So True with Caleb Hearon - Confronting My Mom

Episode Date: May 23, 2024

This is a VERY special episode, y’all! In honor of Mother’s Day (last week) we are joined by Caleb’s mom, the one and only Kellie Hearon! Kellie and Caleb talk humble beginnings, religion, the bond between a mother and her children, single parenthood, Julia Roberts, and so much more! Subscribe to our YouTube Channel! https://youtube.com/@sooootruepod?si=K_0fWVeFUopOWI_R See Caleb Live! https://calebhearon.komi.io/ Join our Patreon for an extended interview with Kellie and more exclusive bonus content! https://patreon.com/SoTruePodcast?utm_medium=unknown&utm_source=join_link&utm_campaign=creatorshare_creator&utm_content=copyLink Follow the show! @sooootruepod Follow Caleb! @calebsaysthings Produced by Chance Nichols @chanceisloudRecorded at Bad Ladder Productions in Los Angeles, CASee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Do you really think I'm the problem in my love life? Well, you're probably part of the problem. That's nuts. That's not the way a mom should talk to her kid. We've never talked to each other. What do you think it's going to take for me to get you to loosen up for the episode? Is there something that anybody in the room could do to make you go... Do you have Miller Lite? Do we have Miller Lite? We should have brought beer for you. No, I'm good. You totally could have drank make you go? Do you have Miller Lite? Do we have Miller Lite?

We should have brought beer for you. No, I'm good. You totally could have drank beer on here. You're a Miller Lite girl. Yes. Miller Lite, if you're listening, it's all you drink. Yes. Well, I don't drink all day long, but when I do drink alcohol, it's Miller Lite.

Totally. You're not an alcoholic. I do work during the day, and I do not get drunk before work. Which is good, because you're a nurse. Yes. Yeah, so that's a good thing to know. I am a nurse. You're in Los Angeles right now, obviously, in our podcast studio.

I took you to dinner last night for Mother's Day, Perfect Son. And Allie and I asked you what's your favorite and least favorite thing about motherhood. And you said your least favorite thing was heartbreak. Yes. And then when we said, what do you mean by that? You said your kids will break your heart often what did you mean by that oh let's see well let's talk about the christmas that we talked no dude okay before we get into the christmas where i was ungrateful what do you think is the over-under on you crying during this episode?

I'm going to try not to. Yeah, but I can see it for you. You're a crier. Well, I get emotional about things. You do get emotional about things. I mean, if you cry, just make sure you look into the camera. That's what I'll say. If we're going to do it, let's really have a moment about it.

That'd get us more views if I put the tears on. Yeah, I think if you're going to cry, let's just really try to make some, let's get the meat off the bone. Okay, tell them about this Christmas. Go ahead. What happened? So I don't know if you guys are aware of, back in the day, there was not,

you could get online Thanksgiving night and buy stuff from Walmart. You had to go and stand in line and literally fight people to get to what you wanted. So Caleb wanted a TV and I go to get to what you wanted. So Caleb wanted a TV and I go to Walmart. So you're talking about I wanted a TV for my bedroom. For his bedroom, yes. And you went to a Black Friday sale.

I did. And I stayed, I mean, I think it was midnight. And I fought and clawed wounds. I got this TV. You had wounds from the Black Friday sale. It was probably that big. I would go a little bit smaller. You're wounds from the Black Friday sale. It was probably that big. I would go a little bit smaller. You're not the one telling the story.

So that was the size of the TV. Uh-huh. And Caleb basically said, fuck that. Oh, God. Basically. Let's try not to be too dramatic on the podcast. You got it for me for Christmas. There's some missing details here. Yes, it was for Christmas. You got it for Black not to be too dramatic on the podcast. You got it for me for Christmas. There's some missing details here.

Yes, it was for Christmas. You got it for Black Friday. I opened it on Christmas morning, and I was not, you didn't like my reaction. You cried. Well, okay. I don't think I cried right away. No, there was only a few tears before you went to your room and broke down full throttle and then i okay and what were you doing during that time well i went to my room and cried

because i was heartbroken because i wasn't appreciative enough i wanted a bigger tv yes you wanted a bigger tv and at that time you know i was going to nursing school and i was working three jobs and yeah um and Caleb was very needy and I just couldn't afford him. Yeah. So obviously, look, no one would argue. I'm clearly the villain in this story. You obviously come off really well.

Bringing up nursing school and the three jobs is a nice touch. Yes. It's a nice touch. That was the reality. I don't, it wasn't about the TV though. We've talked about this Christmas. It wasn't about the TV. I was just depressed, I think, And I didn't have words for it. And I, yeah, I

was also being a snotty little brat, but that's how kids are. Yes, it is. And I think that, um, that was a very sad time in your life. And I didn't even realize you were going through that, which is something I look back on and it makes me very sad that you went through that alone. Because you're referring to me being in the closet in Missouri and not really knowing what I'm doing and going to church and all that kind of stuff. That's what you're referring to. Yes.

Yeah. It was a weird time. But I was good. I mean, I was okay. But I definitely, there were a lot of big feelings. And when you're like, what was I, 12, 13? I'd say probably 13. That Christmas?

Mm-hmm. Might have been 11. I was pretty young. But yeah, I was definitely processing a lot of big feelings. And when you're that age, you don't have that backlog of data to know that it's going to be okay and that you can process big feelings and the next day can be better. You don't have any of that. Right.

So you're just kind of crying at Christmas. But you're older than 11, so. Right. Might have're just kind of crying at Christmas. But you're older than 11, so. Right. Might have been 9 or 10. You think I was 13? Yeah. It's a little too old to be behaving that way. Well, I think that's what hurt the most

is that you should have been better. Yeah, 13's a little too old to be behaving that way. I should have known better. But I've forgiven you. Well, thanks. Do you think, I think I've made up for it. Do you think overall I was a good kid or a bad kid? No, you were a very good kid.

Overall? Overall. Yeah, so were there a lot of heartbreaking moments or was that, is this kind of a standalone moment? I'm open to any answer. A lot of the heartbreaking moments weren't per se what you did so much as I obviously decided to have kids very young. Yeah. I had your brother when I was 18.

I had you when I was 21. Yeah. And I was a single parent. And so I missed out on a lot of things when, you know, and there wasn't grandparents necessarily. things when you know and there wasn't grandparents necessarily so when other people you know we had grandparents day or whatever and other people had their grandparents or had their parents there and I wasn't there that probably hurt me more than than like stuff I did yeah like circumstantial things about being a single mom with not a huge support system yeah see he wanted the tears and that that's something that still bothers me that I couldn't be there for the important parts.

I cannot believe you're crying this early in the episode. I'm sorry. You're going to cut this part. Absolutely not. Make sure the tears glisten in the light. We need that in the camera, babe. Can we get her some tissues or something, somebody? I mean, we knew the crying would come, but we didn't know it would be this soon.

There's people rushing off to get tissues. I mean, yeah, but was I exacerbating that? Was I making it worse? Like, were there times that I was being unreasonable about that stuff? No. No, I mean, like the TV situation. But for the most part, you were a pretty grateful child. You were very much a mama's boy, so you and I spent a lot of time together.

Yeah. Well, if you spend five minutes with my dad, you'll start to get a picture of why I was a mama's boy. He wasn't a – I love dad. May he rest in peace. But he wasn't a blast. Yes, that brings me to another story of Caleb. He was probably three years old, and he would maybe go spend one weekend a month with his dad. Yeah.

And this maybe lasted for three or four months. It didn't last very long, but he would sneak into the kitchen or wherever the phone was. I don't know where the phone was. He would call me and beg me to call his dad and not to tell him that he had called, but to call his dad and tell him I missed him and I wanted him to come home. King.

Because he didn't want to be there. King. He knew what he wanted. We've got tissues for you. And I would do it. Chance if you don't mind. Well, you would do it. So you enabled me.

I was an enabler, yes. Yeah, you enabled me. And you really kind of, you shouldn't have maybe enabled me so much because I really got used to getting what I want. Is that where it started yeah for sure you have a huge you have a huge role in whatever's going on here whatever whatever makes it to where I have to be talking into a microphone seeking attention begging please please like me there's something about I think you giving me what I want a lot as a kid that you definitely played a role sounds more like you were neglected if that's what you need no there's something about being like i like when i get what i want it's good when people listen to me let's do that more i think you i think that's i think you played a role i probably

did well i would say you're my parent yes i very much tried to give you guys everything that that you wanted yeah obviously i didn't succeed the tv could have been a little bigger, babe. The TV situation wasn't clear. You have really, what's funny about you is the TV situation has never been brought up in my life. And in the last month, you have brought the TV situation up five or six times. You're addicted to the TV story right now. Well, now that I've brought it up, it's like an open wound just festering.

So now I feel that I need to talk about it and get those feelings out. Not an open wound fest festering. So now I feel that I need to talk about it and get those feelings out. Not an open wound festering. Kind of. I was 13! I do apologize about the TV. I've apologized to you off camera. After today, we're going to try to let it go. We're going to try to move on from the TV situation.

I've moved on from having such a small TV. I hope you can move on from my reaction to it. I gave you a bigger one when you left for college. You did give me a bigger TV when I left for college. That was years later. It was a big gap in TV sizes there. I really struggled for a while. Yes.

You did give me it. Remember the day that you dropped me off at college? Yes, I do. Do you want to tell people about it? So I dropped him off at college. We talk on the way there. Nothing said. It's like a three or four hour drive.

Yeah. I get ready to leave. He's like, by the way, I'm gay. And again, I cried. Not because he was gay, but because selfishly. You're pretty homophobic. Why? Selfishly, You're pretty homophobic. That is a lie. Selfishly, it was about me, though, and my grandkids.

Yeah, you want to be a grandma, and you were definitely existing in a space right then where you were like, this complicates the road to grandma. Yeah, so he basically slapped me on the back, said, we'll adopt grandkids, now you need to go home. And then I find out that he later hooked up with somebody that night. I found this out last night at dinner not that night honey that yeah you didn't even wait till night yeah it was we're talking like an hour later yeah so you we packed up my car and and your car yeah and we drove someone else drove another car too I think did someone help us move in maybe it was one of my roommates or something but we drove down to Springfield you dropped me off at school we

moved me in we like did a big store run you bought me a bunch of like you know when you move into college you have to do like a Tupperware container or whatever you we went shower curtain soap you like really set me up and then we probably spent a million dollars that day and you were being pretty good I would say about the move you were emotional yeah but. Yeah. But you were being good. You were being chill. And we were getting along great. And then, yeah, when we were walking out of my dorm, we sat at the picnic table out front and I said, hey, I'm gay. And then you got in your car and left.

Well, you cried quite a bit. And then you got in your car and left. And then I want to say an hour later, I got on Grindr. I had been on Grindr for a couple years at that point. And then I got on Grindr, found an RA in another dorm across the street, went and hooked up with him. And it was awesome.

Well, I'm glad that, again, in my pain, I was probably still driving home crying. Of course you were. And you were hooking up with some random guy. God, life is awesome. I was hooking up with some random guy. And you know what's so funny? After we hooked up, I kind of was like, oh, my God, maybe he'll be my boyfriend.

I don't know. I certainly was not in a normal headspace. But he was like, so did you just move in? And I was like, yeah. And he's like, you a freshman? I was like, yeah. And he was like, you've got to use the writing center. And I was like, what do you mean?

And he was like, when you write papers, if you want a better grade, you've got to drop by the writing center. They've got tutors in there. And I was like, thank you? And then he was like, yeah, it's in the library. Don't ever be scared to drop in. They're super cool. I hope that wasn't the poor play.

No, this is the pillow talk. Oh. I say pillow talk. It's like, I'm putting on my clothes and leaving. He's like, you've got to use the writing center. And I was like, okay. And I did. And that was really good advice.

He was an RA, you know, so he knew. So he also had his place in your success. He had his place in my success. I want to thank him. I don't know his name or really anything about him. I don't think I ever saw him in person again. You did try to, though. Shout out to him.

I did. Yeah, I told you this. That whole first semester i would message him and be like do you want to hang out again and he'd be like busy yeah he yeah he played me like a fiddle that was so it wasn't very fortuitous in the long run uh okay so then you go home well you told me something devastating i don't want the whole podcast to be devastating i want to tell people i don't know how much of this is going to be cut by the time it comes out there will be lighthearted moments but it's like I'm talking to my mom.

I have questions to ask you that I Googled. What are questions you should ask your mom? And so I've got those. And then we've got questions from fans later on. The whole episode will not be devastating, y'all. We'll put something lighthearted up front so you know. It will not all be my mom crying and accusing me of being a bad child. I'm done crying.

Yeah. Well, I'll be the judge of that. You told me something devastating. The first, I want to say like maybe spring break of my freshman year of college. So now it's like, I've done the whole first semester. I've done some of the second semester and I came back to Kansas city and stayed at your house. Cause I couldn't afford to go on a trip or anything. And I was at your house and I was like, how you been? And you're like, I'm doing a lot better this month. And I was like, what do you mean? And you were like, oh, the first like six or seven months

you were at school, I cried myself to sleep every night. And do you remember that? Now I would cry myself to sleep every night if you moved back. That was crazy. When you told me that, I was like, bitch, get help. Like, that's nuts. Yeah, but you've got to think.

I had spent my whole life. I'd never been alone. I was raising kids. I always had someone with me. I'd never been alone. Yeah, you'd just always been mom. Yeah. I'd never just had that emptiness.

Yeah. And that was hard. Emptiness is a big word to use. That feels really sad to hear. Yeah. I believe you. I understand what you to hear. Yeah. I believe you. I understand what you're saying. But emptiness is really sad.

But I embrace it now. You embrace your alone time. Yes. I wonder what you... We talk about this a lot, that you're very much a caretaker. You've taken care of people your whole life. You took care of your siblings, and then you had Colton so young, my older brother, and then you had me, and so you raised both of us, and you're a nurse. So you take care of people professionally. Do you think you're very good at focusing on

yourself? I'm working on it. Yeah. Taking care of others fills my cup. It makes me feel, um, I guess wanted. And when you feel wanted or when you feel needed, you know, you're never going to be alone because there's always going to be something for you. Yeah. But, yeah, I'm starting to. I talked to Allie last night about maybe going and working with horses. That's something I've always loved. I did that with my mom before she passed away.

I actually read yesterday on the plane. I just recently moved in by myself myself and I've very much been embracing that. And do you think, I'm very proud of you. First of all, I want you to focus more on yourself. That's a big thing we talk about and have talked about for years. Do you think that if you were like socialized as a man that you would, that you would have spent so, so much of your energy in your life taking care of other people? Like, does it feel gendered to you, or does it feel like just who you are? It feels like who I am.

Yeah. That's interesting. Yeah. Because I don't feel the, I don't feel the, I take care of people. I'm a character. Not the way that you do, but I try to take care of my friends.

I try to be, like, a thoughtful person. But I don't feel, like, I look at the way you take care of people, and I go, Jesus. You're like, I think you're very selfless I would say it's probably my biggest downfall as well as my best attribute being selfless caring for other people yeah okay so how do you balance that how does somebody who feels good when they take care of other people balance looking out for themselves that's what I'm working

on that's what we're getting into. That's where we're at. And where is it headed? How are you feeling about it? I'm just starting to peel the onion. Yeah. Just starting to get the layers. Yeah.

So I don't know yet. So I've Googled a bunch of articles about what you should ask your mom. Okay. Okay, and that is our relationship. You're my mom. Yep. And that's it.

We're not friends. We're not colleagues. You're just my mom. We're friends. Yeah, we are. Yeah, we are. I just wondered if, I just wondered if you would push back on that. Okay. Now this is on the question lists. Okay. So this is not self-serving. I didn't bring this up. This just came up in the Google and I have to trust the research. It says, are you, you chose it to be your number one question. I put it, no, I didn't even put, I randomized them and they came how they came. But the first question is, are you proud of me? Very.

Okay, do you want to talk about that? Do you want to be specific and tell everybody why? So, Caleb came from a single parent family. We, you know, he's always been funny. He's always worked really hard to get whatever he wanted um honestly I don't think there's everything anything ever that he has applied for or tried for that he did not succeed I mean if it was the spelling bee he won if it was king candidate he won if it was um a leadership thing he won I it was just – and I think a lot of people thought, well, he's lucky,

but it wasn't. It was because he had to work very hard for that, and that makes me very proud. It's also luck, though. There is an element of luck. You can work – a lot of other people at any of those things worked very hard and didn't get to win. I've lost plenty of things, by the way. This is all coming from a mother's lens. So're very proud and you see all the victories I know

you've seen the losses too but the luck is a part of it don't you think you've been lucky I think that the hard work puts you in situations that you need to be in to make things happy I don't know that I would say it's luck. This is a version of what I say when I talk about this thing because I think about luck and hard work a lot as somebody who has been very, you know, blessed wouldn't be the word that I would use

because I don't feel that way. It doesn't feel, I don't like the idea that some creator bestows good things on some people and bad things on others. But I think I have been very lucky and I think you have to work hard to be ready when the luck comes.

Right. Right? I think that's fair. I think that's a fair way to put it. Yeah. Now, I know that you're proud of me. What is your proudest moment of me that people are going to want to know?

This is not self-serving. I could do this. My mom and I could do this off camera, guys. I'm doing this for y'all. What is your proudest moment of me? You have to pick just one. Sift through. Think about all the millions. Well,

you flying me out here for Mother's Day meant a lot to me. It made me very proud that I raised you or helped to turn you into the kind of person that cares about that and wants to spend time with his mom.

That is so sweet. I hope you know this is purely business. And this is why I drink, folks. Not folks. You're loving it. You love the audience. I think you would be a great comedian. Would you ever consider trying? Oh, I really wanted to when I was younger. I used to always do

Pee Wee Herman and Whoopi Goldberg, but that's not how it happened. You would do impressions? I can't. I'll allow Pee Wee Herman, but I think we skip Whoopi. I think we'd probably skip Whoopi, but I would allow you to do Pee Wee Herman. You would do impressions of them? Yeah. And for who?

Friends? No, I wasn't quite.'t well some of my friends i was that comfortable around yeah you have to in school i was and you could ask anybody that i went to school with up until i was probably 25 i was very shy if a teacher called on me class, I would want to sink down into the chair. Yeah. I was just very shy. I would blush. So, no, not in front of a lot of people, but at home. Who were you in, like, middle school?

What were you like in middle school? I was in sports. You played softball? I played track. I played basketball. You played softball in high school, didn't you? Okay, I was like, I didn't make that up. No, I did.

I read a lot. Reading was kind of an escape for me. That probably, not so much in high school, but in middle school. Like I would go to the library and get a book, and I would go to my room that night, and I would read it until it was done. That was an escape that made me feel like maybe I was in a place that I wanted to be, I guess. So what you just said is something that someone who didn't have a very good home life would say? I don't want to say I didn't have a good home life. I want to say that it was a very, uh, it was, it was the best situation it could be. Your home life was the best situation it could be.

Yes. And you're talking about in middle school era. Yes. Yeah. So what kind of books were you reading? What kind of books were you escaping into? Oh, my favorite was the Misty of Chicotigue. What is that? It's about horses. Uh, the, Misty of Chicoteague. What is that? It's about horses. The island of Chicoteague. You and horses. You really do love horses. You know, that's one of the best memories

I have with my mom before she passed away is we had horses and we, you know, we would ride into town and when she felt good, my mom passed away of cancer when I was seven, so when she felt good, that's one of the things that we would do. And it's just always been instilled in me, I guess. I like it.

Yeah. Your mom also gave you a white Bible as a gift, right? That's that white Bible that you have? Still sits on my bedside. Yeah. Are you Christian? What is your religion? I was Methodist.

Yeah, you grew up Methodist. What do you think these days? I don't know that you have to choose. Oh, what a politician. What a savvy answer. I'm just saying, I feel like a lot of people feel that you have to go to church, or they feel like you have to meet and worship, and I just don't feel that way. I feel like I can worship the same in my bedroom as I do at a church. I don't think people actually have to come together to worship to make God hear you. You know what I'm saying.

Yeah, I totally know what you're saying. Hey, I worship in the bedroom too, brother, just in a different way. Come on. Come on, dog. Come on, dog. You know what I'm saying and again anyway the performative drinking of the beer is going to get old i think you've got one more in you i think you've got one more in the episode and then it's going to probably get a little it's going to have a a loosening effect so i just won't say anything i'll just take a drink

exactly correct yeah i think you can only call it out probably three times then after that we'll just have to know i think i'll wait till a really good one to call it out i think that's really smart um okay so you're you're not picking a religion you're not gonna go there okay but you are one of the you do you believe in god yes i believe in god yeah and what do you think is our like as a person who believes in god what is what does that entail like what is your responsibility to other i think you're one of the most generous people i know you've always been even when i, you've always been very, like, you would give the shirt off your back to a total stranger. And I definitely learned that from you. I'm a bit more of a businessman myself.

But what do you think your responsibility is to other people? Or how does your faith inform your life? I think it's pretty simple. I mean, I try very hard to treat people the way that I would want to be treated. And I try not to judge people. When I was younger, I probably definitely did at this, you know, at this age. And the things I've been through in my life, I just try not to, I try not to judge people I try to listen and um just be there and that's it yeah well we had a pretty progressive household I feel like I mean not you were never really talking about politics around me or voting you're not a very you're not

a political person I'm not um and you and I have had big conversations about politics but it's always guided by me because I'm a very political person. But I think we had a very progressive household in that, like, I always knew that you would be okay with me being gay. You had gay friends and you, I mean, like in like nursing school and stuff, I didn't know them very well, but you, I knew that you knew and liked gay people. And we grew up in an area of the country that can be very conservative. And, uh, there's a lot of things that come with that not all conservative people are homophobic or racist or uh sexist or any of those things but

none of those things were happening in our house and i wonder what you think about you live in kansas city still i do in in missouri and i wonder what you think about christians who use their faith for being hateful. Because we've talked about this a little bit in the past couple years. What would you say to Christians who are using Christianity to be exclusionary or mean? Well, I think they're hypocrites, for one. I don't think they're actually a Christian if that's the way that they treat people. I think a Christian has a lot to do with how you treat people, you know, and how you handle certain circumstances. And I don't think – I think how you – what you portray yourself to be and how you treat people is what being a Christian

is about. So if you are out saying you're a Christian and using that for, for things other than, you know, being a good person, then you're not really a Christian. So like people who are being transphobic and calling themselves Christians, you would say you're not really a Christian. That's my thoughts. Yeah. That's what I believe.

Yes. I think, I think that if you're truly a Christian, you love everybody. You don't's my thoughts. Yeah. That's what I believe. Yes. I think, I think that if you're truly a Christian, you love everybody. You don't get to judge. Yeah. What does it bother you that I'm not Christian? Um, it probably bothered me a little bit when you were younger. I don't think we've ever talked about, well, we've talked about versions of this. I think when you told me that you questioned whether you were an atheist or that bothered me. The idea that I might be an atheist bothered you. Yes, that bothered me.

But as far as your religion or what you choose to follow, I've never influenced you. It's kind of your thing. Yeah. I'll accept influenced you. You know, it's kind of your thing. Yeah. I'll accept you regardless. You would accept me no matter what? I would. Interesting. Maybe I'll start experimenting.

Get crazy with it. Why would it bother you if I was an atheist? Would it still bother you? I don't know. It just seems like such a harsh word i guess the word atheist seems harsh or the reality of living as an atheist maybe both yeah so what i mean it can't just be the sound of the word right is there something ideological that bothers you about it it just seems so closed-minded like To be an atheist? Yeah.

I would accept that argument. I hear that. Yeah. What do you mean by that? So I think if you're an atheist or claim to be an atheist, I think you've just closed your mind off to any beliefs about not even, well, Christianity, but you know just i don't know it's just that's just uh that's a very hard word for me yeah because you've closed yourself off to everything i guess yeah so you think it would be do you think it would be fair to call people who are certain that christianity is the one true religion closed

minded yes okay i'll take i think that's perfectly fine yeah i think it goes both ways i think Are certain that Christianity is the one true religion? Close minded? Yes. Okay. I'll take it. I think that's perfectly fine. Yeah, I think it goes both ways. I think once you have that mindset that this is what you believe in, and that's, I mean, I guess that's fine, as long as you're not pushing it on other people. Yeah. And you're not being judgmental of others.

I was having people over to the house in high school from youth group and showing them like anti-Christianity documentaries. Do you remember this? No, Caleb. I would have probably shut that down. When I started questioning my faith in high school, I was having over the kids from youth group and being like, you guys need to

come watch Religious with Bill Maher. And I was really trying to convert people out of Christianity pretty actively back then. I don't feel that way now, but that was an era that I had. In my defense, I was working. Yeah. I'm sure I was at work. Yeah, baby girl.

You were at work. Wait, when the cat's away, the mice will play. When mom's at work, you got to convert the neighborhood kids to atheism real quick. RQ, RQ. Do you believe in hell? What do youQ. Do you believe in hell? What do you think? Do I believe in hell? You said something devastating to me recently about this. I sometimes feel like

the world we live in is hell. Yeah, so We were at lunch recently and you said something so harrowing to me. I was asking you, this is a couple weeks ago in Kansas City, maybe a couple months ago at this point, but I was like, do you what do you think about hell? Because I don't think we had talked about it in a little bit. And you are a very open-minded person. I will say the reason that we're able to be so close is because I think we both hear each other out and can always hear criticism and new,

like we definitely talk about all of our stuff. I've talked about times that I feel like you did things in my childhood that really stuck with me in a negative way. Or that you and dad have done. And you obviously are comfortable bringing up the TV situation. I think the word you used that your dad and I had completely corrupted you. I think was the word that you used. You, not corrupted. What was the word I used?

You guys. Damaged. I think I said you guys fucked me up. It was along those, along those. You might have said that. Yeah, you guys definitely fucked me up. I heard corrupted. Yeah, I think corrupted almost gives it a governmental feel,

and fucked me up is more personal, which is the truth. You guys really fucked me up. I mean, romantically, my God. We did. You don't stand a chance. No, I'm cooked. I mean, you guys from different angles and different ways, you really covered every ground,

and I'm not going to have a healthy romantic relationship, probably. I'm 50, and I'm still trying to get it right. Girl, I know. I'm right here with you. I'm in it. I'm in the fucking trenches with you. But yeah, you and dad definitely fucked me up on a number of things. But I love that we can talk about it, and I don't take it personally.

No, because also, I think it's said said with love and it's also received with love. It's like you were a child raising children. If I had kids when I was 20, I shudder to think of the ways that I would fuck them up. That's insane. Well, probably no worse than I fucked you up. You'd have been all right. Maybe. I don't know.

I did have one pregnancy scare in high school. You did? I did. Did I never tell you this no remember remember when you found condoms in my car i do it didn't how did that make you feel that you were having safe sex girl don't put on for the cameras i am you were real weird about it you i was like 17 and you found condoms in my car and you came in the house and you were like, why are there condoms in your car? And I was like,

oh, we use them for a prank. And I probably went along with it because I did not want to have the conversation. Well, you came in like a bull in a china shop. You were real weird about it. Are you really going to posture like this for the cameras or do you actually remember it as you being cool?

I think it was cool. No! You cannot! You cannot possibly think that. You were real weird about it, but whatever. I was having sex with a girl at that point in high school, and we did have one pregnancy scare, and it did ruin my life for three days. I'm glad you could move past it. Three days.

Three days was hard. Three days is a lot when you're in high school and you think you're about to be a father. Did your friends know? I told Abby Brinkley. You said to me at lunch the other day. I don't know if you remember it. But I had said, what do you think of hell, yes or no? Because I'm a firm no hell person.

I'm a maybe on God. I'm a maybe on, you know, could be. I think if there's anything, hell is just the difficult part because I go, if you're going to be a true by the book Christian, you would have to believe that like all Sikh or Muslim or Jewish people are going to hell just by nature of being born where they were born and brought up in their religion. And so hell immediately was out for me very quickly. And I'm still very, hell cannot be real. And if hell is real, I just have to be happy going there because it doesn't make any sense. But I was talking to you about this. And you said, we were at lunch in the middle of the day on a beautiful day.

And you decided to say to me, you know, some people think hell is this earth that we're living in. And I said, do you think hell is the life that we're living in? And you took kind of a slow bite of your salad. And then you went, sometimes. And I was like, I must have been having a bad time. I was like,

Jesus, bitch, that is oof. And so I guess now we're getting to the bottom of it. You do sometimes feel like this life is hell. Well, haven't you ever been in situations where you feel like? I think it's a little dramatic, but I'm open to the bottom of it you do sometimes feel like this life is hell well haven't you ever been in situations where you feel like i think it's a little dramatic but i'm open to the idea i think do you i mean are you do you genuinely have like an ideological i'm not saying yes life can be hellish but is there really a part of your brain that goes and this is totally fine but is there genuinely a part of your belief system that goes

we might be living in hell during our time on earth? This might be a punishment. Well, I don't think there's some hot boiling area under earth that's hell. Yeah. I'm just saying that if there is a hell, I feel like sometimes this is it. Yeah. So you're big on heaven. You like heaven.

Well, I haven't been there. I know, girl. So you're big on it, but you believe in heaven. I do. And do you believe in hell? I believe in heaven more than hell. Yeah, that's nice. And I don't know.

Well, I don't know about heaven either. Sometimes I feel like people are just reincarnated and they just stay here. Okay, Eastern religion queen. Come on. I love that. I'm just saying. That's nice. I like that queen. Come on. I love that. I'm just saying. That's nice. I like that idea.

We've never talked about that. Do you like that better than my answer at lunch? No, I like all of it. I have no agenda. You and I talk about all this stuff off camera enough that I don't feel like I, I don't really have an agenda with the questions. I'm just trying to get an understanding. You know, I'm a good interviewer,

so I want to get down to the subject, what you're really dealing with here. Okay. Okay. But I like that idea. Would you like to be reincarnated? I feel that I probably have. You think you've been here before?

Like you probably have. Yeah, I think. How many times do you think you've been here? I feel tired. I think I've been reincarnated a lot. Again, that's a pretty heartbreaking thing to say if you really get it down to its core. But I think that's beautiful, and it's something that only moms really have the ability to do.

Do you know that about yourself? That, like, you have... Being a mom is obviously an incurable sort of brain disease where you think about me constantly, and you're very desperate. I don't have that disease. You do. Callie.

I have the text messages to prove otherwise. You think about me all the time. Well, you're a part of me. See, but that's a crazy thing to say to someone. I'm a part of you. You are a part of me. And I like that you feel that way. You're a great mom, but I do. Do you know that cells actually cross back and forth from a child to a mother when they're in the womb? Yeah, but that happened so long ago for us.

They say that the cells stay in there, that even after you have have the child you still have some of their cells inside of you and i think that's why moms are so good to their children and their children break their hearts because they don't have any cells from the mom in them so you think that there's cells from me and you but not you and me yeah and you think that's why you can't stop texting me my cells make me do it yes yeah you're looking for a sort of biological approach to why you're needy towards me and that's what you've landed on I think it's pretty genius I I think you're very smart I think you're I think even the way that you've navigated this conversation you should run for office of some sort. I've asked you some pretty straight-on questions, and you found a way around it.

I think it took a full three minutes for me to get an answer about hell out of you. Well, I had to take a drink. Yeah. And I had to think before I said. Wait, okay, we talked about dad earlier. What did you think of that guy? Your dad? Yeah.

What did you think of that guy, that character? He's dead, so you have to be a little nice i chased your dad hard you what i chased him you chased him i don't think i've ever seen you make that motion or say that thing he wasn't he wasn't like he was before you were born what was that like when you were chasing him, quote unquote? He was funny. He was good looking. He had long, silky hair. He was, he'd always run his fingers through it. He was cute. Be 100% honest.

Are you horny right now? Thinking about your dad? No. No, that era's past. That ship has sailed? Yeah. Okay, so he had good hair and he ran his fingers through it and it was funny dad is always that was always funny you got your sense of humor from both of us

i i got very lucky you're both very funny genuinely two of the funniest people i know dad was very funny it was just more of a dry sense of humor that was a little mean i prefer dry but yeah that's a little that was a little harsh and intense and i think i definitely see that in myself like i can be harsh and intense and i try to fight against it but i think i have part of of that from him within me but you're a much softer person i think you're a much you're a much softer goofier kind of funny but both are very valid types of funny but that was a very funny person. Yeah, he was. And that attracted you to him.

Yeah. And you chased him. What did chasing dad look like? Like, what do you mean by that? You were, like, calling him on the rotary phone? No, we worked together. You worked together? Mm-hmm.

Where? At Stanberry's. Stanberry's, which is a good... We made band uniforms. Yeah, it was like a uniform manufacturing company. Now, was this a summer job or a full-time out-of-high-school job? When were you guys working together? It was a full-time job.

Well, it would have been when I was 19. So you had had Colton already. So you're chasing this guy down with a one-year-old baby at home. I didn't take the baby with me. Queen, absolutely. She said leave the baby at one-year-old baby at home. I didn't take the baby with me. Queen. Absolutely. She said leave the baby at home. I left the baby at home.

I'm down at the factory hunting dick. That's exactly what I needed was another one. Well, you found it. Okay, so you chased dad at work and you're what? You're just being like, hey, Brian, or something like that. What are your moves? Well, I don't know. I mean, i don't know like i would just talk to him okay so you're flirting with that at work i did flirt with your dad yes inappropriate and then what happens does he eventually ask you out i don't think we ever really went on a date.

Mom! We hung out, but I'm going to be honest. I don't think he ever took me out on a real date. What a scumbag. And you allowed this? So you're just hooking up immediately? Not immediately. Give it up, sister. I love that.

Me and you, we're not so different. Me and you, hey, apple in the tree. Yeah, didn't fall far. Not immediately. Give it up, sister. I love that. Me and you, we're not so different. Me and you, hey, apple in the tree. Yeah, didn't fall far. Not falling far. So you and dad are just hooking up. How long are you hooking up before you get pregnant with me? About two weeks. That's what I thought.

It was really quick. It was really quick. And then he had no desire to hook up anymore. As if he didn't realize the damage was already done. Now, to hear dad tell it, by the way, dad told me a version of this where he just thought you were, he thought you were the best thing since sliced bread. Yeah.

He thought you were the coolest thing walking on two feet. He just thought you were the bee's knees. And he was like, oh, your mother was so beautiful. This is what dad told me. He told me your mother was so beautiful. This is what dad told me. He told me your mother was so beautiful. Your dad worshipped me. I mean, I don't mean that in an arrogant way, but he was never mean to me.

He always told me what a great mom I was. Always told me how lucky he was to have a child with someone who was such a great mom because he wasn't always there when he needed to be. Yeah, I think... Go ahead very he was very open about that and your dad and i were friends until the end like i don't think we ever said anything mean to each other but he did when he found out i was pregnant leave me and go back to his ex sure so so okay so well that was very a very beautiful tribute to dad that you just did but he dad yeah dad would be like your mom was just the the best thing and i was so into her

and then we hooked up barely and she got pregnant with you so you got pregnant with me and then to hear him tell it he wanted to like get married and raise me together when you were about a year old he wanted to get back together. Right. So what happened? You got pregnant. You told him, obviously. Yeah, I went out to his girlfriend's house and told him.

So he was already back with the girlfriend. And you went to his girlfriend's house. Yeah, because we had friends in common and they talked me into it. And so... Your friends were like, you need to go out there, Queenie. It seemed like a brilliant idea at the time. Yeah. So the girls hyped you up. Yeah. The girls were like, you need to go out there. Brilliant idea at the time.

Yeah. And then, so they, the girls hyped you up. Yeah. The girls were like, get out there. And their,

and their boyfriends. Oh, so the boyfriends were friends of his. Cause I didn't like the girlfriend. Do I know any of these people? I don't think so. So you go out to dad's house or dad's girlfriend's house and you say, Brian,

get out here. And then you tell him, what do you say to him? That I'm pregnant. You just go, I'm pregnant. Well, I don get out here. And then you tell him, what do you say to him? That I'm pregnant. You just go, I'm pregnant. Well, I don't remember exactly. It's a big moment. You're not remembering this?

This is foundational to my lore. No, the fact that your dad said we barely hooked up is the foundation. I mean, we hooked up enough, obviously. Clearly, yeah. I get that you guys were fucking. I'm really getting that. I mean, the fact that he never took you on a date is nuts.

But you go out there, you say, I'm pregnant. And are you crying? Are you upset? Yeah, I was crying. He was back with his girlfriend. And so what did he say? I'm back with my girlfriend. Get the H out of here?

Pretty much. Really? Yeah. Scumbag behavior. I mean, not to speak ill of the dead, but that's nuts. Well, he was young. Yeah, but you're with a... So did he even try

to convince you to get an abortion even? That's one gentleman way to handle it. He doesn't pitch abortion at all. And do you think about abortion at all? No.

Really? Neither pregnancy? No. Why not? I mean, thank you. You're welcome. But I think especially with Colton, it would have been kind of a slick move. With Colton, I probably thought about it because, not so much because I was young, but because I was so sick.

Like, the whole first trimester. So I did probably think about it with him. With you, I never even thought about it because really I thought your dad and I might get together. But then by the time I had you and he was in complete denial that you were his and like. Oh, so dad was like, that's not my kid. I remember this. So actually your grandma saw you and she's like, that is my grandchild. You need to go get a paternity test. So hold on.

So there's, there's many things happening right now. You don't, you considered an abortion with my older brother, but not one with me. I know that's fucking right. And yeah, sometimes you just know what you got. Sometimes you just know what you got. Favorite child confirmed. And so, no, I mean, that's just the facts. We look at all the facts. You thought about just know what you got. Favorite child confirmed. And so, no, I mean, that's just the facts.

We look at all the facts. You thought about getting rid of Colton. You always wanted me. And so then you have, so you told dad, so you wanted to be with dad. At that time, yeah. You were like, I'm pregnant with your kid. We should be together. You can raise this other one while you're at it.

And he was like, sorry, baby girl. It's me and old girl time. Yeah, and old girl's literally, she was like five years older than him. Ick. So you're getting left barefoot and pregnant because he's off chasing some old bitch. And then you have me, and you're thinking, God, it would be nice to be with Brian. We could raise this kid together.

You have me, and the whole time he's going, that's not my kid. Yeah, by the time I had you, I was way past any envisionment of wanting to be with your dad. You were like, fuck this guy. Sisters are doing it for themselves. So then we're in our independence era.

And then Grandma Lillian, Dad's mom, she sees me. Because what, you take me over there or something? You're like, look at this baby. She worked at the courthouse. I was at the courthouse for something and I wasn't in trouble for anything. To be clear. You saw me gearing up for that. Okay, so you're at the courthouse for something and I wasn't in trouble. To be clear.

You saw me gearing up for that. Okay. So you're at the courthouse for something. All these good citizens that have to go to the courthouse constantly. And you take me in there and grandma says, uh-oh, I know that face. It belongs to my kid. And so then she tells you to go get a paternity test.

And do you? Yes. For what reason? I think at that time more so I just wanted to prove to him that, because I hadn't been with anybody else, so I knew. But at that point I think I just wanted to rub it in his face that, like I didn't expect him to step up. Yeah.

Oh, you gave me your last name. Yeah, I did. You didn't, did you even put him on my birth certificate? He is on your birth certificate, yeah. Yeah, but you gave me your name. I did. You didn't, you didn't, did you even put him on my birth certificate? He is on your birth certificate, yeah. Yeah, but you gave me your name. I did. I think that bothered him. Eventually, later on in life.

Isn't that kind of funny that that bothered him when he made his choice? Well, probably because you were the last Buckman. Yeah. You would have been. Yeah. The last Buckman had I named you that. Yeah, but it's kind of a you make your bed, you lay it. But I feel like he deserved it.

No, I mean, he fully, he was your bed, you lay it. But I don't feel like he deserved it. No, I mean, he was off with the Crypt Keeper. Pam. Her name was Pam. He's off with old bitch Pam, and you're saddled with his spawn. That's crazy. Yeah. So you have me. You get the paternity test, and then what happens?

You send him the test, and you go, got you, bitch. I'm not so sure. I didn't talk to your grandma before I talked to him. Yeah makes sense grandma's cool we fuck with grandma yeah we like grandma little's a pretty good one grandma's always been a chiller and and grandma's other kids ash my aunt ashley my uncle travis they're chillers they are they're all-time chillers we like them we do love them we do love them so i'm very close to your dad's family. You're very tight with them. I think there's at least a part of you that acknowledges that none of this is normal, right?

Like, we don't have a normal family. What's not normal about it? Well, Pam, I think the Pam element is one thing. I think you being close with Grandma, hanging out with her at the courthouse, her saying, get a paternity test. Dad, where's that at this point in like New Orleans, Texas wasn't he off like building a hotel or something no he lived down the road from me with Pam

okay and that's a true story this of course probably a mile from us I don't want we are not white trash but the story has why are you guys laughing like But the story has white... Why are you guys laughing like that?

The story has white trash elements. He says we're not white trash and everyone in the room just laughs. Well, you couldn't do the show until they delivered Miller Lite to you. I mean, there is a certain... There's a white trash motif that runs through our family. I'm cool with it. I'm cool with it too, dude. I'm thankful for it. You know. I'm not anything that... I mean, I'm not going to portray to be something that I'm cool with it. I'm cool with it too, dude. I'm thankful for it.

I'm not anything that, I mean, I'm not going to portray to be something that I'm not. I'm just... You and I have talked about this. I think growing up, my biggest regrets about my life were that I was fat, gay, and from Missouri.

I was like, oh, I just, hey, I wanted to be one of the cool people on TV who lives somewhere interesting. And I wanted to be thin and straight. I thought that would just be awesome. It looked like everyone was having a lot of fun with it. And then now I'm so grateful. I'm so grateful to be fat, gay, and from Missouri.

These are the best things that ever happened to me, probably. Well, you need something to talk about. Yeah, they inform my perspective, yeah. So I'm really on board with our... But there is, in the landscape of our family, there's a white trash river that runs deep through the the situation there i think we can admit that yeah but once you embrace it then you can for sure baby i'm in it

yeah it's me and you sister i'm all right with white trash i guess i think it's nice little redneck yacht club vibe i like redneck so much better than white trash you like redneck better than white trash yes if we could go with that why is that because I do feel redneck but I don't feel white trash I'm happy to call you that if you like that's a very I don't identify with either I've transcended

but whatever you think no do you remember when we lived in that trailer in on the highway and you had that lesbian girl up the road drive me to school every morning? Yeah. Do you know, she was not normal. She was a nice enough girl. I didn't have to worry about you touching me or anything.

She drove me to school every morning in a King Ranch. And she was a strange girl. And you really made me go to school with her every day. You were not setting me up for success in that moment. And yet you still succeeded. Maybe I was. You have a super villain way about you sometimes. Like just now when you said, and yet you succeeded,

it was really giving like reality TV queen. Like it was, you have a very, I think you're very compelling. Do you find yourself to be a compelling person? If I have a true belief about something, I do.

Even that was like a crazy way to respond to that question. Even that was like a crazy, that was a crazy way to respond to that question. I said, do you think you're compelling? And you said, when the time calls for it. That's nuts.

Do you think people are compelled to you? Compelled by you? I think sometimes people are drawn to me. Because, I think because I'm a good person. And because, I don't know, people do like hanging out with me for some reason. Well, I think you I'm a good person. Like I think and because I don't know. People do like hanging out with me for some reason. Well I think you're a blast. I think you're a lot of fun. So people are drawn to me

in a sense and maybe that's why. Maybe it is because I'm fun. What's your favorite thing about yourself? Then you can say a lot if you want. Probably are you looking for physical or I don't know why I would be, no. If you want to say a physical attribute,

I think that would be beautiful. No, I think probably the best thing about me is probably my heart. I am very caring and I am sincere about it. Is that your favorite thing about yourself? Your heart, your love for people? Yeah. Yeah?

What's your least favorite thing about yourself? You do not have to answer that. All right, I'll pass. I've got more questions for you. The dad conversation was very illuminating for me. I didn't realize that you were chasing him and I also didn't realize that you were just taking him straight to pound town.

I thought, I guess I imagined somewhere, I thought maybe you guys would go. Well, only partially, obviously. Yeah. also didn't realize that you were just taking him straight to pound town i thought i guess i imagined somewhere i thought maybe you guys felt only partially obviously yeah okay so i guess i had a rosier vision of it i thought i knew you guys weren't like married or anything but i thought maybe he took you to a sock hop or took you to a drive-in film and then you guys went neck in we weren't wearing socks, Caleb. Okay. Mom, it's too comfortable. Okay. Okay.

Here's something fun. Who's your favorite musician or band or, you know? Elton John. Really? I love Elton John. That's way gayer than I expected. He's my one person that if I could go see him, that's who I would go see. We can make that happen. Does he still tour? I can make that happen. Does he still tour?

I can make it happen. Does he still tour? I'll get a hold of him. Elton, ring me, brother. We do have friends in common, actually. I love Elton John. I'll make something happen. Is that your dream?

You want to see Elton perform? I do. Okay, I'm on it. I thought you were going to say Kenny Chesney or something. I've seen Kenny. That was a little hateful. I loved it. Like four or five times.

Kenny's old news. He is old news. You want to see Elton? I want to see Elton. You used to listen. I remember when I was a kid, I have very vivid memories of you getting ready to go do something and just blaring Air Supply. Oh, Air Supply.

I figured you were going to say Dixie. The Chicks. Yeah. The Chicks you were all about. I mean, I got a lot of my music taste from you. Savage Garden.icks, yeah. The Chicks you were all about. I mean, I got a lot of my music tastes from you. Savage Garden. Oh, yeah. Aaron Neville.

We had a lot of... I played a lot of different things for you guys. Remember Jenra and Luther Vantross. You did play a lot of soul music and a lot of R&B, which I didn't realize was abnormal until I got older. Yeah, I don't think anybody else in our group really listened to that. Nobody in our town. They just pretty much listened to country.

It was all country. Or whatever was the vibe at that time. You showed us a lot of different music and you also played us a lot of different types of movies. You played a lot of different types of movies. Like there was all kinds of stuff. Definitely some stuff I shouldn't have been watching as a kid, for sure. You were letting me watch Law & Order pretty young. So, we're going to talk about my parenting skills again.

Yeah. You and I used to actually spend, like, all day Saturday and Sunday binge-watching Law & Order. Right. And I think you can recognize that's a strange move for a kid. Again, I think it's okay. Yeah, okay. Who are your favorite actors?

Favorite actors? Really like Morgan Freeman. He's really, really good. Actress, I think it's always been Julia Roberts. Don't I know it? You do know it. You love Julia Roberts. I do, and I still do. You would's always been Julia Roberts. Don't I know it? You love Julia Roberts. I do and I still do.

You would do anything for Julia Roberts. I would. The way you talk about Julia Roberts I've never seen you light up so much. You love this woman. She's beautiful. You're a little bit of a lesbian. There is a part of you that's a little lesbian I think.

I think it's okay to think that women are beautiful without. Totally. And you're not going to get away with that because that's not what's happening. I think you love Julia Roberts and even Taylor Swift recently. We had a conversation where you were talking about Taylor Swift and I felt like I can see lesbian in you. Would you ever even consider it? You're never going to try lesbianism?

I don't think so. You don't have any fear about leaving this planet without trying pussy? Excuse my French. But it is what they're doing. I mean, there's a lot of things that I think about leaving this planet and not doing, but pussy is not one of them.

I just think you're missing. I think variety is the spice of life. You've never hooked up with a girl once. Do you, pussy? I have. I've talked about it a lot on this podcast. Guess what? You won't be surprised to hear it was not for me.

I don't think it would be for me either. I tried it, though. I think you got to try. You've never hooked up with a girl once. Never. A little drunk. Oh, this pillow fight's getting so... You guys never once?

You have a lot of girlfriends. No. There's not even like a make-out sesh with the girlinas? No. That's crazy. You don't feel like, oh, man, life is so short. I got to try a little bit. You don't want to have some weird...

That's crazy, girl. I just mean you were built different i guess we sure were i don't know you raised a pretty progressive kid but i i tried pussy a couple times i know you had a scare for three days i had a scare for three days are you are you fixating on that do you want to talk more about it? No, I've came to accept that it was just a scare and it might have been my one chance to have your spawn. Yeah, I knew it.

I fucking knew it. I fucking knew it, dude. I literally knew that the reason you were hanging on to it is because you partially wish it would have happened. You fucking wish

I was a teenage dad. No, I wasn't ready to be a grandma back then. You literally wish I was a teenage dad. That's crazy. I mean, I would have rocked it, but I wasn't ready to be a grandma back then. You literally wish I was a teenage dad. That's crazy. I mean, I would have rocked it, but I wasn't ready. God, that is so crazy, dude.

That's nuts. I knew it when I said it. I was like, she kind of wishes it would have happened. I'm going to have kids. You need to talk to these gay men. Look into the camera. Tell the gay men, I'm ready. Tell them that you want them to start acting right.

I need to talk to you because I think you're the one that's being so picky. Yo. That's crazy. I've heard from your friends that you, that they love them, but you...

My friends are mentally ill drug addicts. You can't be listening to these fucking people. They don't even pay taxes. They're not good citizens. You realize I hang out with some very scummy,

seedy type of people. Don't listen to them when they talk to you about me. That's even worse than white trash. What do you think? You really think I'm the problem in my love life? Well,

you're probably part of the problem. That's nuts. That's not the way a mom should talk to her kid. We've never talked to each other. Parent and child should. What do you think i'm doing wrong a guy just broke things off with me you know this i talked to you about it i know and he was really cool and i was really in it and i was participating i was asking good questions i was planning to eat you know i got the ick i get the ick at a rate that is like

i get the ick so quick and so many times with every person i've gotten the ick at a rate that is like, I get the ick so quick and so many times with every person. I've gotten the ick from you several times during this conversation. Now, luckily, we have a different dynamic, so it's like you're here to stay. But dating is hard for me as someone who really is critical. But I really stuck with it, and he broke things off with me. So how am I the problem? So do you feel that if he had submitted and been under your thumb do you think you wouldn't have kicked him to the curb already what are you doing what do you think of me you know what i'm because

you are just like me the challenge is so much fun but once the challenge is over girl be on your way girl Girl. Just saying. Girl. I mean, you're right. I do enjoy the chase. I know I'm right. I enjoy the chase. You enjoy the chase. I do.

We've always been, this is something that's true about me. You certainly, this is one of the ways, Myriad, that you fucked me up. I think I definitely got the chase. I'll own that. And you'll have to because I'm giving it to you. But I think that's one of the ways you fucked me up for sure. But I'm working on that. I've been working on that. And I didn't do that with this guy. When he felt like up for sure. But I'm working on that. I've been working on that. And I didn't do that with this guy.

When he felt like he was into me, I thought it was hot. And under my thumb, I mean, you make me sound like Hannibal Lecter. I didn't say your tongue. I said your thumb. Thumb. But you make it sound like I need someone who's – I like to have control in my life. But I don't need someone to submit to me.

The word submit was really weird. Submit might not have been the right word. What do you think is, what do you think, genuinely, I'm open to solutions. I don't want to be single. I know you don't want to be single. I'm working on it all the time. What do you think it's going to take for me to find a man? A good man.

Caleb, I can't even find one for myself. I don't know how you want me to find one for you. Yeah, but don't you understand? Your dating pool was like... Don't you dare. No, this isn't about you. Your dating pool was like, what, guys in their 40s, 50s, and... Would you go 60s?

Yeah. Okay. Well, I'm going to be 51 next month. I know, but, ick, 60s? So, okay, no worries. Your dating pool was like guys in their 40s to 60s? Yeah. Okay. Well, I'm going to be 51 next month. I know, but ick, 60s? So, okay, no worries. Your dating pool is like guys in their 40s to 60s. 70s? No.

Okay. I'd have to go in line there. So guys in their 40s to 50s and 60s in Missouri and Kansas, and they're straight guys. Your dating pool is not very impressive. You don't have a lot to pick from. These guys are weird. Thank you, because I thought I was the problem. No, I'm telling you you're not the problem.

That's why I want you to say the same thing to me. You're not the problem. That was not... That was not authentic. That was very reality TV diva of you. No, that was sincere. The way you're raising your eyebrows. You're many things, but a good actor is not. Okay, so when you pretended to be hurt right there, that was actually, that was the one time you put on a good performance, and now I'm going to look crazy to the camera.

I don't think I'm the problem. I think these guys, these gay guys, these f**ks. No. You want to say f****** on mic? No. Okay. We could take it out. I don't want to say it.

No worries. These gay guys are not acting right. I'm taking them on great, beautiful dates. I'm flying people out. I fly people. Can you believe that? Well, now I'm a little pissed off. What? Yeah, because I talk about little pissed off. What?

Yeah, because I talk about my special moment being that you flew me out here for Mother's Day. And I'm no different than a piece of meat that you bring home. So now I'm a little pissed. You're jealous of guys that I've flown out? I'm not jealous. But you don't want to be in the category with them? No. You're jealous of guys that I've flown out? I'm not jealous. But you don't want to be in the category with them? No.

You don't want to be in the category of some hot piece of ass? No. They didn't give labor and have labor and give birth to you. You only gave labor for four hours. Those four hours I'll never get back. Okay. Well, I'm not flying out hookups. I don't fly people out for hookups. I've only flown guys anywhere that I thought had a genuine romantic possibility.

I'm not flying people out for hookups. That's crazy. Grindr exists. And yet here we are. So stop flying people out. What? And yet here we are. That was hurtful.

I'm just saying that you're not, maybe you're not going after the right ones. I mean, I started making a list yesterday of all the guys I've dated. I know you did and i want to send them a survey and say what did you think like what has happened that i'm single right now we're looking at a guy who we're looking at me a guy who has beautiful lips perfect little dimples a nice head of hair 29 successful in his career millions and millions of podcast fans right treats his mom really really really well tons of beautiful friendships owns a home i mean look at this guy and you go that's a catch sweet funny and i think anyone would look at me and go how the heck is he single

and so how could i be the problem well now that you've laid it all out like that caleb you're not And I think anyone would look at me and go, how the heck is he single? And so how could I be the problem? Well, now that you've laid it all out like that, Caleb, you're not the problem. I'm going to move on. Because you're not being authentic and sincere. I do want you to find somebody. And I do want you to get married. Because I want grandkids. Dude, I literally know it's the only thing you talk to me about sometimes.

And I want to give you grandkids. I want that for you. I think it would be, I want to give you grandkids and I want to get them a cell phone immediately so you can start texting them. I want to move you from my texts to their texts. I want to transfer your energy to them. I want you to have more people to love. Don't play hurt right now. Wasn't a hurt look.

What was the look? That's fair. No, that's not the look you were giving. You give as good as you get. I joke about the text messages, isn't it? Did it upset you? No, it didn't upset me. Okay.

I just bet you didn't talk to those guys that way that you flew out here. No, Mom. I didn't say things like that to them. That's crazy. They don't text me. If these guys were interested in me the way that you're interested in me, I'd already have kids. If they text me as much as you do, actually, that would give me the ick.

I was going to say, isn't that a little weird? What? To say if they were interested in you the ick. I was going to say, isn't that a little weird? What? To say if they were interested in you the same way that I'm interested in you. Well, I think if you decide

to put a filthy kind of perverted angle on it. But the truth of the matter is if a lot of these guys would text me the amount that you text me, I would get the ick. But I think

at some point someone's going to have to love me the exact right way that I want them to. And I think they will. Your lips to god's ears sister what did what did you think i was gonna become like when i was a little kid what were you like this is what my kid is gonna be i really thought you might be a lawyer you've mentioned this yes you've said this before you do in well not maybe so much well no you still do. You like to debate.

So you're saying I was an argumentative little bitch? I wouldn't have called you a little bitch. But argumentative. I was arguing. What do you mean debate? What was I saying as a kid that was making you think... Well, I don't know that you just... Maybe debate wasn't the right word, but you were a question master.

Like, you had to know everything about everything. That's annoying. Yeah. You had to know everything about everything. That's annoying. Yeah. You never shut the fuck up. And cried. God, you love to say that I cried when you were gone. You cried until you were a year old. Unless I had you.

Nobody else could hold you. Nobody else could. I had a lot of big feelings. Look at the world we live in. You didn't know about it then. Some of us can just sense these sort of things. I think I sensed that the world was unfair. You do tell people that I was concerned with justice when I was a kid.

You were? This is something you say. You very much, even from kindergarten, even from a very early age, You very much, even from kindergarten, even from a very early age, you were very concerned if another child was made fun of or didn't have new shoes or didn't have. I mean, you were a very sensitive child. Things like that bothered you, sincerely bothered you. What happened?

I ask myself every day. Did it stress you out when I... Because I went to college and I got a degree. And I think when I went to college, the idea was that I would be a lawyer. That's what we were talking about. Is that I would be a lawyer and maybe work in politics, right? And then I went to college, got my degree, started doing comedy. And then I moved to Chicago to be a comedian.

Did that stress you out? A little. Yeah, that was worrisome. And then I moved to Chicago to be a comedian. Did that stress you out? A little. Yeah, that was worrisome. Yeah, it was worrisome that,

partly the reason I did not worry about that is because all I wanted you to do was go to college and get an education. Then whatever you chose to do, you had that degree to fall back on. Because I didn't go to college until I was 30 years old, 29, 28. And so I wanted you to have that. So if the comedy didn't work out, then you had something to fall back on.

I want you to be 100% honest right now. No jokes. Just tell the real truth. When I told you at like 21 years old that I was going to move to Chicago to be a comedian, did you think it would work out? I did. Be honest. I am being 100% honest. And that partly goes back to what we talked about earlier.

I don't think that there's anything that you ever put your mind to that you didn't succeed. Okay. Do you think I would have been a good lawyer? I think you would have been a good lawyer. Probably a better comedy. For some reason that hurt. comedy. For some reason that hurt. Okay.

For some reason that hurt to hear you say that. No, I like that. I'd rather be a comedian, I think. I think most is. Do you think I'd be a good nurse? No worries. No. I don't think nursing would be for you.

And you landed on no. Okay. That's obviously, yeah, a little bit hurtful. Okay, here's a question. In what ways do you think that we're alike? In ways do you think we're different me and you it's a mother-son episode in the ways that i think we're alike is i think we're both very driven i think we're both can be very funny you are funny i can be funny you are also funny. I think that we both are very caring, sensitive people that would do anything for the people that we love. Hold on.

You would describe me as sensitive? Yeah. Do you guys think I'm sensitive? Yeah. I don't think you let everybody see it, but I do. You definitely have a sensitive side. That's fascinating. Chance, do you think I'm sensitive?

Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Well, a lot of yeses in the room. That's interesting. But you were saying we're both sensitive. Then opposites. I would say you are, you bigger voice than I am what do you mean by that um just that I believe that if you are passionate about something that you shout it from the rooftops like you if you're passionate about you want other people to be passionate about it. I don't know that I have as much of that as you do. I think it's okay for me to be passionate about it. Yeah.

But I'm a convincer. I'm a persuader. Yes. And that is, I definitely see that in you. You go, your approach is like, this is how I feel, everyone do what you want. Right. And I'm like, everyone has to do it my way.

I want you to think about it how I think about it. Yes. Yeah. And I think the other difference is I think you have a little shorter fuse than I have like I think I think that I can go with the flow and go with the flow and go with the flow, and go with the flow, and it takes a lot to make me get mad. Yeah. But you, I think, maybe not so much. I think I have a short fuse, but I also have a short refractory period. I think I get over things quickly.

I think I get upset, and then I go, moving on. I agree with that. But you were not, you were not always like this. No. You, getting medicated changed you a lot. It did. It did. Are you comfortable talking about that?

Sure. Because in my teen years, we had some tough years where you were really like... Yeah, but you have to remember, too. In your teen years, I was getting no sleep. I was working at the bar sometimes until 2 o'clock in the morning, then going and writing papers for school then leaving to go to school at 630 in the morning and then doing it all over the next day and it was stressful we didn't have money I didn't know how I was gonna feed you guys did we have money that's why

the TV thing was so hurtful I couldn't afford that tv not the tv oh we were gonna drop that yeah so honestly though honestly though it was it was a it was a very hard time and yet i tried to not let you guys see that we didn't have money for food or we didn't have um you know like i know you guys wanted different clothes like other people had and stuff. And once I got my nursing degree, I can give that to you. But before that, I couldn't. And that was very stressful for me.

And just trying to go through nursing school and be a single parent and work all the time. And so I think I've justified me being a bitch a little bit. Anyone else feel like crying? I don't know. Kind of sad. Kind of a sad moment. I mean, obviously comedic timing,

you knew getting too saccharine and got to cut it with a joke. But I think, yeah, I think I also want to give you the credit. I asked earlier if you felt like you would be as caring as you are if you were socialized as a man. And I think when you were talking about the self love thing, I do love myself. I have a lot of self love and it's something you and I talk about. And I think when you were talking about the self-love thing, I do love myself. I have a lot of self-love.

And it's something you and I talk about a lot. And I love that. I love that about myself too. But I think also that's a privilege that I have because I don't think you weren't raised the same way that I was raised. You raised me to love myself. And you instilled a lot of confidence in me

because you talked very, my whole childhood, you talked very positively to me and really talked me up and made me feel good about myself. And so I think self-love is a natural conclusion of being raised that way. And also, you did a better job raising me than what your childhood provided to you. You had a turbulent childhood. Your mom was amazing, and I know that. But she passed away when you were pretty young.

And then your situation was different. And I think there's a lot of – and also being a man in this society and growing up in a different time too, you grew up as a woman in the 70s. I just don't think, I think you were socialized in a very difficult time in a very difficult way and I think it makes sense

that you're on a journey to loving yourself and feeling confident to make your own decisions for yourself and centering yourself. Do you think that's valid? Yeah, I think I'm probably, I think I'm probably in the best place emotionally than I've ever been. Like I, I always, and you know, you and I can talk about that. Uh, we, we do talk about it. You know,

I've always felt like I had to have a man in my life to feel loved or to feel secure, what, whatever the hell it was that I thought I needed one for. But this is the first time in my life that I don't feel like I need that, and really I have no desire. Like I'm living on my own for the first time in a long time. I'm enjoying my own space. I'm just, I think, just truly finding out what I like and who I am again. Yeah, that's beautiful. You're a strong, independent woman who doesn't desire men.

And we actually have a word for that. And it's... Lesbian! I'm just saying. Something to think about. You're discovering things. Maybe we discover a little bit of... There's a little bit of dick in the well.

Okay, now... In the well. Now, do you think hitting kids is good? Do you believe in hitting kids? You didn't really hit us. So it's interesting to say you think we should have been. No, I never really spanked you guys. I don't think it would have worked.

I think it's a weird logic when people hit their kids. Because what you're essentially imposing on the kid is cause and effect. You're saying, if you do that, I'm going to hit you. And if they're either they're not old enough to understand cause and effect, so that wouldn't work anyway. Or so the only thing you're implementing then is terror, which is a different thing. Or they are old enough to understand cause and effect and they can understand a different cause and effect, like taking away the PlayStation. So I was kind of going in that direction.

Like I think if you teach your children from a young age what the expectations are how they should behave then i don't think you have to whip them because by the time they're at an age where they need to be whipped it should kind of already be instilled into them what you expect from them yeah and i i want to be very clear to the listeners that when you say whipped you mean like spanked whooped whooped yeah we're it's just a Midwestern. It's like if you say wash rag, you mean washcloth. Yeah, one of those things. Or the washer.

Because whipped is a crazy word to be flinging around. Just so there's some different context. That's what they do in the stable. Yeah, with livestock, yeah. Yes. So it's not a great feeling. What was I going to ask you when you were talking about, oh, the PlayStation. Do you want to tell them what happened with the playstation we talked about this last night at dinner so i was practicing some tough love with caleb and his brother i don't even

remember what he did i was probably colton yeah i'm sure it was so i took the playstation away for a week and they went to school and had the school counselor called DFS to say that I was abusing. She took the PlayStation away and I went to school and I was like, hey, y'all, my mom is abusing me. And they called Division of Family Services and sent someone down to the school. Me and my brother got called out of class and put in a conference room. And I had some home visits.

Yeah, we had home visits after that they came by and they were like does your mom feed you and we would be like not all the time and you'd be like yes i do we we just don't go to mcdonald's like she was you were truly like you were fighting for your life yeah i think i almost got us taken away from you we literally they came pull us in a conference room and some like like therapists from the state came and was like if your mom hits you you can tell us and i i at that moment i did realize that i had fucked up i was i was like no she doesn't hit us please stop and they're like what does she do to abuse you and i tried to explain the playstation situation and they're like it has to be more than that and i was like no i'm really this dumb i really i really did and then we had home visits yeah yeah

well did you ever take the playstation away again no i know that's fucking right i know that's fucking right a king frankly i don't have the strength for this what's your favorite memory of us me and you sift through the millions there is sift look for a shining moment i really enjoyed our time when i would come to college and we would just go eat or hang out or and I think it was because you were becoming an adult and finding yourself and I really enjoyed spending time with you at that point not that I didn't enjoy spending time with you at your younger years but I mean that that was a time where I really enjoyed I guess just seeing you growing up and changing.

And I feel like you really changed once you came out to me. And you were like a different person. And it was very good for my heart to see you that way. I really enjoyed our time when you were in college. Really? Mm-hmm. So do you think it was just the – I mean, it was a big time. That was a weird time.

I think it was because it really, after we talked about that, and I felt like, I felt like you had opened up to me about something that you had been putting off for a long time. And I think that made me feel closer to you. And so I think that's probably, I mean, I think we've always been working on a friendship. But I think at that point, that's when our kind of adult friendship started. When I was in college. Yeah. I think also colleges were really when I self-actualized for the first time.

I think at college, I felt like I was around people who like I had these professors who loved like talking about big ideas. And they were assigning me books that I had never read before. And I was learning about things that I had never read before. And I was meeting people I had never – we're from – the town where we're from is very, very small. We're a Missouri town. Everyone, pretty much 100% of the population is like straight white Christian people. There's a couple people that are out of those categories, but for the most part, it's a very homogenous place.

And I think there was a sense in me that I wanted to be around different kinds of people. And college was the first time. In high school, I'd go to conferences and I would meet people from other places that were like different religions or races or things like that. But really, college was the first time that I got to be immersed with like different people and big ideas. And I felt very, college was very exciting for me. You excelled.

I felt great in college. I loved it. I think inside and out, you know, like. Yeah. Yeah. I thought I had so much fun in college. I think, yeah, I think everything clicked into place in those couple of years. And I think I feel lucky because there are people who that doesn't happen to ever.

And there are people that doesn't happen to until much later. And so I felt like college, I was really like, oh, I just felt, I just felt i was like this is so cool i felt really good i loved what i was studying i was learning all kinds of fun things i met some great friends i've met a lot of people that i'm still good friends with today i met chance which was obviously an outlier he's an enemy but you know i met some great friends and some great enemies and now we're here i like that time in our relationship my favorite memory of us. Not that you asked. You told me I wasn't allowed to ask questions. That is not true.

You said, this is my show. Don't worry about being funny. I'm the host. I'll ask the questions. That is not words that ever left my mouth. That's what I heard. You are such, well, that's an interesting thing to inspect then, isn't it? You are so devilish sometimes.

That was a crazy way, and I think you might have believed it when you said it. I never said don't ask questions. You said this is my show. I never said that to you. It's implied. My favorite memory with you, oh, goodness. Kel, what do I think? My favorite memory with you.

We have so many good ones. We really have had so much fun. I had a lot of fun with you and your friends in high school, too. You did, yeah. You've always been a lot of fun to be around. You're a blast. I love hanging out with you. I love that we're friends.

I feel very lucky for that. I'm excited for all the fun that we're going to have still. I think it's only going to get better. We'll get more free time, more money, go do fun stuff, hang out. I'm excited for all the fun that we're going to have still. I think it's only going to get better. We're getting more free time, more money, go do fun stuff, hang out. I'm excited for all the future stuff. My favorite memory of us probably if I had to pick one was, it was very formative. I think I'll remember it forever when you moved me from Chicago to LA in 2020. Oh, that was fun. And we drove out with Shelby and her mom and we had two separate cars, did the road trip and we

road tripped it all. And remember when the truck quit, the truck quit in the mountains of Colorado. It didn't really quit when the mechanic got out there. He said, that's just what it does on the mountains. And so we sat for two hours waiting for a mechanic. We had waited for hours after driving all day.

That was horrible to find out we could have pushed ahead for sure. And that was not a great part of it. I love that you kind of went negative when I was doing something beautiful and poetic, but that we, uh, we did the New York times questions, uh, question set for love. You remember that? I made you do that with me. And when most of that drive was me asking you all those questions. And I learned so much. I've learned a lot about you today as well, but I learned a lot about you on that drive that I didn't know things you wouldn't think to ask.

Like, I didn't think to ask you what was your saddest memory or, you know, who wants to talk about that? But because we did it on that drive, I learned things about you and our family and things that I didn't never know. And I love that memory. That was, that was a really fun time. That was a fun time.

And I was glad that you asked me to be a part of that. We should hang out more often. You're not so bad. We'll see. That's hurtful. Well, I'm working on self love right now. So that's not what that's

gonna be that's not what that is honey i'll push back on that any day of the week i'll hang out with you anytime mom i have a question for you and then i have a segment for you and then we're gonna wrap up this episode potentially two episodes we don't know yet you guys we'll figure it out in post um what is so true to you kelly heron oh what is so true to me well i think anybody that knows me knows that if you text me you're probably gonna get a response if you call me i may not answer the phone that's what's so true to you no one should be calling you yeah i like to text and and music music music is my music is my um well it's got me through some really fun times and some really dark times i love that you hedged you hedged your bets by throwing in music

at the end you're like just in case no one relates to the phone call let me just bring up the concept relate to the phone call everyone you think i want to be on your side thinking of it if i'm going down the road and there's a good song on that i like and someone's calling i will not answer them i will finish the song you and i definitely have a love for music that is shared yeah i will say texting you is infuriating you're an infuriating texter because you use voice to text like many people your age bracket and y'all have gotten out of control with it older folks have got i'm begging y'all and you're part of this give it up with the voice to text because you're not good at like you,

you will text. I'll text you and be like, Hey, what are you doing today? And you'll be like, Hey, sorry, I'm,

I'm, I'm busy. Can you, can you walk over here please? I need some help. Yeah, we need some help over here. Thank you.

Yeah. What was your question? Hold on. I'm going to send this and then try again. Caleb, that's called multitasking. Baby, you're supposed to be good at that.

When you do multitasking, you're supposed to be good at it. So don't multitasking, you're supposed to be good at it. So don't send that text. Or maybe when you're going to do voice to text, people are going to relate to this, and they're going to be on my side, I hate to tell you. The fans are really going to join me on this one. You've been the hero of the episode,

but they're going to come, because my fans are young, they're going to come to my side for this. Because old people in voice to text, it's like we've given you guys... I'm not old. Okay, that was actually really rude of me, and I'm willing to take that back. People your age in voice to text,'s like we've given you guys i'm not old okay that was actually really rude of me and i'm willing to take that back people your age and voice to text and older you're the younger bracket you're the you're the baby of the voice to text generation but everyone your age and older with

voice to text you people have gone nuts you're you're tired you're talking for minutes and minutes and minutes and you won't even go back and do an edit for me you're dictating a period and then sometimes it just sends the word period i know that's crazy i want to do better text with your fingers pick it up and text with the is that not an option not if i'm not if i'm driving or not if i'm busy. Like sometimes I am talking to the phone while I'm typing at work. Yeah. Yeah. So. So you're going to make this a working woman situation.

Yes. A lot of it is that when you message me, I don't want you to have to wait for a response. So I, regardless of what I'm doing. You are a snake, dude. I hope people in this episode are starting to get a sense of the kind of thing I deal doing. You are a snake, dude. I hope people in this episode are starting to get a sense of the kind of thing I deal with. I hope they love me. You just sit there and be like, what's happening is I don't want you to wait for a response.

Like that is a master manipulator at work. I know how busy you are. You're nuts. You are nuts. I would lock you away in a jail cell if I could. You should not be in the streets i love you to death well that's a good so true people should not be calling you and i guess just the concept of music is also beautiful i love that so true okay i have a segment for you and this is going to be really interesting i wonder how you'll fare i don't know what a segment is but sure um don. Don't worry about it. I am going to read you 15 statements.

Okay. They have an objective true or false answer. And you're going to answer as quickly as you can if you think the statement I've just said is true or false. Okay. And then I'm going to read you 15 of them. And if you get 10 or more correct, we're going to give you 50 US dollars. Okay. You can do a lot with $50.

Why did you look me up and down when you said that? Like I needed... What did you say? Help. I didn't look you up and down. I think you did. You're trying to create conflict because I nailed you on the moment

where you screamed at me in high school. All right. Let's do it. I'm ready. There are no natural lakes in Maryland. True. Okay. Let's be quicker.

But yes, that's true. A chicken once lived 18 months without a head. False. True. The Justice League is a team of Marvel superheroes. False. False. It's DC.

Kansas City has more fountains than any other US city. True. True. The FDA banned sliced bread for three months in 1943. True. True. Jason Aldean owns 50% of the Atlanta Zoo. False.

False. It rains diamonds on Jupiter. True. True. Landshark beer was created by Richard Branson. True. False. Jimmy Buffett.

On average, I would expect you to know that. On average, nurses walk four to five miles during a 12-hour shift. True. True. Landshark beer was created by Richard Branson. True. False. Jimmy Buffett. On average, I would expect you to know that. On average, nurses walk four to five miles during a 12-hour shift. True. True. The Master Chief is the main character of the Doom video games. False. False. It's Halo.

Wyoming has two escalators in the whole state. True. True. Reba McIntyre has never won a Grammy. True. False. She's got three. The owner of Segway was killed in a plane crash.

True. False on Segway. Humans don't need a colon to live. Need what? A colon to live. True. Toy Story was the first fully computer animated film. True. How many did she get? Eleven! Eleven! Let's go!

Okay, I'll pay for your dinner tonight. But only once. You were paying for my dinner anyway. I want the cold hard cash. You want cash well i guess not i'll give you cash but that was crazy i would have accepted the fact that you flew me out here until i found out about the hookups that you've also flown out here now that's not adequate payment the fact that you're hanging on to that is crazy those could be my baby daddies you could get these grandkids you are always droning on about if that

was the case we wouldn't have been having conversations about how to get you someone today how to get me someone she's not a nice you know what i mean like she's a beautiful woman but she's not nice uh okay mom is there anything you want to plug to the fans anything you want to tell them about where can they find you kansas city i know that's right maybe well guys this has been so true with my mom mom is there anything else you want to say to the listeners about the episode about me about your experience anything else you want to tell these fine folks i love you you love my fans i love you and i love your fans oh your fans have helped make you who you are yeah Yeah, and they pay the bills.

We got to show some love. I love you guys a lot. Well, I love you too. You're not half bad. I don't care what anybody says. And I'm going to start sticking up for you when people talk shit about you to me. Let's make baby steps. Yeah, baby steps towards that.

Okay, that's the end of it.