Small Town Murder - When A Bloody Person Knocks - Spring Brook, Wisconsin

Episode Date: September 3, 2026

This week, in Spring Brook, Wisconsin, nothing is as it seems, when a bloody young woman stumbles up to a farm house door, with a word carved into her arm. She has a terrible story to tell, of barely getting away with her life. She says that she turned the tables on her would be killer, after being attacked in her car on a lonely farm road. The problem is, none of this turns out to be true, leaving detectives a twisted mystery to unravel, with shocking results!!   Along the way, we find out that Wisconsin has too many towns that have the same name, that wild rice takes too long to cook, and that you can only manipulate so many people, before the walls start to crash down on you!1   New episodes, every Wednesday & Friday nights!! Check us out on VIDEO Wednesday and Friday evenings on Netflix! www.netflix.com/smalltownmurder Go to shutupandgivememurder.com for all things Small Town Murder, Crime In Sports & Your Stupid Opinions!   Follow us on... instagram.com/smalltownmurder facebook.com/smalltownpod   Also, check out James & Jimmie's other shows, Crime In Sports & Your Stupid Opinions on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to podcasts!!

This week in Springbrook, Wisconsin, a young woman wandering up to a farmhouse covered in blood has a wild story to tell about fear and murder. But as everything she says just a ploy to cover up her own horribly bloodthirsty actions, welcome to small town murder. Hello, everybody, and welcome back to small town murder. Yay! Yay, indeed, Jimmy, yay indeed. My name is James Petrogal. I'm here with my co-host. I'm Jimmy Wiseman.

Thank you folks so much for joining us today on another wild, crazy, insane edition of Small Time Murder. We have a wild story for you. Just all sorts of strange relationships and awful murder. It's just terrible stuff. You're going to love it. Let's just put it that way. So before we get started, I do want to thank everybody who watches on Netflix, by the way. Wow.

Thank you for that. You guys are apparently watching all of it and sticking around and hanging out. So thank you so much. Also, if you do want to be. watch on Netflix and you enjoy what you see, you can listen. There are hundreds of episodes that came out before Netflix. So many. Before we were on. So you can listen anywhere you listen to podcasts, hundreds and hundreds of small-town murder episodes that are just as good as the ones you're watching. You can't always be around a TV. So, you know. And we might be coming to a city near you.

And then you can come see us at a show there. So definitely, and what you can do with that is head over to shut up and give me murder.com. And you can get tickets for live shows. Absolutely. We are going to be in Milwaukee on September the 18th at the PAPS, we released the last of our hold. So there's a few tickets left for that if they're not gone already. So check those out. The next night, Minneapolis State Theater, September 19th, get your tickets right now. Dallas, October 3rd, October 16th and 17th, San Jose Sacramento, and then Terrytown in Boston on the November 13th and 14th. So get in there and get your tickets.

Terrytown's almost sold out, by the way, too. Shut up and give me murder.com is where you do all of that. You should definitely listen to our other shows, too, crime and sports, which you don't have to like sports, we promise. You just have to like crazy stories of people that screw up even though they don't have to. It's great, I promise. It's wonderful. We assure you. I think you'll like the two guys who do it, too.

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So Patreon.com slash crime in sports is where you get all of that. Plus, you get everything we put out all of our shows, all of everything, all ad free when you subscribe as well. And you get a shout out at the end of the show where Jimmy will mention them all up. Wow, it's so much, I'll tell you. It's amazing.

And also, we have to do the disclaimer now. Yes. Disclaimer time. This is a comedy show, everybody. It is a comedy show. Murder happens as well, hence the title. So, yeah, that's, so you're going to have to deal with both, and you go, why do you do that? That's a mighty fine line to walk, and it is a fine line to walk, and we have great balance, so we can pull this off.

Because honestly, there's really one thing that we shouldn't do, and we don't do it. We never make fun of the victim or the victim's family. Why, James? Because we're assholes. Yeah. But we're not scumbags. That's all it is, pretty much. Otherwise, there's plenty of other stuff to make fun of just because why not?

We're comics and things happen and there's plenty to make fun of there. But, you know, we lay off the victims and the victims family because you don't need to do that. We can make fun of the murderer. Why not do that? We have no other recourse at it. So we do that. Either way, though, check it out. No complaining later is what we're going to say here because you never know.

That said, I think it's time to sit back, everybody. What do you say? Clear the lungs, shall we? Arms to the sky. And let's all shout. Shut on. and give me murder. Let's do this.

Okay. Let's go on a trip, shall we? Yeah. We're doing it. Let's do it right now. We're going to Wisconsin, everybody. Yeah. Steamy.

We will be going as well. We will be there on September the 18th at the Pabst. As a matter of fact, can't wait. One of the best, nicest theaters in the country. We're excited. But we're not going there this week. We're going to Springbrook, Wisconsin, just nowhere near the Pabst or anything that happened.

That happens there. This is in western Wisconsin. It's in the Wisconsin Dells area there. Yeah. Where they all go on summer vacation. Yeah. Like Northwoods, Dells, all that shit. Yeah.

Think great outdoors. That's, yeah. Yeah, those kind of things. Lakes and such? Lakes and, yeah, exactly, because that's where they were in the Northwoods. I don't know if they were in the Dells, but they were the Northwoods. But it's all Wisconsin.

It's all lakes and woods and cabins and, you know, suck my wake and pontoon boats and jets. skiing, I assume. The most local bitches you ever see. Local. And if you, whenever, you have to be careful when you're lining up your shot and pool because you're probably putting your stick in between a waitress's legs. You're probably doing.

You're probably going to hit a very local girl in the giner. Very low. Very local. And don't kiss the old men in wheelchairs. They're all dead. Don't do that. They, they, dead people will breathe on you, everyone. It's disgusting.

You don't want that. So, which I'm sure. It's available on Netflix. Great Outdoors. You should watch it. So anyway, this is about an hour and 25 minutes to Minneapolis. It's actually closer to Minneapolis than it is to the Milwaukee population. It's three hours and 50 minutes to Milwaukee. So really a lot the other way. And about three and a half hours to Fondelac, Wisconsin, our last Wisconsin episode, that was episode 686 serial killer motives. That was a, that was a wild one. The title says it all. Now, this is in Dunn County. We must, differentiate. between the Springbrooks now, which you son of a bitch is, I swear to God, when you're researching a town and you don't realize there's two goddamn Springbrooks and you're taking stuff from different ones and then you realize, oh God, these are different places and then you have to go back and find, oh, it's a nightmare, trust me. Why'd they do that? I can't. This is, first we were looking at a case in Wolf River and there's two different Wolf Rivers as well, which drove me insane. But now this is Springbrook. This is. This is Springbrook with a space. Spring Space Brook. I wish I knew because when you're researching it and you don't know that this is two different towns and you start taking bits from one town and bits from another Springbrook and putting them together, then realize they're not the same place. I have to go back and fix it all. You hate Wisconsin for a minute. Let me tell you something. Who allowed that? I have no idea. This is Spring Space Brook. Okay. There's also Springbrook, one word. That's a one word. That's a one word. That's a lot. That's a lot. That's. It's in Washburn County.

This is in Dunn County. Oh, see, James, that's how it's different. That's how it's different. And I don't think they're that far from each other either, which is even more maddening. So this is Area Code 715 and 534. A little bit of history of this town. Apparently, there was a lot of wild rice going on in this place. As we found out, this region is very ricey.

A lot of rice. The Menominee tribe spread wild rice everywhere. We did an episode in Monominee. Wisconsin, and they were very excited that we pronounced it correctly, by the way. They were jacked for that. I had to thank Roz from Frazier for that, because that's the only way I knew. So by the time... The only gripe I have about wild rice is it takes for fucking ever to cook that shit.

Otherwise, it's crunchy. You got to get that water in there. You're going to bust a filling on that shit and go, what the hell is in here? Metal pieces? And as much as much water as it tells you to use, use double that. Yeah, just keep soaking. It evaporates before the rice can suck it in. It's tough, man.

It's a sturdy rice. It is. So by the time there's any European people here, the area now that's Dunn County was inhabited by the Santee Dakota who are in a feud with the Ojibwa people as well. Yeah. So that's something there. O'Gibwe? O'Gibwee? This is just with an A.

I think it's a J-I-W-A. I think it is, too. I think you're right. So also there was the Knapp Stout and Company. They began in 1846 to become one of the largest lumbering operations that they've ever had anywhere in the world. Nap Stout owned over one, wow, half million acres of pine land in the Red Cedar Valley. And they cut two million board feet of pine and conducted retail and wholesale merchandising operations as well. They had a steam mill, a shingle mill.

Yeah, I was... Do those shake shingles. That was my dream as a young boy to open a shingle mill of my very own. I want a shake shingle house. It's just a house full of kindling. I really was looking for it. But you know what? No one would believe in me.

Give me the initial seed money and I couldn't do it. Yeah, the bank told me that sounds flammable. So they strongly influenced construction, railroads, and all sorts of shit here. Because basically, they were the company of the county. They were like a coal company in some hill, Kentucky Hill town, basically. Everyone was dependent on them for everything. So they kind of did what they want. The Dunn County, they put together a company for the Civil War, the Dunn County Pinery Rifles, Pinery.

Oh, yeah. Stocks. Yep. And they fought in a shitload of wars, a shitload of battles, second bull run, Antietam, Chancellorsville, the Wilderness, Pennsylvania, Cold Harbor. These are some of the worst battles. Some of the biggest. Chancellor'sville was nasty. Cold Harbor was a nasty battle.

Petersburg. So it's interesting. Now, there's no reviews for this town. Cannot find any. Not a review for the town itself. They don't want you to know. Yeah. But I did find a couple of reviews for the Springbrook Resort, which is on the Dells there.

That's fun. Okay. So we'll find out. Owen says five stars. Absolutely amazing. Worth the extra price for this day was really cool, the cabin backed up to a par three. Oh, that's nice. The Springbrook Resort. I guess, fuck, I don't know. Maybe you're on the T or the whole. I'm not sure. The whole course of the par three,

huh? Maybe, yeah, par three course, maybe. That's what they're saying. Not at a par three hole. Every hole is three for par. Yeah. The Springbrook Resort Company texted me several times to see if I needed anything and also responded right away. More than enough room for my full adult group of 11. Ugh. A group of 11, is that right? 11 adults. Is that?

That has to be like a bachelor party or 11 Wisconsin's though. A Nites, what do they call themselves? Wisconsinites. Drunks would be a better way to put it. 11 adult Wisconsinites all in the woods. Wow. Oh, this person's actually from Rockford, Illinois, which is not better. So they're drunk too.

Next, Courtney from Chicago, one star. We are here around 3 p.m. was told the room is not ready until 4. We are still waiting right now at 504. Well, listen, you're not getting any of James's sympathy. Yeah. Hotels me. Hotels are like, well, it should be ready by bed time.

I don't know. We'll keep walking around the city for a while. You'll be fine. Every time we get to the hotel, they go, check-in's not until four. And we go, yeah, I was just kind of hoping, no, not till four. You know, like, okay, well. And then six o'clock rolls around. They're like, we're real sorry.

Yeah. I'm sure you're real sorry. Yeah. Oh, you're a stickler for time, but now it's six. I see how this works. Okay. Yeah, wouldn't it be nice to walk up there and just be like, no, no, check-in was at four. Check-ins at four.

I'm going to go to a room, so you just, you know, I'm going to barge in while one of the maids are cleaning one and just say it's mine now. You better give me a key in number because I'm going to one. I am happening. It's happening. We are frequent travelers and but far, and but far, not by far. This is the worst experience, not the worst. I'm sorry, the worst experience. This is the worst experience for explanation points.

Then there's a response from Julie M, the business manager, who says, sorry to hear this. We want to make sure everybody receives attentive thing, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Then says best, Mira, who is not Julie, who is the person and picture that posted back to her. So I'm very confused. You don't know what's going on up there. People in this town, 1764, not a big town, small. Yeah. Men and women, this is wild.

55.8% men in this town, which is, I don't know what they're, they're still logging or what? Because that's a huge difference. Median age here is just almost exactly the national average, 38.8. This is a lot of married people here, 60.2% married in this town, which is a lot of, lot, 7.1% single with children, which is way below the national average. So it's interesting. I think more men are willing to be this remote. I get, I think, or I think maybe a lot of these resort places have a lot of like jobs that are like kind of outdoor like, you know,

dirt bag transient dude jobs. You know what I mean? They like live in a shed up in the trees. You can't get women to do that. They're like, that's disgusting. It's tough. It's a tough pitch. It's a tough sell.

Enough beer. I can make it work. You know, they don't give a shit. He isn't handy wipes from my long John Silvers to clean with. We're disgusting. We're pigs. We're pigs. Race here, 86.7% white, 0.8% black, 2.8% Asian, 3.6% Hispanic.

Wisconsin is there. Religion, 48.8% religious. And the highest, by far. 25.4% of the people here are Lutheran with a bullet to the top, Lutheran. Yeah, we got that. Not a lot of anybody else, really. It's a lot of Lutheran. Unemployment, a little bit low, a little bit under the national average, which I assume there's always resort-type jobs to pick up around here.

It's always something to do. Median household income here is actually high, only by about $3,000, but high, $72,000 a year. So not terrible. Cost of living. 100 is average for the whole country here. It's 86. Oh, that's great. Not bad.

Median home costs $316,300 bucks. Right up the middle. Not bad. Yeah, it's not terrible. Now, if we've convinced you, damn it, this is the only place you'll be happy on this beautiful green earth of ours here. We have for you the Springbrook, Wisconsin Real Estate Report. All right. Your average two-bedroom rental here goes for $1,020 a month, which is well below the national average.

It's not bad at all here. Now, the houses I found very interesting, weird little houses. Here is a one-bedroom, one bath, 480-foot. Essentially, it looks like a lot shed, basically. It's a tiny house. It's a super small. Oh, sitting right by itself in the middle of five acres. by the way. Wow. So it makes it seem even smaller, really, if you think about it.

You want room but feel like you have none? Yeah, you want to do that? Want to have plenty of room outside and none inside? Want to feel great in the summer and horrible in the winter when you're sitting in this tiny house and can't leave? Hardwood floor is pretty nice on 5.03 acres. 140,000 bucks for that. Much, I mean, for the acreage. For five acres, that's not bad. It's not bad. Here's a three-bedroom two bath, 1,820 square foot house, raised ranch, detached garage. It's green. It's like a weird, like, pea green, which I don't care for very much here. Mint? More yellow than mint? No, more pee, more dull than mint. Doesn't have like a... Mint has some verve to it, you know what I mean? A little bit of... More yellow in the green than...

Yeah, I guess. I don't know. Also, I'm bad with colors. I can't see purple and blue. blue look the same to me and shit. So I have, I have some color issues. So I don't know. Does I not call that colorblind? I don't know. I don't think it's like officially. It's just my little fucked up. My rods and cones are a little off. I'm not sure there. I'm not getting right. But maybe. I don't know. 1820 square feet. This thing is $363,000. $1.89 acres, not terrible. And then here's the most expensive one I could find. Two bedroom, two bath, 1,216 square. feet. It's on 9.6 acres. It's a little house, got a little porch on it. It's nice. Just had a $5,000 price cut. $44,000 for that. Seems like the Midwest dream is to have 10 acres and no fucking

house. And no house. Well, I think, because if you're buying these houses, these aren't to live in. These are summer cabins, summer cabins, vacation places. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's the dream of anyone who lives in Milwaukee, Chicago, it seems like, any of the Minneapolis, they want to have a nice little house and all this, and then they want a lake house for the summer. To go away, too. Yeah. Summer is such a big deal to them because it's so short and it's not, you know, and it's so cold in the winter. They love it. Let's get out there and get Lyme disease.

Let's do. I need a tick to bite me now. Any chiggers around? Because I really would love to have one burrow into my skin. Things to do here. I'll grow up. Things to do here. Wisconsin Dells shit, boating, fishing, outdoor shit.

Yeah. Also go to the Wozawa fall festival. Wozawa, W-O-Z-H-A-W-A, spaces in between those. Which translates to fun time to have fun, which seems redundant. But, I mean, I guess it's not an exact translation. It's derived from the Ho-Chunk. tribe, Jesus.

It is a landmines of watch out for slurs here. Jesus. It's just not our language. Oh, junk. They call it three unforgettable days

of family, fun, local flavor, live entertainment, shopping, and Wisconsin Dell's tradition. Fuck yeah. And they have your carnivals and farmers markets and antique markets. And then the little priest's singers

will be there. The what? Little priest. to singers a southern Ho-Chunk family drum group based in the Wisconsin Dells. These are like wearing the traditional tribal clothing. Don't worry.

Tony Rocker will be there at seven, though. It just says live music on Elm Street. Doesn't say what he is, Tony Rocker. On Saturday night, high mileage will be there. Oh, boy. Oh, yeah. And then there's a parade. Yay. Okay. Not much

going on. Crime rate in this town. What we're interested in here. property crime is about half the national average. So pretty safe. Not a lot of stealing going on here. People are too drunk to steal, I feel like. Violent crime, murder rape robbery, and of course, assault, the Mount Rushmore of crime is about one-third beneath the national average. Oh, that's terrific.

Yeah. I'm sorry, not beneath one-third of the national average, so two-thirds low. Oh, even better. Pretty damn safe. That said, let's talk about some murder that happened here. What do you say, everybody? Let's do this. Okay.

Wow, is this a wild story, by the way? And if you really are interested in this story, you can watch the entire trial on YouTube. It's all there. Court TV did an entire. They have it all. There's also several accounts. Several accounts that have all of the stuff and all the interrogations and everything. So you can really get an assload of this case, which,

makes putting the case together very difficult because you have to decide what you can you can't have a nine hour show. So we have to decide kind of what belongs and what doesn't and, you know, because to me, all the facts are interesting. Although according to Netflix, James, they'll watch it. Yes, that you guys like the long episodes on there we hear. So that's great. You'll stick around. You'll stick around. We appreciate that. So let's start out at March 22nd, 2018. So very recently, pretty much, you know, everything in your normal, you still have the same phone, an upgraded model of different operating system. You can listen to us on iTunes.

Yeah. We are literally on doing small-town murder right now as this is going on. I'm sure an episode came out that day. Yeah. So March 22nd, 2018, 4 p.m. This is about 4.15, actually, to be fair here. Okay, a 911 call comes in from a farmer, like an 85-year-old farmer here, in the middle of nowhere in Wisconsin. He's still farming.

Still farming. Got nothing better to do. Where's he going to go? Don Sipple is his name, okay, this old man. Don Sipple says, quote, I have a young lady that just came to my house and somebody attacked her. Pretty matter of factly. He was sitting down to eat dinner when. a young woman starts banging on his doorstep.

He arrives at his doorstep banging on his door, begging for help. John's sitting down for dinner at 4 the afternoon. 4.15, to be fair to Don. He is 85 and a farmer. So between being 85 and a farmer, I assume he gets up at about, what, 205 a.m. usually, probably. I am 15, maybe. I'm 45, not a farmer, and I dream of this day.

Oh. In bed by seven? Yeah, four is definitely Four is lunch for me for sure. That's not dinner. I ate dinner like 10 o'clock at night, usually. Yeah. So, yeah, that's weird.

Maybe, well, give me another 40 years. Maybe I'll change my mind. Who knows, man? I might run this life different. Just turn that clock this way a little bit. So, when asked what he thought was happening, when someone ran up to his door,

he said, I had no idea. She kind of had like dried blood or something around her mouth, no shoes on mud up to her knees. Oh, she ran through a swamp. You don't get this on a farm in the middle of nowhere, usually. Some stranger running up covered in blood with mud all over the place here. By the way, this comes from an interview with CBS News, who did a lot of extensive coverage on this. So I've got to give them the credit that they deserve.

So he brought her inside, being a friendly farmer and kind of a bloody young lady. And she looks like she might be late teens even. So I'm like, oh, she's a young lady. A young woman, yeah. So anybody who's 85 would take a grandfatherly or if they're gross, they'd take a pedophile approach. But either way. Certainly, yeah. They take some sort of.

One way or the other. They're going to have some interest in this young lady. Whether to help her or do horrible things to her. Help or her. One of the two. One of the two. And she running up to a dark farmhouse in this condition, I'm sure, was happy to see. an 85-year-old farmer.

You know what I mean? Rather than somebody else or whatever. So he brings her in, offers her a blanket. And, you know, he says, because this is in March, so it's cold, you know. Still chilly. It's still chilly in Wisconsin. It doesn't get warm until, what, mid-July there? Till about first week of August.

Once it's warm. Yeah. Oh, boy, is it warm. It's warm for about three, four weeks. And then it goes right back to it. So miserable. I hope fall gets there. by the time we get there.

That'd be nice. Yeah. On September the 18th, we'll be at the Pabst. Yeah. So, and then the state theater of Milwaukee the next night, either.

Anyway. Very next night. Very next night, September 19th, state theater, Minneapolis. So, this guy is clueless.

He brings her in. Here's a blanket. He said, quote, she was cold, and I think, I'm sure, in shock.

And then she said, I was assaulted. And then I went and got on the phone and called 911. And that's what happened here. She was bleeding. Her clothes were torn.

She's covered in mud. I'm saying she's being attacked. I mean, anybody would call 911 in that situation. So once the police get there, you know, there's the body cam footage that they have or dash cam or one of the two where she says, I'm so scared. And they said, where are all are you hurting from right now? The cop ass. And she said everywhere. And the cop said, okay.

And she keeps asking for some, she said, please contact this person. Please contact Jason Mengle. Please, I need Jason Mengle. Please contact Jason Mengle. And we'll find out who he is in a little while. So she's taken to the hospital where she's treated and undergoes a sexual assault examination completed by a sexual assault nurse examiner. They have special people that are, you know, they're extra, I'm sure, nice. Yeah.

Yeah, probably ladies, I would assume. Generally, pretty gentle folks. Yeah. Yeah, they get the nicest nurses and they're like, you're going to be the one that talks to people who come in with having the worst day of their life, okay? You're going to be that lady that's six days from retirement and hates this gig anymore. No, not the lady at the front desk that says sprinkler key sticking out of your eye. That'll be three hours. Go sit down and doesn't even give you a second look without making eye contact.

They don't care. So that is funny that they triage and take the most, take the most injured people. Well, my daughter had, like, a sprained ankle wearing the fucking emergency room. A lady walked in bleeding. My daughter goes, great, this bitch is going before me. Oh, yeah. Take it easy. She's certainly going before you.

Yeah. Great. Here's this bitch. For us, she's bleeding. Calm down. Jesus. Oh, my God. She has rebar sticking out of her chest.

We should probably let her go first. You just called that bloody lady a bitch to her face. Come on, you whining, bitch. Look at this fucking whiner. She's nothing but a whiner. Look at her. Faker, malingerer. She's bleeding.

I'm in pain. There's a difference. Gunking up the gears here. Fuck you. Meanwhile, she's sitting there a little ice on her ankle going, this is wrong. I can't do that. Well, it's an angry kid. Oh, man.

So they, using this whole kit, they examine abrasions and lacerations to various areas of this young lady's body. Okay. Okay. Now, lacerations to her left arm appear to be letters cut into her skin. It's not appear to be. Their letters carved into her skins. Spelling B-O-Y, boy. Uh-huh.

Boy. On her arm. Okay. Boy. She says she cannot remember. what happened or if she was sexually assaulted. She has no idea what happened. Just has a word card in her arm, covered in mud and blood, and no idea what happens.

So they do the sexual assault thing just in case because she says, I don't know if I was sexually assaulted. So essentially, this doctor takes a look at her and determines that they believe these wounds are self-inflicted. Oh. We'll tell you how they believe that, because it's just basically. logic of when you see it, of why that is, and refers to her for a mental health evaluation. Okay. She's then admitted to a secure psychiatric unit. And let's find out who this young lady is.

Because right now, she's like Goldie Hawn and overboard. Like she shows up, she has no idea what's going on. She's been battered a bit here. Annie Gulloughy. Annie Gulloughy. Now, her name originally. not what she's going by now and we'll get to that

and we'll get to also identity and everything else is Monica K. That's what she's born. Okay? Yeah. She's born as Monica K. Later on,

and we'll find out why here, she's born October 6, 1997, a small town Wisconsin kid. Her mom was 14. Oh, boy. 14. Which, I mean, that's a victim.

That's crazy. Yeah. Unless the father's 13, that's a problem. That's a, you know, that's a problem. Yeah. Yeah. Unless the father's an eighth grader and she's a ninth grader, then I'll let it slide. And, uh, you know. But I mean, obviously, today that's a problem. But, uh, in 1965, that's as long as you marry or whatever. But today, I was going to say, and in 97, that's a big problem. We'd be planning a reception if this was 1965. People be deciding who's going to bring the potato salad if it was 1965. Yeah, yeah. For sure. So her father ditches the family pretty much immediately because why not? Because he rapes kids, James.

What was it to say? People who fuck 14 year olds generally don't, they're not looking to settle down at that moment. That's not a reliable guy? It's strange, right? Weird. So mom ends up marrying a different guy who will raise her as his own. Okay. A guy named Joe Shane, I believe, is his name.

So then those two mom and her dad essentially, not biologically, but Joe, end up getting a divorce as well when she's about 11 or 12. She says she was in middle school at that point. She said that it was the household was like living with two tornadoes in one room at that all the time, basically, with those two. Volatile. And yeah, she said that they're both. Her Joe and her mom were both very strong opinionated people and they would just often butt heads. And my mom and my mom and she said that they would disagree about ways that he would discipline her as well and like rules for her and shit like that. So they would argue.

Her mother's name is Rosalina or Rosalena by the way. So then and later on I guess this is, okay, that was when she changed her name by the way. The guy, Joe Shane's last name is Carlin, and that's the name she takes, not George Carlin, like K-A-R-L-E-N. So she's Monica Carlin at some point in there. She takes that name. So then, after the divorce, Joe, Joe Shane actually, because he had adopted her and everything else, they stay close and she goes and sees him on the weekends. Oh, the co-parent. Nice.

Yeah, that's her, his daughter. Now, she'll end up going by a different name by the time she's at a farmer's door covered in mud and blood, okay? She's going by Ezra McCandalous, okay? What should pick those shits from? Mick Candle and then with two S's. So, McAndalus. I know I'll tell you exactly where it came from because she says. She's small, too, 5-2-1-15, little tiny thing.

So why Ezra, why she's picked this different name, she said that she was going through a lot of changes when she was a teenager and the name best represented who she was. She went on a family vacation. She said, and saw the name Ezra somewhere. I don't know, some 90 CD possibly. And she thought it was a nice neutral name. It wasn't too feminine.

It wasn't too masculine. And she didn't know how she felt at the time. so she picked this name basically. Okay. Yeah. And by the way, she will have a, you know, pronoun change for a while. She'll go by the they thing. But then by the time we're done with all this, she's filing everything as she, she, she, she, she.

So that's why we're using she. Whatever. We're not trying to do whatever. We're just fucking, that's what she calls herself, she now. So that's what we do. So she picked the last name McCandalous for a guy named Chris McAndalus, who is from, was from into the wind, or into the wild. I'm sorry, not into the wind.

Oh, from the book? From the book and movie, okay? Oh. Yes. He also, by the way, if you don't know who he is, he went by the pseudonym, Alexander Super Tramp, which is a much more. Well, it's a much more fun name. I found my new name.

That's pretty great, Alexander Super Tramp. Yeah, you can't. I already copyrighted it for porn, Jimmy. It's all mine. I'm Alexander Super Tramp. Take me away. What does Super Tramp mean? Because that was a band.

Yeah. Yeah. I don't know what it means. Evidently, it's a big deal, huh? I guess if you're a hobo, you're like the best hobo. You ride the most rails. You're Super Tramp. Wow.

I'm going to be extra hobo. That's going to be my name. When I'm out of things, I use my bindle as a cape. It's great. Yeah. Wee. He's an American adventure who sought an increasingly nomadic lifestyle as he grew up. Just reading his description of who he is.

He graduated from Emory University in 1990 and traveled across North America and hitchhiked to Alaska in April of 1992. There he entered the Alaskan bush with minimal supplies hoping to live simply off the land. How about that? You're going to get eaten by a bear. You're crazy. You're going to die. That is unforgiving shit Alaska. It is not meant for the weak and the unprepared are not, not that he's weak, but that's unprepared.

You have to be. The wildlife, regardless of whether you find a bear. There's so many other things that'll kill you. Wolves like crazy up there. Yeah, you'll never be found. They'll eat your bones. It's lousy with wolves up there, man. It's crazy.

You're going to be turned into something's shit. No, shit. Now, on the eastern bank of the Shoshana River, this guy found an abandoned bus, Fairbanks Bus 142, which he used as a makeshift shelter. His final written journal entry noted Day 107,

That's what it was titled. He made it fucking four months. Four months. Simply read beautiful blue berries. Days 108 through 112 contain no words and were only marked with slashes. On day 113, there was no entry.

And... I feel like the berries probably weren't good. Yeah. Not a bad berry. Beautiful blue berries. Wow, they make crazy colors, man. Holy shit. All I can write is a sloth.

last day. Beautiful blue berries just had a conversation with several care bears. Things are going well. They're not bears. I can hear their stomachs growling. They're going to eat. Oh no. Wait. That's a grout. They don't care at all. That's not a rainbow on your stomach, is it? Oh, no. So basically, near this time, around this time, he took a picture of himself waving while holding up a written note, which said, I have had a happy life and thank the Lord. Goodbye. and may God bless all. And on September 16th, 92, a hunter who was seeking shelter for the night discovered that the bus

discovered this bus and entered the bus and found his body. So, decomposing remains in a sleeping bag. He weighed only 67 pounds. Just You can't do it up there, man. No. This guy, Grizzly, man, what is wrong with people?

That too. That should be enough for everybody to know. You can't do it unless you own a house. It's ridiculous. There's a lot of debate, by the way, is officially ruled as starvation, but there's a ton of debate as to how he really died. Even when you find a 67-pound man talking about, I ate berries fucking emaciated in a sleeping bag, there's still conspiracy theories. It's real. We got to stop, dude, with the conspiracy theories.

All the evidence right in front of your face. And you're like, nah, he was murdered. There's cases where both sides agree on the facts and people are like, nah, no, I don't think so. I think it's there. It's like, what are we talking about anymore? Clearly, gang violence. Yeah, it's so fucking weird. So anyway, in 1993, outside magazine wrote an article about him and then published into the wild, the book, which was then adapted into the 2007 film, directed by Sean Penn, actually.

Right. starring Emil Hirsch playing him. So it's a big movie. Oh my God, James. I was thinking Call of the Wild. I can't believe I nailed it right that it's still a book. Well, yeah, that's the old book that they made you read in like seventh grade, The Call of the Wild, wasn't it?

Yeah, I'm an embarrassment. Jack London or some shit. Yeah, right. Well, they actually made a documentary called Call of the Wild about him, though. So maybe you saw that. Well, what the fuck? Maybe you saw that. There's into the wild, call the wild.

That was in 2007 was both the movie and the documentary. So either way. Now, back to Ezra, said she identified as more masculine in high school and then got more back into femininity and said she was more fluid. And she now. Now, she's back. Okay. All right. Now, very artsy, super into art.

I think she just, a lot of people just have an open mind. And it's their artsy a lot of times. So they think about things. is this actually how I feel about this? Is this actually how I feel about that? So she was real into arts and she was, you know, four or five years old and all that kind of thing. Wow. Yeah.

After high school, she attended college to pursue a degree in art, but dropped out in the first year, as Ezra does with a lot of things. Yeah, well, as arts people do. Yeah. Yeah, that's the thing. Now, her parents said, well, if you're not going to go to school, then you need to get a job and help out. at home essentially. Oh. Go to school or get a job.

Pick one. Part of it. Yeah. It's fine. So she decided to couch surf and sleep in her car instead of doing that. No, I thought that. How about I sleep in my car? All right.

By the way, about her car, she has like a, you know, a 2015 or so Impala or whatever, a white one Chevy. And she does artwork on her car. and like a bunch of it. Like her whole roof is decorated with like it looks like a bird, like a crow riding a bicycle kind of thing. But I actually dig her style. It's a lot like her style is very Ralph Stedmany to me. You know who Ralph Stedman is?

No. You know that is Ralph Stedman. You know, you know exactly. You've seen his picture because I have one of his drawings of Hunter Thompson on my living room wall. Oh, okay. Yeah, okay. I could see it. Yeah.

He's the guy who does all the Hunter Thedmanman. Yeah. Chaos. And like aggressive. Sometimes. Yeah. Colored in an interesting way. Yeah.

And angles are interesting. It's very much look up Ralph Stedman stuff. I got a shitload of his stuff. I love Ralph Stedman's shit because it's like he would write, draw the pictures to Hunter Thompson's stories basically. Yeah. It's chaotic. It's chaotic. It's, uh, yeah.

It's not real uniform. It's not traditional drawings. No. It's, but you look at it and you go, wow, that's very interesting. Yeah. It's very. Yeah. Yeah. Well, in chaos, a lot of his drawings comes from the fact that he's drawing Hunter Thompson, who is in a constant state of chaos. So that's how he sees him and draws him.

Other shit that he draws isn't so chaotic, but it's got that same style of lines and thicker to thinner and things like that. Yeah. Hard lines. Yeah, a lot of hard lines. And pretty cool. Things are kind of harsh. So she found herself and hanging out in O'Clair, the college town there in O'Claire, Wisconsin. which is about 20 minutes away from Springbrook, by the way. There, in July of 2017, she met a man, okay? Yeah. All right. Not even really a young man.

I was going to say a young man, but he's 33 years old, so he's not even really that young at the time. She's 19. He's 33. Jason Mengle. And I've seen his name spelled either M-E-N-G-A-L or M-N-G-E-L. I've seen it spelled both ways on like official documents, so I have no fucking idea. Now, he's an army reservist. He's a medic in the army.

So he goes off and does some stuff. I don't think he has a car because he's always on a bicycle in this story. Really? Yeah, he gets around pretty good on a bicycle, but he's always on a bicycle. And he lives in like this college town, so that's kind of fine in a college town. Everything's kind of close. Part for the course, yeah. Like we've been to like Madison, a bicycle would be the appropriate way to get around there, it seems like.

Yeah, as long as you live in a specific area, but yeah, some of that area, yeah, as long as you live near the college, if you live out in the woods of, yeah. Madison, you ain't getting around shit on a bike. No, no, you're going to be, you better have a fucking, specifically winter. Yeah. Yeah, that's going to be tough, a little bit tougher. Yeah, that Madison, they are, man, that is a drunk town. Boy, oh, boy. You walk, guy.

And, you know, I've been there during winter. They don't plow like they plow back east. Like, they plow the main roads, but the side streets, you're on your own. Tough shit, yeah. Get some snow tires, asshole. That's all there is to it. Wow. So this Jason, Jason is outside of Reese's coffee place, which is our racies, I'm sorry,

Racy's Coffee, Racy Delaney's, I believe it's called, which is where this is the coffee house everybody hangs out at. Everybody is always at this place. People end up working there. They go there. They hang out there for hours. It's like a Kevin Smith movie. They're all like sitting around talking about comic books in a coffee shop for hours or something. It's an interesting.

You know, kids will do that. I mean, he's a 30-something-year-old. man, but that's what I was going to say. Kids find that one spot still and they congregate there. Yeah. So this guy, he's, he had a flat tire on his bike. You're 33 and you're sitting outside the college coffee place bummed out because you've got a flat on your fucking 10 speed. You got to reexamine your life at that point. This is not what you have had planned. Rest is that. Hard reset. Yep. So there's a nighttime barista that's working named Alex Woodworth. Now, Alex gives Jason, because everybody knows each other, they all know each other. He gives Jason some leftover coffee that they had, you know, they're a throw out anyway, gives it to a minute to go cup and locks the doors and tells Jason to, you know, I guess hang out on the bench. You can hang out in front on the bench.

So now he's sitting there looking like kind of bummed out and looking like a lost puppy. So that catches the attention of a young lady. Ezra. She pops up and some people just need to bring in the strays. And that's all there is to it. That's what they're looking for. Exactly. So she popped up and said, what's the matter?

And they ended up talking for hours after that. Just for hours about everything. They exchange social media info and all that kind of shit. So they go from like messaging on Instagram. That's their way of communicating. And then within about two and a half weeks they're living together. Very quick. Not two and a half weeks to exchanging phone numbers.

No, no, no. Two and a half weeks and she gave him the, he gave her the front door key. Two and a half weeks from what's the matter to. Yeah. This chick's moving in with us. I'm going to bed, honey. What are you climbing in? Yeah.

Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Which is a wild decision on both of their parts. And this is a 33-year-old man with a bike and a roommate also. Like, what? There's another person? Oh, yeah. He doesn't live on his own.

Oh, my God. People with, you know, I don't know, any sort of upward anything, don't just sit around going, man, my bike tire's flat. Oh, yeah. On a bench. Like, you got to have some movement, and he has none. Yeah. If a bike tire hamstrings your day at 33, my guy, you got to get it together. And your roommate won't give you a ride.

You got to, that's a problem. A lot of levels. So Jason's a medic in the Army reserves, like we said. So he would have to be away for weeks at a time once in a while. And Ezra does not like that at all. At all. They're not into that. She doesn't like him leaving at all.

Okay. Which she's got abandonment issues. Yeah. Obviously. You know what I mean? Never knew her real father very much. Or the stepfather, they got broken up and all that kind of thing. So she gets upset.

If a guy leaves, she assumes he's never coming back, you know, basically. Yeah. If he's going to get a pizza, she's coming with because he might not come back. She's terrified. Yeah. Yeah. So Jason was all- Rony my ass.

I'm getting in the car. Yeah, fuck that. No, no, no. Yeah, sure you want sausage. I'm coming with. So she was, he's also critical of the fact that she's kind of very affectionate with other dudes in their social circle. Okay. They have a pretty good social circle, a bunch of people they hang out with.

And, yeah, she's very kind of friendly. And, uh, okay. You know those girls. Sometimes it's fine. And then sometimes it can make you uncomfortable or whatever the fuck. And sometimes you've got to just loosen up and realize that grow up, you know, and like, don't be so upset about it. about shit like that. At 33, it shouldn't be your concern.

Unless she's following them somewhere and blowing them. That's whatever. Yeah, if she's rubbing on their balls or something, that's a different thing. But if she's just a friendly person with their friends, you should like that she's friendly, I guess. Yeah. Some people show their emotions physically. Yeah. Now, this is from Ezra.

She said, I met Jason outside of a coffee shop one night after a music festival. Racy Delane's is a coffee shop. And he said he was doing. They said he seemed, she said he seemed quite frustrated. So I said, well, what's the matter? And we just instantly started talking. And we talked all night after that, all night long conversation. We exchanged information.

We'd begun texting back and forth. And we started seeing each other after at that time. Now, I guess she was living with her mother in Stanley, Wisconsin at the time. Okay. So they said that the texting went on and it led to dating. and she said that, quote, I would say would be the word we fell in love quite fast because we just had so much in common

and how in the beginning of that age difference, specifically the age difference, well, I wasn't concerned necessarily that we had an age gap. I felt a bit awkward that he was so much older than me. He was even close to my own parents' age. Right. Her mom's 14 years, 19, 13,000.

1933. How many years is that? Oh my God. They're the same age. Same close. Same fucking age. Oh, my God. Has her mother. Which, I mean, I guess that could happen when you have a 14-year age difference between parent and child, but that's right away, you'd go, ooh, you're the same age as my parents.

That's kind of weird, right? Sure makes it relatable, though, doesn't it? Makes it easier. Yeah. Well, I mean, any amateur's like, psychologist can dig into that one and understand what's going on here. But, you know, we're not going to, we're not going to bother with it. Looking for dad, and that would be about the right age. Exactly. The same age as her parents.

Yeah. That's what's crazy. Jason said, I was 33 at the time. She was 19, I believe. She kept me energized. You're not 73. She kept me. Boy, I was just spending my night sitting in the recliner, sitting on the rocking chair, just a whittling, you know, just waiting to

die and she came in and boy I felt so much more energy now. Really lights up her room this cow. Oh boy. Makes an old man get that youthful spark. Yeah, you know the spark. You know how it feels. Down in your nether regions. You know how that kind of goes. I don't like

somebody that's dating somebody 14 years younger than and she's still a teenager. I don't like him saying she energized. That's gross. It's creepy and shit. Yeah. That's something That's something that old people say when they get a puppy. Or this puppy's energized me.

Yeah. When their children bring the grandchildren around. Yeah, the kids give me energy or whatever the fuck it is. It's not the person you're fucking. He said she kept me doing things and I was very spur of the moment too. He said she was full of surprises because he didn't even know she was, that wasn't her real name. Yeah. Ezra.

He said, I just knew her as Ezra. She did not like being called Monica. He said, oh, Claire's a big little town. Everybody kind of knows everybody. And, you know, and everybody knew Ezra because she was the chick who had a goddamn car with painted drawings all over it. That person stands out. You know what I mean? So it's a white or silver or something.

But, yeah, it's got like a bird ride in a bicycle. It looks like a raven or a crows. row, Jason said she was wild. She'd always be like trying to break into abandoned buildings and take photos, which is half of YouTube now. Is that wild? It's not really that wild in 2000. That's what, like when we were doing that in the 90s, it was probably more, because we weren't documenting anything. We were just checking it out, looking for places to finger each other and smoke weed and drink beer.

Probably throw something heavy through an old pane of glass to see what it does. Oh, if you find a toilet that's still intact. My God, the fun of that. Jesus. They're so heavy. They're so heavy. Boy, do they explode. Oh, boy.

How high can we get it up there? Oh, my God, I'm telling you. Yeah, teenage kids are assholes. But that's, she'd break into him. Well, he's like, you know, at my age, that's a little much. I'm not, you know, I'm pushing it. Climbing a fence that's six feet high. Who knows what I happen about that?

My hips aren't what they used to be. obviously 33 isn't old we're much older and who cares so the couple lives together and they even talk about marriage what jason said i would call her wife and she would call me husband problem is they have as many problems as a couple that's been married for 20 years and they're brand new that's the problem um why well we don't know exactly what it is but ezra would tell friends here that jason was more controlling than she would like him to be. But the problem is that she is very controlling also.

Like, he's not allowed to go anywhere he wants and see whoever he wants. She's got to approve of all that, too, but she doesn't like it the other way around also. So it's interesting. I guess Jason would have a Monday standing date where he'd play Dungeons and Dragons with his friends.

So it's D&D night on Monday nights. That's what happens. Yeah. He tried to get Ezra involved, they could hang out more and she could kind of get more in the group and all that kind of thing. Yeah. She gave up after one session. Yeah. You have to be real into that stuff. And honestly, too, there's a certain, you got to be pretty smart to play that goddamn game. There's a lot of shit to remember and a lot of stuff going on. So I don't know. It's just you've got to be dedicated to doing this because it's not fucking sorry or Uno. This is going to be intense. It's a, it's like

playing fucking risk or something. This is a big undertaking. It's going to take. And when we go home, it's not because the game's over. It's because we'll pick it up next time. Yeah. It's because we're all filthy and we could start to smell. We need to sleep. Yeah. We're a bunch of smelly nerds at this point.

This is bad. So then she would try to get Jason to stop going to these Dungeons and Dragons night. She would say that she was depressed and she would even threaten that she would hurt herself if she was left alone. I can't be left alone right now, so then he would stay home. So that's kind of how all this is going on here. Now, in February, actually we'll wait till then and talk about it here. In August, August 8th, 2017, she is at a bar called The Joint with Jason. It's Ezra and Jason hanging out.

Now, she sees Alex Woodworth. Remember we mentioned him? He's the barista who gave left. over coffee right to Jason as he sat out there

now Alex Alex the barista is inside the joint hanging out now there's groups of people hanging out

being social he's alone by himself very focused in writing in a journal just writing okay

okay which is a which is a strategy to get chicks by the way too you can either be real gregarious or be

stoic and weird in the corner maybe they'll come to you. It's one of those things. Or sit there with a guitar that you don't know how to play. Exactly. Just look at sheet music and wait for your penis to be gobbled. Yeah. Move your fingers around. Just like, if I do, but don't play it, that'll work.

And then wait to finish in somebody's throat. Yeah. That doesn't seem to be his strategy, though. He seems to be really actually into this writing here. So the bar is by the coffee shop, by the way. Now, he's sitting alone and he's writing in the journal and she's intrigued by seeing someone writing amongst all these people not being social.

This guy is Alexander Lehman Sidney Woodworth Alex Woodworth. Born January 1st, 1994, a couple of years older than her. He is from St. Croix Falls in Pope County, Wisconsin. He's got

parents named Josh and Kimberly and he's got two brothers and a sister. Alex is the oldest of four. Okay. He attended high school and graduated in 2012, and then he went to the University of Wisconsin-Oclair, which is why he's here, essentially. Now, in spring of 2017, he received his bachelor's degree in philosophy and biology. Oh. Heady shit, basically. Yeah.

And things that don't normally go. Those are different sides of the brain working. Yeah, but it's. The science and the. philosophy side. Yeah, that's interesting. That ain't the cut and dry biology side. So this guy's got both sides of his brain working, which is pretty impressive. He planned to attend graduate school at the University of Oregon to get his master's degree in philosophy. That's what he wants. Oh. Yeah. So he was working at the coffee shop. He was a tutor on campus and also taught a few philosophy classes at a local high school around there that had an honors program for it. So that's a what he was into. He even started up a philosophy book reading club as well that he hung out with, which is cool. He wants to be a philosophy professor at the University of Oregon. That's his dream, essentially. That's what he wants. Yeah. Hangs out at coffee places for hours, writes a lot because the manager of the coffee place, too, I saw her testimony, said that even before he worked there,

and even when he worked there and he wasn't on shift, he was still always at the coffee shop. He's just there all the time. May as well, may as well pick up a shift if you're going to be here this much. That's kind of why he got a job there. You're like, you know. You're here so much. He could be a bar stool. Yeah. It's like, exactly, like Goodfellas.

He could be a fucking stool. Guys here, another few minutes, he could be a fucking stool. What I don't know, make a restaurant? He knows everything about the restaurant. He's always there. All right. You can help them. You can help.

All right. I know what I know. I know about the restaurant business. I know how I know about the restaurant. I know about the restaurant. You want me to help you? I can help. Maybe I can help you.

Maybe I can help you. He puts his hand on him. I don't know. There's a lot of, you know. Yeah, there's a lot of, I don't know. That scene is so my grandfather to me. My grandfather looked just like Paul Servino and acted like him too. He was real calm.

Which one? My grandfather or Paul Servino? They're both dead. If you don't have a grandfather anymore, then both. They're both dead. I love Paulie. Polly's my favorite. The first, when they show him, when they show him, when they're describing the whole, how the mafia works and everything, Goodfell's, and there's slow zoom on him outside with the wife beater on eating the sausage and peppers.

It is, it's literally gives me goosebumps because it's like my grandfather's fucking sitting there eating a sausage and peppers. Just sitting in a lawn chair. And my grandfather loves sausage and peppers. He's always eaten. I mean, it's like, I get like a, oh my God, like this weird feeling every time. I see it. Always. I love Paul, too. He's a hobby. He's great.

It's so great that they got a Paul to play Paulie, and he's the most Paulie that's ever Paulie. He's so good. And he's so not Paulie in real life. That's the other thing, too. He's such like he's an actor and a very, like, you know, theater type of base person. Yeah. That's what I mean. Brilliant man. He's not, you know, Paulie Walnuts.

That's different. That guy's really like that. Street's guy. Yeah. So now Jason, her boyfriend, says about Alex, quote, he was the nicest guy, big nerd. He was definitely one of those deep thinkers. I've never seen, and someone so obsessed and completely devoted to philosophy. He would bring it to the bar.

He would bring it home. He would be researching books on Amazon in his spare time. So into it. I guess, I mean, I'm real dumb, but how do you bring people? You're reading somebody else's philosophy on everything? thing? Is that what it is? I guess. I guess you're reading, yeah, I guess you're trying to figure out, I've never taken any philosophy. I'd got a GED, but no one would have taught me that. But the, I guess you're trying to. A book of philosophy is the last thing I want to read. No, absolutely. But I guess that's opening your mind to different thoughts of your own philosophies that you could have if other people have stuff that's not, you know, that might be a different thought, I guess. His grandfather said he was just a normal kid and he was active in the church with us. Another relative said he loved the unlovely. He loved bugs and he loved spiders.

His thing was to find stuff that people didn't care for and make sure they were taking care of. Oh, he's a weird kid from American Beauty with the bag. Yeah. Not like that, though. Not creepy. That kid was creepy. Yeah, he was creepy. This one's not creepy.

He just kind of sticks to himself. He's real into what he's doing. And if you want to find out, he'll tell you all about it. That's all. But, yeah, not that. patio out back that Madison fucking theater. Forget about it.

He would love it out there. The bugs and spiders out there, motherfucker. The biggest fucking spiders we've ever seen in our lives who are in Madison, Wisconsin. Has some bugs. Under that,

oh my God. That awning? Oh, under the awning. I was, they were this big. They were huge. And people just walked in.

No problem. Web is everywhere. We're like, this is fine with everybody. Nobody's got a broom. Keeping the moths away? I don't know. That's all I guess.

I don't know. So, yeah, he likes that kind of shit here. And Jason said she, meaning Ezra, was going through emotional things. You know, she was a really good friend, meaning Alex. I kind of pushed them together at one time because I knew they both had similar viewpoints. He had some things in his life that I figured she could help him with. And I thought that he could help her with some things in her life. Mutual friendship.

Yeah. That's great. Guys, by the way, if you have a girlfriend, this is a bad strategy to try to push her together with another dude who she might have more in common with is probably a bad strategy for keeping a girl. Yeah, that's the other thing. Closer to her age, closer to her interests. Hey, I think you'd love this man's penis. I really do.

It's wonderful. It's exactly what you look for in a penis. And I think you'd love it. You two might relate so hard. Hard you fuck. And if that happens, good for you. Weird. Bad for me.

What a nightmare. Very bad for me. Now, back to this day when he meets, when they're talking about, you know, she said, what are you writing, basically. He's, he's in there writing in a book. She's intrigued and she says what's going on here. So they talk about his writing. She says, I was curious as to how he could focus alone on this topic.

I approached him and I said, are you right? What are you writing about? you know, just tell me about it. And, you know, that sort of shit, basically. What do you got going on here? Now, in his book, he has a journal of like weird shitty rights philosophy, this type of thing. He has a, it's interesting. I'm going to, I can read it to you if you like.

Oh, boy. Oh, you got his philosophy? I got what she was reading that day. Okay. Okay. This is what she read. August 8th, 2017. So it's what he was writing at that time.

Quote, primal man's experiences of encounter were scarcely a matter of tame delight. But even violence against a being one really confronts is better than ghostly solitude for faceless digits. I and thou, page 75 is what that says. That's definitely words. That's a quote. There's quotes around that. So I think that's a quote from I and thou, I would have. assume the book. Okay. And then he goes on to his own writing. Wow. I'm oddly preoccupied with the

concept of cannibalism. Oh, really? Oh my. Not quite with actual cannibalism as practiced, but rather with the indwelling metaphors our understanding actually works with. Cannibalism deals primarily with our own awareness of being flesh that another human could literally eat me raises odd anxieties over what I actually am to another. I can be rendered mere meat reduced to a body in the most vicious way. Beyond anxiety, the phenomenon reaches an utter truth, an uncanny awareness that cannibalism is not merely eating a corpse deprived of its humanness, but is precisely consumption of human by a human. Cannibalism reaches a root as old as birth. My flesh is my humanity for both

are what is at stake in it. What made me being, what made me a being is precisely what lets me lose myself so viscerally. Okay. That's what he says. Okay. So maybe philosophy's not good. To have to, the act of cannibalism, he boils it down to, what am I really? That's moving further into figuration. Cannibalism reduces me into my being another's meal, literally in vivid imagery. But essentially, you get what I'm saying here. So then talk about vampires versus cannibals. A vampire is perhaps less invasive, just the blood, not the flesh.

There's a lot of, uh. Okay. But this is all philosophical stuff. I mean, philosophy is essentially like mental masturbation. You know what I mean? And I don't mean that in an insulting way, but it's none of this shit matters. It's just stuck you're thinking of. It's questions and then you fill them in with what you already know minus whatever you're going to go research.

It's not a science. It's not figuring out how to make an engine run more. efficiently. It's a creative thing and it's part art and part this. So it's an interesting thing. So she says that, yeah, she was interested in this and she says cannibalism's mentioned in this a few times and it goes on to deal with the concepts of metaphorical cannibalism and the concept of cannibalism itself as what cannibalism renders you as and the anxieties and fears of being a meal in its sense. is it so that's that's how she determines or yeah interprets what it is metaphorically cannibalize somebody I guess just render them useless you take from them what you need I guess I think

she was saying the um just the metaphorical meaning I don't think what the metaphorical part of cannibalism is but she he was talking about cannibalism possibly metaphorically using it for something else I'm thinking possibly. Using cannibalism as a metaphor for something, we don't know. Also, she says the concept of cannibalism itself as what cannibalism renders you as and the anxiety and fears of being a meal in a sense. So I think it's, she doesn't, I don't think she knows whether it's a metaphorical cannibalism or actual like, what would it be like to be eaten?

Yeah. Yeah. So she says philosophical in nature as opposed to literal, literal, in nature. She thought it was quite a peculiar subject cannibalism, and quote, I was interested in what he meant. What I understood, he was speaking of it philosophically, and I also wanted his ideas and his concepts of literally cannibalism.

Like, this is philosophically, but for real, for real. Yeah. What would you put on a person's thigh meat? Right. Garlic powder, like dill? What are we getting into? Yeah. So she said, so we talk back and forth for a few about artists that have taken part in cannibalism.

What? There's been artists that have done this before. Really? Yes. Have you ever seen, there was a character that Sasha Baron Cohen did. I think it's one of his newer shows where he pretends to be one of his characters is a prison artist, a guy who just got out of prison for murder, and he's an artist, but he makes his, or he's a chef, but he makes his food out of, like, crazy things, like his own shit is in one meal and, like, his own semen is in something.

And it's just to see how pretentious this guy he's serving is. If you give him a pretentious enough story, will he, even knowing there's semen and feces in it, will eat it anyway. And of course he did. So the last thing he gives him is a fucking condom. Yeah. That you cut open and inside. Like a sausage.

Is the meat, yes, is the meat of a Chinese dissident. Okay. And he says, you know, he's been purchased and his family's okay with it and it helps them and all this stuff. So this is a humane way to actually let him live on and not. That, I've seen this. Yeah, it helps him live on. And the guy's like, mm-hmm, yep, I totally get it. It takes it.

Amazing. It eats it. Yes, people are pretentious. and they will eat people if it makes them feel like they're gonna be above someone else. It's also very funny shit. That's very funny shit,

I gotta say. That was amazing when he's doing that and people are taking. He's amazing. And his artwork is that guy too when he's the prison artist when he gets that art critic lady to give him a bunch of pubes

that he can put on a brush. She's like thrilled to do it to join the pub brush with all the other artist's pubs. Okay, we got to stop talking about this. Okay. I love him. I just.

It's so funny. God damn love him. So they talk about artists that have taken part in cannibalism, and he mentioned we spoke about his anxieties of what it means for someone to consume another. And what he did say at that time when we were deep in this discussion, he was, we talked about, he mostly talked about the philosophical sense. And he also mentioned the fact that often individuals partook in cannibalism because it was in essence a consumption of one's power to take in a. another's flesh to do that, which I think that sounds like almost like a primitive thing. Like 10,000 years ago in a jungle somewhere, on an island somewhere, that was probably how you took somebody's, I don't know.

I mean, you don't have to go back that far. Dahmer literally said he ate them to keep them with him forever. Absolutely. I meant as like a societal thing. Like we all under, like 10,000 years ago, we might have all understood that. Well, yeah. felt it to be real. Yeah. Well, yeah, you're taking his essence, obviously.

Yeah, that's what you do. But like, you know, by 1993, we were like, that's not how you do that. No, because I've eaten so many steaks, and not once have I felt the essence of a cow. I've never moved out of nowhere. No. I've never chewed cut. Never. It doesn't seem like a bad thing, but all right. I did throw up, but I did not chew it.

No, I didn't chew it. Now, Jason pulls Ezra aside with this deep. conversation they're having here about all this and tells him he's a little uncomfortable with him being her being so involved and grossed in this conversation with this guy about cannibalism even though he said I brought them together and thought they should hang out more it's very strange I hate that you're doing the relating that I said you should do you should exactly she also said at one point that she didn't feel she didn't feel like Jason respected her humanity and independence and she told Jason that so Jason backed off and said oh my bad

I mean, yeah. He said, you know, I guess you guys want to be friends with them, be friends of them, I guess. I don't know. Didn't mean to come at you, essentially. And this is what she said. She said, Jason pulled me aside and he kind of interrupted our conversation. And she said, well, I felt that my conversation was cut short and I had plenty more to talk about. So then we all went out for a smoke and we started talking, meaning her and Alex, we started talking about our love for spiders because we both know.

a spider in the windowsill or the spider in a spider web because it's Wisconsin and every building's covered in spiders. It's the biggest fucking spider you've ever seen. That was ridiculous. It's so big. Ridiculous, yeah. So this conversation was a while. They said their conversation was about an hour at that point, whatever.

So they're friends and they're going on. That's August and they're talking back and forth. Fair. Now, at the same time, in October, she says she was throwing up for a couple weeks and decided to go take a pregnancy test and take it. So she went and bought one from the test, from the gas station, and she said it was positive. So she told Jason about it, and she said he seemed anxious and he wanted to go, he wanted to go to get the test confirmed with the doctors. and it was really hard to read what he was thinking at the time. So she went to the doctors and found out she was pregnant.

And she said that she decided ultimately to terminate the pregnancy. She said, I wasn't sure what to do. At the time, I was scared and so young and so confused. So they said how to, she said she felt afterwards, though, she felt very empty and felt very like she needed someone to be there for her. and she said that her and Jason this made them drift apart more than bring them together.

Really? Yeah. Daddy has a roommate, baby. You made the right decision. Yeah, I have a roommate and you live in your car. Right. So, but yeah, I mean, whatever it is. I mean, I don't know.

Also, too, if you go from hormones and they're not having the hormones, it's a big hormonal change and all that kind of thing too. And we're not going to pretend We know what it's like to be 19 and be pregnant. We have no idea. So she said that she told Jason that she didn't really want him in the bedroom right after that.

She said I felt overwhelmingly ashamed and it caused a lot of distance between us and he began sleeping on the couch. And he rejected physical intimacy, even rejected holding my hand at times. Oh. So that's what she said. So this caused a real weird. Big strength. big strain thing. And also this was on her birthday

that she had the procedure done too on her 20th birthday. Oh, boy. Now Jason told her that he was still super in love with her but just kind of felt shut down inside and they became less intimate and he started sleeping on the couch.

So now by November he and his friend went hiking in the redwoods for, I don't know, like a week or so. Yeah. And she used the time he's gone to get closer to Alex. Right. Okay.

And they begin fucking, of course, because why not? So the relationship becomes sexual. Alex is totally into her. He wrote about his feelings of longing and frustration, everything else. He's always doing that. And so she kind of also said she might leave Jason for good, as we're saying that maybe, you know, me and you can be together. And, but then Jason would come back from his trip and then she'd be with Jason and not be with

Alex for a while. So it's kind of, she always needs to have somebody that. She needs affection every day all day. Yeah. If someone's gone for the day, well, someone's got to fill in for that affection. She needs somebody to be with. She said that Jason was, quote, micromanaging me and we had just started to grow apart as a couple.

And she said that he never hit me, but he would be very, very. erratic with his gestures and sometimes he would throw things or break things and that just made me uneasy which makes sense she frustratedly throws things because he's not in touch with his feelings enough to handle frustration all that frustration he should have had to begin with because he's 33 rides a bike and has a roommate so all he should be have that level of frustration to begin with that he should be dealing with anyway I would channel that anger and frustration into finding a way out of being dependent upon another adult to keep life going. Totally.

Well, then he's also, though, I mean, he's in a fucking weird situation, too, with this. He's also in a relationship with a person that's so much younger than him that he's, he's perpetuating this cycle of being codependent by being co-dependent. He's gotten another person that's codependent, too. He's obviously got some issues of his own. There's some issues. shoes. This is terrible. And we don't know where he came from with his background. We have no idea what kind of, if that's his thing too. So she says, though, that at times he would

criticize my makeup. He would say I look like a clown or he would criticize my weight, even though at the time I was very small. And so, yeah, he could just pick on anything. So she said, did you, You know, she talks about Jason and she said that he reminded me of my father, the one who adopted her, which is why she's with them to begin with because he went away. So now the Alex thing gets a little bit more. She said that, you know, we'd talk more at the coffee shop and they'd go on long walks with each other and, you know, they'd get close. And she said that they would close up the restaurant coffee shop and, you know, do all. they'd be the last patrons there and she'd be the last patron there. And they'd talk about life itself and they'd talk about nature and how I viewed things.

And then Alex would talk about how he would view things and his philosophies and his ramblings. And he would say, you know, oftentimes he'd say I was the ying to his gang because a lot of his philosophies countered mine because mine are very in the sunlight and sunshine. And his are very much a rainy day. In the shadows. In the shadows. Ooh. Ooh. Look at hysteria.

Yeah. And when you look at Alex, that's not what he comes here. He's not one of those duches, too. No? No. He just looks like a totally normal guy. He's not like that guy. He's not like that guy.

He's not like that guy. I know exactly. We're picturing the same part. We're picturing Winona Ryder Beetlejuice male version. It's not him. That's not whom at all. He looks like a normal college kid. He just looked normal.

Pete, whatever the fuck his name is. Yeah. Doherty or something. Yeah. Oh, the 80s professional WWF jobber, Pete Doher, the Duke of Dorchester, you mean? He's getting, that's his first time he's ever been mentioned on Netflix, I bet. I don't know. I don't know if Pete's still alive, but if he is, you're welcome, Pete.

He should be very happy that you knew exactly what we want. A fucking mid-80s jobber for the WWF. So anyway, they're in a sexual relationship, whether it's a rainy or a sunny fucking philosophy. Either way. Yeah. It's a dick and philosophy. So there's a lot. And Alex's journals, by the way, he writes on a lot of topics such as internal pain and loneliness.

Oh. Self-sacrifice, violence, cannibalism. One person says that Woodworth looks as an individual that comes back from the dead. and cannibalism, specifically consuming an individual so that the person they loved would never leave them. Domers' philosophy there. Very Wisconsin. Very, yeah. This is, what is going on in Wisconsin?

How many people are having these thoughts? Although Dahmer was like, how do I make a zombie, whereas this guy's just in philosophy. This is not what he's actually doing. So now, Jason finds out about the relationship with Alex. as far as the physical end of it here, and confronted Ezra, and her response was that Alex had taken advantage of her. Uh-oh.

Okay. She skirts responsibility, huh? She said he took advantage of me. Now that they've been going on for, they've had sex more than once. You know what I mean? This is, so Jason said, so I went to Alex, he said,

and he said, I confronted him about all this stuff, like, you're my friend, you know, No, I love you. How could you do this to me? Right. And later on, there's a prosecutor that said, I think Jason has a very big heart. But I also think his big heart, you know, led him to be very manipulated. He's easily manipulated here. So by February of 2018, Ezra is living with Jason and his roommate, a different guy named Alex.

Perfect, of course. Alex Zink, this guy. So he's living with them. She worked at Joanne's fabrics for a minute. Oh, this is Alex as a female. This, no, no, no. I'm talking about Ezra worked at Joanne's fabrics. Oh, is that right.

The other Alex is Alex Zink and it's a man, Jason's roommate, okay? She worked at Joanne's fabrics. Jason said that every time she would give, she would give him money for, like, bills and shit, though, she'd, like, need some of it back because she didn't have enough money. Then, when he was out of town for Army shit, she'd go, fuck Alex Woodworth or other people, as we'll find out about too. Okay. So Ezra and Jason's roommate Alex are always fighting, by the way.

Because if you move into a place with a person and then they move their boyfriend, girlfriend, and you're pissed. Because now they're taking up the living room all the time and you've got to go sit in a fucking room like you're their child. Like that's crazy. Now your egg pan is in the sink and it's stank. And it stinks and now she's making shit that you don't want and what's this in here? Who's is that?

It turns into a mess. Did you have roommates ever? Fuck no. No? Good for you. Fuck no. I was a, I was married. I had an egg pan left in my sink.

I poured the water out and went and put it on his fucking bed. We don't just leave this shit. You want it to stink somewhere? Let it stink in your fucking room. Don't let it stink up my fucking house. My first own place was with a woman. So not a roommate. Yeah, yeah.

I bought a house when I was young, too young to own a house. I don't know what the fuck I was doing. And I let two fucking idiots move in. Of course. One of them still owes me a lot of money. But the other one just left fucking eggs. It's been 25 years. Yeah.

Oh, I'll never fucking forget it. If I see him, I'm taking that money out of his fucking mouth. This was pre-9-11, everybody. This was a while ago. I'm never going to forget. He's like, you're going to pay me that money because I'm going on a vacation to New York to go up to the top of the Twin Towers. God damn it.

This is my dream. I want that panoramic photo. That's right. Oh, Christ. So, anyway, Jason noticed that basically, this is all going on. Now, Jason is away for a while. And Alex, the roommate, basically said,

while he's gone, either help out around the house or fuck off. Like, you don't live here. Yeah. So she moved out and broke up with Jason via text message. Your roommate told me to do things. He evidently has not heard what I did to my mother. Yeah, exactly. I lived in a fucking car because somebody asked me to help out.

I will not help out at all. So he started distancing himself a little bit here. basically because his friends had said when you're not around, Ezra's like out all night. She's always with that Alex Woodworth. They look like a couple when they're hanging out together and all this sort of shit. So he's still in love with her though. And basically still sees her sometime because she still lives at home.

So when she doesn't want to be at home and doesn't have anywhere to go, she'll still go over there and hang out and bang Jason. So he would get a hotel for them and they'd start, you know, whatever. So one night, here. This is interesting. Okay. There's a friend of his was one of his best friends, basically, here. Now, he had some, he thought that maybe his friends were being a little too hard on Ezra, saying that she's out all the time. So he decides, this is never a good idea. When she's in the shower, he's going to check her phone. Oh, God. It's already over. That's it. It's already done.

If you have any inkling to look in that phone, just break up. If you have a reason to look, you don't need to just, you don't need to, you don't need to. That means there's problems, either with you or with them. Right. Don't validate what you already suspect. If you already suspect it, then the trust is over. And either they're actually doing it, so they shouldn't be in a relationship, or they're not, and you shouldn't be in a relationship because you're spying on people. So either way, it's over.

Yeah. So he looks, he's trying to find to see if she's still hooking up with Alex. That's the point here. Okay. Instead, he learns she's actually hooking up with somebody completely different than Alex also. His best friend, John Hanson. Feel better? How do you feel now?

Yeah. Whoops a day. They'd been fucking around for like a month now. And now you know that. And you'll never forget that. Now you know all about it. So he took pictures of the phone screen in case she tried. to erase the text later.

So he took his phone out, click, click, click, and got all pictures, all this shit. Here's one of the transcripts, uh, transcriptions here. This is, uh, February 11th, 2018. We kind of jump into the middle of a conversation. John says nice. And Ezra says, it's stressful looking for places. So that would be nice to relive. Working out again does really make you want to fuck everything that's moved.

Might also be a predator. Okay, that's what Ezra says. She loves to fuck. Oh, yeah. And John says a body in motion wants to stay in motion. Ezra says, quote, are you going to pound this anytime soon? Are you going to pound this anytime soon? Unless she's holding her fist out, that is a very specific thing.

That is wild. Couldn't be more obvious. What's going on? Are you going to pound this anytime? I got a pussy that's growing cobwebs over here. Get over here and bang the bejesus out of me, please. An unpounded pussy gathers moss. It gathers moss, exactly.

So she says that. Then she says, sorry, I'm rude, John. Not this week. I have Warren. It's all right to be blunt. Just got to be all right with it coming back your way. I don't know what that means. So Ezra then said,

just let me know when I can get my next in and out and spells it like the burger place and then puts a smiley face on it. Who has used a winky? That phrase. My next in and out. Before the, you know what I mean? Who's not 40?

A 19 year old chickback. North of 50 for sure, right? I would think so, hey, we're going to get our, what do you want? Some in and out tonight, huh, sweet out. I'm going to get a little in and out. So, yeah, with a winky face.

And then says, it would also be nice to hang out and do art again. You are more than just a good friend. Well, yeah, obviously. He's taking your pound town. Yeah, clearly. So she said, oh, that could be nice. I don't know what, I guess he says something else,

but I don't know what this is. And she says, oh, maybe. Oh, that should be nice. He's such a cool kid. Oh, because he said, I'm going to be with Warren. That's right. That's his son. That's this John's son.

Okay, that's what this says. John says, why thank you. He is a good kid. I'm looking forward to spending some dad time with him. So Ezra says... They're going back and forth talking about children and Pound Town. Within three text messages. That's great.

Take you to Pound Town. Your kid's adorable, by the way. You're going to pound this pussy. God, your kid's adorable. She said, that melts my heart. I'd love to paint with him sometime. Yeah. Then the next day, she says, feeling like a snake today, what's wriggling in your mind?

And he said, I've just been with Warren all day. My mind is pretty preoccupied. I'm busy. I'm with a child. No time for your pussy right now. I see your horny text, and I raise you a way to dry that thing right up. Not interested. So she says, that's understandable dad time and stops texting him because she took the hint.

In other words, don't have time for you, bitch. You ain't that important to me. What's wriggling? She tries to throw a penis reference in there. Fuck, yeah. So she says, this is the now February 14th, Valentine's Day. See something, say nothing, and drink to forget. Happy Valentine's.

That's her phrase. And it should be on a greeting card. That's very lovely. It's nice. John says, that's beautiful, Ezra. Happy Valentine's Day. She says, I have a way with words, John. Ha, ha, ha.

Okay. So if you just read this, they're fucking, obviously. For sure. You're going to pound this in and out? Yeah. So Jason, she comes out of the shower and he's like, what the fuck is this? Screenshots and shit. What the fuck?

Heard you like an animal style, bitch. She said, no, no, no. You're misunderstanding. This isn't actually what it seems like. Uh-huh. Because I ask you, when are you going to compound this all the time, don't I? What exactly is it? I'm like, you're flying in Tuesday, right?

Because you got to pound this. Like I say that all the time to you. What does she say? Are you going to pound this anytime soon? Yeah, you're going to pound this anytime soon or what? What the fuck? Which sounds like impatient, too. So she says, no, no, no.

I'm not pursuing an affair. It's actually, he sexually assaulted me, she says. Oh. That's what she says. She said on February 4th, this is a week to 10 days before all these text messages, by the way. She was hanging out with John and his roommate. They encouraged her to drink too much and she ended up throwing up. So that's not even her drinking isn't her fault.

They encouraged her to drink too much. John took her upstairs to his bedroom. She said the last thing she remembers before blacking out was someone removing her tights. And the next morning she said she felt strange. and so this John dude took her home to the Jason's place and then apparently raped her again in Jason's bed now too. Oh my God. That's what she says. So Jason is very direct.

He went right to Alex. He went right to Ezra. He goes right to John and says, did you fuck my girlfriend or what? Yeah. What's going on? John said, no, what are you kidding me? I'm a fucking girlfriend. So then he says, let me send you something.

Sends him the text. And he goes, I mean, I fucked your girlfriend a few times. Yeah, sure. You know. Because he had to read him and go, oh, yeah, I don't know how to spin. Are you going to pound this any time soon? I don't know how to spin that. I mean, that's tough.

A little in and out. Ah, yeah, we don't have those here. This isn't good. Clos as we got is culvers. Sorry about this. Can it give me a little culvers? That means cover me and butter and jerk off on me. That's what that means.

Yeah, that means stuff your cheese balls in my mouth. Totally different. Totally different. Oh man And then drip jizz on me like hot butter Yeah Drip your curd all over me So he's like

We've been together consensually multiple times Oh god damn it What are you talking about dude So Now Jason is like I don't know Now he doesn't know who to believe What?

I don't know he's like I don't know who to believe He goes I got my girlfriend Who's saying this guy assaulted me twice And then I got this guy going I didn't assault shit she came on to me. So, and this was like a, we've done it multiple times and it's, yeah, she's pretty, seems pretty excited about it.

See, in and out. She literally asked me to pound it soon. When are you going to, when's the, you're going to pound it anytime soon? What's up? Jason is, James, I, I, I think there's something wrong. I, I, it sounds like it. He's 33. How does he not get it?

I he's honestly he's just being rather than sit and stew in your fan in your fantasies and in your like accusations and I bet she did this I bet he did he just goes right to the people and goes what happened did you do this to me dude yeah which most people don't do it's kind of refreshing honestly my point is they're there it's right in his face yeah and he can't see it what's going on I think he wants I think he would like either his best friend or his girlfriend one of them to be honest with him I think he would like that's the other thing too. Even when he went to Alex, he doesn't want to destroy the relationship with these guys as friends. He still wants to be friends with them, which is really strange. Because he's like, listen, I love you. Why'd you do this? Not I'll kill you, you little fucking jerk off. You want to learn about cannibalism.

I'll fucking show you. But he's a 33-year-old, very naive man because he's not getting, he sees it. It's in black and white. He goes and asks the guy, and the guy says, yes, I'm very sorry. or however he said it. I'm sure he said, sorry, right? But then he's got a girlfriend

saying it was rape. Yeah, but it's so obvious. You want to be the guy that says, this girl says I got raped and you go, fuck you, you're a skank? Maybe he's trying to be a decent guy. She asked when he'll pound it. This isn't 1985.

This is 2018. Right. So, you know what I mean? I mean, you hear me too and me too, and he's like, I don't want to be me too. You know what I mean? I better ask. I don't want to be the guy that doesn't believe

Yeah. So this is, like I said, if this was the 80s, it'd be a different thing. He'd just be like, oh, she's a skank and fuck him and I'll kill him both. But by 2018, things are different. And I think Jason doesn't want to believe it. That's the reality of the situation. That's yes. That's what I mean. There's something wrong. He doesn't want to and he refuses. Which means he's a normal human. He's just a normal human being. We're just a very sweet, naive man. But he doesn't just hide his head in the sand. He goes to the people and asks what's up and expects them to be. honest with him. He's a very simple guy, it seems like. But Jason said, he talked, he asked other people for advice. What should I do? Oh, come to me, Jason. Who do I believe? Well, I think this is a

great answer. His friend said, well, if Ezra was raped, she should be going to the police, shouldn't she? Right. You should encourage her to go to the police if she was raped because that's, that's, what are we talking about? That's the answer. Yeah. That's the answer. Exactly. That's why that person's a better friend than me and you would be. Yeah. So as for now, she's fucked because she's like, uh-oh, I don't really want to go to the police, but I also want Jason to believe me. Yeah.

What do I do here? I still like to get some in and out. I still want to get some pound town. So what's up with that? So Jason wouldn't drop it. He said, you have to do it. Oh, no. What do I do?

So she agreed to go meet with the police. She had nothing better to do. Oh, boy. So she goes to the police. It's on March 1st, 2018. There's a detective Ryan Prock who investigates these allegations. And she said, quote, he kept telling me to be quiet. Like, he kept shushing me.

And the detective said about this interview, quote, she's sitting, leaning against the wall with her knees up telling me the story of what took place. And she says, I started getting really, really, really tipsy. And so. So she says that she was sexually assaulted at that point, that she blacked out. And she said it was really scary. So he said, okay. And later on, they asked the detective, you believe she was a victim, right?

And he said, well, yeah, she came in and told me about this horrible story of what happened. But then he, part of this was looking at her phone to see any communication between the two of them. and she had to give it to him. So she saw the cop saw all the text messages and was like, I'm going to pound this anytime soon. That sounds pretty suggestive. More in and out. Like, what are we talking about?

They also interviewed Alex Woodworth because he was in the text streams a lot too. And they asked him about it. And he said, I don't think that's what happened, what she said happened. I don't think she got raped because she didn't tell me she got raped. That's weird. and not only did she not say she got raped, this detective said, quote, he said, meaning Alex, said that Ezra told him it was consensual.

She just regretted it. Oh. Yeah. So the cop was like, you're telling people that you did it inconsensually and you regret it. And you're also saying, when are you going to pound this? I don't think anything happened to you. You regret it, but you're trying to get it done again. It's crazy.

So, I mean, later, you. he said that he couldn't get any text records from Ezra because she deleted them all, but John Hansen had all their text messages, and that's how they got them. These texts showed that Ezra was really into this affair. I'm talking, wow, they talked about how they tried BDSM stuff.

They're sending explicit, wild, crazy photos back and forth to each other. This is a full-blown thing here. Like, it's crazy. They interviewed her friends and they said that, you know, I guess he told his friends that she had spoken to about this and that they, you know, won't back up her story and all this type of thing. He interviewed the friends. They all said that she seemed real happy when she'd talk about this John Hanson. And she was excited about the relationship and she was into him and all this shit.

And it's real weird. And then Alex, of course, said that she told me it was consensual. Yeah. When you talk about that's not first date things. Do you know what I mean? No. You get to pound town and some in and out. There has been plenty.

It takes a few times before you go, you know what else I like. That's animal style. You know what I'm saying? Like, you have, there's been. You know the secret menu. Yeah. There's been plenty of fucking going on. You know, there's chicken on this menu.

Yeah. It's not just cheeseburgers around here. You don't get all that your first time at in and out. Right. You know, you try the burgers first. Most times you don't even see the religious shit on the bottom of the cob. Oh, I do. I saw it real fast.

Haven't been back since. Fuck you in and out. Hate that fucking place. And their burgers are highly overrated and their fries are terrible. Sorry, their burgers are fine, but they're not, oh my God, I got to have that burger. They're just a normal fine burger. It's not half a mile line worthy, that's for sure. It's not wait more than two.

people worthy. No. The, I guess they said this is a prosecutor later on said, this relationship wasn't even a love triangle. It was a love square. And those relationships began and stopped with Ezra. Yeah. Now it's three dudes and her.

Yeah. Just has sides, extra sides because there's only one woman in this shape. Yeah. Yeah. This is a lopsided square is what this is. You betcha. Yeah. So, which doesn't exist at that point.

Square is squared. That's the point. So this sexual assault case is ultimately dropped, mainly because of what everybody said and all the text messages and all that kind of shit. So Jason, her boyfriend, said her world was crumbling around her. She had created Ezra. She had created this intricate network of lies. And they kept falling apart. And there was nothing left.

There was nothing left behind. So Ezra then moves out of Eau Claire and back home with her family. But Jason says she's trying to get with her, the whole, trying to get back with him the whole time. Okay. He said, quote, she wove these tales about these manipulative, vindictive men who, quote, tried to take me away from you, Jason. It's not me. It's them, she would say. Oh, those guys.

They're all just plotting to get her away. She's such a hot commodity. Alex and John. John, they're just, she can't help it. I mean, she's overwhelmed. So, Jason, by the way, started, you know, looking around being like, Jesus, this is, this is wild. It's a common denominator. Yeah.

Yeah. Ezra didn't accuse Alex of assault when they were together anyway, so that's good. But he actually found out about the Alex stuff after he found out about the John stuff, but didn't believe that, you know, Alex would do anything. So, Jason said, I spent eight months constantly being toyed with. It was like, I can't trust you anymore. You think they're little white lies, but they can build up and build up and build up.

And before you know it, if there's horrifying things happening. And she was pissed off that he wouldn't take her back, too. Later on, the prosecutor said, this is someone who's deeply troubled, someone whose life is out of control, and she's desperately trying to get back some control. And that is, Jason is her base. It's her emotional base.

She lives there. She goes there when she needs time away from her family. He's her, like, sponge for all of her shit. So she needs him as a base to work off of. Right.

You know what I mean? Remember in the beginning of a Bob Ross painting, he'd paint, he'd do up like a primer thing where he'd paint the whole thing. Get the whole base laid down. That's what he is to her. And then, but then she'll draw,

happy little trees that are fucking happy little rocks and, you know, sticking it in a sun somehow, but out of nothing. Fucking the top of a mountain, taking it to pound town. Yeah. So, Ezra, because of this, then confronts Alex and says that she doesn't want to see him again. Okay. So I'm done with you. I can't be with you.

I still want to be with Jason and all that. but she would still come into the coffee shop where he worked all the time. What a metaphorical canon. Yeah. And in the meantime, she's all over Jason, won't leave him alone with calls and texts, and he'll go out, she'll show up. Metaphorical vampire. Exactly.

She's a vampire. She would, like, give him journal entries that she wrote about her regrets for hurting him. Just pages, stacks of pages. saying read that and it's all of her shit with tears tears running her ink and shit it's crazy she said she was working on herself and

she wanted to reclaim her real self and she said in one of her journals she said that Alex is just in her past she said I never gave their number a name in my contacts I looked at them and did not see beauty I saw a red

nose too big for a face their eyes looked dead A brow jutted out from a large round forehead. Their smile made me cringe. Pores and veins stood out on their pale, thin skin. It all felt like bugs crawling under my skin. And then you fucked them? Yeah, but it's just because I need Poundowne once in a while, but that's fine.

I don't love them. I love you, Jason. That's it. So Jason began taking her calls. Yeah. started seeing her again because he's fucking weak, obviously. And also, he might need a ride. Let's be realistic.

She does have a car. He might have just needed her ride one day somewhere a little far when it was cold out. This is February. I mean, it's not good bike riding weather. Yeah, but there is this thing, too, about, and who knows if he's even there, but as you age, you get to a certain age and you go, I'm out of 20-year-old pussy. I'm never doing that again. That's not for me. God.

Nope. I'm not doing it. Absolutely not. At 33, you're probably looking at the clock going, it's probably soon. Ticking? At 33, I was, I mean, I was married, but if I wasn't, I wasn't looking for 19-year-olds at all. 20-year-old, no, not happening. No.

I look at, now, we're in our 40s, like, I look at a 20-year-old girl as like one of my daughter's friends or something, like someone to be protected from like someone who's trying to fuck them. You know what I mean? I get very dadlike. I'm not. I can't see them as sexual beings because I'm very like, oh, don't leave her alone. Yeah, but thanks to the advent of the internet, there are a lot of girls out there that are that age that are, they get in a fight with their friend and they go try to fuck their dad.

No. It's crazy now. It's, it's, it's wild out there. Well, at least that's what Pornhub tells us. Yeah. I don't know. We don't know if the back story is. true, but that's what they're telling us on there.

I don't know. That's what they're saying on Twitter. I don't know if they really do it, but I've read it. So March of 2018, Alex is still working at the coffee shop. And, you know, her and him and Ezra broken up now and she's all about Jason. March 21st, 2018, the day before our farmer encountered a bloody young lady here. Jason and Ezra exchanged 600 texts in a day. Oh, fuck. Six hundred texts in one day.

Philosophy. My God. That's too many. Imagine you had to have it on silent or else you'd throw your phone out the window if it kept beeping. Just call. For Christ's sake. But most of them, apparently, according to Jason, were Ezra basically trying to talk him into getting back together. Yeah.

But he had a hard time because he's like, you fuck my friends. You don't even fuck strangers. You fuck my friends. My best friend. What are you doing, dude? But she said, no, you know, both those guys were terrible. And John raped me and Alex was manipulated me and made me do weird sexual things I didn't want to do and all this type of shit. Stop.

This makes it much better. Stop. I mean, stop. This isn't helping. Finally, she said that she was going to go to O'Clair the next day and confront Alex. She said that she was going to get closure and all this type of shit. And he said, why are you going to go? You don't need to go see him.

You just said he's a manipulative guy who's been abusing you and now you're going to go see him. Right. He said, fucking email him or write him a letter or do something like that, just anything, but don't do that shit. But she said, nope, that's what I'm doing. That's it. Yeah, she said, that's it. So Jason at that point said, okay, fine. At the end of it, he said that he's done with her.

He didn't want to hear from her unless I don't call. He said basically, don't call me, I'll call you. I don't want to hear from you unless I contact you. I'm not listening to your shit anymore. Good answer. Good answer because she's going to go talk to Alex and that obviously means you don't care about my feelings. So fuck off. You know, whatever.

And who's to say that goes really well when you guys fuck? Like, who the fuck knows how that's going to go? So March 22nd, 2018, Jason sees Ezra at the coffee shop. Yeah. Now, they had broken up and all of that kind of thing. And also, he was aware she had expired tags on her car. Right. And that basically everyone, like her parents told her until you get, don't drive around until you get your tags figured out.

You know what I mean? So anyway, she showed up this day. And everybody said she was disheveled. She didn't have makeup on. She looked like she just woke up, which is very rare for her and not normal. You can see her in the security footage that day from the coffee shop. She appears agitated. She leaves the coffee shop, Racy's, to go to Alex's house.

That this is when this all happened. She said, I'm going to go talk to him. And he said, for what the fuck are you doing that for? So Jason says, quote, I was like, this is not right. Something is wrong. Why is she at his house alone? What's going on? I thought a million thoughts were all just spiraling through my head.

At least she's showing up not hot. That's nice. Yeah, she's not like in her best look and trying to look. Very good point there. So he said, fuck this. I'm going over to Alex's house. So he goes out, gets on his bike, literally, and goes over to Alex's house where he sees Ezra's car parked outside. Yeah.

So he's like, okay. driver's side door was open and the engine's running, which tells you she's going to be out in about five seconds tops, right? So he paces outside the apartment building for a long time. She doesn't come out, even though that's going on. Her doors open and her car's running. For so long that neighbors call the police. Oh. But before the police show up, Jason went and knocked on the door or went into the apartment and found Ezra and Alex were in.

in Alex's bedroom and deep in conversation. He said that they were oddly calm and both looked like they were wearing masks. Like they were like, hmm, what's going on? Like not like, hey, you know, very, either you're too much, hey, what's up, buddy? Or you're like, hey, what's going on? No, this is cool. Both of those are weird. You know what I mean?

So he said that he told them that he was, why don't you guys talk in a public venue? How about that? Because, you know, she should be afraid of you since you're so manipulative and all this type of thing. So they agreed and they all left the apartment. They all walked outside right into the outstretched arms of the police who are out there to talk to Jason. Jason said, I've just been pacing outside and told them what was going on. And he said nothing, you know, nothing crazy, basically. I just didn't want these two to be alone together.

So that was that. So by one o'clock, Jason fucking rides pedals off on his bicycle. And Alex and Ezra get into Ezra's car and drive off to go have a chat. Okay. What a scene. What a fucking scene. Now, she also said, by the way, she had other things to do that day. Before one o'clock, she didn't just go just for this.

She also ran some errands and wanted to return some shit to Alex. So, you know, it's just like an errand she's running. Now, that's one o'clock. By 4.15, she's bloody and muddy and muddy and standing at a farmer's door. Mm-hmm. 20 miles away from here. Boy carved into her arm. With boy carved into her fucking arm, okay, which is obviously crazy here.

And remember, what was she asking for when the cops came? Jason. I need Jason. Is this whole thing. She's trying to get Jason back, by the way. still. Okay. So on this, she said, I'm so scared. They said that later on here, the district attorney said that you could see on the video, she's borderline hyperventilating. She's someone who sounds very upset. They take her in. The word boy is in her arm. She does the interview. She said that, you know, she couldn't remember what happened. She does all of that. She said

that she couldn't remember where Alex or her car was. She said, I don't know where they are. She said, I remember I left Alex's place. I remember at some point Alex had switched places with me and taken over driving. And she was sure that something bad had happened, which is very vague. She kept saying, I don't remember anything, but I feel this and I feel that. And Jason comes to the hospital to see her that night. He absolutely does. Jason thought Alex had like a doctor.

And that's why she was in the hospital. He brings her a green sweater. Mark that. Brings her green sweater to keep her warm in the hospital. Yeah. Because it's cold in there. So he's back in, basically, is what this looks like. He came to protect her now.

So she, like I said, is talking to the police who think that her wounds are self-inflicted. She's admitted to the psychiatric unit. Now, that's where we left off. So the next day, March 23rd, in the hospital, in the psychiatric unit, detectives come in and talk to her. During this interview, she said to the detective that she went to Owen Park and Eau Claire with Alex Woodworth, but didn't remember anything else, including where to locate her car or where detectives could find Woodworth. She said that she remembers feeling afraid of Alex but says that's all she can recall. She said, quote, I'm trying so hard. I'm trying to get things to come to me, but it's like it just keeps getting blocked out and blocked out.

So the detectives, they go to Alex's house. They call his phone. Nothing. They can't get a hold of him because they'd like to know where the hell he is, too. And maybe if he stole this, if did he beat this woman and steal her car? I mean, the police also touch base with Alex's family and all of that. They said they asked if. Now, by the way, this meeting occurred with the detectives because Ezra asked if they asked if she wanted to meet and they said yes.

So she had asked for this meeting. Okay. So during the interview at one point, the detective tells Ezra, you're not in trouble. And she responded, I wouldn't think I would be in trouble. So it's interesting. They said that there was later on, a court would say there was obviously some concern for Ezra's well-being. here. It was a calm conversational tone. The detective treated her as if she were a victim, and he was trying to find out what happened. This wasn't a big accusatory thing.

This was, we want to help you, and you don't remember anything. So now Alex's family, his grandfather said, we got calls that Alex was missing. And another family member said, I thought it was maybe like an accident or something. And they said, we thought maybe we could help find him. Why was he missing. So the family was like, wait, what were missing? What are you talking about? Yeah. So March 23rd, after they talked to her in the hospital, they go out to the farm where she popped up to see if they can figure anything out here. And the detective says, as we're driving down the road, we can see the muddy road right here and we stop. At that point, we're able to see footprints in the mud coming from the top of the hill down the road and then we lose them right

in this area. Perfect. Footprints in the mud. Which I think that's what Kenny Rogers and Dolly Parton had a duet over, right? Isn't that footprints in the mud? Was it? No, it was Islands in the Sun, but never mind. No, it was Islands in the stream. Stream, what I say, sun? Okay, never mind.

That came out completely wrong. Okay. What is that song? I don't know that. That's not a song. And I was like, wait a sec, that is wrong. So, well, how many times you've seen Rhinestone? I'll ask you that.

Yeah, not enough of a dumb. It's nothing to do with Rhinestone. Yeah. That's what it's on it. No, it's not. No, the footprints in the mud isn't in that? Are you sure? It should be.

Maybe you need to watch it again. That should be the one that's not the one that her and Sly sing at the end. By the way, what other movie will you get like three Dolly Parton, Sylvester Stallone, duos to end your movie? Think about that. That's how you're closing it. Who thought that was a great idea? Is that Sly's idea? Fuck yeah.

What do you think? Who else's dumb shit idea would that be? My God. So they see the footprints and they said, did you immediately think this is Alex? And he said, yeah, we thought it was Alex. Maybe they're his footprints. So they, or footprints might lead. So they followed the footprints in the mud from the home where she had sought help, the farmhouse.

They follow it all the way out. It ends up being about two-tenths of a mile west of Route 8, I believe. And they end up finding her car. Okay. So they said that they found as they were looking, I guess they had binoculars and shit too, and they were looking and they could see the car and they could see something hanging out of the rear door of the vehicle.

Oh. They go and they find it's Alex in the back of the vehicle. Her vehicle is like next to like this trailer thing, not a trailer that you live in a trailer to tow something behind. Okay. It was a big trailer thing. Yeah, like a flap, but like that you drive up on, I think.

Oh, it's a car trailer. Something like that, I think. It's hard to tell because there's tarps and shit, but then her car is sitting right next to that in this muddy road in this field. And out of the back driver's side door is Alex. Now, I've seen the crime. Doors open?

Now, I've seen the crime scene pictures, and it's just, I don't want to, it's disturbing, but he's like, the, the only part of his body that's out of the car is from here up. Shoulder up. He's in the back seat, like with his head hanging out on the floor boards of the back seat, not on the back seat. Oh, he's laying down on the floor. He's on his side.

Yeah. And his legs are still on the floorboard. His one leg almost looks like it's going into the passenger side seat. It looks like if. Like if somebody was being murdered as they tried to get from the passenger seat out the back driver's seat. Oh. That's what it looked like. Like if someone was attacking you, you'd jump into the backseat like Tupac tried to do. Right.

And you'd end up on the floor there. And if they kept attacking you, you wouldn't get out of the car. Or just his shoulders up are hanging out of the door. Is he facing forward or facing backward? He's facing the front of the car. Yeah. So like if you walked up from the back, you'd see the back of his head. Yep.

He's been stabbed 16 times. Wow. And the other thing, it's all over the place. Neck, chest, head, and groin. A bunch of stuff directed at his groin. Oh, boy. Which is on purpose, okay? So they collect forensic shit from the scene.

They get evidence that includes both Ezra and Alex's blood in various locations around the car. And both of their DNA are found on a knife that they find a minute from now. and they also find a wad of Ezra's hair on the floor in the back seat of the car. Oh, boy. Okay. So then they find in a ditch, they find a four-inch serrated folding knife with blood on it. Oh. And that knife, by the way, they figure out was used to kill Alex.

That knife came from Ezra's father's house. Wow. That's not good. So she brought that. They also find Alex's phone in a ditch on the side of the road. Okay. Okay. Now, by the way, the knife, her father said that he had previously given his daughter knives back in the day.

So these are knives that he gave her. Okay. Now, they go back the next day, the 24th. Now knowing all of this, they question her again. Again, she denies remembering anything beyond going for a drive again. again. This is what the detective says for, just to her, just so you know this isn't a lot of pressure on her. Thank you for meeting with us again or with me.

Ezra, this is another detective introduces. He's from Dunn County. So again, thank you. They shut the door for privacy. Just like every time we talk. If you want to be done talking, just let us know. I know you're here in the inpatient behavioral health. You're in a locked facility for safety to get you the help what we both think you need.

But that door isn't locked. When you want to end it, we'll end it. You know, we'll walk you out. We'll get the staff and then get you back to wherever you need to go, okay? So that's him telling her you're not under arrest without saying it. That's interesting. Well, he's saying you're allowed to leave whenever you want. Yeah.

The facility's locked, but this door isn't. So you don't want to do that. Okay. So the detectives eventually inform her that we found Alex. Oh. And then she said, I guess I'll tell you what happened, but it's really painful. Yeah.

Okay. She kept saying, I don't remember, I don't remember. But as soon as they told her, we found him. Yeah. Now all of a sudden she remembers shit. Did she think that a 2013 Impala just disappears? And you'll never find it. Especially one with your very specific drawings on it.

And a body in the backseat? With the door open, hanging out on somebody's farm. Those don't disappear. No. So she said they were talking about Alex's views on life as they drove. She described these views as being pretty dark shit here. She said that Alex needed to realize that, listen, what we did hurt other people. Oh. Wasn't right what we did. I need you to understand that. Yeah. She said she didn't know whether Alex at some point took over driving. She said her anxiety was so bad she couldn't drive anymore. She said that part of her anxiety came from Alex misgendering her. She said, when they were together, he often called her his boy, which is odd because ever since they've known each other, she's not. She's been she at that point, or they at the most, definitely not he.

So he said that, yeah, from there, Alex drove them out to a deserted country road. So, you know, they're like, yeah, dude, we found the crime scene. And then she says, he started like carving something into my arm. She said he got a knife from the center console. And that's what happened. And the detective said, can I see it by chance? And they show the word boy scratched in her left forearm. She says in high school, she had questioned her gender.

And Alex had picked up on that. She said, quote, he used to call me like boy and lots of stuff like that. Come here, boy. Did they say it like an old southerner? Did he say it like, you're my boy? Which one? Either way, it's the least hot thing you can call. The person you want to fuck?

Yeah. And I was just kind of like, I don't really identify that way anymore. So the detective's like, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't believe the shit about your arm. Ezra said Alex is in the driver's seat. And the detective said it didn't make sense that Alex is right-handed. and he's sitting basically where you are, talking about an interviewer,

and he reaches over and carves boy perfectly so she would see it. You'd have to do it backwards. He's here. He's in the driver's seat. She's here. She's saying he grabbed my arm, took his right hand,

and did boy. Upside down. Your boy is visible to her like this, not the other way. So they're saying then he wrote it upside down. Yeah. They're like, that doesn't seem likely probably. Right.

You know what I mean? They said, And perfectly and said you'd have to do it backwards. It's not plausible. So then back to the interview. Yeah, well, while they had parked in a deserted place. The detective said, he didn't do that to you, did he? Just came out and didn't happen that way.

And she said, she said, no. Okay. So they said, you carved boy in your own arm. Isn't that right? And she said, mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah, I did that. Okay.

So, yeah, she said that, well, we ended up in the back seat and Alex started attacking me. She said, he started cutting my pants open and stuff and I didn't know what to do. It was really scary. Like, just like a street rapist, like a crazy one. I'm going to cut her pants off kind of crazy shit. She said that he just kept attacking me and attacking me and I didn't know what to do. And the detective says, okay, because he's not believing it at this point. she says, and I was so scared.

It was the scariest thing I've ever experienced in my life. And she said she grabbed the knife by its jagged blade and wrestled it away from Alex and started stabbing him. Oh. For her own protection. Yeah. In the groin a whole bunch of times. Right in the dick. Right in the ball sack.

So the detective said, you said you had the knife. Where were you cutting him? She said, I was just going anywhere and everywhere. I could. Right in the chest, right in the face, right in the balls. Right in the dick. Everywhere I could. Right in the taint. Right in the taint there. So the detective says, okay, looks down at her hands, which only have superficial wounds, superficial cuts. He said the wounds don't match. If you're grabbing a knife like she said you did, you pull your hand across it, your hand's going to be flayed open. And that's a fact. We've seen this in a lot of murder cases. But she said,

quote, he just kept grabbing me and grabbing me and grabbing me. Too many grabings for me to believe that too. It's a harrowing story. You know, the guy's like, oh, it's terrible. But obviously, the more and more they looked at this, they were like this. She's not telling the fucking truth at all. No. Yeah. So she said, I tried to keep him focused on our problems, but then Alex began again talking about the boy thing and carved boy into my arm. And then she said, no, I guess I did it. And she then claimed he attempted to sexually assault her at knife point. she said she was lying in the back frozen as he cut away her clothing. But the next thing she knew, she's fighting with her life, stabbing anywhere and everywhere.

And she started stabbing him, stabbing him. She fled the back seat, but Alex followed her out. And she was forced to keep stabbing him because he kept trying to grab her. Right. So, yeah, she said her anxiety grew so strong after all the grabbing. By the way, her story gets real messy on when she was inside and when he was outside. She doesn't know. It just gets real messy.

But she said her anxiety was so much that that's how she just ran away and ended up at a farmhouse. That's what happened. Okay. Yep. She said, he kept trying to grab me in the back of the car, so I started to defend myself the best I could. The problem is the blood evidence shows that Alex was mostly stabbed outside of the car, which means none of this is true. Yeah, they said that that's where there's most of the blood. blood loss, and by the time he gets back into the vehicle, he's nearly dead because there's less

blood loss. So all the stabbing took place outside the car. Did he jump in the car to try to maybe take the car to go get out? Get away, or maybe to get inside and close the door so she couldn't get out of him anymore. Who knows? When you're being stabbed, I don't know what you're, you just want to get away, but it happened outside the car. A very integral vein is clearly hit, and he probably bled out before he could get away. Yep. They said there's virtually no defensive wounds, that's because they believe that Ezra took him by surprise. Just all of a sudden started hacking this poor kid. The prosecutor said she comes behind him and completely takes him out, stabbing him first in

the back of the head. Later on, they say, do you think Ezra just snapped? And the prosecutor said, yes, I think she intended to do what it took to get back with Jason. And that meant Alexander Woodworth had to be out of the picture. Now, Ezra chooses to end this police interview. said she could. So she ends it. Toward the end of the interview,

they said, can we photograph your injuries? She consented. The photos were taken. Then they asked, can we ask you a few more questions? And she said, no, I'm done. So that was that. So Jason at this point, this is when he finally realized, holy shit, she's a huge fucking liar. Everything she says is a lie. He believed that she had stabbed him in self-defense because that's what Ezra told him.

So that's what he believed. But then he saw the autopsy photos with 16 stab wounds, some of them at her at his goddamn groin, and said, holy shit. She's not a victim. Everything she does is her own shit, her own little tornado. So April 9, 2018, she's charged with first degree intentional homicide by use of a dangerous weapon. Oh, God. Not good. She's so young.

So young. The prosecutor said, I've been a prosecutor since 2001 and I've never seen anything this violent. just brutalized her. So during, she said that the knife that was found in the ditch outside the house, this is the knife because they're showing this is the knife that she did to get rid of Alex and all this type of shit. The prosecutor said she's trying to figure out what to do while he's laying wounded. She's taking her clothes off and she's trying to cut them. She's trying to cut herself.

She was clearly someone who was trying to stage and attack because she has clothes with big knife shit in it. Like, really? Not where she's, she's not cut there. Just her clothes are? Her clothes, her pants are ripped, like knife marks down the leg and like a big thing in the open. Like, if you were like, if I wanted it to look like someone was going to rip someone's clothes apart with a knife and then rape them, how would I make it look? And that's what it looks like. Really carefully so that she didn't get hurt.

Exactly. Yeah. Very carefully. So they asked the prosecutor, how does he end up back in the car? Because that's the interesting question. and she said, I think he climbs in there to get away from the woman who's trying to kill him. Right. He just has nowhere else to go.

You're out in the middle of nowhere. There's no other structure. They said, Alex was found out hanging out of the back seat because at that point, she said that she thinks that Ezra tried to drag him out of the car. Oh. So she could drive away and just leave him there, but she couldn't get him out of the car because she weighs 115 pounds. She's five, two. And he's like a normal size guy, and he's dead weight. And also, if you're on the floor, you've got to get him up over that.

And there's so much blood. He's so slippery. That's the other thing. So they said that she had to do a different plan. Alex was found with a scarf around his neck. And they suspect that the prosecutor suspects he was trying to stop the bleeding with it. Oh. He was trying to make a tourniquet.

Now, Alex's grandfather said, that's my question going back in my mind now is what he thought when he was being killed. I look at Ezra and do I get angry, you know, because he suffered, he suffered greatly. By the way, his family are wonderfully nice people who are salt of the earth, wonderful people. They really, really are. The prosecutor said not one of the wounds was lethal in and of itself. A thousand tiny guts. Yeah, they said, if he received medical intervention pretty quickly, he probably would have lived.

Oh, my God. This is horrible. But they said that wasn't, she wasn't going to let that happen. And when she took off, she took his phone and threw it so he couldn't call for help. Asshole. So that's it. She smashed it too.

She didn't just throw it. She smashed. The screens all smashed. She made sure it was fucked up. Wow. The prosecutor said, her Instagram page says, I am the Fox, a tricky one. I think she thinks she's a manipulator. The tricky fox.

That's her. So pre-trial, she wants to suppress her statements made on March 23rd and March 24th, obviously, on Miranda grounds, she said. But the court denies her motion, okay? We'll get into that to suppress her stuff. Okay. Okay. Even though she wasn't Mirandized for one of those times. But they're saying that she was warned that she could leave.

Yeah. That's why they said she would, we thought she was a victim. You know, Miranda's a victim. She's not Miranda's because, yeah, right. I think they should just Mirandize everybody that comes into the fucking, if you go in a police interrogation room, that's just before anything. Before anything you get more, even if you're a victim's kid, a witness, anybody. Everybody gets Mirandized. That would be smart.

Anyway. So they go, the trial strategy is self-defense. That's her thing. Oh, wow. Her final story, this is it. This is the court story. give. This is her defense. The car got stuck in the mud. They were unable to dislodge it. That's what happened. She began suffering from severe anxiety and Alex suggested she lied down in the back seat of the car,

which she did. Then she says Alex got on top of her and began describing her in the third person calling her boy and saying how she deserves this and that she had betrayed him. He then covered her eyes and began cutting her clothes and skin with a knife. She said that she was, frozen and that she was afraid he was going to kill her. A struggle ensued during which Alex, quote, grabbed her by the throat and kept ripping hair out of her head. She was able to disarm him. He's in a psychotic homicidal frenzy and she's somehow able to disarm him.

Have we ever heard of that? 105. Yeah, 115. Have we ever heard of anybody being about to be stabbed viciously and just wrestle the knife out of someone's hand? Who is this, Chuck Norris? What are we talking about? No, never.

So she said then she began to defend herself by stabbing. She said that after the struggle she felt dizzy and faint and like she couldn't catch her breath and that things were starting to go black at the sides at the sides. Like a fucking. Oh, she lost a periphery. Yeah, like a full screen. They took a wide screen, made it full. Now we got nothing on the sides.

Formatted for her TV now. Now it's pan and scan. No good. It's all bad. She decided that she needed to get out of there because she was panicking. and at that point, that's when she scratched the word boy into her arm, quote, as a reaction. Oh, an odd reaction. She speculated that she may have done it to wake herself up in a sense and to help her feel something.

But she said she really didn't know the answer to why she cut herself. Then she took the knife and Alex's phone and walked away from the scene. She remember stumbling down a road and she fell a few times, which caused her to drop the knife in the phone. She didn't ditch them in a ditch. That's crazy. That would be fall down a lot. Yeah. Fall down a lot. And, you know, fucking things fly away. It's dark out. Even though it's

four o'clock. You know, it ever killed somebody? You get spaghetti legs. It's... You can't do it. You can't walk. Middle of the afternoon. Yeah. So, she wants the March 24th police interview tossed out. Yeah. And she said she was in custody. She said it was the third day in a row she was questioned by police

that Alex's body had been found and she had become a suspect at that time. Oh. And that the day before, the detective made a show of authority by presenting her with the release of medical information form without asking for her permission or telling her she could choose not to sign it. He just said, here, sign this.

She said she was asleep and had to be woken for the interview and that she was escorted to the conference room by a social worker. Right. When the detectives were standing outside the unit and would have been visible to her, the interview, quote, took place in the same lot conference room as the day. before, but this time there were two armed officers instead of one. Both had visible weapons and handcuffs and the door to the conference room was closed. Her back was to the door and one detective sat across from her one next to her and the

interrogation lasted approximately 90 minutes, which, by the way, is a very short interrogation. It's very quick, yeah, very quick. It's fucking eight hours. Fuck, yeah. They said the circumstances showed that law enforcement were not going to leave her alone and the detectives ramped up the pressure to talk and used psychological pressure, she said. And she said the detectives were required to provide Miranda warnings and that their failure to do so violated her Fifth Amendment right against self-incrimination. Now, I agree once she's a suspect, they should have Mirandized her.

And tell her such, yeah. Yeah, well, you don't have to tell her she's a suspect, but you're Miranda. By telling her, by Miranda. That tells you. That should tell her. Yeah. That should let her know it's up there. but they were saying that they still didn't know if she was the victim that was what the cop said they still didn't know it was going on and then once she started kind of spilling shit it was kind of too late at that point now the trial the court is going to allow her to admit some of Alex's journal entries into court record oh to show that he's a dark person and cannibalism and all that kind of shit the vamporism oh god for get it. But the court limits the use of the journal entries by the defense. You can't just have

everything. You can have very specific things to what you want to talk about. So she had moved to present certain entries as evidence of his character, reputation, behavior, statements, and specific acts. And she said that that will boost her self-defense claim. And she suggested that Alex was violent and that he condone non-consensual sex, also known as rape. Not known by any other word, really. It's like when you'll hear people say like a minor woman and you're like, you mean a young girl. Yeah. You mean a child girl.

Yeah. So she sought, though, to introduce these as a McMorris evidence, which is McMorris versus State. That's the case that that comes from. So the circuit court agrees with some of it and allows her to introduce. produce the following evidence. Alex is writing that Ezra was actually aware of when she stabbed him and which she testified contributed to her perception of the danger that he posed to her. So basically, what you would have read that would have made you feel threatened while this

incident was going on. So if he talked about he likes to stab people, that would be relevant. Or if he talked about, I want to cut someone with a knife and then eat them, that would be relevant, that kind of shit. Other than that, though, they said his character trait for violence through opinion or reputation evidence, but the court refused to permit her to use the journal entries as evidence of his character for violence to support an inference about the victim's actual conduct during the incident. Now, I don't want diaries used, especially if it's fantasy like that. I don't want that used in trials. Not unless it helps

Like catch the murder Yeah Like if it's the victims But it helps I don't want to use it against the victim No Unless they're saying Ha ha I'm gonna make it look like this guy killed me

And they didn't I'm gonna kill myself That's a much better journal to be using Yeah Yeah Now she is By design and by her own Everything

The star of this trial Oh She makes a spectacle of herself She does herself up which a lot of people, they want to look nice in court. Yeah. She does herself up, hair, makeup, which is fine, like we said. All the outfits are all pink, though.

Very pink. Oh. And the defensive strategy was to make her seem like a young, young girl. Like a child, yeah. Like a child. Small, young, meek, pink. Yeah. Look like your daughter.

You know what I mean? Look like whoever's daughter out there. Pink. Everything fucking pink. Too much pink. Light. Different shades of pink, depending on day, depending on. She'll have outfits with three different shades of pink on it.

It's wild, dude. Yeah. So she came in with different hairstyles all the time, different clubs. Like, it was a fashion show for her. Yeah. It was crazy. This is 1819, huh? This is 2019, this is going on.

Yeah, this is post, like, once, I mean, there's been a bunch of them, obviously, that tried to do their best to, like, doctor themselves for an image. But Casey Anthony really fucking went to town with the, with, uh, with, And so did Jodi Ares. Obviously, Jody Arias. Yeah, that's a difference. She's a bit crazy. This is...

I'll go on a limb. This is just Jodiarius in a car. Yeah. It's the exact same case. But she's going to try... She's going to try to Casey Anthony this and try to look like the librarian when she doesn't realize that this is way worse.

She's trying to look like... She's trying to look like the part of the porn before the bun comes down. Yeah. And the panties come off. That's what she's trying to look like rather than after. Yeah. So, yeah, she tried to look like timid and that kind of thing, too. Get small, they told her, really.

I mean, you could tell they told her, get small. You're small. You're real tiny. You're tiny. So the prosecution said shortly after they began dating, unfortunately for Alex, the defendant was involved in a complex series of other relationships at that time, which we know about. The defense says that there was a struggle. Ezra's attorneys point out a muddy bootprint on the ceiling of the car.

There's a muddy boot print on the ceiling of the car, and that's evidence that a struggle had taken place in the back seat. Uh-huh. Okay. That's their whole case. Jason testifies the boyfriend. He's kind of the star of this thing because he's funny. He says that when he walked in, and everybody, everybody talked about this,

everybody noticed this. This is not just an ex-boyfriend. whatever. He said on the day I was testifying, I was kind of shocked when I walked in the room. She's given me these looks, adjusting herself, like being overly, you know, attuned to me. You could see it, dude. She's adjusting her hair. She's fixing herself up. Like, yeah, that's my man right there. It's weird. Then, this is fucking crazy. Jason's asked by the prosecutor to identify Ezra in court, which they do that by, can you tell me where she's sitting and what she's wearing? Yeah. He identified her. as wearing a pink jacket.

Okay? Yeah. And she was. But then during the break, she was wearing the pink jacket over something. She took a- What to guess what that is? His shirt? Nope.

She took it off during the break, and when he came back up to testify, she's wearing the green sweater that he gave her at the hospital. Oh, you bitch. She wore it underneath because she knew he was testifying that day. To fuck with his head. This is the shirt. You gave me. That's what she's wearing, the shirt.

Wow. Now, most people didn't realize anything. Just looked like she had a green sweater on. She took her jacket off, but he knew that's the sweater I gave her at the hospital. He said it was emotional to see that the games never stopped. It was deliberate. Ezra definitely wore that to get a response out of me. He said it was just shocking.

I don't understand what her tactic was, but I definitely felt uneasy. I felt like more of emotional manipulation I had been put through. I definitely felt like she thought that showing that to me is like, this is how much I love you still. I have a piece of you. Yeah, that's what it is. Like, I'm swearing this. There was a case we saw, there was something that Corey Richens did that was a similar thing. You know that metaphorical cannibal part?

She just did it. Yep. The Corey Richens did something similar when her ex came in there, the guy that they had to read all the text messages. Oh, the guy that said. Yeah. What's real? What's honest, Your Honor? He said, tell the whole truth.

He said, what do you mean by the whole truth? That was his... That was what he said, and everyone went, huh? What did you say? Honest engine. I heard a lawyer talking about it afterwards. I think it was Emily Baker said, I was a prosecutor for 15 years.

I've never heard anyone say that before. I've seen thousands of people sworn in. None of them said, depends on what you mean by the whole truth. That's never come out. The judge literally had to explain my name. And then they said, fuck it. Take the oath in the Bible away and just said,

if they ask you questions, will you tell it as truthful as you possibly can? And he said, yeah, he goes, good enough. Let's go. Let's go. Let's go it along. What are we doing here? Getting caught up in semantics with this asshole. Some guy who lives in a fucking rental house that his murderer girlfriend lets him crash in.

He installs a bathtub for pussy for Christ's sake. He's the j-a-old. of this case. It's funny. Put in a bunch of curtain rods for blow jobs. Fucking wild. So several experts for the state and the defense testified at the trial. They discussed her injuries, specifically whether the injuries were self-inflicted, another person.

She had bruises, I guess, on her neck consistent with having been strangled, and that injuries on her hands and forearms were consistent with defensive wounds and that the location of the injuries of her injuries could have been facing. had the cuts been deeper. Yeah. That's her defense people. There's also dueling psychologists here, or psychiatrists, actually.

One guy, Dr. James Hopper, a behavioral researcher and clinical instructor of psychology and psychiatry at Harvard Medical School. And there's a psychologist named Steve Benson, who the prosecutor calls like a hired gun and all this shit. And he sits up there

a real smuggled smirk on his face, too. from Winnebago Community College. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, from fucking O'Clair U. Not even the real college. I don't even know what college is there. So.

Spelled O H. Claire. Yeah. Oh, Claire. So they review police reports, medical records, and recordings, transcripts, all that kind of shit. Benson testified that he diagnosed Ezra with PTSD, childhood onset, and persistent. depressive disorder with anxious distress.

He explained that her statements during the interviews with law enforcement were consistent with those diagnosis and that intrusive thoughts and avoidant symptoms, dissociation, and a regression, which explained why she gave emergency responders her birth name rather than her name she's been using. Or because that's fucking legal. Yeah. He also testified that self-cutting can be a trauma response, which it can't. be. It can also be a way for you to try to set up a fucking murder scene.

There is that too. Dr. James Hopper said after a crime, a person can be really stressed. And that can make it hard for them to tell the police officer about things that are actually in their brain. People's ability to retrieve information can improve over time if we become less stressed over time. Yeah. Okay. Now, the prosecutor, though, said trauma can certainly affect your memory, but it doesn't make you lie. I think that was convenient. Right.

Yeah. Now, a childhood friend of hers said, when asked if they thought she was truthful, Ezra was in her testimony, she says, no, I think she had too many ideas of deception going on in her head. She couldn't figure out which one to use. She couldn't keep a story straight. Fuck. That's what happens when she testifies. And the first thing they ask her about on the stand, by the way, when Ezra testifies, she testifies, it's weird, dude. She's so smiley and like she acts like she acts like she's going to a new school and they're going to put her up at the front of the class and just find out about her.

Who are you? What you do? Well, I mean, I'm from over here. I'm trying to be friendly. I'd like to make friends. It's so strange. What did you do last summer? Well, I was going to think.

Yeah. It's so fucking weird, dude. Her smiles and she's like, it's weird. You're on trial for murder. Look serious. It's weird. That might be okay, but when you see it, it didn't come across well at all. It's bad.

Did she think she was like portraying a girl incapable of stabbing? Is that what she thought? Yeah, I'm so nice and pink. How do you? I'm not a bad person. And they asked her, will you explain to the jury why you've been drawing and doodling in court? Because the media made a big deal of the fact that she's drawing, which a lot of people do. And she said, oh, and she did it real smile.

She goes, it's just like a way for me to like, you know, kind of control my anxiety a little bit and, you know, just kind of get more or just center myself in this trial, because it's trial stressful, you know what I mean? Sure. It's creepy. So she testifies, she said, I cut my hand because I kept trying to grab him and then I finally got free and I finally got the knife away from him. She later said, that was the beginning, what she said initially. Then at trial, she said, I then decided to knee him in the groin and he drops the knife at that point because she can't explain in court that she grabbed the knife by the blade because her hand wasn't cut enough. So now she had to switch it. And now it's a,

now it's a cartoon. She needs him in the groin. Not only does he immediately fall down, he throws the knife and everything. That's not what people do when they get hit in the balls. First of all, if you kick me in the balls, I got about eight seconds to stab the fuck out of you before that shit sets in. I will use that eight seconds. I'm going to use all eight of those seconds on you. If I have a knife and you do that. But once it's, once, yeah, once, once that, the paralyization takes effect, then it's over.

All that's coming out is, bitch, I'm going to fucking kill you. Well, then all you could do is this with a knife. You could be like, just wild swings. Get back. No like real, not even like a sweep, just, little motions. Like you're fanning mosquitoes.

Get away. Get away. You don't know what to do with it. Oh, the pain is crazy. It's the worst. Yeah. So she said, yeah, I decide to knee him in the groin. He drops the knife.

Instantly, I grab the knife. I start stabbing him anywhere and everywhere I could. That's her testimony. So she goes with the back seat thing. She said most of the blood evidence was found outside the car. obviously, so that contradicted that. She said, Alex and I started slow, meaning in their relationship. We held hands.

We hugged. We shared a few kisses. And then we eventually became partners. She said their sex life was normal. She even said it was vanilla at first. But then I encouraged him to explore himself and things he might want. And we started practicing and doing these new things that he wanted. Okay.

That explains a. Four-month torrid affair. Yeah. That takes so long to get to. That's what I mean. That's usually not immediately. Explore yourself, figure it out. Yeah.

It takes a while. So the lawyer said, was there ever a time back in your relationship in January or February where Alex used a knife when having sex with you? Uh-huh. She said, yes, he had cut a pair of my pants. So she said, then they started getting into bondage and shit. She said, he enjoyed to blindfold me. I took the role.

of submissive. It turned into what could be considered a BDSM relationship. The prosecution says there is absolutely no evidence that Alex was involved in BDSM whatsoever. She just pulled this out of her asshole, essentially. He has no

blindfolds or ropes or any of that shit at his house. There's none of that exists. There's nothing crazy in his room. No. There's also a big argument over the word prone. Okay. She says that she absolutely does not like to be in a prone position.

Uh-huh. Okay. So then they go back and forth and they say, well, that's funny. There's a text exchange with John Hanson from February 2018 where she sends a picture to Mr. Hanson of herself in a prone position, then follows it up with, I just want to do something similar, but I'd like you to tie me up for it. They're like, that's funny. I think like on your back.

Defenseless. Defenseless. Yeah. That's what I'm getting. So they said they kept, she kept talking about prone and prone and prone. But they said she was asked about being prone as in lying face down and having sex with Mr. Woodworth behind her. I didn't ask her if she liked it or if she didn't at that point.

This is them talking to the judge here. And so there's a lot of going back and forth with prone. Okay. Is it doggy or is it missionary? That's what they're saying. They said, lying down on her or being prone as opposed to face up in the missionary position, as it's called. Those are two very different things, and it does not open the door whatsoever, nor would I call the photograph prone, blah, blah, blah. They go back and forth on that.

So they ask. Oh, yeah, yeah. Those aren't published to the public, but they're published in court. The lawyer asks, as you were driving, whenever you're sending texts or shit, realize if anything happens down. the road, this is all going to be shown in court. All of it. Also, you don't know how it's going to touch your life. It could be somebody completely unrelated to this and her phone gets opened and it's your fucking dick.

Yeah. You don't know. Because you sent it to a friend who shared it with a friend. God damn it. They said, as you were driving, were you paying much attention to where you were going? And she said, no, I was just driving. They said, what were you hoping to do when you saw Alex? She said, I was hoping we could be friends still after everything between us.

They said, she said, but once the car got stuck in the mud, everything changed. She said, I was breathing heavy. My anxiety was heightened. And she said, Alex positioned himself above me. You could say straddled me in the back seat. She said, was cutting her clothes away. I could feel the knife start to graze and cut into my skin. She said, what was going through my mind is he's going to make you do what he wants.

He's going to take anything he wants. I'm afraid he's going to kill me. then I decided to knee him in the groin. He drops the knife. Instantly, I grab it and start stabbing him. They say, are you trying to kill him? And she says, no, I just want to get away. I need to get out of the car.

I need to get out as fast as I can. Then they say, so why did you keep stabbing him when you were still in the car? She said, because he wouldn't let go. He wouldn't let me out. I was terrified. She says, then they ended up outside. But by then he'd suffered wounds to his head, neck, and groin. But he was still able to grab a hole.

of her. She said, and he pulls me very close and tight to his body. And they said, what are you thinking? And she said, he's going to kill me. I reached around and just quickly stabbed him in the side, hoping he would let go. She doesn't remember what happened next, she said, but, you know, whatever. She, but the, the prosecutor, the prosecutor said that she spent the next couple hours rearranging the evidence to make it look like he did his fault. Carving shit, cutting her own clothes. She's in the middle of nowhere. She's got plenty of time.

She sat there with a man bleeding out and framed this whole situation to look like she's a... How do I get out of this? Yep. She said, I kept saying out loud, what's happening? What's going on? I couldn't get the feeling outside my head, the visual of the horror of seeing Alex and seeing the blood. It felt like I was in a tunnel like I could only see so much around me.

It felt dizzy and faint, like I can't catch my breath. The prosecutor says she, you know, this is later on, she, you know, conveniently forgets kind of everything that happens within that three hour period, which is kind of fun between then and the doorstep. For three hours, she didn't wander for three hours. It's right there. And they have her footprint. She went right to there.

It's not like she went the other way for half a mile and turned around. So Ezra goes on and say, I don't know how to process this. I just don't know. The prosecutor says that Ezra deliberately drove to this remote area with the purpose of killing him. And she said, then I just remember stumbling down the road. I wanted to call the police. I wanted to get help. I wanted to do anything I could.

But I accidentally broke the phone. They said, why did you scratch boy in your arm? Yeah. That's what her attorney says. And she said, I thought about it. And when I think about this, I don't know. It was just a reaction. I thought about it.

Yeah. Yeah. Not to purposely mislead investigators. As soon as they called me on my bullshit, I didn't know an answer for that. Yep. They said, was there a point at the hospital where your memory began to return to you? And she didn't say, yeah, when they started telling me about the crime scene and how full of shit I was, she said, when I was finally able to take a shower that night and I could see my hand was cut and I could feel everything start to come back to me. Now, here's some reactions to her testimony. Her ex Jason said, quote, When she was on the witness stand, it didn't seem real.

She just seemed at times to be enjoying it. There were times on the witness stand where she was smiling or joking, which is not a good look. Her friend, one of her own friends from childhood said, I thought it was really interesting when she was asked to spell her name, how happy she got, how much she lit up. When she was spelling it, she was like smiling, like, yep, this is me. I get to talk about me now, like my time to shine.

someone who knows her. I know how to spell that. The prosecutor said her demeanor during the trial was very relaxed. She seemed on breaks excited to see her family. That this was kind of a family reunion. It wasn't someone who's, I'm on trial for first degree intentional homicide. This was someone who was wondering when she's going home. And she also thought that Ezra was emphasizing, emphasizing her femininity to appeal to jurors.

Especially the first day she testified, she wore a pink sweater. She said she was in pink and trying very much to be very meek and timid. Right. The defense closing said she wanted to live. She fought to survive. She's innocent. Right. Okay.

Jury instructions came on here. And I guess there was limiting basis for the jury's consideration of Alex's journal entries and Ezra's mental condition. Okay. Yeah. Jury comes back guilty of first degree intentional homicide. Yeah. Okay, Jason says when she heard that when she hears the verdict, it's a wild. You can, she's just like, huh?

Her brain breaks when she hears guilty. She thinks she. She's shocked. She thought she was going home. She really did. You could see it. I think she almost didn't believe it herself. She looked like she was going to faint almost.

There was like actual fear. Like nobody believes me anymore and I'm caught. Yeah. The prosecutor said, I think she thought she was going home at the end of that. day. Wow. So a juror said, they asked a juror, the juror said the stab wound to the head, and then she said, that's where I stabbed him first. That's an intentional act to kill somebody. And what does she, and that she also says about Ezra testifying, the juror said, quote, she didn't help herself much. I would expect more, more emotion, more something. And the interviewer

said, remorse. And she said, yeah, yeah, definitely remorse. There wasn't any of that. Yeah, one of those. Give me a, give me a, give me a, remorse. Okay. She had regret about fucking John. She had zero regret about this.

And she got a lot of shit. And I do understand. People get that, oh, people do say that, like, a lot of women

on trial, they look at them too closely and look at outfits and all that. But they do that for men. They do that for

everybody. They do that for everyone. People spent hours analyzing every O.J. Simpson facial gesture and facial

fucking expression. So they do that in every trial. But hers she was particularly her demeanor was weird in court, dude. It was not normal homicide fucking person, whatever. So then, before sentencing, she released a statement. It's a bitch about the media.

She said, if you breathe, it will be used against you. If you cry too hard or too much, she's a fake. If you don't cry enough, she's heartless. If you smile, she's not taking this seriously. If you keep your face calm, she is unfeeling. smile but not too much it's okay to cry but not too much don't react but don't make sure that they but make sure that they know who you are yeah like a job interview it's the same fucking thing yeah be a normal person and if you weren't guilty you wouldn't even have to think about that shit it

would just come to you naturally or don't murder people yeah you don't worry about it yeah and she said about the family reunions quote unquote she said who would not smile after finally face to face with being with their family after so long people are on trial for first-degree murder. That's so stupid. I don't know. I'd feel embarrassed that I haven't seen my family in this long, and I'm embarrassing them. Because I'm in prison. She said she felt retramatized by the trial in the way she was portrayed as a sex fiend and a liar. And she said, I have supporters on my Instagram page, and they say they'll never stop fighting and neither will lie. She said the battle for justice has only

begun. How many followers does she have? Is it a lot? I have no idea. She was still putting out Facebook posts from prison, though. Wow. She's got someone doing that. And sentencing, she looks completely different. She's not blonde anymore. She's cut her hair super short. Well, completely different human being, wearing the jail scrubs, everything.

So, yeah, her mother pleaded with the court to grant her daughter the possibility for parole after 20 years. Please. Alex's aunt said, throughout the trial, we never saw any sign of sadness, shame, compassion, or the slightest bit of remorse for what you had done. Ezra says, I want to just say how sorry I am that they have lost their son. But my sorry doesn't cut it in my mind. I loved Alex very much. And I also feel a great loss.

And I am so sorry. It was half about her. Right. The judge made a point of saying how your apology is the most insincere fucking shit I've ever heard. And you, ma'am, may fuck off life in prison eligible to petition for extended supervision, so eligible for parole after 50 years. 50. Oh, fuck.

She's going to be 70 when she's eligible for parole. I mean, I think the judge did it because she was so young. I can't give you parole in 20 years. I can't do it. You're going to get out and do this more. Right. Yeah. You're going to get out and spit some kids out now.

At 40, you could sit at the end of a bar and bait somebody in. then fucking stab them in their sleep. Yeah. Then she's mad, by the way. Oh. 2020, she says, I've touched on the topic of the media before. I feel that I should acknowledge its presence.

I have no obligation. I have no commitment. I feel that I must comment as things have unfortunately gotten out of hand. I know that I'll never successfully combat the prejudicial, persistent, and invasive coverage. I am only one, but I am one. So I would like to express my voice on what I have observed.

most of all the lack of respect for anyone involved in this tragic event is appalling. We are stripped of our skeletons and reduced to abstract ideas. Now you're starting to sound like his fucking cannibalism philosophy. Feeling the edge of every second

that passes by, like a knife? What is she stupid? What is she doing? I know that I am not the only individual with this burden. I feel in their behavior they disregard our pain, the loss. This is not just something

to click, watch, subscribe, and comment on, I ask, could a greater miracle take place than for us to look through each other's eyes for an instant? I'm never going to win the media, quote unquote. I'm not here to do that. What I am here to do is draw awareness to gather support as well as highlight a system that's broken. I want to thank all of you that do support me. I want to thank all that continue to believe in me. Your support keeps this fight alive. Not only do I fight for myself, but for a better future. And that had 71 likes at whatever time someone took this screenshot. What the fuck?

Which is more than a lot of comedians we know when they're trying to promote their shows. And this guy is, this lady's a murder. 71. So she appeals, by the way, ineffective assistance of counsel for not getting her statements tossed out, yada, yada, yada. Was she in custody? Was she not? We've gone over that a shitload of times. You're not in custody.

If you're sitting in the room, but you're, you know, certain factors, the door's open. You're not in cuffs. Blah, blah, blah. So there's a lot of that going on here. So they deny her shit, by the way. Final thoughts. Here we go. This is, I believe, Alex's brother, said, quote,

I've been forgiven so I forgave her. It's just that simple. Hates like drinking poison and waiting for the other person to die. Oh. Hey, you know what? He's right. Pretty good. The guys, I mean, that's a great quote.

I don't know who said that. didn't, but... No, no. It's an old quote. It's old. Yeah. It's a great old quote. That's like from 2,000 years ago, that quote.

Yeah. It's a great old line. It's like Confucius or some shit. Yeah. Plato or somebody. But it's a fascinating way to say it towards, I mean, towards somebody that knifed your brother to death. That's the ultimate test of it, though. Yeah.

If you really believe that shit, it's fine to say it. But let's see how you, let's see how you practice that forgiveness and all that shit when it's real, when it's not just some bullshit. I mean that. They pass. the test with flying colors these people. They're good people. And I think I would probably say that in a lot of circumstances. But I'm sure there are, I'm sure there are circumstances where I will absolutely loathe

somebody for the rest of their fucking miserable shitty life. There's people I've hated for 30 years. You kidding me? It's fine. And they didn't kill anybody, I know. No. That's what I mean. I know someone who's killed someone I know and I don't hate that person.

I don't care. It's different. They're comedians. I genuinely hate it. I genuinely hate, literally hate. I have no, I don't even feel bad about it. Fuck them. And that's not me hoping that poison kills them.

I just, no, I don't care. Anything can kill them and I'll be happy. I don't give a shit. Doesn't have to be poison. So, Alex's family member goes on to say, I want him to be remembered as someone who loved everyone. Everyone loved Alex, you know, because he was always there to help. Alex wanted everyone to smile. Jason said, I feel like I could have been there.

I could have been the motive for this murder. He was the motive. That's what the prosecution's whole story was. She wanted Jason back. He is a little slow on the update. He is. He is so naive. I've seen his testimony where he comes across as an intelligent guy.

So I think I was snowed by actually seeing him. You have to read his words. He said that, and for her to take his life and put that blood on my hands, this is horrifying. And the prosecutor said, I feel confident in saying she was going to do whatever it took to get back together with Jason. Jason said, maybe I missed something. It like slipped through my hands. I still think about them both, though. I think about them both so often. I didn't have, it didn't have to end this way. You didn't have to hurt all these people. She's currently incarcerated in the Taika, wow, Tai Cheetah, Taikida, Taekita, correctional

institution and in Menominee, Wisconsin. She's there, and that's that. So there you go, everybody. That's Springbrook, Wisconsin. It's a fucking crazy story, right? Holy shit. That is the second woman from Wisconsin that chopped somebody to death. Yes.

We had a business chick. Yeah. That's right. Wisconsin will do it to you. But what's happening up there? Makes women want to cut you up, makes dudes want to eat you. I don't get it. It's weird shit.

Too much dairy, you guys. Too much. the dairy. You're craving protein, everybody. You're craving meat. So anyway, if you enjoy that story, get on whatever app you're listening on, give us five stars. Netflix thumbs up, double thumbs up helps a lot.

Really helps drive us whatever lets them know that you're watching. So thank you for doing that. Thank you for hanging out with us. And if you're listening on Netflix, there are hundreds of episodes that came out before this. We're not a new show. We've been doing this since 2017. There's so many more.

We have all those shows. on whatever wherever you listen to podcasts. We've been doing this since since Ezra was an innocent person.

Ezra was a minor when we started this show. She hadn't done anything wrong. Nothing. So definitely do that. Tell you friends, do all that kind of shit. Shut up and give me murder.com

is where you get tickets for live shows. Please come out and see us at a live show. September 18th, Milwaukee. We have a few more tickets that we just released that were our holds

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Patreon.com slash crime in sports is where you get all the bonus material. Anybody, $5 a month or above, you get immediately upon subscription, almost 400 back bonus episodes you've never heard before. Pau, you're going to get those. Then you're going to get new ones every other week, one crime and sports and one small time murder. You get them all, everybody. This week, crime and sports, worst stadiums of all.

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in addition, and you get a shout out, Jimmy. Do me a favor, my friend. Hit me with the names of the best goddamn people in the fucking world who would never do any of this shit to us ever. There's too much to even get into for this episode. Hit me with them right, goddamn now. This is executive producer Susan Fuwell, Fuel, Fuel. Gary Howard is in Baxter, Tennessee.

And it's his 20th anniversary. How about that? Hey, happy anniversary, Gary. Happy anniversary. She's very nice to. We've met her playing. I didn't make that. I mean, either.

Working on it a second time now. Yeah. Addie Murphy, penis penis, penis, James. Oh, penis penis. There are whores in Minnesota. That's what some man wanted me to say. Okay. Why would you want me to say that?

Alicia Grant, happy hours in Yazoo City, Mississippi. He loses this week. I'd rather be in Tennessee, I imagine. Yes, for sure. Yeah. Hey, Cody. That baby's doing good. Cody, he's a, what a great kid in Michigan.

William October and company. Billy October. I don't know who. Hey, Billy October. Sounds like a... I don't know what the company is, but Bethany Arnett. Also. What is it?

Sounds like a failed gunfighter. Billy October. You got shot one of the first. And company. Thank you guys so much for everything. Other producers this week. Liz Vasquez, Peyton, Meadows. Genesis Hill, Dolly Parton, and her imagination library.

Oh, boy. Don't forget to donate to that. She deserves it. Miranda Star, Jeffrey Adamski, Adamski, Benjie Bennett, Tiff would know last name, Miles Martin Averill, Corey would no last name, Lydia Tees, Thighs, Thieves, Kyle McCord, Chantrell Davis,

yes, no, maybe, Erica Wickland, Wickland, Leslie Hats, Kelly Maline, Malini, Malini, Jared Enos, Brian Nelson, Molly L, Jessica James, Samantha Bolstad, Kira Repchick, Branick would know last name. Joshua Gendron, Bethany would know last name. Gonzo would know last name. Ali Kromer, Trent Mibust, Mbust.

Me bust. Me bust. Trying to be dirty. I don't know what that is. Perhaps not. That might be Trent's last name. It's tough. Lucy Smith, Brianna would know last name.

Bill Sousa. Melissa would know the last name. Mary Briggeron. Bregan. Horn, McKenzie Sio, slow, oh, slow, slough. It's probably slow, right? You know, nobody wants to be slough. I don't know.

The letter H. Justine Sharovsky, between the notes, Christopher Costanzo, Castanzo, Kyle Mendenhall, Rachel Ferris, Shelby Smoot. Donna would know the last name, Stephen Heladio, Kendall Jackson, probably not that one. Carmel Padroni, Eric Radakke. Try my wine. Paton Reed. Conard Richardson. Paula would know last name.

Mary Streepie. Joseph Dupakes. Depeyx. D'Pykez. Anne Claire Pallavi. Stephen Cook. Oh, it's just Steve Cook. Sorry, Steve.

Laurie Haddock. Lauren Cahill. Janella Beeler. Julie would know last name. Beth Simon, Danielle Le Masters. Sarah Smith. Lori Latimer. R-TMama, Daniel Perkins, Joshua Model, Andrew Jackson, probably not that one.

DJ Wilson, Brent Gilmore, Nicole Frazier, Grant Wynn, Renee Brandenberg, Jennifer Cordova, Desiree, Taborah, Dezreirae, Tabitha Ayers, Jeremy, with no last name. Rick with no last name, Judy Campbell, Rachel with no last name, Kenneth Clee, Sean Sorovsky, Amanda Bird, Melanie Barr, Meredith Wheatley, Akiko, Akiko, Grag, Azizizizek. Godziziac. Sure. Gazziziac. Angela Bella. Josh would know the last name. Kerry Troop.

Samuel Myers, Julia Leboe. Asfidel. Asfido. I have a rash and need a good fingering. What? Oh. Why would you want that said? I don't understand.

Well, she wants everyone to know that in case someone wants to get the fingering. What do you want, Jimmy? A15 SP. That's a person. Who needs a finger? Holden Kirk, Patricia Kaufman, Mandy would no last name, Jackie Edwards, A.N, I. Mica Clayman,

Bia, B, would no last name. Ali Hachim, Hachim, Wisconsin Winks. I don't know what that means. Nicole LaFouchy, Aaron Fritz, Melinda, would no last name. Ryan Brown, Ian Davis, Alyssa Rivera, Aaron Stein,

Sandra Stalker, Stokar, Tyler Must Vet, Must Vet, Wendy, Wendy Felt, Tanya Parek, Pam Salauma, Caitlin McMurphy, Malita with no last name, Doug Berlison, and everybody the patrons this show, you're the best. Thank you so much, everybody. God damn it, these people fucking rule. We appreciate the hell out of you.

We appreciate all that you do for us all the time. Thank you for hanging out with us. Thank you for telling your friends. Thank you for spreading the word. Thank you for everything you do for us. You want to find us on social media or anywhere else. Just head to shut up and give me murder.com. Everything's there.

It's all laid out. You can go see us and hang out with us. Either way, though, keep coming back next time. And until next week, everybody, it's been our pleasure. Bye.