Small Town Murder - #438 - An Officer & Three Maniacs - Biloxi, Mississippi

Episode Date: November 11, 2023

This week, in Biloxi, Mississippi, when a rough teenaged divorcee/bartender/dancer gets angry about her relationship with a older man not working out, she forms a team, including another teenager, and a man, who lives in his car. This leads to a nightmare of a night, that ends with someone's head, almost removed from their body! The main question is, who will get the death penalty? All, or none?Along the way, we find out that gulf shrimp come from the gulf, that 13 is definitely too young to get married, and that you never know who may be angry at you!!Hosted by James Pietragallo and Jimmie WhismanNew episodes every Thursday!Donate at: patreon.com/crimeinsports or go to paypal.com and use our email: [e-mail] to shutupandgivememurder.com for all things Small Town Murder & Crime In Sports!Follow us on...twitter.com/@murdersmallfacebook.com/smalltownpodinstagram.com/smalltownmurderAlso, check out James & Jimmie's other show, Crime In Sports! On Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, Wondery, Wondery+, Stitcher, or wherever you listen to podcasts!See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

You're listening early and ad-free on Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. Hello, everybody, and welcome back to Small Town Murder Express. Yay! Choo-choo! Oh, yay indeed, Jimmy. Yay indeed. My name is James Petrigallo. I'm here with my co-host.

I'm Jimmy Wissman. Thank you folks so much for joining us all aboard the murder train, pulling away from the station here for another crazy Small Town Murder Express. And as you know, these are 10 pounds of lightning in a two pound bag. And we have exactly that today for you. A very wild case of just the strangest group of murderers you're ever going to find. Very weird. We'll get into that before we do very quickly. Shut up and give me murder.com is where you get everything. Merchandise tickets, Dallas, December 2nd, still tickets available for that one. Get in there and get those right now. Thank you to everybody who got the virtual live show and hung out with and get those right now. Thank you to everybody who got the virtual live show and hung out with us. That was awesome.

Thank you so much. Also, patreon.com slash crimeandsports is where you get all the bonus material. Anybody, $5 a month or above, it's a cup of coffee, a mere simple cup of coffee. You'll get the entire back catalog of bonus stuff. It's like 200

episodes to binge right away and then new ones every other week including and one crime and sports one small town murder and you get access to everything this week for crime and sports a very tragic tale of a guy named donnie moore was a pitcher who had a very bad thing happen to him in a game and then his life completely went downhill in two years. It's the craziest downfall of all time. And then for Small Town Murder, since it was our costumes and everything else, we'll get into it. We'll talk about the Menendez brothers for Small Town Murder.

So get that right now. Patreon.com slash Crime and Sports and you get a shout out at the end of the show as well. The regular show where Jimmy will mispronounce your name while wanting to get it correct. You also definitely want to check out your stupid opinions especially episode eight because it had a review of the lord calvert whiskey which in the last small town murder express caused a man to nearly behead a woman in a trailer so

whiskey so good it'll take your head off so check that out that said i think it's time to get right into this let's let's all sit back everybody clear the lungs what do you say here arms to the sky and let's all shout let's do this jimmy what do you say? Let's go on a trip, everybody. We are heading on down south this week. Oh. Heading on as south as you can get. We're going to Mississippi, and we're going to Biloxi, Mississippi, which is at the- Oh, where the blues is at. All the blues, and Matthew Broderick walking around saying it's hot and everything else.

So this is right in that little panhandle of Mississippi at the bottom that comes out. So it's something there. It's about an hour to Mobile, Alabama, about an hour and a half to New Orleans in the other direction, and about three hours and ten minutes to Vaughan, Mississippi, which is our last Mississippi small-town murder, which was the family death curse. That was a crazy one. So check that out. That was the name of the show. This is in Harrison County. Little quick history.

We've got to get through quick here. The Biloxi Lighthouse, I guess, is still here. Oh. And it was built in Baltimore and then shipped here in 1848. Really? They shipped a whole lighthouse here, which I guess if you can ship the Statue of Liberty in pieces, you can move a lighthouse. I guess brick by brick, that's a lot.

Yeah. At one point, the Mississippi Gulf Coast had 12 lighthouses. Now there's only two surviving, and this is one of them, the Biloxi Lighthouse there. So during World War II, the U.S. Army Forces built Keesler Field, which is now Keesler Air Force Base. That'll come into play in our show here this week and that became a big site for basic training and for aircraft maintenance and things like that that really boomed the economy as well there because now there's people there in biloxi

it's one of those towns there's a lot of military people and not really much else of anybody else it's yeah mainly military people hurricanes have definitely affected this place a lot, as you might imagine. Oh, it's, yeah. Right on the Gulf Coast. Wear and tear. Sure. Most, the worst ones here were in 1855, 1906, 1909, 1947, 1969, and 2005 with Katrina. Jesus.

Yeah. Katrina really, I mean, just destroyed it. Yeah, they said the governor was quoted as saying that the coastline there looked like an American Hiroshima. And it did. Yeah, I imagine that thing just changed the whole fucking landscape of everything there. It said they destroyed 90% of the buildings along the coast in Biloxi and Gulfport. Wow. And we always just talk about New Orleansleans yep it's destroyed everything floating casinos were torn off their supports and thrown inland as well destroying thing when you throw a casino at a neighborhood it's going

to destroy some shit that's not good so uh reviews of this town we've never been here so how do we know so let's give you some reviews we got a couple of good ones and then we'll give you a not so good one. Here's five stars. Living in Biloxi is nice. There's plenty to do. Shows, restaurants, fishing, shopping, casinos or history. Yeah. Yeah. The people here are mostly friendly.

It's nice to get the chance to talk to strangers. I think that goes against everything we've been taught, but OK. It's beautiful here, too. I've noticed most of Biloxi has more nice areas than rough areas. I see Biloxi as beautiful. A very nice, family-oriented town. All right. That's not bad.

Here's five stars again. I call Biloxi my home. I've lived here for 18 years. It's a small city with big city vibes. The citizens of Biloxi have home. I've lived here for 18 years. It's a small city with big city vibes. The citizens of Biloxi have a real community attitude. We all look out for one another. There's about 49,000 people here, by the way, in Biloxi.

All look out for each other. All 49,000. But I mean, how many of those are military people? You know what I mean? Who's temporary? Who's leaving soon? Yeah. And finally, one star. Okay. I moved here from the Pacific Northwest, and it is the most destitute place I've ever been. Destitute.

Yeah. You have casinos, and that's it. There's a beautiful beach that usually has swim restrictions because of unsafe bacteria. That's not great. Yeah, but it's the fucking golf course. That's gross water. Yeah. I'm a water sports person, so I have a big, beautiful beach that is generally unsafe to swim in.

Outside of casinos and sitting and staring at the beach, there isn't anything. My husband got jumped for his bike four weeks after we got here. Jumped for his bike? What the hell is going on down there why you got an adult riding a bike wow we live on the beach near edgewater so nice area he's riding by the beach that's oh okay god one of those bikes yeah he's not like on the road in the turn lane which is the people i'm like get out of the fucking road on a bmx yeah no oh my god uh the local economy is economy is horrible if you don't work at a casino you don't work minimum wage is still 725 an hour here and the cost of living

is roughly uh 1300 for a one bedroom it's quite expensive here considering how little people make and how uneducated the whole area is the the food here is disgusting disgusting get the fuck out jesus southern hospitality died here people are rude you don't like it here no things to do here now part of this sounds pretty good the seafood biloxi uh the biloxi Seafood Festival. That sounds great. In theory, sounds wonderful, but it's Gulf Coast seafood. You don't want that shit. That's where a lot of the shrimp come from that you're eating. Yeah, that's true.

Whether you realize it or not. Or you can also go see the AA Baseball Team, which is a brewer's affiliate. The Biloxi Shuckers, which is awesome. The Shuckers. So this festival is put on by the Chamber of Commerce. It's a fundraising event. You'll learn about Biloxi's rich heritage as they move throughout the festival in pursuit of delicious plates, great keepsakes, and more.

Also, a chance to mingle with the locals to discover why so many people love calling coastal Mississippi home. Yeah. They're going to have gonna have it says you'll have your pick of oysters crabs snapper shrimp catfish and so much more yeah and don't forget biscuits sides and desserts as well there's band catfish yuck here are the bands that played last year they don't have this year's up but last year um, they started their music at 10 a.m., by the way. Good Christ.

Imagine a band. Do we got to be on stage at when? Fucking 10 a.m.? We got to sound check is when? Day break? Jesus Christ. A guy that works fucking graveyard just fell asleep. I work at 7-Eleven. I get off and now I got to come here?

Because I don't think these bands are. Let's find out. 10 a.m., The Coach Riders come on. Okay. You know you're not doing well because you're the 10 a.m. band, number one. 12 p.m. The Project.

Okay. 2 p.m. Da Real Band comes on. That's when Da Real Band starts? Da Real Band. Duh. 4 p.m. Miles Flat with two Ts. Yeah, t's yeah of course that's why

not miles flat 6 p.m band camp comes on okay it's all locals huh it's all locals and then sunday there's only one musical performer but i think it's gonna just i think he's gonna blow it up all all day everybody 11 30 a.m dj freddie j will be there just burning the house down 11 30 a.m 11 30 a.m just fucking yeah wow okay so it's right out of you yeah take that you've been shucking all morning i got good news for you i'm ready to rock that said let's talk about some murder what do you say okay everybody all right let's get into this let's talk about a young lady first and foremost here her name is atina a-t-t-i-n-a interesting she goes by tina everybody calls her tina because yeah i would why add an extra syllable to this mess here uh atina Marie Canaday is her name. C-A-N-N-A-D-A-Y.

Born September 8th, 1965. Okay, we're going to catch up with her in about 1982. She's just turning 17. But at the same time, let's find out how she got to that point. Now, her mother was a Mobile, Alabama stripper. Oh. point now her mother uh was a mobile alabama stripper oh that's that's um that's her mother and in the 60s so i don't know what kind of strip clubs they had in mobile in the 60s but my own that's interesting um during her childhood she did not have a good childhood dina at all um she is sexually abused by her father at a young age. God damn it. So she ends up being a runaway, which is understandable.

Makes sense. And she gets married at age, ready for this, 13. 13. That's eighth grade for you normal kids out there. Married. Mississippi, that's legal, you sons of bitches. Alabama, Mississippi in 19 in 19 fucking 19 what is that 1978 i don't know how that's legal but i mean she does fake her age a lot too so she might

have faked her age uh it doesn't matter because she's divorced by age 14 a freshman divorcee the freshman divorcee is a strange title to own isn't it a cigarette and a rose on a tuesday afternoon how you doing kids get in here hold on you know what i'm saying like that's a lot going on but i mean she's had a lot in her life obviously this is yeah that's tough man you can just put a bubble on an overview, and go she was sexually abused by her father. But inside of that? Her childhood's been robbed from her. Even if that was the only thing that ever happened and everything else was idyllic.

But something tells me that sexually abusive father, it just doesn't seem like her life around that was probably that great either. She probably was neglected a little bit, left with this guy, you know, things of that nature. Left home alone. Left home alone for Mom Works Nights and left home with this psychopath. Maybe that's, I don't know what happened here. It's awful though. She's also repeatedly tested here and said to be, said to have an IQ

of 71. Terrific. 71 by the way. That's, I think Forrest Gump was 72, I believe, in the movie. I always put it at Gump level because that's what everyone has a reference to. That's what everyone can understand, yeah. So think about that. Problem is, too, she's also blonde and very cute.

Oh, no. So she uses that. She doesn't wander through the world as just an like a, you know, just an ignorant flower. She is like, she's aggressive. She takes advantage of it? We'll talk about it. Yeah, once she gets divorced at 14, she goes to the Gulfport Biloxi area here. Yeah.

And works as a bartender and stripper. Atta girl. At 14. Jesus Christ. What's going on down there? Why are you allowing her to mix your drinks? 14. She's mixing drinks and dancing.

Neither of those things are obviously legal. And sometimes when it's slow and she doesn't make a lot of money, she would supplement her income through prostitution as well. Of course she would. At 14. That's all she's got. I just can't keep expressing 14. Yeah, because what job is she going to go go say i type 80 words a minute i can go right like what other job is she gonna get she's 14 years old so i mean she's got a lot of hustle

to her to go be a bartender and a stripper and all this she's trying to survive it's tough so uh she ends up meeting a guy who is 26 yeah who believes that she's 20 because she's stripping and working at the bar as a bartender. And because she told him she's 20. And she told him she's 20. And if someone's mixing your fucking drink and you go, how old are you? And they go, 20. You're not going to go, I bet you're 14. That is crazy.

I would have pegged you for not a day over 15. Where do you make a rum and coke like a sophomore? That's strange. Very odd. Strange stuff. So this is Ronald Wojcik, W-O-J-C-I-K. Ronald here. He's a U.S. Air Force staff sergeant who lives in the area.

Right. That's what we have in the service, guys that can't recognize a 15-year-old. Well, I'm telling you, if she's working and she tells you she's that old and she's working at a bar and she's stripping, you can't imagine your bartender's 14, can you? Is anyone thinking of that? There was a girl that worked at the improv that looked like she was fucking 13. That's what I mean. And she had two kids. That's what I'm saying.

And she was like 29. That's what I mean. she had two kids that's what i'm saying she was like and she was like 29 that's what i mean you never know with people and so if she's saying she's 20 and whatever i i don't know why he didn't you think he would notice but she's been so like in the she's already divorced so it's not like she's like i was watching fucking my little pony earlier like she's she's worldly by now that's what i mean I don't get it. So he, this is at the Sports Page Bar, it's called. And Ronald would moonlight there after. So he'd work there. I think security because he's a tall guy. After his duties here at the Air Force Base were over during the day.

And he'd hang out. And, you know, there's women there and shit like that. He's a single guy, as we'll find out. He's an instructor with the 3410 Technical Training Group at Kiesler Air Force Base. Wow. So he's divorced. Yeah. He has two children.

His daughter's name is Dolly, by the way. Is that right? Yeah, the 70s. So, I mean, that's a – Yeah, it's certainly for that reason. Certainly, possibly for that reason, which is cool. So he's divorced, though, but he sees his kids all the time. Okay.

As much as he can. So Tina hooks up with Ronald. Yeah. Now, Ronald is a stable guy. This is what's odd because she, I would imagine, and has looked for people who are assholes, abusive people. He's actually a steady guy, not abusive, doesn't hit her, doesn't rape her, doesn't do anything like that. Yeah.

Decent dad. Like he's a, seems like a nice guy. So it's a very odd matchup anyway here, but maybe she's trying to, she might feel safe with him. I don't know what the deal is here. Uh, but she ends up starting, she lives with him now. She moves in with him. Uh, does Tina before she's 15 yeah she's

like 15 16 at this time this is like when she's turning 16 she moves in with him they pretty much just act like a couple okay they go out together they go shopping together they come home and make dinner and it was like a married couple that's all um then after a few weeks of this he found out how old she actually was. Yeah. He never knew. She just lied to him the whole time. So he fucking freaked out.

Yeah. It was like, I've been fucking a fucking 14 year old. Are you kidding me? I would freak out too. Oh dude, I'd lose my mind. I'm a felon. This is awful. I didn't think I was a felon.

I didn't know. So he also realized that the military would disapprove of this as well. Oh, yeah. That wouldn't go well. So he said, you got to move out. Like, this is over yesterday, and you got to fucking go. I did not know you were 14 or 15 or 16. Anything under 18 is going to be bad.

Anything that has teen attached to it is fucking bad. Anything shy of 18 is going to probably raise some red flags at the military there. So she moves out, and shortly after that, Ronald finds a new girlfriend. Because why not? He's out there looking for a girlfriend. So he finds a girlfriend named Sandra Sawash. S-O-W-A-S-H. Sawash.

Sandra. So he meets her, and that's what's going on. It's 1982. So Atina is 16. She hasn't turned 17 yet, so she's still 16. During this time, Atina meets a man named John Cooper, who knows Ronald. There's a mutual friend here, I guess, now. ronald okay there's a mutual friend here i guess now tina tells this john cooper that she caught ronald and sandra sawash in bed together oh she said i caught them in bed together and i threatened

to kill him if i ever caught them again okay okay that's her story now later on she'll say she didn't threaten but she did discuss the thing with him. And she said that Cooper then went and told Ronald about it. Oh, now that's why Ronald was like, why are you saying you're going to kill me? What the fuck is up with that? And she's like, I didn't say that. I just said I was mad. So Ronald was like, all right, whatever.

He didn't care. He just said it thought it was she's 16 running off at the mouth. That's what I mean. Who cares? But I thought it was she's 16 running off at the mouth. That's what I mean. Who cares? So then Ronald said one weird thing, though, here is that on the night before this, before you told me this, she showed up outside my apartment yelling obscenities. So that was weird.

Yeah. So she does seem pretty upset about this whole thing. She's mad. Yeah. She just showed up and started screaming outside the apartment, which must have been fun for all the other people in the apartments that's a show at that point but she's gotta understand she she lied man and and at that age like you can ruin my life with that lie that's a bad lie and she's just i mean her life is just jesus christ this kid is not it's rough i mean she's living like someone who's 10 years older than her. That's hard. You can't live like that when you're that age.

No. That's so difficult. I feel bad for her. So June 1st, 1982, Tina makes a phone call to a friend named Gina Pical. Now, during this conversation, she says she loves Ronald. She loves him. She expresses repeatedly, I love Ronald, but i'd also like to kill him i really would i got it very upset with him so much i went and i cursed outside his apartment and that

didn't that didn't quell it i thought fill the hole i figured that would do it i was like i'll go out and curse i'll feel better and you know what i need blood i just need blood i thought the void would be filled by calling him an asshole i I thought so. And part of this may be that she is like bouncing from apartment to apartment, friends, couches and shit like that. Yeah, it hurts. Yeah. She became friends with a man who is 29 years old named David Gray after this. David Randolph Gray. This guy is 29.

He is an unemployed man who lives in his car. Yeah, let's be friends. So she makes friends with him. What are you, 13 years older than me and you live in your car and you have no job? Awesome. Sounds great. We're going to be fast buddies. And they do and they talk about it and she discusses her feelings.

I love Ronald and I hate that Sandra Sawash for taking him away from me and blah blah blah meanwhile if she didn't exist it still doesn't matter you're still a teenager you're still he's not you're 16 she didn't she didn't take you away for it's not what happened 16 you shouldn't have been there in the first place jesus christ so june 2, 1982 comes around. Tina is at the Red Garter Lounge inside the Buena Vista Hotel. Yeah. This sounds like a place for a 16-year-old, right? The Red Garter Lounge. She and David Gray were hanging out, drinking and dancing.

Perfect. How do you live in your car and you go to bars? How the fuck does that work? Save that cash. You don't have a roof. Jesus Christ. First thing would be roof over my head, not hang out in bars with a teenage girl. Your roof is a vinyl top.

Let's wait a while. What are we doing? Yeah. You don't. Oh, my God. Your roof comes down and then it gets broken and stuck when it tries to come back up. We don't have this. So they both get shit-faced.

And he ends up, Dave ends up smoking some weed, too. He's smoking weed. They're drinking. Again, you live in your car and have weed. You have weed money? How does that work? On patrol there a couple weeks ago, there was a guy in Florida. Shocker.

He's in his minivan sleeping. And they knock on his window and just cloud of smoke comes out he's like i was just smoking and fell asleep in my minivan because my old lady kicked me out no i was like this is perfect he just drove his car somewhere made the back like a bed parked it and was like fuck it i'm smoking they're like do you have any more weed he's like nah man smoked it all, you think this guy has a big stash? No, he doesn't. He doesn't even have anywhere to go.

You think I got trafficking amounts? Fuck no. No. Also at the lounge hanging out is a girl named Dawn Bushart. Bush-art, one word. She's 15. What is it with this place? Everybody can just, what is happening? She's, there's a 15 and a 16 year old girl at the Red Garter Lounge at the moment here.

Jesus Christ. Uh, Tina knew her and referred to her to David as quote, the fat, ugly girl. Okay. That's nice. Um, yeah. So she, that's what she called her. That's the ugly. Oh, sorry. Ugly fat girl called her that's the ugly oh sorry ugly fat girl not fat ugly ugly fat girl she used that first so she ends up joining the party dawn so now we got dawn

tina and david hanging out here uh again so as the lounge is closing she meaning t, asked David if he would go with her, where you may ask, quote, to my old man's apartment to get her van and some clothes. My old man. My old man. Guy I lived with for two weeks until I told him he was 16. A 26-year-old kid. Let's go tell my old man. Let's do it. She also wanted David to beat up ronald to scare him

and then possibly maybe kill ronald after that which david said no i don't want to kill him i'll beat him up but i'm not gonna i don't even fucking know this guy i'm not gonna kill him so she will deny later on asking that if he'll say she asked me if I had a gun and she says I never asked for a gun. So he doesn't have a gun, but on the way, he does take four knives from his car. And this man lives with four knives. He has knife money. His car doesn't work, by the way.

His house is not operational at the moment. His house broke down, which is an issue. This is a very small trailer home. No, it's just a tiny, tiny trailer. So they're going to try to get there a different way. If you don't have transportation to go try to beat someone up and threaten your ex, maybe you can't go then that time. Wait until you have a car. His studio trailer doesn't drive.

That's wild. So he takes four knives, and they said they they wanted she said she wanted the four knives to tina quote in case we got picked up by a nut which makes sense um so the three of these people uh canady gray and bush art they hitchhike yeah want to pick me and my two teenage fucking girls? Who's picking this group up? Right. Someone. I mean, he could say, these are my children. These are my children.

These are my nieces. Whatever it is, it looks like they're, I mean, he lives in his car. Right. He can't look like he's. Looks bad, yeah. Yeah, like upstanding. I guess you could say my car broke down. There it is.

I mean, that's something. My house broke down. My house broke down. My house broke down. It's very sad. Hold on. Let me get everything out of my bedroom before we go. So someone does. We took these knives off the.

Look at the block. He's got a block up on the console. On the dashboard. It's not bad. He's like, it's not bad. So someone does pick them up and takes them to a point near ronald's apartment not right at it though yeah let's drop us off here so atina sees that ronald's white van is there so she thinks he's home at that point she's like he's got to be home

in may of 1980 near anaheim california dor California, Dorothy Jane Scott noticed her friend had an inflamed red wound on his arm and seemed unwell. She insisted on driving him to the local hospital to get treatment. While he waited for his prescription, Dorothy went to grab her car to pick him up at the exit, but would never be seen alive again. Leaving us to wonder, decades later, what really happened to Dorothy Jane Scott? From Wondery, Generation Y is a podcast that covers notable true crime cases like this one and many more. Every week, hosts Erin and Justin sit down to discuss a new case, covering every angle in theory, walking through the forensic evidence, and interviewing those close to the case to try to discover what happened.

And with over 450 episodes, there's a case for every true crime listener. Follow the Generation Y podcast on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to Generation Y ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus. I understand that anybody who's paid attention to the media would have to come to the conclusion that I killed my wife. Hi, my name is Zach Stewart-Pontier. I'm one of the filmmakers behind The Jinx, and I'm excited to bring you The Official Jinx Podcast.

We'll be revisiting all six episodes of Part 1 and watching along with Part 2 as it airs on Max, starting April 21st. Bye-bye. The Official Jinx Podcast. Listen on Max or wherever 21st. Bye-bye. The official Jinx podcast. Listen on Max or wherever you get your podcasts. So they walk up to the door, the three of them.

Gray here, David, gives Dawn a knife and then gives Tina a black-handled knife as well. And he kept a butcher knife and another knife, which was strapped to his belt. Wow. so all three of them have knives david orders dawn the 15 year old to stand out on the front porch lookout basically okay your lookout so they enter the apartment tina and david gray there is it's disputed whether the door is unlocked or whether she still had a key. We don't know yet. We don't, we'll never know that. So at that point she gave her knife to David. Tina gives it to David and enters Ronald's bedroom while David Gray stays in

the living room. Ronald and Sandra are asleep in the bed when she enters, which is going to obviously send her into a very angry little fucking teenage stripper rage. It's not going to be good. Yeah. So next what happens is somehow she wakes them up and gets them at knife point here. Both of them. So Gray comes in to help her.

They take both of both Sandra and Ronald out of the apartment at knife point. Oh, boy. And lead them to the van, to his own van, and make them get in. Okay? Ronald's two children are asleep in the bedroom in the house. What? They're left behind in the apartment because, obviously, he's probably happy to just get these crazy people away from his children, I would think. If you have children in the house, that's what you're thinking about. Number one is get these fucking people away from my kids.

Hopefully they won't notice them and they'll leave them alone. So as they were leaving the apartment, Atina picks up a wallet that belongs to Ronald. And this is the first time that Dawn, they come out and Dawn's sitting out there with a knife too. There's another teenager out there with a knife. They see her. Everybody gets into the van with a Tina driving. Really? Have the drunk 16-year-old drive.

So they proceed westward along US 90, and she's driving pretty quick, too. She's moving. They make a right turn off US 90. pretty quick too she's moving they make a right turn off us 90 she then attempts to race an approaching train to beat the train this this girl is dangerous bro this is i can beat it let's go over and stab my old man and on the way to killing him maybe we'll fucking beat a train this is insanity train so he does that ronald grabbed the wheel and prevented a collision with the train wow he had to fucking grab it and like pull it over because she was literally gonna she's gonna run into a fucking train a train so david then tells dawn that if ronald moves again

you cut him okay meanwhile he just saved all of their lives. Right. That's just number one. Just saved everybody's life. We could have had bodies and knives bouncing all over this car. Oh, it could have been a mess. Meanwhile, in the van, David's looking around going, man, what's the rent in this place? This place is pretty big. I got to tell you, this is much bigger than mine.

This isn't even a studio. This is a one-bedroom, right? When this is all over, I want to talk to the manager of this place. I could put a curtain up right here and get me two rooms. This is nice. It's all he's thinking the whole time. It's a goddamn one bedroom right here. This place is beautiful.

I'll tell you what, man. I could get a roommate maybe if I can't afford it. Won't be bad. So, yes, to cut him. Now, at this point, atina this is fucking crazy this is this girl is is damaged obviously she suggests and this is everyone on everyone here says it that she suggests to dave to gray to david gray why don't you rape Sandra? Oh my God. Why don't you go ahead and rape her at knife point?

You should do that. So he does. Why? Oh my God. So he rapes her at knife point in the back of the van. He never even thought of it. This was her idea. She was like,

yeah, yeah, no, you should do that. Totally. It's so out of control now. While she continued to drive in a moving car, she makes several turns and ends up

stopping on a gravel road at the time it was a gravel road called lampkin road i look this place up it's actually technically gulfport um but it is like the last road before there's nothing there's this road even now this this is 1982 this on. But even now, 50 years or 40 years later, there is nothing. It's all green, just like there's a golf course on the other side of the woods or the other side of whatever the green shit is. There's no houses there or anything like that. It's a swamp. Yeah, it's just kind of in the woods. So she makes several turns, stops on Lampkin Road.

And they're off Lampkin Road, I should say. David Gray gets out of the van and forces Ronald out of the van. Ronald urges Atina to tell him, he's saying, what are you doing? Well, let's talk about this. Yeah, what are we doing? Let's talk about this. But she said, I'm not talking to you. I'm done talking to you.

So David Gray has the butcher butcher knife and he has another knife strapped to his belt there is a there's a beef over who had the black handled knife uh and i believe that that uh that atina had it and i'll tell you why in a minute i want to ruin what happens here but i'll definitely tell you why it's believable that she had it um now uh atina will say that dawn had the knife but she didn't it's tvable that she had it. Now, Atina will say that Dawn had the knife, but she didn't. It's Tina that had the knife. So Gray forces Ronald into the woods and walks him in there. They're walking into the woods.

He's holding a butcher knife to Ronald's back as they're walking. He marches him about 50 feet into the woods. At that point, Atinaina yells kill him okay so gray turns and yells back to atina bring sandra into the woods too now at that point there's going to be we're going to have diverging stories of who did what but they're the one thing that's not in question is at this point ronald fucking jackss David Gray and starts punching him. Hell yeah. As soon as he turned his attention away and didn't have the knife pointed at him, Ronald starts fighting the guy because he's fighting for his life.

He's obviously fighting for his life. And he's a guy that's in the fucking service. He's trained. He's not a pussy. He's a staff sergeant. You know what I mean? He's not going to go down without a fight, obviously. Sure.

He does. He starts fighting. You know what I mean? He's not going to go down without a fight, obviously. Sure. He does. He starts fighting. He starts fighting this. They're going and they're fighting. And so now here's where it kind of veers. Ronald is hitting Gray. They're fighting. Gray ends up overpowering Ronald but dropped the knife during the fight. Which is what Ronald was going for, I assume.

So after he hits Ronald and keeps hitting him until he's nearly unconscious, he starts to look for his knife. During this, Gray ends up picking up the knife. And his version is he picked up the knife and saw At tina she had come up right next to them he says a tina asked for the knife and said that she just wanted to talk to ronald but she wanted the knife okay so david says he gave her the knife and told her to um you know if you're gonna kill him make it fast okay then he's feisty he's feisty. So then he David said he walked back to the road. You might be asking where Sandra during this whole thing.

We'll let you know that he says about five minutes later that can't that Tina returned. He asked her what happened and she said nothing. He got up and ran away. OK, that's David's story. He said he never used the butcher knife against Ronald during the fight because he dropped it. He said that Atina did not return with the butcher knife either. And, yeah, so he said he also didn't use any of his folding knives. Now, the thing that happened was when Atina was trying to get Sandra to go into the woods, Sandra just fucking took off.

Really? Atina's not big. She's not big at all. She's small. And she's 16. So this Sandra, who's an adult woman, she just fucking ran. She's in her nightgown, by the way. Wow.

Barefoot in her nightgown. She was in bed sleeping. Yeah. So she just runs away. So Atina, at this point, when she's running away, rather than chase her, I don't know if she doesn't think she could catch her or what, she just takes the knife and throws it at Sandra. Tries to, like, throwing knife her. Tries to stab her, yeah.

But instead, the handle hits Sandra in the back, and she's able to keep running. Ends up about 200 yards away, finds a house. Bang on the door. This is three in the morning middle of the night you know screaming in your nightgown people are trying to murder me my boyfriend's in the woods going crazy so throwing knife murderers are back there yeah this girl can't she's got a shit arm she's she's aggressive but i wouldn't put her into the knife with bases running with runners on base because because she will fucking mess it up. She'll leave one hanging. Absolutely. So as Gray was looking,

he said that Atina walked up and advised him that Sandra had run away and that she had thrown the knife at her. Gray finds his knife, and then Atina asked for it. Gray says he gave her the knife, and he walked away. So at the van, he said he smoked a cool cigarette, cool brand, uh, a cool cigarette, but was later found several feet from a place where the van was thought to have been.

Okay. So that makes sense. So gray said he believed he left Ronald in the woods and he was still alive. And then when she returned, she didn't have the knife and she said nothing happened and they left. OK, that's his version of what happened. I left them alone. She must have done. If anything happened, it's all her in the woods.

I got no I got no reason to stay up at night. I sleep fine. I sleep great. Now, her version is a lot different. Really? In her version, she says she never went into the woods, but stayed at the van with Sandra and Dawn the entire time, Atina says. Also, she said it was Dawn who threw the knife at Sandra, but it definitely wasn't. Atina had the knife because Sandra said Atina had the knife and threw it at her.

Oh. So I believe Sandra. Yeah. I believe the victim. Yeah. and threw it at her. Oh. So I believe Santa.

Yeah. I believe the victim. Yeah. Both Dawn and the victim both said that Atina was the one with the knife. So I'm believing that. She says that she stayed there. She said that Dawn threw the knife, which we know is bullshit. She also said that when David came back, he had blood on his clothes and on the knife when he came back to the van.

She said that she thought he had blood on his clothes and on the knife when he came back to the van she said that she thought he had killed ronald david became upset when he discovered that sandra had gotten away and then the three left in the van and drove to slidell louisiana with atina driving okay while they're driving david gray threw out his bloody T-shirt. Once they arrived at a store near Slidell, Tina bought a black T-shirt, which she put over her red and pink jumpsuit she was wearing. So there's that. Tina and Gray then went to someone's house. They go to Mildred Paige Robinson's house. to someone's house. They go to Mildred Paige Robinson's house. And her son, Timothy Page, is friends with Atina. They met because Atina and her ex-husband lived in a nearby trailer park. Obviously.

So, Paige noticed that Atina, with the black t-shirt, was pulled over her jumpsuit. So, he said he didn't notice any blood on a Tina. A Tina told him they had come to party and then asked for some cutoff jeans to wear. I'm here to party. Give me some cutoffs. Let's do it. That is Mississippi party clothes. Yeah.

Mississippi, uh, party costume. That's the one is some cutoffs. That's right. That's the one. Some cutoffs. That's right. That's the prom dress down here. Mississippi prom dress. So she removed her red and pink jumpsuit and placed it in some water to

soak. She said that her explanation was that she had started her period and it needed to be soaked because she had a leak there probably. So now this page said he didn't notice any blood stains on on uh any of that but he did notice blood stains on one of david gray's arms and on his pants leg but he was not wearing a shirt because obviously you just come over to hang out at a stranger's house shirtless obviously everyone shows up to my house

no one has a shirt somebody throw me some cutoffs. I need some. We need some cutoffs, a shirt for this guy. Holy shit. A thrift store would thrive here. So after talking with the with Mrs. Robinson for a while there, Kennedy goes to sleep. Tina takes a nap. She didn't take a bath or clean up or anything before, you know, she just washed her shit and laid down. Then Paige, the son, and David Gray get in the van and leave in search of what, Jimmy?

A keg of beer. Yeah. They're going to get a keg. We're going to throw a kegger around. How about a 12-pack? There's three of you. What are you doing? No, we need a whole ass keg.

Two of you are children. What are you doing? No, we need a whole ass gang. Two of you are children. What are you talking about? So Sandra, again, she was there. She was able to get to a nearby house, which she notified Harrison County Sheriff's Department of what happened. She gave a detailed description of the white van as well as the name of Tina as a participant. Yeah. Not good here of Tina as a participant. Yeah. Not good here. They know a lot.

And the vans out there running around looking for kegs. They're out there rolling. And the sheriff's deputies, who, of course, know of a Tina because, obviously, they said they knew she had connections in Louisiana and informed Louisiana authorities to be on the lookout for a white van and its occupants. So now they're even being looked for. By the way, on a highway near Slidell, Ronald's wallet was found. Oh, they threw it out? They just chucked it out the car. Yeah, that's what they did.

So at sunrise, after Sandra summons the police and everything, Ronald is found in the woods. Oh, boy. With 19 stab wounds. It's brutal. The two of them, their story didn't mention that. Nope. It's really, really brutal. The most is he came out of the woods with blood on him is all she said.

19 stab wounds in the face, in the neck, in the chest. His head's nearly severed. It's sawed. Destroyed him. His chest, his back areas, all this shit. He's in a bushy wooded area about 50 feet from the chest. His head's nearly severed. It's sawed. Destroyed him. His chest, his back areas, all this shit. He's in a bushy wooded area about 50 feet from the road. They never did find the butcher knife, though. They must have tossed that probably with the wallet, I would think.

So everybody knows what they're looking for, obviously. Louisiana authorities then spot the white van and they arrest David Gray and Tim Page because they're in it. Yeah. So, I mean, that's that. So they talk to Page, who's not involved in this at all. He's like, oh, I can tell you anything you want. This is just the chick who lived in the nearby trailer park. It's not my sister or something.

I'm just looking for a keg of bud, you guys. Yeah, we had no idea this was going on. This leads police to his house, to Mrs. Robinson, his mom's house, where they find a Tina asleep. Cops walk in. Wow. Out like a light sucking her thumb. Probably. I'm assuming holding the rainbow bright.

I don't know what she's doing, but in our cutoffs, she's a child in their cutoffs. She's awakened and arrested. Yeah. Given her Miranda rights and the investigators sees the outfit that she put in the sink as well. The water had already drained out, but they noticed no blood on the clothing at all. They also had she also had articles of jewelry later identified as belonging to both Ronald and Sandra. Of course, on her person. So she's placed in a sheriff's car for transportation. And at that point, she's being been warned of her Miranda rights again, twice now.

So during the car ride, she made unsolicited statements. She just shouted stuff out. Can't stop someone from talking. That she had used the knife to kill Ronald and that she saw Gray. She'll later say it's different. She'll tell a jailer a different thing. She said she saw Gray grasp Ronald's hair, pull his head back and cut his throat.

Oh God. She later says she tried to cut his throat and tried to cut his head off when she was doing it. She said she tried to behead him, but couldn't. Yeah. That's what she'll tell a job. Like a jail guy later on.

Wow. Okay. So they get to the. Yeah. That's what she'll tell a jail guy later on. Wow. Okay. So they get to the police station. She's criminally charged, obviously. She's given another Miranda warning, and she gives a 14-page statement concerning her involvement. 14 pages. That's the story I gave you, which is we went. We saw the ugly fat chick.

We put her in, went to the place, had a knife, took him out. I sat in the car, Sandra ran away, David came out with blood on. That's her story. They end up getting them, they waive extradition, so they come back to Mississippi. Dawn, by the way, wasn't with them at all. She's arrested a couple days later after hitchhiking back from Louisiana. What? She made a fact.

She was then arrested while walking along Highway 90 in Harrison County. She doesn't have a car at all. Nope. Hitchhiking around. 15. Oh, my God. So, Kennedy stated to an officer she believed that she was pregnant and that Ronald was the father. Uh-huh.

That's what she said. She said she had not had a period for three months. Oh, boy. So they got a pregnancy test and gave it to her. And it was negative. She said, oh, no, you misunderstood me. She said, I stated I had missed two periods, but on today I got my period. Oh, she's bleeding right now?

I thought I was pregnant. I thought I was pregnant, but I'm not. So in jail is when she said that she took the head and tried to cut it and then tried to break his head off his body by the spine. Jesus. Is what she said in jail in response to a question from a guard. She's not Mirandized there, though, so that's an issue. Now, forensics, blood testing here, they indicate that both Ronald and David Gray had type B blood. Blood spots found on Gray's pants were type B blood.

This is pre-DNA, remember? So they also tested the jumpsuit worn by Athena, and those tests revealed the enzyme paradoxin in six areas, which indicated possible blood traces. Possible. The stains were insufficient to get a blood type, though. There were no traces in the crotch of the clothing where she said she had a leak. Had a period, yeah.

And they said that the finding of the small traces were consistent with the garment being washed. So they said there might have been blood on it, but it's not there anymore. So they charge all three of them

on capital murder charges for kidnapping and homicide. Yeah. They walked him out to a car, walked the guy out to execute him. This is fucking cold-blooded. Absolutely. This is as cold-blooded as you get. And the injuries don't.

It's like a terror squad. Yeah, the injuries don't strike me as gray doing that because they are incredibly personal. There's a lot. Although, if he's fighting back. Yeah. And then he's pissed off and he's like, oh i'll cut you you know what i mean like it could be a rage we don't know thing yeah yeah we'll find out don't worry it all comes out it all like much like her jumpsuit it all comes out in the wash here so they're gonna do all this now bush art claims she will not testify at either of these trials she'll end up pleading later on guilty to manslaughter.

The letter plead because she's 15. So and she didn't by anyone's account. She didn't hurt anybody. She could participate in the kidnapping, but she wasn't like, you know, whatever. She's the least culpable participant. So certainly. Yeah. But she doesn't testify against anybody.

That's the thing. So why did they let her plea then? Atina's trial. Yeah. But she doesn't testify against anybody. That's the thing. So why did they let her plea then? Atina's trial. She now Gray is granted immunity from prosecution on the rape charge, not on the capital murder charge on the rape charge in exchange for his testimony concerning the rape at Atina's trial. his testimony concerning the rape at a Tina's trial. Yeah. Because the rape certainly ups his fucking culpability. He's in a lot of trouble. And even Sandra said it was a Tina who said to rape her. It wasn't David's idea.

It was a Tina's who said, go ahead and do that. So that's a big deal too. Um, now the verdict here, cause I gave you all the, the evidence and, the verdict here comes out.

They find her guilty of capital murder. Really? Yes, they do. During sentencing, her defense attorney pleaded for leniency, saying, quote, the poor girl never had a chance. She had a broken home, a series of foster homes. She's married when she's 13 in a trailer park. She's stripping when she's 15.

She really had no chance. She's the ringleader of this. That's what's crazy she's 15. She really had no chance. She's the ringleader of this. That's what's crazy. Dangerous. That's what's so crazy about it. If she was just like one of the – this was her idea. This is insane. She's an idea man.

She wanted this. Yeah. So the defense witnesses describe her as antisocial. This is their defense psychiatrist. This is a quote from the newspaper and from the court documents. Quote, antisocial and mildly retarded. OK. They call her a clinical psychologist.

J. Donald Mather of Gulfport testified he tested her twice and determined she had a mental age of nine years old. Oh, that's a badass nine year old. That's what I mean. That's a mean nine year old. Jesus Christ. What nine year old thinksold. That's what I mean. That's a mean nine-year-old. Jesus Christ. What nine-year-old thinks you should rape that lady? Yeah, she is dangerous on the playground.

That is hardcore. Welcome to the small town of Chinook, where faith runs deep and secrets run deeper. In this new thriller, available exclusively on Wondery Plus, religion and crime collide when a gruesome murder rocks the isolated Montana community. Everyone is quick to point their fingers at a drug-addicted teenager, but local deputy Ruth Vogel isn't convinced.

She suspects connections to a powerful religious group. Enter federal agent V.B. Loro, who has been investigating a local church for possible criminal activity. The pair form an unlikely partnership to catch the killer, unearthing secrets that leave Ruth torn between her duty to the law, her religious convictions, and her very own family. But something more sinister than murder is afoot, and someone is watching Ruth. With an all-star cast led by Emmy nominee Sanaa Lathan and Star Wars' Kelly Marie Tran,

Chinook is available exclusively and ad-free on Wondery+. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. It's all a lighthearted nightmare on our podcast, Morbid. We're your hosts. I'm Alina Urquhart. And I'm Ash Kelly. And our show is part true crime, part spooky, and part comedy. The stories we cover are well-researched.

He claimed and confessed to officially killing up to 28 people. With a touch of humor. I'd just like to go ahead and say that if there's no band called Malevolent Deity, that is pretty great. A dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit with a little bit of cursing. This mother****er lied. Like a liar. Like a liar. And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of cursing. This motherfucker lied. Like a liar. Like a liar. And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal,

or you love to hop in the Wayback Machine and dissect the details of some of history's most notorious crimes, you should tune in to our podcast, Morbid. Follow Morbid on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to episodes early and ad-free by joining Wondery Plus and the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. It's all a lighthearted nightmare on our podcast,

Morbid. We're your hosts. I'm Alina Urquhart. And I'm Ash Kelly. And our show is part true crime, part spooky, and part comedy. The stories we cover are well-researched. He claimed and confessed to officially killing up to 28 people. With a touch of humor.

I'd just like to go ahead and say that if there's no band called Malevolent Deity, that is pretty great. A dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit with a little bit of cursing. This mother f***er lied. Like a liar. Like a liar. And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal. Or you love to hop in the Wayback Machine and dissect the details of some of history's most notorious crimes. You should tune in to our podcast, Morbid. Follow Morbid on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts.

You can listen to episodes early and ad-free by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. or on Apple Podcasts. Another defense witness, a psychiatrist here from Gulfport, said he found she suffered no brain disease, no organic brain damage, and gave reasonable answers to his questions. However, he said if she were 18,

she would be classified as antisocial since she met the normal criteria for the diagnosis. He said this included a lack of remorse and the inability to be concerned about the welfare of others. When you grow up like that, you don't care about others because you're being tortured. Yeah, because you don't care about you.

Yeah, well, you're having bad things happening, so fuck everyone else, too. So they ask if she had anything to say before sentencing, and she said, no, sir, while weeping. Sentencing comes in. You, young lady, may fuck off death penalty

oh shit yeah they're gonna kill blondie they're gonna kill a child as she's led from the courtroom she is heard to say to no one in particular just out loud quote damn y'all i don't know that took you a second you were like is there more nope you looked at me you're like there's no more she just said damn y'all damn y'all that was fast that's fucking wild damn y'all i feel like britney spears says that 30 times a day did she do you think she said yeah did you think she said it with a comma of like, damn y'all? Or do you think she said, damn y'all? Like, damn y'all.

Hope y'all go to hell. You know what I mean? I think it was like, damn y'all. Damn y'all. Shit. More than I expected. Wait, kill me. Damn y'all.

Damn y'all. That's fucked up. So Gray's trial comes along. And the morning of his trial, he's trying to get some witnesses that are prisoners at this point. People that I guess were in the Biloxi jail and heard a Tina say she tried to cut his head off. So they they argue that the judge refuses that because of the expense of transporting the prisoners. Oh, no, I don't want to spend that. No, that's too.

Now you're not worth it, dude. Sorry. You're kind of a piece of shit. Not really worth it. So, yeah, they said the judge recognized that if Kennedy took the stand as a witness and waved her Fifth Amendment right to be silent and denied she took part in the murder, then the testimony that said that she cut the guy's head nearly off would be admissible to impeach her testimony as prior inconsistent statement. So you can only bring it up if she brings it up. It's basically like it's like character stuff at this point because you can't bring up character. And if you bring it up, then they can bring up all your shitty things.

So, yeah. So the trial judge rules that if the proper predicate were laid out for impeaching Kennedy, he would reconsider his ruling on the motion to transfer. And so that's that's his ruling on the motion to transfer. And so that's his ruling, which seems fair. So she is called to testify by Gray. Really? Okay. They call her to testify, but she takes the fifth and does not say shit on the stand.

All right. So Timothy Page. Yeah. She's got the death penalty. What could be worse? Who cares? Yeah. Fuck this guy. So Timothy Page, Yeah. She's got the death penalty. What could be worse? Who cares? Yeah. Fuck this guy.

So Timothy Page, he comes from Louisiana. He's the guy who was in the van and got arrested. Right. He testifies against Gray. He says that he noticed Gray had a skinned place on his hand and some, quote, bad things on his knuckles. He'd been in a fight. Little blood on his elbow. And he said that Gray told him he got in a fight with a little blood on his elbow and he said that gray told him

he got in a fight with a couple of guys in a bar in mississippi couple guys and this guy you go shirtless guy lives in his car that make that all tracks yeah a couple guys in a bar yeah that makes sense blood stains on his arm yeah you know probably true it's all normal um so they said was there anything else about David that seemed strange? And he said, yes. When David handed me a drink of Jack Daniels from the bottle, I don't remember which arm it was. They're drinking Jack Daniels from a bottle. But he had dried blood on his arm just below his hand.

It's better than Lord Calvert's, honestly. Although, same result in the end. Just a smidge. Well, Jack is to celebrate a murder well committed, and the Lord Calvert's is to get you to commit murder. It's a different drink. It's a different drink. It's a pre and post drink. Pre and post, yeah.

And the opposite hand, his knuckles were skinned. It looked to me he had cut his hand hitting someone in the mouth or teeth. I asked him what had happened. He said he got into a fight somewhere in Mississippi with two dudes dudes he was bragging about how bad he was yeah and they said he then said to the dude david the dude the dude the dude david uh he said was real nervous and when i was looking around he didn't want me to look around too much inside of the van okay jesus christ um he said that he appeared shaky and all of that the prosecutor said um then page said he'd been in the district attorney's office

for a couple days and uh they talk about the statement because they're saying didn't the district attorney basically put the statement into your mouth he goes well i mean they we did a pre interview thing but yeah so um, that didn't happen. So now before it goes to jury, there's the jury instructions, which is to give what you're doing. So you could say manslaughter now. And this is when you ask for different things. So during the discussion, Gray's attorney asked the court to permit him to draft a manslaughter instruction for submission as a lesser included offense on the ground that the jury could consider his story to be true that he fought and killed ronald in the heat of passion but without malice okay which if you kidnapped someone you're asking eventually

they're gonna it doesn't yeah it doesn't matter they died in the in the commission of a kidnapping that's capital murder yep they said that the it would not be granted under the rules of the case. Gray argues that his testimony that Ronald hit him and they engaged in a fight offers a basis for presenting the jury for the affirmative proposition that his actions were without malice forethought. The state said that even taking in the evidence most favorable to Gray, there's no way it could be said to support a finding that Gray killed him without malice and in the heat of passion. He armed himself and two others, abducted two people at knife point, took them into the woods north of Gulfport, led Ronald into the woods at knife point, then beat him to the ground breathless, at least, even if you take his as testimony at face value. Then he gave a knife to someone else to kill him with. And then walked away. And then walked away.

So either way, this is bad. But we don't even believe that. So verdict comes in. Guilty of capital murder for David. And here comes the sentencing. You, sir, may fuck off. Death penalty for you, too. We're going to kill a little blonde girl for this?

You've got no chance, man. Yeah. Fucking living in your car is coming, too. Yeah. Let's go, hobo Joe, in here yeah that's right strap in absolutely yeah by 1983 atina wants a new trial based yes it's based on the fact that now david gray comes forward and said he lied and he stabbed ronald and candace everything she said was true. He comes out. He want the he's trying to do this. He sends a letter along with Kennedy's appeals here.

Here this is they asked for a new trial based on the letter. In the letter, Gray recanted his previous testimony that Kennedy had killed Ronald, who had been stationed around there. And Gray said that he acted alone when he stabbed him to death in the woods. He said Gray's attorney, called as a witness, testified that Gray told him in November he lied when he said that Kennedy

had gone into the woods. The lawyer said, I couldn't understand some of the physical evidence and facts that seemed to fit with his testimony. Gray said he couldn't explain it, but he knew what he'd done and he knew what she hadn't done. So the lawyer, though, said it didn't make sense with some of the physical evidence. To me, if you stab someone 19 times, you're going to have blood on them. It's going to be fucking everywhere.

One had blood on them, the other didn't. It tells me she wasn't near him when it happened. When you cut somebody's throat, a lot of blood happens, and anyone near there is going to have some blood on them. So Gray told the lawyer that Kennedy never went into the woods where Ronald was killed and that she never inflicted physical harm to him. They said that his head was nearly severed from his body. And they said that his testimony conflicted with the testimony in his trial. And they asked him, what made you tell the truth?

And he said, what i'd done was wrong huh i was trying to save my life there's no sense in me dragging someone else down for the crime i committed i'm trying to get right with the lord really i felt in my heart i needed to get the whole thing straightened out then he broke into tears and he talks about Ronald and said, I pray for this man. God is the only one who knows how truly sorry I am. I love people. People are what make up my world. I'm a people person. I shouldn't kill people. I'm the welcoming committee for my cell block because I'm the people guy. Yeah. He said that he wrote letters to the district attorney in which he said that he was in jail for a crime he didn't commit at first. He said, I wrote the letter seeking revenge against Tina, but I had a burden on my heart and decided to tell the truth.

You got revenge when the court found Tina guilty is what the district attorney said. And he said, no, sir, I didn't get my revenge. The court did. Okay. So he's asked again, why'd you change your mind? He said, I may be able to lie my way out in man's world, but not in God's world. I no longer fear what man can do to me, but I fear what God will do to me. How Southern.

That's very Southern. So that is denied a new trial, even though the other participant says that he did everything. Denied. Whoa. 84, though, she appeals again. And under this, they said that this is a very complicated legal matter in terms of her. The statement made to Officer Mason in response to a question was made at a time when the Sixth Amendment right to counsel had attached. So that was when she was already in jail.

made at a time when the Sixth Amendment right to counsel had attached. So that was when she was already in jail. Okay. So they're saying that she's claiming that anything questioned made without the benefit of presence of her attorney, because she had invoked her right to an attorney, that that doesn't count. So they're saying even though she was in jail, there was no Miranda at the time. It wasn't a formal questioning. She shouldn't have been able to do that. And that ended up being allowed into court.

Okay. So turning to the sentencing stage, counsel objected to the statement, um, to some of these statements, the, the, they said the record reflects the judge trial judges statement that the head

remark, meaning I tried to cut his head off is what brought the death penalty. And they're like, if you take that out, then it's just her word against his and it's a different thing. So they decide to reverse the sentencing phase and remand her for a new sentence. They take the death penalty out here.

Okay. They affirm the guilty verdict, but said that inappropriate death penalty given the misuse of her statement to a jailer, her age, and the fact that Gray, who physically committed the murder, was sentenced to death himself. So they say, yeah. Oh, boy. New sentencing comes around. Yeah.

She gets, you young lady may keep fucking off, one life sentence and two 25-year sentences. So may as well be death. Still a lot at the central Mississippi correctional facility. Inmate number four, two, four, five,

one. Yeah. Now the dissenting opinion of this that says they shouldn't have given her a new trial or they shouldn't have done this and reversed her sentence. They said the sixth amendment does not require 24 hour a day presence of counsel, nor do I believe that the Sixth Amendment provides authorities from or prevents authorities from asking a question of a defendant so long as the defendant is willing to answer and does not then invoke the right to answer except with the attorney present. I feel confident that the framers of the Constitution never intended that it would protect a defendant from her arrogant utterings voluntarily made with respect to the details of the crime committed by her.

Wow. Jesus, I want to shoot her in the face with a.25 myself. Fuck, this is just, wow, that's brutal. It was not only a confession of her guilt, but was an evidence of her lack of remorse, callous feeling, and depraved heart with respect to the crime with which she planned and enticed others into helping her commit. OK. 1985. Gray appeals and the United States Supreme Court overturns his death sentence and remands him for new sentencing.

Really? Yep. There is a whole. It's. Yeah. It's a whole big deal. Again, it's a very small things, but death penalty cases. That's right.

A woman at knife point. Raped a woman at knife point and then killed her boyfriend after the kidnap them from her home. So from their homes. Wow. So 1988 is new sentencing. He is mad because on sentencing, he's resentenced to life in prison as a habitual offender, which means no parole. Yeah. So it means that even if he gets paroled, they can still keep him. They can decide to keep him because he's a habitual offender, which means no parole. Yeah. So it means that even if he gets paroled,

they can still keep him. They can decide to keep him because he's a habitual offender. Yeah. He fucks up too much. So they say sentencing on Roman was conducted here. The sentencing jury failed to impose a sentence of death. Uh, his original indictment charged him with capital murder as a habitual

offender. So a bifurcated habitual offender status hearing was done here. Obviously. I mean, you've got to have one of those. How often have you done that? I mean, he says that since he's already been sentenced for the crime and since the state failed to press forward with habitual offender adjudication at the original trial, that's because they were going for death penalty,

it didn't matter. If you kill him, it doesn't matter if you parole him. The state should be precluded at resentencing from enhancing his life sentence with the habitual offender status. that's what they say the court disagrees though and says get the fuck out of here affirmed life in jail you're a habitual offender and eat shit basically so 1990. Wow. A film comes out about this. Really? It's a TV movie called Too Young to Die, question mark. Jesus. It's all about Athena.

Athena is the main thing about this. And guess who plays David and fucking Athena? Who? Brad Pitt and Juliette Lewis. Get out of here. Serious. Pitt and Juliette Lewis. Get out of here.

Serious. Brad fucking Pitt and Juliette Lewis are David and Athena. Unbelievable. David has some balls having Brad Pitt play him. You got Brad Pitt to play him? Young 1990 Brad Pitt. Young Brad Pitt. It is based on the true story, although it's a little bit different. It's this movie set in Oklahoma, and they keep referencing the gas chamber, which Oklahoma never even used the gas chamber and all of that kind of shit. The weird part of this is during this, Juliette Lewis was 16 and Brad Pitt was 26, and they started dating.

Is that right? Oh, that happened. They dated until 1993. Oh, my God, Brad. dating is that right oh that happened they dated till 1993 oh my god brad yep in 1989 which is the exact same ages as david and a team that's what's fucking creepy that's gross yep there yep and that's they ended up doing california in 1993 which was pretty much the same fucking movie it's natural born killers but different yeah that's yeah so um yeah they do all this the family ronald's family was super pissed off at this movie because they basically painted atina as a victim which to

show her life it's hard not to show her as a victim she's certainly a victim of the upbringing and the up until the fucking gulf coast up until she said let's get knives and go kill my boyfriend yeah you feel terrible for her right and then at that point it's awful so yeah they said they didn't like it and it pissed them off that she was painted that way march 9th 2008 she's up for parole oh boy for parole now her ronald's daughter posts on a site here about it. Oh, this is in 2008, January 2nd, 2008. So three months. One of the kids she left behind at the apartment. This is Dolly.

Yeah. Oh, Dolly said, I was very upset to find out that Tina is coming up for parole very soon. I was notified earlier this month by the Mississippi parole office. This upset me more than I can even say. I thought she got life without parole, but that's not the case. It really brought up all those feelings from back then. I think about my father all the time, but I was better thinking that she would never get out. And personally, the thought that she might be released kills me. I know she's been there for 25 years and that's a

long time. Some people may feel that she served her time, but my dad will never come back. I just don't feel like she should have the chance to live her life when he never will. My whole family and I have written letters, and my brother and I are hoping to attend her parole hearing if that's possible. I'm checking on that now. It's a little harder since we both live in South Carolina now. Anyway, I just felt like I needed to get my feelings out there about that. I do pray that she doesn't get released, but I guess overall I don't have control over that. i'm just going to do all i can to try and keep her there at least as long as possible thanks for listening dolly i feel so bad she's not even full of like hate or malice or anything she's just like i just want fucking i don't want society safe i don't

want to bump into this broad you know what i mean that's what it sounds like so um somebody then responds what's the likelihood that she'll actually be paroled and she says truthfully i really don't know i'm guessing she won't get it this time since it's the first time but i'm not sure really i hope she doesn't get out and then um on march 9th 2008 she is released from prison what paroled and get the fuck out of here that psycho's on the road yep and then later on she says quote unfortunately it's too late this is dolly again yeah i got a uh i i got a letter last week saying she did make parole i think her release date is march 8th it truly does kill me and i don't understand it was her first board and i really never thought

she would make this one. I figured they'd deny her at least once, but I guess since she's been there for 25 years, they decided to release her. They didn't even contact me until the first week in January to tell me she was even coming up for it. I did send my letter as well as other members of my family, so I did try. Not really much else I can do. Thanks for your concern. It means a lot. Wow.

First parole board. She also goes. First parole board. She's out. First. She goes by Amanda Sue Bradley nowadays, by the way. That's not even close. She changed her name to not be because her name is famous. David Gray, still in prison and looking old as shit now.

Looking like shit. Yeah, he's like 60 60 he's almost 70 now he's 69 but 69 and he's been in prison for 30 40 years 40 years that's a lot so he is in uh he is the mississippi id number 01440 if you want to keep up on him yeah he's at this point yeah it says he's in there for life the homicide is life and there's no release date and um yeah he's pretty fucked he also had other things too at the time that he got sentenced for that he was on the run from which was grand larceny in 1980 and aggravated assault in 1979 a wanted man committed a murder crazy wasn't a great guy to begin with so anyway that everybody is biloxi mississippi and one hell

of a fucking crazy little tale that is isn't it she's a monster man she is that's a dangerous person i mean get it back around it's terrible but at some point you know if the dog's biting people it's not the dog's fault but holy shit it bites everybody what do we do with it you know what i mean this is terrible so it's hard to do. There you go, everybody. If you like that show, tell the world about it. Yeah. Number one, get on social media and also tell your friends and give us a review on whatever app you're listening on. Helps drive us up the charts a lot.

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All your bonus material. This week, Donnie Moore for Crime and Sports, a tragedy of a mess of a downhill ski of a life for two years, just a mess. And then for Small Town Murder, the Menendez Brothers. You know all about them. And you get a shout-out at the end of the regular show. That said, it's been a wild one.

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