhere over the Caspian Sea. It's just gone. It's out. So that's what's going on here. Shit like that. So we knew that she doesn't let Ashley does not like Brandy very, very much. Now, the friend, the mutual friend said she didn't take it seriously at the time because people say a lot of things when they're upset. Sure.

That's all she said. So back to Christyy christy is with brandy's mom carrie and christy said quote carrie said you know this is stupid we know where she is and she was going to last let's go i'm sure we can find it in the daylight so then they go out over in the daylight okay gps leads them to the house a different GPS. They're met outside by Ashley and Jade and Ashley's father as well. Okay. Now, this is Brandy's mother said, Jade came up to me, Ashley stayed back, and I said, you know why I'm here. Yeah.

And no, I don't was the response. Okay. No, I don't. Why else would I be here? Stupid. okay no i don't why else would i be here stupid so she said well you know brandy's been missing and the response was yeah but she's not here and um there she said quote i said well she was coming here we have a text saying that she had a bad feeling and that this is the address that she'll be at so this was the last known place of her location you know things cops should be doing

yeah not saying that the mother's doing a bad thing her location. You know, things cops should be doing. Yeah. Not saying that the mother's doing a bad thing by doing this. I'm saying the cops should have already been there doing this. She should be saying, yeah, I already talked about this with Detective So-and-so. That's what I mean. Yeah. A lady in street clothes does not warrant the same response from a guilty person or somebody that has something to hide as a guy in a blue uniform and a fucking badge she can't bring her into a little room and sit her down and fucking talk

to her and scare the shit out of her and do all that she's a guy with a guy with some red and blue saying you know why i'm here warrants a different conversation than than from the mom that a little bit so yeah she said this is what i you know she said she never made it there kept saying did she never made it there she never made it there now at the time ashley uh had a bandaged a bandage on her arm in the elbow area and upper arm area she had um injuries on her and um that this is the mom says quote she said they were at the hospital when supposedly brandy was coming but she decided to turn back and not come because they weren't going to be there so that's what the the start their story is we had to take ashley to the

hospital so we told her and then she didn't come because we weren't going to be here anyway we told her head out here uh never mind we're going to the hospital. Turn back. That's the story. Because the story is Ashley fell down the stairs and hurt herself. So falling down the stairs, hurting herself, she needed to go to the hospital. It was not an appointment or anything.

It was an emergency. So Carrie, Brandy's mom, said, quote, I was very aggressive with Jade. I finally told her, I said, I don't believe a fucking thing you're saying. That a girl. I like this a lot. And that's when Ashley came up from behind Jade and said, whoa, whoa, whoa.

I said, don't whoa, whoa, whoa me. This is great. Yeah. And if she is Italian, yeah, you don't fuck with an Italian mom looking for their kid. No, no, no, no. If you whoa, whoa, whoa italian mom looking for their kid no no no if you whoa whoa my mom she would stab you like there's no doubt i have no doubt in my mind that this girl would already have a blade in her fucking throat if this was my mother it would be a my mother would be going to jail this night i know that if i'd be going oh jesus ma don't stab her please

which hospital did you go to because i'm'm going there next. Yeah, I'll be there next, motherfucker. So she said, don't know, whoa, whoa, whoa, me. I said, my daughter's been missing for five days, and this is the last known place she was at. Five days, and there's been no cops here? Five days. That's what I mean. No cops. What?

No cops. I mean, there's cops. Apparently, somebody, but they're not really, they're just going, have you seen this person? Nope. All right. And they get in the they don't. They're not really. They're just going. Have you seen this person? Nope. All right. And they get in the car and leave. They're not questioning anybody.

Oh, my God. It's fucking ridiculous. So she's missing. So a friend of hers checks basically Ashley. She looks on Ashley's social media and sees photos she's posted of marks on her arms where she had fallen. and sees photos she's posted of marks on her arms where she had fallen. And her friend, this is Brandy's friend, said it just seemed a little too coincidental that Brandy was missing and now Ashley has bruises all over her. Yeah.

Just seemed like a lot. So mom and Christy leave and take their investigation to the state police because they're not doing shit. So they had to go out canvas. Yeah, this is all shit. Cops do canvas with pictures. Have you seen this girl? No. Go to the last known location.

She was question a fucking suspect. Now the problem is they have to do this because they're trying to find their daughter, hopefully alive. So they're going to go question. But the reason why the cops should do this first is because they have a certain way of questioning that they're, you know what I mean? They want them to know. Right.

Yeah, they can surprise. Oh, yeah, we just want to talk to you about this and then hit them with a left hook about, oh, actually, motherfucker, we think you did this. So the cops have fucked this up six ways from Sunday. This is ridiculous. So these poor people, pissed off and enraged, take their information to the state police and go, here, assholes. Here's some information. And quote, unquote, this is evidence, motherfucker. Will you go talk to these fucking two?

And maybe you can get something out of them with authority. Not just me yelling in their front yard. This is a little different. Maybe you've taken a class on interrogations or something. Maybe use that fucking badge that they give you. Maybe use it now for this. So this is, I'm sorry, but if your kid is, imagine your fucking kid is missing for five fucking days. And you're the one who has to investigate it because the cops are like, I don't know.

What? Fuck, man. and this is 2012 this isn't 1975 where you're like i don't know you know kids are out there hitchhiking smoking the grass we don't know how to get them having sex with each other swinging no it's 2012 like fucking ridiculous so this is well beyond hayman lee territory we need to figure this out god damn it start looking so um apparently that at that point uh the da said quote they come and interview ashley barber and jane jane olmstead and they tell the same story she was supposed to come she called us they never showed up so that's that now um they report that the next day, apparently the parents were driving around, Carrie's driving around looking for her still.

Now the Kia Rio is now at the Barber house in the driveway where it wasn't in the driveway before. Now it's there. I guess Ashley Barber's mother reported to the state police that that that there was a car there and they don't know whose it is that she called the cops and said there's just a car in our drive we don't know whose car this is somebody left a car on our property okay now the car's exterior according to the mother carrie said she said the exterior matched the car but the interior didn't at all. What? Carrie, the mother, said, quote, I said, what's in it?

And the answer was, well, nothing is what she was told. And she said, I said, then something's happened. I said, because my daughter's car is a pigsty. I know my daughter's car. And if there's nothing in that car, something happened to my daughter. It's the truth. It's clean. There's something wrong.

Something wrong. something happened to my daughter it's the truth clean yeah something wrong something wrong um so they they figured the the police and the da even thought that it was staged here's a quote it's been staged it's been cleaned you had a missing person who was supposedly coming to this home barbara and olmstead tell the police she was never there there but yet the vehicle was found there yeah you can't you can't have the story i've, I haven't seen her since we told her to come here, and then you have her car. That's bad. Yeah, that's real bad. Real bad. They wait until the next day, then they're going to go grab Ashley and Jade and talk to them and bring them in for interrogation.

It's all very, can you start my orange? This is all a very fucking, you know what i'm saying everybody's taking their time everybody's real cash about this whole thing what missing girl we'll get to it we'll get to it why are you guys why are you so busy i got a fantasy football draft coming up i'm gonna get to that first that's on sunday my kids got a little league game gotta hit that up you know that's good i gotta i got a ribeye on the grill i gotta keep an eye on the flames i don't want to fuck this up it's a wagyu i gotta take it off early and let it rest you know what i'm saying so these are expensive

they got it's pricey it's a holiday babe so the uh a true state trooper Eric Malloy said, when we went back to the residence the next day to talk to them, Ms. Barber and Ms. Olmstead, they in fact went missing. In the middle of the night, they had packed their belongings and left the residence. Oh, that. They're fucking gone. What are you trying to do? Jesus Christ. For two people that are mad innocent, you're doing some mad guilty shit. Yeah.

Listen, Bonnie and Bonnie, come on back here for a fucking minute here. You're wanted. Chill out. for two people that are mad innocent you're doing some mad guilty shit yeah listen bonnie and bonnie come on back here for a fucking minute here you're wanted chill out you gotta know they're gonna want to talk to us a little more probably if nothing else so later on uh like i said this troopers go there they see the the whole deal um she is uh they're missing. So Carrie, uh, fucking, uh, her mom, Brandy's mom, she posts a message about her daughter's disappearance to the Facebook page of two different local radio stations. Oh shit. And says, quote, the PA state police have found her car last night. Uh, Barbara and Olmsted had been questioned the night before and told police that Brandy

never made it there. Then last night they stated that Brandy came there and got a ride from another friend. That's their new story we'll talk about. Then they said they never saw the car. They never saw the person that picked her up and that she walked down the dirt road to get picked up. The car runs? Why would she do that? I'm going to walk down to the end.

I'll leave in the driveway and then walk out there so they don't have to find the place. She also said that her daughter's car had been completely cleaned out, and she said that Ashley Barber had been taken to the hospital for an injury. Barber coincidentally went to the emergency room from falling down the basement stairs right around the time Brandy went missing, is what she posted on the Facebook page. She's putting them on public fucking blast. Honest to's she's shaking trees she really is man so um the uh ashley barber's father even signed a pennsylvania state police missing person declaration saying that his daughter was missing don't know where they are they they they went missing Then a trooper, State Trooper Joseph Stryle, he's off duty and traveling around here at the Park Avenue Plaza is where he is.

He spotted what he thinks are Ashley and Jade near the woods under the overpass of the Smock Bridge in Vernon Township. Jesus, they're under a bridge? Literally under a bridge downtown. This is fucking sad. We'll just live under a bridge? Literally under a bridge downtown. This is fucking sad. We'll just live under a bridge forever. This will work. They'll never find us. Jesus Christ.

They said the women matched the descriptions and that when he drove by them in his own vehicle, not even a police vehicle, they turned away from him. They both turned away from the car. Yeah. Which, you know, maybe they don't want to see you. I don't know.

Something tells me this guy's had that reaction from more than one woman. That's all I'm going to say. So then the women get in a car driven by an unknown man. They just hop in a car and take off. So this cop decides to follow after and he contacts the state police barracks in meadville he ends up catching up with the vehicle in a traffic light in meadville and he exited his vehicle identifying himself as a state trooper showed the driver the badge and asked the driver to park in the parking lot of the uh of a store nearby there. We're going to go grab who you got there in your car.

So troopers from the Meadville Barracks Forensic Services Unit are sent to 29558 Drake Hill Road. This is in Wayne Township technically, I guess, but on May 23rd here. This is to investigate an apparent what's been said is a possible blood stain in the Drake Hill Road roadway. Oh. In connection to this. So they're going to go check that out. At that point here, like we said,

the car was there. Now there's a blood stain. Blood puddle, right? Yeah. Christy said this is what ended up happening. Brandy's car was in the garage the whole time we were standing in the drive. We were so close. We were so close. Oh, my God.

We find out later that the car had been in the garage. They did the preliminary test in the road and found out that the substance was some kind of blood and certain. They find that they find other things that look suspicious around the house. So they get a formal search warrant. To bring in a cadaver dog as well. Yeah. Bring the cadaver dog in. Now there's something. One of the police troopers here said you could smell a certain odor of decay at certain times

depending on which way the wind was blowing. Take note of which way the wind is blowing, sir. That's a bad sign. You idiot. No shit. Hey, which way the wind is blowing sir that's a bad sign you idiot no shit hey uh which way is that blowing follow it's like it's like a dog in a cartoon going for a pie but the opposite get your legs up and just get in the scent stream follow it go so he said after spotting tire tracks leading across a grassy area from the road into a nearby woods, they followed the tracks to a logging road and then followed the logging road, the logging road as well. They said about 50 yards into the woods, they located a makeshift foundation was what they called it, which was covering dirt that wasn't the same color as its surroundings. Okay.

So an obvious disturbed earth situation here. So they plunge a stick into the dirt, as they do to look for shit, and the stick goes very easily into the dirt. So they said it's not even compacted, this dirt. It's not evenly compacted. All the wood's dirt is all even. So they said um you know seems like digging's been placed here so they bring in the excavators and they come in they

end up not having to dig very far under the earth here in a 22 inch deep grave stop that 22 inches fence footers are deeper jesus christ fucking lazy assholes uh lazy disrespectful that's what i mean not even not even respectful enough to not be lazy about this you know what i mean unbelievable in the ground they find brandy in there in the 22 inch grave uh she's fully clothed minus shoes and socks um she has a yellow colored rope wrapped around her neck. There's also an empty six ounce water bottle there as well. A black ski mask here. But they keep calling this hat a saw hat.

What is that? From the movie Saw. A saw mask? Not a mask. They keep calling it a hat. It's a cloth, some kind of hat. A saw mask? Not a mask. They keep calling it a hat. It's a cloth, some kind of hat. What is that? I don't know here, but they keep saying that.

They find that in there, as well as a black Ohio State College hoodie sweatshirt, and three or four large rocks were found on top of her as well. One especially large rock with blood on it was found on her chest her as well. One especially large block with, or rock, I'm sorry, with blood on it was found on her chest. Oh, no. Okay. Now, she's obviously deceased, and we'll talk about her injuries in a moment,

but we're going to talk about these interviews quickly with Ashley and Jade. Now, Ashley's first story was, I don't know what you're talking about. We never saw her. Never saw her. That's what she told the mom and everything. Her first official police story that she tells is, last time I saw Brandy, she was walking up Drake Hill Road to go be picked up by somebody.

And yeah. But as she was leaving, she this is a great this is a great story. She told Ashley and Jade, hey, clean that car that I brought. I drove my car. Why don't you wash my car for me? I'll be right back. Clean it and hide it for me. Thanks.

Why would you show up at somebody's house, your ex-girlfriend and her new girlfriend who hate you and just be like i'm gonna drop my car off and get picked up by somebody hey you guys detail my car and hide it for me would you no problem and they have like fucking you know yellow rags in their hand going no problem spray and stuff no that's not it's a terrible story you want the tire shine yeah and then hide it though hide undercarriage wash too all right why would she want her car hidden yeah i'll get that a rust proofing shirt so yeah they said that's that's a goddamn bad story ridiculous story and ashley said she's bruised up on her head and her arm because she fell down the cellar stairs that's where where we keep the tire shine. That's tough.

That's where we keep all the supplies. All the buckets, everything's down there. Hose attachment. The trooper, Eric Mallory, he conducted their interview separately. He said, I started out interviewing Ms. Barber, and she wasn't being truthful with me. She changed her story from Brandy never making it to the house to telling this guy that Brandy did come to the house but left to see another woman and said blah blah blah he says quote the second rendition of the story basically was that Ms. Stevens had showed up at the house and she had planned on meeting another young young woman by the name of Jamie she was being very clandestine about this

and she didn't want her parents to know or her grandparents to know Ms. Barber had indicated to me that after Ms. Stevens arrived at the house, they played video games. And she said Ms. Stevens actually took a phone call. She went outside onto the front porch and had some sort of conversation with somebody. When she came in, she had looked like she had just won the lottery. And basically, shortly after that, she gathered her personal belongings out of her vehicle and started walking down Drake Hill Road, and she was never seen again. That's a bad story. That's not a good story.

I don't know. She just didn't say shit. She just, like, came in happy and then got her shit and left and told us to hide her car. You know, usual things that people do. Yeah, but how happy was she? Like she won the lottery. Like she won the lottery. Who says that wow so he said basically they both stuck to the story that ms stevens had showed up and was running off to meet another

young lady and was never seen from again okay later in that same day ashley's got a different story she says listen obviously i didn't tell you the truth the first time. It's obvious. Yeah. You know it. I know it sounds implausible. Doesn't sound right. I'm going to tell you what really happened. Okay.

What really happened. Number three. This is after they find Brandy's body and everything like that. She says, listen, you're right. I mean, obviously Brandy was killed and she's buried at my house, near my house. And that's where she was going and everything like that but you have the wrong person is the problem it's not me and it's not jade my father actually killed her oh jesus yeah it was my father he he killed her that's right um i lied

earlier because i was afraid but not afraid anymore it's my dad okay it's my dad she told police that her father killed brandy because brandy, quote, looked like a boy. And her father wasn't very tolerant of homosexuality, is the quote. She said they said, you know, that's it. He says this is the DA later on. Ashley Barber comes up with this fantastical story and blames her father. She explains that Brandy, Ashley and Jade are down in the woods by the

fort. We'll get to that. And her father comes down and he's mad that the vehicle is there and he's mad that Brandy Stevens is there and he says some disparaging things about lesbians and homosexuality and Barber says that her father and Brandy end up getting in a fight. A fist fight, apparently.

Brandy's gonna fight somebody. 19-year-old girls usually try to fist fight 50- fist fight apparently. Brandy's going to fight somebody. 19-year-old girls usually try to fist fight 50-year-old men. That's a normal thing. A girl that reads music is – Yeah, that's what I mean, Brandy. Ashley maybe. She's quick to throw hands. Right, right.

Not Brandy. She says it's Ashley's father who then uses the shovel and attacks Brandy Stevens. So she says the father squared up with her, threw some bows, and then fucking... He needs a weapon. Then he decided he needed to shovel this 19-year-old girl. So this is fucking ridiculous. So they end up...

She's about 400 yards behind the house, the barber house buried in the woods. So someone needs to come up with something. So Olmsted, in her interviews, again, she said that she contacted Brandy and asked her to come to the house because she wanted to leave with Brandy. She said, so I was hoping she would come and take me because I wanted to leave with her. She said that that's the real reason why I called her here and that's also the reason that Ashley got mad

and didn't want her there. She said that she and Elmstead finally admits that she and Ashley are the ones that buried Brandy. Washed off the shovel and burned Brandy's shoes and belongings from her car, then moved the car into the garage.

She said that Ashley faked the bruises and disposed of Brandy's cell phone as well. Jade said, quote, she faked a fall down the basement stairs and her parents took her to Meadville Medical Center. And they said they put the phone down a storm drain at the drugstore where they went to fill her prescription after the hospital. Regardless, what you just said is a life sentence. What are you talking about? It's fucking horrible. We didn't kill her. We just did all of this.

We just did all this shit. She said that Ms. Barber indicated to me, this is the state trooper, that she had more information to tell me. But she wasn't going to say another word until she was able to look into Jade's eyes and wanted to be able to talk to her. Not a lawyer into Jade's eyes. I want to be able to make sure we get this connection. So they talk. He does let them talk because they say, we'll tell you everything.

Just let us talk for a minute to each other. So he says, all right, there you go. I know what you guys want to do. Sure. because they say, we'll tell you everything. Just let us talk for a minute to each other. So he says, all right, there you go. I know what you guys want to do. Sure. Then they're separated and recorded, and now it gets real. Okay. We talked to Ashley, and she tells police now that her mom and dad weren't involved. No shit.

Thanks. We know. In fact, they weren't even home, never mind involved. They didn't even in fact they weren't even home never mind involved they didn't even know of course they weren't even there she said that they her and and jade planned the whole thing to scare stevens she wanted to scare brandy because ashley had heard that brandy was abusive to jade because that's the bullshit story story Jade had been telling. So she said they were going to get her over there and scare her and say, leave her alone and don't ever talk to her anymore, even though Jade's calling asking for fucking 10 hour long rides. So it's ridiculous. So according to this plan, Jade's going to bring Brandy to the fort.

They're going to say, hey, we built this cool fort in the woods. Are they 12 year old boys now what's going on that would have worked on me when i was 12 and it did my friend built a fort and i was like this is fucking awesome so they're gonna get her to come see the fort and then uh at that point barbara ashley would jump out and be like you fucking stay away from her and you leave her alone and scare her basically and then and then brandy would run away to her car and get in it and never talk to Jade again. And then Ashley and Jade would be happily ever after

with no one ever bothering them. Until the next person. Until the next person, the next time Jade needs something else. So anyway, so that's what they said. They lured her into the woods. They were, you know, to see that, hey, we got this fort that we're building. Come check it out. Anyway, Ashley was hiding at the fort.

And when they got back there, Jade and Brandy, Ashley popped out and started hitting Brandy. She started hitting Brandy and then Jade jumped in too and started hitting Brandy. And they're both punching and kicking her. They stuffed the cap into her mouth to make her screaming quieter. That's what they did. They told the state trooper, quote, they said they were freaking out from her screams. They were kicking and punching her until she fell to the ground. kicking and punching her until she fell to the ground.

She was down. Brandy was face down on the ground when Ashley said she grabbed her by the head and beat her head against a tree stump multiple times. Gets worse, man. This is terrible. That's when Jade came in and hit Brandy on the head with a shovel four times. There was a shovel. Shovel four times, twice with the flat side, and then turned it to hit her with the sharp four times. There was a shovel. Shovel four times, twice with the flat side, and then turned it to hit her with the sharp edge.

Jesus Christ, what the fuck, man? One blow resulted in a large cut, and the other broke through her skull and revealed brain. Fuck, man. At that point, I guess it was Ashley who grabbed the yellow rope, which was already at the site they had the grave pre-dug jimmy it was dug already that's why they had that's why the shovel was there because they had dug the grave with it that's the only reason it was there they were

planning on doing it with the rope but she said oh shit this shovel i'll grab it because it's here already premeditated like a son of a bitch pre-fucking dug grave you canug grave? You can't argue that. It's over for you. Like, you could have the thought of it, and you could argue, like, you told your friend, I'm going to kill that son of a bitch, and then later you kill it, and you could say, hey, I didn't mean it like that, or whatever. There's a lot of ways to argue premeditation. We see it all the time. A pre-dug grave is like...

There's no way out of that. I mean, you didn't just think about or talk about it or mentally plan it you dug a fucking grave that's crazy and if you both took shifts and dig a body you're looking at each other going oh god that that gurney is going to be awfully lonely why don't you grab one too and hand them the shovel this is there's nothing you can do about this. This is there's no argument. No, this is your you're you're so fucked. So they grabbed the yellow rope and looped it around Brandy's neck and started to try to strangle her as well. So the Ashley ends up telling police that the bruise on her own forehead didn't come from falling down the stairs. It came from head-butting poor Brandy,

trying to inflict more pain on her as she was choking her. She was head-butting her as well. Jade told police that Brandy was screaming for her life, and she said, quote, it was like she was seeing someone no one else could see. She's dying. You're killing her, you fucking psychopaths, fucking scumbags.

This is from a quote from the state trooper who interviewed her. She was on the victim's back with her knee in her spine, pulling her head back with the rope and letting it hit the stump. Wow. That's what she was doing. This is fucking horrifying. Then they proceeded. It gets worse, by the way. What? Yeah. Then they proceeded to roll her by the way what yeah then they proceeded

to roll her into the shallow pre-dug grave yeah and it's at that point they realized that she's still alive oh dear fuck man yeah this is um wow they said they pulled um they said her shirt was pulled up so they could see her chest rise and fall so then barber through found uh ashley found a large rock and threw it on brandy's face jesus um so after jesus christ after this they poured water on her face and nose area to see if she's still alive yeah they said the first time at first the water gurgled then when it stopped they figured okay she must be dead now yeah so that's when they shoveled the dirt back on her at that point not dead um they said they told the police the sweatshirt they put the sweatshirt into

the grave because it had gotten so much blood on it anyway it was might as well just throw it might as well bury it with her yeah And the hat had been used afterwards. The hat, after they took it out of her mouth, had been used to, Jesus Christ, to pick up what Ashley Barber referred to as meat or brains. What the fuck, man? And put it in the hole. These two are fucking. Picked it up like doggy bags. Yeah, that's. Oh, oh my god this is quotes from the

interview here's mallory ashley let's clean the slate and just tell me what happened she says it was planned how did you get brandy to the house we just told her that we were going to hang out um she said jade sent a message to brandy inviting her to meet ashley and for them to check out the fort uh for the campsite they were building in the woods. So come on, meet my new girlfriend, hang out. You know, we got a camp thing. It's going to be cool. They said the girls tell Mallory that when Brandy arrived, Jade led her down the path to the fort and said the word babe, which was their code word.

That's when she's going to hop out at that point. When she says babe, that's when, you know, whatever. So Ashley says, I hear her say, hey, babe, and I ran as fast as I could. And I came down and Jade had her arm around her neck. So I came up and punched her in the face. I don't know how many times, but I know it broke her nose. Brandy was screaming. I said, do you know what she was saying

ashley uh barbara said jade stop it i won't tell anybody just let me go now i told people where i was so she's saying people know i'm here you dumb you guys are in a lot of trouble for this now and um she said that brandy would fight she fought back like a fucking you know she fought back she was punching kicking begging for help intermittently just just trying to get out and fucking save her life. She said the cop said she thought she was calling out to somebody like help me or something. And Ashley said, yeah, but it's like she knew she knew somebody else was there. I mean, my neighbor was cutting his grass in the back. I knew if she ran, I was not going to be able to catch her.

Plus, you know, her car being there and stuff. So I started beating her head off the tree stump. That's when the blood started coming. So you have potential witnesses right here. People know where the fuck she is. There's electronic fucking electronic trail leading

to you. People have her address and her car's in your fucking driveway and you're like, this is still a good idea. You're 400 in your fucking driveway and you're like this is still a good idea let's carry this out 400 yards from your house and you're gonna leave a body there you're an idiot well the neighbor's cutting the grass in the back where if this girl gets loose and runs away she's gonna hop over this neighbor's fucking fence bloodied up while he's trimming his fucking while he's weed whacking his bogan vias this is ridiculous and even if there's like noise from the lawnmower if that thing if he has to stop because there's a rock or something at any time he may hear what's happening

over yeah he may hear something awful right now that's what i mean this is a terrible fucking plan and just a disgusting thing to do obviously that's horrible i feel like that doesn't even need to be said but once in a while we have to stop and go this is fucking terrible i mean i get it we talk about murder every every week and it's all it's all bad but every once in a while we have to stop and go, this is fucking terrible. I mean, I get it. We talk about murder every week and it's all bad. But every once in a while we have to go, for the love of Christ, how do you fucking even. It's a lot. It's a lot. Especially, it's just a lot, man.

So that's when Jade grabbed the shovel, she said. So in the interview, he asked Jade, how many times did you say you hit her with the shovel? She said, I don't know, like four times. That's why Ashley had bruises on her arms because I accidentally hit her while she was holding Brandy down. In a mad frenzy panic, she's just throwing that shovel. She's just beating the whole anything moving with a shovel. The cop said, was anything being said by either of you ashley or brandy and jade said brandy was screaming for her life she said then ashley puts the rope around brandy's neck and

tries choking her while jade is beating her with a shovel in the head jesus um jesus christ um the cop said and what was brandy's reaction after that? And Ashley now back to her, she said, quote, she went limp, but she was gasping for air and she was saying, Jade, stop, Jade, stop.

The girl was laying in a puddle of her own blood. I started getting angry. And the cop said, what, what do you think made you angry about that? Like, he's like, I'm sitting in the middle of the fucking psychopath.

This is crazy. What made you angry? She said, quote, that she wasn't fighting back anymore. What? She enjoyed killing her. Yes, that's what I'm saying. Dude, that's crazy. Then she said, I pick up the back of the rope and I let her head hit the stump probably 10 times.

So she's just enjoying this. She's loving it. Yeah. Then they, like I said said drag her into the grave and um ashley said i picked up a big boulder because i could tell that she was still breathing and i walked over to the top of the grave and i smashed her face in how are you capable of this you fucking monster oh my god then she said we had a full bottle of water and i stood above her and poured it into her nose and mouth.

They were trying to drown her. Yeah. They were trying to basically waterboard her, essentially. She said, that's when they started covering her with dirt. And the cop said, do you think she was still alive when you buried her? And Jade, this is back to Jade now, Jade said, I don't know. I don't know. So she didn't know if she's alive. We might have buried her alive who

knows that's what she said basically that's staggering um yeah she said quote our intentions were to bring her over so we could kill her and the cop said okay there it is so thank you yeah that's you got it that's the one right there was your intentions we the so we know what happened we know she's dead we know the results so a to b easy peasy that's it and um by the way later on as we'll talk about with her injuries here well we'll talk wait for a second here now they also burned their own clothing worn during the murder because it must have been fucking covered in everything yes yeah and also burned some of brandy's stuff, as we said. In May of 1980, near Anaheim, California, Dorothy Jane Scott noticed her friend had an inflamed red wound on his arm and seemed unwell.

She insisted on driving him to the local hospital to get treatment. While he waited for his prescription, Dorothy went to grab her car to pick him up at the exit, but would never be seen alive again, leaving us to wonder, decades later, what really happened to Dorothy Jane Scott? From Wondery, Generation Y is a podcast that covers notable true crime cases like this one and many more. Every week, hosts Aaron and Justin sit down to discuss a new case, covering every angle and theory, walking through the forensic evidence and interviewing those close to the case to try to discover what happened. And with over 450 episodes, there's a case for every true crime listener. Follow the Generation Y podcast on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts.

You can listen to Generation Y ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus. They told police they burned Brandy's shoes as well with all of that now the official cause of death here um they first start out by saying miss stevens had multiple injuries from multiple different odd objects she had blunt multiple blunt force injuries to a large percentage of her body jesus um oh my god jesus christ so they they they fuck sustained blunt force trauma to the head, including 15 lacerations to the scalp. Multiple scalp and facial injuries, a skull fracture and hemorrhage, blunt force trauma to the body, a ligature around the neck, evidence of suffocation, including an article of clothing placed in her mouth the evidence of suffocation involving organic

and earthen ground liquid observations were summed up as suffocation in a setting of blunt force trauma and ligature application dirt and water suffocator suffocator her mud essentially

yeah assholes this is fucking disgusting um it doesn't get any any it doesn't get any more cold than this no it doesn't i mean people people you know you have to enjoy this there are plenty of murderers out there that will you know they're trying to get it over with they'll put the person out of their goddamn misery pretty fucking quickly you know what i mean this is like uh this is colder than leo at the end of titanic for i say yeah this is rough and just watching them fucking float down watch them sink so um yeah this is fucking crazy it's awful her friend christy, once they find out, said, quote, I want people to know that Brandy didn't deserve this. She was a college student trying to make her way through life.

Yeah, I would say. Her other friend said she was a wonderful person. She was nine years younger than me but was like a mother to me. She was very, very nice. Jesus. Another guy said this isn't supposed to happen here. It's something you hear about in big cities and um i hate that oh yeah well that's why we have small town murder because people say

that's why we do it they feel safe and idyllic and our whole show is to say you're not very safe you could be buried in a backyard in no time i deal that yeah i deal that motherfucker that's how it is so it's all point of the show see uh another guy here a uh area businessman said that he and his daughter were horrified by the whole thing after seeing and reading the news accounts of the case and um other people are horrified as well another guy a woman named janet hopkins said it's strange for a small town i don't think i've ever even heard of another murder around here. It's pretty sad. So, yeah, I don't think whether there's murders or not, it's still sad.

I can think of one and that's bad enough. It's fucking terrible. Now, the funeral for Brandy, she is cremated because her mom said she didn't want to bury her again. Fair. Oh, God. Yeah. You wouldn't want to rebury her. What's more heartbreaking of a sentence than that i've never heard anything no that hit me right in the heart before that's sadder than that

oh poor lady that is fucking horrible man um that's fucking horrible um uh christy did her eulogy here she said all brandy wanted was to be herself in a world without prejudice. And I believe Brandy achieved that goal the best she could. Brandy was an inspiration to others. She taught others not to fear who you are, but to embrace his or herself. She shared 20 years with us and now it's time to cherish those years. Um, yeah, uh, everywhere. Our friends talked about how smart she was and how great she was to talk to.

And she knew little bits of knowledge from everything. She took a trivia kind of a person. She knew cool little factoids and shit. And they liked hanging out with her. Christy said no matter what you told her, it wasn't going to offend her. She wasn't going to get mad at you. She was just a super understanding person. She was able to put herself in anyone's shoes.

She just had this incredible energy being around her made you feel good yeah we need people like her yeah we need less people rad yeah fucking yeah she did seem really cool we do need less people like ashley and jade though because ice veins um oh it gets worse jimmy really remember veins. Um, Oh, it gets worse. Jimmy really remember how I said it gets worse. It gets worse. Now, do you think after they did that,

how would, how, if you did that, how would you feel afterwards? If you did that to another human being who didn't like molest your daughter or something, just someone who had did nothing to you, just, uh,

you know, maybe you had a slight disagreement or something, but no fucking like nothing that's like you killed my mom. Yeah, I guess I'll bet my father prepared to die. I guess I'll bet her off because I know I'm in. But if I'm if I'm capable of something like that, you can. These two can do fucking anything and it would not surprise me now. That's what i mean you're good well apparently they went inside after all that and no they got out a little journal little notebook

that they write in yeah and on that date may 17th it's dated in their handwriting and one of their handwritings 2012 they wrote about how wonderful the murder was. Oh, yeah, yeah. No, they didn't even feel bad about it. They thought it was great. They thought the whole thing was just top notch. Ice cold. Jade wrote that with, quote,

this beautiful memory of this murder, eventually we will want another kill. What the fuck, man? They think they're like natural born killers now. This is starting up. Eventually we'll want to kill we will want another kill what the fuck man they think they're like natural born killers now they're starting this is starting up eventually we'll want another kill and she's doubted that she would get caught for it she said it feels like it was the perfect murder i don't know wow that's the yeah 2012 is too late for that attitude yeah i'm sorry it's too fucking late for that dipshits have you ever seen an episode of law and order you've left way more evidence than most on that case on that and that's a dramatization watch fucking forensic files for five minutes

fucking the first 48 this is a terrible crime you can you are idiots wow the story of she walked away that ought to hold no one will doubt that i'm sure eventually we'll want another kill oh that's gonna be tough it's gonna have to be your cell mate because you're gonna be in close proximity to that person and that person only they did start the fska though the future serial killers of america which is a program that it's very nice for the kids you know monthly dues are a little steep but well it's tough it's tough it goes to defense all the postage too if they want to write you back from prison it's going to be difficult so um another time and in the book this is in the same same

page they were both writing on it um she she talked about that she used a shovel to hit her jade jade jade said that uh it was perfect the whole thing hitting her with the shovel using a shovel was perfect because that way she could see skull and brains mixed in the dirt what oh this is freddy krueger shit man we're getting in the we're getting in the crazy pocket robin territory yeah this is nuts dude this is fucking nuts um at one point she said the that person didn't deserve to have life jade wrote in the book then said do i feel guilty not an ounce no i feel proud yikes then oh my god yeah then ashley writes her thing in here she writes in the journal in the form of a letter to a letter to brandy's mom instead of this she says quote jesus this is these people are fucking horrible quote i fucking murdered

your 20 year old mistake she deserved it bitch that's what she said the the incrimination that these are two morons two fucking idiots then from jail while she's being held ashley wrote a letter to her parents hinting that she said this won't be my last and it was not my first murder. All right. Yeah. They said that she was also trying to deflect some of the blame. She was trying to take some of the blame off of Jade. She was trying to take the blame from Jade.

And she was saying that they were saying she was doing that to make herself look tougher. And she was saying that she was they were saying she was doing that to make herself look tougher, you know. So the charges against them are first degree murder, but they don't know whether they are going to seek the death penalty yet for these two. Because they're young. Why? Well, he'll explain it. He says, quote, he says, they never really came out and explained to the state police what their motive was. I always believed that it was their crazy attempt to show one another how much they cared for each other. Jade Olmsted had explained to the state police that Ashley Barber was very jealous. And I believe when Ashley found out that Jade was still communicating with Brandy, they decided that she had to go. Brandy Stevens wasn't bothering these two people and they basically lured her here to

murder her. Yeah. So, you know, this is a friend of hers here. Haynes is her last name. It's Tara Haynes. She says, quote, Normally, I'm not a big fan of the death penalty. I think people should have to sit in jail and think of what they've done. But I don't feel that Jade and Ashley are sitting there feeling bad.

So I do want the death penalty in this case. That's true. They're not feeling any remorse about it. She said that she doesn't believe Brandy would, though. She says she doesn't think Brandy would want the death penalty for these people. She said Brandy had a huge heart. The people who took her life, she still wouldn't want to see them hurt. That's what she's about, man. is that she's about yeah I mean that's some people a lot of

people are like that man I don't know I might feel that way right up until you start pouring water and then burying me I'd be like man go ahead and kill these two what if one of my cousins wants to go kill them awesome revenge my death but I don't really want some weird state thing happening. That's creepy. No, I think it's creepy. I think the whole thing's fucking creepy. I don't. And then if it's a family member, I don't have that.

My great grandmother was murdered. None of us. We didn't all go down there and sit there and say, I want to see her fry. They said they were going to give her. It was a 21 year old woman who had a kid and she was a crackhead who did it and all this shit. And they said they're going to cut a plea deal with her. And we could have said, no, you go for the death penalty because it was a 21-year-old woman who had a kid, and she was a crackhead who did it and all this shit. And they said they're going to cut a plea deal with her. And we could have said, no, you go for the death penalty because it was a robbery. You tied an old lady to a chair, cut her throat, and robbed her.

That's pretty fucking bad. But our whole family said, what good does that do? True, yeah. How does that help us? It doesn't. The thing that would help us would be to move on from the whole thing, not to seek vengeance, and it doesn't work. would help us would be to move on from the whole thing not to seek vengeance and this doesn't work and we are clouded also by gender in situations like this where if if a dude did this yes oh is two dudes did this this would be we need to be insane and that's the the justice system does

give and this is statistically i'm not saying every time because there are judges i'm sure leniency is crazy yeah but if you look at sentencing for similar crimes women get less of a sentence because generally half the time there's a guy involved in the crime too that probably have forced them to do it and shit like that yeah but this is a this is tough man um christ even in those cases sometimes the woman gets out and the dude stays in. Yeah, we've seen that how many times on this one. It happens all the time. Happens all the time. Now, Christy, her friend, said that she recently saw an episode of Law & Order SVU where the detective put himself in jail for a day in solitary confinement to see what it was like.

And she said there's no one to talk to no window in the tiny cell and no way to tell if it's day or night so pretty soon the detective starts freaking out she says he starts banging on the cell door saying i told you 24 hours not a week that's what i that's what i want for them like you've been in here 45 minutes yeah it's it's not even lunch yet bro you haven't even peed yet how could you think there's been here a week you haven't even written in your own shit yet you've not experienced the entire the entirety of solitary you've not even made a mural in your own feces i feel like to break though i feel like this isn't going as much as you want it to you're almost there bob ross yeah no shit now Now, the Barber family, Ashley's parents, James and Marie Barber, they don't feel justice will be served until their daughter is set free.

What? Ashley needs to be set free. They don't believe she actually killed Brandy. That's crazy. They said, quote, we didn't believe most anything they said about her at the hearing. The things they accused her of, it's just not feasible. She said it, you guys. Really?'s just not feasible she she said it you guys really it's not feasible she wrote it you guys she's got a real act of imagination then because she said a whole lot of shit where if you came up with that it either happened or you should start writing stephen king books because you should start writing horror

thriller books because you came up with some fucking terrifying scenario. Yeah, it's absolutely disgusting and made my stomach turn. So I'm going to say and then the police and the medical examiner corroborated with physical evidence exactly what her story is. So exactly. Perfect. You weren't there. You're bad parents. You're dopes.

Shut up. Yeah. You fuck something up along the way to cause this. You blew it. I don't know what it was, but something something bad happened. and it's out of the barn already horse out of the barn here it's over with there's no let's just get out there and chase it yeah nope it's over with hope may you have any other kids that's what i would say any anybody else if you do start concentrating on to make sure this shit doesn't happen again hug them a little more yeah please because ashley

might have needed it. Otherwise, she wouldn't be a murderer. Right. Who knows? So Ashley, they said she studied film production at the Art Institute of Pittsburgh, and she was going to go into the police, not the police, the Peace Corps. She's going into the Peace Corps. She's not a murderer.

Come on. She said, quote, my daughter is a good person. She's a humanitarian. What the fuck she beat 90 percent beat a girl to death and then buried her alive that is not a humanitarian act whatsoever just like bringing mosquito nets to africa what is humanitarian about that what is that is that daughter's an asshole oh yeah she that asshole is the best way to describe her i think you're mixing up humanitarian with barbarian barbarian or

non-human entity maybe she mixed those words up monster uh she has helped people all her life except for this one she uh one of uh her friends one of brandy's friends wondered if jude and uh if jade i'm sorry jade not jude jade and ashley said do they understand what they've done she said quote i wonder if they even realized not only what they've done to so many lives but what they've done to their own lives because they don't have lives now. They essentially took their own lives, too. Yeah. So the district attorney decides not to pursue the death penalty. Is that right? Not to pursue it. He says, and he gives full explanation, because people certainly are like, hold on a minute.

I got a feeling why he's doing it. There's a lot. Well, he spells it right out, too. There's nothing between the lines to read here. He says, after careful consideration of the law and the facts that have been uncovered in the investigation of this case, I've decided not to seek the death penalty against either defendant. Although the allegations surrounding the murder of Brandy Stevens suggest that the attack that led to her death was brutal, those allegations alone are not sufficient to warrant the seeking of the death penalty under Pennsylvania law. alone are not sufficient to warrant the seeking of the death penalty under Pennsylvania law. He says he'll seek first degree murder convictions and try to get mandatory life and life in prison sentence out of it that he'll get. He says, but under Pennsylvania law, a prosecutor may only

seek the death penalty in a case of an alleged first degree murder if at least one of 18 aggravating circumstances is present. OK. Eighteen. Eighteen. Any one of the 18. He said in this case, there's no evidence to prove any of the death penalties qualifying aggravating circumstance beyond a reasonable doubt. This decision was not one made lightly or without first consulting other prosecutors in my office and the Pennsylvania State Police. Just because something is horrific doesn't make it a death penalty case.

He said, we would have to prove it was the intent of the actors to inflict substantial and unnecessary pain on the victim. In this case, they were simply ineffective in killing, in attempting to kill her. That's why the death took longer. They're saying the plan wasn't to torture her. They're just fucking inept at what they're doing. They're just not good at this. They're saying if they had a gun and put two in her head,

they would have been just as satisfied with that. The point wasn't to do all this, but I don't know. It seems like Ashley really fucking enjoyed. She was having fun. Seemed like she was enjoying that shit. But it also feels like even if even if that would be a difficult case to prove you've also got two defendants who who knows they may try to play off of each other they could muddy it so much other the fact is they both

admitted that they were going to kill somebody somebody's dead and they did it so slam dunk for fucking first degree and life in prison and life in prison yeah and if you have the death penalty off the table too well you could there's two ways of looking at you could have the death penalty on the table and then use that as leverage to try to get a plea and you can offer life but also if you take the death penalty off the table then you're more likely to get a plea because they're going to get life and not the death penalty so it's a it could go either way depending on the person he did say the age and the gender were also factors too.

God damn it. It's the truth. He said based on my experience and it's what a jury will do. And it's got... I'm a father. I have a 20 year old daughter. You know what I mean? 21 today actually. And she is... I would look at this from both

sides and I don't think I could execute a 20-year-old girl. Because that's, you know what I mean? I just don't think I could do it. And I think that's the general consensus. If it's a 20-year-old boy, I'm like, you little shithead. But for some reason, for me, I have a soft spot for my daughter. You know, it always melts me i can't it couldn't do it now at the same time i wouldn't want my 20 year old daughter being butchered like that but if it

was by another 20 year old that would really fuck with my brain 20 year old girl i would i would lose it look at the other side of the coin it's not not necessarily a young girl jody arias uh dressed herself like a fucking librarian and she carved a man up and shot him and she you know i mean she got life so it's possible that it's possible she did everything he walks free you never you know what i mean and there's oj's free and scott peterson's in jail and it happens both you know for women though it's so easy to not give them the death penalty because uh because they're a lady and it's for me anyway for a guy it's hard to destroy a woman i can't say from the opposite whether women feel the same way because

i'm not a woman but from a guy's point of view i'd be way less i'm not giving the death penalty probably to anybody just because that's not my responsibility mind my own fucking business here but i'm saying like if i had to i couldn't i'm not doing it with a woman. I'm just not, I'm not killing a woman. I just can't do that. I don't want to sit on a jury at all. That sounds horrible. It's very, it's a very Italian thing.

I'll only kill guys, but still, I don't want to do it. So he said, based on my experience, I didn't believe a jury would give them the death penalty. Being female,

being that young, and the fact that I didn't know I could prove they had the intent to torture. So he's like, it didn't, you know, it was a long shot and i didn't want to look like i was losing something because at that point then you look like you lose so um uh her her friend christy though brandy's friend christy said she was confused by it she said it seems like he's taking it easy on them does this mean i can plan out a murder dig a grave kill a person then live off taxpayers money

in jail for the rest of my life well yeah if you want to fucking kill somebody sure that's also called prison it's not pleasant live off taxpayer money sounds like you're in your apartment ordering fucking uber eats and playing video games well it's it's it's it is prison they're making me stay here and sending me food all day that's the nicest they ever made prison sound but it's it's different so um they said no sort of punishment will bring brandy back so i have reluctantly excited i've reluctantly accepted the da's decision is what christy ultimately said she's like i don't get it but you know what it's not going to help anyway with brandy and that's a healthy attitude because you can't can't live seeking that vengeance forever like that and it'll eat you up inside right

especially if this person's in prison and they can't hurt anybody else anyway and and you can't live seeking that vengeance forever like that, and it'll eat you up inside. Right, especially if this person's in prison and they can't hurt anybody else anyway. And you can't get her back, so what are you going to do? You know what I mean? That's what I mean. You've got to have some sort of closure and move on. But that sounds so cold to say, too. You know what I mean? But it's for your own sanity.

Yeah, right. And you'll feel like you're not giving that person their due, your loved one their due, but it's not. own sanity yeah right it's not and you you you'll feel like you're not giving that person their due your loved one their due but it's not it's not that your loved one wouldn't want you to sit and torture yourself god no that's the thing nobody would unless they were real asshole you know think about it more it can hurt yeah i'm dead damn it doesn't hurt as much as that so i took a shovel did you did you yeah nobody wants that no so at the there's a competency hearing for ashley there's a psychiatrist and she said she interviewed ashley here for about four and a half two i'm sorry two to a half hour session so an hour she spent with her and she said it's a lunch break a lunch break yeah that's not it doesn't seem like

enough time to fully diagnose a human being's mental you ever sat with a friend on for two lunch breaks and known everything you couldn't even get through you know where are you from what are your parents like did you get along with your siblings like you wouldn't even get through all that never mind anything else that's two stories of the bad first day at school that's it yeah there's no there's no you can't get into anything that leads to something else anyway this uh doctor said that ashley suffered from major depression disorder as well as a sleep disorder and borderline personality disorder which she must have line would explain a lot laid it all out but i guess so very quickly i think a lot of it's based on her actions too yeah they also said that she was apathetic and not able to see herself going to trial in the case.

And that Ashley also had a, quote, passive death wish. She's not in reality, this Ashley. She's in another. She's a very dangerous personality type is what she is. Bad girl. And very bad uh they said despite anti-anxiety anti-anxiety and depression medication she had not been sleeping and has lost 20 pounds since being in jail really and uh she said lack of sleep and weight loss or symptoms of depression obviously and uh she said that barbers

that ashley's apathy to the situation didn't give her the ability to engage in her own defense she basically just didn't give a shit ability to engage in her own defense. She basically just didn't give a shit. She was like, whatever, whatever. She turned like sullen teenager. And her psychiatrist said she's not able to cooperate with her attorney. She needs more intensive treatment to restore competency. Now, under cross-examination, they said, isn't she just kind of an asshole, though? Come on.

You know, they said that during her interviews, she was able to provide answers to questions. And the doctor said, yes, her answers are logical, relevant, and goal-oriented. So they said, okay, that sounds competent. That sounds pretty competent. And they said, the mother, anyway, said that, quote, this is Brandy's mother competencies, whether defendants able to. Oh, no participant in her defense case. She understands. I don't see competency as lacking. There's no reason this case isn't able to move forward. Let's fucking go.

So in court, by the way, Christy says they were basically the prosecutors took the friends and family aside the night before. She said, quote, the night before, the detectives told some of us that the details would not be, would not be, told us the details so we would not be so terribly surprised. But even after that, it was still shocking to hear what Brandy went through.

They didn't know exactly what happened until court came out and the details would have to be read in court, that whole thing that we talked about, and they were just like, holy shit. So they had to sit them down and go this is what happened so you guys don't gasp yeah don't make noises in court right yeah um she also said christy said she was like the little sister that everyone would want to have and for her to be brutally murdered is unfathomable yeah i would say um so does jade i think think Jade figured that out because she please she takes a plea deal.

Yeah. She's like, I don't want to go through all this. Her attorney said that she only wants to plea to spare the Stevens family further pain. Fuck you. Yeah. Further pain. Yeah. OK.

So one of the reasons for her plea, in addition to the fact that she is guilty, is that she didn't want to make Brandy's family sit through the trial. That's what the lawyer said. Oh, my God. Christy said she's happy with the plea, the friend. She said, I'm glad she pleaded guilty and allowed Brandy's family the slightest of relief to not have to go to trial twice. to give her credit for that but her conscious her conscience must have come um her conscience must have come back uh to uh to decide to plead guilty before the trial this might be the first sign of human behavior she's exhibited since planning the the planning of the senseless murder um yeah so jade is questioned in court by the judge about are you pleading to this are you

saying this she said quote we were going to kill her and they are you pleading to this are you saying this she said quote we were going to kill her and they said you're going to kill her and she said yes and she said that you know they talked about and agreed to lure her to the home in order to kill her when she arrived jade walked into the woods and barbara was hiding and surprised her and punched and kicked her she said quote the shovel was already down there from us digging out the grave. Holy Jesus Christ. She talked about hitting her. Yeah, it's it's fucking terrible.

They said the judge asked, did you see visible injuries to Brandy's head? And she said yes and admitted to seeing a lot of blood. And she said yes and admitted to seeing a lot of blood. So the judge is rightfully horrified as well as everybody fucking else. During sentencing, Carrie, Brandy's mom, she said that her daughter looked for the good in everyone and was sensitive to others' needs and was just starting out her life. And it's bullshit. She said, quote, she was cruelly and unjustly taken. She was taken from us. It's been very hard every day. She said, quote, she was cruelly and unjustly taken. She was taken from us.

It's been very hard every day. She never hurt anybody. Yeah, I would say not. Christy said, we're all different people since Brandy's been taken away. Another friend said, a cruel and sick-minded person. You deserve much more than life in prison. You deserve every bit of torture you gave Brandy and then some. That's the aunt. That deserve every bit of torture. You gave Brandy and then some that's the ant.

That's a, that's Brandy's aunt. However, her father, Jade's father, um, said that, uh, quote me and my wife,

our hearts go out to the family. When we moved to Maryland, we hope to keep her away from people. She had trouble with in her past. She, they talked about the fact that Jade was, uh, molested by a neighbor when she was 13

but the man was never prosecuted that's probably more about her her a lot of molestations don't get prosecuted because if there's not physical proof then it's word against word and a lot of times they'll get away with it like that there's a lot read michael jackson's book the book about him oh boy um be careful who you love is the name of it it's fucking disturbing so um he then said quote i don't want to i don't want her portrayed as a monster well that we're already past that brother sorry read her words sir that she wrote in her own handwriting. I'm truly sorry for the family. What Jade Olmsted did. Oh, no, this is the defense attorney. Her defense attorney said what Jade Olmsted did 18 months ago was monstrous, but she's not a monster.

She's guilty and freely acknowledges that. She does not want to make Brandy's family sit through another trial. She knows how terrible the thing is she and Ashley have done to their daughter. Then Jade has to talk and she said she's truly and deeply sorry for what happened. Brandy did not deserve what happened to her. Yeah. Then the judge said that. Wow. He couldn't imagine what the victim's family was going through. He said, was this hardness of heart? did the did this occur through coercion was mental illness involved or was it pure evil I don't know but this act under these circumstances with these facts has only one option and that option is life in

prison not that that'll bring Brandy back but I'm hoping it'll bring some sense of closure to the family you ma'am may fuck off life in prison without parole by the way whoa yeah no parole life in prison and she pled no she pled to that there's no going back you're still we'll we'll talk about oh my god um they said also her defense attorney said later on to the press that the life sentence is not entirely written in stone. The present state of the law in Pennsylvania is that she's not permitted to have parole. However,

the one thing we were able to accomplish is that we agreed that if there were ever a change in the law, she would have the benefit of being able to petition the court for a sentencing hearing at which she could present mitigating factors that might result in something different than a life sentence. So there's a lot of ifs there so fingers crossed what they'd have to change the law there's a lot going on now uh obviously ashley's got a plead too now she's fucked she was going to go to trial but now that jade pleaded and she's there to fully testify against her and it's all right it's hard to you're fucked now and they're going to say it's all you it's all you so it's just gonna be an ugly trial so um the um she goes to court and uh pleads guilty like we said and uh her mother

marie this is uh ashley's mother said i want to extend a heartfelt apology and sympathy to brandy's family and friends the way our daughter is portrayed is not the girl we know and love. She said she's an activist, wanted to join the Peace Corps. She said, I pray one day she'll prove her value to society. I have to be from prison, chicky. So that's wow. That's unbelievable. Then she has to talk herself here, Ashley.

And she says one action does not define someone's life this too shall pass for me overall i'm sorry what could you get a more callous own death callous my god you're doing this to show all i care about is contrition that's the if you're not gonna say that don't say shit she said one you hit her head against a tree how many times each one of those is one action fuck you she said this too shall pass no for me because i'm the important thing i'll get that overall i'm sorry what the fuck does that next time you get in a fight with your with your spouse everybody out there try that one go listen okay one action doesn't mean i'm a bad person this too shall pass overall i'm sorry they'd be like overall what the fuck does that mean what are you not sorry about what are you sorry in a fucking umbrella no what

specifically are you sorry about that shit doesn't work on a personal level never mind in court those are words i say to my bowels after i eat a microwavable burrito when i'm sitting on the toilet yeah overall i'm sorry but it was this too shall pass for me this burrito too sorry about this colon we'll get through it we'll get through it it together. Together. But stick with me. Don't fall out, please. She's an asshole. Then she said, I don't have much to say. I have no explanation. You may not believe me, but I do apologize.

Baby, don't talk. Stop. Just shut the fuck up. It gets worse. What are you doing? Every time. Every fucking time. You're making your mom look like a jerk.

Your whole family. You're an embarrassment. So the judge says, you, ma'am, you young. Did I say you, sir, earlier? You, ma'am. Yeah, you did. I did. Sorry.

You, ma'am, you, young lady, whoever you want to say it may fuck off, life in prison for her, too. I feel like she should get a little worse. I don't know. Like, she should have to get kicked in the ass once in a week or something. Come out for your ass kicking. They just give her a good solid. Like a guy puts a big boot on and just gives her a good like in The Simpsons. Yeah.

Like when Bart took the frog to Australia. Yeah. They just fucking whatever the hell happened in Australia. Something he pissed off the whole continent anyway um now the you want to know they're not together anymore by the way her lawyer jade's lawyer said they're no longer a couple he said quote i'm uh they sure are they sure are not in fact they may have been since they were arrested about 18 months ago kept separated because there's a lot

of antagonism between the two they got to keep them separated so they don't attack each other now so jesus um they asked him about um what about your client's journal entries let's talk about that this is their her lawyer jade's lawyer said quote it's so heinous i'd rather not repeat it it certainly indicated as of that day a lack of remorse can we not can we not wow holy i would say it certainly indicated a lack of fucking remorse is one way to put it now after brandy's death a friend of hers mentioned that they could they said why don't you sell wristbands to raise money for the? But Brandy's mom said that the funeral costs were being covered by an organization that does advocate work for victims' families. That's cool.

So they got some wristbands and they got some donations too. And they saved up to do this memorial bench. They wanted to put a bench maybe at her high school or something like that. They ended up getting a memorial bench in 2013 was unveiled on the campus of Youngstown State University. Awesome! Yeah, it's really cool. So it's a

memorial thing. They said that they hold their candlelight vigils every year at the bench. They said that they used the remaining donations to fund a scholarship in her name as well. The scholarships went to Boardman High School students who were pursuing an education in music because that's what she loved. And every year on May 17th, they hold a vigil in honor of Brandy on the campus by the bench there. They said usually about 20 to 30 people show up, light some candles and shit.

Hey, maybe this year, maybe more will come because now more people know about it. So this year, go support the family. They probably like that. Just don't ask weird questions. Don't ask anything. Don't be weird. Don't ask a thing. Just be respectful and be cool.

But support. It's nice. So 2015, Ashley is going to appeal. She says her previous lawyer was ineffective and her mental state was not taken into account when she entered a guilty plea to murder. So, you know, you can just take that life sentence back and all that stuff back. We're going to have a do-over. What do you say? So they had a hearing about it. to understand fully the consequences of her actions when she entered her plea of guilty and claims that her previous attorney failed to explain the nature and consequences of her actions to her.

She claims that her previous attorney didn't have the appropriate experience and qualifications necessary to counsel her, as a matter of fact. What? Yep, he was just a fucking idiot. So they argue that the court failed to properly take into account a medical diagnosis of Barber's incompetence and mental status with regard to understanding and voluntarily entering a guilty plea. They said if the evidentiary hearing was held that she would testify to suffering from an unhealed concussion. So she got CTE? She got CTE from that day

and being suicidal or near suicidal at the time of her plea as well. So she, her brain was a, like every murder suspect's head isn't a little fucked up from being in jail and being accused of murder. That's everybody. It's just everybody.

You're convicted. You were going to jail for a murder you did and wrote about i'm sure you weren't i'd be probably suicidal too no shit so then 2016 jade says i'm gonna do the same thing oh my god i'm gonna do it as well she does it but then ends up pulling it back yeah They said that she'd only be able to file an appeal of her sentence if the law she were convicted under were to change. So she's in there for life. And they said the court had discussed the difficulty of a successful appeal. Her public defender said, listen, you have nothing to appeal.

There's nothing. You admitted to everything. You wrote it down. It all matches up with the medical facts. And you went in court, told them about it, and said, I i'll take the guilty plea what part of that do you want me to fix also the part where you said i don't want to drag the family through this yeah now you're gonna drag the family through it what the fuck's wrong with you that's the thing they said you voluntarily entered a guilty plea now you're gonna have it she wanted a trial like what are

you gonna do in a trial you're gonna get to lose. You're going to die. This is stupid. They said evidence in the case hadn't been suppressed. Nothing's been suppressed. Everything is, you're done, dude. So then Ashley, she, people keep saying withdraw your, she decides not to withdraw her guilty plea after all. Okay. Okay. The judge, well, she wants to, but the judge says, no, you're going to have your guilty plea after all okay okay uh the judge well she wants to but the judge says no you're gonna have your guilty plea ashley the judge wrote three specific examples of

contra uh conversational detail-oriented statements barbara made that demonstrated she was paying close attention and participating in court yeah so quote she exhibited both the ability and the desire to communicate her understanding to the court. She was able to correct the court when necessary and demonstrated she was thinking critically during the process. He said based on the entire record, including Barber's answers to various questions about her competency and mental health, all led her to the clear, all led to the clear, inescapable conclusion that she was competent at the time she entered the plea. They said that the judge said that the lawyer was a credible lawyer and didn't force her to do it and didn't know what he was doing. He said he was prepared or at least notably prepared and ready for trial. It was the it was the petitioner, which is Ashley, for her own reasons that indicated a desire to enter a plea and conveyed the same to counsel. Not his fucking fault.

They said she entered a knowing voluntary and intelligent guilty plea. And, um, they said you can fuck off basically is how that goes. The district attorney said it can be a frustrating part of the job and it certainly is frustrating for victims and their families. However, most defendants are unsuccessful.

Our judges in Crawford County do an excellent job of covering all the legal requirements on the record with defendants when they are entering pleas of guilty. Yeah, that's just dot the I's, cross the T's. That's all it is. So now Brandy's mom, give her the final word, I think, in this whole thing. She said here that she believes there's a lesson in this for everybody, even though this is a terrible thing to happen. She goes, hopefully her friends, people that know her, people that hear about this will take at least this lesson from it. Quote, listen to your gut. You have a bad feeling.

Don't just text somebody that you have a bad feeling. This is where I'll be if something happens to you. If you have a bad feeling, don't go. just don't go yeah that makes a lot of sense yeah that's what you said earlier and that's exactly the truth yeah saying that's good that we can find your murderer later but we'd rather you be alive that'd be better we'd rather find you out there we'd rather find you alive we're not in a fucking 22 inch grave um christy horvath the friend also said quote the fact that she was taken in such an ugly way for such a beautiful person a beautiful soul it was just shocking that's why i don't want her to be remembered by how she was taken i want her to be remembered

as who she was before so there you go um poor brandy jesus christ unbelievable man i like brandy this sucks man she seemed cool and uh this is very uncool what happened to her and just a so unnecessary i hope somebody wins a grammy uh that that uh benefits from her scholarship that's right how fucking depressing man so unnecessary because it's not it's not like they lived down the street and every time they drove by, they had to see her car. They literally made her drive an hour and a fucking half to get there so they could do this to her. It made no fucking sense. And it seems like if they just said, if Jade said, don't text me anymore, she wouldn't have.

That would have been it. Jade was the one that kept initiating fucking contact. So what are we talking about this is just these two i don't think the fact that they started writing a journal about it the day of it tells me that these two and from what they said afterwards i honestly honestly feel like they said let's start killing people yeah well that felt great because i can surely do that yep that felt great and they're gonna they're documenting it in their journal for themselves to be like so they can go back and read it and figure that's what i feel like it is i really feel like they were planning on on killing more people because there was no reason to kill her so if there's no reason to

kill her that tells me that you're capable of killing anybody yeah anybody out there and um i'm just i'm this was disturbing very just the way they worse worse over their her parents know what she's capable of as a person too and they're gonna stand in open court with the victim's family there and say that are you out of your fucking what it's fucking crazy man unreal and and at what point while someone's committing a murder like this that isn't like it isn't a mob hit it isn't like i'm killing my my uh girlfriend's husband for insurance money or some bullshit like that this is a there's no benefit to this at all. None. None. No benefit from this. So to me, it's like, at what point during the murder that it's not going well do you go, what are we fucking doing? Yeah, we're so bad at this. This is taking a long time.

And then you're like, well, we can't stop now, I guess, because we've half killed her and she's going to go tell everybody and then we're going to get in trouble. But Jesus Christ, at least she's alive and you're not in prison for the rest of your life you dumb fuck this is this is fucking hard but they didn't ever have that thought that oh my god this is terrible they were like oh good hit her more let's i'll just choke her more she got mad when she her body went limp think about that think about the mentality of i'm trying to choke someone to death oh they stopped pulling. That was fun. I liked fucking.

I liked feeling them fight back against me trying to murder them. That's disturbing. The fight must have been a long, long fight, too. And she still was upset that that long fight was over. Gee, that's fucking disturbing. I am. That chick is capable of anything. I think I think Jade is pretty malleable.

Yeah. But I think Ashley is a dangerous person, man. I really do. So I think Jade is just as dangerous because you put her with somebody that's dangerous like that and she'll just do whatever that person tells her to do. That's scary. That's it. Bonnie and Bonnie. Let's fucking do it.

I'm on it. That's it. So either way, that is Cochranton and Wayne Township and Meadville and that whole area, Pennsylvania. Wow. Holy balls. That was crazy. Jesus. If you enjoy the show, you want to tell the world about it, tell the world about it, please.

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same way the same table we set up the screen behind us with the pictures so you get visuals of the murder and funny pictures and everything else and it's exactly the same as a live show except instead of the audience being in the room with us they're in their own rooms wherever they are in the whole world and we are broadcasting out but it's a lot of fun people talk in the chats about it and bullshit it's so much fun honestly we've had nothing but good feedback from these things that's why we keep doing them because they're fun and everybody seems to like them so get your tickets right there shut up and

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Not only are you going to get two new shows every other week on there but there's a whole back catalog with like 150 shows on there that you can get to tons of new stuff very bingeable and uh in addition though every other week you're going to get a new show that is no exception this week this week you will be getting for crime and sports because you're going to get both for crime and sports we're going to talk about sex scandals, part three. Hell yeah. These things, this has nothing to do with sports. This is just hilarious. This is fun. This girl's detailed Yelp review of college athletes' penises is the funniest thing in the world.

Then we'll talk about a soccer player who had an affair with his sister-in-law that ended up being very public and then had some other public thing where his poetry got read in court. And it is really funny and really bad and hysterical and sexual and weird we'll talk about all that then for small town murder we're going to talk about something two things very near and dear to my heart anyway the mafia and serial killers those are yes we're going to find out what's the deal with certain mafia guys that are actually serial killers that just happen to get lucky of hey i grew up in fucking this is where i grew up and i happen to be italian and i happen to be in this organization that

values the one thing that i really really want to do it's fucking amazing yeah uh how do those worlds cross we'll talk about all of that patreon.com slash crime and sports like i said and if you just want to make a regular donation and get a shout out, you can do that as well over at PayPal using our email address, crimeinsportsatgmail.com. That said, damn it, Jimmy. Who are the people? Who are the most wonderful people who would never, ever,

ever bash our heads in with a shovel and then bury us alive? Hit me with that list, but not a shovel. This week's executive executive executive executive producers are uh corporal carl kershner see you in uh in wisconsin corporal carl uh beautiful he's excited yeah he's excited about it uh jb and yeti shetty in canada regina kuda jaroff lisa dunton brooke crawford hunter duchesne and bj cyprian she's new she's an author by the way down in Texas thank you all so much for everything other producers this week are Peyton Meadows Stacy Sengel Captain

Lou Albino uh Barry Mark and the Shitsteins uh Amanda Granieri uh Willis Tanya giving it to us both ways uh Beaver and Drunk Nicole and also Baby Kit happy hour checking in in Panama City Beach Florida that's a terrible that should be Panama Happy hour checking in in Panama City Beach, Florida. That's a terrible, that should be Panama Beach City. Shouldn't be Panama City Beach. That sounds gross. It does sound like a city beach. Yeah, Panama City Pool.

That's wild. That's disgusting. Yeah, Panama City Sewer. It doesn't sound good. Morgan Dugan, Janice Hill, Chester Copperpot. You know who that is. That is Danny DeVito's character from Batman, correct? Yes. Right?

Copperpot. Yeah. Nope, that's Oswald Copperpot. Who's Chester Copperpot? Is that something from the Goonies? Oh, yes. Is it? No.

Yes. I don't know. One-Eyed Willie and Chester Copperpot. That sounds right. Oswald Copperpot. That sounds like it. Jesus. Christopher Hickey, Nashville's Steve Earle said hello.

Hey, beautiful. I apologize, Chris. I didn't know that you were saying woo in reference to James's woo. Yeah. I thought you were just being a drunk lunatic. Yeah, wasn't even drunk. That was the funny part. Totally sober and fine.

He's a sober, fun guy. Met him afterwards. Nice guy. Thanks, part. Totally sober. He's a sober, fun guy. Met him afterwards. Nice guy. Thanks, Chris. Thank you. Jimmy Secret Sauce Wisman, Jorge Medrano, Alex Hopper. He liked the J.R. Smith episode. Thanks, Alex.

Well, great. Or she. Jesus, who knows? Either way, yeah. Thank you. Kinsley Kohlklischer. Nope, probably not. Sharon with no last name.

Roman Jacobo. Darcy with no last name. Jimmy Lane. Cole with no last name. Katerina Fry. Hannah with no last name. Jimmy Lane. Cole with no last name. Katerina Fry. Hannah Govedick. Govednick. Govednick.

Govednick. Donna with no last name. Timothy Parker. Doug Cazor, I think. Cazor. Jocelyn Gordon. Matt Ringering. Ring, Ringering.

Menna Lloyd. Marty Fortier. Fortier. Amy. Amy Ann. Hannah Bell. Kayla Counts. Brantley Clark. AJ Austrins,

Chris, you can do, oh, you can't fuck this up. Yes, I can. Stop. Danny Dyson, Georgia Caitlin, Keith with no last name, Danny Octavian, Octavia, Helen Dubois, Mercury Muse, Tina Cook, Troy Natter, Holly Soden, Val Willett, Arianna Keller, Terry Taina, Lori Johnson, Corinne Hill, Keith Alden Baker, Mike Hodson, Brittany Hohoff, Parker Keenan, Yvette Juhasz,

Hannah Garcia, Christina Hamlin, Kim Smith, April Schiavone, Eric Suchin, Jesse Shira, Joe Crossley, Edward LeBlond, Andy Pagan, Julie Kodem, Tina York, Robert Fuentes. Was that Fuentes? I may have written that wrong. You were flowing so hard. I know. B and also a U. Thomas Giles, Jackson with no last name, Desiree and Andrew McKinney, Matthew Hanson, Abby Feekek matthew murphy kyle garner brian mccauley i wonder if that's related to to that space lady maybe jameson with no last name nicole

with no last name though with no sorry to bring up maybe the the worst memory in your fucking life brian that's my mom jesus christ sorry bro bill space and i called her space late jeez yeah i can still see pieces of her sprinkling down to the ocean that's horrible what a piece of shit god i hope not now it's amanda dalton tiffany aberflews uh alicia war louise martinak hayley smith elizabeth carpenter artley goodard good good heart good heart oh boy good and hard kyle carter crystal blaze blair clark dominique lieb uh daisy with no last name bobson dugout james i can't pronounce it laura that's how i'm going to pronounce every last name i can't pronounce they're just i i can't

pronounce it is uh laura klein uh courtney eve seb Klein, Courtney Eve, Sebastian and Betty, Kristen Taylor, Jeremy Wagner, Corey Engel, Slip Stitch. Corey would know last name. Jessica Rice, Jake Blank. Crystal would know last name. Maggie would know last name. Kelly Bosley, Creekside Custom Paver Smith, Allie Linton, Jessica Stember, Bethany, Bethany, Bethann Carvin, David, David Evers, Evers. Zach with no last name.

Colin Maxey. Elliot Reinston. Krista Mallory. Kelly Frederick. Mackenzie with no last name. Jack Blackwell. Jack Blackwell. Ah, you were almost there to fame, you son of a...

I'm sorry, Jack. You already got one. Danielle Strotter. Connie Bonner. Layla with no last name. Azari Stevens. Samuel Carr. Kate Bauer, Luis Serna, Project DQ, Adam Rowley, Dominic Forbes, Kyle M., Brandy Aubrey, McKenzie McGuire,

Taryn Malloy, Lim, Kotraba Hofer, Matthew Hickory Hansen, Nikita Weil, Jocelyn Whiting. Yes. Frank, Just Frank. Danielle Green, Afton Scott, Torero M. Christine Lester, Liz Phillips, KingTigerKiller415. Wow. Oh, boy. Bray Breedlove. Bray? Bray, maybe.

Oh, it's probably Bray. Bray? I don't know. Ryan Wolf, Barb and Bob, Mother Tucker, Chris Zimmer, Stephen Hoff, Sammy Fitter. I can't pronounce this. Mark Frylock, Todd Beck, Julie McCullough, Francis, Kyle. Nope, that's Kelly. Kelly, why?

Fred Shingles, Silent113, Marlene Ganey, Megan Turner, Bailey Butchert, Sarah Garrison, Megan Higgins, Christina Park, Janet N, Brandy Weddle, Maddie Campbell, Jennifer Fix, I hope, J.R. Walters, Mimi Tucker, Kate Ann Chant, Clay Verdon, and also all of our patrons. You guys are fantastic. Thank you so much. Thank you, everybody, so much from the bottom of our hearts for what you do for us honestly it's amazing and it's incredible

and it doesn't go unnoticed so thank you thank you so much you've really you've changed our lives and we appreciate it if you want to follow us personally on social media very easy head over to shutupandgivememurder.com the links are right there to follow us or just google small town murder podcast host because we're the only fucking ones easy head over to shut up and give me murder.com the links are right there to follow us or just

google small town murder podcast hosts because we're the only fucking ones i should hope anyway that said keep coming back and seeing us week after week after week because we're not going anywhere and until next week everybody it's been our pleasure Hey, Prime members, you can listen to Small Town Murder early and ad-free on Amazon Music. Download the Amazon Music app today. Or you can listen early and ad-free with Amazon Music. Download the Amazon Music app today, or you can listen early and ad-free with Wondery Plus and Apple Podcasts. Before you go, tell us about yourself by completing a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.