Sober Motivation: Sharing Sobriety Stories - Behind The Mask: Dean McDermott's Sobriety Story

Episode Date: March 11, 2025

On the episode, we are joined by Dean McDermott, who shares his rocky road to sobriety. He opens up about his traumatic childhood and his rise to fame. Over the years, Dean had numerous failed attempts at sobriety, and it wasn’t until he was willing to surrender that things changed. This is Dean’s story on the Sober Motivation podcast. ---------- Dean's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/imdeanmcdermott/ Join the Sober Motivation Community: https://sobermotivation.mn.co/ 00:00 Introduction to the Sober Motivation Podcast 00:16 Meet Dean: A Journey Begins 00:39 Early Life Struggles and Trauma 02:52 First Encounter with Alcohol 03:56 Losing a Parent and Turning to Alcohol 04:30 Descent into Addiction 05:52 Failed Attempts at Sobriety 08:32 Life in Hollywood and Further Downfall 13:04 The Turning Point: Surrender and Recovery 20:15 Finding Faith and Building a New Life 22:45 Challenges of Staying Sober 30:24 The Turning Point: Realizing the Need for Change 32:06 A Cry for Help: Public Mistakes and Personal Realizations 34:00 The Path to Recovery: Embracing the 12 Steps 34:52 Parenting and Personal Growth: Lessons from Recovery 35:58 The Struggle with Sobriety: Overcoming Self-Doubt 43:44 The Power of Willingness: Embracing Change 51:46 Finding Purpose: The Role of Service in Recovery 54:17 Final Thoughts and Reflections

Welcome back to season four of the Sobermotivation podcast. Join me, Brad, each week as my guests and I share incredible and powerful sobriety stories. We are here to show sobriety as possible, one story at a time. Let's go. On this episode of the podcast, we are joined by Dean McDermott, who shares his Rocky Road to sobriety. He opens up about his traumatic childhood and his rise to fame. Over the years, Dean has had numerous failed attempts at sobriety, and it wasn't until

he was willing to surrender that things could change. And this is Dean's story on the Subur Motivation podcast. Welcome back to another episode of the Subur Motivation podcast. Today we've got Dean with us. Dean, how are you? I'm good. I'm good. I'm okay. I'm okay. Let me rephrase it. I'm okay. We got to be honest about our feelings, right? So I'm just okay today. Some things, life is life in a little bit. Yeah, I hear you on that. I'm with you. I'm with you on that, man. We talked before so we nowhere. You may have an idea where things they're at. What was it like for you growing up? Growing up was interesting. I'm from Toronto, Canada, and my dad was an alcoholic, and my mom was in Normie. We grew up in government housing, so the Canadian hood. So things started out

interesting right from jump. You know, I like to do trauma work with some of my clients that I work with in recovery. And, you know, after doing my fourth step, I wanted to go deeper into, you know, my resentments, my character defects and, of course, where they came from. So I went all the way back and started looking at traumas. And I completely forgot about the very first trauma. The day I was born November 16th, 1966, dead, along with my mother. And they brought us back. All right. They brought us back to life. And my mother suffered severe amnesia from it and had to spend six months in the hospital. So I was sent home to my three older sisters who were just babies themselves.

My oldest sister was 12, 13, and my dad was in jail. So right out of the gate, you know, I lost that imprinting with mom and was sort of put into a house sort of chaos. And dad wasn't around. So parents are supposed to make us feel protected safe. and loved. So that wasn't there. So that flipped me into fear right away. Before I was even cognizant of it, right? So the base of fear grew and grew as I got older. And so I was constantly in fight, flight, flight or freeze, which is an incredibly uncomfortable place to be. I was walking around like this. A fear of judgment, fear of getting physically hurt, fear of never being loved,

fear of not being successful, fear of not being intelligent. These fears, So I was really uncomfortable as a kid. I didn't want to be on the planet because I thought if this is life, I don't want to have any part of it. So at age eight, I started having these eight or nine suicidal ideations because if life feels like this, I don't want to be a part of it. And lucky for me, I didn't know, I started to take my life. And when I was 12, our hockey team won the championship. It was Italian neighborhood surrounding the government housing. So a lot of my teammates were Italian.

So we went back to this one player's house. And they put on this big Italian feast. And then after that, dad brought out the Grappa, which is Italian Moonshine, basically. And we started doing shots. So that very first shot, all those fears just washed away. Just as it burned on the way up and I became flush, everything just escaped. body the fear of judgment the fear of failure the fear of not being loved and you know I came out of my shell I was like this is the guy I want to be I was funny I think I even danced with the

lampshade on my head and I was like oh this is the guy I want to be right until I got home and just painted the house with Italian food throwing up everywhere and I was like okay I'm never doing that again and just continued you know to trudged you life uncomfortable Three days before my 15th birthday, I came home from school. It was just my mom and I at this point. And she died sitting right next to me of a pulmonary embolism. And I tried to resuscitate her, but she died instantly. So my whole world fell, the bottom of my world completely fell out.

And I just froze, right? I was so full of fear at this point that I just froze. I stopped everything. I stopped school. I stopped pursuing my hockey. career. I wanted to play in the NHL. Everything stopped. And I started blackout drinking at 16 because now I had all this free will too. Like the center of my universe was gone. So I was basically, I kicked around with two of my older sisters and then I was out on my own since I was 17

and just continued to blackout drink because it was my coping mechanism. Right. That's my coping skill was, you know, putting booze and drugs. I started experimenting with with hallucinogenic that led to cocaine and then opiates and there it was off on a 41-year run. So having fun, don't get me wrong. I had some fun. It's funny. An old-timer said, if you didn't have fun doing drugs, then you got robbed. You got robbed.

You weren't doing it right. But it was fun until it wasn't, you know. I hear that all the time. You know, they worked until they didn't. And it's so true. just like anything now like i can i put down drugs and alcohol but i could pick up you know another shopping for instance or i could pick up anger you know i could keep substituting one drug for another whether it's something physically i do or something emotionally so i was ripping and running

for 41 years and in in about 30 of those years i would try to get clean and sober yeah to no avail What did that look like, though? Walk us through, if you can remember it, too, of those earlier days of, you know, maybe given things a try. Yeah, I was 26, 27. Yeah. And I had a problem because that's when cocaine use really kicked in hard. And my first wife at the time knew someone who was in the program. And it was AA.

And I was like, okay, but I don't have a problem with alcohol. I'm having a problem with cocaine. I didn't put the two together. This is the same disease, right? And again, being in full-blown ego, flight from reality, self-seeking, the smartest guy in the room, you know, all our traits, right? I was full-blown in those. And I fought against it. I fought against it.

I'd go to meetings, but I was like, this is a cult. This is really weird. how the hell do these 12 steps by reading a book and writing some shit down going to keep me clean it's over. I don't get it. And my problem is cocaine. So you guys just talk about alcohol.

I don't know a problem. So much so that I got kicked out of what I was trying to make my home group because I went off on the secretary telling him that he was full of shit that I'm not an alcohol. Blah, blah, blah. So then that continued, you know,

like I said, for 30 years. just trying to do the same thing, it's trying to do it my way. Right? Yeah. And then, you know, step two or three, where the God higher power thing is introduced, I was having nothing to do with because God had just taken my mother away when I was 15 and gave me this, you know, raging alcoholic father, like, what kind of a loving God would do that? So I had nothing to do with God whatsoever.

Didn't want to touch it. So, again, giving my disease a lot of. things to get in my ear about and lie about. You know, I have this disease that lies to me in my own voice. So, well, you know, it just excuses, excuses, and I'd get a week, I'd go out, I'd get eight months, I'd go out, I'd get a month, I'd just kept relapsing and relapsing, burning things down. You know, I had a very successful career in Canada, and I was buying properties. He's like I was a big fish in a small pond in Toronto.

And it got me a green card, right? These extraordinary ability act in the immigration log got me, you know, and my family at the time, my first wife and my son, a green card. So I moved to L.A. And I started to destroy everything again. You know, I was making great inroads establishing myself in Hollywood and really starting to get noticed. Because again, I went from a big fish in a small pond to a small fish in a really big pond, but I was starting to make inroads.

And, you know, there were problems in the marriage, but, you know, putting alcohol on top of that just made things worse. So I did a movie in Ottawa, and that's where I met Tori. And, you know, we fell in love. We fell in love. It literally was love at first sight. And off we were. You know, she was married, I was married, both in unhappy marriages, and we found this love and excitement for each other.

So it's party time. It's on. So we had a lot of fun together. And, you know, she reeled it in because it was like, okay, that was fun. Now let's get back to normal life. And I was like, no, this is great. This is great, especially going from not being known to, like, overnight, knowing everybody knows who I am.

And now I'm all of a sudden, I'm a celebrity. Yeah. I'm a celebrity with the disease of addiction and people are just giving me shit. Anything I wanted. I could drink in restricted places. People were giving me drugs, cars, motorcycles, clothes, you name it. It's so funny when you become famous, people just send you stuff. So stuff just shows up at your door.

So this is great because that was, that's what I wanted. I just always wanted more because I was trying to fill that hole. in my soul, right? So I had all this great stuff given to me, and it meant nothing. It meant absolutely nothing to me because I meant nothing to me. You know, I didn't, and I couldn't see that at the time, right? Because it just kept coming in. And it wasn't until things sort of slowed down and I started to destroy my career by pushing it away,

not showing up and doing the right thing. You know, I started to just push away my career. And I was like, okay, well, you know, I'm really successful with Tori and the things we do together. So I lost my autonomy, right? I wasn't Dean McDermott. I was, you know, Tori Spelling's boyfriend, Tori's fiance, Tori's husband, Mr. Tori Spelling.

So I lost my autonomy and I was like, okay, well, we'll continue to work forever and make a ton of money doing reality shows or TV shows or whatever. And that's just not the case. case. So when things slowed down and I have no career anymore because I was implicit in burning it down, I just kept on that path. I was really good at building myself back up. And then when I got successful again, I was like, I'm miserable so, right? I'm miserable because inside I'm hollow. I'm a shell of the person. So, you know, if this is what being

I'm sober, like, fuck that. I'm going to get loaded. So again, I'd burn everything down again, build it up. And it wasn't until this last one that I had nothing in me to build back up. I had no motivation, no desire, no passion. I was just a shell of a person. And I, you know, I didn't know who I was. I didn't know what I wanted from life anymore.

I was just a dad taking kids to school and picking them up, making dinner, doing homework. miserable wearing the same thing for weeks on end because I didn't give a shit right closet again full of beautiful clothes that were given to me or that I bought price tag still on them never worn because that's how I felt about myself I don't deserve to wear nice things I'm just a piece of shit taking my kids to school being a half-ass dad a horrible dad emotionally spiritually I mean I was just checking a box taking school check go home be miserable pick them up feed them start drinking start drugging put them to bed start all over again until i got to a point where i was getting angry that i was i woke up you know i didn't want i you know five

we got five beautiful kids and a wife down the hall and and i don't want to be on this planet that's where this disease took me yeah so i found myself at 56 again i don't know what i'm doing and i really surrender was the biggest thing for me. And I think it's the biggest thing for a lot of us because we're so used to living in addiction and it's easy, right? It's all we've ever known, especially as far as coping skills go.

Right? It's all we've ever known. So it's easy to stay in this lane. Right. And we know where it ends, jails, institutions, and death. And this other road goes on for infinity and we don't know what's at the end of it.

but it's a lot better than for, you know, this other path we're on. So, I didn't know how to get into that lane, right? I had to, I finally surrendered and said, okay, clearly, I don't know how to be a husband. I don't know how to be a father. I don't know how to be a son, a brother, a co-worker, a friend, or a normal human being. You know, so I just, I threw in the towel. I threw in the towel and I was like, okay, I need help. I can't do this anymore.

And I went into treatment. And I, like we talked about earlier, I made a deal with myself that I'm doing this a thousand percent. I'm all in. Because you're either all in or you're all out. You can't be a little bit pregnant. You can't have a foot in each one and expect things to change. So I jumped in. I went to Harmony Place here in Woodland Hills, which is an incredible facility.

and that's where the work began, where I started to figure out how do I do this thing called life? Because I'm like, okay, I'm starting ground zero. I've surrendered, right? I've surrendered, and I've shredded the fact that I don't know what I'm doing. So what do I do?

Right? Interesting, yeah, yeah, really interesting. You mentioned that there too, though. You go into the center with sort of the question of how do I do life as opposed to, and maybe you're in line with this, what I'm going to say next and maybe not. I always thought the drugs and alcohol were my big problem.

But I realized I had sobered up. And my life was maybe even more chaotic at those times than when I was wrapped up with the stuff. I liked how you put that as to go into this to figure out where's the disconnect there as far as like how to live life and why does drugs and alcohol always wind up being my solution. But it's good. In your story, we get a clear picture of it because early on you had a lot of stuff

happen, drugs and alcohol really works so well. I really worked so well to make all of what you shared about all those fears, which I can relate to of being so uncomfortable in my own skin and life and trying to do what I'm supposed to do, make friends. I just never felt like I could get any of it right. Drugs and alcohol, the same time I went to my first party. I mean, I was getting phone numbers. I was talking to girls. Everything came together and I was like, how could life be any different? I mean, this is great. What took so long for us to meet? Yes. But I love that, wrapping all that up there.

I love how you mentioned that too. I'm really interested, though, as well on top of that, your approach to surrender because you sharing your story there with us that you tried this over a 30 year span or so of going to meetings, trying it out, things getting in the way, getting some time, going back to how things were. I mean, what does that surrender feel like and look like differently maybe for you this time or even if it was involved previous times. A great weight was lifted off my shoulders when I surrendered because again, I still thought

I knew everything. I was the smartest guy in the room and everybody was an idiot. A great weight was lifted off my shoulder because I didn't have to wear that mask of being super intellectual in the life of the party and the know it all and charming and all that shit. Like I could actually just sit in the fact I. I didn't know anything. There was a great relief in that.

It's great, it's something today that I talk about in my groups is it's okay to not know, right? It's okay, you know, if someone's gonna judge you for not knowing something, then again, you know, that's their side of the street, right? But I can't take it personally because it's gonna hurt me because I'm so sensitive, right? So I love that.

I love being able to say, I don't know. Because you could ask me, he's like, hey, Dean, how does this microphone? How do you build a microphone? Well, let me tell you. And I bullshit my way through making a microphone. I have no idea how to make a microphone, right? But I needed to be right. I needed to feed my ego and I needed to raise my low self-esteem.

So I was always on. So now I'm just like, yeah, I don't know how to make my microphone, but I have this $1,000 little computer in my hand. Maybe let's look it up. Right? So I can evolve, so I can keep learning, right? You know, in my addiction, again, I keep saying this. I thought I knew everything.

So if I know everything, I don't have to continue to learn. So to me, that stifles growth, right? When we stop learning, we stop evolving. So the surrender was a great relief, but it was scary as hell. Because again, all right, I threw in the town and I admitted I don't know what I'm doing. Where do I go from here? And I guess I'm lucky because I had those 30 years ago in and out, maybe I learned some things from osmosis and maybe it was my age that, again, I still didn't see, like I thought, I went into it thinking like a lot of people do. If I can just do 30 days of not drinking or not drugging, I'm going to be okay.

I just need to, you know, dry out. But I did go in with going, I need to learn how to live life. They had a really good mental health program, and that's what attracted me to Harmony Place. So we could really, we really started to attack that first, right? Once I was in and stabilized. And so they came at me with, you know, the drugs and alcohol are the remedy of my problems. I could put them down, but I'm left with this. So we need to straighten this out.

And that's when it really clicked for me. And it only took a week and a half, two weeks. for me to get that. And again, I think it might have been a combination of my age and doing the time I did do in the first fellowship. Yeah. Maybe it was my higher power. I don't know, you know, which I still wasn't having anything to do with.

I wasn't having anything to do with. But then again, I had to keep reminding myself. I made a deal with myself that I'm in. I'm going to take direction. I'm going to be honest, open-minded and welling. So I'm like, okay, I'll put a pinky toe in. I'll put a pinky toe in and just through routine and working the steps and the spiritual principles and just hitting my knees every morning whether I believe they're not.

You know, because I was like, okay, I'm going to, again, open-minded and willing and I'm going to take direction from others. It's okay, well, that's what they're telling me to do. So I'll do it. Yeah. Check it out. Check it out. Nothing changes if nothing changes. So I'm like, okay, well, let's give it a shot.

And so first I used my mother, right? She's my angel. So I used her as my higher power. And I heard this amazing share at a meeting about this gentleman after 20 years of sobriety became quadriplegic. And he's an atheist. And the 16 years he has since the accident, he's got 36. years in total, but the 16 years since the accident, he's, I've never had a more spiritual, fulfilling life. And I was like, wow, because like, we all looked at each other, like, our jaws dropped.

Like, how do you do that? There's a surfing accident. So he was acting. I'm like, how do you get that spiritual as an atheist after that happens to you? And his God was Gus, glorious universal spirit. So I ran with that for a while. you know, Gus grant me the serenity to accept the things I can. So every time I would refer to God, it was Gus. And so I started to get some traction with that and started to incorporate that into my program. That's when the steps really kicked in for me. It started to make sense.

And I just kept doing, you know, the same thing over and over again until finally it's just, boom. Just like, I have God in my life. What am I fighting? What am I fighting? I know I need some kind of faith in this program. I need faith to fight fear. You know, I need faith in others as well. And I started to discover that with, you know, finding a home group and really reaching out and connecting with others.

I was like, oh, this is faith. This is how faith works. And started to see the signs, right? My eyes were open to seeing the signs of a higher power present in my life, where before I would think there were coincidence. Right. It was like, no, that was just a coincidence. a coincidence that I spun down the frozen highway spinning about eight times with six grams of cocaine in my pocket and didn't hit anybody and hurt anybody. That's just a coincidence. That was a

higher power in my life. Yeah. It's so interesting though. You mentioned that too, the higher power element, you know, people plug into, I went to, you know, treatment center many moons ago. And as always people, they're different backgrounds and everything people. come into the mix, right? One guy had a trouble with faith in one of them, I remember one of the counselors there was like, do you check that the floor is there when you get out of bed? And the guy was like, no, I don't know if any of us check to see if the floor is there. We just have faith that there's going to be a floor when we roll out of bed. And I thought it was just a great way to open the door to like maybe the next level of things. But it is, it is something to, you know, I'm wondering

too back to like how you shared sort of, you know, becoming famous at the, that level and, you know, like how that changes maybe the dynamics in your life and then kicking off with the partying, but then like other people scaling it back, but you wanting to keep things going. I mean, did you recognize like a change in your life to at that time when things started to pick up for you in that direction? No, because I was so far in it. I was a kid in a candy store. Right. Every day something would show up at the door. So it just fed into him. It must be doing something right. And it gave, you know, that, that voice in my head going, yeah, oh, mortgages paid. You're getting all this stuff. People, you know, this is what our show was

big, Tori Dean, Home Street, Hollywood. We were like this power couple. People look up to you. Couples want to be like you, right? So there was no way that I was looking at any sort of problem because I didn't think it existed. How are you keeping it together with all the stuff, going on and then were you able to put it in compartments of this is sort of party time, this is time when we, you know, show up to do that or did it all blend together? They all blended in. There's so many interviews that I did, you know, the vodka soda and the coffee cup. You know, we do these electronic press tours where I don't know if you're familiar with them, but, you know, we just have a studio. We're all lit and all done up. And then they just plug us

into different news outlets across the country. And we talk about the show. So I constantly had a vodka soda going. I remember, I think it was a big interview. It was, I think it was Good Morning America came to this Airbnb that we were running in our very first show, Toray Dean, in love. And just plainly sitting there with that vodka soda, the lime in it. It wasn't even hiding it at that point. And I was like, you arrogant, son of a bitch. You know, this is big.

Good morning America. Who gets to do that to begin with? And we're at that level. So that's, again, that's self-destruction, right? That's burning things down. And it wasn't until I surrendered and got an achievement that I started to learn that the self-destruction, burning things down, was all, you know, how I felt about myself, that I didn't deserve it once I got there, right?

that I'm some kind of fraud. I was waiting for them to pull back the curtain like the Wizard of Oz. Right. And really see me for who I am. I'm never going to work again. People are going to see them a piece of shit on and on. Yeah. So once I started, once I learned why I was burning things down,

was I able to start looking inward and process that? And step four, right, finding all these character defects, then I tell the people I work with you. You don't know until you know. Right? You have to sit down and write them out because we can all think that, hey, yeah, no, I have an anguish or, hey, you know, I'm manipulating. But it's just kicking around in our head. It's not until we put it to pen to paper that it's real, I believe, right? And it's very catharty to get it out of here to get it on a paper and then share with another person. It becomes real. So now I know what they are. And I know, you know, when I get a shortcoming and I'm heading into a character defect that I, I'm going to.

can stomp it out. As before, I would just run into it, full force. You know, I'd run into the burning building while everybody's running out. The Kool-Aid man. Yeah. So, yeah, that's why I think the rehab is so beneficial for so many, right? But one of the biggest things I see that it helps people with all the stuff you're talking about, but it also removes us from the environment that we're in. Like getting removed from that environment that we're, you know, it's causing a lot of the same stuff that we're used to can really, you know, change things the direction and give us a different perspective. And then also the professionals and the groups and the support and the meetings and everything else adds up onto it. But sometimes if people

are stuck in the same environment where all the chaos and all the messes, it's hard to get them out of there to really focus on, you know, other things that are going on. I'm wondering, if you have any thoughts on that. And then I also, I add some. something else I was curious about too. Okay. You know, there was a stretch there that about 60, 70% of the people in treatment were from Oklahoma because there's a real meth epidemic in Oklahoma and in that part of the world, but particularly like a lot of people from Oklahoma.

And, you know, our literature talks about people, places, and things. So it's great to get them out of that environment and they start to see it, right? They can't start to see that, hey, I can't be around people who are holding, or using or drinking, I can't. And I help them set up boundaries, right? And it's really hard because when they start to get it, when the light goes off,

they have to go back home. That breaks my heart, because I know they're walking into a minefield, right? So we try to armor them up as best as we can because they're going back into that. And a lot of people come out from different states want to stay in California. You know, they want to do it geographical

because they know they've learned enough in recovery that they're in trouble when they go back, even if they create boundaries with these people, places and things, because it's everywhere. It's rampant. And that's not to say that it's not here and on every corner here in California. But, you know, there's so many other factors to socioeconomics. And a lot of people can't get out because they can't afford to move to the next state. So that's a heartbreaking thing of it, is to do. all this great work, armor them up, and to go back and, you know, and then see them a month later.

But that's a good thing is that you can see them a month later because some people don't come back. Right. They never make it back in. Yeah. So that's the heartbreaking thing about working in recovery. But the rewards, like I said, when the lights go off on someone and they start, it starts to click.

It's just, that's the most amazing thing. Because I know I was there and it didn't click. Yeah. Right. Yeah. And I fought against it for so long. So when the surrender happens, man, it's a beautiful thing. Yeah. It's almost like time collapses in those moments to where it's, thank goodness, you know, don't have to maybe some people hopefully don't have to spend, you know, 10 years, 15 years, 20 years, trying to figure it out and can kind of get, you know, not that it's like, you know, linear journey straight up from there. It's, you know, you have your footing, right? You can see the light in that sense that this path is not going to get us to where we want to be. It's complete destruction on this too.

I'm wondering too, like towards leading up to you going to the treatment and everything. I mean, were there any events or anything? And what did your life like look like directly before that to say for you to throw your hands up and make the call? Oh, yeah. Thank you for asking because I just skipped over that. It was horrible. It was horrible. I was so toxic and I was so full of venom and anger and self-loving and hatred and the list goes on and on.

That's all I had to give. So I gave that to Tori. I gave that to all my kids. I gave that to anybody who was around me. So I was a horrible human being. I was a horrible human being. That's when I knew I had a problem. I had a real problem because I was just in attack mode all the time.

defensive, condescending, egotistical, crude, nasty. And I was destroying this beautiful family. I was hurting these beautiful kids. And there was one particular incident that another argument broke out. And I was just in a fit of white rage. and I, you know, was raging against everybody. And I was so angry and hurt by what I had done. And I was so hurt, too, because there was a lack of, the relationship was waning.

It was falling apart. And I was hurt by that. So I went out and I went upstairs, loaded. and I put out this post that Tori and I are divorcing. Unbeknownst to her, I was like, okay, I'll show you, you're not hearing me. You're not hearing me? You're going to hear me now. And, you know, I woke up the next day.

It had like my phone blowing up and it was all over the place that were divorcing. And that's when I knew I fucked up because my kids were like, Dad, how could you do that? you know, our friends are going to see that. It instilled a whole bunch of fear in them, that they didn't know what their next day. It was on a Friday, so they didn't know what their Monday was going to look like

when they went back to school because it was everywhere, right? And it really hurt them. And it really hurt them that I wouldn't even talk to them about it first before I did something like that. But I was so wrapped up in my anger, ego, and self-loathing that I was just like, fuck it. And, you know, took a handful of ambion. that night too to go to sleep and was like, well, it's not going to matter if I don't wake up. All of this doesn't matter.

And so when I woke up, well, man, I, he talked about feeling the floor. You know, I got out of bed and I felt about this tiny, about this big on the floor. And I knew I had fucked up. I knew I'd fucked up on a big scale, on a real public scale. And looking at it in high, When I was in treatment, it was also a cry for help. It really, it was a cry for help. And again, did it in the wrong way.

But it led me here. It got me to hear. And it got me to recoveries got me to a much better place. Is it clowns and blames? You know, am I shitting rainbows? No. But where I was from where, from when I came, it's infinitely better. It's infinitely better as long as I keep showing up.

I keep doing the work. I keep being of service. You know, I love recovery today and I love the 12 steps. And I try to teach that to my kids. You know, it's just beautiful filter for life. You know, it's the other thing to teach is once you get through the 12 steps, right, you use this, hold a book up, I say, you filter your life should this. Anything that's going on in your day, any feeling you cop, any situation, run it through this,

filter of the 12 steps from one to 12. And by the time you're halfway through them, your issue is going to be resolved or it's going to look like nonsense, right? Yeah. It's just a great tool to learn spiritual principles and coping skills because I'm not sure, are you parrot? Yeah, I have three kids, yeah. Three kids, yeah. So I've fucked up, you fucked up. We're going to continue to fuck up as parents, right? Because we have all these books on parenting, but boots on the ground is completely different story. Yeah. Right. So, you know, my, my grandfather fucked up, my dad fucked up, blah, blah, blah, and we'll continue. But it's to what degree now, right? If I had those coping skills that I was lacking for all those years, would I be a better father?

Yeah, probably, but I'd also fuck up too, right? Because we are human. So I just, yeah, I wish they would teach it in school because you know it's not a 56 year old man how to grow up and be a man yeah when i go back to my high school days and stuff i mean i was always getting in trouble but i'm just like yeah it was always it was just a discipline approach discipline out of school suspension getting around you know all that type of stuff it it took a lot longer for anybody to really realize there was more more going on i'm wondering too you i mean you reflect back on all this and you know share it in a way that you know obviously you know where things went and how they ended up for your life.

But a share in a way of accountability and I'm working on it. What have you learned about yourself? I mean, since embarking on this journey? What I've learned about myself in this journey is that my character is being revealed through recovery. You know, I didn't know who I was and I didn't know who I was for the longest time. And that's where we put on all these different masks. and I'm an actor.

So, I mean, I'm able to lie and bullshit my way through everything and lie and bullshit myself through everything that I'm learning. That's not the person I was put on this planet to be, right? I've been put on this planet to be a kind and loving human being, help others and be of service and just have a beautiful life, right? but again, I have the disease of addiction and it took me down this road. It doesn't have to end that way, right?

It's teaching me that, hey, I can get back to who I'm supposed to be and I can take accountability for all my wrongdoings and it's okay because, again, I'm very contrite. If I hurt you and I apologize to you, I would apologize to you for weeks, right? But I understand that, you know,

now my word means something and if I apologize to you, you accept it, and we can move on. It's just building character. It keeps revealing the character, my strength of character, my adaptability, my intelligence, my self-esteem. It just more and more gets revealed every day.

So what I've learned in this is that I can grow. I can get out of this. Anybody can get out of this. There is a way out, right? But there's some work involved. And it can make me a better person. definitely make me a better person than I was in my addiction. But for the 40 more years, hopefully, that I have in this lifetime,

I can be happy and free and enlightened and love others. Because what I've experienced doing that so far, having self-love and giving it away freely, what an incredible way to live. So I don't know if that answered your question, but I guess change is possible is what I've learned from this. Yeah, which just had me. thinking too. I mean, you shared before in your story about like these highs and then burn it down,

hit this mountain top. But I think as correct me if I'm wrong here, but I think as humans, we have this outwardly vision of if we reach these goals, then we'll be satisfied. And like some people, they might be. I think those of us that struggle with addiction, it doesn't matter what it is, where it's not going to, the external things are not going to fill that internal void that we feel. Right. Some people talk about a black hole or something like that, right? There's a size hole. Yeah, something like that, right? So you hit these peaks and then you burn it down and then go back on this journey of building it back up. Maybe thinking that, you know, once I get here, all good, you know, and I have, you know, my thing is not the, you know, that type of things. But I've had those things in my life too where I'm just like, if I get there, you know, of course, right?

If I get that car, get that truck, whatever, blah, blah, blah, that relationship. You'll be. good. And then every time I reflect back, I'm like, you know, it wore off so quick, sort of the fun of it. And I relate that back to sort of my trouble with getting sober for so long. My whole life was failure. I was a convicted felon at 18. I got first time arrested at 16. I got deported from the U.S. Got a lifetime ban back to Canada, you know, went to jail, failed every test I ever took, you know, was in learning centers, ADHD, doctors, psych wards, treatment. Wow. I felt, you know, I felt like such a failure that it became normal. It just became normal to just always come up short.

And the idea of sobriety, I used to go to meetings when I was 18 and 19. And it's the weirdest thing. I was the youngest. I don't know, just guessed 30 years or so. And I would hear of sort of how people's lives were changing. And I would always think to myself as I left there and went over to get some beer right after, is that I would think, you know, I don't know how that life would look. It was such a foreign concept to me to have a life of no chaos and a life of a steady

job and not getting fired all the time or just not showing up. And I just always find it so interesting to sort of hear different people's perspectives on what we feared about maybe a sober life, even though it's beautiful and we see it now, but maybe that feeling emotions and not being able to just hit the, ejection button all the time. I mean, is anything like that for you about sort of maybe what you felt held you back from plugging in or anything? It's funny. I was just talking to a friend of mine in the program and he shared with me. He's just, you know, only an addict would go to these meetings and hear how people's lives were horrible. Did these 12 steps and now their life was

amazing. Only an addict would keep going in those meetings going, I don't get it, where a normal person would go to one meeting and go, oh, I got to do this, I got to do this, I got to do this, and go out and do it. Right. But we as addicts are just like, no, I need proof it works. I need proof it works. I don't understand how doing these, reading this book and doing this, these child steps is going to help me. I need proof before I'm going to attempt it. Right. And I think that kept me from it. I want to see the proof, but I was blinded to it because every meeting, there's the proof from the podium or from the share, right? You know, and we've heard horrendous stories from doing deplorable things behind dumpsters for drug money, alcohol. And still, yeah, I don't get it.

You did your 12, you did 12 steps and your life turned around, now you own a company? Yeah, no. I need to do. Now I need more research. It's, there's so many things, right? There's so many things that keep me or get me from doing it. And it was me, right? It was just self.

It was fear because we don't know what recovery looks like. Because we, like I said, we've been running in this lane for so long. It's comfortable, right? When I feel uncomfortable or a cop a feeling, I put drugs and alcohol on it is fine, even though it's worse when I ate the next day, right? Because now, you know, I still have those same feelings, but now I have shame and guilt because I got loaded and God knows what I did. So, again, I needed proof.

I needed proof. And even I had a sponsor with a whole whack of time, but still just couldn't, because, again, I was just so into me. It was all about me. I was the mayor of Deanville. I was omnipotent.

I was godlike, even though I didn't believe in God, but I was the God of my universe. So if something just didn't jive with me or you couldn't prove it to me, it was bullshit. And if you couldn't prove it to me, then I had no use for you either. I don't know. Did they ask you? It does 100%.

And I think it goes back of what I'm getting from it. I was talking with somebody else actually this morning about it. I think one of the most difficult times, and you work with people who are going through this, I've worked with people going through this for 14 years. And one of the biggest challenges is that there is, it's so hard to say because it's a really interesting dynamic. but there's got to be some sort of level of willingness that we have to put forward. But I feel like the willingness comes from the pain that we go through,

or maybe as you're saying is like kind of the research, right, go back out and see if it works. And it's one of the most difficult spots of supporting people on the journey because it's sometimes it's like they're ready, but they're not ready, you know, to say, my way, you got to be like, you got to get to that spot of surrender and say, you know, the way I look at it.

at it in my life, my best thinking, my best planning, my best ideas. I mean, it got me in the worst positions in life. And I had to get to the spot to put everything aside and say, you know what, Brad, you got yourself here and you can do a lot of incredible things in life and make a lot of cool things happen in life, but you ain't going to figure this out on your own. You're not. And I fought with that just butted heads time and time again. It was also confusing because sometimes it would work for a little bit. Yeah. You know, I would kick the drugs. I would, you know, sober up from drinking for a little bit and then, you know, get back into moderation or I'm just going to dabble a little bit. Three days later, boom, you know, it's disaster. Yeah. Yeah. You know, certainly

experience that a lot, working recovery. And, you know, my sponsor always says that, you know, hopefully one day the pain will be so great that you'll finally take action. And hopefully now, you know, with all the shit that's on the street now, with fentanyl, hopefully they make it back. Right. You know, so, but hopefully one day, yeah,

the pain will be so great that you'd be willing to take action. Yeah. And then again, that's what it comes down to. It's all, it's willingness, willingness to surrender, willing to be honest,

willing to be open-minded, willing to work with others, willing to take direction from others, you know, listen to predecessors. Yeah. It's all about willingness. But again,

what's the, what's lighting the wick? Right. And it's pain. Yeah. It's pain. And if you're not ready to light the wick on that, you haven't experienced enough pain. Yeah. In my opinion. Yeah. Yeah, for sure.

Just looking towards wrapping up, a two-fold question for you. Okay. If there's anything that we missed that you want to mention, we'll start with that one, actually. Is there anything that we just haven't discussed here that you'd like to share with people listening? I don't think we've missed anything, but I like to share with people who are listening and who are struggling. You know, my sponsor always says that hell has an exit, right? And no matter how far down you've gotten, hell has an exit and you can get through this. And I want you to know that you're worth it.

You're worth it. And life is beautiful. It really is. Life is hard as hell, but life is beautiful. And, you know, we can get out of that hell of that life and start. to experience the beauty of life and the gifts it has to give us. But, you know, I want people to know who are showing you're worth it. Give yourself a shot.

Give yourself a chance to experience that. Get out of your own way. Give yourself a chance because you're worth it. You're a beautiful, I don't know, however you look at evolution or God or how you made it onto this planet, but you know, you're here for a purpose and that is to have a beautiful life and you're worth it. You're a beautiful human being. So I really want people to hear that because I know for me,

I was so far down the rabbit hole of being a piece of shit that I didn't want to live. And today, my life is fantastic. I went from a really big life, the 7,000 square foot houses behind gated communities in the cars and all bells and whistles, prize and cash and prizes. And I was miserable. And today, you know, I can almost touch both walls in my little studio apartment here is still in a square feet. And, you know, I've never been happier. You know, I've right-sized my life, and I found happiness.

I found happiness. I have everything I need, especially the relationship with my children. That's the biggest thing in my life today that I have. And I have a great relationship with my ex-wife. And, you know, we're co-parenting and we're doing a great job. There's always a solution, right? Even in the darkest moments, darkest hours of our lives, there's always a solution. And for me, I'm that kind of addict.

I need a program. If I don't have a program, I'm not getting loaded again. So jump in, you know, do it for a year, right? Jump in and do it for a year, but do it diligently, fearlessly, searchingly, right? And after a year, if you're still miserable, you can always go get a refund on your misery. Because there's a plug in a liquor store in every corner, right? So that's sort of, you know, what I like to tell people, struggling. You don't have to live like this anymore. There's a way out. So true.

What, yeah, that just, I said there was only two questions. There might be a couple. You liar. Yeah, I know, I know it's brutal. That just had me thinking too, though, like, when did sort of that magic happen for you, right? Because that's something that if you're wrapped up in the mix, it's hard to believe these things, right? It's hard to believe it gets better. It's hard to believe that we could possibly turn our life around. I mean, look at the sort of the stuff you shared and I mean in my own story just the wreckage of the past some things can't be undone but there's forgiveness out there and I had a really hard time realizing that I thought even when I got sober I thought for sure these bridges will be burned forever with

these people and rightfully so like I never I didn't put the expectation on other people to welcome me back in their life and stuff I was like that yeah I get it but it was so magical how over the years it was like this no hard feelings approach to things that i never thought would be ever moved on from so when was it like for you that you know some of the magic of the whole thing started to happen it was this go around it was this go around again at age 56 it's just a bad look and you know i got to a point where i didn't want to live so something had to change. So again, you know, surrender. Surrender's a big part of my, my story. And through that, things slowly started to change. It doesn't change overnight, right? But it takes time and

consistency. So if I'm willing, again, there's that word willing, if I'm willing to keep showing up, you know, doing the groups, doing the work, going to meetings, doing the 12s, my life will change. And it slowly, for me, it came in a little bit. For some others, it's fine. You know, it's a big moment. But once I got a higher power in my life and I attached that spirituality to the steps, that's when the magic really started to happen for me because I wasn't going through and just checking boxes.

There was something else connected to it aside from the words, you know. Admitted I was powerless over drugs and alcohol in my life had become unmanageable. Once I started to look at it from a spiritual perspective and how it was affecting me spiritually, emotionally, and mentally and physically, was I able to expand upon it? So that's when things really started to cook. That's when things really started to make sense and my life started to change. But again, you know, slip back into that real easily. I can slip back into character defects really easily and push that away, which recently

happened to me. I was just having a bit of a spiritual issue lately. and by being open to seeing the signs and the gifts and the lessons that aren't so on the nose, right, was I able to get back to it? You know, we talked earlier. I had this young man put in my life who is suffering really badly. Tragedies, deaths in his immediate family, and he doesn't want to live. That was my higher power putting that young man into my life to show me that, you know, things could, always be worse, but you could be of service to this young man. You could give of what you have for this young man. There's no coincidence that it just happened to be, I was his very first group

being in this residential detox. It was at 11 o'clock my time. It could have been a number of other facilitators, but it happened to me. It happened to me. And this young man and I connected and that fed my spirituality. And it's things like that really helped block. you know the recovery for me that moment that you talked about that you asked me about when things really start work things like that it's continuous now it's not just you know it starts off in little bits in the beginning when we're trying to get our legs underneath us but just daily now again if we're willing to open our eyes and look for the lessons in the size they're there and it just feeds you you know that's what I love about this job I'm of service every day you know I have my commitments and I'm of

service at my meetings, but I get to do this every day. And, you know, that just, these clients help me more than they'll ever know. And that's how the program works, right? Yeah, it's a full circle. It's those full circle moments are full circle days where it's like everything, everything just truly makes sense. And, you know, it's so beautiful. I think when people who go through it to get into a position to give back, because then it's sort of putting forward our experience. and maybe they're pushing it forward to help somebody else. And it creates that, you know, that fire to keep going, right? And it's tough at times, too, like working with people.

It's really tough because not everybody gets it in the times that we work with them. You know, that was I used to work with teenagers. Years ago, I did it six years. I worked residentially with teenagers. And, you know, it was really challenging. And, you know, a handful of guys here and there would, you know, the lights would come on. They would see it for what it was. And then a lot of people, our job was planning.

seed and hoping throughout their life that they would be watered. But it's really tough when you spend six months with somebody and you're like, come on. You know, you want them to just be rocking and rolling. You see where this ship is headed, right? You want everybody to do well. Yeah, well, thank you, Dean so much for jumping on here. My pleasure, man. My pleasure.

I could talk for another two hours with you, brother. This was great. I love recovery, man. I could talk about it all day. Yeah. I really could. Beautiful, man. Oh, one last question for you.

Who's taking down the cup this? year. I would love to see Edmonton. Yeah. I really would. Yeah. I really would love to see Edmonton. You know, I grew up with the Gretzky, Messier Dynasty, right? And I would love to, I would love to see them. And it would be great for Connor McDavid. I mean, one of the greatest players in the sport today, all his hard work. And he stuck, you know, he stuck to fit and thin, right? He's stuck with that team. And that means a lot, right? That's character. That's character right there. So I really like to see that for him. I'm a Calgary fan too. You know, you're not from Toronto, Fred. I got off that bandwagon a long time ago. Too many heartaches? I was like, okay, no, I can't do that anymore. So I became a

Calgary fan, and obviously now I'm at Los Angeles Kings fan. But, you know, the thing I liked about when I jumped ship, I liked Edmonton and Calgary because there were small market teams that played with Hart, right? And to me, that hockey's all about heart. And I just love how they'd show up and just put it all out on the ice night after night, no matter where they were in the standing. So I'd love to see either one of them. I don't know. I watched Calgary last night,

but I wasn't paying attention. They lost in overtime to Dallas. But where are they in the standings? Are they on a wild card or they're in? No, I think they're around the wild card spot. The wild card spot, yeah. I think so. Yeah, I'd love to see them get in.

Yeah. Good. So, yeah, there's oilers. Oilers. Oilers for the cup. Pull it off this year. All right, cool. Well, thank you, Dean. Have a good rest of your day. Good week. You too. You too, brother. And again, thank you for having me. Yeah, of course. Well, there it is everyone. Another incredible episode here on the podcast.

Be sure to send Dean over a message. If you enjoyed this episode or could take away anything from it, I know he would love to hear from you. If you haven't left a review for the podcast yet and you're enjoying all of these episodes, jump over to Apple or Spotify and leave a review. Written review on Apple. is dynamite and a five stars over on Spotify. It's incredible too. So thank you guys, as always, for hanging out. And I'll see you on the next one.