Small Town Murder - A Web Of Deceit, Sex & Murder - Keeling, Virginia

Episode Date: September 17, 2026

This week, in Keeling, Virginia, a bloodbath, with two butchered people, and some ominous last words lead to one of the craziest murder conspiracies, ever. A bagged lunch, in the victim's fridge is one headscratching clue, with several more that only make sense if one particular murder scenario happened.  These strange clues lead to an unlikely pair of planners, and their recruited team of losers & screwballs, with murder on their minds!!   Along the way, we find out that you can base a small town festival on yarn, that your coworkers apparently pay close attention to your lunch choices, and that killing one person, so that another person will go to the funeral, so you can kill that second person is diabolical & crazy!!   New episodes, every Wednesday & Friday nights!! Check us out on VIDEO Wednesday and Friday evenings on Netflix! www.netflix.com/smalltownmurder Go to shutupandgivememurder.com for all things Small Town Murder, Crime In Sports & Your Stupid Opinions!   Follow us on... instagram.com/smalltownmurder facebook.com/smalltownpod   Also, check out James & Jimmie's other shows, Crime In Sports & Your Stupid Opinions on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to podcasts!!

This week, in Keeling, Virginia, a bloodbath with two butchered people and some ominous last words lead to one of the craziest murder conspiracies ever with an unlikely pair of planners and their recruited team of losers and screwballs. Welcome to Small Town Murder. Hello, everybody, and welcome back to Small Town Murder. Yay! Yay, indeed. Yay, indeed. My name is James Petrigal. I'm here with my co-host.

I'm Jimmy Wiseman. Thank you folks so much for joining us today on another crazy, crazy episode of Small Town Murder. We have another just really wild twisted onions and layers and all sorts of things coming apart here. So going to be wild stuff. Before we get to that, though, absolutely. Head over to Shut Up and Give Me Murder.com. Get your tickets for live shows, everybody. Hurry up.

Yeah. We're coming up this weekend. If you're listening to this one, it's coming out. September the 18th, Milwaukee at the Papps. Not sure if any tickets are left for that. We released the rest of ours. We don't know. September 19th, though, the next night, state theater, we know there's tickets left for that.

So get your tickets and be there. Come and see us. Yeah, get in there. And then Dallas on October 3rd, tickets available there. San Jose, October 16th, October 17th, Sacramento. November 13th, Terrytown, just about sold out, everybody. So last minute, if you want to get the last few of those tickets. And then the next night, November 14th, outside of Boston and Medford.

get your tickets for that as well. So do that right now. Shut up and give me murder.com. Also, check out our other shows, crime in sports, which we promise you you don't have to like sports. We swear, you just have to like funny stories about people who screwed everything up and didn't really have to, just unnecessary,

unforced errors, which is fun. And then your stupid opinions, oh my God, we love, want to hear people complain about Glacier National Park? Go ahead. Yeah, not enough bears, too much bears. That's how we get it. It's crazy stuff. It's so much fun.

And then get yourself Patreon as well. That's huge. Patreon.com slash crime in sports, just like the name of that show you should listen to there. And that, anybody, $5 a month or above, you get everything we put out. Everything. Everything we put out.

As soon as you subscribe, you're going to get almost 400 back bonus episodes. You've never heard before. Boom, right away. And then you get new ones every other week. One crime in sports and one small town. murder and you get them all, everybody, every last damn drop of them. This week is no different, which you're going to get this week.

For crime and sports, we're going to talk about lawn chair Larry. What a guy. Sounds like a failed UFC fighter. Like, it's a nickname. Lawnchair Larry Brooks or something. But no, it's a guy in the 30s and 40s who tried to make an aerial device from a lawn chair. And it's, you can imagine how that worked out. It's pretty crazy.

Then for small town murder, Donner Party, Part 2. It's getting cold and they're getting hungry, everybody. It's about to happen. Sharpen up your knives and forks and bring all the salt and pepper you can muster because it's going to be wild stuff there. Patreon.com slash crime in sports is where you get all that and more. And that more is, in addition to all that, you also get all the shows we put out. Crime and Sports, your stupid opinion, small-time murder, all add free with your Patreon.

Add-free. Add-free. And in addition to that, you also get a shout-out at the end of the show where, don't you worry, Jimmy, you'll mess your name all up for you. It's everything you can get for five bucks. Come on. What more do you want? It's a cup of coffee, everybody. So do that. Patreon.com slash crime and sports. That said, disclaimer time. It's a comedy show, everybody. This is a comedy show. That means nothing as far as the realness of the story goes. This is 1,000% real. We wish we were making this stuff up. I would be Stephen King if I could make up 735 of these stories. That's insane. So trust me, every last drop of it. is real and well research, but it's also funny.

And you go, how does that work? That sounds kind of creepy. Well, it's not. All you have to do, we figured it out. There's a formula. All you have to do is we never make fun of the victims or the victim's families. That's it. You know why that is?

Because we're assholes. But we're not scumbags. That's pretty simple, I think, right there. There's plenty of other stuff to make fun of. We make fun of small towns because we're all from somewhere that deserves we made fun of. Who cares? It's just fun. It's all in good fun.

Some bumbling police force doesn't do their job and let's a murderer wander free and kill more people. That's deserving of mockery. Certainly. We make fun of murderers because fuck them. What do we have to do? We don't know what we're doing. We can't go take the ramen away from them.

It's the only recourse we have, though. But, you know, so if that sounds good to you, you're going to hear a wild story. Pull up a lawn chair, Larry. Let's go, Larry. If you think that true crime and comedy should never, ever go together, then maybe we're not for you. Or maybe we are.

Give it a chance. Either way, No complaining later. That's what we want to say here. That said, I think it's time everybody to sit back. What do you say? Clear the lungs here. One of those.

And let's all shout. Shut up and give me murder. Let's do this, everybody. All right. Let's go on a trip, shall we? Yeah. We're doing it. We're going to Virginia this week.

All right. My goodness, Keeling Virginia. K-E-E-L-I-N-G. Keeling Virginia. It's in southern Virginia, way southern Virginia, right in the central part. So it's right in the meat of Virginia. This is kind of the middle of nowhere here.

There's not really close to anything. It's about an hour and 45 minutes to Raleigh, North Carolina. It seems to be about the closest big place. About three and a half hours to Norfolk, Virginia. And four and a half hours to our last Virginia episode in Pound, Virginia, episode 688, A Mystery of Stupidity. Whole Pound Town.

Going to Pound Town. Yeah, we made a lot of those jokes. Sure. This is in Pizzlvania County. Pittsburgh. Pennsylvania. Pennsylvania, but Pitt, P-I-T-T. Which.

Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. Seems like that's the name that. Pittsburgh, all the people in Pittsburgh were like, damn it. So close. We could have done that. We'd have been, fuck, we blew it. That's so much easier.

So much easier. Area code. 434. A little bit of history. Keeling was named for James C. Keeling, who owned a store in the location of the town and was also the first postmaster. A lot of towns named after railroad executives and the first postmaster. And just a dude that worked for the railroad. Yeah. Yeah. The postmaster really seemed to be like a big deal back then, I guess, because that's the only way communication happened in the, you know, early 1800s. There's no telegrams. Kevin Costner made a movie about it.

That's the whole thing. Yeah, going back to day one there. So it became, I guess that's a big deal. He's the center of the town. He knows everybody. He was the son of Thomas and Margaret Keeling who were born in Ireland. And these people were prominent in this area and all that kind of thing. They were in Danville, the family ended up being big, which is Danville's about 20 minutes away from here.

Here's some history of the town. And we're going to talk about this on a Patreon for Crime and Sports one of these. days. On August 28th, 2019, three people were found shot to death in a house on Keeling Drive. Fuck? Yeah, they found basically this guy shot his mother, his sister, and his nephew, who was a year old. Okay? What? Yes. Now, the suspect, 18-year-old Matthew Bernard was arrested after a chase during which he was running around buck naked during the chase. He's running through the streets naked after slaughtering three people. Now, the 25-year-old woman killed was married at the time to a Tampa Bay raise pitcher.

Oh. In their system, a minor league pitcher named Blake Bivens, who was the father of the deceased child and this lady's husband. Yeah, that's tough. Now, here's some reviews. There's no reviews for the town, but this is for Pennsylvania County. Yeah. So I assume it's probably pretty steady across the county here. Has 3.2 stars on Nitch out of 69 reviews.

That is not good. It's doing great. That's not good. Let's do if positive. Here's five stars. It's a common peaceful area to live. Very family friendly area to raise your kids. Yeah.

That's it. Okay. Peaceful. Here's three. There's nothing in this town. It's all just land. The only thing you can really do is go bowling and go bowling and go. to the movies and the people here are all nosy and racist.

All of them. Jesus. Nosey and racist. That's what is that? What do you got in there? Black guy? What's going on? Who you having?

Mexicans over for dinner? I'm nosy and racist. Does smell enchiladas? What's going on in there? Yeah. And here's three stars. I personally was born and raised here. Personally.

Good. If you said I was born and raised here, I'd go, Personally born and raised here. Oh, man. I familiar. I familiar with every corner or hangout spot. I love this area and wish to bring success back to this area. He's going to bring it back all on his own.

The future for the area does not look very good. People always say to get out while you can. Oh, that's, it's one of those towns where people go get out while you can. They tell out to like 16-year-olds or like, you know, ominously and shit. Well, they sit on the hood of a firebird drinking some fucking malt liquor. Get out while you can, boy. You don't want to be like me, boy.

Just welding scars all over him going, don't run from this town, boy. Black soot that doesn't wash off. Let's see, but I would prefer to come back and make it an even better area than it already is to me. Oh, personally. He's going to come back and improve the area. Here's two stars. Crimes are getting worse here in Danville, Virginia. that's very close by.

This area was one of the first areas discovered in the new world many years ago. No. No, wasn't? Danville, Virginia is not one of the first. No. How far down the list of new places is this? There's Plymouth Rock and Danville, Virginia. There's just those two.

One and then two. Let's see. This town has a lot of history behind it. We just gave it to. It's a guy with a post office and a devil-raised pictures. There's not a ton. But instead of blooming, crimes seem to be getting worse. Shootings keep happening.

Drug busts slash cells and robberies. Sales is what they were going for. And then finally, two stars, and this is relevant to our story. That's why I put it in here. When my son had an accident, it took the ambulance 45 minutes to get to the scene because they were lost and didn't know how to get here. Ah! On your fire department. You don't even have one.

Not that nosy. What's the cross streets again? It's very rural and I think that's part of it. There's some areas where they're like, where the hell is that? I don't know. They have to get out of the mapbook. We can't put a mile marker into Google. Yeah, to a dirt holler that goes up somewhere.

So anyway, people in this town, population, and this is for the zip code of 24566. So this is more than just the town proper. 1,200 people in that zip code. Now, by the way, they say this is from Spurling's best places, which is a website that has stats and all that kind of thing. They give like a little breakdown of the town just in terms of, you know, it's this, it's that. They said, located in Pennsylvania County, Virginia, it offers visitors and locals alike plenty to do. The county is home to several local businesses, including Davis's store, Lee's Hardware, and Miller's Pharmacy.

And then they go on to some, that's what there is to do. Go to Davis's store. Head on over to Miller's Pharmacy. Do that. And the stats are weird here. The men, women break down. It is 59% women here. Wow.

That's, are they killing all the men? What's happening? How is that possible? I don't get it. That is, that's a lot. That's like World War II. There were stats like that because all the men were overseas. This makes no sense.

That never happened on this show before that high. Never, never, especially for 1,200 people. It makes no sense. Median age here, 48.1, it's about 10 years older than the national average. Everybody here is married. I don't know how because apparently every man here must be married because it's about 59% married people here. Okay. So they must all be married.

There's about average single with children. Race in this town, it is 71% white, 29% black. That's it. That's it. That's it. The Chinese food must be terrible in this town, I bet. Just awful. God damn terrible.

That is, that's never happened either. I'm telling you, this place is anachronism or whatever the hell here. Okay. 36.9% of the people here are religious. All right. And that is, we're going to take a guess of what that is, you think. It's Baptist. Yes.

22 and a half percent Baptist. and no one else cracks 6%. So that's it. It's just just Baptists here. It is 0.0% Catholic, 0.0% Lutheran and all that. It's pretty there. What a weird town.

It's a weird town. Unemployment here, a little bit low, a little bit under the national average. Median household income of this place, not terrible. 65,000, 95,000, 956, which is in the ballpark of the national average, within five grand of it.

Now, cost of living, 100 is regular, average here at 79. So pretty affordable. And the housing is the super low thing. Median home cost here, $135,000. That is not bad if you can pull in $65 grand a year and your home's $135 grand. You're doing pretty well. I mean, with the amount of women here, that's about right. That's about the pay scale gap in it. Yeah, seems like it. So if we've convinced you, damn it, you must see what's going on in Keeling, go to Davis's store or whatever it is, we have for you the Keeling Virginia real estate report.

Average two-bedroom rental here goes for, this is, we haven't heard these numbers in a while, $790. Oh, what dream. It's almost 1,500 in the rest of the country. So that is, it's almost half here. Why own when you can rent for that? That's what I mean. Well, here is a three-bedroom, two-bath, 1,404 square foot house.

It is on... That's your starter. It's on 5.23 acres. And it is currently going up for auction and under foreclosure. Wow. The estimated auction price for this is $150,200. It'll be lower than that. The problem is it says this property is being sold as is and the occupancy status is assumed to be occupied.

Buyer takes all responsibility. So you got to find, you got to then rouse these people. people from their home. You got to get a hold of a constable after you win this auction. And then good luck, because it's like the middle of nowhere, Virginia. They're probably going to set up. Oh, they got rifles. There's going to be shit coming from the trees and this. This is like, no one's coming to get my land. This is, they nick the census man. Yeah, we got him last year. Here's a damn Tennessee Valley Authority. Ain't going to give me electricity. Here's a three-bedroom, one bath, 960 square foot. It's all redone on the inside. It's on the inside. It's on.

on 0.76 acres, but very small. $189,000. I don't think that's going to sell for that. No, that's going to drop. And then here you go. Four bedrooms, three bats, 3,65 square feet. It's a big brick house.

Looks new. It has like a triple carport, which I don't think I've seen before. Like all brick and stuff. No, interesting. No doors? No doors. It's all open with a roof and some pillars.

A brick. 78.45 acres. This is $2 million. Shit, look. $800,000 with a $50,000 price cut that just happened. Holy.

Please come take half of Virginia. It's free, basically. Not free. 800,000 is a lot of money, but 78 acres is crazy for $800,000. And then with a big house on it, that's wild. Things to do here,

Yarnival 6. What fuck is that? Well, they are, They're celebrating music and yarn and arts. Oh, yeah. Don't fucking besmirch the yarn, James. No, not at all. They're celebrating.

Oh, yeah, Jimmy got some shit for saying. Don't wait on those waters. Making a joke about yarn. The yarn ladies, tell you what, while you're knitting, you got a lot of time to type too. And strong thumbs. Yeah, it's strong thumbs to type with. No, I really feel like that's the problem. I feel like when people would complain back in the day,

and this is not the yarn people, anybody. They'd have to get paper out. Yeah. And, like, address something. And it would cost the money. They'd have to put a stamp on it. Halfway through that, you're like, this isn't worth it. Who cares?

Whereas now it's like, I heard something. Even if you don't think of five minutes later. You'd have to go find the phone number somehow. Get it. Find it. Then wait on hold. Who's doing that? So Yarnival says we will continue to feature whatever kind of music we feel like

alongside our feature of alternative forms of entertainment, i.e. magic, carnival acts, circus performers, etc. You won't be seeing any super, quote, big names at our festival, but you will be seeing talent that's equal to or even greater than said big names. I don't believe you. Come on. Most likely, some will even go on to become big names.

The difference between a band that draws 100 people every night and 10,000 people every night is a tiny speck of dust. No, it really isn't. It's a big chasm. That felt aggressive, the words that they just used. They're angry at people. We offered money to the big names, but they won't play here, so we're not good enough for you. It feels like these people have heard that there's a small podcast that makes fun of small festivals.

Well, albeit magic dust, but just a little dust, nonetheless. By the way, the bands that we've talked about have the best sense of humor of anybody. And some of the best merch. And they all, to a tea, we've never gotten an angry message from a band. They're always like, thank you for mentioning our name. That's great. They send us shit, even though we were making fun of them. They're great people.

Music here, yarn times three will be here. Okay. North Mississippi All-Stars. Danger muffin will be in town. That sounds awesome. Sneasy, just sneezy, without the rest of it. of the dwarfs. No talk or anybody.

None of that shit. Dale. He went out on his own. He's all on his own. Sneezy broke out solo. You know what I mean? Tired of dope. He's shit.

Sneezy's like Stevie Nix. He's like, listen, I got my got hits in me. I don't need. I got the talent. I don't need Lindsay Buckingham for this shit, okay? Dale and the Z-dubs, pressing strings, the Haley Jane band, Scott Tornet, Big Daddy Love. Oh my God.

James Justin. and company. Fancy Gap. Then there's going to be a bunch of... Fancy Gap and Danger Muffin. That's what I mean. A muffin. At least it wasn't Danger Muffin Gap. That would have been awesome. Nightly Campfire Jams.

There's a contortionist. There's all sorts of mystics and acrobats and shit like that. So get in there. What we're interested in, crime rate in this town. Property crime, exactly average. Like exactly average. Really? Exactly.

violent crime, murder rape robbery, and of course, assault. The Mount Rushmore of crime is about one third above the average. What? Yes. I don't know how. Danger muffin. Danger muffins in town. They raise the crime rate.

I don't know what's going. Especially with a town of 59% women. Violent makes no sense. I don't know. These are some bad bitches, James. Either that or this 41% is like it was a prison camp and they just dumped all the men into here. I don't know how this works. That said, that's a.

Let's talk about some murder here. Here we go. All right. Let's go back in time just a bit, quite a bit, actually, about 24 years. We're going to go back to October 30th, 2002. So think about that. Everybody's got a landline. Yeah.

You probably have a cell phone, but it doesn't do shit. I mean, it does nothing but call people. And if you're really cutting edge right now, if you sheld out for the new LG, maybe take a very pixelated, terrible picture. That's about the only things this phone is doing. Do you remember the T-Mobile phones that had T-Zones Internet? It was the fucking worst. I can remember even as late as like 2005 or six. Like if you wanted to check your email on your phone, it was, you better settle in for a while.

It's going to be a minute. Good luck. It'll be a while for it to populate. Oh, yeah. It is going to take a while. Then you get it on. Then you want to click on one. That's another 20 minutes.

Good. Enjoy that. So this is October 30th, 2002, at 4th. 4.18 a.m. So late night, early morning. Early times. Pennsylvania County Sheriff's deputies are called to and walk into a trailer on five acres off loop road and keeling. It's actually on loop road.

It's not off loop road. Now, the woman who meets them at the front door tells them, my husband is on the floor in the master bedroom and my stepson is in the other bedroom. And they're both dead. Oh. So go collect them. basically. Bless men. Bless, yeah.

So her husband is Julian Clifton, Lewis Jr. He was born January 1st, 1951. He's currently, before he's in the condition he's in now, an electrician at the Dan River Mill. So he works at a mill. So the deputy here goes into the master bedroom and finds Julian not dead, but alive, actually. Oh. So he is alive.

he's been shot repeatedly with a shotgun. I mean, he is in pieces, this guy, somehow staying alive. A bunch of shots. A bunch of shots. He was making what they described as slow moans. He was just moaning, wailing. He's in pain. It's the end, yeah.

And he kept saying one word over and over and over and over again, which dying people do seem to do sometimes here. He just kept saying, baby, baby, baby, baby, baby, over again. That's the only word he would utter. So the deputy leans down and asks him his name and he gives it. He says Julian. Yeah. So they asked him, do you know who shot him? Do you know who shot you?

Do you know who did this to you? Who did this? And all he'll get out, this is, and then he'll literally die minutes later. The only thing he can get out is he says, my wife knows who done this to me. Oh, boy. So ask her, basically. I can't get word. She knows.

Just talk to her. Yeah, I got a proxy. Yeah, I'm going to go ahead and die now. So I've seen danger, Muffet, and I've done it all. It's time for me to go. So this poor guy, he dies without ever saying anything else. That's the last thing, his last words were my wife knows who done this to me, which is pretty, that's set in the scene here. So the deputies are trying to help him, and Deputy Webb hears this wife on the phone in another room.

And he writes down what he hears her say on the phone. She says, I told CJ about leaving that back door unlocked. That's what she says. Now, CJ is the stepson. He's 25 years old. And they do find him dead in the next room shot five times with a shotgun as well. Both shot a lot. Yes, both shot a lot.

I mean, this is someone... She's left alone. Making sure, and she's there. So now there's other interesting things about this scene. Number one, the family has a pit bull, which are pretty protective dogs if you want to, you know, generally protective. They've got a reputation for being a good watchdog. Even if they're not an aggressive dog, because my mother-in-law's pit bulls are wonderful. I love them.

They're sweet as shit. But if someone tries to break in, they're going to bite the fuck out of that person. It's the kind of dog they are. It's the reason people have them. on junkyard properties, pawn shops, shit like that. Yeah, they're tough. But the dog is found locked in the middle

bedroom. So the dog had no chance to intervene here, apparently. Dogs locked in. I wonder if it's like my cat that goes in the bathroom and then accidentally closes the door and then can't get out. Yeah. My drive has taken to doing that in the laundry room.

I guess you call it your mudroom. It's the interim between the garage and the house. He follows me out there when I leave and then locks himself in and then he's fucked for however long. We've looked for Benny, who's a 140-pound Connie Corso. We've looked for him all over the house and found him just sitting in a, sitting behind a bathroom door, just, thirsty and tired. Been in here a while. Yeah, I've just been in there. We're like, where were you? He's quiet anyway, so.

Why'd you do this to yourself? He's so quiet. So if he's missing for a minute, you don't notice. Yeah. So anyway, in the fridge, there is a bagged lunch. Okay, brown paper bag with lunch inside. Ready to go. And it says on it, I love you. I hope you have a good day. And also on the bag is a smiley face drawn. And inside the smiley face, it says, I miss you when you're gone.

Wow. All right. I'm so jealous of that. Yeah, that's nice. Well, yeah. Now, I never even got that from my mom. No, God, no. No, I'm going to throw a dollar at me and be like this.

$1.15. They got pizza rolls, don't they? Get 15 out of the can. Yeah. We had a can of change. That's it. Now, Julian, the medical examiner, determines that Julian died of extensive blood loss,

but it took him over an hour to die, they figured out, 45 minutes to an hour to die. So he has been there a while, okay? A while. Shot. Shot. And been there a while.

So, like, he may have been able to, be saved if he had been gotten medical attention an hour earlier. So let's find out about this family a little bit here. By the way, the son CJ, is Charles James Lewis. He is born April 16th, 1977.

25 years old at this point. It goes by CJ. He was born at Fort Campbell, Kentucky. Yeah? So anyway, now the wife is the person who was at the, received the police officers and said where they were. This is Teresa.

Michelle Wilson Bean Lewis. Oh, boy. Those are all her name. Born Michelle Wilson, first husband is Bean, and then there's Lewis here. So those are all her names. She's born in Danville, Virginia, born to two textile mill workers,

textile mill workers, her parents, very poor family growing up. This is just stuck, you know what I mean? You can never, this is paycheck to paycheck. If the mill closes, we're in real trouble. Right. And we don't have enough money to do anything else or go anywhere or get out of here, just enough money to survive to the next paycheck. So it's tough.

That is really brutal when, like, you get your, you're sewing your buttons on a shirt job at 16. Yeah. And then you just do that for 40 years. Or do that for 20 years and then the mill closes. And then you got nothing. Nothing. You have a lot of button sewing experience and nothing else. And there's nowhere to work now.

So that's, it's brutal, man. It's brutal. So her father was Melvin Wilson, Sr., and her mother's name was Dolores. Dolores became something happened to her, and they said she became an invalid. She couldn't move. She couldn't do things. And so Teresa took care of her. Teresa sang in the church as a girl.

She is – everybody says she has a very good voice, very good singing voice. She also, as this will come out later, has an IQ of about 72. Oh. That's exactly Forrest Gump. I think he was exactly 72. He did great. He did fantastic. And we all know most people of his intelligence thrive and become multi-millionaires.

World famous multi-millionaires who are very good at running businesses also. Excellent business people. So at 16, everybody says, and this is, we'll talk about this later, but that she dropped out of school at 16 and married a young man named Billy Bean. not Billy Bean the money ball Brad Pitt character yeah exactly Billy Wayne Bean Jr

seems like they had a son and they had a daughter so they have a son and a daughter Christy Lynn Bean is the daughter she'll come up the son doesn't really he's not really around now she's going to end up getting a divorce from Billy Bean

Billy Wayne Billy Wayne and basically from then on kind of gets into painkillers and booze, Teresa does, after the divorce. Not great. Now, her mother-in-law from that marriage was Marie Bean, and she described Teresa Lewis about as succinctly as a human being can sum somebody up. So what do you think of Teresa? She said, quote, not right.

Two words. You know exactly what she's talking about. It's so succinct. That's amazing. She ain't right. Not right. All right. Well, I think you know what that means.

No further explanation necessary. Wrong? It's wrong. For everyone. Yeah. For everybody and everything. Now, Teresa's own dad said that her daughter had run off to get married when she was 16, but then later abandoned her children to run off with her sister's husband.

This is before the Lewis, she was married to Julian Lewis. and all that. She abandoned both her little kids to run off with her sister's husband. You know what I would say, how I would describe that? Not right. Not right.

That ain't right there. That ain't right. Did she leave those kids with Billy Wayne? Or did she... With the parents, it seems like. With the grandparents. Yeah, her parents. Just dumped them off.

Which is 16-year-olds a lot of times. Well, my parents take care of everything else I do. Here, we'll dump them off. So between the divorce, in the mid-90s and the year 2000, Teresa worked every low-paying job in the county, basically. If there's a job that needs no experience and is minimum wage entry,

she's done it for a while here. She could never hold a job, really, and she would kind of drift around a bit here. But she always had a job. She was always getting another job than always doing something. So that's better than just doing nothing. in 2000 she began working at the Dan River textile mill

where she met a guy named Julian Lewis Julian is a recent widower and has three children or Julian so Julian Lewis Jr., who we know about from his dying last words of his master bedroom floor there he's born in Danville his parents were Julian Clifton Lewis Sr. And Jeanette Wood is his mom and he has a sister named Helen. He served in the U.S. Army in Vietnam during that era

and then came home to Danville and stayed there just in this area. Now, he's an electrician at the Dan River Mill, so he's got a skill in a trade, which is great. This apparently is a huge textile operation that at its height employed more than 10,000 people in this town. Dang. Which is a lot. Yeah, a big play.

And this was in the area that it was, was in, there was about 50,000 people there and employed over 10,000 of them. So, I mean, that's 20% of the fucking, yeah, that's a lot. Basically, if we shut down, so does the town. That's when you see all Main Street closed down and boarded up shit. And that's when things go down there. Where was it that we were just at where that, where that factory did that? Oh, God.

Where the fuck was that? Buffalo. Buffalo. Buffalo. Yeah. A giant fucking factory. That was huge. It was. Far as you can see, just rusted and shit equipment.

Yeah. Miles and miles. and miles and that's where everyone was employed. The big steel mills up there. And the guy, our Uber driver, was explaining to us that basically, that's where everybody worked and see it now. As we drove past it for 10 minutes. That's why it's taken Buffalo 40 years since then to try to come out of it.

You know what I mean? They're turning it around now. But he's also active at the faith church ministries and even sang on the praise and worship team. Sure. I hope they had jackets with their names and like praise on the back. And worship on the tramp stamp. Praise worship.

Donny Sharp. Now, his first marriage, about, I think about 1969, 1970. Don't have an exact date. But this was to a woman named Paula Joe. Paula Joe, PJ, they called her. Sure. That ended in divorce pretty quickly within the first couple of years. Yeah.

They were both like 18, 19. It's about right. No kids from that marriage. 1972, he married Joyce Dale Evans in North Carolina, and that's the woman he's going to be with. Sticks with. Has three kids. Three kids. Till death.

Till death, it was part. Jason Clifton Lewis is the first kid. And then CJ, Charles James, the dead kid in the middle in the bedroom there. He's the middle kid. And then Kathy Lewis is the other one. Kathy is the daughter. We'll hear from Kathy a lot in this episode. Not too much from Jason and really nothing from CJ.

Ever again. Ever again. Yeah. Joyce got sick and she was sick for a long time in the 90s in the mid-90s. Oh, no. Was doing bad. We don't. I don't know exactly what the illness was, but she was prolonged.

Prolonged. And on January 26, 2000, she died. Oh. So 28 years of marriage, three kids. Sick for so long of this. sick for years and then dead. So now he's like a 50-year-old widower with three kids. And they're adults, the kids, and they're not little kids or anything like that.

But that's worse almost because the house is empty. It's just him in the house. Yeah, yeah. So he's lonely now. He doesn't even have the kids to distract him. You know what I mean? At least that would distract you when you could have to do things. But if the house is quiet, too, it's like, oh, boy, it is lonely here.

So he is just, this plunges him into just a chasm of depression. Can't imagine. Just absolutely fucking, the guy is overwhelmed with depression. Mortality realization. Everything. All kinds of shit. Yeah. What more tells you that you're aging.

Right. That you're. Than outliving your spouse. Exactly. They're dead now. It's like, oh, my God, Jesus. Now I'm here. It's just, it's going to come for me next.

I mean, who wouldn't think that? So everyone said in the months after his wife's death, he was to the point where he stopped eating even. He would just sit there and stare. He just was having a hard time. His daughter, Kathy, would come over to the house and force him to move around and force him. She would cook for him and stand there and make him eat. Physically watch him put food in his mouth because otherwise she knows if she put made a plate, he would just put it in the fridge and not eat it and let it rot.

They're just not interested. He wasn't physically ill. He's perfectly healthy, but mentally he's done. Just watched his wife die slowly, which would be depressing anyway, and then just that's that. So it's very, very sad there. And then in March or April of 2000, here comes Teresa starting to work at the mill. And Teresa's 18 years younger than him, I believe. She's a lot younger and all that kind of thing.

She was 30 and he was 49. So 19 years difference here. Yeah. And she was on his crew and, you know, she could be friendly and he's lonely and very easy target here. She told an acquaintance named Debbie Anderson that when they first started dating here, she said that she was, quote, using Julian for money and he would buy me things. Okay. That's what he told. Yeah, that's what she says at first.

Then it gets a little bit more serious, though. Yeah. She started working there in like April. By June, she is moving into the house. Whoa. She's moving in and bringing her 16-year-old daughter Christy with her as well. Uh-huh. And she just said, and in 60 days, you know what I mean?

She just said, I'm using him. Yeah, between that. Now, we don't know if she was just using him at first, and then she was like, actually, this guy's pretty goddamn great and I should stick with him or what the deal is. the last 60 days. Yeah. Well, Christ, five months ago, his wife was alive. So this is, a lot of shit has changed since Christmas.

It's been a turnaround. Totally, yeah. So Kathy, the daughter, Julian's daughter, described Teresa and Christy functioning less like mother and daughter and more like a pair of best friends. And she didn't mean that in a good way, like that they were close. She meant it like they were on the same level. And they were, she did not control her daughter or, you know, anything like that. I do understand that there is a way to be good friends with your kid and it be positive and healthy.

Yeah. At the end of the day, though, most times it's not healthy. No, at the end of the day, they have to know that when you say something, it means something. And that's, if you can be friendly and do stuff and they still understand that, that's a good balance. But it has to be a balance. Don't wear matching shirts with your junior and high school children. Don't do that. Never do that. Either gender, don't do that.

That's so weird. Men, women, that is... Don't do that. If they're wearing it, that means you're too old to wear it. That's what that means. Because you know how you know that? Your kids are wearing it. That's why.

Doesn't matter. So basically here, she is described Teresa as an on again, off again mother, who, and this is by someone who knows them well, who could either fill her daughter with joy or send her into bouts of depression. Oh, boy.

This is, here's a quote from Brenda Bean. This is Christy's stepfather. Billy's wife after him and Teresa got divorced. So Christy's stepmother said, sometimes she was happy, sometimes she was depressed. She'd go in her room and she didn't want to talk to us, basically, when they'd try to ask her what she'd do at her mom's house or whatever. Brenda said Teresa and her daughter acted like friends rather than a parent and a child.

She said she always treated Christy like a girlfriend. She was never a mother to her. Ew. Not good. Now, Kathy sees this happening, Kathy Julian's daughter, and she's very protective of her father, obviously, because she's been trying to nurse him back to health and the fact that her mother just died and all that. So she is a little protective, and this woman just shows up and the father's like, this is my new girlfriend. There we go. Now, at the time that he introduced Teresa to Kathy, Kathy had just had a surgery that left her temporarily unable to speak.

So she couldn't even say anything. She was just. Yeah, tongue or throat, something like that. No idea. No, I have no clue. She said that Julian brought Teresa into the house and delivered the news all at once. This is my girlfriend, which you didn't know I had. And not only that, she's moving in.

She lives here now. Yeah, yeah. You know how your old room? That's going to be her craft room now. Enjoy it. That's what goes on. In fact, Kathy couldn't physically respond. She couldn't talk at the time.

So, yeah. Then Teresa says to Kathy, and this is great. They just met. Yeah. They can't talk. Not only that, they're not very far apart in age. Yeah, right. They're within, you know, five years of each other, six years of each other.

So it's not like it's, you know, there's some chick that you could have went to high school with, essentially. shows up at your dad's house and he's like, this is my girlfriend. She's moving in. You can't say anything. And Teresa says to her quote, you can just call me mom. Her mom just died six months ago. Call me mom. Yeah.

Okay. I know you don't have one. I'm being kind to you. Wow. That's disturbing, isn't it? My closet, Sue Kasa. How about that? Yeah, totally.

Yeah. So, Kathy, basically, said she did everything she could to distance herself from Teresa and Christy. She wanted nothing to do with them. So I have no interest in these people. And she didn't approve of her father being with her, basically. She thought that Teresa was, quote, overbearing. And she said, I would do my best that I could to ignore them, is what she said.

So now, CJ took it much differently. And CJ is older than Kathy. Kathy's the youngest. C.J. and her are like, wow. five years apart at this point in age. Very close. Very close. And CJ just took it as, okay, that's my stepmom now.

Wow. She said he referred to her as a parent. You know, this is my dad, my stepmom, basically. Like, that was that. He just took it as for whatever it was at face value. He was pretty easy going about the whole thing. Yeah, guys generally do that, right? No, not with their mom.

Not with their moms. CJ, though, he's like in the Army Reserves and he does stuff. I don't think he gives a shit, basically. CJ's, I think CJ's got his own shit going on and he looks at it and he goes, well, dad seems happier than he was before. He didn't move off his chair for five

months and now he's smiling and laughing and, you know, whatever. So we watched mom die for eight years. Yeah, fuck it. I mean, I think he took it as that. Like, good, dad's happier. Who cares? Sure. If it makes everybody happy if I say she's my stepmom, then she's my stepmom. What do I give a shit?

Easy enough. Now, Julian's oldest son, Jason, called Kathy within months of Teresa moving into the house to tell her that, hey, sis, he calls up and he goes, no, dad's new girlfriend there, the one that he's engaged to now and that lives in the house. I was over there and she made a pass at me. She made sexual advances toward me. Now, they're about the same age, too, these two. Right.

So, yeah, and he said, I turned her down, obviously. in and I didn't bang my stepmom. It wasn't, it wasn't innuendo or a little comment. It was, hey, we could fuck. Yeah, it was, hey, those fingers looked like they could use a place to rest. Oh, boy.

I got a spot for them. Yeah. Yeah, so. Want to check my danger muffin? Who wants to check my oil? Anybody? It's right up there in my danger muffin.

He didn't tell his dad, he said, because he didn't want to, basically he said, I don't want to hurt dad because he seems happy. And he's been so miserable. I can't, what would happen if this, if he found this out now, it would crush him. And then he'd be 10 times more depressed than he was before, even. So he told his sister and then just sat on it and didn't say anything. All right. Now they get married, Teresa and Julian. Teresa quits her job at the mill as soon as they get married, by the way, too.

Oh. Which I don't know. She's now a stay at home. Now she's a stay at home, which I think was the goal here anyway. That's a point. Yeah. So December of 2001, Jason, the one who she made a pass at, is killed in a car accident. Dead.

Dead. What? Fucking. He's just gone now. He's gone. So that story dies with him, basically. Holy. Cackey knows about it, but he's dead.

So this guy has now lost his oldest son and his wife within a year. And the, and the, and the, the, uh, world trade center is smoldering right now. Yeah, it's been a rough couple, year and a half. No kidding. Paster. Yeah. So that's why he's holding on to this Teresa with both hands. Yeah. His 50s are fucked up. It's tough. It's tough. Um, so they died. It was 23 months apart. The son and the mom died. Um, then they got a phone call. Yeah. An unexpected phone call. apparently Julian had life insurance or not Julian

Jason had life insurance Jason did yeah and they called him up they called Julian and say we got a $200,000 check for you which I mean in the middle of nowhere

Virginia when you work at a textile mill 200 grand anywhere in the world but I mean especially this situation and in 2002 that's a man shit that's a fuck yeah you might as well

got a guy at your door with a giant cardboard check who had balloons and shit It's crazy. So then he took the proceeds in an account with prudential securities, and the proceeds of the account were accessible by only use of drafts bearing his signature, Julian. So Julian's the only person who can take this money out of the prudential securities. In February 2002, they used this money to purchase a home in Keeling, the Loop Road home there. It's five acres of land

And they put a trailer on it It was just five acres of land They stick a trailer on it Okay So the address is loop road and keeling So he moves Teresa CJ Kathy's there for a minute

But she takes off And Teresa's daughter Christy So it's Julian Teresa CJ when he's around Because he's in the army too And does other shit And then 16 year old Christy That's what's going

on in the house. There's three bedrooms, two baths on five acres. It's a big trailer. So it's a good one. Yeah. CJ at this point is a security guard at unique packaging, some factory or something. He's also a musician, super into music, and he's in the Army Reserves. And he has a young daughter named Catherine as well, I believe, named after a sister. So he's got a daughter. He's served two years of active army duty and then 18 months in the National Guard Reserve up to this point. So that's what he's been doing. He better hope he gets out quick. Yeah, I would say so.

Now, he's going to be apparently, they're talking about him being deployed because this is August 2002. If you're in the reserves, you're going somewhere. So he goes out and gets an insurance policy, as a lot, most people do, when they're going to go overseas if they're smart anyway. He gets a $250,000 insurance policy on himself naming

no, naming Julian as his beneficiary with Teresa as the secondary beneficiary. So he's treating her like his stepmother, like a mother. So she's the secondary beneficiary. In August of 2002 he was called up

and he was ordered to report for active duty and deployment to Iraq to follow. That's what's going on. Holy. Yeah. So that's when he bought the insurance and everything like that. His commanding officer later said that CJ made estate arrangements, executed a will, obtained an insurance policy, all that kind of thing.

And he was proud of it, CJ was, because it was responsible. Yeah, yeah. When you're in your early to mid-20s as a dude, you're like, anything you do responsible, you feel like you have to be like, look, I'm responsible. Look, I didn't wrap my car around a telephone pole after drinking tequila for four hours. Isn't that impressive? That's all it is. So he wanted them to know that if something happened to him, they're going to get something. So he sat down, sits them both down, Teresa and Julian, and says, listen, I have this quarter of a

million dollar policy. So, you know, you guys are covered there. And he even handed Teresa a document that said basically, you know, if I die, dad gets it. But if I die and then dad dies, then you get it. Because you're the secondary. If dad dies before I die and then I die, then you get it. Whatever, but you're the secondary. Gives her the breakdown there.

Then October 30th, because that was August 2002, October 30th is the night in question that we started with. Now, the 911 call came in at 3.55 a.m. So a Pittsburgh, a Pennsylvania County 911 operator gets a call from Teresa.

come on out to Loop Road. She said that her husband and his adult son were shot. And she says they're both dead. She said that she was in bed with her husband when somebody broke in her house armed with a pistol, came into the bedroom and told her to get up. She said her husband, Julian, told her to go in the bathroom. And said, you go in the bathroom. And then he started asking whoever this intruder,

her was what's going on. Why are you here? So she said she was hit in the bathroom, as her husband told her to do, and heard all of these shots going off. A lot of them. Ten in total, basically. So she said she reported the shooting occurred sometime between 315 and 3.30. Yeah. And then she stayed in the bathroom. She said scared, huddled in there. And then she finally got enough courage to look around and see if the person was still there and come out. And that's when she called line 1-1 at 355. And that's two shotguns or one that was reloaded. That's a lot of rounds.

That's a lot of rounds. Yeah, it's, it's, the guys are loaded with fucking shotguns. So, um, yeah, so she reports that. And then at 418 is when the cops show up. So someone broke in my house, shot my husband and son, took 23 minutes for the police to get there. 23 fucking minutes is a long time. long time.

Yeah, especially when you're shot. Yeah, that's what I mean. I don't know if that's why I read that review of they didn't know how to get here. I think maybe it was one of those things. I don't know if they got lost or if everything's just so far and rural that it takes a while to get there. Is Loop Road an actual loop that goes all the way around the down and the addresses? Loops up to Kentucky comes back down. We went the wrong way around the loop.

Yeah. So, deputies Harris, Harris, Silverman, and Corey Webber. at 418. Teresa's at the front door. Tells him where the bodies are, like we said, husband's there, step-sons in there.

That's when you hear baby, baby, baby, baby. And my wife knows who done this to me. Yeah. Now, he had been shot, Julian had been shot by shotgun fire

in the upper left arm, the shoulder, the abdomen, the pelvis, the penis, the thighs, the legs, the arms and the chest.

That's where he had wounds. Everything he's got, basically, injured. Large areas of tissue in his upper arm, shoulder, and upper chest had been destroyed or just taken off completely. Several of his ribs were fractured. Plastic wadding from a shotgun shell was lodged in his left lung tissue. That's a close shot. Very close. I mean, it is a trailer. Everything's close. But still. Yeah. Yeah. But the wadding usually comes out last and slow. Yeah.

slower than, you know, the round. Yeah, than a projectile. Yeah. So that's when he said, my wife knows who'd done this to me. But he's laid there like that for almost an hour. Yeah. Think about that in that kind of excruciating par. Then he died.

That's when they hear, I told CJ about leaving that back door unlocked, Teresa, on the phone. And they're like, that's interesting. Now, CJ's room, he was dead when they arrived. He's dead, dead. The autopsy shows a total of eight wounds from an undetermined number of shotgun discharges. He was struck in the back, the abdomen, the chest, the neck, the upper left arm, the shoulder, the elbow, the left thigh, the face and the forearm. Yeah. This one they determined he died pretty quick from these wounds.

This did not take long. This was a done deal. And like I said, the family pit bull locked in the middle room. which they were like, that's curious. It's odd. Who would break in? What pit bull would let an intruder take them to a room and lock them in there? That's not normal.

And even more so, no pit bull's letting 10 rounds be fired at their owners. Yeah. And then be put in a room. No, I would think that'd be the first thing you'd do. And then the bagged lunch in the fridge for Julian's day. It's his bagged lunch. I love you. I hope you have a good day.

Smiley face inside of that. I miss you when you're... gone. Okay. Now, Julian's death, medical examiner determined that Julian died of extensive blood loss approximately 45 minutes to an hour after being shot. God, God. They said it was the most consequential sentence here in this report, because that's a big

deal. Think about that, how huge that is. He was shot and then bled for almost an hour on the floor. By the way, the house, there's a working telephone in the house. It's not like the line was cut or anything like, that and Teresa was, you know, conscious, but she said she was hiding in the bathroom, which also makes sense. They determined he died from blood loss, though. That was the death, blood loss. So it seems like they might have been able to put him back together if they did that. Now, the scene, any clues here, an investigator with the county sheriff's office arrives at about 7 a.m.

And this is investigator Keith Isam, is working the case here with this J.T. Barrett guy. So The Commonwealth of Virginia attorney, so the state's attorney, David Grimes, comes out to see the scene personally in the hours after the killings. That's how not, this doesn't happen often here. Day of. Day of, the goddamn DA comes out to take a peek around and see what's going on in this case. Okay. This is not routine and not normal. They said several things were wrong at the scene that were odd.

There's no force. No forced entry. Okay. The door isn't damaged. The lock hasn't been picked. Nothing's been pried. No windows. Nothing like that.

So that's a thing. They're like, well, probably should have. Your home was probably locked in the middle of the night and there's no, how'd they get in, basically? Are they ghosts? Are they Santa Claus? What happened? Yeah. 3 a.m.

They're able just to get in the house? Yeah. Without disabling or picking or prying or. And also, they said nothing is ransacked at all. Nothing. Nothing. Nothing's disturbed. Nothing. There's nothing taken. They said then the other problem they came up with is a shell casing problem. They look around and they collect, they recovered five or six spent shotgun shells where Julian was shot, okay, which makes sense. That's about how much he was shot.

But then in the room where CJ was shot, there's no shells anywhere. Nothing. Nothing. So they're like, why is there less shells than shots and who would pick up some of the shells but not the other room shells? It doesn't make any sense. There are no revolver shotguns. No, that's the other thing. So this, they said definitely two different weapons and probably two different people with different levels of how to do this.

Yeah. Somebody in one room doing shooting cleaned up all their shells. The other person didn't think to do that. That's what they're thinking. So that's why they think it's two people. It just doesn't make sense that one person would go from room to room doing that and not pick up all the shells. Also, while they're shooting someone in one room, wouldn't the other person here shitload of shotgun shells and be at least calling 911 at the least if not grabbing a rifle? Or running away.

Or running away or a numerous, whatever the thing is, something going to help their father, whatever the fuck it is. So especially some military guy, he might have ran in there and tried to tackle. the guy who knows. So, you don't know, it's all inconsistent with a single intruder, which is what Teresa told 911 and told the cops is that there's one guy broke in. But I mean, she was in bed, and if that one guy was in their bedroom and sent her to the bathroom, maybe she didn't see the other guy, too. They're thinking she might only thought there was one guy. So that morning, though, the morning of the killings, we don't even know if the bodies are out of the house yet, like, or if they'd just been taken out of the house.

I mean, there's still gun smoke in the house. It's that morning. Teresa calls Mike Campbell, who is Julian's boss, sit down at the mill. And she tells him that Julian won't be in today because he's been murdered. On account of he's dead.

Yeah. And when can I get his last paycheck? And that? I'd like his last paycheck. So this guy says, well, I mean, you can pick it up any time after four. We'll cut the check and get it ready. Can you cancel his health? insurance and not take that out of that, please?

Hey, don't do that, yeah. Doesn't need the Blue Cross Blue Shield anymore. Not going to need the 401k match if you can just. Skip the dental, too. I realize it's insignificant, but just don't do it. Let's not do that. So that afternoon, a lieutenant Michael Booker, who is CJ's commanding officer in the Army Reserves, calls the home to offer condolences.

He's been, they've been notified of it. So they offered a he offers to call and gives condolences. Teresa said, quote, I'm still in shock. The police had me in Chatham all day today, all up in my face. There is no way I would have killed my husband and stepson. They guessed that because I didn't get shot that maybe I have done it, my husband told me to go in the bathroom, so I did. And this guy's like, I just wanted to say, sorry for your loss and hang up the phone. This is a lot.

Yeah. That's a weird thing to say. Yeah. She then tells Booker, who, again, has no interest in this, I'm sure, that she is the secondary beneficiary of CJ's military life insurance policy and that she has been told that she will be contacted within 24 hours of his death with information about when she gets his money, when she gets that money. Right. And this guy's like, well, so sorry for your loss. Hope he rests in peace. Yeah. So the way it breaks down, Teresa's the secondary. Julian's the primary.

So if CJ died alone, Julian gets the money. If Julian died alone, Teresa would inherit Julian's estate, including the prudential account that holds the balance of Jason's $200,000 but get nothing from CJ. But if both of them are dead, she gets the prudential account and $250,000 of CJ's insurance money. Right. Okay. So that's how it had to work. So October 31st, 2002, the next day, Teresa Lewis calls Julian's boss at the mill again.

Okay. She says she's really sorry she didn't get out there to pick up the check the day before. I had a lot going on. You know how it is. My husband died yesterday. You know, crime scene and all. It just gets messy around here. They're up in my face.

All up in my face. She said, when can I get the check? So they arranged that. Teresa calls Kathy, by the way, the night, this is the night of the 30th, Teresa called Kathy and tells her that she's already gone over the arrangements with the funeral home. So don't worry about it. I've already taken care of the funeral. Kathy's like, I would have liked to have had some say, but I guess she's the wife.

So, you know, she tells Kathy, all she needs are the names of some of Julian's family members. She tells Kathy that Kathy does not need to come to the funeral home the following day. You don't need to be there. I'll take care of everything. Kathy comes anyway, though. Right. Yeah. While she is describing the or talking to the funeral director trying to figure out caskets and do we do this and headstones.

She says, she's telling him that I'm the sole beneficiary of everything. So money is no object. Let's do it right. Let's bury these guys right. And they share. They share a headstone, I believe, here. So a few days after the murders, Julian's boss, Mike Campbell, comes to the house to pay his respects. Which is very foxy and nice.

Teresa tells him that Julian had bought her a red sports car before he was killed, but that she's going to trade it in along with one of his vehicles so she can get something bigger. So I'm going to trade two cars. Yeah, two for one. She also tells him plans. She has plans to sell the land and the mobile home as well. Don't want any of the show. No. Getting out of here, my new car.

What a downsize. Get a little condo in the city. You know how it goes here. So that's what she's saying to him. November 4th, 2002. Teresa calls Lieutenant Booker again, the commanding officer. They have no other reason to speak forever at this point. He's dead.

What are we talking about? It's over. Well, she wanted CJ's personal effects and that anything he may have left in a barrack or anything like that. And a photograph of him that she had provided for the memorial service that the military had for him. They had a little memorial service amongst the group that he was in. So she said, give me that picture back and send me a shit, basically. She tells, he tells her that he'll return the photographs, but his personal effects won't go to her. they'll go to Kathy, his next of kin, his sister.

Yeah. So Booker said that Teresa became very angry about this. Really? Why do you want this kid's belt and extra pair of sneakers? What do you care? Call his sister about the toothpaste. That's what I mean. What the fuck are we talking about?

So when she said that, no, that's bullshit, you're going to bring them to me as soon as possible. I would like you to bring them to me. And he said, no. No. I won't. It's not goes to the next to kin. You're not the next again. It's a bottle of L.A. looks, lady.

What do you want? It's a bottle of depp gel. We're good. Jesus. His Fidel Sassoon mousse will be dispersed throughout the platoon, okay? So she again then asks about the life insurance money. Yeah. And reminds him.

that, you know, I'm the second beneficiary, and they're both dead. And he said, well, sounds like you're entitled to the insurance money. You know, I'm not an insurance agent. Again, I'm the commanding officer of this guy. And she said, well, that's fine. Kathy can have all of his effects as long as I get the money. Okay, fine. Then Teresa walks into a bank with a check drawn on Julian Lewis's Prudential Securities account

purportedly signed by him payable to her for the amount of $50,000. Wow, that's a lot. That's a lot of money. A bank employee refuses to do it because the signature doesn't match the signature

that they have on file for Julian because she forged it after he died, obviously. So this is interesting. So obviously, his signature is the only one that'll work. Now, on the day of the funerals, Teresa calls Kathy before, the service to tell her that she's just come from the hairdresser. She's just got her nails done and she has bought a beautiful funeral suit to wear.

So, I'm set. Quaffed, polished, and fucking dressed here. Looking sharp. She offers at that point to sell Kathy the land in the mobile home. Would you like to buy it? So they're having this conversation and Kathy's like, I don't know. What? this is the funerals today.

Like it's all, there's other shit on my mind. There's a lot going on. Yeah. Then out of nowhere, she says, quote, this is Teresa, quote, you don't think I had anything to do with this, do you? Why? Why would you even ask that? So that's weird.

Then at the memorial service, even weirder shit here. Okay. Kathy said that Christy Bean, the 16-year-old, that daughter there, came up to her and hugged her, which she found, Kathy found, quote, very, very strange, which, listen, Kathy, okay, I'm with you up until this point. But when someone who's vaguely related to you hugs you at a funeral, that's not strange. That's just what people do. Pretty, yeah.

That's what normal people do. Yeah, that's part of the course for a funeral. Yeah, you should see an Italian funeral. Holy shit. Oh, boy. You get kissed 700 times, yeah. So she said that was, quote, very, very serious. strange that someone hugged the daughter of a dead person at a funeral.

That's weird. She also said that when Teresa realized that no one wanted to speak with her at the memorial service, she became irate and started, quote, running her mouth. They're talking shit to people at the funeral. She said her daughter, Christy told her, be quiet. Mama, shut up. Like, you're embarrassing us. It's getting loud.

Yeah, that's, I know better. and she said Christy told her mother during the service that she waited too long to phone authorities to report the shootings. That's why people are mad at hers because she waited too long. And she said, well, I was in the bathroom scared. What do you want? I'm going to come out and get shot. They told me to wait in there. So I waited.

Well, everybody here's talking about it, Mama. Yep. Now, the police interview Teresa several times here. Twice, basically once right away, the day of where they were all in her face. and then kind of around this part here. The Isam and Barrett do this. In the early conversation, she said, Intruder came in, you know,

made me go in the bathroom. Husband told me to go in there, whatever. Then, out of nowhere, a couple days later, she adds a new wrinkle to it. Out of nowhere, she says, yeah, that's what happened that night. And a couple days before he died, Julian beat me up.

He physically assaulted me. Which, why say that? I don't know. She's never said that before. never said it to anybody, never had a bruise, a mark. No one's ever seen that, heard of that. Never told anybody that. But smirching a dead man for no reason.

Yeah. She said, I didn't kill him, though. And they said, well, we don't think you, maybe you had him killed. And she said, I didn't have him killed. That's crazy. I don't know who killed him. Someone broke in my house, made me go in the bathroom. What do you want for me?

So they said, okay, let's calm. Let's just go step. Reset. Reset. What did you and your husband do before bed that night? Yeah, simple. Okay. She told him that, well, we talked and then we prayed together.

Yeah. And then she told him that she said she was going to go pack his lunch. And she told him she prepared a lunch and put it in the fridge for him. And the lunch bag was in there, the one with the note. I love you. Hope you have a good day. I miss you when you're gone. Okay.

That's what she tells them. The investigators learned also that Teresa, and a friend had visited an attorney shortly after the murders to make sure that Kathy would not be inheriting C.J.'s money or Julian's money to make sure there was no fancy work with wills or anything like that. Yeah. I get all the show. It looks, but there will be no money. There will be no money.

So the police had a couple problems with Teresa's story. Number one, the fact that why would C.J. unlock the back door. That doesn't make a lot of sense. The second was C.J. was lying dead in the next room. So how the fuck did she know on the phone with 911 that he was dead?

Because according to her, she came out of the room, went into the bedroom, called the police, came out of the bathroom. Nothing to do with C.J. But yet she knew he was dead in the other room. Maybe she heard the shotgun shells from way over there and just assumed.

That's what she said. But she did say he was 100% dead. She said they're both dead, which she knew he was dead somehow even though she shouldn't have. And then her husband was actually still alive. He's alive. So that's the other thing. She didn't say bring the ambulance. She said they're both dead.

If she said, hey, my husband's barely hanging on to life. I assume the ambulance would have came sooner. And that would have been a... Probably. Yeah. Not a detective. You know, that's a different thing. The DA.

And the DA. Yeah. So that's very interesting. And the third thing here is that she reported an armed intruder and not an unlocked door to 911. So they said how basically she was already saying how the person got in before anybody even asked how they got in. Right. She said, must have come in through the unlocked door. How do you know the door's unlocked?

How do you know that's what happened? How do you know any of that? So they're like, well, that's she could be just trying to figure it out. People like to put puzzles together. Speculation, sure. Yeah. And also they said that when they informed her that both her husband and her stepson were dead, she did not appear that upset to the officers, more annoyed by the whole procedure.

So Julian's boss is the guy that's going to blow this whole thing. Really? Yes. Weirdly, oddly enough. Yeah, the supervisor down there at the Dan River Mill. They went and talked to him. And somehow it came up about the lunch that he had a lunch in the fridge and blah, blah, blah. And he said, paper bag.

He said, I've worked with Julian for years. He does not ever bring his lunch to work in a paper bag. Matter of fact, every single day, he brings it in the exact same blue and white cooler. He's got a lunch pail. He's got a lunch cooler. He never brings a paper bag. So why the years? And the whole time Teresa's been with him there.

Never brought a paper bag in before. Why would he bring a paper bag in when he's got a cooler that keeps his shit right? So that's when they were like, huh, that's odd. Yeah. Nice things written on it and all that. Never did that before. Interesting. Then a guy named Bobby DeMont, who had known Julian and Teresa for a long time, known Julian

longer, but also knows Teresa, heard Teresa say a couple months before the killings that if Julian died, she would get the money. And if CJ was killed and Julian was dead, she would get that money too. Why is she talking like that? Don't know. She was telling everybody how the insurance breaks down and what she gets.

So November 7, 2002, detectives talk to Teresa again. Let's have another chat. Why don't we hear? Now they confront her with all of this shit. They're like, listen, A, B, C, D, what the fuck? None of this adds up, Teresa.

If Igloo made a dry arrangement, race, we wouldn't have got to the bottom of this. Not at all. So they confront her with all that. She's staring at him and she says, okay, I hired people to kill him. Oh. They're like, no shit. Really?

That worked? We didn't expect that to work. It worked. She admitted to it. Yeah. We were prepared to be frustrated. We were going to be very frustrated and we got to arrest you anyway on the mounting evidence, but you just made this way easier.

Cool. What happened? She just starts to confess? Yeah. They said, listen, we don't believe you. Here's all the evidence against you. And she was like, well, I don't know. And I'm going to say 72 IQ, that's like confronting a 10-year-old with all sorts of facts.

And they'll go, oh, shit, I'm busted. I better admit to it. Yeah, when you get, when you have a bunch of evidence about what you're doing and you know what you're doing and they're real close to being right. Yeah. That feeling in your stomach sucks. It does. Yeah. Your head gets real hot.

When you're 10 and there's a broken window and someone in a baseball sitting in the living room with glass all around it and someone looks out the window and you're standing there with a baseball glove on. Yeah. You kind of got to admit it at that point. You're kind of fucked. You kind of go, uh, fuck. Yeah, all right, I did it. Yeah. Shit.

Some kid just ran up and threw a baseball through the window. I tried to catch it with my glove, but I couldn't do it. He was crazy. He was crazy. And then he threw it at the house. It was crazy, man. He was nuts. that's basically her story.

Yeah. Some kid ran by and broke the window and I'm standing there with a glove and that's it. With a dry throat. Yeah. So then she tells them a story that's kind of true. She'll refine it later. Okay. She said, I hired a guy named Matthew Schallenberger to kill Julian.

Oh. She said, they go, well, how do you know him? She said, met him at the Walmart. Really? Yep. Met him at the Walmart. on the checkout line. That's how they met.

Does he work there? No. Oh my God. The guy bought, she put the divider up and goes, do you kill people? Baby, I don't mind if our products touch.

And she was smitten. What? And gushing ensued. I don't mind if our best foods, best value, whatever the fuck it is. Great value shit touches. You're mustard my mayo.

Yeah. Let's get after it. Your peanut butter, please touch my jelly. I want your skippy on my smuckers right now, baby. Come on now. My God. Go ahead and put your skippy on my smuckers, would you? So it didn't go to do you kill people by chance?

It was, we should fuck? That's how it started. Okay. Wow. She said, we know that's true. She said Matthew's from New York originally. We know that's true. Yeah.

She said, I let him into the home on the night of the murders. I unlocked the door for him so they could get in. That's why there's no forced entry. She said that Matthew shot Julian and CJ and took Julian's money from his wallet, which she didn't report before. The money was missing. And then he left. So they're like, well, how the fuck did he shoot both people without the other person? Do you shoot one, one over, shoot the other, and then do shot by shot?

or how would you shoot a guy five times without somebody else being aware of this here? Right. And she said, well, I don't know. Yeah, she said that, you know, that's what happened. She said she had, uh, yeah, watched this stuff go on and everything like that. Yeah. And then she told them that Matthew had expected to receive half the insurance proceeds, but that she had changed your mind and decided to keep all the money.

I'm not giving him shit. Why should I give him anything? Also, we find out this is not true because there's another guy involved in this. And apparently the other guy, we'll find out later. The other guy shot CJ three times, then twice more. So she said that CJ, or this guy had said CJ wouldn't die. Okay. Now, she was not asked about the division of the money, but she volunteered that she,

She had decided to cut this guy out of the payment and not pay him, even though she had promised to here. So then they said, well, if this is true, do you know where this guy lives? This Schallenberger fella? And she says, I do. And they said, well, hop on in the car and take me on out there. Let's go on out to the residence. She drives him out to his trailer and points it out. Chateau Schallenberger.

That's right. That's him. That's a shitbox. And here we are. So then November 8th, 2002, she has some more to say. She is at the Danville City Jail, and she asked to speak to investigator Isam again. I don't know if she's bored in there or what, but she then says, hey, all the stuff I told you yesterday, I wasn't being completely truthful about that. Not true.

No, there's another guy involved. We know that. Which guy was he? We were on his tail. She said a guy named Rodney Fuller. He's also involved in this. She also told the cop that my daughter, Christy, also helped plan it. Christy was involved too?

Christy was involved. Why are you telling the cops on your 16-year-old daughter? Wouldn't you keep that one and I won't, I'll cut her out of this fucking thing and not get my 16-year-old involved, considering it's probably me that dragged her into it? If I snitched on Schallenberger and the other, and Rodney, one of them's going to tell on me. So I may as well just throw the daughter in too. That's wild to just throw your 16-year-old. You'd think you would protect your 16-year-old at all costs. I don't know.

She's dangerous. Well, you have a 16-year-old daughter. Would you tell the cops on her if you did something together and they had you busted but didn't know about her? No. No. I'm afraid of her. I'm afraid she would break out of her prison, break into my prison, and kill me. Oh, no, she wouldn't.

She's a nice kid. She's pretty badass. I'm scared to her. She's a nice kid, though. She's getting not so nice. She's just a 16-year-old. You know what I mean? That's just a 16-year-old.

They're all like that. Horrible, horrible people. We were all terrible people when we were 16. Holy. Grumpy, angry. I don't know what the hell's going on. If I had a parent that gave a shit that wanted to hang out with me, I don't think I'd be mean to them. I don't know.

Maybe not. I'm not sure. If you don't want to hang out with them, then they want to hang out with you. If you want to hang out with you sometimes. I don't know if it's just 16-year-old, kind of. Contrary. If yours dad gave you a coozy and was like, that's yours. Come hang with me.

By 16, I would have been like, is there weed in that coozy? Peace. I'm going down here and I'm going to do. I had a lot of shit going on at 16. If he threw your a coozy and told you to smoke weed with it. I had a bunch of. And when we get where we're going, there's a Miller light involved. I had to hung out with them.

I had like drugs to sell and stuff. By 16, I was far gone in terms of you couldn't reach me by then. I was done. At 10, you could have started with that. 16. I was already, I was like the kids in the wire where it's like, well, they're too far to have gone to reach. Let's go down lower to the 12 year olds. Yeah, Duke, he's on a shopping cart with a crackhead. It's over. Yeah, once he's on the shopping car with the crack cat, it's all over with. Yeah. So she then said after the shooting, the two men left the house. And then she waited approximately 30 to 40 minutes before calling 911. Yeah. She said that, um, she said that, um, she said that, um, she said that, um, she said. She told Kathy Clifton it was 45, and she told the cops it was 30. So we don't know exactly where it was, but the medical evidence supports the longer one.

Yeah. So this is how this all went down. They said, how do you know these? You met a guy. How do you go from being online at Walmart with a guy to him murdering your husband? How does that happen? Please walk us through this. So here's what happened.

So your 16-year-old hiring them for you. Well, she was just sort of way till you hear the group. This is horrible. dude. This is Teresa. Oh, my God. Early October 2002, this is, you know, the month of the murders, but like the first week of the month. At the Walmart,

they met. Okay? On the checkout line, she meets both Schallenberger and Rodney Fuller at the Walmart in early October. Now, Matthew Schallenberger's 21 years old. Matthew Jesse Schallenberger. MJ. He's 21.

He's from New York, and he's living in a trailer with Rodney Fuller, his roommate. From the city or from... Not sure. You know. We don't know. All right.

He wants to be a hitman. Okay. Which... Nate, he's not from the city. The funny part, he is. The funny part is, is he's in New York and he goes, I want to be a hitman. I'll move to rural Virginia. That's where all the work is and hits.

That's where everyone's killing. Paying to get murders, go on. It's a real tough market in the city. It's hard to crack. Yeah. Billboards for everybody else. It's difficult. So he wanted to build a resume. This was his goal here. This is wild. This is like a comic who lives in New York and they're like, I don't know how I'm going to crack this scene. I'll go to a smaller market first, get myself going, make a name for myself, then crack into New York or L.A. That's basically... I can get past at the stand. I can get past at the loony bin. That's the problem. Yeah. Fuck, I don't, there's not, I can't even get in an open mic in this city at first. You know, You got to go to South Jersey and fucking do some stuff first.

So that was his plan. As he came here like a minor league, he said he wanted to build a resume of contract killings because you keep a track of everything. Oh, I killed this guy. I killed him. He was excellent. You have pictures that you give people.

And he wanted to be. I've got to see my LinkedIn. You should see. It's amazing. He has like a plastic surgeon, like a book. Here's before. He looks pretty happy with his family. Here's after with two bullets in his forehead.

Didn't I do a good job? So he said that he wanted to build up this reputation that would then travel north and the people in New York would hear about his incredible murder techniques and then recruit him into organized crime in New York. He does not know how any of this works, I don't think. Who has the 70 IQ? That's what I mean. That's real. This guy, 115 IQ, by the way. 113, sorry.

That guy's smarter than me. That guy's a lot smarter than you, yes. Well, technically, not smart. I would, if you're saying you're going in on something, would you rather go in on it with this guy or Jimmy, I'm taking you 1,000 out of 1,000. You're smarter than this guy. Does he not know that the point of murder is to not get credited with it?

Try to be as anonymous as possible. He wants word to spread. And where's word going to spread? Who's Teresa going to tell, who's then going to then tell the head of the Lucchese, crime family who's going to go, hey, there's a guy down in a this Schallenberger guy down in Virginia. He sounds good.

We don't have anybody that can murder, but he can do it. So, yes. Now, he also wanted some seed money to start a drug distribution operation. He doesn't start out slow. Like, he's going to get, you know, sell an eight ball and break it down into fucking quarter grams. He wants to get a whole big drug distribution started by like kilos at the same time. He doesn't know that.

The people that hire hitmen don't want that guy. They don't want that guy. No, no. That guy brings too much heat in the first place. You're going to do that and murder? Yeah, he's going to get caught for drugs, be facing 100 years and telling everybody. What are you doing? Oh, boy.

And he had a brother who'd offered to supply him with cheap product, cheap meth to get started. So as long as you can get some cash here. That's wild. So he's the smart one of the operation, by the way. Holy. His roommate, Rodney Fuller, who's 19 years old, is even dumber than Teresa, according to the courts here. Right. He would later be described as having an IQ, quote, much lower than Teresa's.

Much. Much. Lower. I don't know how much lower you can go and still be able to tie your fucking shoes, though. That's the thing. Yeah. To stand online at Walmart. Yeah.

To have you understand that that's where the line, you hand the money and they get the... And you're next. Yeah. It's like a 40. Yeah. Explaining next to a 60 IQ guy. Well, I mean, a smart dog is 50 in that region. So, I mean, you're starting to get into a dog territory at some point in terms of cognitive ability and processing abilities here.

So not that they're a dog because they're stupid. That wasn't what I was trying to say. So someone will take it wrong and be like, you said stupid people are dogs. No, that's not what I said. But they'll say it. And then a bunch of people would be like, James said stupid people. What an asshole. Like, they don't know.

A piece of shit. They're going to listen to the three hours to hear if they're wrong or not. No, that's what I mean. They just assume it's true. And then I'm an asshole. There's such a piece of shit. Such a dick, dude. I'm picking on the low cognitive, you know, processing people and calling them fucking dogs.

Functional morons. They're German shepherds. That's it. That's it, that's it, man. So Teresa gets close to the pair, essentially. Right. So basically she's got the Schallenberger guy and the other guy with the IQ of a floor lamp. And here we are.

So Teresa gets closer to them. They talk. And Teresa and Matthew Schallenberger exchange phone numbers. Oh, boy. And they begin to communicate quite frequently. Very frequently as a matter of fact here. By the way, she's 33. He's 21.

That's fine. Fuller said that he met Teresa when he was with Schallon. Allen Burger at Walmart and later met her at a Kmart. Just Walmart's and Kmart. All the Marts. All the fine establishments for shopping of Mart. Yeah. We're going to smart and final later.

It's got the word mart in it. So we're going there. It's in there. Where they then drove around to the back of the store, of the back of the Kmart, where they talked and then had sex. That's where I take all my ladies, though, is the back of the Kmart. That shows that they're gamers or not, you know what I mean? What are they doing back there, James?

Fucking. No. Talking and fucking. Yes. Oh, boy. They're fucking. And this is that. She's already fucked Challenberger, by the way.

Because they were originally the one. This is where she's fucking Rodney? This is Rodney behind the Kmart. Oh, my God. The young guy who she met in the Walmart line, whose trailer she goes to to fuck him, she also fucks his German Shepherd IQ level roommate behind a guy. Kmart at the same time. She's dim and he's dimmer.

And imagine accidentally producing something dimmer. Oh, no. That's going to be ugly, man. Oh, no. That's going to be bad stuff. On at least one, at least one occasion, more than one occasion. Yeah. Oh, my God.

She invited both the men over to her home. Yeah. You know, because no one's there now. Oh, boy. and performed what she and them called a, quote, lingerie show for both the men. Okay, a strip tease. Where she would do all of this. Yeah, and then she would have sex with both of them.

At the same time, probably. Yeah, they'd Eiffel Tower her. Yeah, that's what's going on here. Yikes. That's not the creepiest sex story in the story, though. It gets creepier. Okay, everybody. Hope you haven't eaten recently because this is going to make you.

Okay. Teresa takes Christy, 16 years old to meet Schallenberger and Fuller in a parking lot in Danville. Christy had never met Rodney Fuller before. Never once. Okay?

Her mother introduced them. Then Christy said, hey, I'm going to fuck Matthew in this car. You fuck Rodney in the car next to us. And that's what happened. Boy. And that's what they did.

Mom fucked a man and looked out the passenger. And his daughter, fucking another man. Look at you. Never been prouder in my life. This poor Christy, man.

She's not good. She's 16 years old. I mean, he's only 19. So, I mean, technically, most states, it's within three years, even if you're under 18. So technically,

it's two. Like, I know California's three. I know most states. A lot of states are three. I don't know if they've changed it, but that's always the thing that they used to say back in the day. I don't know.

So that's, that's at least in the ballpark of normal. If your daughter's a junior in high school and she's going out with a guy who graduated last year, you don't love it, but it's not... That's early junior year. It's, yeah, that's what I'm saying. It's not great, but it's also at least not like, at least he's not 35 or something. But you don't say, go fuck this guy. You don't arrange sex dates for your 16-year-old.

That's disgusting. I'm saying if she found him on her own, whatever, but this is totally different here. Upon first meeting. Upon first, this is Rodney. Go fuck him in this car while I bang somebody else. When you're 16, the last thing you should want to see or know about is your motherfucking, number one. You don't want to know about that. Right.

And then you're going to do it next to her in a car, this poor girl. And then... Go catch cock in the celica. When it was all over, they all went and got drinks. What kind of drinks? Booze, yeah. Booze. You know, because...

I mean, they're best friends. They're best friends. In a parking lot. Yeah. They're best friends. Teresa also was involved with another man from her church who she was banging during this period as well. She would claim she was at church and that, by the way, that's, Julian started suspecting

her of cheating. This was going on before Julian died. Yeah. Along with the other two was, this was, all of that shit was going on before Julian was even dead. The lingerie shows and all that kind of shit. That was while Julian was at work. Like, yeah.

I mean, yeah, that's how you seduce somebody to do things for you. Yeah. He's not dead yet. That's fucked up. That's crazy. And but she would say she was at church at odd hours all the time. And Julian started suspecting her of cheating because she was. She was also cheating with somebody from church.

Then the phone logs at the police fine between Teresa and Matthew during the, since they met the planning period is what they call it. About a week after they met to the time of the murder, there was 170 phone calls between them. God damn. Teresa initiated 160 of them. It's a lot of phone calls, man. Oh, my. He is not calling her very often. She is courting as fuck.

Yep. October 23, 2002 here. This is when it all kind of starts happening. Teresa withdraws $1,200 in cash and hands it to Matthew and Rodney to get guns with. This is gun money. 600 a piece. 600 a piece. But they are thinking they're smart.

They're like, what we'll do is we'll separate ourselves. from the purchase of the gun so it's not connected. You know, we're real smart guys here. So they give the money to Antoine Bennett. He makes the purchase for them. Ammunition, too, and all that, but they didn't know, he didn't know what he was even, he didn't know about a murder plotter and he wasn't involved in any of that. They just said, we just got guns for us.

Bought some fellas, some pistols. That's it. Some 12-gauge Mossberg shotguns, as a matter of fact, is what they got here. They went into the store, purchased a 9-millimeter rifle and 2-2-tenths. 12-gauge Mossberg shotguns. Okay. That's what they said. So that same day,

Teresa tells Matt and Rodney the route that Julian drives home from work. Because this is the original plan is not to kill everybody in the house. Because CJ was not around at this point. Yeah. So they were thinking, okay, in order to get this money,

CJ and Julian have to die. Right. So the plan was kill Julian have him be dead, then when CJ comes home for the funeral, we kill CJ too. Okay, that's a bad plan too. Which is like a plan like organized crime figures would have in a movie. You know what I mean? And then when the funeral comes.

It's like the last action hero, remember? It was like a cheesy, an intentionally cheesy plot of a cheesy movie. That's what's supposed to be. That's what's going on. Kidnap the son to bait him to come to the top of the roof. Exactly. Same shit. So the plan was to, for the men to, quote, follow and stop Julian on the highway and kill him and to make the murder look like a robbery. This is all while Teresa is waiting home, you know, like the good wife waiting for her husband to come home from work.

And she's so shocked when she hears about it. So that evening is the first attempt at this. Another vehicle, though, stayed too close to Julian's truck for the entire length of the drive and they never got the opportunity. Filed by traffic. And that's the funny thing. They literally said traffic was our problem there. They said traffic was moving too slowly for the group to reach them. There is a third man involved in this, apparently, that I was reading about.

They only mentioned briefly in a newspaper article about him getting sentenced later. That's a guy named Amin A-I-N-Gagins, like Walton. He was 29 years old, apparently. But, yeah, the point is, CJ, he'll get leave from the National Guard to come home for the funeral and boom, we'll kill him there. Okay. So, apparently, during an attempt to kill, during this attempt, Teresa was on the phone with her daughter so that they both have an alibi. They're on the phone with each other at home, so neither of them were out on the road doing anything.

So that's literally what they did. But that didn't work out as we heard here. Now, Julian ended up driving home, unaware that he was somehow miraculously getting out with his life. And his wife was very surprised when he walked in the door. Yeah. Oh, what's for dinner?

You made it. Hadn't been making anything. I didn't expect shit. So that's probably the first day that she had like a celebration when he came home. Like he felt loved. You know what I mean? Yeah. Because he comes in the door and she's like, wow.

Wow. Well, she's probably like, fuck. The fuck are you doing here? He probably didn't say it like that. No. Yay. I'm so happy you're here. So they regroup.

New plan. Okay. New plan. Kill Julian. CJ will still come home for the funeral, but we'll kill Julian at the house because we can control the environment in the house. We don't know what's going on out in the outside world. That was crazy.

So then he comes home. We kill CJ. Second policy pays out. Everybody's happy. Okay. So an investigator said that Teresa said at one point, she started to wonder if it was all worth it and started to falter in her effort. and she just said, maybe we should just forget this whole thing.

She's getting smarter? Just ride it out. I think she's lazy at this point. And she told the police that it was her daughter, Christy, who urged her on and told her to go ahead and do it. Come on, Mom, you can do it. Oh, my God. She told the cops that. Why would you tell the cops?

She's trying to get blame off of herself onto a kid, which is fucked up. I wanted to stop, but my child, really. she's bloodthirsty. Yeah. So they're going to do it like that night, but then Teresa learns, holy shit, C.J. is going to be home for a night. Oh. So we might not have to wait for him. We might be able to do this all at once.

He's coming home the night of October 29th, 30th and stay in there. Two birds in the bush or something like that. There's one in the hand and one in the bush. Whatever the fuck. So he said that they were like, this is the night, October 29th into the 30th. So that night, the night of the 29th, they do some preparation here. She said she talked with her husband, prayed with him, arranged for her daughter to speak with him so that she wouldn't, so that he wouldn't think anything was wrong. Everybody's being all nice in the house.

Even her daughter's being nice to him. She told him she was going to go to the kitchen, pack his lunch. She packed the lunch, put it in the refrigerator, wrote the shit on the bag. then around 3 a.m. Schallenberger and Fuller drive past the home about three times without stopping because lights are on inside. So they keep circling. I'm sorry, that was a little bit earlier. Then at 3.15 a.m. they see the lights are off.

So they enter through the rear door, the Teresa left unlock. Each carries a shotgun. They go to the master bedroom where Teresa is asleep beside her husband. This fucking idiot. asleep. Okay. Is it idiot or was that part of the plan? You know what I mean?

That she's just like... I would be awake for this. Maybe I'll wake up when... They'll surprise me. There's an alarm clock coming. Remember Widows Bay when... Yeah. What's her name?

Gilpin there was getting the people to come kill Richard Warren. And because she was fucking awake. And she's lucky she was awake because they were about to kill her. And she was like, hey, wrong person. there. They were like, oh shit, my bad. And they went over there. So apparently, Matthew said, hey, Teresa, get up. Woke her up. She got out of the bed and walked to the kitchen. At that point, 315 to 320, Matthew shoots Julian several times while he's in bed. Teresa's in the kitchen. Here's

the shots. This is at the same time Fuller goes into the other bedroom and shoots CJ three times. Teresa walks back to the master bedroom and sees Julian on the floor bleeding alive and conscious enough to speak. She doesn't speak to him though. This is why he says my wife knows who did this because she came in and saw him and they were all in the room.

This bitch wasn't in the bathroom at all. She gets his pants and takes his wallet out and goes to the kitchen. That's what she does. Wow. Okay. Then Rodney Fuller's. comes into the kitchen and sees Teresa and Matthew pulling money out of

a wallet. So they were dividing the money that Julian had in his wallet. And Rodney said, man, he wouldn't die. So Rodney takes Matt's shotgun, because I guess his was empty, and he goes down the hall and shoots CJ twice more.

And make sure he's dead. And picks up those shells too. He, Rodney, the one with the fucking... The dimwit. The end table IQ. The dim wet dipshit. Who thought to pick the fucking shells up. The wet wipe.

Wow. He decided maybe I should pick these up, whereas Schallenberger thought, maybe he thought, because he's banging Teresa, maybe he thought, like, she'll pick it up for me. She'll grab those. I don't know what it is, but it's wild. So they miss fucking all the ones in the other room. They divide $300 in cash from Julian's wallet while he's still alive. They needed all three of them to do the math.

Yep. They had to put their heads together here to divide that up. $300 among three people. Hold on a minute. What does that make? Shit, that's going to be, that's going to bother me all night. So afterwards, Schallenberger, Matthew, tells Teresa that he's sorry that she had to go through something like this and then hugged her and kissed her and then the men left. Wow.

So she remains in the mobile home until 355. before she finally makes the calls. The call to 911. While in the meantime, she made at least two other phone calls. What? Before she called 911. Who she called?

The first is to her former mother-in-law. Don't know why she'd call her at 4 o'clock in the morning. Marie Bean. Not right, that one. Who said, not right. The second is Debbie Yates, who is described as her best friend. So she called her ex-motherer.

in law and her best friend in the middle of the night. Did she think that they wouldn't know she didn't know that they would be looking, huh? I don't know, man. I honestly don't know what she knows about forensics. When things happen today and like there's like three phone calls before the police, how do they not know they're going to look at that? That's, I don't get it. All I can say is in 2002, if you haven't really been watching much TV for the last 10 years, you might not know what the cops are doing and what they're capable of. Yeah, CSI's pretty new at that point. It doesn't have a huge audience yet.

Even law and order. If you haven't seen a lot of law and orders or something, you don't know, like they check phone records. They do that kind of shit. Robert Stack told us this shit in 96, babe. Yeah. So back to November 7, 2002, that's when Teresa just pointed out Matthew to the cops. And that's where we were and that we just described Matthew and Rodney.

So the police go in and search Rodney and Matthew's trailer. You would think they'd at least be smart enough to get rid of evidence, right? Yeah, right. Okay, we would hope so here. Well, apparently they recovered two shotguns. Yep. They got the guns? The actual shotguns.

Two pairs of rubber household gloves from a closet in Matthew's bedroom. The dish gloves. Primer residue from the discharge of a firearm present on the gloves. They wore fucking yellow dishwashing gloves to do this murder. Jim, those are called disposable. and then they did not dispose of them. They kept to, well, I might have to watch some dishes soon. I'll wear them to wash my car.

Oh, someone changed the oil on my truck? That's what I mean. Then the kudagra here, they found the shells recovered from the fucking bedroom. They saved them. How do you keep the gloves and the shells? And then they match those shells up. They're the same shells that are in the rest of the house because of the same shotguns and the same ammo. And they go, hey, look.

Look at this. We got matches all over the place here. Wow. Now, they think that Teresa had to have been the center of this. They're like, there's no way it was any other way because, number one, Matthew and Roddy never met Julian or CJ, so they didn't know them. They didn't know where they lived, what they drove, where they worked, or even that they were human beings on this planet ever. So, Teresa could tell them the schedule, the employer, the route home from work. Everything. Second life insurance. It's all her. She's the only one.

She's the straw that stirs the drink here. She told them where each man would be sleeping. She unlocked the door. She put the pit bull in the middle bedroom. She did it. Yeah, they didn't do it. They would have bit them. So that's how it works.

So obviously, Teresa is charged with this, clearly. She is charged with the capital murder for hire of Charles, capital murder for hire of Julian, conspiracy to commit capital murder, robbery. of Julian took the wallet out, took his money. Where was her daughter? Not home at the time. Not in the house. Use of a firearm

in the murder of Julian Clifton, use of a firearm in the murder of Charles, and use of a firearm in the robbery of Julian. So the robbery charge is there for a reason. That's an aggravator. That's an aggravator. That's robbery. That's robbery in the commission of a murder,

which is not great. No. put that together with murder for hire Yeah as well You got some ugly aggravators In a burlap sack and throw you off a bridge I believe that's what they do Well they first they like beat you with big sticks

Then they throw you off a bridge Her daughter's arrested too Fucking A They go ahead and arrest Christy She knew about the plot and she didn't report it So she's a conspiracy to commit murder Is her charge She's got more later too

Now Rodney and the first guy there. Ammon guy. They are going to plead. Okay. They are going to plead here. They know they're fucking... I'm shocked, Rodney.

He had the fucking balls. I think a lawyer... He sat down with a public defender and they said, they have every bit of evidence against you. If you don't want to go to the death penalty, if you don't want to go get a lethal injection, you plead guilty. Because otherwise, they're going to kill your ass.

You know that, right? They have you dead to rights on murder. higher, dude. You're fucked. And he was like, okay. You're going to eat like shit. I guess so. One day you'll have a nice meal, and that's it. That's going to be the last one. So Rodney is going to plead guilty under a cooperation agreement to testify against everybody else. Everybody. Okay. So, Rodney said that Matthew told him that Teresa wanted Matthew to do something about her husband. So now we get corroboration of what she said and what Matthew

said. He said that Lewis had gotten $1,200, just like she said, and instructed them to come to her trailer late in the day to pick up the money to purchase the guns. They did. They got the Mossburg shotguns. He said, Matthew told me how to hold the guns. They test fired them the day of the 23rd. He didn't know how to shoot a shotgun, Rodney. So he said, they went to a field in Ringgold, which is nearby, and shot off the shotguns. And he said, Rodney, Matthew told me how to hold the guns. I shot all of them. Yeah. So the rifle and the shotgun. I gave my shoulder an alley.

Yeah, so he was sore. No, he's 19, so he's feeling great, no matter what. Fuller then, Rodney testified later that Matthew told him they were to attempt to ambush him on Mal Mason Road that night. He said he needed to do it that night, or Teresa would be angry if they

didn't get it done on the 23rd. But the plan backfired. Fuller had another passenger in the and they were unable to catch up with him, Julian, who was driving home in his Jeep, and there was traffic, and he had somebody else with him. It was a mess.

Six days later, Matthew picked Rodney up from work, and they proceeded to the home around 11 p.m. Yeah. He said that Matthew told him to wear dark clothing and used something to cover his head, since, quote, forensics were, forensics was high tech now. They can pick up your hair.

So Matthew's at least been watching TV. That's the, The extra 50 IQ points come in handy for that at least in this particular. Pick up your hair. They pick up your hair more than that. So he said he's, Rodney admits firing the shotgun at CJ three times, going to the kitchen to complain he wouldn't die, then going back with Matthew's gun and shooting him twice more. Yeah. Rodney said that he, Matthew and Teresa, were planning to leave town after the murders.

That was the plan. Wow. He said he and Matthew were hoping to move to New York City where they would make a living by selling drugs. Yeah. Because there's nobody else selling drugs in New York City. You can walk right in and pick up a big part of the market share. Don't worry about it. Easy pickings that market.

Oh, yeah. No one will be mad at you either. You can waltz right in there. No one will care. They all welcome it. Yeah. So Fuller receives from this, you, sir, may fuck off. life sentences times seven, seven life sentences.

Seven life sentences. Because he got all those charges Teresa got, pled guilty to all of them, all of them life without parole. Okay. And 53 years for two counts of conspiracy to commit capital murder and 13 years for three counts of use of a firearm in the commission of a murder. So seven life withouts, 53 and 13. Add another 66 to 7 life withouts. I get the, I understand why, but two dead people created all of that. There are so many, there's one dead person and people get like eight years and it's like incredibly fucked up.

Yeah. This is like, I mean, this is obviously because the aggravators and everything. Oh, God. Yeah. There's a ton of it. We've seen way dirtier crimes get 30 years and they're out. 15 sometimes. Yeah.

So Amin Goggins, by the way. He is also going to plead guilty and will serve 17 years of a 28-year sentence with the rest suspended. He pleads guilty as well. He was just in the car on the 23rd during the... When they were looking for him. When they were during the attempted thing. So he's in there for attempted, you know, conspiracy to commit attempted murder or whatever the fuck. So he said, I want everyone to know that I did not shoot anyone, but my actions contributed to the crime.

That's what he wrote to the judge. And he said, he wrote to Julian's daughter. So to Kathy, he wrote, I'm truly sorry for my actions and my role in the crime. I'm just truly sorry. He's a young man, yeah? 29, he has Goggins, actually. Oh, he's way too old to be talking like that. Yeah, absolutely.

No, he's 29. I'm just real sorry. He should be begging for mercy, because that's a crazy thing. I didn't shoot anybody but. Browski. Yeah. You couldn't stop this. But actions contributed to the crime.

Honestly, whether he was in the car or not, they would have went looking for him and then they would have shot him later, which he wasn't involved in. So really, he was a- Stopped this. He couldn't have stopped him. They would have just dropped him off. Hey, guys, don't do this. My point is, my point is, he went shopping with him. No, no, this is not the guy who went shopping.

This is the guy who was in the car. I mean, he went shopping. He was in the car, shopping for a murder victim. Perfect. Yeah, yeah, totally. They didn't find. They didn't find it. find anything. So he just went

home. He could have called the cops and been like, you know what? Something's fucked up just happened today. True. True. At the same time, he went for a ride. I mean, you know, it's one of those things, but I think that's fine. He got 10 years... I'm riding with some kids I shouldn't have been around anyway, because

plenty of times. Plenty of times. I could think of a couple things, and I don't know if the statute of limitations are over yet that I'm not going to talk about, like, that I could have went to prison for a long time for, you know what I mean? I'm just saying, He went on a ride with boys that he shouldn't have based on the age difference. That's the other problem. He shouldn't be hanging out with a 19-year-old and a 21-year-old.

Probably not. Probably not. She shouldn't be fucking them either. No. So he's sentenced to 10 years for attempted murder, three years for use of a firearm in an attempted murder, five years with three suspended for possession of a firearm by a convicted felon. Oh, fuck, damn. 10 years with 8 suspended for conspiracy to commit murder.

He was scheduled. Oh, he's a piece of shit. Yeah, he's done other bad. He had a record and everything. Yeah, he's hanging out with these dipshits. Obviously, he's a scumbag. So he was set to go on trial and pled to avoid it. And to avoid serving the other 11 years of his sentence, he was ordered to be on good behavior for 10 years following his release and write an apology for the crimes, which was filed.

And we told you about him. Sorry for what I did there. So the, is there going to be a plea for Teresa here? Yeah. The trial judge appointed two experienced defenders for her. David Furrow, who's been going on for 26 years and another guy with 23 years experience and a ton of capital cases. So try to get her good lawyers here because this is a capital case and their death penalty on the table here for anyone who doesn't plea. So they've worked together these two lawyers on a bunch of these cases as well.

They also consulted a national death penalty expert, Canvas local defense attorneys who regularly practiced in front of the assigned judge to see what this judge is all about. First, they tried this, a plea. How about a plea in exchange for the Commonwealth taking the death penalty off the table? We'll plea because that's what they did for Rodney and for this one. The prosecutor said, not happening. We're not taking it. Not taking it off.

You want to plead guilty, go ahead, but we're not taking the death penalty off the table. So they went, shit. They said she's the worst part of this whole thing. She's the planner. She got the money. She's the one who, none of this would have happened without her. So they said we're adamant about seeking the death penalty against her. So basically, the defense attorneys talked to her and said, look, in Virginia, if a defendant pleads guilty in a felony case, the court hears it.

And the case is determined without a jury. So therefore the judge will sentence you not a jury So if you plead guilty You let a judge sentence you not the jury Plead not guilty and you get 12 Rural pissed off people who've seen crime scene photographs Of people blown to fucking pieces and they're gonna hear about how you had your 16 year old Fuck a man in a Selica and did lingerie shows and got Eiffel Towered by two more

You met at Walmart You got spit roasted by a dude dim wit. Do you want these 12 rural folks to fucking judge you for all his shit, basically? You don't want to smoke. Nope. They wrote a 10-page letter to Teresa

laying out exactly what they were facing. Took her a month and a half to read it, probably. She's still reading. She's still like, wait a second. He told her the photographs of Julian and CJ were among the worst he's ever seen in all of his time. He said, this is not good. The

ammunition they used is vicious shit. And it tore them apart. He told her that he fully expects, this is what's going to happen if we go to court. The prosecutors are going to get one of those Mossburgs and he's going to pump that shotgun in front of the jury so they can hear that clack while displaying the photographs on giant fucking poster boards. That's what they're going to do. Because I would. Yeah, who wouldn't? That's what prosecutors do.

He said, I have watched this guy do this in other cases and it works. It makes the people horrified. He then said, your 16-year-old daughter's then going to take the stand and describe having sex with an adult man in a car beside you after you just introduced them and told her to do that. He said, think about, and he said, this county, think about these people. These are not sexually liberated. This is a Baptist. These are some Baptists. They're going to be more pissed off at that than the murder.

Honestly, I get fire and brimstone, but. Sex is a whole different thing now. So that's not great. Also, he said the case, it's a strong case. They got everything against you. They said the other thing you have in your favor for pleading guilty is this judge, Charles J. Strauss, has never imposed a death sentence on a capital defendant in his entire career. Ever. This is the worst I've ever seen, but this has never done it.

He's never done it. So he's like, you got a good chance here. And they said, especially because the judge already sentenced Rodney Fuller, who's an actual trigger man who butchered one of these people to life. So he's not going to give the guy life who did the shooting and then give you the death penalty who sat in the other room. That would not make sense. So they said in only two cases in the history of the Commonwealth of Virginia have produced a death sentence for the hireer of the murder for hire. It's usually the killers themselves.

And also, no woman has been sentenced to death in Virginia that they can remember. And the last woman executed in Virginia was in 1912. Got a hundred years. A lot of good facts. That's why they're saying, do it. Also, Teresa has no history of violence. She has a single nonviolent conviction for prescription forgery a few years back. But that doesn't count toward a violent crime.

crime here. She also confessed and led the police to both shooters. Yeah, without her? Yeah, it wouldn't have happened and the bust wouldn't happen either. So they're like, you have done a lot to show that you don't deserve the death penalty. He said that her best chance of life without parole was to plead guilty, roll the fucking dice with the judge. Wow. So she signed the letter in her own hand stating she wished to plead guilty and get sentenced by the judge. Sounds like a good idea. I'll go with that option. Okay. Okay. Now, the other thing they have to figure out is, is she competent to do this? Is she bright enough and competent enough to do this?

So a Dr. Barbara Haskins, who's a forensic psychiatrist, conducted an interview and arranged a cognitive testing thing by another doctor. They said, quote, cognitive testing showed a full-scale IQ of 72. Verbal IQ was 70 and performance IQ was 79. This place is the defendant in the borderline range of mental retardation. Wow. Not good to prosecute, I'm saying. So now, they did find her competent, though.

They said she understands. She's aware of her charges and the possible penalties. She knows who her attorneys are, understands their roles, understands her role, feels comfortable working with them, and is able to provide them with information and ask questions, which is, that's competent in this world. It's all we need. You have to be able to assist with your own defense. what the law says. Not that you're a great shape or whatever.

So they said that before she could, they also said that she could recount her basic defense strategy and explain the reasoning behind it, understanding the role of the jury, the judge, and knew the advantages and disadvantages of each. So she understood all that, which means she gets the trial. She gets things. They also, she records now, this psychiatrist says that Lewis graduated from high school and completed one year of college. That's what's in the report.

Oh. Which is completely the opposite of what's in all the newspaper reports and what Teresa said was she dropped out at 16 and had a baby. Yeah. So, and that's like a discrepancy that just kind of hangs in court. We never get a resolved. So either way, they said she attended school for a substantial period, had been an average student.

There's the graduated thing. There's nobody reconciles that, though. We don't know what's going on there here. So basically, there's two versions of her. Version A is a functionally impaired, pill-addicted woman who's afraid of her boyfriend and has the reasoning capacity of an 11-year-old, essentially. Version B is she's a high school graduate, went to college for a year, held down jobs, raised a kid, open bank accounts, and organized a double homicide. Yeah. That's competent.

And got caught. Yeah. to me she's talking about checks and this and that. She's doing more shit than I know how to do. I don't know. Maybe I'm in moron. I wouldn't know who to call about life insurance. She makes and starts picking phones up.

Then the defense position here, they have Duke psychologist, Dr. Philip Costanzo, and an addiction psychiatrist, Dr. Eleanor McCants, Katz. And they said that she functions at a 12 to 13-year-old level. and, you know, she's not really responsible for much shit here. Okay. But the Commonwealth, again, argues that forensic pathologist that they have say she understands everything. So May 2003, they find her competent and they allow her to plead guilty to all seven counts. Okay. She pleaded guilty in addition to murder, the firearms, the robbery, all that shit that we talked about here.

So now the circuit court questioned her directly, determine the pleas were voluntary, intelligent, and knowing. The judge confirmed she was waiving her right to a jury and that she would be sentenced to either life imprisonment without parole or death by him personally. Is that okay with you? She said yes. Please accept it. Okay.

Sentencing comes up. Again, death penalty fully on the table. Prosecution says that the evidence that. that basically the evidence that ends the whole intellectual disability feel bad for me argument is this, that DeMont, her friend's testimony that establishes that she understood the beneficiary structure of the estate and a separate insurance policy. Yeah? She knew if this happens, he gets the money, but if I get it, if they die first and all. She knew all that shit.

And understood the conditional sequencing required to collect on the second one, which was sort of, if you told that to, an eight-year-old, it would take a few times before they'd get it. You know what I mean? She explained the mechanism of the crime correctly to a family acquaintance before committing it. The funeral plan also here, they said they were waiting to murder a soldier at his own father's funeral. Do you understand how depraved that is and how awful of a person you have to be? Especially in 2002, a soldier, you know. At that time, there were flags everywhere. Oh, Maron, Jesus Christ.

Specifically because that was when he was reachable, just a plan gross act. It requires multi-step contingency in mind across an indefinite time horizon, they said. These are all things you need some reasoning ability for. So they also said the bagged lunch. The judges keeps returning to this because they said that that found depravity of mind. Yeah, it's fucked up. It's fucked up. It was created just to be found by police to show what a loving wife she was.

That's the only reason it was there because she wasn't going to use it. Yeah. So, but they found out that he carries his lunch in a cooler and it was all over. One igloo fucked the whole thing. One dry erase eggling. One that you could leave some messages on. That's it. So in arguing for the death penalty, the prosecution argued that she had no regard for the feelings of the victim's family and friends

and was concerned with only the insurance money she hoped to collect. They sought the death penalty on two statutory aggravators, vileness, on the depravity of mine and aggravated battery to the victims, and future dangerousness. Yeah. That's what they're going for. The defense attorney argued that she should be sentenced to life, obviously. They said that Rodney Fuller, the actual trigger man's,

he's getting life without parole. What the fuck? He said Rodney Fuller is just as culpable as Teresa Lewis and saying, there's no qualitative difference between Lewis and Fuller and my art client Teresa, her cooperation

is the reason you even found Matthew in Fuller. It's the only reason you even know about this shit. You didn't know about him. And also said the death penalty

should be reserved for quote, the Timothy McVease and the people who fly planes into the sides of buildings killing thousands of people should be for terrorists.

Invoke the United We Stand shit. He's literally saying that's who should get the death penalty. These colors don't run. That's right. Giving Lewis the death penalty won't bring CJ back and it won't bring Julian back. Okay.

The defense mitigation case was built on this basically, the witness summaries from other people that said that she's got either was cooperative or has problems. Teresa Lewis's probation officer for the forged prescription thing said that she had complied with every term of her probation on the prescription. conviction and had never demonstrated any type of violence. The pre-sentence report probation officer said that Lewis had seemed remorseful in his interview with her. A longtime family friend and schoolmate of Lewis's engaged to be married to her sister testified that he had never observed her behaving in a violent manner. That's not the one she fucked, different one.

An official at the Roanoke City Jail provided a statement that there had been no incidents of violence involving Lewis. or even minor infractions during her pretrial incarceration. So she's in there. She cooperates. Melvin C. Wilson, her father and her brother and sister were present in the courtroom. And the court was advised that all three would testify that they loved her and did not want her to receive the death penalty. All right.

So she's got a family. She's got all the mitigating factors. Teresa, in a statement before the court, said that she was very sorry for what. what happened and all the people that I hurt. Quote, if I could take things back, I would in a minute. And she said she wanted to spend her life in prison to try to forgive herself for what she did. All right. The judge rejects the future dangerous aggravator right away.

It says there's never been any other, she's never been violent any other time in her life. So this isn't a pattern of behavior. The absence of any criminal history or violent behavior or even non-finding. criminal violent behavior that people have just anecdotally seen. I saw her, you know, beat up a girl at a bar one time or so there's none of that shit either. Now, on the vileness, that's the other aggravating factor. They said the death penalty requires a finding of either future dangerousness or that the conduct was outrageously or wantonly vile, horrible, or inhumane that involved torture,

depravity of mind, or an aggravated battery to the victim. That's quote unquote. The Virginia Supreme Court has been pretty explicit here. Proof of any one of the three components, torture, depravity of mind, or aggravated battery supports a finding of vileness. Depravity of mind is defined as a degree of moral turpitude and psychical debasement, surpassing that inherent in ordinary legal malice and premeditation. So you're extra shitty. That's all.

Put some extra stank on it is what that is. the judge found both the depravity of mine and aggravated battery. He also talked about what the other people do here, what the other two killers did. The Virginia, now, Judge also acknowledged openly that the case was made harder by the fact that Lewis had led police to these two who have pleaded, already pled guilty. So he said, and the fact that one of the trigger men already got a life sentence. So he said, that's making this whole thing hard. Then he said he found this was a cold-blooded, pitiless slaying of two men, horrible, inhumane, and committed for profit. He noted the cold lack of emotion she displayed.

He found there was no motivation for the killings except greed and no thought on her part beyond the two murders and what she would receive once both men were dead. He found that she lured two men and her juvenile daughter into a web of deceit, sex, greed, and murder. This episode will absolutely be called deceit, sex, greed, and murder without a fucking doubt. A web of it. A web, sorry, a web of deceit, sex, greed, and murder. And then within an incredibly short period for meeting them, she had recruited them, planned and completed two murders, and staged one failed attempt on her husband's life within a week before the actual murders. Unbelievable. He noted that while her husband lay dying in the bedroom, she was in the kitchen, apparently writing a love note to put in the refrigerator,

splitting up the money from his wallet and waiting for him to die. He stated he was convinced. She waited until she thought Julian was dead before calling police and that she allowed him to suffer without any feelings at all with absolute coldness. Called her, quote, the head of this serpent. Okay. And imposing the sentence, he said, you lured two other men and her juvenile daughter into this web.

You, ma'am. May fuck off. 20 years on the conspiracy count. Yeah. Life on the robbery count. 13 years on the firearms count. And for the murders, death penalty. Oh, fuck.

They gave her the death penalty. Her lawyer's like, I'm sorry. I really thought it was a good. You're the only one. That's positive. The good news is you're the very first. There's a lot of whispering. going on there.

The last person we killed was a witch. It was like a fucking 110 years ago. She was the first woman sentenced to death in Virginia since 1912. Wow. 1912. It is 2004 at this point or three. 98 years? Whatever.

80. Yeah, that's crazy. That's 90 years. That's a lot. So she is assigned to the Virginia Department of Corrections. Inmate number 32194. and enters the system. Now, because

Death Row and Virginia only houses men because there's no fucking women on death row, Teresa was sent to the Fluvana, which sounds like a name of a stadium

named after a drug that helps you with allergies. Fluvana Stadium. Yeah. With a little song like Sky Rizzy. Nothing is. Yeah, one of those. It's definitely got a commercial.

It's how you, it's how you buy vaccines from a vending machine. Fluvana for neck swelling or some weird thing that you didn't know as in medical condition. Fluvana for bulging eye vans. That's the one. I was just going to say that one I saw, I'm like, that's a disease. I didn't even know that.

That was a disease. It's crazy. Okay, I guess you need that. There's so many things. I wouldn't want my eyes to bulge. Everybody's got an ailment, I guess. I suppose. So this is the fluvana correctional facility for women,

sponsored by Fluvana Corp in Troy, Virginia, and held in the segregationation. and held in the segregation wing, which is usually used for disciplinary infractions, for seven years she's held there. Oh, my. Then where'd she go? Because that's death row, basically.

They made up a death row for her because they didn't have one. It's a six by eight foot cell. It's the fucking, it's the hole. They just gave her the shoe. Yeah. She had a five, a five inch black and white television.

So one of those little handheld jobbers there. Yeah, that's one of those. Wow. A large, print, New International Version Bible, given to her by the prison chaplain. And that's it. That's what she had in there. A shitty TV and a fucking Bible.

Oh, that's it. June 4th, 2003, the judge denies a motion in the Matthew Schallenberger case. Okay. There was a thing here. He was accused, obviously, of the shooting. Schallemberter's attorney asked Pennsylvania County Court judge here to strike evidence of future dangerousness in the Commonwealth's pursued the death penalty because Schallenberger had no previous convictions. So the judge ruled here denies the motion, though.

So that's that. I will look at that. And he said, I read the law to be broader than what you say, he said, adding that the lawyer could be absolutely right about his interpretation. But he's like, I read it a different way and I'm the judge. So I'm going to go with my reading. I'm judging it this way. So Schallenberger says, fuck it, going to trial then. Let's do it.

Why would you go to trial here? They all are going to testify against you. Yeah, not a chance. There's a ton of evidence. During jury selection, he makes a deal. Sometimes this is just for posturing. You have no idea how much money is wasted on we're going to select the jury and we're going to do all this shit and then right before it starts, they plea.

It's just a game of chicken. How far will you go? How far will I go? We neither of us want to go to trial, but we're ready to do it. it's one of those. So he makes a deal. During sentencing, his father, Brian, testified that he was not a good role model for his son. Apparently, Schallenberger had a shitty life.

I'm sure he was. Shitty child life. To end up in a fucking trailer with this other idiot with a goal of becoming a hitman. Yeah. At 21? At 21. He said, I wish I had done some things differently. Well, let's see what we find out because he seems to be him and Teresa are the main two for me.

Well, it's the same judge, too, by the way, Judge Strauss. You, sir, may fuck off life in prison, no parole. He really fucking hates what she did. He hates that she made her daughter fuck a guy in a parking lot. Yeah. It has to be that because otherwise... It's the sex. Yeah, it makes it so much more callas.

Yeah, they said he gave his reason. He said he agreed with the Commonwealth that all three conspirators deserve death, but felt unable in good conscience to sentence Schallenberger to death. death when the Commonwealth already offered Rodney life. Yeah. So I can't give one shooter more than the other shooter. That's what he said. So he receives multiple life terms.

It's a tonny. When this lady is, she knows, she's got a 16-year-old. She's old enough to know better. Fuck, yeah, I would say. So August 22nd, 2003, Schellenberger writes letters from prison. Not to Teresa, by the way. To where? To other people here.

On the subject, this is to a friend, on the subject of why he said he's telling her he never slept with Teresa, which we know his horse shit. He said to get her to fall in love with him or why he had ever, I'm sorry, why did you ever sleep with her? He said it was for her to fall in love with him so she would give him the insurance money. He's called the entire relationship work. It was all work. He was putting in some time. Oh, yeah, because I'm a hit man.

That's what I do. And he said part of the job was fucking her. That was what I had to do to get that money. In a separate letter to an ex-girlfriend, he said that why go to New York for $20,000 a hit when he could do one job and make $150,000 off of it? Okay. He thinks so. Well, no one's paying you $20,000 a hit in one place, and no one paid you, he said, $350,000. No one's giving you that either.

So he exaggerated his importance to his girlfriend. Yeah. And also, he said in the same letter that Teresa, was, quote, exactly what he was looking for. A moron with money who he could manipulate. Yeah, someone who's into his whole vibe. What did he think he was going to do? She's going to get the money.

Yeah. What do you think he's just going to get all of it himself? Okay. He thought she was so stupid that she just like give it to him or whatever. And she ended up being like, fuck that guy. I'll keep it all myself. I'm not paying him at all. She double crossed him, which is hilarious.

I love that. November 2003, Christy's going to trial. Really? She's going to trial. It's got no choice. They have taped interviews of Christy with the sheriff investigator. In those tapes, she said that she learned the plot through communications with her mother.

When they asked her why she consented to providing a false alibi to her mother, the night the murder was supposed to happen, she said, quote, because she's my mom. That's my mom. Which is very reasonable. Rodney Fuller testified. I'm 16. She told me to. That's why. That's why.

Yeah. Rodney Fuller testifies that during his two encounters with Christy, she mentioned neither CJ nor Julian. So, like, she wasn't saying, oh, I'm blowing you so you'll kill my stepdad or some shit. So a sheriff's investigator said that in his interviews with Teresa following the shootings yielded no mention of her daughter either. So Christy wasn't really in it that much. she was as peripheral a person as you could be. She wasn't involved in the planning. She wasn't the money.

She wasn't getting anything. She was just kind of... Just extra danger muffin. Yeah, she's just like mom's murder cheerleader on the side. Like, yeah, I'm in it with you. I'll help you whatever I can. In the closings, the prosecutor here compared Christy's role in the shootings

to that of a person who gave a group of terrorists $5 for gas money knowing they were on their way to bomb a federal building. Everything was compared to terrorists in 2002. Everything. Everything. You could steal a pack of juicy fruit from the store and they'd be like, this is like a terrorist walking into a military complex and stealing missiles to blow up a building.

Everything was terrorism. What if everybody took a little juicy fruit? Then what? It's like, it's a one stone. Yeah. Then they ain't going to call Wrigley Field. Riggly no more because they ain't going to have no juicy fruit money. That's how it works.

It's like if everybody threw a stone, then dead people die. That's how it works. So what if we all went five miles an hour over speed limit? Then what? So he also said that Bean was an accessory because she agreed to supply her mother a false alibi to throw off investigators. And she talked with Julian Lewis on the telephone just hours before he was killed to assure him that nothing bad was going to happen to him. She didn't say that. But it was just like, hey, look how we all, friendly we all are tonight.

They also recalled statements that Christy made to investigators between the day of the shootings and late November, during which the girl admitted to knowing about the failed to October 23, 2002 attempt on Julian's life and that the murders that occurred a week later. So she could have stopped, had it stopped, just like you were saying the other guy did. He said she knew everything was going to happen before it happened. Right. Now, the defense said in closing statements that she's been manipulated by her mother. That's true. She said, I submit to you that she was, in fact, another tool used by her mother, a disposable tool.

And she said that his client was also a tool for the Commonwealth, since her statements to investigators led them to identify and arrest Fuller because her mom and only talk about Schallenberger. I submit, Your Honor, that she is a tool. That she is a tool, a double tool. The only time that being a tool is a positive defense. Yeah, tell him I'm a tool. Go ahead. Keep telling them that. The defense attorney also said that when Teresa told her daughter that killing Julian and CJ would solve a lot of problems.

This is what Teresa had told police that Christy said, solve a lot of problems, but it may do that, but it would still be wrong. Yeah. Okay. So some form of morals. So it's a 10-man. two woman jury here. Deliberated for an hour before convicting her of conspiracy and two counts of first degree murder as an accessory before the fact.

Okay. So not good. As the verdicts were read, the defense attorneys asked that the two accessory verdicts be set aside by the judge. He said they are contrary to the law and the evidence, saying that Bean's father and stepmother each were crying by them also crying there. So she was the only defendant to actually go through the whole trial phase. Everybody else bled, as we'll talk about here.

Now, during sentencing, so since she's a minor, she's only 17 at this point, the sentencing will be, I guess it'll be decided by a judge who could sentence her as a juvenile or an adult or a combination of both. Okay. In sentencing, the prosecutor said that she should be sentenced as an adult because her role was small but significant. They were called her statements to investigators in which she talked on the phone with Lewis hours before he was killed in order to reassure him. They said she was the last chance that CJ and Julian had. We can point to a number of things that she could have done.

The defense, they put Billy Bean up there. And he said he's been visiting his daughter every Saturday since her conviction. He said, I have watched my daughter break down and cry. She is very sorry. Which certainly sounds like you're sticking up for a teenager when you say that. Billy's attempted to bolster. He attempted to bolster the argument that Bean was a victim of manipulation. He said Teresa Lewis had tried to maintain contact with her daughter through letters in prison in jail.

She said, I know how manipulative Teresa was to me and she manipulated Christy. Okay. Okay, Christy, when asked if she wants to make a statement, she said, I'm sorry in a shaky voice. That's it. Bean's attorney asked that the judge sentenced his client as a juvenile or that she serves sometime in a juvenile and the remainder of an adult or, you know, let's do this fine. He said a sentence is needed to rehabilitate her. I don't think there's much rehabilitating to be done. There's that much.

Now, he said he wasn't seeking to reduce his client's culpability, but also saying that Bean wasn't going to get anything out of the murder plot. And her expressions of remorse, lack of any criminal record, status as an honor student at school, the fact that our mother made her do this, the fact that she could still lead a productive life. They said, this is really the only life that Teresa Lewis has touched that can be salvaged. Right. Give her a break. they argued that she was under the influence of her mother. Several defense witnesses testified that the girl desperately wanted to maintain a relationship with her mother from whom she had been estranged earlier in her life and didn't want her to go away again. Judge says, you, young lady, here.

I'll read this. Christy Bean's father, Billy Bean, appeared on the verge of tears Monday when Judge Strauss ruled that she would be sentenced as an adult and fixed her punishment at 20.000. years for both murder convictions and 10 years for the conspiracy charge. Yeah, because you, you, yeah, Ma, you can do it. That's not good. But seconds later, Billy Bean and his family breathes size of relief when Strauss suspended the sentence for the murder convictions and half of the conspiracy sentence. She gets five.

Strauss, Strauss mandated Bean beyond probation for five years, refrain from possession of drugs her alcohol, received substance abuse and mental health counseling, reimbursed court costs, and remain on good behavior for 20 years. Oh, this girl's in prison, right? She could have spent the rest of her life in prison. So she didn't get shit. She got everything pretty much suspended. Yeah.

But she's on probation for 25 years. 20 years for the murders, 10 years for conspirators. So she did five, I think she got five years. And then probation and refrain and then 20 years of probation afterwards. guy. Wow. So she was sentenced five years in prison, basically, is what she got out of this. So she's still on probation today? Yeah. She would still be, well, 20 years, this was 2004. So she would have just gotten off. Oh, 20 years after her five. After her five. Yes, you're right. You're absolutely right. Prosecutor said she had knowledge and that's what it's all about. The prosecutor said that

the prosecution could be concluded because they said anybody else you're going to put, this is like five people so far. And he said that no one else is currently charged in connection, but he said, hey, you never know if anybody else pops up. He said there may be someone who had a peripheral role and we're going to get them in here. We'll get them. So March 5th, 2004 is a direct appeal. She raises for Teresa. These are all appeals for Teresa.

She raises the disparity argument that no Virginia court has ever approved death for a mere hireer on the vileness predicate alone and that her sentence was disproportionate. given that both trigger men received life. I think it's a pretty decent argument, personally, for me. The court rejected it on established doctrine that Virginia repeatedly refused to let capital defendants compare their sentences to those received by Confederates. Right. Not people in the Confederacy, their Confederates. Anybody confederated?

With Virginia, it can go either way. You never know. Comparative review looks at whether sentences in Virginia generally approve our sentencers, generally approve the Supreme penalty for similar cases, not what a co-defendant got. So it's to the aggregate of all the cases, not just your case. They also argued her gender should factor into proportionality. She's arguing, you shouldn't kill me because I have a vagina. Which is generally how we operate in this country.

For more or less, yeah. Yeah, because it's just, I don't know, it's fine. That's just how we all feel. If you look at statistically, same crime, women get sentenced much less than men do because we look at them as less dangerous. Yeah. Sorry about that dollar an hour. Yeah. So the court, yeah, right.

That's, that's fucking, that's a funny thing. So he said the court, the court declined firmly stating that all criminal statutes in the Commonwealth must be applied without regard to gender and refusing what it characterized as an invitation to apply capital. murder statutes in a discriminatory fashion. What you're saying is you shouldn't kill women, only men, which we can't really apply the law like that. On the vileness, the court's language was unambiguous. It found the evidence of depravity of mind overwhelming and recited the reasons. She married her husband because she wanted his money.

Plan the murders to acquire his assets and her stepson's policy. Failed first attempt. Involved her 16-year-old, encouraged her to have sexual relations with a murderer, paid for the shotguns and the ammo, took her husband's wallet while laying bleeding, and split the cash up to the killers. Waited 45 minutes in a house with him while he suffered, didn't give a shit, showed no remorse or emotion, initially denied involvement, and on the night of the murders, she prayed with her husband and arranged for her daughter to speak with him.

They affirmed this. Yeah. Okay. November of 2004, a private investigator working for Lewis's post-conviction team, travels to Wallens Ridge State Prison in Big Stone Gap, Virginia, which is right next to Danger Muffin. Big Stone Gap is right next to...

What was the other gap? There was somebody else Gap, too. Bald Gap or some shit like that. He goes up to interview Matthew Schallenberger. According to the investigator's sworn account, Schallenberger said that from the moment he met Teresa Lewis, he knew she was someone who could be easily manipulated. Really?

And that from that moment he met her, he had a plan for how to use her to get money. Yeah. He was like, fucking get this. He's a scumbag. So they make an affidavit. He signs it. And then basically, this is wild.

He tells the whole story. They have it printed up in an affidavit. He signs the affidavit, looks at it. Then he tears off the portions of the paper that had his signature on it, put them in his mouth and swallowed them. Why? I don't know. Who the fuck knows? Just decide I'm eating this paper.

What is the show of that? That he changed his mind? Never mind. I didn't sign this. Fuck it. I don't want to help her. I decided. On the way out,

Schallenberger said to him, what will happen will happen? Like, they're going to kill her. They're going to kill her. I don't give a fuck. Okay. A signed affidavit as evidence, a partially transcribed one whose signature has been eaten

is not exactly as good of a legal document. apparently here. So, 2006 now, Wallens Ridge State Prison, Matthew, he kills himself, dead.

What? Done, off himself. What will happen, will happen? What will happen, will happen. He's like 25, 26, dead. So early into the sentence.

Didn't want to do another fucking 60 years. Four years of that will probably make you want to do it. That's plenty. It's plenty, probably. It's enough to really consider. Good enough for me.

So back to post-conviction appeals for Teresa. She argued ineffective assistance of counsel that the trial counsel had successfully refuted future dangerousness, but had failed to investigate and present evidence that would have refuted depravity of mine, specifically evidence that she was incapable of masterminding anything. She said, mastermind and me should not be in the same sentence ever, just not the same. The hearing was conducted by Judge Strauss himself. The defense assembles a panel. Dr. Philip Costanzo, Ph.D. from Duke University, a psychologist evaluated her post-inviction, concluded she had a dependent personality disorder,

described her as having trouble making ordinary decisions without the advice of others, difficulty in initiating activities on her own, and a need for other people to assume responsibility for most major aspects of her life. life, he estimated her functional mental age at roughly 12 or 13. He argued she lacked the verbal intelligence and independent initiative to frame and lead the plot. His formulation was this. A woman functionally impaired, intellectually, passively dependent, and habitually submissive to men is a poor bet as the mastermind of a brutal murder plot. And also, yes. And also he said the IQ score, they make an arbitrary 70, as you're kind of.

off here. Oh. She's got a 72, so she's fine. Whereas if she had a 69, then we could say she was, so he's like, there's really very little difference between a 72 and a 69 is what this guy's saying. And if she took it on a different day, it might have been 69. Maybe then, yeah. Yeah. So another Dr. Katz here, not the cartoon who's on the 90s on Comedy Central. That's a good, too. An addiction, loved it. That, the critic, I love that shit. Who was Dr. Katz? Jonathan Katz. Jonathan Katz. He's a comedian.

Oh, it was, wasn't it? Yeah, yeah. He's an addiction psychiatrist, and also he found, gave H. John Benjamin, his first voiceover work, which he's fucking, the guy's awesome. So this lady, an addiction psychiatrist, testifies that Lewis had a severe addiction to prescription narcotics and that the quantity she was taking around the time of the murders would have impaired her cognition and flatten the affect she displayed to others, which would explain the coldness observed.

She's piled up. Now, Dr. Barbara Haskins, the original court-appointed psychiatrist, expanded her findings and concluded that Teresa suffered from a dependent personality disorder and a dependence on narcotics. Another doctor, her treating gynecologist, I don't know why that's relevant. Let me tell you about her pussy. Now, I get that her brain and she's doing all. Yeah. Her pussy, though, is in top shape. You don't know what a yeast infection will do to a woman.

No idea. No, it's in, it's top shape. She, you put a speculum in there. She snaps it off with that thing. It's, it's impressive. It's,

I wonder why. So, and Deborah Gray, a social worker and substance abuse counselor who conducted a full mitigation investigation also concluded she was

addicted to prescription drugs. I can feel it in her pussy. She's addicted. It's warm. It's warm down there. A 2004, Virginia Commonwealth University psychiatrist

evaluation reached a parallel conclusion, borderline intellectual dysfunction, passive dependent personality features and drug dependence made it highly unlikely she initiated and planned the crime. Yeah. Yeah, I think that Schallenberger got out of her that there was some insurance involved. And I think he was manipulated the dumb, yeah, into wanting it.

Yeah. The state put up Dr. Lee Hagan, a forensic and clinical psychologist, and he said that there was insufficient evidence to support the claim that she was actually addicted to prescription meds or that her use. of them caused extreme mental or emotional disturbance. She did not meet the diagnostic criteria for dependent personality disorder. What she exhibited instead in his framing was a passive aggressive or aggressive dependency, characteristics involving the use of other people to achieve one's own objectives. Yeah. He said that's a genuinely different diagnosis.

It's not she was used. It's using people is her method. That's what she does. And he said, she had the capacity to plan and carry out a murder plot. And they also said that the Commonwealth had two concessions from the defense witnesses. Dr. Katz acknowledged that Lewis's behavior around the time of the murders was purposeful and goal-directed and admitted that her ability to carry out the murder plans was not affected by her prescription drug use if she was so high.

Lewis herself had admitted she was not under the influence of any drugs at the time of the murders, and there was no evidence that she experienced withdrawal or adverse effects after. her arrest and incarceration. So she wasn't that hooked, is what they're saying. Right. She's not an addict. Yes. They said, now, her trial counsel said that they didn't develop that mitigation because

they knew about the low IQ, the alleged prescription drug difficulties and possible dependent personality traits. They made a strategic decision not to pursue them, and their reasoning was specific. The low IQ was already going in front of the judge and the competency report, free of charge, with no downside. That's just whatever. The other two were double-edged swords. Presenting a drug addiction and dependent personality would open her up to potentially

damaging evaluation by an expert, which is exactly what happened when they did this in post here. They said both were excuses that would have supported the future dangerous aggravated, dangerousness aggravator. So we were trying not to make excuses. We were trying to say she's sorry, she's remorseful, whatever. They said a woman with an untreated addiction and personality disorder that makes her latch on to dominant men is a woman who may do it again. Yeah, she finds another man that's dangerous, yeah. All I have to do is give her some drugs and would have undercut their entire strategy of portraying a nonviolent defendant who had accepted responsibility and helped arrest her co-conspirators.

So this wasn't in a, this wasn't them forgetting about it or not. This is their strategy. and it's a sound one, I think, honestly. I mean, it didn't work, but the strategy defeated future dangerousness, and the judge threw that aggravator out, and the defense won that fight, so it was smart for that. The judge found that counsel had made reasonable and proper choices and that Lewis had failed to show either deficient performance or prejudice,

and the Virginia Supreme Court rejected the claims on prejudice grounds alone, holding that any psychological cognitive and physical difficulties Lewis may have had could not explain or even mitigate the carefully calculated conduct she exhibited and carrying this out. Affirmed. Okay. So how's Teresa doing in jail here? It's not good. Is she dead?

Well, let's find out. Lynn Litchfield, the former chaplain in Virginia where she was being held, described her in a Newsweek article and said, Teresa seemed meek, almost pliant. When I hugged her, the only hug we ever shared, she was so grateful. She didn't look like a remorseless killer, a mastermind who plotted. murders, as the judge put it. Her original lawyers did little to dispute this image, she goes on to say, which they did plenty to dispute that.

In one of our sessions, she collapsed into great soul-shattering, body-heaving sobs and cried into my wrist. The only part of me I could get through the slot in the door. She put through the slot in the door, and she cried touching her. Okay. She is scheduled for execution in 2010 here. Holy shit. June 2010, three months before the...

the execution to the Fourth Circuit court we go. The opinion is the most complete, basically. They go to them with the she couldn't have planned an argument. And they eviscerate it and say, yes, she goddamn could have. She was the wife of the victim. She alone stood to profit. We've gone over all this. She withdrew everything.

She gave them the money. They got the shotgun. She's making calls. She's setting things up. She's doing a lot. She baited them with their kid, too. Like that's, wow. Blaming CJ for the unlawful.

locked door in front of the cops. I mean, these are all things dumb people, really dumb people couldn't do. She began pursuing the paycheck while the victims were still in the mobile home. Still not even taken out yet. Forged a check for 50 grand. Made plans to trade in cars, offered to sell the land, did all this shit. Affirmed. She's not too stupid. There's a big fight about the IQ, the number. Oh, that's the thing, the number. They said one significantly, basically, it left states to define the condition. You using the clinical criteria requiring three things, not one. The Supreme Court did this, basically.

They didn't say, here's the number. If they're under this, they're fine. If they're over this, whatever. They held that executing people with, quote, mental retardation violates the Eighth Amendment. But that's all they said. Yeah. But they didn't really say what that was and didn't define how you define that,

essentially. So they said that it requires all three of these things, significantly sub-average intellectual functioning, classically about two standard deviations below the mean, often operationalized around IQ of 70, significant limitations and adaptive behavior across conceptual, social, and practical domains onset before the age of 18.

So, okay. Virginia passed emergency legislation to track this structure. It's interesting, though. The score alone was not going to be enough. 72 was not a good number. The court order testing. Yeah, that's what they're saying. So then a later test by a Commonwealth psychologist in the fall of 2005 produced a 70.

So somewhere between 70 and 72. Or just bad day. You could have not slept well that day or something. Or somebody told her, try real hard to get it in the 60s. I don't think she'd have to try real hard. Seems like. So the measurement. error argument is real and the strongest thing her lawyers had, the IQ instruments carry a standard

of error measurement typically around plus or minus five points, which is why clinicians treat 70 to 75 as a gray zone rather than a boundary, and a 72 is not cleanly separable from a 69. That could be a 67. Yes. So, anyway, there's that. Now, August 12, 2010, Rodney Fuller makes an affidavit. He stated that everyone knew Teresa wasn't smart. and that Matthew was the dominant one in the relationship.

He said between Teresa and Matthew, Matthew was definitely the one in charge. Yeah. The affidavit, though, obviously runs in the opposite direction of Matthews. Fuller already had his deal, so he had nothing to lose here. John Grisham quoted that line in the Washington Post on September 12, 2010, in an op-ed, arguing that Lewis's death sentence was an example of the unfairness of the system. and making the point that had this. What could make a killer more culpable than repeatedly shooting a sleeping victim?

Yeah. Why are you doing these? He writes that the IQ just above 70, borderline retarded, quote, unquote, as such, lacks the basic skills necessary to organize and lead a conspiracy to commit a murder for hire. Right. So he goes on with this whole thing here about a lot about IQ tests and about Lewis was also a prolific writer in prison. frequently sending letters to various pen pals and trial counsel. Lewis even planned to and appeared for cosmetic appointments while incarcerated in preparation for her court appearances. Based on those operations, he opined that Lewis had the capacity to act intentionally.

Now, Grisham writes that Lewis had a dependent personality disorder and all that shit and just basically makes a big stink in the Washington Post. Women here not executed very often, like we said. the state has not executed a woman since Virginia Christian was put to death in 1912. She was convicted of murder in Elizabeth City County, which isn't even a county anymore. State law was changed in 1908, requiring all executions to be performed by the electric chair. And in Richmond, before that, they were hanged at local courthouses. So it's a lot. Nationally, as of January 1st, this is 2010.

Did I say here? Something like that. 2010. There were 52 women on death row across the country. Or 1.41% of the total death row population of 3,692. We do not like sentencing women to death. You guys are doing great. Period.

Yeah. If you're a woman and you get sentenced to death, you did some shit and it had some stank on it. Yeah. In the past 100 years, more than 40 women have been executed in the United States. United States, 10 of them since 1976. The last woman executed, Eileen Warnos in 2002. Yeah. Yeah.

According to a study, a professor of a professor here, he said, as of January 9, 2003, California and North Carolina have sentenced the most women to death with 16 each, followed by Florida with 15 and Texas with 13. Half of those in California were the Manson girls, though. Yeah. That was a difference. Oh, sentenced to death. Given death is a different story.

Yeah, exactly. California has 14 women on death row, twice as many as any other state, but they're never going to execute them. And twice the population, too. Also, more than that, yeah. Three women were, yeah, per capita, it's whatever. Three women were executed in 2001, all in Oklahoma. Jesus, Oklahoma, what are you guys doing over there? The most.

The fuck. What are those are you doing? Damn, the most executions nationally of women in any other year since 1953. Wow. Wow. 13 women who killed their husbands are currently on death row, five of whom have been sentenced to death in the past four years. 11 women who killed their children are currently on death row, six of whom have been sentenced in the last four years. August 25th, 2010, Clemency petition to the governor, Robert F. McDonald.

John Grisham was writing to the governor doing all this. A former Fluvana chaplain is campaigning publicly. this became a huge, I don't know if you remember this, but this was a big, this was a big fucking deal at the time. There was a lot of people that did not want her to get executed. Really? Yeah. Saying that, well, number one, she's a woman. And number two, she's mentally challenged.

Yeah. And she's mentally challenged. Yeah. That's what it is. So, yeah, they want a commutation. Teresa makes a statement to the governor, quote, I just want the governor to know that I am so sorry deeply from my heart. And if I could take it back, I would in a minute. I just wish I could take it back.

And I'm sorry for all the people that I've hurt in the process. The governor said, I thought she didn't pull a trigger. No, I would have put that in there. Having carefully reviewed the petition for clemency, the judicial opinions in this case, and other relevant materials, I find no compelling reason to set aside the sentence that was imposed.

Holy shit. She sends a request to reconsider on September 20th, denied like within an hour. The shit's going to expire. We got to go. Supreme Court. Yeah. They deny a stay.

Seven to two vote there. September 18th, she's moved from Fluvana to Greensville Correctional Center where the death house is. She spent her last hours praying and singing hymns. Her attorney said she was peaceful and she accepted what was coming a long time before. She wrote a message to her fellow inmates at Fluvana, which was. was read aloud at prison service. Man wants me to die, but I'm not worrying over this.

I'm trusting Jesus. He will forgive you of all your sins and he'll bring you into his loving arms. That's what I'm told. September 23rd, 2010, execution day. In an interview, she said, I wish I could give Kathy the world and take away her hurt.

Oh, that's the daughter. Last meal! What did she ask for? Peach Cobbler. Two fried shards. chicken breasts, sweet peas with butter, a doctor pepper, and apple pie. Apple pie, yeah. Not that bad, solid moves.

I always pick a nice dessert. Gotta have dessert. Yeah, it's like, I usually don't, but today, why not? Yeah, they run the strawberry ice cream a lot and apple pie and some cobbler. Those are they bring her, they bring her in. They have the phone there connected to the warden's office right next to the whole thing. It never rings. She comes in wearing a light blue shirt, dark blue pants and flip flops, and, uh,

They put her down and they put her down like a fucking arm. Wow. That's that. She said at the end, I just want the last words or I just want Kathy to know that I love you and I'm very sorry. Yeah, yeah. You're a German Shepherd today. Yep. Clim on the bed.

9.13 p.m. Wow. 2014, the Supreme Court decided in Hall v. Florida and held that the states cannot apply a rigid IQ 70 cutoff while ignoring the standard error, error of measurement, meaning five on each side. Teresa Lewis's lawyers were making that argument in 2010, but it became law in 2014. That would have helped her. They said, even a clean 70 doesn't produce an exemption without significant developmentally originating adaptive deficits, and that was the weakest developed part of her case and

the part the Commonwealth leaned on the hardest. They said, is 70 a hard floor or must the court treat 70 to 75 as a range requiring adaptive functional analysis. So that's the whole thing. March 2021, Virginia abolishes capital punishment. Oh, fuck. She just missed it, man. She is the last.

That's not bad, though. Normally, these could have kept it alive, kept it going. The last woman executed in the Commonwealth of Virginia is Teresa. First one since 1912 or whatever, and the last one to have it done. Under the law, none of the three conspirators in the case could be sentenced. to death today. And the last one in the United States today, right? I think we've killed a woman since then. Have we? 2010. Pretty sure.

Oh, that was just Virginia. We definitely did because there was a grandma. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. We've done, I think, cases where we've done that. Now, the boys there, the men, I should say, CJ and Julian here were buried at the school field cemetery in Danville, Virginia. Fuller, Rodney Fuller, still in prison. He, by the way, got in trouble a couple of times in May of 2012. One for assault on a law enforcement officer. And one same day possession of a cell phone. And he got an extra five years for each of those.

Oh, Rodney. He's currently ID number 114-4-49-2 in Lawrenceville Correctional Center. He's 43. He's only 43. These fucking ups. God damn it, Rodney. He's multiple life without paroles. Oh, right, right, right, right, right.

He's toast anyway. Amund got 20 years or whatever the fuck. Yes. By the way, the murder house is currently worth $118,500. It still exists. Three bedroom, two bath, 1,080 square foot on a 5.01 acre lot built in 2002. That is our house. Oh, my God.

That's what we put it on there. Brand new place. And they've ruined it. It's fucking murdered it up. So there you go, everybody. That is Virginia. My Christ, Virginia, you guys, that is some wild stuff. Keeling Virginia.

Yeah, yeah. That's just crazy. I don't know. I feel like if you give the shooter's life, you give her life. That's crazy. You can't give her worse than the people who actually think about Rodney shot a guy three times, then went back on another gun, went in, shot him twice more. That's so different than I'd like.

insurance money. It's just that's if you, if that guy doesn't go to the death penalty, you can't give her the judge really does not like her paying for murder in her child's pussy currency. Nope. And that's, I think that's a lot of what it was. That's a problem. Stank on it was I'll even manipulate my daughter. Right. You can't be the person being manipulated if you're also manipulating other people. I think that's how they probably looked at it. So anyway, there you go. You're sucking and and fucking at the same time too. That's not good. That's nice of each other. That's crazy. crazy weird and gross and creepy. Imagine if your dad was like,

mount up beside me, son. You'd be like, ew, fuck away from me. But it's like she outsourced one of the dicks because she was tired of taking both. That's like, ah, he'll get one. That's fine. Wow. So, anyway, there you go.

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we put out. All of our shows. Crime and Sports, your stupid opinions, all the small town murders, all ad free with your Patreon as well. And you get a shout out, which happens right now. Jimmy, do me a big favor here. Hit me with the names of the best goddamn people going. People who would never

have forced their daughters to have sex with us in cars and then murder us. You know, the Jimmy, hit me with them right fucking now. Does the executive producer of Peyton Meadows, Gary Howard's in Akron. Ohio. Jesus. Close to Cincinnati.

Happy hours in Midland, Texas. That's a wash, right? Yeah. Aaron Webb. Happy birthday, Aaron. Happy birthday. Justin Woodyard. And scout's favorite pibbling.

What's a pibbling, James? Beats the balls off of me. I don't know. John and Alicia Grant. Thank you both very much. Thank you. And Delaney Leversy are celebrating their fourth anniversary. They've been married for four years.

Christ, we met them when they weren't even married yet. That's crazy. Congratio now they have babies. They're one baby anyway. Nice people, though. We love you guys. Thank you. Corporal Carl Kirshner is back.

Hey, there he is. What's up, Purple Carl. Van Dam as well. Thank you. Oh, you guys are the best. Other producers this week. Janice Hill, a falsetto child? Janice.

A falsetto child. That's a overboard reference. Yeah. A falsetto child. Sorry. Did she say it matter of fact or was it a question? The kid went And she said

She just said A falsetto child Yeah Sorry, go ahead Lord Shitter I don't know what that means Michelle McGibony Wow

Dene Castro Shirley would know last name Danny would know last name Amy would know last name Gina would know last name Or Jina I don't know Matthew Magnum

Derek Augustino Carla McAleb Jennifer Chamber Stan and Laura Nunya would know last name Nate Valentine Brianna Giddens, Hendo would know last name. Christian Shea, Dr. Z, Tara.

Oh, is this tanned? Tanned, J? That's got to be. Oh, boy, I may have written a, that may be Tara. What's tanned? Is that somebody's real name? Jill McGrannahan, Crystal Townsend, Stacy Levin, Mackey, Hemphill. Krista would know last name.

Mitch Kutch, Terry would know last name. Kayla Elverrood. Phil Horibon. Doug Emerson, Brandy Bootsy, Buttsy, Jennifer Horley, Warley. Warly? He wants somebody to be whore tonight. She is horly. Horley.

Are you horley, dog? You doing horley, doc? Krista Pennington, Sealy, Sili Ritsua, Saili, Stacey Lauren, Mary Gad, Kathy Joe, McMahon, McMahon, that's McMahon. Jackson would no last name. Gaylord de Bois Jr. Michael Jones. Kendrick Pleasant. Barbara would know the last name. Cheryl Fury.

Jackie Stilson. Jennifer R. Jennifer Rockhold. I think that's the same person. She has two probably. Jennifer Rockold? Rockhold. That's like cuckled with... All right.

Luis Mendiola. Transmission money. Kylie Huth with no... Oh, that is her last name. Nancy Anderson, Groovy Juvie. Lawrence Neesie. Naisei Violet Shattuck? Yep.

Emily Danan. Degnan? Matthew Parton. Esther Brachama. Brakema. Brachima. Mariah Paiat Sarkawit. Huh.

Fuck. Trudy would know last name. Megan J. Nathan Phillips. Aaron Long. Ryan Fine Bros. Nicky Boudet. Diana Seeley.

Benjamin Halluer. Shansi? or Siancy? Sianse. Pam would know last name. Cody Sims, Erica Anderson. Jen would know last name.

Joshua Maness. Brian Allen. Cassandra Swaggerty. Kara Bergner. Miriam Phelps. Jamie would know the last name. Amy Adkins. Emily Adkins.

Alex Johnston. Praetorian. Preatorian. Stephanie Brenn. Brandon Bear. What is this? Aileen Dickinson. Corky Clough?

Clue loves Brittany, Santos. I don't know who either of them are. Ben Tardif, Tardif, Rita G, Tricia McPhee, Angie from Oz, Exeloma, Exeloma, R-Y-V-X-X-X, what is that, Rivix, Azana Reed, Kathy Looper, Andrew would know the last name, Hunter Pogue, Chris Peeler, Kimi Nguyen, Nikki would know the last name, Ashinushka Acharya, Atrea. Atrea. Kevin would no last name. Barb would no last name. Brian Wilkin. Brenda Coach, Cock, Koch, Coke. I don't know. Jenny Rhinewand. Rachel Finston. Shikari S. Drew Wionne. Abby would no last name. Tracy Shannon. Matthew Kramer. Angie J. Brian Bennett. Don would no last name. Corey Seiler. Truce. Tracy Cuday. Philip would no last name. Humann Sharifi. L. The letter. Jennifer Samir, Samir, DeAngelo, Casey, Michaela Rust, Janet would know last name. Paul Tate, Julie at 3, at Bits 3D, Krista Bauman, Alex Grace's, Jay Futch, Brandy H, Nikki R, Che Butter, Joyce Kreiger, Brian would no last name, Jason Sabine, Sean Johnson, hey Todd, I'm gonna marry Steve. Take that, Todd. Charles would know that's name Brad Brad Gobin, Chloe Lee, Andrea Holmquist,

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