Small Town Murder - #399 - Titanic Insanity - Port Angeles, Washington

Episode Date: June 29, 2023

This week, in Port Angeles, Washington, when it looks like the story is going one way, it takes a complete left turn into unexpected, and shocking cold bloodedness. When a woman is found, dead, in an overturned car, it becomes obvious that this woman didn't die in this accident, but was murdered, and put into the car, to make it look accidental. The story from the killer is part guilt from an earlier death he had a part in, and trauma from seeing the movie "Titanic" that haunted his every thought. Will he be found insane??Along the way, we find out that any town where people pee on each other doesn't sound very good, that even a doctor can lose track of their condition, and that some crimes truly do go unpunished!!Hosted by James Pietragallo and Jimmie WhismanNew episodes every Thursday!Donate at: patreon.com/crimeinsports or go to paypal.com and use our email: [e-mail] to shutupandgivememurder.com for all things Small Town Murder & Crime In Sports!Follow us on...twitter.com/@murdersmallfacebook.com/smalltownpodinstagram.com/smalltownmurderAlso, check out James & Jimmie's other show, Crime In Sports! On Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, Wondery, Wondery+, Stitcher, or wherever you listen to podcasts!See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Small Town Murder early and ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. What if you married the love of your life and then stood by them as they developed 21 new identities? What would you do? This Is Actually Happening is a weekly podcast that features extraordinary true stories of life-changing events told by the people who lived them. Listen to the newest season of This Is Actually Happening on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. This week in Port Angeles, Washington, a case with more twists and turns than can be imagined, complete with death, craziness, and a lingering state of sadness brought on by the movie Titanic.

Welcome to Small Town Murder. Hello, everybody, and welcome back to Small Town Murder. Yay! Yay, indeed, Jimmy. Yay, indeed. My name is James Petrigallo. I'm here with my co-host. I'm Jimmy Wissman.

Thank you folks so much for joining us today on another edition of Small Town Murder. And this one, put your seatbelts on, everybody. This is a case that you think is one thing, and then it's not that thing at all, and it's something completely different. That's all I can tell you. It's wild, and you're never going to see what's coming coming. We'll put it that way. So a very fun episode. Well, not fun.

It's awful, but you know what I mean. As fun as murder can be. Put it that way. Fascinating. Fascinating. So we will get to that. That's a good, better word. Fascinating murder.

We'll get to all of that. First, head over to shutupandgivememurder.com. Get your tickets for live shows they are sold out up until august 12th when we're in chicago it'll be our biggest show ever if you come out big for us chicago get out out there we're gonna do a chicago only show too the only place you can see this live show this year on our tour is in chicago so get over there get your tickets right now shut up andAndGiveMeMurder.com There's a lot of sold out shows but there's a few with tickets left. A couple tickets left in D.C. We have Atlanta,

Dallas, Charlotte and Philly and that's it. So get your tickets right now and get into those and come see us at a show. That'll be fun. So also you definitely want Patreon. Patreon.com slash Crime in sports is where you get all of the bonus materials anything anybody five dollars or above you're going to get

access to the whole back catalog over 200 like 200 bonus episodes to binge on and catch up on and new ones every other week this week is no different what you're going to get is for crime and sports which of course you'll have access to you're going to get is for crime and sports, which of course you'll have access to, you're going to get players who like to pay for sex. So this is just going to be a whole episode of people getting busted in very embarrassing situations. Call it the pants. It's going to be hilarious. Put it that way. And then for small town murder, we're going to talk about finally Casey Anthony.

Let's get into that whole mess and see we'll we will unpeel one lie at a time there and it's it's wild she might for her age she might have more lies per like per minute alive than anybody else you know like lies per minute her lies per minute her her lpms are off the chart so we'll talk all about it that is shut up or that's actually patreon.com slash crime and sports also make sure to keep an eye out for your stupid opinions our new show we're we want it to happen it would have been out already if we had total control over everything it's literally business stuff feeds contracts it's a lot of stuff we have no control over that we love to control.

And it is coming. The show is done. So I know we didn't do it for nothing. It's definitely coming. We cannot wait for it. Your stupid opinions. And you should be listening to Crime and Sports if you're not, too. A lot of murder lately.

A lot of crazy stuff. Give it a shot if you're on the fence. I don't care about sports. Doesn't matter. If you like hearing us talk about crazy stories, you're going to want to to see that sir here's the story of conor mcgregor is waiting for you check that out it's it's there two-parter so that said disclaimer time yeah it's a comedy show we're comedians that doesn't mean the story's not real everything in the story is unfortunately real uh to the to the t it's all definitely. Nothing's made up for comic effect or anything like that.

You don't have to. The stories are crazy. And we will make jokes, absolutely. But the jokes are not where you might think they are. That's the thing. We go out of our way not to make fun of the victims or the victim's family. Why is that, James? Because we're assholes.

Yeah. But we're not scumbags. And that's how that goes. There's nothing funny about the actual murder. But there's a lot funny about things that go on around a murder as far as, hmm, now what do I do with this body? That's a funny situation because now you've got a situation. Now you've got a problem.

So that said, if you think true crime and comedy should never, ever go together, maybe we're not for you. Maybe we are, though. Give it a shot, but don't complain later either way. But for the rest of you that want to hear an insane show and a crazy murder I want everyone to sit back let's clear the lungs everybody here and let's all shout

Shut up and give me murder. Let's do this, Jimmy. That's a good stretch. That's a good one. That's nice. I mean, to the sky it feels great. Let's go on a trip, shall we? Alright. That's what I mean. To the sky. It feels great. Just stretch with it. Let's go on a trip, shall we?

All right. Let's do this. We're going all the way to Washington State today. Okay. The severe northwest we're heading to here. So lovely. It's a lovely part. And this is northwest Washington.

It's Port Angeles, Washington, which is very near Squim, which was our last episode. So it's kind of up on that coast, the northern coast. If you look out and squint real hard, you can see canada so it's up there on the water about two and a half hours northwest of seattle so seattle you think of seattle is like as northwest as it gets but there's a bunch of shit feels northwest of their corner it really does about two hours to victoria british columb Okay. Across the water there. Yeah. And about 25 minutes to Squim, which was our last Washington episode. Right around the corner.

Yeah. About seven months ago there. So this is in Clallam County, C-L-A-L-L-A-M. A lot of L's and A's and M's in that word, so that's a lot. Clallam County, area code 360. Motto of this town. Oh, boy. The center of it all on the Olympic Peninsula. Okay.

Well, I mean. Center of it all. Corner of it all. It's the Kobolamat Peninsula. They're the center of it all. Geography-wise, we're right in the middle, pal. Don't you take that away from us. A little bit of history of this town here. About the 1800s, you know, people started people started coming from other parts of the United States.

It was a small whaling and fishing and shipping village that developed here. Because it's right on the water. So it makes sense. And they traded with Victoria, British Columbia a lot because that was right there. The first settlers were here in 1856 and 1857. And then the Chorberg land company came in 1859 now it's a town yeah now they're gonna start selling lots and doing all that shit here we go now it's all gonna be ruined very soon downhill since then downhill since 1859 that's their other

motto by the way so it caught the attention of a guy named victor smith and he was a guy who was a protege of the collector of customs for that area all right the for the government collected customs tariffs and shit like that so he got approval to relocate the u.s customs port of entry for washington the territory at that time time from port townsend to port angeles and that's when people started coming so that was good but then smith died when the brother johnson sank which was a boat out there oh shit he died in a shipwreck and it went down and so that people started losing interest in the area because he wasn't promoting it anymore. Yep.

And so then the Port of Entry was returned to Port Townsend, and this place sunk into obscurity. Oblivion. Made it like where the Goonies live after that. No one cared anymore. They built a hotel in 1884. They got a trading post and a general store, and then they started getting a ferry pier and started trying to – you're on on the water have some imagination yeah come on but you got to embrace the water though and make everything about the water yeah and also logging because there's there's water one way and trees the other way so yeah you know those are your those are what you have those are your resources

so they began 1914 a large-scale logging operation began and there there was a big mill, and they had a railway that would take the trees from there, move it to shore, and then you can ship it off from there. But that lasted until the 70s, 1970s, early 1980s, when the mills started to close, and they only had one left after a while, and that closed in 1997. Oh, boy. So, now this is crazy august 2003 they got a 275 million dollar construction project known as the graving dock project what does that do the great just think

of the name the graving dock project okay okay now this was uh it was intended to construct an area for anchoring pontoons for the bridge. All right, for a bridge. Now, during construction, they discovered human remains. Oh, no. At the Graving Dock Project. Hilarious. Okay.

The site was found to be, quote, the largest prehistoric Indian village and burial ground found in the United States. Oh, my God. It's a horror movie. It's a plot of a horror movie. It's poltergeist is what we have here. Yeah. It's an Indian burial ground. It's what you don't want.

The biggest. When you break ground for anything. The largest, especially the most, uh, also included native American burials of the late 18th and early 19th centuries. Uh, they came in, they found about 300 graves and 7085 pieces of human bones in addition to numerous ritual and ceremonial Indian artifacts here. After you find 10, you put the fucking dirt in.

We got to do a different route probably, right? Because of the significance, they said this, the remains at this site of everything go back at least 8,000 years. Oh, my. The artifacts and things that they found were 8,000 years old. Yeah. So they said it was a very significant site. And in 2004, they abandoned the whole project.

Good. So, wow. When they all started finding lumps all over their body. Yeah. What's happening here? I don't know. I can't sleep at night, and my daughter got sucked into the TV. So I feel like maybe we should stop doing this, right?

There's a very small southern lady saying weird things to me. It's strange. It's really weird. John Lithgow's around. Whenever he's around, weird shit happens. I feel like we should stop. Incredible. A lot of the graves uncovered appeared to hold entire families who seem to have

died suddenly and archaeologists speculate that it was probably the result of pandemics like smallpox and shit like that yeah they caused massive death tolls between 1780 and 1835 in the native population and they had no immunity obviously so as soon as the europeans got there they were like here have some disease some disease. And they all died. So that's what happened. Now, born in this town, somebody you love very much, Jimmy, and I'm pretty fond of as well, John Elway born here. Is that right? The hometown of John Elway, yes.

I had no idea. Yep. When he got drafted by the cults originally and when they were looking for a team to take him to, Seattle was one of his first choices because he is from the area and so is his wife so and his wife he wanted to go back there but then he ended up in denver so there you go he was almost a washington mainstay reviews of this town let's find out what others think of it you know we've we don't know we're not there we're not on the ground this is the first i'm hearing of it. That's it. So let's do this. Five stars.

Perfect. Perfect town. It's some of the most beautiful land in the Pacific Northwest region of the United States. Home to the Olympic National Park and the Olympic Mountains, Port Angeles, Washington, and the surrounding areas should be visited by everyone. Okay. Mandatory. Yeah. You've got to fill out your draft card when you're 18 and make a commitment

to visit port angeles that's the two things you have to do don't see all the remains you gotta do selective services thing and that so five stars is another one here what i like about port angeles is the beautiful view of the mountains right on the ocean and the short commute around town on a bus is a good way to find out where stuff is. And cool mom and pop corner stores and restaurants, all sorts of interesting shops for tourists. I think he means tourists. Yeah. It says tourists, though. Like, only if you're born in April.

Only March, I think, is tourists. Yeah, only if you're a March kid. That's it. Yeah, it's March into april i believe because then no because the beginning of march because then it's aries after that there you go okay i don't fucking know so the i'm not a chick i don't know okay you don't blame your period on it james i was gonna say walk into a walk into like a bar or a public place find the chick who has like the most shit in her hair like beads and things she'll tell you all about it i guarantee you that's not drinking a beer and not drinking a bit drinking or drinking some sort of weird ale

thing what is that mead what are you drinking so uh the camping scene around here is amazing what i would try to change is the access for homeless people to better programs and resources. Oh. You said that in the same sentence you said how great the camping is. Right. Which is a very strange. Not that that's. I'm just saying that's a weird.

Two weird things to put together. Sleeping outside is the best. They should be happy but they're not. They should help these people sleeping outside weird okay one star now the bad we've heard the good now the bad okay one star bad drug problems poor economics too remote mixed bag of humanity with some nice folks and social derelicts then i love a nice mix of humanity i like that too that's beautiful i love when people use the word humanity to describe the mess just the human oh the humanity it's just and

throwing in derelict derelict is also and i like degenerate and derelict a lot those are great words great words then all capital, three exclamation points, not recommended. They do not like it here. Okay. One star again. Dirty, noisy, corrupt, and filled with the rejects of society. Rejects. That's another way to put it.

These people are so learned. Derelicts, degenerates, mixed bag of humanities rejects. That's what this place apparently is for me. Town motto, leave your money and get out. Come on vacation and leave on probation. Leave your money and get out. So you're being robbed? Go ahead and hand over your money and turn on around there, pally boy.

Just drop the bag and get out of town. Wow. All right. One star. If you like the high cost of living, crime, needles in the parks and beaches, trash and human feces on the sidewalk, and to be harassed constantly by the unhoused population, do you like to have your belongings stolen out of your yard, house, or car?

Do you like being harassed by druggies while you're on your own way overpriced property? Do you like paying for needles that are left where your children play? Do you like rapists roaming your streets? Then Port Angeles is the place for you. They need to make one of those Cleveland videos. You know what I mean? Yeah. Come see our two buildings.

They have a lot of, see our river that catches on fire. They have a lot of pent up aggression. I feel like a video would be the way to disperse that possibly. Is Port Angeles this bad? Well, here's the last one. It's one star.

And if it's, if this is true, then yeah, I think it is because we've heard a lot of bad, but this one, no. Okay. Quote, I saw someone peeing on my friend that's the first sentence i saw someone on my friend so if you come here people will pee on

you is what he said so that is a bad that's a bad review. And that's only the start. Did your friend see it? Did your friend ask for it? I saw someone peeing on my friend. That's what I mean. Did he pay for that? Was that extra? Did he pay an extra $20 to have that done to him? I saw someone peeing on my friend and then someone else using drugs.

Well, yeah, they go together. If you're peeing on people in public, you're probably on something. If you're being peed on, there's likely someone doing drugs real close by. Real close by. What did it smell like? Was it like a drug smell or an asparagus smell? That's how you can tell if it was a real drug addict or not. Because drug addicts don't eat asparagus.

That's how you can tell. Or their minerals. So I'll have to admit it's not the best choice to visit or live no matter what people might say wow this sounds like a dreamland over here holy fuck i gotta see it i i want to see this place so bad i'm looking at my watch when's the moving truck gonna be here you know what i mean because we're waiting we gotta get over there. People in this town, 19,888. So a little under 20,000. We're about usual with male, female, that sort of shit.

The median age is about normal. It's about 38 years old. Less married people than normal. That's a few more divorced people. Maybe that's why there's less married people. They're divorced now. A few more widowed people than normal as well, but less old people. So maybe they're dying of other things.

I'm not sure. Dying young. Yeah. They got the curse. They got the Port Angeles curse. The Goonie curse. Race of this town, 83.4% white, 2.2% black, 2.6% Asian, 1.9% Native American 5.4 percent hispanic so interesting it's a lot of white people um they're uh 29.6 percent are religious so yeah well i guess if your religion

is the needle i guess you're gonna i don't know if that counts that's not on the official list of religions here and it's it's spread around pretty good you got some a few mormons here other christians some lutherans a catholic or two throw in a presbyterian and a pentecostal you got yourself a real party uh 0.2 jewish uh last election here in the county in clallam county 50.2 of the people voted democratic and 46.8 voted republican three percent independent 3% independent. So it's very close. It's very split down the middle here. That's as close as you get, honestly, because the independent vote,

that makes it pretty much even if you put that in. So people don't make a ton of money here. 36% make $30,000 or less. What the fuck? That's a lot. The unemployment rate's a little bit high, but median household income's also low. Right now it's about $57,000.

Here it's $41,297. Huh. Cost of living isn't low either. That's the thing. It's expensive. Cost of living, 100 is regular average. Here it's 97. And the housing is high.

The median home cost here, 415,900 bucks. How are they doing? That's what I mean. This is rough. I guess that's why you're on your overpriced property and someone's peeing on you. You know what I mean? This isn't what you want. They're throwing their needles at you. But if we've convinced you, damn it, that this is fine and you're okay with everything that we've described, we have for you the Port Angeles, Washington real Estate Report. Your average two-bedroom rental here goes for $1,180, which is actually right about the national average, so that's not terrible.

Here's your first house. All right. Foreclosure, everybody. It's the's your first house all right foreclosure everybody it's the special of the day here foreclosure it's a one bed one bath 556 square foot little house he couldn't pay for it it is a fucking mess there is a gigantic i don't know if this comes with it but there's a mountain of garbage in the front yard nearly as high as the house. And in the backyard it's not piled, it's just scattered about knee deep all over the backyard.

That is, listen, that is a compost pile and I want you to take it easy. There's shiny shit in there. There's bumpers and shit in there. No, it's not compost. There's hubcaps and bumpers and like, there's, yeah, there's an old furnace in there. It's like shit like that. Garbage.

Where do they get it all? There is a, right next to that, the good news is right next to the huge pile of garbage, there's a broken down camper with spray paint all over it. So that's nice. Online bidding starts at $1. Oh! This house could be had for $1, possibly. Should we get it?

I don't think so. No. This looks like a lot of trouble. I feel like if you don't clean it up, the city's going to fine you, and it's just going to be a lot of bills that we're paying here. There's probably already back fines that you've got to pay to acquire it. Yeah, exactly. You're going to get hepatitis going through that pile. I don't want anything to do with it.

Three bedroom, one bath, 1,264 square foot house. It's like a raised ranch. It's kind of not that great looking, but it's on 7.91 acres. So lots of land. Interior, 1977 in a nutshell. I mean, they redid it in 77 and said, perfect. Never changed a fucking thing. It's a jam.

Yeah. A lot of linoleum, linoleum baby everywhere. Oh, boy. 349,900 bucks for that, though. But there's seven acres. It, a lot of linoleum. Linoleum, baby, everywhere. Oh, boy. $349,900 for that, though. But that's seven acres. It's a lot of land, almost eight. Then finally here, let's say you've done very well. You're doing great, and you want to have the nicest house in town for people to pee on you.

Sure. We have a five-bedroom, five-bath tea bowl for each and every b-hole. You betcha. 4,593-square square foot house right on the water i mean right on the water deck that overlooks the water boat dock beautiful inside all brand new beautiful three million five hundred thousand bucks for that oh it's gonna cost you three and a half mil but you're on the water i mean mean, your property, you have a huge waterfront. It's all yours, private. Things to do here.

I want to go here and then leave when the music starts. But the Dungeness Crab and Seafood Festival. Fuck yeah. Hell yeah. Count me in. Exceptional and delicious food, beverages, and live music abounds at the Dungeness Crab and Seafood Festival. The vocabulary up here, I love it. They use words I like.

Abounds, derelict, it's good. And the first fed crab central tent on the city pier and in and around the gateway pavilion. So not just about food, though. There's plenty of other fun to be had during the festival. The Grab a Crab Derby is fun for kids of all ages. What's that? I assume grabbing a crab. It's probably like bobbing for apples, except not with your mouth, I hope.

Oh, I hope they do it with their mouth. That'll work. Ow, ow, ow. You've got to really want it there. Then there's great music, as they're talking about now. Under music on the website, crabfestival.org, by the way, is the website. On the website, if you click on music and art performances, it says, quote, again, this could be a category with posts. But you can also just make it a child page.

But you'll want to include lots of photos, video, things from past performances. And for the current performances, you want to list the performers and whenever possible include a YouTube video embed of the current year's performers and pitch them. This is for the person who is supposed to put the bands on here who never did. They just left. Somebody copy and pasted the instructions of how to build this page. Nice job. Like this is not helpful to me at all trying to find the bands.

And nobody has clicked it and told them yet. Nobody. They don't care. They know now, crabfestival.org. Now you know. So the music there and the main stage in the Kitsap Bank Crab Central tent. Yeah. Sponsored by Jim's Pharmacy and Airflow Heating.

Because those things go together. Jim's Pharmacy. Give me my pills and because those things go together. Jim's Pharmacy. Give me my pills and some ducks. Like, what the fuck is that? We have, let's see, let's start down here. We have Shea Jazz. They'll be playing. Yeah, they jazz standards.

Hippie and the Squids. I like that. Rock covers there. So Yaya. That's indigenous African rhythm and blues. The Lisa Mitz Band. Original pop. They have original songs.

Not even anything you've ever heard. Oh, my God. Perfect. Crush Water. That sounds dumb. Shaky Jake, which is hilarious. He's just... It's a guy with Parkinson's.

Either that or just the guy who really needs to fucking... He's got the DTs and shit, and he's just having problems up there. He's like, I quit drinking this morning, and it's not going well. I'm shaky Jake. I only play the salt shaker maracas and a tambourine. That's it. That's what I'm good at. He plays classic rock, apparently, on these tambourines. The Steve Eaton trio. That's it. That's what I'm good at. He plays classic rock apparently on these tambourines.

The Steve Eaton Trio. Gotta have them. Jack Dwyer and Friends. Whoever. Joy in Mudville. There's another band. Black Diamond Junction. They play classic covers. They could save all the money

that they pay all these fucking bands and just pay one person to headline the whole thing. Yeah. Do an hour of music and get the fuck out. They're all going to play ZZ Top and fucking George Thorogood over and over. So what's the difference? Just play it and get over with. Just get somebody that plays the real music, pay them for an hour, and be done.

And then we don't pollute the air all fucking day with lisa mitts and also the buck ellard band they play country of course as you might have might have guessed crime rate in this town what we're interested in here property crime almost double oh so that would be like peeing on someone shitting on the streets leaving your needles places harassing people legs around yeah the wet leg capital of the world it's not just the rainfall uh violent crime murder rape robbery and of course assault but mount rushmore of crime is only a slightly high actually so it's that's pretty average but the the you know kind of regular people street shit goes on yeah yeah

you're gonna get some shit stolen but they if you catch them stealing they'll probably run away not stab you that's the odds are it's that kind of town yeah oh shit and they'll run away so that said let's talk about some murder here what do you say yeah let's do that let's do this let's start out back in time here going back to 1998 okay so it's a beautiful time 1998 1998, I'm just going to say. I don't know if it is. It was a good time to be alive, man. Yeah, Yankees won the World Series that year.

That was fun. I just mean, like, that was the pinnacle of everything. Everything was so good. Decided to marry my first wife that year. That wasn't a good decision, probably. You can balance the good with the bad i guess so you know yeah yankees win we got this happening i don't know then you marry something that's not gonna last yeah that's a problem so but in 98 too it was it was just such it was a nice time everything

was quiet and peaceful a year later columbine happened and then the world went to shit yeah that that happened too 98 was kind of like we're and then the world went to shit yeah that that happened too 98 was kind of like we're not worried about any of that shit yeah everything was so safe yeah so the seinfeld's almost over what are we doing here like it's like yeah it's a good time it did it was nice for that so let's talk about a couple of people in 1998 the night of january 11th 1998 to be exact here early in 98 and very early in somebody's life, as we'll talk about here. There's a couple, Martin and Michelle McInerney. M-C-I-N-N-E-R-N-E-Y.

McInerney. Welcome to the small town of Chinook, where faith runs deep and secrets run deeper. In this new thriller, available exclusively on Wondery+, religion and crime collide when a gruesome murder rocks the isolated Montana community. Everyone is quick to point their fingers at a drug-addicted teenager, but local deputy Ruth Vogel isn't convinced. She suspects connections to a powerful religious group. Enter federal agent V.B. Loro,

who has been investigating a local church for possible criminal activity. The pair form an unlikely partnership to catch the killer, unearthing secrets that leave Ruth torn between her duty to the law, her religious convictions, and her very own family. But something more sinister than murder is afoot, and someone is watching Ruth. With an all-star cast led by Emmy nominee Sanaa Lathan and Star Wars' Kelly Marie Tran,

Chinook is available exclusively and ad-free on Wondery+. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. It's all a lighthearted nightmare on our podcast, Morbid. We're your hosts. I'm Alina Urquhart. And I'm Ash Kelly. And our show is part true crime, part podcast, Morbid. We're your hosts. I'm Alina Urquhart. And I'm Ash Kelly. And our show is part true crime, part spooky, and part comedy. The stories we cover are well-researched. He claimed and confessed to officially killing up to 28 people. With a touch

of humor. I'd just like to go ahead and say that if there's no band called Malevolent Deity, that is pretty great. A dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit with a little bit of cursing. This mother****er lied. Like a liar. Like a liar. And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal. Or you love to hop in the Wayback Machine and dissect the details of some of history's most notorious crimes. You should tune in to our podcast, Morbid.

Follow Morbid on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to episodes early and ad-free by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Martin's 22, Michelle's 20. Okay. Young married couple that just had a baby three days ago. Right. So very nice.

They're considered a young couple. They have a friend over as well here that we'll talk about. Three days ago right so very nice they're considered a young couple they have a friend over as well here that we'll talk about but three days ago three days brand new baby and they're kind of a lot of they talk about they're kind of what a lot of the people in port angeles are at that time their parents are blue collar workers laborers that's what they do they don't really have any they don't have a career path they're going going to get jobs. And like, you know, us. Normal fucking people. Like we stumbled around for years and years and years like that, you know.

So the exact same type of thing. Their families had worked in like lumber and paper and fishing and the blue collar jobs around there. And Marty and Michelle, being young especially, too, they both of them have just had like kind of shit jobs here and there either of them have like a job with benefits or a career yet they're 22 and 20 also which is I worked at a gas station

when I was 20 so yeah what does that tell you and other terrible places yeah that tells you a lot so they had been I worked at a bar, so they don't have a lot of money at all. They're just a young couple trying to make it on love, Jimmy. Yeah, yeah.

And they have a baby. They have a three-day-old son on January 11th, 1998. He hasn't even had a second bath yet. Oh, no, no. They just got him home from the hospital that day. I mean, just got home. His name's Connor, and they name him Connor, spelled like McGregor, C-O-N-O-R. And they had a friend that comes over that drops by to show them a board game that he'd been given for his birthday.

I'm going to show you this board game. I don't know what the board game was, but he stops by to show them this board game. It's a new game? Can you imagine it's you just got home from the hospital remember getting home from the hospital with a baby holy shit there's shit everywhere there's fucking onesies and things and rags and diapers and you have no idea what's going on it's you don't you don't sleep no you sleep like an hour here an hour there you're stumbling around you don't remember if – did I put the baby down or did I take it outside and give it to somebody?

What did I do? Like you don't even know what you did anymore. I put my son in the car seat wrong and the one that you have to like – that you can carry around. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I put him in the car seat and buckled him in and I was ready to leave the hospital. And the nurse was like – bugged eyes out of her head, ran to me. No, don't leave with him like that. You're not good at this.

eyes out of her head ran to me no don't leave with him like that you're not good at this i had the towel the blanket swaddled him up and then i seat belted him in like that and i was like he likes being swaddled she's like you're gonna suffocate him yeah you can't yeah that's not great it's gonna end up choking him and shit see that's that's i almost killed my kid in 10 minutes you're like on the sims basically it doesn't last long like oh baby fell in the pool i pulled it out and then it was too close to the grill and it caught on fire oh shit that's a problem that's it always happens they're incredible yeah or uh yeah the sims that's what that does and then they jump up and down and shit themselves so they had this baby and their friends like let me show you this board game.

Now, if I have a three day old baby, I'm like, I'm not going to give a fuck about your board game for about six months. I've got a real life Tamagotchi in my house. Leave me alone for right now. This is combat. You know, it's it's you are you're fighting against the elements. You're trying to keep this kid alive. And then six months ago, I don't know how it's still alive, but somehow we've got that. It's crazy.

This is crazy. This is wild. So this guy stops by, and it's snowing like crazy outside, by the way. It's a real big snowstorm, which doesn't happen often up in these parts, especially in the Seattle area. And down there, it's even snowing. Everywhere, it's snowing. So the snow continues to pile up outside. The three adults set up the game and start playing a board game really it's a board game i'd be like i'm fucking exhausted if this kid's stopped you

know crying or if it's sleeping for 20 minutes i'm gonna take a nap or you know what is this game wash my face or something i don't know it's got a really really drawn people in here to a game of apples to apples. I don't know what's happening. How good is this game? It's amazing. So the Connor is sitting the baby, sitting in the child's, in the swing thing that you put in. Yeah.

The best thing ever. Yeah, it works very well. And their friend noticed that the baby seemed kind of fussy. Oh? Ag agitated is what he said looked a little agitated so michelle picks him up and walks him around to calm him down you know like parents do oh here you go it's okay and you hug him and do all that shit and um yeah that's how it goes and connor calms down a little while after that connor seems hungry so michelle starts to breastfeed him as they're playing the game.

So she's rolling dice and breastfeeding at the same time. Amazing. Doing her thing. Yeah, good job, Michelle. Michelle reclines on a couch that has a recliner part to it. And she's feeding the baby. And she had the guys roll for her. You go ahead and roll for me, her husband or the other guy.

So after a few minutes, their friend friend here byron is the guy's name he noticed that connor's he saw that he was getting a little bit fussy what are you staring at her tit for with a kid hanging off of it don't look over there let's look the other way you shouldn't notice this stuff right now this game has got you so riveted that you made us play it keep an eye on the game yeah what are you at? So the friend asked Michelle, is everything okay? And Michelle told him that Connor wasn't yet really good at breastfeeding. Yeah, he's not latching so good. It takes a while.

Breastfeeding's not easy. They don't just pop on there and they start sucking on it. It's a mess. It's hard to teach them that shit. You can't teach them what's coming out of there. Yeah, so after a few minutes, then Connor quieted down, and the friend thought nothing more of it. So they keep playing the game, and Michelle keeps reclining and feeding him and hugging him and burping him and doing all the bomb shit that you do when you're breastfeeding. So after a few minutes, Connor's quieted down.

Michelle starts to get panicky and noticed that something's not right. So she asked, she asked them, she goes, is he breathing? Is Connor breathing? Look at him. Is he breathing?

So they stopped looking at the game and they look at Michelle and the baby and they say, he doesn't look like he's breathing. He's not going up and down, which we've talked about a hundred times. When I first had a kid, I didn't sleep because when they were asleep, I would stare at them and make sure that they breathe the whole time.

Cause I was terrified of SIDS. So I was like, it just, they just stopped breathing for no reason. Holy fuck. I got would stare at them and make sure that they breathe the whole time because I was terrified of SIDS. So I was like, they just stopped breathing for no reason. Holy fuck, I gotta stare at them. So it scared me there a lot. So they... Something's definitely wrong. She's not moving. Marty said, oh my god, and he takes the

baby here and looking for a pulse on the baby. They can't find a pulse. Oh my god. So Marty goes, oh my god, tells the friend call the 911. Call can't find a pulse. Oh, my God. So Marty goes, oh, my God, tells the friend, call the 911. Call 911. So they're panicking, obviously. And Marty begins performing CPR on the baby at that point, trying to do this. This was just after 7.40 p.m.

Oh, boy. So the paramedics arrived in less than four minutes, thankfully, even in the snow. So they were really on top of that shit. They take Connor and they try to intubate him, put a plastic tube down his throat to make it air to him. But they also noticed that his heart wasn't beating as well. So he was turning blue. So they got in the ambulance. They take off.

And by the time they're going in almost to the hospital, Connor, they don't think, hasn't breathed in 20 minutes. Oh, my God. So this isn't good, obviously, there. So they get to the hospital, and at 8.05, he is in the emergency room. So 25 minutes here. And he is treated by, he's shown to Dr. Bruce Rowan, R-O-W-A-N. He is about 34 years old at this point, younger doctor. You know, he's not one of these older guys.

Younger doctor. He's not a hospital employee, but he's an emergency room specialist in a partnership of doctors who have a contract with the hospital, which is what a lot of the hospitals are. It's contracted doctor groups that kind of rent out space almost, how it works. So, you know, like a hair salon except with a lot more training. Let's do that with people's lives. Just pay for your chair. So he's one of these people. The partnership, they rotate 12-hour shifts and they're always there.

But they make a lot of money as well. Rowan earns about $185,000 a year from this gig. Not bad. So he does very well for himself, this guy here. He's the head doctor in the unit as well. So this is the guy you want taking care of your kid when he's not breathing. He noticed immediately, Dr. Bruce Rowan, that Conor's toes, legs, arms, and fingers were purple. So that's a sign of lack of oxygen.

So they said that he had to have suffered brain damage by this point. So they said there's no way. They didn't have the machine to measure electrical brain patterns. Normally, they would fly him to Seattle on a helicopter, but the snow is so heavy, all helicopters have been grounded. Oh, Jesus. So they can't get him to Seattle. This is the worst time to have anything. This is a terrible time.

So they place an IV in Connor's arm, epinephrine, there you go, epinephrine, and atropine were administered, and a slight heartbeat is detected now. Great. So Dr. Rowan gives the baby lidocaine, and the heartbeat goes up to 100 beats per minute. Terrific. Does this on purpose, trying to, you know, jar him, basically.

Yep. So Dr. Rowan is trying to save this baby's life. I mean, frantically trying to save this baby's life. And he needs assistance, though. He's telling people, help, call this guy, call this guy. I can't be the only one here doing this, basically. So they call up Dr. Eugene Turner, who at the time was 61 years old, and he's the on-call pediatrician in the emergency room. They tell him about the emergency.

He gets there at 8.50 and takes over. He's like an older guy, 62 years old. You know, he's kind of the... He's known as a legend in the area, too. As far as doctors go. He's, you know, he's that kind of guy. He's a pediatrician. He's a very sandy-haired,

genial, you know, come on and bring the kitties in, we'll check them out, type of guy here. He's said to have delivered about a third of the babies born on the olympic peninsula over the last 30 years literally unbelievable he's the guy so before that he was a volunteer in the peace corps before he was a doctor um in his in his off hours in port angeles you know what he did he blesses children he cut wood for poor families. What in the saint is this, man?

Or volunteered at a number of different charities and good works, basically. All good works. He gave a bunch of money to Habitat for Humanity's first housing unit in Port Angeles and even helped with the construction as well. Oh, built a house. Yep. Fuck. He's got his own clinic. Then they picked up the trash along

a stretch of highway 101 which was the main highway leading into town and rather than hire somebody to do that you know this sponsored by he just goes out and picks it up himself that way he can wave at people and see people and all that shit while he's picking up trash on the side of the road single-handedly carrying this town trying Trying to, anyway, here. So Dr. Turner, everybody's happy to see Dr. Turner. So they said that Connor's condition appeared to slightly improve, but he still was unable to breathe on his own. That's the problem. What has happened? If he can't breathe on his own and he's been brain damaged, there's not much you can really do here.

Right, yeah. So at 9.30 p.m., Dr. Turner determined that the child was brain dead. Now, they don't have the machine to check that and make sure. That's the problem. But he determines. 30 years of experience. Yeah. Otherwise there's really no way to tell is the problem here. There's tests you can do but you don't know completely.

There's no dipstick. Right. So he told the parents. He told Marty and Michelle and obtained permission from them to cease life-saving mess measures at this point. So they said, you know,

well, we can cease Connors pronounced dead now. Okay. This is, this is the crazy part. Here's a count, an account from the emergency room nurse named Lori Boucher, butcher,

Boucher. I don't know. Lori Boucher, possibly it's ER though. So that'ser? I don't know. Lori. Boucher, possibly. It's ER, though, so that's maybe. I don't know. Lori, she had worked most of the day in the ER, scheduled to go to work the following day at 10 a.m.,

but the snow was falling, so she said, I don't want to drive home. It's 20 miles away, and the snow is deep, and so I'm just going to sleep at the hospital in the nurse's quarters and just do that. It's easier. So she said that she would carry a beeper while she slept in case the storm prevented any of the night staff from coming to work so she ends up getting pulled into this because they needed help so she's now

dante from clerks and she's like i'm not even supposed to be here today so she's uh she knows this is all going on, and she's preparing. She's the one who prepared the pediatric crash cart and the medications that the baby would need, knowing that the baby was coming in. And her job, she would assist in administering IV drugs to the doctor who was doing that or the nurse who was doing that. So the respiratory therapist was doing that. I'm sorry. who was doing that. So the respiratory therapist was doing that.

I'm sorry. So Dr. Turner, like we said, arrives. And she said it became clear, at least to Dr. Turner, that Connor was not going to recover. And Lori recalled Turner informing Marty and Michelle that the baby showed no neurological response, meaning, you know, reflexes and shit like that. It's over. Yeah, so they said that the baby is brain dead.

Told the emergency team that once oxygen was stopped, the baby would's over. Yeah, so they said that the baby is brain dead. Told the emergency team that once oxygen would stop, the baby would die quickly. Yeah. So he pronounces Connor dead. Marty and Michelle leave the hospital. What are they going to do? They go home. Lori returned to room 2A

to begin cleaning stuff up and making an inventory of the crash cart. So she'd been planning to carry the baby's body down to the hospital morgue, but had to get clearance before she could do so. So she's in and out of the room. She's restocking the cart, doing all that. Ten minutes later, she said she heard a gasp come from Connor. Oh.

Yeah, a gasp. So she went to look, and she said it wasn't one gasp. It was several. So she looked to look and she said it wasn't one gasp. It was several. So she looked at her watch and she said the baby seemed to be gasping four to eight times a minute. Once every eight to 15 seconds, the baby was taking a big, deep breath. So she felt the chest and could feel his heart beating. The baby's alive. Yeah, he's doing great. He's back from the fucking dead here so

at that point another nurse came in the room and laurie said can you look at connor and make sure i'm not crazy because this baby like it was declared already to be alive right so this is wild vicky thought connor was now breathing 10 times a minute too she counted and got 10 vicky said with with each breath I heard the infant making a soft high pitched noise. I noticed his respiration increased in frequency as we watched him. At one point the infant was even able

to grasp my finger. Get the fuck out. This is insane. So Lori runs out of the room to look for Turner. Yeah. She's where the fuck is the doctor? You're wrong. Turner's with Dr.'s where the fuck is, you know, where's the doctor? You're wrong. Turner's with Dr. Rowan.

They're standing there together. Laurie said the fucking baby's alive, you know, tells him the whole story here. So they come back into the room along with Ann Duren, who I think is another nurse. Turner picks up the baby and begins vigorously rubbing his back. Yeah. Laurie later recalled. Yeah. Doing something.

Laurie recalled him saying something about the possibility of miracles, you know, at the time. Maybe it's a miracle. So Laurie put the oximeter back on Connor's foot and noticed that Connor's oxygen level was at 95%. Oh, my God. On room air without any kind of intubation. Oh, my God. With no oxygen, kid is doing great.

He's breathing. So his coloring was pink although he remained neurologically unresponsive though that's the problem he's breathing but there's no there's no it doesn't matter it's just like this shell of a body that's breathing it's functioning but there's nothing upstairs there's nothing happening yeah it's not anything so yeah it's it's crazy. So they talked about during all this, they tried to, I guess they said that after this still Connor was, or before this all happened, before that Connor was breathing again, that Dr. Turner was trying to intubate the baby. Dr. Turner was trying to intubate the baby. Dr. Rowan walked in and saw Turner trying to do it. And Dr. Rowan asked Turner if he wanted, you want me to try?

I've been doing, I've done this more recently. I'm at the hospital all the time. And Turner said, no, I need the practice. Because he thought the baby was dead anyway. So, yeah. So Bruce said, quote, this is Bruce Rowan, Dr. Rowan said, I wasn't sure how to take that, whether it was that he felt the child was dead and he needed practice or that it was just in a nice manner. No, I really want to try it and see it myself. Turner's seemingly casual attitude about the injuries upset Bruce, Bruce said. He didn't like it, Bruce Rowan. So and also Dr. Turner wrapped the baby in an ice cold towel wrap as well.

Why would you do that? Yeah, that was when Rowan said he decided to call Dr. Jackson in Seattle. And Jackson told him that Turner's treatment method sounded unusual. And Jackson told him it would be impossible to know for sure whether a three dayold infant was brain dead if the baby was breathing and had a heart beating. So they don't have any idea. It's strange. So they're – Jesus Christ. They're doing all of this several times over the next hour, though, because the baby's just sort of breathing, but he's kind of, like we said, brain dead.

Several times over the next hour, Dr. Turner was observed closing the baby's lips by pinching them lightly with his fingers. And when he did that, the oxygen levels began to decline, and then he'd release them, and they'd return to normal. Weird. Yeah, why are you doing that so it's very strange they did some other things too he's looking at fixed and dilated eyes prodding his skin with a sharp pin in hopes of eliciting some observant observable nerve

response but every time they've conducted it connor shows no reaction so yeah it's very, very strange, obviously, the way this is all going. So they Rowan had developed some concerns about Turner's course of treatment after when he went and called Dr. Jackson. Like I said, Jackson ended up saying, quote, this is kind of a political call is what they were told back and forth. It's kind of a political thing. You're going to challenge this guy. You know, it's one of those. Like, it's now a pissing contest. Wow.

At one point during this, they're talking back in room 2A where this is all going on, the baby breathing and everything. Lori and the respiratory therapist, they're all discussing how they should chart the situation. You know, work on a baby who'd already been declared dead. How do you chart this? He's dead already. That's a weird thing. Dead, and then this happened 10 minutes later.

That's weird. So after some discussion, they said that one of them would keep notes in pencil until the situation was resolved, and they could figure out what to put on the chart later. Speaking of charts, uncharted waters here. This is not normal. Somebody dies and comes back to life. How do you do that? We don't know what's on this island. Yeah.

So at that point, Turner asked if he could just stand with the baby for a short period on his own. This is what Lori said, the nurse. So all three nurses left the room. This is shortly before midnight. Now, Vicki returned to the room. She had heard an alarm going off. The lights had been dimmed. OK, Dr. Turner had dimmed the lights. Vicki said, even in that light, I could see the monitor and it's reading from the doorway. I saw the oxygen saturation rate was at 45 percent, which was half of what it was a few minutes before. She said, as I approached the monitor about two feet from Dr. Turner, I saw that he had

the infant in his arms. I saw the infant's face and I saw Dr. Turner was pinching the nose. I was confused. Yeah, yeah. She had the same thought. I was confused by what he was doing, which is an understatement. I walked to the monitor and turned off the alarm. He said something like he could

not stand to watch this go on much longer. So mercy of death. It's crazy. So, yeah, she said I was upset by what I saw left immediately and found my supervisor and during

I immediately reported to her what I saw and I believe she would follow up with the proper steps. I saw her go into the room with Dr. Turner and the baby. So the baby is then pronounced dead for a second time that night after that. So the parents, by the way, they had no idea any of this was happening. As far as they were concerned,

the baby was dead two hours ago, and that's that for them. So there's going to be, obviously obviously an investigation here over this whole thing. So Dr. Rowan, Dr. Bruce Rowan, is questioned by hospital officials. He said he hadn't seen the pinching of the nose or hand over a mouth or anything like that, but he was critical of Dr. Turner's treatment and general attitude toward this child. treatment and general attitude toward this child. Yeah. After studying all the information surrounding the death, the hospital officials decided not to inform police of the incident.

Why? I don't know. I feel like that's one of those just to cover your ass. You tell everyone you need to. You report that. But it looks bad for the hospital. This is some small town shit here. That's the other thing.

Yeah. You're dealing with the most popular doctor in a small town and all this type of shit. There is a lot that has to do with that. He said, but so many people knew of the unusual death that it didn't take long for police to be notified. Other people told them it got around. It's a small town. That's not going to stay. Three nurses saw what you did. That's not going to stay so an investigation follows the whole town freaks out about this obviously it's a huge fucking deal huge deal and the big deal too for all of it is that most of the town is on dr turner's side is that right they're mad that anyone's making a big deal they're going that's. Turner. We've all trusted him with our lives all this time.

All of our babies. If he did whatever he needed to do, who are you to question it? Right. That's the doctor. Did you go to medical school? Because I didn't. I listened to him. But not only that, they just all love him.

They've known him for so long. It's more like it's not even like his medical expertise. It's like, well, I know, doctor. I know Eugene. That's, you know, he cut my wood for my family and he just know him. He's well, he's done a lot. He's built up a lot of good karma, I guess you could suppose. So he's helping him out for now.

But they're wondering if they're going to charge him with that. Are they going to charge him? What's going to happen? They end up charging Dr. Turner really with second degree murder, second degree murder, second degree Charge him. What's going to happen? They end up charging Dr. Turner. Really? With second degree murder. Second degree murder. Second degree murder.

Yeah. That's what it is. That's steep. Yep. That's steep. So that's going to happen in a little while. His trial. Second degree murder.

That's not the murder of the story, by the way, at all. Is that right? That is just. That is a tip of this. That is prologue to this other story that's happening okay that's what i mean when you think it's going one way this isn't a story about a baby's death and all that that's very sad and terrible crazy shit happened now so march 1st 1998 less than two months later yeah dr bruce rowan We know him from the hospital. Obviously, he's the other attending guy. Now, he's married to a woman named Deborah Fields.

Deborah Fields is her original name. Now she's Debbie Rowan. Both of them came from Weiser, which is a small town in Idaho. Yeah, they're both small-town Idaho people, the Rowans here. Bruce is the youngest of six children. His parents' names craig is his dad's name yeah his mom's name hortense what is that hortense h-o-r-t-e-n-s-e i've heard that as like an old name but i don't know when the fuck the last time i've heard hortense was

he was born in 1964 this guy yeah His mom's name was Hortense? She was born in the 40s? Fuck, they called her Tensey, which isn't much better. No, it's not. That's what you call a jumpy dog. Like a chihuahua. That's Tensey. Don't worry about him.

He just barks. He's not going to bite you. Call him that because he shakes a lot. I don't know what his deal is. Now, a lot of the older children in Bruce's family were all really good students, great athletes. Bruce's older brother, Barry, graduated from Harvard and became a very successful businessman. Look at that. Yeah.

Bruce is the youngest of the kids. And he's kind of doted on by his parents. Even his older brothers and sisters take care of him. He's the family baby from day one, Bruce. But he always said he felt overshadowed by his older siblings and never felt he could live up to the example. When he goes to school, they're like, oh, you're with this family. Oh, you have the most, your brothers and sisters are the most incredible students.

You know, you're going to be the same. A lot of people thought of Bruce as a vulnerable, sensitive kid. Yeah, basically, who was had a lot of self-criticism, very hard on himself, always yelling at himself. And why did you do that? That type of thing. He said that he felt he felt shame in how he felt humiliated. His brother, his older sister, one of them was, had very bad brain damage and it was noticeable to look at her, to hear her talk. So in public, she was born that way. You'd notice. Yeah. I think it was from birth.

So he said that he felt humiliated by her in public. And then he felt horrible shame for feeling humiliated by her. So he said he had a real spiral going on about that. He said he knew it was wrong to feel embarrassment, but he couldn't help it, and that made him feel bad because he couldn't help it. He couldn't control himself. So, oof, Bruce is spinning out, man. That's a quagmire of shitty emotions. Oh, Jesus, that is, you need a therapist is what you need.

You need to get through all of that. You need to untangle some shit. It's not your fault, yeah. Oof. Everybody said he's got huge empathy for everybody he's a big empathy guy he he said he wasn't able ever able to balance empathy with you know he couldn't do it he's just all empathy and he would let himself spin out and that sort of thing he started to become depressed as a teenager yeah because he just always felt like this he said he

couldn't show it to anybody though because his felt like this he said he couldn't show it to anybody though because his family everybody was perfect so he couldn't be like i'm a mess even even his brain damaged sister's happy take it easy yeah i'm down stop being so mad at yourself that's what it is so he said that he just told himself to buckle down work harder and try to block out bad thoughts okay which is hard i mean it's you know it's a chemical thing it's not not easy so by 12 he by the age of 12 he sat around and considered committing suicide with a shotgun at 12 12 is too much going on in his head he couldn't deal with it anymore so he said that you know he considered it but no, no, he didn't want to do that.

And he said he thought about it. Maybe he wanted to make it if he killed himself, he couldn't just shoot himself with a shotgun. He said he would have to have make it look like an accident to kill himself. Otherwise, his family would be embarrassed by him killing himself. And you want that to happen? Does he feel shame about that? So, yeah, it's like, how do I make it? It doesn't work.

So that's why he didn't kill himself, though, because he couldn't think of a good way to make it look like an accident where his parents wouldn't be embarrassed. Yep. Literally why he didn't. That is mental illness. Hardcore. Very much so. It's sad is what it is. It's real sad.

So in high school, he did very well. He played on the football team. He was twice elected student body president. Two years. Wow. Clearly, he pushes all this shit way down. Way down, yeah. Because to feel like that on the inside and be able to be on a football team and be student class president and all that kind of shit, and also in the top 10% of his class in grades, too.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. You've got to really have some strong mental, I don't know, willpower. I don't know what it is. I mean, one way or another, the work ethic's there. He's doing it. Oh, Jesus. I mean. And he became a fucking doctor that they rely on.

That's an emergency room doctor. The guy's, man, how do you do it? So they'll find out here. People in town said he's going to be a, you know and Idaho said this guy, he's going to be something. This Bruce Rowan, he's going to be something. So 1982, Bruce enrolled at the College of Idaho, which is in Caldwell, Idaho, where he took chemistry and biology courses, which are prereqs for medical school that he had to take. His first year he hated. He was very lonely.

And it's hard yeah and if you that's hard for that makes perfectly mentally healthy kids sometimes get a little you know need some help but for someone who's already clinically fucking depressed this isn't good isolate and then focus on this shit oh man it's a lot now by the third year he had a lot of he developed difficulty concentrating one time he said he stayed in bed for two days because he simply couldn't summon the energy to function i'm telling you which is very depressed heavy holy it gets heavy and it feels like well if i took it off of me then i actually have to take a foot and put that out too on the side of the bed which is also going to be a foot and put that out, too, on the side of the bed, which is also going to be a lot. So one step at a time here.

On the other side of these blankets is the world's problem. Fuck that. One step at a time, let's work on this blanket, and then you don't, and you're under it. And then you never do. You don't. He said, quote, that was very disturbing to me because function was always the most important thing to me, to be able to function. Yeah. So he actually went and saw a college counselor great he said this won't embarrass my family they won't even know about it cool we'll keep this between me and them yeah exactly it's all confidential the counselor gave him some pamphlets about study habits and time management

bruce is like not what i came here for thank you no dog why do i hate me yeah they just thought it was normal school stress of you know you just need to manage your time better so you won't be so stressed out about shit you'll be fine it's all a light-hearted nightmare on our podcast morbid we're your hosts i'm alina urquhart and i'm ash kelly and our show is part true crime part spooky and part comedy the stories we cover are well-researched. He claimed and confessed to officially killing up to 28 people. With a touch of humor. I'd just like to go ahead and say that if there's no band called Malevolent Deity, that is pretty great.

A dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit with a little bit of cursing. This mother****er lied. Like a liar. Like a liar. Like a liar. And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal, or you love to hop in the Wayback Machine and dissect the details of some of history's

most notorious crimes, you should tune in to our podcast, Morbid. Follow Morbid on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to episodes early and ad-free by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. In May of 1980, near Anaheim, California, Dorothy Jane Scott noticed her friend had an inflamed red wound on his arm and seemed unwell. She insisted on driving him to the local hospital to get treatment. While he waited for his

prescription, Dorothy went to grab her car to pick him up at the exit, but would never be seen alive again, leaving us to wonder, decades later, what really happened to Dorothy Jane Scott? From Wondery, Generation Y is a podcast that covers notable true crime cases like this one and many more. Every week, hosts Aaron and Justin sit down to discuss a new case, covering every angle and theory, walking through the forensic evidence, and interviewing those close to the case to try to discover what happened. And with over 450 episodes, there's a case for every true crime listener. Follow the Generation Y podcast on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to Generation Y ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus.

I understand that anybody who's paid attention to the media would have to come to the conclusion that I killed my wife. Hi, my name is Zach Stewart-Pontier. I'm one of the filmmakers behind The Jinx, and I'm excited to bring you the official Jinx podcast. We'll be revisiting all six episodes of part one and watching along with part two as it airs on Max starting April 21st. Bye-bye. The official Jinx podcast.

Listen on Max or wherever you get your podcasts. He didn't know what the problem was, but he knew it wasn't time management. They knew that wasn't his issue. He said he was very unhappy and he said he felt terrible about being unhappy because he knew he was from a privileged background and he had no fucking reason to be unhappy. He goes, I had everything in the world handed to me. I'm in college right now that my parents are paying for that.

You know, I'm doing well. Lots of people would love to trade places with me. I have no reason to be sad. There's people that be sad. Right. Which also, yeah, if there's no reason to feel sad and you feel sad, then you feel even sadder because you feel like an asshole for doing that. It's got to be doubly because he's got five brothers and sisters at home that all think he's better than them. Yeah. That's the other thing. He's like, shit, I got to do this.

Well, maybe not the Harvard guy. Yeah. Well, who knows. Harvard business asshole. He thinks he's better than everybody. Trust me. He may still think that kid's better than him. He's worried about him coming up from behind. He's checking his rear view.

I know that. Looking over his shoulder an awful lot. That's right. So Bruce pulls his shit together and he majors in zoology and he graduates with very high grades in 1986. majors in zoology and he graduates with very high grades in 1986 so after he graduates that's when he starts applying to medical school because that's what he's on a path to do so he's not excited about it or anything he literally is like i don't really want to go to medical school but i've come this far might as well follow through so yeah he goes to the university of washington medical school in seattle and he's just not excited he said quote i wanted to take a year off really just take a chill year

he said i got a lot of material about doing work in various parts of the country appalachia and southwestern migrant workers that sort of thing but the university of washington refused deferring my going in they wouldn't let him defer He'd have to reapply and do all that shit, which is a huge pain in the ass, go through the whole process again. And if you wait an extra year, if you wait a year to go in, perhaps when you go to go in next year, prereqs change, and now all of a sudden

you need other shit. Yeah, and you're not going to remember all that biology and chemistry and shit. You're not going to know. So he's from Idaho. So the first year of the medical education was taken at the University of Idaho in Moscow. And he said it was very, very hard. He had difficulty concentrating. He said he would, out of nowhere, suffer extended crying fits.

Yeah. He'd just cry for a while. So he would find private places to study in case he started crying for no reason couldn't do it around people because it wasn't like i'm starting to feel sad i'm gonna cry he'd just be like okay so the aorta goes oh god jesus christ that was literally what happened it was just come out of nowhere phones connected to the oh my god jesus connected to my family is so much better than me. So that's what he was doing.

He didn't seek professional help, though, and tried to keep everything to himself. Just push it down. Push it down. Poor guy. Goes to medical school in Seattle his second year in 87, 88. Concentration problems worsen, which I can't imagine is helpful in medical school, which seems difficult. He tried to escape his mental situation in his schoolwork. Just do 24-7 schoolwork.

That's it. It's not a bad way to bury it, but it's not the answer. People bury their shit in work or hobby or fucking crime or drugs or booze all the time. He said Bruce found himself. What he would do is he would dress himself up in like dirty old clothes and go to Skid Row to hang out with homeless people. What? Because nobody there is judging him. Nobody judges anybody on Skid Row. Is that what he's worried about? The judgment?

It's judging. It's feeling like you need to be better and great. Down there, we're all just sitting here. No one cares. We're all the same. We're all fucked same we're all fucked we're all fucked there's no competition yeah there's no if you don't do this and then you'll be here and then dad will be mad at you and none of that shit just hanging out he said he'd just try to quote blend in just blend in he was asked later why did you do that do you think and he said quote i knew there was a good chance I'd end up there someday.

I thought I probably would. Really? How many kids in their second year of medical school who come from this background of, you know, a very successful family who has money and all that think, I'll end up on the streets, I'm sure. Probably. Yeah. Especially in their second year of medical school. You know, like that. That's what I mean.

His brain just hates him. So by the end of his second year, he was studying for a final exam in psychiatry. And he read about at that time was the first time he read about the symptoms of chronic depression. And he realized, oh, shit, I check every box of this. This is what's going on here. Yeah. Which it's a funny thing is like in college they have people who do their first year like psych medical students that are doing that. They have tons of maladies that they come up with. They think they have first they think they have a million diseases when they start medical school. Then when they do like anything with psychiatry, they think they have all these mental illnesses. It's a thing that happens. But he's like, no, this is fucked. This is exactly what I am. Okay. So he said the stress, the depression, all of this, he was prescribed Prozac for his problems here.

And at the time, that was the most effective one on the market. So he managed somehow through all of this to pass all of his classes at university and he even went to alaska that summer to work on a commercial fishing fishing boat thanks prozac jesus christ talk about a prozac commercial yeah he's studying one minute next minute he's got wind going through his hair as he pulls up a big net and he goes no it wouldn't be possible without prozac high fives the fucking fisherman next to him as they pull out a salmon, a giant king salmon. He's on deadliest catch going, thanks, Prozac. Thanks, Prozac.

He said he started to feel better immediately upon taking the medication. He said it was a big relief to get up there when he got to Alaska, too. He said it was a big relief to get up there and back to someplace where I could just work. I could just work and not have to think about or worry about anything. While he smiles. Just fish and do his thing. Yeah, he's the guy from office space. You know what I mean?

Like, I just don't want to deal with it. Shut my brain off. Yep. So back in the winter of 1990, he went back to medical school doing clerkships. I don't know if that's internships or whatever. In January, he began one of these in pediatrics in Spokane. And while he was there, he contacted, he somehow got in contact with an old high school friend of his, Debbie Fields, his future wife. So she's about three months younger than him they're the

same age and he'd known her in high school she went to santa clara university in california and since they were in high school together he did his stuff in medical school she went to college sure and she's considered kind of a not like him they're the opposite a lot of like she's considered real feisty and kind of whatever and he's real mild-mannered and kind of meek, everybody says about him, is what it is. So these two things everybody said balance

them out. Places where she was up, he was down. Places where he was up, she was down. Opposites attract, man. One of those things. So her father, she comes from a good family too. Her father's a lawyer yeah his name is dick fields really dick fields attorney at law whole field of dicks that's what i just saw i saw stalks with dicks on the end of them my god oh the dildo crop is big this year

it's a good one it's gonna be healthy i tell you the rains this spring really helped out the dildo crop look at those those 18 inch black ones back there looking shiny as they ever have i'll tell you what coming in nice oh the ones up front with the balls on them connected to it these are real nice this year the balls are nice and round yeah that's nice there so uh her father richard fields and he's got a her mother's name is Shirley and they have two she has two other sisters and of course they're you know very successful

in a small town he's a lawyer obviously so as Bruce starts to do his pediatric rotation in Spokane he considers you know he starts getting together with Debbie she had just returned

from a year in Japan. Just exploring. Interning or some shit? Oh, just having some fun. Just doing stuff and doing like a broad, I guess. Holy shit. Well, I guess you could backpack. There's mountains in Japan.

There's got to be something, right? There's mountains. There's cities and then it's all mountains, the rest of it. There's some backwoodsy shit there. Oh, big time, yeah. So Bruce said that after he finished medical school and his residency, the two of us, we should go to third world countries as medical professionals. Do like charity shit.

Yeah. Without borders. Yeah. He said that he wants to help people and he roots for the underdog and that's kind of his thing. So February 1990, Bruce asked Debbie to move in with him when he comes back to seattle okay come back move in with me and she does she moves in february 10th 1990 and you know they're they're kind of debbie was she would she's confrontational with bruce and bruce has to be okay with that and he's kind of very rigid he does things in a certain way period and that's that and so

they just said that's they're adjusting to each other they figure each other out their relationship seems to get better as it goes on yeah that's that's generally how it's supposed to go it's almost like they were like well on paper we should just be together because we're from the same town we're from same kind of upper class families and we're both professionals and white collar i mean we should get together and then of upper class families, and we're both professionals and white collar. I mean, we should get together, and then now that we've got together, we'll work out differences and figure out how to coexist together. So it's a reverse relationship, I feel like, kind of, in a way.

Are they forcing it or not? No, no, no. It's just I think they're professional people who look at things. They're like that type. I think they look at things on paper more than, yeah, my heart feels feels this but that guy's a piece of shit so no matter what my heart feels i'm not going to move in with that guy he's got no future dick fields isn't going to accept him at thanksgiving dinner we will we will intern the the the wedding and then we will uh go ahead and give it uh it's a what is it a logical professional way to proceed with a wedding they do it's very

take the emotion out of it i feel like give it a residency and uh hang on to it no shit so at one point debbie goes away for a three-day weekend with her friends i think that she went to a wedding or something so he says i should kill myself this weekend while she's gone what yeah but he this is this is the logic this weekend while she's gone. What? Yeah. But this is the logic. This is very strange. And it makes sense only in the mind of someone who is mentally ill. You'd understand this.

He says that he's going to do it. It's a perfect weekend for it because it's a three-day weekend. He says, so I'll kill myself this weekend. That way I won't have to miss work on Monday. Okay. What? I mean, you're going to miss it on Tuesday. Yeah, but Monday I'm off.

So that's one extra day before it'll be a problem for anybody. That's some fascinating logic. Very confused. Also, I don't know how serious he is or if he's just thinking about it or what's going on here. But Debbie was going off to hang out with her college friends and do her thing. So Bruce ends up he says he went in his car and took Unisom, which is sleeping sleeping pills here. He said, but things started happening that were very odd. I started feeling. Yeah, you're on fucking

drugs you're on sleeping pills dog that shit is crazy i took acid at one point and you know when i was a teenager took a acid a few times and that's i would say things started happening that were very odd last time i took mushrooms in the woods things started happening that were very odd birds don't normally have red fucking beams behind them as they fly no trails usually on birds that was interesting so he said i started feeling very strange and seeing things that i that i wasn't sure existed uh-huh you're hallucinating you're overtired and hallucinating that's what you're just you're trying to beat sleeping meds that's what happens when you're trying to do that yeah so they said what did you see and he said quote just bizarre things like my fingers getting real long and all my

skin coming off yeah wow i gotta take some of that so i gotta take some of that unison this is good shit drop a couple hits of unisom i think my next fucking day i have off and i'm gonna party sleeping meds like that when you try to stay up through it dude it fucks you up it's crazy because your brain's trying to shut your brain down yeah and you're trying to keep it awake therefore the combatants cause your brain to see shit you don't it's not working everybody else left the mcdonald's and you're starting you're trying to keep the drive-thru window open you gotta drink grill take orders money you get fucking poor drinks it's too much you can't do it you start seeing things your brain's making a

dream in reality that's what's happening right so they said if you wanted to kill yourself you know what's going on here and he said quote i scared. I didn't want to have major brain damage. He said, I was terrified. I made my way back up to the student health services. It seemed like the place to go. He said, I didn't want to mess up a suicide, jump off something. See, even that is just worried about fucking it up. He's like, oh, that'd be embarrassing if I fuck that up.

He said, didn't want to mess up a suicide, jump off something or do something else and survive it, then be really overdosed and brain damaged and physically damaged as well. So, he was thinking,

yeah, he's like, what if I fuck this up now that I'm on drugs? I can't try to kill myself because I might fuck it up. So, at the health center,

the doctors pumped his stomach, obviously, took all the shit out, sent him to the county hospital where he was placed in restraints on a floor. So the other medical students couldn't see him because, you know, they don't want to embarrass him here. The following day, he agreed to commit himself for observation for five days and went to a private hospital in Seattle. Now he's going to miss some work time. Yeah, now she should have done it on a five-day weekend. Spring break, baby.

He said Bruce said he had no idea why he tried to kill himself when they asked him. He was put in a group therapy session, and he says about that, I remember one time we were having a group session, and everyone was talking about what was wrong and what their plans were, and I just got a little bit angry because they had completely missed the point. They had just completely, from my point of view, the whole system missed the point. I don't know. He wasn't happy.

So after this, they moved to Pennsylvania, he and Debbie. Debbie's got some kind of schooling to finish and she wants to do it in Pennsylvania. So they moved to Pennsylvania for a minute. Then they end up moving to Port Angeles after that that that's when they settle into port angeles they have a young daughter as well you know named annika that's born here around 96 ish so you know um debbie's nearing big star wars fan i'm sure so that wouldn't surprise me with him he seems like he would be so deb Debbie was at the end of that. They returned to the West Coast. He contacts a Seattle employment agency that specialized in placing medical personnel.

And he was put in touch with a partnership providing ER physicians to hospitals on the Olympic Peninsula. Therefore, that included the one he ended up with where Connor came into that. So they move. It's mid-96. In mid-96, Debbie and Annika follow out to Port Angeles. Sure. They rent a house on the west side at first, but then they buy a house.

And they found a house here. It is a split-level house on Yellow Rock Lane, which is in the foothills above Port Angeles. And it looked like a nice house. It looked like one story, but there's a big wooden deck that runs around the side to the rear. It's a nice house. It's a nice house. It's surrounded by five acres of pasture. God damn, that's great.

Quiet. They paid $125,000 down and mortgaged $100,000, so $225,000. Incredible. Yep, and25,000. Incredible. Yep. And they began extensive renovations. And they even adopt a lamb named Wooly as a pet for Annika who plays in the pasture. That is awesome. Wooly, not Annika.

Yeah. Plays in the pasture. They just let her go out there and they're like, eat the grass, honey. It keeps it low. So they end up moving there. They're very, very happy. And they're very, very happy for a few months or for about a year and a half up until 98 here when this whole thing happens with Connor. So after this happens with Connor, Bruce, that depressed him a lot.

Yeah. The Connor thing. It depressed him. He didn't like what he saw and he thought he could have helped and he didn't. Yeah. He felt like a piece of shit because he didn't. Because then he couldn't. He felt like a piece of shit for other shit.

Yeah. Yeah. He felt like a piece of shit because he couldn't and didn't. So both of those things. So March 1st, 1998 now. So back to that. Almost two months later. Now how does the movie Titanic figure into figure into the story well let's find out

here on march 1st that night they debbie and bruce decided to get a babysitter and have a babysitter stay with annika and they were going to go see titanic in the theater they hadn't seen it yet this is titanic was in the theater for a year remember it was a whole fuck i think it was even longer than that. It might have been like 14 months or something. That motherfucker was sold out for like six months, too. It was forever. You couldn't get a seat.

No. So early 98, a lot of people were seeing it for the first time. So they saw it for the first time. It was everywhere. It was one of those things. Fine, I'll fucking see Titanic just so I can know what people are talking about, whether I hate it or not. I get it. King of the world. All right it or not. I get it. King of the world.

All right. All right. I get it. So Titanic traumatizes Bruce. Really? And not for the reason you think. He's not yelling about fucking, you know, Jack could have fit on the door too, you selfish bitch. That's not what he's yelling.

Okay. It's none of that. You'd think that's what it is, but it's not actually here. What's he mad about? He's upset. First of all, he thought the movie was awful's what it is, but it's not actually here. What's he mad about? He's upset. First of all, he thought the movie was awful, is what he said, which I think is great. He hated it, which I'm right there with you, Bruce. I think it's a cliche-filled piece of shit.

He called it filled with all sorts of posturing and shallow silliness, which is a great description of that movie. It's perfect. I want to know some of the specifics from it's perfect well i want to know i want to know so many specifics from it yeah i want to talk just have a chat with him about titanic just so you can we'll all agree we'll talk about it when we're done recording they had to see now by the way i have to mention right now they went to see titanic yeah the coincidence of this i swear to god this isn't on purpose because we picked this well before this even happened as we are recording right now yeah the submarine people

are submersible they're submersible they're a bunch of people gasping for breath billionaires that have gone down to see the wreckage of the titanic As we speak, they have about 15 hours of air left, literally. So by the time you hear this, anything's possible. They might have found them like bobbing around the North Atlantic, pop the top open, and they're like, it's about fucking time. They might be at the bottom of the ocean, like with a giant octopus wrapped around them. They might find them with one hour of air left and four of them

are dead because one of them has killed all the rest of them and is in the midst of eating he's holding someone's femur like a drumstick just like fucking ah when they open the porthole covered in blood well a team family of ghost crabs are waiting on that thing to run out of oxygen and open up so they can get in there and pick the bones. Anything. We don't know what's going to, anything's possible to have happened by then. But somehow, how often we've done, by the way, this is another thing to mention. This is episode 399.

Oh, next week is something awesome. Our next Express, this next episode will be our 400th episode. Unbelievable. So we're coming up on 400 episodes. In 400 episodes, how often has Titanic come up? Not the crash, the movie, any of it. Never, maybe? I don't think it's ever come up.

No, I mean, apart from that conspiracy theory about Titanic being Olympic, i think that's the only time we've ever talked about it that's in all that time and the first time titanic has a serious fucking it's in a story where this is happening this day this is the craziest show i don't understand it i don't get it but it's meant to happen like we're meant to do this show because we always do something relevant james not even on purpose it just happens it'll become relevant after we record it somehow sometimes it's so weird so debbie liked the movie though she liked titanic oh that's perfect so they drive home him bitching about how much money they just spent to see this piece of shit well they drove home like every couple drove home from Titanic. Him going, oh, God. And her going. And her just smiling.

So sad. Yeah. Why don't you ever fuck me in a Model A? Can't you paint my tits, huh? Do you think she was happy after? Do you think she ever found happiness? I don't fucking care. I hate all these people.

That's what I think. How much do you think that diamond was worth? Who gives a shit? It's not real. None of this is real. Except for the ship. That part's real. And the song's pretty good.

It's very touching. She liked the romantic shit in the movie. She thought that was good. And she thought that there was, you know, it was a nice movie. She liked it. Whatever. So it's a date movie. It's what it's made for. A dirty dick was better than the rich dick. That's nice liked it, whatever. It's a date movie. It's what it's made for.

A dirty dick was better than the rich dick. That's nice. That's it. That's the date movie. Maybe Bruce, he might have identified with her fiance, with the other one. Oh, maybe. What's his name? You think so?

You don't think he identified more with the fucking steerage passengers? I don't know. The other guy grew up more like him though you know what i mean like i don't know if he looked at it that way or what it is but i'm not sure so the one scene in the movie stood out for bruce though that freaked him out and according to him sent his brain into some spin out here okay the scene when the titanics deck officer everybody's rushing for the lifeboats. He's overwhelmed by it, telling people to stay back, stay back.

He pulls out a pistol and shoots the guy. Yeah. Okay. Then Bruce was like, oh, my God. He watched that, and he was like, wow, that's so crazy. Not all the people trying to survive and the guy shooting him. That's very interesting. But then the deck officer turned the gun on himself and shot himself.

Yeah. Okay. Now, he was fucked up by that. Really? It started to spin out because the way Bruce took it was he was so overwhelmed by the guilt of what he had to do and not being able to perform his duty that he had to kill somebody that that made him that this guy couldn't take it. So he shot himself. Not that my take was he realizes this is chaos. And why go down with this ship?

I'm going to do it now and save myself the trouble. Basically, those that don't fit on these life rafts are dead. Yeah. And that's me. I'm not getting on the life raft because I'm the one helping them get on the life rafts. Fuck this. Why should I bother trying to keep these people in line when this is happening? It's every man for himself.

Nobody's taking this for what it's worth. They're just being dicks and selfish about it. Fuck it. Not how Bruce took it at all. He took it as like a duty thing, and he spun it all in his own mind, and it fucked him all up and sent him into a dark hole, okay? That's a dark car ride home. Dark car ride.

So they get home. They chat for a minute with the babysitter. The babysitter and her sister are there. They made and took a few phone calls because there's messages for them. This is pre-everybody having a cell phone, so people would still call your house. And they're important people. Yeah, and they and they have yeah they know people know them uh one of the phone calls was from debbie's sister in lacey washington uh that was in about that was about 10 or 10 30 uh that was i'm sorry that was before that then about 10 or 10 30 they decided to go to

sleep bruce and debbie neither of them could get to sleep because they hadn't eaten dinner, by the way. They just had a bunch of candy and popcorn in the theater. Because Titanic was over three hours long, so they only had like a 6 p.m. and a 9 p.m. showing, and that's what you had to do. We're at 6 and a 9.30, so they can't go at 9.30. They're going to be out until 1 in the morning, so they went at 6, which is they came home from work. That's dinner time right exactly so they were you know and at that time when they before they left annika was up and wanted attention and all that so they were playing with her at some

point annika wakes up while they're trying to go to bed here and she ends up in bruce and debbie's bed debbie turns a movie on tv and then another point anika was in her crib sleeping and debbie was dozing off or doing whatever and uh you know it was just kind of one of those nights she came up she put her back down this one's dozing off watching a movie have a relaxed kind of evening 1 a.m comes along it's now march 2nd 1 a.m okay Okay. A Jefferson, a Clallam County deputy sheriff named Jefferson Davis. Get out. You named your son after the president of the Confederacy. Yes, that's.

Jefferson Davis was heading south on Ridgeline Hill of Mount Pleasant Road toward the Olympics here. Okay. He sees a late model Subaru Legacy station wagon sideways across the roadside in a drainage ditch. Oh. Yeah, the lights and engine are running, and it appears that this car had run off the road and crashed. This being his job, he stops to see what's going on. Inside the car, he sees a woman lying

across the front seat in the back he sees a child's car seat strapped in no no kid in it uh the seat had been turned over actually oh his first thought was shit there might be a baby in that seat what's going on because it had turned over so he opened the rear door and yanked on the carrier and there's no baby in the seat so So he's like, okay, that's good. So he looked back, and he sees the woman sprawled across the front. He sees two big bloody gashes on her forehead. Just two nasty ones. Blood visible on the driver's headrest.

And it looked to Davis like the woman was dead in the front seat. She'd been killed in this accident. So he got back into the car, radios it in. There's a fatal accident out here, blah, blah, blah, one car accident. So another deputy comes. This is Stacy Sampson, Deputy Stacy Sampson. She drives to the scene, and the Subaru in the ditch, still there, it had apparently plowed into a fence post, a heavy fence post,

and its right front wheel had run off the ditch, causing it to flip violently to the right and slam into the ditch. So it looks bad. So when this deputy, Stacy Sampson, looks into the car, she saw the same thing. It looks like a dead young woman lying across the seats, blood on the headrest.

The car's airbag had deployed. The woman had a cast on her leg, so Samson calls it in and was joined by another patrol deputy. Let's all come out. Let's get a third fucking opinion on this here. Want to see a dead body? Who wants to see a dead body?

So it turns out the woman in the front seat is Debbie Rowan. Oh. It's Bruce's wife. She's got a cast on. She's got a cast on. She's got a cast on her leg, yeah, because she had Achilles surgery a couple months ago. She had torn her Achilles skiing. She had Achilles surgery a couple months

ago, and so she's in the car like that, but she was dozing off in bed after putting the kid down. Where the fuck is she going now? This is about 200 yards from the house house by the way oh it is close two football fields away so they go to dr rowan here go to bruce and they not notify him at 2 a.m that hey looks like your wife's been killed in a one-car accident and he said oh my

god she went to the grocery store around midnight and she never came back holy fuck i thought it was getting late i was dozing off. I didn't realize. So they feel like though when they look at the whole thing, once detectives get there, they start looking at the body in the car and they're like, this doesn't look like normal car accident injuries. The two gashes

on the forehead aren't usually what you see. It's just weird. If there's a gash, it's generally one unless you slam into a two-barred object. Yeah, absolutely. Also, she has no crutches with her. Oh. And she never goes anywhere.

She can't walk without her crutches. So they're like, well, why does she have crutches? Then they found them in the home, the crutches, still at home. So they talked to Dr. Rowan in his living room here. And he said, yeah, you know, we went to the movie. We came home. And, you know, they said he showed little emotion. He just told detectives his wife went to the grocery store about midnight.

She couldn't sleep. I don't know. So they said, tell me what you can remember from the point that she got up, like, to go to the grocery store. Bruce says, quote, boy, she left there shortly after. I think she probably left around 12 or sometime shortly thereafter. I don't know exactly what time she might have left, but then I don't know. I woke up maybe one or so and I figured she ought to be back, but I wasn't sure what time she left. So he said, then I started getting more worried. And with her driving, considered calling the emergency department and making sure they hadn't seen her down there or something and then i just sort of sat and waited

a while longer and then your officer came and told me she was deceased dude she's 200 feet away 200 yards away yeah by the way who would say that then your officer came and told me she was deceased i guess a doctor maybe would say to put it's your wife. Wouldn't you go? Then they said, I don't know. He then said, can I help you anymore? Is there anything I can do? Yeah. And they said that the detective said he was so taken aback by Bruce's very casual demeanor. Like anything else I can do for you?

Like, yeah, like he's an emergency room doctor. He probably says this shit all the time. It's weird. The guy, the detective said he actually started. He couldn't get words out because he was so surprised by his demeanor he said he said like between between between he couldn't get between out he was like shocked he said between the time she got out of bed and the time the officer came to the door how much time would you say during that time where you know you were in a conscious state he said oh i don't know i was just kind of in and out of bed maybe in and slept a half hour the half the time something like that he said did you hear

any noises no no no no nothing like that they said nothing that would make you think an intruder and he was in here or anything like that he said no not that i'm aware of bruce says i was just kind of up in and out and up and. But we have a lot of noises with dogs and they bark and jump and they jump on the deck. They said, did you hear the dogs barking during that time at all? And he said, I heard a couple dogs barking, but nothing, you

know, major. So then they said, then he mumbles and then he says, did somebody kill her or something like that? Why would you ask that? The detective said, all that we're able to see out there on the road right now, we think that's a possibility. Bruce said, quote, no, she's very well liked.

And, you know, with her pre three school co-op, she's got a lot of friends that way and nobody would kill her. It's a co-op between parents for. Oh, OK. Yeah. Yeah. She said he said nobody that's ever been. They said no one's ever had serious problems with her. And Bruce says, not that I'm aware of. I know she had done this youth thing, youth court thing where they go and get kind of a second chance for first offender youth. Like, you know, maybe some kid who had got in trouble once killed her.

They said, did she ever mention any problems between herself and anybody she worked with then? And he said, no, she just went once and observed. But she said it was kind of odd how they could just put the person's last name on the paper. She felt it was kind of odd they would give those folks in the news media that much access. So they're, you know, it's a very confusing situation. Then they come in and they talk to the detectives. Other officers come in.

They talk to detectives. They're all kind of having a little chat for a second there. They're talking about how her injuries don't seem consistent with an accident. Then one of the cops tells the detective, not in front of Bruce, but he says, we found that the accelerator pedal of the car had been rigged to stay down. That's weird. Who drives like that? Right.

I'll just pin it to the floor and steer, baby. This is going to be fun now. So they told Rowan that the accelerator was stuck down. And Rowan said, oh, well oh well yeah that's normal because sometimes sometimes a neighborhood dog sometimes they drop rocks into the car what so you know maybe one of those rocks could have caused the brake pedal to the gas pedal to stick got a lot of clifford the big red dog yeah marmadukes. There's a couple Scooby Doos. And they're tricksters. Constant rock droppers.

And they know where to put them, too. They're real tricksters. He goes, maybe there's one of those. They said, well, we also found your wife's crutches in the driveway. And he went, you know, what about that? And he said, oh, yeah, she probably forgot them. Meanwhile, it's been months. She hasn't walked anywhere without them for months.

So she's probably not forgetting them. She's got no fucking Achilles right now. She can't walk. Yeah. So they said, what do you think about, do you think it's possible that she was murdered again? They asked that. And he's like, I really don't think so. You know, that's crazy.

So they told him, look, we think somebody killed her and then placed her in the car. And we're going to figure out who did it. All right. So then another detective starts talking. He's going to try to play a little. He's going to be the not so nice guy here. He says, what's your explanation to me, doctor, as to why your wallet was in the car? Oh, uh-oh.

And Bruce said, well, I assume she just took it to have money. And they said, to pay for groceries? And Bruce said, yeah, I assume. She takes my wallet every once in a while. And they go, well, how much money might have been in the wallet? And he said, I don't know, $150, $180, something like that. So they said, does she usually carry, I thought you said she usually carries a checkbook

and all of that sort of thing. Did you know if she had it with her going to the grocery store? And he said, I thought you said she usually carries a checkbook and all of that sort of thing. Did you know if she had it with her going to the grocery store? And he said, I don't know, but if she didn't have her wallet, she'd take my wallet and she, then she didn't have her checkbook. Okay.

So they're like, okay, this is interesting. Um, now the cops stop the tape recording and talk to each other again. They have a little conference outside. They sit back down four 30 in the morning, turn the recorder back on again. They have a little conference outside. They sit back down, 4.30 in the morning, turn the recorder back on again.

Yeah. And he says, Bruce, the detective says, there's still every indication your wife may have met with some kind of foul play. What I'd like for you to do would be to think and tell me whatever you can think that might help us solve this. Anybody that might have intended harm to her.

He says, nothing I can think that might help us solve this. Anybody that might have intended harm to her. He says, nothing I can think of. They say, okay. And then Bruce says, and you've done well. So far you're doing all right by my standards. Gee, thanks. Thanks, Bruce. We appreciate that. Next time you're like pulling out an appendix,

we'll tell you you're doing his bang-up job, too. So it was very strange, very, very strange. And so the detective then said, okay, what was the marital situation like with you and your wife? Was it pretty good? He said it was good. It was good, and it was even getting better as the years go on. Like, they both said that to people. So they said, okay, what about your friends?

Maybe people we can talk to. They want to find if they're friends. They can ask them if they've been fighting lately, what's going on with this. So Bruce provides the names of people Debbie had known, you know, all sorts of people. Although he couldn't remember the last name of her best friend. That's weird. Which is interesting. Yeah.

Back then, you know, people's, I would think so. I'm trying to think. I guess I know Sarah's friends. I know their names. I don't know the one's last name, though. She talks to her all the time. So maybe not. Is she Bill's friend?

I guess. She's not over the house all the time. They don't live here. I don't fucking know. So anyway, the detective then says, remember, I explained to you that I saw a large aluminum object in the car, a chrome colored object in Debbie's car. I now know what that object is, he says to Bruce. It's your trailer hitch. Oh, shit.

Bruce said, oh. And they said. That's where that is. They said, was that in the vehicle? And he said, yeah, it was. It was. Why? Why the fuck would that be in there?

They said, whereabouts would it have been? And he said, quote, boy, he starts a lot of sentences with boy. Yeah, boy, it would have been between the two front seats. It's more kind of moving. I tend to move things around a lot. I've been trying to keep things picked up. I don't do a very good job of keeping things picked up. I don't do a very good job of keeping things picked up. I don't know exactly where it would have been today. You lost your trailer hitch. Are you shitting me? I just move it around the car. Sometimes it's between the seats.

Sometimes I throw it in the back. You know, it's a mess in here. How about putting it on the car, sir? Yeah, what the fuck? So they said, any reason why she would have left without her crutches? And he said, quote, boy, I can't imagine. Boy, she mentioned she wanted to use the motor scooter thing at Safeway to ride around on. Yeah, those are fun.

Yeah, that's a good time. Me and my kids, we go late at night so that we can race them. No, they're fun stuff. Yeah, nobody needs them then. They're fine. At 11, we're about to close in an hour. Fuck it, we're racing. There's nobody.

Yeah, it's fine. There's no old people here. So they said, was it easy for her to walk without crutches? And he said, no, she definitely need her crutches. I think she forgot them probably. And then they said, they kind of go on a little more here. And Bruce says, actually, that was where she parked because they were talking about the driveway

that would be the place where she would get in the car and she just laid them right there first time that was her first time driving with her cast she's not very well organized okay now they go at this point another cop pulls up so the detectives say well

we're going to go talk to this guy real quick and we'll get back to you in a minute. All right. We'll get back to you. And he said, well, yeah, I think I should go check on my daughter. You know, anyway, she's up there. And they asked him a couple of quick questions as they were walking away. And they said, how big is your house?

He said, it's 2000 square feet. And the cop said, oh, now you say your daughter's three years old. And he said, did your daughter, you know, they were wondering if he had maybe the daughter maybe had seen something between them and could talk about it so you know they said she was watching a movie tonight is that what you were saying and bruce said mostly kind of uppity she'd been up in bed and then up and down so she's just been like in and out so they they came they got to the room of her of the daughter, the cop and Bruce. And the cop said, Bruce, you know, I hate to say it, but I do think somebody killed your wife and put her in the car. And we're going to have to figure out who did it.

And Bruce didn't really respond to anything. Instead, he looked down at Annika, who was sleeping and said, I guess she's sleeping good tonight. Dude, her mom's dead. They were like, OK. Yeah. And and then bruce said quote i have to use the bathroom and they said the cop said on the recording oh sure you bet that's all so bruce goes through the kitchen walks toward the bathroom uh walk you know through there the other detective came back in the living room and they're talking and the one detective tells the other, he's in the bathroom. You want to sort of keep an eye on him or, you know, what here?

Like, is he going to climb out the window and run away? So they went, nah, he's not going to fucking run away. He's the doctor. You know, he's not going to run away. He's not going to go anywhere. He's fine. So then they walk back into the house because they walked out in the yard for a minute to talk. They come back into the house.

into the house because they walked out in the yard for a minute to talk. They come back into the house. As they come back into the house, Bruce is walking into the living room as well, profusely bleeding from stab wounds to his torso and cuts to his neck. What has he done? They grab him and handcuff him to a chair while he sits there bleeding. They go, what the fuck is going on?

And what are you doing? And he said, um, you know, by the way, he's carrying the baby, too. He's holding his child bleeding. Bleeding all over the place. They said that the cuts on the neck look somewhat superficial, but then they noticed more blood and all over his chest. And he says, quote, Bruce says, quote, I tried for the aorta, but I missed. Oh, my God.

So they were like, holy shit. They said, why'd you have why'd you stab yourself and bruce said because the voices told me to oh bruce oh bruce bruce bruce um annika was now crying because the scene is tense and babies can sense tension she's a toddler she knows what's up and toddlers don't like blood probably and a three-year-old sees what's happening to dad this This is crazy. Yeah, something weird is going on. So they're like, holy shit, they run over here and everybody's tending to him because now he's bleeding profusely all over the place.

They said at that point, one of the cops said he turned into a different guy, Bruce. They said it was like he was back in the emergency room, he's the patient he said no more passive shit now he's cool calm pointing people telling him where to go they said the child's up and about upset and frightened and uh the cop said one of the first things i do is pick her up and he says that bruce starts communicating with me he's communicating about he knows he's going to the doctor he's going to the hospital and he starts planning for the kid. He's calling people on the phone going, yeah, you got to come pick the kid up and blah, blah, blah. He's bleeding out. But he's like, yeah, you need to come do this.

They're going to do that. He's coordinating things. So the paramedics then arrive and Bruce begins instruct begins instructing them on how to treat him. Because they're EMTs. He's a fucking emergency room doctor. So he's like, listen, listen to me here. It's fucking wild. So they find out that while he was in the bathroom,

he inflicted himself with at least five puncture wounds with a kitchen knife that he grabbed before he went in there attempting suicide. The knife wounds to the neck and back were so serious that without surgery, he would have died. Incredible. Yes. So then he's sedated on a respirator and unable to talk to anyone, which is wild.

But before he got to the hospital, they said he discusses his condition with the paramedics who are arriving. He directs the cops to the phone, to the list of telephone numbers. He directs us to the knife, makes sure they're going the right way, to the right room. It was like he was controlling us just as he would control the medical people. Asking questions, discussing his injuries. It was remarkable.

Start an IV stat. I need 30 CCs. I'm going to save this patient. That's what he's doing. He's doing CPR on himself. He's just pumping down on his chest. Yeah. It's fucking insane.

Give me the paddles just give them to me i'll do it myself he said and they asked him again why'd you hurt yourself and he said i just don't want to say right now and then he said the voices told me to oh man oh boy couldn't hit the aorta now they're that he's gone they could kind of they get a warrant they can start looking around a little bit here and the inspection of of the Subaru reveals blood spots on the driver's side door jam. Debbie obviously had been killed before the door closed. She had been killed, so she couldn't have done it in an accident. They also found heel drag marks beside a spot of blood in the driveway.

They found also here, they inspect the bedroom and they find blood spatter, substantial blood spatter patterns on the carpet, walls, and ceiling of the master bedroom, as well as substantial soaking on the underside of the mattress. So laying there soaking through with blood.

That shit jumped out of the car. Bruce had apparently, or the murderer, you will say, had stripped the old bedding off, tried to mop up the blood with paper towels, and had flipped the mattress over before taking the sheets and blankets from a guest bedroom to remake the bed. Flipped the mattress over? That'll do? That'll do.

What the fuck are you doing? They'll never notice that. Besides the master bedroom, more blood was found in Annika's room, in the bathroom, on paper towels that plugged a downstairs toilet. They tried to flush them down the toilet. They said there was basically not a room in the house that didn't have blood on it everywhere. He just ran around the house. Large, small, drips, spatters, everything. Outside the house, they found a small lawn cart that had blood stains on it.

You know, like I have that I take the wood to my house on. A running hose ran through some wet cat litter on the driveway, which bore shoe prints. Yeah. Try to grind it all up. Yeah, with cat litter. Like throw up. Yeah.

Like throw up you would do. You'd put some like fucking, who's got some sawdust on here? They said the particles of litter led the way to because now there's footprints with litter in them. Yeah. Led the way to a small aluminum shed in the backyard. What's out there in the shed? They found numerous plastic garbage bags filled with bloody clothing, bloody paper towels, bloody bedding and one taped bag that was super saturated with blood. They said it looked like Bruce had tied a bag around Debbie's head to keep the blood from her head wounds from spreading around the house. Oh, my.

He put a bag on her head to catch the blood. What the hell, man? Yes. There was a large bed rest, they said, covered with blood, the corner of the shed, and another blood-stained black plastic bag. They found full-size single-bladed axe, a clean one, and a small wooden baseball bat, like one of those mini-bats giveaways. Did he cleave her? They're thinking now it's the axe and the bat because they were together in a bloody bag. They found this.

They found the pillows and pillowcases drenched with blood, men's clothing, women's clothing. You name it. It's all there. It's it's there's a lot, man. Just a shitload. Now, the bloodstains were also found in three sinks on the main floor, both bathrooms and a kitchen. Debbie was not wearing a bra, and the blood-stained bra was found in the washing machine.

So a thorough search of the home, just blood spatter fucking everywhere. That's all you can find. Autopsy now. The pathologist called in to give a quick examination here before they even took Debbie out of the car there. The car had been removed, but she's still in the car, basically. So both cuts on the forehead had flaps of skin that peeled back revealed massive incisions into the forebrain.

Oh, my God. The doctor said those cuts seemed to match the wound patterns that could be expected from an axe. Yep. He cleaved her in the face. Fuck, man. They suggested that Debbie had been struck three or possibly four times with the blade of an axe.

In addition, Debbie's lower face, jaw, and teeth had all been broken. What? Apparently in one or more blows from the baseball bat, the small bat.

They said it wasn't immediately clear which occurred first, the axe blows or the baseball bat, but they said it wasn't immediately clear which occurred first the axe blows or the baseball bat but they said that uh the lower jaw blows weren't fatal so they didn't know they couldn't tell basically um holy shit they said that they didn't know if the the joes the the blows with the bat were to make it look more consistent with a car accident. That sort of thing. More of an impact blunt force type of deal.

They do find no defensive wounds on her. Asleep. Asleep, Jimmy. Fucking asleep. The ride home. He hated how much she loved Kate Winslet. I don't know. The whole thing fucked him up.

We'll talk about it. He'll talk. Don't worry. He comes out of his surgery. We'll talk about it. He'll talk. Don't worry. He comes out of his surgery. He'll talk about it. The medical examiner said, I believe a sharp instrument was used. Then a blunt instrument was used. Jesus Christ.

They said that the only way he could account for the massive blood spatter in the bedroom was by the bat and the axe, which left over 700 individual spots of blood. Jesus. They count them. Jesus Christ. That is fucking wild. They said the small size of the bat accounted for the repeated backswings and the rapidity of the blows, which in turn explained the vast number of spatter on the ceiling and walls.

Now, what in the fuck happened? Honest to Christ, man. How do you get here? Bruce sitting around, spinning out, not only, he says, from Connor, but from this Titanic fucking thing that messed him all up in the head here. He said that around midnight or so, because they had talked on the phone to people before that. She called her sister and everything. As Debbie lay kind of dozing off in bed she had her head propped up on the like a rest you know a headrest so she's sitting up

and bruce exited the house while she's doing that went down to the wood pile on the side of the house this is according to bruce by the way picked up the axe carried it back to the bedroom and then just without warning just fucking started chopping at her head wow at least twice if not three or four times that's what he said too he then said hmm and then went to get the small baseball bat which by the way he bought earlier that evening he just got it before they went to the movies they, they stopped at the store. He and Annika stopped at the store where he bought a mini baseball bat, a vacuum cleaner, some peanuts, some beef jerky, shit like that. Stuff to take into the movie theater, snacks too.

So they said that this bat, he beat her repeatedly with it, breaking many of her teeth in the process. One tooth and parts of others were found in the master bedroom, along with all the blood spatter, much of it on the ceiling and walls, they said, indicating a frenzy of blows with the axe and the back. Following this, Bruce goes outside, gets the lawn cart, rolls it across the deck toward the master bedroom deck door and into the bedroom, because there's a deck door there. Brought the whole cart into the bedroom.

Brought the cart into the bedroom. Loads up Debbie into this cart. Then wheels the cart all the way around the deck back down to the driveway. Out that way. He stopped next to Debbie's car. Tipped the cart forward, spilling her body onto the ground. Dumped her, basically. Then dragged her into the car. Shoved her across the street of the seat started the car and he drove out of the

yard up a slight incline to yellow rock lane then down yellow or yellow rock lane to mount pleasant road at this point he arranged debbie in an upright position and sent the car on its way with a holding the pedal down there jesus christ superstar fuck man then he went back to the house and started to clean because you gotta clean now you got a whole lot of shit to clean and all the bloody paper towels the clothing shit in the shed he was cleaning he probably was cleaning till the second before the cops got there to tell him about this he just closed the cupboard and he sat down and they were like hi he's like oh boy just woke me up why i was dozing in the chair didn't know what to do so they said what the

fuck did this to you what the fuck man like when he's in the hospital he the cops think that fuck they said that he definitely tried to kill himself, too. He knows where to stab himself because he's a doctor. And they said these are well-placed stabs. He knew what he was doing, trying to stab himself. He really was. People in town, the next day this gets out and everyone's like, what the fuck? The doctor?

Why did he do that? The two doctors that everyone loves, one allegedly killed a baby and then this one's killing his wife. What the fuck's going on? The one detective who was investigating the Connor death, who had talked to Bruce a lot, said he couldn't believe it and said, quote, I would have voted him most likely never to hurt a fly. He's that fucking timid. He's that meek. That's how he is now after he recovers in the hospital here from his suicide attempt he tells them all that he tells them exactly what

happened wow says that you know he drove it he cleaned up the best he could he tried you know it's just he's his mind snapped the voices and all that shit i didn't know what to do see titanic nobody see you know it'll make you either get in a submarine that's controlled by a fucking playstation one controller or this one of the two is contact an hour and a half after it goes every time everyone saw and every every single time and everyone saw that movie and how many things have happened that we don't know that it's because of Titanic? Is it subliminal?

Did James Cameron put some subliminal shit in there that makes you go home and murder people? But they found out on March 1st, the same day that this happened, that night it happened, when they went to see Titanic and everything. They also found out that was the day when a life insurance policy on Debbie kicked into effect. Is that right? A $500,000 life insurance policy on debbie kicked into effect is that right a five hundred thousand dollar life insurance policy actually and he paid the 169 premium on february 23rd and it kicked into effect today and so he is the beneficiary of that his attorney now because now he has an attorney said that that timing is, quote, purely a coincidence.

I'm sure. Pure coincidence. The movie had nothing to do with it. This guy fucking planned this. That's unbelievable. This is a lot, too. This is disturbing, man. So his lawyer said,

anyone who knows him knows the money has never been an issue with him, that he didn't need it and wasn't much interested in it. Insurance is not a motive for death in this case. What's more fucking callous then? No, that's what I mean. What is more callous? Is there no reason?

I don't know what would be considered worse, but one would be considered more premeditated, I guess, if it's for money. But this is like, like I said would this case start somewhere and you never thought it would end up here no this when this this guy was a witness to the baby right you're not like well i'm sure he'll kill his wife with an axe and make it seem like a car accident blame it on titanic did who guessed that anybody guessed that he was a hero six weeks ago yeah it's fucking crazy so they're gonna charge bruce now that they know what happened here's the thing though they don't know there's a lot of different charges and there's a lot of options for the jury here yeah you know what i mean because they charge him with murder in the first degree

that requires proof proof of both intent as well as premeditation okay so in his case intent to murder obviously that's he killed the shit out of her. He obviously meant to kill her. But they were saying he even went down to the woodpile, got the axe, means that he thought about it. He had a minute to change his mind. So that's something. Then for premeditation, they point to the purchase of black plastic garbage bags that day of the killing, the purchase of a small wooden bat that day of the killing, and, Jesus, one of the things he used to dispose shit of

and one of the murder weapons he purchased the day of the killing, and that the life insurance policy kicked in that day as well. It all looks real bad. No shit. So the prosecutors concluded that Bruce had decided to kill Debbie several months earlier. And they said that the death of Connor McInerney just accelerated the whole thing. Yeah. The one cop said, quote, I think it had or the prosecutor. I think it had something to do with the Turner case and the effect of this.

This nice world that he had taken about a year and a half developing was now crashing down on him because he took the opposite side. He took the side that found fault with what Dr. Turner did, so he's becoming a pariah at the hospital. He's becoming a pariah to the supporters of Turner in town, which is a vocal majority of the people in town. He's all of a sudden become a part of the problem, so I think he wants to cut ties here in port angeles and move on oh he sure did it that's what they're thinking so they said debbie though was putting down roots in the community that when they investigated it making friends developing her own career and all that kind of shit and this isn't what bruce had in mind the one prosecutor said from the start

she was going to be his support in this nomadic lifestyle we'll be here for a while and then we'll go do some medical good works in this poor country then we'll come back and earn some more money then we'll go off in some third world country and they had agreed that this was going to be their lifestyle when they became a couple and i think she changed her mind on him i. Yep. I think her family will agree that she changed her life on him because she loved Port Angeles. She loved the people in Port Angeles. She didn't want to move. She's a baby.

She likes her house. She's got friends, business stuff. She's comfortable. So they said he wanted to cut her out of this whole thing, take off, and have a half a million dollars to start over, too. Good start. That's the thing so that's there's multiple there's first degree murder there's manslaughter all these different options one of the options as well that bruce is going to be going for his attorneys is insanity

is that right they're going for insanity yep they're going for diminished capacity here he did tell the cops the voice has told me to do it right out of the gate. He said the voices told me to stab myself. He didn't say the voices told me to kill Debbie. Good point. But still, if you have voices telling you to do anything, that's probably bad. Well, the voices told him to do this, not that. So there's still voices.

That's a problem. But it's not. This never works in Washington. It doesn't work hardly anywhere. But in Washington state, there hadn't been a successful jury acquittal on an insanity defense in 25 years. Why does anybody try it? It never works. I have no idea. It also sets up a lot of things for appeal though too with that.

So you can talk a lot about that, Micah. That's one of the things you can bring up again. You can't really rehash evidence so much, but you can bring up states in certain stages of the appeals you can. Yeah, and in the original case, if it doesn't come up at all, you can't be using that later. Yeah, exactly, exactly. And a lot of times insanity is considered a procedural issue with certain things, so there's a lot there. So he's going to try that, though. But his lawyer said, listen, he's got a history of chronic depression he's got a recognized mental disorder here it

can lead to violent behavior this is a thing so they looked at his medical history chronic depression that went back all the way to college if not before twice documented psychiatric hospitalizations were further evidence in his of this so it wasn't like he was fine and then he said, I went crazy out of nowhere. His attempt at suicide while in medical school. So they sit him down with a shrink here, his defense team. Sit him down with a psychologist. And they conclude that Bruce was a tortured soul,

a victim of classic case of unipolar depression. Just all sorts of depressed. Up, down, sideways, left, right. Fucking depressed. The doctor said he's always been a walking wounded. This man has never experienced a day of joy in his entire life. They said Bruce said very little during the interview about his upbringing. But the doctor came to believe that an essential part of Bruce's ongoing depression was a severe conflict between his empathy for other suffering and his strong desire to avoid it,

which in turn set up shame in Bruce's mind. Yeah. After shaming himself, he would plunge back into situations where he felt extreme empathy, was revulsed, and then was in turn shamed by his revulsion. They said it's a never-ending, continuous, repeating cycle for him. They said becoming a doctor was probably the worst thing he could have done with this condition. Absolutely terrible. Not good. The doctor said most of us, when we have conflicts in our minds,

work through them by exercising a discipline over our emotions. Doctors do this all the time. They need to have empathy for their patient, but also an objectivity that prevents them from getting too emotionally involved it's a fine line you walk and also in our country it's probably even more frustrating because we're treating symptoms and not a fucking disease anymore well in our country too you're worried about are you know who's going to pay for this test and right you know and also who's going to sue me when i fuck this up that's the other other thing. Yeah. So they said that. Where am I there?

The empathy for the patients. They said if they get involved, their judgment can then be clouded by their emotions. He said, quote, The problem with Bruce was that he couldn't control the sympathy he had for others misery. As a result, he had misery every day of his life. This is what his shrink said here. The fact that he was miserable embarrassed and shamed him, and these feelings in turn drove him to construct a tight mask of superior functionality to the rest of the world. No one must guess that Bruce was not in complete control of his emotions, is what they're saying here. Like, he's got to be perfect on the outside. So that's what he's doing.

The doctor talked about his experience with Bruce's sister bruce's experience with his sister the doctor said she embarrassed him and he felt shame that he was embarrassed and the the doctor also said that his actions in trying to kill himself had a lot of psychological overtones he said it was like a sacrificial ritual going right for the heart and with a dull knife. So Dr. Turner, by the way, he's still charged with second degree murder. Remember? Yeah. His defense releases a press release to clarify their position.

And here's what Dr. Turner is going to say. Quote, on this night, he used his medical skills and judgment and tried longer and harder than many might have to resuscitate Connor McInerney. Now these efforts now these efforts are being labeled as murder. This case is not about profound medical questions of life or death. It's about a seasoned and compassionate physician trying to resuscitate a baby and ending resuscitation efforts when it was clear there was no life to save. Dr. Turner is not guilty of any crime dr turner did the right thing on the night of january 12th his diagnosis of connor mckinney was right his heroic efforts to save him were right and fighting today's charge is right and that's what we intend to do because today's charge is wrong. What about the second time? Wow. Okay. So they asked Dr. Turner, he does

a, the town's on his side, so they said, the best thing for you, go to the press. Fucking talk to them because you're just getting more people on your side. They said, was there anything you'd do differently if you had to do it all over? And Turner said, no, I would not. He said, I would not. I've been

accused of saying that I should have walked away after the first pronouncement of death. I could not find it in my heart to do that. So that's what engendered the last two hours of resuscitative efforts. And I would certainly do that again. They said, would you cover his nose and mouth again? And he said, what I did was done under the circumstances at the time. I probably would not do that again, not because I don't think it's the thing to do, but because of the unbelievable amount of anxiety, angst and emotional turmoil and financial embarrassment that has become as a result of the situation. He just admitted what he did. Oh, yeah. You know, he said he did it and he said it didn't matter because the kid was fucking dead anyway.

He's like, the kid was brain dead. It doesn't matter. If I took him and picked him up and dribbled him on the floor and shot a three pointer with him, he said he did it, and he said it didn't matter because the kid was fucking dead anyway. He's like, the kid was brain dead. It doesn't matter. If I took him and picked him up and dribbled him on the floor and shot a three-pointer with him, he's fucking dead. That's what he said, basically. What the fuck? Doesn't matter what I did. So that's his defense. Doesn't matter shit.

Okay. So he runs his clinic still in Port Angeles at this point when this is going on, but he lost his right to practice at the hospital. They kicked him out. when this is going on, but he lost his right to practice at the hospital. They kicked him out. The state's medical commission is going to hold a hearing that can result in him being stripped of his license, and he's charged with murder as well. He also faces a civil suit. Marty McInerney was heard saying, I'm going to own this fucking hospital after all this

went down. So they say it's Conor's parents here. Marty and Michelle said what he did was wrong. And they said that they will always be haunted by the image of what Dr. Turner did while he was alone with Connor that night. And they said they're going to keep trying to get justice for Connor. So the trial is about to happen for Dr. Eugene Turner, right as it's about to happen.

They dropped the charges. What? Dismissed. Dismissed. They were just about to impanel a jury. Uh-huh. Yep. They said that he's been treating children for 27 years, and they said that he always believed he did everything he could to save the life of Connor McInerney. and this was after a medical board said that the kid was a medical board's report said that the kid was brain damn it brain dead and basically essentially dead breathing or not he was dead

when he got to the hospital so anything that happened after that is all moot boy did turner get to work back at uh connor mckinney uh hospital again i don't think so that he old marty mckinney memorial i don't think so he said and he wasinnerney memorial. I don't think so. He said, and he was right. And we think the decision bears that out, the defense said. So the parents, though, Marty and Michelle quickly serve notice that they'll be suing him for wrongful death. they didn't know what to do with Dr. Turner. They asked him did he place his hand over the mouth and nose even if the breaths are only reflexes preceding death. They said is that what you did?

So a panel is done here and there talking about whether he's going to keep his license. And they said blocking the airway of a baby for any reason even to hasten an inevitable dying process or to be humane and compassionate was below the standard of care expected of reasonably prudent physicians Yeah. They said it broke state law.

They said his actions created actual harm or an unreasonable risk of harm to the baby and the baby's parents. So, yeah. Now, he's had an un... You can't put a fucking newborn down you can't do it that's it but this panel censure of him his censure is just disciplining him yeah carries no limitations on his practice he can practice he can do whatever he wants no charges nothing so they turner said we're related it's an almost total victory. Wow. They also said he was asked if he would consider offering an apology to the parents in light of the commission's ruling that he was wrong.

And Turner said, no. I put out four hours of my life to do everything I could for that baby and more. I cannot find it in my heart to find a single justification for an apology unbelievable wow that's a nice bedside manner doctor i would never take my kid to that man fuck me so now dr bruce is gonna go to trial they're gonna drop his charges too or what here the prosecutors say that he carefully planned the slaying, staged a car crash to make it look like his wife did all that. His defense said he suffered a major psychotic episode that night. They said, here's his lawyer, quote, one would have to be crazy, stupid or insane to kill your wife on the day the insurance policy took effect. And we know Bruce Rowan is not stupid.

So he must be crazy and insane. Rowan is not stupid. So he must be crazy and insane. They also denied that his client faked insanity that day when police began an interview with him and then he stabbed himself. They said, quote, nobody's that good of an actor. This is a psychotic state.

He wanted to die at the time and he still does. That's what they told. That's what his lawyer says. Now, they're going to have a battle of the shrinks here. This is the state doctor versus the fucking defense doctor. So the one doctor, Dr. Eunice, that's Bruce's doctor. That's the guy who examined him before and said what a mess he is that we told you about. And then Dr. Bremmer for the state.

So the psychiatrists have completely different views of his mental condition at the time of the crime. Oh, yeah. Dr. Eunice believes that Bruce's chronic depression produced a psychotic episode that rendered him incapable of forming intent, let alone premeditation. Okay. And Bremer was convinced that despite his chronic depression, Bruce knew exactly what he was doing on the night he chopped his wife's forehead with a fucking axe. Yeah.

So the truth is going to be the jury decides. That's what it is. That's what two cases, we think this, they think that. Yeah, you decide. Witnesses here. Prosecution first witnesses. They have the babysitters who took care of Annika that night and when they went to see Titanic.

The sitters said after returning from the movie, they said Debbie and Bruce both seemed completely normal when they came back. He wasn't like, oh, I'll destroy. Oh, my God, there's a guy that shot himself. So they said they called Debbie's sister to the stand, and she said that she called the Rowan residence

sometime that evening, and Bruce was on the phone with a friend of Debbie's, and Bruce told her that Debbie would call her back, and Debbie called her back about 11 o'clock. So there you you go so we know she was alive at 11 o'clock right so they said the next thing is did Bruce want to move away so they bring up people to witnesses to depict Bruce as someone who was thinking of moving away from his wife and daughter one witness testified that Bruce had asked him about buying a custom log home, but Debbie had said no because it was too expensive. And so they're talking about Bruce wanted it for himself.

The log house. Another is Diana Fields, who's Debbie's sister. Diana testifies that Bruce and Debbie visited her and her husband in Boulder, Colorado for Christmas just that year, 97. And as the Rowans were leaving, Bruce may turn to them and made a remark, quote, I have a feeling you're going to be a parent this year, which is saying he thinks they're going to have a baby. I just, you know, weird thing that they say. So Diana said that's what Diana said. Bruce told her.

Now, after he killed his wife you know who has custody of annika oh my god no way those two got the baby the prosecution tries to use that as premeditation though yeah he's like he said like i'll be killing your sister and you guys will be taking care of our baby soon like i don't think that's what he was saying i think it was more just a folksy thing like, you'll probably be parents this year. That's some cold-ass shit to say. That'd be super cold. Wow. Maybe they were just talking about how she wants a baby and stuff, and they're trying.

That's what I mean. They had tried, and they haven't had any luck yet. And he was like, I have a feeling. Or just sometimes, like, old Italian people say that all the time. You're going to have a baby this year. Like, what? You weird superstitious asshole. Leave me alone.

Don't wish that upon me, you jerk. Don't wish that upon me. Good God. How dare you. The last thing I want to happen. You're a cunt too. Yeah. Go fuck your mother too.

How's that sound? So Bruce testifies on his own behalf here. He has to. He has to show, tell you, say he was fucking crazy. He described that night as a poorly organized nightmare and he said it took him weeks and really months to fully

understand that his wife was actually dead. He said, I could see myself, but I was still within myself. Debbie was just as peaceful as could be. I remember her image. The bat came down really fast. Then she groaned. That's all she did.

Oh, my God. So, yeah. And they asked him, what's up? Talk to us about Titanic. And he said, well, was there a scene that bothered you in that movie that night? And he said, yes, there was. There was an officer toward the end of the movie. People were trying to get on lifeboats,

and he was trying to push them back, and some of the people wouldn't be pushed back. And so he took his gun out, and he shot somebody. He killed them, and he killed them. And then he appeared to be, the officer appeared to be in pain, distressed. I should say distressed as a result of that,

and then he took the gun and just shot himself in the head. So they said, what went through your mind when you saw that scene? He said, quote, just the relief, the tremendous relief of being dead before, just before he even hit the ground. It was like a pheasant. You just shoot it and it crumples and it's dead instantly. That was graphic for me. And so they said, okay. And that thought continued in your head. And he said, yes, it did. It distracted me the rest of the evening. Okay. They said, well, what happened? Sweet release. It looks so easy. They said, what happened after that?

He said, after that, I was having more problems. I couldn't get to sleep. And the thoughts were the same sorts of thoughts. They were just going through my head repeatedly. As far as suicide, you have to kill yourself. You're a terrible person. You're a terrible father. And then I finally got out of bed. What happened next? Quote, I went in the hallway and was walking, pacing up and down the short hallway there into the kitchen area. And then the sound just kept, it just kept repeating all the things over and over again. And suicide is not an option because that is what I tell myself when I got real bad. When I got real bad over the years since my suicide attempt, and that was a way for me to try to look at other options. He'd just say, can't do that.

That's not an option. Yeah, kind of like if you're in the middle of somewhere and you have to shit. You go, well, shitting isn't an option now. So that thought out of my mind and keep plugging forward. So I guess I'm just going to kill everybody in the house. Think about something else now. He said, I could eat. I could try to sleep.

I could go for a run. Anything but suicide. Oh, yeah, that's healthy. It's all healthier than killing yourself. They said, so what happened then? Could you describe to the jury, were you hearing things or? So Bruce said, quote, the sounds, the sounds, the repeating got more and more pronounced and I couldn't put it out of my head and it got louder and louder to the point that I just was starting to sweat and my heart was pounding and I was very shaky. My face felt contorted and then after a while,

I wasn't real sure where the sound was coming from. It was, if it was just my thoughts going through my head over and over still or if it was coming from someplace else.

Oof, I thought the sound might be going out into the world or either that or the outside world the sound was coming in to me. So neither of those are happening.

So they said at any time where the sound's telling you something. And he said the sounds are very similar to what I had been hearing before, telling me to kill myself over and over and over again. They said, well, what happened next? And he said, well, it really was not tolerable anymore. I can't explain why it wasn't tolerable. It just wasn't tolerable. Everything just went calm. And I felt like I had just was removed from the whole situation and was watching myself

at that point. My face got calm and sort of flat and I quit shaking. I wasn't sweating. I was just looked like nothing was wrong, but my mind was still going. And he said, it was very difficult to explain. It's not as though I could say I was sitting in that chair over there and watching myself that way. It's more, much more abstract than that. I could see myself, but I was still sort of inside myself. Wow. They said, what happened next? He said, I went out to the garage and I got the baseball bat that we purchased that day.

Then what? I came back in and I was sitting. I just came into the bedroom just as calm as can be, just like Debbie was as peaceful as could be. And I remember her image. And they said, then what happened? And he said, then the bat went down really fast, really fast. And it just, I could just, the swiftness of the bat coming down and just hitting her in the forehead. And he starts weeping and he says, then she groaned.

And that's all she did. She didn't, it was just a groan. And they said, what's going on in your mind as you're at this time you're describing. And he said, nothing, just watching it, just watching it all happen. Then I went downstairs and I got the axe out of the woodpile. I brought the axe upstairs and I walked into the bedroom and I was as calm as could be. This is like The Shining. This is turned into here. It's just snapped. I could just I just took it and I just swung it and I just hit her. I just hit her. I said, how many times? And he said, just twice. I said, how many times? And he said, just twice. And I said, what reaction did you have after hitting her with the axe? He said, nothing. I was just watching it.

I didn't do anything. I didn't hear anything. And he said, did you realize at that point you were killing her? And he said, no, no, I would never do that. Never. So, yeah. They said, Bruce, you did indicate what was going on in your mind at the time. Let me ask you, after you swung the axe, what was Debbie's appearance? And he said, there was blood everywhere.

And they said, what was your reaction to that? And he said, there was no reaction, no reaction at all. It was just, I have a picture of the scene. I just have a picture of the scene in my head. And I remember going into Annika's room, and then the police officer was kind of right there. And then he left and I went back out and there was a police officer and I just went to the knife block and got a knife. And then I went into the room and closed the door and took the knife and pulled it into my stomach. He said the bathroom had a door that opened into Annika's room. And they said, well, why'd you go in there into his or her room?

And he said, I don't know. I was watching it happen. And she was, I took her out and she was playing with her toys. Then I took the knife and I had stabbed myself three times in the stomach. And then I took the knife and I put it up on my chest and I was trying to push it in and it wouldn't go in. Yeah, because there's a rib cage. Yeah, that's chest plates hard. They said, so what did you do? And he said, then I had to pound it in kind of like a hammer.

Oh, God. How did you pound it? He said, I grabbed a hold of the doorframe and pulled myself into the doorframe, the door jam. He recalled that he had his back to Annika while he was doing this. She didn't see this. They said, OK, so you went to the hospital and then you were in. You've been in a, you know, in an institution for the last few months here. They put him in a little place to cool off.

And he said, this was my first opportunity in my life to reflect. I don't know if it's an opportunity, but not to be able to do anything except look inside and look at that black demon in there, that black demon that's been dominating my life at times. And at other times i've been able to get control of it okay cross-examination now yeah oh boy they said well let's exclude wars and self-defense you know it's wrong to kill somebody right yeah and he said i absolutely do and they said you knew it was also wrong what you did that night didn't you and he said march 2nd 1998 I don't know anything.

I didn't know anything. I was just watching something happen at that point. And they said, you went outside and got a weapon, correct? And he said, I watched myself do that. Did you? You watched somebody else get the weapon. And Bruce said, well, now I know it was me. Obviously, now I know it was me.

But at the time, or even for weeks thereafter, I wasn't sure who it was. Which weapon did you get first? The bat, Bruce says. And did you watch yourself? What did you watch yourself do with the bat? Bring it in the house, Bruce says. Where were you when you watched yourself? It's hard to explain. As I mentioned before, it wasn't like I was sitting in a chair over there and watching what was happening. It was like it was someplace sort of inside and being removed from it, being removed from the situation. So you've seen POV porn, right? It was like that. It's kind of like that.

We're like, I'm in it, but I'm also kind of separated from it. Like, you're the person watching the POV porn, not the person in the POV. They said these voices were telling you to kill yourself. He said they were. They said, were they not telling you said these voices were telling you to kill yourself. He said they were. They said were they not telling you, they were not telling you to kill Debbie? And he said they never did. So you brought the bat in the bedroom? Yes.

You were walking with what kind of shoes? He said, I don't know. He said, was it quiet? And he said, I don't know. Did you wake her up? And Bruce says she was sleeping soundly. Just the image of her was being very peaceful they said where's annika in her crib and uh you know all of that so they then asked him about the

shopping trip he'd had that afternoon didn't you buy a baseball bat and some trash bags and some pepperoni sticks and some popcorn that afternoon before the killing and he said he had he said sir then they said sir what was the need for the bat on this afternoon yeah why'd you buy it bruce said no need just anika and i needed to entertain ourselves and go out and that was something that we'd been thinking about getting they've had they've been talking about it him and the three-year-old been having a real they went over the pros and cons they made a list they sat down let's get this mini budget right now you know yeah they said getting a bat like this and he said right and it's only a

coincidence that it was used a mere six or seven hours later to smash debbie in the head bruce says i don't know about coincidence it's just what happened to be used or there was a lot of other things that could have been used they said it was a mere coincidence that a full bag of trash bags eight of them were used in the course of this evening and he said i'm sorry we had bought them that day fuck does that mean i mean i'm sorry i'm sorry i'm prepared sorry if you had them wouldn't you use them i mean come on jesus so they said so is it your medical opinion with reasonable medical certainty that the bat rendered debbie unconscious and he said i don't have any medical opinion about that they said did it split her skin and he said yes i think so okay so this is the argument here i'm crazy don't can't you hear me i saw myself from the inside but sort of the

outside closing arguments here the prosecution asked why bruce would have gone to so much trouble to clean dozens of blood-stained surfaces and lie to police and interviews if he wasn't aware of his actions yes the prosecutor also said here that he carefully planned the murder scene then staged a car crash to make it look like his wife died in a traffic accident so he could collect a half a million dollars and fucking travel the world. That's what he wanted to do. Defense lawyer David Allen said his activities on the night of his wife's death are evidence of a psychotic breakdown. He saw Titanic. That's great.

Yeah. I mean, who the fuck wants to watch that? It's so long. It's just so long. Rose, Jack, Jack, Rose, over and over again. Anyone will lose their fucking mind. So then he said, again, one would have to be crazy, stupid, or insane to kill your wife on the day the insurance policy took effect. We know he's not stupid.

He said, rather than send my client to prison, don't do that. He knows they're going to find him guilty of something because he did it. So he's not denying. Yeah, he's in court. So they said rather than send him to prison, wow, quote, you should put Rowan away in a locked ward in a mental hospital. He said Bruce Rowan will obviously have to be under care for the rest of his life. So, you know.

What's the difference? Come on here. So October 31st, 1998. Halloween night is the verdict here. Verdict comes in and, you know, all the jurors in there. Finally, it took them a while. Got a unanimous thing finally here. And they find him not guilty by reason of insanity get out i swear to

christ not guilty by reason of insanity he's good he just went a little loopy pie there for a minute he's fine okay well what the fuck what do we do with this guy then? We've heard this a lot on this show. And like last week with the girl stabbing her mother's vagina, I believed her. Yeah. I believed a lot of what she said. I think she was fucking loopy crazy nutsy time. So this guy is just like, I don't know. I saw myself, but I wasn't really doing.

Get the fuck out of here. Oh, my God. But there's going to be a hearing next week to see if he'll be committed to a hospital since he's found insane here so during the hearing here the the if the well during this the jury felt that he posed a danger to himself and others so he needs to be he's committed to an indefinite term at the hospital for the criminally insane until they do the hearing so they put him in there so then we'll find out what to do with you here. So he says to the jury as he leaves here, and they tell him that,

finally the hearing comes up, by the way, and the jury rules that Rowan poses a threat to himself and others and should be confined to a state mental hospital. So he will be confined to a state mental hospital, but there's no set term or anything like that. It's just indefinite tomorrow, 50 years from now, who knows? He says to the jury, quote, I just wanted to say how much I appreciated your attentiveness.

Okay. He said the most important thing for me was to get the story out accurately and for Debbie's parents and her family to hear directly from me what happened and for my friends and family to hear that. He said, so once again, thank you very much. I had planned to make this statement before you came back with a verdict, but they wouldn't let him. They said you have to wait till afterwards. So the judge said that they're going to commit him to a locked ward at Western State Hospital for an indefinite period. They said this means his attorney, David Allen, this is the defense attorney, said this means the public will be protected indefinitely.

That's what indefinite means. Indefinitely. He said it could be 10 years. It could be for the rest of his life. Going to be in there a while here. Know that shit. So it's all a psychotic episode. And then he finally said at Western State, he'll get the therapy he needs.

Deserves. Yeah. Nay, deserves. So then he his brother also says that he's happy this happened because, you know, it's he needs the help, obviously. So they're happy. Mentally ill offenders are kept in a separate building other than than other psychiatric patients. And their status is typically reviewed in hearings every hundred eighty days. That's how this works here. Also, he even thanked the judge and the prosecution also during that.

Other reactions to this verdict here. The 12 jurors wouldn't detail their deliberations, but they said the three week trial and three and-half days of deliberations were hard on them. I'm sure. One here, juror Leo Schmallenbeck, he said, insanity is not an easy matter to come to a conclusion on. We had to really look at the evidence, and we did that very carefully. Then we all bashed ourselves in the fucking head with our shoes until we started drooling and then we filled out our fucking forms that's what he did the juror another juror said quote it's been one of the worst things i've ever done in my life and it will change my life uh for the rest of my life okay okay wow fuck me they also said that jurors were split 10 to 2 and say in favor of the

insanity verdict on their first vote. It took three and a half days to get the other two people on board here. Now, Debbie Rowan's family, her parents and sister, said that one of the sisters, like we said, the one that was you're going to have a kid. She has now legally adopted Annika. That's great. That's nice. Now, Debbie's father, Dick Fields, here, he said the family's pissed off at this verdict. I'm sure.

He's a lawyer, too, so he's real pissed off. He said, I just sat through the trial from beginning to end, and I can't understand why the jury based on the evidence that I heard could reach that verdict. This one kind of tests my faith in the system. Oh. Yeah. The prosecution, they said that fucking this was crazy. Quote, they believe they did not know. They believed he did not know right from wrong at the time. If we had it to do again tomorrow, we'd prosecute it the exact same way. Yeah, obviously. So clearly now the doctor's family, one of his brothers, Barry, the very successful Harvard educated businessman, said we haven't missed a moment of the trial. We believe the jury returned a verdict of truth. Our family has rallied behind Bruce and unconditional love.

Our hearts have also gone out to the fields. The families were close before this happened. There are no winners in a tragedy like this. And now they hate us. It's crazy. Now they don't want shit. So we them to christmas and they said to fuck off so yeah i don't think so so they said the difficulty the defense said that it's hard to put a defense up like this but they're very happy here they said i just felt incredibly tense and i'm ecstatic now justice has been done now alan says on the future of bruce rowan this is his attorney beforehand he

didn't care if he lived or died he said he was at peace with whatever the verdict would be now he hopes that he's going to start a new life someday he said it's not going to happen quickly though while awaiting all of this by the way during all of this rowan wow he fucking put in to basically just because this is going on they like suspend his medical license while this is happening and in early december of that year he asked the commission to consider the decision arguing that he wasn't given proper notice of the pending decision as required by law he wants to keep his medical license and fighting to do so. He's at the hospital here and he says that he wants to be,

he wants to be, rather than have it revoked, he wants it to be indefinitely suspended from a practice, which would make it easier for him to reapply for his license and resume his career when he's released. Reinstate it when I get out of here.

I'll be fine. The case is before the state's Medical Quality Assurance Commission, which handles disciplinary matters involving physicians, and an administrative judge is to decide whether to allow Rowan's appeal to go forward. The order revoking his license bars Rowan from

seeking reinstatement for at least 10 years. He's like, come on, that's harsh. He said he must act now or wait 10 years his attorney said he said you know they said his role in a murder has nothing to do with this his lawyer said he's mentally ill the law does not the law does provide that if a physician is mentally ill and is treated they can return to practice so yeah but what about what happens during the mental illness? Like, that matters.

If you can go from, eh, Titanic kind of sucked to a psychotic breakdown and a snapping finger. And cleave your fucking wife's head open. Jesus, you want to be in charge of people's lives? I don't think so. Right, I don't want that guy looking in anything I've got that's ill. Shit. Dick Fields there, his father-in-law, or ex-father-in-law, said that he should never be allowed to practice medicine again. Fields said this is a fellow who's had a lot of psychiatric training in the course of his medical training.

This is one smart fellow. He would certainly know how to appear insane. I'm sure. Don't let him do this. So the commission officials can't recall a case in which a doctor has come before it after committing a homicide. That's not one that they usually get. They said, let alone a doctor seeking to remain a physician after this. This doesn't happen. He says to them, quote, I was a good doctor.

This is Bruce here. I was well regarded and got frequent praise from patients and colleagues for my work. Having the possibility of someday returning to practice once i know i am well enough to do so is a strong motivation for me to do the very hard work of coming to grips with what has happened to my life and in the life of my family and my deceased wife's family what has happened to me experts on this they're asking the press is asking they're saying that kind of goes against do no harm you know what i I'm saying? Right, exactly. Yeah, having a physician identified as a killer is antithetical to the whole notion

of trust the doctor-patient relationship and what that's based on. Yeah, no shit. You gotta get down with the ship. Fuck yeah. So they're appealing all of this. They said, Rowan does not dispute the heinous details

of the night he butchered and beat his wife to death is what the prosecutor said. But now he wants this. And he said, reconsideration would interfere Okay. Now, early 2002, treatment staff at the hospital say his mental state has improved and they asked the court for a conditional release that would allow him to eventually move home into the community. This is delayed several times by appeals and then they block it and it's appealed. Another judge comes in 2005. No. They said he'll remain in the hospital for at least a few more weeks following a request from his wife's family that he undergo a third-party psychiatric evaluation.

Superior Court judge expected to sign an order that would allow Bruce to move into his own apartment away from the Western State Hospital campus where he's lived since 1998. The conditional release was set to an emotion on a 2002 court order. The conditional release was set to an emotion on a 2002 court order. Yeah. And Rowan's next stage of independence comes as a unanimous recommendation of the hospital's review board. So they said during the court hearing, they present they were presented with a letter from Deborah Fields, Rowan's parents and siblings asking for an independent psychiatric evaluation to determine whether he'd be a substantial danger to others or a substantial likelihood of committing criminal acts so they said this is again dick fields it's a mystery to us given that mr rowan initially committed such a heinous act without warning the hospital can appear so cavalier about mr rowan's likelihood of reoffending right but after a couple weeks he is released oh my god he is released the hospital's

risk review board unanimously approved his transfer into the community incredible and the judge signed off on the offer that will allow him to move off hospital grounds they said quote bruce has done extremely well at the hospital okay holy shit They said there's nothing that the prosecutors judge or anybody can do to block this move because it's a unanimously recommended by the psychiatrist. And that's how this works. You're let out when that happens. I don't know. They can't overrule the doctors. So Rowan will begin a 30 day transition into a Lakewood Tacoma area apartment near near the hospital here.

Obviously, Dick Fields is super fucking pissed he's pissed he said the family's concerned that Rowan have no contact with his former daughter though yeah now adopted with Annika who's now nine when this happens he said she was adopted by the wife sister lives in Colorado and is doing fine leave her the fuck alone that's the one condition and Rowan's attorney said he would not object to that condition. The Fields has said we won't continue to break your balls. We won't write letters. We won't go to the press if you agree to do that. So

2014 Bruce Rowan dies at age 50. What? Yep. No comment on cause of death because I think we probably know what it is. It's pretty obvious. I think we know what happened to him at age 50. I mean, he might have had fucking pancreatic cancer, but I feel like he probably took a shitload of pills and killed himself is what I think. His gravestone is the weirdest fucking headstone I've ever seen.

It just says his name. It says R.I.P. His name and just his born year and death year, not date of birth, date of death, just 2000 or 1964 to 2014. And RIP, RIP. It's the,

it looks like it's totally generic. Like I've never seen RIP on a fucking head. Stop. No, not outside of Oregon trail or something. Yeah. It says fucking rip bruce w rowan 264 to 2014 that's it that's the whole stuff not a thing about him this that friend doctor nothing

just dead guy the headstone that thing's crazy i don't know man that's fucking wild though um i did find on the pages that have his you you know, find a grave and all those. There's things where you can put memories about them and stuff. So a woman named Nancy Renner posted on several different sites of his death. to the question, do you remember the first time you ever met Bruce? What was your impression? She said Bruce was the ER doc when I took my husband in for repair to a large cut in his arm. Who says repair to their body? Prepare? 64 cut list? I was just going to say, was he a 68 Nova? What's happening? I have never seen

such incredible kindness and skill. Bruce did a beautiful job. He was an amazing surgeon and a very kind person. person restored my father wonderfully all doctor doctor eugene turner oh still out there practicing medicine oh my he is 87 fucking years old um i found him this is healthgrades.com. It says he's an MD pediatric specialist in Port Angeles with over 56 years of experience. He has one star and three ratings here. Is that right?

Three one-star ratings. I don't know if that's just one-starring because of what happened to Connor or what, but then I found another one, health.usnews.com, where he's on here as well, Dr. Eugene F. Turner, MD. And he's had shitloads of experience, and he has three out of five he's on here as well. Dr. Eugene F. Turner, MD, and he's had shit loads of experience and he has three out of five stars on that rating as well. So not great anywhere. Not great. People I think are, plus he's 87.

How great of a doctor could an 87 year old honestly be at that point? You, I would wonder, did he leave something out that he forgets something? Wouldn't you like doc, did you cover all your bases? You got to wipe my arm with the, with the alcohol before you put that in come on you wash your hands what is that jesus christ you're eating a sandwich while you're don't do that so that

is port angeles washington and that is a twisted fucking story as unbelievable as we've ever had i i gotta say it's wild it's crazy i can't believe it worked it worked it worked and then he got out either way he's in his own personal hell obviously and uh so you know i don't know let's see can't he's not gonna do it again we know that oh yeah there we go he served in in his own head so much time so much time so but i don't think it was enough still for what he did that was bad and this is bad thing when you have mental health issues fucking see somebody as a doctor he's got to be perfect though it's the god complex there so if you like that show tell the world about it get on whatever app you're on doesn't matter whether you're you know spotify i don't

know if spotify can do it but Podcasts or this one or that one, Audible, whatever the hell. Give a review. Give us five stars. It helps drive us up the chart, helps the show be more visible. So definitely do that. You definitely also want to follow us on social media so you can get all sorts of updates on everything we're doing.

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Patreon. Our episodes are fucking great on Patreon. They're so much fun. They're fire. Hot fire. Get in there. They are. You get, for anybody, it's five bucks.

It's a cup of coffee per month. Not that much money. And you get the whole back catalog. We put out new ones every other week. So you're going to get new episodes constantly. This week is no different. You're going to get all the crime and sports and small town murder bonuses. Because even the crime and sports bonuses aren't really ever about sports.

They're always about just weird things. So for this week for small town murder and crime and sports, for crime and sports, what you're going to get is, and you'll get this, you're going to get players who like to pay for sex. Right. Which is hilarious. You don't want to hear about a bunch of guys getting busted in the act. That's awesome. That's hilarious. They got busted with their dicks in people's mouths.

That's funny. Well, a gun's on them. People want to suck their dicks willingly, and they're paying for it. They're like, I want to pay for it. There's that then for Small Town Murder. You've asked for it, and we're finally going to talk're like i want to pay for it there's that then for small town murder you've asked for it and we're finally going to talk about it casey anthony everybody let's talk about another uh three-year-old who had a hard time and uh casey anthony who is one of the biggest liars i think the state of florida has ever made and that's saying something

yeah so yeah it's it's wild shit so we'll talk all about casey anthony and all of that shit there that is patreon.com slash crime in sports and you should be listening to crime in sports seriously if you don't listen to it check it out you're gonna like sports i understand you don't like sports i get it fine it's not about sports trust us the only reason we tell you about the sports is to see who the why this person even matters why are people kissing his ass why are they letting him get away with all this shit oh because he hit 340 last year and then

don't worry he'll beat somebody up or fucking leave somebody hit somebody with their Lamborghini and leave them trapped in a car and get a ride and drive away or kill somebody or molest somebody it all happens there so check crime and sports out please and also keep an ear out for your stupid opinions which will be coming as soon as it's happening we are possibly allowed to put it out business wise trust us it's definitely happening we know it's

happening because it's done already so we've already made an episode so that's how you know it's done and we're making it not doing that shit for nothing it's happening so i made a theme song god damn it it's happening it's on so get in there and do all that and you will get a shout out at the end of the show if you do that because you're so goddamn wonderful and we love you and as a matter of fact, Jimmy I need it right now, hit me with the list of the names of the people who would

never ever ever place our bodies in cars and push them into a drainage ditch and then say they were insane Jimmy, hit me with that list This week's executive producer melinda o'connor and her shattered ankle she's having oh no eight uh fusion surgery oh jesus feel better good luck melinda i can't imagine conor mcgregor yeah her conor mcgregor ankle uh adam canapacus and ho Winter. They're celebrating 15 years together.

Hey, rats. I could only do nine, and then I checked out. Emily Slack, happy birthday, Emily. Happy birthday. Benjamin Siramati Tero. No? Benjamin's got an Italian last name Jimmy can't pronounce. Benny C. Happy birthday, buddy.

Benny C. Happy B. Happy BD. Benny C. Benny C. HBD. That's right. Better than HPV. All right.

Carrie McCall Cameron with no last name, or maybe it's Cameron, that 90s R&B singer. It's possible. It's always possible. Laurie, the Stanley Cup champion Las Vegas Knights fan. Thank you so much, Laurie. That was very nice of you. Other producers this week are the Scarlet Whore Beast III. Happy birthday.

Janice Hill and Alexandra Jones. Happy birthday. Sabrina the phone sex operator. Look at that. I don't know if that's true. Rosenitis suffers everywhere, Unite. May you regain the power to stop sniffing bases. Gary remembered that last week.

Somebody's last name was Rosinitis, and I said it was something about a baseball disease. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Eaton Areola is a great dude. Over there just eating on Areola. All right. Matt Earn. Chomping on nips. Ridiculous.

Matt Earn. Ernie. Ernie? Ernie, maybe. I don't know. Sarah Crystal? Dan McNeil? Jason Sprague? Lynn Bollinger?

Rebecca Minich? Wes Rersenzinski? Holy fuck. Dan Herb? Will DeLulo? Maria Abarkadabra? Abarka? Abarka.

Liberty Ray? Amanda Stewart? Alexi with no last name, Amy Pickney, Candace Merricks, A.M., Cody Giberson, Chrissy Walker, Casey Martin, Melissa Blue, Joseph Gill, Sarah Lloyd, User123445, Kim Kopnack, Tiffany Webster, Lisa Wise, Eric Lazowski, Susie with no last name, Nicole Lemke, Arlo Vincent, Cade Bramlett, Sarah Almey, Victoria Harlow, Elizabeth Sturcelli. Sturcelli. All right. Mama of four Beatles. Elizabeth Stockton, Rachel Quintero, Azalea Seldon, Caitlin McAfee. Caitlin. Nope, that's Kathleen. Hernandez, Devin Buckley, Randall Theilmeyer. I'll never get this right. Sheryl with no last name, Emily Hastings, Briar Lee McClure, Anusha Storage, Jay Holt, Nhi, N-H-I, Nhi, maybe, Nguyen, Sloan H., Trevin Winters, Megan Swanson, Zach Wall, Samantha Miles, Amy Colby,

Madison Reed, Beth Leggett, John Butler, Levi with no last name, Anthony Rodriguez, M. Ford, 82, Donna Davis, Dominic Brown, Gary Mazeros, Kimberly Merlo. Anna B. Becky with no last name. Denise Danker. Paisley and Voodoo. Andrew the old Scottish cunt. More. Haley Boris. Boris. Oh, boy.

Chris Delauder. Delauder? Delador. Colin Rustin. Megan Cannon. Brandon with no last name. Brianna Suarez. Ronnie with no last name. Anissa. Anissa Williams. Anissa? No, it's Anissa. I with no last name. Brianna Suarez. Ronnie with no last name.

Anissa. Anissa Williams. Anissa? No, it's Anissa. I'll bet it is. All right. Peyton Stoppel. Spencer Helzebeck.

Maria Lenz. Diana Zagardos. What is this? Kasten Johnson. I know that person. That person's on Instagram or something. I know that name. Tony D'Andrea. D'Andrea.

Bailey Dutter. Amy Stokes. David Kuhlman. Kuhlman? Kuhlman. Kuhlman. Joseph Pendergast. Daniel Hamilton.

Deja Arnold. Lori Snyder. Bobby Sue Prowse. Liz Hinchgen. Sean Stacy. Chelsea Brown, Gadot Not Found, Mickey Pizek, Rachel Richardson, Brenda Smith, Leeloo Dallas, Melissa Flieger, Jessica Paulson, Mr. Gamer Man, Shane Trim, Eva Scott, Eva maybe, Patrick Flynn, man uh shane trim eva scott ava scott uh eva maybe patrick flynn uh thomas nope millie millie sauber thomas walker kara flower fluffer maybe fluffer uh mindy minter with mindy winter sammy wills wiles maybe emily beaver oh bevin bevin beaven maurice lewis you're having a field day even Maurice Lewis, Julie Stanger,

Melissa Dawson, time traveler, Tim Scott, Scott Hill, no, no, me would know last name. Brandy Greenside,

Catherine Collins, Mark Turner, BM Weiss, Shelly, uh, Ray, Brett Snyder, Daniel Mantalas,

Mandel, Mantalas, Mantal, Mantalas, Mattalas, Steven Davis, Jeanette candy, Mike Aaron, Drew would know last name, Melissa Kettner, Catherine Barber, T. Horvath, Killian Casey, Alex with no last name, Heather Engelman, TJ Clemente, Nate Moeller, Brett Osborne, Thomas Arose, Tate Tata, Tata Kempf, Lynn Feil,ibler, Amanda Anderson, Mitchell Corwin, Stacy Shankle, Travis Arunda, Lauren Hanson, Brittany Highoon, Louis Blake, April Morgan, James Galatzer, Christy Hayes, Steve Mazzotti, Jen Anderson, Ebony Sam, Alyssa Soriano, Jessica Reed, Jenny Murky, Caitlin Zemla, Tracy Thompson, Heidi Lewis Millard, Dogbite409, Old White Guy. That's me.

Josh with no last name. Jim Good. See you next Tuesday, Pod. Krista Rupmanis. Rupmanis? Rupmanis rutmanis rutmanis john lang uh kristin kakos uh kakos maybe uh julie showalter elizabeth of alabama uh randall williams savannah with no last name and maria armando no amando amando amado amado listen and all of our patrons you guys are amazing thank you so much thank you

so much everybody from the bottom of our hearts for all that you do for us all the amazing thank you so much thank you so much everybody from the bottom of our hearts for all that you do for us all the time thank you thank you thank you we hope you love the patreon it's awesome fucking listening to this everybody who spreads the word tells your friends posts on social media all that shit helps grow the show you don't know how much that helps us out so thank you for doing that and all that you've done for us. Reviews, everything. You want to get a hold of us on social media as people, you can do that easy. Go to shutupandgivememurder.com List of links. Click on them. You're right

there. Boom, boom, boom. Keep coming back because we'll keep coming back. And until next week, everybody, it's been our pleasure. Hey, Prime members, you can listen to Small Town Murder early and ad-free on Amazon Music. Download the Amazon Music app today. Or you can listen early and ad-free with Wondery Plus and Apple Podcasts. Before you go, tell us about yourself by completing a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.