Small Town Murder - #401 - A Seriously Crazy Cuisine - Morrice, Michigan

Episode Date: July 6, 2023

This week, in Morrice, Michigan, a successful man, with a good job, and nice family seemingly loses his mind. He begins having strange fantasies, and losing touch with reality. From there, the story goes in a completely different direction, when this man turns out to not only have an active fantasy life, but also commits a horrific murder, and even eats part(s) of his victim, after frying it up, in his kitchen. That's only the tip of the crazy iceberg, as this story is strange from start to finish!!Along the way, we find out that there isn't much you can do with a beeswax festival, that the first half of someone's life can't always predict the second half, and that human parts are apparently best fried up, with a little Worcestershire sauce!!Hosted by James Pietragallo and Jimmie WhismanNew episodes every Thursday!Donate at: patreon.com/crimeinsports or go to paypal.com and use our email: [e-mail] to shutupandgivememurder.com for all things Small Town Murder & Crime In Sports!Follow us on...twitter.com/@murdersmallfacebook.com/smalltownpodinstagram.com/smalltownmurderAlso, check out James & Jimmie's other show, Crime In Sports! On Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, Wondery, Wondery+, Stitcher, or wherever you listen to podcasts!See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

You're listening early and ad-free on Wondery Plus. What if you married the love of your life and then stood by them as they developed 21 new identities? What would you do? This Is Actually Happening is a weekly podcast that features extraordinary true stories of life-changing events, told by the people who lived them. Listen to the newest season of This Is Actually Happening on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. This week in Morris, Michigan, a seemingly very normal guy has a quick fall into madness that eventually leads to some strange situations and possibly cannibalism. Welcome to Small Town Murder.

Hello, everybody, and welcome back to Small Town Murder. Yay! Ah, ha, ha. Yay, indeed, Jimmy. Yay, indeed. My name is James Petrogallo. I'm here with my co-host. I'm Jimmy Wissman.

Thank you, folks, so much for joining us today on another this we say another insane edition or crazy every week but wow is this crazy i'm telling you buckle up this is one of those where where it starts you'll never ever predict where it ends up it's one of those you just go ah that hit me out of left field. So very quickly before we get started, definitely head over to shutupandgivememurder.com. Get your tickets. Chicago, August the 12th. We're sold out through August the 12th. But August the 12th, Chicago. It will be our biggest show ever, Chicago.

As of right now, it will be. So let's make it even bigger. Let's sell this bad boy out and have a good time. It's going to be a Chicago-only live show. So this story, you'll only see it in Chicago this year if you want to see it. So it's going to be a lot of fun and lots of tickets available in a couple other cities. A lot of them are sold out, but we still have some left in Dallas, a few left in D.C. Like I'm talking 20, I think, is left or something like that.

They're just about sold out. Philly, Atlanta, Charlotte. So get in there right now, get your tickets, and come see us for a live show. They are fun, I'm telling you. If you're on the fence about it, it's a comedy show. It's great. And there's a wild murder story with pictures and everything else.

Crazy stuff. We can't wait to see everybody out there. Head over to shutupandgivememurder.com. Get the tickets, I'm telling you. Also, patreon.com slash crimeandsports is where you get all the bonus material anybody five dollars a month or above you get access to everything we put out bonus wise the whole back catalog a couple hundred episodes not to mention new ones every other week one crime and sports one small town murder and you get it all this week what you're going to get as your bonus episodes are for crime and sports which

you get obviously we're going to talk about your bonus episodes are for crime and sports which you get obviously we're going to talk about theme park disasters oh yeah yes we talked about defunct theme parks and some of them were defunct because of disasters let's talk about a ton of weird terrible theme park disasters and then for small town murder we're going to talk about something that relates to last week's show we're going to talk about prison riots all right some of the craziest prison riots we've ever heard of in history so that's going to be wild that is patreon.com slash crime and sports and you get a shout out at the end of the show of course where jimmy will mispronounce your name while wanting so desperately to get it correct

so do that also definitely keep an ear out your stupid opinions coming soon yeah we say it every week and i'm telling you right now, the show's done. We're waiting on other people to do things that we can't control. So it's a business thing. We're sorry. We do want it to come out, and thank you so much for being impatient for it. Thank you. We're impatient, too.

So thank you. I like the idea. I'm telling you it'll be every week after that once it's out. We will not mess you up at all. So keep ear out for that that said disclaimer this is a comedy show it is we are comedians that does not mean we make up anything in the story for comic effect everything is unfortunately real you're going to hear about and uh thing is you don't have to make jokes and not bad times that's the thing about it yeah you can you can be tasteful about the whole thing there's nothing funny about the. You can be tasteful about the whole thing. There's nothing

funny about the actual act of a murder. There's just nothing funny about, oh, he cut his head off? That's hilarious. That's not funny. But what's funny is, I don't know, a small town police force bumbling an investigation for a year, a murderer going, I think I can get away with this. Sure, I'm cutting him up in my living

room and my carpet's soaked through right to the floorboards with blood, but I'm pretty sure sure i can get away with it that's crazy and funny when you think about that so that said what we don't do what we go out of our way not to do is we never make fun of the victims or the victims families why is that james because we're assholes but we're not scumbags so that's how it works so for the rest of you though if you think true crime and comedy should never ever ever go together i don't know maybe that's number one who are you but number two makes it a little easier to digest in my opinion but you know come on just a little lighten it up a little bit but you know if you think that's that's fine that's your right to

feel that way and maybe we're maybe you won't like us maybe you won't but for the rest of you who definitely want to hear a crazy story yeah wow i think it's time everyone to sit back rick arms to the sky people and let's all shout shut up and give me murder all, let's do this. Let's go on a trip. Shall we? We're going up to Michigan. There we go. Bumpy roads and all. Michigan here. We're going to Morris, Michigan. How far north is it? It's central Michigan. It's a half hour outside Lansing.

Not very far. This is M-O-R-R-I-C-E is Morris. I've heard it pronounced more ice, but This is M-O-R-R-I-C-E is Morris. Oh, oh, oh. I've heard it pronounced more ice. More ice? But I looked at a local newscast of the high school football team's highlights, and they called it Morris. Oh, Morris.

Repeatedly. So it's Morris. At least according to the local news. Complain to your local news if there's a problem. It could be Maurice? Yeah, it's Morris. But they said more ice is what i've heard other people say like more ice please that sort of thing it's about an hour and a half to detroit about a half hour to lansing michigan like we said about an hour and a half to canton

township which was our last episode the not so missing spouse which was, which was a wild one, too. This is in Shiawassee County, which I'm sure I'm saying incorrectly. But there it is. Area code 517. Motto here, and this is a ballsy motto for this community. Quote, we are a community on the grow. Yeah. There is nobody here, first of all. There never has been. Well well maybe they're on the go

james i don't think they're on on the not on the grow they're on the go you think so history of this town 1838 william morris with the same spelling really he came to the area bought 160 acres northwest of some people's farm and he just married his childhood sweetheart and all this type of shit. Not the tobacco guy? No, different guy. William, not Morris, like regular Morris. This is the town spelling. Oh, William More Ice.

More Ice, yeah, like the town. They had new land. They built a cabin. They had no bed for a long time, so they slept on the ground and listened to the wolves outside. Oh, my God. Wolves knew they were there and ground and listened to the wolves outside. Oh, my God. The wolves, like, knew they were there and would come up to the door of the cabin and howl, which sounds terrifying. It really does. So his three brothers ended up settling nearby, and Scots people from Scotland were the first people here, pretty much main people here.

There's also Bennington Town township which is right next to here it's on the border and this story you'll hear they always reference it as bennington township but it's actually morris is the actual address of the where this all happened but they founded a church in 1839 the first presbyterian church of bennington oh later changed to Morris. And they founded the church strictly on the abstinence from alcohol platform. Really? In 1839. Yeah. People met at each other's houses and later at the school, and they really hated booze a lot.

In what year was this? 1839. Wow. About 80 years before. Really ahead of the curve? 60 years, 80 years before Prohibition. Yeah, that's a lot. before really 60 years,

80 years before prohibition. Yeah, it's a lot. There was, that would happen in times and waves because the late like 1880s, there was waves of these women's groups that were going into taverns and breaking everything up. They were going and busting shit up. They were pissed.

Their husbands were drunk all the time and beat the shit out of them. So they get in large groups like the society women and they go in with hammers and break all the booze bottles and the guys would just stand there where they can do clothesline, right? Cl clothesline her hat off her big fucking fancy hat off her head it's victorian times you also got to protect the last glass of booze you've got yeah i gotta hold it tight so they're uh they had a 1911 they finally had a like a an actual incorporation of the town and they had a big party 15 years later and they had barbecue lunches

and free coffee for everybody oh boy that sounds they also had a three-legged race a bicycle race an obstacle race wrestling matches a tug of war and the old pie eating contest gotta have that.

And, of course, the greased pole climbing. Got to have that. Just have a beer, you guys. It'll be so much better. Just come on. You're going to be so much happier. I was going to say abstinence from alcohol did not stick in Michigan. If you've ever been to Michigan.

No, it did not. They went the opposite way. Good for them. ever been to michigan no i did not they went the opposite way good for them yeah so this place in the 1990s started expanding a little bit because i guess a lot of the professors at michigan state university found this town oh it's only a half hour away and they can yeah 45 minutes and they can drive so it's it's one of the few communities remaining by the way that has no chain stores or franchises so it's still like like kind of a small town there. Yeah, no corporate America yet.

Not really, hasn't gotten. I don't know because there's no money to be made there, which we'll find out there's not a lot of people there also. If it's not a big drive-through area. McDonald's doesn't give a fuck how many people are there. They want stores. They've got to move these McMuffins. But you've got to have like a road that's going through that people are driving on with a sign where they'll pull off and go to the mcdonald's otherwise you're really gonna you know

gonna be a mcdonald's that goes out of business and that's that's rare so you don't want to be that guy you don't want to be that guy i couldn't sell fucking hamburgers to french fries i couldn't make people want mcdonald's french fries i couldn't sell mcdonald's cheeseburgers to anybody wow uh over 12 50 60 billion served but not here not this one here it's been bad i got reviews i got 12 served reviews of this town five stars okay morris is a beautiful small town with friendly neighbors. Small town community that is kept clean and nice in appearance. Always have great service at local businesses.

Always. Five stars. Always. Never a problem. Okay. Never a bad day. Never a bad day. I don't believe anybody who's like that, by the way.

Four stars. Morris is a small village halfway between Lansing flint and us and awasco awazo jesus okay awoso i don't know how to pronounce that ayahuasca flint and ayahuasca it has easy access to the i-69 yeah yeah buddy that's right i-69 the i-5 we have a easy access baby head to to the old 69er we have a bank post office hardware superette i don't know what the hell that is a grocery store does that mean super eight superette miniature super like a small grocery store i don't know and a gas station we have our own class d school is that good i don't know what that means class class d that doesn't sound good don't brag about that that's the fourth letter that sounds like they don't really have books per se they just

they see what's in like usa today and they're just gonna flip through it and they're like i don't know this is in color color. The kids will look. Class D, along with our own police and fire departments. Terrific. So they're just happy to have a fire department here. They're educated in Class D school. Yeah. They're like, listen, we got fire departments.

We're good. People in this town, 1,521. I mean, that's a tiny town. It is way more female than male. I'm talking 54% female, which is way, way out of whack for everything. Me and Morris. But median age is low, 33.4, which is much lower than the average. Young women?

No, children. Oh, okay. It's 10% 0 to 4 and 11% 5 to 9. So 20% of the population is between 0 and 9 years old here. Jesus Christ. 7% 10 to 14. They're all high. All the kid demographics are super high.

All the old people demographics are low because otherwise they'll freeze to death in Michigan. They have to leave when they're old. 54% married, which is higher than normal, lower divorce rate. So this is very much a family-oriented, you know, come here and have a bunch of small children running around your big yard here. Race of this town, 94.5% white, 0.7% black. Not a lot of black people. 0.0% Asian, 3.7% black. Not a lot of black people. 0.0% Asian, 3.1% Hispanic. It's white people in Michigan.

Religion here is low, actually. 50% is normal for religious. Here it's 32.8%, and it is mixed up pretty good, except the highest here is Catholic, which, as we know, Catholics are the Baptists of the North. And they're in here, too. In this county, in the last presidential election in Shiawassee County, 39% of the people voted Democratic, 58.9% voted Republican, 2% Independent. Their unemployment rate's about average here. Median household income is like $200 from being the actual national average for median.

Yeah, this is like your small-town America, middle-of-the-road, kind of stereotypical small-town America, what you would think of. Main Street USA type of shit, without even a McDonald's or a Panera Bread or some shit marring the landscape. What the fuck are they doing for money? Well, we'll find out. Okay. 100 is the cost of living. That's regular average. Here it's 84, so it's a little low.

Housing is the lowest. Median home cost here, $187,200. This place is a little secret, huh? It seems to be. But the thing is, the houses are not what you would really want. And to tell you about all the houses you would not really want, just in case you're thinking of moving here, we have for you the Morris, Michigan Real Estate Report. Your average two-bedroom rental here is $990. So that's cheaper than normal.

Here's a three bedroom, two bath, 1,344 square foot. I don't know what it is exactly. This is the thing. I don't know if it's manufactured. I don't know if it's like a big trailer that they like welded two trailers together. I don't know what it is, but it has that corrugated metal along the bottom of it, which is not a good sign. I don't see regular houses with that ever it has that corrugated metal along the bottom of it, which is not a good sign. I don't see regular houses with that ever.

That's just there to hide the tires. That means, yeah, or something to hide. That means no foundation, correct? Right. Okay, no basement for sure. It's to keep the possums out from underneath there. Yeah, it's to keep the groundhogs from living there. So this house here, I mean, it's okay.

All these houses look the same, all three of these houses. They look the same with different amenities. This one actually isn't that bad. It's not that dated inside. It's not that bad. Fairly new. $78,900.

Not bad. Not bad, but like I said, I don't know what you're buying. It's got brake lights on it. It's somewhere. They're hidden under some lattice, but it's there. I found here's a three-bedroom

two-bath, 1,680 square feet, and it's kind of the same setup on the outside with the corrugated shit on the bottom. It's strange, though. It has these weird round cabinets in the kitchen that stick out, that are like they come out and they're like rounded,

so I don't know. They seem like the one on if you open one on one side, it would go right through to the other. So there's no real cabinet space because it seems like every three cabinets is just one cabinet. So it's really weird here. It's a private community. It's an old person house. You can tell by it. There's two chairs sitting like by the TV in the living room.

Very old person. $104,900 for that, though. All right. And then here is a three-bedroom, two-bath, 1,960 square feet. There you go. It's really weird. It says it's built in 2005, but it looks like it's from the 80s inside. So I don't know if in 2005 they were like, give me a 1984 kitchen.

That's what I really want. Very strange house. It's odd. It has wood paneling in it and shit. Who put wood paneling up in 2005? I mean, I get it's the Midwest, but come on, guys. They're getting back to it today, too, though. People are doing it a lot. Yeah, and then in 30 years, people are going,

ew, look at that. It's disgusting. $144,900 for this house. Okay. So everything's very affordable. Everything. And that's kind of all there is. There's only four houses available in the whole town. Those are three of them.

So you can enjoy. There's only 500 people here. Yeah. Things to do in this town. Okay. The Michigan Honey Festival. Yeah. Oh, boy.

The Michigan Honey Festival is a fun, inexpensive, and informative weekend for everyone. Young and old, non-beekeepers, newbies, with quotes around it, new bees, not like an I-E-E, and seasoned beekeepers alike. Our attendees, sponsors, and vendors and volunteers will walk away with something. All our attendees. But you'll walk away with something. Something bee-related. This sounds like you're going to stand in a field all day and hope not to get stung by bees

and i like bees bees are cool yeah we have the little we have the little habitat things to make the mess and we put those out those are neat those are cool but yeah this is gonna be and now i'm not walking around because now i'm terrified of getting struck by lightning after the other day yeah you're you might be in a storm. I'm almost, this is insane that I'm alive. I'll be honest with you, everybody. I'm not even kidding. That's 10 feet away.

Jimmy was on the phone with me on FaceTime. There was absolutely, I mean, witness Sarah saw a lightning bolt struck. I think she measured, I think it's 11 feet from where i was standing it was the brightest loudest yeah thing in the world left a hole with a burn mark in my driveway right there and i was standing right it was the fucking craziest thing in the world i'm still went white and and it was instant noise and you go i think that was close by. I was like, James, that was right there. That was right fucking there. I was like, look around, man.

There's a mark somewhere. I just jumped and ran in. I ran inside. I screamed like a four-year-old girl and ran inside. And Sarah found it. Is it a good three, four-inch hole in the asphalt out there? It's not that big, but the burn mark around it has got some – it's got a good burn mark around it. It's a small hole, like an inch maybe across?

Yeah, yeah, maybe an inch and a half across the hole. That's a fat bolt of light. It's burned all around it, and I'm like, that would have definitely killed me. So almost didn't get to make this. That's all electricity. The whole thing. All electricity. That's crazy.

Right there. I almost was basically dust, I would assume. Ashes and sneakers, I think I would have been. A big chunk of Italian sausage. Pile of ashes sitting on my pumas. That would have been that. Put them in the sauce. Fuck, man. That would have been sauteed nicely.

So there is honey judging here, by the way. It says, beekeepers, bring in your honey to get an idea of what a honey show is like. Get your liquid honey or beeswax judged. See the list of rules below. Okay, all entries must have been produced within the last 12 months, which makes it sound like a sperm sample, and I'm disgusted by that. Do you have your sample? Did you produce it? by that do you have your sample did you produce it that is the worst part of a vasectomy is when you have to bring the sample to have them test it and then it's like they're like when was this

collected and you're like yeah the shame is like just a few minutes ago i have my dick in my hand i've produced this very recently is what has happened here. Wow. All honey entries will have three of each item. Only liquid entries accepted. Three one-pound jars. Exhibitors are allowed one entry per class slash color grade. Jesus. They are very specific.

Entries must have no identifying labels or marks on the entries other than the marks placed on them by show officials. All entries must be entered and in place before the program begins on Sunday. You can't sneak any honey in later on. There's a lot of cheating involved. Standard honey jars, Gambler, Queen Line, etc. are acceptable. No other jars, Canning, jelly, etc. will be accepted. Metal or plastic caps may be used. Sounds like a sperm sample you're giving.

It really does. Beeswax in two classes, three one-pound blocks, artistic presentation that shall use a minimum of one pound of beeswax. And finally, rule number 10, decisions of the judges are final. Oh, there's no bribing afterwards? Don't you fucking dare try to go bitching later. Change your mind, Ted. Trying to get some, yeah, trying to, you know, I want to recount. None of that shit.

Judges will tell you who's got the best wax and you go the fuck home with your bees and shut up about it. That's it. We should show up as pimps and be like, I want to judge the honeys. I want to judge the honeys. Oh. What? Oh. We misunderstood.

I think we misunderstood what's going on here. Entries not picked up by 5 p.m. on Sunday become property of the Michigan Honey Festival. They will keep your beeswax. It will be none of your beeswax anymore. Be all theirs. Tips, each jar should be identical to the next, weight, color, etc. Make sure your jars are clean. No fingerprints or smudges.

Oh, my God. Don't tip your jars or turn them upside down because that will make the honey run down. Right. Like shit. So there you go. Not a lot to do in this town. No. That's what we just said.

Very specific about honey, for christ's sake go to a field and watch people be really serious about beeswax and honey like way too serious about incredibly overcritical about bees and honey their jar was smudged oh boy well let's see his fucking fingerprints the jar is smudged you can't have that so crime rate in this town what we're interested in it's a safe little town, too. It's about property crime, about one-third below national average. Very safe. Very safe. Violent crime, murder, rape, robbery, and, of course, assault, the Mount Rushmore of crime, is less than half the average, under half the average.

Fantastic. So, I mean, it is extremely safe as far as that goes. That said, let's talk about one of the most disgusting things I've ever heard about my life. It's always in these towns. It's always in there. It's so nice. Incredibly safe.

On this wonderful, leafy, fucking idyllic little street with kids riding their tricycles. Listen to what happened in this house. One of the most horrific stories you've ever heard. Oh my God. Jesus, I wonder if DoorDash will bring liquor there. We'll see.

So we'll get into that later in the show. We'll talk about the DoorDash incident later on in the show. Poor Jimmy had no tequila, and I was out a shitload of money, and nobody got anything. So upsetting. We'll get into that later. Wow. So let's talk about this murder. Let's talk about a man first, okay?

Okay. All right. Let's talk about Wilk let's talk about a man first okay all right let's talk about wilk ali cos vilkas huh aka edgar thomas hill aka william gregory dean aka mark david latunsky why well he's an interesting fella uh mark david latunsky is his given name, actually, what he was his legal name will say. The rest of them are various aliases that he'll go that he'll use at different times for different reasons and different ideas that he has. So he's born in 1969. And this story, by the way, is very recent.

Like it just wrapped up. It's a very recent story he uh he was born to jack and ruth they lived in morris that's his mom and dad he had a family farm that he grew up on okay i mean he grew up on a family farm in a small town in michigan you know does very well he's the his father is a local 4-H club leader, 4-H leader. So into agriculture, this whole thing here. His father raised beef cattle to show in competitions. And so Mark got into that as well when he was a kid.

But, you know, kind of as he started to be a teenager, he realized farming wasn't his calling. Okay. He just didn't want to be a farmer. Not really in his wheelhouse of interests. He's allowed. And he's very intelligent. Not that farmers can't be very intelligent, but we'll hear what he's into. I don't know if he would have been satisfied farming because he's real into, like, chemistry and physics.

And, like, he's very, like chemistry and physics and like he's very very smart in science and stuff so i feel like he needs to be stimulated more than i mean which could help on a farm i would assume you could probably yeah help out but there's plenty of shit to do on a farm there's always something that needs to be done but you have to be a farm person to really to enjoy that you have to be a person who really loves the farm otherwise if you put either one of us on a farm we're not going to enjoy it i'd like it for maybe three four days three four days by noon you would be like my back is so fucked up right now seriously i'm gonna stop i'm gonna stop for the day and we'll see you wouldn't last four hours on a farm

and neither would i so i'm not making fun of you you. No, I'd have a great time with it, but I'd be in pain. Oh, I'd hurt. I mean, I'd be like, can we start at like, why do we have to start so early? The cows don't know when they're eating. They don't care. We say we bring them food around noon. Like 1, 1.30. We'll eat at noon, and then 1, 1.30 we'll bring them food.

How do we know they're not saying bring it at noon we don't know they're telling us what time they want the food how am i supposed to know what these i don't think they'll know the difference as long as we feed them at the same time every day i think it's fine and again let's just skew our day later five hours what do you say this is nuts what are we what are we doing why do you need to be back in the house by 4 p.m what's what are you waiting for i'll hang out until the evening it's good in the summer there's long nights what are we doing i'm sitting still my elbow still feels like i'm moving it it hurts so bad what did i lift why does it hurt like this why does it hurt to milk a cow that shouldn't hurt

that bad right my hands arthritic what's going on what is in that bag jesus christ why does it hurt so bad we would be the worst farmhands ever here are your two new farmhands james and jimmy it sure is beautiful out here wow maybe the last positive words it'd be funny for boss for about an hour they'd be like you fucking jerks you idiots till one of us gets like caught in a thresher they'd be like okay the the alive one can leave you got to get out of here and we got to clean this one up over here bury your friend and get off my farm i'd like you to bury your friend in the animal cemetery and then get on out of here. So, wow.

In 1987, he is at Morris High School, and he is one of the schools recognized on the list of top 10 students in the high school. He's a member, and he's an athlete, too. He's a member of the cross-country team. He's in the National Honor Society. He's on the and he's an athlete, too. He's a member of the cross-country team. He's in the National Honor Society. He's on the quiz bowl team. He's on the forensics team. I didn't know high schools in the 80s had a forensics team.

Yeah, that's new. And also was senior class treasurer and was active as a yearbook member, too, involved in the making of the yearbook. All his yearbook pictures, he's glasses and sweaters over collared shirts. Oh. Like, you know, he's got the real Alex P. Keaton, Michael J. Fox, family ties look going on, but with glasses too. I'm studious. Look at me.

Look, my homework's done. Need to cheat off someone's test? I'm your guy. Probably me, yeah. I'm your guy. Trust me. There. I'm your guy, trust me. There might be milk money in my pocket, too. Whoever you're closer to, me or the Asian girl, but either way, I'm here for you. It's all a lighthearted nightmare on our podcast, Morbid.

We're your hosts. I'm Alina Urquhart. And I'm Ash Kelly. And our show is part true crime, part spooky, and part comedy. The stories we cover are well-researched. He claimed and confessed to officially killing up to 28 people. With a touch of humor. I'd just like to go ahead and say that if there's no band called Malevolent Deity, that is pretty great. A dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit with a little bit of cursing.

This mother****er lied. Like a liar. Like a liar. And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal, or you love to hop in the Wayback Machine and dissect the details of some of history's most notorious crimes, you should tune in to our podcast, Morbid. Follow Morbid on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to episodes early and ad-free by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. In May of 1980, near Anaheim, California, Dorothy Jane Scott noticed her friend had an inflamed red wound on his arm and seemed unwell.

She insisted on driving him to the local hospital to get treatment. While he waited for his prescription, Dorothy went to grab her car to pick him up at the exit, but would never be seen alive again, leaving us to wonder, decades later, what really happened to Dorothy Jane Scott? From Wondery, Generation Y is a podcast that covers notable true crime cases like this one and many more. Every week, hosts Erin and Justin sit down to discuss a new case, covering every angle and theory, walking through the forensic evidence, and interviewing those close to the case to try to discover what happened. And with over 450 episodes, there's a case for every true crime listener. Follow the Generation Y podcast on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts.

You can listen to Generation Y ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus. grades the best grades so this guy has a capacity to that's a lot yeah yeah that's so much in high school to do he is yeah he's wired to do things all day i mean that yeah it's he's always got an activity and then he's got to go home and do homework and all this shit especially he's in like hard classes too he's in like you know honors classes and physics classes ap shit and he's trying to that's wild man so he wants to attend central michigan university and that's where he goes to major in chemistry oh so yeah he's a science guy man this isn't like uh you know he's not just going to like party and drink beer right if you're going for chemistry you got to actually study and shit he wants to be involved yeah big time so he gets a bachelor's degree

in chemistry in 1991 and right after he graduates in 91 he gets an internship for the dao chemical company as well oh really yeah i mean i guess if you're a chemist yeah you gotta be work for people who make chemicals and those are never great people by the way no you're never going to be like i'm working for the best just the nicest people you want to believe no they really care about everybody they're a chemical company yeah i mean yes they put poison in the groundwater and things like that nothing you buy of theirs is you know your kids will have cancer and everything but still it's wonderful never no one ever says that he went on to earn his master's degree in chemistry after he moved on to iowa state

university and and earned his master's degree there so he's whatever road he wants to be on in this chemistry road he is on it and killing it right now he's capable of any of it yeah yeah this is a guy who fuck i mean works hard has it has it all together yeah just the amount of together you have to have it to keep all that shit straight think about it think about all that shit and like wow i couldn't keep all that straight no these shows are difficult to keep straight you know what i mean i can't and this is nothing compared to like eight different high school things and chemistry and all this shit it's wild so i'm very overwhelmed i'm trying my best to pay my water bill and keep my house clean and i don't know how people do this every day i don't

know how yeah how do things get trimmed and stuff there's a yeah bushes that are out of control how's your place just stay nice how wow how do you do it it's wild isn't it people just must have a list i think oh i think people are making lists out there things to do and we're not doing that we're trying to we're just grabbing willy-nilly out of our brain whatever everybody everybody living in the house has a thing to do and all of it yeah it's to make it look nice there's a chart huh there's a chart i tell my kids take out the trash the trash gets taken out and then then what how do i make the rest to this claim trash is out now there's no garden now there's no bag in the can because the kids

they'll take it out but they'll never replace the bag now i can't put anything in that can now you throw something disgusting in there next thing you know you're outside with the hose there's no bag in there. We've all done it. God damn it. So Mark here, he moves home after he graduates. Okay. At first.

And accepts a job working as a research chemist at Flint Inc., a manufacturer of commercial printing inks. Okay. So that's what he's doing doing he's doing very well for himself he's making good money doing that especially for a single guy yeah he's a single guy swinging making decent money i mean he's got chemistry going for him what do you want here so he stays in this free swinging lifestyle until his early 30s when he gets set up by mutual friends on a date with a young lady named Emily. Oh. So, yeah, he gets set up. They go out for Chinese food their first night. Great choice.

Not in Morris, probably, but somewhere else because it was 0.0% Asian. Get the fuck out of there. Yeah, it had to be in another town, I would assume. Now, Emily says of him, to have somebody describe his personality, and this isn't surprising for someone who was a chemistry major and valedictorian, she says he was always a little bit awkward. Oh. Which, yeah, I could see that, you know what I mean?

Being, it seems like it, you know? He's Anthony Michael Hall in The Breakfast Club. That's who he is. Yeah. That's exactly who the kid is. A little on the nerdy side, but fine. But fine, yes. As an adult, though, that's the thing, because they were both in their 30s.

When you're like 19, you're like, oh, this guy's awkward. By the time you're in your 30s, you're like, okay, if they're not going to murder me and they have a job let's get through the awkward thing and see if i like what's underneath that you know what i'm saying you don't have to be cool on the surface and fuck that you know seriously yeah are you going to beat the shit out of me and gamble all our money away no are you an alcoholic no this is great then let's maybe we can make this work you're by mid mid 30s your your standards change as far as that goes. Cool isn't really a thing anymore. You tolerate a lot.

You tolerate a lot. She said, I liked him a lot. He was very considerate and kind. I fell in love with that side of him. He was very gentle. Oh. So that's what he is. He's a gentle, sweet, nerdy, grown-up Anthony Michael Hall from The Breakfast Club.

That's all he is there. Yeah. So they date about a year, and once they're dating about a year, they purchase a home together. Terrific. It's Morris. Everybody says Bennington Township, but if you put the address in, it comes up Morris. So that's why it's Morris. They are married in 2001.

Oh. So, yeah, he's 41 at the time. Or he's 40, yeah, 41, 42 at that point. So, you know, he held out for a while here to get married. But he does. He gets married. Oh, I'm sorry, 32. 32, yeah, 32.

Good math on me. So they buy a home at 703 West Tyrell Road in Morris, and they have four children together. Wow. So, yeah, right away, because both of them are like, all right, she's in her mid-30s, she wants to start having kids. By 2003, their son is born. That's their first child.

Okay. And then they would have three girls after that. Wow. All in a row 2004 2007 2010 every three years yeah they had a kid so that's again planning every we'll have children every three years and then it's they have their shit together every two years i'm getting you pregnant i'll get you pregnant that's a good time for that that'll it's good space it's good spacing you know what i mean to get that thing out and then you got a two-year break because it's coming again it's one out of diapers yeah okay this one is out of diapers now you have this

one it's right like that you're not changing two diapers all the time which feels like that's the way they planned it just based on the type of people they seem to be smart yeah shit together type of people you know and they have kind of this like they have a five acre property here. Wow. It's kind of an idyllic little life. They raise goats and chickens and ducks and rabbits. Hell yeah. Yeah.

The cutest of the animals. Think about the little kids frolicking around with with little baby chickens and ducks and shit. Goats. Goats. Cute. They stink, though. They stink terribly. We've chickens, too. They're disgustingats, chicks. So cute. They stink, though. They stink terribly.

Chickens, too. They're disgustingly smelly. Oh, they're vile. If you take a picture, though. Yeah, you can't smell a picture. A little goat by the kid. That's what I mean. You got little baby chickens running around. Ducks and little rabbits. All of these things are making a copious amount of shit. But in a picture, you just

see happy kids running you don't see cleaning the shit off of them later on instagram's flooded with amazing images you don't see someone holding a child's boot later scraping it out of the shit out of the divots with fucking screwdrivers getting a flathead screwdriver and dragging it through the waffle through the chip yeah through the waffle the little nikes so holy shit so that's what they're doing here uh emily rides horses yeah they have enough room to have horses and shit on the property they have family trips they go on family vacation every year of course they do all four kids jump in the family truckster. They go to Disney World. Yeah.

This is crazy. This is like a, for both of us who grew up less than like this. Less than anything. Less than anything like this. This is crazy. Imagine growing up on a farm with your parents together and having their shit together and like having jobs. Yeah, the animals are like taking care of well and things are going well. and you're going well come on kids we're going to where are we going this year kids disney world or disneyland and i don't know in california like that's crazy that wow

nary a rib is showing on any of your pets they're all fed and looking great they've been to the vet recently all of none of them have worms or anything. Everything's going great. Even the animals have doctors. This is incredible. They come right to the house. Emily and the kids would join Mark when he used to have to travel for Kentucky to work all the time. I guess he had to every once in a while go to Kentucky and all. Come on, we'll make it a family vacation together down there, all the way down to Kentucky and all. Come on, we'll make it a family vacation together down there all the way down to Kentucky. So there was a dinosaur park near where he worked down there that the kids really liked.

So come on, kids. Yeah, that's what a family. This is awesome. Is it like a fossil park or is it just like... No, it's real dinosaurs walking around. You know what I mean. I don't know if it's like

dinosaur themed park or if it's like, I don't know if it's like, you know, like dinosaur themed park. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Or if it's like Cabazon when you're driving to California, just giant concrete dinosaurs. I don't know what it is. Or maybe fossils. But seems like if they would like to visit it, I think you get bored with fossils after once or twice. They probably have rides and dinosaur themed shit, I suppose. It has to be. So someone will correct us and say nope it's just one fossil it's a rock damn it it's a rock

zoo that's all it is so this is just by the way you have no idea where this is going you're you have no clue where this is going not a bit of it Not at all where you think it's going. So he's very busy with work, but his wife says, Emily says, he's very attentive to the kids. He's a great father, she says. Just terrific. They said it's kind of a hectic family, all these animals and jobs and working and all this. But they make it work, and they're all very happy, and they seem to thrive on the chaos that's going on. It's good chaos, not bad chaos. Control chaos.

Yeah, it's not bad chaos. Like, I don't know, mom hasn't been home for three days and dad got fired again and he's been on an alcoholic bender for a week and a half. None of that shit's going on. So he works for American Chemical Technologies, Inc., which just sounds like a warm cuddly company doesn't it just sounds like you could just settle in and stay there forever and there's a class action somewhere this is not good oh many i'm sure this is camp lejeune's involved there's probably a lot there's a vaginal mesh there's a vaginal fucking yeah take that vaginal prolapse

jenna maroney so uh it doesn't sound all that nice but i guess a very good job it's in fowlerville he's making over a hundred thousand dollars a year jesus at his job and they got the farm going on so yeah life could not be better for this family. Oh, my God. Idyllic. Take a picture. Fucking painted up Norman Rockwell. It is wonderful. Wild.

So some things start to change. I guess a couple weeks after their youngest daughter was born, which is 2010. Now, normally for a woman, obviously, when you have a kid, there's a lot of crazy hormones that are going on. You were pregnant. Now you're not. And it's, there's a lot of crazy hormones that are going on. You were pregnant, now you're not. And it's why postpartum depression exists and all that sort of thing. The Stitch Itch. Yeah, the Stitch Itch.

That's probably worse. So you get all of that. You don't usually hear about that from the husband's point of view, though. Usually the husband doesn't, you know, because nothing's been inside their body causing massive damage and hormonal changes and all that sort of shit. Also, you've done this three times before. It's the fourth kid. Yeah. But Emily said within a couple weeks of their youngest being born, something seemed different with him. Yeah.

Started to act different. She said he started saying things that just didn't make any sense out of nowhere. Just weird shit where they're like, that's odd. Why did he say that? Strange things. Things like, and this I'll quote Emily, quote, he believed that he wasn't actually his mother's son, but that he was his mother's brother. Okay. Gross.

Which is the opposite of what people pretend, by the way. What do you mean? Okay. Gross. Which is the opposite of what people pretend, by the way. What do you mean? Okay. They wouldn't, if he wasn't her actual son, a lot of times back in the day when like a young lady would get pregnant in the family, they'd hide her for nine months. Then they'd pretend like the parents had the kid. That's what they'd do. And they'd call the kid that girl's brother, and that's how it would work. There's a lot of people that found that later on that, oh, shit, my fucking aunt is actually whatever, my mother.

You know what I mean? They gave my dad to his aunt because she was the older sister, and she just raised him. That was less embarrassing for the family for for the parents to have a kid i don't know what they did with the other daughter that so she could recover from having a goddamn child who knows how do you hide her for a little bit oh they would send them away and say she's away at camp at class at boarding school they just send them she's staying at a our relatives farm for a year. Jesus.

They'd have all sorts of excuses when they would send the kid off. Because there's shame involved or something? Oh, yeah. In the 60s before that, there was the teenage girl's pregnant in a small town the whole time. Oh, the shame, the scandal.

But you wouldn't pretend that he belonged to the girl when he was actually the parent's kid. No one would pretend that. You'd pretend the opposite is what I was saying. So it doesn't make any sense. She said, quote, and that they were hiding that from him because there was some sort of family inheritance that he was going to inherit.

But he had to do all the right things. He had to say all the right things. He believed that there were people watching him to make sure that he did that. So to recap, not only is he not his mother's son, he's actually his mother's brother. They're hiding the fact that he is one of his mother's siblings because there's some inheritance coming to that generation of the family that they don't want him to have. And if he doesn't stay in line and say what he's supposed to say they're watching him and then he's going to get slashed out of the will or out of the inheritance how did he get here that's what i mean so it seems odd she said this was just out of nowhere he started saying shit like this and

she's like i don't think so like i think you don't understand it's truman show yeah it is they're all watching me all the time and she was like at point she said, I think you should maybe talk to somebody here, get some help. Yeah. Because what you're saying isn't making sense. You know, she's like, I love you. I promise you that I'm not trying to put one over on you. I really want you to understand that you're not thinking straight here. Right.

So this continues. His mental state just declines and declines and declines over the next two years. He is diagnosed in 2010 and then again in 2012 because he's hospitalized multiple times with severe recurrent chronic major depression with psychotic features, adjustment disorder with depression and anxiety with paranoid schizophrenia and borderline personality traits. This is... Oh, what happened?

This is a wild cocktail. This is like, let's put some gasoline. You got napalm? Throw that in there, too. Gasoline, napalm, anything else that's flammable we could throw into one mixture. Throw some fertilizer on it. That'll do a trick there. Holy balls.

What happened? Bring the kerosene. Holy shit. Is that just too much pressure, too much shit happening, and you just snap? It's weird because this is a lot of stuff that usually would come out younger. Yeah. Like paranoid schizophrenia, that happens in college and high school a lot of stuff that usually would come out younger yeah like paranoid schizophrenia that happens in college and high school a lot of times usually it doesn't happen like your 30s and

almost 40s and then it snaps in yeah he's like 41 with four kids and shit and all of a sudden paranoid schizophrenic now i'm borderline it's strange it's almost like did he have like a head injury not that head injuries cause mental illness but but sometimes you can knock you a little off or I don't know what it is. But everything is just bad for you. Yeah. So even just just fucking dropping a load, apparently, because like I said, I could see if the wife had this because who knows what four kids do to your hormones. It could mess your whole chemistry up or something. But this is like he had a stroke or something.

This is crazy. He's prescribed medication, which he starts taking, but very, very quickly stops taking it. Yeah. He decides he doesn't like the medication, doesn't like the way it makes him feel. The medication isn't helping him, he thinks. It's helping them hide. Yeah, it's keeping it in, the stuff that he needs to get out that's important. It's hiding it now.

So it's part of the conspiracy. It's not working. It's part of the conspiracy, Jimmy. That's how it goes. And that's how a lot of people feel with medications. They feel different. So they feel like, oh, it's terrible. I feel bad for people like that.

So 2013, they continue to try to treat him with medication, but he just will take it for a bit, then not take it. And when he stops taking it, he goes completely. Yeah, you can't do it that way. Yeah, he goes completely off the deep end when he stops taking it. He can't do it that way. Yeah, he goes completely off the deep end when he stops taking it. And so she doesn't know from day to day if he's taking it or not or if he stopped and if he's going to freak out on her or be normal. You've got to be consistent.

And work, apparently, his job, because he keeps this job he has through 2019. So they're very understanding, this job. I mean, he must be a hell of a chemist, first of all. I mean, honestly, he must be amazing, this guy. Jesus Christ. So his wife said, though, he doesn't like to take the medicine. And when he doesn't take his medicine, he does some strange things. And they asked her, well, what kind of strange things does he do? And she said, well, he'll watch torture and horror-type movies and videos of that nature.

He'll talk to himself. He'll stay out all night, not at bars or anything, just outside. Not out partying or just out on the patio. Where is he? Who knows? In the woods over there? Who knows? He's just wandering.

So he's just out all night wandering around which is very strange he will threaten to get rid of all his children's animals okay i don't know if they're listening and they know too much or what the animals um that he'll claim that his son isn't his child out of nowhere he'll stop showering and shaving for days at a time and get all scruffy and shit and uh smell and and be he'll get all smelly running around threatening animals and saying that's not my kid and i'm gonna watch a torture video while i wander around the yard this is yeah crazy weird and kind of scary if you're a woman who's trying to raise four kids in this environment and you don't know it's hard enough to raise four kids

that are ranging in age from like you know 10 to fucking 2 that's all that's rough without a guy wandering into the woods talking to himself about getting rid of all the yeah you have to worry about him more than you would your children at this at this point because you're worried he's going to hurt somebody

or hurt himself or who the hell knows also she finds out about some other issues that he's having that don't really have much to do with his mental condition but just have to do with um what he's up to she founds out she finds out and he admits to her that during this time period he has been cheating on her as well uh with who with men that he meets online oh yeah he's cheating on her with dudes that he meets on apps and shit and and that sort of thing and he's been meeting them for sex and sometimes when he wanders around the yard he'll disappear and that's where he goes oh so yeah and also when he's at work sometimes late she's used to him working late all the time

so she doesn't know when he's actually working late or when he's got hookups that he talks about. So she says, quote, this is Emily, quote, he was always working, and now looking back, I think, oh, my gosh, I was so stupid, I should have known. Should have known that he was... Cheating, maybe. I don't know how you would know he was cheating with guys that would be a stretch yeah pretty amazing if you're really blaming yourself for

missing that one damn it i'm not clairvoyant i didn't know my husband was into dudes oh he's into guys it's so so obvious so strange i thought he used to watch american gladiators too much back in the day i don't know so do you think maybe okay it doesn't is he gay and he repressed it for so long it drove him crazy i know i mean jesus i'm not a doctor i'm not i don't know if that's i don't know if that would be it's not like holding down like a chemical in a where it's gonna build up build up steam chemical in a or it's going to build up build up steam and pressure and explode i don't think is the craving for cock that crazy that it would make you give you a chemical imbalance jesus i would hope not that only that only semen can

balance out you know i don't think so um i'm neither a chemist nor a doctor, so I'm not sure, though. Maybe I'm not the best guy to ask about this. I don't know. So the marriage obviously is suffering and having some problems during all this, clearly, because, I mean, he's cheating, number one. I don't care who you're cheating with. He's cheating outside the house. But he's definitely cheating. He's not just saying it.

He admitted it. No, no. She thought so, and she caught him. She found something and caught him, and then he went, yeah, you're right. But he's definitely cheating. He's not just saying it. He admitted it. No, no. She thought so, and she caught him. She found something and caught him, and then he went, yeah, you're right. This is what I do. I cheat all the time with these guys I meet online. Wow. This is in addition to threatening the animals, and that's not my kid, and all this type of shit.

So she says, we need marriage counseling. That's what we need. Is that what we need? I don't know if that's what we need here. I think we're beyond marriage counseling. I think we need some paperwork dissolving this one. You're insane. You won't take your medication, and you're fucking not only just dudes you meet online outside the marriage and lying to me.

We need way more than this. How about lawyers more than doctors is what we need right now? You're sucking Craigslist dick, bottom of the barrel dick, and we don't need to talk about it. I'm done with this shit. So they end up, they begin sleeping separately while they go to counseling and all this. And his mental health, Mark's mental health, continues to spiral out of control. He now begins accusing his wife of being part of the conspiracy run by the overseers of an enormous trust fund that he's set to receive that doesn't actually exist. It's completely in his mind.

There is no giant trust fund that he's got and all this shit. But he thinks that this all these people that were watching him and all that to make sure he says the right thing. And he's his mother's brother, not his son. All that shit. Also, she's like hired by them. So she's really, this is a, you're going method to get into this role. I'm going to have four kids with this guy. Four of them.

And buy a house and ride horses. This is a big setup, man. Talk about a, it goes deep. Yeah, This is a big setup, man. It goes deep. This is like some royal family shit. You can't get away with this shit unless you're that deep. He's doing all of that nutty stuff and then he ends up

having stints in psychiatric treatment centers twice in 2012. Rough year. Again in 2013. It'll happen again later on never helps he's in they let him out and he's the same guy won't take his medication because they'll put him in there they medicate him yeah and then in a few days he's fine and they're like oh you seem okay and he's like yeah i'm fine and then they let him out and he goes right in the fucking garbage with that shit where who's who else is in the conspiracy?

Right. It's fucking nuts. I mean, that's tough. If someone won't, you can't. What do you do? I mean, other than have them in a facility where you stuff the medication in their face every day. How do you force them to a wall or some shit? How do you force a free person to take medication?

Impossible. You can't. I mean, obviously, or else or else you know we wouldn't have heard shit from kanye in the last fucking eight years you know what i'm saying seriously yeah we'd be the only thing in the news about him would be like oh he got a divorce from her and put out a new album okay oh those are his shoes oh those are terribly terribly ugly like the rest of them awesome that would be it machine gun kelly would have never met yeah he wouldn would have never met. Yeah. He wouldn't have been like, I think that Hitler had good ideas. We wouldn't have heard any of that shit if he'd be on this.

So he ends up, at one point, he reports his wife to CPS for child neglect. Oh. Which is completely unfounded. He just gets mad and calls there and they say the accusations were made up the police investigate it and there's nothing to it it's just uh him being crazy i mean honestly yeah but they have to investigate the claims but what are the just neglect just over neglect for child neglect now when he calls the cops for anything they should go mark you taking your medicine, buddy?

If, pal. Anything. Unless he says my house is on fire, then maybe drive by and take a look. But otherwise, you taking your meds, pal? Yeah. Because otherwise it could be anything.

So by May of 2012, Emily and the children move out and she files for divorce. So it's over by this point. So what he does is this is crazy. Over the course of the next year or so, he'll kidnap the kids. He'll keep her from the kids. He'll make frivolous claims to CPS about her again.

He'll claim that she and her brother were trying to murder him by poisoning a well on his property. He is so much fun. He'll call the cops and go, I trying to murder him by poisoning a well on his property he is so much fun he'll call the cops and go i i gotta report something uh my ex-wife or soon to be ex-wife you know how these things go in the courts they take forever anyway her and her brother trying to kill me by poisoning my well oh boy and they go mark you taking your medicine buddy yeah that should have been the response to that hey pal um you take your pills this morning no uh he's going to be charged in 2013 for custodial kidnapping yeah custodial interference this uh they call it custodial kidnapping is that right yeah well you'll hear the details here the charges will eventually be dismissed after several competency hearings they

go well i mean he's obviously out of his fucking mind so the court had granted mark unsupervised visits with the kids somehow unsupervised even though he was in and out of mental hospitals so during one visit they were supposed to go to a they went to a water park in dundee and he did not return the kids at the scheduled time. So she called the police who learned that Mark had taken them to a water park and would not return them. Like they got ahold of him and he said, I'm not bringing them back.

They called him on a cell phone. He's like, nope, they're mine. I'm keeping them. Yeah. Or like, you can't do that.

You have a custodial agreement. You have to bring them back. And he said, well, I'm keeping them. So they went and went, well, you're under arrest for custodial kidnapping.

You fucking moron. That's not how this works. So they arrested him. Now it's a felony charge of kidnapping. Wow. This time before it was custodial kidnapping. Now it's just he's done it before. He's done it before.

That's the thing. So the case is again dismissed after court ordered competency evaluation finds him mentally incompetent to stand trial in 2014. At what point do you not let him see the children if he's got these, you know what I mean? Well, she's trying to get it so if he's allowed to see the children, it's only in a supervised capacity. But the court let him have unsupervised visits, which is nuts. And now there's this. And now after this, he goes nearly four years without seeing his kids at all. Four years?

Four years. After he takes them to the water park, he doesn't see them again for a little less than four years. Last time I saw Dad, he almost gave us Giardia. And now... Yeah. It was... I did love the water park.

It was wonderful. We had a great time. Better than that dinosaur shit we went to in Kentucky. But still. I shit my brains out for three days afterwards. But it was so much fun. That's part of the experience. It's part of the experience.

Slipping in diaper water. It's nice. You can eat anything you want for like four days after it and you won't gain a pound. It's wonderful. I just eat like pie and Burger King and shit for like four days because it's coming right out. Liquid time. It's all a lighthearted nightmare on our podcast, Morbid. We're your hosts. I'm Alina Urquhart. And I'm Ash Kelly. And our show is part true crime, part spooky and part comedy. The stories we cover are well researched. He claimed and confessed to officially killing up

to 28 people with a touch of humor. I just like to go ahead and say that if there's no band called Malevolent Deity, that is pretty great. A dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit with a little bit of cursing. This mother f***er lied. Like a liar. Like a liar. And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal. Or you love to hop in the Wayback Machine and dissect the details of some of history's most notorious crimes, you should tune in to our podcast, Morbid.

Follow Morbid on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to episodes early and ad-free by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. I understand that anybody who's paid attention to the media would have to come to the conclusion that I killed my wife. Hi, my name is Zach Stewart-Pontier. I'm one of the filmmakers behind The Jinx, and I'm excited to bring you the official Jinx podcast.

We'll be revisiting all six episodes of part one and watching along with part two as it airs on Max, starting April 21st. Bye-bye. The official Jinx podcast. Listen on Max or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to the small town of Chinook, where faith runs deep and secrets run deeper. In this new thriller, available exclusively on Wondery+,

religion and crime collide when a gruesome murder rocks the isolated Montana community. Everyone is quick to point their fingers at a drug-addicted teenager, but local deputy Ruth Vogel isn't convinced. She suspects connections to a powerful religious group. Enter federal agent V.B. Loro, who has been investigating a local church for possible criminal activity. The pair form an unlikely partnership to catch the killer, unearthing secrets that leave Ruth torn

between her duty to the law, her religious convictions, and her very own family. But something more sinister than murder is afoot, and someone is watching Ruth. With an all-star cast led by Emmy nominee Sanaa Lathan and Star Wars' Kelly Marie Tran,

Chinook is available exclusively and ad-free on Wondery+. Join available exclusively and ad free on Wondery Plus. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple podcasts. So in 2013, late in 2013, Mark kills Mark. Oh, makes sense. Obviously not. It's coming out of his ceremony. obviously not yeah it's coming out of his ceremony well in 2013 he went to the police station and introduced himself as hello i'm william gregory dean and they went okay good to meet you billy

sure and he said i have killed mark lutinsky with the stroke of a pen yeah because they're like well i'm william. Yeah. Because they're like, well, I'm William Gregory Dean. They're like, that's nice. He's like, I killed Mark Lutensky. So cuffs are coming out and they're going around the counter. Then he goes with the stroke of a pen. And they're like, who are you, you asshole? What do you want from us?

You fucking idiot. What is this magic comedy? What are you doing? Yeah. So he left, and then there's a call to the police a little while later to come get him because he's unconscious lying in his father's house now. When they get there, they find him pretending to be unconscious lying in his father's house. He's not actually unconscious. He pretended to be unconscious in his dad's house, which is a little bit weird this was september 3rd 2013 he just walked into the lansing police department and said hi i'm this guy and here's my fake birthday i killed lutinsky with a with a

stroke of a pen and they ended up later on stopping by his house for a welfare check yeah i'd do that probably once a day. Just have somebody, just take a swing by. Somebody on first name basis with him that just pops through every now and again. Just make sure he's not wearing a golden retriever's head as a hat. That's all. You know what I'm saying? If everything's good.

Mittens and slippers. Yeah. Let's just hope, you know, after that we can move on so he made a a retriever skin rug let's hope that that didn't happen so they did that they found what they did called cryptic notes scattered across his kitchen so they so they looked at these notes because they're like what the fuck there's just notes everywhere with weird shit written on them all over the kitchen. Some referenced being cursed and breaking the cycle. That's what he kept talking about, breaking the cycle of this curse that's going on with him.

So they also found references to William Gregory Dean, which is his new name, that he's just calling himself. So they ended up finding him next door at his dad's house. And again, this was when he was unconscious. And they said after some prodding, he, quote, sprang to life. I'm good and just popped up. No problem. He told the cops, see, here's the thing is, I'm a, quote, protected person. Yeah.

I don't know what that means. Like the program? He said, listen, I'm protected, so because of that, I want to know, quote, the truth. Oh. And they were like, about what? Yeah. I'll tell you how much away. I don't know.

What do you want to know? He also said that him and his children, by the way, who he hasn't seen in a while now, are being poisoned by a bladder tank filled with lead that his brother, not his wife's brother now, now it's his brother, somehow maliciously attached to the side of his house. Oh, God. Now it's his brother somehow maliciously attached to the side of his house. So there's a big bladder filled with lead attached to the side of his house somehow that his brother put on there that is poisoning him and his kids being that close to this much lead. Yeah. This. Yeah. Imagine you're these cops.

OK. So the cops say, OK, tell you what, you show us that. Then you go for a ride and we'll show you something. And he says, OK. And they show him the mental hospital. You take him there and they go, let's you showed us the lead. You know, we're going to drop you off here with some very nice people are going to take good care of you. You put lead blankets on you. No shit. So they do that.

He's arrested, by the way, at the Memorial Health Care Center on September 19, 2013, and that's when he's criminally charged with that custodial kidnapping after that. So the criminal case continues for 18 months while they deal

with psychiatric evaluations and all that. And like I said, they dismiss it in 2014. He was committed to mental hospitals four times during that period, too. At work, he said that, like I said, he must be a hell of a chemist because it's not like everyone at work goes, gee, he's normal here. At work, they're all like, oh, yeah, he's fucking out there, man. He's nuts there, too? Oh, he's nuts there, too.

At work, a co-worker of his said that his mental illness began impacting his job performance by 2012 shit he worked there another seven years jimmy right think about how understanding of a company this is if you're a chemist this is a place to work um the colleague said quote he just thought everyone was out to get him that's how he that's how he rolls was out to get him. That's how he rolls, man. Out to get him. Here's a strange incident that happened on September 14th, 2014. Yeah.

Police near Grand Rapids spot him walking down the street wearing only, and I stress only, one article of clothing on his body. And you know what it is? A beanie. A right sock. One article of clothing on his body. And you know what it is? A beanie. A right sock. One sock. Just a sock on his right foot. Nothing else. Dick swinging, balls bopping back and forth.

Asshole just out there. Oh, just out there. For bugs to crawl into or anything else. Anybody to come after, do whatever. My God. He initially ignored the cops as they drove next to him. Yeah, yeah, just walking down the street. And they were like, hey, buddy.

And he's just like strolling. Yeah. I want to know if he had like the Saturday night fever strut on or was he just walking like it was normal or. Walking like he's tired. Yeah, walking like he's a little hunched over. Like, whew, man, I've been so tired. all my clothes fell off, I've been walking so long. I have no idea. So he ignored them.

And then he climbs in voluntarily into the back of the police cruiser, and they took him directly to a hospital. Yeah. And they said, quote, it appears that he has some mental problems when they showed up at the hospital and handed him over. And they were like, we don't know what to do with him. He's got a sock. One sock.

Let's take that sock off, put it somewhere else. And that's a start of at least covering him up a little bit. So the Kentwood Police Department ultimately decided not to or ultimately do request criminal charges for indecent exposure, but the prosecuting attorney declined to pursue them because he's like, you took him to a hospital and he's in a hospital. A guy with mental problems took his clothes off and walked down the street. Clearly this wasn't a criminal act. He wasn't trying to show everybody anything. He's clearly out of his mind, so I'm not prosecuting this. On September 18th, so that'm not prosecuting this on september 18th

four so that's four days after this incident wait his it was july 14th wasn't it that was september 14th oh september okay so september 18th four days later i guess he's out of the hospital yeah his boss mark's boss calls the sheriff's department to report that mark hadn't shown up for work in the past four days that's because he's been in the hospital. Right. But he was calling for like a welfare check. So they couldn't find him during this too. They looked at like regular hospitals.

They looked at all this shit and they couldn't find him. So they thought he was a missing person. And then he popped out and went to work. And he was like, hey, how's it going? Been in the hospital for four days. He just showed back up at work. And they were like, oh, never mind. We got him.

Call off. Yeah. So a few months later, in January 2015, he gets kind of a positive report from a psychiatrist here. He's getting better. Okay. Starting to feel like, you know, Mark might be able to pull this together. Yeah. like, you know, Mark might be able to pull this together. Yeah.

A doctor's note records his records. They state that Mark had made, quote, adequate process or progress in therapy and was able to address, quote, the powerful emotions and distress from his recent divorce. His sense of paranoia and anger have subsided enough for him to function and to be held liable for the alleged custodial kidnapping incident. So this is kind of the last. Is he competent? So eventually they said the charges could have sent him to prison for up to a year. They decided to give the case up and they said that the charges were dismissed at the request of his ex-wife, Emily, who didn't want to see Mark face legal consequences of this,

being that he's... Trying to spend time with his kids. Well, also, she knows that he's sick. Yeah. She watched him devolve into this, so she knows he's sick, and the fact that he's doing better... The psychiatrist says he's doing better in taking his medication. She's like, well, I don't want to see him prosecuted

if he's trying to be better. Ideally, I'd like him to be doing well paying child support and watching you know taking his kids and spending time with them and being a normal father ideally so um yeah the prosecutor said things had apparently been going okay she just wanted him to play by the rules and the case was dismissed at her request she said that he was warned the charges would be refiled if he quote did anything stupid okay so instead he just doesn't see his kids for four years wow which is interesting so 2015 enter jamie arnold okay jamie arnold is Mark's new husband. Oh.

Mark marries a guy now. Okay. Marries a guy. Yeah. So Jamie Arnold knows nothing that's been going on. None of that stuff. Everything I just described to you, no fucking clue. He knows he has kids.

He knows he was married. He has no idea. Mental problem. None of that stuff. Hospital trips. None of that. idea of mental problem. None of that stuff. Hospital trips. None of that. Just not telling him about any of that shit. So Jamie said, quote, I knew something wasn't right, but I didn't know it was to that extreme.

He was progressively saying stranger and stranger things like the neighbors were polluting our water supply. Someone's always polluting the well, whether it's his brother-in-law. His water's never clean. Never clean. And a lot of times people with mental illness that are very paranoid, that's what they're most paranoid about is their food and their water and someone's putting stuff in it and they think that they're being poisoned all the time. It's a very, very common paranoia. It's really common.

I welcome it. Yeah, come on. It's fun. Poison common. I welcome it. Yeah, come on. It's fun. Poison me. I don't want to do this anyway. I got nothing better going on here at this point. Strike. Well, you know what?

I am happy I didn't get struck by lightning, so maybe don't poison me. So Jamie went on to say they were all nonsensical. All I knew was I had to get out of that situation. But they're together for four years here. Didn't divorce? No, no, no, no, no. Not at all. But so they're together for a long time.

By 2019, they're still together. In February of 2019, he's still working as a chemist for the American Chemical Technologies Company. But in February, they fire him. February 2019, he's fired after 12 years of working there shit yeah he refused to make his take his medication and he claimed both to the employer and to anyone who would listen that his employer was trying to force him to put harmful chemicals and products that he didn't want to use okay now it's a chemical company so that could be true for all we know but you're not going to stay an employee long if you're saying that great either

right maybe he was exposed to something at his job that did this fuck you know i'm honestly yeah being a chemist anything's possible that is a really really really good point he might have been exposed to god knows what that made him yeah just anything to change his brain chemistry a little bit maybe it could have made him chemicals it could have made him like some kind of you know goodwill hunting mathematician or could make him a little crazy or i don't even know i don't know i don't know what's going on so matter of fact i don't feel anything i don't feel none emily said quote his boss was amazing his boss was amazing gave him so many chances and was so patient with him you'd have

to be to keep him around that long july of 2019 he is arrested for failing to pay child support okay because he hasn't had a job in a few months. A July 22, 2019 court order states that he spent four days in jail for the offense. Wow. So four days in jail. Now, like I said, Jamie didn't know any of this, wasn't aware of the mental illness. He said none of this came around until he was arrested for failing to pay child support. That's when he found everything out. And Jamie said, to my knowledge, I couldn't force him to see a therapist or take medication.

True. Like there's no way to legally make him do that. So how do you do it? August 22nd, 2019 is a custody hearing to see if he should be allowed to see his kids at all with Emily. OK, it's it's filed by Emily to suspend his parenting time. She says that Mark has a history of mental illness, has been hospitalized in the mental stress unit. Mark has a history of going off his medication, you know, until he demonstrates that he can take it consistently. He can't be around the kids.

I need consistent behavior. Fuck. Who cares about what he's taking? I just need consistent behavior. Yeah. about yeah what he's saying i just need consistent behavior yeah he can't do crazy shit at all but usually when he's on the medication no crazy shit happens that's what she's saying as long as he's on the medicine i'm not worried about it but if he's off his medicine then he's off his rocker and we're fine there you go so september of 2019 right after that jamie leaves him jamie's Jamie's done with it. He said, it's too much drama.

I'm done. Can't deal with it anymore. At the end of 2019? September 2019. Okay. Decides he's leaving him. He's gone. This is after they were doing some stuff online together

that we'll talk about, though. Oh. There's some overlapping time periods here. So here he is. Mark is single. He's unemployed. Yeah. He's got no money. He doesn't know what to do with himself you know not a real catch at the moment not a real catch and also when you're when your mental state is a little off like this it's really hard to put a

good resume together that's the thing you're not your your mission statement deal that's going to be a little off i think yeah that cover page is going to look a little obscure. That cover page, mission, to find out who's poisoning my wells and attaching this large lead bladder to the side of my house. That's not a mission that employers really want to deal with, I don't think. Get my children back and stop talking to myself. Yeah, it's not good. So he tries to find odd jobs. Yeah.

He tries working as a handyman. Oh contractor at one point, just trying to get anything he can, you know, trying to make money, which is a hard worker. He's always been a hard worker. So he tries to do that. But that wasn't working. Nothing was working for him. So he switched courses and decided to try to work as a male escort. Oh, boy. That's a different leap.

Which is very strange for a big bearded like 48-year-old man. 50. He's almost 50 at this point. 50-year-old man. He's a big guy? Yeah. He's a big bearded 50-year-old guy. That shows up in your door.

You'd be like, wait a minute. you're like who's paying for yeah what dude is paying for that you know what i mean because this is for dudes not for ladies or anything yeah he uses the alias wilk alicos vilkas at this point this is where his okay it's his escort alias that's where he uses that european shit yeah he'll later use that in some legal matters as well but that's what he uses. Oh, yeah, yeah. Don't you worry. I believe that's Greek, by the way. Oh, is it?

It's Greek because the one name is Greek for – Wilk is Greek for wolf, apparently. Oh. That's why he's going by that. Okay. He's a wolf, Jimmy. Yeah. So October 10th, 2019. He's very single and he's trying to find some fun stuff out there. There's a guy named James Carlson, C-A-R-L-S-E-N.

He's 46 years old at the time. And Carlson met Mark's husband, Jamie Arnold, on Facebook. That's how they end up knowing each other. Now, Jamie Arnold introduces James Carlson to mark god okay now they began chatting online mark and james carlson james carlson lives in new york so not even close to here suffolk county so no but yeah so i think that's anyway they're talking about they're talking about you know a sexual relationship yeah um they're talking about bdsm shit and role role play and sexual fantasies linked to eating people oh they start talking about having cannibalism fetishes which is we'll talk about this but this is a big thing you

remember there was a big deal with that cop in new york yeah years back or he got in trouble for he never did but he never did this is a whole society man this is a whole subculture of people here so they begin talking about all of this um mark had told him in a facebook message quote i would quote, I would need to make sure my technique was perfect, pain-free and bloodless before I did you. I know that if a pig is afraid, the meat is tough and the blood must be let to have the meat that is tender. He says that. To which James Carlson responds, thank you, Master Chef, sir. Is that what he is? is apparently he's going to cook people he's talking well he's talking about how to make the meat tender he sounds like gordon

ramsey talking about a fucking cow or something this is ridiculous he thinks humans have to be the blood can't be scared so that yeah you got to get the adrenaline out of them yeah yeah they can't be sticks in the meat you're gamey you. You don't want that. Nobody wants to be tough. I'll tell you what. Nobody wants to be tough. But if I am tough, you just make jerky with me. You know? So I'm already tough.

Lean into it. Tough and gamey. Tough and gamey, babe. So the two of them chat regularly online from July, you know, pretty much through this October date. And then again later, but that's strange. Of 2019? 2019, this is going on.

Now, while they're chit-chatting online, obviously, Mark is meeting other people and hanging out with them and stuff, but he's also doing some home renovations as well. He's single. What the hell? He's got time now. So he starts, quote, fixing up the basement, which, I mean, we've all – you can finish your basement. That gives you a whole – it's a whole other floor of square footage. It's something.

It's an extra house down there. It's an extra house down there. And what you do is – and we all kind of do it the same way, I feel like, too. You want to make sure to – well, we'll see what he did and see if it's normal of what you would do to finish your basement. You put in caged, tamper-resistant lights. That's normal, right? Yeah. A four-inch thick insulated door.

That's normal, correct? Got to keep that place separate, yeah. I mean, I would. Yeah. I mean, it's a basement. You don't want the moisture to leak into your house. You got to get a dehumidifier down there. It fits well with the tamper-proof lights.

It really does. The tamper-proof lights like in a mine that's those like that's what's in like or like like an austin powers fucking uh dr evil hallway they have the tamper-proof cover lights or like a stranger things nuclear facility underground he also puts in a sliding barn door that hides the entrance to the place. Oh, you son of a bitch. All very standard finishing the basement techniques. You put in a big screen and a lazy boy, you got yourself a real party time down there. A little mini fridge for your beer. This should serve as a warning, too. You should have to put in tamper-proof lights and a four-inch door. Four-inch thick door if you want

a fucking barn door in your house. Yes, that's what you should have to do. The other side of that bathroom door, when you slide the barn door open, there should be a four-inch thick bank vault door in there. And tamper-proof lights. Tamper-proof lights.

So, while this is going on,lson's going to come for a visit james carlson he's going to come for a visit so what they did is mark somehow buys a ticket i guess it's a bus ticket um from new york to michigan for james carlson okay and it's to come visit him at his home here for the purposes of having some sexual party time, obviously. Just like lots of people do when they find someone online and they hook up with them eventually. You want to fuck? Jump on the bus. Jump on the bus. That's how you know someone wants to fuck you, by the way.

If they're willing to take a three-day-long bus trip to you. Through Pennsylvania and Ohio. They want your dick slash tits or whatever you got whatever you got there so carlson travels to michigan mark picks him up at the bus stop and drives him to his house to mark's house so james is exhausted from all this traveling he's been on a greyhound for days i can't imagine he fell asleep in the car on the way from the bus stop to the house yeah of course so they arrive at his house at mark's house and that's when he gets there and he goes james carlton carlson says oh where's jamie because

that's how that's who how they met was through jamie so he knows that he's got a husband and he says jamie moved out already. So they go, well, why did you break up? And I'll let Jamie say that. You want a quote from Jamie of why they broke up? Jamie tells us why? Jamie tells later on, tells the press why they broke up. Quote, we're not together anymore because he, meaning Mark, started saying some very unusual and unreasonable things. Accusations.

He claimed that the neighbor was polluting our water. He claimed that his family was not his family, that his biological family was not his, that his children were not his. He said, I can no longer bathe in the house because it was toxic. Oh, the water supply.

So you couldn't bathe there anymore. Um, he said that he was dealing with mental health issues and I don't know what to say. This is so just not him. He's a father. He has four children, but things have changed. Yeah.

He says he's very intelligent, but he needs help managing his mental health. Back to the Carlson deal. Okay. They spend some time together, chit-chat and having some fun in the living room. I don't know. Put out a dip, maybe. Cheese log with nuts all over it? Some toasted onion sour cream dip that they mixed up there with some ruffles.

I don't know. Some Sabra hummus? Some middle-of-the-road shit, I'm thinking here. So they start putting some Sabra hummus. It's the spicy one, I assume. The roasted red pepper. Yeah, that's the one. So Mark, at this point, retrieves locks and chains.

Uh-oh. That's what he gets. And he locks James Carlson up in the basement, which is all on purpose. This is what they were going to do. By tying him down with leather straps and stating that James Carlson wasn't going anywhere okay this is more than carlson bargained for oh he wasn't yeah he's starting to get scared now very scared yeah so he waits until mark goes upstairs to get something else and he it's been a while so he thinks mark may have fallen asleep he just left him down there and fell asleep so there was a butcher's knife nearby

that james gets a hold of and cuts himself out of the leather straps that oh cuts to lie him down cuts the leather yeah not cuts himself he cut his arm off and he made an escape yeah this is really going to wow that's this is getting hardcore yeah This is a gravedigger song now. So at one time, once he escaped from the straps, he found his cell phone and he found Mark's car keys. And so Mark couldn't chase after him. He takes the car keys. He jumps over a fence. Yeah. And runs down the middle of the street while calling 911 with a butcher's knife and car keys in his hand.

Okay. Okay. Gets on the phone and says, quote, I met this guy. He says, quote, I met this guy. He's out of breath. He's been running. He's, I met this guy. I'm bi.

He's cute. He hit on me. I don't know. We went out to the car and talked. We went to the store, had a soda. I woke up in the basement. Oh, which sounds like he put some shit in my soda. I woke up in a basement. Yeah. This is why it's dangerous to just meet people online and like not dangerous people with you.

Reckless. This is crazy. So that's that's what he tells the cops. He says again, then he continues, quote, I've never had anything like this happen. I don't know if he drugged me. All I know is I ended up locked in the fucking basement. Okay. Chained in the basement. So within 10 minutes, cops arrive. They find Carlson on the side of the road.

And Carlson tells the cops the man who did this was a stranger. He doesn't know him what is the problem he does know him he's been talking to him for months his husband he says i don't want to press any charges i don't want any charges i just wanted to be protected and get away from this guy i don't want to press any charges because we don't know if he's got a job or that isn't cool with this or if he's who knows what his deal is oh yeah he's got his own personal shit he's got his own personal shit yeah he just wants to be private about it he said that he didn't know where he was and he was in a panic he called 9-1-1 and you know that now that

he's with the cops are here he feels better and now he knows what's going on and he's you know got his shit together so the cops drop him off at a gas station bye yeah here you go so from there he makes himself he carlson gets to the bus station and he calls mark okay he must have calmed down a lot to the point where he's like well maybe i overreacted yeah yeah he went from that to maybe i overreacted and maybe i was just tired from the bus trip and was confused. I don't know. So he calls Mark. I don't know if that's what he was thinking or what.

And he lets Mark know that I'm leaving. Your car keys will be at the bus station counter. I'm leaving them with the bus station people in the lost and found. I left your name. You come here. You can get your car keys. Mark said, sure, that's great. But your ticket to go back to new york's not good for

another week you're gonna stay here for a week so six days to kill son i don't know what to do so james had no money had nowhere to go had a bus ticket for a week from then so he goes back to mark's house what is he doing he goes back to his house and he stayed there until mark would pay for his ticket and let him to leave and let him leave um he had said that i mean i don't know if he took him too seriously like mark took carlson seriously because one of the things they talked about was carlson had a sexual fantasy involved with being treated like a pig and being butchered weird and that's why they were talking about the pig meat and all that kind of thing. So that's how that went.

So they said, in the end, they said all consensual. Everybody's fine. He leaves a couple days later, like two days later. A couple days after he leaves, October 15th, the police are called by neighbors about a strange man searching around a ditch around Mark's house. This is another one of Mark's hookups. That is for some reason, I don't know if he dropped his keys or what the deal is, but searching around a ditch in the dark on the side of the road by Mark's house, which is strange behavior. Now some even stranger stuff happens. Now some even stranger stuff happens.

November 25th, 2019, a 29-year-old man runs out of his house screaming, bleeding from the face, running down the middle of the road calling 911. He is wearing blood running down his face, wearing nothing but a leather kilt. Oh. That's it. A leather kilt is all he's wearing, okay down the street ronstein fan mark is chasing behind oh that's a scene this is a fucking i want to see the video footage so it's 2019 someone's got a ring doorbell or a simply say someone's got this footage i swear to christ so he says and this is obviously scary but guy says, I'm trying to get away from some creepy guy.

He had me tied up in his basement. This is becoming a theme now. He says that, quote, he's after me. All right. So this guy ends up running to a neighbor's home and pleads with them to call 911 to give the address to the police because the police said, where are you? And he said, beats the shit out of me. I have no fucking idea.

I don't know where I am. They're like, well, you should find out. Be easier to help you. So a state trooper shows up at the neighbor's house, but no charges were filed again here. What? They said that when they talked to Mark, Mark said, yeah, I was chasing after him. He took off wearing my leather kilt. It's 300 bucks.

Oh. Because I wanted it back. Because he can't fucking steal that. It's a very expensive article of clothing he's stealing from me. Yeah, that's expensive. It's a $300. It's a custom leather kilt, buddy. It's got like a dick cutout for it and everything. It's a good one.

A Scottish man made that for me. He didn't know why, but he made it. So nobody wanted to press charges, not for stealing a kilt, not for tying him down. They believed, the cops ended up saying later on, they believe believe this is police Lieutenant David Kaiser. He says he believed that the victims both wanted to keep this, both the kilt guy and the first guy, Carlson, wanted to keep this a secret because of, you know, just whatever. He said, quote, nobody wanted the police there. Nobody wanted to file charges. A lot of times people have a professional life and a personal life and they don't want to intertwine the two.

Their personal life is very secret, very very protected which makes perfect sense here um then later on though carlson will get a lawyer james carlson and jane and his lawyer says that's just not true okay you don't call the police unless you need the police there so that's how it was so neither no charges from anybody and the kaiser goes on to say sometimes people in these relationships are embarrassed or maybe they have a professional career and so they're very reluctant to share anything with law enforcement that's it's really hard if nobody wants to press charges and then they both say yeah it's consensual bdsm then you can't really right that's not illegal you know what i mean true okay december

10th 2019 mark is arrested again for not paying child support police have been called out to his house about a dozen times in the last seven years good lord quite a bit between the weird goings on child support arrests just general welfare checks performed on him everything let's enter someone else into the story now yeah kevin bacon stop it not that one okay a man named kevin bacon somebody with the last name of bacon had a child and landed on kevin and he explains why too we'll talk about this in a second yeah okay his his date of birth jimmy kevin bacon 1994 way too late way too late to be named 28 1994 yeah and we'll explain this his mother's name is pamela his father's name is carl bacon carl with a k okay his sister's name is jennifer bacon yeah they said that the father said it wasn't intentional father said quote i wanted the same initials as mine but i didn't want carl jr very smart by the

way he's been listening to the show yeah he might be listening to the show he said so that made sense the other kevin bacon wasn't quite as famous as he is now what are you talking about he was not only as famous he had been famous and already was fucking washed up by 94 and he was ready for a prime for a comeback 10 years from then he was so famous he was washed up wasn't that famous footloose came out in 1984 right he was in he was in she's having a baby the big picture tremors flatliners fucking he said she said jfk a few good men the air up there these are all between before this child was born sleepers was out before this right i don't think that was a little bit later maybe 96 that was yes a couple years later but still i think the air up there was huge ample kevin bacon out there

never ample kevin bacon never heard of him he wasn't quite as didn't think it was a big deal should have hit him with kyle bacon or some shit like By 94, there was already six degrees of Kevin Bacon. Right. People already did that by 1994. That started in the late 80s, six degrees of Kevin Bacon. Yeah. You just added a seventh by putting a child into this mix. So, holy shit.

I've never heard of him like that. What a dummy. That's wild, man. He did it on purpose. Shit. I've never heard of him. What a dummy. That's wild, man. He did it on purpose. He named him Kevin Bacon because he liked Kevin Bacon. He thought it was cool. Now he feels stupid for it. He said he just didn't know.

So young Kevin Bacon here. Young Kevin Bacon went to Schwartz or Swartz. I don't know what it is, but I think it's Schwartz because in German, SW is schwa, right? Is it? I don't know. I think so. I think it's Schwartz Creek High School. He was in band and was among the top 10 graduates with his grades.

So another very smart guy, Kevin Bacon. His mom said he was too smart for his own good, they said. Well, you know, like laughing. Like, yeah, he's very smart here. He graduates from high school. Like I yeah, he's very smart here. He graduates from high school. Like I said, top in his class there. His first job was as a receptionist at JCPenney's Beauty Salon in the mall there. Really?

Yes. He wanted to work his way up to be a hairstylist there. And there's not a lot of places around here to really do this sort of thing. In high school, he used to test out new hairdos on his girlfriends. And he's gay, by the way. He's gay. So, yeah, his girlfriends are girlfriends. And although they said he sometimes, you know, they said he'd want to do crazy shit and do all this crazy stuff.

But he became experienced to where he did somebody's hair that it would be look really nice after a while. He knew what he was doing. His friends would just let him practice on him. Carl, his dad was a packaging engineer. I don't know what the fuck that is. Figure out how to get shit in a smaller and smaller boxes.

That's a UPS driver. Is it a packaging engineer? I don't know. It's probably someone in you, like in, like putting it on the trunk or something, you know, maybe not the driver. That'd be a delivery engineer.

A train driver for them? Maybe, maybe. Now, he wanted, his father didn't want him doing hairdressing. He thought he could do, because he got really good grades and was really smart, he could do something to get more money, he thought. Kevin told them that Carl, he told all his friends that Carl expected him to go into a technical trade and not be like a hairdresser. He wanted to be like a famous hairdresser. Okay.

He wanted to because he was real into like Jeffree Star videos, the makeup guy, and all that kind of shit. Like he's into YouTuber hair and makeup videos. Oh my God, yeah, it's 2019. There's all kinds of things he could be into. That's what he's into. Yeah, all through the 2010s, that's what he's into. So he wants to be like a hairdresser with a big online famous following, that sort of

thing. He started out also, he went to Baker College, which was around there. He ends up getting into the school, the college he wants to go to, which is Eastern Michigan University, but he didn't have the $200 housing deposit. Oh. So he doesn't go. Oh my God, $200 away from- $200 away from going to college.

Which is, to me, that sounds like he didn't want to go and probably use that as a reason and just didn't want to tell his parents he didn't want to go or didn't want to tell whoever it was because- No, but he's only $200 away from a fucking college experience. No, especially this kid's got a lot of friends, man. Like, people like, he's a really well-liked guy. So he has a lot of friends, and they would pitch, somebody would get him $200 if it was that important, I feel like.

But who knows? I don't know. They said during college, though, he was still into doing hair. That's what he wanted to do rather than do his studying and shit. He just wanted to do hair. So eventually he dropped out and got his cosmetology license. Wow. But then he was frustrated with how shitty paying doing hair does.

It really sucks. It's a bad business. You got to pay every month for people to sit in that chair. And I know this for a fact because there is a lot of people in my family in the hair business. My grandfather was a barber. He started cutting hair when he was 13. His brother was 12 standing next to him cutting hair and they both cut hair forever and then i have aunts that own beauty salons so like i know a lot about the hair business and unless you own your own business yep you're not making shit i mean it's it's really

really difficult if you own your own shop you can do okay. Sure. But if you don't, you're in bad times here. So one time he disappears. He takes off, tells his friends he's going to the UP, baby, going to the Upper Peninsula of Michigan, where he's going there to work. He said that he doesn't know what the job is, but it does pay very well. I don't know if lumberjacks needed haircuts or what. But he came back nine days later, though, saying it was the middle of fucking nowhere. It was super boring.

He couldn't take it anymore. And he said one other thing. There are no other gay guys up there. He said there was nobody to talk to, nobody to try to date. He was the gay guy. The gay guy. He's like, there was no potential for something. It was just, well, I'm going to sit in my room at night and not talk to anybody.

Nine days. Nine. Yep. That's it. So he ends up going back to school, this time at the University of Michigan in Flint there. And he's working hair stuff on the sides. And he actually, you know, all sorts of things like that he everybody said he seems to be working toward a good future he's trying to build a following he's trying to do

something he also has some some some dark side to him i guess you could say troubled side we'll say not dark but he has a history of a lot of depression and especially body issues. He's a big guy. He's like 6'2", 6'3", like 280. He's a big, giant guy. He's fucking huge. And at 25, he is bald. I mean, he has lost most of his hair by 25. Wow. It's back to here.

Not a choice. Yeah. No, no, no. It's back to here, and he like dyes what he literally has left in fun colors and shit because he's trying to do something. He does hair, so he wants to look like he, you know. That's what he does. So he has problems with that, obviously, with depression and body image issues. They said that he would self-harm at some points.

They said he would eat his emotions or starve his emotions, either one. He'd be starving and binging. They said he would eat his emotions or starve his emotions. Either one, he'd be starving and binging. They said he would cut himself on his arms and legs and all that sort of thing. His roommate remembers at one point they went to see a star is born in 2018. It's the lady Gaga thing,

right? Uh, is it Bradley Cooper? Yeah, it's lady Cooper. Yeah. Lady Cooper and Bradley Gaga. Bradley Gaga.

Lady Cooper and Bradley Gaga. Bradley Gaga. Lady Cooper. Bradley Gaga. Lady Cooper from Essex. And fucking Bradley Gaga. I like that. So they go to see Bradley Gaga in October 2018 2018 his roommate says that he was out of it after watching the hanging scene she said quote out of it who uh i don't know someone was hanging in the movie i didn't see the fucking movie i have no idea i'm a guy i'm a guy and i like women

so i've never seen a star is born that's there's not a lot of straight guys lining up to watch a star is born i'm just saying that's no offense to anybody but me and jimmy aren't like on the road like let's go see a star is born while we're in fucking minneapolis what do you say yeah yeah free morning for me buddy let's go see it together fucking matinee what do you think yeah come on let's go see bradley gaga he's looking good now so the next day this sucks man the next day kevin bacon overdoses on pills what and has to get his stomach pumped oh my god just really depressed him um according to text messages between the roommate and kevin bacon's mother that's what they figured out

happened about a month a month later his mother ke Bacon's mother, took him back to the hospital after he said he didn't feel safe. So he's having some problems here. In November 2019, he cut himself so many times that his roommate said you couldn't see his skin. Jesus. Just a shower of blood. That's horrible, man. Two weeks later, he checked himself again into a psychiatric treatment center. He does under, he has enough, he's not like Mark, who you have to wrangle up and put somewhere.

He says, I don't like the way I'm feeling. I don't want to feel like this. I need help. You know what I mean? He's trying. And he starts doing things and he goes, Jesus, what the fuck am I doing? And then he goes and sees somebody. And the poor guy, I mean, he's just having a hard time.

A lot of people, a lot of people, it's depression. It's tough. So he said that his friends and his roommates said the part of the way he dealt with depression was by finding guys online to talk to, which is what a lot of people do. It's food, drugs, sex. It's whatever your button that makes you feel better is.

That's what people tend to press here. So they said that, quote, Kevin's biggest thing was he just always wanted to feel loved and never felt accepted by, you know, men and things like that. And I think that's probably why he was always on the dating apps, you know, Tinder and stuff like that. It's actually Grindr is what he's on, not Tinder. Yeah, that is what we'll find out later. But his, I mean, that's not saying that's the gay app. I mean, he's on Grindr. he's yeah that is we'll find out later but his i mean that that's i'm not

saying that's the gay app i mean he's on grinder we know that for a fact so his his relationships are tough his friends say that the men he dated would often psychologically abuse him or at least that's how he took it you know so has a hard time with relationships his roommate described one man who um aggressively accused kevin bacon of cheating and was very abusive about it another another man that seemed to just be using kevin for rides he just didn't have a car yeah wasn't even gay just using him for your rides that's the wrong app sir it's called uber not grind he picked his chick up and he's like what the fuck swing by here pick this chick up quick yeah what's happening here so they said that they were you know he described kevin bacon described these two men to his roommate as quote projects

that bacon would often attract broken men in hopes of fixing them. He's a fixer. Oh, yeah. That's what he is, which is a lot of people of every persuasion. That's what they are. These failed relationships, though, would put him deeper into depression. Right. And that's how it would work here. Exactly. A friend of his said that he, a friend that he used to hang out with, but this woman ended up moving to Chicago,

said he was losing himself because he also had things that he was struggling with now bacon would visit this woman in chicago and they would party in boystown oh which if you don't know boystown right next to wrigley field is the gay area it's like they have you know rainbow crosswalks and yeah it's fucking it's awesome it does feel very safe though that's one thing boy does it doesn't it feel very it feels very safe you see two dudes walking hand in hand eating like you know uh eating the deck really designer cupcakes and shit you're like wow this place is the safest place ever so that's where he would go he'd hang out and he would vow to be i'm gonna move here this is great this is all people are

just like me here awesome but then he would return back home and he would struggle again he would struggle with his finances and he would get depressed and then he would just search for somebody else to fix online and it was a cycle that he would do a friend of his said describe seeing him at his lowest point after a relationship ended. She said twice that fall she had to drive him to the psychiatric hospital. She said, it's hard seeing your friend like that. He was really upset about the relationship. He just wanted so desperately to not feel like that. Yeah.

Which is horrible. So he's working as a hairstylist in a Flint area JCPenney. My God. In 2019? In 2009. This sounds like something that was going on in 1984, doesn't it? Right. You go, they still have those in there?

He's working at the photo center in Sears. It might as well be that. It sounds so. I didn't know they had a hairstylist in JCPenney still. Did you? I'm going to be honest. I didn't know there was a JCPenney still around. That's what I mean. too um so yeah he had recently he's still enrolled at the university

of michigan flint where he had changed his major to psychology recently oh that's good society he was interested in mental health and how to help other people that might be going through the problems he's going through it's also helpful for yourself to figure out what the fuck is going on with me what's wrong in my head and i'll save some money in therapy, maybe. Well, if my teacher is a, if they're licensed, I can just pose things as questions that I might need for the curriculum and get my shit taken care of for free. Tuition, one stone, one stone, babe. So the Kevin Bacon here, he also has several tattoos. He has tattoos. One is a hummingbird in honor of his grandmother who died from cancer.

His sister said they were very close, and she told him about the diagnosis before anybody else. So they were very close. He's got several other tattoos. He's got a lot of tattoos of different things all over his arms and stuff. So Carl Bacon says that his son was proud of who he was as a person. He said, though, he hated being in the suburban slow town of Schwartz Creek. His roommate said, quote, you come here and there's just so much like really outdated. It just felt like we were missing out.

Yeah, they put wood paneling and shit in 2005. Yeah. It's backwards. It's a little behind the times. That's what small towns are. And in this small town, he's a big husky dude with pink hair and a bunch of tattoos. So he stands out huge in this town. They're like, Oh, you mean the gay kid over there? Like they all know him and he stands out a lot uh he sometimes would carry a purse as also he had you know he'd wear like designer clothes at certain times and a little bit of makeup eye makeup here and there like you know he just fucking he stood out in a small town in michigan right you walk around fucking greenwich village like

that nobody will even look twice at you gay guys other gay guys will call you a poser but in small town michigan this is a big deal you know what i mean big deal so he's got the receding hairline that he would dye colors to try to act like he didn't care about it type of deal his friends said everyone knew kevin he's big he's tall and usually had something crazy going on with him. So 2019, though, like we said, horrible, terrible year for him. But he had started by the end of the year to try to turn it around. He's making solid concrete plans to move to Chicago to be closer to his friends and be in a community that fits him more. He's trying to stay on a structured spending plan, but it wasn't easy,

so he's always struggled for money. And that's why he hasn't moved to Chicago yet, just can't afford it. So he's having family problems, his roommate says. His roommate's name is Michelle Myers, and she's a longtime friend of his and roommate. She said that he was upset one day in December after finishing up with work at the salon. He met up with his sister and his mother to do their hair too, and then he learned from them that someone he didn't want to see was coming for dinner. I don't know who that is, but somebody. So he said he didn't want to deal with it, so he got on Grindr to look for a distraction.

They said this is what he did a lot. He said he would like to, you know, he was a young guy who talked to his friends and brag about, you know, I hooked up with this guy and found this cool guy. Guys like to tell sex stories, whether it's with a dude or a chick. They have that gene no matter what. Right, right. You know, that's just a thing we have. If you ever sat with a gay guy long enough, he will tell you a story of a time that he had a one-night stand. Oh, yeah.

Absolutely. If you hang out with a regular guy long enough, regular guy, if you hang out with a straight guy long enough, they'll tell you the same thing. Actually, if you hang out with him for about 15 minutes, he'll probably tell you that story. Or he'll tell you a story about how he fucked his wife like it's surprising. Yeah. Fucking my wife. Great. Wow.

How'd you manage that? I mean, she is legally and religiously bequeathed to me but still i fucked her good so they said that you know that's what he did he used sex to escape his problems like many young people you know do here so he's looking for a date he's scrolling through his phone and they discuss his plans for the evening this is in december um this is like new year's eve or christmas eve type of deal here yeah christmas eve they're talking so they're talking about getting some drinks at a friend's place and he eventually finds a guy who lives nearby on grinder yeah so it's on grinder and

he finds the profile of a 50 year old bearded shirtless man using the name Olicos. Olicos. Which is, that's what means wolf, I guess. Olicos means wolf. So, variation. I'm sure we've gotten 100 tweets until then, between then and now, but there you go. So, that's what he's using. So, he found Mark, is what he found. The online conversation is found later on, okay?

And we have this. Bacon, Kevin Bacon, tells Mark that he's interested in being with multiple men and strangers and being tied up. So he has a, quote, complete loss of control. That's what he's into, which a lot of people are into that sexually, the loss of control thing. So Lutensky responds, I can make that happen. Oh. And then describes a fetish scenario in which Kevin Bacon would be, quote, taken naked and blindfolded and delivered to men for use. Okay.

Okay. And for this to be, Mark tells Bacon that for this to be fulfilling for you, you have to induce a fight or flight response. You have to be panicked to be this said to be that sexually aroused, I guess, is what he's saying. I don't know. So Bacon says, right. I need to be basically helpless. So I'd feel terrified. Yeah.

You want ropes? You got to get some ropes. But this is also all under the umbrella of safety. Safety. Yeah, we're going to do these things that all seem crazy, but it's all under a very umbrella of control. That's, I think, that's not my deal as a BDSM ship, but I believe that's what's going on there. There is an air of danger, but the whole thing is this is completely controlled. This is all controlled and it's fine.

So that's what Bacon says. Then Mark tells Kevin Bacon that he'll be blindfolded and, quote, taken to the place where he'll meet five men for sex. Oh, five. Five. He says, once the scene is over, you are returned, is what Mark says. Bacon says, quote, now just one question you are going to keep me safe right and you know which is a fair question and mark said i will show you how i'm going to transport you and let you determine if i am trustworthy okay so bacon replies with hopping

in the shower and i'll be ready that's a yes that's green light all the way i'm in this seems great so bacon gets ready and leaves in his car shortly after 5 p.m according to his roommate and according to the nest doorbell camera that captured him walking out the door that's what time it was shortly after five so here we go on christmas this is Christmas Eve, mind you, 2019. Wow. This is right before we all thought that, hey, 2020 will be fun or whatever the fuck. This is about two months before everything went back shit. And a few hours before the newborn king is produced. Yeah, that too. So Mark, according to his internet history here, he began looking that morning.

He began looking online for knives at about 730 a.m. He wakes up early on Christmas Eve to look for knives on the internet, which is what we all do over the holidays. In between searches for, quote, lore payment in gold, L-O-R-E, lore payment in gold. I don't know what that means. That may be an online game. Lore payment in gold. I don't know what the fuck that is. And also, quote, sexy Navy male stripper.

Okay. Also another one of his search terms here. Then he searched for daggers butcher knives hunting knives and quote razor sharp knives a total of 56 different searches of knives for different knives wow okay 56 different knife searches sexy male stripper and lore payment in gold he He's having a weird, sexy Navy mail stripper. He's having a weird day. He sure is. So then he finds Kevin Bacon,

which now he's going to fuck Kevin Bacon, of all things. This is so weird. You think he expected Kevin Bacon to show up, really? Kevin Bacon has to use a different picture to keep it low profile, otherwise people will be lined up to bother him. So you never know. Fingers crossed. So they meet up.

We're all great hookups start at the Dollar General on Miller Road in Clayton Township. Mark says that he pulls out a bag of, quote, fetish devices, harnesses, and restraints. This is in the car. He's got a bag of that, yeah. He brought with him and gives Kevin Bacon a minute to decide what he wanted to wear. Pick a nice something out for yourself. Here's wardrobe. Yeah.

Here's wardrobe. Pick yourself out something nice. He said he looked at the Y harness, but it wasn't the right size, Mark said. The Y, yeah. The Y harness. He put on earmuffs and blinders because he was going to an auction as part of his fantasy,

and he put on the leather wrist and ankle straps. So that's what he wanted on. He said otherwise he was naked. Oh my. This is in his van, okay? In Mark's van. If a guy pulls up in a van with a bag of fetish devices, fucking get in your car and run.

Jesus Christ. Have you learned nothing? He's got a Y harness in a duffel bag. Get the fuck out of there. Holy shit. And that's the least of the weird shit in there. So he's naked except for the things I just described. Mark gives Bacon two blankets to stay warm back there and, you know, to lean on,

takes Bacon's phone, clothes, money, cards, and other personal items, and locks them in Bacon's car so he has them for later. You know, we're going to go to a fucking auction. There's going to be five guys all over. You can't have your personal effects floating around. Someone could steal it. You could get lost. So before all this, Bacon asked to text his friend he goes let me text my friend and tell him i'm okay before i before we put my phone away this this is 6 12 p.m he texts michelle myers

who's his roommate he says quote i'm going to be out for a while actually because he said i'll go there i'll see what's up i'll text you and let you know if it's cool or not or if I'll meet up with you later on. He says, I'm going to be out for a while anyway. Or actually, this is going to be fun. He's inviting more friends. Merry Dickmas. I'm not sure when I'll be back. Probably will be out late.

So if mom calls you, I'm sleeping. Ha ha. gay guys have the most fun merry dickmas everybody he's very dickmas more friends am I allowed to have that as a title of an episode on a podcast at merry dickmas can I have that I think so you know what I think we might have to try because that is the greatest funniest shit i've ever heard my no that's probably standard gay guys like of course we always say that that's how we greet each i don't know but fuck man that's hilarious i love it so merry dickmas lots of dicks so dickmas morning now comes around. And Carl Bacon, back to Carl Bacon, he's expecting Kevin to come over for breakfast on Christmas at 9 a.m.

But he never shows up that morning. Which, I mean, if he's had a good enough night, maybe that'll explain it. Carl said he was concerned when he doesn't hear from Kevin and Kevin doesn't answer his phone all day long, though, and on Christmas yeah and so he calls the police at 5 p.m. on Christmas so Carl Bacon met with the police and later they found his son's car in the parking lot of the plaza near a family dollar here inside the car they found his his phone, wallet, clothes, all this shit. They're like, well, that's weird. It's not normal, not what they expected. So Christmas Day, on the other side, Mark's Christmas Day, Jamie invites Mark over. Ex-husband Jamie invites Mark over for Christmas Day.

He said that the Mark's – Jamie said the last time I saw Mark was on December 25th. He said that now Jamie Arnold was with another guy Christmas Eve. He had a friend over, so he definitely didn't see Mark Christmas Eve. Merry Dickmas and all, you know. So he says about Christmas Day, quote, I had some friends over and I didn't want him to be alone on Christmas. When you love someone, you don't just stop caring about them. He came over late in the afternoon and his behavior was normal as normal as he can be anyway so absolutely so the next day december 26th you know it is christmas we got to let the

cops are like we'll hit it hard tomorrow but not really today give it a shot on 26 we found his car that's enough for now. We gave you a gift. There you go. Here he is. So that day, the police, they're still looking for him. Search parties are looking in the area of the Sports Creek Raceway. So there's search parties. His friends are looking. December 27th, they can't find Kevin Bacon. His friends are searching fields and wooded areas. That's where we've come to now.

Then the police find Kevin Bacon's Grindr account. Finally, they get into his Grindr account. It takes days, by the way. Carl Bacon was pissed at Grindr. Really? He was fucking mad because they weren't helpful, he said. I don't know if they were or not, but he said they weren't. So Detective Kaiser, or Lieutenant Kaiser, said,

I believe the conversations contained the things they wanted to have happen. I don't know exactly what acts were discussed, but I know they were sexual in nature. We know, and they were. Grindr. Grindr. So the Michigan, December 28th, Michigan State Police receive a call for assistance from the Clayton Township Police to conduct a welfare check on Kevin Bacon, who was thought to be in Mark Lutensky's house on December 24th.

So the Michigan State Police, the Clayton Township Police, they all head to Mark's house. Yeah. They knock on the door. He opens it. Oh. Wearing what, Jimmy?immy oh wow nothing but a leather kilt oh just that he got the kilt back that's all he's wearing yeah big beard 50 years old nothing but a leather kilt gentlemen yeah can i help you welcome welcome uh they said he didn't

appear nervous he appeared calm as can be they said do you mind if we come in and look around? We're looking for somebody that we think might be here. And he says, sure, come on in. Come on. No problem. Welcome. According to police, Michigan State Police Lieutenant Dave Kaiser, quote, true troopers. Sorry, I was going to say something completely different.

Troopers check the upstairs. They check the main floor and they check the basement. When they're checking the basement, they find a hidden room in the basement. Uh-oh. With a four-inch thick door and protected tamper-proof lights and all that shit. Yeah. Yeah. Michigan State Police Trooper Robert Viviano said that he was the one to find Kevin.

Viviano said that he was the one to find Kevin. He described finding a disguised room, opening the door. And he said, I immediately pulled my head back and exclaimed, Oh my God. Oh my God. We got it.

That's when officer Wurtz asked what was wrong. And I told him to look, couldn't even tell him that's when something's really bad. You just go look. That's how it is wow there in the room bacon was found hanging from the ceiling by a rope upside down naked oh no okay um fucking unbelievable hanging from here. So they go upstairs after finding that and go, Hey Mark, um, yeah. Mind if we sit down? Maybe a cup of coffee. Let's have a, we found it.

We found a guy. We need to have something here. So he said, there's a, um, guy down there. Do you know, is that, do you notice that? Probably I would assume. Um, so they said, yeah, that Lutensky said, Lutensky said? Probably, I would assume. So they said, yeah. Lutensky said, yeah, I'll talk. Sure, no problem.

Let me tell you what happened. Yeah, totally normal. He said, well, there was never any men waiting at my house to fulfill Kevin Bacon's fantasy, but he said, I role-played like there was. He said he thought that's what they were doing the whole time. Bacon didn't really expect five guys to be there at an auction. That's just the fantasy. They don't. Yeah. It's a fantasy thing. So he said bacon remained blindfolded during the fetish play, as he wasn't sure mark was about how long the sexual

portion of the night lasted but they had some sex down there i mean enough to simulate five guys so yeah that's a lot he said though when it was over with he said that kevin bacon told him to kill him he said he wanted he told me to kill him. Yeah. So Mark said, rather than go, no, you're crazy. I just met you. Go home. He said, quote, we made an agreement.

He was supposed to disappear, be gone. What the fuck? It's all agreed upon. No, it's fine. We agreed upon. This is totally cool. Just wait for him to go home. Yeah.

Mark said that Bacon's been suicidal in the past. And he said that Bacon told him he could never quite pull it off. So he said, I would help him disappear. Okay. He said they were laying on the ground. Mark and Bacon explained how he'd been suicidal. Mark said Bacon explained how they'd been suicidal in the past, and the discussion began about how he could make Bacon's body disappear. Okay. pass and the discussion began about how he could make bacon's body disappear so mark said he just walked upstairs grabbed a gerber brand hunting knife with a four and three quarter inch fixed

blade that he purchased from walmart that day by the way yeah just hours earlier um bacon said according to mark quote i'm ready and first mark stabbed Bacon in the back of the neck just below the hairline, he said. But he was still alive. And so he was like, oh, no, I don't want him to suffer. So he realized he wasn't dead. So not wanting him to suffer, he slits his throat. Oh, boy. With a hunting knife.

He said, and quote, and this is a quote from Mark. You don't need to take that in for a second. It gets worse, everybody. Quote, and then, of course, it was a matter of doing what I needed to do to complete what I told him I would do, turn him into something that would produce life. He tied Bacon's ankles with the ropes, fed them through a system of pulleys that he had rigged up and then lifted him and used bodybuilding weights to suspend him in the air

wow because he needed a way down on that he suspended bacon's body upside down from the ceiling to let the blood drain out you you know, like a deer. Right. He said it under him was a dirt with an open dirt under an open trap door. Basically, in his basement is a trap door that goes to the dirt outside. He dripped it onto the dirt so that, wow, it was set up this way on purpose so he could do this so that the blood could, quote, fertilize the plants outside the house. Unbelievable. Yeah. But he's not done yet.

Right. He then, wow, okay, he went upstairs and he saw that in his words it was a, quote, new moon. Oh, yeah. It was a whole new moon. Yeah. Okay. It's dark out so he goes down and he cuts open kevin bacon scrotum and removes his testicles okay removes them and

takes them upstairs with him he then pulls out a frying pan and cooks them up. He even took, by the way, a photo of this. Really? Yes. Later on, forensic analysis will find Kevin Bacon's DNA in the skillet. Oh, Jesus. So he's not lying at all. And Lutensky's on the handle.

He ate them. He cooked them up. Okay. Bringing a guy back, eating things. This is a very Domery story, no? Is this? Yeah. He cooked them up and ate them.

He says to the police, which they said you ate his testicles. And he said, quote, yeah, I eat Rocky Mountain oysters anyway. Jesus. It was really very simple. You slice them thin, you saute them with some Worcestershire sauce, and once they're done, you just eat them. You slice them thin? Like a...

Ah! Every guy out there just went, oh, God! Yeah. You slice them thin like garlic like garlic yes and then saute them apparently with worcestershire sauce this guy has a fucking recipe for balls that he uses and says like oh yeah you just do that it's all the time so they said based on the information from the medical examiner bacon died before he was hung by his ankles anyway. Then they found the murder weapon, the knife, in a dresser drawer of Mark's there. The forensic analysis found that DNA matched to Kevin Bacon and Mark.

I'm sorry. Yeah, Kevin Bacon and Mark. Their DNA was on the handle. They said 470 trillion times more likely the DNA on the swabs from the handle of the knife came from Mark than anyone else on Earth. 470 trillion times. To one. To one. There's only almost 7 billion people, so that's not good odds for him.

Weird shit. So the forensic pathologist said the cause of death was blood loss due to sharp force injuries to the neck. So that was the stabbing and cutting. Just the two? Just the two. Oh, my God. Toxicology reports showed an antidepressant in Kevin's bloodstream. So he was taking medication, and that's how that goes.

They found out that that night, when they looked through Mark's phone, that night at 2.15 a.m., Christmas morning, 2.15 a.m., Mark had texted James Carlson. Remember James Carlson? Yeah, the guy that ran away. The guy that ran away, not the leather skirt guy, the other guy. He said he texted him and he said, quote, I killed Kevin Bacon. Kevin Bacon is my heros, which heros, I guess, H-E-R-O-S, that's what cannibals call their victims, apparently. But he didn't say, I met this dude.

He said, I killed Kevin Bacon and ate him. You would never take that serious. You'd never say this. I killed Jeremy Irons and ate him. It could be anybody. Just pick a fucking name out of a hat. I ate him. It could be anybody. Just pick a fucking name out of a hat. I ate him. It's very weird.

The message was accompanied by a photo of the testicles cooking in the skillet. That's not enough. That will never raise alarms. No. They said if Carlson had believed that Mark had killed and cooked the portion of a person they said he obviously didn't believe him he said quote i hope you enjoy them and then switched subjects and said can i see more pics of my room oh like the basement because he likes it he wants to show people the stuff in the basement that this guy set up this awesome like

you know bondage center my fuck down just acts like he's just people the stuff in the basement that this guy set up this awesome, like, you know, bondage center. My fuck down. Just acts like he's just kidding. Eating shit in the middle of the night. Doesn't care. So then he said that this is even worse. He tells the police that, yeah, the agreement with Kevin Bacon was I'd kill him and I'd utilize his body. He said he would use his bone meal to plant tulips, his intestines to grow chestnuts in, or peach pits, either one, depending on what he's into at the time.

And he would use his muscles to make beef jerky, or Kevin Bacon jerky. Making bacon. And the U.S. Postal Service intercepted a package from Mark containing a dehydrator right after the murder. Yeah, he bought a fucking dehydrator. He was gonna do it. He was going to do all of what we just said. He was gonna absolutely do all of that. That was his plan.

He's not lying. It's exactly what he was gonna do. He bought a dehydrator. It was on the way. I think it's 1996. He just jumped on Amazon and was like dehydrate, which he's lucky because in just a few months, you couldn't even get a dehydrator. Couldn't get anything. Because they were all bread machine, dehydrate.

Everybody bought it all up. So he's ahead of the game. Yeah. So he's arrested, obviously. Clearly, Mark's arrested. The Kevin Bacon's father, Carl, said the police have definitely identified who he is. They've dealt with him in the past. And this is the same person they arrested on site.

And he has not left their custody at all. Wow. Obviously not. He's, Mark's appointed a public defender. The county prosecutor says this is a case that should have only existed in the pages of a horror book. Pages of a horror book? What does that mean? What are you, 112 years old?

In the pages of a horror book like what are you talking about this shouldn't happen except on netflix that's what oh that mary shelly should have wrote this like shut up neighbors here are freaked the fuck out as you can imagine the michigan state police clear the scene about 3 15 p.m on december 28th neighbors say they're shaken that something like this could happen in their small community of morris oh that's right from the paper can you imagine here is here's mark's neighbor art turner he says you hear a lot of rumors what was done and this and that and you think that couldn't happen but now we're finding out it did happen i can't even imagine anybody doing something like that well you better wow and pauline his wife also

says yeah it's crazy they said that they first heard the police arrive the troopers then came to their door to ask questions regarding the resident of you know whoever lives there mark and art turner said quote it's a messed up. It's been a fiasco all day. Damn traffic's been backed up for miles. Mailman didn't even come today. This is ridiculous. Goddamn I-69 loaded with SWAT teams. This is silly, damn it.

His other neighbor, Michael Park, said that he's seen odd behavior before. He said he knew about the leather kilt blood on the face thing. He saw that. He said, quote, we're all just farmers and deer hunters, so it's quiet. We moved from Atlanta, and I thought we were going to get away from crowds and all this kind of stuff. But I guess you never know who your neighbors are. That's a good point, sir. You can't move away from crime.

No. It happens everywhere. It's just you can't move. You can move away from odds of crime. You win you can move away from a specific event yeah somewhere people's heads are always going to be chopped off somewhere so yeah another guy named derek who lives by he said that he was disturbed by the cannibalism detail he said quote now that part's disgusting that's nasty yeah then he says and this is after they said what did you think of the cannibalism? I'm going to read this quote.

Now that part's disturbing. That's nasty. He's a little nuts. Now, come on, man. Think about what you're saying. A lot more nuts now. For just one second. Fuck.

You ate him, sir. He's a little nuts. Like he knew what was happening and he just said hey yeah come on in and look around like there's nothing wrong so obviously carl bacon is upset he said that his son passed away sometime late christmas eve early christmas morning he said the medical examiner is not sure of the exact time of as of right now we know it was before two something because that's when he sent the fry frying pan text to james carlson so it was before that they said that they're they hope their son's story will help others as new details have been released about what happened there he said carl said he obviously got into something he wasn't prepared

for we all make mistakes it's gut-wrenching to hear the details and we're just beside ourselves yeah yeah carl goes on to say what was released today shows kevin had a dark side it was a dark side he's just into sexual shit for those for those who knew and loved kevin did not know that side those who knew him knew his good side he loved and cherished everyone he touched and touched and he touched a lot of the lives in his past during his short life it's not a bad side that he likes to leave and it was no matter which way you come you should be able to do it safely that's all well it doesn't make you a bad person you know i'm saying that's the thing it's oh that was his good side bad side it's a good side bad side i mean he had a he had a bad side and that's why he was hung upside down and his nuts chopped off that's not it's not his fault for christ's sake damn uh the roommate michelle myers said quote there should have been further investigation there should have

been further follow-up just some basic police work and some basic follow-up i think could have changed this whole situation and mr bacon might still be alive she said how come mark wasn't questioned then when the guys were running away from his house with kilts is it because it's just gay guys doing stuff in the basement and then she says what would have happened if it was a girl chained up in the basement and ran out of there even if she said don't worry about it the police probably would have investigated it more maybe probably yeah yeah i would assume so but that's like we're in the domers thing again and also it's a small town and it's you know who knows so jamie arnold the ex-husband here who dodged a real bullet here he said quote i don't believe it was premeditated i think it was like

i said a hookup that went wrong that went terribly terribly wrong never in a million years i think he'd be capable of doing such a horrendous crime. He says that he never thought Mark was could seriously harm or kill anybody. And he said that since then he has involved in it and he helped lower the guy here and all that kind of shit. If he was not capable of this and it's not premeditated, why did he just buy a knife? That's what I mean. He bought a knife that day. He was thinking of something. So Jamie says, in hindsight, it's easy to sit back and speculate at the time. But at the time you're going through it, there are emotions and feelings involved.

You don't want to think that the person you fell in love with is some crazy homicidal maniac. I pray that God is there for Kevin Bacon's family in their time of need and that he helps us all get through this one day at a time. I wish Carl hadn't done this. Every time. I know. Every time he says it. It's impossible to take it serious. God damn it, Carl.

Kevin Bacon. There was roommates. Okay. Or an article. time you say it's like take it serious god damn it kevin bacon it's there was roommates okay or an article i can't remember what it was like a major paper that says man eats kevin bacon man kills and eats kevin bacon and you click on and it's obviously not that kevin bacon wasn't there a rumor around this time that kevin bacon was dead wasn't there an internet thing did that come from this it had to because i remember remember something about Kevin Bacon's dead and he had to come out and go, I'm not dead. I'm here.

It's got to be that. It had to be from this, right? There's no other reason. It was another guy named Kevin Bacon. I'm pretty sure it was. So the roommate, Michelle, said, I'm just in shock about the whole thing. It's just hard to process right now. She says I was, I think, the last person to see him alive that he knew before this guy.

Now, how common is this, by the way? What? Cannibalism. Oh. Let's talk about that. Cannibalistic homicides accounted for only.01% of all killings tracked in the U.S. between 1960 and 2018. How many? .01%.

Very rare. Holy. That's how rare it is to fucking want to eat somebody. I thought it was more common than that. I've heard of it so many times. Well, we've heard of it several times on this show and with Jeffrey Dahmer because it tends to stand out when it happens because it's that much. It's that rare. That's why we freak out about it.

How many murders happen? It's crazy there's a research study named kin avoidance and cannibalistic homicide and there's also a fringe community of the sexual people this is a sex fetish expert named katherine gates who's probably totally vanilla i bet missionary only get the fuck out of here. Never puts it in her mouth. Never. Quote, there are people who want to be the meat, and they call themselves meat boys and meat girls. Okay.

So this is a whole society here that goes on. She said she's researched all this stuff, including BDSM, cannibalism, furries, the whole deal. She says, and then there's the ones who want to do the cooking and eating. They would be man-eaters and woman-eaters. So there's a whole thing here. She says, often in order to make the chat more exciting, people will try and make it feel realer by introducing realistic details so they can get more of a jolt and more arousal.

But the person who wants to do this for real is someone who's mentally ill yeah clearly um she this gates runs a website called kinkmap.com and also wrote a book in 1999 called deviant desires based on her unscientific anthropological exploration of niche kink subcultures and cannibalism play um she said even if it sounds real so she knows her kink she's been around it yeah she wouldn't explore she knows her shit she says no matter how real it sounds it's almost always a fairy tale type thing version she said people have all sorts of far-out fantasies that they want to explore and have no intention of doing for real they don't actually want to eat somebody's penis because it wouldn't taste very good but they like the idea it wouldn't taste good i don't know i mean you could probably see you can season anything to

taste i've had terrible meat that you see that motherfucker i'll bet it's delicious on the taco fuck yeah some cocktail sauce on it i'll eat it. Tempura, I would say. Yeah. I would say penis tempura would be the best. That way it's delicate. Rice, I'll try it. Yeah, it's delicate, I feel like. Dip it in soy sauce.

Oh, man. So Gates said that. That's terrible. Gates says that the cannibal fantasy is a quote very particular flavor of bdsm which particular flavor she said that's why i said that she said particular flavor it's a little nuts we know that um she says that for the meat the excitement is being the center of attention the object of desire to submitting yeah so yeah it's being a fucking you know you being the center of attention, the object of desire to submitting. Yeah. Yeah, it's being a fucking, you know, a submissive person. You're the star of the show, yeah.

Exactly, exactly. They said, obviously, this is not normal that they're going to do it, but 99% of the cannibal fantasy that plays out online rather than, you know, it's kind of plays out online rather than in person because it's kind of a secret thing. She said she rarely meets, has met cannibal fetishists who cross into reality, although she says that she did have an interview subject who asked repeatedly to be prepared and eaten by Gates and her friends at a dinner party. She said, quote, Those people are mentally unwell in general. And this is just a manifestation of that. The way they're taking this to the extreme, they take things to the extreme that makes a lot of sense and um a marlies oostland who's a

neuroscientist researcher and professor conducted a 2020 published study called the kin avoidance and cannibalistic homicide with neuroscientist michael brecht and they studied actual people who actually wanted to eat people and wanted to be eaten the research looked at 121 cannibals identified since 1900 and their 631 victims yeah the study did not include cannibals who ate humans based on cultural norms like a religious ritual or you know some sort of you know papa new guinea just the ones that whatever or or for survival also the donner party or the the other ones like that too said instead their work focused on people such as german computer repair technician armin miu miu miwes who severed his willing victim's penis which they attempted to eat together while the victim was still alive. Oh, my God.

Holy shit. I didn't need to know that happened. Take this and make this for us. Oh, my God. They said when he died, this guy continued to eat other portions of his body. Wow. The research looked at whether cannibals are less likely to eat their relatives, which it appears they are less likely to eat their relatives, but also revealed other data related to cannibalism.

So you're more likely to kill a relative but less likely to eat them. That's interesting. That's some knowledge. Cannibals are more often older men, victims more frequently younger women and men who wants old stringy meat, I guess. I don't want to be bad. I want it fresh. Yeah, they said a lot of cannibalistic homicides were sexual in nature whether before or after the killing just like dahmer we find sex or rape involvement in quite a lot of cannibalistic homicides we also found that victims were mostly

strangers or unrelated acquaintances one more thing that we noticed was that quite interestingly actually is the weapon of choice they said cannibals likely using knives. They're often compelled by what's began as a fetish focused on eating the meat. They said quite a lot say they didn't necessarily want to kill, but they had this dream of eating meat of their victim, and the only way to eat the meat of the victim usually is to kill them. Right. Yeah.

So they said, I think it's very clear that any offender of cannibalistic homicide has some kind of mental illness regardless of how we define that illness yeah she said sometimes they really prepare a special meal with it they get a special wine to accompany the meat from the victim and they have a fancy dinner for themselves real silence of the lamb style here all gross shit yep. Sometimes they sent it to, for instance, neighbors who were completely unaware where this meat was coming from. That's so fucked up. If you want it, you do it. Don't leave me the fuck out of it.

Yeah. Hey, look what I made. Fuck. Genitals were the third most popular body part to be consumed. Well, they don't say what the top two are. Yeah. Heart, probably. I bet it's a bicep.

Bicep, ass muscle, the ass, and a dick. This woman, Oostland's a vegetarian. She says there's not much of a distinctive taste that distinguishes human meat from other popular animal meat, according to accounts reviewed by people. On numerous occasions,

human meat was sold and probably eaten by cannibals as ostrich pork horse or tenderloin mostly without any customer complaints reported nobody has this happened in the world yep while people are repulsed they said the revulsion is accompanied by fascination you're listening to this still right it's fascinating yeah and because cultures fix on it jeffrey dommer albert fish the donner party we're still everyone knows who these people are still you know what i mean fucking the uh alive the andy's that alive movie where they had the soccer team or whatever had to eat people and hannibal lecter all that shit she says we believe that this fascination goes beyond a simple

interest in the exotic unusual or the. The discovery of an apparent connection between cannibalism and sex suggests possible reasons for this fascination. I mean, I still get goosebumps talking about this. I'm trying to have happier conversations at parties, though. I'm trying to be much easier to deal with in public, but it's real hard. I know too much. You're at a party, everyone's got a drink in their hand, and someone walks up to you and they go, do you know the

penis is the third most consumed body part by sexually motivated cannibals? You're probably going to have someone walk away from you unless they're one of us. Unless it's me or Jimmy or somebody. Then they'll be like, for real? Tell me more. What are the other two? Mark's attorney here asked the judge to add a charge. You know how there'll be a long list of charges that the jury can choose from?

Add a charge of assisting a suicide to it. Oh. Because he wanted it. Because that's what he wanted. Yeah. Wow. That's pretty interesting. They said the defendants cannot add charges on, so the judge denied his request.

In court, during his arraraignment he uses his aliases his aliases here on advice on his felony advice rights form he signed with the olikos alias okay that's the gay escort profile then at the arraignment though the judge said sir are you mr latinsky latinsky whatever he said quote no oh my name is edgar thomas hill welcome mark latinsky is my nephew what huh where the fuck did that come from my nephew fascinating choice what the fuck are you talking about he gave the name edgar thomas hill there and to his attorney say he then says that i'm edgar thomas hill i'm part of the thomas clan of wales oh and was given the lutinsky moniker as protection that's what he told his lawyer who his lawyer then turns to the judge and goes, dude, he says, quote, because he turns as Lutensky turns to him, says this.

And then his lawyer turns to the judge and says, quote, he believes he's named someone else. He believes he's a he's from a royal family out of Wales, from the Thomas clan. And just the nature of the crime itself, what he did and how he did it. And that has come out just by the nature. As an attorney, I have to send him for an evaluation. I don't know. He's out of his fucking mind, clearly. I mean, the first thing in the charges is the name.

That's it. Yeah. And he's got three different ones. We can't even agree that. Yeah. No. So he does that. They said, though, the his attorney says he's been

very cooperative and very polite i mean he's you know he's doing that but he also really seems to believe the grandiose stories he's telling people that's the thing so the judge orders a competency test he's sent to the center for forensic psychiatry to determine if he's competent to stand trial if he's competent then they're to set up a conduct a criminal responsibility test, which will test if he was competent at the time of the crime. You have to get him competent now to get him into the court to see if you can figure out if he was competent then. Wow. So they said the defense said we are alleging that maybe at the time of this offense he was criminally insane.

They said it'll probably be a 60 to 90 day process they said the forensic center's pretty backed up right now so there's a delay in getting people down there to get evaluated so yeah they and there's a disease ravaging the planet so that's the other thing that's happening right now well that wasn't quite yet no this is like when is this like two weeks from now this app happens. This is in like February? This is early February. Oh, wow. Early February. They're really speedy trial. Right before that.

So, well, this is his arraignment. They can't figure that part out, never mind a trial. So they said once his evaluation is scheduled, the county jail will transport him and he'll be scheduled, whatever. So they said it can take 30 days to get a report. If he's found not competent, he's going to be hospitalized and treated until he's deemed competent. Carl Bacon says he feels like Mark is playing the mental health card. Okay.

I mean. Quote, unquote. Some people are crazy. Yeah. I get, too. You want to punish the guy. I totally get that. But, yeah, some people are crazy.

I can't imagine what the guy's going through. They said that, quote, he's used the mental health card to get out of situations in the past, and he's attempting to use it again. I would like to see him locked up for the rest of his life in some form or another. That's totally fair. Completely understandable. The prosecutor said that he's seen his share of homicides and dismemberment cases in 35. I'm sorry, the lieutenant said that. I've seen some stuff in 35 years in the police department,

but I've never seen cannibalism quite like this before. He said that he suggested those using dating apps have meetings in public places and keep their friends apprised of their whereabouts. You know, like every time anyone's had a blind date since the beginning of fucking time. You should still do that still still. Have some safety. Somewhere with all. Yes.

He also said that it would be better off here if people were, not only people, but society, everybody was more comfortable with sexuality shit. He said it doesn't matter if you're straight, gay, bisexual, it's 2020, and it's okay. In the society we live in, in this culture nowadays, you can tell

somebody, let somebody know where you're going. At least somebody let them this culture nowadays you can tell somebody let somebody know where you're going at least somebody let them know which he did he let somebody know where he was going it didn't help any that you know still got killed so the funeral there's not a lot he has no money his parents don't have a lot of money it's kind of tough but jeffree star the makeup guy on youtube heard what a big fan he was i guess guess he had tattoos that were referencing Jeffrey Starr stuff. So he hears all about this, and his sister, Kevin Bacon's sister, set up a GoFundMe page, and Jeffrey Starr donated $20,000 to it for a funeral. They end up raising $36,000.

Oh, Jesus. Now, Kevin Bacon, he got robbed by Bernie Madoff, so you can't expect money from him. But Kevin Bacon did tweet, actually. He did tweet, for obvious reasons, I'm thinking this morning about the friends and family of this young person, Kevin Bacon. He said his life was taken from him much too soon.

His love was hairdressing. I bet he would have done a great job on this mess on my head. R.I.P. K.B. I'm devastated to hear of the passing of someone from Michigan who lived their life fearlessly and was taken too soon. So that's nice. Bacon's parents said they were overwhelmed by the support that came from the community. People actually were supportive. And they said it was amazing.

Wendy Walters, a friend of his, said, his dancing, his sassiness, and his love for makeup and hair, and how good of a stylist he was. I'm just going to love everything about him. I just miss him, which makes sense. Yeah. And Bacon's parents, Carl, said, when you use these apps, just let other people know

who you're meeting and where you're going to be at so you have a safety net behind you. And he says, my son was a real good person. He was compassionate, cared for the people he met, cared for the people he worked with, and he loved. So they now find out the cops are investigating the other instances of the guys running away with the kilt, all that sort of thing. running away with the kilt, all that sort of thing. And they're also, they want to check around to make sure that there are no missing people, if maybe he hasn't done this and actually ate somebody and grinded them up and do all that shit. And they also found on rentmen.com, it appears to be attached to nude photos of Mark and

the Olicos alias, if you, in a Google image search of the name. Rentmen.com. Rent.men it is. Oh, boy. Rent.men. In jail, waiting to go to the mental place here, he is found unresponsive in his cell after not eating. Oh, just plain possum?

Well, we don't know. He didn't eat. He was treated and taken to a hospital as a precaution he was returned to his cell a short time later they had they say he hasn't been eating since he came through here but they didn't characterize it as a hunger strike just was being weird so um yeah jamie arnold he said he left the area and he said i had to get out of there it was dangerous situation because people were accusing him of being an accomplice and yelling at him in the street and shit like that. So his

defense attorney tells the Detroit Free Press that a physician has found Mark incompetent to stand trial. What? So the district of court, the district of court, the district of court, the district

court judge agreed to accept the recommendation and referred him to another institution. And they said what that means is everything's on hold in regards to the trial while he gets treatment. If he is deemed competent in the next 15 months, then he'll proceed to trial. They said they were going to try to restore him to competency within 15 months. That's the treatment. Okay. That's a magical date that they put up there. Fingers crossed.

June of 2020, James Carlson sues Mark. Oh? Yes. They said, quote, Mark Latunsky must answer for the heinous acts committed against our client. Mr. Carlson deserves justice for the trauma he endured, an experience that will haunt him for the rest of his life. They're suing him for $75,000 for negligence and gross negligence, assault, battery, intentional infliction of emotional distress, false imprisonment, and damages. Okay, and I'm on his side, and I think he deserves it. But, dude, you can't wait this long.

You've been texting him, asking for pictures of the torture room. What are you talking about? You can't do this now. Yeah. This is eventually dismissed about a month after this. They said that the motion to withdraw was filed as cited a breakdown in the attorney-client relationship to the point where further representation of plaintiff James Carlson is no longer possible. So it eventually gets dismissed without prejudice, which means that Carlson has the right to refile the lawsuit with the same claims in the future if he chooses.

So the house, 703 Tyrell here, West Tyrell, it's auctioned off. Oh, really? And it is sold, because it's a hot housing market after that, and it still is now. It is sold at auction for more than $20,000 over the asking price. Wow. Okay. Now, it had four bidders here come to the courthouse to put their offers in.

The Sheriff's Sergeant Douglas Chapman told the police the highest bid came in at $101,733.28, which is $21,001 over the minimum asking price. So, yeah, that was, I guess, originally purchased for $80,000 in May of 2001 and had a market value, they said, of about $93,000. Jesus. Now, the guy who buys the house comes forward. His name is Alex Deal. And he says that this house, he bought the house, but it ended up in a legal entanglement that leads to its return to the family,

the Latensky family. He bought it, and he said it was a horror scene when he went in there. He said, quote, I had to clean up human remains. Yes. That's what he said. He said it was a horror scene when he went in there. He said, quote, I had to clean up human remains. Yes. That's what he said. So he took the body but left like all the blood and all that stuff. I don't know.

Yeah. Well, it gets more than that. He recounted in the five months he spent living in the house, he bought the home in February 2020. He said in the five months living in the house, the disturbing things he saw. He said the intricate design and how specific things were of the basement. That's creepy. He said that he provided chilling details of what he found. He said specifically there was a lot.

And he had a hard time talking about it. He said the basement, the den, the master bedroom, the kitchen, specifically the dishwasher. What? He said he'll never forget what he saw in that dishwasher. Quote, three sets of dishes with human remains on them, and all three sets are in the dishwasher, and the dishwasher never had electricity to it. It was brand new.

It still had the plastic in front of it. Why did they just leave it in there? They just left it. Oh, no, the crime scenes, you have to pay to get those cleaned yourself if you own a house. The cops, they don't pay to clean that up. So they just take pictures of it and leave it?

There's whole businesses that are specifically to clean up crime scenes like that for people. And they said, well, why the fuck did you want to buy that house? And he said, I bought the object, not the subject. Simple real estate transaction. Houses don't kill people. It's not the house's fault that house and he said i bought the object not the subject simple real estate transaction houses don't kill people it's not the house's fault is what he said but he said he owned it until july 2020 when the family the latunsky family regained possession of it he said

i never sold the home back mark bought his crime scene back he bought it back but But how? I don't know how that happened. September 2022, out of nowhere and against the vehement advice of his attorneys, Mark says he's pleading guilty to first-degree murder. Doesn't care. Mary Chartier, one of his lawyers, said she believed a jury trial would have ended with definitely a different result and probably putting him in a hospital, I assume here. So she said, well, the outcome, while it's not an outcome that Mr. Krause and I, that's the other lawyer, think is in his best interest, we do have to follow his wishes. He is the client. We have discussed this matter and consistently he's been very clear more than once, multiple times on his choice and reasoning. They said that I um, I'm glad we got the plea is what the prosecutor said. Now they don't have to go through this whole trial.

So the investigators after the guilty plea, they, one detective says that the crime scene was the worst thing he's ever seen in his entire career. Uh, they said that, uh, one Michigan state police detective said, I'm pretty surprised that he, you know, admitted guilt to begin with and then pled guilty. He said, I quote, I had not seen anybody in person located in that manner that Kevin was found. So it was definitely not something I would normally respond to talking about seeing the body like that. He was pretty reserved, pretty stoic, not a lot of emotion, short answers talking about Mark. He said what happens at the degree hearing is that the judge will make a finding of whether it's first or second degree murder or manslaughter.

It's open murder in Michigan. And then later on, they decide what what degree of murder it is. That's what they call it. Open murder. They believe there's a strong case for first degree murder, which can carry life without parole. The prosecutor said it was really gruesome and horrific. I guess they're the words that come to mind. I guess fucking so.

They said this is the first time in the entire county's history that someone's pled guilty to open murder. Just not knowing what you're even going to be charged with. Just guilty to whatever you say. Nobody's ever said, I'll take whatever. Yeah, you don't do something and then go bill me whatever later. That's not what you do. Send it to the house. Shit.

The sentencing comes around. Pamela Bacon, mom, says, quote, In your sick, twisted mind, you probably don't think you did anything wrong. But in reality, you took our world away. This Christmas, I hope you suffer like we have because you won't be able to be with your family. I hope you feel pain as you are all alone with all these years to come. His attorney, though, Mark's attorney, Mary Chartier,

said, quote, it sounds like fartier, said, quote, Mr. Lutensky is remorseful and truly regrets his actions. He knows that he cannot turn back the clock and he certainly cannot bring Mr. Bacon back to life. The prosecutor said, I tried to think of a word for this murder. What came to my mind is pure evil and the ripple effect it had on the family, the friends of Kevin, the court staff, my staff, and anyone who has read this horrific story. And the judge says, to Mr. Bacon's family, I know nothing can ease your suffering and I know that the weight of

your pain is without measure. But it's my hope that perhaps today's sentence will be a small amount of comfort in what I know is an enormity of hurt. You, sir, may fuck off life without parole. Yeah. And a concurrent term of 11 months for dismemberment and mutilation of a dead body. For eating the nuts. Just in case. Yeah.

Deal with that. Yep. Emily, his ex-wife, Mark's ex-wife, said, quote, my son didn't even want to wear his varsity jacket at a college event because it had the last name on it. Oh, Jesus. Yep. And she said she has to remind her kids that mental illness changes her father. It doesn't change the way he felt about them. She said this is not who their dad was.

He absolutely loved them. The person he was then would be horrified at the person he is now. And I make sure they know it's still okay to love him because that's who they knew. He was their dad. Kevin Bacon's family, a mess. Kevin Bacon's mother said, because of this, we got a divorce. We just couldn't move past it. Ah, that's fucking horrible.

That's terrible. That really sucks. The worst. Yeah, that's so fucking bad. Carl Bacon said, my only thought was going back to the day he was born. That's the only thing I could think of, looking at him in my hands. I was the second person to hold him after his mother, just holding him in my hands,

and it was the only thing I could think about. Now that's no longer. Pamela, mom, said he would want everybody to move forward and do what they had to do for their goals and dreams and i'm going to say it like my daughter said it please be careful on the internet because you never know what's going to happen we will always miss him no matter what we're going to miss him um she said because of that him we we got divorced and it's not been an easy thing to do and trying to cope with my daughter right now because of what him we we got divorced and it's not been an easy thing to do and trying to cope with my daughter right now because of what letensky did my daughter blames me i don't know

why but she blames me for what happened with the divorce and what's happened to kevin so she got so she kind of doesn't want to talk to me right now it's destroyed the family maybe they maybe they weren't okay with maybe they weren't completely okay with him being gay, so they felt like he had to hide it. That's why he didn't tell people. I don't know. But she said he was an angel to us and he always will be. That's terrible. Grinder, Carl Bacon says he'd like to take some umbrage with Grinder, which is hilarious.

Carl Bacon has umbrage with Grinder. He said they didn't give us any info during the initial investigation, said they were rather uncooperative, said there's no regulation of law on how they operate and how accountable they are to people's activities on their apps. Also, that can be a weird thing when you're talking about, quote, alternative sexual lifestyles and governments being able to subpoena what you're doing and stuff. That goes into a gray area there. But he said Grindr had a response. We here at Grindr are heartbroken to hear about this terrible tragedy. Any serious statement that starts out

we here at Grindr is just hilarious. And share our condolences with Mr. Bacon's family and friends. While for privacy reasons we do not offer public comment on individual user accounts, we remain fully committed to working with law enforcement in the event of any investigation. Carl Bacon said he'd like to see some kind of legislation done to make them be held more accountable.

They said that was our biggest obstacle in the investigation. We did not know where he was going or who he was meeting with. If he had relayed that information early on, it may have been avoided, but it could have been accelerated a lot quicker if we knew who and where. Mark's fucking LinkedIn page is still up, by the way. Really? Chemist at Self-Employed in Morris, Michigan, with

39 connections, says he received a BS in chemistry from Central Michigan University, worked in the barrier resins division of the Dow Chemical Corporation in Midland, Michigan, characterizing the rates of decomposition of polymeric materials. He obtained a master's in chemistry from Iowa State University of Science and Technology while studying physical organic chemistry and the mechanisms of a free radical processes. Who the fuck knows what that is?

He has 47 followers, though. That is Morris, michigan everybody and holy balls is that a wild fucking case 0.1 percent uh 0.01 percent yeah of all murders end up in crazy 100th of a of one percent of murders so that's insane if you like that story tell everyone about it tell everyone you know tell everyone you run into on the street stop your car in an intersection get out and shout it from your roof also definitely get on whatever app you're listening on and give us a review that's the easiest way to do it give us five stars helps a lot helps drive us up the charts shut up and give me murder.com chicago august 12th get Get your tickets. Let's go. Get them right now. A lot of things.

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The whole back catalog, couple hundred bonus episodes to binge on. New ones every other week. One Crime and Sports, one Small Town Murder. You get it all. This week is no different. For Crime and Sports this this week we're going to talk about theme park disasters how fun is that i mean that's not a that's a fun subject there's there's a lot of death oh there's death destruction mayhem it's got it all here and then for small town murder we are going to talk about prison riots some of the craziest prison riots that we've ever heard of there

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we're trying it's on not on us it's out of our hands at this point and into business pans that we have nothing to do with so we're waiting we can't wait thank you for wanting to see hear this and for giving a shit about it so thank you for that that said jimmy hit me with the names of the people who we couldn't fucking live without because they keep the show going and they're the goddamn best people on earth hit me with them right now jimmy this week's executive producers are Jordan Bennett, of course, obviously. Hey, Jordan, my girl. Margaret Thatcher's dank meat sleeve.

That's disgusting. Why would you do that to me? It's a bad visual. And Michaela, happy birthday. It doesn't narrow it down very much, Michaela. Except that it's from DeLuca. Do you know DeLuca? Are you Michaela? Do you that it's from DeLuca. Do you know DeLuca? Are you Michaela?

Do you know a person named DeLuca? They wish you a happy birthday. Happy birthday, somebody from somebody else. Other producers this week are Fanny Fister, you son of a bitch. Peyton Meadows, Dixon, my ass. Hey, very nice. Oh, boy.

Why do they do this? Does that make you feel better? Sweet Pete. Gary Friedman, Janice Hill, Gorilla Monsoon's comb over. Shitta Perlman has relapsed, James. She's back on the rosinitis. And we're really pulling for her. Rupert Bumpkins, Lizzie B., Lynn Ash, Sandy Minj. Oh, yeah.

Of course. Lizzie B, Lynn Ash, Sandy Minge. Oh, yeah, of course. Caitlin Wellborn, Jan Lewis, Kathleen Cox, Tucker Smith, Diana Ortiz, Caressa Hill, Grant Richard, Anne-Marie Marquis, Patrick Badizzi. Not that probably. Fast for Chase Applegate, Holly Royce, Caitlin Dornan, Carrie Elwell, Sydney Irvine, Jess Vixen, Jenny Fernandez, Whitney Smith, Bethany Morin, Da Bushmeister, Daryl Hunt, Maria Saldino, Saldino, Saldino, Jessica Nihill, Neal, Ezekiel Suarez uh katie mcgritt mcgary jesse goodhugh brook sandstorm

it's brook sandstorm that's real uh amanda cook barbara name yeah barrett barrett thornton that's a cowboy name uh holly trexler randy phileo oh boy be careful with that one. Justin Reynolds, Alexandra Moody, Zana Roth, Daniel Valdivinos, Jody Orlando, Jennifer Morgan, Boston Hensley, Jeremiah Murphy, Kyle Benjamin, Jason with no last name, Brenda Wegner, Kyle Yoon, Jeff Brown, Christy Durham, Kristen Wells, Melody Potter, Mikel, Mikel, Mikely, that's Mikel, right? Paige, Daniel Bricado, Heather Bellinger, Austin Witters, Anora with no last name, Sonny

Palmitier, Palmitier? I don't know. Jeff Schaefer, Daniel Cantrell, Crazy Kiwi in the Land of Oz. Greg Eckler. Sarah with no last name. Lindsay White. Christopher Miller. Peachy Nemo. Nemo. Lacey Kieser. Mary Hudson.

Kelsey with no last name. Brian McDavitt. Dan Peruzzi. Jennifer Swezecik. What? Sweze? Sue? Suecik?

Yeah. All of that. Aaron Keeley. Jolene Pritchard. Heather Hunoff, Whitney Bernard, Emily Casey, Sky Emiliano, Emilino, Trisha L., Justin with no last name, Tanzania Lucas, Kylie, Kylie, Kylie, Barash, Wendy Bagneski, Bev Tremblay, Nathan with no last name, Kim with no last name, Jap Cat. that feels awful, Sean McAdams, Eric Everett, Stephen Sowers, Jacob Olinberger, Paul McGreevy, Crystal Moyer,

Brandon Wilburn, Rachie J, Julia Rose, Jeanne, Jeannie, Colleen Crowley, Jess Badeau, Bodot, John Kirby, Susan Rez, Jane Comtois, Kelly Smith, Faye Youssef, Marina with no last name. Marina, no last name. Matthew D'Arizio, Susan Wilson, Francesca Brim, Depoler Diamond. Depoler. Depoler. All right. Gay Nolan, Brock Skaggs, Cassie Costello, Flatwoods, Nancy Bonilla, Victoria Walsh, Ari Van De Graaff, Sonia Silvers, Jenny Lynn Warren, Jason Kozian, Eddie Fox, Sarah Bradburn, Kim McGugan, Madeline M., Toby Armstrong, Sydney Roberts, Lee Jane, Leah J. Russell, Lisa with no last name, David Dorn, Adam Topless, Becca Haas, Flexbert Hamilton, Mary Clark with no last name, Penelope Clark, Ron Reader, uh becca hass haas haas flexbert hamilton mary clark would know wait mary clark is her name

penelope clark or ron reader or riad or uh sean dennehy sky would know last name kaylee callie grossum grossheim msm damn it grow a pair grossum grossum callie kaylee uh steven stevie barr tanner holmgren mckenna barajas, Lauren with no last name, Catherine Kruger, Randy Stone, Jesse Webb, Jacqueline Tinsley, Ryan Chapdelaine, Chapdelaine, that's right, Benjamin Frufrauer, Frufrafoff, Fruhoff, Fruhow. I have no idea what that person's name is. Gigi Lamb, Joseph Iramo, John Holyfield, Holyfield maybe, Zachary Cherukov, Cheruk, Rene Murphy, Hope N., Joseph San Juan, Miriam McAdams, Kim Earl, Raj Panjaki, Pank chacky pank hanny pank hanny

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