Smart Money Happy Hour with Rachel Cruze and George Kamel - Do DINKs Have More Fun (and Money)?

Episode Date: November 21, 2024

💵 Start your free budget today. Download the EveryDollar app!   Carefree (and kid-free) travel isn’t the only reason DINKs are living their best life. In this episode, Rachel and George get real about the cost of kids and how to know if you’re ready. Next Steps: 🎥 Watch our video Why Fewer People Are Having Kids Today. 📱Submit a Guilty As Charged question for Rachel and George! Send a DM to @rachelcruze or @georgekamel on Instagram! Be sure to type “GUILTY?” at the top of your message so we don’t miss it. Connect With Our Sponsor: 🔒 Get 20% off when you join DeleteMe.   Today’s Happy Hour Special: 🍸 Isn’t She Lovely? Recipe: Imbibe 1 1/2 ounces vodka 3/4 ounce fresh grapefruit juice 1/2 ounce lemon juice 1/2 ounce elderflower liqueur 1/2 ounce blanc vermouth 1/4 simple syrup 1 ounce club soda Instructions: Combine all the ingredients except the club soda in a shaker with ice. Shake until chilled, then strain into a collins glass over fresh ice. Top with club soda, and enjoy! Listen to More From Ramsey Network: 💡 The Rachel Cruze Show 💰 George Kamel 🎙️ The Ramsey Show 💸 The Ramsey Show Highlights   🧠 The Dr. John Delony Show 💼 The Ken Coleman Show 📈 EntreLeadership   Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey guys, I'm Rachel Cruz. I'm George Camel. And this is Smart Money Happy Hour. Cheers, George. Cheers. Very refreshing. That's a delight. I mean, not mad at all.

It'd be hard to be mad at that. I don't get mad at lots. It's inoffensive. That does not make me mad. All right. This is the show. We're two friends who happen to be money experts talk about what you're talking about. So everything from pop culture, current events, and money.

And today we're talking about dinks. If you know, you know. And if you don't, we'll tell you. That's the point of this podcast. Before we talk about dinks, shall we talk about drinks? I did it in a question. Did you see that? That was good.

I went up at the end. Should we talk about drinks? We are sipping on and isn't she lovely, which I believe is named after producer Kelly Day. That's the etymology. It's where it came from. I don't make this up. Kelly.

And it's a lovely drink so far. So stick around until the end of the episode. We're going to give you our rating, reveal the cost per glass. and as always the recipes and the show notes if you want to skip ahead. Yep. All right, George, have you seen the internet trend, dinks?

But, like, I know that term has been around, which is, we'll just spoiler alert. Should we? Sure. I was going to wait till the very it now. I'm just going to just tell them. Dual income, no kids. But there's, like, a trends on Instagram

where they're like, we're dinks. Of course we sleep eight hours a night on a temporepetic night's mattress. Of course we take three-week vacations to Europe. Yeah, we're dinks, right? So it's like this like free. freedom living, right, before kids, dual income. Yes.

No kids. Hit me with some stats. Okay, so in 2021, from Pew Research Center, they found that 44% of people from ages 18 to 49 who are currently without kids say that they are not likely to ever have children. Wow. Isn't that interesting. 44%.

That's a big range. 18 to 49, which is like adults who aren't retired, half of them basically said, yeah, probably not going to happen. Yeah. And 44% percent. That's high. It's close to half. Wow. Well, even if you look back 100 years ago, having kids was more of a financial necessity than a choice. Like you needed the village. Now that child labor laws exist, you know,

you can't pull your 14 kids out of grade school to have them be unpaid labor on the family farm for harvest. That's right. Different times we live in, Rachel. There are some legitimate reasons, though, while people, you know, maybe don't want kids of their choosing. And then sometimes it's not of their choosing, right? The idea of having children. Everyone's got their reasons. For sure. Yeah. And I mean, first and foremost, why people aren't when you look at me, infertility.

We should call that out at the very top here. Because a lot of people want kids. Yes. They're unable to have kids at their own. And that's growing at a rapid rate as well. Right? So that's a whole conversation going on. But that's one reason.

And now there's career. Some people just, you know, they want to dedicate their time and their energy towards their career. And growing up. Yeah, it's hard to be a parent and work 60 hours a week and do all of these. you know, grow your career or get further education. All that's just harder when you're a parent. Absolutely. Increased access to travel.

This one's interesting. The ability to travel has highlighted alternative cultures, ways of living that are a communal, but less nuclear family focused. And travel is tougher with kids. So if you want to go, like, I'm going to live in Costa Rica for half the year. That's just tougher to do pulling kids around and pulling them out of school and all that stuff. For sure. And I do think the ability to travel is so much easier today than it was.

You think back in like the age. 80s or the 70s, right? I'm like, there's apps and deals and, like, you can get to places be informed so much faster, right? So even that, the travel opportunity, I feel like it's wider today. And even to do a two-week trip, you're like, I've got to find a sitter for two weeks. And if you don't have family that you trust or that's local, that's difficult. It's hard to do for sure.

And also with medicine, George, I mean, all the advancements, you know, health-wise, people are able to have kids later in life and even space them out if they choose to, right? So even the timeline on which you have children. Yep, there's going to be some. some planning there. Another one that's interesting is just individualism. As a society, we've become more self-sustaining and maybe self-centered. I'm not saying that you're selfish if you don't have kids, but there's a piece of it where you don't have to reproduce to have a life that feels full and social and entertaining. You can just pay for things, maybe. But I would argue that

have money. I feel like I have a purpose I didn't know existed now as a father. You know what I mean? It's not to say you don't have purpose if you don't have kids. I just feel like there's this, wow, there's a responsibility of like I get to raise this human up to hopefully be a great adult. There's a whole other part of, yeah, life that opens up. Yes. But some people just go, no, I'm good. Yeah. And that's fine.

They do. Also a chaotic world, you know, we see the news. We see what's happening. I mean, it's just like. This one I really have empathy for. I get it. I mean, some people are like, I don't want to bring my kids into, I don't want to bring kids into this world. And, you know, for some people, like, it's going worse and worse and worse.

and why bring kids in? That's a reason. It's a very sad, pessimistic outlook, but I get it if you just look at headlines and go, listen, the world's going crazy and I don't want my kid in this environment and I'm going to have to deal with this and I'm responsible for what happens to them.

So I get that part. Another one is equal opportunity. The ability for women to have their own bank accounts and work the same jobs, that's only a few decades old. So I think that level of autonomy, you know, women can earn money more independently. They're able to take a step back

and think about what kind of life and career do I want. And that doesn't always involve kids. Whereas back in the day, it was more traditional roles and you have kids, you take care of the family. That's what you do. Yep, for sure. Times have changed. Also, the generational baggage. Pack it up and let's unpack it, if you will, you know what I mean.

Yeah. No, really, all this self-help, people have become more self-aware seeking therapy and all of this. And I think the more you realize, oh, my gosh, I don't know if I, you know, want to bring kids into this, like, generational mess of a family even, right? Like, there's the world and then the family dynamic. But there's been a lot of pain and trauma. Yeah.

And some people are like, I don't want to bring kids into that. I don't want to repeat the cycle. I don't want to pass on this DNA. And I think we believe that you can change your family tree. Yes. Oh, and anyway. Spiritically as well. Yeah.

And every way. For sure. There's also adoption. So the need for adoption, foster hair, all of that. I think, again, as we get more than, information into the world, even parts like this of life, you are exposed to and realize, oh my gosh, real numbers, real data, seeing and experiencing, you know, children that need a home. And so, yeah, I think people choose that avenue. I actually had a lady on my show, George Marcy, and they chose

her and her husband not to have kids of their own. She didn't even know if she could or not. She was like, regardless of what my body can do, we're choosing to foster to adopt. It's like what they went in planning. So some people are doing that. Yeah. And that's expensive, which might mean we're going a weight later in life until we have our finance and order, grow our careers. Foster to adopt, though, on average is $5,000. It's the cheapest avenue. I didn't know that. Out of domestic adoption and international, yeah.

Wow. Okay. We talked about that. And last but not least, and the main thing we're talking about today, money. That is one of the biggest reasons. It's expensive to have kids, whether natural IVF adoption, raising them to age 18, which is why our dink friends out there are leaning into the season and they're making the most of it making TikToks while we're out here being parents. Would you all say this is, I think infertility

is a big one for sure why people aren't having kids, aren't able to. But money, I think money is like top three on the list. I feel like when I hear people say, we don't want kids, it's because they're expensive. I feel like that's like, it's a, that's a big one. So yeah, I would see career, infertility, money. I think just the ones that I hear my, like, I hear people talk about. The general responsibility, I think is, is not exciting for a lot of people. Yes. Of another, It's such a sacrifice. Yeah. Uh-huh.

For sure. I mean, it takes a lot of physical, emotional, mental energy. Yep, for sure. Especially in those first few years. And then I don't know beyond that, but from what I've heard, it can get crazy. Gets crazy. How old are your kids now? 9-7-4.

And do you feel like this is a great season for you guys? Yes. This is the most fun we've had. Is it less chaotic or just chaotic but fun? Yeah, different chaos, but they're fun. They're like, you can talk to them and hang out. Yeah. I'm looking forward to that.

Not as much Charles. He's still four. Like, he's still little. But Amelia, like, when they hit that, like, sweet age. Amelia feels like a tiny adult. She feels very mature. She is. She's an old soul.

I could just talk to her right now as an adult. She's so sweet. I know. They all are so great. But that's a sweet age because I still, like, she wants to, like, she still, like, holds my hands or walking. Like, she still, like, wants to be with me. But yet she can, like, make scrambled eggs and get herself dressed.

Like, she can, like, do things. Wow, scrambles. That's more than most adults can do. I taught my kids scrambled eggs and pancakes. That's all you need, honestly. I don't know what else you need. You're not going to thrive in life, but you can survive. Pretty good.

You get protein and a little... That's great. A little cupcake. Best of all, you don't have to do it. That's right. That's the goal. Start to get lazier and lazier if you can. So I recently did an episode on my YouTube channel about this very topic,

and the overwhelming response from people was the financial margin. That's required to have and raise a kid. And one stat we found was that on average, it takes $310,000 to raise a child to 8,000. age 18. So over 18 years, divide that out. And that breaks down to about $17,000 a year or $1,400 per month if you distribute evenly, which, as you know,

some seasons are more expensive than others, certain ages. But yeah, I mean, in daycare, that could be $1,400 a long without food and clothes. I mean, even for the beginning, when you find out that you're expecting, it's like, okay, doctors, appointments, and co-pays, and the ultrasound bill and hospital bills when you have the baby, and then you go into

diapers, bottles, baby gear, formula, insurance premiums, continue to go up, the more kids you have, the more people on your plan. Then you talk about, yeah, daycare. You talk about school tuition if you're doing a private school. I mean, all of that comes into play. Strollers?

When you're traveling, yeah, strollers. Do you're a travel stroller? You got a bigger car. You got three kids. You got to get a bigger car. Got to get a minivan. Hey, don't put that on you, I think, Bobby. Did you ever have a minivan?

Well, we have one now. We, yeah. Kelly. Gosh, I knew I liked you. Eventually, we all succumb to the minivan. And then we all brag about the minivan. And then we all get out. And then we'll get out of it.

All right, moving on. Let's do you guys. It's just very expensive. It's very expensive. So giving birth. Let's talk about giving birth. On average, costs $18,865 without health insurance.

And that includes the pregnancy delivery, postpartum care. Wow. Daycare for one week. On average, $3212. That checks out. $16,000 a year. It's a lot, y'all.

It's a lot. So to be fair, when we're like, just have kids, it's going to be easy and fun. There is a financial requirement. And here's the deal. We know that even if you're not financially ready, you figure it out, you make sacrifices, and you make it work.

Yeah, and let me just say this too. There is, I mean, besides a couple of these things, but overall, there is a spectrum, right? Even the stroller. We joke about it. They'll be fine in a plastic umbrella stroller. That's $30 for. from Walmart, right?

Like, there's a spectrum on all this stuff of which you can purchase and buy. You can make it as expensive as you want, right? To a degree. Some of these categories don't change. But some of them, we can be okay, right? Yeah, but I think we have way more information than our parents did,

and that's caused us to make very different decisions. So my wife is, I would say medium crunchy. Like she gets the organic, like, goat toddler formula instead of whatever. I think it's pretty crunchy. You know? So she's up there. And so it costs more for all of the baby stuff. Oh, for all that, yes, yes.

Because she wants higher quality, foods and items. And it's not a judgment call of like, well, everyone should do this. It's just what we do for our family and we build it into the budget. Yep. But to your point, it's more expensive, right? It is very expensive. All right, so we've been on both sides of the coin. So I thought it would be fun to do a little pro and con list.

You know, have a little challenge in here. You know, I'll love a good game. She loves a competition. Love a good challenge. Only if she wins. So it'll be good. I think it's going to be fun. Okay, so we're going to take turns going through some questions,

talking about the cost and reality of having kids. Some are serious, some are fun, and all will be answered in full transparency. Oh, well done. After your drinks, dinks joke, I had to have one. That was good. That was good. All right, let's get to the questions.

How did you and your spouse know you were ready to have kids? Was there a BuzzFeed quiz you took? Why are you like that? how we did it. I did not want kids for a while. I was like, Winston would have had him a year in the marriage. Wow. He was just ready to be a dad?

Yeah, for sure. He was like, yeah, I'm great when you are. And I was the classic, this is so Rachel, but I didn't want them. I was like, I'm good, I'm good, I'm good. And then one of our friends had a baby, and I went to the hospital. Baby fever. Nick and Dana Island, never forget them, went in, saw the baby, and I last we got into the elevator, and I said, I think I want to have kids. Wow.

I'm ready for a baby. Now, was it a cute, must have been a cute baby to inspire. I know. I don't know what, I mean, I don't know what it was. It was one of those classic. Because you ever see. Because you've seen other babies up into that point. I know you've done this.

When you see a friend's baby and you can't say, oh, how cute. What do you say? They're so precious. They're precious in God's eyes. No, what? You can't say that. That is a little bit too far. That's too far.

It's very specific. Actually, I say precious a lot. So just because if I call your baby precious, that doesn't mean I think they're ugly. But when you saw my baby, Mia was super cute, super cute, I know. Gorgeous, beautiful. Beautiful. I know. Yeah, beautiful, beautiful baby. Yes, that was us. It was me. It was just a literally a flip of the switch. I was ready. Five years later. I'm ready. How about you? I think we just ran out of other things to do. Like goals. You know what I mean? It's like, all right, got a dog, got another dog, got a house. All right, now what?

You know what I mean? What's the next step? Naturally. So I think once you just run out of entertainment, you go, all right, let's let the baby entertain us. Have some kids. So I think that's what happened. But also Whitney's age, she was starting to go, hey, listen, I'm in my early 30s. You know, I don't want to wait too much longer to start because what if I want three kids and we want to space them out? So there is a bit of kind of family planning you've got to do there.

For sure. You got to think about it. And so it felt like game on. There you go. After dealing with two French bulldogs and wiping their butts, it's like, what's another butt? What is one more butt? I still can, I just can't, I just can't.

Would you not do it for your daughter? My baby! Your dogs! There's not much difference with a dog. My daughter doesn't sleep in the bed with us. My dogs do. That's a level of intimacy that very few know. That is true.

Sometimes I hold her paw at night. It's very comforting. Where's John Deloney when you need to be psychoanalyzed? What's holding the dog paw is. That's real life. Okay, next question. What's one surprising? cost of having kids that you didn't expect.

Oh, that's a good one. I will say the formula, I didn't realize, especially the type that we get, how expensive it is and how much they go through. Yes. As far as cost goes, because my wife stays home now, so we don't have daycare. Yeah.

But we also lost her income. There you go. So that's a cost. Here and here. Yep. Totally worth it. How about you? I would say baby-wise, it was the diapers.

I remember, Winston going out to get diapers, like, I don't know, the first week or something. I was like, just get that little pack. And we'll go out this weekend and get more. You go through a pack and like a day. I mean, it's crazy. So I remember thinking, wait, what? Oh, my gosh.

And you got to buy a big box. And that's expensive. I mean, they're expensive. So, and I didn't get like the crap. I mean, I just got pamper's. So it wasn't even like a. I thought that was the good name brand. No, I think there's like the organic, the honest brand.

I mean, there's like. Yeah, something like the organic diapers, which we didn't. didn't do. It's disposable underwear, guys. Let's remember that. It's what we're talking about here. Did you want to do cloth diapers at all? No. I wouldn't have let that. Now, I get it. Like some people are made for that. Because that's a money saver. I bet there's some people out there. I don't think I could, I don't have the stomach for it. Yeah. I mean, we had a snake in our garage the other day and I couldn't even look at it in the face. I couldn't look at it. I said, everyone else deal with it. I'm going to go in. I'll be ready to hit 911 when the time is

right. So clean in a diaper. So, clean in a diaper. weak stomach, not going to be cleaning out. Has anything happened so far with Mia that's made you, like, be sick? Oh. Like throw up, blowouts, all that stuff. Yeah, weak stomach? No, I feel like I've been, I've held strong. Yeah.

I did it for Whitney. You know, she needs strength. And I think I exude strength in our marriage. Okay, you think strength. But sometimes I will walk in that nursery and go, nope, let's turn on a fan, I'll be back in three. It's so aggressive. Sometimes it's a lot. Sometimes it's a lot.

George, here's a little quiz for you. Name three ways to save on child care off the top of your head. Oh, gosh. Have amazing family that watch your kids for you. That would be nice. That's a life hack. That would be nice. Does this count like daycare and babysitting?

Yeah, all the above. I've heard of this, the barter system. So it's like Rachel, I'll watch your kids for a night. You guys go out on a date night next time you watch our kids. Yep. And that way you sort of can avoid the high cost of babysitting. And I know some moms that work. part-time.

Oh. Like even setting up your schedules, which takes some planning for sure, but man, so much cheaper. A nanny share is great, too. We have someone at the office, yes, that uses this

where there's like three or four kids in it, and you split the cost, and it's so much more affordable. Also, the stay-at-home parent, just like what Whitney did. And a lot of people are doing that. Because of how expensive child care is, a lot of people are re-examining,

okay, is it even worth me working, right? After taxes and everything is done, you're like, okay, how much are we actually gaining per month? How did your relationship with your spouse change when you became parents? Ooh. That's deep. I mean, naturally, I feel like you have less time together.

But Winston and I are early bedtime, like the kids, like, it's like seven o'clock still. Wow. Wow. I know. That's impressive. We get them going. It's a big deal if they're up to late. So we do, we will try to like in the evenings have time together.

But it's just, it is harder. I'm like, when you try to talk to each other, it's like, oh, my God, people just screaming at you and wanting to talk to you and stuff. You know what I mean? Like, uninterrupted conversation is hard. So I would say, yeah, there's a level there that changes. But then on the other end, like, you see your spouse be a parent and it's beautiful. That's true.

We always laugh. Winston's more nurturing than I am. Like, he knows what to do more in, like, situations. They go to dad a lot more than they go to Google it. And he's just like. Oh, Winston knows. He knows. He knows. He knows the words that is like not Tylenon-Adville. It's the other big words behind those.

Acidaminifin? Like that? I'm like, well, this is that and you can do it every four hours. Or we can rotate with this because of the... And I'm like, how do you... Dr. Winston? How do you know all this? So like, he knows a lot.

It's probably very basic. All right. He knows the generic name for some medication. That's what I've gathered is what's required for Rachel to be like, you're basically a doctor. If you know the generic name for the top three medications in the world, you're a genius. I am terrible, though.

Charles broke his leg, y'all, two summers ago. And I was like, he's, like, after it all happened, the incident, I was like, he's fine. And Winston's like, no, he's not. I'm like, babe, I think he's fine. He's like, he's not walking, Rachel. I was like, okay, maybe we should take him

in broken leg. And then another time, Amelia hit her head on a coffee table, and I was like, it's fine. Like, you're okay. You're okay. It's fine. And Winston came home from work and he looked, he was like,

babe, that is really deep. I'm like, how do you know what's deep? I don't know. Shaddy could get staples. So, like, obviously medically not very inclined. Oh, my goodness. I know, but it kind of stopped bleeding. I was like, I think you're fine.

Wow. I don't know. So the medically inclines, it's not my go-to. So to see him step into this role and, like, he really does. He, like, cares for them. He's really good at stuff. Like, he knows what to do and all of it. We're all just like, does what to do instantly.

Wow. So that's what I would say. How about you? I would say, number one, it was deeper because of this shared experience. Yep. And then it also became transactional at first because of the like partnership. I'm just like, hey, what do I need to do? What do you need to do?

What do I need to do? It sort of became like a to-do list of, all you do this, I'll do this. And there's still teamwork there, but it's not the same as it was before. I'm like, what did we even talk about before we had kids? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It just sort of consumes a lot of your life, not in a bad way, but just in a, all the other stuff was just less important that we talked about before. And so we just have to be more intentional once the baby goes down, like, how you doing? What are you thinking about?

What's going on? And just also have fun. So I try to always have moments of levity at the house, make her laugh. That's sort of my way of becoming a person again. Yes, I love that. Yeah, yeah, the levity and the laughter is very important for sure. Okay, George, what's your number one life? saver when it comes to affording kids. Oh my goodness. Well, the budget is, I think, the thing we always

go back to. Whitney and I always go, okay, what's in the budget? What are we planning for this month? What's happening? There's this birthday party. We got to get the decor, the toys. She needs new clothes, all of that. And so that becomes the source of truth to where it's not floating around in our head. And it's not a, wait, you spent what on what? I didn't know. Everything is talked about, and the budget is key. And for that, we use every dollar. And it makes it super easy. We're both logged in. And it's a free app you can go download right now in the app store. How about you guys? Yeah, I would say that.

That's a big one because I think it dictates and shows, hey, what are we able to spend this month, right, on the kids? And knowing ahead of time, too, I like it because it also helps with, like, the schedules, which sounds silly, but you're like, oh, yeah, soccer signups are there. Okay, so that starts in August and we got to plug it into the calendar. Like, it kind of helps with the rhythm of life, too. So, yeah, the Every Dollar app, I would say that. Yeah.

Oh, and they can go to every dollar.com slash smart money to get started, and we'll drop a link in the show notes. And then have a line item for each kid in the budget. We do that too. Very helpful. And so that's helpful too to see, okay, yeah, how much have we spent this month on this kid or that kid? And planning for babysitting.

If we know we're going to have two date nights, we need to plan for two nights of babysitting. And it's in the budget, so it's not a big surprise or a big, oh, gosh, we've got to pay for this. That's right. All right, George, the number one question I always get. We're on kids and money. Should we be out of debt before we have kids? Ooh, the hot take is you don't have to be.

wherever you are in your financial journey, again, you will figure it out, you'll make sacrifices. Now, is it going to be less stressful if you're in a better place financially? Absolutely. Yeah. But I don't like this idea of, well, when we get to this place financially,

then we're going to be ready. Because the truth is you're never going to be ready, whether it's emotionally, physically, financially, whatever. So go ahead, have the kid, but also be doing a budget, see how it will affect your life, see where you're going to need to cut back, so it's not a giant surprise.

But if it slows down your debt, off, that's totally okay. Yeah, yeah, big life moments, you know, getting married, having a kid, all of that, enjoy life. Like, you live once, right? So there is a point of, like, these things are important to. So if that's what you want to do is start a family, start a family. But to your point, it's like, yeah, money as a tool in life.

And when you have more control over it and even more of it, you know, you have margin. It's not going out the payments. There's going to be places that is going to be less stressful. But don't wait until that point by any means. Well, another piece. of it that's real is some people wait and then they realize, oh, it's taking us way longer than we thought to have a kid or to get pregnant. And that can be a scary thing and you look back with a regret about waiting so long. And so I just feel like when you're emotionally ready of like you're

excited, you have that moment of like, all right, we're going to do this. You just figured it out. Here's the last one that's controversial. Do parents owe it to their kids to pay for college? Whose responsibility is it? Not the parents. I think it's a gift if you're able to do that. It's a blessing, but it's not an entitlement. So no, parents should not be forced to pay for their kids' college. Now, again, it's part of the Ramsey Baby Step. So again, it's a huge benefit if you can. And it should be a goal right when you get to that point because it just, it just helps your kids out to start on a level, you know, foundation financially. But there are ways to go to school debt-free. I mean, school choice is always huge, going to a community college.

Like, there's ways to do it. In-state schools. Yeah, and a lot of people are doing gap years even. Like there's other things to do around that subject. So as a parent, do not feel like, oh my gosh, I'm just terrible parent because I can't provide this for my kids. They're going to be okay. They're going to be okay. Yeah, I agree. I think it's your obligation to have the conversation with your kid and student and figure out a plan to go to college debt-free. But as far as who's taken what, you know, my plan is to be able to. I think it's a beautiful thing. And even for like the grandkids, I think it's a cool life goal to just say, hey, got the grandkids college funded. I'm going to do a lump sum when the kid's born and go.

Oh, that's nice, George. Grandpa George got you taken care of. Oh. Yeah. What are they going to call you? What's your grandpa name? You know, there's an Arabic name for grandpa that I love. That's fun.

I don't know that. Pappy? Are you just guessing? Boppy? Poppy. Oh, Poppy. No, it's not Poppy. Okay, what is it?

It's Giddo. Wow. Or Giddo. Oh, no. Say it again. So Giddo is like the Syrian-Lebanese dialect, is soft G. And a hard G for the Egyptian side. side. That's Giddo.

Giddo. That's what I hope that my daughter calls... I like Giddo better. Yeah. If I had to pick. And then grandma is Teta. So Whitney would become Teta. Teta.

You're not cute. Yeah, I like that. So good. I like it better than like Mimau. I don't know. I'm not Southern enough to go there. I know. I had a Mammal.

You had a Mammal. Well, she's passed. Oh. So I'm sorry. Mammau for some reason feels more authentic. Mammal. Mimau. Mimau.

Mimau. Mimau. Mimau. It sounds more like... Mammal and Mimau, that's very southern. That's very southern. If you have a mammal or a meme, that's a southern. But Whitney's parents, they're going to be called Gigi and Poppy.

To your credit. Gigi and Poppy. I felt Poppy in the spirit. That's what it was. And Gigi, she liked it. My mother-in-law likes it Gigi feels a little younger. Gigi's cute. We're like gram-gram or something, you know.

Yeah, Gigi's cute. What are your parents? Did they go Arabic? Yeah. I mean, Mia can't speak yet. Wait, is it what you just said to me when Mia's going to go, oh, I'm sorry? Are you going to adopt?

the same? I meant your... I would like to. Yeah, okay, okay. Okay, that's good. Like, Mia's kids, would they call me? Yeah, yeah, yeah, I would like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't know, I can't... My gramps, I don't know, I don't feel like a grandpa.

Gramps. I'm gonna be like Jeff... My goal is to be like Jeff Goldblum when I'm older, like still be kind of like... Oh, yeah. Wimcical, and you don't know what I'm gonna do. I'm still young. I feel like it all comes down to like,

if you're a grandpa and you have, like, cool glasses, and you style your hair and your fashion isn't terrible, you're like 25 years younger. Yeah, that's fair. Fair. I love that. But I'm excited to wear suspenders, too. Always wanted to try that out. Feels like a big part of being a grandpa.

Coming soon, George. Coming soon. Wow. So good. Okay, so here's the spark notes. If you're at a fork in the road, I would say, be honest with yourself about what you want for your life and your money and what your spouse wants and look in the financial mirror and then take the steps to get there. What is the gap?

What must be true for us to take this next step? And then also realize you'll never fully be ready. So if you have some giant checklist of all these. these things must happen, you'll never have a kid. Yeah, I think that's fair. And I think it's also fair to say that there's, you know, people today that may be of that age and that longing and want it, right? And it's just not happening right now in life for them, right? Whether maybe they're still single or maybe they can't have kids like we were talking about. So it is. The whole like kid conversation, I think it does

carry a lot, right? It's a lot of emotion around this topic. But the more, again, when you are in that position to say, okay, yeah, financially, how can we be smart about this and be wise in every aspect of life, I think is, I think is key. Yeah. And another piece of this is don't alienate yourself. Don't alienate your single friends. Like bring them into your life. I think a lot of times or single people feel like, well, they're married now, so, or they have kids

now, so I don't really feel like I'm a part of that. So you have to be really intentional on all sides. Single people, married people, and then don't judge each other. Like the dinks are like, ha-ha, you have kids, and the kids are like, people with kids are like we have a better life than you. I don't like this whole like, you know, name calling and other than the fun acronym of dink. I just feel like let's all be kind to each other and realize we're all just doing our best. That's right.

We're all living our life. George, you sound like me. What is happening to me? How did that be all? Oh, dear. All right. Well, George, it's almost the end of the episode and we close out every episode with Guilty as Charged. And this is where our producer Kelly gives us a new guilty-a-charge question every week.

And if we're guilty, we take a sip. Kelly. All right. What's one frivolous expense that you're guilty of splurging on before you had kids? Oh. So something we no longer did once kids entered the picture. Right. Vacations?

That feels like an accurate one. If you look at our Amazon Target purchase histories, very few things are for me. At this point, most of it is for the baby. And so I think you just shift your spending away from personal things. But I don't feel like I'm missing out either. Yeah. It just felt like when you have disposable income and no kids, you're just like, no, I don't know. I bought a pair of shoes, one pair of shoes.

It's like, this brands that I wanted. The selfishness. And I was like, and now I'm like, I would never, I'd never wear them. And I would never. And again, I think it was that before kids, the dink life. But you're like, oh, yeah. I don't know. That sounds fun.

And I, yeah, that's like the one purchase. that I think back on. I'm like, wow, it's so stupid. Do you still have the shoes? I do. Uh-huh. You still wear them? Nope.

What are they doing? Let's list them. They're a moment of time for me. You know what we should do? I think we do a whole episode where Rachel just sells her old clothes to Smart Money Happy Hour, viewers and listeners. No, these were like, these were like, they had red bottoms, George. Oh.

They're very like. I've heard that means something. Yes. They were like fancy designer shoes, which I had never bought before. I got them actually after about my first book. That was like one of the first things I did. I know. I'm going to get like a designer purchase.

And then never again. Wow. I know. But I blame the kids. I also blame. Well, you got to afford Charles King bed. So I get it. Sacrifices must be made.

I think we're both guilty. But they're all things that I don't miss. You know what I mean? Yeah, yeah, for sure. How about you, Kelly? I used to go to, this isn't one splurge, but I used to go to Starbucks every morning. Oh.

And then so my kids are adopted, and when we started the adoption process, and my husband slid a piece of paper over, and he said, this is what your Starbucks daily is costing. And I was like, oh, oh, wow. And how much that went towards, you know, because adoption's expensive. So what did he sacrifice and cut out? He's not a spender. Must be nice.

So easy for him to say. He's not a spender, but it's a treat now, not an everyday thing, because it was thousands. Are you a curate girl? Huh? No, because now my husband drinks coffee, I drink coffee, my kids drink coffee, curing be too expensive. So, okay.

It's a pot of coffee in the mind. I imagine for the ladies, does self-care kind of take a back seat when you become a mom? Like, you know, getting the nails done, like, you know, massages. Although Wendy's back in massage mode, can I say that?

Because of momhood. It is messed up her back to where she has to go to physical therapy. Oh, no. And so I'm like, girl, let's get you that massage. Yes, for sure, at that point. See, those were things that kept me alive, not massages, but like my nails, my hair. You still felt like a couple of things.

You're like, I'm a person, yes. You know, Whitney just got that she loves now as a mom is a nice set of PJs. Truthfully, she was wearing like old, like, you know, she worked at Ramsey for nine years. We have a lot of T-shirts. Every event, I see some around the room. There's a new T-shirt. Totally, yes. So she would get big, baggy, Ramsey T-shirts from events and then wear those every night.

Totally. And she has, like, matching PJ sets now, and she feels like a whole new person. That's a grown-up set for sure. when you get the matching PJs. That's big. So you switch out your old frivolous stuff for new fancy adult stuff.

Yeah, I think that's just like age too, not necessarily motherhood. I think that's like, it's an adult thing as a woman. Put on your restoration hardware bathrobe. Yes. I got her that for a great gift. So good.

So good. So good. That's fun. Well, if you guys have any fun and guilty is charged questions, make sure to DM us on social because we check home and you give us some good ones, you guys.

Make sure to do that. And George, who's finishing first? I think I'm a little closer, just barely. Yeah. It was great. It's melting quickly. This was a, isn't she lovely? Again, named after producer Kelly.

I'm going to rate this. I'm going to give it a 7 out of 10. Okay. I'm going 8 out of 10. Wow. Yeah. I really have no bad words for it. I just wish it was a little bit punchy.

It's very simple. It's very light, refreshing. I almost want a little more flavor, but I think this is a lovely drink. The cost per glass, $2.98 cents a glass, and here's what's in it. It's got vodka, fresh grapefruit juice,

lemon juice, elder flower liqueur, blanc-fermuth, simple syrup, and club soda. So there's a lot in there, but it all just kind of like melds together in this light, airy, effervescent, I think is the only word for it. I always think, like, when I order at a restaurant, I would not order this for dinner. Like, this wouldn't be like a cocktail of like, oh, before dinner.

But if I'm at a beach or a pool, yes. A pool side at like 3 o'clock. What's the fancy hotel that you've gone to and you felt out of place? The Bergdorf or something? Oh, that was for lunch. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Bergdorff's for lunch in New York City.

It feels like this is a drink you could get at Bergdorffs. It'd be very, like, classy. Oh, for sure. Yeah. And they're sipping that out of a martini. They'll just charge you. my guess is 10 times the cost. What is it too?

It was $2.98. Oh, yeah. After tax and tip, 30 bucks. Oh, man. So there you go. Recipes and the show notes, give it a try this weekend. So great.

And if you enjoyed this episode, make sure to check out our episode on why people are having fewer children coming up next. Yeah, make sure to subscribe you guys. We appreciate you watching and listening and we'll see you next Thursday on an all-new episode of Smart Money Happy Hour.