Sober Motivation: Sharing Sobriety Stories - Navigating the Holidays in Sobriety: A Special Holiday Edition with Jeff Simone, Megan Wilcox, SoberDave and Stephanie Noble

Episode Date: December 12, 2023

In this special holiday episode of the Sober Motivation podcast, Brad sits down with Megan, Stephanie, Jeff and Dave. We talk about insights and strategies for staying sober through the holiday season. In a roundtable discussion, we touch upon various challenges people face during holidays including social pressures, family gatherings, and emotional turmoil. We discuss the significance of maintaining consistent sobriety, setting clear boundaries, and developing a plan to respond effectively to triggers. The discussions also explore concepts like 'playing the tape forward', implementing accountability, and participating in sobriety support communities. The talk concludes with some empowering thoughts for those who might experience relapses during their sobriety journey. -------------- 👉 Download the SoberBuddy App: https://soberbuddy.app.link/motivation 👉 More information on SoberLink: www.soberlink.com/recover 👉 Grab Charmaine's ‘Delicious & Doable ~ Recipes For Real and Everyday Life’ Cookbook: 👇https://www.amazon.ca/Delicious-Doable-Recipes-Real-Everyday/dp/1989304559 ------------- Episodes Guests on Instagram👇 Megan: https://www.instagram.com/sobahsistahs/ Sober Dave: https://www.instagram.com/soberdave/ Jeff: https://www.instagram.com/reactionrecovery/ Stephanie: https://www.instagram.com/iamstephanienoble/

How's it going, everyone? Welcome back to this special holiday edition episode here on the Subur Motivation podcast. This podcast is all about making it through the holiday sober so that you can start off the new year, the way you want it to be in sobriety. I'm very grateful for the four guests who came on and shared their expertise and their experience on this episode. This is going to be an incredible episode. You're really going to enjoy it. Have your pen and paper ready to write some notes down. hold on to your hats, and let's go.

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helping you rebuild trust and stay committed to your sobriety throughout the busy season. Stay sober and rebuild trust this season with Soberlink. Visit Soberlink.com slash recover to sign up and receive $50 off your device. And I've got to give another huge shout out to our other new sponsor, Charmaine, cooking show host, and author of Delicious and Doable Recipes for Real everyday life. Charmaine prides herself on living a drug and alcohol-free lifestyle, and she's also a huge fan of the show. So if you're hungry for fun, delicious, and doable dishes, Charmaine's collection of over 70 mouthwatering recipes will be sure to please your hungry gang. Pumpkin

muffins with coconut crumbled toppings, lemon walnut tuna melts, cranberry turkey burgers with sweet horseradish mayo, and grilled chocolate sandwiches are just a few of the fabulous and flavorful dishes you will enjoy preparing and devouring with ease. Check out Charmaine's cookbook today. I'll drop the link in the show notes below to the Amazon listing. Let's go. Maybe now more than ever we need support on our sober journeys. With the holidays coming up, things are going to get busy. And to have other people by your side that understand the journey, the hurdles, the challenges that come with recovery and sobriety is so important. Come and check us out on Sober Buddy with over 40 support groups each month, you're for sure to get connected and find some other people

that are on the same journey that can help support you. And I want to give a big shout out to everybody who listens to the show that's part of the Sover Buddy community. It's been incredible to get to know all of you, to see your growth. Some people have been with the app for 10 months, maybe even a year, and to see the progress that they've made in their lives and of the lives of the people around them is truly inspiring. So if you could use a little support on your journey, check us out for a free seven or a free 30-day trial. Make sure it's a good fit for you. If you're a fan of the show, you love all the episodes, you love the stories, you love what we're doing around here. Do me a huge favor this holiday season. Jump over to Apple or Spotify. Leave a review.

Now let's get right into this episode. Welcome back to a special holiday episode of the Subremort Motivation podcast. Today, I asked a few of my friends if they would come on here and share some of their experiences and some of their expertise with staying sober over the holidays. We've got Jeff from Reaction Recovery, Sober Dave, Megan from Sober Sisters and Stephanie Noble with us today. Jeff, how are you doing? Doing great, Brad. Thanks for inviting me back here. I was on an episode back in March. I think you titled it A Pharmacist's Journey Into Hell, something like that. And that was a lot of fun. So I'm glad we're, you know, doing this again.

I run reaction recovery. We're an online extended care, addiction counseling, health coaching, and personal development service for people in active addiction or early recovery. So it's great to be here. Beautiful. Thank you. Dave, how are you holding up? I'm really good, Brad.

Thank you very much. Lovely to be here amongst these fine people. And I'm the only one for a Christmas jump for on out of you all, which makes me feel special. But I'm really good, mate. It's absolutely freezing. I'm in the UK. So that's what I've got my jumper on.

But I've been on your podcast. before, done one of these, being on my own and you've been on mine. And it's just a joy to share hopefully some good tips to help people out in the Christmas period. Yeah, perfect. Thank you, Dave. In the sweatshirt, it looks incredible, by the way. Thank you.

I does. I agree. Megan, how are you doing? I'm doing pretty good today. Good. Well, thanks for joining us. Stephanie, how are you doing? I'm doing great.

It's also cold here because I'm in Utah. So I feel you, Dave, winter here. But I did wear, like, my Christmas festive red. I'm happy being here. I also did an episode with. Brad. I don't remember when ours was, but it was awesome. I got a lot of great messages, so I know it touched the right people. And yeah, I'm a counselor in the addiction treatment field. I'm a program director at an intensive outpatient program here in Utah. So I've been working in the field for

about, I think I'm in my fifth year and I've been sober since 2015. So this is very near and dear to my heart. I'm so happy to be here. Thank you, everybody for sharing that too. Let's jump in with our first question, right? Because the holidays, there's a lot of different things. stuff that goes on, right? A lot of people I think are off work, maybe newly sober. There's a lot of get-togethers. Family can be very triggering. There's a lot of consumption of alcohol, other substances too. I'm sure of that. And things can become really stressful, the expectations, too, especially for Christmas. Everything that goes on, I feel if there's something that's going to come up to be triggering for us in our recovery, especially early on, it's definitely going to happen

around these times. Jeff, starting with you, why do you think that the holiday season can be challenging for people trying to stay sober? For a lot of reasons, there's a lot of emotional charge with the holidays. I know it was very difficult for me. I just celebrated seven years sobriety. So this is, and I got sober on November 12th, right? So right before Thanksgiving. And so this time of year is always very nostalgic anyway. I kind of think back to being cold and shivering and detoxing. And, you know, I had a pretty bad. Cute withdrawal. post-acute withdrawal, very long. And that first Thanksgiving and Christmas,

no doubt, was part of that. You know, we call that like Bermuda Triangle, right? You know, we lose a lot of good people from Thanksgiving, Christmas, New Year's, and all that time in between it. And even, like, the work I'm doing right now, it's tough. And a lot of people are going through it.

First of all, what I tell folks is, they feel comfortable saying no to as many of these, like, abights are just, you know, like events that you might get invited to. You know, I used to try to figure out little ways to handle some things. And there's a lot that we can do. There are a lot of tools.

I'm sure you guys are going to get into some of these too. But first and foremost, you're not obligated to do anything, really, nothing. I mean, the world is not going to implode because you feel like you're being rude by not showing up to something. I mean, this time of year, first and foremost, this is about saving your ass, not your face.

I can't tell you how many events I just simply didn't go to, really, you know, at least the first year. For a couple of years, we planned on having commitment. over Thanksgiving and over Christmas. So, like, I would actually leave those events and we would drive down to West Philly, a couple of detox facilities that we would speak at. And we would play it that way, right? I mean, one, I was doing it because I liked it, of course, and I wanted to.

But it was a great excuse to cut the night early. And I say it that way, right? And I like being around my family and friends, generally speaking. You know, I have a nice family. But family is, it's incredibly triggering for all types of reasons, whether there's booze or other drugs involved or not, there's so much there, so much emotion, and really what you're trying to move towards in the beginning is a place of emotional stability. So whatever you can do to avoid those high highs and

low lows of the holidays. But it takes a while to get there. So anything we can do, I mean, anything that we have to do to take some of that power away. For example, like how long we're going to be staying somewhere. Yeah, no, I love that, is that you can say no to different events. You can leave? Yeah, you can leave early. Or you can just not go in the first place. And you can leave. You can just not go in the first place and you can catch the next one or the next year. Dave, what do you think? What made the holidays tough for you to begin with? I think it was the association. Change of seasons for me was a big part for me, you know, going from summer where it was the barbecues into autumn, where the leaves changed colours. And there was always something that I related to having a drink in an old pub

with a roaring fire or the barbecue in the garden and Christmas, all the advertising, it's everywhere, in it, Christmas jumpers that I've got on now. Hubs with little twinkly lights in the windows, you know. And it's, I think, a bit of advice I was going to give is try not to romanticise alcohol because we do naturally. And, you know, I used to journal a lot and write down the truth behind my drinking. So it wasn't going into a pub and there's cheers as I walk in because I knew that I was the big drinker and it would be a big Christmas bash.

it was more like how long did that last for me? It lasts at tops of the hour before I start to feel a little bit tired or aggressive, sleepy, you know, and how would I feel at 3 o'clock in the morning if I woke up full of anxiety? And then what would be the domino effect the next morning around Christmas? You know, you wake up Christmas morning

if you've had a scimful the night before and you get off of Bucks Fizz at 10 o'clock in the morning. And that starts it off again, the domino effect. And I remember one Christmas, I was carving the turkey and I could hardly see. And I cut my finger and the family with this straw. And so I think it's putting it all in perspective.

And as Jeff says, it's how you present it to other people. And I always say, stay in your lane, really before you go to these family gatherings, get it clear on your head what you want. Why is for not drinking? And also don't give it too much energy because if you say, I'm trying not to drink and I'm struggling, people are going to hook into that. Go, there's nothing wrong with you.

Have a drink. Go on. It's Christmas. Right? So I'm not drinking at the moment and that's it. And it's simple, you know, and you minimalize the drama. Yeah. Figure out before you go to the events,

what the decision is going to be and how you want to go about it. Don't wait until you get there. And I love what Dave was just saying, Brad, you know, just in terms of making it clear, I am not drinking, right? Using those words versus I'm trying not to drink tonight or I don't really want to drink that much tonight or anything. I was actually just talking with somebody this morning.

She went up to Spain and there's kind of like a big little event and she made it almost the entire time and then the very end. And that was what it came down to. She had told a friend, I'm trying not to drink too much tonight. Okay, which worked for an hour and a half. And then that friend, oh, here, you know, have a glass. And she had a glass of wine. and then the whole night was just like a disaster.

And that was the conversation, right? It was setting that early on. I am not drinking tonight. Most of the time, that is enough right there. Some people might press you and then you could come up with maybe a follow-up response to that. But I am not drinking tonight is huge. Yeah, no, I love that. Megan, what are you thinking about all this?

As you know, my sober date is the day after Christmas. So the holiday time is definitely. I mean, I'll be hitting my three years on December 26th this year. So holidays actually before I quit drinking were harder for me. They were extra lonely. They're still lonely. I'm getting there just because I don't have family around here. I'm divorced. And so holidays can be difficult for me, but I would always ramp up my drinking around the holidays. I would drink more to just not feel anything and just be comparing my life to everybody else's life, especially, you know, with social media out there. And if we're scrolling and we're drinking, we're already

feeling low about our self and our life. And now we see everybody else with these perfect happy families and these perfect Christmas trees that are decorated great and presents and people hanging out. And then I would just drink more. And it keeps torturing myself through just seeing people's highlight reels. And I would say my holiday time now, it's still is a little bit lonely sometimes, but nothing like it was when I was drinking. I would start my night drinking, feeling kind of sad and lonely, but by the end, I would be really lonely.

I'd be crying and ultimately ended up hitting my rock-bought-a-moment on Christmas three years ago. So it's definitely like a special time for me. And it's anyone out there who's thinking about quitting, maybe you haven't yet, is to don't wait till January. Do it now. Do it before the holiday so you can make all new memories that next Christmas you can look back and be like, that was my first sober Christmas. And now this is my second one. You know, and so I know so many people we wait till the first of the year to make some big changes, but do it now. And then also as far as sharing, I love that. I think it's so important is to be open and honest as possible. I know it can be

hard. And you don't have to dish out all your dirty laundry about, you know, why you're not drinking, but simply saying, I'm not drinking today and I feel great. Say it with confidence so that they don't say, So they don't feel bad for you or, you know, like Dave was saying, oh, you're not that bad. Because my family would say that too. They didn't know how bad I was because a lot of my drinking was alone. And so say it confidently, I'm not drinking today and I feel great. And what are they going to say? Oh, here, have a drink. I don't want you to feel great, which is maybe the case. But again, just be ready to say that. Have your line of what you're going to say to people because you will be asked. You will be the odd man out, most likely, when you're not drinking.

And just be proud of your decision because it is just the number one, I feel like, decision you can make in your life that will just be able to ripple effect into your life and change everything. Yeah. You were right at the peak of the pandemic, right, Megan? I guess the December of 2020. Yeah, exactly. And I work in an ER.

And so it just, and my kids were home. I was homeschooling my kids. It was crazy. And my drinking had ramped up. I was drinking in the morning after my overnight ships. And it ramped up real quick and just hit the point where I was like, what am I doing here? I'm drinking in the morning after work. I'm drinking in the middle of the day when I had to work at night.

And so, yeah, for me, you know, it was a blessing in disguise at that time that everything just kind of got, you know, escalated so fast. Yeah, I think since Jeff brought up the names of the episodes, I think yours was like the something, the present they kept on giving or something. of the holidays, right? That's incredible. And maybe even like I've heard people share like practicing in a mirror or role playing with somebody about what you're going to say and have a response down pat so that you're not fumbling and that you're confident in your approach. And how you deliver it, I think is going to instill more confidence back towards us about our delivery for things and even mentioning before we go to these events. And I know a lot of times people don't want to because of the stigma and everything attached with it. But that's a

really good tool to mention with somebody before you go is that this is what you're doing. And like nine times out of 10 or nine and a half times out of 10, I think that's going to be well received and respected. More in today's world than probably ever before. And there might be a small percentage of people who that, but I think that you'll surprise yourself. I know I sure did when I taught with people. I was surprised by their responses and how many people were kind of exploring their own journey with things. Stephanie, what are you thinking about what makes the is a little bit maybe more challenging than other times for sobriety. I mean, a lot of stuff that you guys already talked about.

Being around family, I think, is like one of the biggest reasons. It's a stressful time. Being around family can be very triggering. A lot of people have childhood trauma and then they're around all of their people from childhood. And I think it just brings up a lot of emotions. And when emotions are high, intelligence is low. And so it's just like with this very like fighter flight reactive state.

that we kind of show up in. And so I think just, and Dave says, like the glamorizing of it, the commercials of it's packaged in this beautiful bow, right? Ooh, let martinis and this Christmas party with an open bar. So if we are very honest with ourselves, I was never some glamorous drinker. And I need to be very honest with myself about what my drinking and using actually looked like because we can get so caught up and, oh, yeah, like just a glass of wine. at this party and we think that, you know, I think that I can drink like that. I never drank like

that. So if I am very honest about what my addiction looks like, I'm quickly brought right out of them. And I think it's great. Talking to people about it, people will only take our recovery as seriously as we do. So if I'm like, no, just tonight I'm not, I'm trying not to, like you guys all mentioned, they will only take it as seriously as I do. And so I'm very like, I don't drink. I'm not drinking today. I have to be like, I don't drink. If I do, it would be better if I burned this restaurant down than if I drank. That would cause less destruction.

Like, I'm very, like, blunt and open about it. But I think it is kind of different in my case because I was a full-blown junkie. So when I got sober and I told people I didn't drink, they were like, thank God. Or if I was like, no, drinking gets me back on heroin. They were like, yes, please don't drink. But I think it took a minute for me to get there, but I was just very done with it all. And I was like, this is my life I'm talking about. And if it makes someone else uncomfortable, I don't care because I could die from this.

So I became very open and very blunt about it. And no one ever asks me if I want to drink. Unless it's a complete stranger. And even then, I'm not really in those situations because I've designed my life in such a way where I'm not around. high-risk situations, which I think is something to speak to on this. We're all saying, you don't have to go to the parties. You don't have to go to that. Truly, you don't. We have, for the most part, if you're looking at getting sober, you are sober, we've been to every party. They're all the same. No one cares if we're there or not. And I think sometimes just

being very, like, black and white about it is helpful because it's not worth it. No high-risk situation is worth it to me because my recovery has to come first. Orly how long we're there, you know, they don't care of that either. Maybe just an hour is fine, you know. Then that to be six hours. No. And I think, too, like when you get sober, like nowadays, like I, the longer I'm sober, the less tolerance I have to be around drinking at all because there's no room for genuine

connection. And that's the thing that I thrive on the most in my life is genuine connection. And when booze is involved, the chances of genuine connection is completely diminished hour by hour and I just don't care to be there. So if I do go into situations like that, I go early, I leave early, I bring someone with me, I have a code word. If I'm with Jeff at a party and I'm like, hey, code word is like jingle bells. The second I say jingle bells, we're gone. No questions asked, right? And I just make sure that I set it up in a very safe way. But I know that it wasn't always like that. So I know I'm coming off kind of like aggressive, but it took me a minute to get to that place where it was

just like, this is what it is, take it or leave it. Yeah, I love that. Yeah, no, that's great. Yeah. No, it's not aggressive at all. I mean, I think that's the reality. If we want to strengthen this thing together, right? For me, kind of comes down to those boundaries and in letting other people know, like you mentioned there too, about other people are only going to take it as serious as you're taking it. And I'm a big believer that we teach other people how to treat us. So if we just let them do whatever and we don't have any boundaries or hold any boundaries ever, then we're just going to get run all over. And I was like big into people pleasing. So I always went to the events and did whatever was needed, it brought the carrot cake, whatever was asked of me and hung around to the

end because I thought people wouldn't like me if I didn't. In everything you all are saying, makes so much sense. And we've got to put recovery, the sobriety is the number one because without it, I mean, for me personally, everything else falls apart relatively quickly because I've got the research. I completed the research on that. So that's incredible. Thank you, team. for sharing that stuff. It really paints a good picture about a lot of different experiences for the holidays.

I'm wondering about what are some strategies. We listed off a lot there. I don't know if there's any other strategies that you wanted to share for somebody that, you know, just kind of visualizing somebody in their first year, somebody maybe that's been on this journey for a couple of months.

Is there anything specific that they should really put on their tool belt or be mindful heading into the holiday season? I want to start with Jeff again. One of the points that we were just making and Stephanie and Dave touched on this too. And I just want to stress this again, because this comes up all the time. There's a lot of, you know, maybe the excuses for why I'm not doing something, right? And you get into like the classics, you know, I'm, um, whatever. I'm taking a course of

antibiotics, you know, so I'm not drinking. And, you know, that's fine. I had the same experience as you, Stephanie where so I was living in California for maybe the six or seven years where like by drug addiction got really bad. And then my family sort of found out about it from a call from jail cell. Essentially, it was like an explosion. So everybody had to find out everything overnight. So nobody ever said to me, why aren't you drinking later in that? They knew that it was heroin and meth and my life was completely destroyed. So I didn't get those questions either. But this comes up a lot, right, where, oh, I don't know what to say. What are they going to think? Am I going to? I'll just tell them that I'm whatever. I'm not feeling well or I'm taking hormones for blah, blah, blah.

I mean, that's just a reservation, right? Where now, that's where you're at right now. That's where you're at. So that's fine. But are you going to be on antibiotics for the next 50 years? Are you going to just be continuously taking antibiotics? So like at some point saying, I'm not drinking because I don't drink. And then if close family, look, like your close family and friends know what's going on to

some extent. Most of the time, people that are close enough to you are not going to be blown away. Oh, my God. you know, really, you had a problem drinking? Usually the ones that have a problem are the people who kind of drink like us, right? And then maybe like your sobriety is kind of like an accusation almost. Or if somebody drinks just like me and that person says to me, I'm not drinking because I have a problem drinking. What does that mean about my drinking?

Which I'm not ready to look at yet. You know, so people don't like that. And those are the ones who usually have most of the problems. But yeah, 97% of people are just, they're not thinking about you nearly enough to really care about what's in your cup, you know? I'm not sure if I just answered your previous question or not or if I just went into some other topic. No, that's good. I think it's that idea getting off the fence of things here, right? About, like, just making a decision and going all in on one thing.

Because I think we can even fool ourselves in a sense. If we go into a bunch of these different conversations while I'm not doing it today, I did that a lot. I did that a lot. I have a lot of experience with that. And what I was doing looking back, like, I didn't know this completely honestly at the time. but looking back, I was just leaving the door open to retreat back because I knew if I did end up going back to the way I was living and I didn't make the full commitment to my family, to my close friends, to my brothers, then they wouldn't be on my back. But there's a level of accountability

when you have decently healthy relationships and you make a commitment to going alcohol free or sober or getting off drugs. People around you are healthy relationships. There's going to be a level of accountability, not judgment, but accountability of the way my mom went about, it after I did say this is what I was doing and when things didn't work out and I had a relapse. She would mention something to me and I would get upset, right? Mom, come on. How dare you? You have no idea. And my mom would tell me this. She would say, hey, this is what you said you're going to do. I'm not telling you what to do. This is what you decided you're going to do and I'm just simply asking about it. And it really put the ball in my court to say, hey, you know what?

Like, this is true accountability and this is kind of what I, in a roundabout way, asked for. So yes, Jack. Great thing. What do you think, Dave? What's a few things that we can put on our belt? I think personally, there's no good just racking up the days thinking, right, I'm going to try and get through today. I think there's a plan you need to put in place.

Talks about associations earlier, and that could be a certain time that you would normally drink in the day, whether it's lunchtime, whether it's evening. So you need to fill the void of that and think, right, I need to plan ahead and maybe do something different. You know, the environment's important is where do you normally drink? You know, I used to have my position in my lounge with my table next to me and my vodka bottle next to that and I didn't even get up unless needed the toilet. So, there's no good me sitting there tapping the table with my fingers thinking, well, my brain's going to go, there's something missing here and the craving's going to get worse. I removed myself from that situation. And even if I went to the bloody bed,

you know, I would never drink in bed, but that felt a safe space. so it could be exercise, get out in nature, get stuck into a Netflix box set, do something different. It kind of tricks the brain and remove the association. And I always think a plan is really important because otherwise you'd right-knuckle it. And social media is fantastic these days. There's so many different options out there. Online AA meetings, there's a great app.

Sober Buddy, I think it is, right? that's a great community in there. And, you know, having conversations with people, like-minded people, is what keeps you going because you feel lonely enough when you're drinking, don't you? You could be at a party and there's a room for the people and you're isolated in your own addiction. So why feel like that if you're trying to stop drinking?

Because those thoughts can eat away at you and then before you know you're drinking again. So I think a plan is absolutely essential. plan ahead, tell people what your Christmas looks like to you. And I think Stephanie said earlier about confidence and knows that Megan, you know, be confident in it. If you go in week, they're going to pick up on that. And they go, you know, that thing.

Go on it's Christmas and that. And if you're not confident in yourself, you're going to give in easily. And if you tell them up front, they know, you know, and you've got to be firm with your decision, healthy boundaries as well to say, I'm not doing. What Jeff was saying, whatever. works for you as well. Like it could be go down the mental health route, go down. I don't remember last Christmas, so I want to remember this one. Whatever works for you, what feels comfortable for you is how you can play it, you know. But yeah, definitely a plan, Brad. Yeah, beautiful. I love that.

I'm a big planner. You know what? That's why community is really good for you, right? Because if you are in a facility in that and you come out and you've got a community as well, that can be part of your plan, because connection is the opposite of addiction, right? So being amongst like-minded people that can pull you up when you're down, there's accountability, and that's a big part of that plan moving forward as well. Yeah, and that's so important to be connected with other people. So a written plan is definitely, I think, a must, a must have to navigate the holidays. And some great tips everybody's given for anybody who wants to put together a plan.

I've already heard 50 things that you could put on it. Megan, what do you think? Yeah, I have a couple of things here. And the first thing is that most people who drink wherever they are on the spectrum of drinking, they wish they drank less or not at all. Majority of people who wake up after a night of drinking are like, damn, why did I drink that much last night, you know? And so the fact that you are braven up to head into a Christmas party

or a work Christmas party, whatever it might be, and not drink is actually really amazing. and breathe. And so something that is going to be really helpful and key is your mindset. If you go into this party is going to suck. It's going to be so boring. I'm not drinking. Everybody else gets to and I have a problem and I can't drink. So I shouldn't even go. It's going to go. If you go into it like that, thinking it's going to suck and it's going to suck, it will. But if you go into it, this is just one Christmas. You don't have to think about every Christmas or the rest of your life or every holiday, whatever you celebrate. It's just this one. Just this year. Just one day at a time, one holiday at a time, one event at a time.

And truly, this one decision could change the whole trajectory of your life. And so many people I know worry and get caught up on what other people are going to think. And then that's why they end up, you know, drinking that night or, okay, well, just today because people are asking me and I don't want to feel like the odd man out. But, you know, people are going to hate on us no matter what. They're going to hate on us when we're at our lowest. They're going to hate on us when we're at our top. So why not just do what makes you happy? And if that means not drinking and trying to remain sober for as long as possible,

then why not just do that and try not to care what other people think? They're not the ones that are there with you at 3 a.m. when you wake up, hating yourself, you know, just feeling like absolute craft. No one else is there except for you. And even if someone's laying next to you, they still don't know how you feel. Only you do. And so I just think mindset, you know, not going into it as a punishment and that you're broken and something's wrong with you, but instead that you're so intuitive to have realized this was a problem and that you're doing something about it to change it. And for me, that's been really helpful as just thinking about it as a decision that I make every single day, but knowing that it's getting me to a better place than where I am even today.

So that's, I guess, my little tip. Yeah. Brought the fire right there, Megan. I love that. The way we think about it, too. I did a meme. It always is really popular on Instagram about, we might think that giving up alcohol is about like giving stuff up,

but it's really about so much more than that. We're really not giving anything up. We're really getting so much back. It sometimes takes a little bit of time for the clarity to click in to maybe realize that whole idea. But I think it's incredible, right? And keeping that mindset and making that decision every day. even after all these years it's a decision I make every day when I wake up.

Hey, this is just the way it's going to go today. And I'm not spending an hour, two hours on it, but it's just, hey, this is the way that today's going to go. And I was talking with Dave, too. I was talking with you, Dave, yesterday? And you brought up the other good point, too, about the one day at a time, right? Like one event, one event, you can worry about the next one. And I also love, I heard this somewhere along in the investing world that the eighth wonder, the world is compounding interest. But the eighth wonder of the world is also these events and everyone that you are able to do successfully and come out the other side, you feel that much more confident and that much more proud of your abilities to be able to make it through these holidays and these tough times and the new years and everything like that.

So it's another way to look at it, right? Stephanie, what are you thinking? What are you seeing? Because you're working with people for, I think you said five years, right? What are you thinking? So many good things have already been said. I think something like if you're at a holiday party, just have a drink in your hand. Whatever your non-alcoholic beverage of choices, just having a drink in your hand

will eliminate so many of these conversations that we're all so nervous to have, right? Oh, they're going to ask why I'm not drinking. They're going to do this. If you just have a beverage in your hand, you're not going to have nearly as many of those conversations as you're thinking you're going to. And no one cares what's in your cup. No one cares if you're drinking. I think we build it up so much.

Like, they're going to ask why and they're going to do this. For the most part, actually, like, for all the part, no one's thinking about us. And I say that in the very loving, empowering way so that we don't get stuck. And if I'm at a party, I'm thinking of me. No one else in the room is thinking about me. Everyone is too busy thinking about themselves. So I think we build it up. Oh, crap.

I have to tell everyone how I'm a horrible. were junkie and I went to jail and I did this and this is why I don't drink. If I just have a drink in my hand and I'm like saying hi to people and making the small talk like most people do at holiday parties, it's never going to come up. And I think people are really surprised when they do go out and, you know, socialize in early sobriety or at these Christmas parties and stuff. How surprised they are when they come back and they're like, oh my gosh, I didn't have to talk about it once. Oh my gosh, no one even asked me about it. I just had a drink in my hand and for them, most part, there's not some detective going around the party, like, what are you drinking? What are you

drinking? What are you? Like, it's really like we build it up so much. And I think it's not even that big of an issue. Right. And we get to decide who we tell our story to and who we don't. And I believe people are owed privacy. I think it's different than secrecy. And people need to earn the right to hear our stories. And I believe that. But for the most part, especially in professional settings or settings where it's not like immediate family who already know like Jeff said, you know, we don't have to like worry so much about that. And so I just want to tell people that because we do have these conversations a lot. And I think people do really get nervous about needing to tell people about how bad it got and where they're at in it when for the most part,

it really won't come up. If it does, you get to decide what to share. And again, you guys have all given so many great tips. Like, but for the most, far no one's thinking about us. So I think one, I guess one skill or tip is have a drink in your hand. It will eliminate so many of those conversations. And then as far as like in between the holiday parties and stuff like that, like Dave mentioned, recovery lives in your feet. You have to keep taking action. You have to. And whether that is going to the next room and putting on the Netflix show or if it is going on a walk, if it's calling someone, if it's finding a meeting, if it's reading, keep moving, keep distracting, because if we just sit around

and spend too much time in our heads, that's where addiction lives. Adiction lives in my head. Recovery lives in my C. So anytime I feel squirrely, especially in the beginning, I just kept moving. Even if it was room to room because it's freezing cold outside and I might be home alone, I just keep moving and distracting because if I spend too much time alone in my head, shit gets real weird. So keep moving your feeds. And the written plan, like you guys mentioned, is so great. And it's great on paper. It's better in action.

So having accountability. Sharing the plan with someone else, I think is where, like, the magic happens. Because we're much more likely to do things if we have people that we're accountable to or that we've told these plans to. Because if I just have the plan on my own, I can talk myself out of it in a nanosecond. Yeah. But if I'm like, Megan, this is my plan. This is what I'm doing. I'm going to text you after I do it.

or I'm going to message you, like, I'm way more likely to do that because I have that accountability. And I think in the beginning, accountability is gold. So if any of you guys need support in that, I'm sure every person on this call right now would be happy to help with that. Even if we're strangers on the internet, I get so many messages all the time of people sharing these kinds of things with me. And it's amazing what can happen when we just speak it into existence,

especially to another human. So accountability is another great one. Yeah, beautiful list. Even to come up with all of those, Stephanie, after everybody went through all the things, incredible job. I loved it. Yeah, the plan and sharing it with someone.

And the drink thing too. Having a drink, right? Because sometimes we go to these events and I think sometimes people are just trying to be, what's the word for it? Show good hospitality. Hey, do you want a drink? Can I help you get something?

And their intention is not necessarily. to set us off, but if we just have something or have brought something with us, then we can avoid that whole thing together, just bring a cooler. I mean, we did it when we were drinking. I wanted to drink more than what the host had available. So I wasn't waiting for them to provide the supplies. We have a flask of LaCroix now. Yeah, exactly.

We're springing our own supplies. But it's a flask of cranberry juice. Ah, yes. Jeff has Lecroch. Jeff's got it. Just got the high-end stuff. I've just got the aha. man, the beginner stuff.

I have water, so I'm the most boring one. Water is good too. So wrapping things up here shortly though, everybody. Is there anything specifically? I know we went over a ton of different tools and shared some experiences, which it's been great. I wish I definitely had something like this when I first started out because different things

are going to work for different people and to have options in different situations. And that's why I really loved bringing everybody together because we all have a different background. We all had a little bit of a different experience too and in recovery and addiction and everything like that. So I definitely appreciate all the different perspectives. But moving into, if somebody is listening to this episode

and this is probably there's going to be a lot of people just because I've talked to a lot of people that listen to the show, this is going to be their first holidays. And they're all at different places, but they're probably concerned about it, right? There's a lot of downtime. There's a lot of boredom that could come into play. A lot of people might take off of work the 22nd of December and not go back till the second or third.

I don't know where the weekends fall, but second or third, and that's kind of two weeks. And for a lot of us, I mean, we ramped up. This was the green light to hang out right. We might have got a little Christmas bonus. We had a lot of time off. We had maybe less supervision, less responsibilities for work. Dave, what would you say to that one or two people that are listening that are heading into this? And they're a little unsure about it all.

I would suggest that you look at the bigger picture of what you really want this next few weeks to pan out to be because you can decide that. We've all had such a tough time in the last two or three years with lockdown and cost a living crisis. You know, wind your life forward a month and imagine what that life would look like if you took a break from alcohol or drugs. See how your health would be, your mental health, you're in. relationships, how you are with your children, you know, having the time off at Christmas and going back into work, feeling relaxed and refreshed. And imagine that in comparison to the flip side, if you drank leading up to Christmas and all the way through Christmas, how the relationships,

the arguments, the falling asleep at the Christmas dinner, and the domino effect of the poor food choices and the lethargy and just slobbing around when you wake up all day. try and think of the comparisons. And the guy said earlier about going into it with a positive attitude, being really positive about it and self-motivation and to connect with the right people and to educate yourself as well. You know, there's so many brilliant podcasts out there. There's brilliant quick-lits, communities and really taste the flavour of living a life

about alcohol and embracing it. you can go into 2024, feeling really fresh and positive, and give it a good old shot, is what I would say. Yeah. Well said. Sir David Wilson. Thank you. And just check it out.

Yeah. Check it out, 30 days. See what improves? Look at it like an experiment, you know, like what can I gain from 30 days away from these toxic drugs? Like, have an experiment, make it non-negotiable. Right. I'm going to give myself this.

opportunity for 30 days to see how I look and feel at the end of it. And then you can make a decision after that. Love that. Jeff, what are you thinking? I love what Dave just said. Yeah, I mean, I guess if there's like a lasting thought, it would be like, you don't need to prove anything to anybody, you know? If you're sober right now, then you're sober, right?

It's like you're not better or worse than anybody else who's trying to do that same thing, regardless of how much time you may or may not have. The entire name of the game right now is going to be survive in advance, right? You might have 50 more years to live, who knows. You'll have so many opportunities to maybe get back the magic of the holidays, you know, because I hear that a lot. It doesn't feel magical. Or if it feels a little bit dull and a little bit boring, that's not unusual. There's nothing wrong with you.

This is kind of what a lot of people experience, you know, like around this time in the beginning. I promise that that's not going to last forever. Surround yourself with good people. Prepare a plan like everybody was just saying. Set your boundaries, you know, hard and firm. okay, this is what I'm doing, and then commit to yourself to not picking up no matter what, you know, exactly what everybody was just saying. So it's not, I'm going to try not to drink tonight or I'm going to, or hopefully I don't

drink. It's, I'm not drinking right now. I'm not saying I'm not going to drink for the next 60 years. I'm saying I'm not drinking right now. And happy holidays. Thank you, Jeff. That's an incredible point too, because early on, yeah, it feels, things can feel kind of blah, right? We're not getting that massive dopamine hit all the time that we have.

have become accustomed to, the highs and lows. And we're more of like a rate, it's more of a regulated wave. So we're not getting the big highs. But the good news is, too, is we're not getting those big lows necessarily as big of a crash, right? So I can relate to that 100%. I didn't really feel joy doing anything. But I just stuck with it.

I just stuck with it like we have to do. But I also looked at the flip side of the coin, too, is I might not have been feeling the extreme joy and everything else. But I also wasn't waking up, feeling depressed, suicidal, anxious, felt like my chest was caving in, sweating all night in the middle of the night, broke. So many other things I just had to get honest about that I might not have been in the clouds, but I sure as heck wasn't as low as I was before. And that kind of just kept it together. But I love how you just normalized. That's real and that will pass. Thank you, Jeff.

Megan. Yeah. All right. I love that talking about those mid-range emotions because that's something that totally comes up for people is when we kind of feel we don't feel either. We're not like super high highs and we're not low-low. That's when most people are in that like in-state,

that they go back because they're like, this is really weird and uncomfortable and I'm not used to this. So I'm going to go have a drink to get rid of this feeling. But isn't that what we want? Don't we want to feel just normal? Don't we want to feel not the highs and low? So when you're feeling that way, think about that. Think about this conversation right now that you're listening to and that it's okay

and give yourself permission to just sit there. It usually, or like Stephanie said, don't sit there and get out, go outside, move. But also, I haven't heard this in a while, which is play the tape forward. I used to hear that all the time when I first stopped drinking and play the tape forward. What will it look like if you do drink that night? What will it look like the next morning? What will happen? And then more importantly, what would happen if you don't, you know, how will you feel the next morning if you don't drink?

You know, you'll feel good. You'll feel well rested most likely in that to really just focus on your future selves and do it for that version of you that is counting on you to make the right decision so that you're not living the same day over and over again. That's what I felt like it was groundhog day every day. Felt like crap. Then it would be like, I'm not going to drink. And then I drink. And just living that cycle, I did that for at least. four years after my divorce. Finally, you know, I was like, enough's enough. And so nothing changes

and nothing changes. You have to fight through these moments. You have to fight through these holidays, all these firsts, and they're not so bad the second time around. And they do get easier. And you come in with more knowledge and more tools and more confidence. It's not always going to be the first one. But if you can get through this first one, then you'll be at the second one and the third one. And things get easier over time. And so make this, your year that you get sober or that you get through it and you make it work. So that, as I mentioned earlier, next year, it's the second one. And one other thing, too, I have this come up in my phone every day as like a reminder around the time where I would normally be going to the liquor store.

And so you come up with your own like mantras or affirmations, whatever you want to call it. But I have never questioned the decision. It's been in my phone for three years. It still comes up every single day. You can come up, you know, with any of them and make them positive, make them I am affirmations as if they're already true. I am a sober, confident woman, you know, not like in the negative, like I'm not drinking. You want them to be something positive and have them just like, you can have a timer on your phone where it's, and then it just pops up. And it's just like little reminders like that just to remind yourself what you're doing and why and how you want to feel. Yeah. Amen.

That's incredible. Oh, yeah. That's incredible. Another mic drop from Megan, the Soba sister. A little mini mic drop. Oh, wow. Stephanie, what are you thinking? Well, again, so many great things have already been.

I think speaking to, like, when Megan brought up, like, the ground hugs day, like, it being the same thing over and over again, I think it's really important to just, be really real with yourself and ask yourself, does drinking or using have anything new to offer me? Like, it's so predictable. It's so miserable. The only thing new it has to offer you are deeper bottoms. And so I think just really recognizing like drinking, it's done what it needed to do. It stopped being fun a long time ago. If you're listening to a podcast like this, like you're to that point where it's not the solution that it once was. And so I think just really being honest with yourself and giving yourself the opportunity of recovery has all the new things to offer you. Being in sobriety is the greatest thing in the entire world. All of us can speak to that. I've never met a single person who's, oh, I wish I didn't get sober. But I've met a lot of people who, like, lost people because their loved ones didn't get sober. So it really is, it's life and death, especially like if you used like I did, if you drank like I did. I work in the field, so I see it all the time.

But just really, you know, coming to this place where it's like, okay, enough is enough. It's not going to change. Drinking is not going to all of a sudden become the solution again. Like, we're past that. And so really looking at, okay, how do you? do I rediscover who I am? How do I redesign my life? And I think Dave said picturing it like, okay, when I do go back to work in January, what version of myself do I want to be? Because what do we want in the moment? Probably a drink. What do we want more? A healthy lifestyle, healthy connections,

like trust with family. So really looking at what do you want? What do you want for what do you want more? And really giving yourself that time to wait through the trigger and the craving and continue to focus on what you want more. I think it's also important to know triggers and cravings are normal. Triggers and cravings are normal. Triggers and cravings are normal. The brain is going to crave alcohol once it stops. Of course it is because like you guys talked about the surges of dopamine, it changes the wiring in the brain. So when we've been drinking, we're so longer using and we take it away, the brain is going to crave it. You are going to have triggers because the brain remembers everything about it. So really having patience with yourself and talking to someone about those

triggers and cravings because it doesn't mean you're doing anything wrong. It doesn't mean you suck at recovery or you suck at sobriety. It is a normal process that every single person goes through. So don't judge your triggers. Don't judge your cravings and speak them into existence because it helps take so much that power away. Find people to talk to. Find people to talk to who get it, who know this thing because we don't get sober alone. I'd never met anyone that got sober 100% by themselves. I get fucked up. We get sober.

So find your we. Find your people. Reach out, talk about the triggers and cravings, and look for the glimmers. And the glimmers are just like the opposite of a trigger, right? So even though it feels like Jeff and Brad, you were saying like, oh, this feels boring. This feels shitty.

Please look for the glimmers. Look for the snow. listening and the mountains looking beautiful. You can tell in from Utah. Find your favorite song, eat your favorite food, you know, go on a walk, find little glimmers that we can hold on to that keep us going because there's so much magic that we can find in sobriety that's just not available to us when we're drinking and using. But if I can do it, and if all these people on this call can get sober, anyone can, I truly believe that. We have a guarantee to get better. if we just move our feet, don't use no matter what.

If anyone needs support, reach out. And happy holidays. Wow. Wow. Amazing. Yes. Thank you. You need to go for a second hour, Brad.

A second hour. I'm wondering. I'm just thinking about those people too, right? That maybe you're going to veer a little bit off their course, right? They're going to veer and things are not maybe going to go according to plan. And I wanted to send a little message to them as well to if that is the case for you and you do have a slip or a relapse or you go back to some. behaviors. Have a little bit of grace for yourself and get back up and get back at it. You don't need to

wait to the new year. You don't need to keep going. You got to get yourself back up. I had somebody actually reach out to me today. Five years of sobriety had a relapse and now is finding it very challenging to get back going. And that's a very real thing and it can be a tough spot. There's a lot of shame involved with it, right? Because if you find yourself with some time and you've told some people, maybe you're part of a fellowship or a support community or just your close family members know and you've been living that lifestyle and then you've went to in that direction it can be very hard to get back up but look this is the deal is what going back to what Jeff said i think it was Jeff is about it doesn't matter about what everybody else thinks and maybe Megan touched on it too and a few

people is you got to do its best for you so even though there might be some feelings there you know I just want to offer some encouragement because I've been there personally. You know, I had everything figured out and it was really tough to come back. But it's so important to give yourself some grace, get back at it, and really be honest with what you were doing. Maybe some aspects of it were working. Maybe there were some aspects you were avoiding that you could implement maybe differently this time. So if that does happen, get back up and get back at it as soon as possible. because what you'll hear more times than not is when you jump into a relapse, things get worse.

Every time things get worse and they get worse. And I think part of it is that the shame that we feel, that we can feel, right, because we feel like we've failed while we've let everybody down. And you only ultimately fail at something when you quit trying. So if you're still working on the journey, then you definitely haven't failed. Anyone have any closing thoughts on that? I would just say to that because I've, I had a year. sober at one point and then I relapsed. And now I see a lot of relapse happen working in the field

and stuff and something that my mentor taught me that I just love so much is she says relapse is feedback. Right. It's just feedback. So if you have a slip, if you have a relapse, take a look at the feedback that you can gain from it because the using and drinking is the last thing that happens in a whole series of events. So like you said, Brad, going back and seeing what was working, what wasn't working. But if we're lucky enough to come back from a relapse, because not everyone does, please get as much feedback out of it as possible. Addiction wants me to live in shame because then it gets to keep taking me down, but recovery tells me what can I learn from this?

How can I move forward with all of this information and this new feedback and make sure that I'd notice my relapse cycle a little bit more clearly. But the shame is the addictive part. So when the shame comes up, ask it to leave, it's just feedback. And I loved hearing that because I think it offers so much grace for it. Yes, I slipped. Yes, I relapsed, whatever it may be. But I can learn so much from it so that I don't completely have to spiral. So it's just feedback. Get the feedback. Yeah, I love that. Dave? Well, I was just going to say that this journey's never linear, is it?

And it's also a reminder not to get complacent and think, do you know what, I've cracked this, I'm never going to drink again. And I look at it like an X that stalks you, that it can be silent for years, and all of a sudden she'd pop up in the high street, and you're like, what are you doing here? And it's not snakes and ladders as well, is it? You don't get to 98 on the board, and then you think, oh, I've got to go back to number one and start again because that can bring in a lot of shame as well. And it's what you do with that slip up, I call it.

And as Stephanie said, it's feedback. You're obviously taking your foot off the gas somewhere along the line and you can think, right, I need to learn by this and carry on and just look at it as feedback and learning and I won't do it next time and keep on going. Because otherwise, it's like pushing the domino, isn't it? And it all comes crashing down. And before you know you've done a month or two of heavy drinking or drug taking, everything goes out of the window, the relationships, the food choices. And then it's so much harder to get back up and start again.

So I think you need to really nip it in the bud. Immediately reach out for support, share your experience and give yourself for an easy time, you know, just think, wow, okay, what do I do? The whole conversation tonight's being about positive thinking. So it's not, I can't do this, I'm useless. It's, do you know what? I've done five years, for example, I can do another five years. Come on, brush yourself down, get up the next day and start again with a positive attitude. I would say that it is hard on the ego, right, in terms of like consecutive days.

I think that's what you guys were just touching on. And that comes up a lot. And I experience this. And that is hard, you know, if that, especially if that number kind of means something to you, when you were talking about that number, for example, to feel that we have to restart it. It's hard. I was court ordered into treatment in 2013, and I said that I got sober in 2016. So there's three really long years of a lot of relapse and slips.

I will say that the first holiday, I was probably a little bit too arrogant about the whole thing. You know, I was telling everybody like my story and I'm done and I'm not drinking anymore and all that stuff. So I will tell you that this past time, I've been way quieter in terms of my story. of any of that forever talk, right? There's, there has not been any of that stuff at all. I've watched my words.

There's been no pink cloud. There's been no excitement. If you can regroup and kind of keep moving forward, it's, you know, a lot of people end up being better off for it. Yeah, so true. Yeah, just getting back up and at it. Megan, do you have any thoughts on this? Yeah.

Most people don't wake up every day and say, hey, I want to quit drinking, and then they never drink again, and it's happily ever after. It's a process. I know even for myself, there was a lot of dipping my toe back in and being like, okay, it's still getting the same results. It's still giving me the same feelings. The same things are still happening. And it's, our brain is just so crazy how it can forget about all the bad stuff and only remember the good things. And so really remembering what it's like if you go back. Instead of playing the tape forward, sometimes rewind the tape and remember some of those moments. I don't like to dwell in the past, but sometimes just remembering how bad it really. was because our brain can really just trick us. But to always keep coming back, you know,

if I would have given up on that last time, what would have happened? Like my whole life, none of the magical things that have happened to me in the three years would have never happened. If I said, you know what, I slipped again and that's it, you know, I'm never going to get it right. And so I think just never giving up and keep going, give yourself grace. This is really freaking hard. You know, we're talking about highly addictive substances here. It's not like it's something that's not addictive. You know, alcohol drugs, they're meant to get us addicted, so it's not easy to stop. And the last thing I'll say is to really tap yourself into community. That's like the last thing that you haven't done yet. And you keep saying, I've tried everything and nothing works

and all of that. But have you really found your community, your people? We're so lucky to be getting sober and to be sober in these times with technology. And there's just a million communities out there. So find one that bides with you, that if you do have a slip and you come back that you're able to share and be met with grace and support. And they're out there and sober, but again, there's so many out there. So you just have to find what works for you and vibes with you. And it makes you feel like you found your people. It makes a huge difference. I wouldn't be sober 100% if I'd ever logged on to my first ever virtual support group three years ago. So true to get connected to people that are going to be good for you and people that are going to support your journey.

Whatever you got to do and tell yourself to get back going is going to be helpful because staying down and staying stuck is, you know, it's just such a slippery slope. It'll just go back to literally the way things were and probably a little bit worse so quick. And the idea of controlling it, it'll work for a little bit. Sometimes it'll work for a little bit and it will wear you down and you'll be exhausted and it'll be right back. So thank you everybody, though, for coming and sharing the wisdom. I learned so much here. And I'm always learning every day. But from the four of you, incredible people doing stuff.

And you all are doing stuff in your own ways to help people out. That's incredible. But thank you, everybody, you're willing to hang out today. Thank you, my. Thank you for what you're doing for the community, too. My people love, like all my clients love your podcast. So it's amazing. Well, you guys have all been on it.

You're all part of it. You're all part of it. Well, as always, everyone, another incredible episode on the podcast. So grateful for Jeff, Dave, Megan, and Stephanie for jumping on here and sharing their experiences, their thoughts about making it through the holiday season sober. A ton of experience on this episode. A ton of sober time. I hope you guys were able to get something from this episode. It was a lot of work.

It was a lot of work, but I wouldn't trade it for the world. If all we do here is help one person show up for the holidays and show up for their family or show up for themselves, our job here is done. So thank you guys for tuning in. Can't wait for the next couple episodes. You're going to love them too. So as always, I'm extremely grateful for the support and the community that we've built is just incredible. The kindness that all of you show to the previous guests. And don't forget, send these people a message.

Send them a message, Jeff, reaction recovery, Megan from Soba Sisters, Sobe Dave and Stephanie Noble, all drop their links to Instagram in the show notes below. But be sure to send them a message and a big thank you. I'll see you guys on the next one.