Small Town Murder - #386 - Cheers To My Killer - Whitewood, South Dakota

Episode Date: May 12, 2023

This week, in Whitewood, South Dakota, a crumbling relationship is certainly not helped by a five year affair, but everything looks like it will work out just fine. Until, one night, when one of the pair is left with a gaping chest wound, and the other is left with quite a tale to tell. Including a wild night, complete with hot tub violence. Was it self defense, or a cold blooded, premeditated murder?? Along the way, we find out that you don't want to kick a service animal out of your restaurant, that violence is in the eye of the beholder, and that you should always raise a glass to the person who is about to kill you!!Hosted by James Pietragallo and Jimmie WhismanNew episodes every Thursday!Donate at: patreon.com/crimeinsports or go to paypal.com and use our email: [e-mail] to shutupandgivememurder.com for all things Small Town Murder & Crime In Sports!Follow us on...twitter.com/@murdersmallfacebook.com/smalltownpodinstagram.com/smalltownmurderAlso, check out James & Jimmie's other show, Crime In Sports! On Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, Wondery, Wondery+, Stitcher, or wherever you listen to podcasts!See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

You're listening early and ad-free on Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. Hello, everybody, and welcome back to Small Town Murder Express. Yay and choo-choo! Oh indeed jimmy yay indeed my name is james petrogallo i'm here with my co-host i'm jimmy wissman thank you folks so much for joining us all aboard the murder train let's get away from the station here because we got a lot of a lot of crazy story for you here a lot of my face a lot of wild shit uh Before we get to that, very quickly, you definitely want to head to shutupandgivememurder.com. Get your tickets for live shows. They're coming all over the place. Chicago, April 12th is our next, or April 12th, August the 12th is our next one.

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Chicago first. And most importantly, get your tickets to that. Definitely shut up and give me murder.com. Patreon.com slash crime in sports is where you get bonus material. You want more episodes? There's tons of them on there. Anybody $5 a month or above, you're going to get the whole back catalog

which is a couple hundred episodes of bonus stuff. And you're going to get two new ones every other week. One Crime and Sports, one Small Town Murder, and you get access to it all. What we're going to give you this week is for Crime and Sports even if you don't like sports, this is a fun story. Disco Demolition Night

1979 the White Sox thought it would be a good idea to blow up records Even if you don't like sports, this is a fun story. Disco Demolition Night. 1979, the White Sox thought it would be a good idea to blow up records and 8-tracks in the middle of the field between doubleheaders. Surprise, riots and fires happened instead. So there you go. And then for Small Town Murder, one of the weirdest stories ever, Sherry Papini, the blonde California lady who faked her own kidnapping why we still don't know um but the way she could help her story the and what actually was the truth and the interrogation while her husband's sitting right next to her is just priceless so we'll tell you all about that that is patreon.com slash crime and sports. And you get a shout out at the end of the main show. Jimmy will mispronounce your name while he'd love to get it correct.

That said, where are you at right now, everybody? Yeah, what's in your hand? What you doing? What you doing? What are you doing? Peeling an orange? Is that what you're doing? Just standing around peeling an orange? Just do it. It's hard to do, but you got it started. I'm very proud of you. Even though you got it started and you feel ownership of this orange, I'd like you to turn to the person next to you,

throw it directly into their chest so it explodes in orangey, pulpy goodness. Raise your arms to the sky and shout,

shut up and give me murder. Let's do this, Jimmy. What do you say, everybody? Let's do it. Let's go on a trip, shall we? Let's do this Jimmy What do you say everybody Let's go on a trip shall we Let's go we're going all the way to South Dakota This time

Hey hey now South Dakota where we don't go very often Is that Rushmore That is yes that is South Dakota I believe North Dakota has not much of anything Almost Canada is what it has. Yeah. They have snow and plains.

This is in western South Dakota, all the way in the western side. It's only 20 minutes outside Deadwood. Oh. And there is a Deadwood TV show connection, too, in this show. Is that right? Interesting, yeah. It's five hours and 15 minutes to Aberdeen, South Dakota, which is our last South Dakota episode. The Great Kidnapping Caper was the name of that one.

I remember that one too. That was a, it was one of your night white knuckle ones where you're like, what's going to happen. Um, this is in Lawrence County area code six zero five. The population here is 901 people. Nobody,

nobody. And this is up about 200 people since the year 2020. Really? So in the last three years, it has gone up a lot. That's a substantial amount for this place. It was only 700 people. 200 show up. Fuck, that's a lot.

That's a third more. 900 people is barely enough to have a murder. That's what I mean. You'd think everyone would know what happened. Yeah. They're all just standing around. They all saw it around doing something. Median household income here is about $56,250, which is right around the national average.

And median home cost here, also right around the national average, $303,800. So, your average place except in the middle of goddamn nowhere. It was platted in 1888, which is when deadwood was blowing up and all that that's during the the tv show era and um the this happened when the chicago and northwestern railway was extended to this point they built towns along it um this town took its name it is uh white uh whitewood south dakota i don't think I even said that yet. Whitewood, South Dakota. Remind me of that. Whitewood, South Dakota.

Where is that? Western South Dakota. It took its name from the Whitewood Creek, which makes sense here. It was, like we said, 1888 when people got here. The Pioneer Townsite Company purchased the town site of Whitewood. Bought it. So there's a company that's like if they're gonna have these towns pop up we'll buy the whole town and build a town and then sell it to everybody so that's what they do yeah um they bought the land from william selby who was an early settler to the area people could purchase lots in this town, business lots, for $250 to $500.

You could come in and start your business, and the town soon filled right up. They had three hotels, two saloons, a barbershop, a drugstore, a clothing store, sawmill, the whole deal. Seth Bullock, as you might recognize. Hardware Seth. Yeah, as you might recognize from the show Deadwood, who was a real guy. Yeah, slinging dick in the widow. Slinging dick and – slinging hardware and dick. hardware Seth. Yeah. As you might recognize from the show, Deadwood, who was a real guy, um, slinging dick in the widow, slinging dick and slinging hardware and dick. That's what he slings and justice hardware,

dick and justice in the American frontier, a carryable commode. That's right. That's, that's the one he, um, he helped to convince these other, uh, Fremont,

Elkhorn and Missouri Valley railroads to build a track from Whitewood into Deadwood. And a train would use that line for the first time in 1890. That same year, the railroad also built a track into Belforce and St. Onge. I don't know how you say that. It doesn't matter. If he was really a hardware guy, he probably wanted that train to get products, right? To get products and also it would make the town bigger. I mean, if you have businesses and more people, more shit you're going to sell.

That's all there is to it. Now, they built their buildings out of, because Deadwood would catch on fire every three days, they built their buildings out of this sandstone, real sturdy shit there. How about that? So they wouldn't burn down yeah and the the national register of historic places says by establishing formidable buildings and developing their main commercial street the people of whitewood secured their future while other neighboring towns disappeared they read the three little pigs good for them and

then they're still here there we go that's why they're not it hasn't burned down yet so it's realized had its 125th anniversary recently so good for them reviews of this town okay there's a couple of the town and a couple of a restaurant because there's not much of the town here's one of the town five stars small and quaint quiet gorgeous scenery friendly neighbors quick drive to market short drive to surrounding towns for further necessities five stars okay here is five stars but it's a very very mean one five stars go away oh go away don't move. We like our small town small. Well, that's one way to keep it small. Tough shit. How about that?

You can't control where I go. Sorry. But no problem. I won't be coming here. Surly neighbors is one way to keep me out. That'll do it. Next up, they have in town, we'll talk about their saloon in town, the Bullwhackers Saloon. Okay.

That is far too close to Bullwhacker. Sounds like a euphemism for jerking off, doesn't it? Yeah. There's a couple of good ones and then a couple of bad ones. We'll read them quickly. Here is a good one here. Five stars. I wasn't sure what to expect when I parked in front of...

I hate when they start out like this. Tell me about the food. Tell me about it, Mary. When I parked in front of this nondescript building. Actually, this is Marcus. Oh, really? Yeah. Man, was I surprised. Open the door and you feel transported to another time and place.

Blonde, pine tongue and groove, 12-foot walls draw your eyes upward to the original tin ceiling and the various displayed historical guns and other familiar Old West pieces. The beautiful bar and back bar mirrors are just breathtaking but the

real gem i discovered that evening was a feisty little redhead bartender erica she was very attentive highly mobile lol i don't know what that means with a knockout smile i ordered mini tacos because i am a taco slaying bandito and ended up closing the bar with Erica. She was a hoot. Hope to have more opportunities to make this a favorite place to have interesting conversations. I'm going to come back and try to fuck Erica. That's what he's doing. He's like, I'll leave a review and I'll say your name a bunch

and they'll give you a fucking $5 or something. I hope Erica hated him. Yeah, Erica was like, ugh, this guy wouldn't leave me alone all night. Next up, there's a ton of one-star reviews for the same incident okay it's the same thing august 16th 2021 it's the date this happened and there was i mean there's a lot of reviews about this the owner was extremely rude and told shorty rossi do you know who this is i had to look him up he is a little person who hosts who hosted multiple shows about pit bulls on like the animal planet and all that kind of shit hosted a show called pit boss with about pit bulls little guy that's what pit boss is that's pit boss yeah not about casinos or anything like that or barbecue it's this it's it's

pit bulls um they told was very rude and told short Shorty Rossi and his party they had to leave as Shorty had his service dog with him. He doesn't get around well. It's pretty obvious. He's a little guy. He's got a pit bull in there. This owner needs to be educated on federal statutes as well as the statutes of the state of South Dakota. Shame on this owner. Oh.

Shame. And then here's one okay not quite as good as it used to be three stars burger has lost its juicy goodness but it was better than lots of rallies food ew so better than fast food yeah um and then another guy saying probably the worst ribeye steak i ever had okay so the food tastes worse when you yell at little people. When you yell at someone and their dog's being kicked out. Yeah. Things to do.

Welcome to Bear Country, USA. Is that what this is? Come see black bears, elk, cougars, goats, and more. It looks dangerous. It looks like when we did the amusement park bonus episode and we were talking about all the animals walking. That's what it seems like. Just like, well, don't let them bears bite you now keep the little ones under toe all

right keep going like it's i don't like this it's fucking it's insane um then there is the whitewood extravaganza which is a room full of what looks like shit from a flea market that they couldn't sell at a flea market it's not an extravaganza. It's a bunch of old shit that's not valuable enough to sell. It's a hundred old ladies came together to have a really lousy garage sale is what it looks like. A lot of like dream catchers and jams and bracelets and shit like that. Extravaganza. Also the extravaganza. Also the Whitewood Festival of Trees.

Okay. They have trees and you come look at them it's in december look at here's one here's some pine trees everybody look at there's a white wood oh look at that you know it's going to be at the fire department so you know it's going to be wild stuff and then we're going to burn it all and then we'll burn it to the ground baby holler at me when you stack all those together and have a keg. Then I'll come by. Then we'll otherwise go fuck yourself.

So that said, let's talk about another kind of fire. Let's talk about a murder. All right. It's not a fire that causes it, but it's a crazy fucking story. Okay, these two. Let's talk about a couple of folks here. Start out with Gloria Jean who she that's her maiden name she will later on be gloria jean berts laugh b-u-r-t-z-l-a-f-f berts laugh yeah um she is that

because she's born she's born 1942 and she becomes berts laugh when she marries larry dean bert's laugh who was born in 1941 i found an article his parents were together for over 50 years it was a 50 year celebration for them in the newspaper and shit so it comes from stability anyway my grandparents just celebrated 64 years wow that's incredible holy shit to them. I'm sure they listen to the show every week. They don't listen. And my grandmother has dementia. Every week would be brand new to her. She'd be like, oh, he does a what?

Jimmy has a show? Wow, Jimmy does a show? Every week you have to tell my grandma what a podcast is. And then she'd go, wow, who's Jimmy? After a few weeks, she'd eventually forget you. She came over my mom's birthday this weekend and wished my mom happy birthday three times with gusto like it was the first time it was adorably sad it was depressing but she's so sweet maybe she just has extra enthusiasm and nowhere to

place it in her old age maybe she's fooling all of us that's it yeah she's just maybe it's all an act she just wants people leaving a happy ass life leave me alone for five minutes happy birthday happy birthday happy birthday then she goes she won't be coming over for fucking at least a month she'll leave us to fuck alone she thinks i'm crazy now so these two gloria and Larry, started dating during their senior year at Deadwood High School. Is that right? Going to Deadwood High, baby. Awesome. That sounds awesome.

Cool t-shirts. Yeah. They married the September after graduation, so two months after they graduated, in 1958. Hey. Oh, yeah. Big old skirt on her. Swing it. Slicked back.

Oh, yeah. Cigarettes in his sleeve. Oh, in his sleeve, in his mouth, in his ear. All sorts of cigarettes everywhere. In his greasy ear. In his greasy, greasy ear. They have three sons along the way here as they build their life. My three sons.

Marshall, Leonard, and Miles are the three sons. Cool name. Larry works at Wheeler Lumber Company in whitewood that's his been there for years and years and years that's his uh that's his joint where he's a strong man where he works yeah and he's got some problems later on we'll talk about here everybody said he would verbally downgrade himself during the marriage that's the way it's put verbally downgrade so he would say bad things about himself all the time. Not necessarily self-deprecating because that implies jokes, right?

Yeah, I think so. Yeah. This is like, I'm a piece of shit, but he means it. He's not, you know, not in a comedic way. There's no, there's no bit of tongue in cheek at all. There's no punchline coming. I'm a fucking monster. Yeah.

And then you're not going to tell me how you jerked off in a funny way and got caught or shit your pants or something like that you're going to say like something serious like i i took money from my mother and from her account when she needed it and then now she's stuck in a home in a state home rather than a private one that would be all i did was buy watermelon with it and rape the watermelon i just raped them over and over and i don't know why i bought them all at once like that because they're going to go bad at the same time i can't rape can't rape a truck full of watermelons all in one day you know what i'm saying a man's got lemons should have spread it out a little bit and bought a watermelon every other day maybe i think now i'm raping spilt watermelon it's not good so larry did that gloria um here also said that he would slap and poke her a lot over the years

or like no like poke at her and call her names oh yeah not slap her on the ass and be like what's happening sweet stuff he would be like you know slap her and poke her and call her a bitch and things like that yeah um also he she said he abused her sexually. She said she was... Well, no. None of it's good here. She said she was intimidated by his size and his loud voice. So he was a big, booming voiced guy. He liked to drink

too, so he would get drunk and be a loud, big, booming-voiced drunk guy. So she says, and she told other people that he told her quote divorce never murder maybe oh divorce which will definitely be the title of this show divorce never murder maybe murder maybe so uh 1981 larry gets has diagnosed with bladder cancer. Oh, shit. When he's 40 here. So he has a successful surgery for his bladder cancer.

And somehow through this, he came into some money at some point. I don't know how he came into money, but he paid Gloria's way through four years of college. He said so she could get a job if he died because they have kids. Yeah. And shit like that. Plus, he didn't want her to be, you he died because they have kids and shit like that. Plus, he didn't want her to be ass out and alone and not have anything. He's a piece of shit, but he's got a heart. He said, yeah, I want you to be able to do something with yourself if I die. He's got a bladder, but he's got a heart.

He's got piss all over the front of his pants. I don't know what bladder cancer even does, but it sounds terrible. It sounds really bad. She graduated in 85 from college here. She's 43 years old or something like that. She took a job at Wheeler Lumber Company with her husband there. Larry also worked there and was opposed to her working there. But it was a job she could get because she knew everybody there from all the company parties and all that kind of thing so it was an

easy there's 700 people here where the fuck am i gonna work it's an easy job to get it's not like it's not like she has a whole city's worth of jobs to choose from there's not the best paying job here and yeah and they'll treat her right because they like her husband now larry when he's not working or being home here he he served on the board of the American Cancer Society's Lawrence County unit and spoke to the group as a cured cancer patient in remission here. Larry and Gloria used to ride horseback in the evenings, and the family would do together and you know they'd all ride horses together come on everyone we're going out horseback riding get your horse let's go you know how you know how it used to do when we were kids how yeah yeah your mom and dad would be like come on mount up kids and then we'd all just go for a night stroll yeah remember that jimmy don't you

i think every kid would love to have that come on kids we're going on the horses yeah you'd fucking that'd be great i don't care where you're growing up that sounds awesome but not uh i never had that actually growing up no no we rode horses but we didn't have them at the house where we could just go you know down the street go for an evening stroll you know they were in another state yeah you'd have to go there and pay money, and then somebody would let you ride them for an hour and then kick you out. You'd ride some depressed horse for an hour. These are their actual horses. Something whose spirit was broken long ago.

Absolutely. So they would also help him with different projects for the Cancer Society. They did a fundraiser trail ride where the whole family participated in helping out promoting it and everything like that this shit brought the family together yeah so they seem like they're they're doing just fine here i mean just having a great old time together um through the 80s you know they've been together for 20 something years and um gloria at the lumber though, within a year of her starting at the lumber company, she also starts an affair with a co-worker. Oh, Gloria.

Which is not great in terms of your husband works there, too. Yeah, that's rubbing his face in it. Yeah, it's a co-worker whose entire family was friendly with their family, too. It was one of those. Oh, God damn. So this is rough she thinks she's gonna get away with this uh well she does for about four and a half years oh my yeah it goes on a long time all through the late 80s from 86 through 91 here late 86 to 91

this affair is going on with the guy yeah there's 700 people in the town right the guy works with how the fuck do you hide that yeah and how do you do that so calculatedly and organize it so well that you don't get pregnant too because oh yeah you gotta really obviously there's ways but uh she's also four half years, she's in her 40s. She's also 45 years old. Well, that's 45. You can get pregnant. But still, that might help.

It's dicey. It's less likely at that point. So, yeah, all that shit. But, I mean, no one in the small town saw and told them. And I saw them at the diner playing footsie and fingery and everything else. No one said that. nothing nothing at all so late 1990 by the way she leaves the lumber company in the spring of 1990 she no longer works there anymore but she's still fucking the guy yeah so she leaves the company but not the lumber if you know what i mean so

she takes the lumber with her yeah taking one of these with me if you know what i'm talking about sometimes you steal a little bit from the office on your way out so late 1990 larry has colon problems now no she's attacking his every horrible thing you don't want to have problems every way you you get waste out. He has to have two different rounds of colon surgery. And after that, he has to wear a bag, which obviously nobody wants to. Nobody wants to wear a fucking bag, obviously. That just sucks. Nobody wants that.

Nobody's like, this is great. Yeah. I love having a bag of my shit. My God. It's just you feel terrible here. And it would collect all of his waste. And a friend of his, Mick Roberts, he said the bag was very depressing for Larry. He said one time, Larry, recently, Larry joined a poker game.

And Larry thought one of the players was cheating and flew into a rage. What year does he think it is, by the way? He's out by Deadwood. He's flying into a rage over a poker cheat. He crawfished. You're fucking break, man. I'm going to shoot you and say you killed my brother in Dodge City. My brother.

Yeah, you killed my brother in Dodge City. I'll get you back. We're blending Tombstone and Deadwood together now. I love it. Why not? Let's make them the same thing. It's all the same. Yeah, it's all around the same time.

So I guess he flew into a rage and would freak out. His friend said, Larry was an odd kind of character. That's a very Western way of putting it, an odd kind of character yeah that's a very western way of putting it an odd kind of character he was the boss he had quite a temper yep yep uh this friend said he tried to console larry about wearing this bag saying that your life will go on and um you know whatever and larry said no my life's over this is bullshit might as well be dead and his friend said quote I came home and told the wife I think that damn fool

Larry's gonna kill himself that's what he said so that's what he was thinking that's how depressed he was though he was that low about it so late January 1991 Gloria returns home from bowling later than usual yeah so after four and a half

years this is his this is his big warning hey she's usually home earlier from bowling so larry questions her as to what you were doing, really. I know you weren't bowling. The alley done closed. You know what I mean? So she confesses that she's been having an affair. She was out with this guy. Not only that, she's been fucking this guy for almost five years. She's tired of hiding it.

You have to be. How do you hide that for so long? It's a guy named Roger Schoon. Schoon, S-C. It's school with an N instead of an l oh schoon schoon roger schoon gross hi roger schoon he's i'm gonna i'm gonna be mrs glorious schoon i'm gonna be glorious schoon it's better than i don't know is it as bad as bert's laugh i'm not sure so either way it, it's not a good option. Not a lot of good name options for old Gloria here.

Tough going. So she says, yes, I've been fucking Roger from down at the lumberyard. And you know how that goes. And he's been giving me all sorts of wood and blah, blah, blah. So she said, though, that they didn't like she didn't leave. Larry didn't leave. They just kind of stayed static. Yeah.

didn't leave they just kind of stayed static yeah she said from that time on though for the next couple months larry would just kept railing on about her about the affair oh really why yes you would a man affected by two types of cancer and you're cheating on him now what why would he possibly be upset he kept bringing it up she said just kept bringing it up kept bringing it up yes that said. Just kept bringing it up, kept bringing it up. Yes, that's what happens when you cheat on someone for five years. They might get upset about it and bring it up once in a while. A man shy of 50 who's already had now two bouts of cancer. Yeah, two bouts of cancer and feels terrible. Who carries a bag.

But they agreed to try to work out their problems and stay together. Okay. Okay. They sought marriage counseling for a little bit here now she told him on a day in january three months and two days later exactly okay 10 30 p.m um she calls the uh lawrence county sheriff's department and said hi uh gloria here i just shot Larry. Y'all might want to come by and take a peek at that. So deputies Charles and Russell report to the scene, and she's standing outside with her clothes soaking wet.

Wet? Head to toe soaking wet. It's not raining. Not raining. And in early April in South Dakota, it's chilly at 1030 at night to be out there in soaking wet it's not raining not raining and in early april in south dakota it's chilly at 10 30 at night to be out there in soaking wet clothes so that's that's weird when they arrived there this is deputy deputy sheriff charles she repeatedly said quote i killed my husband i can't believe it i killed my husband oh jesus all right so not a lot of mystery here as to what who killed two here. But this is crazy.

We find out how it all went down here. They walk into the house. They find Larry in the living room. He's lying face down by the couch, kind of like with his knees in a little bit over there. Huge gaping hole in his chest. Oh, boy. uh over there huge gaping hole in his chest oh boy they're like oh boy uh may we inquire as to what may have occurred here in your living room any anything here um now she said that larry ever since the affair thing came out he's been particularly drunk and abusive lately okay

especially that night and we will later find out that his blood alcohol content this night is 0.358 attaboy which is you you could be really drunk you could be dead you could fucking pass out like there that is that's danger zone territory i think john bonham had that in his system when he fucking died. You know what I mean? That's a man who knows what he's doing. Wow. And he's still ambulatory and shit.

Like with that, if I, you'd have to inject me with that. I'd be well passed out before I got to that, but Holy shit. Um, I guess they had returned from a local bar. The two of them went out together, Larry and Gloria, to a local bar.

It's all a lighthearted nightmare on our podcast, Morbid. We're your hosts. I'm Alina Urquhart. And I'm Ash Kelly. And our show is part true crime, part spooky, and part comedy. The stories we cover are well-researched. He claimed and confessed to officially killing up to 28 people. With a touch of humor.

I'd just like to go ahead and say that if there's no band called Malevolent Deity, that is pretty great. A dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit with a little bit of cursing. This mother lied. Like a liar. Like a liar. And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal. Or you love to hop in the a creepy tale of the paranormal,

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She suspects connections to a powerful religious group. Enter federal agent VB Loro, who has been investigating a local church for possible criminal activity. The pair form an unlikely partnership to catch the killer, unearthing secrets that leave Ruth torn between her duty to the law, her religious convictions, and her very own family. But something more sinister than murder is afoot, and someone is watching Ruth. With an all-star cast led by Emmy nominee Sanaa Lathan and Star Wars Kelly Marie Tran, Chinook is available exclusively and ad-free on Wondery+. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts.

And when they got back, he dragged her into the family hot tub fully clothed. Oh. And shoved her under the water several times, holding her there for a minute. At.35, he's doing that? At.358, he's fully, yeah. So that's her story. When doing so, he would pull her up and say,

tell me that you love me. And then put her back down and pull her up and say tell me that you love me and then put her back down and pull her up and say do you still love me and um she said he then pulled her out of the tub threw her on the floor and kicked her so she's soaking wet dripping kicked her and said quote you think i'm gonna kill you like this don't you'm going to tell you right now it's not going to be this easy. So that's a threat and also saying I'm not going to kill you right now at the same time. If I kill you, it'll be much worse than this. This is a cakewalk. This is just some run-of-the-mill domestic violence here.

This is not basic stuff he's saying. So he leaves the room and he leaves her there. Yeah. You know, she's laying there dripping. He leaves the room. She then goes downstairs and grabs a shotgun. Okay. Okay. She finds him sitting on the couch with a drink in one hand, you know, and a glass.

Drink in one hand, drinking booze and watching television. He's got the remote in one hand, glass in a glass drink in one hand drinking booze and watching television he's got the room the remote in one hand glass in the other ah she rolls up in the living room points the shotgun at him and says quote larry i'm gonna kill you which is really i mean it's honest it's it's very straight and to the point. No bullshit. Larry, you're a dead motherfucker, and I'm the guy to do it. Or I'm the chick to do it here. So, Larry, I'm going to kill you. You know what his response was? This is fucking amazing.

Go on, do it. Lifted his glass up as a toast. Which is the greatest fucking response to a death threat I've ever heard in my life. Larry, I don't know what you did i don't know what hats off to you for that that is the most incredible he just lifted up daisy if you do salute go ahead he just literally lifted his glass to ah you know daisy at all which is fucking incredible. Unbelievable.

Unbelievable. Okay. Here you go. Cheers. Cheers to you, darling. It's going to be fine. I'll drink to that. I'm going to be okay.

I think I have to pee. I hate this man. He raised his glasses of toast. To a threat of impending death. Not only with a threat of it, a shotgun fucking pointed at him from six feet away. I will appreciate it there you go put me out of my misery please i can't piss or shit i don't care do what do i owe this favor

what did i do for you salute so then incredible if you're her what do you almost have to start laughing at that point right i mean how do you not how do you not go well you just saved your own life if he abused me i guess maybe not i guess i could stay in a rage through that if he had just beat me up and tried to drown me and waterboarded me in the hot tub for a while but you almost have to just admire the gusto here so it's impressive her response is a bit different she fires the shotgun at him from four feet away oh man right into his chest four feet which as you can imagine leaves a huge giant gaping fucking monster wound oh my intense so he was completely unarmed drinking one hand remote in the other so

and sitting for christ's sake that's when she went outside telephoned the sheriff and then went outside and waited for them to come to the house soaking wet so they get there and um single gun shot wound to the chest yep they said it was not point blank point blank but within the range of it pretty goddamn close for a shotgun um they said that there was um when they do the autopsy there's medical problems but none of them were contributing factors to the death it's not like it made his colon shut down and he died he had a it was already gone fucking hole in his lungs heart liver and every other organ he had in there. So they sit her down. They're like, what happened here, darling?

You know? Yeah. Wow, this is pretty violent. This is the day. This is shortly afterwards. It's that day. And they said, you know, what happened? Did he threaten you that night?

And she said, I don't remember if he threatened me or not they said okay better explanation please um that would be sure helpful if we had some reason yeah explanation not even excuse explanation help us help you here um she told one of her sons in the meantime before this interview that her husband had tried to drown her in the hot tub and had beaten and kicked her that night, according to the interview there. She said the day she killed him, he threw things. He hit her. He tried to drown her. He made irrational statements.

He kicked and slapped her, broke a necklace he had given her, and picked the cat up and threw it against the wall. Okay. Jesus. Jesus. Jesus. I mean, it's like if you want to make an evil villain out of it, it's like, and then they're like, okay, and they're not shocked yet. And then he picked the cat up and right against the wall. So this is all before they went out for drinks.

Literally. This all happened besides the hot tub thing before they went out for drinks literally this all happened besides the hot tub thing before they went out for drinks i guess when someone's you know spiking cats into the wall that's a sign they might need a drink right maybe you need a drink sir yeah yeah it's horrifying it's terrifying it's a real it's one of those it's terrible if it was in a movie, it's like, because your picture is Reno 911. When they drop the cat down, it goes into the fucking air conditioning and blood flies up. You see it. That's hilarious.

Not a real cat. That's why. Because it's not real. Nobody's hurt. It's not a real cat. The cat's fine. It's all good. This is an actual cat that got spiked against the wall.

So it's not funny but that is for some reason a funny noise it paints a picture it does so after all this happened they went to the local diner for drinks and who goes to the diner to get drunk by the way that's a yeah that's a very degenerate move it. And all the diners have full bars. And whenever you're in it, you're like, who's going to get us fucking scotch and soda at the diner? It's just weird. Who's getting hammered with a plate of pot roast? Yeah.

I mean, there's like, I guess if it's by a hotel or something, that makes sense. Somebody's going to go back and get shit face. But yeah, I don't want some blue plate special. A diner on the turnpike. Who's drinking fucking Jack Evans? Like the one we go to here. Full fucking bar. Full bar.

Any drinks you want, boy. Fucking dry martini, no problem. And would you like that with your pancakes or before the pancakes? When do you want the Grey Goose martini? So after they got home, he pulled her into the hot tub, and she said the next thing she remembered was she was seeing his blood. And she was thinking, quote, I can't believe I shot him. I don't know how this happened.

He's laying on the floor. I thought, I need help, I need help, I need help. So it came upon her pretty quickly here. she is later on going to try and say, by the way, that this interview is not admissible in court. She's going to try to fight that because she's going to say that she

didn't knowingly and voluntarily waive her Miranda rights, even though she waived her Miranda rights. They said that it's unreliable also. Also, she made mistakes. First, even she misidentified the type of shotgun that was used. Oh, then she said she wasn't dressed when she was pulled into the hot tub, even though when they showed up, her clothes were completely soaked, which is if you went through some tragic shit, that's something you might not remember or I don't know.

We'll get into the by the way, the evidence with the soaked clothes here soon, because there's a real easy way to tell whether it was before or after. How's that in my mind? But we'll talk about it. The also during this interview, the presence of the county sheriff, Chuck Crotty, Chuck Crotty. Yeah. Who's a lifelong friend of the couple and a former neighbor who's, of course, a sheriff investigating the murder and sitting during the interrogation, which is very, very normal. She will say that it amounted to subtle police coercion to have a friend of hers there. Yeah. You can't be a conflict of interest fella it seems a little wrong so first of all was he fucking abusive or not let's get to the bottom of that let's get to

because that really a lot of that because if what she's saying is true yeah then a lot of this builds up to this if what she's saying is not true she looks like a person who's got a husband who's kind of a drag and some guy she's been fucking on the side for four and a half years and wants to get rid of her husband to move on to that. That's what it looks like if he's not abusive. So that's very important and kind of what the whole case hinders on. So despite this is from all three of his sons and their friends and everybody else, they said, yes, he drinks and he is a strict disciplinarian as a parent. You will clean your room. You will do this shit

but all three sons said that he never hit anybody he's a teddy bear the kids the mom nobody the kids know if abuse is going on in the house that's the thing ask the kids they know you think they don't know you think they're in their room they're fucking they hear it even if they're in their room there is a noise that happens in domestic violence that you will never hear from a woman's mouth ever it's not even a noise there's a static in the air sure you can feel like a thunderstorm it's that it's that fucking much to where kids know their hair and if it's just a psycho a psychological thing you feel that for sure. But the sound of domestic violence you cannot mistake. You can't mistake it.

It's different. One of the kids testified that at one point in time, his mother had a bruise of unknown origin that he can remember. His entire life, he can remember his mom having a bruise once. Once. So that's all they have as far as but but they also drink and have how many times have you woke up from drinking and you've got a random bruise you have no fucking idea where it came from how did my kneecap get all scratched up why is why do i have water on my knee fuck how did that why are my clothes soaking wet so the uh sons mild and leonard told the county deputy sheriff, Jim Charles, in separate interviews that their father was not a mean man at all.

He was strict but not mean. He was very nice and that they had never known him to assault their mother or anybody else. Ever. Ever, including them. ever, including them. They also said their father had been depressed and in pain from extensive surgery and that their mother had been put under a lot of pressure because she has to care for him and care for him at the same time. They said, yes, strict disciplinarian, never saw any violence. They said, quote, I think he probably they're talking about, was he abusive at all? And Leonard said this later on, I think he probably was to all of us, especially when we were younger, verbally.

He yelled at us when we were kids. So, yeah. He said that she is saying that he tried to drown me at this point in time. So the son said he believes that that might have happened because he says quote you could tell just by the uh the house we had one door split all the way up the middle a solid wood door so i don't know how that corresponds to that but there was obviously some kind of something that went on that night something Something hit that door. Yes. So she's going to say it's battered woman syndrome, and it just built up, and that's what happened here.

So she said that Larry threatened to kill her, also her lover at the same time, and also his wife and children as well because he's married with kids also. The man's got a bag. Yeah. He's going gonna kill everybody um after yeah she said he's been the attacks have become increased since he's had surgery has a bag oh and found out his wife was fucking the guy at work for four and a half years now the bruises she says she has that night from the abuse she was held down and kicked right held in the hot tub. She should have some marks on her from this.

So on the day after the killing here, she was examined by her doctor and a small bruise was found on her chest and upper arm and a large bruise on her hip, according to her doctors. OK, now her defense attorney, John Hughes, he said, I'm tired of this shit. You know what? Fuck you, Steve Martin. John Candy, eat my ass. This young Emilio Estevez, pain in the ass. Bullshit. God damn it.

I'm tired of Judd Nelson. I'm going here. So the lawyer here, John Hughes, and also Mike Strain, those are the lawyers, they've been hired here. They said that their client has been bruised during the incident and needed to be examined by a doctor, and they did that. Now, when she's examined by the doctor the state puts her up for, they say the evidence we have indicates there weren't any bruises. Not a bruise on her. So the same day, apparently, it seems like she went to two different doctors and one didn't see any bruises and one saw a couple of bruises. Now, the friends, their friends, when they heard about this, they thought it was either suicide or a mercy killing when they found out he was dead.

Wow. Yeah. One woman said, my first thought on hearing about the found out he was dead. Wow. Yeah. One woman said, my first thought on hearing about the shooting was he got depressed. Then I thought, no, Gloria wouldn't do that no matter how depressed he got. He got depressed and said, put me out of my misery. Right. And she would never do it. So another witness, this was a woman who was engaged.

Monica Jorgensen was engaged to the middle son, Leonard, in the 80s. So she's been around the family and she has no horse in the race at this point. So they talked to her and she said that there was never any indication that Larry was abusing his wife. She said, I'm not saying he was not domineering. He was, but he wasn't abusive. I was on a very friendly basis with Larry, and the thing that kills me is how she's gotten those boys to believe he was abusive. They worshipped him. Yeah.

So she was saying, now they're like, oh. He's a strong-ass cowboy, and they're like, oh, my dad beat my mom. Yeah, now, but she's saying back then, they never said that, and they knew that wasn't, that never happened. Now, fellow employees, since they work together, they would have a really good insight here. They said they never saw any bruises ever on Gloria. The plant manager, Dean Herman, said he never saw Larry hit his wife or yell at her. Well, I would hope he wouldn't do it at work. Jesus Christ.

Have some decorum, domestic violence people. Are you kidding me? I mean, we see husbands beat the shit out of their wives in the break room. Not Larry. All the time. I mean, Larry, though, I'll tell you what. Normally, it's right out there on the woodcutting floor. They get pissed off, threaten to put their wife through a bandsaw.

But this time, Larry, not even here, never beats her. He said, or even yelled at her, though, he said. Never saw him angry with her at work he said the day that larry was shot he appeared to be in a good mood and was fine well the man had 0.35 he was fine he was different he was real good mood he was in a different mood from work till then i'll tell you that much a neighbor named duane reddick said that larry had called him at supper time that night uh the night of the shooting to ask permission to hunt on his land you mind if i come hunting on your land there yeah and uh this is what this guy says this is duane reddick quote he sounded

plum fine 0.35 he sounded time well this is four hours before he's killed, though, so he could have put a whole... This is before they go to the diner to tie one on. They really got drinking at the diner, and then he came home and kept drinking. So he sounded... He's a guy that could be fucking 0.20 and still sound fine, probably, though, if he can even raise his glass when he's got 0.358 in the system. He sounded pl plum fine, and everything sounded fine when I talked to him

about 6.30 or 6.45. Plum fine. At almost 7 o'clock at night. Yep. He said he knew Larry as a good neighbor, but said he never even met Gloria, and he said he didn't have a clue as to what transpired between the phone call and the shooting.

He said, I don't know what could have happened between then and then. They were neighbors, and he never even met Gloria? Never met her. Isn't that weird? She's out all the time with that Roger. I guess they used to hook up during the day a lot, like on lunch break time, and then they would hook up at night,

and they'd have a bowling night where she'd go fuck him. So two guys who worked for Larry in the bridge building at the Wheeler Lumber Company in Whitewood called him their favorite boss and said he'll be hard to replace. This is Bill Cooper and Dwight Griffey. They said they also had a high opinion of Gloria, who, according to Cooper,

worked in the accounting department at Wheeler Lumber. And friends of the couple said that although rumors had floated around about the incident, they're reluctant to believe anything until the facts come out in court i don't know what's going on and uh one friend said it might not be fair this is one of the guys from work it might not be fair to gloria to start believing the rumors even if she did kill larry i couldn't hold it against her it's not up to us to judge that's a man that's like i don't know she fucks a lot of people i got you know i got or that's a guy with really awful friends you know i can't judge um bud hudson who's co-owner of the whitewood bar said i still can't believe it i thought they

were a great couple as far as i know no fights no nothing something went wrong but i don't know what it was i always thought they were happily married so the charges here um she has they charge her duly with murder and manslaughter okay murder carries a mandatory life imprisonment yeah manslaughter would be punishable from every anything from probation to life in prison. Oh, my. It's a big old deal here, or a $25,000 fine, or both, or whatever. The judge can pretty much do whatever he wants with manslaughter. That's a window. But mandatory life for murder.

So psychologists here are going to be important. They get a clinical psychologist who interviewed her five days after the shooting and then conducted 25 therapy sessions with her. During this, he's trying to find all the abuse. During all these sessions, she reported just two physical attacks in 32 years by her husband. Okay. Okay. So, two in 32 years.

And she's using that as justification for shotgunning a man in his seat. Yeah. Yeah. Not even like my life was in imminent danger because that's self-defense. It's battered women's, which means that you've built it up over time. Right. So, they were like, that's not great for her. And that's her own therapist.

I mean, that's the therapist. So, defense, her defense here, they said that this before it goes to court, her lawyer, Mike Strain, comes out publicly and says this case involves issues of mercy, killing, self-defense, family violence and alcohol. OK, the county attorney said that none of those are a factor is what he said. None of that's a fact. Maybe alcohol outside of that. Now, they said that the county attorney said that he felt like he was less of a man since the. Yeah, the whole thing. His drinking was increasing and he wished his life to end. He arranged for Gloria to do it for him.

Not a day goes by. This is her attorney. Not a day goes by that Gloria is her attorney, not a day goes by that Gloria doesn't feel remorse. He's saying that he wanted her to do this and he was trying to force her into it. So he beat her into submission to do it.

Yeah. Finally she got the shotgun because I was waiting for her to get it for so long. Cheers, it's about time. She never gets it. I put it on the kitchen table and everything. If you do it now, I don't have to change this bag. Come on.

Yeah, come on already. So the state's attorney says that the slaying was not a mercy killing, not self-defense. And he was asked by the reporters, is there a history of family violence? And he said, none that was ever reported. Right. So he said alcohol is involved, but it's not a factor in the case. She is let free on a $50,000 cash or surety bond. Wow.

They let her out. So they're talking about a change of venue. Are they going to do that attorneys estimated 60 or 70 possible jurors they got to see if they know if they've heard about this and all this shit they're talking about suppressing the interview that she gave to the police they said officials took advantage of her emotional instability and established a conciliatory atmosphere for the interview that's called a murder interrogation. That's exactly what they do.

They try to take advantage of whatever instability you're feeling. And give you the opportunity to close this case with the least possible police work. And say, hey, I'm your friend. Tell me and I'll help you. That's what they tell you. That's how they do it. They also want to suppress the gory stuff. They don't want the jury to see that. The brief

says the death certificate should not be allowed into evidence because county coroner Michael K. Chaput, who signed it, is not qualified to verify the cause of death, which is listed as gunshot wound to the chest. I'm going to tell you what. I think I can solve that one.

I could have 358 worth of alcohol in my system. Yeah. And if you showed me a gaping hole in someone's chest, I'd go, I think that hole's the problem. I think he's supposed to have organs and stuff. There should be a heart right there. That's right. Let me draw that.

Do we have, is this pin the heart on the poor me another whoa so i could play operation with that guy and crush it crush it he said gory photos of his body and a video tape of the crime scene are not needed it would only prejudice the jury the defense says um the counts as the state attorney said that he'd served notice that he intends to offer the photos and video as evidence. Yeah. And they also want suppression of a church bulletin, which talked about the murder,

a taped interview with Glory, and Larry's birth certificate. So basically, you know all that stuff that, what do you call it there? Evidence? None of that. Can we what do you call it there? Evidence? None of that. Can we have none of that in? Is that possible?

The only evidence I would like in are the ones that help me. That's it. Everything else, fuck it. So the defense experts will testify to the realities of battered woman syndrome and the symptoms that she possessed consistent with the syndrome, which is a thing. that she possessed consistent with the syndrome, which it is a thing. So she sought the trial court's permission to present expert testimony of a psychological autopsy of Larry.

Oh. A psychological autopsy. What is that? It means to post fucking death, posthumously fucking analyze him psychologically. Okay. Although he never had interviewed or met him dr richard fairbarn was prepared to reconstruct his personality and behavior on the night and testify that it was obviously self-defense how do you do that that

is sounds like psychic the dumbest thing ever psychological autopsies have been admitted where the victim's state of mind was relevant such as suicide victims and where the murder defense was suicide though these mental evaluations have been used for other purposes he admitted this doctor even admitted that the reconstruction of his personality larry's was not common in the field of psychiatry no No shit. This is, by the way, the first time in South Dakota history that the battered woman defense is being used. Is that right? Absolutely.

The first time. She is a trendsetter here. So she's a groundbreaker. So they had another expert witness that talks about the realities of battered spouse syndrome. The witness discussed the truth, the misconceptions, as well as the symptoms that she possessed and all that sort of shit. Under a self-defense argument,

the issue is whether she perceived herself to be an imminent danger, but she's going to say that the battered woman, battered women perceive imminent danger differently than the average person. So therefore you have to find self-defense because to me, even though he was in another room sitting down drinking, watching TV, that meant I was in imminent danger because I am a part of the syndrome. Okay. Or I have the syndrome.

So they say that they want to tell the jury that it might not be imminent danger to you, but it would be to a battered woman and gloria is such a woman so um for it's interesting so gloria is going to testify on her own here is that right she has to she has really yeah she has to yeah if you're going to present she has to be sympathetic yeah self-defense why would you have anything to hide he came out you know i was terrified so she takes the witness stand and um she says you know uh 32 year nightmare marriage she called it she said quote i'm here to tell you my story and to tell everyone what really happened my children need to know larry's family need to know and i need to tell it so it can be resolved and also so i don't go to prison, which is also part of this.

She claims, obviously, self-defense. She says he tried to drown her. He hit her and slapped her consistently during the marriage. She said very, you know, she had to say this. She never he never abused her in front of their three sons or anyone else. And Gloria never told anyone about anything. Gloria Larry said that it was nobody's business if I beat you. Literally, that's what she said.

She said she shot her husband to save her own life. She didn't know when or how Larry would kill her. She said the prosecutor then said, well, Larry was watching TV when you returned from the basement with a loaded gun. But then she said she couldn't remember what happened. And he then says to her, he unarmed wasn't he what threat did he pose as he sat on the couch and she said he was going to kill me he was fueling up and uh yeah and so he said you're telling this jury that you believe he was going to kill you sometime somewhere some way but you don't know how he was going to kill you and she somewhere, some way, but you don't know how he was going to kill you. And she said, no. Um, so the prosecutor said that you could have left

the house. You could have called for help. They show, uh, how in her travels to get to him, she passed three different exits to the house. They said, you could have got out three different doors, um, or called for help. She said under questioning from her own attorney that that wasn't an option for her to do that though. She, um, also said, talked about the medication her husband had been taking and about the

emotional side effects that this could, could have on him. So, um, the, uh, the, the prosecutor in closing said that Larry state of mind when he was gunned

down on his couch was irrelevant. The mental state of his wife is also immaterial because she's not using mental illness or insanity as a defense. And the battered woman syndrome wasn't like a, an actual defense at the time. Oh, you couldn't say that it was self-defense is what you had to use. And then you introduce that to say,

to say that you would perceive danger differently. And that's why it's self-defense. That's how they it there so um she said she's uh you know that's irrelevant so the verdict comes in it's august 30th 1991 and of first degree murder yeah she is found not guilty what not guilty of first degree murder okay get the fuck out of here that's wild uh first degree manslaughter she is found guilty of that okay so they went less window to me it's either first degree or you acquit that's how i look at this because that's just hedging a bet that's going i don't think that he beat her up but just in just in case, we don't want to bang her for life mandatory. So to me, that's a hedged bet.

That's a compromise. That's just the prosecutor trying his best to get something out of this if he can't get first. And that's a jury compromising, not only with each other, but also with their own consciousness about the whole thing you know i'll feel guilty if it's and the other people in this town because everybody knows what 12 are on this fucking jury that's the other thing so during sentencing her sons beg for probation for her really they both say you know don't take our mom away She told us all this horrible stuff. All three go up there and do that. Now, her lawyer argues for probation.

Yeah. Probation. Saying that she would have been killed if she hadn't shot her husband. She reads a statement saying, obviously, you would think, you know, this is terrible. Well, either way, I feel terrible. My sons have lost their father, even blah, blah, blah. She said, well, either way, I feel terrible. My sons have lost their father, even a blah, blah, blah.

She said, no, no, no, no. Her statement is I have lost faith in the police and the public because my efforts to cooperate with them have been used against me. Oh,

Gloria. It's almost like they say, it's almost like they should tell you anything you say, you say can and will be used against you in a court of law. It's almost like they say, it's almost like they should tell you anything you say can and will be used against you in a court of law. It's almost like they should say that before. Oh, they did. That's right. They did say that.

Every fucking time they talk to her. If you don't want to talk to us, you're welcome to talk to a lawyer. Blah, blah, blah, blah. Come on. The prosecution recommends 75 years. That's their recommendation. So anywhere between probation and three quarters of a century, somewhere in there. Anywhere between probation and the rest of her fucking life.

And forever. Yeah, she's 52 at this point. So, you know, the prosecutor said, quote, I get hate mail over this case. That's fine. This is not a woman's rights case. It's just murder. Good point. Yeah. over this case that's fine this is not a woman's rights case it's just murder good so yeah at sentencing the trial judge says this because a lot of people wrote letters on her behalf too

he said i've read every letter that's been written on your behalf i read the entire pre-sentence report i've listened to the testimony of your sons twice now but after reading the evidence on battered woman syndrome i was convinced that i needed to supplement the law in South Dakota in order for you to have what I felt would be a fair trial. Now, on the night your husband died, there were options. Yeah. Society places a very high value on human life. He said he has felt he's gotten a lot of pressure from letters and from a lot of people to place her on probation. But, quote, I don't work that way.

I have a conscience, he says. Atta boy. You, ma'am, may fuck off 20 years. Okay, not bad. So he makes a hedge bet, too. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's all a bunch of hedging bets. Nobody knows what happened.

That's why. Yeah, I wish he raised his glass. Yeah, yeah, and saluted her. That would would have been amazing he raised his glass and said 20 years november 1992 she appeals to the state supreme court on the appropriateness of her sentence among other things and the judge could have sentenced her from anything to from probation to life and uh the defense attorney said the 20-year sentence was fairly harsh. He said this was strictly punishment, which is part of our system, but she's served more time than any other woman for this type of crime.

This is a year later. And served more time than most men who have similar sentences. Most men who get 20 are out in a year. I'm not aware of that. Or most anybody. Men, women, fucking, I don't care. Dogs, cats, anything. most men who have get 20 or out in a year. I'm not aware of that. Okay. Or most anybody, men, women fucking,

I don't care. Dogs, cats, anything for this type of crime. Yeah. Most, most people get 20 years for murder and get out in a year. Jesus Christ.

I'm going to North Dakota. I'm going to murder. You can fucking, why not? Who cares? Wait for the first guy to piss you off. They also talk about the elements of manslaughter. And I'll go through this very quickly the third element of manslaughter requires the perpetrator to be without design to affect

death because she admitted telling him larry i'm going to kill you right you don't get any more i'm thought about it and then i did it that's what that is that's not a yeah so they say she ironically alleges there was designed to affect death, thus eliminating the third element and a manslaughter conviction. Her thing is, because I did that, that means it's not manslaughter. It should have been murder. So you have to get rid of my manslaughter charge. That's literally her fucking thing. To have manslaughter, I couldn't have thought about it ahead of time.

Yeah, it's ballsy. I'll say that much. They should have convicted me and they didn't. Yeah. Wow. Yeah, it's ballsy. I'll say that much. They should have convicted me and they didn't. Yeah, wow. They said that the record discloses that she also testified she did not shoot her husband intentionally. Thus, this combined with her testimony that she did not remember actually carrying the shotgun presented the finder of fact with sufficient evidence that she had no design to affect death and thus will sustain a conviction of first degree manslaughter and can fuck off. Battered woman syndrome, too.

They said the jury heard all the evidence and decided upon the evidence and the instructions given that she was not justified in taking the life of her husband. Right. So, yeah, the jury looked at that. The state supplied evidence supporting its burden. She retreat or he retreated from the hot tub or she retreated from the hot tub area that returned to kill her husband during trial she said that uh he that um he uh he was going to kill her but she didn't know when or where when the jury is properly instructed of these elements of self-defense and the state meets its burden of proof we defer to the jury's verdict because that's that's the point of our legal system they also go into the self-defense no duty to retreat thing this is stand your ground the state they say prove beyond

a reasonable doubt that she did not act in self-defense they say when a defendant raises the affirmative defense of self-defense it's incumbent upon the state to prove beyond a reasonable doubt the killing was without the authority of law and they talk about the fact that um a person who's been attacked and who's exercising her rightful her right of lawful self-defense is not required to retreat. And she not only may stand her ground and defend herself against the attack, but may also pursue her assailant until she secured herself from danger. if that course appears to her and would appear to a reasonable person in the same situation to be reasonably and apparently necessary. And this is her right, even though she might more easily have gained safety by withdrawing from the scene.

You can chase somebody in South Dakota? It's all the standing around. Is that right? That's the law. My God. It's fucking ridiculous. It's a little silly, yeah. Someone can come into your yard,

like in Texas, someone can come into your yard like in texas someone can come into your yard then say oh sorry and start walking away and you can shoot them in the back and that's fucking legal that is not okay that's insane that's insane that's i'll call it what it is that's chicken shit pussy that's what it is you want to shoot people yeah and that's that's ridiculous that's just as ridiculous as someone can break into your house be over you with a butcher knife and you're not allowed to shoot them, which is what people say was the law, which was never the law. Never.

Never the law. So anyway, they say that a person who defends herself against an unlawful attack must stop the use of force as soon as the danger of attack has ended. If it would appear to be a reasonable person in the same position, there's no further danger. There should be no further force. If he's unarmed, sitting in a chair, watching TV, that doesn't work. Toasting you, for Christ's sake. Yeah, that doesn't work. So they said their husband retreated to a different part of the house to sit down.

This is all legal shit. This isn't like our opinion of he should, she should have done that. This is what the court says legally, we're just saying. She should have done that. This is what the court says legally, we're just saying. So they do advocate changing the South Dakota rule on the issue of battered woman syndrome and making that a thing, the battered spouse thing. So they did say you should have that. But they say, quote, a battered spouse does not possess a license to kill the batterer. Right.

I don't know anyone who claims he or she does. to kill the batterer. Right. I don't know anyone who claims he or she does. The diagnosis of battered spouse syndrome is a fact for the jury to consider along with other evidence in the case that it's not,

in the case, but it's not the ultimate issue. There you go. That's denied. So there you go. 1993, she wants a reduction of her sentence. No.

Goes to court. 33 people attended the hearing for her, all wearing purple ribbons for her. Wow. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. She said, I need to come home for a while. My family needs me, is what she said in court. They say, no, that's not.

No, man. It's been two years. Get the hell out of here. No, it's been two years. Get the hell out of here. January 28th, 1994. She is going for another sentence commutation and she's not given it. She said if she's denied parole, she will continue working with other inmates and self-help groups that she started at the prison and all that. They said she's suffering.

She's paid for the crime. That's never going to end, said it's a coalition against domestic violence. That's denied, by the way, for her early shit. April 26, 94, up for parole. Not going to get it. Board votes 5-1 to deny her parole.

She's up every eight months from here on out. Is that right? August 94, later on, December 94, up for parole, denied denied 5-1 okay 95 work release she it was at the woman's prison in pierre and she's been on work release she was cooking at the governor's mansion what that's what she was doing and for work release um yeah so her lawyer says i think that clearly showed that she's not a risk for society and her family definitely needs her home. So April 1995, they deny her again on a four to two vote.

Oh, it's getting close. Yes, but she is January 27th, 1998, her sixth try. They vote to give her parole. Oh, my. So their reactions here, she said, I don't think I'm hardened. The day the judge sentenced me to 20 years, I said it's not going to make me an old, bitter woman, and it hasn't. I have a lot of joy in my life. That's what she says.

Anybody seen Raj? Anybody seen Raj? She said the Black Hills is where I want to live, but if I have somewhere to go somewhere else to find a job, I think my parole requirements will allow it. Meanwhile, the kids, Leonard and Miles, they're happy. Everyone's going to be happy, Leonard said. Wow. They can't wait for her to get home here. Leonard's or Larry's family, not so happy.

No. No. His sister said she was pissed about the whole thing. She said it was a very political case and all that. And then the daughter-in-law, their almost daughter-in-law, wrote a letter to the newspaper editor saying this is all a load of shit. Yep. She said that does. Battered woman does exist, but not here.

but I have not seen a case as of yet, she says, I'll quote from her, that the woman has not had any medical evidence or testimony from friends or family stating they had seen marks, bruises, broken bones, suspicious scars on anywhere. I feel Gloria should not be eligible for parole, as she's only served a few years of her crime. Larry cannot come back from the grave to ask for it. So upon release, she starts speaking at women's... Fuck you. Like anti-domestic violence stuff wow yeah plays the whole i'm a plays that's her that's her role now that's what she does that's her thing the grave by the way yeah the her fucking name is still on that grave it is larry dean on

the same headstone gloria jean but with no end date. Like they're going to bury her next to him? Like they're going to bury her next there. Oh, my God. In the Little Dane Cemetery in Lawrence County there. There's also a book about this called Have At It, Sister. What? It's only available. It's actually, if you have Audible, it is included in the Audible membership.

It's one of the included books. Are you trying to say that's his last words or something? No, no, no, no. This is, she's involved in this. She's one of the narr books i'm trying to say that's his last words or something no no no this is she's involved in this she's one of the narrators in this book even i don't want to hear that glorious so it's crazy so there you go that is whitewood south dakota that's a hell of a crazy story if you like that story tell the world tell whatever app you're on give us five stars helps a lot there head over to shut up and give me murder.com get tickets to all your events merch everything like that you want to go give me murder.com. Get tickets to all your events,

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This week, disco demolition night and Sherry Papini kidnapping for why? Who the fuck knows? So there's that. There's that. Uh, definitely do that. You get a shout out at the end of the show too. Who doesn't want a shout out?

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And until next week, it's been our pleasure. Bye. Hey, Prime members. You can listen to Small Town Murder early and ad-free on Amazon Music. Download the Amazon Music app today. Or you can listen early and ad-free with Wondery Plus and Apple Podcasts. Before you go, tell us about yourself by completing a short survey at wondery.com slash survey. In May of 1980, near Anaheim, California, Dorothy Jane Scott noticed her friend had an inflamed red wound on his arm and seemed unwell. She insisted on driving him to the local hospital to get treatment.

While he waited for his prescription, Dorothy went to grab her car to pick him up at the exit, but would never be seen alive again. Leaving us to wonder, decades later, what really happened to Dorothy Jane Scott? From Wondery, Generation Y is a podcast that covers notable true crime cases like this one and many more. Every week, hosts Aaron and Justin sit down to discuss a new case, covering every angle and theory, walking through the forensic evidence and interviewing those close to the case to try to discover what happened. And with over 450 episodes, there's a case for every true crime listener. Follow the Generation Y podcast on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. And with over 450 episodes, there's a case for every true crime listener. Follow the Generation Y podcast on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts.

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