Smart Money Happy Hour with Rachel Cruze and George Kamel - Disney Adults, Disney Trauma, and How They Priced Out the Middle Class

Episode Date: October 6, 2022

Join Rachel Cruze and George Kamel as they talk price hikes, megafandom, and insider savings tips for the most magical (and arguably expensive) place on earth: Disney World.   In This Episode:   ·     What it really costs the average family to take on Disney World ·     A shameless testimony from a real-life Disney adult ·     Why Disney execs are okay with pricing out the middle class   Helpful Resources:    ·      Be entered to win a $100 Visa gift card when you take our listener survey! Click here to let us know what you think.     ·      Do you have a Guilty As Charged question for Rachel and George? Send a DM to @rachelcruze or @georgekamel on Instagram! Be sure to type “GUILTY?” at the top of your message so we don’t miss it.   ·      Get your finances organized, make a plan, build up your confidence, and kick money stress out of your life for good with the EveryDollar budgeting app. Click here to get started today!   This Week’s Happy Hour Special:  Spiced Cider ·     8 ounces apple cider ·     1 cinnamon stick ·     1 ounce rum (optional)   Heat apple cider until slightly steamy. Stir in a cinnamon stick and—if you’re feeling a little something extra—an ounce of rum. Cheers! Learn more about your ad choices.  Ad Choices | Megaphone by Spotify Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey guys, I'm Rachel. I'm George. And this is Smart Money Happy Hour. This is the show where two friends who happen to be money experts, armed with a drink in hand, talk about money, pop culture, and everything you wish your friends were talking about. And this episode, we're going very controversial. So controversial.

Are you sure we're ready for this? This is a hot topic. People might get very angry. Oh, boy. Are you ready? I'm nervous. What is it? Disney.

Oh, boy. Yep. Some of you just. Some of you just got out of here. So we're going to talk about whether or not the middle class can afford to go to Disney. This is big. We got facts. We got stats.

We got research. We have personal stories. And we're going to give you some insider tips to make that magical vacation more affordable if you so choose to go. That's right. It's your life. Now, George and I are on the Ramsey show co-hosting taking calls. We both have our own podcasts. Things are just going and move in.

But on this podcast, unlike others, we have a different drink. every podcast. And this one, we decided to go a little kid-friendly. So we went with an apple cider. Just a spiced cider. It's a mocktail. Now, if you want to spice it up, you can add some rum. That's your choice. That is your choice. We are going non-alcoholic this episode. And with a cinnamon stick,

fall. That makes it very nice. It's great. And you know how this goes. We start with a drink and we talk until it's finished. So drink up because these people have things to do. They're busy people, Rachel. And this is a warm drink this episode, which is very, very. fun. Okay, so let's get into it. Can the middle class afford to go to Disney? What's middle class? How would you define middle class? I'm curious. Income wise. I mean, I would take like the average income in America. Okay, which is like what? Well, single, single is 44. Yeah, household. I think it's what. 60 to 64.

So I'd go, hmm, I'd go 50 to 80? Okay, I was going to say 50 to 100. Okay, we can do that. It would be middle. Upper, you're talking six figures plus. Okay, that's not fact people? Lower middle, probably 30 to 50, and then lower class, like we're talking, you're basically at or below poverty line. Okay, fair.

Like minimum wage. That's where we're at. Okay, so middle class, that's who we're talking. about, which is the majority of America. Where can they afford this these days? Yeah, so let's do some little happy hour Disney trivia, shall we? Okay, I'm going to hit you with this question. Okay.

Even I know this. Okay. How many parks are at Disney World and bonus points if you can name them all? Let's see. Animal Kingdom. Yep. Magic Kingdom. Nailed it.

Epcot. Yep. And Hollywood Studios. Boom. Dang. Okay. Got it. So far, your team is winning.

Check, check, check. That's pretty good. Right, here's your question, George. On average, how many people visit Disney World each year? That's way harder than yours. That's just tough. I can't wait to hear. Okay, it's got to be over a million but less than a billion.

Wow, there's a range for you. Is that right? There's a range for you. Yes, yes, you are hot. I'm going to say, okay, if there's 365 days and let's say 100,000 people go a day, maybe more. Yep. You're talking, I'm going to say five million. I did not let...

Is that it? No! I think only five million people a year go to Disney World? Is it 20? Keep going up, George. This is fun. 50? Getting closer.

Y'all, they have too much money. Getting closer. A hundred. No, no, no, no, no, no. You are... Go back. 60. Go down a little bit.

55. Go up a little bit. 57. 56. 58. 58. Good job. Wow.

I'm a great guesser. Wow, that was good. That was good. Seventh tries the charm. It's what they say. Yeah. 58 million. That feels like too many, y'all.

To comprehend that number, that's basically the entire population of California, plus the population of New York. Go every year. But think about all the international. Now, COVID probably put a dent in that. Oh, that's true. But think about the international. Yeah, that's a lot.

I mean, it's a big deal. And people that love Disney, they like do Disney Paris and Disney Tokyo. Oh, yeah, they're an international. I forgot about that. Yeah, they are. Okay, I got one last one for you. All right. What was the cost of park tickets when it first opened in 1971?

And if you're listening, get the number in your mind to see how far off you actually are. Okay. 1971 cost to get into the park. Okay. So I think it's around like 200, I want to say today, ish. So, man, I'm going to go like $38. $38? I don't know.

Yeah. Am I close? You're way off. Oh, shoot. Too low or too high? Way too high. Oh, really? Yeah.

Wow. Let's go 16. Uh-uh. Lower? Lower. Stop it. Eight? It's probably the cost of like a cup of water at Disney now.

I'll say that. Okay, we're going to go six. Lower. Five? Lower. No, George, that's not true. This is not correct. 350.

No, I don't believe it. I'm sorry, I don't believe it. Sometimes facts are presented to you and you have to say that's not true. And guess how much it was if you were a kid? Free. $1, Bob. Wow. One dollar.

Inflation. No, that's a little bit higher than inflation. That's like college tuition. Yep. So since Walt Disney World opened, the cost of the park tickets has risen 3,871%. And you were close. Single-day tickets today, 169 bucks. Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah, it was close.

I thought we were 200. And the cost of park admission one day for a family of four, $500. Man. That's a lot. Gosh, okay, so what's crazy, too, is there's so many other expenses that go in. No. You can't just get park tickets in calling a day. But thankfully, the author of the blog, Mouse Hacking, did all the math for us.

So she estimates that the cost in 2022 for a family of Ford to go to Disney for five days is around $5,630. I just threw up in my mouth a little bit. A little cider just bubbled up. Okay, so my question is for four, for five, that's for five days. That's a lot of days, right? I mean, that feels like a lot. Most people probably going for two or three days. I guess.

How long did you go for? I've been, so I went when I was little twice, and then I went as an adult. You took the kids more recently. Yeah, I took the girls. We went for three days. Okay. Because we couldn't, well, no, I shouldn't say that, not to throw my husband under the bus. Winston?

He couldn't handle it more than three days. He's like, eh, we don't need that much. I could probably go for like a week long. I love it. If four parks easily one day per park. Yeah, yeah, if you're like doing it all. If you're doing it all. If we're our girls, they don't do everything.

They're still small. So like... Yeah, they don't care about Epcot. Let's be honest. I love Epcot. I'm an old man. They put the frozen ride in there, so they kind of go to it. Okay, let's break it down.

Where does that 5630 come from? Okay. A thousand is transportation, which is, you know, four round trip flights. A lot of people drive, so it may be cheaper that way. Plus transportation to and from the airport. Which we did that. We did Disney for our, where we stayed, they had like the, yeah, you could add that package on. And that feels low.

I mean, that's $2.50 per round-trip flight. Now, kids are cheaper, hopefully, to fly still. If you're under two, you get free, but you can't buy a ticket? Oh, normal ticket above two? Yeah. That's highway robbery. They're little babies. I know.

I guess they take up a seat. Yeah, I mean, what are you going to do? What are you going to do? Okay. Okay, so then roughly it's about $1,200 to stay at Disney's Pop Century Hotel. All right, and then it's another two grand for five days of park tickets, and that's without the park opera option. Yes. Okay, and then about $130 for Jeannie Plus and Lightning Lanes.

You don't need that, but I feel like it makes the experience better. I know. And you know what? That's it. When do you spend money for convenience and I think that stuff is worth it? If you're going to go and you want to make the most of it. Just get there. Yeah, go fast if you can. Okay. And then you're not done because we got to eat. So food and drink and souvenirs because you got to get the Mickey Ears or else she's crying and then Brother needs one to. Do it before. There's a life hack. years before.

What do you buy them? Amazon. Oh, way cheaper than at the park. Oh, for sure. But it's not the same as getting it at the park. They don't care. They don't care. Wow.

Food and drink and souvenirs, depending on how hard do you want to go, you're looking at $1,300 for a family of four for five days. Yep. And that rounds us out. That's a lot. Yeah, it's an expensive trip. That comes out to about $1,400 bucks a person. Do you, though, George, y'all don't have kids yet?

But, like, if you had them, like, do you think you'll, like, take them, like, once? I would have to wait until they have like actual memories. I'm not convinced that like two. You're one of those. Yeah. Okay. That's a lot. I see you.

I see you over there, sipping that cider. Mm-hmm. I got you. Wow. Shade has been thrown. Because the magical ages, though, and those are before the memories. Hey, all, if you need me, you can find me under the bus where Rachel threw me for not

taking a one-year-old to Disney, because I've ruined their childhood. Taking an infant child, a young baby. With a quick story, Rachel. I have Disney trauma. No, are you serious? I think that's why it puts a bad taste. Give it all. Was it the teacups?

No. No. I went to Disney and I lost my parents. George, that breaks my heart. Little George. I mean, I'm little now. I was so little. Everyone looked like giants.

I'm looking up hoping to find my parents. And I cried for what felt like hours. George, this is terrible. And no one grabbed you. Thankfully, no one grabbed me. But I'm pretty sure. I'm sure like I found a security guy. No, like, no, but usually a parent would be like, there was a...

This was the 90s, Rachel, it was a different time. It was every man for himself. You know, there was no tracking of your iPhones. His small Middle Eastern child lost in a sea of adults. He needs help. I just remember standing there looking up going like, do you know where my mommy is? Okay, so what happened? I just waited and waited, and I think I found a security guard.

and I think like an hour later probably, I found my parents. You were your parents freaking out? Oh, I'm sure. They had to have been. So they were probably at security. I was, you know, probably like four or five. George, that's terrible. Which park was it?

Do you remember? I think it was Magic Kingdom. Wow. So this is a hard episode for you. How are you doing? How are you feeling? I thought I was okay. And then I was like, where's all this bitterness towards Disney?

And your memories come up. We need Dr. John Deloney in here. That's what we need. This is therapy. Yeah, you need to counsel all that. I'm sorry that the trauma happened to you. It's okay. Trauma's affected when you don't feel like you have a safe place to go.

I'm so sorry. A lot of people have great memories of like how special it was. And I just remember crying my eyes out thinking I die here now. Oh my gosh. So anyways, one of a caveat that because I think it will be a helpful filter for our listeners. I'm like, why is George so against Disney things? And it's because of all that. Yeah, that's fair.

You know what? If I had that same experience, George, I could empathize. I've gone back as an adult. It's a good time. Now, I will say tourists like can be the worst. Like they, if it was just me hanging out there, I know. Amazing.

But there's unaware people, selfish. They're just, they're not walking in any certain direction. They're in a foggy days. There's no order. They're just, yeah, they're just living the magical dreams of their life. So here, if we go back to the pricing besides baby George crying in Magic Kingdom, how expensive everything is, what's crazy is that they are opening a new hotel, okay? I'm not going to get this right.

I'm not a Star Wars fan, so help me out. Star Wars, Galactic. Galactic. Star Cruiser. I thought you were going to, like, hit me with something difficult. I saw that word. I was like. Galistic.

You're so close. But this is a theme on the show. Star Cruiser Hotel. It's not a normal smart money happy hour unless I'm teaching you a new word. Okay, now here's another crazy word here. So two nights stay on the... Halcyon. Halcyon Star Cruiser

Starts at Hit him with this number Are you ready for this people? Two nights Remember this is two week nights $4,809 For the most modest package Is what it says

A two-guest cabin That's pretty wild That's insane Four thousand bucks Pooh Now part of the Disney magic Is Disney adults Have you heard about this

Oh it's a thing It's a thing Some of you listeners out there Might be this I could be on the cusp I could If someone convinced me enough I think I could go over the end.

There's a spectrum of Disney adult. Yeah, I'm on the low end of it, but I'm there. You loved it more than your kids did. You were more excited to be there than they were. That would be me. That's true. But then there's like people who have devoted their lives to Disney, right? Yes.

So a notable quote from Rolling Stone magazine article on how Disney adults became the most hated group on the internet. Here's what it says. With its emphasis on selling magic moments and making dreams come true, Disney sells a rather unsophisticated version of wish fulfillment to consumers, who willingly spend thousands of dollars on an authentic emotional experience that they know, at least on some level, isn't really authentic at all. Wow. And another quote says one of the reasons people find Disney adults so object. Thank you, George.

I'm just making sure we got there. It looks like object on the paper. No, I got it. I haven't, yeah, my apple cider hasn't hit me too hard. Hasn't really kicked in that much. The mocktail? The mocktail. Is that they decide to live in this world because they can. if they pay enough money or buy all the merch, it almost always signals a break from regular society or real life, says a Ph.G candidate in sociology who studies memes and fandoms.

I think that sums up a lot of my feelings towards it. There's a level of like escapism from reality. And you can't love that though. A bit. And they're apart there. That's why I love books. I'm like, I can read a book and just kind of like go into this world and it's awesome. Reading books is a normal thing people do. devoting your life to a company is very different. It's very different.

There's no, like, universal adults. Where are those people? That's a great point of six flags adults I don't see walking around. And here's the thing. Disney has done a masterful job at branding and marketing. That is true. But there is something magical about it, though. Unlike anything else, unlike a Six Flags,

like they've carried Walt's legacy so well. I think so. When you go in, it's like, man, people are helpful. They're happy. I don't know. I kind of like the escape. Well, here's what a Disney adult looks like. NPR released a story about a 28-year-old attorney in Connecticut who has been to Disney World more than 30 times. Last year, he took three trips to Disney World and each trip he estimates was about $2,000. Now, as an attorney, dropping $6 grand on your trips to Disney, not a big deal.

Yeah, I'm not like, I'm not mad at that. So we have a Disney adult in the room. Yeah, so Nicole, who does our social media, and she is, she loves it. So I'm going to assume Nicole's been to Disney more than 30 times. True or false? It's almost true. I'm gone three times this year and definitely like over 20, but probably we're close to 30. Not there yet.

She's a Disney adult, people. That is official Disney adult status. We're not judging you. I have no shame. It's fine. We love Nicole. She's very normal. I want everyone to know that.

How much of these trips costing would you guess? So it depends. Like if it's a family trip that I'm going on, like my family, we're all grown adults now. So we split it four ways. So it's a lot more economical. So we're talking under 1,000 per person, including travel and food and lodging? Probably close to 1,000, maybe a little over. Okay.

Because also if you do like the food and you do it all, it's going to tick up there. It adds up. I feel like I'm too frugal for this lifestyle. I'd be staying at a holiday inn off property. I'm eating, you know, breakfast. I'm bringing snacks. Sneaking in my own water bottle, all the things. If you had to, to go.

Financially, absolutely. But if you had a little margin, George, you wouldn't, like, upgrade and go stay at the... At this point in life, I would say, yeah, I'm just going to save up and make... Because at this point, convenience matters. Yes, that's it, I know. Time is everything. We're getting old. We're just grouchy. We're in our 30s now.

I know. Okay, so let's go back to the math. Disney, is it worth it or not? If your Disney trip costs $5,600, here's what savings would look like. So if you take home... If your household take-home pay after-tax is $6,000, which means you're making an annual household income around $85,000. A family trip to Disney will cost close to an entire month's salary. It's a lot.

It's a lot. And to save for that family Disney trip, you'd have to put away $416 every single month for an entire year. Okay. And if you want to do it in two years. Yeah, $208. That feels... For two years straight, saving $280. dollars. For the average person, that's a lot.

Yeah. Because remember, we're talking about the middle class. Can the middle class afford to go? I think the answer is yes, but there's sacrifices that would need to be made or not going on four other vacations that year. Like, you're not going every year probably. This is once every five years. I know. So it's like, okay, if it's a one-time thing, do it. But if it's the thing that you're like stretching your budget every month for your life just to do Disney World, that experience. That's not worth it because your everyday life then takes a hit. And is it worth that for Disney? Gosh, maybe I'm not a Disney adult. Well, the Disney execs, here's kind of what they're trying to say.

They're saying the higher price allows for lower capacity, which makes it a more enjoyable experience. So they're okay raising the price enough that it prices some people out, which I don't love that. But they're saying, well, at least the parks are going to be packed every single day. Yeah, I don't know how I feel about that. I know, I know. And those who can't afford it,

might say that the middle class makes up some of Disney's most loyal fans. Agreed. And they just priced them out. But if you're committed to visiting the most magical place on Earth, here's some ways to say. You've got some tips because you've done this thing. So spend part of your trip at the hotel pool or Disney Springs. And this is especially if you're like going for five days, six days, you don't have to do a park every single day. And in fact, if you have little kids, just to rest and be at the hotel, that's great.

You can also skip the park hopper option. and that saves at least $70 a day. That's a lot of savings, which means you have to commit, though. Commit to the park. And sometimes it's not fun because it's like, oh, we want to be spontaneous. We're at Disney.

But, you know, to save 70 bucks a day, it's going to be worth it. And then lastly, this one hurts a little bit, but it will save you money. Bring your own food. I enjoy the food experience at places. So that's a hard one. You love a big turkey leg or whatever they have there.

I don't know what they have. I know. Well, I'm not like, yeah, yeah. But I've heard the food is they've done a good job. Yeah. So, but if you want to save, though, this is a great place to save. You can bring a cooler, you can bring your own stuff in, which is actually very generous of Disney to do that. So yeah.

It kind of makes you want to go just to, like, get an actual non-trauma experience. We should do. You know how like Kelly and Ryan do, like, shows? Taking this on the road. Shows on the road? Should we do one at Disney, George? A thousand percent. How many people you think would, like, watch us live?

We have to take Nicole from our social media team. Yes. She can show us the ropes and capture all the, like, reels and memes and whatnot. not do it all. George and Rachel, go to Disney. I need a redo. I don't want to be better anymore. I want to love again.

Is that the only time you've been or the last time you've been? I went as an adult. Oh, you said that. Okay. Yeah, I went probably like five or six years ago. But I don't think I got the full experience. Yeah, you might need a redo. All right, George.

So, do you think it's worth it for the middle class to go to Disney? I think it is. I think do it one time, but here's the caveat. Do not put it on a credit card. Make sure you budget for it. pay cash for it so it doesn't come home with you and try to make some wise decisions so that you don't blow, you know, six, seven grand.

So maybe do it three days. Maybe we take one or two of the kids. I don't know. Make some decisions. Leave one at home. Leave a child at home. Yeah, now that's fair. Just to have a better experience.

Okay, so I am going to concur. Concur? Wow. We agreed for once. I know. I would agree with that. I think once every blue moon, if that's what it is,

because of just how expensive it is, Is it worth it in the long haul for the joy of your family? Every now and then, yes. Maybe once, maybe twice. And put a tracker on your kids. But then go to the beach. Like, go do other stuff. There's other great experiences out there.

That's cheaper than that. Don't lose your kids. It will cause lifelong trauma if you do. Trauma that's going to be talked out, man, later in life. All right. So, it's time for our last segment. Guilty as charged. This is where our producer gives us a new guiltiest charged.

Question every week, and if we've done it, we've got to take a drink and explain our story. Do these make you nervous? I get a little bit like, oh gosh, what's coming? I get excited. All right, Lindsay, what is it this week? Okay. You've committed less crimes, so. Let's see here.

Have you ever been jealous of something your neighbor or a coworker had, and what was it? Ooh. Kind of this whole contentment angle here. Yeah. Actually, the person I was jealous of is sitting right beside me. No. What could you be? How?

When you... I know. You know? Tesla. Yes! I wanted one for like two years. And then George pulls up with a Tesla. And I was like, what?

And I wanted to be excited for you. Deep down, I was angry. But I really did. I felt you. I felt your seething anger. I'm just kidding. I was very happy for you. But I really thought,

God, it's just a good-looking car. You don't have to pay for gas. You're plugging in. I mean, it was everything I wanted, George. And you... And you got there first. And you got there first. And you were so bitter.

But you know what? I applaud you. You got yours. I did. And it's gorgeous. Thanks, George. Way nicer than mine. Which, you know, not comparing.

I'm just kidding. But mine was very, very old. I got like the starter pack, Tesla. And yours is like, grand spanking new, just beautiful pristine. No, no. So, George, you were my, uh. Wow. I could probably figure out some others in life.

Sure. There you go, George. You were right in front of me. So it immediately came to mind. Okay. This is a tough one for me. Because you're just so content. No, I'm not.

But I'm just saying like there's so many options. Oh, okay. That makes me better. But part of it is I'm just unwilling to spend the money that they were. But I'm still like, oh, gosh, I want that. But I'm just not willing to put it. Hey, what? What do you want that you're not spending money on?

I mean, some of it's lame. I don't even mow lawns, but like seeing a guy with like a zero-turn mower, you're like, well, that'd be nice. I don't even mowl. Like, why am I jealous of my neighbor? Who's got like a nice mower? Do you want to be him? Not really.

Okay. I mean, Gary's a nice guy. Hey, Gary, if you're listening. But it's just one of those things. Whereas an adult, you're like, that's the, kind of stuff you want when you're adult is like those kinds of toys and you're like man that that looks nice does winston have a mower you know what Winston had a zero turn mower uh and then when we moved one of the things we said is that he we did it we did a lawn service for the first time so

for the first time of Winston's whole life for the past two years he is not mowed a lawn he's motelon every good for him yeah he's always done that uh growing up and through college he mowed lawns when we were in our house mode lawns and we moved two of you. years ago, he sold the zero-turn lawnmower. Wow. So he had, which you want. George, we could have switched. You could have pulled up in the zero-turn lawnmower, and I could have pulled up in your

Tesla, and we would have just high-fived each other. Our best lives. But it's usually houses, cars, vacations. That's right. I'm like, dang, that's how they get that house. Yeah. They're driving that car. Yeah.

They went to Europe. They went to Cabo, and it wasn't an all-inclusive. This is bougie. This is booginess. Unbelievable. Contentment. It's hard to get to. but it's so worth it is it is okay so you guys if you have any fun guilty as charged questions

make sure to DM me on instagram at rachel cruz or at george camel with a k and we might use one of yours in an upcoming episode make sure to label them though guilty is charged so we go through the DMs we see it you're just throwing random questions at us i'll feel like whoa this person's coming hard with snaps man why are they i don't know you like that bro why are they asking all these questions good caveat okay who finished the drink are you closer no you you you you Oh yeah, I win. This was a good one. This was a great one.

The cinnamon stick in, too? Fabulous. I'm going to give this one. I'm going to give it an 8 out of 10. I'm going 9 out of 10 because it's so fall. And it's not pumpkin. Which I appreciate. Give me a cinnamon all day over a pumpkin.

That's true. And let's talk about the cost. This one is super, super cheap because all it is is spice cider. So the cost of a half gallon of apple cider is about $450. The cost of cinnamon sticks. A little jar is $2. So you're looking at $6.50 for a half gallon of hot spice cider with the cinnamon sticks. And it comes out to $81 per serving.

Yep. And if you want to spike it, put a little adultness in there. An ounce of rum will bring it to $1.41. I like that. Love it. And these mugs are nice. Let's do one more of these. Cheers.

Cheers. Cheers. It's like a deep fall. It's great. All right, you guys. So make sure to follow us on social. And make sure to click the subscribe and follow button if you want to want to to learn more about money in our culture today. And plus, you get a free drink recipe going into the

weekend. Look at that. Check out the show notes for that. And new episodes releasing every Thursday. So tell your friends, tell your mom. Your mom may enjoy this. We don't know. And if you have a friend that loves Disney, send them this episode too, because they may love it. My wife likes this podcast. And she rarely likes, like, actually listens and engages with things I do. She works here. She's sick of me yak. She knows. But this. I think she likes you. Thanks, Whitney. Appreciate you. Okay. All right. See you next Thursday, George. for Smart Money Happy Hour.