So True with Caleb Hearon - Zach Zimmerman is Not Evil

Episode Date: November 13, 2025

Welcome! This week’s guest is the hilarious Zach Zimmerman! Zach and Caleb talk moral dilemmas, parental expectations, good vs. evil, praise, so much more! Join our Substack for an exclusive post-episode chat with Zach and other bonus content!  https://calebsaysthings.substack.com/ Follow Zach! @zzdoublezzFollow the show! @sooootruepod Follow Caleb! @calebsaysthings Produced by Chance Nichols @chanceisloudHead to https://www.squarespace.com/SOTRUE to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain using code SOTRUE.Stock up on sustainable cleaning products for yourself or to give a beautiful gift to your friends by going to https://www.Blueland.com/SOTRUE and get up to 30% during Blueland’s holiday sale! Ready to quit for good? Go to https://www.quitwithjones.com/SOTRUE to start your personalized quitting journey and get $10 off with code SOTRUE.Use my code for 10% off your next SeatGeek order*: https://seatgeek.onelink.me/RrnK/SOTRUE10 Sponsored by SeatGeek. *Restrictions apply. Max $20 discount There’s no replacement for human connection. Better with people. Better with Alma. Visit https://www.helloalma.com/SOTRUE to get started and schedule a free consultation today. About Headgum: Headgum is an LA & NY-based podcast network creating premium podcasts with the funniest, most engaging voices in comedy to achieve one goal: Making our audience and ourselves laugh. Listen to our shows at https://www.headgum.com. » SUBSCRIBE to Headgum: https://www.youtube.com/c/HeadGum?sub_confirmation=1  » FOLLOW us on Twitter: http://twitter.com/headgum  » FOLLOW us on Instagram: https://instagram.com/headgum/ » FOLLOW us on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@headgum So True is a Headgum podcast, created and hosted by Caleb Hearon. The show is produced by Chance Nichols with Associate Producer Allie Kahan. So True is engineered and edited by Nicole Lyons. Kaiti Moos is our VP of Content at Headgum. Thanks to Luke Rogers for our show art and Virginia Muller our social media manager.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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and schedule a free consultation today. That's hello-a-l-M-A-com slash S-O-T-R-U-E. I think it depends. I think something bad people There's a troll. Who can never tell a lie. One more time?

There's a troll who can never tell a lie. A third time just to make sure we have it. You got it. How are you, Sugar? I'm hanging in there. Yeah.

What does that mean? Live and love and learning. What can you, you told me about 10 topics. I think you're the first guest ever to walk in and tell me 10 things I didn't know that I'm not allowed to talk about. Yep. It's called Boundaries, baby.

I'm learning what they are. I'm really happy for you. They're very hard to do. I'm really happy for you. It's all I want to talk about are those 10 things. Yeah. And so that's, oh, I get it. So this, yeah, the reason you're having to be so intense about not talking about it's

because you're dying to talk about it. Oh, of course. It's the headline of my summer. It's hard for us. But I'm processing those things. It's hard for us. But we're the kind of people, I think most comics in general, but we want to talk about everything that's ever happened to us. Oh, yeah. And that's nice in that it's vulnerable. My friend

said, like, that's what she loves about me. I, like, open up and I share my inner so people can like poke around. But I'm realizing like, oh, not everyone has, and I'm sort of violating my own boundary now, not everyone has the purest intentions. Like, hey, this is how to love me, is also like, hey, here's how to emotionally abuse me. And so I need to be a little more mindful about who I let in. Well, you're giving them the code to this. I gave him the code to the safe. Because I trust people. I'm so naive and immature. I thought people were good. I still think they're good. I'm very and frank Jesus Christ in that way and what happened to them, you know, says something. Do you feel positive about referring to yourself just now on the

So True podcast as very and frank Jesus? Does that feel good to you? Because I'm a mere humble interviewer and all i'm happy to i believe people are good to my detriment yes that's what i mean and so good i'm not saying that i'm jesus i'm not and i'm also not jewish i realize both those people were jewish um those people and i'm not what else do they have in common that is so funny anne and jesus um i don't know i'm empowered by this by what the shoes off yeah and a I feel like a little kid. Yeah, the striped shirt, the shoes off. I'm a baby.

Just learning about boundaries last month. Really? I thought you told everybody everything. Me? I thought one did. Oh, one. That one should. Capital role you.

Overshare. Yeah. Well, I think it's fun to share. I like to share. I think I share a lot. But I keep some things for myself, but very rarely. What do you do for yourself? See what I'm doing?

I'm testing his own boundary. That was wrong of me. No, I was just talking to somebody about this yesterday that, like, in work, I'll talk about absolutely anything. I don't really have much fear around any topic. I don't have fear around any topic. I exercise some boundaries in my work only around a key couple of specific, like, familial relationships, and not my dating or sex life, but my romantic life.

Oh, you talk about fucking, but not falling. Yeah, exactly. Zach, you are such a poet. Stop. You are such a poet. one to know you also you make me want to embrace my my southern poet side stop we do where is the midwest south no i'm stolen valor over there some people talk about uh missouri as the south but the truth of the matter is there's really two missouri's and one of them is southern one

of them is midwestern i am from squarely from the midwestern portion but there's it's a spectrum yes because if you're down in the boot hill of missouri that is called the boot hill yeah and it's That's like Arkansas, Tennessee. Yeah, that's like down in the whole dip of Missouri. You're down there. And then up in the north, it's like Iowa. Is it a pair of heels or it's a boot for sure? Yeah, I'm just telling you what it's called.

You know what I'm realizing these chairs are? Tell me. They're kind of like rocking chairs. It's fun to swivel. Isn't it fun to swivel? It's fun to swivel. I feel like one of those fans. What?

You know, a fan that kind of gives a little air over here. You're referring to the concept of oscillating, yeah. Okay, SAT. I know that word. also don't act like you don't know what oscillation is comedy is just synonyms yeah it is vacillating what do you think that you're blocking from me right now by focusing on the the chair and the shoes i'm keeping things light so you don't get into the summer the summer from hell the summer the summer i turned broken oh my god i just love that we

We were talking before the show about Portland, and you mentioned a fun experience you have. May I share a Portland experience I had? Well, I wish that you would. This is Portland, Oregon. Portland, Oregon. I was there having a nice fun. I was on a dating app and matched with a beautiful trans woman. And we started messaging. And then she was like, oh, can I get your number? I was like, sure. We started chatting. We were going to meet up to fool around. She shared a dirty pick. And I was like, oh, that's a different pick than your profile picture. And she was like, oh, that's my roommate. She's also a trans woman. I was like, okay, you're a catfish and I blocked, et cetera, et cetera, phone call.

Do it now. I was like, what? Do it now. I look at my phone. This scammer has sent a report of my name. They have my address, my age, a list of possible family members, some of which are true, a picture of me, and then a picture of a penis, which is not my penis. I never sent this penis. Are you lying right now?

No, it's literally not. Not my penis. They sent a penis, which is it mine. Hey, do I send my penis? I don't know whose that was. Yeah. No, it was, it's not, it, it, it was bigger than mine and. They always are.

They always are. They always are. I know. That's why being by is nice. Gay men like need 10 inches to feel anything. No, I've, I've been on record about this. A big dick is such a, it's cumbersome. Don't bring a big dick around me.

It's cucumber. It's not, it's like, why do you even have that thing? Yes, but I have. have to finish the story. Well, then get back to it. I forgot where I was. He said, do it now. Yes.

They built this report, not my penis, that they're going to, they're like, I'm going to send this to your family and ruin your life. I was like, what? And they're like, I'm counting down 10, 9, 8. And I was like, you don't. That is so. Like texting this, like 10, 9, 8. Like, do it now.

And I'm like, what? He's like, send me $500. I'm going to ruin your life. And I was like, you don't have my family's phone numbers. And then he's like, all right. And so a couple minutes go by. My sister texts me like, hey, Did you get that text?

I was like, how is this scammer, like, pretending to be my sister? That's insane. So I call her, like, Hannah, what are you talking about? He somehow sent this report to my immediate family and my brother's ex-wife. Their numbers must be online with like, this guy does gay and teenager. And they send the dick pick. Not gay and teenager. To be fair, I was talking to an of-age trans woman.

when the allegations aren't even like based on anything and i'm just texting my mom like that's not my dick mom that's not my dick and i think she was most offended by just being reminded that i'm queer um in her inbox i was gonna say it's it's it's not great for your mom who has like maybe a some some questions about queer for her to get a text it's like here's your son's dick he's doing teenager it's like okay horse case scenario really yeah and she she was probably just like Send him the $500 second. Just do it. No, but that was quite an afternoon.

It was quite a rush, actually. Because I wasn't going to give in to it. I knew it wasn't real or mattered, but it does get your heart racing. I mean, this is a horrifying story. Yeah, I do have a habit of going through terrible things and immediately thinking they're funny before actually, like, sitting with the emotions. Oh, it's horrifying that this person did this to you.

Yeah. It's such an invasion of privacy. I know it makes you kind of not want to go on apps or give your number anymore. or trust your gut more i kind of knew something was up i don't give my number she was like i don't charge and i was like well that's a funny headline for your account like okay i was like i do a dollar a minute babe but they they pray on sweet horny tourists yeah yeah that's true i hate that it happened to you thank you so much what app was this grinder dot com this was grinder grinder

full of bots these days i know it hot people ooh hey joined my only fan i was like No, I want to meet up. They're getting better at, too. I think for a number of years there when I was a little bit younger, the Grindr fake accounts, the pictures were so clearly fake. It was always like some man in like a mostly unbuttoned white shirt on the beach with like a Pinot Grigio. And it was like, you're clearly not in rural Missouri right now. And now they've gotten good at finding like multiple pictures of a real looking person from the area. They're pretty good.

My big beef with Grindr right now isn't the bots. It's the death of the imagination. Okay. People in these albums are sharing photos that sort of leave nothing to it. Do you know this is one of my biggest things? It's like graphic, you're showing me a dick in your ass. You're showing me and imagine, there's no, like, write a, write a poem, write something. Like, there's nothing, it's so graphically explicit.

Like, there's, the mind isn't engaged. It's just body, like plug and play. This is your thing also. I'm with you. I'm so excited to hear you say this because I have been saying I don't send nudes at all. I don't do it. Oh, same. Because I'm like, there's too many people.

I've caught too many people even kind of early in my career. I caught too many people trying to get me to send news. They just want to see the goods. And then they don't want to hook up. They just want to like do whatever they want to do with them. And I'm not interested in that. Are you on LPSG? I'm sorry?

There's a forum out there. LPSG? Yeah. What is that? large penis support group it's where people share the nudes of notable public figures that they've accessed in order to determine if they have LPs that's horrible it's terrible people are really nasty I have a page there yeah they have nothing on me yeah also I'm I don't whoa I need to check in on that on the size of my penis I need to check in on the size of your penis on the chat

no the form I mean I find that bookie so anyway but the the the the sending of like every angle of your naked body before you meet up with someone. I'm like the whole fun is that we like meet each other. We make out for a little bit. We feel around. We wonder about what's going to be going on. Yeah. It's like this is the fun of it. Why do you like you've removed the whole entire enjoyment of the process. Soon you don't even have to meet up. There's probably some weird AI future where you just bloop bloop and then they appear and you don't even, I don't know. Yeah. I really, I don't like it at all. It really makes me sad. How do we get back to like a letter? Okay, so yeah, you and I are...

Dearest Caleb, Aaron. The evening has descended, but my penis is rising. Yeah, if you sent me that letter, there's a less than zero percent chance we'd fuck. That's not how percentages work. Yeah, well, it is in this scenario. Oh, okay. Welcome to your world. I like it over here.

I like it over here. It's good. Everything makes a little bit more sense in my world. Can I tell you the catchphrase of the summer? Yeah. Tell a man, no. This is the... I already know it is. Clip this. Clip this. Tell a man no. Get ready for a show.

Whoa. Tell a man no, get ready for a show. Tell me about it. What does that mean? All you have to do is tell a man a little itty-bitty-no. They will put on a production, a little bit of rejection. Yeah. You will see, do this on an early date with someone, do this with a new friend. It shows everything about the person. What do you mean? Like, like, no, give me some context. Ask me, ask me something. Okay. Well, I don't think, okay. Ask me a personal question. What's, what's your, what's your idea of a perfect day?

That's a great question. I don't, I don't want to talk about that. Well, yeah, that's really rude. Oh. Don't you think that's rude? That was rude? That would be rude if someone asked you such a benign question to say that you don't want to talk about it. Oh, potentially.

Let me give you a better one. Yeah. But you also might not be a man in this scenario. I have to be a man in this scenario. I want to be a man in this scenario to make your thing work. Let's go out Friday night. No, thank you. Yeah, there is a better way to do that.

Hey, I'm busy. I'm busy. That's different than no, though. You want to see how they respond to being told no to. Like, oh, can I get the door for you? No, thank you. What do you mean? I can't get the door for you.

Like, you're going to see anger. you're going to see playfulness. You'll see how they react to a no. And this summer, I was telling men, no, I got shows. Yeah. They put on little song and dances. I got shows. They got angry.

I got shows. They did their little dances. Yeah. And what did you learn? What did I learn? That it's not to hold firm to it. Don't give in. Yeah.

Just because of their oversized emotional reaction to that no. Yeah. Like maintain your no. don't personalize their reaction. It's some thing they have. Even you being like, that was rude is based on like your understanding of like social etiquettes and norms.

Like, oh, I didn't mean to be rude. I just don't want to talk about that. Yeah. Well, I do think, yeah, I think that's totally fine. It's totally fine for someone to say, I think both sides are fine. It's totally fine for someone to say that was rude and for you to then say,

oh, I wasn't trying to be rude. If I experienced an encounter in dating where I thought someone was rude, I would say that was rude. And if they said, oh, I wasn't trying to be rude, I'd be like, okay, that is enough. Perfect interaction. Yeah, that's a perfect interaction. I think there is something that, like, conflict is not inherently, I've encountered a lot of people. Abuse. Sarah Shulman.

What is that? Conflict is not abuse. It's a book she wrote Sarah Schoen. Oh, I don't know that is. Who is she? She wrote Rent, and it was stolen by Jonathan Larson. Obsessed. She's a lesbian scholar, wrote. Oh, my God. I feel like a queer elder right now.

My God. What was the first book she wrote? People in Trouble. That inspired, it was stolen by Jonathan Larson to make rent. And what did I read of hers? There's a family book about how therapists and people need to intervene in homophobic family units that we like celebrate and worship the family. Like, oh, the parents are always right, let them do. And it's like, no, if the parents are homophobic, the state slash a therapist slash community members need

to intervene. Yeah. I forget what the title of that one was. Do we, um, is that a skill? Yeah, what's the, what's the last name? Sarah Schult. Am I getting her name wrong? Sarah Shulman.

I feel like the lesbians are going to be really mad if I got that name wrong. Don't worry, they're mad at me last week. Oh, what did you do? I don't know what I was talking about. There's this, there's this phenomenon that happens sometimes on this show where if I, if I make any joke about another group, there's like 12 people from that group that are like, why would you be speaking on this? and it's like because I can and I want to.

You need to grow up. And I'll keep doing it as well. Is that you're right? Yeah. And it is and I will. That's my job. It's literally, yeah. Do we find a chance?

There's a lot. Was it fiction or nonfiction what you're looking at? People in trouble was their fiction work, but the nonfiction was... There's My American History, Lesbian and Gay Life during the Reagan Bush years. Stage struck, theater aides and the marketing of gay America. Ties that bind. Ties that bind. There you go.

What is ties that bind? That's the homophobia one. That's the interview. And then the conflict is not abuses for the most recent one, which I haven't read. But with a name like that, you kind of, I mean, you don't have to read the book. That is, that is, though, something like the let them theory. Yeah. You don't have to read the books.

Just let them. Sorry. No. You were saying. That is something I've been thinking a lot about is conflict is not like, yeah, it's not abuse. It's not inherently a bad thing. That someone, you're allowed to have your thing and someone is allowed to have an opposition to it. And you can probably both get to a place of being like, oh, okay, understood.

In fact, it's healthy and good that you've, that you've, both leave that as still individuals. Yeah. Like with your own ideas and thoughts. My dad, God forbid, I'm citing him, said. And I'm citing the dark magic on this one. But yeah, I'm going to invoke my father. You brought him up.

You brought him up. If two people, Caleb, you want to talk about my dad. Welcome, Zach. Stop it. Frank Zimmerman is not here. If two people agree on everything, only one of them is thinking. Yeah. Ooh.

That actually is really insightful. He has like four or five things, and then my therapist has like six or seven things that are just like Bible verse quality things you want to cite for your whole life. Therapist beats dad. Therapist is dad. Yeah, first of all. Or is sort of the non-judgmental, shameless, kind, loving, and supportive father figure. Yeah. Of course, he's a 55-year-old straight white man.

Naturally. In Chicago, of all places. Gay? Change my life. Straight. Straight. Wow. I've had gay therapist, and it's...

never took off why not for various reasons yeah one in chicago just would sit there what do you mean just give me something just wouldn't say a word just like oh i don't like that like kick us off and then i had one in new york who was like more insecure and anxious than me and i was like that can't be how this work we set up a first meeting and i was like hey like if If, yeah, if this works out, I'd love to, like, keep seeing, keep, make another appointment. He's like, what do you mean if this works out? Of course it's going to work out. I was like, no.

Oh, no, honey. I'm not iron sharpening iron, please. This can't be. It was dull, sharpening dull. That's crazy, dude. Have you had gay therapies? I don't really do therapy. God, you really are enlightened from the jump.

Oh, I don't think so. I mean, I feel good, but I think I could probably, there's times where I need therapy. I just haven't. made the leap back to it. I did, when I say I don't really do therapy, I mean lately in my adult life. I did therapy a little bit in college. It was fine.

But I kind of got over my big thing at that time. And then everything since then I got a lot of tools from that. And then, I don't know, I've just felt like I can mostly handle things. From our first lunch forever ago, I was like, Caleb, someone, you know who you are. I do, I think. In a very confident way. And you've told me about saying no to things before. You're just like, you're very sure of yourself.

and I admire that. Thank you. Do you feel like you know who you are? I'm starting a process of learning who I am. Yeah. Post, putting other people's needs before mine. And when did that process begin this summer? Is it the, the, the unmentioned...

I've always been, like, I processed some of the... I grew up super religious, evangelical, thought I was going to hell. I've processed, like, some of that, but I'm realizing anew that those wounds, by keeping the relationship with my family, those... I'm still receiving some... abuse. Yeah, you've given a lot. I noticed from afar,

you've given a lot to your family. Yeah, and I thought it was noble. This is sort of on the topic of the book I'm writing. The new one. The new book. It's called Ship Mother. Yeah.

It's, I took my mom on a week long cruise, my conservative evangelical mother in order to fundamentally change and alter her religious and political beliefs. And we all know how that turned out. And it worked.

It worked. She's been, she's running with, she's been door knocking for Mom Dani. Yeah, yeah, yeah. She loves that free bus Yeah I yeah

And so But what I've I don't want to Well I mean I'll give it away Because the book may never come out Or I might die tomorrow What I learned Me being like obsessed with her

And trying to understand her Was at the expense of me Being obsessed with myself And learning who I am Like why am I trying to like Why does this woman believe I'm going to hell And sort of can't accept this This queer part of my life

I caught her in a lie. Whoa. I caught her in a lie. What was the lie? You don't want to tell. Do you want to say for the book? I don't want to pressure you into giving away a big good lie. I mean, if everyone listening could go by the first book,

that'll help the second book maybe exists. Okay, so everyone go by Zach's first book, which sits in my home beautifully. Oh, thank you. Untouched. It's in a mausoleum. Everyone prays to it when they come in. No, it is touched. Do I mind giving that away?

Yeah. I mean, it's not, I don't know if this will be in the book, that she loves me unconditionally was a lie. Yeah. And how did you catch her in that? I came out to her as bisexual or let her know I was dating a woman this summer. And she said, I've been praying for this, which is funny and hurtful at the same time. Hilarious.

I know that she hid it behind humor, which is what's tricky. Yeah. Oh, that's actually really hurtful, but hilarious. Yeah. Thanks for the content. Mom. And as I was dating a woman, she was asking more questions about it. She sent us, like, a present, a game for us to play.

And I was like, oh, would you have done that if this was a man? You can be honest with me. And she said, probably not. Yeah. And so a couple weeks later, I was like, hey, how do you show love? Oh, you ask questions. You send gifts, right? Excuse me.

I'm not getting choked up. That was like a belch. Yeah. You just had a whole variety of coffee. Yeah. We're at like a, I'm at like a 20% chance of crying on them. the pod nice i'm i would say have you ever have i cried on this pod yes oh have i i think didn't hmm yeah i can't remember what episode i cried on a bonus segment yeah once with bob

with bob yeah um have i cried on the main show mom stuff trying to think yeah i don't you didn't cry during either of the kelly episodes no kelly cried instantly on the kelly episode my mom I don't know. Oh, your mom. She's a crier. I feel like you've gotten choked up or like tiered up a little bit. Yeah, I cry. I mean, I was, I've, I cried to you like two days ago.

I cry, I just, usually on the show, it doesn't usually go to a place that gets me to cry. Gotcha, gotcha. But I'm open to it. Let's cry on camera. I think it would be very chic. I, we're at 25% now. Oh, we got up. Yeah, I'm feeling a little safer.

You got safe and that's like, maybe you are safe here. But I confronted my mom. I was like, oh, it seems like the level of your love is conditioned. based on the gender of my partner. Yeah. And she's like, I, well, I, I, well, I, I, well, I, I, I, well, I, I, I, well, I, I, I, I, I, I, I'm, well, I'm doing what I believe.

I was like, oh, I'm just disappointed in that. And she's like, well, ah, yeah. And I just stood, stood my ground to co-opt a phrase. Yeah. Just to stand your ground state. Yeah. Let's just stand your ground state. I'm doing your air safe.

Yeah. And, yeah, it was just eye opening to me like, oh, you've said that for so long. I love you unconditionally. We had a funny, you, your mom. your mom called when we were having brunch and I asked where you got all your confidence and you said my mom. Yeah. She like, praised me every day when I was a kid.

Yeah. And I was like, I called my mom after that. I was like, hey, can, will you like praise me? I'm sorry. That's so sweet. I love you. That's so sweet. Is it sweet?

That is funny, though. You're almost a 40 year. Oh, man. Why didn't need your mom to praise you? Yeah. And I was like, oh. Because you didn't when I wasn't 40. Yeah.

Because you didn't do it when I needed it most. And then the next day I got like, you're amazing, my amazing son. That's really sweet. That's effort. Yeah. Yeah. Maybe, you know, a day late, dollar short. Yeah.

And there might be a word for a person who does that sort of push, pull, degrade praise, degrade praise that I hesitate to say. Yeah. Yeah, it's really, it's tough. It's really tough because I don't know. You oscillate sometimes with parents between it's their first time on earth kind of thing where you're like

they're a person who's figuring it out. You're oscillating. Between like that and then also being like, well, I was the child. I shouldn't have to have this much grace for you. 1,000%. My dad I asked him once like, what is a good dad?

Thinking, oh, he had some philosophy. He's raised four kids. we're all like reasonable adults, productive members of society. And he goes, I don't know. I didn't have one. Yeah. I'm like, oh, you're trapped. Yeah.

You're 12. Yeah. You're 60, but you're 12. Yeah. And it comes back to one of the Bible verses of my therapist. Everyone is a fourth grader. This has been a thing that's been coming up a lot lately. I've seen a bunch of...

You're skeptical. No, I've seen a bunch of stuff online like everyone's 12 now. Like everyone's... We were always 12. Yeah. We've always been 12. Yeah, I don't... Don't you feel 12?

No. I feel that I've always been 30 I feel that when I was 12 I was 30 I felt 60 since the day I was born This podcast is brought you by Squarespace Squarespace is the all-in-one website platform designed to help you stand out and succeed online Whether you're just starting out or scaling your business

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Taking back control starts now. Thanks to quit with Jones for sponsoring this episode. Disclaimer. Just a heads up. The mints contain nicotine, which is an addictive chemical in all seriousness. Jones is FDA approved and available for those that are 18 and older. And I really do. I mean, I remember being 12 and being like, why do I not relate to any of these people

the other 12 year olds and I'm like God I wish I was the adult they seem like so much more on my page oh the teachers and I shared a special bond yes of course of course every little teacher yes oh a little straight A Zach of course my legacy my poor sister how so she was two years behind me and once the teacher went down and saw Zimmerman on that list they're like I had your brother she was just in my shadow oh poor soul I bet that was hard for her yeah she's doing well now she teaches of all things trauma informed education in south carolina public school system wow one of the most incredible just doing it for all the right reasons it's a big i was actually just this morning thinking about how big of a swing it is but teachers there's like one into it's it's very

it's very uh it's very polarized there's not much in the middle no i don't hair and hates teachers well listen to the take because overpaid they not a certainly not overpaid but half of them are the sweetest most angelic like truly and it sounds like your sister in it for the right reasons, want to, like, change the future and be there for kids. And all you can do is, like, tip your hat and admire them

and ask what more can we do for you? And half of them are the biggest reject losers who, like, miss high school and middle school and wish they could do it over again so badly. Miss Bryant. I'm saying it's like a... Name her. It's like ends of the spectrum.

And I think there's more of the good ones, but I'm saying it would be ridiculous to pretend that we don't know that some teachers are just, like, bloodthirsty, like, rejected losers who feel bad because they were bullied in high school. Same with parents or people that just have some vendetta and bitterness. Same with comedians.

Yes. And we don't even actually have the angelic spectrum. We're all just shades of demons. It's like, how hurt are you is the only, yeah, yeah. So I'm not, yeah, I'm not proclaiming to be above. I'm just saying it is an interesting thing, that profession. One of the most interesting teachers I had was my math teacher in high school. And she was a beautiful woman.

And at the senior breakfast, she sang, that don't impress me much by Shania Twainty. God love. And would cast the cutest boy seniors. Oh, uh-oh. Uh-oh. Hey. She was like, she would come over and like, that don't impress me much. Oops.

Oh, not that. Not that. She also, she wrote me letters of recommendation that changed my life. She gave me four of them for colleges and I only needed three. Yeah. And it was wrong of me to do, but I wanted to look at what it said because I'm a words of affirmation girl. and I want to see what it is.

And it goes, Zach is one of the best students I've ever had in all my careers of teaching. She is sure to excel at whatever she does. Wow, I bet that actually did something huge for you. I was like, she copy-pasted,

but also she knew. Yeah, maybe she knew. But also kind of nailed it on accident. I got it. Accidental affirmation, let's go. But then Miss Bryant was the bad end of the spectrum, eighth grade, English. Yeah.

Evil woman. Had us do resuscitations. What's that? She had us memorize in, recite things, but she called it a resuscitation. Yeah, how about a recitation? When you're dying. Yeah, weird. And she gave me my only zero. Whoa. Evil. The tears are coming. 30%. 30%. It was back when instead of like reading a book, you had to do like a hundred different activities to do the book or whatever, little fun things. And she gave one way to

earn points was to draw a picture of a scene from the book. And she gave us all a piece of tracing paper. And so in my book, it was a beautiful, intricate scene that had already been drawn. So I used the tracing paper to go over it. Zero. Plagiarism. Whoa. My mom, lover to death. Rabble Rouser.

Doesn't love me unconditionally, but fights when necessary. Love a good fight. Loves a good fight. The 2024 election. January 6th. Who wishes she could have been there? Charlie Kirk. She wrote, I am Charlie in the same.

in Myrtle Beach that's that's a fun thing for our listeners to know about Patty Zimmerman she loves a fight she called the principal

why is why did my son receive a zero the principal calls the teacher Zach gets another chance the next day I drew the most beautiful picture of the scene from that she goes to the beach

writes I am Zach in the sand I'm Zach Ari Zacci oh yeah she fought for me also came to school and had me removed when condoms were discussed in sex ed, which did lead to me using Saran Wrap once in an early sexual encounter.

Yeah, which works. I don't have a child. Yeah. I don't know. I am not father. I don't know if it's my poor sperm or the clinging power of Saran Wrap. It's hard to say. Are they a sponsor?

Seran Rap, yes. Good, good. Yeah, they run two million of ads on here. Yeah. You're doing well. Yeah, Saran runs two million of ads on here. This is, you've really, this. You like the new.

studio? I love it. We have much to do, but we're really getting there. Everyone's working very hard on it. The pot is great. May I praise you? Briefly. And we might cut it. Does it make you uncomfortable? You've just, you're a good egg who's building something really special and doing it your way and bringing people up with you. And I don't think you're evil. Why was there a question mark on it? Just playful. Yeah, okay. Just playful. Just being a little. Just. Just being a little playful. I was giving room for a further bit, but I liked that.

Yeah, okay, that's nice. Everyone has a little evil. Yeah, I clocked myself like 3%. Yeah. I went on a date with someone who said 60%. Them, they said 60% for them. Whoa. She.

Yeah. I said they. Did you like that? That was nice. Yeah, but she. Yeah. But I gave, I left a really open door there. Oh, really great.

Nice. Open door. And I let you know what's inside the door. Yeah. Behind door number one. Was she a woman? Open the door? She.

She. It's three doors. Your children, listeners won't know this. the Monty Hall problem. It was on let's make a deal. There were three doors, and you would open, you pick a door to win a prize, and then he opens up one of the other doors,

lets you know it's not the prize, and then you can either switch or stay. Yeah. What do you think gives you the best odds? To stay. Exactly. Yeah. No, switch.

Whoa. The door you picked has a one in three chance. The door that you didn't pick has a two out of three chance. Whoa. Because... I said so. Something math.

It's mathy. Yeah. Because Monty opening a door, he knew which didn't. There was more information. It's not just 50-50. There's extra information. All of which is to say there's three doors and behind one's a she, one's a he, ones a they.

Yeah. And that's kind of a fun way to date. Yeah. A doors-based dating system. Door-based dating system. Doors-based dating. We're going to start a dating app called doors. Doors.

I do think we're dating apps should have videos. Either we should do a love is blind dating app or you don't get to see the person and you only connect. Okay, superficial Sally. No, I just think it's important to see someone. I like to see someone's eyes. I like to see someone's vibe.

I like to see the pictures they choose. That's interesting. I think we should do a little video then. We should normalize video. Hinge has video. I also like the voice note. Oh, voice. I know instantly.

Voice is fun. Oh, you get so much information from voice. Voice is good. More than pictures even, I think. For sure. Because you get like pacing, tone, personality. Yeah. You can fall in love with the voice.

Oh, for sure. Hashtag love is blind. Her. Love is blind as her. Joaquin did this. Oh, I know. Joaquin did this. Everybody, now erotica's on AI.

Yeah. Yeah. I don't like it. We're not leaving the house. I am. You can just on Grindr, get all the pictures you need from every angle, and then just talk to the AI, but. I like Grindr, but I, yeah, the point is to, I enjoy Grindr. I actually, I frequently have, like, pretty fun conversations on Grindrinder.

I'm like, if people are willing. Yeah, I'll chit chat on there. Sometimes if you deviate from the hey, hey, what's up, what are you into? What are you into? You're seeing like a freak. For sure. And I get that sometimes you're so horny that you can't entertain like a whimsical little

combo. Been there, been there, been that. What do you think about a bar that lets everyone know how horny you are, sort of mental state? I think that people really good. I think that should be on like, I think that should be on Slack. That should be on every application. Hey, does anyone know, um, uh, uh, this. status of this report someone reach out to susan oh she's at a nine she's really horned up she's

rubbing against her desk right now let's give her a minute they should have it on door dash like hey your driver's really horny just honestly i've had some cute door dash drivers that i've been like if i knew i would i'd let you in i've had a ups or two that there's a vibe yeah never sealed the deal i haven't either never with it never with a delivery driver there was one task grab at once a task i didn't sleep with him but there was a task rabbit that there was a task rabbit that that I'm like, if I wanted it, it's odd. You know what they say about rabbits. They fuck like rabbits.

They made for life. No, they have so much sex. Yeah, they fuck a lot, yeah. They're gay. They make, yeah, they're, they're made for life. And they don't get ulcers. What? I don't know.

Is that true? Zebras don't. Oh, my God. Because they don't worry because they're animals. Yeah. We worry as humans. What are you un worried about? What's making you happy?

What are you looking forward to? Oh, my God. I'm going to go on a fall foilage cruise. Fun. It's like a four-hour. It was recommended by another comedian, and it's going to be so nice this weekend. You just look at all the trees.

There's beers, but I think I'll just have a coffee. And just nature. We forget about nature. Yeah. We as an I. We as in me specifically. Me specifically.

You forget. You think, like, oh, there's nothing here. And it's like, no, there's everything here. Where's the tour? It goes up the Hudson, up the Hudson. Fun. I said that twice to make sure it. Just to make sure that it's up the Hudson.

Yeah. I think it goes up to Hudson. I'm looking forward to that. And then I'm scheming. I am not going home for Thanksgiving this year. Really? Because it's a Trump dinner this year. Because my sister is going with her husband and her kids to Guatemala to visit his family.

And then my other sister and I were like, this drops our numbers. It'd be like six of us and four Trumpers and just me and my sister. I was like, I don't know if I want to go through that. Yeah, don't do it. Yeah, so big old boundary. So I'm figuring out what I'm going to do. Yeah, these things are supposed to be fun. Yeah.

I don't have to do things you're not excited about. Has anyone seen this TikTok of the guy who says an alien's in his body and then a kid is like, what's the, what do I need to know? And he's like, I've told you everything you need to know. Do what excites you to the best of your ability with no expectation of the outcome. Miss this one. I missed this one. Oh. I haven't seen this one.

I'll do it a couple more times. Yeah, run it by me. Just let's make sure we got it. Yeah. But it seems so silly. Do what excites you is such a simple idea. But for so much of my life and often for people, you're doing what you think you're supposed to do to be a good son or a good employee

or a good community member. It's like, do what is exciting to you because that is infectious and it gets everyone excited. And then we're changing the world with excitement. Yeah. Yes. Mostly. Oh.

No, I come up with a problem with it because I have. said that the world would just be a much better place if everyone, yeah, did what made them happy. If everyone truly just focused on what made them happy, that actually, we talk about this sometimes in the tenant union, that like, you're acting in your self-interest will actually most of the time benefit everybody. When you're talking to working people, when you're talking to billionaires, you obviously can't talk like that. But that's the issue is when you say, do the thing that would make you excited, some people

are excited by being mean and bad. Unfortunately, and I think it's a small number, but that's why it can't be a universal maxim because even though most of us are excited by good and kindness and happiness and joy there are some people who are excited by nastiness and that's it's tough it's yeah you forget those people exit or i forget that they exist i think they're like over there on the tv or doing awful things in in other cities but it's like oh no they're your mom yeah they're your friend yeah or could be they're yeah they're around and it's it's or they're you on a really really really bad Day.

Yeah. Like, we all have the capacity for great good and great evil. And what makes choosing good powerful is that you reject the evil. Yeah. Do we all have the capacity for great evil? There's two buttons before you. You're going with that one? No.

Already? I'm pointing them out. One. Kills a man. man. Okay. And one gives you $1 billion to invest in changing the world. Yeah. I don't know if this is good or not. I'm, so far it seems only really clear cut. You could save a malaria net costs $23 and you can save a million lives. Somebody do the math. You could do, or do you kill this one guy. I don't think you got the dilemma right because the question is, there's a

The train. The train is going 60 miles an hour. Right. It leaves New Brunswick. There's an old lady in the boat. Right. And there's a doctor in the boat. The moral dilemma you posed was there's two buttons.

One kills one guy and one saves a bunch of lives. So what are you going to do? Save a bunch of lives. Boy, it's money. Okay. So you would do something evil. You would kill someone for a billion dollars. No, you didn't present the buttons right, is what I'm telling you.

You know, you're not presenting the problem you think you're presenting. Present it to me. You said this problem. kills a man. This button kills a man. Yep. And this button... Gives you $1 billion. That's not a moral dilemma. I was trying to make you take the money.

Right. And I knew I needed to say something good to get you to take the money. Yeah. But taking the money is not anywhere equivalent to killing a man. That's not the evil. So what are you going to do? Do you kill the man? Wait, I feel crazy. What are you talking about? Are you doing a bit right now? Oh, no. Do you know?

No. I'm so sorry. I was like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm not set up a dilemma. I'm crying. No, it's the same button. Okay. One button. There's one button.

For a moment, I felt high. You're welcome. I've been gaslit into. There was always one button, Kayla. What are you talking about? Folks, you know me. I'm the type of guy who wants to get out of the house and see some live music.

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Bluein.com slash show-true for 15% off. That's blue-in.com slash show-true to get 15% off. Okay, so what are the buttons? There have to be two buttons because a choice has to exist. No, there's one button you either press it or not. Okay, so that's the choice. Okay, so there's one button. One button kills a man, but you get a billion dollars.

No, I would not take that button. But you're going to save millions of lives with your billion. I don't, I wouldn't take that button. Okay, then you're good, I guess. I really don't think I would take that button. I wouldn't, I don't think I would. You don't think you have evil in you? I think I have evil in me.

I think everyone has, I don't know about evil. You don't think you're capable of great evil. Specifically, the great is the thing I'm pushed. And I'm not even asking about myself. I'm asking, do we think everyone has the capacity for great evil? Well, absolute power corrupts absolutely. Do you think if you had complete and total power, you were a billionaire? You could never be tried for a crime.

Are you doing only good things? Oh, I think so, yeah, but I guess I don't know because it hasn't happened to me. Have you seen Sorry to bother you? No, was that Boots Riley? Who did that? Yeah, yeah. It's sort of the, he's a, well, go watch it. Just the idea of we all think at this level, we will break down.

the system when we get there but if you like get access to power do you tear things up from the inside or do you enjoy your access to power i i've had very very micro experiences of this that are nowhere compared to what we're talking about where i've we just this week i was having a crash out to chance actually and a couple other people uh about some of the money that we're getting offered at this juncture and who it comes from and the money is it was like a little crazy last year. Like there would be like an amount of money that you're like, yeah, that would be a lot of money. And this year it has been, obviously we'll talk about it off mic. There's reasons I can't talk about it. Sorry guys. But the specifics of it. Saran rap. It's a lot of

money. But like a thing that I think is not objectively evil, but like I really don't agree with it and I have concerns about it. Anyway, anyway, there's this very small problem of an ethical dilemma that I've been in this year that has really been tearing me up. And it's hard because I do good things with my money. Right. And so I do go like, oh man, if I took that, I could donate this much to this group and I could take care of this person who needs help. And, but then also part of the agreement is that I would have to sit here in this chair and tell the people who listen to me to endorse a thing that I don't believe in. Gotcha. So it's a very small version, but it's like, yeah, it's a new thing. I mean, is ice that bad. That's the thing is I'm wanting

to run ads for ice. I want to. But I'm trying to get the number up. I guess to me, the line from small evil to great evil is just like the amount of power that you have right like if you're willing to make the evil choice on a micro scale like you'll do the same like the extra money isn't going to and access to things isn't going to make you a better person but i think that spectrum is definitional because i think when you're doing small acts of bad i wouldn't call it evil oh you would you call it like a little naughty like it's like it's like silly silly i don't know i don't know anyway. Great evil. Look at me. Why would I say that?

The button dilemma is one of the funniest things. The button dilemma is really cracking me up still because I'm like... I can't believe you, maybe it's the me. I was messing up the meme. There's a meme where there's two buttons. Yeah and he's sweating but they're actually the same choice or the very obvious choice. I was confusing that with

the box with the button. I understand exactly what you mean. Yes, that there's a box to the button. All you have to is open it and push it and one thing happens or it doesn't. Hey, I was wrong. It's really funny. I've also done, it's like I, when I try to do, like, sometimes when I try to do like spur of the moment, like the moral problems like that, I do get in my head where I'm like, it is like, the train is leaving and there's an older woman, but there's a younger person and you press or don't press, by the way, someone's wearing a white coat off to the side. Oh, interesting. I get them all mixed

up sometimes and I'm like, I don't know, I just, I basically get down to being like, what's the white coat guy doing? Are you good or bad? That's what I want to ask. Yeah. And, uh, and, uh, Will a bad person say they're bad or will a bad person say they're good? I think it depends. I think some bad people genuinely say they're bad. There's a troll who can never tell a lie. One more time? There's a troll who can never tell a lie.

A third time just to make sure we have it? You got it. I'm being mocked. I'm being, I do think my, I do like great evil and great good. I like big story from growing up Christian. Like I love God and Satan, these ideas of great evil and great good. I love Lord of the Rings, like sorrow. love a good villain.

Yeah. I just didn't realize they were right there in my life the whole time. Yeah. Also, hot take on God. Say it. You know, I love this.

I reread Herman Heses Damien recently, which comes for the Kane story, saying like, oh, how did that come about? Like, maybe actually Kane was a really powerful guy people were afraid of. And so they said they had the mark of Kane, and that's why people like vilified him. And I was like, okay, let me do this with another myth.

God and Jesus. Okay. how is it such an act of love to kill your son? Yeah, this is a... It doesn't really feel like an act of love. Seems like killing your sacrificing yourself would be an act of love to save your son. And so like God and Jesus, to me, feel like very different ideas of how to exist in the world. Jesus preached love and acceptance and inclusion in the Gospel of Thomas,

which was discovered at the Nakamati Library, but not kept in the Bible that we know in love, was about how there's a divine light within us all, not just with Jesus. And Jesus being God was later, too. And so God is this like angry, toxic guy who picks favorites, Kane and Abel. God, to me, is the original narcissist. People like, yeah, people like this version better.

Yes, of course. And so, yeah, people are drawn to God is evil. Jesus was good. Nobody wants to be Jesus and everyone thinks they're God. Because Jesus is harder. Yeah, being Jesus sucks. You get sent to die. Yes.

And you have to be doing that willing to preach that people are good. Yeah. The people that believe to come back to Anne Frank Jesus and Zach, the people are free. Can I slip myself in there? Yeah, you can. Marianne Williamson. Does she allowed to get in there? People that are preaching good.

Oh, she's still alive. Yeah. People that are preaching. They haven't got her yet. People that are preaching the importance of love and acceptance and inclusion are, people come for them. Yeah. God.

Yeah. So that's my hot take on God and Jesus that I'm still mulling over. Hmm. I think that makes a lot of sense. I like that take. I like thinking about that.

The difference between the two. Just pokes a little hole in it. And Jesus being like, why did you forsake me, God? That feels kind of important. Yeah. Like we put that in there and we're kind of overlooking it.

Yeah. So maybe Jesus wasn't God. Yeah. I don't think he was. Yeah. Okay. Maybe there is though, God. You think?

Is that where you're out with it? Oh, I did listen to a clip of yours about this. I'm, I'm not, evangelicalically atheist, I've surrendered to, I surrender to the universe. I think God is the dead name of the universe. We say universe now. And just like, hey, there's vibes out there. There are things in this world beyond my comprehension and control. And if I put out good vibes, I've noticed synchronicities happen. I can think of a friend right now, Claire. And I bet I look at my phone after this and she's texted me. And you think like, oh, that was random.

It's like, maybe it wasn't random. Yeah. Maybe like you thought of her for some special reason or... So I'm, I'm thinking of a, I'm thinking of a hot, sweet man in his 30s that loves his family and has a good job. Open your eyes. I bet he texts me right after this. Open your eyes, sweet art. Man?

Gender queer these days. That's what I thought. Yeah, I was going to say. You put me on trans watch a few months ago. I put you on trans watch and I let you know. I have a couple of watch lists in my life. It just makes, as a gender, queer, bisexual, people have to love me. I just moved a friend from depression watch to lesbian watch. You?

I moved her over a friend. Yeah. Oh, a lot of overlap. Yeah. I thought maybe she was giving signs of depression when I was checking in. It's actually just lesbianist. Well, I think, yeah, it might be. We're going to find out.

Oh, that's exciting. We're going to find out, but I've moved her. She's on a new watch list. Adla, thank you for clocking my own misgendering of myself. That was beautiful. I was just checking in. Yeah. Happy to know.

Yeah. I haven't, I don't, why would anyone want to be a part of, no offense, the toxic legacy of masculinity? That's how I know I'm a man is I'm like, I would not be over here if I had any other, right, right, right. You think I'm not humiliated to be a part of the team? This is a humiliating team to be a part of. You guys have done some, tell a man, no, get ready for a show. That was rude. One of the funniest things you've done in recent memory is that you, I don't know if you will fall in love because it's kind of, it's not, it's not a drag, but it is.

is an observation. One of the funniest things you've done is come into this podcast and say, I had a transformative summer that I refused to talk about and it put pieces together in a way that I didn't know was still possible.

And then to continue to reference it throughout the episode is a legitimately hilarious bit to be like, to be like I had a transformative summer that changed the way I think about what I'm capable of. I don't want to talk about it.

And I want to do this because I think this is actually a really brilliant and captivating thing to do. And I mean that. I didn't mean it as a bit, but you're right. is quite a funny bit. It's like I can feel what's actually happening

is that you want to talk about things that you know you shouldn't. And I do that sometimes where I'm like, I'm not going to talk about this, but if I was, just no. Yes. Oh my God.

Well, yeah, yeah. But it's my own, I have healing to do around it and I want to be really intentional about the words I do use when I am ready to talk about it. I'm supporting the boundary. It feels very like I'm,

yeah, on like a talk show and they're trying to get me. I'm like, I'm not ready to talk about it. And I'm not. But also I brought it up. that's the funny part I'm supporting the boundary fully I will not I will not go into it but I do think her name was Susan when his name was Corey here's a question for you because you're

this is kind of on on that topic you're somebody who talks about a lot of personal stuff on stage and you're very incisive on stage you're very insightful you have what I think to be a really beautiful mix of funny first and foremost thank God but then also like actually insightful interesting important things to say about the world we live in and the way we exist in it how do you decide when something raw that did actually affect you is like ready to go to stage? I don't know. You don't know. It just happens.

I think I air on the side of real time, share how my day went. And part of that, I think, is the charge of the comedian. Like, hey, tell me about your day. You're sacrificing your personal privacy so that we can all have a laugh or gain some beautiful insight. But I think I need to learn some boundaries around what I keep for myself. what I don't, how soon, how raw. I think, like, some space is nice.

I think John Marco said about mentioning his girlfriend and material that, like, the thing has to be resolved. Yeah. Like, it can't be live. Yeah. And so maybe that's the move. And also I've learned to add a little space because I did tweet, like, yeah, I can't wait, me when I don't want to do the thing.

And when I went on John Marco's podcast, the producer found that tweet, like the day I was going on the podcast where I replied to an email like, yeah, can't wait. And so you want to add a little plausible deniability between the activities of your day and going on state. Like if I go on stage tonight and like, went on the worst podcast you guys have ever heard, then I would that wouldn't, yeah, that would be fine. Oh, I would never. Yeah. I'm enjoying myself. I know you are. But I do think sometimes people, I found.

How do you approach? How do I approach when to take stuff to the stage? I feel similar. It's kind of like electrical currents. If a wire is cut and the end is still like sparking, it needs to at least be capped. That's not to say that if you took the cap off the current, it couldn't flow again.

It's not to say that the thing is completely resolved and I'm never going to have negative emotions about it again or that I'm completely healed of whatever thing has occurred. But I think the way John Marco put it is, frankly, even better of like, yeah, it needs to not be like a live wire of a topic in your life when you take it to the audience because also... First and foremost, I think you need to make sure that you're in a place to be funny about it.

Yes. It is simply not any audience's responsibility to, like, caretake for you through whatever shit you're going through. You better be making them laugh. Right. Stand-up's not therapy. They paid money to be at the show. Yeah. Within a set, I do think there is a little space for a freight edge or two, but don't make it the whole thing.

Although, I feel like one of the great, there's a great set of Tig coming on stage, like the day. she gets her breast cancer diagnosis. Yeah. So there is a power and a rawness of being fucking real. And you can smell it when the comic is just doing their act and they're not with you. And so it's sort of your right to take in whichever, but you're building a career. And if you're, you know, just the guy who comes on stage and talks about, wait, now I want to do a bit. We're like, hey, everybody, I had a transformative summer, but we can't talk about it.

I mean, that is a really good bit. Can I have it? For sure. I think throughout the set being like, oh, God, if I told you guys about this summer. Oh, if I were willing to get into it. Reminds me this summer. Ma'am, ma'am, ask me about this summer. Sorry.

I can't. Not taking questions at this time. Yeah, but TIG also, I will say, by the way, this, like many, like all other things, is a rule for myself. My rules are for me. My rules are not for other people. Other people are allowed to do whatever they want. My rules are for Caleb. I think TIG is an interesting example because TIG as a performer is somebody who's so

balanced and so um like joke driven to begin with I trust TIG to go and do the cancer set and Largo you know what I mean? Trust is the trust is the word yeah does the audience trust that you're okay yes and there's also there's an issue with

there's an issue with less skilled comedians trying to pull off masterful stuff too soon a thousand percent it's like well you're not good enough to behave that way yeah and that's okay there's no there's nothing mean in saying that you're not Tick Nautaro TIG was a very, very accomplished, like, died in the wall, two-words, successful, skilled, talented comedian when she did that set. Almost did they.

Sorry, Tig. What is the, I'm trying to think if there's a metaphor in, like, painting or another medium for this, like, but maybe there isn't. Maybe there isn't. This is a perfect time to ask you, Zach Zimmerman, what is so true to you? you don't get to ask questions of the barista. Oh, tell me what you mean by that. I feel like it's mostly in the Pacific Northwest,

no offense, I love Portland. But whenever I'm in a rush, I'm always behind someone who's always like, what is coffee? And I'm like, and then the bristo be like, well, we take B,

and it's like, no, ma'am, pick the thing. That is so funny. So I think a little, what's hard is I love, I love these little, like, micro interactions that we have that do breed community. I do think is important to, like, have those little moments, but not at the checkout line. Yeah.

Can I praise myself? You sure can't? I was out Dunkin' Donuts, and I got my coffee, and then I saw a woman get her coffee, and she had a tiny little grimace when she got it. And I was like, oh, did they mess it up? She's like, yeah, I didn't want the scream on top. And I was like, let them know. They'll remake it for you.

She's like, oh, I don't want to make a big deal. I was like, let him know. And she let them know, and they remade it for her. Yeah. And I, I'm proud of myself for, I don't know, just those little, I think a, oh, maybe this is what's so true. A little nudge is very powerful. Yeah. A little nudge.

My friend, but also careful, because a little nudge can be too powerful if you're unsure of who you are. Like, hey, go, go in there. My friend will nudge me and I will listen. So just, we got to look out for each other and give each other little nudges like that. Yeah, noticing is love. noticing the little grimace is loving Noticing is love And then there's an additional act of love

If you had noticed the grimace And just given her a smile To say I saw your grimace That would be love A further act of love is saying What's the grimace about? Yeah Did they mess up your coffee?

And even further You made like six or seven acts of love in that moment I made it to third base Yeah You went to third base with love That wink Third base with love Third base with love

I do think Yeah love is listening. Love is noticing. Love is, I use the Bell Hook's definition, commitment to one's spiritual growth. The willingness to extend oneself. That took a little out of my day. It took an extra 10 seconds. Yeah. I guess I did love that woman. That was love. Yeah, I am by. I'm deciding. That was love. You're by. You're by. Care and love. It is funny when you're falling for someone you don't get to say the word love. Like, I care about you. Like, you're shy to tell someone like, I love you. Are you?

me yeah oh no i girl oh i wanted who is i went on a first day recently i was like i i caught myself because i was like i shouldn't be doing that but i was like i can see a world which is very which might be very similar to this world yeah i fall madly and deeply in love with you could almost be the exact world we're living in yeah might might be and then later later did i say i love you i won't say but the idea of someone saying i love you and me saying back i can see a world. No, I say it first. Could you imagine it as the response?

That's dark. You love me. There are universes in which... We live in many worlds. Are you familiar with the Marvel universe? There are planes of existence. Can I start there? Thank you for saying that.

Are you familiar with string theory and vibrations? Yes, exactly. Zach. Did I... I don't think I did the assignment. No, you did a great job. You don't get to ask questions of the barista is a great so true. And I'm very, if there's no line, look.

It does beg the question, who then do you ask? But that's not important on this show. Google. Right. Or a friend. Right. A trusted confidante. I think if I really dove into it, I'm team.

You get to ask the brista questions, even though it ruins my own line. Even though, I know, I know, it sucks. That's why I didn't bring it up originally. This is based on a true story. I'm in an airport and an old lady is like, well, is that problematic that I had to make her an old lady? Was she old? Yeah. Well, you didn't make her.

She was like, what's a latte? and so now I'm kind of charmed by the idea of I was going to say you're making it all year old life and not knowing what a latte is I need to invent an argument that makes mine okay Hold on I already said you're behind Jeff Bezos And he's like where do you get your beans from The specific city and county

Now bitch Yeah the bitch would definitely take it over Zach I have a segment for you You ready? Wait this is an act of love This is an act of love. I'm going to read you 15 statements. You're going to tell me as quickly as you can

if you think what I just said is true or false. If you get 10 or more correct, we're going to give you 50 U.S. dollars. Wow. And may I ask? Now, yes. Is it random? What is true and not?

Or did someone sort of make it so that there's some back and forth? They're objective, trivia questions. But then the order of them. Will you deliver them to me in a random order? You're about to find out. They're ready.

Okay. There are two NFL... I have to get 10, right? You have to get 10 right. Okay. There are two NFL teams in the state of New York. Wait, we can't talk about what happened this summer. That's the second one.

You went through a transforming of this summer. Tell me about it. What's your perfect day? There are two NFL teams in the state of New York. False. False. There are three. Bank of America has more locations in the U.S.

than any other bank. false false it's chase uranus is the coldest planet in the solar system true that is true william fleming high school won state men's basketball in 2007 this is where i went to high school we won what state and men's basketball in 2007 i graduated in 2006 i have no idea true it is true every founding member of the band aerosmith is still alive false true oh bald eagles meet for life.

False. True. Spike TV is older than MTV. True. False. A group of ladybugs is called a loveliness. You're, yes, true. Even if it's not.

Thank God, it's true. The Princeton Triangle Club was founded in 1905. True. False, 1891. Skittles are banned in Norway. True. True. Reddit was originally a book review website.

True. False. Oh. The sentence. 19 letters long is 19 letters long. The sentence 19 letters long is 19 letters long? Or words? Letters.

The sentence. 19 letters long. That's the sentence. Is 19 letters long. 19 letters long. And I am. True. It's true.

Lawrence Fishburn is 6 foot 5. False. False. He's 6 foot. Snapchat was discontinued in 2021. False. That is false. The current mayor of.

Roanoke, Virginia is Travis Fleetwood. True. False. Joseph L. Cobb. How do you do? Catch and strays. Nine. No!

Wait. I want to litigate. Which ones did I get wrong? There's nothing to litigate. I don't, I could, that could get me out of a lot of minds. That could get me out of a lot. Don't tell anybody that. So don't sweat it.

I thought one of the questions is going to, I'm ready to answer. To answer. The question I refused to answer earlier. Oh, okay. There's two buttons in front of you. One does nothing. One kills somebody.

Zach, thank you so much for doing this. This was lovely. You don't want to know what my perfect day is? I would love to know what your perfect day is. I thought you were doing a bit about your summer and I wasn't going to actually push you on it. Oh, no. What is your perfect day? October 3rd.

Okay. It's not too hot. It's not too cold. It's really cute. All you need is a light. a bit of a deflection but really cute um i was thinking about i was peeing it's it involves coffee and uh maybe an omelet oh what kind of omelet oh my god because you know i'm ham onions and cheese well i'm a vegetarian because i care about the sentient beings other than humans and i don't we've made that

clear i love cheese and maybe a little salsa on it a little cream fresh a little sour cream yeah and um sweet potato or a really good home fries like a twice fried twice baked home fries English muffin yeah butter jelly and there should probably be some sex in your perfect day for my perfect day yeah I think the perfect day starts with a little because I don't know about you guys

I wake up a little ready to go I do but morning sex is a chore of all chores morning sex is like asking me to run a marathon I'm like, I need a, I need to brush my teeth, I need a shower, I need to stretch, I need, like, it's just too, morning sex is like, who, what? No, it's the best. I don't like it. And I don't like when someone tries that morning sex with me without having, like, brush their teeth and whatnot. Oh, yeah, you got to go brush. You got a brush little mints. You don't have a little sex corner with mints and condoms and a gallon of lube. Something like that, yeah.

giant you know at a stadium when they've got like yeah ketchup mustard mayonnaise yeah and i have the little paper cups with it too oh my god just bring a paper cup of loop to the bed to the bedroom uh Zach this was so much fun thank you for doing it oh I had a blast tell people where they can find you um I live at boundary I live at boundary um I'm on Instagram ZZZ double ZZ um that's easy the word double and ZZ um that's the big place Instagram TikTok uh Twitter sorry um And your stand-up special, which is on YouTube. Yeah, I watch my stand-up special called Surprise Me. It's about my search for a definition of love, and Dunkin' Donuts is there.

And then I have a book that came out two years ago called Is It Hot in Here? Or My Suffering for All Eternity for the Sins I Committed on Earth. You can get that on Bookshop.com or ask your local independent bookstore to order it for you. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Thanks for doing it, Zach. Thanks for having me. That was a hate gum podcast.

What's going on? It's Lamorn Morris. And Hannah Simone. And we host The. mess around a new girl rewatch podcast now on headgum now here's the thing every single week we chat about an episode of new girl and we really get into it like we get up in there we get up in there you know we reminisce about our times on set we share behind the scenes tea we react to rewatching episodes that we haven't seen in years we talk about how jake johnson is dog that's not true

we talk about so many memories we have of working with the biggest stars on the planet i'm talking Prince, Taylor Swift, Olivia Rodrigo. We're just two BFFs having a good old time, okay? Sometimes we even talk to other co-stars like Zoe Day Chanel, Jake Johnson, Max Greenfield, and Damon Wayne's Jr. And your dad. We talk to your dad on this show as well. Make sure you subscribe to the mess around wherever you get your podcasts.

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