Snapped: Women Who Murder - Hilma Marie Witte

Episode Date: March 16, 2025

Years after a beloved father is shot in his home, the family matriarch mysteriously vanishes.Season 31, Episode 19Originally aired: Nov 20, 2022 Watch full episodes of Snapped for FREE on the Oxygen app: https://oxygentv.app.link/WatchSnappedPodSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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come from them. Trust me, listening on Audible can help you reach the goals you set for yourself and see what good can come from them. Trust me, listening on Audible can help you reach the goals you set for yourself. Start listening today when you sign up for a free 30-day trial at audible.com slash wonder ECA. That's audible.com slash wonder ECA. A horrific accident rips a family of four apart. I couldn't believe it. He was my big brother and he was gone. A horrific accident rips a family of four apart. I couldn't believe it. He was my big brother. And he was gone.

One family member dead, and three years later, another vanishes. No one had seen her, no one had talked to her, no one knew where she was. What detectives uncover is beyond the pale. I began to realize that I had dealt with these people in the past. It went from a missing persons to something more serious. Anybody who would do that must have been a sociopath. And a sickening ultimatum is revealed.

He was told he didn't have a choice. You have to do something about this. It has to happen now. I said, what worse she had? Where's the body? She says there is no body. My worst nightmares were coming true. In the quaint resort community of Beverly Shores, Indiana, the pace is easy and crime almost non-existent.

But on the evening of September 1st, 1981, the local police department receives a panicked 911 call. It was Marie Witte that made the call and it went to Beverly Shores Police Department. Marie Witte, a 33-year-old mother of two in Beverly Shores, says she just got home and found her husband dead on the couch, that her husband has been shot, and she needs help immediately. First responders raced to the residence

to find Marie, her mother, Marcie O'Donnell, and Marie's two teenage sons Eric and Butch seemingly in shock. When the police came in, Marie told them there was a terrible accident, that her husband Paul Whitty had been shot. Paul had been apparently asleep on the couch when he was shot in the head. Paul is pronounced dead at the scene. It was a shocking revelation for the people who arrived because a lot of people in the community knew Paul Witte and knew the family.

They were friendly and loving to outsiders. Paul Witte was born in Michigan City, Indiana in 1937. Paul's family was pretty rooted in the community. They had been in that county for a really long time. His dad worked for the railroad. At some point, his parents split, and his dad remarried a woman named Elaine. When Paul was 17 years old, he enlisted in the Navy. When he was in the Navy, I was little. I saw him occasionally, and at Christmas time, he would always come visit.

I remember him as being a go-getter, you know, always wanting to do something. After his discharge, Paul returned to Indiana and settled in Beverly Shores, a popular beach community just an hour south of Chicago. He was working with the steel company and Gary. He was also a volunteer fireman in Beverly Shores. And whenever he did anything, he went gung-ho for it. 200%.

He was very much an outdoor man, a real macho guy, had the full beard and mustache. He was a hunter and a fisherman. While in his late 20s, Paul took an eye-opening trip to sunny South Florida. For whatever bee he got in his bonnet, he went to Florida. And my brother Paul tells me, oh, you get to tell mom where I spent my vacation. I was at a nudist camp. And my aunt just about had a cow. My mom about had two cows.

That's where he met Infamous Marie. Born in 1948, Hilma Marie Christ had a free spirit that matched her unorthodox upbringing. My birth father ran a nudist camp in Delray Beach, Florida. We had lots of acreage. There was a pond or a lake and a big pool. We walked around nude all the time.

But as a child, I never felt uncomfortable. I mean, people can't fathom that type of a lifestyle. Paul and Marie hit it off, so much so that he soon returned to the resort a second time. There was some secrecy about where Paul had spent his vacation. And here I was, I was maybe 14 years old, and that would make Marie 16. I think he was infatuated with her. They probably didn't look like a logical match to outsiders, but it wasn't very long after

that Marie got married to Paul Witte. When I first met Marie was just before they got married. She's not what I imagined that my brother would marry. She was loud and nobody, at least for our family, was impressed with her at all. 27-year-old Paul and 16-year-old Marie married in 1964 and settled in a home in Beverly Shores, not far from Paul's father and stepmother, Len and Elaine Witte. Paul was happy to be married, and he wanted a family. In 1966, 18-year-old Marie gave birth to their first son, Eric.

His brother, John, also known as Butch, came along three years later. Paul was very much the boss in the house. And Marie, she was a pall maker. Of the children, Eric was more of a sportsman. He had dad's favor. He was sort of the golden child. Which comes along, and he is mama's boy.

Everyone knew Paul ran a tight ship. Butch and Eric described their father as being a very strict authoritarian. Paul seemed to have a pretty traditional view of marriage. So Paul worked for a living. Marie stayed home, took care of the house. However, the young mother struggled to fill her role. She did not know how to keep house.

You had to walk across the clothes on the floor in the kitchen, and it was a disaster. In December of 1980, Marie's mother, Marcy O'Donnell, moved in with them. Marie's mother was widowed, so she spent a lot of time with Marie, and Bush would be with him often. She loved being a grandma, she liked being close to her daughter, and she would help out as needed. They seem to share a happy-go-lucky type of coexistence.

But this outwardly happy household crumbles on September 1, 1981, when officers find Paul Witte dead on his living room couch. Strangely, it was a little serene for what they were walking into. The people in the house were pretty calm, but what police found was a man dead on his couch with a bullet hole in his head. Even more shocking to police is who fired the gun. Essentially, Marie had told our investigator that her son, Eric, had a gun, had a.357 magnum, and it could trip. And he had went off and shot her husband in the head.

According to Marie, she wasn't home when her husband died. But her 15-year-old son, Eric, insists it was an accident. Marie was basically in the driveway pulling into the house when the gun went off. So the only person believed to have been in the room when the gun fired was Eric. Eric Witte, the son, said, I'd found this gun, I'd never seen it before, I was interested in learning a little bit about it, so I brought it into my dad, tripped, and it discharged. When Paul was shot, it was on the television in South Bend. My mother called me and I was at work.

I couldn't believe it. He was my big brother and he was gone. We were told or heard that it was an accident. I didn't know what to think and even to this day, I don't know what I did think. Coming up, 15-year-old Eric Witte tells his side of the story. There was skepticism that it didn't make a whole heck of a lot of sense. And later, heartache hits the witty home again. The neighbor across the street from where Elaine lived

indicated that she hadn't seen her for months. That's when I just knew something was wrong. My worst nightmares were coming true. September 1, 1981. Officers in Beverly Shores, Indiana respond to a 911 call to find 44-year-old Paul Witte dead in his home from a gunshot wound to the head. Indiana state investigators soon arrive at the scene to assist the police force. Marie says that she hadn't been home at the time. She was running some errands

and when she walked into the house, Eric was there, her husband was dead, and Eric said, you know, I tripped. The gun went off. It was not a well-kept house at all by any stretch of the imagination. It wasn't impossible for what they said to have happened. Someone tripping. So you keep an open mind. Investigators collect the 357 handgun as evidence. with a.37 handgun as evidence.

Although Marie Witte's mother, Marcie O'Donnell, and Marie's youngest son Butch were in the house at the time of the shooting, neither saw it happen. Marcie, the grandmother, said she was in the dining room. She's in the back of the house. And Eric had been at the front of the house walking into this living room where his dad Paul was asleep. Butch tells police that he was in a bedroom when the gunshot fired. The family's whereabouts isn't all that strikes detectives as odd.

It appeared he'd been shot in the top of the head, in a sort of downward angle. And if he had tripped, the bullet would have come in more of a direct angle as opposed to a downward angle. I didn't think it was an accident. I didn't know what it was yet. Detectives want to question 15-year-old Eric, but Marie quickly intervenes. Marie didn't want me talking to Eric. She said, I think we need an attorney.

And I said, that's your priority. That's fine. People do that, but it's a little flag wave in there that says this is not normal. Six days later, investigators sit down with Eric and Marie at their attorney's office. Eric says the night of the accident, his dad wasn't feeling well and had laid down on the sofa for a nap. Eric found a gun upstairs. He brought the gun down from upstairs to show it to his dad. He wanted to talk about it. Paul was familiar with guns.

Guns were something that we all grew up with. Paul had guns in the house, and it didn't seem odd to me at all. Eric tells detectives that this was the first time he saw this particular. 357 revolver. His dad was asleep on the couch. He came in the room and talked to his dad about the gun, how it worked. He said he had tripped on the rug and that he had fallen forward and this has happened. The gun accidentally went off and shot him in the head. There was skepticism that it didn't make a huck of a lot of sense that it just happened

to his dad right in the head with a shot. My question to him was, why are you taking a gun, loaded gun, to your dad? And he said that he wanted to see about the safety mechanism or something. I said, did you have the gun cocked? And he said he didn't think so. And that was a big red flag to me because it takes quite a bit of pull to be able to shoot at double action 357. There is a trigger pull to it.

But at that point in time, the attorney stopped me from questioning him. Unable to question Eric further, investigators turn to Marie. She corroborates her son's story, but refuses to give a formal statement. She would answer a question if I asked her something, but other than that, she didn't volunteer anything. She tried to be very quiet around me. I told Marie and told the attorney, you'll see me again someday because he's getting by with

this and he'll do it again. So trust me, you're going to see me again. Had Marie been home, maybe there would have been more suspicion. But she wasn't, and that was backed up by her alibi. There were people who had seen her car around. She pulled into the driveway as the gun was going off. The autopsy findings provide no further insight

to the officers. With no evidence or eyewitness testimony to refute Eric's claims, Indiana authorities officially ruled Paul's death an accident. That's what we had, but it was an accident and that was really all... I was pulled away for different investigations. investigations. In the coming months, Marie turns her attention to rebuilding her family's lives. There was a small life insurance policy, I'd say small, like $25,000 or something, but nothing of any real major importance.

But shortly after Paul's death, the land the Witteys' house sits on is earmarked to become part of a national park, and the family is forced to move out. Marie's mother, Marcia O'Donnell, goes to live with a friend. Marie and her kids get an offer to move in with Paul's stepmother, Elaine Witte, on Johnson Road in Trail Creek. Having been widowed 14 years earlier, Elaine is delighted to welcome family into her home. I don't think she probably ever had any question whatsoever about letting them go there or inviting them. Over the next three years, the fresh start lifts everyone's spirits. Elaine and Marie seemed to get along really well.

They would sit on the porch together, they would share stories. They really seemed kind of like two peas in a pod. After graduating high school, Eric follows in his father's footsteps and joins the Navy, ultimately relocating to San Diego. I thought it was great he was going into the Navy. Paul had been in the Navy. So it seemed like a good thing for him. 15-year-old Butch stays home with Marie and Elaine

to finish school. Three years after Paul's death, the Witte family seems to have settled into a new normal. Until May of 1984, when a concerned citizen contacts the Trail Creek Police Department. Max Trout was a neighbor across the street from where Elaine lived. Max indicated that he had seen Elaine out in the yard, usually tending to her flowers, but he hadn't seen her for months. Sergeant Skip Pierce is dispatched to Elaine's residence to conduct a welfare check. Murray said as far as they were concerned, Elaine Witte had went on an extended vacation.

She was traveling alone and was going to West Coast and making various stops in between. She had no schedule or anything like that. Nobody could pinpoint where she was. Coming up, a disappearance raises an alarming red flag. My son didn't get a Valentine's Day card from Grandma Elaine. He didn't get a birthday card from her either. I just knew something had happened to her. And Marie confronts a ghost from her past. I said, hello, Marie.

Remember me? I'm back. And she almost fainted. and my podcast is back with a new season and let me tell you, it's too good and I'm diving into the brains of entertainment's best and brightest, okay? Every episode, I bring on a friend and have a real conversation.

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The only way out is to scam their way out. Follow Scam Factory on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can binge all episodes of Scam Factory early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus. Three years after officials declared Paul Witte's shooting death an accident, law enforcement are speaking with Marie Witte again, trying to locate Paul's stepmother, Elaine. She said Elaine was traveling, that she also was visiting Marie's son who was in the Navy, and that she didn't know when she would be coming back. Marie assures Sergeant Pierce that Elaine is fine. But as weeks go by with no sign of her,

friends and family grow concerned. Elaine would either call me or I'd call her. I would say on an average of about once a month. My son didn't get a Valentine's Day card from Grandma Elaine. They didn't get a birthday card from her either. And then in August, I called. And Marie answered the phone. And she said that Elaine had gone on a trip.

She'd be back, and she'd have her call me. That didn't happen. And that's when I called the police in Aurora. Sergeant Pierce, he had been back again to Murray's house to get more information. Again was given the same story about her being on vacation. You have to understand, Trail Creek is a four-person department. So at that point, we got ahold of the Indiana State Police.

Skip Pierce came to me and said, we got this lady, her name's Malane Witte, she's missing. No one had seen her, no one had talked to her, no one knew where she was. It doesn't take Detective Sergeant Boyd long to recognize the name. I began to realize that I had dealt with these people in the past and that these

were the same people. Her son had tripped and shot her husband in the head. You know, I think we've got a problem. Sergeant Boyd has long harbored reservations about Paul Witte's untimely death. It could have well been just that an accidental shooting. But again, when the gun went off, it shot downward into the head, which made it really

much more suspicious. If he had tripped, the bullet would have come in more of a direct angle. On August 14, 1984, three months after Elaine's reported disappearance, state investigators pay Marie an unannounced visit. I said, hello, Marie. Remember me? I'm back. And she almost fainted. I said, Marie, I'm here about Elaine Whitty. We're trying to find her, and she's on a trip, and she stammered and stuttered.

And I said, can we come in now? Marie sticks to her story. Her explanation was that Elaine took off Marie sticks to her story. Her explanation was that Elaine took off for parts out west. Marie's statement is that Elaine took a bus on her travels, didn't take her car. She just simply said, if I hear from her, I'll let you know. But my concern is that Marie didn't have a clue where she was gone to. She's been gone two or three months here and that's not normal.

When investigators run Elaine's VIN number, they find something else disturbing. Marie had recently sold Elaine's car. Obviously that didn't make a whole heck of a lot of sense that she would sell her car if she was planning on coming back. Investigators try to locate Elaine themselves, but make little headway. The other thing they looked at at the time were phone records, people who called in phone numbers, those kind of things.

There was no long distance calls coming in from Elaine that would have substantiated that she was traveling anywhere. We tried to track her through the bus system, but there was no way to do it because you purchased a ticket. You don't have to register or sign for it or anything else. We were concerned, but you have to have probable cause to believe a crime's been committed. We didn't have that yet.

Authorities returned to the home to speak with Marie, only she's not there. So authorities contact her mother, Marcy O'Donnell. I asked her where Marie was. Where's Marie staying now? She said, well, she and Butch are going out to California and Sierra. With Marie and her family 2,000 miles away,

detectives attack from a different angle. We had subpoenaed Elaine's bank accounts. That was probably the best way to try to find somebody if they're gone and see where they're at when they're taking the money out of the bank. Bank accounts showed large withdraws in a period of time from the beginning of January up until May or June of 1984. She had social security checks that were coming in

on a monthly basis and they were still being cashed locally. But no one has seen Elaine Witte in her hometown since January, nearly eight months earlier. Many of the withdrawal slips were signed in the name of Elaine Witte. They asked me to look at a signature on a check, and whether I thought it was hers or not, I did not believe that the signature was hers.

Any kind of issues involving Social Security funds are investigated by the Treasury Department, so that's how the federal law enforcement gets involved. It went from a missing persons to something more serious. federal authorities were notified that the family left unannounced in the middle of an investigation of a missing person, and so that kind of put everybody on high alert. As more time passes with no sign of Elaine,

her family begins to suspect the worst. My worst nightmares were coming true. From my standpoint as an investigator, there was no question in my mind that Elaine was not with us anymore, that she was gone. Investigators still lack sufficient evidence for an arrest, but they keep in contact with Marie's mother, Marcy.

Marcy appears to be a very nice older lady. What I want to do is put pressure on Marcy. You can tell that she knew more. I kept contact with her, and the more I talked to her, the more I could get from her. And I finally said, what's going on? And I said, I'll go after anyone who was involved in this whole thing and I'll lock them up. The tactic works and Marcy finally buckles under the pressure. On October 26th, 1984, she reveals what really happened to Elaine.

It was on a Friday. I called and talked to her and she said, Boyd, Elaine's dead. And I said, OK, I'll be right over. Marie's mother said that she had been told that Butch had accidentally shot and killed Elaine with a crossbow. I said, well, where's she at? Where's the body? She says there is no body. She said, we've got rid of the body. Coming up, the hunt for Marie and her sons intensifies. They were very close to going across the border.

And the details of Elaine's murder grow more horrifying. They were told this was an accident. We pulled out floorboards, wallboards, to see if we could find any blood. For the second time in three years, an untimely death has claimed a member of the Witte family. Marie's mother tells detectives that Elaine Witte was killed months earlier in January of 1984. The story that was given to police

was that Butch, Elaine's 15-year-old grandson, had a crossbow. He accidentally fired the crossbow and fatally struck Elaine. It had to have struck them as a little bit odd. Marie Witte's mother, Marcy O'Donnell, was saying Marie and Butch had got rid of the body. Had cut it up and had dismembered it and got rid of the body. It was Marie's idea. She didn't want to supposedly involve Butch in another investigation,

like Eric had to go through with the father. For detectives, it seems too much of a coincidence, especially when there's money missing. Elaine Witte's Social Security checks were being deposited into her account in Trail Creek when Marie was there. Subsequently, they were transferred to a California location. Marcy O'Donnell told us that Marie was writing these checks and authoring the checks and copying Elaine's signature.

Federal authorities begin monitoring banks in California, while Indiana authorities execute a search warrant at Elaine Witte's home on November 3, 1984. We pulled out floorboards, wallboards, to see if we could find any blood, anything like that. We didn't find dink. We got some questionable hairs, and we'll send them in to lab and see what we could find any blood, anything like that. We didn't find Dink. We got some questionable hairs. We'll send them in to lab and see what we can find is that. But really, we got nothing else.

With the search warrant yielding no results, Indiana detectives fly to California to track down Marie. First, they visit Eric at the naval base in San Diego. He agrees to talk to detectives. Sergeant Pearson, Sergeant Boyd went to California to talk to Eric. And he stuck to the same story about Elaine, supposedly, vacationing.

about Elaine supposedly vacationing. Investigators believe Eric knows more than he's letting on, and they confront him with Marcy's confession. I have worked a number of murder cases with Sergeant Boyd, and I've learned they want to confess. They want to tell you what they did, because they know it's wrong. Feeling the pressure, Eric finally breaks down and admits several months ago his mother called him

about a family emergency. Eric told us he was informed that Butch had accidentally killed Elaine with a crossbow back in Indiana. Marie told Eric it was an accident and she needed help. Eric said he told her to freeze the body until he could come home. Two months later, Eric says he returned home to Indiana. Eric said he went home with his Navy buddy, Doug Menkel. Marie said, this was an accident,

but he never saw the body. When asked what happened to Elaine's remains, Eric is evasive, but investigators keep up the pressure. Eventually, he admits he and Doug Menkel, in fact, took the cooler with portions of the body, bags of flesh or bones, when he went to San Diego and got rid of it out there.

It was deposited in the San Diego Dome. It is a mammoth landfill for the entire city of San Diego, and that's where all the refuse comes in. It was huge, and we'd never find it based on how big that place was. After investigators hear Eric's story, they ramp up efforts to locate Marie and Butch. The very next day, on November 7th, 1984, federal authorities spring into action when one of Elaine Witte's Social Security checks is used in Chula Vista, California,

just north of Tijuana, Mexico. When they found them, they were very close to going across the border. Marie and Butch were arrested in Chula Vista by the feds for cashing Elaine's Social Security checks. All three are charged with forgery. But Marie has no interest in cooperating with authorities. Investigators confront 15-year-old Butch about his older brother's allegations.

That's when Butch confessed everything to me. He was pretty forthcoming as far as what had happened, what he had done. Marie was telling him that she had taken money from Elaine, and Elaine knew about it, and she was going to, again, put him on the street. They wouldn't have anywhere to live. His mother told him he needed to kill his grandmother to keep that from happening.

According to Butch, the events leading up to Elaine's death had been building for nearly six months. They had tried to kill her by first giving her drugs and keeping her in a room that was cold with the windows open, hoping that she would die naturally. When that didn't work, Butch says his mother demanded his cooperation. Marie says it has to happen now. She drugged Elaine with Valium and Elaine was asleep in her bed and the time was now and Butch was told he didn't have a choice beyond whether he strangled or shot her with a crossbow.

Butch chose the crossbow method, went into Elaine's bedroom, and fired. And he killed his grandmother. After Butch killed her with the crossbow, they put her body in a freezer downstairs and then began the process of using an electric chainsaw to dismember her. It took months of her going in and out of the freezer and slowly being cut up and disposed of.

It was horrific. That's where Marcy O'Donnell also got involved in helping dispose of the body. They were able basically to get rid of most of the body except for, I believe, the skull, hip bones, some of the larger portions. So that's what they put in the cooler and took out with them to California

that went into the landfill Which had a lot of guilt for what happened he obviously when he confessed I think he felt relieved Which was 15 at the time he was the one that had to Cut her up He can't even imagine how badly that had to cut her up. I can't even imagine how badly that would have screwed somebody up like that. Based on Butch's confession, he and his mother are charged with Elaine's murder and conspiracy to commit murder. Eric Witte and Marcy O'Donnell are also charged with conspiracy to commit murder.

Coming up, the witty's youngest son has one last horror story to share with investigators. He wanted to talk about the murder of his dad. And two impressionable teens finally come to grips with their mother's murderous manipulations. She did whatever she had to do to basically satisfy her greed. In November of 1984, 15-year-old John, aka Butch, Witte, admitted to killing his 74-year-old grandmother, Elaine Witte. Butch said that he committed the murder at the behest of his mother, Hilma Marie Witte. Elaine was on to the fact that Marie was forging her checks. Marie and her children are immediately

extradited back to Indiana. But less than a week after Butch's shocking confession, he reaches out to investigators again. He wanted to talk about the murder of his dad. He gave us a story about Eric and that Marie had also manipulated Eric into killing Paul and that it wasn't an accident. Which tells authorities that, much like his grandmother's

murder, Paul's murder was all Marie's idea. Marie said that he had to kill his dad because she was suffering abuse by him. Also, he was threatening divorce. And if they went through a divorce, they'd be out in the street. They wouldn't have anywhere to go. First they started out giving him rat poison.

He gets sick, and they go to the hospital. Of course he goes to the hospital. He gets better. So then they went and got arsenic to bled. That gets sick and he goes to hospital. Of course he goes to hospital, he gets better. So then they went and got arsenic to bled. That just made him have an awful headache and he'd sleep on the couch. Finally, on September 1st, 1981, Marie said it was now or never. She said, you gotta do it now.

Eric was given a choice, either strangling or to shoot him. Maurice says, I'm going to leave. And when I come back to this house, he needs to be dead. And if he's not, I'm going to drive away. And you will be here with your brother. This will be your life. You are choosing your father over me." He's standing there over his sleeping father, trying to muster up the ability to pull the

trigger. And then he sees headlights turning into the driveway. He had to do it now because mom's gonna really be mad now and she kept throwing it into it. And that's when he took the gun and shot his dad. When Marie walked inside, she told everyone to say it was an accident. Even Marcy, her mother, and aligned it so that they all were telling

and looked like they were telling the truth. They interviewed Eric and he was able to corroborate that statement by Butch. Eric's corroboration of Butch's confession gives investigators what they need to charge Eric and Marie Witte with Paul's murder. In time, Butch and Eric agreed to testify against their mother in exchange for a plea deal. Eric and Butch received a sentence of 20 years,

a voluntary manslaughter. Nobody likes plea agreements, but it's part of the process. We didn't have a body, so we had to put everybody's story together and align it. At Marie Witte's murder trials in 1985 and 1986, prosecutors argue money drove Marie's actions. She complained incessantly about Paul. Nothing made him happy. And he had a horrible temper.

This conversation had gravitated to divorce. And 27th of August, Paul said he was gonna file for divorce. And September, he was dead. She got not only his Social Security, but she got his pension. The only way she was going to get it is not through divorce, but if he, in fact, was killed. The same with Elaine.

She wanted her Social Security, and she wanted all her savings. She was able to manipulate her two children to do some pretty horrific things. But in the end, Marie's hold over her children has its limits. Butch's testimony was very compelling and very believable. And then you had it corroborated by his brother, Eric.

They were both testifying against their mother. So I think that established a pretty high degree of credibility for the jury. Marie is convicted of murder and conspiracy to commit murder, receiving 90 years in prison for the deaths of Paul and Elaine Witte. She receives an additional 10 years for forging and cashing Elaine's Social Security checks.

What struck me the most, it was Marie Witte. And just through the process of having both of her sons testify, Marcy O'Donnell testified against her. Not one sign of emotion at any point in time. And then after the guilty verdict, not one shed of emotion, nothing. Anybody who would do that must have been a sociopath. That's it, sociopath.

Marie's mother, Marcie O'Donnell, pled guilty to assisting a criminal and was sentenced to six years in prison. She died after her release. Eric's friend, Doug Menkel, was sentenced for a Class A misdemeanor and was released to the U.S. Navy. Eric and John David Witte were released from prison in 1996. John died in 2008. He was 39 years old. Eric died in 2022. He was 56 years old. Hilma Marie Witte is serving her sentence at the Indiana Women's Prison. Her earliest possible release date is October 2026. Hey everybody. We have some exciting news that we want to share.

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