Small Town Murder - #54 - A Serial Slasher in Strathroy, Ontario, Canada

Episode Date: January 24, 2018

This week, in the seemingly quiet town of Strathroy, Ontario, Canada, where a serial killer earned the name "The Mad Slasher", as he terrorized the area for over two years. His crimes were horrific, but the handling of his cases by the legal system was almost as frustrating. This is a crazy story, with surprises around every turn! Along the way, we find out what goes on at a Turkey Festival, how easy it was to talk your way out of a 1970's murder interrogation, and how close a serial killer came to being released to the public!! Hosted by James Pietragallo & Jimmie Whisman New episodes every Thursday!!Please subscribe, rate, and review!Listen on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher, or wherever you listen to podcasts!Head to shutupandgivememurder.com for all things Small Town Murder!For merchandise: crimeinsports.threadless.comCheck out James and Jimmie's other show: Crime in Sports Follow us on social media!Facebook: facebook.com/smalltownpodInstagram: instagram.com/smalltownmurderTwitter: twitter.com/MurderSmall Contact the show: [e-mail] See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Small Town Murder early and ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. What if you married the love of your life and then stood by them as they developed 21 new identities? What would you do? This Is Actually Happening is a weekly podcast that features extraordinary true stories of life-changing events told by the people who lived them. Listen to the newest season of This Is Actually Happening on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. This week, we look at Strathroy, Ontario, Canada, where a man that would come to be known as the Mad Slasher terrorized the area for over two years. back to Small Town Murder.

Yay, indeed, Jimmy. Yay, indeed. My name is James Petrigallo. I'm here with my co-host. I'm Jimmy Lissman. Thank you, folks, so much for joining us. No kidding. We're pumped. We're excited for Small Town Murder, as always. A couple things right off the top here.

Threadless. Crimeinsports.threadless.com is where you can get all of your Small Town Murder merchandise, shirts, mugs, bath mats, you name it, all the sayings, all the logos, anything you could possibly want. Also, quick plugs here, Boston, February the 18th in Boston, 1 p.m. show added for Small Town Murder. Hurry up, because those tickets are selling out pretty quickly. The 7 p.m. is already sold out.

If you can't get in either of those, Crime and Sports at 4 o'clock. If you're not listening to Crime and Sports, I don't know what is wrong with you. If you enjoy this and you enjoy us, you like that. You don't have to care about sports. Do you care about geography of town? No, but you like this. It's the same thing. Listen to the show.

Come out and see us at 4 o'clock in Boston at Laugh Boston. Also, Phoenix, March 25th at Stand Up Live. All these tickets, links are going to be in the show descriptions. Come to that one. That's our hometown, so it's going to sell fast, fast, fast. Get on that. I believe Detroit with Dan Cummins is about that one. That's our hometown. So it's going to sell fast, fast, fast. Get on that. I believe Detroit with Dan Cummins is about sold out. It's close.

The stand-up show is just about sold out, but the podcast, it's close. So come to the late show. If you want to come, fucking you better get on the ball now. That's February 16th. Besides all that, thank you guys for iTunes reviews this week. Thank you so much, guys. We pushed over 9,000. Unbelievable.

Which is huge. We are pushing toward 10,000. And when we get to 10,000, we will do a bonus episode. There you go. You always said, well, you do bonus episodes based on, it's like, guys, we do four and a half hours of podcast a week. It's so hard to do. We just don't have time.

I don't have time to research for bonus episodes and all this sort of thing. Think about talking for an entire half day at your job. Solid. Straight. Just never stopping. Yeah. talking for an entire half day at your job. Solid. Straight. Just never stopping. And yeah, that's what we're doing. It's very hard to do. And all that research just puts 60 hours of reading behind that too.

So it's a lot to do. James is overworked, you guys. We're going to do this though. But we're going to do it. $10,000, we're going to do a bonus for you guys. You're welcome. Because that's incredible. Thank you guys.

And you're welcome. Yeah. If you have not done it yet, please get on iTunes and give us that review. They help out immensely. iTunes, funky algorithm we've talked about. It's not our fault. Say anything you want, but the five stars are really important on the business end. The quicker you get there, the quicker James gets there.

And then we get a bonus episode. Also, everyone that contributed this week on Patreon. Ridiculous. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. You guys are killing it for us, and we just can't do the show without you. Yeah. So we're blown away byulous. Thank you, thank you, thank you. You guys are killing it for us,

and we just can't do the show without you. So we're blown away by it. Thank you so much. We have a long list of shout-outs of our producers, our executive producers. And there are new ones, by the way. There's so many new ones. Just so everybody knows. Thank you, guys.

If you're donating, we get your money. Definitely. I promise you we're getting it. Thank you, guys. And this week, this is the new people that just signed up this week. Awesome. And if you want to make a one-time donation, you can do that over at PayPal.

No problem. Oh, God. Every dime counts, and it's immensely appreciated. You can just use our email address, crimeinsports at gmail.com to do that. And quickly, next week, podcast coming back. P.S. I hate this movie. There you go. Myself, my wife, Sarah Hunt.

We do a funny podcast where we rip apart romantic comedy movies and make fun of them, and I am just livid and ranting the whole time. You guys hear what you're doing to James? If you enjoy that, yeah, there's that too. So check that out. That's going to be the week of the 25th of January, I believe, so get on that. Besides all that shit, Jimmy, never mind all

of that. We have to do it. We have to do the disclaimer, guys. We have to do it, guys. This is a comedy podcast. It is. And we have to say, because we still get messages. We don't say this because we say horrible things and make fun of dead babies and things. That's not why we give a disclaimer. It's not that bad.

It's not that bad, as we say. We give a disclaimer because no matter what, we get messages saying, how dare you make jokes about murder? Period. How dare you have a show that has murder and jokes in the same show? And kiss our asses, honestly. How dare you listen to it? You know what?

We tell you what it is. It says what it is in the description. We tell you right now. If you're still listening, guess what? You're on board. You're just as big a part of the problem as we are. Okay? So enjoy the show.

Kick back. Have a good time. And if you don't like true crime and comedy to be together and you never think they should be together, stop goddamn listening. Turn it off. Unsubscribe. You're not going to like it. Right. OK.

And if you want to just have a good time, have some fun. Right. And you know what, too? We're respectful. Yeah. We go out of our way to never make jokes about the victims or the victims' families. We are assholes, but we're not scumbags. True.

So hang in there with us. We're going to have a good time, besides my craziness. Never mind all that shit. It's time to shut up and give you murder, guys. Let's do this. All right. Let's go on a trip, Jimmy. Fantastic.

What do you say? Last week we were in Wyoming. With the Wyomingers. Jesus, in a trailer park in Wheatland, Wyoming. Boy, that was some bleak, bleak stuff right there. Wow. That was depressing. Working on the hog farm, and I'm like, oh, Wyoming. Boy, that was some bleak, bleak stuff right there. Wow. That was depressing. Man, working on the hog farm, and I'm like, oh, boy.

Tainted ass water. Tainted. Yeah, I was like, this is bumming me out. So let's get out and let's pack it up. All right. You got all your stuff? Yeah. You ready to get your phone charger?

You've left it constantly. We're going somewhere cold, aren't we? We're going somewhere cold. Get your park on. Long John's. Let's go. Let's go. We are going to Canada.

All right. Never mind cold. Perfect. And ha-ha, by the way, everybody who's like, oh, this state and that state. Threw a curveball at us, assholes. That's right. Going to Canada this time. Long John's with the butt flap.

Let's haul ass. That's right. Yes. We have some Canadian connections lately, so we're going to do a Canada episode in honor of this here. We're going to Strathroy, Ontario, Canada. Strathroy. Strathroy, Ontario, Canada.

It's southern Ontario. Ontario is kind of where Toronto is and all of that kind of above Buffalo and New York and all that sort of thing. This is where Canada goes slumming. This is where it dips into U.S. airspace. You know what I mean? You see it above the Great Lakes there and you see some Canada dipping down. You're like, oh, boy, those poor bastards practically live in America. That's where we're at right now.

Well, I've seen recently on a map that Detroit is damn near Canada. Detroit pretty much is Canada. I didn't realize how close it is to Canada. It's legitimately across a lake from it. It is. Oh, absolutely. And that's the thing. Across a bridge. People who live in Toronto and who live in Canada, they go, like, they say, oh, we go to Detroit for concerts all the time and all that sort of thing.

Like, Detroit is like an accessible city for them right there. It's right there. I would have never thought that. To me, like, I don't know, when you think about it, you think of a border as like this solid thing. You wouldn't just drive back and forth across it. But it's like, yeah, you can, I guess. Hear that, too.

People go from like Vancouver to Seattle and back for the night. And I'm like, how do they do that? Because it's fine. That's why. Because all the Canadians, they crouch right on our border. That's what it is. They do. They just crouch the warmest possible area.

Get close to that line as you can. It's warm down there, guys. When you're camping, everybody's around the fire. Have you seen up north? Yeah. It's Toco there. Toco there. Head to the fucking, just get down by Idaho.

We don't care. It doesn't matter if it's a shit state. It's fine. As close as we get to warmth. That's right. And this place here, two and a half hours to Buffalo, about two hours, 15 minutes to Toronto, two hours to Buffalo. About two hours, 15 minutes to Toronto. Two hours to Detroit.

So it's all these major cities. It's within three hours of it. About 40 minutes outside of London, Ontario, which is a pretty big city there also. So it's kind of a suburb out in that area there. It's in Middlesex County. This is a big area, 106 square miles for this town. What is Middlesex named after? Do we even know? It's a British thing.

Well, I mean, I assumed, but there are so many Middlesex in this world. There is a lot of Middlesex. Everything, it's so funny, England is this little tiny country that everything is named after everywhere in the world. Everything they've got there, everything else is named after England. Half of our cities are named after English cities and towns and people and kings and lords and, you know, bewigged douchebags from time past. Who knows? Jesus. I think that's going to be the tattoo I get.

Bewigged douchebags. That's the one. That's the one, everybody. I like it. So it's in, like I said, Middlesex County, 106 square miles. And that's because they've kind of, as they call it, amalgamated with another town. Okay. That was of 2001, but we'll get to that.

We'll get to that. 274 kilometers for all you Canadians out there. That's a great word. Amalgamated, yes. That's adorable. I saw that. I was like, what the fuck does that mean? I actually was like, I don't know what that means.

And then I read it, and I was like, oh, context. All right, I get what it means. This is actually a, there's no, like you say, postal code or zip code we always give. This is a forward sortation area. Fuck. It's a geographical region in which all postal codes start with the same three characters. The first letter of an FSA code denotes a particular postal district which outside of Quebec and Ontario corresponds to an entire province or territory. I don't know what that means.

Exactly. That was a lot of words to say they don't have their own. Their postal code is NG7, or N7G. That's what it meant. It's not a long postal code. It's just a prefix of a postal code. Just a forward one. That's pretty much a forward sortation area.

Strange. I spent an hour on that, so who's an asshole here? Area code 519 and 226. Okay. And motto. They have a6. Okay. And motto. They have a motto. Fantastic. Town motto, quote, we advance.

Where? What? What? That's not enough information. Two words. That's all they're giving us? That is not enough information. That sounds like somebody got interrupted.

Yeah, no punctuation, nothing. There was a dude sitting there writing, we advance. And they're like- They had a heart attack and died on his desk. They just put it on the website. Somebody's like, there's a moose in the yard. He's like, I'll come back to this. They were like, it's the last thing Bill ever wrote.

We can't change it. We can't change it. It's the last thing he wrote. Come on. That's what happened. We advance. Bill, there's a moose in the yard. And then he went out there.

The moose killed him. And they were like, he wrote this. They're so damn nice in Canada, too. They were like, well, we can't change his last words. And then they just made it happen. That's it. You know that's what happened. Yes.

The town is now Strathroy Caradoc these days here. They merged in 2001, these two towns, for some goddamn reason. Just recently. Yeah, 2001. I don't know why. The industry's in this town big on turkey and chicken hatching and processing. Hatching. And processing.

I've never heard of that being an industry. There's a turkey. I mean, obviously, it's got to be. There's a turqueria, I guess you could call it, where they hatchery. Turqueria. I don't know where that is. A turqueria. That would be like something Spanish.

It's a cafeteria where turkeys eat. That's what it is. They all come on in. They pull up a tray. They move. I just saw a carniceria, like a Spanish. Oh, eat. That's what it is. They all come on in. They pull up a tray. They move. I just saw a carniceria, like a Spanish. Oh, okay. You know what I mean?

But they only do turkeys. That's it. Only turkeys. I saw turkeys with their trays on the thing going like a cafeteria or someone's slopping. They're slopping shit on their plates. And they move along. I don't know why that's what I thought of. That's as mature as I am.

Also, corn, tobacco. There's some pharmaceutical things around here, that sort of thing. Well, if you farm tobacco, you're going to need some pharmaceuticals. Yes, that's what I'm saying. You're going to need something here and all that chicken and turkey. It's a lot of industry here. There's jobs here, that sort of thing. Now, Strathroy itself, because we're going to talk about that because that's where this all happened because we're going to go back in time a little bit on this one here. This region

itself, though, was settled. They can trace everything back to about 8,000 B.C. Holy shit! So they go, yeah, early natives had a lot of the trails for the natives. I'm an idiot. You're like, there's people back then? I'm so fucking stupid.

I just heard you say that, and I'm like, well, why didn't they live down here? Why didn't they just come here? Of course they did. Holy Christ, I'm dumb. They're everywhere, Jimmy. I just saw the whitest, nicest people from 8,000 B.C. and going, why didn't those idiots The whitest, nicest people?

Ladies and gentlemen, my partner, Andrew Jackson. I just saw nice white people. Not none of these dirty engines. I didn't see no dirty engines. I mean the French Canadians. I just saw a bunch of French Canadians up there. With their fire water all over them. I saw nice white people.

I didn't see none of that. That's terrible. Christ, I'm dumb. That's amazing. I'm like, what? How did they do that? The French came real early over here. They claimed all that white shit up there, but then forgot to get the nice part.

That's it. That's why they fucked up. That's what happened. That's a problem when that happens here. Holy shit. A lot of the trails that the natives had actually turned into the main roads in the area. They came in and they were like, yeah, good idea. They had it right.

They carved it perfect. That's where I would have put it too. Perfect town design. Yeah, nice layout. What is that? No, that's mapping. Never mind. I'm not even going to get into this.

It's by the French or by white people here in Strathmore. Nice white people. Nice white people came and settled in 1832. A guy named John Stewart of Buchanan. Yeah. He had a guy with him named Sir Michael Jacques. Yeah. And they started hanging out there.

Yeah. The Sydenham River, they flowed through there, and that made enough power to power a gristmill. Oh. Oh. Got to get the gristmill. What is a gristmill? It's for, I had to look this up. Okay.

I'm saying it like, you know, it's like this, but I actually had to look this up. It's any kind of processing of grain, flour mostly, mainly flour. That's what I got out of the whole definition. These, by the way, were not nice white people. These were horrible. Oh, they were slaughtering people, giving diseases. Just complete dicks. The rape guys so much.

I just, just rape, rape a native girl, throw her in the woods. It's horrible. And then, and then they created a grain mill that is showing them, look, we will fucking process the shit out of this wheat. Now work in there. We're cheap. You go make the wheat and we'll process the shit out of it. That's right.

Or else we'll rape your daughters. Nice white people. That's what that is. They're so kind. They opened, there's a general store opened in 1840. Yeah. When a general store opens, that's when you know shit's starting. That's when shit's happening.

Yeah, there's enough people to buy shit. Right. So you know what's going on there. Strathroy was finally incorporated as a village in 1860, became a town in 1872, and that is where they found, that's all the way back then is where they got that motto, we advance. Really? Right away, 1872 on, we advance. It where they got that motto. We advance right away. 1872 on.

We advance. It's a fucking war motto. That's what it is. That's kind of what it is. Yeah. Yeah. If you heard that from like an army advance, you'd be like, OK, there you go. That's terrifying.

Yeah. It's now I this this town here, by the way, was named as we always these fucking names always Buchanan. That guy named it for his hometown of Strathroy in Ireland. So, of course, no originality. Nothing changed about it or anything? Across the ocean, all the way over. Strathroy, that's what we're going to call it here.

1866, they got a newspaper, which is a big deal. Once again, you get a newspaper, a general store, things are popping. Now, Sir Arthur Currie was born there. He was the commander of the Canadian forces during World War I in Europe, a commander there. He was born in 1875 there. So there's some people that come from here. 1896, the Strathroy Furniture Company opened up, made furniture for a long time, and everyone

loved it and apparently made some amazing, amazing furniture there. Immigration after the World War's immigration started here. Mainly, though, mainly just nice white people. Of course. Don't worry, Jimmy. Don't worry. Hungarians, Portuguese and the Dutch came in a lot. You know what I was just thinking about is that you said that a newspaper started and

I just started thinking about the de-evolution of journalism. Oh, yeah. Don't you? Isn't it weird that it's like gone the opposite way? Yeah. Like when it first started – Well, the journalism was terrible back then too though. Yeah. They just made shit up.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. They just made up stories. But now it's just all gossip. Now it's gossip, yeah. That's crazy that it – you'd think that you give somebody a pen and paper and tell them write the news. They'd write something like so-and-so's fucking so-and-so's wife. You know what I mean?

That's where you think it would start. That's the news people want. That's the sad part. That's when people get together. Yeah. When people get together and gossip, they don't talk about politics. No. They gossip about-

Who's fucking who? Yeah, these two are fucking. Did you know that? Yeah, I knew that. Yeah, and his wife doesn't even know about it, blah, blah, blah. And now that's what journalism has gotten to. They've turned that into, yeah. With TMZ and so-and-so was caught with so-and-so, whatever.

Journalism turned into a business in the 80s. Never mind. I'm not going to get into the political aspect of it. Sorry. We deregulate media. That's what happens. My point is that you'd think it would go the opposite way. That it would start with that shit.

It would be an evolution. Right. And get to and evolve to just the facts. It's more like waves. It goes in waves of journalism's good and then journalism sucks. And it depends on the time period. It's like turn of the 20th century, journalism was awful. It was just the yellow journalism era where they'd just write anything.

Anything at any time, whatever pays. Anything, just because there was 14 newspapers in every city. So they were standing on the corner going, extra, extra. Yeah, a guy got his head cut off and stuffed in a thing so they'd all have to make sure. Whatever moves papers. That's it. All right there. 1954, the most important thing that could happen in a Canadian city happened.

The West Middlesex Memorial Arena opened where they could play hockey. Perfect. So that's the most important thing there. The Canadians beat the Junior B team, the Strathroy Rockets, 14 to 3 in that game, which is expected from an NHL team beating a Junior B team. You know, that sort of thing here. The town is home. It's the headquarters of Cuddy Farms, which is the world's top turkey hatching company.

It's the top turqueria in the world. They make the most. It's the most turkeys hatch here, goddammit. 2001, the town's amalgamated with Karadak here. Now, Strathroy had 12,000 people to its own, and then they added Karadak's people, and they got about 20,000 people. Notable people from this town, by the way, I would say 80% of them on the list are fucking hockey players. Hate to stereotype you guys, Canadians, but when 90% of the notable people from everywhere have to do with hockey, at that point it's on you guys.

You care way too fucking much about hockey. I'm sorry. There's no town in America that has 90% football players. 90% basketball players. The only people that came from there. No, this is just all hockey. Hockey and some parliamentary guy from the 1800s or something. Nothing fancy.

Population is just under 21,000 right now. 20,978, that's in Strathroy, Karadak proper. The whole thing here, 12,000 in Strathroy. Now the stats, another thing, Canada, guys, the stats you guys keep aren't, you have them, but God damn it are they hard to find. Really? I have to go through government documents. Really?

Yeah, you need to really get this a little better. To get population or crime? God damn it, are they hard to find. Really? I have to go through government documents. Really? Yeah. You need to really get this a little better. To get population or crime? To get stats for things. Everything. Everything, except for population. That's on there. That's on Wikipedia. Yeah, exactly.

That's easy. Everything else is awful. Oh, everything else is really difficult. And the same thing with the case. Jesus Christ, guys, with your records, man. Digitize that shit, for me at least. For the love of God. It's like Canada didn't exist before about 2001 on

the internet. No documents exist. Was there a war for the paper records here, too? I think so, yeah. Somebody just destroyed them all. Somebody came over from the other town's county seat and was like, we're the county seat now, and just took everything, burned it. And then did it with every county seat in the entire country. Burned everything.

Females outnumber the males here by a little more than average. Weird age groups here. There's a lot of old people. There is more people over 65 than there are under 14. Really? Which is a... That's skewing old, I would say, at that point.

That's definitely skewing old. The most people are in the group of 50 to 59 years old, which that tells you a lot right there. A lot of 60 to 69, a lot of 70 to 79. They have 900 people over 80 in this town, too. Holy shit. It's a very old town. Yeah.

It seems like as far as that goes. Most of the people speak English here, from what I found. About 135 people speak French, which you would expect. I would expect more than that, honestly. Yeah, that's pretty low. But I think that's their native tongue is what we're talking here, not just what they speak. It is now. Yeah, exactly.

Yeah, and then a lot of people speak other languages there also. Many more married than not married. It's way over. In Canada, that's the other thing. I couldn't find averages very easily. So I'm comparing this to the U.S., and we're different countries, so it's very difficult. But here it's about 50-50 on marriage. There it was way more than that as far as married goes.

Yeah, a lot of married people. But it's odd because there's so many more married people, but there's an equal number of couples with and without kids, which is a strange stat, I thought. So they're responsible, I guess, is what they're doing. They're not knocking each other up willy-nilly up there. Free health care is what it is. You think they'd be knocking each other up like crazy then? They can have kids for free. Pump them out.

The ladies are very careful with their parts, and they watch over them a little more carefully. I don't know how to fucking say it. They scared of moose invasions or something? No, no. My wife got raped by a moose last week and I'm not, we're moving. I'm not so sure that one's mine. I don't think, he's got antlers, let's just say that. I'm just saying they have healthcare and it's very accessible and they can go get checked,

not Jesus, get checked. They can get birth control. Right. Yes, that's what, get checked. They can get birth control. Yes, that's what you're saying. They can get a checkup. They have more control, whether than if you live in, say, a Mississippi trailer park or something where you don't have access to health care and especially good health care. And Bubba's drunk and you know he's going to be horny. I've got to take care of Bubba.

Every time he comes home, he's so horny. He gets in a fight at the bar, comes home horny. And he says, sit on it. And then he doesn't tell me when he's going to finish. And I'm still sitting. And nine months later, we got Bubba the third. We got six kids in a single wide. And we'll say that from last week where they had three kids in a single wide, which Jesus Christ.

And it was tainted water. It was. And I couldn't even. I can't believe that. I couldn't even let him drink the water. I can't believe that. Jobs here. Like we said, you can work at the turqueria. The hatchery is open. You can do that. You can do that. There can't believe that. Jobs here, like we said, you can work at the Turk-a-ria.

The Hatchery is open. You can do that. You can do that. There's a lot of other jobs here, a lot of industry. There's a lot of pharmaceutical sales. Like we said, they make manufactured drugs there. A lot of trade-related things, I guess, because it's down on the border. So there's probably a lot, you know.

Yeah. Intercontinental shipping. In and out shipping and that sort of thing. Not intercontinental. Not the intercontinental champion. No. The intercontinental champion lives there. out shipping and that sort of thing. International, not intercontinental. Not the intercontinental champion. No. The intercontinental champion lives there. Jesus, I'm an idiot today.

I don't know what I'm doing. I don't know what I'm doing. I don't know what I'm doing. No. That's the most honest thing ever. I don't know what I'm doing. I wish more people in this world would just stop and go, I don't know what I'm doing. You ever gone out and watch somebody struggle with something?

Like watch a waiter try to fill an order, and you're just like, if he just stopped and said, excuse me, I don't know what I'm doing, it would make everyone feel better, I feel like. We'd all go, okay, so we're all on the same page. We thought you thought you knew what you were doing, which scared me. Next time you're sat down by HR and they go, why did you do? I don't know what I'm doing. I honestly don't know what I'm doing. I have no idea what I'm doing.

Clearly, or I wouldn't have done that, obviously. I did tell the nurses that when they told me after two days to go ahead and take my child home, you're going to be released and discharged now. And I was like, I don't know what I'm doing. I don't know how to do that. I'm not leaving unless one of you fucks are coming with me. Because this is going to die. Somebody help us.

This is going to die. We're going to leave it somewhere. It's just going to, I don't know what to do. Where's the closest fire department? I hope she does. Right. I pray to Christ she knows what she's doing. I hope being pregnant gives you magic knowledge.

I can't absorb. I don't know. My God. Magic knowledge that I can't absorb. I don't know. My God. Median household income here, and this is in Canadian dollars, I assume, which there's an exchange rate. It's about 70% of U.S. money right now, I believe.

To me, worthless. I think it's 71 cents to the dollar or something like that. But their median household income here is about $71,500, which in America it's about $54,000. But if you take away the 30%, I think it's about – It's close to that. It's about the same. It's an average place. It's an average suburb of a big city. It feels like it's like outside of Minneapolis or something, honestly, when I did all the research on this town.

That's what it feels like. It doesn't feel like an exotic foreign place, but it's Canada. There's no exotic foreign places. Nothing exotic. Unless you go to like Yukon territory. There's a 14 foot snowdrift. That's exotic. That's exotic as fuck.

That's exotic. I don't know anything about that here. But there's also a lot of people with a lower income here that I've noticed. A lot of a lot of a lot in the like 20 to 40 thousand dollar range. Yeah. And then there's a lot like 10 to 20,000, which I assume is probably students, elderly people, things of that nature, I would imagine also. Cost of living? Can't find cost of living for shit.

Really? As far as the indexes and that sort of thing. It was very difficult to find that. So we'll just do it even up like we're talking about America here. The average monthly shelter cost for an owned dwelling there. That's what I mean. Simplify this shit. It sounds so basic.

It's $1,021 Canadian dollars. So that seems about like here. The median value of a home in this area is about $250,000, which is higher than the $185,000 here. But once again, you take the 30%. It's Minneapolis suburb right here. And if we've convinced you that no other place for you will do except for Strathroy, Ontario, Canada, we have for you the Strathroy, Ontario, Canada Real Estate Report.

Brathroy, Ontario, Canada. Real Estate Report. We have a two-bedroom, one-bath, lovely brick, a lovely small brick home. It's L-shaped. How many square feet? They do not. This is the other thing on these. Every Canadian listing, they do not list square feet.

What the fuck? There's no square footage. There's not even like a square kilometer. There's nothing? There's no square footage. There's not even like a square kilometer. There's nothing. There's no measurement of how big it is. It just tells you. They don't even put in centimeters for you? It tells you bedrooms and baths, and then you're Canadian, and you should know. Right.

That's it. You just go, oh, that's good enough for me, I guess. A bedroom and a bathroom, they're all the same size here. That's good enough for me. That's okay. It's got a toilet and two beds, eh? It's got four baths and four beds. That's good.

That's all right. We'll make do. I feel like that's what they do. We'll make do. It's got a toilet and two beds, eh? It's got four beds. That's good. You know, it's all right. We'll make do. Like, I feel like that's what they do. We'll make do. It's good. They're so nice. They're so nice. It also has an attached workshop.

Fantastic. $239,900. I found a five-bedroom, four-bath home. Wow. No idea how big it is, but it looks pretty damn big here. New roof and new hardwood floors in this bad boy. $399,900. Very nice. That's like $1,450 here. That's not bad. Yeah, that's not a bad thing. And I also found a six bedroom,

four bath, super weird looking house with like a funky like design in the front. Super weird and different. Pretty cool looking damn house. $499,000 up there. It's a big house too. Like I said, six bedroom, four bath. So get your ass up there to Canada and get in on that. Things to do. Okay. Things to do might just make you move to Canada and buy one of these homes here. It is home. Strathroy is home to the Strathroy Hometown Turkey Festival.

Of course it is. As if you didn't know here. Right. It's Strathroy's largest event. It's also known as Turkey Fest. Turkey Fest. And that's in June. I have a couple of, let's see how they describe it, shall we?

It is sure to be a terrific year for the festival with plenty of exciting attractions, including the fabulous Show and Shine car show, kicking off the weekend featuring over 300 cars and motorcycles in the downtown streets of Strathroy. Wow. They got cars? We're going. Get the kids. Get them in the truck.

Plus, very popular events like Karaoke Idol, a full assortment of vendors in our local lane. What? A wide range of entertainment on our beer garden main stage and an awesome midway that was new to the festival last year and received positive community response. And, of course, the traditional carnival games, cotton candy and ice cream. Jesus. That's not it, though, because I found an ad for-

You are selling it. That's not all. That's not all. I found an ad for a band that was playing this, that they were advertising that they're going to be in this festival. And who are they? This is Canada's Kiss Tribute Band, Sonic Boom. Oh, my God.

I've heard of them. You have? Jesus Christ. They fucking tour America, too. Wow. They'll be there headlining night have? They fucking tour America, too. They'll be there headlining night two of the festival, Saturday, June 17th. If you can't get enough of the real Kiss, when Kiss doesn't come to your town, we fucking will. We got these guys. For a fucking discounted rate.

And they say, quote, we can't wait to rock Strathroy like never before. Because Kiss has never been to Strathroy. Strathroy's own Basement Bound will be opening the show. So they got like a local opener. They're throwing 50 bucks like he's a comic. Basement Bound. That's fantastic. They're going to do two fucking songs up front.

Quote, we want to see all, all capitalize of the Western Ontario Kiss Army out at this one. Oh my God. You're not Kiss, sir. The Kiss Army. You are Sonic Boom. The Kiss Army show up for the not Kiss. Not Kiss. Oh, this sucks. You're not Kiss, sir. The Kiss Army. You are so- The Kiss Army show up for the not Kiss. Not Kiss. Oh, this sucks.

You're not Kiss. What the fuck? But they're so nice in Canada, they just be like, they think they're Kiss. Just try it real hard. Just tell them they're Kiss. It's okay. It's okay. You know, maybe they think they're really Kiss.

I wouldn't want to really ruin them. You know what I mean? I wouldn't want to ruin their psyche. So nice up there. God damn it. So they've got a car show, fake Kiss. They've got- Turkeys. Turkeys. Watch the turkeys hatch, everybody. And carnival games. God damn it. So they've got a car show, fake kiss. They've got turkeys. Turkeys.

Watch the turkeys hatch, everybody. And carnival games. That's it. This is fucking- Largest festival in town, guys. Woo-hoo. They've got a fucking- Yeah.

Ren fair. That's it. They've got the Ren fair with kiss. You know there's turkey legs, too. You know there's big giant turkey legs. That's probably all they have. Crime rate. Well, we're interested in this town.

It's a low crime rate here, actually. Well, compared to America. See, that's the thing. In Canada, I don't know what the crime rates are. Compared to here, it's a wonderland. It's like Disneyland up there. And it's so cute, too. I found a local crime map, and it had little icons of the crimes on it.

And it's so Canadian and adorable, I have to say. They had little icons for the crimes. They had a little weed leaf for a drug offense. Which I found offensive. How about a needle weed leaf for a drug offense. Really? Which I found offensive. How about a needle? Put a needle on there. How about something fucking that hurts people? How about a needle?

For theft, they had a little dude, like a little silhouette of a dude with a sack over his shoulder like Santa got busted. It was very adorable, I have to say. So, you know, low crime rate. Or they go to fucking Microsoft Paint and just find some cheap fucking icons. It was like a silhouette of a chimney sweep that got greedy. You know what I mean? That's what it was.

Swear to God. Now, Strathroy there. Now, let's go back in time. We talked about Strathroy. We talked about a current day. We talked about this. Back then, there was only about 5,000 people in Strathroy. It's a much smaller town, about half the size.

We're going to go all the way back. We've gone through the plain notes. Calendar pages are flipping. They're going back. Clocks are spinning. We're spinning around. Lots of clouds. Clouds and things happening.

All the way back to 1974. Holy shit. We're going to go. Let's go back in time, guys. We've been doing a lot of current in the last 10 years lately. And I was like, I need that 70s feel again. Yeah. We need that dirty 70s grimy.

Yeah. Everybody with big- Your pheromones reeking out of your dick. And just sticking in your giant bush of pubic hair. You know what I mean? Just one of those. But tight enough jeans so that that stuff doesn't come out until you open the fly. And then it blossoms like a flower at that point.

It's just a pube flower. Bang. Take that to the turquoise. That's a great time to be alive, too, because everybody looked like they had a huge dick. That's true. It was just all a quaff of girlies. Tight pants and pubes. Yeah, nowadays, the last few years, it's tight pants, but everyone's got no pubes, so that's not going to help any.

So it just looks like Ken dolls. Yes, exactly. Can we loosen up the pants a little bit, too? I hope they do. Just a drop. I hope they do. Just an inch. Just take an inch out.

I want my balls to be comfortable. Is that possible? Can I have my balls comfortable and not look like a fucking weirdo? Is that a thing? I don't want a ball on each side of the seam. I don't enjoy that. No, I don't need that. That's not good.

So anyway, we're going back March 1st, 1974. Yeah. Now, Strathroy, like I said, different time't need that. That's not good. So anyway, we're going back March 1st, 1974. Yeah. Now, Strathroy, like I said, different time, different place. Canada now, as you can imagine, is considered pretty damn safe. Yeah. Like, I know people that are Canadian, and I know people that don't lock their doors that live in cities in Canada. Really?

They're just like, yeah, you don't need to. What? It's just an... And I know there's crime up there, and there's horrible things that happen everywhere, but way less like toronto for a big city comparable to like one of our big cities there's nothing like it there's not it's just there's nothing like it and there is crime and there's poverty and there's all that sort of thing but compared to america it is just like wow this is quaint that's nuts to me though. It's a big city. We live in a pretty big city here. Five million people?

We just had a fucking serial killer caught last week. Well, they have that. I didn't even know about this guy. I've been locking my doors for years. Yeah, oh, absolutely. They didn't even put this fucker on the news until they caught him. No, but this is a different time and a different place. And this is, like I said, now in Canada.

Everybody's nice and everyone's not. And I think, too, their media is a different time and a different place. And this is, like I said, now in Canada, everybody's nice and everyone's not. And I think, too, their media is a lot different. Their media doesn't pump out. It's not constant bleeds. It leads media there also, which I've seen like their news and stuff. It's way different than it is here. OK. Way fucking different than it is here.

Do they do like the weathertop list? That kind of news? No, no, no. They do like serious news, like serious, like adults. That's what they do. They don't have like, and we'll find out right now what's going on with Hugh Jackman. No, that's not the fucking news, okay? You can keep your brownie recipes to yourself.

This is what I'm talking about. It's not horseshit. We're going to show you a video of the maids doing horrible shit in your hotel room. What are the Real Housewives of New Orleans up to this week? Let's find out after the break. That's not what they're doing up there. It's like British news. If you watch British news, if you watch the BBC.

And I think a lot of that, too, is because I guess this is not political, but it's government funded. So they have the rules where you have to be serious. You can't just go fuck off. And the other thing is they don't have to make a profit. So they're not going after. That would be great. Well, that's how it was in this country until the 90s. Until they made... Until the 80s... See, this is what I mean.

Don't want to be political, but it's not political. Don't make it political. Just go... The party that was in charge in the 80s decided that it was a good idea to make media entertainment, basically. They decided that equal... It's not political. That's called honesty.

They decided equal time wasn't a good idea. Right. We had equal time clauses and all that sort of thing. They decided that wasn't a good idea, and that's where Fox News came from, by the way, and also MSNBC on both sides. This isn't a political thing, like I said. CNN, too. It's everything.

Okay, never mind all of this. Never mind all that. What I'm saying is the news up there is different. People are less scared. It's a different thing completely. It took way longer than I wanted to to say the news is different, but you get what we're saying here. March 1st, 1974. I want to go the BBC route of topless news or topless weather.

What is that one? That's in Scandinavian countries. That's the one I want. I don't care if it's dudes or women. I just think it's fucking hysterical and it's freeing. Fucking do it that way. I'm sure in Estonia they just tell, you know, the girl, the woman doesn't even want to. They're just like, you do topless.

You do topless. And she's like, okay, I do topless. I don't want to get stoned. That's all it is. Yeah, there. She's like, okay, I do. Or else she's going to be. She talks.

Okay, I do. She talks like she's smoking. She does. She's from Estonia. I don't think she's allowed, actually. No, she's like, you smoke more. Keep you skinny. That's what they say.

Keep you skinny. Keep breasts looking good and perky. You go out and say, partly cloudy here on my breast, and then you come back. We give you more cigarettes. Okay, camera on. You go action. That's how it works over there. You go action. Holy shit.

I think I captured that guy's essence. Wow, that was perfect. So March 1st, 1974. And that guy in America directs porn. Yes, exactly. Hey, everybody. Just going to take a quick break from the show to tell you about one of our favorite sponsors, Lisa Mattresses. Lisa.com.

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And now, back to our show. March 1st, 1974. There's a 19-year-old young lady named Judith Barksley. She's at a pizza restaurant in Strathroy. And this is why I say all that was for a reason. We mentioned all that in the news and people being less scared because it's a different time. She leaves a pizza restaurant. It's at night. Yeah.

It's a chilly, cold, really cold night, too. It's March 1st. Yeah, March 1st in Canada. June in Canada is still chilly. Like almost summer, eh? It's sweater time still. It's the 1st to the 14th of August. We're going to have a hell of a time there.

That's going to be a good one. It's going to be summer like you've never seen before. We'll play in the salt remnants of the snow. I'm going swimming. I'm going to go see Sonic Boom over at the Turkey Festival, eh? They're opening the hatcheria to the public. Holy shit. She is leaving a pizza place at night, and she's 19 years old, so I mean, she's not like

a little kid, but she has no ride. Right. It's dark, and people here are scared to walk in the dark at 19, you know, home in a city and that sort of thing. It's a small town, but still, like, it's dark. Especially women. Yeah, that's what I mean. Women don't want to fucking walk along in the dark.

No, I don't fucking blame them either. I don't blame them. But I mean, this is a small town in Canada right now. You couldn't feel any safer, probably. The thing she was afraid of was the cold. That's all she cared about. Got it. don't fucking blame them either. I don't blame them. But I mean, this is a small town in Canada right now. You couldn't feel any safer probably. The thing she was afraid of was the cold. That's all she cared about. That's all she thought about. She wanted to get home quickly.

So rather than take the path on the streets, she decided to cut across some railroad tracks and take a shortcut to her house because she was freezing. Like I said, we see that and we're like, oh God, no. But in 1974 in a small town in Canada, that was just like, oh, hope a moose doesn't get you.

That was the danger. They were way more afraid you're going to be eaten by animals than attacked by people. Hey, watch out for that. Our awful Canadian accents. By the way, we forgot to mention this at the top of the show. We know Dick.

We know Dick and we don show. We know Dick. We know Dick. We don't pretend to know Dick. We hope that you find our ignorance charming. That's what we're going for here, Canada. You're getting a lot of stereotypes today. Yes, that's all we know. And they're so nice up there, they'll be like, that's okay. That's all right.

That's fine, guys. We've heard it a lot. We get it. It's okay. There's beavers on our money, so, you know, we get a lot of jokes. Goddamn beaver bucks. So, yeah, she cuts across the railroad tracks. As she's walking, she has no idea that she's being followed because it's dark out.

And I can't imagine the, you know, off the main paths, a small Canadian town in the 70s being super well lit across railroad tracks and by woods and things. So she's going and has no idea that someone is following her. That's crazy that she has no idea because in the 80s you had a Walkman. You know what I mean? In the 70s, what the fuck did you have? You had no portable tape player. I assume it's quiet. You don't got a phone to be staring at with your plenty of fish. I assume, yeah, nothing like that.

You're not dicking around looking down. With your plenty of moose, whatever it is up there. Plenty of moose. Plenty of beaver. That one should probably be the moreose plenty of beaver that one should probably be the more appropriate that probably exists up there that's the sad part that's just that's their tinder plenty of plenty of bees we got apps up here too you know so uh she's she's walking and uh out of nowhere she just thinks she's cold and she's just concentrating on getting home. And she is grabbed from behind.

Oh, fuck. She's grabbed by the hair. Oh, my God. And dragged down to the ground, down to the concrete here. It was a very, very, very, very quick thing. This person, one second she's walking, next second she's grabbed by the hair, dragged to the asphalt, and quickly, quickly has her throat cut. Fast.

Holy shit. Yeah. She wouldn't have even known what happened to her. She went from walking to having her throat cut in half a second. Like, it was that fast. Sweet Pete. No idea what was going on, which is horrible. She's lying there bleeding in a cold Canadian, which just sounds horrible, man.

Your blood goes cold so fast, too, in that kind of weather. It's got to be scary is what I'm getting at. Scary, lonely, cold. A bad way to go is what I'm saying. You feel that trickle. When blood is cold, that trickle is so fucking creepy. Go on. This is a bad way to go.

Let's get past this part. Yeah, well, it gets... You want to hear something worse? Oh, I don't. Let's hear something worse. Okay? This is horrible, man is horrible man as she's see there's a lot of stuff in this one a lot of these things we're uncomfortable with details and things like that and we're uncomfortable with them and you're uncomfortable with them too but they're in the case and you have to know it's one of those things so we we don't enjoy it let's just say that we're

not like let's talk about the details uh so as she's dying there uh it's a deep cut it's it's yeah he slashed her throat she's she's dying it wasn't a it wasn't a little slash it was he got her good and uh uh what this person does who her her uh her attacker unbuttons her pants and fondles her oh my god as she's dying in the cold, bleeding to death, he says, I'm just going to, but doesn't you know, have intercourse with her or anything like that. Just rubs it. Fondles her and then he robs her also. Takes everything

you can find off. After. Jesus. That's, you know. This is crazy. First of all, I think he flipped that around. Yeah. I think if you're going to do that, it would be robbery. You rob, fondle, slash. Then slash, I would assume. That's the order. But this is a guy, when you talk about serial killers and talk about killers that escalate, not an escalation thing, but a lot of times this is an unsure killer.

This is a person who had to do a blitz attack because he didn't know how else to do it, how else to go about it. So it's a quick thing. This was his going after it like that i feel like it was one of those so this person runs away yeah leaves her there to die in the cold yeah uh she's not found till noon the next day sweet fucking christ noon the next day uh a guy who was going who was cutting across the railroad tracks to go mail a letter in town uh stumbled across her body uh there uh around her was a like a there was just, stumbled across her body there.

Around her was like a, there was just garbage all over there, too. There was garbage. It was like a pizza box. There's like soda bottles and like chocolate bar wrappers and things like that. Just like stuff strewn about. The worst. There was a lot of litter back then, by the way. And somebody's daughter.

And somebody's daughter. I mean, just everywhere. The 70s were, before they had those commercials, people just littered and threw shit out everywhere. So this poor girl. I mean, I the way. And somebody's daughter. And somebody's daughter. I mean, just everywhere. The 70s were, before they had those commercials, people just littered and threw shit out everywhere. So this poor girl. I mean, I still do. You're an asshole. This poor girl is, they find her body there. That's horrible. So poor

Judith is Judith Barksley. Yeah, that's her. That's March 1st, 1974. So this makes everyone in town a little uncomfortable. They're not used to 19-year-old girls being murdered in the darkness for no reason. One injury, by the way. Yeah, that's it. One slash to the throat.

It was that deep and dispatched that fast. That was it. Dragged her to the ground, slashed her throat, and then went from there with everything. Now, some time goes by and it's quiet. Not completely quiet, but quiet. You'll understand what I'm talking about in a minute because there are parallel things happening here that we don't know about, that these people involved don't know about, but everyone's contributing to a common theme we'll talk about, and that is serial murder.

So we'll get into this here. September 1975, so this is about 15 months later. An 18-year-old woman named Rosalie Winters. She is heading toward Alexandra Park. She's just walking. Same thing. Just walking along. You know, just an 18-year-old going to a park.

She's tackled to the ground. Okay. So hold on. Park like where swings and shit are at? Yeah. A park. Yeah. A park. Alexandra Park.

I don't know where that is. It's in Strathroy somewhere. But she's walking toward there, 18-year-old young lady in September. It's probably nice outside. It's, you know, well, nice for Canada. It's 48 degrees, maybe, tops. That was the high that day. Warm summer night.

Yeah, yeah. It's an 18-degree low, but, you know, they're like, eh, it's not bad. It's great. You put on your light park and you go out there. It's a good time. I'll tell you. It's not bad. You go see Sonic Boom and you have fun. It's great. You put on your light park or you go out there. It's a good time. I'll tell you. It's not bad. You go see Sonic Boom and you have fun.

That's all. You go watch the turkeys hatch. Be careful, though. That tryptophan will make you sleep on the park bench. Oh, it'll make you sleep, boy. I'll tell you something right now. What the fuck? I like our two Canadian guys sitting on a bench. We have Canadian guys that just sit on a bench and talk.

That just sit there and bullshit. Hey, I'll tell you, boy. Look at that right there. That's something. That's a little nip in the night air. You feel that? That's a little mush. Is the Leafs game on or what are we doing?

I got a pocket full of nuts. You want some for the squirrel? I just carry nuts everywhere. I'm missing the whole first period. I got to get inside. I don't know what's going to happen. It could be one-0 by now. I'm missing all the action.

Fucking exciting hockey. Oh, man. Anyway. Oh, that's hilarious. So this Rosalie Winters, let's get our jokes in now because it's going to be hard to make in a minute here. It's going to be tough. It's going to be tough for a while here on this one.

You say serial murder, and I know this show is going to be hard to make it a minute here. It's going to be tough. It's going to be tough for a while here on this one. You say serial murder and I know this show's going to be a bit of a downer. This is going to be a downer. This is going to be a definite downer. You're going to get pissed off at a lot of it and it's a crazy goddamn story and it's one of these stories that you don't hear a lot. Most of the time a lot of these serial killers are really Oh, they're super publicized. You know what? Not to talk shit

about other podcasts, but we get it. We get it. The BTK fucking killer exists. Holy shit. Who? Really? No, tell me again about that Dahmer fellow because I've heard of him, but I haven't really heard anyone explain it to me in an audio format for an hour and a half. Oh, wait.

Yes, I have. Fucking everybody. Are you telling me Madeline McCann is still missing? Really? No shit. She's still missing. Really? I mean, and I get it.

That's how you get. Yeah, they're fascinating stories. And that's how you get listens, too, because that's Jackson. And we don't, obviously, we don't give a shit about that. Right. Because I pick the most obscure goddamn things I can find. You pick obscure things, and at the top of the show, you tell people, don't fucking listen. Don't listen.

Here's some shit you've never heard of. We want to compete. Right. That's what we're doing. So, yeah. What the fuck is wrong with us? And then we're going to talk shit about the people. We want to compete.

Who play the game correctly. And we're like, no, God damn. We're going to do it our way. We're fucking indie, man. We're Fugazi in 87. You know what I mean? Give me your vape pen. Oh, Jesus. Yeah, that's what we're...

But it's true, though. I didn't see anybody else covering this, so here we are. We want to compete. It's true. That's how dumb we are. Holy shit. They're like, yeah, well, stories you've heard of and you want to hear. Nope, we got this guy.

Never heard of him. Listen, anyway. My glasses are foggy. I'm laughing too hard. That's a good thing. That's a good thing. Okay. Let's see here.

So Rosalie Winters is 18 and heading toward Alexandra Park, and she's tackled to the ground. So this is the second one under 20 years old. Second one under 20 years old, walking just in a normal area where people walk and being immediately tackled to the ground. Yeah. This time, it's a little more advanced than last time. Last time, as we remember, the hair pull, throat slash, and then he fondled him. And then he did whatever he wanted to do.

This time, and by the way, she notices that he has long hair. Okay. She sees it. But it's the 70s. Everybody's got long hair notices that he has long hair. Okay. She sees it. But it's the 70s. Everybody's got long hair. Politicians have long hair. Everyone's got long hair in the 70s, literally. Ted Knight had long hair in the fucking 70s.

You know what I mean? Everyone had long hair in the 70s. It's ridiculous. So he tells her that he intends to rape her. Yeah. He makes his intentions known. He starts to choke her. So she stops struggling yeah to

get him to stop choking her sure uh she chose you know i'd rather not get choked to death here let's survive this encounter which is i guess i don't know i don't know what you would i can't imagine the horror going through your mind at that point especially just not knowing this that's what he says his intentions are but you don't know if his intentions are to kill her to you have no fucking idea what his intentions are you've you don't know if his intentions are to kill her. You have no fucking idea what his intentions are. You've heard of killers giving intentions. As if rape isn't bad enough. Right.

You know what I mean? You've heard of killers giving intentions. If you want to live, you'll do what I say. They do what they say, and then they still die. Guess what? Maybe not an honest guy, someone who's tackling a woman in a parking lot and telling her he's going to rape her. He might not be the most honest guy, though.

He may not be honest. Yeah. He lied to me. Yeah. Crazy. Fuck, man. So this poor Rosalie Winters is down on the ground. He's squeezing her neck.

He eases up a little when she stops struggling. He tries to undo her pants. As he does, he broke her zipper. Okay. The zipper broke. Yeah. So he got super pissed off at that. What the fuck?

Like it's her fault, for Christ's sake. The zipper broke. He gets super fucking mad at this, and it chokes her unconscious. What the fuck? It's not her fault., for Christ's sake. The zipper broke. He gets super fucking mad at this. And it chokes her unconscious. What the fuck? It's not her fault. It's Levi's fault. No, he's so mad, he chokes her unconscious and then groped her more, like the first one, and then leaves, though.

Okay. Doesn't slash her throat. Okay. Doesn't do anything. But she's seen him. Yeah. Also, she knows what he looks like. Okay.

And, yeah, so he let her go. So that is, well, not let her go, but he left her there. A little worse for the wear. And the other thing is, who knows if he's an inexperienced guy. When she went out, he probably thought she was dead. Exactly. In a movie, you choke someone, and then when they go unconscious, they're dead then. They go unconscious and then die in a movie.

So he might have, especially in the 70s, now there's a little more realism in violent scenes and movies. But back then, you choke a guy, he's alive, he's struggling, and then he dies suddenly. So maybe he probably was like, oh, got her. Okay, good. But he didn't. He left her there. Heads up, they don't die like that.

No, that's not how people die, usually. Heads up, movies are a bit sensationalized. Yeah, no shit. So Rosalie gets left there, and that's September of 1975. So by now, it's only been a couple, but there's more in the area that we'll discuss later. But people are starting to get freaked out. Yeah. And this is the mid-'70s.

This is when even a responsible news outlet would have to cover tons of – this is when – the 70s is when the serial killing became – this is when shit became just public knowledge in the just lexicon of everything. This is when Zodiac Killer had sent all these letters and people knew about it. There's so many active things going on. Shortly after Manson is when it really fucking exploded. It blew up, man. It blew up, man. Yeah. It blew up. For some reason, they've never been able to figure out exactly what the hell caused that. Right.

Because it was just that one period of time. It was crazy. Yeah. And there are so many serial killers that you've never heard of. Oh, God. Like this one. Yeah. What we're going to talk about.

Just dozens of them. There's so many of them. It's crazy. There's so many of them. They're everywhere. And obviously, the highway system is a big deal. People get in and out. We know that.

Also, it's kind of like the movie Scary Movie. You can do one and it's great. And then eventually they fucking get boring. You know what I mean? So eventually you just go, I get it. A bunch of people killed a bunch of people. And you lose interest. So the town is a little bit freaked out now.

We have a dead girl who was groped. and we have a girl who someone attempted to rape, but in the same fashion as the first one, same MO minus the throat slashing, which was a big deal. A busted Jordache jean zipper. And a busted, yeah, it's the 70s, so maybe Jordache, we'll say. Probably. Who knows? Something with bell bottoms, for sure. Yes, definitely.

October 20th, actually, it's Canada. They're probably about 15 years behind. So she probably was lucky she didn't have a poodle skirt on at that point. Some of the 55s. So Canada's slightly more ahead than Mexico. Right. It's one of those things. You ever go to Mexico?

They are 30 years behind. You betcha. It's weird. They have mustaches and members-only jackets and like 80s mustaches, though. Not douchey, hipstster ones that are like novelty. Push broom. Yeah, push broom. Some Burt Reynolds shit.

Members only and they're like, yeah, see, this is good. Trans Am. This is good. So October 20th, 1975, there is a woman named Louise Jenner. She lives in Mount Bridges, which is an area right there in town. She gets an unexpected knock at the door at her apartment. She opens the door, and it's a guy that she knows. It's a guy that she actually considers a handsome guy, a guy that she's friends with.

She's a married woman. She has a baby in the house and everything. But she knows this guy, and so she sees it's him. It's a guy named Christian Herbert McGee. She looks at him. He's there. They're friends. He's a 27-year-old guy. He's from the area. He also was

acquainted with Judith Barksley and Rosalie Winters. Known them. So that's interesting here. McGee also has two kids at this point. He's 27. Two kids. He's married. He's 27, two kids. He's married. He's got a three-year-old boy named Christopher and a one-year-old girl named Tracy.

So 70s, I guess I didn't have two kids by the time I was then. Me neither. No, it's so, you know, he knocks on the door. He knows this person. She doesn't know why he's there. It's unannounced. That's the other thing, too. I feel like in the 70s, you could just show up a little easier at people's doors because the communication wasn't

the same. You're going to be like, why didn't you text me and tell me you were here? It's the 70s. That's why, asshole. You had the hi-fi on. You might not have heard the house phone. Sorry. I mean, you know what I mean? Like, who knows? Back then. And it's so funny. Whenever we cover 70s stories, there's a lot of popping in and popping out of everywhere.

It's like, yeah, he popped over. He just went over to this guy's apartment. Everyone just went over and knocked on people's doors. Just wandering around. Don't come to my house unless you tell me you're coming. Ever. Yeah. I don't want anybody to do it. Thank God times have changed.

I got a friend that disconnected their doorbell. And every time somebody comes over, he goes, he sees them through the big picture window. They can't see in because it's tinted and mirrored. But he sees them come up and he says, they came up and touched my house because there's no doorbell. They just come up and touch his house and stand there and then eventually they walk away. But he's like, I'm not,

I don't want people at my fucking house. I don't want unannounced friends. I remember talking salesman things like, I don't want my friends just coming over unannounced. Let me plan something. Tell me, tell me I'm doing something. I'm busy always. Just know that. Even if I'm not, I am.

I have so much shit going on. I have a lot of shit going on. Leave me the fuck alone. So McGee here, he's at the door. He goes by Chris, doesn't he? He goes by Chris. Of course he does. He goes by Chris McGee.

Because when you said his son's name is Christopher, I was like, ah, he goes by Chris and he hates his first fucking name. So he named that kid Christopher. Christopher, not Chris Chin. hates his first fucking name. So he named that kid Christopher. Christopher, not Christian. Right. Yeah, exactly. And his middle name is Herbert, which I goddamn hope he did not pass on to anybody. No.

Nobody wants to be named Herbert. No. So she invites him inside. Okay. It's the 70s, I guess you invite people in when they come over. You say, hey, let's put on an ABBA album and let's fucking rock it out, I guess. I don't know what you do in Canada. Oh, Rush's new stuff just came out.

Right. You're goddamn right. You know, that's what it was. Rush is brand new, and they're good, I tell you, boy. They're going to be something. I'll tell you right now. Rush, I see big things in their future. One day there's going to be a podcast that has an agency that reps the same fucking band.

That's hilarious. Oh, man. So they invite, she invites Christian inside. Pete comes on in, old Christian Herbert McGee. A little bit about McGee. He's an interesting fellow. I mean, it sounds like a married guy with two kids who is considered handsome by some, you'd say, oh, that seems fine.

Like I said, he's going to come over, smoke a joint, and put some of those giant big headphones on they had in the 70s, and I don't know, listen to Simple Man over and over again. I have no idea what they would do. I don't know if they listen to Skinner up there. I wasn't born yet. I'm just assuming the 70s were just nomadic. Everybody had a day job, too. Everybody was working.

Everybody's wandering around with giant headphones on and stupid pants. If they weren't at work, they just had huge headphones and wandered from Everybody was working. Everybody's wandering around with giant headphones on. If they weren't at work, they just had huge headphones and wandered from house to house. With stupid pants on. With a fucking weird shirt. Dumb shoes. The sleeves were so fucking big. Huge sleeves.

What is that about? Shoes with no laces. Super tight on the chest, and then the forearm was just baggy as fuck. Yeah, like a pirate. We're going to go into that again. Like Seinfeld's puffy shirt. That's what we need. So bizarre.

Let's bring that. Now, McGee, a little bit on his background. He is born to his parents broke up when he was younger, when he was very little. But that's probably better because his father was an abusive lunatic. Both his parents were abusive, actually. So he grew up in a very abusive environment described as a completely loveless home. You mean the 60s? Yeah, just how you treated your kid.

Well, he was born in 1948. Oh, no shit. So he grew up through the 50s. Through the 50s, yeah. Even worse. Yeah. Beating your kid was considered paying attention to him. Right.

That was good parenting. That was spending time. Yeah, I spent some time with my kid. I kicked his ass this morning. Right. He spilt something. He's got a steak on his face. Yeah, don't you know that?

That's a real 50s thing there. He's got a steak. He's jammed a piece of fucking rock beef on his face. He's got a steak on his eye. That's how bad I whooped his ass. And the people go, good, good for you. That's a good dad. Send my kids over there to hang out with you for a while.

Like, oh, okay. You could hit other people's kids back then. As long as you brought a T-bone with you. That's it. No kid wandered into your yard, cut up. You could beat his ass and his parents would thank you from across the street. Thank you. It kept me from having to go over there and slap him.

I appreciate that. Save me the time. Oh, that Bob's a sweetheart, man. He saw little Johnny, just smacked him right across the face. Used the back of his hand, too. Really let him know there was a little sting to it. You know what I'm saying? That's the 50s his hand, too. Really let him know his little sting to it, you know what I'm saying? That's the 50s. That's how he grew up,

but apparently this was worse than most. This was a particularly abusive environment here. Later on, too, in his marriage with his two kids, he'll follow in that footsteps of being, having no love at all in the marriage and just being complete robot people.

Yeah, he doesn't understand. I guess if you grew up in that environment, how would you understand? It's just learned behavior. And especially back then, being demonstrative wasn't considered a real positive anyway. And I guess after the 60s. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm not sure how. See, that's the other thing, too.

I'm not sure how the 60s affected Canada. Yeah. That's the thing. Like, here, you could almost put the 60s as 60s as a reason for part of the serial killer culture and all this sort of thing. It's also like an awakening and people are like, fuck it, let's just do drugs. That's what I'm saying. I don't know how much of that happened in Canada because I know most of the 60s came

from Vietnam and they didn't have that big thing to fight against, so I don't know if they did anything. They just sat around laughing? Hey, we're fine. It's good. They sat around with short hair listening to Perry Como going, I don't know if they did anything. They just sat around laughing? Hey, we're fine. It's good. They sat around with short hair, listening to Perry Como going, I don't know, hey, give me another moose lager, would you? And that's all they do.

Right now, they were raising that super nice chick singer. What's her name? I don't know her name. Bryan Adams was being raised right now up there. Yes, he was. That super nice chick, Celine Dion. That's it. I hate Celine Dion. Listen, he was. That super nice chick, Celine Dion. Celine Dion. I hate Celine Dion.

Listen. Good God. I didn't say she was a great singer. I just said she's super nice. She's not nice. She seems like a horrible person. Really? Horrible.

I don't know. She sings sweet songs. She seems like she would tell everyone not that it works for her. They're not allowed to make eye contact with her. You know what I mean? That's what she seems like. Do not look at me with my big camel toe and my pants. And my weird nose.

And my weird nose. My husband is dead. I think I covered everything I know about Celine Dion. That's it. Dead husband camel toe. With bedazzled fucking phones. Is that Tyra Banks that did that? I don't remember.

No, it was the other. It was a model. Tyra Banks was a model. No, the other one, though. The other model. What the hell is her name? Damn it, I can see. Naomi Campbell. Naomi Campbell. Tyra Pinks was the model. No, the other one, though. The other model. What the hell is her name? Damn it, I can't. It's Naomi Campbell.

Naomi Campbell. Yeah, she's right. Bang. I'm like, I can see it. Somebody on the other end of this is going, it's Naomi Campbell, you couple of dickwads. Yeah, one of our female listeners, for sure. Whatever. I imagine Celine Dion's done that.

Oh, yeah. The jeweled. Yeah, but in Canada, they're nice enough not to say anything about it. They're like, well, you know, hey. Yeah, she probably was acting up, huh? She's on the $5 bill, so there's not much you could do about it. It's her on one side, children playing hockey on the other, so not much you can do. And then a picture of her moose knuckle on the other side.

So Christian here, he has no self-esteem from being raised by these parents. When he was young, he would walk around with his head hanging down all the time because he was just kind of beaten down by the whole situation. His mother would force him to walk around with a broom behind his back. Oh, Christ. Put a broomstick long ways around your back and put your arms behind it so it's pressed against

so if you're strong, you could break it with your arms and your back like that. She would make him walk around like that to keep his head up. Posture. Yeah, so that was her way of like that. She would make him walk around like that to keep his head up. Posture. Because he couldn't. Yeah. So that was her way of posture training. They would berate him constantly, you know, as you did in the 50s. Of course. They told him he'd never amount to anything.

Is that the male version of the teacup on your head? I think so. Yeah, yeah. Or the book on your head or something like that. Right, right, right. But it seems more abusive, honestly. Yeah. It just seems like uncomfortable.

It's a prop for fuck's sake. So his parents are berating him constantly while he's walking around with a broomstick and keeping his head down and all that. And they told him, obviously, you'll never amount to anything. You're obviously a piece of garbage. You know, the typical upbringing of people who turn out to do bad things generally. Typical spirit-breaking exercises. And not everyone turns out to do bad things.

Some people go the opposite way. But a lot of times people, they don't know anything else. So they just don't have any emotion and they get that flat affect type of thing and no sympathy and no empathy. And then you end up with a sociopath and a horrible person. You're welcome, society. You're welcome, society. And they trained him so well that by the age of 12, it only took to 12 to get him to be a rapist. What?

That's nice. That's how bad. That's how they raised him. By the time he was 12 years old, he committed his first rape, raping a 10-year-old girl. Perfect. Perfect. What a dick. By 12, he had that lack of empathy, that cold-bloodedness, and that aggression.

What's the punishment for that? Not only sexual. I don't think anything. Wow. Honestly, if you're a kid, and especially back then, like we didn't, kids didn't become criminals until the 90s. You know, and back then, if a kid, a 12-year-old did something crazy, they were like, oh my, well, you know, get him a soda and sit him down and see what happened.

See what's going through his mind. You know what I mean? Get him a hockey stick. You need something to focus his energy on. Give him a teaspoon of maple syrup, eh? Yeah, and some skates, you know? He needs to maybe play left wing, join the team. So, he could be a defenseman.

He's vicious, huh? He could be a defenseman. He's tough. He's going to spend some time in the penalty box, but that's a tough boy. He doesn't have good posture, but I think it'll be okay. So, we're not laughing about the rape of a 10-year-old here, but this is... We're laughing about how easy it is to get into hockey. Yeah, I think so. Yeah, we're laughing about when the rape of a 10-year-old here. We're laughing about how easy it is to get into hockey. I think so, yeah. We're laughing about when you're 12.

Right. So, I mean, he's such a 12. I mean, that's heartless. It's fucking nuts. That's heartless. And I don't even know if you're 12 and you're already committing heartless rapes of a smaller child like that. I don't even know if you're fixable at that point. I'm just trying to think.

I don't know if you've gone too far over the line already. When I was 12, I was still chasing girls. You know what I mean? Like on the playground. Like playful. That was sixth grade. If I'd have been able to, I was slow in sixth grade. If I'd have been able to catch them, I wouldn't have been able to rape them.

No. You were writing. You probably wouldn't have wanted to either or known that that was even an option. That's the thing. I wouldn't have known where to put anything. At 12, you're writing notes saying, do you like me? Check yes or check no. Like, that's what you're doing in sixth grade.

And this guy's a hold down and insert penis. That's fucking bananas. It's insane, man. By the time he's in his mid-teens, about 15, his father yanks him out of school. Yeah. So no more education for you. You don't need school anymore. I thought you were about to describe an event.

It's over. Came in the day, took him out. They went to a baseball game. It was really nice. They had a hot dog. They stopped afterwards, looked at the sunset. They went home and he never committed another crime again. Thank you for listening to Small Town Murder, everybody. One murder and he's all cleared up. It's fine.

He's sent to work at 15 to support the family rather than go to school. This was against his will. He didn't want to leave school and go to get a job. He wasn't like that. They just forced him to. By the time he's in his late teens, he is illiterate and has a drinking problem. Which is great.

That's what you want, a sexually aggressive, illiterate drunk. That's perfect. At 15, he didn't fucking learn to read and write? No. This was later on. He still had. I mean, if you add that up, you know, heartless, illiterate, and has a drinking problem, he would have been a great hockey prospect.

They really should have signed him up. He's frustrated as fuck. That's an angry man. Sorry, hockey players. But no, he is. He started. So his upbringing was not great. No.

Not an excuse for what he ends up doing. I mean, if he's responsible for these two things. But still, you can see the building of a monster here. For sure. You can see the construction of a monster. They put the posts in and they really. Sprinkled it with Miracle-Gro. And then finally they raised that barn up and he's raping 10-year-olds.

The lattice is up. Yeah. So he has, lately, he's been working on a farm to try to support his kids. Oh, Christ. And he's not liking it at all. He's having a rough time. He hates that. That's another thing we get with a lot of killers is they have these menial jobs that they don't like and they think they're smarter than that.

But he's also illiterate and it's like he gets – there's a lot of frustration here and a lot a lot of a lot of people always tell him he never amount to anything. A lot of this. And they they get this aggression. And what ends up happening, how this manifests manifests itself is once the door is closed. Yeah, because we took a sidetrack there. Louise Jenner's apartment we're at right now. Once Louise Jenner's door is closed, Christian forces her to the floor immediately. And this is someone he knows well and knows well enough to just stop by. And she goes, hey, come on in.

Yeah. That's a lot. So, you know, this isn't going to be happy. This is not good. He forces her to the floor, which we've heard before. Yeah. Tears off her pants. Yeah.

This time. Now, the first time he killed and then said, oh, now what do I do? Right. Didn't do it second time. He's like, I'm going to do this before I kill her and then just left her there. And this time he's like, I'm tearing the whole pants off first. I'm not going to deal with a broken zipper or any of this shit. He starts, he rapes her.

Oh, boy. And as he's doing this, as he's attacking her, after a few minutes, he just stops for some reason. No idea why. Just stops in the middle of the whole thing. Stops everything. Stops the rape in the middle of it and just stops. There's no reason. He didn't finish.

He didn't like lose his whatever. That's enough. He just stopped out of nowhere. Now, what she does is she's fucking horrified and terrified. Five minutes ago, she was like, hey, it's my buddy Christian. Come on. We'll put a fucking album on. And now we're going to put some fog hat on.

And now this is happening. She starts struggling to collect her clothes and put them back on. Sure. Obviously, because she feels horrible. And I can't imagine what she feels like. So she's trying to get her clothes back on at that point. And she feels like, I she's trying to get her clothes back on at that point and she feels like I don't know, she feels like maybe

he stopped because he realized what he was doing was not okay. So he's going to let her do this. He's going to let her get her clothes back on but instead he takes a black lace from her boot, a boot lace and wraps it around her neck and

strangles her. What the fuck is a boot lace? A lace on a boot. Oh, a boot lace, and wraps it around her neck and strangles her. What the fuck is a boot lace? A lace on a boot. Oh, a boot string. A boot. Got it. Okay. So he's wearing, all right, like short boot shoe lace. Got it.

Okay. He takes one of those and strangles her until she's unconscious. I saw like a piece of lace. Oh, oh, like a, okay, I got you. Yeah. Because I'm a dirtbag. Yeah, definitely. And I'm like, what the fuck is a boot lace?

What is he doing? No, no, no. This is so, he's got the black boot lace. Yep. He puts it around her neck, loops it around her neck a couple of times and chokes her until she's unconscious with that. Okay. She's not dead yet though.

Yeah. She's unconscious. But then he takes a knife and he slashes her throat too. So, because she knows him. Yeah. First of all. You got to make sure that's done. Yeah.

Yeah. If you're going to be a serial rapist and murderer, you should probably find strangers maybe. Or rape people and then try to walk away like nothing happened. So not to give you a tip. Small town murder tip out there for all you aspiring rapists and murderers. No, we're not doing that. So, yeah, he leaves her. He flees the scene, takes off, leaves her bleeding excessively, as you can imagine, on the floor.

This was in the middle of the day, too. Jesus. Middle of the day, broad daylight, knocks on the door, decides, that was my friend over there. I'm going to go rape her quick, and then maybe I'll kill her. We'll see what happens. If I have to. If I have to. You know how it goes out there.

So her husband, Dennis, comes home at 5 o'clock and finds her in the kitchen in a pool of her own blood. He just comes home from work like normal and this is what he finds. His immediate thought is, I have a daughter in this house right now. They have a daughter, Rachel. Luckily, the daughter, she's an infant

and she was unharmed in her crib upstairs. He didn't do anything to the baby. Don't even know if he knew the baby was there. Probably not. Not even sure. So much anxiety right now. That was crazy. I know.

That's what I mean. When I'm reading this whole thing, I'm like, oh, my God, there's a baby. Oh, my God, there's a baby. That's all I kept thinking. Not that Louise didn't matter, but I'm thinking of a baby. I don't like hearing of babies getting. No. Things are bad here.

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and get your 30 off with free shipping from blueapron.com small blue apron a better way to cook blueapron.com slash small. Now back to the show. So now this time, the first two attacks, police had no idea what happened. They had no idea. They just knew that one girl said it was dark and the guy had long hair. And I think he was familiar, but I don't know. Okay.

And this time they have leads in this one. The police have leads. How do they have leads in this one. The police have leads. How do they have leads? They have leads. An elderly neighbor. Oh, thank Christ for nosy people. Nosy old lady looking out the, what is she doing over here this time? Oh, this whore.

I was going to say, you know it. You know she was like, oh, she's having a book. She's having a man over and her husband doesn't get home till five. You know she. Shaking her ass for the menfolk. It's funny. When we get gossipy, we give her a Southern accent. Like she just got out of a church service and she's going to go talk. Now, can you believe I saw him go right up into her house?

That Louise Jenner, she is a slut. I know her husband wasn't home. I know her husband wasn't home. She's got a newborn baby and she's out there just having a strange man over in the living room. So luckily this nosy bitch over here reported seeing a young white male with shoulder length hair pull into the driveway. And she said the car looked like a yellow or cream colored late model Oldsmobile. So now they have a physical description and a car description, which is in a small town that's better than nothing.

That's great. That's better than nothing here. She said that she watched him stand outside the doorway for several minutes before entering. So he stood out there before he knocked. He stood out there getting up his medal. I don't know. Getting himself up for this.

Can I do this? Is this a good idea? Maybe looking around, making sure nobody popped out. I'm not sure what goes through a potential rapist murderer's mind. I just can't imagine what you're thinking. But I'm trying to think of it like if you were like 10 and you were going to steal a Twix from the corner store

and you're scoping it out and you're going to stand in front of the Twix for a while and act like you're looking at the Whatchamacallits and be like, am I really going to do this? James has stolen so many Twix. Actually not. I actually am so scared to ever been so scared to steal shit. That's like one thing I would never do is steal shit. I was a terrible thief.

I did it all the time. I had friends that used to do that all the time. I loved it. And that's what they did. They would stare. I remember from the video game of Best Buy. See, I'm not a thief. I can't do that shit.

I'm just like, I guess I don't have that. See, I thought it was Best Buy. No, it was Sears. That's just saying. You put them out of business, Jimmy. You did this to them. You did this to them. No, it was Sears. That's just saying. You put them out of business, Jimmy. You did this to them. You did this to them. I got 86 from Sears, and they told me that my face had facial recognition.

They didn't have facial recognition software 15 years ago. Joke's on them. Now everyone's 86 from Sears. No, no. Sears is 86 from everywhere. From the world. From the world, Jimmy. That's what happens when you start a business by selling the fucking lost and found, you creeps.

That's awesome. Fucking ridiculous. That's right. We had the origin story there. I'll never forget that as long as I live. That Roebuck's a scumbag. That guy's a fucking asshole. Total scumbag.

So him standing outside for a few minutes, that didn't give clues. I mean, that just gave this woman a chance to see him a little better and kind of see what was going on and make it suspicious. If you just walk up and knock on the door real quick, it doesn't look suspicious. It looks like you have business there. That's your friend. You're dropping something off. She told you to come over. It doesn't look like, oh, I'm creeping outside this house here.

They've honored Tupperware Party. Yeah. So what that did also is they didn't know whether he knew her or not at that point because he could have stood outside, thought about it, and then talked his way in, they thought possibly. But inside, what they found in the crime scene inside the apartment was photographs were strewn across a table. What? Like in a way that you're showing them to people, not a way that you're like going through something or trashing the place.

And if you're like laying pictures out back when people had physical pictures of shit. So there and back then that was a big deal was to show someone your pictures. Yeah. Because like now we didn't have Facebook. So Facebook was when someone came over your house. You'd go, hey, I went away. Look at these pictures from my vacation. You'd show them to them.

All the Polaroids. Otherwise, nobody would ever see your pictures because they didn't keep track of you every second of every goddamn day like they do now. So they saw that and they said, interesting. The police took from that that she must have known the person she was talking to because she was showing him photographs. Obviously, this looked like a layout situation. So that's a big deal knowing that she knew the killer.

That's a huge deal. So they look at who this could possibly be. It's a small town, not a lot. They settle pretty quickly on Christian McGee. They figure out that he had access to a cream-colored Oldsmobile, and he also knew all of these victims. But especially they were looking at Barksley because that's a murder victim. They weren't looking at just the attempted rape.

They were looking at Barksley, and they were looking victim. They weren't looking at the attempted, just the attempted rape. Got it. They were looking at Barksley and they were looking at Jenner here. Sure. The two murder victims. So they're very, very curious, as you might imagine, to talk to young Mr. McGee and find out possibly maybe what's up with him. So they bring him in for questioning. Right. Obviously.

He says, I don't know what you're talking about. Likely. No clue. I don't know what you mean. That's where I'd go to. Yeah. I mean, I can get a cream colored car there, but I don't know what you're talking about. Likely. No clue. I don't know what you mean. Yeah. I mean, I can get a cream colored car there, but I don't know. Yeah. I know her. It's a shame she's dead. That's terrible. Yeah. Oh boy. I don't know anything about that. I was just playing hockey out there. Hey. And you know, the whole deal. So they say, well, nothing we can hold them on. He says he didn't do it. We don't have any physical evidence. Couldn't

crack him to make a confession. So they release him. Oh, boy. What else are they going to do? This is the 70s. There's no DNA. No, and this is what I mean. There's nothing they can do about it. They're like, well, I don't know, unless he took a picture of himself on a Polaroid and Kim killing her and left it at the scene.

We really don't have any evidence of anything. Back then, that's what it was, unless he left a fingerprint. And even then, even a fingerprint, he would have been like, yeah, I know her. I've been there before. No big deal. It's too much. So, yeah, they had nothing to go on, so they had to let him go. And how many times have we done this before where they talk to a serial killer and let him go?

Yeah. Everybody. They talked to Gary Ridgway like nine times before they fucking actually. They talked to Dahmer and then sent him back in his house with a victim. They talked to Dahmer and said, naked Asian boy running. And he said, no, that's fine. Yeah, that's fine. I said, all right, good.

That's what I mean. It was like, it's crazy back then. Those guys were fired. How awesome is that? I would hope they would be fired here. So now the cops, they are looking at him, though. They don't think he's innocent. They just don't have anything to hold him on.

They couldn't crack him. So they're- You have to assume that Zodiac's officers and investigators talked to him at one point, too. Yeah, I'm sure they have. I'm sure they have. I mean, you're positive of it. And they know that one where they missed him by two seconds. He was walking in San Francisco, that whole thing.

So much. Sorry, we'll let other podcasts cover the more famous cases. They have. And they'll continue. That's why we all know these facts, because you've heard it 1,700 fucking times. So, November 3rd, 1975. This is two weeks after the Jenner killing, and this is right after he's talked to the police. So talk about emboldened.

I mean, he doesn't even say, I'm going to take six months off. This is, whew, he can't. At this point now, it's gotten the time periods, too. They went from 15 months to closer to now we're into weeks. It's just the time, he's progressing so quickly. He really is. So November 3rd, 1975, a 19-year-old girl named Sylvia Holly Jennings was hitchhiking outside of London, Ontario. Can you imagine a 19-year-old girl hitchhiking?

It just happened. That's why Kemper got so many girls. That's what I mean. It was then that people... That's why they hitchhiked. That's why they stopped, because of that fucking guy. Because of lots of people like this. This is a common thing to do.

Well, if you're driving, that's like... If you're a serial killer, you're a murderer, and you're driving, it's like, oh, there's one. Kill me, kill me. Hey, there you go. Yeah, it's insanity. How do you... I mean's it's insanity how do you i mean it's bananas fuck it's i mean you should be able to just stand on the side of the road and not be murdered and ask for a ride but in reality

human beings don't work like that yeah they don't so yeah not at all so uh he takes her uh says he's gonna take her where she wants to go but instead instead, he drives her to an isolated side road in Mount Bridges and tells her to remove her clothes right away because we know what he's after. She paused and didn't want to because she was scared like a normal person. He goes into just an absolute – he turns into a maniac and starts tearing her clothes off of her. Now he's gotten even more aggressive. This progression is really getting fast here. She starts to kick and scream and fight, good for you, like she should. She's trying to subdue her.

He's trying to subdue her. She's fighting back. He then hits her in the head to subdue her, and he rapes her horribly. I mean, a horrible, horrible rape. Chokes her unconscious also while he's raping her. So now he's hit her, knocked her kind of half unconscious to get her to stop fighting, raped her, chokes her until she's unconscious. This time, though, he knows she's not dead because what he also does while she's unconscious, he goes and gets a bottle and smashes a bottle over her head also. Doesn't cut her or do anything like that.

Smashes a bottle over her head, fracturing her skull. Jesus. By the way, that's how hard he hit her with this fucking bottle. Holy Christ. So he has no regard for any human anything at this point whatsoever. By the way, a rape. You can't get any more horrible and aggressive than that, number one. It's so violent. That's the worst thing. It's so terrible. It's not like... A man pictures rape like

she doesn't want it, but you have sex with her anyway. I don't think that's what men picture. You don't think so? I don't know. No, I know a lot of dudes that don't know... I saw the accused when I was like 10, so I don't... That's a problem. I know, yeah. I was like, oh God, this is horrible. If she says no, just go, OK, and then leave. Like, don't be a fucking weirdo because this is scary.

Your parents brought you up right. Yeah. Terrible. Oh, my God. No, don't do that. I know dudes that are just like, so she didn't want it. You gave it to her. No, no.

Who are these people? A rape. Please write their names down for later on when it comes up. It's horrible. When there's women with fractured skulls being found on the side of the road. Shit is being forced. It's horrible. Don't force anybody to do anything, especially sexually.

Not small town murder approved behavior. We'll just say that. We do not condone any kind of rape at all. So he's fractured her skull. She did not die. She wakes up later on the roadside with a fractured skull and completely covered in blood. Yeah. But now she's seen him, too.

He made a mistake there with that. So now June 15th, 1976, this is about seven months later, there's a guy named Jeffrey Scholls. He's got a 15-year-old sister named Susan Lynn Scholls. Now Susan needed a ride back home. She's somewhere in town. And Jeffrey was at work. He's a little older than her.

He's at work. So he said that wait for her until he got done at work, and he would pick her up and drive her back to the parents' house in Strathroy. But she instead said, no, I'm going to walk. Didn't tell the brother that, but decided to plug on ahead and walk slash hitchhike. You know, I'll walk. And if I get a ride, I get a ride. Jesus.

She accepts a ride from McGee. Mistake, obviously, as we know. He offers a ride to her. She's 15 years old, which is, God, I have a 16-year-old daughter. So when you say 15, I'm just, I get horrified here. Luckily, I don't know. So she's hitchhiking. He rapes her, obviously, as we know he's going to do.

Strangles her again. Stabs her in the throat and chest this time. Oh, my God. He decided from last time, you got to make sure you do it. She's 15. 15 years old. Wasn't bad enough. She doesn't know him.

She doesn't know him. It's bad enough that he had to obviously rape and choke her into all this shit. But then he stabs her in the chest and the throat and the back. There's so much crime already. While he's doing that, he strangled her with her own shirt with her halter top. Oh, no. Strangled her with that. And then the worst part of all, he took the knife and just absolutely went nuts on her.

On her girl parts. On her girl parts there. Absolutely went. Raped her with a knife. Worse than that. I wouldn't call it raped her with a knife. Just cut her. Oh, Jesus.

Destroyed her. It's horrible, man. We'll talk about a little more of the detail. But it couldn't. Disturbing as can fucking be. A farmer ends up finding her body a farmer was uh she thought it was thought there was a dead animal out on his on his property so he went and he found her uh all she had on were uh bikini underwear yeah at the time uh the next

after afternoon the police said she had a 20 centimeter cut above her vagina 20 centimeters so that's that's that's a lot that's a rip and that's uh it's violent and that's angry and that's uh that's definite progression yeah that is that's progression i mean now he's not only killing but he's he's killing and he's mutilating also after he has what he wants uh so a police try to figure out what happened. They figure out that one o'clock the previous day, her brother dropped her off in the town of Forest to buy batteries for her portable radio. To buy batteries for her portable,

it's such a kid thing, you know what I mean? She wanted to listen to some music or whatever, and that's so fucking sad. It's an 80s equivalent of dropping her off to pick up Teen Bop. Yeah, exactly. It's fucked up. She's last seen at 1 pick up Teen Bop. Yeah, exactly. It's fucked up. She's last seen at 1.30 p.m. walking toward County Road 12 by a witness here.

A forklift driver. So this forklift driver reports, and this is the guy who really cracks this whole thing. This forklift driver reports seeing her climb into a 1975 Ford truck used locally for picking up dead animals. So distinctive. It's not like it's a gray Dodge Ram. You got the fucking year. This guy likes cars. Not only that, it's the truck that picks up dead animals in town.

It's a very specific vehicle. That's the animal truck. There it is. See the flies following it? That's the animal truck. There it is. See the flies following it? That's the one. So the police contact John Grinsvin, who owns the company. It's a Strathroy company that owns the company that owns the Dwork truck that picks up dead animals. And he said on the day in question, that truck had been driven by Christian McGee. You bet.

You know it. Now, he says they questioned Christian about it. And he says, oh, no, I remember that girl. Absolutely. Yeah, I picked her up. I picked her up along the road, and I dropped her off where she was going. This is so weird, Christian. I said, it's just a strange thing. There's a dead body.

Everywhere you go. Yeah, your car is spotted in the drive. Super weird, right? Now, all of a sudden, we've got a dead girl, and your truck picked her up. Super weird, right? Now all of a sudden we've got a dead girl and your truck picked her up. Super strange. So they said, well, let's just check and make sure that we don't find any evidence in here. What they do find is the company, there's equipment in the truck, the filleting knife is missing.

Okay. The only thing in the whole truck that's missing is the filleting knife. What a coincidence. I just saw the most horrific part. a coincidence. I just saw the most horrific part. Yeah. That knife has been used to chop up fucking animals that

have been hit by cars or whatever. And he's using, unbelievable. He's using that to kill a young girl. To just ruin a child. That's fucked up. Fucking horrible. Yeah. So they figure that's enough evidence. Now he's been seen with two. One is a definite and the thing's missing.

So they go ahead and on June 16th, 1976, they arrest Christian. This is the next day after that. The media immediately begins calling him the Mad Slasher. Jesus. That is his nickname, Mad Slasher, and that's still what he's called to this day. That's a vicious name. Oh, absolutely. People are shocked, by the way.

They didn't expect this out of him. There's a farm owner, the guy who employed McGee. And remember this name, Mel Veal is his name. It's hard to forget a guy named Veal. Yeah. Mel Veal said, quote, he was quiet, easygoing, always kept to himself. He was a hard worker. Everyone was shocked when he got arrested. And I got a young cow I'd like you to take a look at. Yeah, I own a cellulose. What does he do? Mel Vealville is he owns the farm okay so he's a farm owner well we'll see let's find out okay he's not only the farm owner he's gonna have another job later on that's gonna give us a good laugh don't worry fantastic so uh 1977 he's uh is forced to stand trial for the slaying of Susan Scholes, the young lady who came to buy batteries in town whose brother was going to drop her off. He gives a sob story in court.

He talks about the physical and emotional abuse from childhood and his loveless childhood. He had no self-esteem. He told him about the broom thing. All sob story, basically. He said his older brother beat him mercilessly, and his parents told him he would amount to nothing, which just sounds like growing up with brothers at that point here. So what they do is they find him not guilty by reason of insanity. What?

These fucking assholes. Not guilty by reason of insanity. What part makes him insane? That he was kind of sad from childhood. A little sad. He was sad, Jimmy. I could have done so many horrible things in Canada. You know what? He had to...

You know what happened, Jimmy? Here's the deal. They made him do chores and he missed Super Friends in the morning and he fucking lost his mind. What? Oh, Jesus. He wasn't repeatedly raped. No. Then I could honestly say psychologically he might not – he can't control that because people have that problem.

If they are assaulted, they assault. Sometimes that happens. But no, no, no. He had a sirloin on his face. He was kind of sad. That doesn't make you insane. A little sad. That's all.

I had friends' older brothers that would beat me up. Not even my own. I didn't have an older brother. You're not even going to get into the abuse I endured. It endured it was like oh you have a friend over good someone else i can beat up that's what it was and you get beat up by them too and you go i don't want to go over there his brother will beat you up christ i could have got away with so much mayhem ridiculous just based on my childhood story most people could have apparently so uh my christ he's committed to oak ridge maximum security mental health Facility at that point.

Okay. That is just for the one murder. Now, Canada's – the way their law goes, and this came in 19 – they replaced not guilty by reason of insanity with not criminally responsible, the NCR. Okay. By mental defect. Yeah. And their criminal code here says, quote, no person is criminally responsible for an act committed or an omission made while suffering from a mental disorder that rendered the person incapable of appreciating the nature and quality of the act or omission or of knowing that it was wrong. I'm sorry. He knew that it's wrong.

He tried to hide it. He knew it was wrong. Right. Exactly. When you're lying about what you did, wasn't me, then you know it's wrong. You know it's When you when you when you're lying about what you did wasn't me. No, you know, it's wrong. You know, it's wrong. And you knew that was wrong.

And what happened to him did not. I'm sorry. That's not enough. It's not enough. And I wouldn't excuse it no matter what happened to you. But that's not enough to make me even go. I get it. Right.

You know, it's horrible and they should put him away forever. But I understand what caused it. No, I'm sorry. Apart from his father chopping up a 15 year old in front of him and saying, this is how you treat people, then no. That's what I mean. Fuck no. Son, let me show you something.

Have a gander. Yeah, exactly. I'm going to show you how to field dress a 15-year-old. That's the only way. Apart from that, go fuck yourself. Exactly. So 1980, he has to stand trial for two counts of first-degree murder, one count of rape for his other killings here. Again, again, the trial goes on.

He is found not guilty by reason of insanity. Two counts of first-degree murder, one count of rape, one count of indecent assault. Who's his lawyer? A very good one apparently here. He tells the doctors too because they interview him and all that. He tells the doctors that the psychiatrist that at one time during all this was going on, he was confused by sex and love. And he believed that forcing sex on someone could get him the affection that he wanted. But now, now that he's thought about it, he's had a couple of years in the facility, he realizes that he was wrong.

Jimmy, he realizes it's wrong to rape and mutilate women with knives. Oh, I can't do that. I didn't know that. That's wrong? Oh, wow. Okay. I didn't realize that. I'm glad I've had this time to reflect.

Yeah. I mean, my dad, he put a big emphasis on like turn the lights off and do things like that, but never told me that was shit. Totally skip. Don't force your penis inside people. See, I dropped out in the 10th grade. Maybe they would have taught us that in the 11th grade. Not. Totally skipped. Don't force your penis inside people. See, I dropped out in the 10th grade. Maybe they would have taught us that in the 11th grade. Not to murder people.

That was in the syllabus for 11th grade. Yeah, that's what it was. He didn't know that. So you have one more year. Jesus. One more year. Now, while this was going on, he is not the only guy who was murdering at this time. Really?

Absolutely not. There was other serial killers going on. This became known as, there was three active serial killers at at this time. Really? Absolutely not. There was other serial killers going on. This became known as, there was three active serial killers at the same time. Really? In this town, in this area, in the London, Ontario area.

Wow. There was three active serial killers. There was Christian McGee, Gerald Thomas Archer, who you may have heard of. That sounds familiar. That's a little more, he's the London chambermaid slayer.

Jesus. He killed hotel workers. Other podcasts have done that i'm pretty sure i tried to pick the less known of all these also russell russell johnson who's the bedroom strangler who i've heard of also uh all three of these people are they're combined for uh 13 people that they know they killed 13 confirmed kills of those people uh during that time period johnson on the other hand did the bedroom strangler he confessed to us killing seven women and attacking 10 of 10 others he'd follow them into their homes and break into their bedrooms where he would rape and strangle them as uh sounds like mcgee that would have been doing

that eventually yes yeah uh he was also found not guilty by reason of insanity and put in the same goddamn hospital wow same fucking time same hospital same time these guys are like hanging out together uh yeah wow uh fucking i don't even know what to say about this what i mean what a terrible arkham they have all of these serial killers and like they're all just crazy they must be to do that right which is the logical thing but still fuck especially when we find out that canada's laws mean that if you're in a mental institution that can't be a life sentence yeah you have to let them out eventually really you're in a mental institution there's no open-ended there's no closed yeah there's no possibility of getting out really well when he's better you gotta let him go you canadians are so

sweet it's the same thing here. Really? It's the same. If you commit someone by reason of mental insanity, when they're okay to rejoin society, you've got to let them go. That's why people get out. On the chance that they're not ever. Wait till we cover Rhode Island and you're going to find this exact case and we let somebody even worse than this out. Okay.

So it happens everywhere. No, I'm not telling. No more clues. Okay. Wait till Rhodeode island let's just say that here uh so yeah he's he's goes to oak ridge mental facility here uh yeah by the way they released archer from prison really yeah he uh he he's the chambermaid slayer they released him from prison in 85 he didn't even do like 10 years and what did he do after that? He died. So that's good. He died shortly after. We wanted him to fucking die.

He's a complete piece of shit. In 2004, Dr. Philip Claussen conducted a five-hour assessment of McGee, a psychological assessment, and concluded that he had personality disorder, no shit, fantasies of torture, necrophilia, cannibalism, and dismemberment,

and a mindset in keeping with the classic sexual sadism. What the fuck? Just a good guy is what he said. Just a fine young man. Not guilty. Yeah, not guilty. If you have any daughters, bring them on by. He's a worthy suitor.

Jesus Christ. Wear your glass slippers. He's available for birthday parties. What the fuck is this? Since in prison, though. Model prisoner. Oh, I'm sure. Great guy.

He's busied himself. He's being watched. Oh, busied himself making baby cradles and rocking horses for charities out of wood. Just what I want. He's woodworking. That's what you want. Charities have his work. They have a vagina-stabbing rocking horse.

Unbelievable. Thank you. Great. That's wonderful. Nice strangle-stabbing rocking horse. Unbelievable. Thank you. Great. That's wonderful. Nice strangle baby cradle. That's terrific. Wow. How many girls had to die so you could have that?

Wonderful. Holy shit. He converts to Protestantism. Of course. He converts to God, of course, because that's how you get out of jail. And sympathy. And sympathy. He claims that God has been using him to help people and that he no longer has violent urges.

Except for that 15-year-old and that other girl. Yeah, now. He says, since I've been in here, God has been using me to help people. God likes to find the people that have done the worst fucking thing on earth and uses them to really push his message. What God does is, they say, close the door, open a window. It's one of those things where they're like, I need a baby cradle. I'll make a murderer because someone's got to make those baby cradles. So you slash a bunch of young ladies and we'll make one cradle from that.

We'll raise some money for charity. What do you say? Fucking hell. Wow. So no more violent urges. God has saved him. I'm good now, as we say in crime and sports everything's fine here may 2005 he has a review board hearing a hearing from the review board to see if you know they can let him out of jail right now out of mental institution

may 2005 a report from a clinical team of specialists described him as a sexual sadist, a man with an antisocial personality disorder, and they calculated it at a 76% chance of reoffending within 10 years if he was to be released. 76%. I would up that to 146% or 385% or a million and 12% or pick a fucking number because it doesn't matter. He's going to kill people. Here's the part that I don't like. They see 76%, correct? 76% chance of re-offending.

Oh, yeah. They're going to let him out, aren't they? That means to me, 24% success rate. There's no chance that anything that you'd sell me, that they say, 24 24% chances will work.

He's going to rape and kill three out of four teenagers that walk in front of him. That's what that means to me. I know that's not what it says, but that's all I say. Three out of four. I'm on board with that. He's got enough control to let one of four go. There's nothing you could sell me that you tell me it works 24% of the time and I'm paying full price. Never.

Thank you. And the psychiatrist had the exact same thought. They said, quote, there is no proven and effective treatment or intervention that is likely to change the outcome in a man who commits serial sexually sadistic homicide. Right. No fucking shit. Right. Dr. Lisa Ramshaw said in the report that it would be safest for society if McGee stayed in a, quote, highly structured environment because he has a, quote, dangerous combination

of personality disorders. No fucking shit. Yeah. She also said, quote, highly structured environment because he has a, quote, dangerous combination of personality disorders. No fucking shit. She also said, quote, he should never get out. There's nothing much more to say than that. Yes, exactly. Never. Jeffrey Scholz, the man who must feel guilty as shit for dropping his sister off to get batteries, he said, quote, what gives him the right to even exist?

30 years have passed and my sister has never been the same. McGee took away her God-given right to enjoy the magical act of enjoying a normal relationship with a loved one. Justice will not be served until he's dead. My man. Fair enough, I say about that. The Ontario Review Board, though, grants his request to be transferred from a maximum security facility in Pentang to a medium security health facility in Toronto. He wants to go to medium. They approved that.

Officials at the maximum security facility he was at opposed the order, saying he was still a, quote, sadistic serial murderer, likely to reoffend if released. Right. Please don't do that. The order's given, but it's not executed right away. Okay. The transfer's put on hold while the facility, Oak Ridge, appealed to the Court of Appeals arguing that he's a substantial danger to society that cannot be moved, and the case

was heard and he stayed put for a while. Okay. Now, January 16th, 2006, he's still trying to be moved. The Court of Appeals, they're doing this whole thing. He wants to be moved to the Toronto Center for Addiction and Mental Health. And that would have been the first step toward his eventual release because you'd go maximum, medium, minimum, and then they let him out. Day passes, that sort of shit. At this point, he's a diabetic.

He's overweight. He's 57 years old. Yeah, he kind of looks like there's a picture of him from like the 70s. He looks like a fat Kirk Hammett from Metallica. Gross. That's what he looks like, like a fat version of him. No. He's got this round face.

He looks like – it's weird. In some pictures, he looks like – he's got like curly hair. Someone's got like long, dirty blonde hair. It's super weird. Now, McGee had an interview with the Toronto Star. You want to hear from this asshole? Not really, but we've hear from this asshole? Because he's got a shitload to say because he's a total dickhead. Oh, you'll want to hate him more. He says, quote,

there has to be a progression of better treatments and privileges. This place thinks all they have to do is house the person, but the court sent people here for treatment. We ain't criminals. That's supposed to be the difference between this place and the correctional facility. Someone should have cut his throat right there. For sure.

How dare you fucking say you're not a criminal, motherfucker? I don't care what the court says. You know what you did. Oh, my God. How do you not just pummel his face? I swear to Christ, I'm going to punch this guy. So when they say, what are you in for? What do you think he says?

Nothing. I gave a Canal Street pap smear. Is that what he tells them? I think he did. What a piece of shit. Nothing. I'm in here for help. Right. I'm in here because my dad was mean. I'm sick. Yeah. Is that it? Is that what he tells him i think he's a piece of shit i'm in here for for help right i'm in here because my dad was mean i'm sick yeah is that it is that what he does uh he he has even expressed willingness and wanting this to meet that with the families of the victims

face to face if that'll give them closure uh yeah he said quote it wouldn't be a very comfortable meeting but i owe them that much i can never take that hurt away as much as I'd love to. I'll always it'll always be there. But I feel as if I give them a chance to meet with me and let them vent their anger. How much I messed up their lives. It would be a step in the healing process. No, I'm exhausted right now. This guy is a fucking asshole.

Fucking does he have like a business card that says like freelance gynecologist or something? Is that what he's trying to tell people? Yeah, he's got like a T-shirt. Yeah. What a cocksucker. I hate this guy so much. And it's so weird because normally we cover these cases and a lot of them in the small tower murder cases are, you know, relationship between two people got out of hand.

And it's usually, usually the cases we cover, obviously there's been Herb Coddington in Hawkins, Texas, lots of exceptions. But usually if this specific situation didn't happen to this person or they didn't put themselves in this specific situation, they would have probably never killed anybody. But this specific thing got to the point where they fucking snapped or they couldn't take it, they couldn't, whatever. This is not that at all. No.

This is a completely different thing. This is somebody enjoys inflicting pain on women. For sure. Yeah. On women. On women only. On women. Just females.

Females. The female gender because it's children and adults. He's a fucking nightmare. Well, he's also a pussy because he's not going to go after guys. And that's what it is, too, because he's afraid. I know. And I just like that description of him. He is. Because it's exactly what he is. He is a pussy because he's not going to go after guys. And that's what it is, too, because he's afraid. I know. And I just like that description of him. He is.

Because it's exactly what he is. He is a pussy. You're going after a 15-year-old girl when you're 27 years old? No, you're right. Sorry, you're a pussy. He's a coward. End of story. Yeah, it's all you are.

I don't see you attacking another 27-year-old dude because he'd kick your ass. That's why. It's because, and also, his wife probably would kick his ass because that's where he's at. He's going with children because they can't fight back. Yeah, it's true, man. His lawyer, this guy is, can you imagine being his lawyer? He says, quote, he wants to say he's sorry. It could benefit both sides.

Just saying he's the devil and not trying to understand doesn't help you get on with your life. It helps me just fine. Imagine if you're one of these people, the preparation you'd have to do to talk to this guy and how it would affect you afterwards. You're going to let this guy do this to you again? Run you through the ringer again emotionally? It's not just that. As somebody that survived it, the girl has to come back. The victim has to come to him and ask what –

Victim's family. And the ones that survived. You're going to ask, why did you do this to me? Why did you do this to my family? And he's going to give you an excuse that you're going to buy? Fuck you. Fuck that, Jeffrey. There's no excuse.

No. Jeffrey Scholes, whose 15-year-old sister was killed there, he said, quote, talk to McGee. That's a definite no to that. Fuck that guy. My man. Yes. Jeffrey's wife, Donna, said, quote, this is just so upsetting to everyone.

Yeah. She also said that her mother-in-law, she's happy that her mother-in-law, Ida, who is Jeffrey and was their mother, Donna said she's happy that Ida has Alzheimer's so she doesn't have to know what's going on because she'd be so upset about it. She gets to forget about this. Exactly. How fucked of a statement is that? I'm thankful that she's got a horrible disease that's going to kill her. Yeah. But the benefit is she doesn't remember what all—

She doesn't have to deal with this. She doesn't have to go through this again. Good Christ. Now, his lawyer, Daniel Brodsky, said that, hey, he would have been better off in a penitentiary. He'd have been released if he was—or at least in a minimum security if he'd have been criminally convicted, which is probably true. Not in America. No, but there— In America, they'd murder him.

He probably, oh, he would have been jailed in prison. Dead so fast. Yeah, good. Canada, you know what? Get your prison shit together. If you need, we have lots of violent people. We will import prisoners for your cell blocks just to stab child rapists. Just to clear shit like this out.

We're fine with that. We'll export them, no problem. You can bring them back when you're done. We're fine. Leave them on the front porch. We got that. We'll export them. No problem. You can bring them back when you're done. We're fine. Leave them on the front porch. We got it. We'll take them in when the lights come on. I've heard of foreign exchange students.

Why can't we just foreign exchange prisoners? Foreign exchange murderers. Let's do it. Yeah, let them have a different scenery. Yeah, no shit, man. So they're saying that anytime he's moved, if he eventually gets to minimum security, in minimum security, you will get day passes. So they're like, if you move him to medium, that's one step closer to minimum to where he's actually going to be outside.

On the street sometimes. Which is fucking scary. It's commonly – we know that we can't cure these people. But in May of 1991, the Supreme Court of Canada ruled that it was a violation of human rights to incarcerate a mentally ill person indefinitely. Indefinitely. So you have to have a time. Is it though? Yep.

So basically what they're saying is. How long has Mark David Chapman been in a mental health facility? Because he's not in jail. No, no, no. He's in a mental health facility. He's still fucking there. He's married and he bangs. I thought he got out.

No. Who's the one that got out? Shit. The other one. Yeah, the other one. There's Who's the one that got out? Uh, shit. The other one. Yeah, the other one. There's two from that time he got out. Yeah, sorry. Moving on. Mark David Chapman's still in there.

Yeah. I believe. Do we have to Google this? Let's not. Let's. Okay. Google it out there, everybody. The point is, uh, one of those guys gets like conjugal visits and.

Disgusting. And he's still in there. Like there's, there's no, it's open ended. Yeah. You just hang out until we think we can trust you. No shit. So, by the way, nobody wants this guy out. Nobody.

Apparently his son, there was a post on a blog thing about this whole deal, allegedly from his son. And here's what it says. We don't know if it's true or if it's from his son or not, but it says, quote, I can say in my heart I feel this man should stay right where he is at. I am scared. I am scared day after day of this man. He has tried contacting me.

And if he ever gets out, I feel that I am in danger. And so is my family. My prayers go out to those families. He hurts. I wish there was something I could do. I will continue fighting anyone who who is trying to get him out. I ask everyone and anyone to please support me in my fight, not just for the safety of me and my family, but for the safety of you and yours. That sounds real, honestly. And if it's not real, it's pretty on point. And just as somebody who knows what they're talking about other things

too, on these threads, there are people saying, I need to know more because my sister was murdered in that area in that time. And it's unsolvedolved and i want to know if it was him or not and it was killed in the same way this one girl says that her one woman said her 14 year old uh her sister was killed 14 days before one of his murders in the same area and in the same mo and she said she's tried to get uh you know the police to look into it but they can't do anything uh the problem is because he was found not guilty, they can't legally extract DNA from him. Even if they had, they can't force him to give DNA, even if they had samples from 1974, which I'm sure they don't.

But if they did, they can't force him to give DNA also. Okay, don't force it. Just wait until he's done with lunch and grab that milk carton. Yeah, fuck a fucking hair out. Right. Dink, there we go. Done. I mean, there's so many different ways that you can get it from him.

So many ways, but I guess then it's not, i don't care at this point it's fucking bullshit but there's still the point is there's people that never got closure because there's a lot of unsolved murders from that time period that they don't know who to attribute them to they think a lot of them are his because anything that was found out somewhere not in a bedroom or in a hotel right may 13th 2006 uh a provincial tribunal ruled he should be moved immediately to a West End Toronto health care center. OK. Yeah.

So it's it's unfucking real, man. The people from the medical community are freaking out about this whole thing. They're like, what are you talking about? One said, quote, we find it rather offensive that the review review board's order from last year has been snubbed, is what his lawyer's saying. They've slubbed, because they made a ruling, and it's been a year, and they still haven't transferred them yet. He says, quote, a year ago, an order was made, and nothing was done.

Well, it's so amazing, too, because all these people are looking on. Imagine you're a victim's family, and this guy's complaining. I don't want to. I don't like my room better. I need a better room. It's over here. He says about all this thing, he's all smiles. He said, you know, he expects to be moved soon because of the ruling.

And he says, quote, I'm elated is what he said. He said, quote, I'm no longer dangerous. I don't want to hurt anybody. I'm hoping sometime down the road I will be able to go out and visit with my family. Right. I'm no longer dangerous. Can you believe it? I don't even want to hurt anybody. Yeah. You got it. A 15 year old. No shit. The his lawyer said, quote, this was a flat out victory for Chris. If Chris is not at the Toronto facility by next week, I will go to the superior court with a motion calling for contempt charges to be laid against Oak Ridge.

Yeah. So he's been in Oak Ridge for 30 years. His lawyer said he's not looking to just them to fling open the gates and let him walk out. That's not what he's doing. He said he's seeking a controlled exit, starting with weekend passes to visit with his family, show society how much he can be trusted, and then we can let him out to do whatever he wants here. He's a grandfather now. He's a grandfather. Oh, yeah, he had two kids.

So, you know, they had kids. They have fucked up genetics. You think they're going to keep them to themselves? No, spread them around. He said that he's, you know, he works, plays solitaire on his computer there. He has a computer. Likes to show 24. That's his favorite.

Loves listening to gospel music. Born again Christian here. Called a model prisoner with a spotless record of three decades of custody. Don't care. Don't care. You know why he's got a spotless record? Because there's no fucking 15-year-old girls there. That's why.

He's never had a problem with anybody else. Yeah, all dudes. And people who could kick his fucking ass once again. Holy shit here. So, yeah. And there's a reporter there also that says that he talks to him and shakes hands with him. And he's saying how he's got a very strong handshake. And he said it was kind of disturbing because, you know.

That's a hand that's been around next. He strangled people with that and stabbed people with those hands. Jesus. He says he used to be illiterate, but he's fine now. He talks all about his, quote, mental health condition. Oh, boy. Yeah, he's all full of the. Now he knows how to bullshit people.

He's all full of the lingo. He says, quote, I was out of reality when I killed her, talking about Judith Barksley. He said, quote, the reality is I'll always have the problem, but now I can recognize the symptoms and take preventative measures. Stop myself before it happens again. I don't want anyone who's thinking about this shit. No, the reality is there are dead people and you did it. Yeah. That's the reality.

He said Barksley, he didn't plan it. He just saw her draw. He saw her walking and he made up his mind that he was going to rape her. He said, quote, I talked myself into it. I was fantasizing more and more as I walked behind her, building up the courage, the desire, the want. She looked good from behind. He says, I want to fucking stab this guy myself now.

He said that now this is his version of saying i'm good now he said she looked good from behind so i needed to attack and rape her yeah what don't you want to stab this guy to say that after fuck me how do you get to say that the reporter should have punched him absolutely just right there punched him right in the face i'm sorry throw him a sirloin and walk out. What the fuck? He said he never saw her face. He just attacked her.

He just wanted sex. He never even thought. This is what I mean, first attack. He never even thought of what to do after. He didn't have a plan or anything like that. He didn't have anything. He said he was startled because when she turned around, he said that he thought he had to kill her because she could identify him to the police.

That's why he slashed her throat quick. He's like, Oh shit, I better do that. He said, quote, I just couldn't walk away even though I hadn't done anything yet. But in my mind,

I had already committed the crime when he was walking behind her. It was already locked in. I've got, I want to fight him. Don't you know? 57 fat and diabetic. I want to fight him so bad. We challenge you, Christian McGee, to a fight. Yes, you and your likely purple and green blues ankles, I hate you.

He says, quote, if I were in... Jesus Christ, man. By the way, he hates the name Mad Slasher, he says. He hates it. You know, not him. Tough shit. I hope you name this podcast episode... It's going to be called The Mad Slasher.

He's lucky it's not called The Mad Cuntface at this point. He says, quote, if I were in the same situation now, I would just walk away if I got those thoughts. Now I would be able to recognize the warning signs and stop myself before anything happened. Back then, I couldn't do that. Those thoughts aren't normal. You shouldn't have those thoughts. You shouldn't walk behind people and go, I'm going to rape her real quick.

That's not normal. She looks good from behind. I'd sure like to rape her. I've never had that thought. Never. Not once. Never ever. And I've never thought, should I have those thoughts?

Just never crossed my fucking mind. He says his woodworking has given him confidence. He says he's raised more than $25,000 for charity by donating his woodwork at auctions. He sponsors a student in Ethiopia who's studying to become a nurse. He's just a good guy. He admits that he still gets deviant sexual

fantasies. He said, I still get them. Put them back in. He said he could never be cured of that problem, but he does insist it couldn't be controlled. Again, he says, quote, I was sent here because I have an illness. I didn't understand that then. I do now. Oh, Canada.

He said, I would have been out 25 years ago had I been found guilty at a criminal trial and given the mandatory life sentence. People convicted of first degree murder are allowed to apply for parole after serving 25 years. We're a compassionate country. That's the way our system is set up. I can never repay my debt to society. But in Canada, you're supposed to be given a second chance. Wow. You're not compassionate country. That's the way our system is set up. I can never repay my debt to society. But in Canada, you're supposed to be given a second chance.

Wow. You're not. No. Other people are. People like you are not. Sorry. You get a second chance when you stop paying your car loan and they repossess it. You get a second chance.

You can buy a new car. Yeah. All right. You want to hear from the mayor as we've found these small town mayors? Oh, Christ. Do I? Do you know who the mayor is? No.

Mel Veal, farm owner. Oh, my God. Are you shitting me? Yeah. They elected a fucking small town mayor. Come on, Jimmy. That's why I is? Mel Veal, farm owner. Oh my god, are you shitting me? Come on, Jimmy. That's why I said remember Mel Veal. I know how to tell a goddamn story. It comes full circle always. You guys voted for a man named Veal.

Mel Veal who owned a farm. That farmer guy, Mel Veal, I think he can run shit. He helped crack that mad slasher case. Oh man, that's some small town shit right there, man. Holy fuck, man. You know what's fucking going... He's out, right? Is he out or are they letting him?

No, no, no. I'm talking about this fucking asshole. They let him out? Yeah. No, no, no. They're still holding him here. Okay. He's trying to get out.

They're still having him transfer him to me. They're trying to transfer him. He's trying to get to a medium security facility. I'm just... I'm just... I'm mad because he's talking about getting out and he's talking about woodwork. You know what? Woodworking, you get heavy fucking sharp tools.

Don't give him knives. No. You're creating, you're fucking. You know what you also worked and carved? Right. Girls. A little girl. Women.

Yeah. And teenagers. So many of them. Fuck, man. Oh, Jesus. Mel Veal remembers him from the farm. He says, quote, he was so proud of his two kids and then something happened to him. We all heard he's been a model prisoner, but I don't think he can handle being on the outside after so many years in custody.

He should stay where he is. Yeah. Which, again, he's a farm mayor and all that type of shit. That's way better than, it's lack, you know, from last week. Better mayor. That statement's what got him elected. Yeah. For sure.

It's no, it's lack, but it'll do for now. May 17th, 2006, McGee loses his bid to be transferred to Toronto. A review board says, no, that should have never happened to begin with. He says he remains determined to get out. In the meantime, the lawyer's going to help him prepare for the appeal to get another bid to transfer because he's going to do that. Jesus Christ. How about just count your blessings? You know what I mean? Just be thankful you're not in a real actual fuck me in the ass prison.

Yeah, absolutely. He should be. Good God, because it would be happening. The Jeffrey Scholes guy there, the brother, said, quote, this is a small victory for victims and their families. He said, I feel good about it. So that's good anyway. At least he feels good about that, keeping him in there. So he's still stuck in there at that point.

In this hearing, they found that the review board erred by concentrating on finding the least onerous and restrictive setting for McGee. It was what they said. They were trying to find that rather than just find one that's more safe for society. A rehearing will be ordered. The brother here, Jeffrey Scholl, said, quote, I'll be there. I'll be there every goddamn time. That guy's a badass. Yeah.

The Justice E.A. Crunk, who sounds grumpy, wrote a 27-page ruling. I was just going to say he sounds like an author, and he showed it. They said in this one article, he said, quote, he, quote, minced few words as it condemned the review board's decision last May. He said, quote, the board's disposition was not made after meaningful consideration of the requisite statutory factors, namely the need to protect the public from Mr. McGee, Mr. McGee's mental condition, his other needs, and his reintegration into society. The evidence was that Mr. McGee persists in seeking a transfer to a medium secure facility because he believes that it will facilitate his desired access to women. Mr. McGee's motivation in seeking a transfer should have sounded an alarm bell for the review board.

There you go. Thank you. There's going to be fucking women there. Gee, I bell for the review board. There you go. Thank you. There's going to be fucking women there. Gee, I don't know. Nobody to rape in here. Right. Because like we said, the medium security facility is much more stress on reintegration. When are we going to get this guy back in here?

John Hinckley Jr. That's what you want. There you go. I don't know why that name just jumped into my head. Popped in your head finally here. People are very happy. Obviously, there's a lot of people that are elated about this here. March 2nd, 2014, a book is written by Mike Arntfeld.

It's London is the serial killer capital of the world. It's a really interesting book, actually. Yeah, it's a really pretty cool book. He talks about between 1960 and 1985, the London area had 32 homicide victims that are all women and children. That's a balls fucking claim. You know what I mean? What? London is the serial killer capital of the world?

During that time period. Okay, all right. Which I'd still say California probably had a beat at that point, I'm going to say. California and New York are fucking really beating on you. California really in the 70s was packed with serial killers. over that ridiculous but for the they're they're saying actually for the population there's only 400 000 people in ontario i got you and they had like four serial killers operating and what's one a one person in a hundred thousands of serial killer that's a high fucking rate man that's pretty bad in californ, that'd be like fucking 3,000.

Yeah, well, no, there was at least so many more million people. Right. Per capita. Right. They're pretty damn good at the serial killers here. Not too shabby. Canada, that's what you're good at. Per capita, you guys are good stuff.

It's just a ball's claim. That's all I'm saying. Yeah. This guy who wrote this book got notes from a detective sergeant at the time, a Dennis Alsop, based on everything. It's pretty damn cool. In an article about the book, they said, quote, it's unclear when it all came together, but Alsop established his compendium of his original diary entries from the 60s and 70s. Old documents from a bygone era.

Photostats, teletype transcripts, and documents created from now extinct technologies that we thought were lost to history. My God. And he gave them over to this author. Yeah. I would love to have access to this shit. This is the shit I don't have. That was an unbelievable statement. That was beautiful.

That was great, yeah. Most people say just like, they don't say now extinct. They say obsolete or some shit like that. That shit's gone. Yeah. Shit don't exist anymore. Yeah. What did he say? Extinct. Ext. That shit's gone. Yeah. Shit don't exist anymore. Yeah. What did he say?

Extinct. Extinct. It's beautiful. And the messed up part is these diaries really show a frustrated cop that knew what was going on. And it said, quote, through Alsop's diaries, he knew who did it and he was basically stonewalled for making arrests because they felt he didn't have enough. They didn't have enough.

They wanted a slam dunk. So he kept dabs on these people in his own time until they moved from London. And it seems at least one in the case that there are two other victims in Toronto connected to the same killer. So they wouldn't listen to him. And he's like a cop in some movie. Just pissed. Who's just like, I don't care. I'm a crack.

He's got that one picture of that girl who he never found the killer. And he keeps it up on his desk. And he's like, like i'm gonna find him and he just he looks over his old notes i'm gonna sleep at night thinking about her there's gotta be something yeah uh they said among the remaining 19 killings there are links to all sorts of things and at the time there's 400 000 people now at the time london had like 200 000 people that's not a lot to have that many fucking serial killers going on in it uh they had about five or six serial killers out of 200,000 people at that. And during one time, which is batshit. That's a lot.

That's a lot. Arntfeld, the author, said, quote, we have this massive cluster of victims that suggest they were all operating coincidentally. My Christ. Just happened to be out there. Wow. I'm surprised they didn't run into each other trying to pick up the same girl and rape her. You know what I mean? You know those conspiracy theorists?

Somebody's got to have a theory that the government did this, right? I mean, I'm sure there's some, yeah. But what was it? It'd be like something was in our food or something that was making this go on. That's the conspiracy is that there was something in a water supply, something about testing a weapons testing or something that made people lose their fucking mind. DDT. Yeah.

You name it. All that type of shit. There was something in the drugs in the 70s or some shit. Yeah. I mean, they're saying, why London? And they said, basically, because it's its distance from other cities. It's kind of its own thing out. And it's kind of an island.

It's like Tucson. Okay. In a way, I guess. That's too bad. I'm sure much better than Tucson. Sorry, Canada. We don't want to compare you to Tucson. Sorry for the insult.

Tucson, go fuck yourself. I don't care what you think because there's not enough of you for me to even give a shit and i've been there and to dump and you're all busy you know you're all busy painting anyway you're all busy painting and roofing and uh trying to get the bugs out of your house because it's disgusting down there building your own solar panel in your garage you fucking weirdo now may of 2014 they open up a uh they open up a new facility where they're transferring people to. It's a new facility called Waypoint. It has 301 psychiatric beds, 141 reserved for women. 301.

301. 20 of the beds are reserved for medium security, and 160 of the beds are reserved for male forensic patients requiring maximum security like our man Christian here, our asshole Christian here. Him and that other serial killer are also there. They're also coming. The old facility, Oak Ridge, was built in 1930, and it looked like a big mental institution basically is what it was here. One flew over the cuckoos and that's kind of place. Yeah, that sort of thing, whereas this is not. This is more of a hospital-type place.

I hope he's got a nurse ratchet that's a dude, though. Just like a mean fucking dude. So he's in there along with the Russell Maurice Johnson, the bedroom strangler, is also in there. That's nice. Yeah, this is the guy. He scaled up to 15 stories to enter apartments, this guy, by the way. What?

That's what a piece of shit this bedroom strangler is. Yeah. He was arrested in 1978 for the three killings, found not guilty by reason of insanity. And he now says that he runs a computer business from inside his room. What is it? Runs a business? You're in a fucking mental institute. What are you running?

Who's buying anything from this man? Ever. What is happening? What the fuck? Canada, you're too nice and forgiving computer business yeah no is he selling computers or is he doing business through the computer what the fuck is going on their national anthem is oh canada and it's it's definitely got to be something that's like an insult oh canada come on oh canada jesus canada Oh, Canada. Jesus, Canada. Come on, Canada. For the love of Christ. For fuck's sake.

Now, 2017, patients and inmates, slash inmates, whatever you want to call them, of Oak Ridge that were there sue the country. What? They sue the Crown over treatments and conditions during the time, including McGee, who is one of the plaintiffs in the fucking lawsuit. The Crown does not deny any of the conditions or the treatments, but says that they were the standard of the times and that their actions were only in an attempt to help the patients. Oak Ridge opened in 1933. So, you know, wasn't the most up to date. What was it?

Just like the Oak Ridge Boys songs? The constant. Just over and over again. It's like it was awful, dude. It was. If they were saying when they went in, they lost their minds. They're nuts now. No, they actually had a different –

They had three programs, the DDT program, the MAP program, and the CAPSUL program. And now these were – under the DDT program, patients were administered combinations of hallucinogenic, delirium-producing, psychosis-producing, or mind-altering drugs, including combinations of alcohol, dexamultofrananol, dexedrine, dextroamphetamine, imipramine, LSD-25, largesical, methadrine, Nozanan, Ritalin, Scopolamine, and Sodium Amytal. A party. That's what they're doing. That's what they're giving them to see what happens. What the fuck? The idea behind the program was that the drugs would disrupt the defense mechanisms of the criminally insane so they could confront their illness and the underlying personality disorder. By spending time at Manson Ranch?

What the fuck? MAP is weirder. MAP is a form of reeducation that involved regimen study, discipline, and punishment. The patient lived under a set of rules and was required to study papers and write examinations on interpersonal communication. The patient was not permitted to leave the program unless he had completed 14 days without unauthorized talking or movement. A disruptive patient at Oak Ridge was forced to sit on a bare floor with his feet straight out in front of him in the attention position.

His hands would either be cuffed or placed in front. He was confined to a space of approximately three square feet in which he would only be allowed to move only four times during a four-hour session. Standing's not permitted in this. It's crazy. You can't do that. No, you can't do that. That's bananas.

It's crazy banana shit is what it was here. Also, there's no casual talk. You can only talk in groups. Going back to MAP, have you sat in a position? I can't sit in that position. No, that's horrible. My fucking feet will fall asleep. Yeah, that's the other thing, too, here.

These are guys older than us. You can't do that to people. Yeah, in order to leave the MAP program, you'd have to be perfect for 14 consecutive days. A perfect day involves no slips of the tongue, no unauthorized moving, no keeping others waiting, no lack of participation, satisfactory demonstration of motivation, attitude, and participation. Perfect posture, deportment, and language. Impossible. Impossible.

Also, they would make them be naked and do meetings and things naked because that would free them, which would make me feel more uncomfortable. Fucking Guantanamo Bay. That's, thank you. I was getting there exactly to uncomfortable. Fucking Guantanamo Bay. Thank you. I was getting there exactly to that. That's exactly what it is.

That's terrible. So they talked about before that, people were choked, given tranquilizers, injections, all that sort of thing. That lawsuit is going on. That is in 2017. It's going on now. It's going on. I dug that fucking lawsuit up. Christian was in the MAP program three times and was in DDT from time to time.

So he's been through some shit in there. He's on the lawsuit. That's Christian McGee. Don't really care what the fuck they do to him at this point. Sticks something up his ass. Run him up the flagpole. Don't give a shit. I hope so.

Fuck Christian McGee. That's Strathroy, Ontario, Canada. Wow. What a disaster of a story. What a town. What a town. What a mess. Wow. Get your, Ontario, Canada. Wow. What a disaster of a story. What a town. What a town. What a mess. Wow. Get your shit together, Canada.

Get your shit together. Keep these people away. Oh, my God. Wow. If you like that story, you're a sick bastard. Yeah. And we love you for it. Yeah.

So thank you. And get on iTunes and give us five stars, please. It really helps out on the business end, like we said. iTunes, that's a huge way. Patreon, even bigger. Patreon.com slash Crime in Sports. Any penny counts, honestly. No doubt.

You can make a donation at PayPal using our email address, Crime in Sports, at gmail.com. And we have a huge list of people who have done just that this week and been amazing to us. Before we get to that, a couple other things. Live shows. Detroit with Dan Cummins. Not sure if there's any tickets left to that so it might be a moot point at this point. Boston, February 18th. It's a Sunday. 1 p.m. Small Town Murder.

4 p.m. Crime and Sports. 7 o'clock Small Town Murder is sold out so don't even try it. And March 25th, Phoenix, Arizona. Stand up live. Of course. Get your tickets there. All these tickets will be in the show description. The links will all be there. And then brace yourself because there is a

windfall more coming. There's a ton. Probably next week, if not the week after, we're going to announce a shitload of dates and a shitload of cities. So chill out on asking us to come there because we might be coming there. It might already be booked. So do that. If you want to get a hold of the show, you can do that at Murder

Small on Twitter, Small Town Pod on Facebook. Do that and CrimeAndSports at gmail.com is the email. Jimmy, I know you have a list that could just knock a horse out if you hit it in the head with it. So please, why don't you hit us with that list right now? This week

you guys was fucking incredible. Christian Castelli and Sarah Gilbo continue to be fantastic. Thank you both Why don't you hit us with that list right now? This week, you guys, was fucking incredible. I'm blown away. And Sarah Gilbo continued to be fantastic. Thank you both for being just angels to us. And we hope everything's going well over there. No doubt. I don't know if you saw the email. We got an email from Mercury DePhillips.

It's an email about a 60-year-old in an apron, which was fantastic. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Thank you, by the way. That was great. And then I got a snap today from her daughter asking if we got it. And I was like, yeah, yeah, yeah, I've seen that one. And then she said that she thought we ignored it. We did not ignore it.

And she looks terrific in it. There was a little bit of side boob. The email said, brace yourself for a 60-year-old side boob. And by the way, I've slept with much uglier girls in their 20s. So good for you, Mercury. Keep it up. You're doing fine. Jesus Christ.

I don't know what was the worst part of that statement. I don't know what's going to make everybody madder, but we'll find out. We'll get emails. This one sucks. Guys, don't send it to the page. Benito Martinez, Mariah Min here over in Deutschland. Oh, she's great. And she's Dutch.

She's Dutch. She told me where she's at. In Deutschland, Germany. And I forget every time. She's Dutch. She's definitely Dutch. Netherlands. I tried to say Netherlands.

No, it's not. Netherlands is Dutch. Is that where she's at? If she's Dutch, then yeah. Okay. It is Netherlands. That's definitely right. Thank you, Mariah.

Thank you. For being fantastic. Adam Davies, Jessica Leitke, Roxy Goetz, Daniel Whitford, Julian Flores, Tiffany Robertson. Where did I go? Alyssa Rojas. Rojas? Rojas? Rojas?

It's two S's. Rojas? Rojas. Ethan Ford, Kelsey Munoz. I hope your little girl gets better. Thank you so much. Andrea or Andrea Johnson, Barbara Lamka, Leslie Green, Lonnie or Loney? It's Lonnie, right?

Let's go with Lonnie. Yeah. Lonnie Strach, David Stanich, David L. Hemsley, Xander Myers, Callum Ceglinski. He donated both on Patreon and then over at PayPal. That's so awesome. Thank you so much. Thanks for the effort, too. Xander Myers.

That's cool. Did I say? I said Xander Myers. Yeah. Scott Howells, he loved an episode of Crime and Sports. So thanks, Scott. I appreciate you. Extraordinary Stories podcast.

Angela Chadwick, go listen to that Extraordinary Stories podcast. Stephanie Chapman. We don't know if it's good, but they gave us some money. So give them a shot. Give them a look. Hey, give them a chance. Jennifer Thompson did both also. Donated on Patreon and then over PayPal.

Thank you, Jennifer. Spencer Gaynor. Samantha Gibson. Dominique Waller. Drunk Bray Wyatt. That's fascinating. Drunk Bray Wyatt. That's a wrestler, right?

Really? Bray Wyatt's a wrestler? Oh, you're right. Yeah. That's true. I've heard that name. So Drunk Bray Wyatt is the person who does it. I don't watch modern wrestling, but I've heard that name before.

That's true. Amy Starr. Thank you, Amy. Josh Cole and Britt Cole. Thank you both. Keith. Is it Keith? No, it's Kevin.

Kevin. Kevin Wagner, right? Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, Kevin Wagner in Jersey sent... Is it Kevin? It's got to be Kevin. Yeah, yeah. Kevin Wagner sent money through... Yeah, yeah, yeah.

The guy sends money through the fucking mail. That's so cool. Thank you, man. Snail mail shit. It's so cool. It's fantastic. It's got to be Kevin. Yeah, yeah. Kevin Wagner sent money through. Yeah, yeah, yeah. The guy sends money through the fucking mail. That's so cool. Thank you, man. Snail mail shit. It's so cool. It's fantastic. It's great. I feel like my grandmother sent me a card when I'm eight.

It's awesome. Thank you, dude. Seriously. Lena Sears, Hazy Nelson, Olivia Fung, Becky Miller, Stephanie Dymek. No, Stephen Dymek. Not Stephanie. Stephen, bro. I'm so sorry.

Stephen Dymek. We just gave you a janitor. Right. Carissa Snyder, I'm so sorry. Stephen Dymek. We just gave you a Jenner. Right. Carissa Snyder. Pete Yankura. Pete Yankura. That's it. He's got Yank at the beginning of his last name. That gets you very excited. You're like, hey, my man. It makes me go, that's definitely not Yank.

My man. Right, right. Nadia Skulia. Skalia? Skali. S-K-A-U-L-I. Skali? Skali. Sure. We'll call it that. Nadia. Thank you, Nadia. Ashley Scalia, Scully, S-K-A-U-L-I. Scully? Scully. Sure. We'll call it that. Nadia.

Thank you, Nadia. Ashley Hathaway, Doug Burton, Daniel Frumkin, Amy, Jesus Christ, really? The easiest. Amy L. Jones. I'm going to fucking stutter that. Yeah, Amy Jones is about as easy as you get. You're not going to get much better than that. Amy L. Jones.

Thank you. Talena. Jones, thank you. Talena Jensen, Elizabeth Armour, Jared Crooks, Stacey Huffaker. She's the best. Thank you. There's got to be something. And we figured it out. Did you? I'll tell you afterwards, but there's an algorithm there to that. Thank you.

She sent us a message explaining it. Oh, hilarious. That's fantastic. Thank you so much. Jared Crooks, I already said that. Stephanie Huffaker, there she is. Stephen Mace. Catherine Collado.

Esther Wright. Michelle Jolly. She's fantastic also. Oh, yeah. She sends me shit on Snap. Australian, right? Yes, I think so. Amy Pohanek.

Oh, yeah. Rise Probin. Rachel Dean. Carol Hayden. Thank you so much, Carol, by the way. That was a fucking unbelievable donation. Thank you. So nice of you.

Luke Rogers. Nilu Rafsanjani. What? Are you shitting me? You got that right. That was amazing. unbelievable donation. Thank you. Luke Rogers, Nilou Rafsanjani. What? Are you shitting me? That was amazing. She's going to be blown away. Kathleen Thill, Samantha Taylor. She has a podcast called Hidden Staircase Podcast. Listen to that if you can.

Megan Strapik, of course. She didn't hear her name the other day. Megan Strapik, Megan Strapik. There you are. For sure. Ge Strapik. Megan Strapik. There it is. And we'll definitely see you in Boston. For sure. Geekcast Live Podcast. I'm not sure what that one is. I haven't listened to it yet. Where are all these podcasts donated? Oh, because they want a plug. Of course they do. That's pretty fucking

clever. Isn't that fucking clever? That's very smart of them. We should have thought of that back in the day when we needed it. Right. No doubt. Good jobs. Way to think, guys. Dana Grayson started a podcast and he has a website stateofgrayson.com. He's a trucker. We love Dana.

He's a good guy. Give him a shot. Whether it's good or not, listen to him. Give him a shot because he's a good guy. That's what it is. Give him a chance. There you go. Brandy Allen donated.

She's an author. She's the one that sent us those children. Those are great. My daughter loved that. She's an artist. My daughter, she was like, the illustrations are beautiful. She wanted us to tell you that. There was so much to the imagination.

My daughter had all kinds of questions. I was like, thanks illustrations are beautiful. She wanted us to tell you that. And there was so much to the imagination. My daughter had all kinds of questions. I was like, thanks a lot, Brandy. She just wanted her to know how beautiful she thought her illustrations were. And my seven-year-old wanted more explanation. I was like, I don't know. The words are in the book. I don't know. That's what you got.

That's it. She's from Spain. I don't know what to tell you. She's from America. Lives in Spain. I know. Okay. Joseph Shelpman, Zachary Dubois, and Lauren Le Bourgeois.

Isn't that fucking... Jesus. Both of them right next to each other, too. Coming out. James Cook, Naima Shea, Amy Negley, Timothy Young, and then Wyvern Workshop. I'm not sure what that is, but Google that and give them some whatever business. Tyler Dyke, I think, or Dick. It can't be Dick, right? It's either one. Yeah. It's D-Y-K. It's business. Tyler Dyke, I think, or Dick. It can't be Dick, right?

It's either one. It's D-Y-K. It's got to be Dyke, right? I would think. I don't know. Tyler, that's unfortunate. I'm sorry, dude. John Wipert, thank you guys so much for everything you guys do.

Really quickly, listen, we get a ton of fucking emails, and we get a lot of emails from people telling us that we help them through a lot of tough stuff, like legit life challenges and legit hurdles that I can't fathom being faced with. And the thing is we pay attention to them. Right. And we'll tell each other, oh, my God, did you see that one from that? And we talk about it, and it means the world to us. It does. It really does.

I'm not thankful for the awful obstacles, obviously, but I'm thankful for the grace and humble humility with which these people handle the things that are being thrown at them. I'm a cold-hearted asshole most of the days, and it's because of the tortures that I've endured in my short lifetime, which it's only gotten this far by the grace of dumb luck, chance, and happenstance

that I'm here now. And there are people in this world suffering through turbulent and uncertain futures. I just want you guys to know that we think about that stuff all the time. Every goddamn day, I think about it. And I thank you guys for listening. I thank you for laughing. I thank you for getting it. But thank you for spending your time with us, because that's the shit that's more valuable than money. And I realize we entertain you in a cubicle, in your car, sometimes more intimately that in your house or in your bed.

But you're doing something for us when you laugh and you enjoy it. And time is precious. And when you spend it a little on a review, reviewing this, interacting on social media, telling a friend or actually giving a shit and listening, you guys are giving something back, giving to us something that you can't get back. And that's why we try to involve you. Right. something that you can't get back.

And that's why we try to involve you. Right. So from the bottom of my cold, black, brittle, calloused, shitty heart, thank you guys so much for caring and thanks for being around. Yeah, we appreciate it very much. We appreciate you caring and we appreciate you guys kind of making us a part of what you do and a part of your life and a part of everything. And then if you do anything extra for us, that's just ridiculous. It's amazing.

It's so amazing that it's actually silly. Yeah. That's how awesome it is. So, guys, thank you so, so much. What if one of these fine people wanted to get a hold of a guy like you? You can find me at WismanSucks, W-H-I-S-M-A-N Sucks, on Twitter, Instagram, and Snapchat. Follow me, play along. I try my best to put up new things every day or at least every couple of days so that you guys can see what dumb shit I'm up to.

So thank you guys for playing along. And I am at Jimmy P is funny. You can find me there or you can copy and paste my last name from the show description. Don't try to spell it. You're going to be a hero and it's not going to work out for you. So don't even bother. Just do that. And honestly, guys, we do from the bottom of our hearts appreciate every second you spend with us,

every penny you give us, every friend you tell. These things are little and they add up, though, like you have no idea. And they've added up to just a tsunami of us being overwhelmed by this tsunami of support. So thank you guys so much. And we'll be here supporting you next week. And until next week, guys, it's been our pleasure. Bye. Bye.

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Visit ADT.com slash podcasts. Hey, Prime members, you can listen to Small Town Murder early and ad-free on Amazon Music. Download the Amazon Music app today. Or you can listen early and ad-free with Wondery Plus and Apple Podcasts. Before you go, tell us about yourself by completing a short survey at wondery.com slash survey. It's all a lighthearted nightmare on our podcast, Morbid. We're your hosts. I'm Alina Urquhart. And I'm Ash Kelly. And our show is part true crime, part spooky, and part comedy.

The stories we cover are well-researched. He claimed and confessed to officially killing up to 28 people. With a touch of humor. I'd just like to go ahead and say that if there's no band called Malevolent Deity, that is pretty great. A dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit with a little bit of cursing. This mother****er lied. Like a liar. Like a liar.

And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal, or you love to hop in the Wayback Machine and dissect the details of some of history's most notorious crimes, you should tune in to our podcast, Morbid. Follow Morbid on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to episodes early and ad-free

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