Small Town Murder - #7 - A Young, Budding Serial Killer in St. Johns, Arizona

Episode Date: March 1, 2017

This week, we look at the quiet mountain community of St. Johns, Arizona, where one of the youngest serial killers in history was just getting started, when an unexpected event, derails his plans for more murder. And a small town police chief ends up hearing the tale of his life. Along the way, we find out about some old west shootouts, how to be "prepared", and exactly how far back we'll look at boy scout master records to see if someone may be a bad guy. Hosted by James Pietragallo & Jimmie WhismanNew episodes every Thursday!!Please subscribe, rate, and review!Listen on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher, or wherever you listen to podcasts!Head to shutupandgivememurder.com for all things Small Town Murder!For merchandise: crimeinsports.threadless.comCheck out James and Jimmie's other show: Crime in Sports Follow us on social media!Facebook: facebook.com/smalltownpodInstagram: instagram.com/smalltownmurderTwitter: twitter.com/MurderSmall Contact the show: [e-mail] See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Small Town Murder early and ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. What if you married the love of your life and then stood by them as they developed 21 new identities? What would you do? This Is Actually Happening is a weekly podcast that features extraordinary true stories of life-changing events told by the people who lived them. Listen to the newest season of This Is Actually Happening on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. This week, we look at St. John's, Arizona, where one of the youngest serial killers in history changed things forever.

Welcome to Small Town Murder. Yay! Oh, yay. You're excited this week, Jimmy? Fuck yeah. I'm super excited this week. Thank everyone out there for joining us. My name is James Petrigallo.

I'm here with my co-host. I am Jimmy Wissman. We're excited. We're very excited. Thank you guys for all the iTunes reviews this week. We really, really appreciate it. That helps us so much. You're help keeping us on the charts.

And we just got some sponsors about to come on board soon. We haven't fallen off the charts yet. I love saying that every week. Thank you guys so much. Absolutely. Hope you enjoyed last week. I don't know if enjoyed is for a horrible tragedy. But that was one of the we've covered in crime and sports. We've covered a lot of people and we've covered a few here.

And he's in the top three of worst people we covered. The Jerry McFadden, one of the worst people I've ever heard of, ever heard of. He was just a horrible person. Terrible. Somebody sent us a message saying that they know the secretary. Get out of here. He took on the 1979 deal and left her for dead. The kidnapping and all that shit? The kidnapping. She said for some reason they only charged him with a sexual assault.

She doesn't know why, but she knows the lady, and he did horrible things to her, abused her, and left her for dead. Yeah, ruined her life forever. Yeah, so, I mean, it's ridiculous. Poor girl. And that was the minor crime in that, which was just ridiculous. How crazy is that? That's the fucking nicest thing he ever did in his life. It's unreal.

Yeah, the other things were worse because at least the woman wasn't 14 or she didn't end up dead. That's how bad this guy was. He was horrible. What a terrible individual. Thank you, guys. I just want to go over one thing real quick with you guys here. I'm going to let you preface it. I'm going to let you tell the story. But listen, don't fucking take this lightly what james is about to say this is

so important that's this is a real story i'm going to tell you guys about and we've gotten a couple of people some feedback saying how basically just just some feedback thinking that we don't care about the victims or we're laughing about it or we're doing all this. Let me explain something to you guys. And this is going to be a short story, okay? This is the origin of why I think we should be laughing around these things, not at the crimes but around the things that happen to them because this is the way you get by. When I was 11 years old, 1989, true story, and I've never told this on either podcast, have I? True story.

My great-grandmother at the time was 84 years old. She lived in Florida. And we got a call one night that she was murdered. And that's dead serious. We got a call that she was murdered, and we found out how she was murdered. Apparently somebody knocked on the door and asked to use her phone or use the bathroom, something like that. My great-grandmother was a very nice woman. First of all, too, let me preface. she's five foot tall, about 89 pounds soaking wet,

sweet little old lady looks like a Hubie Brooks, the basketball announcer. That's what he looks like. That's what she looks like. We used to call him, we used to call him big Nan because she had the same hair, the white hair. Anyway. So we found out she was murdered and we found out this person ransacked her apartment, tied her to a chair, and cut her throat. Oh, what a turd he is. So she, actually. No, no, not your grandma. No, no, she, the person who did it, was a woman.

This was a woman. She was a really bad drug addict. She was a crackhead. And she did this to my great-grandmother. And so, yeah, this was a personal thing that we could cover something like that on this show. That's how nasty it was. It really was disgusting what they did to her. It was bad.

And we were at the funeral. Yeah. And it's an open coffin and an open casket at the funeral. So they had to cover her throat, obviously. So they had strings of pearls because she used to wear, like, pearls, old lady stuff. And she had strings of pearls, and it was probably wrapped around her throat about eight times around her neck to cover the— Oh, Jesus. To make, like, a barrier to cover the wound so you wouldn't see it at the funeral

and i was 11 years old and i was sitting there with my cousin at the at the casket and i looked over at my cousin and i said if she had been wearing that the whole time none of us would be here right now okay that's my great-grandmother who i love i love this woman she's sweet she was the matriarch of that side of the family and that's what popped into my head to get through it yeah because it was disturbing for me and it was either be depressed turn into some kind of serial killer or make a fucking joke about it and that's the day i became a comedian and that's the day i became interested in this sort of thing and so that's where this comes from. That's where humor comes from.

You said that standing over the matriarch of your family's coffin. I did. And my cousin looked at me. You're an animal. Well, it wasn't even, it was just how I could get, I was 11. I love it. I was 11. It was how I could get through it.

And I didn't know what else, it was either that or like, oh my, I didn't know how to, everybody was very sad. And I was like, I should say something funny and make them not sad anymore. I picture a tiny little Italian guy saying that shit. That was me. I had big puffy hair. Big puffy hair and everything. You dressed nice, and then you said that shit.

That's the funniest goddamn thing I've ever heard in my life. I had the 1977 Pete Rose haircut just over the ears, one of those. And my cousin thought it was hilarious because he's got a dark sense of humor, too. He looked at me like either this kid's sick or he's funny. And so hopefully I'm funny. But anyway, that's where we come from with this. So I don't take this shit lightly. I didn't take that lightly and I don't take this lightly.

Humor is how I can get, how I can deliver information, how I can get through stuff. And how I can tolerate terrible circumstances. And we're thinking hopefully maybe there's a lot of other people that are like that out there that are feeling the same way and maybe they'll be on board for this. So the disclaimer for the week is if you don't think that true crime and comedy should go together, turn it off, unsubscribe, take a hike. Because if we hear later, oh, they're denigrating the victims. No, we're not. No.

Guarantee you we're not. Because I have respect for these victims and so do you. And we really do. I don't say a damn thing terrible about any of these victims yet. I'll rip apart a murderer. Absolutely. I'll rip them limb from limb. We're actually going to actually, as I say that, we are going to denigrate a victim this week.

All right. Because one of the victims of this crime was a complete piece of shit also. There's nothing wrong with that. So it's one of those. Sometimes karma comes around and bites you, bro. Sorry to make that a little lengthy, but I thought that would explain a little bit of where we come from and where our mindsets are. And Jimmy, I know you've had tons of tragedy and horrible things happen to you.

And that's why we're comedians. And that's why we do this. So let's get into the crime this week, shall we? Or the town first of St. John's, Arizona. Oh, it's so pretty. It's a tiny town. And by the way, everybody, too, we've also had people, you don't make fun of your own hometown.

We live in Arizona. This is our home state. I've lived here for 20 years. How long have you lived here for? 30. 30 years. We're residents here. We're locals.

It's kind of the place. Yeah. And we live in Phoenix, obviously, which is not a small town. No. But we've been to all these towns in Arizona. And let me tell you something. This is northern Arizona, northeastern Arizona on the New Mexico border. This northern Arizona is

weird. It's a weird place. You think small town, you think you have an idea in your head of what a small town is. Not out here. It's super weird. It's a mixture of retired people and people hiding. And mountainous weirdos.

Like survivalist nutcases. There's tons of that. It's such a weirdos. Mountainous, yeah, like survivalists. Yeah, there's tons of that. It's such a weird place. There's a show on TV, like they're survivalists. There's a guy that lives up in Prescott that walks, he's never worn shoes in the last 40 years. Jesus Christ. He's barefoot all day long. It's like a Kenyan.

It's weird. It's fucking bizarre. And that's what lives here in Arizona. That's what I mean. It's weird. It's fucking bizarre. And that's what lives here in Arizona. That's what I mean. It's like rock people that get their juju from fucking crystals. That's the other thing too. You have Sedona which is a bunch of super like you know

hippie like Stevie Nicks lived up there and like that's all crystals and aliens and shit. And then you have like some of these towns where it's just where it's they're like a lot of them are too like refuge for the religious. Yeah. Fundamentalist Mormons. That's right. And take over some of these towns where it's just – where it's – they're like – a lot of them are too are like refuge for the religious. Yeah. Like the fundamentalist Mormons.

That's right. And take over some of these towns. Colorado City. And have 14 wives. Not regular LDS fundamental – the Warren Jeffs people. Yeah. That's where this comes from. Northern Arizona is –

You can call them what they are. Child molesters. Those fucking weirdos. They are. He is a child molester. Read the court documents because I have. He's a fucking child molester. He's a piece of shit.

He's gross. So St. John's, Arizona, it is also, it's up in the White Mountains up there. Yeah. The elevation, maybe that's what's making these people crazy. It's at 5,686 feet. Is it really? It's higher than Denver. No kidding.

I mean, it's the mile high city here. Yeah. It's up there. It's, like I said, in the White Mountains. It's kind of a big town for a small town and area. It's 26.1 miles. Wow. Square miles.

That's a lot. That's what Manhattan is. Yeah. So, I mean, it's a big town for a small town in Erie. It's 26.1 miles. Wow. Square miles. That's a lot. That's what Manhattan is. Yeah. So, I mean, that's a pretty big area. It's just spread the fuck out and not up. Except instead of 8 million people here, there is 3,483 people here. They almost all have a square mile to themselves. Pretty much.

Less than 3,500 people, which is actually up 5.7% since the last census. Some people are moving there for some reason. I don't know why. The population really went up between 1970 and 1980. It went up 155%. Wow. It stayed steady, steady, steady all through the years since it was founded, and we'll get into its history, and then just shot up in the 70s. And I'm like, what the hell happened?

And then I finally figured it out. I found that SRP, Salt River Project is one of the electric companies here, built a massive power plant up there. There you go. So they needed workers and people building it. That's where all the people came from. That'll do it. That was them. They expanded one here.

It's an older town, as a lot of these towns up there are, because a lot of people retire from Phoenix up there. Some people retire to Phoenix, and then people who are in Phoenix retire even farther north. So we just do the circle. They get the hell out of the heat is what they do. That's what it is. And it's they can't take it anymore. It's the median age. There's forty six point seven. Wow. Which is way older than the thirty seven point four national average of a median age for a town. Even male versus female. No, no weird. Nothing's out of whack there like it was last week. Pretty average statistically all across the board except for the number of married with no children, which is nuts. Married with no children, the average around the country is 41.44 percent.

Yeah. Married with no children. Here it's 72.66 percent. So I think we're dealing with old couples. Yeah. That's the only thing I can think of. But married with – People who use –

Yeah, that makes sense. Or people who are really dependable taking their birth control pills. Either one. Something. But that's a lot. And also way more widowed people up there because it's a ton of old people. It's a lot of retirees and stuff like that. And then, like I said, the redneck survivalists are up there also.

We're going to talk about that. Less than average in every age group from 0 to 14. So not a lot of kids there, as we just mentioned, obviously. There's not couples with kids. 45 years old plus more than average in every category. That's no shocker here. Every category. Everyone. Everyone. That's hilarious. Racially, it's interesting here, actually. 61.13% white, 62% is the average. So that's

normal. 0.17% black. so it's probably one guy, literally. That's Ed. Here's our black guy. There he is. How you doing, Ed? Hey, buddy. How are you? 12.24% average, 0.0% Asian, of course.

Right. They're not even a restaurant there. 5% is the average. 8.16% Native American, which is way higher than the average. It's normally about half a percent's so many reservations up there. Oh, yeah, yeah. It's all reservation, a lot of it. And 29.8% Hispanic.

Wow. 29.80% Hispanic, which is way higher than the 16% average. And this is the first town we've had with more than 2% Hispanic in it, actually. And that's shocking to me, too. Even though it's in Arizona, that there's that many Spanish people living in northern Arizona in the fucking mountains. Well, I'll tell you why in a second. There's a reason why, actually, a historical reason. Oh, you know what?

I think I've got a good grab of it right now. But go ahead. Just a quick thing on the schools. They spend less, about a quarter less per quarter amount, less per student. I actually have a higher graduation, higher amount of people up there with a high school education than normal by about 5%. It's 91% are high school graduates up there. Four-year grads, though, 11%. That drops.

Graduate high school, fucking quit. I've had enough. 30% is the average. Just people don't go there because there's no jobs there for people with four-year degrees. And they're kind of aged out of the people that are there. When they got out of high school, they went to the fucking army. You know what I mean? They went to the service.

They fought the Koreans. You know what I mean? They went over with Alan Alda and fought the Koreans back then. Master's degrees, not a lot of them, about half the average, and 0.00% doctorate. How about that? So once again, nothing to do there if you're doing that. Religious. Now, here's where we'll get into the history.

Religion, 49.67% say they're religious. 49.42% is average, so right on average there. 21% Catholic. That would be the Hispanic people. Some Baptists, some Pentecostal, other Christian, that sort of thing. 22% LDS. I was going to say Mormon. 22% Mormon.

You betcha. That's a big thing up there. 0.0% Jewish, 0.0% Muslim. Once again, I don't know what it is about these small towns. I don't know if Jewish people aren't allowed. Get yourself some Jews, you'll have less markers. That's just an anecdotal observation. That's what we found.

Yeah. Surprising politically, actually. 66% Democrat, 31% Republican, which I wouldn't expect up there. But okay, we'll take it. I guess it's close enough to Colorado. I suppose. I mean, it's just a very small town deal. Colorado's still a red state, I believe.

No, not really. They lean more blue, but they're still red. Colorado is one of those states that actually splits electoral votes. Oh, they do. They have them in Maine, I believe, the two that split. You can get different districts. OK, let's get off of that. That is not interesting at all. Research for different districts. Okay, let's get off of that. Jesus, that is not interesting at all.

Research for another time. Anyway, it's mostly Democrat. Moving forward. Now, originally the town was called San Juan. That's the original name of the town by the first settlers. In 1879, a Mormon land agent bought land and water rights from a guy named Solomon Barth. Basically, he was a freight hauler. He built a bridge across the Little Colorado River

and settled some of the workers' families there. The Mormons found out when they bought it that this guy had also already sold a bunch of this land that he sold to them to 17 Mexican families also that had been there for a long time and settled there. Yeah, because they used to own it. Exactly. They're settled.

I mean, they're not going anywhere. I mean, this is 1879. So, I mean, they're not going anywhere. So the Mormons found, like I said, it's already gone. So the Mormons and Mexicans resented each other for a long time. They fought with each other. Big shootout, like an OK Corral situation. Awesome.

In 1882 on June 24th. This is some Old West shit right here. This is good stuff, man. Fuck yeah. We haven't had any of this. There's a big shootout between the cattle ranchers from the nearby Greer Ranch and the Spanish settlers. Yes. Big shootout.

The ranchers hated the Mormons, though, even more than the Mexicans. Really? Yes. They said they had an anti-Mormon newspaper. It was literally an anti-Mormon newspaper, which is crazy. And in May of 1884, this more anti-Mormon newspaper wrote, quote, desperate diseases need desperate remedies. The Mormon disease is a desperate one. And the rope and the shotgun are the only cure.

Wow. That's strong. That is. Yeah. That's fighting words. The Klan wouldn't fucking say that. Like, that's rough. No.

These people do not like Mormons at all. Wow. And we're not laughing at the. No. But this is, you know, 120 years ago. It's not like there's someone doing it now. Oh, I'm laughing at it. But it's funny as shit. Like, wow is 120 years ago. It's not like there's someone doing it now. Oh, I'm laughing at it. But it's funny as shit.

Like, wow, that's aggressive. It's aggressive. The rope and the tree are the answer. The rope and the shotgun are the only cure. Oh, my God. That's even more just – that's fighting words for sure. The only cure. That's a challenge.

That's fucking amazing. Unreal, man. So the economy of this place, as you might imagine, is a little weird being a small mountain town up there. I'm guessing mining. It's not actually mining. There's production, transportation, material moving. That might be considered mining. So I'm not sure.

Unemployment rate is 12.7%, 12.70, which is more than double, more than twice the national average of 5.2. Lousy job growth. Household income is about $31,000 is the median household. It's 53,000 average. Only 0.44% of people make over $200,000. Wow. That's 5% is the normal. It's mostly fixed income, Social Security stuff it sounds like.

Most people there make between $20,000 and $50,000 a year. That's exactly what it is. That's exactly what it is. That's exactly what it is. Not a lot of tech jobs, which is why there's no college graduates there. You mean that's not the new Silicon Valley? It's surprising. Surprising. 0.99% of the jobs are engineering and science, so it's less than a 1%.

0.0% legal again. Guys, get some lawyers up there. It might help you guys. Stop relying on other towns. Jesus. Production, material moving is 17 percent of the of the deal cost of living up there yeah everything is actually a little bit more expensive because it happens to be in the middle of nowhere except for housing like utilities all that yeah let's say 100 is the average as we do for cost of living st john's is an 85 for the cost of living cost of living now the health John's is an 85. For the cost of living? For the cost of living.

Now, the health care is more expensive. Transportation is more expensive, that sort of thing. Housing is a 44 compared to 100. So it's way cheaper than usual. Yeah, way cheaper than usual. Median home cost there is $82,000. $185,000 is our average nationally. Low property taxes.

For some reason, 20% of the houses are vacant up there. I don't know what the hell that's going on, but I guess maybe they're shit boxes no one wants to renovate. A two-bedroom apartment there will cost you $865 on the average. That seems steep. That seems steep for there, honestly. $1,027 is the national average. 10% of the houses there are valued at less than $20,000. Wow.

So what the hell are they? That's got to be. Why would you rent an apartment if you can get a $20,000 house? Absolutely. Now, totally. Now, looking at also, too, here, looking at the St. John's housing report, in case we've convinced you to move there, you want to have a shootout with some Mormons or some Mexican settlers in a creek somewhere, you can find there. Now, a lot of these are manufactured houses.

You have to look close. They all look like those houses that you see on the freeway coming in, you know, two. That are cut in half. You could say wide load on the back. Yeah, giant truck. Yeah. It's one of those. Like, there's a four-bedroom, 1,500-square-foot house that I think possibly is manufactured for $117,000.

That's a big place. That's a big place for cheap. That's a cheap place. They all look manufactured. It's so weird. Or they're cabins. Either one. Either you get a cabin or a shithole, you know,000. That's a big place. That's a big place for cheap. That's a cheap place. They all look manufactured. It's so weird. Or they're cabins. Either one. Either you get a cabin or a shithole, you know, manufactured.

And some of those that are up there in the White Mountains, in that general area, tend to look like they're manufactured, but they're just preformed, slapped together shit. They're just shit houses. Right. They're just garbage that somebody just, all the sides are the same size. That's it. That's kind of what, yeah, that's the deal we're looking at here. Now, I found a really nice house, a four-bedroom, three-bath, 4,500-square-foot house, which is enormous.

Yeah. For $249,000. Wow. And it looked nice, too. I was like, this is a nice house. If you're making $30,000 a year, you can't afford that goddamn thing. That's the problem. Now, if you just want to get a tent and camp out somewhere in the beautiful mountains up there.

That's around that. A 119-acre lot. It's a lot of acreage. Wow. For 76 grand. What? So you can just spread out. Just go up there.

That's amazing. Do your thing. Yeah, that's why people move up there. You would never see the end of your property. No. That's it. That's so much land. And the land up there is gorgeous.

Yeah. It is beautiful land. Besides the shit that happens there, it's a beautiful area. 20 of those acres might be right down the side of a fucking mountain. You never know. Yeah, that's the thing. They might be rocks, rocky things. They might not be usable.

No. Let's get into the crime rates because then we'll get into the crime that occurred there. Crime rates here, property crime, which is burglary, larceny, theft, et cetera, is exactly average. Wild. Normally, the small towns, it's a little higher than average. Exactly average there. But another thing that's odd, usually violent crime, murder, rape, robbery, assault is usually half.

It's usually half. Here, it's actually significantly higher. Wow. Yeah. It's about 25% higher than the average. That's incredible. Which is really weird. Now, on the town website here, it's sjaz.us.

Yeah. They have three different slogans. They cannot decide on a slogan on the website. One's for the Mexican settlers, one's for the Mormons, and one's for the other people. For the cowboys. Right. Yeah. It's such a weird thing because they're in different spots and you're like, pick a fucking

slogan. Pick a motto. Get an ad company in there and say, pick a motto for us. Let's do this. They didn't even go after what Rainham did and just lie? No, no. Also, too, here, their upcoming events I got's do this. They didn't even go after what Rainham did and just lie? No, no. Also, too, here, there are upcoming events I've got to do quick. This is on the town website of upcoming events.

April 1st and 2nd, there's a gun show, obviously. And up there, too, you kind of need a gun because bears are a consideration up there. This isn't like, oh, these guys are all... No, you need a gun if you go outside because you might be attacked by a giant wild animal at any moment. Just to take the trash out. Exactly. You should have a gun on you at all times. On the 8th of April is a preparedness fair.

A what? Those are the survivalist cases that are out there. A bunch of like pretty much a bunch of white supremacists out there, like, you know, wanting to live off the land. No offense, but sorry if you're a white supremacist, go fuck yourself anyway. Or Eagle Scouts that just can't let the Scouts go. I think it's like that. That's why they move there. It's like when the shit happens in the city, I'll be up here.

I'm safe. That's what they think, too. When everyone's running from the cities, I'll be up here with my shotguns. They ain't coming on my property. That's how these people think. I know people that live up there. Not in this town, but in other towns up there. I got 120 acres down the face of a rock mountain. I dare you to climb it. Yeah, go ahead, asshole.

On the 7th and 8th are the horse trials. So I don't know if a horse has committed a crime or if that's some sort of judging deal or what. The horse trials. That one shit on my property. That one shit on my property. Now, let's get into the slogans here, and then we'll get into the crime. All right.

The slogans are, slogan number one is close-knit, family-first community. That's what it says at the top of their website. That's the Mormon one. That's the Mormon one. Okay. Then there's one that says the people, the land, the life. That's the Native American one. Okay.

That's them. And then the third one, which is the one that seems to be thrown around by everybody else as their town motto, is, quote, the town of friendly neighbors. Oh, boy. Friendly neighbors. That's the cowboys that sent out the propaganda. Let's get into some of these friendly neighbors and what they do to each other in this town

because that's an excellent segue for this. This is the same town. This isn't the case we're going to do now because it's not that interesting of a case. I looked into it and I really don't want to mock an eight-year-old boy. we're going to do now because it's not that interesting of a case. I looked into it and I really don't want to mock an eight-year-old boy. This is the case where in November of 2008, an eight-year-old boy shot his father and his father's roommate and is currently being charged with murder. As an adult?

He's eight. Okay. He's being charged with homicide. Okay. That's crazy. Bat shit, first of all. I have a nine-year-old kid. He is not responsible for shit.

I have an eight-year-old right now and he can't even hit the broad side of a barn on uh on his fucking xbox so not only that but i'm not very scared of him to be honest with you do you think he really understands consequences of tomorrow does he know what tomorrow is or is he just in full hyperactive mode all the time like mine so that's that's what that's what happened in this town so that's crazy this town has had some weird shit go on. That happened during the cases we're going to talk about here. So it really brought this town some attention. The eight-year-old kid actually overshadowed this case because how often does an eight-year-old

kid get charged with homicide? Never, because that's insane. Clearly, that's nuts. Meanwhile, we'll see it's somebody here that gets away with pretty much murder anyway. Okay. But the eight year old though he's locked up. Let's lock him up. Good. Let's keep that menace to society and behind bars. Gotta keep him behind bars. Now April of 2007

we'll start here. The body of 72 year old William Stoney McCarger was found dead in his bed with several 22 caliber gunshot wounds. Yeesh. Wounds also from different guns. They're all.22s, but from two different guns. Oh, boy.

They discover later upon autopsy. They don't have any suspects. They have some suspicions, but nobody with any evidence that they could really call a suspect. Now, Stoney was a character. He's known as a real, real character. He's one of these kind of eccentric old guys. Carries around a lot of cash yeah said to you know carry around thousands of dollars in cash for some reason would have teenage

boys do a lot of work on his property oh boy sounds a little creepy and we're gonna get into him later on because i did some digging on him okay i found some shit but yeah just a just a weird character and known around town is one of these like oh he's an eccentric crazy character right and up there that's kind of a normal thing. Yeah. Everybody in this story has a stupid nickname. That's what I was just going to ask. Is that a nickname or is that his middle name?

Stoney's his nickname. Stoney's his nickname. We have another one that we'll get into here that's a ridiculous nickname. They all have like, they're all like weirdo old guys who are like, hey, there's Stoney and there's so-and-so. We'll go down to the coffee shop and see them all. The worst. It's very odd.

Now, late 2007, Apache County Sheriff Sergeant Spivey sees a truck. This is, I think, is complete bullshit. This is what he says he did. He says he's in a Circle K parking lot, and he eyeballed the truck tie, eyeballed the tire treads on a car as possibly matching that homicide from six months ago. That's some unbelievable police work. And a hell of a memory, by the way. He remembered to the T the tread marks and said, there, that car there. That's some unbelievable police work. He had a hell of a memory, by the way. He remembered to the T the tread marks and said,

there, that car there. That's the one. More like he thought he should talk to these two idiots and had no other reason to talk to them and said, I recognize the tread marks. Okay, pal, sure you did. Whatever gets you cracking the case. Whatever gets you from A to B, I'm good with. Yeah, he said it looked like the treads in the mud at the

Stoney's murder scene. Yeah. So stupid. If you were such a great police officer you'd be working in another city sir. That's another thing. So Spivey he talks to the driver of the van who is a 20 year old man named Joseph Roberts and Joseph Roberts denies any involvement. He says I don't know anything about it. It's my

friend's van. I don't know what you're talking about. I don't know anything and unless the kid says sure I killed the guy all you have is I eyeballed tire treads there isn't really much you can keep him on. They don't happen to have're talking about. I don't know anything. And unless the kid says, sure, I killed the guy, all you have is eyeballed tire treads. There isn't really much you can keep him on at that point. They don't happen to have a Xerox machine up there, do they? Exactly. That's what it is. They're going to absolutely do that to him.

I feel like he's a perfect candidate for this, this idiot. For the Xerox lie detector. It's perfect. I'm telling you. I just got a picture of it again. Lie. Oh, shit. All right.

I did it. Go back and listen to that one. What was that? Episode three. Episode five. Was it five? It was two weeks ago. Two weeks with the lie detector.

That's the Eaton, Ohio murder. A murder for greed in Eaton, Ohio is the name of it. So in late 2007, police also talked to a 19-year-old man named William Inman. Okay. Now, William, he's a weird little character, too man named William Inman. Okay, now William is a weird little character too, this William Inman. He's another one. He's kind of a scruffy, dirty kid. He wears swastikas, wears swastika buttons on his hat, is obsessed with the military,

dresses in a lot of khaki and olive drab green, stuff like that. So he's— Not a good kid. No, he's part of the... He's going to the preparedness fair on the 8th, I think, this guy. Well, he would be. So he would be. So they talk to him about Stoney's murder, and he says, quote,

the whole town is suspect because a lot of people don't care for Stoney. When someone says that, you go, okay, that's suspect right there. It's a weird thing to say. It's a weird thing to say, rather than, I don't know, he's full of whole town. Anybody could have done it. Everyone, that's suspect. It's a weird thing to say. It's a weird thing to say. Rather than, I don't know. Yeah. He's full of old town. Anybody could have done it. Everyone hates that fucking guy. Stoney's daughter at this point, her daughter, his daughter in law.

I apologize. She said, quote, he was a gritty, crass old man who had a big heart that a lot of people never saw. But he would give you the shirt off of his back. That's what she says about him. That's what she thinks about him. That's generally what the town thinks about him. I found some shit to the contrary that we'll get into

in a minute. But before that, in March 2009, now 60 year old Daniel Acton goes missing from his home near St. John's. So this is another guy. Now this is in a year and a half now. Two people just up and disappear. One's dead in the bed and this guy's just gone from his

home. He is known as hummer dan to the locals which that is a terrible nickname that's possibly the worst nickname i've ever heard that sounds like i don't want to go by that ever even if i've got a hummer i don't want to leave that out of my name altogether it wasn't because he drove a hummer it was because he constantly hums apparently he just he's constantly humming something i don't know if it's a tick or what his deal is call him music man Man. Call him Piano Man. Hummer Dan.

Ugh, what a terrible name. Stoney and Hummer Dan. He's Hummer Dan. They're not very clever up there either. That's a terrible nickname. Stoney is actually a self-given nickname. Okay. As we'll find out, it's actually more of an alias than a nickname.

All right. So this Hummer Dan is a retired Marine. He's a career Marine. Vietnam vet. He's a hero. Yeah. Yeah. And police have no leads on his whereabouts.

He's also kind of a drug addict and a bit of a scumbag. OK. So, I mean, that's fine and all. That doesn't take anything away from his previous accomplishments. Right. It also doesn't make him eligible to be murdered. No, no, no. Not at all.

It definitely ups the chances of it. No. Yeah, it does. Now, August 14th, 2009, a 16-year-old St. John's boy named Ricky Flores is reported missing by his mother. Oh, fuck. Okay, he left on the 13th of August without a change of clothes. He didn't take his phone charger with him, so he's not planning on being gone long. But he was carrying a gun strapped to his hip, which is not legal for a 16-year-old to do. And I was like, why does he have a gun?

And then I thought, oh, yeah, because he lives in the fucking mountains. Literally going from the house to the car with his friend, he might get attacked by a bear. It's dangerous. So I get it. Okay. Now, he leaves in the day on the 13th. Later on that day, Flores texts his mother to tell him that he was with William Inman, just to let her know what he was doing. He's 16 fucking years old. So he's with William Inman just to let her know what he was doing. Yeah. He's 16 fucking years old.

Right. So he's with William Inman, whatever. But he disappears. He's gone. William says, I don't know. I dropped him off in town. I don't know shit about shit. I don't know.

Don't know where he is. That's no good. He's just gone. Now, Flores, Ricky, he was a high school dropout. Never. He's considered a nice kid. Everybody that like son liked him, but he's just kind of a kid that fucks up a lot. Yeah. He does drugs. He drops out of high school. He's already a nice kid. Everybody that saw him liked him, but he's just kind of a kid that fucks up a lot. Yeah.

He does drugs. He drops out of high school. He's already a father. What? He has a one-year-old child at this point. Jesus. That he had with a girl named Jessica Johnson, who's also 16. At least she wasn't 13.

Right. There was also 16. So they have a one-year-old. Terrible. And an on-and-off relationship, basically, that these two have. They met in middle school. As they would when they're 16 and have a baby together. You don't want to be around that woman very long.

They met when they were 13 in the eighth grade. I mean, you're going to have, you know, things are going to happen here. Early September 2009, Sergeant Spivey, the tire man. Yeah, the tire professional. The amazing eagle tire eye guy. He says he decides at this point it's time to have another chat with Joseph Roberts after he finds Roberts driving a Corvette. Now, that's, you'd say, why does this kid have a Corvette?

Well, it's even weirder because the Corvette belongs to Hummer Dan. Oh, no. So that's a bad sign. If you're driving a missing man's car, that's not great. Roberts said he doesn't know anything about Hummer Dan. He also doesn't know anything about police work or watches zero crime programming. You're absolutely right. The Xerox lie detector would have worked so well on these guys.

Done deal. I'm done. Fuck it. So he says he got the vet from William Inman. He said, I don't know. William Inman said, hey, you can drive this car. So I drove it. I don't even know who it belonged to.

Why does William Inman have this car? Well, let's find out. Now, in late August, a partially burned body is found in a shallow grave in Blue, which is in northern Greenlee County, which is the middle of nowhere. It's 80 miles from St. John's. It's literally like an isolated...

It's like an Alaska town. Yeah. There's nothing there. It's like a stone's throw from the border, though. It is. It's right by the border, exactly, of New Mexico. Yeah. The body turns out to be 16-year-old Ricky Flores of St. John's. So now we have three bodies, one in the bed, one missing, and one in a shallow grave partially burned. Yeah. So we have – that's a nice escalation, I would say, for that.

Now, August 2009, police from nearby St. John's. This is amazing. I always look forward to whenever you giggle this is ridiculous this this is the funniest stupidest thing we've ever had a person do in any of our shows and it's amazing okay uh police from nearby st john's john's come to springerville which is right next door it's a town next door and that's where in mon is staying at this point he's living in springerville with his 44 year old girlfriend he's 21 at the time what which is weird if it's a 44 year old man and a 21 year old girl and even weirder if it's He's living in Springerville with his 44-year-old girlfriend. He's 21 at the time.

What? Which is weird if it's a 44-year-old man and a 21-year-old girl and even weirder if it's the opposite. It's just as bizarre. It's just weird. It's just strange. His girlfriend, Storm Williams. Oh, boy. She sounds like she's a character.

That's a nickname. That's a nickname. No, that's her real name. She really is an X-Men character. Her name is Storm. She's really named Storm. Wow. Somebody even back then, back in the 60s named her that, which is strange. But, yeah, so the police come to the house because they have a search warrant to search their home.

In Springerville. In Springerville, in Mon and Storm Williams' home. Okay. In Mon, rather than staying there for the, you know, search and acting casual, he runs from the house. In his mind, this was to keep attention off of him. He ran from the house, which I don't understand how that works, which he wasn't under arrest at the time, so he was allowed to leave if he wanted to. So they were like, I guess we don't know.

So he started lighting fireworks and kicking dogs and just trying to keep the attention off of him. Just trying to keep it all separate, okay? This is nuts, okay? So where do you think he's going? Just anywhere. Just running. Hiding in the woods. Away from cops, you think.

Just hiding in the woods in a dumpster. Places where police are not at. In a bar somewhere, maybe. Just turn 21, sneak in there. What he does is he sprints two and a half blocks to the Springerville police station. What? He goes to the police station. This is his idea, okay?

He's going to call the police on the police? He goes there, and he says that he's there to make a complaint, informal complaint. He doesn't want to fill out any paperwork or anything, but an informal complaint to the chief, Steve West, about the cops there at his house. He tells the chief West that the police were bothering him and he wanted chief West to get rid of them. He said he's filing a harassment complaint against cops with a search warrant with a search warrant. He said he told chief West, quote, there's people in your town.

What is it? The 1700s? Get out of my town. No sheriff comes in here but me. He thinks he's Paul Revere. I don't know what he thinks. I don't know if he thinks this is Tombstone in 1884 or what he thinks is going on. He thinks he's warning the military of the Redcoats.

He went to tell Wyatt that the cowboys are back. What the fuck is going on? This is insane, right? Get Doc on the street sweeper. Come on, let's go. Let's do it. Come on now. Get Doc on the street sweeper come on let's go let's do it come on now get doc on the sweet street sweeper it's perfect that's what he's thinking though he's really thinking like let's go we're gonna get some saint john's town pride with a town of

friendly neighbors you're my friendly neighbor let's go have a shootout at the okay let's do run these fuckers out of town. They think they are. Ah, get Doc with his tuberculosis out here. Puff on him, Doc. Get him out of here. This is fucking incredible. This is incredible. He told Chief West that Inman came to him because, quote, everyone says you'll listen.

Who is he talking to that are selling him? The people in his head. He'll listen. He'll listen. So West said that Inman thought that West would say, hey, get out of my jurisdiction and run them off. Like, as we said, like he's Doc Holliday. He had been sitting there for a while. He admits that he that they're investigating him for the Ricky Flores disappearance because Ricky Flores had told his mother he was with him.

He was the last known person he was with. So you're going to be a suspect. Definitely. They're going to be a suspect. Definitely. They're going to take a look at you at least for that one. Now, Inman ends up telling West his whole life story. He sits there, tells him his whole story, tells him about how he grew up, tells him he grew up. He's from Phoenix, Inman. He's a Phoenix kid.

He's a South Phoenix kid, actually. Oh, that's not a good place to grow up. Not at all. South Phoenix, moved to the area a few years before he said to have a lot of family problems uh parents did a lot of drugs and just a shit family life in general makes sense said that he's been working and also he's been working at like a local convenience store and he hangs out at the tire shop that's quite the life for a 21 year old's hanging out at the tire shop he He says that he has no family. His mother is still alive, but doesn't talk to her.

Has no family. The only family he has is his childhood dog that he still has up there. Oh, my God. That was the only family he had, okay? Because we're going to find out what happened to his dog. Oh, my God. Now, also, too, when he walked into there, he had Nazi pins on. He went to the police station with Nazi pins, which I think would get you taken less seriously.

Like, all right there, Adolf. Come on. Calm down. This isn't Goebbels. We don't want to hear. So, yeah. Chill out there, Himmler. Calm down.

We don't need you and your goddamn buttons in here. All right, Eichmann. Take a walk. So, in Mon, after sitting there for a while and tells him of the heartbreak of having his only family be this dog, he tells them, finally comes out and says, all right, I killed Hummer Dan. He says, I killed Hummer Dan. He says that their properties touch and that there were some disputes among them and that Hummer Dan also did drugs and he was a bad person and he killed his dog. He says Hummer Dan killed his dog. Hummer Dan hummed his dog to death.

Yep, and he just dropped dead. He says he killed his dog. Inman went to talk to him and ended up chasing him against a mobile home on the property and just unloading 22 rounds on him. Wow. And ended up, you know what he did after that, though? Oh, my God, I don't want to know. Calls his buddy Joseph Roberts up, the guy with the van

that's been talked to before and the vet. Calls him up and says, you've got to help me burn this body. Oh, Jesus. So he goes, all right. And they try to burn Hummer Dan. You know, burn him up some.

As much as they could. As much as they could, as we found out from that same Eaton, Ohio episode. It's not easy to burn a body. No, it's not. Those incinerators are very hot at the crematorium. So Joseph Roberts comes over. It's not easy to burn a body. No, it's not. Those incinerators are very hot at the crematorium.

So Joseph Roberts comes over. They do that. They bury the body on Hummer Dan's property. It's a big property. They find a distant location. Sure. They bury him in a shallow grave on the property. He would later take the police that day to find the body to the place.

He took them to all these places and showed them what he did and did all this shit. Wow. He also says killed Stoney, too. Uh-oh. Killed him, too. This shit just got unraveled. Yep. Says that he and Joseph Roberts were the ones that shot him.

Now, he's also just putting his friend in this, too. Yeah. He said that Inman asked Joseph Roberts if he would go with him and provide cover fire for him. Cover fire. Cover fire, like he's going into the battle. He thinks he's in the military, this kid, which he is clearly not. No.

Unless it's the German army. I'm not sure. So he enlists him to give cover fire. They get another idiot over there. Oh, my God. The guy with the van is James Dandridge. He's the driver. All he does is drive them and take them back.

They pop out. They get to Stoney's house. They both have 22 rifles. Inman's like, here we go. We're doing this. Inman basically would... He cut the screen out of a window so he could open the window and then kick the side of the house to startle

Stoney in bed. Stoney sat up in bed and they shot him a bunch of times through the window. Wow. They both unloaded on him through the window. They said like 15, 16 shots they fired on him. That's shitty, man. And hit him with a lot of them, too. Wow. They riddled him with him through the window. They said like 15, 16 shots they fired on him. That's shitty, man. And hit him with a lot of them, too. Wow.

They riddled him with bullets. He was like Sonny Corleone at the total booth. You know what I mean? I imagine it's a small house. I imagine it's not a long shot. No. And those rifles are so accurate. And also, too, these kids probably shoot a lot.

They live in the woods. Yeah. So they're probably pretty good shots, I would imagine. Pretty good shots, especially with a.22. It's not hard to hit what you're aiming at. You're going to a preparedness festival here to do it, or festival, I don't know what it is. My kid has shot a.22 before, and he's a pretty damn good shot with that thing. Yeah, they're not that tough to shoot, too.

There's not a lot of kick on them. They're easy to do. So, yeah, he says they awoke. They shot him 15 times and shot at him 15 times. Got back in the van where James Dandridge took him away. Now he said that he was proud of those murders. Inman is fucking proud. Really?

He is proud. He said they were bad people. He claimed that several people in town had told him that Stoney had inappropriately touched them. Several teenage boys had told him that. And he was being the hand of justice here. He also claims that Stoney made a pass at him while Inman was doing work on his property in 2007, which caused him to want to kill him.

He's a bad person. He's trying to molest him even though he wasn't a child. At that point, it's just making a pass at somebody. And that's not really all that. That's not illegal. It's two consenting adults. He's checking if he's consenting. He's checking on him.

Yeah, he's seeing that. Now, Stoney, I found out, you know, everyone's saying he's just a nice old man with a big heart. Rarely, like I said, do we go after a victim. But this particular victim, I did some deep digging on him. And he has been in trouble for inappropriate relationships with young boys since the 60s. Holy shit. He was cited several times in documents from the Boy Scouts of America known as the perversion files. Where they were trying the perversion files where they were trying

to perversion files. And his name is listed in it. More than once. Oh, my God. Because he didn't just get in trouble, get kicked out, and go away. He went to different states and used aliases. Oh, my God. He's worse than the fucking-

So he could be a scoutmaster. He's worse than the goddamn- Yeah. That's where Stoney came from. What am I trying to think of the word? He's worse than a lot of things. He's worse than the priests. Yeah, that's where Stoney came from. What am I trying to think of the word? He's worse than a lot of things. He's worse than the priests. That's what I was thinking.

He's way worse than the priests. The diocese, because they would move shithead priests from diocese to diocese, and they would just fucking touch more kids there. This guy is... But the Boy Scouts are trying to get rid of him. That's why they had these perversion files, because they wanted to have everybody on file so you could see if someone coming to volunteer was one of these weirdo perverts. And his name is listed in it.

Multiple times. Don't hire him. That's why back then before. That's why he chose Stoney. Yeah, that's why he chose Stoney. Motherfucker. Because Stone was his, he would use Stone as an alias and then he used Stoney as another alias. So he was just using all these aliases and those are only the aliases they know are him.

Wow. So it could be more that they don't know about. But they know he was in at least three places. And by the way, in all of the coverage of this case, none of this is in there. Wow. None of this. I had to find, I found a piece of this in a small Nashua, New Hampshire newspaper. Wow. And then had to do Boy Scout digging and find perversion files.

No, but it's just, it's ridiculous. Yeah. A reporter didn't do that. Yeah, it shouldn't be buried like that. They just said, oh. This should be able to be found, too. He's a kindly old man that did that. No, he's a fucking child molester, too. He's a terrible person.

And I don't just say that, too, because he also was arrested in New Hampshire in January 1962 for three counts of unnatural and lascivious acts with a child. The illegal conduct was for boys who were 14 and 15 years old. Oh, my God. So, yeah, this is illegal. He's a pedophile, for sure. He's a pedophile. He pled guilty, and while he pled guilty, he was holding his Bible because he's a devout Catholic,

in a sense. He's like, yeah, I'm sure it was the Lord next to you or your fucking kids, you asshole. I hate this son of a bitch. Catholic is the perfect religion for him, though, I'm being honest. Well, yeah, let's be realistic here. No offense, but hey, history's history.

He still tried, by the way, after being arrested and blackballed from the Boy Scouts and being in their perversion files, he still was trying to register under aliases. And they would catch him and be like, no, you're in the perversion files. We have files named for your fucking behavior, you dick. And this bothers me even more so because my grandfather was a scout master for 30 fucking years and he was a he's an amazing man who taught boys how to do amazing things and how to survive i'm i'm so proud of him and even more proud that he's not a piece of shit like this guy what a vile human being and he gives he like when if my grandfather ever tells people he was a scout master i'm positive that that fucking thought is in the back of their head. Oh, I think it pops in. Is this guy weird, though? Yeah. Is he weird? Why is he a

scoutmaster? He's not. No. So, anyway, he... My grandpa's amazing. Go on. I'm sure he's a fine man. He was all... He reiterated again he's proud of killing Tom or Dan because he did drugs. He was just a, quote, bad person. He said he would kill both of them again if he could, and he planned on killing at least two

more people in town if he wasn't caught right now. Oh, Jesus. He planned on killing two drug dealers in town that he had his eye on that weren't that desirable that he wanted to get rid of. He thinks he's Dexter. He thinks he's Dexter. Now, the Ricky Flores thing is more complicated than him just killing someone for being a bad person. Yeah. This is deeper. One thing is he said he wasn't proud of killing Ricky Flores because he said they had been friends, but he killed them at the behest of Ricky's girlfriend's father.

What? Ricky's girlfriend, Jessica Johnson, her father. The 16-year-old girl. The 16-year-old girl. Was not happy that he knocked her up. No, she was fine. Her father wasn't happy. Her father was not happy that he knocked up his daughter.

Also, too, he's Mexican. Father's a white supremacist. As we'll find out when he's arrested, he has all sorts of white power tattoos everywhere. So Jeffrey Johnson didn't like Ricky, obviously. He wanted to get rid of him. He didn't like him being around his girlfriend. He would call him a punk to his friends, this punk kid with my girlfriend, all this stuff. And I don't know if it was a racial thing or if it was just that this kid's a jerk off and he knocked up my 15-year-old daughter, which would make you want to kill somebody anyway.

So I get that. But you don't actually do it. Inman said Johnson offered him money to kill Flores. So now he's a hit man too. Inman said he and Flores, he went and picked up Flores. And he was trying to tell Flores to change his life and not do drugs and shit like that. Like, I don't know what the point of that was. Who is this guy?

Inman said that he took that he, Inman, and his girlfriend, Storm Williams, picked him up and drove him out to a remote location. And they got in an argument over drugs. And Inman shot Ricky once in the left ear with a 12-gauge shotgun. Whoa. Which will do the trick. That's all it takes. That's all it takes. And then Inman and, like I said, Storm Williams here, they were out in the forest.

And then they end up taking him out to blue out in the middle of nowhere. Like we said, in the Greeley County and trying to burn him and bury him in a shallow grave. But that didn't work. They found him. Well, he told them where he was. They found him. But before they buried Flores, William Inman took Flores' body to Jeffrey Johnson's house. Oh, my God.

Killed him. And on the way to bury him, he took him there, quote, just to show Jeff that the job was done. Wow. So he wanted to prove to him. So, I mean, this is hardcore. I mean, if the kid doesn't come back and you just say, I killed him, that's evidence enough for me.

That's good enough. No, he said, here's the body, all shot in the head. Now, when they brought Flores to the house, the mother was there. The wife, 37-year-old Melissa Johnson, was there. Oh, Jesus. And she saw the body and didn't do anything to stop it. What? Didn't call police, didn't do anything. So, after he's

confessing, Jeffrey Johnson's arrested and charged with conspiracy to commit murder. Melissa Johnson is charged with hindering a criminal prosecution, false information, and giving false info to the law enforcement. Accessory after the fact. That's basically what that is. Yeah. Accessory after the fact. Now, Inman and Williams, the girlfriend, will be charged with first fact that's basically what that is yeah it's accessory after the fact now in mon and williams

the girlfriend will be charged with first degree murder after taking to police the police to find the body and all that sort of thing the girlfriend must be like jesus this was your idea now you're fucking putting me in the pokey for it thanks a lot and meanwhile she's a 16 year old girl who probably relies pretty heavily on her parents to help her raise this child she's completely she's not even an adult. Melissa Johnson doesn't get time for this. She ends up coming out, and actually Melissa Johnson and Jessica end up living with Ricky Flores' mother.

Wow. Which is very interesting. That's pretty fucking sordid. That's deep sordid shit, right? Yeah. That's some forgiveness, too. I would say so, man. Now, Joseph Roberts, for his one two and one disposal at this point he is

charged with first degree murder conspiracy theft of means of transportation mutilating a human body concealment of a dead body tampering with physical evidence and hindering prosecution oh god they're trying to bang him good yeah uh now in arizona that's that you're fucking you're facing a big one sir that's what i'm saying now uh he says at the town, they interview the town here. There's an investigator, a cop, Brian Hounsell, Brian Hounshell, who comes up later. He says about Joseph and William, he says about William specifically, quote, this is an animal that needs to be caged. He needs to be incarcerated for the rest of his life. And then here's one from a resident of the town named Autumn Smith in the paper.

She just said, you see something like this at least once a week in Phoenix, but this is a little town where everyone knows everyone. It's ridiculous that people are killing people they know. Where in Phoenix is she from? I don't know where in Phoenix. I've never, never, never seen this. There is not a serial killer on the loose once a week, at least once a week in Phoenix, first of all.

And second of all, it's ridiculous that people are killing people they know. Eighty-five percent of murders are people they know. That's how murders work. There's not just random-ass people running around the country killing everybody. Generally not. From time to time that happens. It happens. But it's mostly crimes of passion.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. But this, no, mostly it's for a reason. I don't like her. I want money. I want this. She can tell on me. He can do this to me. She has a for a reason. I don't like her. I want money. I want this. She can tell on me. He can do this to me. She has a life insurance policy.

And guess what? I'm the beneficiary because we're close, because we know each other. Because we know each other. That's the thing. So, yeah, you would have a reason to. Plus, if you don't know somebody, for me personally, it's like, eh, fuck that guy. Yeah. That's it.

He's a dick. Eh, whatever. Go away. Fuck him. Yeah, fuck him. I don't have to talk to him then. Whereas if it's your family, you're like, okay, I got to either kill them or deal with them every day forever.

It's a different fuck that guy. It's fuck that guy. Yeah. I either have to deal with them for the rest of my life or kill them now. My only choices. I have no other way out. That's family. So Inman, Jesus.

Inman's pretty agreeable about this whole thing. He's just like, well, did it. I don't know. Did it. Proud of it. There it is. Yep. He agrees to plead guilty to three

counts of dangerous manslaughter and two counts of abandonment and concealment of a dead body. The state will not seek the death penalty, even though he's technically, by the way, a serial killer. He falls under the technical... He killed three people. He's actually one of the... He's 21 when this happened. 21 when they arrested him, and he started this when he

was 17. He's actually... I'm sorry, 19. He's actually one of the youngest serial killers in the history of America. Wow. But he's overshadowed by an 8-year-old who shot his dad in the news. And that's definitely a serial killer because it's three different occurrences. Three different occurrences. That's serial murder. He's a vigilante style is what they call them.

That's his type of thing here. Also, too, they'll give him some sentencing consideration in exchange for testimony against the others also here. Also, in part of the deal, they're going to dismiss the charge of damaging his jail cell, which apparently he went a little buck wild in his jail cell. Made a mess of shit. I don't know what you can do to a St. John's, Arizona jail cell to cause much damage. There's very little in there, and most everything that's in there is bolted down, unless you own it. I feel like he fucked up the sink or something. He clogged the toilet. I don't know what he did.

Flushed all the toilet paper. Yeah. Started throwing those those fucking moon patties where you soak a bunch of toilet paper and throw it at the ceiling. You ruined the acoustic tiles. Jesus. It's going to take months to scrape all that off. It's all dried now. Jesus. We got to hire some teenage boys to come do that.

Never mind. Never mind. We were killed that way. So William Inman on September 30th, 2009 pleads guilty to all three murders. Because of his age and cooperation, like I said, no death penalty. Now September 2010, this is a year later, full year, Inman's attorney, Bruce Griffin, files a motion to withdraw the plea agreement and files for a competency hearing. His idea is like, look, let's just say you're crazy. Let's just say fuck it.

The judge denies both. Let's just say fuck it. Let's just say fuck it. Let's just try again. Try again. Can't go worse. I see the lawyer actually saying those exact words. He probably called his lawyer and was like, is there anything we can do to try to reverse this?

Because I'm having a little bit of remorse about pleading guilty. And he's like, let's just say fuck it. Is that cool? Is that cool of you? I'm going to call the job. I'm going to try. I think it's a legal defense. Let's just try. I feel like I could see him metaphorically just blowing the dice.

Come on. So he rolls a snake eyes as the judge denies him. Basically, to get out of the deal that's been set for a year, he would have to prove some sort of, quote, injustice on the prosecutor's part in making the deal, which they can't because it was made in good faith. So Apache County Superior Court judge in 2011, remember Joseph Roberts is charged. Apache County Superior Judge throws out all the charges against Roberts. What? Throws out all of them.

Why? All of them. The reason is in February 2010, investigators, including Houndshell, who said he needs to spend the rest of his life in a cage, met with Roberts in jail to discuss his plea and try to get him to take a deal. They did this without notifying his counsel, and they did this without explaining anything to him. Oh, my God. They didn't Miranda. They didn't do anything they needed to do.

They just went down and tried to talk him into it. What the fuck? Which is not legal to do at all. And they blew it. So, yeah, all charges are dismissed. Not only dismissed, dismissed with prejudice, which means they can't retry. They can't refile these charges.

This lucky son of a bitch. He walks out of the courtroom. Wow. Not even held for bond because there's no charges. Walks out of the courtroom a free man in 2011. Prosecution says they will appeal the case. Apache County Attorney Michael Whiting said about this. I have a couple quotes from him because they're good.

Quote, I can tell you that the moment I found out he was going to be out, I was worried. This is an individual that was charged with first degree murder. And last night we went to bed wondering where he is and what he's doing. Fuck yeah. No shit. And he also said about it, because he's pissed off in this one about the whole decision. He said, quote, like the rest of the county, we are shocked and left wondering why a judge would do such a thing without referencing any legal authority to do so. Judge Grimsley's decision to release the defendant who was being held on first degree murder has re-victimized the victims.

This is a travesty of justice in the first degree. Wow. That's a statement right there. He said, fucking judge. And that was just a regular ass person? That was the prosecutor. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

He was like, fuck. He was pissed. Yeah, he had this shit planned out. Yeah. God damn it. So now on September 9th, 2011, William Inman is sentenced in St. John's, three counts of manslaughter. The way they're going to do it is basically 24 years to life. It's 21 years for each count to be served.

Those are going to be conserved concurrently. And then he has two counts of abandonment or concealment of a body, which are 18 months apiece on each count maximum. So it's 24 to life is his deal, basically. And also subject to $ 000 in fines he works at a convenience store he's out at a tire shop he wasn't gonna make that in his life never uh the sentence is down from 25 to life which is the usual deal for cooperation because uh because as part of the deal he gets one year off wow so he gets 24 to life instead of 25 to life. They must have just been like, this kid's an idiot.

I mean, I don't know. Let's just let him out and see what happens. Fuck it. Fuck it. Fuck it. Roll those dice. That guy's fucked. So yeah, but he must serve all 24 before he's up for parole.

That's at least some silver lining. He's going to be 45 or 47 before he gets out possibly. He isn't even going to be 50. No. And he killed three people. He killed three people. And he 47 before he gets out possibly. He isn't even going to be 50. No. And he killed three people. He killed three people. And he could possibly be out. Yes.

And Justin Roberts, or Justin, Joseph Roberts, that appeal was actually overturned. Good. And they said they were allowed to charge him again. But I searched and I searched and I searched. I can find no trial, no charges, no pleas, nothing. They didn't try him yet. Don't think they tried him again yet. But this was in 2012, so it's been five years.

What are you waiting for here? Yeah, let's go. They have all the evidence. Fucking kickstart this shit. I don't get it. They have confessions of Inman putting him in with him there, his own confessions at the time. It makes no sense. And Inman's convicted, so what are we doing here?

So he didn't have to be convicted. I don't know. To wrap it up, we have St. John's police chief here. He says, quote, when tragedy happens up, we have St. John's police chief here. He says, quote, when tragedy happens here, we are a little more involved. It affects us a little harder than it might in other places. And that's St. John's and the town

of St. John's and this William Inman insanity. Wow. Imagine being that chief of police in a small town. You're bored. You're probably sitting there reading a magazine, dicking around your phone, eating a donut. And this kid walks in and you're like, what's this jerk off on with his Nazi pins? They're in your town. You're bored. You're probably sitting there reading a magazine, dicking around your phone, eating a donut. And this kid walks in and you're like, what's this jerk off on with his Nazi pins? They're in your town. We gotta talk.

Yeah, he's like, oh Christ, I gotta deal with this asshole. Like, he probably just thought this will be entertaining. Like, what do you got, jerk off? Next thing you know, he's like, I'm clearing three murders here. And the police chief, he didn't even prompt him. He didn't say, like, anything. He literally just said, what happened? And he just sat down in Mon and told him his life story up to and including killing three people.

The best part is that that police chief gets to clear three murders that he didn't even know he had. No. Yeah, well, he knew they existed, these murders. But it was just like, oh, shit. But they weren't in his county, so he didn't have to deal with it. They were in the next town. But some of them were. But Ricky Flores is from St. John's. Oh, he didn't have to deal with it. They were in the next town. Right. But some of them were. But Ricky Flores is from St. John's.

Oh, he was there. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So he was there, and it's the next town over. But he was just like, you know, I don't know. Who expects to just get cleared like that? Amazing. That's this case, man. It's nuts.

So William Inman is in jail up there in Apache County. And good for him. He's up in the middle of nowhere in the forest in a jail. Yeah. Which is a good place for him. And we'll wait on the other fuckface. Fingers crossed. We'll wait on the other guy.

And yeah, so that's that. Holy shit. I take it you don't want any of that real estate in St. John's that we talked about earlier. A lot of acreage for cheap, but let's not go crazy here. Oh my goodness. So do we have any shout outs for this week? Yeah, let's talk about some people that are amazing.

If you want a shout out, please, you can contact us on social media. It's at Murder Small on Twitter, Small Town Pod on Facebook. If you really – also to iTunes reviews. Shout-outs for that. Please, please, iTunes reviews. Give us five stars. Tell us you like the show. Tell us anything you want.

Really don't care. Just give us five stars. It really, really helps out. And if you don't want to give us five stars, don't fucking bother. Right. Just stop. Just turn it off. This isn't a restaurant.

It was free. This isn't a restaurant with a Yelp review. You didn't spend your whole night, take your wife, spend $150 and buy a bottle of wine and they fucked you over. This is free. You didn't get a babysitter for this shit. We put a lot of time and work and effort into this. So if you don't like it, we'll say we'll be happy to part company. Bye.

But if you like it, please give us an iTunes review. It's been our pleasure. It's been our pleasure. And if you love us and you want us to have a few dollars from you, you can go to patreon.com slash crime and sports, which is our other podcast. But you can donate there and it all goes to us. And that would be wonderful also. And here are these fine people who have been so kind to us. Let's start with at Gigi Creation on Twitter.

Kristen in Greensburg, PA. Becky Punky Brewster. Bexter. Punky Bexter. At Punky Bexter. Anyway. A little Punky Brewster reference. Right.

Jillian Hobday. Abby Saunders in the UK, Lauren Marie in NorCal, Ash Rose, Lee Brown, Kayla Selby, Frances Edwards, and B. Al Daraj. I love that one. B. Al Daraj. That's a cool name. I think she's Pakistani or Indian. I can't remember. The cool name.

Yeah. It's great. I like that name. It sounds gorgeous. It's like a flows. Her actual first name is B. That's pretty cool, man. That's pretty bitchin'.

That flows. Danny Creek, Dame Judy Bent, Shannon Lamb, Eric Bingham, and Savannah Trainor. Thank you guys so, so much for everything this week. You make this worthwhile, and we love doing this, and we'll be back here each and every week. Hope you'll join us with us. Hope you'll be here with us every single week. Until then, we'll see you next week, guys.

It's been our pleasure. Bye. Hey, Prime members, you can listen to Small Town Murder early and ad-free on Amazon Music. Download the Amazon Music app today. Or you can listen early and ad-free with Wondery Plus and Apple Podcasts. Before you go, tell us about yourself by completing a short survey at wondery.com slash survey. It's all a lighthearted nightmare on our podcast, Morbid. We're your hosts. I'm Alina Urquhart.

And I'm Ash Kelly. And our show is part true crime, part spooky, and part comedy. The stories we cover are well-researched. He claimed and confessed to officially killing up to 28 people. With a touch of humor. I'd just like to go ahead and say that if there's no band called Malevolent Deity, that is pretty great.

A dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit with a little bit of cursing. This mother f***er lied. Like a liar. Like a liar. And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal, or you love to hop in the Wayback Machine and dissect the details of some of history's most notorious crimes.

You should tune in to our podcast, Morbid. Follow Morbid on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to episodes early and ad-free by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts.