Snapped: Women Who Murder - Catherine Pileggi

Episode Date: April 26, 2026

Police respond to reports of a deceased male and their investigation turns to a homicide case.Season 33 Episode 23Originally aired: Sun, Jun 23, 2024Watch full episodes of Snapped for FREE on the Oxygen app: https://oxygentv.app.link/WatchSnappedPodSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

A millionaire is found dead in his South Florida mansion after an odd 911 call. So how is that an accident? How's it an accident? The guy fell down the stairs, but he's dead. They said, holy cow, you know, we've got an issue here. The body was inside of this sleeping bag. There was a fitted sheet. I opened up the bag a little bit further.

Pull some of the stuff apart. I saw a hand. A bizarre and complex crime scene raises more questions than. answers. For me, as an investigator, I'm going, what are you doing here, you know, with the attorney? This was a lot more than just an accident. He would drink a bit too much, and that, I think, caused some rift between the two of them. But with multiple witnesses and conflicting stories, investigators must determine what's

true and what's a cover-up. She said to me, he want to bury in the ocean. He's what, 85 pounds, maybe five something. Somebody had to help her. Tupi were there, and no one else knew what the story was. Fort Lauderdale, Florida is a place most people associate with relaxation. Fort Lauderdale, it's a vacation spot. It's a hot spot for taking cruises to go to the Bahamas and everywhere else.

We have seven miles of ocean, ocean beach that you can go to. On June 28, 2011, police are called on. to the scene of a fatal accident on one of the area's more affluent streets. 911, what is your emergency? We need a detective at Poconet Drive for Lawgadale, please. Okay, what's going on there, sir?

They had an accident. A person fell down the stairs. Okay, do they need paramedic? Not anymore. So how is that an accident? How's in an accident? The guy fell down the stairs and he's hit. It wasn't frantic when he called 911.

I don't want to say he acted as it was another day at the office, but something just doesn't seem right. When the police arrived, they discovered the body of Ronald Vincere. President at the scene were Catherine Pilegi, Mr. Vinci's significant other, an attorney named Sam Fields, and a close friend of Ronald Vinci named Spencer Gordon. The attorney identified himself as I am representing Miss Pileggie.

What are you doing here, you know, with the attorney, with the attorney, with Spencer, you know, why you hear? That was kind of suspicious. Spencer Gordon tells police he's the one who called 911. When he leads the officers to Ron's body, they realize the situation does not match the story they were told. The story at that point was that he had apparently fallen down the stairs, which was confounding to the police.

The body we're thinking is at the bottom of the stairs, But once you go in the entrance, you go to the right, you walk into the bedroom and there's a big bed. That's where the body was at. The body was inside of this sleeping bag. There was a fitted sheet, I believe. There was a towel. There were multiple elements to all of the coverings

directly around the decedent. His body looked like a big clump of dirty laundry sitting off to the right side of your bed. Once they saw that, they said, holy cow, you know, we got an issue here. We wondered how he could get from the bottom of the stairs into the bedroom. Since it appears the body has already been moved, officers clear the scene to preserve any potential evidence. They immediately shut it down and called us out there.

Catherine Pellejee was being detained in a patrol car as a personal of interest or a possible suspect. And the crime scene was sealed. So no one goes in until at least the Amegro. until at least the Amigo is in there, and then the scene is processed. It was such a complex scene, meaning the scene directly around the decedent, and not knowing what would be in there.

I thought it would be better just to wrap everything up, not disturb anything, and just put the entire unit in a body bag and have it transported. The assumption is that at this point, because of the context of the scene, that this is a homicide, Then we decide our plan of attack here.

What are we going to do? The bigger thing is to collect as much of the evidence as possible, and because we just never know what is going to be important. While investigators are securing evidence, detectives learn more about who is at the scene. Before you start looking for the boogeyman who may have entered and fled, you look to see who in the immediate area, who could have been involved and find out what they know.

Miss Pilegi was taken downtown, and then our witness is the same thing, just to get them away from the scene, and we can talk to them and try to get their version of what happened. What is the story behind all this? Ronald Vincey was born in Ohio on August 16th, 1940, but he lived most of his life in California. A salesman at heart, Ron was drawn to a career in auto sales,

in auto sales, and he spent decades becoming one of the most successful dealers in the state. Ron was a self-made man. I would characterize him as being very street smart. Back in the day, nobody really knew how successful Honda Motors would be, but he made a real success out of it. You couldn't hide how much money the boy had. He had yachts, he had a motorcycle collection. This was not somebody who was scraping by.

Ron married in his early 20s and had a son. But after many years together, the relationship ended in divorce, and Ron's focus turned back to his work and some rather expensive hobbies. I met Ron Vincy in a small town called Lake Havasu, Arizona, and we found we had similar interest. We like boats, we like airplanes, we like water, those types of things. Ron was a very fun guy. You wanted to be around him from any standpoint, from a social event to going down to the Bahamas.

He had just a zest for life that was unparalleled. In 1993, at the age of 53, Ron decided it was time to cash out and enjoy the fruits of his labor. When Mr. Vinci retired and sold his interest in the Honda dealerships that he had, he had a lot of money, which he spent on toys and property and travel. On one of his luxury trips, Ron got a second chance at love when he met a 37-year-old woman from Georgia named Catherine Pellejee. Kathy grew up in rural Augusta. He had a pretty large family. I think she was probably the oldest of five or six children.

She was extremely close with both of her parents and with most of her siblings. She was a real lady, a humble lady, a very kind and considerate person. She was a flight attendant when they met. You know, people normally date within an age range. And, you know, he got somebody who was, fairly significantly younger than him. I met Kathy about the same time that I met Ron. They were always an item.

They had been together for many years, and she was just a really nice person. Kathy was a very good-looking, gorgeous woman. I think that she was somewhat of a trophy girlfriend. You know, my girlfriend's an airline stewardess, and she's a hottie. Despite their age difference, Catherine and Ron found they shared many things in common,

including a taste for the high life. Earlier in their relationship, they shared a joy and a passion for flying. Kathy was a pilot. She was actually a better pilot than Ron was, and used to do most of the flying wherever they would go. And there were many trips that they would take all over the country and throughout the Caribbean.

The couple spent the next 20 years jet-setting before putting down roots in southern Florida. He purchased a two-story home in one of Fort Lauderdale's richest, ritziest neighborhoods that he shared with Catherine. Although they never married, Catherine and Ron seemed to have the kind of relationship most only dream of.

The two of them attended functions all the time, Gala events, they enjoyed the good life. Weeks after moving into the new mansion, their high-flying lifestyle has come to a tragic end. After securing the crime scene, detectives bring the three potential witnesses in for questioning. We need to identify almost immediately, okay, who are my key players here that I need to talk to

and then separate from the scene. Investigators start with interviewing Cathayette's interviewing Catherine, who requests to have her lawyer present. And did you understand your rights as high and read them to you? And you are willing or not willing to make a statement now, reference to this is? It's not willing. After getting nowhere with Catherine,

in a separate room, her lawyer provides some startling information. Put it this way, this was a lot more than just an accident. Coming up, a witness reveals a sinister discovery. Basically, he got hurt to say, okay, he was shot. And an autopsy reveals the details of a brutal murder. There were budgeting marks from a hammer in his skull. It was overkill, so we know it's personal. Fort Lauderdale police are questioning everyone who was at Ron Vincy's mansion

the night he was reported to be deceased. Ron's girlfriend, Catherine, isn't willing to make a statement, but in a separate room, her attorney reveals some disturbing details. He said you'll find blunt force trauma, you'll find stab wounds, you'll find gutcha wounds, you know, on the body. Well, only a person that would have been there or committed it would have known the injuries. Now we're thinking, okay, well, is that a confession? There's so many questions and so many things that were going on.

that we didn't have answers to. Catherine's attorney refuses to elaborate, so detectives turn their attention to the man who called 911, Spencer Gordon. You've worked for Ron. No, I don't work for Ron. One of the largest friends. I fly his helicopter, I fly this airplane,

occasionally. Spencer had told us the night before in the 27th, Spencer Gordon, Miss Pellejee, and Mr. Vincey. They were all there at dinner, Chinese food, and had some wine. and socialized. According to Spencer, it left about 7.30 that evening.

As far as he's concerned, Mr. Vincey was alive and well. He was passed out or was asleep. He was left in the sleeper passed out. He looks rich. Spencer tells detectives, Ron was something of a party animal, so he didn't think much of him passing out

in the living room. But the next morning, he was surprised to get an emergency call from someone who works for Ron. Renaldo Silver and he was a handyman, but he did a lot of gardening work among his other duties. He called Spencer Gordon, who he knew to be a close friend of Ronald Vincere. I called him back at 1042 and asked him what the problem was. Right. And at that time, he said, I can't find Long, Ron passed.

That was his exact words, Ron passed, which I took to mean Long passed out. Right. I said, all right, calm down. Let's go over there and we'll see what's happening. Not in the car, we went over there. When Spencer arrived at the house to check on Ron, he quickly realized the situation was much worse than he imagined. She was in the foyer.

Rinaldo at that time was trying to get me to go into the back bedroom to see what was going on. I was talking with Kathy. I've seen as normal as ever. Right. Rinald is still nervous saying there's a bag, there's a bag. bonds in the man. Ronaldo pointed out where Mr. Vinci's body was in the bedroom, and Spencer went in.

I unzipped the thing. I opened up the bag a little bit further, pulled some of the stuff apart, and I saw a hand. I saw that. I knew it was a mission. Before he made an eye on one call, he confronted Catherine Pellegi about it, and her initial version was he fell down the stairs. When did this happen? She said about 1 o'clock or 1.30. And I said, what did you do?

I stared. I said, Kathy, you got to tell him to what happened here. Spencer said eventually he got her to say, okay, he was shot. She told you there's a bullet hole in him? That's what she said. They were in an argument, he did argue me and got into something and that she shone him. What do you want to do? I don't want to go to jail.

I said, I understand that, but what do you want to do? I said, here's my phone. Call 911. Let's see what happens, sir. What happens here? No, I don't want to call 911. I said, well, if you're not calling, I said, no, no, don't do that. I walked out to the front and I called 911.

And at some point you felt she needed an attorney, so you called an attorney for? What I did is I called my friend and this is after calling 911. I asked to see you have an attorney there that's a criminal attorney, said yes. But when investigators review the specifics of the 911 call, it doesn't match what Spencer just told them. Are there any weapons involved? No, I don't know. For us, that was weird. Why not just simply say, I need, I need help, I need an ambulance?

A guy's been shot. He just says somebody fell in their disease. That takes thought. And you're starting to say, okay, this guy's not being truthful. Detectives confronts Spencer about the discrepancy. There's a lot more detail here now than what you gave in your first statement. That absolutely, I don't know, I just, I don't tell you, I was in shock, man.

I was not in shock, man. After getting nowhere with the witnesses, police are forced to release everyone. They wanted to interview Ms. Pilegi, but she exercised her fifth minute right to remain silent. We were told that, okay, let's go ahead and release her for the moment. And Special Gordon, because we don't have a confession. We don't really know what happened and whether she's the person that did it.

With hopes of getting more answers, They asked the handyman Reinaldo Silva to come in for questioning. The detective of Jesus me called in Mayan. He asked if I could go there in a delegacy. In the hour that I came to hear, he said, He said, me tell all of the morning. She called me. I have her in my phone.

She called in Ronsphone. She called you using Ronsphone. In Ron's phone, then she said to me, Ray, you have to rent a truck tomorrow, because I rent a truck before. I never received order of Dakot. The time entire, Ron. I say, OK, 1.45 in the morning, then I go back to the bed.

That day, something like a quarter to eight, I called the house. Ron's phone. She answered the phone, then she said, Ray, come straight to the house. Then I go inside, then she comes, cried and say to me, Ron's past. Ron's what?

Pass, pass, die. Ron passed? Yeah. Say, why? She fell from the stair. Then she going, she said to me, Ron has to be here wanna bear in the ocean. She wants you to help her

to take him in the boat. to take him in the boat and go into water. I just say, I want to say wrong. When I went to see, when I went to see the corpse, he not was in the camera, where I respected with vella, he was enroled

on the side of the camera. Rinaldo says he immediately suspected foul play. I think that she is responsible responsible, because she She was called at the madrigada, she showed the core, I wanted to go to the mar, I didn't look to the police

because I was with a MED. MEDEEDE MEDE to not be understood because there was an English that I had a English I don't know that is a poor,

I wanted to ask I wanted to I didn't know what I would do. I wanted to call Paul Spencer. He said, I'll be there. The wrong, Spencer is good friends. He's together all the time. So I talk to him and say,

Hey, is this situation. I see the body. I don't see the face, but I see the . Then he said to me, I mean, it had to see wrong. I don't think she expected him to call Spencer Gord. He was very traumatized by it. You know, like he told me, again, he was very emotional about it

when he talked about it, and he couldn't believe that this had happened. Was it the handyman? No. I don't think it was the handyman. I think he was too traumatized of what happened. Investigators wrap up their questioning with Rinaldo and shift focus back to the crime scene to shed further light on what happened.

The first thing they find is a large bin and dive weights. This would come in handy if you wanted to dispose of a body at sea and make sure no one found it. You would imagine that this would be suspicious. They also discover evidence of a hasty cleanup. By the naked eye, there was no blood there. You can clean some areas with chloro. chlorox and completely clean and as clean as you think it could be,

that Luminol will bring it out and you could see it. Detectives lumenoled the tile floor by the bottom of the staircase and found blood stains. The blood trail led to the first four bedroom and then into, you know, on the bed and where everything else was that. So they tested it and determined that it was Mr. Vincey's blood. But if it happened in that hall, at the bottom of the stairs.

How did he get into the bedroom? Maybe she just pulled them and dragged them. If you look at Ms. Pileggie, she's what, 85 pounds, maybe five something. So for this woman of such small stature, you know, to have done this, something just doesn't seem right. I want the whole story.

On June 29, 2011, the day after Ron Vincey died, the medical examiner conducts a full autopsy of his body. of his body. Detectives believe the results will confirm if Ron fell down the stairs or was shot by his long-term girlfriend, Catherine Pilegi. We still didn't know what we were going to find in the autopsy. The body bag is x-rayed with the decedent and all the wrappings in it. Once we look at the x-rays, we have a feel for anything like bullets.

The x-ray gave a clue as to there was very likely a gunshot wound. And then immediately you can see the sharp force injuries on the neck and blunt force injuries to the head. He also had a large bruise on his chest. He had a gunshot wound to the left side of his head, and it had fractured his skull and actually lacerated his brain. He had, I believe it was seven incised wounds on his neck and five stab wounds to his trunk. Whoever killed Ronald Vinci wanted to make sure he was not getting up. It was overkill. And any time we go to a scene where we see that the injuries sustained or overkill, then we know it's personal.

As far as detectives are concerned, Catherine's refusal to cooperate with their investigation makes her the prime suspect. We suspected who may have done it, but we have to tie the suspect that. the suspect to the crime scene. We spent three or four days at the house. In Ron's Bentley, they find a treasure trove of evidence. In the trunk were several plastic bags filled with items that turned out to be of evidentiary significance. Most significantly was a 380 handgun,

a knife that appeared to have blood on it, and a hammer. On the 380 handguns magazine were fingerprints that were subsequently matched to Catherine Pellejee. Is that the same firearm that Mr. Vincey was killed with? We don't know. But according to Spencer Gordon, she's handled those firearms. So the fingerprints could have been in there from who knows whenever. We continued our investigation.

We determined that she had made purchases, you know, on her credit card. She had actually went out and purchased a bin at Home Depot. She had gone to Brownies, which is a dive shop, purchased some weights, dive weights, that allegedly she was going to use to take a victim's body out in the ocean and dump them. The receipts show it was her. The video surveillance showed it was her. There was no one else with her. The purchases are consistent with what the handyman Ray not.

Maldo told police. But what's also suspicious is when Catherine bought some of the items. The weights they had been purchased a day before the body was discovered. It was a red flag because if she was planning to do this ahead of time, this would be any earmark of premeditated murder.

The questions facing investigators now are, why would Catherine plan the murder of her longtime boyfriend? And did she have help trying to dispose of his body? When they ask friends of the couple, they discover the relationship was more volatile than it appeared. Ron and I went to breakfast two or three times a week. He didn't share with me what the problem between the two of them was, but it was apparent to me that Ron would drink a bit too much.

And that, I think, caused some riff between the two of them. They had reached the point clearly, according to the... their friends, this relationship was not going to go very much further. Catherine and Ron even separated for a few months in 2000. One of the times that we went to breakfast, he disclosed to me the potential settlement agreement that Kathy had asked for. And that was she wanted a new car, she wanted $100,000, and she wanted the penthouse that she was living in. Ron asked me my opinion if I thought that was the right thing to do.

And I told him that it was. I told him I think it was an easy bout. But I guess that didn't happen. But friends say after their time apart, they wound up reconciling. So if Catherine was back in Ron's good graces, what was her motive for killing him? The day after Ron's murder, police learn of another suspicious death.

In talking with some of Ms. Pileggie's closest friends, we were told that she blamed Mr. Vincey for her sister's death. They were out in some sware somewhere in the Caribbean or stuff like, yeah. Her sister became sick, and allegedly

Mr. Vincey gave her some of his medication. But at some time thereafter, obviously the sister passed. She blamed him for her death. Saw you there was a lot of anger there. Could that be motive?

Sometimes a heat of passion can be so great that it might negate conscious intent to kill. Coming up, Catherine finally opens up and reveals claims of self-defense. She realized, oh, this time he really met it. He really was going to kill me. But is she telling the truth? There was no question in my mind. And she had developed Battered Woman syndrome. Armed with evidence linking Catherine Pellejee to the death of her boyfriend, Ron Vinci,

Florida police obtain a warrant for her arrest on July 5, 2011. At this point, based on witness testimony, based on the evidence collected at the scene and processed, we submitted it at the Commonwealth Attorney's Office to say, I think we have no problem of cause to arrest her. But now, Catherine has hired a new attorney. Bernie Bruce Yudoff. I got the call from Fort Lauderdale Police asking me to bring her down to self-surrender.

She did so. Our crime scene folks photographed her and fingerprinted her. We got DNA swaps from her. She was charged with burning the first degree. Once again, Catherine refuses to give a statement to police. Months later, when Catherine is evaluated by a forensic psychologist, her version of events finally comes to light. She confessed that she had shot Mr. Vinci.

But Catherine claims it had nothing to do with money or her sister's death. According to her, she was a long-term victim of domestic abuse. She was going to offer a defense that what she did was an overreaction due to battered spouse syndrome. When that some way, shape, or form, this was really self-defense on her own.

self-defense on her body. She said, he had two personalities. He said, you know, he'd be nicest as ever. And then he could do a flip on you in a heartbeat and become the meanest person, you know, in the world. He would just drink, become very boisterous. He would bump into people or he would be obnoxious. And I think he was being somewhat too obnoxious to Kathy

from time to time. I actually told him if he didn't quit being obnoxious, I was going to throw his ass overboard over the side. side of the boat. In addition to that, he was taking lots of different medications, which had a variety of effects on him, including hallucinations, losses of consciousness. Catherine claims she suffered in silence for more than a decade. But on the night of June 27, 2011, she decided she'd had enough.

She said he had an argument at the top of the stairs. She was trying to keep a condominium that she liked to live in on Los Olives Boulevard from being sold. And he blamed her for the deal not going through. And we know this only from her words. He stuck a gun in her face. He's so drunk and out of it from all the drugs that he was taking, that he fell backwards and fell down and hit his head at the bottom of the stairs.

He's not bleeding that much, but she wipes up all the the blood and she puts him on a rug so she could pull him into a bedroom. She puts him in bed. She finishes cleaning up. It took probably about a half an hour by her estimate. She gets dressed. She goes downstairs and she sees the gun, sees the clip as half out. It was a semi-automatic. And the gunhead jam. She realized, oh, this time he really meant it. He really was going to kill me. And that's when she takes the gun and goes into the bedroom,

sees him lying there. She described how she raised that gun, closed her eyes and squeezed the trigger. She says, the next thing I know, I'm standing over, Ron. And he's in bed dead. and I have a knife in my hand. She said I don't remember what happened. Well, I know I must have killed them.

Investigators attempt to verify Catherine's claims, but there are no records of any domestic violence calls. It seemed like they had several moments of acrimony that they really, really, really didn't like each other from time at time, but I didn't see any hint whatsoever. of physical violence. Victims of domestic abuse generally do a pretty good job of concealing their bruises. We're a long-sleeved sheriffs or makeup.

Investigators are working to corroborate Catherine's allegations when a pivotal witness comes forward, the captain of one of Ron's boats. They were out again out on the water somewhere, and there was an argument that he says that Ron became so angry at it, and he just simply pushed her either to get her away. Aaron Brown had been with them for a while, and he said he had witnessed a great deal of fiscal abuse. He's one of the few people that actually saw it in real time. Ron also was pointing a gun at her and at Aaron Brown on another occasion. But that night, the Mr. Vincey had been killed.

Two people were there, my victim and my suspect. And no one else knew what the story was. Investigators still have to figure out one more piece of the puzzle. How did she do this alone? Maybe she just pulled them and dragged them. Well, that would have certainly took an effort. But then to get him on the bed, was she physically able to do that? Not to me she wants it.

You know, somebody had to help him. To investigators, one man seems to be a perfect fit. This is the point we're starting to suspect that Spencer Gorda may have some involvement in it. His actions, his demeanor, just at times really confuse us. I didn't see what I wanted to see in saying that he's going to say, oh my God, my friend, he's dead. You know, I loved him, he treated me well. We didn't get that from him. So we started talking to friends and say, hey, what's this relationship between Spencer and Mr. Vincey?

According to Mr. Gonzalez, he was a leech. Quite often people with a lot of money have hangers on, and that was Spencer Gordon. He liked to hang around for the free lunch. He got to go on Ron's boats and fly his flying machines and those kinds of things. Was he trying to help her because he liked her, or was it something else? Was his mind on the business end of it? Oh, God, I'm losing my bankroll here. However, detectives are unable to confirm their suspicions.

I could not prove that Mrs. Spencer was involved in it, and that he had a hand in it, or was an accessory after the fact. After reaching a dead end with Spencer, investigators turn their focus to their main suspect. Worried that sympathy for Catherine's emotional story will overshadow the evidence at trial, prosecutors consider other options. I wanted to see our state attorney for approval to potentially seek a plea. in this case to resolve it that way. He said, let a jury of her peers decide, bring this to the people of Broward County in a jury trial, and that's what we did.

In November 2014, Catherine Pellege's murder trial begins. Despite her claims of domestic abuse, prosecutors believe they have a solid case against her. There's not a self-defense case because she chose to do what she did. What she did, to shoot him, to bludgeon him, all while he lay conscious or semi-conscious on a bed when all she had to do was call the police. But Catherine's lawyer presents expert testimony, arguing Catherine believed she had no other option. I'm a clinical and a forensic psychologist. I interviewed Ms. Pilegi, who at that time was incarcerated.

There was no question in my mind after doing the evaluation that Catherine Pilege was a battered woman in her relationship with Ron, that she had developed Battered Woman syndrome and post-traumatic stress disorder, and that at the time of the incident when she shot and killed him, she definitely was impacted by all of that trauma. That she believed that she was in danger, that he could no longer control him. himself and that he would kill her. And that's what prompted her to actually take his life. I did my best to convince the jury that Kathy sincerely bleed that.

It's one of a few times I've ever put my client on the witness stand, but I felt I had no choice. She took the stand and it was sad. She just didn't look like somebody who could possibly do this, and if she wasn't telling you that she did it, you'd never believe her. When testimony ends, the judge instructs the jury not to consider a conviction for first-degree murder. It went to the jury as either a murder to a manslaughter or not guilty. And I not only think, I know that decision was lawfully and rightfully and morally correct. A prosecutor who goes for a first-degree murder conviction and doesn't get it

is going to be upset about it. This one didn't get it and was satisfied with that outcome. That alone tells you that this case is highly unusual. After two days, the jury returns with a verdict. She was found guilty of a second-degree murder. And ultimately, the judge indicated that Although he didn't want to impose a sentence of 25 years, he felt he had to because the case involved use of a firearm, which under the law calls for a mandatory minimum sentence of 25 years. Ultimately, the self-defense was not believed by this jury.

I would say that this was one of the more nuanced cases that I've ever covered because you had a suspect that there was a suspect that there was. defendant who fit the role of victim in a lot of different ways. And you definitely feel compassion for her. I can't help but wonder whether she's been punished enough. Given that she had no criminal history in this one moment when she snapped, literally snapped, and had this out of body of experience. No matter how you look at it, it's a troubling case. There are other details that still nag at the minds of investigators.

When we went to the grand jury, one of the grand juries actually asked is, why haven't we arrested Mr. Gordon? And I had that same question. Well, we haven't arrested Mr. Gordon because we don't have the evidence to show that he was involved. But how did this frail woman, you know, do what she did? It will always stick with me. As far as Ron is concerned, I really enjoyed his company.

I enjoyed his friendship. I never had a dislike for Kathy. I liked her. I never expected any of this, so it was a complete shock to me. It was hard for anybody to get their mind around how it happened. Sad, sad story.