Small Town Murder - #83 - Affairs & Stabbings Of The Heart in Essex, Vermont

Episode Date: August 29, 2018

This week, in Essex, Vermont, a happy marriage somehow turns into deception, affairs, insurance money & a nasty, cold blooded murder! Everything seems to add up to an obvious & disturbing conclusion. Justice seems served... But that's only the beginning. It quickly devolves into a murky & unbelievable situation, with an explosive ending! This is a crazy one!! Along the way, we find out how easy it was to raise a spouse's life insurance benefits, that you can't fight off a stabbing while you're unconscious, and how a mountain of circumstances doesn't equal a hill of doubt!! Hosted by James Pietragallo & Jimmie Whisman New episodes every Thursday!!Please subscribe, rate, and review!Listen on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher, or wherever you listen to podcasts!Head to shutupandgivememurder.com for all things Small Town Murder!For merchandise: crimeinsports.threadless.comCheck out James and Jimmie's other show: Crime in Sports Follow us on social media!Facebook: facebook.com/smalltownpodInstagram: instagram.com/smalltownmurderTwitter: twitter.com/MurderSmall Contact the show: [e-mail] See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Small Town Murder early and ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. What if you married the love of your life and then stood by them as they developed 21 new identities? What would you do? This Is Actually Happening is a weekly podcast that features extraordinary true stories of life-changing events told by the people who lived them. Listen to the newest season of This Is Actually Happening on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. This week in Essex, Vermont, affairs, insurance money, and a vicious attack form a cloudy mess of speculation. Welcome to Small Town Murder.

Yay! Yay, indeed, Jimmy. Yay, indeed. My name is James Petrigallo. I'm here with my co-host. I am Jimmy Wisman. The yay is music to my ears this week. It's a crazy episode, and we cannot wait to share it with you. Thank you, folks, so much for joining us. Thank you so much for your iTunes reviews this week,

and whatever that is, Apple Podcasts, I like to call it now. They shake the boat on you. Who knows? Thank you for those reviews. And anywhere you review, anywhere you listen, give us five stars. It doesn't matter what you say. It's not for our ego. Name changes, but that goddamn algorithm is still there.

It's still funky, and it still needs to be fed with reviews, and it helps drive you up the charts. So if you could do that, that would be wonderful. Thank you so much. And if that's not enough for you, if you need to be a superstar, and there's a long list of these people coming up at the end of the show you can do that extra easily yeah by going to patreon.com slash crime and sports or going over to uh to uh paypal and using our email address which is crime and sports at gmail.com there's an easier way to do that than even going to those places you can just go to shut up and give me murder.com slash slash whatever you want oh yeah that's it just shut up you. You're like, dot what? I'm always waiting for slash to dot.

You're always waiting for slash. Slash small? No, it's not. This is not a commercial. If you go there. Show up at gimme murder dot com. That's it. You go there.

You can find a merch and t-shirts and tickets to the live shows. Oh, my God. So here's something. Get your tickets now. I get a lot of questions about why are tickets $200 to these shows shows and i'm like where the fuck did you find that and then they send me the link and i was like no no yeah don't buy it from there don't buy from those fucking buy right from the go to shut up and give me murder that's it we have the live slash live and we have the we have the venues that you there are links to the right places that won't charge

you exorbitant amounts of money go to the the calendar. Find the calendar date that's near you. Please do that. Thank you so much. Go to there and have fun and do that. Never mind that shit, Jimmy, because we have a lot of craziness to cover here. Also on that website, there will be new shirts coming out next week. Oh, yeah. New shirts that you're going to enjoy.

Brand new designs. It's going to be great. All sorts of stuff. Small-time murder and crime and sports. Right. So get those and huddle them together and wear them to the live shows. That's what we're going to do here. So that's the fun thing.

We're going to do that. And a quick thing, too, before we do the disclaimer here, we're in Vermont this week, okay? Just a spoiler alert for a minute and a half from now. We're in Vermont this week, and i found so many crazy cases that it was i couldn't choose it took me it was killing me not to do one and to do the other we have to stop this structure of only doing the like the states all one at a time and then redo we have to stop that vermont's got too many vermont there's a bunch of states it up vermont florida they have all these crazy cases and they crazy cases. We won't do the same state all the time, but we don't need to go once a year.

Now I go, oh, no, there's four more cases in Vermont. What is that, four years from now I can do those cases? No, we're not going to do that. There's not a lot in Wyoming. There's like 12 people. Also, we got maybe- So we'll skip Wyoming once in a while. We'll do that.

We better go right the fuck back to New Mexico in maybe eight episodes because I want to talk about that guy. Yeah, I had the other guy there. So never mind all of that shit, though. It doesn't matter what we're going to do here. That's the only time I'll ever say we need to go back to New Mexico in eight weeks. Yeah, I definitely never want to go. Well, it's better than tomorrow.

We have to go back to New Mexico tomorrow. No, please. No, please. We have to do the disclaimer at this point. We have to. It's a comedy podcast, everybody. We make jokes. We're comedians.

We try our best not to make jokes at the expense of the victims or the victims' families. That's how we play this because we're assholes. We're not scumbags. That's honestly what we're doing here. We're not trying to be dicks. We're not trying to exploit. We think it's more of an exploit if you slowly describe the murder porn. We feel like that's way creepier than us trying to make jokes around a murder.

We don't make jokes about a murder. But we make jokes around it, about the characters involved, these people, weirdo, small town nutcases, or a police force that's bumbling. It's not funny that a man was forced to blow his kid. No. It's funny that there's a fucking cult involved. That's funny. And the things that go on around it. And then you go, ooh, this is gross for five minutes.

Then we get back to jokes. Right. So we think that's better. And if you're on board with that, you're a smart person. Hang with us. Hang with us. And you know what you can say? Yeah.

Say it with us now. Loud and proud. Unless you're in like a really conservative office and then say it just to yourself very quietly or maybe in the bathroom. That might be worse. If someone's screaming what we're about to say from a bathroom stall, you're going, what the fuck did they eat last night? So, use

your own discretion, but shout it if you can. Shut up and give me murder. Let's do this. Let's go on a trip, Jimmy. I would love to. We're going on a trip. We're doing it right now. This is the great Red Man said yeah drop it on the one fuck the two three let's do this shit jimmy westman he also said if you find a bag of weed on the floor motherfucker what the fuck you gonna do pick it up pick it up that's what you're gonna do that's what i mean he's a he's a great man he really is a brilliant man because he's still around he really isn't he's a he's a great man he really is a brilliant man he's still around he really isn't

he's a goddamn hilarious never mind I'm gonna say it's just bananas that he's not in Wu-Tang why is he an outcast Tupac had a two percent of red man he'd still be alive and he would have 300 million dollars in the bank he'd be a movie star and everything else anyway moving on we're going to Vermont we're heading out from dusty New Mexico. And we're on the vistas and the mesas and whatever the fuck else is there. Plateaus and just flat red shit. We're going northeast, baby. People in New Mexico are furious with how much I hate them. Yeah, fuck you.

Sorry. You live in New Mexico. You know what? We live in Arizona. It's just as horrible. And if anybody says it's horrible, we go, yeah, it's horrible. We're not mad at them for it. We go, yeah, I know you've been here, haven't you? That's what we'd say. It's just as horrible. And if anybody says it's horrible, we go, yeah, it's horrible. We're not mad at them for it. We go, yeah, you've been here, haven't you?

That's what we'd say. We are New Mexico hotter. That's it. And more people. And more people. So we've had, you know. More rocks, less dust. That's it.

It's a little deeper gene pool. We'll put it that way. Vermont is a different story. We're going to Vermont. Vermont is all small towns, pretty much. I think the biggest city in Vermont is 42,000 people or some crazy shit like that i don't know shit about vermont vermont is a strange odd weird that's where bernie's from right yeah yeah it's like a giant dairy farm mixed with hippies it's a weird place everybody smokes weed it's a very strange place i've been

to vermont as a kid and i was just like, this is the strangest. Super Troopers is very accurate. That was based in, too. That's based in Vermont, and that was like, yeah, it's weird up there. It feels like that. It's just weird. It's a weird place, Vermont. This is in northwestern Vermont, too.

This is even farther removed from any sort of normal civilization. This is up near basically Canada. Vermont is not on the coast, correct? No, no, no, no. New Hampshire is over above Massachusetts and all that. And so it's west of that. Yeah. Vermont is wedged between New York and Massachusetts. Got it. South of Canada. Okay. North of New Jersey and Pennsylvania, I guess. I don't know. But south of Maine. But south of Maine or west of Maine. So you're getting it. You're gettingimmy jimmy's he can almost draw a map well the best part about that is that everything's south of maine i'm gonna give you a denny's place matt

and some crayons and you're gonna fucking dominate that shit dude you're gonna dominate it it's just the west i could pick those states out fucking look at the split but the east side of this fucking country is so fucked up they wedge a lot of them in there they wedge a bunch in there there's norths and souths you really gotta you gotta be on your toes there i just don't get the the how they figured out the layout i realized that that mississippi really fucking put a solid solid border on a lot of states you could tell that it was a lot it was argued over a lot back east how jagged everything is it's like well my farm's here so you're not putting that shit there well we'll jut it out away from there and over to a proud west virginian so i will not be a part of your horse shit over

here in this state so this uh this county that it's in is it bordered it's chittenden county it borders new york so it's the far western and it's like the second county from the top in in northernness one of the last to be yeah this is except for instead of new york almost canada so close so close it's 20 minutes outside of burlington vermont which is their big metropolis which is like 42 000 people that's their biggest that's their biggest i think is that the capital i believe so yes i believe so and then uh two hours and 45 minutes to albany new york and about three and a half hours to boston so you're fucking up there that That's it. You're in Vermont. That's a long trip to fun. It is.

It is. Zip code OFA. It's a long trip away from flannel. Yeah. That's what it is. It's a long trip from bad Irish fucking Boston accents. Well, yeah, you're going to get to them. You're going to get them fast up there.

That's like the destination. That's fucked up. They want to flee to there, I feel maybe uh zip code 0 5 4 5 1 area code 802 it's a big place 39 square miles and not a lot of people in these 39 square miles as we'll get to the town motto uh come sample our maple flannel that's very strange that's not true jimmy looked at me like they have maple flat. You bought that for about three seconds. You were like, what? You looked at me like maple flat. That's a taste and a design together.

They don't go together. And maybe a smell. And maybe a smell. This is weird. You're going to almost use all your senses to absorb that. I saw you processing. Is that a plus on the flannel if it smells like maple? Like, is that good?

Why is that a thing? And you're like, wait a second. That's not right. That's just somebody that went hard at IHop that did that real hard to the hoop and fucking iHop they filled out that whole place Matt they had it down so uh town was incorporated June 7th uh 1763 okay so we're talking pre first pre-america yeah this is when we were still England you know England light right uh there it was was named after, you know what it's named after? No.

The Earl of Essex. Oh, boy. Yeah, the Earl of Essex. Bewigged douchebag. I don't even know what an Earl does. He's a bewigged douchebag. He is bewigged. That's what he does with himself.

Perfect. You sit there and you wear that wig and you're going to look fantastic. Look very feminine, but do horrible things to women. That's a good point. How does that make you emasculate? I don't know what they were thinking there. Put this powder on your face. There you go.

What the fuck? There you go. Now go. What's the logic behind that? Make yourself look as much like a woman as possible, and we will respect you more. Absolutely. That's fucking crazy. But don't go so far that you chop off that penis, because that will beat the living shit out of you. Well, that. That's fucking crazy. But don't go so far that you chop off that penis because that will beat the living shit out of you.

Or if you get caught with dudes. Also, back then, that was a problem, even though most of them liked dudes. Anyway, the Earl of Essex is a title in the peerage of England, which was first created in the 12th century by King Stephen of England. So this is a hardcore bewigged douchebag. england okay so this is a hardcore bewigged douchebag uh it's been recreated eight times from from its original inception beginning with the first earl upon each new creation so you're the earl one whatever uh possibly the best known of these earls is thomas cromwell who is chief minister to king henry the eighth okay so and that guy was a monster so yeah interesting shit going on here uh there's a current ear of Essex. They have one now.

What? Right this minute. Paul Capelle is the 11th Earl of Essex. He's a retired school teacher from Lancashire. You could be a teacher and be an Earl. Does he have to wear the wig? Right. The kids would mock him unmercifully, I feel like.

They really would here. So apparently, though, shortly after the revolution, American Revolution in this area, Ira Allen was here. He's the brother of Ethan Allen, the furniture man, I guess. Is that who? It's Ethan Allen. Yeah, it's Ethan Allen. I wonder if that's the... Is it the furniture guy?

Yeah, it's the same fucking guy. That's interesting. Yeah, that's why you got to be in from the ground floor to get a furniture empire like that, Jimmy. You should see Jonathan Pier one. He's unmatched back then. He was poof, owned all the land, did horrible things to Indians. So many just crooked trees everywhere. That's what it is.

The worse you were to the natives, the better your business flourished in the future. Anything now that's a big thing, they were terrible to the natives. It's just how it was. They sucked the force from them. Awful people. So these terrible Allen brothers, I don't know if they were terrible. I'm sure they couldn't have been nice. They had to be.

This guy constructed a dam at a bend of a water fill in the Winooski River between Essex Junction and Williston. Essex is a town, big town, like 39 square miles. Then there's Essex Junction, which is sort of kind of technically part of Essex, but it's like a little tiny, it's like a little neighborhood, but it's sort of on its own. It's sort of not. It's like Hong Kong before China took it back. It's like kind of independent, but a part of it.

It's just around. It's hanging out there and they do. They're the same thing. Basically, you're both named fucking Essex and you're in goddamn Vermont. You're the same thing, basically. You're both named fucking Essex, and you're in goddamn Vermont. You're the same thing. Everyone looks the same. Fuck off. Just annex it and fucking call it good.

It's not like one of them are Palestinians, and one of them are Muslim sect, and the other one is Israel. It's not what we're talking about here. You're connected. You're fighting over oil. Jesus fucking Christ. It's literally over services. Do you want the rural areas to have... Do you want to pay for their fire service and shit like that and it's silly anyway uh there was

a sawmill there uh that sent uh logs down the Winooski to Lake Champlain this is Hubbell's Falls which was uh it's kind of where the industry I guess kind of started in this town uh it was formed the Essex Junction was formed within the town of Essex in 1892 and it was formed the essex junction was formed within the town of essex in 1892 and it was formed to provide services to the villagers uh the rural villagers it's weird they formed this little thing they're like we'll put all our services in one little area and then they wanted to be on their own there's a long story but uh they got a fire department and electricity was brought to essex junction in 1893 great so before that no electricity you're just in the forest well you're relying on a fucking river to make sure that it

gets the logs to somewhere yeah is it floating all right they just watch fascinating like put their hand over their eyes there you go all right then what happens when they get stuck in a tide pool or let's say you're a smart guy and you realize that's what they do. And there's a big position of open water between beginning and end. If we're being, I don't think they float them down one log at a time, probably. I would assume they made a big barge, maybe, and brought it down. I don't think they were like firing them down there. That's the way I see it.

That's the way I saw it, too. Like a giant awful log flume, basically, ride where there's just logs flying in there. Guys just throwing whole trees in the river. They float downstream. That's how the log flume ride started. And it flows right from the stream into a saw and comes out a chair on the other side. Toothpicks. Yeah, toothpicks and all sorts of things that are ready to use.

Paper. In a perfect world, that's how it should be. That would be the easiest way to get it done. In a cartoon world, that's how it definitely is. that's how it should be that would be the easiest in a cartoon world that's how it definitely that's how it's definitely isn't that sad that there's grown men as grown men we still see industry as cartoons isn't that fucking woody woodpecker is fucking pathetic yeah that's really really sad uh they they got a trolley service in 1895 uh after electricity asked for you need the electricity to have a trolley uh police department in 1895. After electricity. You need the electricity to have a trolley. Police department in 1896 to guard

the trolley that's run on the electricity. You've got to have all of that. And then a library because you needed something to read on the trolley from your electricity while you're going to the police station. How about that? Electricity just fucking starts everything. Starts everything. Once there's electricity and then all public water was made available

in 1900. That would have been number one for me. Let's figure out where to get our shit away from us, number one. Let's get all of our shit away from us, and then we'll turn the lights on. I don't care if I can see. As long as I know there's no shit here, I'm much better off not seeing. Also, electricity makes water pumps. Why did it take you seven years to get that shit going?

You had lights before you had plumbing, so you got to see how shitty everything was was the other problem and it took you seven years to clear that to clear it up seven years i'm sorry the library i love a good library but fantastic give me water first before the goddamn library everyone was sitting in the library going i gotta go to go. And they're like, oh, there's nowhere for you to go here. I can hit the corner. We need running water. This is not going to work here. Well, now that we've got lights,

we can see what you're doing too. No, Jesus Christ. This is terrible. Put that French art book down. What is wrong with you? Put it down. I know the Renaissance period is very erotic. I understand.

So, Jesus Christ. So, they built a large brick school in 1912, which later was Essex High School and is now an elementary school. So, it's still there serving as a school from 1912. 1957, IBM arrived, the company IBM, which is a huge deal. I'm from in New York, like the Hudson Valley area where I'm from, lower Hudson Valley, like Wappingers, that area. IBM is like the major employer there. My dad worked for IBM. Half my friend's dads worked for IBM.

It was just like a place where people could go get a fucking job. They had a giant. Our school was just a crisscross of high tension lines between IBM plants. Really? It was cheap land between like four IBM plants, like triangulated between three of them with high tension lines. That's interesting. And it was a swamp. So they're like, put a school there. That's a good place for a school.

That's where they can learn. Tons of people have cancer that are like, we're like, I know so many people who died when they're 26 of weird cancer. Wonder why? I don't know. Gee. So thanks, IBM.

Upstate New York has Kodak, so it's the same thing. Yeah, it's fucking terrible. I'm sure that's poisoning people too. There's nuclear waste and Indian points up there. It's a fucking disaster what chemicals make like pictures you know what i mean that that stuff is dangerous as fuck that can't be good people are like dunking their hands oh yeah in that stuff with big kitchen gloves on not even like little ones no rubber like the ones

that you that you hold uh chemical experiments with when you're doing like dry those gloves yeah like making pictures with that shit and i know nothing about that at all i know nothing uh they went back and forth these the the town apparently there was a they had uh there was a merger between the the junction and the town here and then they passed this and then it changed in 2006 where they there's a merger past oh jesus christ yeah the town and a village i'm so sick of these fucking towns fighting with each other it's you know what it's charming when it happens uh in 1885 and they steal each other's records and they set the other you know office on fire from the other that's we're gonna be the county seat that's fun this is horseshit in 2006 you're

fucking suing each other fighting they're still see they're still 2006 2007 are fucked up yeah i'm not even gonna talk about it fuck these people i'm not i'm not even gonna give them the fuck i have vote counts they have vote counts posted of six to one said this and that shut the fuck up 2006 told him somebody burned the other one down yeah that's it it's on one that has the most wood still standing wind. War. Right. War between towns. Let's get it on.

I don't think that's probably good. But you know what? At this point, fuck these people. Do it. Take up arms. Don't take up arms, by the way. This is not a call to arms, I swear to God. People in this town, population, it's up 27 since 1990 all the way up to 20 946 that's

great that's spread over 39 square miles so that's it's a pretty it's very rural i mean when i do the real estate report all these houses they're not like you know with a little house next to them and a cul-de-sac it's like a fucking house and there's nothing plenty of shit around it i don't know densely populated. Lots of woods. It looks like you definitely have to compete with animals. Like, you know, if you came out of your house and you're going to your car, you're going to look both ways.

Not for people to rob you, but for like skunks and shit. Yeah. Looks like one of those places. The raccoons from, from great outdoors. Oh, your trash cans over every night. Having a fucking field day. They love hot dogs. So many lips and assholes.

Oh, fuck. Lobster tails. They must be from Chicago. They're fucking on top of that shit. That was maybe the greatest sidebar of that movie. It was a great, it was fantastic. It was just the raccoons recurring constantly throughout the movie. And John Candy's constant fight puts the rocks on him.

That'll do it. No, it's not. Because they go about their lives, and then the raccoons have this whole other fucking thing going on. It's like, yeah, who cares what they're doing? We have garbage to eat. Didn't they say something like they put rocks on the trash cans? They think that's going to stop us? Yeah, they think that's going to stop us, like they're wise-ass raccoons.

See, that's what I miss. Yeah, that's why cinema today sucks. Because that stuff is fucking... We just need to resurrect John Candy from the grave, I feel like. Figure out how to reanimate his fat ass. Fuck getting Ted Williams' head off the tuna can. I don't care about Ted Williams. Leave him alone.

John Candy's a national treasure. That's what we need. They better not have incinerated that big fuck. I think they probably did. That's a lot. Or he's buried in Canada somewhere, frozen deep in the tundra and we can't get to him anyway fingers crossed babe because uh if if jurassic park is for real we can figure that out yeah we can get him back you never know make a new fat guy let's get a shot i know the greatest he was the fucking greatest genius funniest shit yeah just a nice fucking happy that you can't not

like john candy right if you say you don't like john candy i fucking hate you you're an asshole you're an asshole i you probably kill people you're probably a serial killer most of the people we've talked about don't like john candy that's what i'm gonna look for now my research did they like john candy what's their opinion on the candy okay well we know what this guy's gonna be about we know who's gonna do the killing in this one the man at the end of his life was so big and he was in a movie where he rode a horse, and he made that shit movie actually decent to watch, just because he's fantastic. He's the best. He is. Age here.

He makes cool runnings better, too. Well, yeah. He makes everything better. Everything. God damn it. Everything's better because of Candy. It's the truth. I felt bad for him in JFK.

Never mind. Okay, we can talk about John Candy all night. John Candy episode of Small Town Murder. I wish he was murdered. We'd do a whole series on him. He's going to die anyway uh that'd be great so uh median age here's about three years higher than the average it's about 40 here uh it's a little bit older and all these towns in vermont are kind of a little bit older uh all these most small towns are full of older people people who can leave and have the upward spryness to get the fuck out of there

leave generally and they leave the elderly behind to rot that's how it works how do you get away from this old bastard that's how it works man yeah grandpa's bumming me out i gotta get the fuck out of here so uh male female there's a few more females than males it's about average so there's nothing crazy more married people than not married people uh a little higher than average which you kind of get with the older people most of the time but there's less widows here than normal so i don't know what that's about uh the cost of living here is a little high we'll get to maybe if your significant other dies off maybe you move somewhere cheaper i have no idea uh racial breakdown of this town vermont shockingly 92 and a half percent white that's high that's vermont vermont is a very

white state that that i will say uh 2.16 percent black okay so vermont is basically like a cow yeah it's white and there's like two three black spots on it if you look real close that's vermont each town they're just the blacks are in different areas every cow you're like that cow's like 2.16 percent black that one's ear is black yeah that's what it is that's that's vermont uh just like ben and jerry's which is what i think of when i think of vermont and they have that cow so automatically that's my connection once again fucking cartoons is what i think about with logs going the cow riding one uh two and a half percent asian so about half the normal population of Asians. 1.66% Hispanic. They have not made it that far yet.

Not border to border over there. They haven't gotten. It's a long track. No, it's normally 17%, so that's very, very few Hispanics. Here, religion in this town, East Coast, it's usually a little lower, except if you get like these pockets in Massachusetts or something where it'll be like 87% religious and everybody's catholic uh here though it's 39.6 religious so lower than the average about 50 50 is the average uh mostly catholics again catholics are the baptists of the north that's true as we all know uh about almost 26 catholic i'm interested in the in the

north uh having just low populations of Spanish folks or Mexican folks. It's just interesting. Well, New York doesn't. Like, New York has a lot. It's the urban areas there they kind of go to. In Vermont, there is just not a lot of, it's not very urban there. There's not many Luis and Clarks. No.

You just go there for work. If you come in as an immigrant. That's great. Not a lot of Luis and Clarks going all the way cross country. Sorry. That's quite all right. I don't mind that at all. I'd like to see that someday. Yeah, that would be good, a Luis and Clark.

Well, I think that's kind of what's going on every day fingers crossed i think christ expand it babe they're finding their way get those beige babies everywhere yeah vermont yeah vermont there's not a lot of them because uh some 0.6 lds yeah it's they'll find their way there it's cold they will find their way there uh uh one percent jewish no a full one percent everybody raise somebody up on a chair fuck i'm so happy amazing that's i think it's our first time right now you can't see it in the studio but there's streamers coming down lights and balloons the star david ceiling spinning i set this up it took a while i gotta say it cost me

about 300 for all these decorations but i think it's worth it i think that right there was was well worth it you kicked off nagila hava and all these dreidel stuff it was awesome man so we're gonna have a party after this uh 0.2 percent islam not much there uh democratic in this town mostly uh politically uh about 70 percent Democrat in this town. But that's heavy. That's heavy. Twenty eight percent Republican. That's there.

It's this town, too, is it's a kind of an artsy craftsy kind of a you would you wouldn't expect that people would be real conservative here. I would say the schools here, they're very proud of their schools here. So I look some shit up and they spend more per student by like four thousand dollars here there's 13 students per teacher that's great that's amazing that's incredible in my high school it was like 35 kids in a fucking class and they were all horrible throwing shit yelling give a fuck whatever you're all lost causes anyway that's pretty much what they thought of all of us yeah so uh anybody who's not in the classes, you're going to work at IBM anyways. You might as well just trudge across the swamp. Follow the power line until you get there. You probably already got cancer.

You might as well just work there. So unemployment rate in this town is 2.8%, which is excessively low. It's about half the national average, which is impressive, I got to say. And the household income here is a little bit higher. It's about half the national average, which is impressive, I've got to say. And the household income here is a little bit higher. It's usually about $53,000, the median in the United States. Here it's $73,000. Wow. So it's about $20,000 higher. Is their taxes heavy up there?

The taxes are a little bit high up there, but, I mean, it's not that much. Not $20,000 heavy. But they're more. But, I mean, when you get 13 pupils per student, whatever, you've got to pay for that. Oh, that's so great. That costs money. There's more manufacturing jobs here than in normal places. There's a few more health care and that sort of thing there also.

And there's a university in Burlington, too, so I think that has something to do with it, too. There's a lot of people probably working at the university. There's a lot more education jobs. Now, cost of living here, we said it's a little bit high. $100,000 is average, par, normal. Here it is $124,000. That's not so bad. Not terrible.

In the Northeast. No, and it's all housing. Housing, the median home cost here is $272,600. Median is almost $300,000. Yeah, that's a little bit high. Most of the houses are in the about 41% of them are in the $200,000 to $300,000

range and then a lot from $300,000 to $400,000. And if that has convinced you that you need a maple flannel right now, you need to wrap it around yourself, we have for you. And I'm going to our first, not a sponsor, but this person sold our goddamn house in a fucking week for us. So it was brought to you by Jennifer Runyon of ROI Properties in Phoenix, who sold my house.

Way to go, Jen. And made it so I don't have to pay for it empty every month. So thank you so much. This is the Essex, Vermont Real Estate Report. Essex, Vermont, Real Estate Report. We have a two-bedroom average apartment house, whatever, two-bedroom to rent is about $1,720 a month. My Christ. It's about $500 more than the national average.

$1,700 a month. It's pricey. Yeah. I found a four-bedroom, two-bath 1,612 square-foot house. It looks like many people were murdered there and stored possibly in the basement or fruit cellar or whatever they have. Looks scary. $255,000 for this.

$1,700 a month. Yeah, for this slice of heaven here. And it looks like it's in the woods. It's frightening. I found a four-bedroom, two-bath 2,210 square-foot house. It's nicer. This one a four-bedroom, two-bath, 2,210-square-foot house. It's nicer. This one looks like it's got a nice porch on it and shit. This one's pretty nice.

$312,500. So getting pricey. And then I found a five-bedroom, four-bath, 3,600-square-foot house. This one's real nice. It's a good one. Nice porch that goes all the way around the thing. It looks like a movie, this house. It doesn't look like a real setting.

Like a house from fucking House Guest with Steve Martin. Exactly. That's what it is. A Goldie Hawn. Was that the one with Goldie Hawn? That's the one. That's Sinbad. That doesn't matter.

Yeah, Sinbad was Phil Hartman. Okay, moving on. $459,000 for this. Amazing. So, yeah, it's a nice house, I guess. But you pay that much to live in Vermont? I don't know. You got to really like Vermont.

I don't know. If you've got money, though, and that's a pretty good-sized town. If you've retired and you've got a good nest egg, that's great. That's right. I'd love to have a big-ass house somewhere. I would love it, too. Things to do in this house. The Harriet Farnsworth Powell Museum is located there.

Doesn't that sound exciting? No. It's a museum. It's housed in a former two-room schoolhouse. It includes a collection of costumes, school items, and local memorabilia. What the fuck does that have to do with anything? That doesn't excite you, Jimmy? If that doesn't get your fucking juices flowing and your dick dick a raging just a raging torrent of blood

did what i have for you house i should be arrested you should be while you look at school items and local memorabilia look at that fucking maple spout that's something right there well if that doesn't get you this will the vermont quilt festival holy shit get quilting it's new england's oldest and largest quilt festival i do like a quilt both celebrating 43 years in 2019 they will be hold on 43 years the festival is okay all right i was like wait a minute they've been quilting for 43 what are they doing the prices here a one day pass 12 12, $12. That's a deal. $12, two days for $22, three days for $32, three days of quilts. Who wants to do that?

That's a lot of quilts, man. You've got to really be into fucking quilts. I don't even want to do Disneyland for three days. They have the Best Quilt Outside the USA Award. What is that? Best Miniature, a miniature quilt. What the fuck is the point of that? Let's call it a fucking napkin.

And finally, the Governor's Award for the best Vermont quilt, which is fantastic. What does a fucking Vermont quilt look like? Maybe it's got to be in the shape of Vermont. I don't know. I have no idea. I'll bet one won't like that. It's got to smell like maple syrup and be made out of flannel. I don't know what the fuck it is.

It does feel the burn on it. Feel the burn. That is B-E-R-N for people outside the the united states and you have no idea what the fuck we're talking about moving on call back to a few years ago when a dickhead won it's interesting so crime rate in this town property crime is about 15 percent lower than the average and violent crime the mount rushmore of uh of uh crime the murder rape robbery assault is about a third less than average this is a safe town every week i start looking at that mountain going which are you which are you sons of bitches

this is about a third this is a safe town it's known as a safe town they have a country living magazine ranks it as one of their safest towns 43 years of quilting james of course that's what i mean it's a quilting town they don't have have a festival that's like you go in the streets with your dirt bikes and drink beer. That's not their festival. They have like, you know, 54-year-old women quietly quilting. I want that dirt bike and beer festival. I made

some hot chocolate if you'd like some. Thank you very much. Yeah. Very polite. That's a really nice pattern you have there. Thank you. Isn't that floral? They go back and forth with each other. Is that the state of Yes, it is the state of Vermont. Thank you. Isn't that floral? They go back and forth with each other. Is that the state of... Yes, it is the state of Vermont. Thank you. Every patch is the state of...

They make a square. I made them into a square. Or you can do a pancake because they like maple syrup. You have to have the pat of butter. It has to look like it. It has to really look like it. Is that a circle quote? It's a pancake.

It's a pancake. It smells like maple syrup. I thought it should be a pancake. Everything fucking smells like maple syrup. That's why. I don't think they can help it. The whole thing is made of maple flannel. The whole damn thing.

They've been trying to figure out where that smell is coming from. That should be their state motto. Vermont, wondering what that smell is for the last 300 years. Is that maple? It smells like maple. I don't know. Could be. Could be.

Let's talk about some people who did not have such a nice time here okay or one person that didn't have such a not such a nice time here let's talk about a couple nice married couple uh let's talk about rebecca and michael uh dunray how do you say this duran lu okay duran duran lu d-u-r-e-n-l-e-a-u yeah duran lou duran low duran low duran low oh let's go it's duran low duran like like okay that's the french shit right yeah you're asking me what the origin of this fucking name i have right huh i don't know i have no it's duran low we're gonna call itlo. Well, they're a married couple anyway. They're not brother and sister.

It's Rebecca and Michael Durenlo. They're a married couple. We're going to go back. We're going to catch them in the early 80s. We'll go back in time and we're spinning, phone booth going and all that shit. Lightning bolt. Bill and Ted and everything. You know how that goes.

Clocks are spinning. There's George Carlin. Holy crap. I missed you, sir. Hey, damn it. Shit, I should have saw him in Vegas that time when I was there. Tickets were $60. It was too expensive.

God damn it, James. Sorry, George. Fuck. I messed up, man. You really did. But they're married. They're married in the early 1970s. They have two children.

Their kids are Jason, who is born in 1972. And then they have a daughter named Jennifer, born in 1975. They live in Swanton, which is nearby, about 30 miles away from Essex. They live there for 18 years. They are a boring Vermont. They are NPR in real life, is what they are. They're just thrown into a house, I feel like. Jennifer and Jason.

Jennifer and Jason are the kids. Rebecca and Michael, 18 years in a small town in Vermont. And they're both J's. They eat so much Ben and Jerry's ice cream. That's ridiculous. He's a little guy, by the way. He's a little tiny dude. He's like 5'4".

He's like 135 pounds. He's a real small guy, which will come into play later on. Jimmy's like, I like that about him. I like that. Good, good. Stick with it, buddy. You can make it. It's a tough life. Just work on your jumping, man. like that about him. I like that. Good, good. Stick with it, buddy. You can make it. It's a tough life.

Just work on your jumping, man. You're going to get up to that. You're going to reach the top shelf. You can get there. You're going to ask your wife for a lot of help out of the freezer. That's what you're going to be doing. Things have to happen. If you like pizza pocket.

Yeah, I found out, by the way, last night. I discovered that I am officially too old. You're out. This is my first too old. You're out. This is my first too old. You're out of the game. I'm too old to eat 30 pizza rolls at 3 o'clock in the morning and then go directly to bed. That is not okay for me anymore. I'll wake up feeling like shit if I do that now.

I used to be able to do that. That's the worst. You should never be too old to eat 30 pizza rolls. No. I'm going to push it back to 230 and try. Try again. I will figure out what my threshold is. Don't get me wrong. Where's the time limit that I can have 30? And when can I push it up to 230 and try. I will figure out what my threshold is. Don't get me wrong.

Where's the time limit that I can have 30? And when can I push it up to 40? You never know. When I'm going to have that whole fucking small bag. I'll do it, God damn it. Do you do the oven or do you do the microwave? Oven's the only way. Really?

I'll wait the 13 minutes. I'm not fucking around with this micro shit. Well, you're a hero because two minutes is all I got. No, no, no. I overcook them in the oven. They're all crispy on the outside. Yeah, around the edges. Oh, Jesus.

They're so rad. You don't need to dip them in anything. They're such a perfect meal. They're a perfect food. They're all crispy on the outside. Yeah, around the edges. Oh, geez. They're so rad. You don't need to dip them in anything. They're such a perfect meal. They're a perfect food. They're amazing. Unbelievable. So I believe these people, the Durenlo's probably loved pizza rolls as well. A nice American family liking pizza rolls, living in Vermont.

As long as the wife's home and he's not home alone because he can't reach them. No, that's true. Yeah, they're all the way in the freezer. He's like, damn it, we need one of those freezers. It's down below. Why do we always get the high-fetched voices? God damn it. I don't know why that is.

It sucks. I don't know why that is. I blame the Wizard of Oz. I get it, too. Sorry, that's what I blame. But he pops out. And every movie ever, when anybody shrinks, the voice has to be high.

He's like, kids, Jennifer, get over here. Will you get those pizza rolls out of there for me? My eight-year-old daughter, please. Jennifer, Jason, stand on each other's shoulders and get that shit for them. Both of you stand on my shoulders and we can all reach. Oh, wait, get a trench coat. Hold on. I want to go to the bar.

Get a trench coat. Let's go, kids. I'm going to have little rascals my way into getting a beer today hey everybody just gonna take a quick break from the show to tell you a little bit about bombas bombas b-o-m-b-a-s.com oh my god these are the most comfortable socks in the world great these socks are literally incredible. I can't believe how comfortable they are. They're like having a bed for your feet and your shoe.

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Bombas.com slash small and small and check out go get your socks they're amazing and now back to the show now they're a normal couple they're they never get in any trouble they're not like they don't have a meth lab in the back they don't you know they're not doing anything crazy they don't like oh colombian drug lords a bunch of money there's no there's no seedy underside to this like but at night you know then they're doing this and they have you know they're actually coyotes running the two percent of hispanics in the town through their yard illegally up to canada to sell to wealthy people to work in their homes like that's not what they're doing there's no

not importing asian women in in uh you can women in crates like The Wire Season 2. None of that shit. When you're too tall or too short, you can't do criminal activity. Because you stand out either way. It's true. I can't be a criminal. I'm too tall to be a criminal. I'm on the verge.

You could blend right in. You could blend right in. You think so? Yeah, you're still average height. You're still okay. You're in the in. I'm almost there. You could blend right in, I feel like. Yeah, yeah. You're still average height. You're still okay. You're in the range of two more inches and you're fucked. You're going to get caught in there. I still grab a little bit of attention because I talk like an asshole.

Yeah, me too. Like tall Italian guy. Right. There's not a lot of them. Let's have a talk. Six-four guinea. There's like one of them around here. Let's have a chat.

You're going to find them. Yeah. You'll find them. Don't worry. Bend over, sir. Cough. So what are we, Ben Cousins here? I don't know.

That's a crime and sports reference. Now, Rebecca, the wife, she had a little brush with the law, but nothing much. She had a DWI, which is DUI in most places. DWI in 1979. So, I mean, this, I don't know. That's when she was driving around drunk in the late 70s. That was, I feel like you had to be real shit-faced in the late 70s. You had to almost crash.

Yeah, before there, you had to be like sleeping on the side of the the road your hazards going and your doors open before they would be like hey otherwise they'd just shake and be like can you make it home can you get home follow me let's go i'll follow you get home you got to be like in a ditch with your pants around your ankles and you passed out taking a piss something yeah before they come out it's got to be a fucking hazard to society otherwise it's like whatever so they carry on this relationship obviously they've lived there like i said and for 18 years two children picturesque picturesque couple from the outside you would imagine until the early 80s uh mid 1984 uh rebecca begins to have an affair uh-. She has an affair with a man named Harmon Olmsted.

Yeah. Starting in 1984. Not a handsome man. Harmon Olmsted. He better be a handsome man. He sounds like he wears overalls to court. Yeah. Doesn't he?

He sounds like. The name alone is like you can say it with your lips together. Harmon Olmsted. You don't even have to really enunciate anything he chews straw while he wears overalls and core and his hair is incapable of growing beyond a flat top it's just formed to a flat top you can say that name through your teeth and it sounds exactly the same amish for fuck's sake he has a beard and no mustache harman holmsted i'm gonna go right out on a limb beard and no mustache his name is almost homestead it's almost it's it's almost homestead homestead almost stead that's what it is it's so

bad harman so uh mid-1984 they start having an affair now i say they start having an affair not just she has an affair because he is also married oh so they're having an affair harman got two chicks to fucking harman olmstead man got two chicks to fucking what is amazing yeah he must because they both the wife thinks he's a great guy and this one falls rebecca falls hard for him wow i mean falls hard for him she and they start in like june having an affair august of 1984 she files for divorce now two kids right now yeah and we're talking with a 12 year old son and an eight year old nine year old daughter right and a husband and they've lived together all that she says two months with this guy that harman is swinging he is a fucking what a monster i mean that that's harman when he when he when he throws down on the table. What a monster.

That's Harmon when he sits down to dinner right there. That's it. I mean, he must be a fucking beast, this Harmon. It's got to be knocking things over accidental at this point. Yeah. Is he a big guy? He needs special pants, this man. Do we have size on him?

I think he's like six foot tall, Harmon. She's not enough of the tiny fella. Yeah, he's not a huge guy. But compared to Michael. Yeah. You know, whatever. That's the curse of my life. That women are finding somebody that surprisingly fits them a little better. Fits them a little better.

The woman fits in his arms. Yeah. With me, it's like, sorry, I'm not going to get around your back. I apologize for that. I don't know what to tell you. Sorry about that. This is all I got. These two here, the Dunn, Jesus Christ, the Durenlows, Dunrelows, I wanted to say.

The Durenlows, they're, like I said, outside of her DWI in 79, which didn't seem, it seemed like an aberration. She didn't have any other issues. She wouldn't get caught, you know, getting in bar fights or anything like that. He worked for Harrison Concrete Construction for years and years and years. Hard work and do. Hard work. They're just a stable, awfully stable couple. Now, she files for divorce in 84 for the express reason that she wanted to be free to marry Harmon.

Wow. She wants to marry Harmon Olmsted. That's her goal. She wants to be Mrs. Olmsted. She's like, well, atsted. That's her goal. She wants to be Mrs. Olmsted. She's like, well, at least people can fucking pronounce it. This Dunrelu, people don't know what the hell they're talking about. They have no idea.

Durenlo, Dunrelu, I keep calling. Durenlo, people don't know what the fuck I'm talking about. So anyway, but she ends up actually becoming, she files the paperwork, but then she tells her mother that she's worried that she might have fucked up oh she's like i think i made a mistake here she's like because you know if we get divorced this is still contingent upon harman leaving his wife well not only that she thinks of actual practical things of uh we could lose the house that we could you know they we could have to sell the house and lose my house that we've had for years and years and years for with our two kids and all that and who knows if what if he wants custody of the children right i'm cheating on him you know he has a he's a stable guy he you know he

has as many much grounds as anybody else to say he wants custody of the kids this sounds like post orgasm realization yeah she's like oh shit harman blacked me out for about eight minutes there but Yeah, she's like, oh, shit. Harmon blacked me out for about eight minutes there, but I'm fucking back to reality here, boy. We are going to lose so much shit. God damn it. Harmon, get back here. I need to quell this, please.

Jesus Christ. So she ends up dropping the suit. She drops the whole thing, actually, legally. No divorce now. She pulls the divorce off the table, pulls it out of the court. Going to stay. Going to stay. Well, she doesn't stay. They end up being separated on and off.

She'll move out for a while. She'll move back in. This whole time, she's carrying out an affair with Harmon Olmsted. Once Olmsted puts his stamp on you, once he slaps you with his Harmon, it's over with. That's it. That's all there is to it. You're done for yeah you're in for life at that point so she got a harman tattooed on her stomach like tupac and it was over with you

know so she uh she uh she's still having this affair uh that now michael uh durnlow the husband here is aware of this affair at some point or at at least aware of this Olmstead kind of hooking up or pushing up on his wife. God, what a terrible feeling. So it's an awful feeling for this guy. And like I said, this is it's not like a new relationship. They've been together for 18 fucking years with these kids and all this type of shit. So it gets to the point where they have some confrontations. Michael and Harmon have some confrontations.

And I was really bad. One of the times I was in a parking lot and Michael actually started the confrontation and Harmon knocked him out cold with his cock. It was amazing. I'm sorry. That didn't actually happen. I'm sorry. He was hanging on my everywhere too.

He's like, really? Really? Yeah, he was down there anyway. And he just swung his waist around and knocked him silly. What happened is that Michael said, Harmon, I got to talk to you. And he turned around really fast. And that's all. That was the end of it.

What's that? He was impaled. Just embedded in a wall somewhere. So she's having this affair. They apparently had exchanged michael and harman had apparently exchanged threats and engaged in a couple of physical encounters in public places and uh you know and places where people saw it they had kind of not they didn't fight each other but they were like they'd start tussling and people would pull them apart two guys that don't know how to fight and don't want to

fight or decide they need to fight for some reason. And people pull them up. I'm going to grab him like that. And I could see. I just see the fucking midgets from. Hey, come here. Let's go. Come on, guys.

Guys choking. Listen, listen to me, guy. Yeah. With the seatbelt from the back or our Pennsylvania case. Sunbury from the back seat. That guy. Poorael running into a bar and jumping up to hit him in the knee and yeah no i mean i can understand michael's plight here too he's like how could my wife fuck a guy named harman i'm mad that's bullshit i'm so angry i'm

so angry so poor michael i'm sorry michael it's not your fault your your your wife is having an affair on you this is terrible by all accounts he did nothing he didn't beat her he didn't fucking wasn't horrible wasn't gone for months at a time he was a he was a decent person a nice man and a good father and and you know this time was just having a rocky time in his marriage and it's not his fault that he's tiny but that's fucking hilarious i'm sorry sorry so uh just to let you know and i share his placeight, so it's fun. It's funny. Jimmy's short.

We can talk about him. So that's fine. We got short, bald, Italian. We got all sorts of shit covered here. Don't worry about it. So one point here, though. Late 1984. So this is, affairs started like May, June-ish.

The divorce papers are filed in august pulled back in there now we're in like november 1984 uh she rebecca tells a friend of hers that she's just having a conversation like you know just a woman to woman talk i figure uh now this again i picture this is a cartoon thing i've just big hair dryers over their heads and they're talking magazines the whole deal but i think it's actually happened on the heads and they're talking magazines, the whole deal. But I think it's actually happened on the phone. So they're on the phone

and she tells her friend that she wouldn't have so many problems if only her husband were dead. Which I mean, clearly. I mean, good God. That's a terrible realization to have. That's an awful realization

and that's a weird thing to get to. Not to how do I leave, how do I leave. Because I said, she's not under any, there's no harm i leave because i said it's not she's not under any there's no harm has come to her she's not under any threat threatened every day he hasn't done anything wrong to her or told her she's not allowed to go anywhere she just feels

like life would be a lot easier if she could just kill this fucking guy or he would die somehow and you know then she could have custody of the kids not have to worry about it and fucking this guy can lay down the harm and, night, and fucking morning. I see it as a Sex and the City thing on the phone where she's just like, Harmon just wants to go down on me all the time. It's just ridiculous. It's all he wants to do. And that's what I'd rather have that than having him climb up on me. It's true.

He smells less like maple than anyone else around here. So it's just, you know what I mean? Always going down on me. It's fantastic. It's fantastic. So she tells her friend that, which right away, your friend's got to be like, oh, yeah. Yeah. I mean, how do you react to that?

If I tell you, like, man, it'd be so much easier if Sarah was dead. You'd be like, I'd die laughing. Yeah. You'd laugh because, you know, I wasn't serious. Number one, you'd be like, shut the fuck up. Hey. And two, you'd be like, what are you, stupid you stupid what the fuck i don't think you'd encourage that line of thought is what i'm getting at if a friend tells you that you wouldn't be like well you know

yeah sometimes you gotta kill a bitch i can see that i mean yeah obviously if he were dead your life would be much easier let's just hope he dies i mean expensive you can't say that so she tells this is so we go to spring of 1985. So this goes on now for almost a year. This affair has been going on and the marriage has turned to shit and they're on and off separated. And there's affairs and dick downs happen and left or left and right. her mother that she was going to go through with the divorce at this point she's tired of this shit she's tired of the charade she doesn't care what the consequences are she's going to go through with this divorce and marry harman this is the express reason for the divorce is i need to get divorced before i go marry harman mom needs to say but harman's still married what are you talking about yeah that's you've got it you've got to put some things into perspective your goal no matter what you do still relies on somebody else's fucking actions this is a twisted

mess yeah is what this is this is a fucked up i would say triangle but it's a square i guess because you the wife his wife has no idea what's going on she is in the dark that's the other thing she has no goddamn idea he's having an affair. She doesn't know that he's tussling with a jockey in a fucking parking lot somewhere. She has no idea about this. She knows about his cock. That she knows about. She's been around him.

But other than that, she's really clueless to his goings on. It's another John Candy movie. It's another John Candy movie. I think we just wrote one right here. Damn it, bring him back from the dead. movie it's another gigantic movie i think we just wrote one right here damn it bring him back from the dead so uh uh now uh one point here she gets frustrated with with harman and it's under it's of some dispute what she's frustrated about now there's multiple things that this could mean and this is what where we get a gray area and where everything kind of turns to a muddy tapioca of a fucking legal mess.

But she tells Harmon that she is about to resume having sexual sexual relations with Michael. OK. Unless Olmsted, quote, proved himself. Yeah. Now, this is not disputed because she told someone she said this. He told people she said the exact same thing. People who don't know each other both heard the same thing separately so corroborated from both sides he needs to prove himself or else she's going to start fucking her husband yeah which is wow okay this is like who's harry crumb with like that bitchy lady in the

movie this is wow this is more complicated than who's harry crumb actually and that includes the wig john candy was wearing and that was complicated mister so he had a merkin on his chest he had a fucking merkin on his head on his chest his head was a merkin too that thing was terrible again john candy terrible movie he makes it wonderful he makes it very very watchable yeah i'll watch the shit out of that when When he's dressed like the Indian guy, oh, John Candy is an Indian. You want to laugh. I'll tell you, that folksy 80s racism was hilarious sometimes.

Cold-full appreciation for no reason at all. No reason at all, just to make a costume. They could have had a character of anybody. They could have just put a mustache on and been fine. But nope, I'm going to be an elaborate, and we wouldn't say Indian, like India india right that's what we're saying so it's bizarre it's very very bizarre now very much like like bobcat golf weight and hot to trot another great movie that is only good because he's in it i used to watch that when i was little all the fucking time hot to trot it's a dumb movie but it's

fucking great the god it's a goddamn horse that talks to bobcat golf weight so he brings it in an apartment to live with him and the horse is much well better spoken than bobcat golf if you saw a human and a horse you'd go which one am i going to need subtitles for you're wrong you're so it's fucking 100 wrong you're absolutely wrong Absolutely wrong. Guarantee you that. So June of 1985. We've gone through the spring. June of 1985, Rebecca tells everybody that she has ended the affair with Harmon. He apparently did not prove himself. No. As of this point.

We have no proof. No proof. He doesn't prove shit. Right. What are you going to do if the guy doesn't prove himself, Jimmy? Then what? You go back to the little guy. You go back to the little guy. You go back to the little guy.

And Michael, he's very dependable, Michael. And he's been wanting to get the affair wasn't a deal breaker for him. He wanted. What a hero. He wanted his family together. And that's what he told. Everybody told his relatives he just wanted his family to not be fucked up. He wanted his kids to have a mom and a dad in the same house and all that shit.

So he's trying to make it work. And apparently, as of June 1985, she decides that she's going to try to make it work too okay great good for her uh she says the affair is over and uh she tells everyone she's reconciled with michael but she's also seen with harman uh olmsted at a fourth of july party so that's what she tells everybody but who knows how true that is because i would say if you're having an affair with somebody and then you break off the affair, you're probably not going to go to any parties with them. Probably not going to want to talk to that person anymore. I would assume if you see each other, you're probably going to fuck.

Right. Also. Right. So you're not. This isn't like a. Well, we're all platonic now. Right. You don't become platonic friends with the person you're having an affair with.

I don't think that works in the real world. It can work as like an ex-boyfriend and an ex-girlfriend they can be platonic eventually i imagine but a month after you break it off to reconcile with your husband because this guy didn't prove himself so you decided this is all a little murky i think and it's not going to work out the same way is he a four uh one of the harman kardon people is he part of that shit or is he just a just an olmstead somewhere he doesn't matter i don't know yeah i don't think he's got any kind of special connections or anything like that there's nothing he's not a wealthy man yeah he's just a dude that fucks well dude swinging some serious meat jimmy that's all it is so uh she said she hadn't ended

the affair but like we said fourth of july party they are seen together by multiple people she went to a fucking party so obviously they're going to be seen together now july 9th 1985 uh the duran lows have decided that they are life is grand they have reconciled and they want to announce to the world that they're reconciling and they're going to go out and have a reconciliation celebration for the two of them they're going to go out and have a reconciliation celebration for the two of them. They're going to go out and have some drinks. They're going to go out on the town. But they drive like 30 miles away to Essex.

Go show those people. To go. Yeah. Which is strange. They don't go to Swanton. They go to Essex. And it's not this place. It's called Veronica's Tavern in Essex.

So a shit hole bar. Yeah. It's a fucking bar. You better go tell the alcoholics that you're now not fucking everybody else well the weird part is what is that yeah let's let's go tell all the alkeys that don't care at all because they're all running away from their terrible relationships that's why they're drinking in here hello everybody put your drinks down we would like to tell y'all i realize you're in here tonight having drinks and hoping to

fuck that bartender now listen this girl right here used to be fucking everybody okay now she's only fucking me again again now because at first she was fucking everybody then i married her now she was only fucking now then she went fucking everybody now she's back to just this dick everybody keep cocks in your pants though because i don't you never know how long this is gonna hold continue trying to fuck that bar to the roof. Yeah, this might not hold. We don't know.

I'm going to take her back home 30 miles away. And they're like, who the fuck was that little guy? No shit. He's like, those are cool people. They really listen. They're good listeners. Really good listeners. I like them.

They're blind drunk, Mike. God damn it. Jesus Christ, Mike. He's like, I don't know. I couldn't see their eyes. They were way up there. So the strange thing about Veronica's Tavern is that this is not a place that they have frequented, Rebecca and Mike. This is a place that Rebecca goes with Harmon.

Okay. This is their place that they go to. So when she comes in with Michael, the people that do know her are like, what the fuck is going on now? So this is super fucking strange. Like, why would you take him 30 miles away to a place that you take the guy that you are having an affair with? The whole thing is very fucking strange here. They've been seen there multiple times over the last year. Harmon.

Harmon and Rebecca. Like, many, many times. This was one of their regular watering holes. She likes to go out and have a drink. This Rebecca is Mike taking her to the places she used to go to embarrass her. No, no, no. This is her idea. This is her idea.

She's driving. Okay. She's driving. She took her, him out here. This is her idea. We're going to go out to celebrate. We're going to Veronica's tavern. I know it.

It's a great little place. We're going to have a ball over here. Blue Harmon in the corner. Yeah. So he's just happy that they're together and he's like, I'll go with it to whoever's fucking tavern. He it it's a great little place we're gonna have a ball over here harman in the corner yeah so he's just happy that they're together and he's like i'll go where to whoever's fucking tavern you want it doesn't matter so he seems like a good guy here uh they go there so this is on july 9th they plan this out that they're gonna go uh and it's the evening of july 12th is that when they're gonna go have this celebration i don't know why they couldn't just go have a drink

some other time maybe he's tired from his concrete work i'm not sure maybe the groupon was about to expire you have no idea that's true it's it's coming so it's which expires on the 13th let's get it in right on the 12th let's make them think that we're not going to do it and then just fucking get it we're going to take from them anyway right under there so they meet uh or something they meet they're at home on the evening of the 12th uh They leave their home in Swanton and go to the tavern all the way there. Like we said, it's like 30 miles. They arrive at about 9.30 p.m. and Rebecca's driving this whole time. This is her car, her driving.

She parks the car back in the back of the building. There's two different places you could park. There's a front lot where most of the people park and you just walk on in the front, like most bars have, on a front entrance and there's a back entrance then you park in the overflow parking when the exactly on friday on friday night well here there is the the the back of the tavern that parking area is totally unlit it's like the woods back there it's pitch fucking black then they refer to it a million times as pitch black back there no lights no nothing i don't know why nobody put a street light up it's vermont i don't know so uh they park there rebecca parks the car in an unlit area behind the building rear of the tavern that's where they are uh now uh the the lot that they're

that they're uh parked in the back of the tavern is uh next to it is a grassy embankment an embankment with a bunch of grass and train tracks next to it separating that parking lot from a lumber yard it's a fucking murder field so there's a yeah there's there's a park pitch black parking lot train tracks lumber yard back there so this is just to give you an allay of the land of what's going on here it's the place where if a drunk in a bar i don't know say veronica's was like y'all want to see dead body yeah you just be like yeah let's go out back i'm sure there's one there or more likely even uh drunk in the bar gets in his car and he's like i bet we can jump them tracks and then just fucking tries to take his car four-wheeling into the lumber yard and across the tracks that's probably happened sir that's probably

happened so many times when people were shit-faced hammered in there like it's gonna be so much fun and then they get 12 feet and they're fucking bottomed out on a like shit that doesn't work anybody uh frank tried to jump his lincoln continental last week we're gonna have to we had to winch it out it was a bastard let me tell you something so let's not do that so uh this also uh the the, the lot they're in, there's a few other parked cars there, mostly employees,

they park in the back and shitloads, there's a bunch of debris back there. There's shit from the lumber yard, shit that's blown in, shit, there's just shit everywhere.

It's the area that's not, it's very well, it's not taken care of. No one cares. Yeah, no one cares. The front is where people give a shit and they care,

where most of the people come in. So, the Durin Lowe's enter the bar together, they walk a shit and they care where most of the people come in uh so uh the duran lows enter the bar together they walk in together they find a table they order a beer uh now like we said 30 miles and they are there they order one beer they don't even finish the beer and decide to leave what they're there for 15 minutes yeah and they drove 30 miles to have three quarters of a beer yeah and get in the car and go home what the fuck which is super weird yeah and and nothing happened there wasn't like oh there was a confrontation or somebody said something and they were like let's just get

out of here nothing happened a bunch of people were at the bar to that reconciliation sex everybody was there they need to get to the car to go fucking an unlit parking lot next to a dirty lumber yard and train tracks that sounds hot that's fucking hot so uh so yeah they're they leave after 15 minutes not a whole beer they leave they go to the back of the parking lot like we said the back of the building they leave to they go to the car when they get to the car rebecca goes to the driver's side and michael goes to the passenger side. She drove. It's her car. So she's going to get in her side.

This is what she says and he's going to open the passenger door and at that point out of nowhere, out of the complete darkness, Michael is struck in the back of the head with a blunt instrument and stabbed twice in the heart. Oh my God. And he dies. That's it. He dies there. They end up taking him into surgery and all that but he doesn't make it. He's bleeding out, stabbed in the heart. Oh, my God. And he dies. That's it. That's it. He dies there. They end up taking him into surgery and all that, but he doesn't make it.

He's bleeding out, stabbed in the heart twice. Holy shit. And plunked in the head with a blunt object. That was fast. That was very fast. He was having a beer. Everything was fine. Reconciliation.

Dead. Like that. What the hell? Now he's dead. Now, she said that Rebecca says that she heard her husband say, I've had enough just after he got hit or just after she heard the scuffling over on the other side of the car. She heard him say, I've had enough, apparently. I don't know. Sorry. I don't want to make fun of him, but that's what we said.

He said, I've had enough, apparently, is what she says. That's what she says. The one slam on the back of the head, he'd had enough? There's so many questions. There's a lot of questions here. We're going to get into all of this here. What do you mean, Michael? Yeah, exactly.

She reports the attacker as what she could see, approximately five feet, four inches tall, and could have been male or female. Okay. So she can't even make out a gender yeah it's so dark and this is 1985 so it wasn't like well he was gender fluid no this was vermont either overalls or a dress one of the two i think i feel like so that's that's what's going on here so that's how she describes him five foot turf describes the assailant five foot tall gender indeterminate so that's interesting now uh another witness uh somebody around there reported around this time seeing a man of harman olmstead size who's about six feet tall and a truck that olmstead drives in the vicinity of the back parking lot around the time of this assault that had happened.

So that's damning a bit. That's, you know. Why are you... I mean, it is a six-foot-tall man with a truck in Vermont. So, I mean, it could be other people, but that's still a lousy coincidence, we'll say. It's not a good coincidence. Hey, everybody.

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And now back to the show. so at this point rebecca uh after this has happened uh her husband has hit the ground rebecca right now nobody touched her no no nobody asked for money from him there was no hey give me everything you got there's no rape no rape no nothing just somebody had it in for this guy wanted to kill him get the fuck out of there. No interest in her at all. She runs back into the bar and she shouts that her husband's been hit. That's all she shouts is my husband's been hit. Okay.

But didn't say where or what happened. So everybody in the bar exits the front door and goes out to the distance and goes through the parking lot out in the street thinking that he'd been hit by a car because my husband's been hit in the streets right there and i'm sure a drunk has wandered out and got fucking taken out by a car once in a while on a dark road in the middle of vermont another one of these yeah jesus christ all right fine we'll put put him with the cow we got this morning off the fucking road so it's one of those things so they all run out and they're like where the fuck is he is he in the bush they're like looking in the weeds on the side of the road did he fly off the road what happened and uh they can't fuck they can't find him so then she

uh comes out finally after a couple minutes she comes out of the bar in the front and says no no no he's in the back parking lot she didn't say as they rushed out the door you're going the wrong direction you should come this way she didn't lead anybody out no lead them to the body she told that led them into the street and she said the five foot four gender indeterminate attacker ran toward maple street ran away that way so that's what she says also so she's got a lot to say here so uh so they all the people go from the front of the bar back through the bar and back into the back parking lot again. Now this is getting to be a comically ridiculous scene of a bunch of drunks searching the weeds and then running back in going, where's the attacked guy? Or where's the hit guy?

Because they don't even know what happened. They don't even have a description of what injury he has. No. He's just been hit. He's been hit. what injury he has. No. He's just been hit. He's been hit.

So while this is happening, while they're all searching, the bartender is calling 911 or whatever the Vermont 1985 equivalent of 911 is just nine probably, dialing some shit, you know. And a car that's painted like a cow comes along with spots on it and shit

and they pull up to the fucking thing. With one red dome on the top that he had to magnetize. Yeah, he had to magnetize it and there's its own little maple spout coming out of the dashboard you know because they got to have that put a little in your coffee in the morning so you got to have that maple scent coming from your pores maple and brandy in your coffee that's how you attract the women up there you should harman like i said you put that's how you get through a day it's the only way to get through

a day jimmy so as the people a rescue team arrives and also the people there were you know obviously trying to do cpr on him or whatever they could until the ambulance gets their ambulance gets there they're trying to revive him everybody's attempts to revive him all of the fighting for this guy's life during all of this rebecca stands far away from him wow she is like 30 feet away just arms crossed watching the whole scenario take place yeah which is i gotta say a little weird i mean i get that people have different reactions to different shit but i just tend to think that you would dive in there and try to help that person or at least we all grieve different ways

try to make them comfortable while if they're in pain i don't know i would if it was your husband that's what i'm saying if it was my wife i'd be like oh shit you know and try to help her you know and at least you know comfort at least or something i wouldn't be like i'll let those strangers take care of it i'm gonna stay over here i'm gonna at least be standing there trying to see what happens this is right hey don't grab her tit you know shit like that this is right around when aids got big though and she's like i don't know what he's got yeah i don't know what he's got. Yeah, I don't know what he's got. Shit. Oh, no, I'm the one fucking other people.

Damn, never mind. Shit. I may have gave him something. I don't want to catch it. Damn it. Fuck. So two people named Charles Blaisdell and Douglas Belenko, who work at IBM, obviously IBM employees, as most of the people were at that point.

They are the B in IBM. They are the B in IBM. They are the B, yes. They testified for both of them. They testified later on. They say that they tell the police that they came to Michael's aid and that Rebecca had told them that she'd been hit. And they just backed up the story of running out in the front and running out in the back. And they found Michael in a position that the medical examiner would say was consistent with their findings. So we'll find out what those findings are in a little bit.

But now state police at this point say that investigators found no evidence indicating anybody in particular of this crime. There's no anything with fingerprints. There's nothing that they can match to anybody. They have no no suspect. They have no physical leads, no evidence of this crime. There's no anything with fingerprints. There's nothing that they can match to anybody. They have no... No suspects. They have no physical leads, no evidence of physical leads. Obviously, they have suspicions.

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. But they have nothing. They don't have any that's concrete in evidence that would hold up in court that this person did it. No, exactly. Nothing like that. Now, an Essex lieutenant,

Robin J. Howell, said that Rebecca, quote, became obviously more agitated and became unresponsive to my questions at the scene. So he's trying to gather information. And at this point, it's a whoever attacked him could still be close by. And it's a it's a hey, what happened? What's going on? Would you see?

And she starts fucking being like, fuck you. I don't want to talk about. I'm not talking to you about this. Like, fine. Yeah. She starts getting her arms crossed again. I just see her as a very arms crossed type of person. Like, well,. I don't want to talk about it. I'm not talking to you about this. I'm fine. Yeah, she starts getting her arms crossed again. I just see her as a very arms crossed type of person. Like, well, I'm not going to go revive him.

I'm not going to tell you what happened to my dead husband. She seems like a pain in the ass. Became obviously more agitated. Now, obviously, too, he could have been asking her pointed questions, too. Do you know who did this? Are you fucking somebody that might have done this? Is there a huge dicked man riding around this fucking town with a beef against this fucking guy or what like you don't know what what he's asking her but apparently she became agitated unresponsive and not helpful to

the police at this point uh they make her uh or they she don't make her but she agrees to take a polygraph test the day after the killing uh they don't do the xerox machine on her they give her more credit than that jill let's take his lie detector phillips go get the xerox machine come on let's take her to the copy room that's what they did too they didn't even bring a one in the interrogation room they took him to the copy room you'd think in that story just the fact that there's just reams of paper around in the fucking copy room would make you think this isn't a lie detector room this is a goddamn this is the copy room there are still butt cheeks on that sir what are you doing what are you doing a guy had

his ass on that 10 minutes ago so she agrees to take a polygraph test and she passes it really the day after the killing okay but what were the questions she yeah she passes it the problem is the police learn that she through the polygraph that she had taken sedatives before the polygraph which is how you pass a polygraph that's the number one way to pass a polygraph their first question medicate her no later on they said did you take anything and she said no and they said yeah you did motherfucker and she said okay yeah i took sedatives because i'm nervous to do this obviously as anybody would be but that's part of the test is your baseline nervous is here and then when i ask you did you kill your husband your baseline nervous jumps up to here and it's you know spikes whereas if you're on sedatives i could ask you

anything and you'd just be like i don't know whatever sure did you kill your husband no i don't know whatever your heartbeat is physically incapable of fucking raising your body's incapable of producing the things that physical manifestations of not telling the truth so uh they learn about that and they say okay well you got to take it again you know clean and sober with no sedatives. And she says, fuck that. No, thank you. Really? So she refuses to take a second polygraph. She said, I already passed one.

I'm not taking another one. Fuck you, people. Okay. Which they're not happy about. At that point, they're starting to get. Well, they were suspicious before. If you're taking a lie detector, they're suspicious. We'll put it that way.

Definitely a suspect. You're something. Yeah, they're thinking about you. We just want to clear you means let's make sure we just just want to clear you yeah yeah so do i yeah uh because you guys are clearly thinking about me exactly so she refuses to retake the test and never does take another lie detector test never does never takes another one because she passed one she passed one she's good driving test i passed that once i passed it yeah i haven't taken another driving test since i got my license no no they don't know how bad i've gotten no i could be terrible out there they have no idea i've committed crime since that's a weird yeah that's a weird

thing you get your license and they give it to you there's no retesting there's no anything it's just until you do enough bad shit to where they have to take it away you have it or you age out of it or well yeah or you but otherwise it's you until you do enough bad shit to get it taken away from you silly you've gone 85 and a 30 so now you can't have it anymore other than that you can have it forever i don't get it i mean you were caught doing that that's all it is because i i've done it i've gone very very fast and we all have i mean we did 110 to texas, we did. But in Texas, that's the right lane. Or is it 95? In Texas, that's the right lane.

That really is. If you want to be in the left lane, you have to be going 120 and firing a shotgun out of your passenger window. That's the left lane. That's for fucking closers in Texas. They don't fuck around. You're doing 105 in the slow lane, and then big rigs are passing you. They're passing you, firing shotguns out of the passenger window.

It's fucking weird. Yeehaw, motherfucker. Yeehaw, bitches. That's their horn. Yeah, that's exactly what it says. That's the pull horn. Yeehaw, bitches. So two days after the killing,

Rebecca goes to a friend's house, and this is not like her. She's not someone who shows up she goes without calling first and the person's like what the fuck are you doing here like she's an adult she's like 40 years old like you you don't just show up at people's houses unannounced you do that when you're 19 you go knock on your buddy's apartment door and he's home and you're like hey cool let's do some bong hits and they go yeah come on in they don't care that happened to us a lot when i was a kid i think what people come over yeah they would they would come over to smoke weed with my stepdad yeah yeah they just show up

that's a sign of a bad adult yeah no one shows up at my fucking house unannounced nobody if they do i don't even show i'm not letting it no you could but very don't very few people could most people i'd be like i don't they didn't say they're fucking coming over i'll let that fucking doorbell ring forever let the dogs bark eat shit i keep doing what i'm doing motherfucker so she shows up though without calling and this friend of hers had just returned from ohio uh where she was going to move with her family so she went to look for a place to live in ohio where her husband and her kids were going to move uh so uh now at this point rebecca says that she and harman should also consider moving to ohio this is two days after the killing by the way after the big reconciliation party in the state they should leave and listen to why she said they

should leave as well because there's no way they're going to be able to live in swan is what she says because you know people are going to fucking talk, obviously. There's a dead man and there are questions. Well, especially when you were, he was killed at your giant, I'm not fucking that guy anymore party. Because that's what the party was. At the place where you used to fuck that guy. That's the thing.

Because that's what the party was. The only beef they had was her fucking him. And so that was the party. I'm not fucking him anymore. My wife's not taking that huge cock anymore, everybody. Drinks on me. Right. Celebrate.

For 15 minutes. Hava Nagila. 15 minutes of open bar. Let's go. For me, baby, like a wedding. Jesus Christ. So she says later on, Harmon called the friend's house, this friend that came back from Ohio that Barbara or that she was visiting. And then she says that she was expecting to find her there.

That's what Harmon says. Harmon called this friend and said, you know, where is she? God damn it. I want to lay some dick down. And Rebecca is nowhere to be found here. So she says, I called her Barbara a minute ago. Her name's Rebecca. It's not fucking Barbara.

So anyway, she's not there. Now, the friend speaks with Harmon, but says that basically speaks with him and is over. He tells her on the phone that everything's going to be all right for some reason. And she's like, okay. Tells Rebecca that. Tells the friend this on the phone. Yeah, because Rebecca's not there. Yeah, so she tells her everything's going to be all right.

And she's like, okay. Terrific. I don't know. Fuck you want from me. I just got back from Ohio. Everything's fine. I'm moving. I'm not involved with you people anymore.

You shouldn't move there, by the way. So over the next three weeks, Rebecca is at this friend's house a lot. Not normal for her to be over there all the time. This is a normal friend she sees once in a while. All of a sudden, she's there all the time. And whenever she's there, Harmon is calling her there. So rather than calling her on her phone that you know police might be oh brilliant there she it's 15 calls over a two to three week period is it dumb or yeah it's two it's a 15 call thing

over two to three weeks so it's a definite pattern of i'm going over there to get a call from him right especially since she normally doesn't go over there to hang out especially not unannounced how worried would that be if i just showed up here unannounced and there's a phone call for you then your phone rings and they're like is jimmy there yeah that's that's what would happen why the fuck would you think that jimmy would be here but actually actually sure he comes over it's like they're all teenagers he comes over literally she comes over unannounced yeah and then five minutes later he calls there is rebecca happened to be there actually she just wandered in. This is very weird. Shocking. I've been calling everywhere.

I figured I'd call you, too. If that happened once? Yeah. Amazing. That's a coincidence. What a bizarre occurrence. 15 times in two weeks? That's a lot, I would say. That seems like a pattern.

Yeah. After the third day, the friend should just be like, are you fucking using me for my phone? Why are you taking calls here? You're weird. Don't you have a phone, you fucking weirdo? Is mail for you showing up here now, too? By the way, where are your kids? Don't here you're weird don't you have a phone you fucking weirdo is male for you showing up here now by the way where are your kids don't you have kids don't you have children a dead father that you should be talking to and hanging out with 13 and 14 year old child you shouldn't be here one of them's fucking uh 10 at this point for christ's

sake oh is that yeah you're right so they're like 13 and 10 these poor kids ridiculous a 10 year old girl who lost her dad and this lady's over here taking phone calls at her friend's house i don't know if they were at school or whatever 10 year old i'm going through a divorce and my kids are losing oh yeah jesus that's my kids i can come over at any time yeah it's still dead yeah imagine if you were dead oh jesus and poor kids mom's getting dicked down so uh rebecca also she uh at this point now you start to once there's a death and you go through the police talk to you, now you have to start dealing with all of the logistical shit like, oh, I don't know, life insurance. Oh, boy. Oh, boy.

Turns out, yeah, he's got a pretty good policy. And guess who's the beneficiary? You betcha. Definitely Rebecca. Is she taking those phone calls at the front house, too? Yeah, I got to make some calls here. She needs an office, this woman. That's what she really needs.

Just a small office, maybe in Essex Junction down there with the public services. They could use a Kinko's or a FedEx Express or FedEx office. Yeah, or even just if there's a hotel with a business center in it. I think she can make that work for her, I have a feeling. I don't know what it is. So she claims to everybody not to know that the death benefit for this the for the insurance had been increased when in the spring of 1985 right right then three months beforehand when uh yeah when she had announced that she's no longer gonna fuck this other guy it's terrible yes she

basically increased it yeah who knows she increases the the amount and then he's dead like immediately like three months later where she used to at the place where she used to bang the guy she's now celebrating the night that she's not fucking and taking all sorts of phone calls at that person's house secretively and sedatively uh passing and polygraph balancing it but yeah and it's all very but the assailant five foot four no idea dick or not, who knows, an Asian. Fluid sexuality. It was just an Asian ninja. I have no fucking idea.

Not that Asians are gender neutral, but you know what I'm saying. They just look the same. Exactly. There you go. Male and female, same haircut. There you go. So at least in the 80s. Right.

At least in 1985. If you've been to Disneyland in 85, you would think the same thing. Absolutely. Absolutely. Now it's different. Now it is. Then it's not. They grew their hair now. They do. They know. They're Disneyland in 85, you would think the same thing. Absolutely. Now it's different. Now it is. Then it's not. They grew their hair now.

They do. They know. They're like, hey, we can do shit to it. This is allowed. Hey, cool. Hey, right on. That's true. Yeah, China was pretty fucking oppressive in the 80s. It's still shitty, but I mean, in the 80s, they were still running people over with tanks

on the news and shit. So they do it now. Just they'd fucking kill everyone with a camera anywhere nearby. They got smart about it. They're throwing tiny babies, tiny girl babies off cliffs oh yeah that's ridiculous they'll do that forever so she she claims not to know about this increase she said i knew we had insurance i didn't know he upped it in spring of 85 i guess i'm a real lucky lady here what a guy what a guy uh but the insurance agent who arranged the increase said that oh oh, actually, she was aware of it. She was the one that did it.

It was all her. And not only was it increased two months before that, it was increased by more than $90,000. So that's the extra she ended up getting out of it from what it was before. And it's also said by the insurance agent that Rebecca forged the husband's signature as well. So his signature is different and her signature of him is that. The other question now is why did the insurance guy allow that? Oh, is it because he gets a commission? Well, you fucking slimy.

Well, these nice people from Swanton ain't going to kill each other. She's just take. Oh, God, that paperwork. How many times has your wife signed shit for you back when you're married? Zero. Zero. When you're married, she never was like, oh, slapping on a fucking thing like that. I don't want her to sign my fucking name.

I'll be strapped to some goddamn financial burden for however long. No. No, that's good. God, no. Well, you never know. She doesn't get to touch shit of mine. You don't know what she signed. That's why I'm divorced, because she touched my shit.

How would you know what she signed, Jimmy? You got a good point. I don't know what she signed, Jimmy? You got a good point. I don't know what she signed. I may have all kinds of financial burdens out there. You could have credit cards out there. I'm going to start getting phone calls for shit I don't own. Every time you go to the ball game, she's fucking signed you up for another card. She's got like 26 tote bags at home.

That is a good point. There were a lot of Phoenix Suns and Coyotes shit in my house. Why are there 14 newspapers showing up every morning? What's going on here? Where is this coming out of? Because it's coming out of an account somewhere. Oh, shit. So now we'll talk about Teresa Dum between, this is interesting now, between Michael and Harmon that even the mother knew about.

What the fuck? The mother knew about this shit. In one case, the mother quotes Rebecca to the police saying that Olmstead issued a warning to Michael, this is what Rebecca told her mother that, quote, make sure you've got eyes behind your head, he told him, which is a bad thing when you got hit with a blunt object in the back of the head. Right. Those words. It's also impossible to do.

It's also, yeah, very difficult. The mother also said, Rebecca's mother also said that Rebecca told her the comment was made at a bar called The Outpost in St. Albans. And she said that Rebecca also said that Olmsted told Michael, quote, I'll get you sooner or later in front of a bunch of people in an open space in a bar. Not a good threat. Again, terrible threat. Now, afterwards, after the whole thing, you would wonder where the fuck they've talked to Rebecca. She got a polygraph.

I'd like to know what Harmon has to say about this, especially since a person fitting his description was seen in the area. In a truck he owns. They should at least probably have a chat with him. So the state police look for him at his mother's house. And his mother, Martha Olmsted, that is the most Amish name I've ever heard. She's at least Mennonite. At least. No television for this woman. She's at least Mennonite, at least. No television for this woman.

She wiped her hands on her skirt to answer the. Oh, absolutely. She's making a pie. She had to wipe them off real quick. She tells the police that after after Michael had conferred. I'm sorry. After Harmon conferred with a lawyer, he took an unscheduled trip to Oregon to, quote, visit a distant relative for a few days. Oh, boy. So, OK.

Out of the blue, you're going to visit a distant relative? Life insurance upped. She's telling people the wrong way. He's seen in the vicinity. They're having an affair. Reconciliation. Reconciliation. Two days later, she's you know wants to fucking

move to ohio with this guy she's taking sedatives during her lie detector he decides after talking to a lawyer that he should out of nowhere visit a distant relative coincidentally right after this fucking shit happens other side of the planet on the complete other side of the country on vermont west right which is what oregon is it's western vermont vermont west and oregon east same amount of weed same shit same flannel less maple you bet that's all it is baby so now brenda donna that's her name she is harman olmstead's wife okay this fucking poor woman jesus christ brenda donna is her name uh she was she is harman's wife at this time she said she learned she didn't learn about the affair that he was having with rebecca until 10 days before michael was killed so july 2nd 1985 right before fourth of july right 4th of July. So this happened.

I mean, this affair had been going on for like, you know, all this time. And then she, he finally, though, she found out about it, which might, you know, facilitate. Probably because he told her he was going to a 4th of July barbecue with this bitch. Either that or she found out about it. And that just made the wheels move on. He's like, fuck it. She knows about it now. So whatever. We don't have to hide or whatever.

once he's like fuck it she knows about it now so whatever we don't have to hide or whatever uh she uh said that harman moved out and filed for divorce within a month of michael dying oh boy so he's dead he goes to oregon comes back gets his shit leaves he's filed divorce papers he's fucking done with that house of cards fall fast quick yeah this a month before that everything was fine she's married to a nice guy with a huge cock and a beard and no mustache. Great truck. Great truck, and out of nowhere, what the fuck is going on? He's in Oregon, there's affairs, people are dead. God damn it.

We live in Vermont. What is happening? Jesus fucking Christ. I just found out you're having an affair. Now that lady's husband's dead, and three weeks later, now we're divorced. Now we're divorced. Or at least going through it. It's fucking bad shit.

My Christ. weeks later now we're divorced now we're at least going through it it's fucking bad my christ so police believe the blunt object used was either a sledgehammer handle or a railroad tie both found nearby in the parking lot okay a couple of there's all sorts of shit there's weapons everywhere there's it's it's a lumber yard next door there's a fucking wood all over the place tree branches literally make weapons it's so many weapons the earth is making weapons it's all trees it's everything's a weapon so uh uh during all this shit here uh they they uh they talked to john powell who's the owner of flanders lumber uh the lumber yard next door to the bar obviously he says that about a half hour before the killing he saw a pickup truck driving through the lumberyard in a suspicious

manner oh that's weird stopping and going and doing shit like that he said a man he couldn't identify for due to the distance and darkness got out briefly and then got back in his truck and later drove the truck out so he drove through a lumberyard getting out and doing something and then getting back in his truck i don't know picking up a piece of wood maybe something something like that finding a railroad tie yeah it's right there i thought you were gonna say flannel lumber it's a flannel lumber yard yes that's what it is it's flat flannel flannels lumber flanders flannel lumber so uh now olmsted at this point by the way in the time after the killing after michael's dead in the time where he's filing divorce papers and moving out but he's

back from oregon and all this he tells rebecca that he had quote proven himself yeah now you could take this one of two ways you could take it the way of he told his wife right and he's getting the fuck out and he proved that he's getting out of his marriage for it or you could take it as he proved himself because he stabbed her husband twice in the fucking heart and popped him on the back of the head with a piece of wood or you can take it as he proved himself because he stabbed her husband twice in the fucking heart and popped him on the back of the head with a piece of wood. Or you can take it as he proved himself because he's a mature adult who can now drive himself across the country.

That's true. And get back in one piece. I proved myself. I proved that I can book travel. You know how many shit hotels I stayed in? I found them. I proved myself. They had vacancies and I paid for the room.

I got back. No bed bugs. I had a credit card. I used it. I won. That's right. Yeah. They took an imprint, but for the room. I got back. No bed bugs. I had a credit card. I used it. I won. That's right. Yeah. They took an imprint, but they didn't fucking charge me anything.

No incidentals. You know how it goes. I don't make local calls. I'm not stupid. They did one of those rack jobs over my credit card on that fucking carbon copy paper. Yeah. I'm a man. Now, this is the weirdest thing in the whole story just because it makes no sense.

Rebecca started referring to Harmon by his attorney's name at that point which i have no idea why his attorney's name is dick gadbois which is or gadbois either one g-a-d-b-o-i-s i'm gonna go with gadbois which is the greatest name ever dick gadbois is what she's calling her boyfriend for some reason. Dick and then the noise you make whenever you spit out the wand. That's the one. Yep. Absolutely. That is amazing. She starts calling him by that.

They move in together. She's calling Harmon Dick Gadbois. Dick Gadbois. She's calling Harmon that. Harmon Olmsted. She's like, you sound too Amish. I'm calling you Dick Gadbois. That's calling Harmon that. Harmon Olmsted. She's like, you sound too Amish. I'm calling you Dick Gadbois. That sounds sexy for some reason because I'm from Vermont.

That name sounds horny. It does. Oh, boy. That's better. It's better now. What the fuck? No. Why is she?

I don't understand that. It's weird. You would think there's some sort of arrest imminent and something happening with this case nothing happens no no charges filed no nothing they move in together she moves her kids in with him yeah they start a life together she uses the money from the life insurance to buy land from harman okay so just to give it to him somehow where they build a house and move in together look at this fucking picture perfect and sometime in 1989 four years later they build a house together she moves in she's there with her children from you know the marriage there everything

they're not married though they're not they're not married at this point but they live there with him and he's this is fucking crazy she's not mrs good boy yeah she's not mrs gadbois not quite so uh uh her her they they live there in this fucking house which is insane and nothing happens everything is fine her insurance money she's got it nothing's okay she's good she got away with it if she did it and they're they're saying it's all fine until until in the early 1990s. There is a new district attorney in town. It's new prosecutor. This Sorrell guy. Well, gumshoe.

And he has things to prove. He looks into this case and he goes, how the fuck come there's no charges here? And also his family, Michael's family, is not quiet this whole time. They're like they want some somebody to fucking go down for this shit so every time they would ask the da to file some kind of charges they never did it so a new guy comes in and they're like well will you do this shit so he looks into it and uh he decides maybe he'll maybe he wants to prosecute this thing he at least wants to look into it problem here is it's an unusual case because the box containing the original investigative file was stolen from the Essex Police Department in a police station in 1987.

Stolen. It was stolen. That and some other shit, a bunch of files, property, things were stolen from the police station. Somebody broke into the evidence locker or some shit. Some shit like that. They stole all this shit. all this shit uh now the uh essex police and the state police uh reconstructed most of the file uh because they found photocopies of statements and all that shit and they reconstructed it that way tried to piece the original file back together but it's highly unusual to not have an original

investigative file going into a prosecution it's very strange so 1991 they finally arrest rebecca so they take her into custody she does get bail, which I mean, she's been out for six years. She hasn't killed anybody else. So, I mean, it's not like she's dangerous. She didn't even follow up on moving to Ohio. No, that's what I mean. She moved to Franklin or something. It's a few towns over.

She ends up being released on bail. released on bail uh she said that uh she would pledge her property that she bought from olmstead and built a house on in franklin and post ten thousand dollars cash and uh her parents were willing to pledge their property also if that was necessary and so they they released her on bail she must remain in franklin county except for court hearings where she can go back and forth so they eventually bring her to trial in 1992 nine women three men on the jury so that's good for her yeah that's that's the balance she's looking for that her lawyers are looking for uh now the opening of this trial the state's attorney the william sorrell guy we talked about opening statement man he really he really fucking lays

this down i think this might be the title of this episode here. He says, quote, envy, greed, lust, murder. Sexy. Damn. Sounds like a rap group from the 90s. Sounds like all the makings for a bestseller, a made-for-TV movie. Sometimes these things happen in true life. You're going to hear a true story with all of these things.

Now, that's perking up the fucking jury's ears. They're like, this sounds fucking great. This is going to be awesome. This is lifetime. hear a true story with all of these things now that's perking up the fucking jury's ears are like this sounds fucking great this is gonna be awesome this is lifetime if you're a jury you're like fucking let's get it on especially nine women in there like this sounds like a great fucking story that should have been like an r&b group called no offense women but you tend to like soap operas and dramatic shit otherwise they would have never been on the air because we weren't watching them so sorry i think it would have been a 90s r&b group called lifetime with all those characters all envy greed lust and murder being the name of the four people yeah those are their so uh he talks about how she cold-heartedly walked him back uh walked him back

to the to the back of the parking lot and he was saying how it was pitch black out there it was an area about 200 feet behind the bar, too. So it was a good goddamn distance she parked. And he said that Michael was attacked as he tried to unlock the door and how vicious it was and all of that. Now, physical evidence here. The Vermont's former, and a lot of these people are now retired or moved to different jobs because it's six years ago when this was going on.

They have to rely on memory and notes. Their former chief medical examiner testified. She says this. She's Dr. Eleanor McQuillan. She says that it appears to her as if two people attacked Michael, she says, the night he was killed. She says he was stabbed through the heart twice and clubbed in the back of the head twice behind the tavern. She said either knife wound could have been fatal. She said both blows to the head would have knocked him out.

She said the knife's tip in one of the wound penetrated all the way back through him into the heart. Through the heart. Through the heart that way. It went through his back and into his heart? Yeah, from the heart that way uh now it went through his back and into his heart yeah from the back they stabbed him like a like a fucking vietnam uh you know guy i've seen that in vietnam movies sneaking up behind a vietcong guy and stabbing him so he can't scream like in turner and some crazy shit i was thinking more like platoon okay well i was thinking more like willem dafoe or tom berenger and platoon but we'll take turner and hooch on

that one the ugly guy that only stabbed the old man once and he died in like, I don't know, seven seconds. Yeah, well, he's old. Because he was a military guy, too. Yeah. Well, if you stab an old guy, they have very little blood left. That's the problem. You stab an old guy, they bleed like half a cup and they're done.

That's all they got left. So that's why they have to be very careful to keep it all. Half a cup's all that's in there. They have to be very careful to keep it all in their veins at all times. little one little cut they're dead all right that's how it works so now uh this medical examiner also said that at least one of the stab wounds had to be inflicted before he was struck on the head so they're saying that he was stabbed and then struck on the head, not the other way around. Like she said, that makes it.

Yeah, he was, she was saying that, uh, that, uh, Michael had a cut on his right palm and three fingers defense wounds from the knife attack.

So he couldn't have been knocked out because he wouldn't have fucking defense wounds. Obviously it was one of the back and one of the front. She said that the injuries occurred so quickly that one person would not have been able to switch weapons before he hit the ground got it that's what she said she couldn't have been stabbing he's blocking and then they switched to another thing and hit him that would have given him an opportunity to to defend to defend himself it might have been different uh she said these injuries were inflicted while he was standing which was consistent with the way he crumpled down which was how the people found him now uh they want uh harman olmstead to tell by he's not charged by the way nothing they have

not charged him yet that's a big thing they have not charged him they want him to testify as to what that but they don't have any deal with him or he hasn't flipped they have nothing they just are calling him to testify i don't know to try to look make it look like he's lying i don't know what their strategy is he's a dipshit if he wants to participate in this well he doesn't because he doesn't show up to testify he doesn't fucking show up he goes and visits another cousin yeah he's got another cousin in new mexico he's going to visit now uh judge matthew katz agrees to give him one more day to show up or they'll put a warrant out for his arrest as a witness. The state also attempts to

at this point, the state's case, they're trying to say that her original story about the assailant's size, lack of gender, and direction they ran was all misdirection for the police so that she was trying to cover it up. They're trying to approve

there. Thursday in court. This is a Wednesday and Thursday. Wednesday. Well, instead, supposed to show up, doesn't show up Thursday. He shows up. He appears in court. He's worried about being arrested, refuses to testify. Nothing cites his constitutional rights against self-incrimination takes the fifth.

You betcha. Which is a bad sign. That's not good as well, which I mean, his lawyer might say, no matter what you take the fifth, you go up there. They're just going to, takes the fifth. You betcha. Which is a bad sign. That's not good. As well. Which, I mean, his lawyer might say, no matter what, you take the fifth. You go up there, they're just going to talk about the affair. They're going to make it look bad for you, blah, blah, blah. But still. Very seldom in history has somebody claimed the fifth and weren't guilty of some shit. Probably.

But you weren't. Well, a lot of people. Yeah. A lot of, you just don't, most murder cases, you don't fucking testify. Why would you want to testify? It's just bad for you. Now, on this, he don't fucking testify. It's just bad. It's just bad for you. On this, he's not even charged. So for him, it's like, what the fuck do I have to testify for?

He just takes the fifth. As far as I'm concerned, I wasn't even there. Yeah, that's it. Also on that day, they talk about the life insurance and all that stuff in court and how it was raised. Now, her defense, her lawyer, Peter Langrock, he's going to be involved in this to the end here. Why is everybody's name a euphemism for dicks? Langrock. Peter.

Peter. Peter Langrock, which you can kind of make Langcock also. He was probably called Peter Lang, Peter Longcock is what he goes by. For sure. That's his like screen name when he first got on. AOL. Like AOL messenger. Peter Longcock.

Yeah. That's what it is. J.D. Yeah, that's right. Peter Longcock. Yeah, that's what it is. J.D. Yeah, that's right. Peter Longcock. So Peter Longcock here tells the court that the police were more interested in arresting Rebecca than finding the people responsible for this killing. Maybe you could say that if they arrested her like that day, but they waited six years.

That's a pretty long time. They didn't seem interested in arresting anyone. No. As a nice client or anybody fucking else. They didn't seem to care about this case at all no uh he said there's no way that rebecca would kill the father of her children she said he said the lawyer long cock here said quote this is a case where the conclusion came first and the evidence came later okay long cock did acknowledge that olmstead was quote a decent suspect yeah he's a decent suspect. He's a decent suspect.

I mean, everybody saw him there. He had perfect reasoning, threatened the guy, you know, a lot of reasons. But, you know, whatever. But he said the police were without any physical evidence to link him to the scene. He said that Olmsted could be considered a suspect because he was having an affair. And that's all that was. And he'd been in a fight with him before. But he's like, you could consider that. my my client has nothing to do with that rebecca's just

the one they're fighting over and the one that she yeah nothing to do with that obviously uh so the prosecution actually does say yeah we know it's a circumstantial case but we feel like the circumstantial case is overwhelming here it's pretty fucking heavy. There was a witness who came forward, this is amazing here, to say that he knew where Olmstead was the night of the killing. So they said they had a bench conference about this.

Was his last name Johnson? Well, no. His last name was Dong, actually. It wasn't even subtle. It wasn't even subtle it wasn't even subtle his name huge his name i'm gonna go with harry but okay fine it's gonna go even less less juve or even more juvenile but whatever i'm just going with just straight up huge dong just testified big dick swinging that's his name. This is ridiculous. Apostrophe. Everything. So this witness at this point was the defendant's brother.

Okay. That's the problem here. It's her brother. So that's not a great witness. You're not getting yourself further away from the crime. Yeah. Well, police said they'd heard this rumor before and they heard that there was an alibi and all that.

But then the police uncovered substantial bank transfers from Rebecca to her brother after the killing, including a $10,000 check that said happy birthday on it. What? That's a hell of a sister. You betcha. Right, and $10,000 birthday checks in 1985. That's a lot of money in 85. That buys you a new car in 85. Absolutely. in 85 absolutely he also said that uh they they that uh state police said the birthday check was

actually for twenty thousand dollars not for the 10 that they had claimed and that the total amount over three years was for seventy thousand dollars why she wrote him seventy thousand dollars worth of birthday checks in three years that's a lot of checks that's that's like i mean you could buy a murder for that much money yeah you could buy a killing for that kind of money you could buy silence for that kind of money you could buy an alibi for that kind of money you could buy a murder for that much money. Yeah, you could. You could buy a killing for that kind of money. You could buy silence for that kind of money. You could buy an alibi for that kind of money. You could buy a Range Rover for that kind of money. You could buy a lot of things.

Back then, you might be able to get two. You could probably get two. You could get a house for that back then. For sure. A good house. So the jury has three and a half hours of deliberation only. Nine women, three men. They come back with a verdict here.

And three and a half hours. I mean, that's that's short. That's that's quick. That's quick. They come back like, oh, Jay, that was fast. And they fucking that was good for him. But this is not good for her. They find her guilty.

Oh, boy. They find her guilty of first degree murder, which is that's a bit rough. Steve, she has some sort of attack here now and needs to be taken to the hospital. She has a drama attack. She complained of chest pains, difficulty breathing, which, you know what? Yeah. So does your husband. He's got worse chest pains because he has two knife wounds in his.

But yeah, I would say if you said you're guilty of first degree murder, I think anybody would have that reaction. Probably. That seems normal. think anybody would have that reaction probably that seems normal uh so uh following this her her uh her her bail is revoked so she's ordered held because up to this point she's been out during the trial on bail the whole time uh and once she is discharged she'll have to go to the correction center by taken by by guards and all that sort of question just because i don't know anything about the judicial system or how bail works. When your bail is revoked, they just give you back your shit? Yeah, yeah.

Yeah, yeah. If you have met the criteria, they give you your cash back and your house is taken off the books. They don't hold that over you. I wonder if they keep a restocking fee or some shit. They probably should. They probably should. You put up $10,000, you get back $7,500.

There's a lot of overhead here, sorry. It's just a lot of papers. You've been in the copy room. It's just a lot of paper there. You took our lie detector. You took it, right? Gonna take a quick break from the show to tell you a little bit more about True Car. Truecar.com. What is MSRP?

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When you're ready to buy, visit True Car to enjoy a more confident car buying experience. Some features not available in all states. Yes, that's true. But go to truecar.com to find out. And now back to the show. So now sentencing comes up. Longcock here. Petereter long cock we just keep it going fuck it he's why call him langrock there's no reason we gave him the real name it's out there i'm calling him long cock it's way more fun the fuck man i we gotta have some joy in there we're talking about murders and horrible shit long cock and he's happy with it he doesn't care he'd be like

if you told him they're calling you Peter Longcock on there, he'd go, you betcha. That's pretty funny. He wouldn't care. He'd have flashbacks

to the first chat room he was in. He'd fucking know it. Like, that's right. Now, they talk about before sentencing, apparently the state,

Longcock says the state approached her to discuss her testimony possibly against Harmon, in exchange for some consideration during sentencing. Now that she's convicted, she's kind of in a vulnerable place where she might want to have a deal.

She refused, though. She said she wouldn't talk. She won't say fucking shit. What? So, yeah, she won't say a goddamn thing. Now, during sentencing, all of Michaelael uh duran lowe's family was there duran lowe's family was there her sister was there uh his sister was there his sister rachel uh read aloud in the court and that's always rough she said quote this is directly to rebecca quote we

believe you are a sick and twisted person how have you are how you have been able to live with yourself is beyond my understanding. There's no reason, no excuse in the world that could ever justify the brutal and vicious death our brother received. There isn't a prison sentence long enough that can remove the hurt our families have suffered, nor the hell that Mike went through, all because he loved you. That's rough right there as a victim impacts. All because he loved you. Ouch. So during this, before the judge gives

sentencing here she showed little emotion uh she gives a statement she said quote i have gone through the this for over seven years and i'm still going to prove my innocence until the day i die so that's not what you want to do before sentencing even though if you didn't say you didn't do it you got to stick with it i guess. Longcock said that he will appeal the murder conviction and it's total bullshit. The whole thing. I picture him like a pirate now. So Rebecca says, quote, before this case is over, we will be found not guilty of this charge, is what she says. Now, like we said, Harmon still not Olmsted, still not charged.

Still goes home. Still goes home. Now, like we said, Harmon still not Olmsted, still not charged. Still goes home. Still goes home. Now, William Sorrell, the old the the old D.A. there, he took another job since the case originally was in the year that's gone by between sentencing. He took another job. He comes back to talk to the jury about the sentencing. They jump back in the case. He says, quote, This was the epitome of a premeditated cold-blooded murder mrs duran lau is a murderer at this point she jumped up rebecca

jumped up and screamed back at him quote i am not a murderer uh which uh long cock had to hold her back and uh tell her to chill the fuck out technically hon you are calm down yeah so apparently the chief court officer had to arrange for extra security, quote, because there was, quote, so much anger and emotion through this whole trial. Apparently, 10 officers were on hand for the sentencing and everyone who showed up in the courtroom was searched. So search beforehand. The judge said that he was still in doubt that she was the driving force behind the murder. in doubt that she was the driving force behind the murder. He didn't know her role, but he did say, quote, but we do know from the evidence that we do have

a person who drove the victim a long way and positioned him at the lonely scene of death. Did it so skillfully and without any hesitation? You, ma'am, may fuck off 35 years to life in prison. She gets that.

It's a life sentence, but... She's like 42 years old, so that's a pretty good sentence there. 35 to life in prison that's steve she gets that yeah she's a life sentence yeah she's like 42 years old so that's a that's a pretty good sentence there 35 to life uh by the way harman was there for the sentencing watching that whole thing because they had been living together until the trial started and he shit everywhere all over the place it was terrible so uh uh he said the judge said that uh cats here he said he hoped the sentence would send a message to others that murdering a spouse to escape an unsatisfactory marriage carries severe consequences. The sister told the press, quote, If you hated him so much, Becky, why didn't you just get a divorce? Which that's. Yeah, you've been point.

I've been through it. It happens. It's rough. It sucks, but it's way better than killing the person. Holy shit. Because guess what? I got divorced. Now it's over.

If you kill the person, that's it forever. And especially you can't kill the parent of one of your fucking kids or two of your kids or any of that shit. That's insane. That's crazy. That's what crazy people do. I don't like them so much. It's okay that my kid doesn't have a father or a mother or whatever the fuck.

That's nuts. I'm going to likely get caught and then I'm going to remove both their parents. You don't give a shit about your kids at that point. You don't care at all. All you care about is cock. And if you don't have any kids, just fucking get divorced all day. It's so much cheaper. No one cares.

Oh, it's not going to cost anything. You can get divorced all day long. Obviously, if there's an abusive situation, there's not a difference. We're talking if everything's even. Right. Just get a fucking divorce. Even playing field, go see a lawyer. Whatever it costs you, you'll make it back.

It's so worth it. It doesn't fucking matter you'll be fine so uh the state attorney uh declined to comment on whether harman would be charged with murder yeah he's just said quote we don't consider the investigation to be closed we're obviously interested in bringing everyone to justice who is involved in the killing uh now uh the sister by the way afterwards says to the press that her brother can finally rest yeah okay now that's not the end of it by the way by a fucking long shot we have just begun to enter the crazy zone of just what the fuck is happening all the

time here might maybe for better maybe for worse we'll find out let you guys be the judge here like marriage this episode is like marriage except better because it's funny. Anyway, January of 1993, she has a hearing for a retrial based on what they talk about new evidence or evidence that was overlooked here. Now, the emotions are high. They do pat down body searches of everybody going into the court uh they said quote we had quite a problem with the families in the courtroom at the verdict and i had some concerns because we knew both sides of the family would be back it's just not for us

to be the judge it's just for everybody's safety so yeah vermont's hatfield mccoy yeah i don't know they're going to show up and kill this woman in court. So Longcock is still on the fucking scene here. Longcock is slinging that dick all over this courtroom. He says that the sledgehammer handle that was identified by prosecutors as one of the weapons used to kill Michael had been lost or destroyed before the trial began because it was six fucking years ago and they had a bunch of shit stolen. But I've got something in my pants. It's about the same size. Yeah, you can.

Harmon, can we get Harmon up to Mr. Olmstead? can you come up to the stand and slap that there you go everybody take a look at that look at that very nice uh now uh he also long cock said contended that the murder weapon might have been a railroad switch handle found at the scene of the crime rather than the sledgehammer handle that the prosecutors brought, say, was brought there by Rebecca or Michael. Those big metal things that operate. What the fuck? He's saying it could have been that or it could have been this sledgehammer handle. That thing would be crazy.

Yeah. He's saying that they brought the handle themselves, not just pick something up off the ground. He said that, quote, the entire theory of the state's case is that this was a planned killing if someone wanted to commit a homicide wouldn't they bring a weapon with them well they did have a knife that they stabbed him twice with correct even the last minute they might have been like i should clonk him on the head first and then fucking stab him probably easier i'll stab him shit he's putting his hands up let me knock him out it'll be easier to stab him whatever the fucking case is here so uh they the state obviously concedes that the weapon had been lost in the seven years uh he said this is this is kind

of a ballsy statement by the prosecutor that i don't really care for quote where there is a failure failure to preserve evidence the burden is on the defense to demonstrate bad faith that has not been done that's not true that's that's probably legally true but that's a load of shit how about the burden is on you to produce produce evidence that committed yeah if we lose shit right you know it's up to you to fucking prove we lost it i don't know it's up to you to fucking prove it's there what do i look like i'm just the guy trying to put this person in jail for fucking the rest of their life the burden of a fucking constitution the burden of proof actually it's called as a

matter of fact it's pretty clear so uh i guess in a in a and it's different in an appeal situation uh now uh he said that he was still considering charges against olmstead uh now the judge said he would rule on it in a short time and he denies it denies the hearing for a new trial so no new trial right then go back to. Go back to jail. Go back to jail, back to the hospital and then to jail. 1994 comes around, July of 1994. So now we're nine years after the killings, but she's been in jail for almost three years at this point. She wants to go to her daughter's wedding.

No. She wants to. She's seeking a legal way to go to her daughter's wedding no uh she wants to she's seeking a legal way to go to her daughter's wedding she originally wanted to go to her son's graduation and they said that she could and then what got lost in the shuffle of the bureaucracy and she never got to get out so now she's seeking to go to the wedding of her daughter i can't believe this is the shit that happens this is crazy long cock uh he says that he's worked it all out yeah uh two correctional guards have volunteered to accompany durin lao to what the fuck is she doing for these guys to volunteer from the prison to the wedding

at the american legion in uh st albans classy you know it now uh he says that uh i mean there are great establishments for veterans. Yeah, fantastic. Smoke indoors and it is fucking bring the kids. Everybody bring the kids. So the prosecutor said it isn't that simple. She said that state employees would have to be paid and they'd have to be on overtime. Longcock said that they'll pay for the employees overtime. They don't care.

They'll pay out of their pocket. They said that if the prosecutor said that if Rebecca is allowed to to attend the ceremony she would have to wear prison chains and handcuffs now long that guest at your wedding right i'm so happy for you honey great can't even clap this isn't a distraction at all this is much better than if you just weren't here you're chained to a folding chair yeah so long cock has the balls to then say that it would be a tragedy if rebecca could not attend her daughter's wedding uh the uh sister said the bigger tragedy was that michael was murdered and the real tragedy is that he's not able to walk his daughter down the aisle not that she can't come to the fucking wedding she should have been forced to carry a ball and

chain down like an old timey? We're really into cartoons. Just a real heavy one. One that says, like, 200 pounds on it. She's got to hold it and walk and waddle. Just drag it behind her. So the estate's attorney here said that releasing her to go to a fucking wedding would send the wrong message to the public that, you know, you can just get out if you have personal problems. She's not in there on murder. She's not in there on murder she's not in there on some on uh tax evasion or some shit so september 30th 1994 these there's this goes all the way to the state supreme court okay the state acknowledges here this is the this is from the this is the opinion of the

state supreme court they say the state acknowledges that the evidence against rebecca was entirely circumstantial but they contend that the prosecution proved beyond a reasonable doubt that she uh procured incited or participated in michael's murder yes that's what they say he also says they also say the state is not required to exclude every reasonable hypothesis of innocence in proving a case with circumstantial evidence. So basically, they don't have to fucking go down every rabbit hole and find why somebody else isn't guilty. They just have to look at where the evidence is pointing and do that. They do say the evidence and inferences, however, must add up to more than mere suspicion. The jury can operate evidentiary gaps with speculation which is obvious and they give several case law where and the case law they cite they're like

they're citing case law of like a guy uh a guy was uh went into a police station uh and was drunk and then left and then five minutes later he was like sleeping on the side of the road and not in his car though but his car was nearby and did would they charge him with a dui because they knew he was driving when he showed up to the police station so it's like that like could they bridge the gap from him showing up at the police station to him getting there and it's like well there's no other way the car would have got there with him so it's also a stretch in that you're comparing that to a fucking murder but it's a logic right it's a logic legal logic train is all it makes sense they also compared it to a man stealing a car and the car having the keys in it and him being found

in the woods afterwards but something happening in between and could they say that he got from there to there without the car being messed with by stupid shit? Yeah. Legal mumbo jumbo. So anyway, they say that. Now, they said that, quote, if Olmsted had lain in wait and ambushed Durenlau, the only evidence of Rebecca's participation was the fact that the reconciliation celebration had been planned in advance and that she drove and parked behind the bar. This is all evidence is what this was called.

Yeah. That they stayed only briefly and that she did not immediately direct people to the rear of the building. They're saying that's the only evidence. Without additional evidence, the jury was left to speculate that the defendant and Olmsted had orchestrated the attack. The thin evidentiary record raises considerable doubt that the defendant assisted in her husband's murder. The jury may employ rational inferences to bridge factual gaps left by circumstantial evidence.

But at some point, rational inferences leaves off and speculation begins. In this case, a guilty verdict resulted from jury conjecture and speculation supplementing a meager evidentiary record of defendant's involvement in her husband's death defendant may have been happier without her spouse and may have unwisely continued to associate with olmstead a suspected murderer but the evidence does not permit rational inferences sufficient to establish guilt beyond a reasonable doubt therefore no we reverse the conviction what and direct uh entry of a judgment of acquittal we do not readily overturn a jury's determination but this court cannot shrink from its duty to protect an individual's due process right to conviction

only by evidence of guilt beyond a reasonable doubt the evidence established that the defendant carried on an adulterous affair wanted to leave her husbandmsted, was concerned about losing her house and children, lied when she denied knowing about an increase in her husband's life insurance, and said she would be better off if her husband's dead. Knowing of the mutual hostility between Olmsted and her husband, she threatened to start sleeping with her husband again

unless Olmsted proved herself. The fatal trip to Veronica's was planned in advance and defendant drove to the tavern and parked in the back. And they go through the whole thing. Then they even talk about an individual fitting olmstead's general description and truck uh similar to hers were seen his his were seen in the area around the time of the assault rebecca failed to direct the bar bar patrons to the direct to the right spot shortly after the killing rebecca and olmstead were in regular contact and olmstead told the defendant that he had indeed, quote, proven himself.

Right. After careful review of the record, in light most favorable to the state, we conclude that a jury could not properly find the defendant guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. Justices vote 5-0 to overturn the conviction, not only overturn the conviction, but enter an acquittal. Wow. Therefore, she is free there isn't a and they even put bar the the constitution barring double jeopardy means that

she is fucking free clear done never to go out tomorrow and say i killed him like a motherfucker i stabbed him right in the face are dumb they uh they did that now long cock's got some shit to say about this of course long cock is riding high right now he's got a parrot on his shoulder he's holding his sword up in the air he changed his name to long cock he's got his yeah he's just like i am peter long cock now and everyone's gonna call me long cock or they're gonna bow down before me porn now i do not law no uh later on he says that uh the most important case he's ever been in was the Rebecca Durenlau trial. A woman accused seven years after her husband's death of hiring someone to kill him. He said even now the case makes his blood boil, makes Longcock's blood boil.

He said the polygraph tapes came up missing. The evidence file came up missing. They reconstructed bits of evidence and convicted her as an accessory before the fact she was sentenced to life the vermont supreme court found insufficient evidence and entered it in quittle uh he said quote we were able to write an injustice it's also a fun way to win so he's just fucking psyched about this as a fun way to win fun way to win well for him that he's like famous this is going to make me in this state and this case by the way is so under the radar man you cannot find shit on this case trust me i look i found it the court documents of it originally and i'm like well i need a lot more than this and the only thing i found this was newspaper archives i mean there is nothing like that's googleable it's like i have archive

sites that i'm you know pay to be a member of and shit. And that's the only way to find all of this crazy shit. We don't even get to call her a murderer anymore. No, that's what I mean. This is crazy. That is fucked up. A small town murder occurred. Now, William Sorrell,

the chief prosecutor here from back then, he's fucking pissed. Oh, I'm sure. He's super pissed. And his family is even more mad. Oh, during Laugh-Fat. Oh, boy. Dude, they were fucking livid.

They're like, this is ridiculous. They had so much security at court. They were scared that the family was going to kill her. Like, they were so fucking mad. They were making all these statements about, you know, this is, they were pissed. Oh, boy. As you can imagine. He says, his statement on this, old uh prosecutor said quote there was enough evidence

for 23 grand jurors to vote to indict her there was enough evidence for one of the state's most outstanding trial judges and there was enough evidence for 12 members of the jury the unanimous decision of 12 jurors is all for naught i feel sorry for the victim's family. No doubt. No shit. So bad stuff. Obviously, this is this whole fucking thing going on. It got botched so poorly. So badly. This got fucked up so bad. And the messed up part is and there's more, by the way. The messed up part about this whole thing is who the fuck knows.

But it's they're saying this is so weird. They're saying in the state is the defense and the state are both saying the same thing. This the defense is saying it's probably Harmon Olmsted that did it, but she had nothing to do with it. But do you think that do you think that he would kill? They seemed tight. I don't think that that he would kill her, kill her husband without her knowing about it or without her guidance and help and uh yes and approval you know how would he know that they're going to be parked in the back of a dark fucking parking lot this is what i mean if the defense is around and traced him all night this is what i

mean the defense's theory to me is more gives more evidence to her guilt right if the defense's theory was there was a stranger michael had gotten an argument with a guy at work three weeks ago, something like that, at least that's something that you could say is possible. But they're saying that this Harmon Olmsted, with no help from Rebecca, knew everything that was going on, knew when they were going to be there, knew that they'd leave after 15 minutes and half a fucking beer. Why would they abruptly leave? They didn't even finish their beers yeah like that's weird if you go to a bar and you have a beer you don't leave without finishing your beer driving 30 miles to go have a drink you'd be like i'm finishing this fucking beer like it had to be like we have to leave right now right like i don't like this place or whatever it is we have to leave right fucking now john goodman's character in the big Lebowski. I'm finishing my coffee. I'm staying.

Exactly. I get basic fucking freedoms, James. That's basic fucking freedom. No, that's what it is, man. And instead, she brought him outside. She drove there. She did all of that. The guy looking for a piece, something else to clock him with, driving around the lumber

yard. There's so much circumstantial evidence. I don't know if you convict somebody on that much circumstantial evidence. But if your fucking theory is that this other guy did it, then she was with him. Right. There's no way that he did this without her. Right. So that's that's my point. If that's the defense's theory, that's the worst, stupidest fucking theory I've ever heard.

It's fucking bananas. And sweet Pete, the whole fucking family gets no justice. No. It's the most sweet Pete fucking episode we've ever done. Well, Jesus Christ, six years go by where they get nothing. And then finally they arrest this woman for right or for wrong. The family's happy that something is wheels moving. And based on the evidence, they think it's a pretty good chance that because they didn't know about the affair and all that shit.

That all came out afterwards. The way they looked at it was, oh, they're a nice couple. And oh, no, what happened? And then they're like, wait a second. She's having an affair with this fucking guy was oh they're a nice couple and oh no what happened and then they're like wait a second she's having an affair with this fucking guy and they're planning on being whoa once the evidence started coming out they started thinking this is a different fucking person because she was at the memorial for him and they were all hugging and kissing and all that shit and oh god who could have done this and so i mean there are five years of dateline episodes that are exactly like this and the woman goes to prison with zeros i mean there are five years of dateline episodes that are exactly like this and the

woman goes to prison with zeros i mean with this is not with similar evidence and she stays and how many men go to every but we've just the gender doesn't matter here it's a matter of we've seen this is enough evidence for people to be convicted all the time and for justice i don't know if it is right but like i said if your theory is that he did it well then you did it too right don't offer a different theory if you don't want to believe that it's gone through the court system and justice served you know yeah and then the justices in their supreme court overturn it and acquittal like that's the that's the crazy part at least give the state yeah the chance to not even vacating theseating the judgment, and they could have had a retrial or whatever they could

have done without the double jeopardy deal, but they could have refiled different charges or something. Give the state the opportunity to at least make a better case then. No, this was... This is fucking bananas. They just flipped it, acquitted, no double jeopardy. I mean, they were so clear in the language of, you are free, lady. Go free and

go get all the car yeah go uh multiply be fruitful and multiply enjoy yourself yeah so uh now we go to may 1998 let's go to there may 1998 years later several years she's been out of prison for almost four years uh she is not uh rebecca durenlau anymore she She's now Becky Berard. She's going by. Okay. She's married? Apparently, she's married. Yeah. Becky Berard is her new name.

Clearly married somebody at IBM. Yeah. Oh, you know it. Yeah. With a B name, obviously. So, she's going by Becky Berard. She got a very good job at IBM. They said, you got to be Becky from now on.

All Bs around here. So, Becky Berard. She's out there may 1998 essex police say they received an emergency 911 call from a bicyclist about a domestic dispute between a man and a woman in a parked car near the west street extension uh the couple had been drinking and they were uh they were fucking basically having a drunken fight in a car at that point uh uh so uh they get they pull the cops come they pull these two fucking idiots out of the car uh becky said she had five drinks uh five drinks and was driving and was in the car

okay you can't do that that's not okay you can. You can't be in your car with the keys after you had five drinks. That's just not okay. So at that point, she tells the cop that it's okay. A friend's coming to pick me up. It's all good. I'll be fine. So about 15 minutes. So they said, okay, fine.

You guys, everything's settled down here? Everything's cool? Small towns operate. Yeah. Literally, they were like, you guys cool? Because, I mean, they weren't punching each other. They were just arguing. And so they they were like is everybody calmed down now and they're like no no we're fine now we were arguing we got over it i had five drinks we're a

little drunk and we know it it's all good friends coming to pick me up it's all straight and they were like all right you two have a good night you know just a just a fun loving married couple out having a good time gotten a little row. You know how that goes. So they just go back to their police work, hanging out until about 15 minutes later when this police officer said he spotted the 1993 sedan that she was driving, headed along Pearl Street, weaving between the two lanes.

Perfect. So the cop pulled the car over, but she didn't fucking pull over. No? She keeps driving for about a mile and a half before stopping. But she didn't speed. She just drove more. She was just like, if I just drive enough, they'll go away.

They'll get bored and leave, I think. Right? Are they flashing their blues at me? That's okay. Their headlights are so bright in my mirror. I hate when they do that. It's so fucking annoying. It's the worst.

She is just driving, so the cops are following behind her like this fucking drunken asshole. Just going to go around. I'm only going to do the speed limit. Amazing. Friends, this cop was letting you go. Could have fucking been a dick about it. Just get a friend. And didn't.

Even not at public intoxication. Nothing. Just said, good deal. Get your friend. And didn't. Even not at public intoxication. Nothing. Just said, good deal. Get your friend to drive you home. You folks have a good night. And this fucking asshole has to be a dick about it. And now next time, that cop's going to be a dick to somebody and not give them the fucking benefit. You ruined it for everybody, asshole.

This is what fucking happens. The world could be so fucking great if winks and nods could be just done by everybody. But they can't. Because some people are not an adult enough to handle a wink and a nod and do shit that you're not supposed to do but we all know it's fine yeah they have to take advantage of it and be cocks nobody's been hurt yet just get out of here that's what that's like it's like school so i used to drive me nuts in school you have a teacher who was cool and they would let people get away with little shit and you could like oh you could take an extra hall pass and then somebody would

fuck it all up and then they'd be dicks and you'd be like you motherfucker you ruined it off campus smoking a cigarette with a hall pass you ruined it jerk everybody yeah they blame the teacher when they got caught doing something well he let me out here don't tell them that we're all god damn it tell them you stole it you dipshit yeah fuck have some balls so anyway finally after about a mile and a half they stop uh and uh she ends up getting uh arrested for dwi again so this is her second so she's got two dwis and an on and off murder you bet so not bad uh this is following a report of the later on. But she ends up having another report of a little domestic dispute between her and her husband, Leon.

They love hard. Leon Berard there. She pleads innocent to having a blood alcohol level of point one five seven. So almost point one six, which is basically double the legal limit in most places. When she was driving, she has a 1979 uh dwi conviction and based on the fact that she had a previous one even though it's you know 15 17 8 20 years 19 years in the past and she has one now she's released from court from this but with orders not to buy drink or possess alcohol of any single kind anywhere okay so uh that's what happened to her that's the last

i've heard of her oh my god i cannot find her i mean i didn't really look i'm not gonna hunt this woman down on social media and be like there she is she's on twitter go fucking break her balls like we don't know what the fuck happened but jesus christ make your own fucking conclusions i mean we normally don't do cases like this we normally do a case where it's pretty clear what the fuck happened but this is a case where it's pretty clear what the fuck happened. But this is a case where it's a small town. This is some small town shit. And our man is not charged either? Never charged.

What the fuck, James? Harmon never was charged. He never sat through a significant interrogation. Nothing. Harmon just skated. He just went, I don't know, wasn't me, and went to fucking and never nothing he went to court they never made him testify they didn't force him because they could have they could have they could have forced him to testify based on like what they do with fucking the reporters that won't reveal sources hold him in contempt until he decides to testify if they

decide he's a material witness type of thing right but instead they let him plead the fifth they let him take the fifth and they fucking let him do his thing and he never forgot charge man i mean i don't know what happened with their relationship in the in the in the time clearly disintegrated disintegrated yeah it didn't didn't work out but maybe it's best we don't see each other because uh that's a problem yeah you know it's that looks bad we get together it's obviously bad murder happens so it's volatile but yeah it's so fucking strange but this is as small town as it gets they let it go for six years and they're like oh she's fine and then they end up it's so weird they convict her but it's it's it's weird and it's it's all

people are fucking and their there's life it's so weird man so many cocks in the story there's so many cocks and long cocks and yeah she's she's a dick too. Either way, I feel bad for the kids that they had. Jennifer and Jason there, they had it rough. I mean, Christ almighty. When that was going on, by the way, the trial was going on. Jennifer was 18, 17. She's in fucking high school. Imagine being a junior or senior in a small town where your mother is on trial for

murdering your dad for fucking life and that's a big deal around there through high school with her mom uh accused of murder and then convicted of it and the son went through high school also with a mom behind bars before she gets just right at the last minute there he it's it's fucking nuts the whole thing i feel bad for them they and they lost their dad and now they don't know if their mom killed their dad which is also kind of creepy when she gets out of prison is it just like my mom welcome home or is it like did you what what happened i guess you just have to just believe that it's fine i mean if the courts say that's what happened i guess that's what happened mom said she didn't do it so uh i don't know but that is essex vermont that is the clusterfuck of essex vermont

and like i said we're gonna visit vermont a couple more times uh in the near future not right away but there's a couple of bat shit crazy there's one case where literally i was like i need more than a week to research this case yeah so i have to do it another time maybe we'll do it like a special sometime or something because it's insane. Not a long one, but a special episode. It's a batshit case about a... It's crazy. So, Vermont, I don't know what you people are doing up there.

I don't know what you're putting in the syrup. We know you're fucking. You're fucking, and you are making some weird cases of murder. Sex is in the name of this town, for Pete's sake. It is. It's SX, baby. SX. That's what they were doing back in England. The Earl of Essex

was getting the fuck down with his powdered ass face. That's Essex, Vermont and that is the Durenlau tragedy with Harmon the Dick slinging fucking Olmsted and of course, Peter Longcock.

You betcha. That's our cast of characters tonight. That is Small Town Murder. If you enjoyed that show, there is something you can do to prove it you can go to itunes or apple podcast or whatever the fuck or whatever platform you listen on give us five stars tell us you're following instructions following directions it really

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Unless you're in North Dakota. Then you can't drive to Minnesota because that show's sold out around Minnesota. Come on over to Seattle or Portland. Yeah, you fuckers in Minnesota will do anything indoors in the winter. Let me tell you that shit. That shit went up. Fast. It's like it's in December, end of November or some shit.

And that was, I think it's in December. It is. It's like December 11th or some shit. It's December 17th. And it sold out in like, yeah, it sold out in like five days. Six days. Yeah. Sold the fuck out. They're like, it's going in like five days. Six days. Sold the fuck out. They're like, it's going to be freezing out.

Get tickets. They have heat in that place. I've been there. There's heat in there. So thank you, Minnesota. Heat in seats. Let's go. Oh, Minnesota, we're psyched to see you guys because you guys are so psyched for us to

come and you're buying the tickets and we love it. So get your tickets now. Do that. They're all the tour dates are on there. We have the links to all the where it's not going to overcharge you and that sort of thing if you want to be an even bigger hero you can stay on shut up and give me murder head up to the donation link and you can uh follow that link over to patreon.com slash crime in sports where you can make a donation or head over to paypal use our email address which is crime in sports at gmail.com you can make a one-time donation there

if you want to contact the show very easy at small town murder on instagram murder small on twitter and small town pod on facebook and never mind all that shit jimmy because we've told a murder yeah we've told about a crazy story we don't know what the fuck happened but you know what we do know happen you know what happened we know that a bunch of people were really fucking awesome to us and helped us keep the lights on this week and why don't you go ahead and tell me about these fine people jimmy this week's executive producers are ann spence uh jenny lynn bertolo pamela rogers devin reskinoff resnickoff i don't want to fuck that up no get it right rachel smallski yes no uh yes it's rachel yes no or smokeski i don't know well thank you so much and then ryan hagan thank you guys so much for for being absolute heroes

this week that you are our heroes amazing thank you so much amazing uh the the remainder of heroes are david clark jesse jessica lightkey, Daniel C., with no last name, just C. That's good enough. That's cool. Mariah Med here. Yvonne Abrahantes. I wanted to get that right, and I think I fucked it up. You think?

It sounded confident. I hope so. Confident never means right. No, no, not at all. But it still sounds. Everyone who, except for that one person, will think you were right. Right. Stacey Roy, Heather Rylander.

She's terrific. She helps other podcasts with their research, too. She's a good person. Thank you. Gretchen Oswald, Lorraine Tuckson. Yes. Tuckson. I think so, too.

Touch sin. Touch sin. I don't know. I don't know what I'm doing right now. Tuck skin. Yeah. Tuck skin. I don't know. Lorraine, know what I'm doing right now. Tuck skin. Yeah, tuck skin. I don't know.

Lorraine, thank you so much. Thank you, Lorraine. Rob Roberts, Cody Hargo, Jen Bass or Bass. It's probably Bass. Bass. Jesse Hartman. Again, the dude fucking comes through every week. Thank you.

That's amazing. Thank you. Jenny Edwards, Kelly Robinson, and then James Fraker, a new one that keeps showing up quite a bit. Laura Sauter, Jamie Pickle. That's for sure right. That's cool. Kelly Higby, Kate Ives, every week with her.

Her and the other Kate, I forget her last name. And Kelly too. We'll find her in a sec, yep. Kelly too, thank you. Ashley Vietri, Jillian Tuba, Wesley Thacker, Tom Kopczynski. Oh, nice. I like the name. No, it's probably not right.

No, it's a solid name. Sasha Medina, Christian Parrott, Carl Rogers, Ariana Folsom. She's fantastic. I got to talk to you about something with her, too. She's whatever. She's wonderful. Reza W. Reza?

Reza. Reza W. Yes. You won. I think so. Yeah. Maybe that's what that is. Somebody's fucking with me. Yeah. I think that's, I think they're a Cubs fan. Maybe.

Or it's a person or it's a person. And then you're now we've insulted them. Maybe race. I'm so sorry. It might be Risa, but who knows? James Lamb, uh, Shannon felt us. Uh, she's, she's been around a long time. It's hard to make fun of that last name. Yeah. At this point, we're just so happy to have you here. Kate Myers. That was the Kate, I think. Yes, that's definitely her. Kate Myers and Kate Ives have been around for several weeks, and they're fantastic.

Thank you so much. Marissa Oman Hughes. Martina Kunkel. Alisa Carlson. Joe Hung Lo. Nope. Probably not true. I would say no.

Probably fucking with me. I'm going to go with fucking with us on that one. Might be an Asian guy that's just like, you guys are dicks. Yeah, thanks a lot. Jake Labier. Iana Nelson. She's wonderful in New Orleans. She's terrific. She's like a fucking bookworm that does legislation work

or something like that. She's great. She's wonderful. Awesome. John Bowden. And that may be Bowden, but Bobby Bowden fucked your name, brother. Sorry. Lauren, Lauren Demerath, Alexander Golemus. Yeah. Lauren Demerath is the one from Chicago that her name sounds like a drug.

Yeah. Yeah. Demerath. She messaged me and was like, I get to be a drug. 20 CC's of Demerath. She's jacked about it. Stat. Alexander Golemus.

Golem is. Golemus. Golemus. There you go. Azra Begovich. Under the Sea Fabrics. They're the best, too. Thank you. Bunny Blush. I think that's some sort of product, too. Okay.

Do you put blush on your bunny? It's probably a person. I would assume. It's blush that's been experimented on with a bunny. Kelly Miller. Crystal Gennaro. She's the one that's a fucking air traffic control yes she's cool thank you danielle graham jenna jenna fairbanks jason hamming donated twice one on patreon one on paypal thank you thank you uh jamie finch cj james is a butterfly what the

fuck why would you do that i don't know james is handsome as fuck man have you seen my friend i don't cj come to a live show and say that to his face. He won't do it. I guarantee CJ might be huge. I might start a fight right now. That's all right. CJ. I don't care.

James is handsome. Fuck you. Matthew Dietrich. Maybe his last name is James. It's definitely. Maybe. Maybe he's the butterface. CJ James is the butterface.

Maybe that's what he said. I have no idea. I doubt it. He's being a dick, this CJ. Aaron Butterface. C.J. James is the Butterface. Maybe that's what he said. I have no idea. I doubt it. He's being a dick, this C.J. Aaron Anderson, Ellie Guzman, Bryant Toole, Amanda McKelvey, Jess with no last name, Jessica Manor, Janice Hill, Karen Farnsworth, Teresa Gouland, Jason, no, it's Joshua. That is Joshua, not Jason. Joshua Doyle, Jessica Dowd, Kiko, Omar White, J.D.

Oh, that dude's a lawyer. Thank you, Kiko. Thank you. That might be a woman. No, it's Omar White, JD. Oh, that dude's a lawyer. Thank you, Kiko. Thank you. That might be a woman. No, it's Omar, middle name. Okay, yeah. Who knows? That might be a wire reference.

I don't even know anymore. That's the thing. This is fucking crazy. Jesus, it's gotten out of control. Michelle Smith, Mike Gibson, Justin Suter. Yes, Justin Suter. Nicky Eddie. No, Nick Eddie.

Vida Muerta, who is a cosplayer and model i don't cool good for you vita um what is that vita is what word i don't know what that is in spanish i just know muerta is death which is fucking creepy i don't christopher brooks i think vita's life is that it life life and death boom you nailed it my man yeah i know italian so i can get a spanish word if you talk slowly yeah becky pantuso which sounds like underwear leah maddox uh rebecca doe charlene ramler uh melissa roker uh damian palmer uh fuck how did i do this candace kennedy and mckay mckayla Michaela, hmm, Thiviergy. No, it's not right. Michaela, I'm so sorry. We tried.

I even fucking put somebody else's name in between it so that I could try and get a good running start at it, like Evel Knievel. A little sorbet on the palate there. And I still hit the bus. God damn it. I'm so sorry. And thank you guys so much. We love you. Thank you, folks, so much.

You're amazing. You are amazing. You really, really, really make this a thing. You make this worthwhile. With all the frustrations we have and we bitch about once in a while on the business end and being young Motown singers turned upside down and having the chain shaken from our pot. Yeah.

One thing stays the same. You guys keep us afloat. You keep us our heads above water. You literally, quite literally keep the lights on and the mics fucking hot. And we appreciate that. You guys jam cash in our socks so they can't shake that out of our pockets. You do. And it's fucking great.

And we fucking appreciate the hell out of it. So thank you, everybody, for everything that you do for us. Always your donations. You're talking about us. Anything you can do to help us, we appreciate it. And what if they wanted to help you, Jimmy? What if you were in need? How could they get a hold of you? You can find me at WismanSucks,

W-H-I-S-M-A-N Sucks, on Twitter, Instagram, and Snapchat. You guys telling us everything about your lives and involving yourselves in this is what makes this special to me. So thank you guys so much. And happy birthday, Amy Pohanek. Oh, yeah, Amy. This week coming up. Happy birthday. It's a few days away, but whatever. Happy birthday, Amy. We'll see you in Denver. Definitely we'll see week coming up. Happy birthday. It's a few days away, but whatever. Happy birthday, Amy.

We'll see you in Denver. Definitely we'll see you in Denver. Thank you. What about you? You can find me at Jimmy P is funny. Find me over there and say hello. And I seriously love that you guys say nice things or say anything at all and give a shit to come hang out with us and everything like that.

Thank you guys so much, really. We are we're pricks and we're assholes and we know that for a fact, but we actually really do like you guys and we really do appreciate that you want to hang out with us. So thank you so, so much. You guys alert us to so many things that we didn't know about like the list from BuzzFeed.

The things that you guys send to us are heads up enough for us to actually feel good about ourselves and it feels like we're doing something here, and it's because of you. Yeah, and thank you to all the English folks out there who gave us soccer teams to root for. I love Liverpool. We appreciate that. I guess I'm a Chelsea guy now.

They sent, Andrew Bailey convinced me. He sent me pictures of the uniforms and everything. He's like, the tall dude looks sharp in this shit. I'm like, all right. Because it's like a royal blue, and half my He's like, the tall dude looks sharp in this shit. I'm like, alright. Because it's like a royal blue. Half my shit's like royal blue. Liverpool's very maroon, but it's got a nice teal

around it. I saw. It's pretty dope. That's dope, too. But I'm going to go with Chelsea, I feel like. I might change my mind. I'm not locked in in Chelsea yet. I'm going to have to look into them a little bit. You might like Juventus also, because they've got that Ronaldo fella. I'm going to go over an English team. Is that an English team?

Italian? I think it's Italian. I got to go into the English team right now because that's what everybody follows. And the other shit I can do on the side. I'm running with Liverpool because I hate the fucking Beatles. And it feels good to support something from that fucking town. I got you. I got you.

Yeah, I'm trying. If you have a better team, I think people have been trying to. Everton is one they keep suggesting to me also. So I have to look into Everton. But as of. Yeah, I'm trying. If you have a better team, I think people have been trying to Everton is one they keep suggesting to me also. So I have to look into Everton. But as of right now, I'm supporting Chelsea and I'm going to learn their songs and I'm going to go fucking kick someone in the head for no reason just because they like the other team.

I'm sure Liverpool is a Beatles song. Jimmy, watch out. Whatever their fight song is. As soon as I hit stop on this, I'm kicking you out of your chair. So watch out, you Liverpool motherfucker. With that said, everybody, until next week, it's been our pleasure. Bye. Hey, Prime members, you can listen to Small Town Murder early and ad-free on Amazon Music. Download the Amazon Music app today.

Or you can listen early and ad-free with Wondery Plus and Apple Podcasts. Before you go, tell us about yourself by completing a short survey at wondery.com slash survey. completing a short survey at wondery.com slash survey. I understand that anybody who's paid attention to the media would have to come to the conclusion that I killed my wife. Hi, my name is Zach Stewart-Pontier. I'm one of the filmmakers behind The Jinx, and I'm excited to bring you the official Jinx podcast. We'll be revisiting all six episodes of part one and watching along with part two as it airs on max starting April 21st. Bye bye. The official jinx podcast. Listen on max or wherever you get your podcasts.