Sober Motivation: Sharing Sobriety Stories - Sobriety Updates and Insights with Sober Dave, Kristen, and Manny - was it worth it?

Episode Date: March 27, 2025

In this episode, we hear updates from Sober Dave, Kristen, and Manny as they share their inspiring stories of recovery and sobriety: - Dave Wilson: Known as Sober Dave, he discusses his journey to becoming a trauma-informed coach and the challenges he faces bringing sobriety talks into corporate settings. - Kristen: Celebrating four years of sobriety, Kristen shares her experience overcoming alcohol and Xanax addiction and the tools she uses to manage anxiety. - Manny Vitale: From a former police officer struggling with severe addiction to recovering from multi-organ failure, Manny now helps others through his initiative, 'My Fight Our War.' Find the full Episodes Below:  Sober Dave Episode #6: David Wilson aka Sober Dave struggled with alcohol for 40 years Kristen's Episode #93: For Kristen alcohol melted away the social anxiety and then she found Xanax. Manny's Episode # 29: Manny was told he had 6 weeks to live and nothing could be done to reverse the damage alcohol had done. Guests Instagram Accounts Sober Dave: https://www.instagram.com/soberdave/ Kristen: https://www.instagram.com/kristenlmcavoy/ Manny: https://www.instagram.com/myfightourwar/  

Welcome back, everyone, to another update episode. Thank you so much for checking this out. On this episode, we've got Sober Dave, Kristen, and Manny all joining us. Incredible stories, sharing what things have been like since they joined the podcast last, a little bit of the overall experience of being sober and what it's like working through the years as things change. And we've become more aware of other things maybe that we want to improve in our life and really great chat. So let me know what you guys think. Send me a message over on Instagram if you're enjoying the update series. And yeah, let's get into it. We got Dave Wilson, aka Soba Dave with us. Interesting story before we even kick off. Well, how are you doing, Dave? I'm really good, Brad. And it's so lovely to see you,

mate. It feels up we've both been really busy in the last few months and that. So it's lovely to see your handsome face. Same to you, man. Since we're on the podcast. I mean, it's, it's only appropriate to share when I had the thought of doing this, and I shared this on our episode we did too, you're the first person that I mentioned, right? Because you have your podcast, one for the road with Sober Dave, which has like just that incredible English accent intro to it, which I love. And I was like, Dave, do you think I can pull something like this off?

And you were like, of course, man, why couldn't you? And you were like, you need this, you need that. And then I went right to work on it, right? I went on Facebook Marketplace, grabbed a roadcaster, got a microphone, like, within two days. I think I sent you back a picture and I was like, I'm ready to go. And you were like, you're a maniac, man. You know, so I appreciate that, man, that you kind of gave me that direction, man, to get things started. And look at you now, mate.

You're absolutely smashing it out of the park. Congratulations, mate. Yeah, thank you so much. So catching up. It's been a while since we've chatted on video anyway. in sense you joined to share your story on the show. Is there anything that stands out to you that's changed over the last year and a half or so as far as your sobriety goes and maybe other things you're learning about and about yourself?

Yeah, the last time we really caught up, I was doing my coaching from home and stuff like that. And I was actually doing a bit of coaching in your app as well, and I loved that. And things started to ramp up when I become a trauma-in-form coach, because most people were coming to me and they had stuff going on when they were younger and it's always getting to the root of the problem. And I didn't feel like I was suitably educated in that area.

So I did a course and I qualified to be a trauma-in-form coach, which was a journey in itself, Brad. It was crazy. It was a few months of intense learning. And when I was drinking, I couldn't learn anything because I was always flipping drunk. And I flunked it at school as well. Being in my 50s and doing a proper course, this, really took it out of me. But anyway, I scraped out of the line, qualified, and then I started helping people with trauma in a way, like childhood staff, imposter syndrome.

But what that did as well, that allowed me to look inward to myself and see what was going on myself. And that took me on a journey. And I probably learned more about it. myself in the last year, then I did in the other five years of sobriety. Like the first year was learning the basics of managing social situations, managing boredom, anxiety and stuff like that. But the last year, I've really got on my own journey and I've learned about internal family systems, which is fascinating. It's about our sub-personalities that we have, our protector parts. I've learned what attachment style I am. And I've just such a better person for it, Brad.

I've really got to understand how I tick. I probably never will fully understand how I work, because I'm a maniac. But yeah, I feel in a really good place now. And that's led me on to looking at my career, because I'm getting a bit older now. And we've discussed this privately about my venture into corporate in a corporate world. And that's been going really well. But what I've realized is that there aren't many companies that want to have this discussion. And I've really noticed that.

Like, big banks in the UK have said, we haven't got a problem with alcohol in this country and whatnot. And every industry has got a problem with alcohol. Every single person knows someone that's gone, And there's a real resistance I find in actually landing these gigs in corporate because they just don't want to open up the conversation. So that's been a battle for me. But the companies I have worked in have been amazing. I've done webinars.

I've done in-house things, which has terrified me, Brad, because we're used to sitting in our chair and I comfort our own home. So going into a corporate and seeing a load of people coming into the room and sitting down and doing a presentation has been a challenging itself. Yeah. Yeah. And the people that, you know, we meet with in our chair, they in one way or another signed up or asked us to help them. And when you go to another group where the company has made this meeting for everybody to join, it's different, right? It's so interesting you bring that up about, hey, in our industry, we don't have a problem. There's always this thing on the podcast with everybody's story, right? Whether it's the restaurant employee, whether it's the car salesman, whether it's the marketing person working in marketing, it doesn't matter what it is.

You know what they all say? Oh, the drinking, you wouldn't believe it. And the same goes with countries as well. They say, oh, man, we have someone from the UK or someone from Ireland or someone from Vegas, wherever it is, the USA. Oh, you wouldn't believe it. The drinking is just off the charts. And I'm like, that is a true story everywhere. I mean, fluctuates a little bit about like consumption and stuff, but actually looking into the numbers of that because I was interested, like a lot of the countries that people were joining from Australia, the U.S., Canada, the U.S., the U.K., weren't even in the top. There's other European countries that were in the top or like amount of consuming like per

individual type deal. That's great for you, though, man, to bring the conversation. And I think, correct me if I'm wrong here, but I think that it's just about starting the conversation. Yeah. Yeah, without judgment. I've gone in there and I've told my story and I've given them a few stats, nothing too heavy, talked about productivity. Over in the UK, the typical Thursdays and New Friday, right? So a lot of people are going into work feeling a bit fuzzy on a Friday morning and what happens then? It's going to the pub, Friday lunchtime. What kind of productivity is they're going to be Friday afternoon in the workplace? Very little, right? Monday morning.

So it's in their interest to get it in. But what's interesting as well, Brad, is what you say about people involuntarily going into these meetings, do you know what I mean? Where they're forced to go in. I've heard some mumbles and it's, oh, I don't know why I'm even going here. Like, what waste of time? Afterwards, always say, look, hanging about for an hour,

come and have a chat and whatever. And it's always those people who have grumbled in the beginning that come and see me, which is really interesting. And we have an open chat. And it might not necessarily be their problem. It might be someone they know or a partner or whatnot. But I think it's getting the conversation out there in a non-judgmental way that encourages people to speak up about it.

Yeah. But it is so interesting too that does cause friction for some. It's such a strange thing to understand, right? Because, and I think I know why, because there's a lot of people who struggle with it. And it's like when you're struggling with it, last thing you want to hear, like when I was smoking cigarettes every day, the last thing I wanted to hear was like, why I shouldn't be smoking cigarettes. But there was so much truth to everything that was shared and everything that I heard and read. Like, it wasn't that it wasn't

true. It's just I wasn't ready or willing to look at it. It was just like, oh, that's annoying. But I think there's just so many people who kind of, you have that stigma, Dave. You have that stigma about what a quote unquote alcoholic is, how they operate, what they do. what their life looks like. And all of this stuff we've seen in the movies and it's just been this character, I think, that's been built up. And as long as my life doesn't look like that.

Yeah. It's like, it can't really be a problem. But like you and I know with the work we do, like none of that stuff actually matters. It doesn't matter where you work. It doesn't matter that you're married. It doesn't matter that you have kids. It doesn't matter.

It's about how do you feel? about how drinking is impacting your wife. It's not about quantity. It's not about frequency. It's about how do you feel about it? And I think that maybe throws some people off a little bit. A hundred percent, Brad, and I always say, let's not compare quantities and that or what jobs.

Because alcohol doesn't discriminate whatever you do. I've had people come to me in the addiction field and they've got problems. Yeah. It's incredible. People say to me, oh, I'm so embarrassed that I do this for a job. yet I'm drinking and whatnot. And it's, look, let's talk about it. Let's get to the bottom of it.

And there's no shame or stigma there. But I think the way society is now, it creates that stigma. Because we've heard it before. It's the only drug we have to justify not having. And it's ridiculous because it causes so much harm. We're running some adverts in the UK with the NHS on smoking, right? And you're saying like two out of three people die of smoking now. And on the cigarette packets, people in,

with tubes coming out of them and stuff. They don't have any such thing about alcohol, yet it causes seven types of cancer, domestic violence, mental health, suicide. It's crazy. And this is why I think our podcast and the conversation we have in the community are so important because to try and destigmatize it,

make it more of a normalized conversation. And the big thing, you asked me in the beginning, how things change, Brad, I've always noticed that since lockdown, things have got worse. And even now people come to me and they say it all started to get worse in lockdown. What I've found in my community is there are more and more men coming out now, where before it was 95% of my clients were women and 90% of my followers were women.

Now there's an equal balance. And I think that's really encouraging that men are more open. to discuss it. And I don't know if you've noticed that your side, but I have. Oh, yeah, for sure, 100%. I think even on the social media side of things, it's very, but I mean, obviously, there's nothing wrong with it, but it's very heavy for women to have accounts, to have podcasts, to be sharing their stories and their journeys and helping people, which is great, right? That's incredible. But I think it is important for men to, to have those places where they can land, too. And I noticed that in the suburb motivation community, too. We have a lot of guys join,

and it's so interesting, right, because I think they're really hesitant at first. Like, I'm going to check this out. Kind of dip a toe in. And then they join a meeting and they hear somebody else. Another guy be really vulnerable about what they're struggling with or what they're going through. And I think it encourages them to share that. But yeah, I mean, you hear it all the time on the show. I hear it maybe from a lot of men in your generation, too, about we're just raised. we just didn't talk about feelings. And even it was like, it's kind of like one step further, I think. Not only did we not talk about feelings, but we put up a wall and we wanted everybody to

think everything was okay. And that behavior was never really role modeled. So it was like now and then we got to get into drinking at a young age, that's our way to cope. And then we get sober and it's okay, now I've got to identify what I'm feeling. I have no idea. I have no idea what I'm even feeling. Now I've got to articulate.

it and share it and learn how to trust people, be vulnerable. So there's a lot of different things at play. But yeah, I noticed that too, man. And I love every bit of it, man. I think it's just incredible. Yeah. And you know, what you said there, you hit upon an older generation, which I'm in. I come from the old school kind of men go to work and roll their sleeves up and don't talk about feelings. And I think because I always have done and I come across that, it's okay. to talk about emotions. I just hope that encourages people to know that. And I think it's about feeling safe, isn't it?

And when you're looking at stopping drinking, if you've been doing it for 40 years like I was, there's a real feeling of unsafe there because I've relied on it as a coping mechanism all my life or my adult life. And then all of a sudden I'm taking it out and I felt vulnerable. But it was connection that really helped me with that.

Talking with like-minded people, sharing stories, reducing the shame and the stigma made me feel safer. And I think that's why it's so important to connecting groups like yours and mine and other communities, A.A. If that works for you and stuff like that, is the connection is such an important part of sobriety. Yeah, 100%. I mean, we feel alone, right? Like I was talking with Ryan and he's going to be on this sequence as well. well too from the community. You remember Ryan, great guy. And just with him waking up in getting right into drinking vodka, just felt like nobody else shared or whatever, understand that story.

You feel like I'm the only person going through it. And although we have our own little tendencies about how maybe we go about it or what we drink, the small details, that sort of impulsive way of going about life drinking and starting a day. Like, it's good to get part of a community so you feel less alone. And you hear other stories and when you hear stories, you believe, hey, if so and so can find a way, maybe I can find a way. Interesting too on the podcast, too, Dave, you've been doing it for longer than I have. Do you feel like you recording the podcast has enhanced your sobriety or brought something really positive to it? 100%, Brad. Honestly, in the beginning, it felt out of my comfort zone and I was just constantly trying to plan the conversation.

And now I don't. I just go with a flow. I don't have any notes or anything. It's like meeting for a coffee. And it's like they're spending an hour together and hang out and have a conversation and then see where it goes. And that's really helped me as well because it helps me self-reflect on some things guests say to me. It's all a learning thing, isn't it? We're never going to come masters of this.

We just learn as we go and hopefully improve. And, you know, what I said earlier about my course, I'm doing. FFT course in Brighton next month, which is an emotional freedom technique. So another frame for that is tapping. Tapping. So that's something I want to learn to help people calm their nervous systems, regulate their nervous systems just because a lot of people come in there full of anxiety and sometimes meditation doesn't work or yoga or breath work.

And then that's something I can do on myself. So it's constant learning for me, which I love because I was terrible at it. school. Like a lot happened to me in my early teens and that and I just threw school at the window and it's almost like stopping drinking has given me a second chance now to educate myself. And I'm loving it. Yeah. Yeah, no, that's great. Always plugging in to learn new stuff. The thing is too, if we're not consistently changing and evolving and moving forward, like we're going backwards. If we're not moving forward, we're going backwards. Change is constant. It's going one way or the other. So I think it's always good to be plugged into stuff. Any final thoughts, Dave,

appreciate you hanging out. Any final thoughts before we sign off? I suppose it's anyone listening to this and they're on the fence whether to take the leap or not. What have you got to lose, honestly? Like even if you give yourself a month to trial out, join your group, listen to the podcast, read. Education really helped me understanding what alcohol did to me and understanding in who I was as a person. But I think in the beginning, it's just concentrate on the basics. And a day at a time, as we both know, just concentrate, get your head on the pillow at night and go,

that's another day ticked off. I'm doing really well. Look in the mirror and start speaking to yourself in a more positive way because we've spent years running ourselves down. I used to call myself an idiot on a daily basis, you use less, what a waste of space. And I learned that really affected my mood in the day. So it's, you're doing all right you are.

You're trying your best. At least you're trying to change. And just give yourself the opportunity, treat it like an experiment and go, let's see how good I can feel in 30 days. Eat the right foods, a bit of mindfulness, have some sleep. And at the end of the 30 days, reassess it and go, do I really want to go back to that? Or do I want to do another week or another 30 days and keep moving forward that way? And I think at least that way, it removes the pressure of forever for a start. And it gives you more as well, like positive attitude is a must because when I was drinking,

I was always negative. Everything was doom and gloomy, and I had to change that. So I just think, give it a go and see where it leads you, really. Yeah, I love that. Yeah, I mean, you have to get started somewhere, right? You hear people share too sometimes like, I'm on my first day when it's got heavy tone. And it's like, man, like, great job. That might be the hardest one to get through for a lot of people.

So it's like, pick your head up. Great work. You're getting started on something that could literally change your entire life as you know it. It's going to take a little bit of time. You're going to struggle a little bit. It's going to be uncomfortable. But come on. If it wasn't a good thing, I sure as heck wouldn't have stuck around.

I don't think you would have either. If we weren't getting some benefits from it, we want to see the results. You don't get a sober person saying, I regret getting sober. And as you framed it then, I'm on my first day. I'm on my first day. You pick it up. I've made the leap. I've got up and I've said, this is day one rather than, oh, you know, like, you've got to be

positive and everything changes and it can change so quickly as well. One of the things for me that changed the most was anxiety. My anxiety went down within a few days. I felt so much calmer within a few days. And I thought, actually, there's something in this, you know. Yeah, just go for it. I would say, Brad. Yeah, 100%.

Thanks, Dave. Pleasure, mate. And it's lovely seeing you, mate. Yeah, you too. Well, there it is. Sober Dave, giving us an incredible update. I'm always inspired Dave drinking for 40 years and then making the changes in his life and to see where he's at now.

I've known Dave for years here virtually, and we've worked on a lot of cool projects together. And yeah, it's been an incredible friendship across the pond. So hope you guys enjoyed it. Be sure to check out as Instagram, too, if you don't already. Sober Dave. And now we're going to chat with Kristen. Welcome back, everyone. We have Kristen with us today, who just last week, right?

Four years last week? Yep. Wow. And that's incredible. Give us a little recap from the episode since we recorded a little bit of a little a while ago of your story and how things look for you towards the end and where you are now. Yeah, so four years ago, I was deeply struggling with alcohol and Xanax addiction. And I was just in a horrible place.

I was physically dependent on Zanahing alcohol, specifically wine. And at first I was functioning for a while. I got to a place where I got them. I no longer had it under control. My family ended up having an intervention with me. I tried rehab. As soon as I got back from rehab, I relapsed. And then I ended up, my family got me into a recovery house.

And I ended up living there, getting sober. And after that, I have been sober ever since. Yeah, wow. Great job. You know, it's interesting, too, with the Xanax mix of things. There's been a handful of people on the podcast that talked about sort of their experience with Xanax mixing with the alcohol and stuff too. And I think there's a lot of people out there because those episodes seem to have a lot

of listeners. A lot of people out there are struggling with that. And there doesn't seem to be out. I don't know, I'm not everywhere, but it doesn't seem to be that there's a ton of people talking about it. It's sort of really interesting. thing I find. Yeah, I think there's a lot of shame around it. Even if you have a prescription and you start abusing it, you know, you don't want to tell anyone that because you feel embarrassed.

So I think people do struggle in silence because I definitely was. Yeah. And then too, I always wonder, too, having, if you're if you're being prescribed it and you have that conversation, like, I've never been there, but I would imagine like there's going to be, um, some sort of intervention about, you know, how do we go about this if you're struggling with it and you prescribed it too, right? Like, and maybe that's worrisome for people that could be in that spot. What do you think? A lot of people that have messaged me, it's the fear of withdrawal, like, they're scared to go off of it and they're like, how do I taper down? And am I going to feel awful? And so I just think it's that fear of knowing that there's going to be

withdrawal symptoms or there could be withdrawal symptoms. But when I tapered off properly with the doctor, I really didn't have any withdrawal symptoms. So that was really lucky. Yeah, that's great. What does emotional sobriety kind of mean something to you in your journey and how have you been able to really work on that? Because that's something that comes up a lot. A lot of times it's like, okay, we got sober. Now all this other stuff comes up that we've maybe been avoiding or numbing for however many years, how have you been able to work through that aspect on your journey? Yeah, it's been hard and also really cool to see how much I've changed over the four years. Like when I look back and luckily I've, you know, documented it all on Instagram. And

when I look back at like videos or things I said in the beginning, I'm like, wow, I feel like my mind was still not right even like a year or even two years into sobriety. I'm like I still feel like I wasn't myself. Like I think it took my brain a really long time to heal from the damage that I had done from the Xanax. And I think by year three is when I kind of was like fully feel like myself again. But with that also came challenges like because I. you know,

drink and took Xanax to numb my anxiety. And so kind of as I developed, I guess, for myself, just I'm like, okay, I get why I was numbing. I get how hard this was. But as you go on, you kind of develop tools and skills along the way.

And I think also there's so much good that comes from sobriety that it out, I feel like it outweighs any of the anxiety or struggles that I'm feeling. And so it really helps me just be like, okay, this anxiety is just a small part of the day compared to like this lifetime of sobriety I get to have. But you do like the longer you stay sober, I feel the more you become yourself and you start like just becoming the person that you knew you could be like when you are using

substances. Yeah. So finding other ways to work through the anxiety and not turning. to what, you know, the interesting thing about the Xanax, too, a lot of people when they share, they had, you know,

this anxiety, right? So they go through the proper channels. And the Xanax becomes like this thing of like, oh my goodness. Like it really just helps out so much in the beginning. But then like as time goes, people have different experiences,

but as tolerance builds and I think when you mix alcohol into it, right, it can make it a slippery slope for things. So now it's like when you get sober, then it's like, how do I work through that? I mean, what is like a tool or two that you've really leaned on and developed over these four years to help you through those times when you do get anxious or you do struggle with things?

Yeah. So I am in, I think doing research on like what type of anxiety you have and what specific type of therapies you could need. I've been in therapy for my OCD. I'm now doing EMDR therapy just for some PTSD I have. And I didn't really know when I was just drinking and numbing to escape these feelings. I didn't really know what I needed like to heal or what I was really struggling with. And so getting sober, I've been able to do research and be like, okay, I need to get in therapy for my OCD.

I need to get an EMDR therapy because that is going to be the best for, my PTSD slash panic. And my faith has been a huge part of it when my anxiety just feels like so overwhelming that I can't handle it, really just leaning on Bible verses on anxiety, like literally Googling like verses on anxiety or using chat GPT and saying like what Bible verses are for anxiety and just reading them, memorizing scripture for when I'm in panic attacks instead of room. repeating scripture to myself. Yeah, no, those are incredible. And it's, it's so interesting, too, right? When we get sober, then we start to plug into these other areas, right? Because I think a lot

of us, too, as we're struggling, we might plug into therapy. We might plug into counseling. We might plug into support. But it's really hard to soak it all up, I think, right? If we're still in the mix and it becomes a lot more manageable and a lot more possible when we're sober to really get the benefits out of, you know, a lot of this stuff. Because when I was struggling, I would go to this stuff, I would do this, get people off my back. And then I would always be like, it doesn't work. It doesn't work.

And when I look back at it now, it's like, well, you weren't really putting in, for me anyway, I wasn't really putting in a whole ton of effort to do it. Plus, I just wasn't in a good place to be able to soak everything up and, like, really have the confidence to make those changes. So those are incredible examples. I mean, what have you learned about yourself as well on top of that as you just celebrated four years? Like, what have what have you learned and maybe, you know, a few things that have surprised you about this journey for you? Just how much I've been able to do sober.

I just really can't believe it. I mean, in these past four years, I have, like, gotten a promotion at work. I've moved. I just put a contract in. for like my dream land to move on like just all these things I got a puppy I found the person I think I'm going to marry just like it's like literally all these things I used to write down in active addiction and dream of and never thought that I could do like I now have all that because of sobriety and I mean I've gone on the news like which I never thought I could do

because of anxiety, like just all this stuff that drinking and using Xanax to numb, like, it holds you back from so much that like, I feel like when you're doing that, you just can't be the person that you're meant to be. And when you let go of all of that, it feels really scary at first. But then the longer you stay sober, like seriously, it's like each year, more and more blessings keep happening as I continue to become my. again and figure out who I am. Yeah, stick around.

You know, that's the thing is sometimes I feel like we, you know, we want the instant gratification of staying sober. Now I'm 90 days sober and I want everything to change overnight. And although changes are taking place, some things as well take time. It does. You know, I look at it like there's levels to it. Yes. You know, and new things come about, the more we show up in this direction.

Always curious, too, when I meet with other people who share their story. on social media too, which I think takes a lot of vulnerability, takes a lot of courage to put it out there and stuff kind of on the internet can live on forever. It's not like we can just take it all down one day. Like stuff can live on in one way or another. And to put yourself out there in a sense, you know, why is that something that's really important to you to kind of, I guess, further the message to let other people know that they're not alone and to help them out in any way that you can. What do you think about that? it's important to me because when I was struggling, I didn't know anybody, you know, in real life that

had addiction. Like, whenever I'd go out with people, I was always the one getting too drunk, being like, you know, people being like you're too drunk. Why did you drink this much? And so I always just felt like something was wrong with me and I felt so alone. And then I found, I didn't know about like sober podcasts or sober books or sober Instagram or any of that when I was struggling or even in the beginning, the very beginning of sobriety. And so I truly felt so alone. And so I remember seeing someone that I knew from years ago that I followed talking about their sobriety.

And I just couldn't believe it because it was someone I never thought would have. have, you know, a problem with drinking. And when I was struggling, they would do these lives or they'd be like, hey, I'm going to go live tonight and share like about my, you know, struggle with alcohol. And I remember I was deeply struggling with wine then and Xanax. And I would be like, okay, I'm going to try to be like kind of sober so I can like listen to this. And so it just really helped me. It made me want to be like sober enough to listen to it. And it just, it made me feel less alone. And it gave me something to look forward to and some kind of hope that I could listen to her story and relate and that there was someone else out there like me. And so I remember when I

got sober, I was like, I want to be that for someone else. Like even if it just helps one person like me who's struggling in silence and trying to pretend they have it all together. Like, I want to be that account they can come to and, you know, feel like they're not alone and get some hope from. Yeah. And has that been a part of your experience with it, like response from people? Yes. It's been amazing being able to connect with so many other people online and them share their

story with me and where they're at. and, you know, I can talk with them with no judgment and give them advice. I've been able to meet so many people and friends now. You know, it's just, it's really been a really positive experience. Yeah, that's incredible. And too, I mean, it's interesting too there where that kind of helped you out. And now you flip it around to be that for somebody else. You know, I mean, that's a common trend that we hear a lot, right? It's we didn't know any sober people in our life, right? Like, we didn't have that maybe exam. or even what it's going to be like, right? And our perceptions of what a sober person was, like, come on, that's like how much fun is that going to be or, you know, what does that even look like? And that's boring because there was a time in my life, too, I even reflect on where I just couldn't wait to go out to party, to mingle, to connect and all this stuff. I just, there was a part where I thought that would be my whole life.

Like that would be my whole life. I'm like, this is going to be my whole life. and I was like, this would be incredible. You know, you feel that sense of purpose, but you don't have an example or a role model of how other people are doing it in what, you know, sobriety looks like, right? We all think like, we hear it all the time, right? It's going to be boring or how fun is that going to be?

It's like, oh, my goodness, it's so far from that, though. It's like, when I look back at it now, I'm like, man, the way I was living, like, that was just such a small, it felt big, but it really, looking back and cutting myself a little bit of slack, it was such a small life. It was such a small life for me. And now the opportunities like the stuff you've mentioned too, right? All these other things coming into your life. A direct result, I think, in one way or another of getting sober and opening up opportunities.

Anything else, Kristen, you want to mention. I really appreciate you jumping on here. Huge congrats to again on four years. Thank you. Is there anything else you want to send out there to maybe anybody struggling or any other thoughts? Yeah, I was in a place where I literally was on the floor, like, sobbing with my bottle of wine, crying because I had ran out of Xanax. Literally, I felt like the most hopeless person alive. I didn't even want to be alive. And now, like, my life is a complete 180 from that.

And in that moment, I never, ever would have thought that. So just don't give up, like, your mirror, could literally be around the corner, like that moment where you are about to surrender it and give it up and, you know, just be done with it. Like that moment can be there way sooner than you expect because I definitely never thought I was going to stop, thought that was going to be my life forever. And now it's just, it's completely different. So just don't give up hope and just keep showing up and trying. And yeah, it can get better. it is possible for you too. Yeah, no, everything you said there is so true. And it's always interesting how we kind of reflect back. I mean, I remember like it was yesterday. I never thought

my life would change or be any different than, you know, the way it was. And like so many years later, I'm just like, I'm just waiting for somebody to turn the lights on. Like, there's some sort of joke they're playing on me of like how much things can actually change in our worlds by, you know, I like the way you put it there about just surrendering. Some people talk about surrendering to win, you know, in many other areas of life that doesn't make, you know, the most sense, right? Like if we're doing a sport or something, you surrender, well, you're not going to win, you lose. But in this case, it's giving up that fight and just saying, like, enough is enough. I'm not going to be able to do this maybe the way I once did.

You know, I got a note from somebody recently, too. And it's a common sort of thread, too, about I'm drinking every day, but I only want to drink. at events. You know, how do I make that possible? And, you know, my thoughts are, my quick thoughts on it are, is like, if that was something that that person could make possible, they would have done it already. You know, it's like if I could have just drank on weekends and not made a mess of my life, like I would still be doing that, you know? Like, I don't know that I really wanted to give up drinking and really wanted to give up drugs. I think that the pain was just increasing to where I was like, maybe I'll just try this.

And then as I went on, it's like I couldn't imagine my life any other way. But I think like if we're trying to put this fence around it, it's something to have a look at, you know, because if we could do that, like we would do that. Yeah, that never worked for me either. And I tried. I wasted years trying. Like I'd be like, okay, this month I'll just drink beer instead of wine. I'll just, I'll only drink on this night.

Like, and it just, it never works. It always ends up over time getting worse and worse. Yeah. And what a lot of people share too is it's exhausting. Like, it's much more exhausting than actual just full sobriety. I agree. It is so much easier for me to have none. Like, it sounds so much harder.

But when that's not in your life anymore, you're not freeing it the same way. You're not thinking about it. It's not something when you're stressed, you're even like it's not an option so you're not thinking about it in the way you did where you're like oh my gosh should i'm going to go home and have a drink but then what if i'm hung over for work but then i need to relieve the stress should i drink it's like it's been a lot easier for me to have just none yeah i'm with you yeah it's that that gymnastics that math of i remember that too it's just like you know try to have four drinks right because then the hangover wouldn't be too bad as like four

drinks but then you look at the clock and it's like it's only 11 o'clock so it's like five drinks and two more cigarettes and then it's like, okay, it's still early. And it's just like, oh my gosh, you, and then you wake up in the morning anyway and feel terrible and the anxiety. And then it's beat ourselves up. Why couldn't I just not end up there again? But thank you so much, relatable. It's so many ways to me and I'm sure to others.

So thank you so much for spending some time with me today. Yeah, thank you so much for having me. Another amazing clip there. Huge shout out to Kristen, too, again on four years. Making the changes, bringing that interesting dynamic to things of struggling with the alcohol and the Xanax, which is a really deadly mix. It can be anyway. And a lot of people experience blackouts, and it's a really, really tough place to come back from.

So incredibly proud for her. If you enjoyed that clip, be sure to send her message over on Instagram, give her a follow. It just puts out really cool stuff, you know, lifting people up and sharing her experience. and how things were and how far she's come. So incredible stuff. We're going to catch up with Manny next. Mani was on the podcast long, long time ago. You know, when we first met, we touched about it a little bit here.

But Manny, after we connected, he said, you know what, I'm going to start a show. And I was like, we'll see, Manny. We'll see. And he's been doing a whole heck of a lot more than just that over the years. So incredibly proud of him. Let's hear from Manny. Hey, guys, with us on this clip, we've got Manny Vitaly. Mani was on the podcast many moons ago.

Good to see you, buddy. How are you doing? I'm good, man. I can't believe how long it's been. You know, it's going on, what, two years? That's insane. Let me paint the picture real quick, man, for everybody who couldn't see the video. So Manny joins in.

He's in his truck. Probably the first podcast you ever did, right? First one. First podcast he ever did. We connected, I think, on Facebook. I don't even know if you really completely understood what the heck you were getting yourself into with the podcast, Matt. Not a clue. You were my first one.

And I was very blessed to have you as my first show. And yeah, I planned on just doing the show, telling my story. And that was it. But after the show was over, I was like, holy shit, this is something that I want to pursue. And I think I remember telling you, I want to do this stuff. And yeah, it just ended up being amazing. And then you opened a few doors for me with a few other people and contacts. And I tell you, I mean, it's been amazing ever since.

So thank you. Yeah, of course. And it's been great having you and great to stay connected over the years. Walk us through for anybody who didn't maybe listen to the episode or can't remember everything. What it was like for you at the end and how much of an uphill battle you were really up against. Yeah, I tell you know, One thing doing these shows, I listen to all of our stories and how, of course, all of our stories are so different. But when it comes right down to the root of it, man, there's so much the same.

And for mine, you know, drinking, drugs and just going down that pathway of destruction, man, and the drinking, everything just escalates it with addiction, as we know. It just gets, it's not like I become a better addict or a better alcoholic. It's just, you know, it just disasters waiting for us. And with mine, there was a lot of issues from, I was actually a Detroit police officer. And with my drinking and drinking and drug abuse as a Detroit police officer, there you go. So it obviously affected my life and decisions where I actually, there was a decision. You know, drugs, alcohol are my career. And drugs and alcohol ended up being such a stronghold that took over my decisions.

and I ended up leaving the police department. And I always ran with a bunch of wild crew with the Harleys and all that. And I became a one-percenter motorcycle club member with the Detroit Highwaymen. So I literally went from a lawman to an outlaw. And the drinking, the drugs, the violence, the shootings, stabbing. I've, you know, been shot, stabbed, numerous things going on out of control to the point where you always hear you're rock bottom. and mine, I've been told many times you're lucky to be alive. You know, gun shoved right here, trigger pulled.

I've got a plate under my eye. One, I'm still alive, I can still see. You think that would teach you your lesson. A year later, another fight got slid with a razor knife down the side of my face. All these things, you know, drugs, alcohol, just, you know, and that was all I cared about. You know, I didn't give a shit about anyone or anything until the faithful day when I woke up and I looked in the mirror and I saw these edy little, eity-bitty yellow eyes looking back at me.

And as a former EMT, you know, working in the medical field as well, I obviously knew, you know, obviously liver issues and, you know, from the drinking. And, you know, I had a friend come over, saw me and she's, man, your eyes are fucking yellow, man. And she goes, we got to get you to the hospital.

I'm like, no. She goes, you're going to die. Yeah. I didn't care. The next day, it was that same routine, man, got up, went right to the party store, grabbed a bottle, which was an adventure in itself because my hands were shaking so freaking bad, make it out to my truck and just start guzzling down this god-awful bourbon as fast as I could to try to make the shakes and that feeling go away. Later on that evening, I just remember waking up. And I was at my mother's house at the time. And somehow, like, moaning, yelling,

whatever and got her attention. Next thing I know, EMS is there, putting me on a gurney. And from where my mother was living, it was like a five-minute ride right to the hospital was right there. And the rest of this story is being filled in by family and friends, because I was pretty much going out of it at this time. I got there and the doctors more or less said, there's nothing we could do for him here. We got to send them down to Henry Ford, Maine, and Detroit, which is our big trauma center. And I spent 30 days there, 15 in ICU. I coded twice. And on one faithful day, I was laying in bed and these two doctors that were in charge of the organs, this older gentleman and a female doctor. and the older doctor had the bedside manner and the guy was just a jackass.

And he wakes me up and I'm in this room by myself. And says, Bannie, I got to talk to you. And he starts giving me statistics. Six out of ten people with labs like yours don't make it and this and I'm like, I still, besides being, by this time I'm completely yellow. I am yellow from head to toe. I'm starting to hallucinate. My organs are functioning, but barely.

my pancreatitis was so severe. They've got me on dilauded. So that's a heavy pain killer. So between that and the liver issues, he's telling me, you know, why you've been here, you've coded twice. You know, we got you back. And basically, right now there's nothing more we can do for you. And again, he's telling me this all alone.

You know, I don't have any family there to listen to this story. So he says, you know what? We're going to have people come in and talk to you. So he gets up and leaves. Okay, there's nothing we can do for you. So I'm still not sure what's going on. I fall asleep. I wake up, but I look and there's this younger associate,

the female doctor, who was just amazing. As soon as I saw her, I knew it was like, oh shit. And she's standing there in my room crying. And I'm like, damn. And she goes, I know you talk to my associate. And she goes, I'm so sorry, Maddie. And I'm like, you know, there's got to be something you can do. And she goes, there's absolutely nothing.

we can do for you. She goes, the entire time you've been in the hospital, your organs have been functioning, but just barely, but they have been functioning. She said in the last 24 hours, we've been monitoring your lab work with drying blood every four hours. And in the last 24 hours, your kidneys, pancreas, and liver have all completely shut down. They're no longer functioning. And with multi-organ failure, there's no coming back. There's no medicine. There's no magic pill, no magic medicine to start your organs. And I just remember staring at her, man.

And I said, well, how long do I have? And she starts crying more and sits down on the bed, holds my hand. And she says, less than six weeks. And I just remember sitting there. I was like, holy shit. She said, hospice is here to talk to you. They're taking over your care. Basically, you're going to go home and die.

And we're having this conversation just like me and you are now, Brad. That's how I am talking to her. So I'm still lucid into all that. So not only that, she's like, do you want me to stay until your family gets here? I got to make a phone call now. I got to call my mom because my dad passed a year before. So I'm like, I actually have to call my mom right now. Hey, ma, it's your son.

Yeah, I want to be dead in six weeks. I mean, how do you make that phone call? So I call. She answers the phone. And she's so high. She goes, I'm just running to the store. Do you need me to bring you anything? It's a hospital.

Do you need to? She has no idea what's going on. And I'm like, listen, Mom, I need you to get to the hospital now. You know, I need to talk to you now. Okay, well, I'll be there. You know, I just have to go to the store first. No, Mom, I need you here right now. And she's, I will, and she still has no clue.

Finally, I was very forceful about you need to get here immediately. And she goes, what's going on? I'm not about to tell my mom over the phone that her only son's going to be dead a few weeks. So she rounds up her sister and some other family and loved ones, a friend of mine. They come to the hospital and I'm thinking on the way here. How do I tell my mother this? how do I have this conversation with my family when they walk in the door? And I mean, how do you do that?

And I remember when they walked in just staring at them and they had that look like what is going on. And the only thing that popped out of my mouth was I said, I'm sorry, but I have to leave you. And of course, they're like, what are you talking about? But I said the doctors were in. My organs have completely shut down and I have lasted six weeks to live. My aunt starts crying. A friend of mine, she starts crying. My ma didn't even blink.

She was just like, you know, they're coming over hugging me and there's got to be something. And my ma, nothing. And I said, Mom, I'm so sorry. And she goes, no. I'm like, what do you mean? No. And she goes, it's not up to them.

It's up to God. And I'm like, Ma, you don't understand. And she goes, no, and that's it. And all of a sudden the doctor's walking because she was getting a little love. And she said, my aunt said, maybe there's a mistake. And the doctor said, we're very sorry, but there's no mistake. Hospice is here taking over his care.

And, you know, he's got less than six weeks to live. And I mean, it was just unbelievable. So here I am, you know, just waiting to go home. So they come in to do my blood work. And they said, we're transferring your information to hospice. Well, they came back another couple hours actually later. to take more blood, which even in my polluted mind at the time, thought it was weird. So they take more blood, and then they came back again and again, like throughout the night with more

people. And it's what the hell's going on? They wouldn't tell me. They just said, we need to get more blood from you. Well, Brad, this went on for seven days. You know, they kept making up excuses while I was still there. And finally, on the seventh day, my room's full of doctors, full of nurses, full of these specialists, all just sitting there looking at me and doctor death than the younger female are at the foot of my bed. And all of a sudden he leans over and grabs my ankle. And he's looking at me and he just starts smiling. And then he starts laughing. And I'm like, you evil prick, you're sending me home to die and you're fucking laughing at me. And I look around. He looks at the other doctors and they start laughing. I'm like,

the hell. And the female doctor comes over, sits down, and she starts crying. She says, Manning, we're sending you home, but not to die. We're sending you home to live. And I was like, what the hell is going on? She said, we've been coming and taking your blood to transfer the records to hospice. And obviously, there's going to be no change in your levels because they're not functioning. She goes, however, when we got your results back, there was movement in all three levels. Kidneys, pancreas, and liver, they were showing some movement in the numbers, which they know had to be wrong. So they did a recheck, and they did it under different conditions. It moved again.

Every time they came in and drew blood, my numbers kept fluctuating for the better. By the seventh day, and in the meantime, they're calling in all these specialists. By the seventh day, they said, not only are your numbers fluctuating and moving, they are all now in normal range. She said, you know, you should be, she goes, when we told you six weeks, she goes, we were trying to give you the energy and the fight to stay alive until your family got here. And she said, you know, we all thought you'd be dead in less than 48 hours. And here, all of a sudden, all your levels are completely functioning, your kidneys,

pancreas and liver all started up again. And that's why all these doctors are here. So, I mean, you talk about a lease on life, boy, that was, that was it. That was incredible. Wow. When, what year was that? That was in 2020. So, and don't forget, 2020 is when the world shut down with COVID. So here, you know, here I am ready to die. I mean, basically every time I shut my eyes, man. It could have been the last time that I ever saw the lighted day. And all of a sudden now, it's, oh, no, you're going to live now. I mean, thought about messing with your head. So I'm sitting there now, listen, man, you need to get intense health therapy, rehab. I mean, 24-7 inpatient care, and you need this and this. And if you even look at alcohol,

you'll die. You know, we don't even think of drinking. And that was the only time I was ever were scared, just when they said, you know, you can't drink. It's like, that's all I knew. So I get released and I go home and I contact the people who I was told to contact. And they're like, Mr. Vitale, we're closed. You know, COVID, this was the beginning of March when everything completely shut down. So I never made it to one meeting. I never went to anything because the world was shut down because of COVID. But by the grace of God, this past January 27th, I just celebrated five years of sobriety. Yeah.

Well, it's been helpful for you. I think of things going. For me, the whole time, I, every day that went by, I'm getting stronger. I'm eating better. I'm not doing anything different besides not drinking and doing drugs. I'm working out. I'm back at the gym again. Going on with my life without drugs and alcohol.

And then I always knew I wanted to do something to give back and help. But I resorted to the old mani and just talk a lot of shit. Yeah, I'm going to change. I'm going to do this. I'm going to start a social media family and help people. Well, I did that for three years, just a bunch of talk. And one day, I was in the living room and I got up and walked into the kitchen. In fact, here's my, the actual paper that I went and sat down and I said,

tonight's the night. I'm going to start a social media foundation of an organization. And I go, I need a name. So I'm sitting there and bred less than five minutes, all this happened. I grabbed this pen and this paper, and all of a sudden I wrote, this is the actual paper, my fight our war, and that's supposed to be a little wolf, but I wrote it just like that too. I wrote my fight our war.

And I remember going, what the fuck? Why? And it didn't make sense. My fight. Someone's might be heroin. Someone's might be meth, alcohol, whatever's there fight. Our war is addiction. It made sense.

I'm like, man, I look up. Oh, God, you're good. And then I wrote, join our pack, you'll never be alone, which is now our logo, which is behind me. Yeah, and I started that on January the 9th, 2023, and we just celebrated our two-year anniversary of social media platform helping anyone and everyone dealing with addiction, mental health issues, anything at all. You know, it's just incredible. Yeah, just to offer that support. Yeah, that's, you have that little picture there. It reminds me of when somebody starts a business and they make their first dollar.

You know, they put a dollar on the wall. I mean, what's it meant to you? Like, how has you sounded fulfilling to create a space so just helping so many people? I don't mean they disrespect to anybody because like I said, you know, I'm not inventing the wheel here. But, you know, the best way to recover is whatever works for you. Yeah. I think it's important, too, to meet people where they're at. I mean, in a perfect world, you know, we would just.

you know, get sober for everybody else, right? We would do the work for them. It doesn't work like that. People have to be interested in and invested in there. I think people are more likely to pursue something that they feel like they're deciding as opposed to us just telling people how to do it. You know, and the options are more than like when I first started getting sober. There were less options.

Now there's more things you can plug into such as podcasts, books, you know, different virtual platforms, different in-person platforms. There's just so many options out there for people like definitely keep trying until you find what works for you. Just thinking about wrapping up here, man, because we went for a quick 20 minutes already. Oh my God. Thank you. Anything you want to leave us with, man? I mean, we'll be sure to check my fight hour war. But I mean, any other thoughts that, you know, you've learned over the last five years or in everything and two since last time we connected? Sure. The one thing is, you know, don't ever look at your, how minor or major accomplishments are. Anything that you've accomplished, man, be proud of yourself.

It's okay to look in that mirror and smile and be proud, man, for what you've done. Don't compare yourself to anyone else. You be you. And the most important thing to remember is just remember, addiction is not a death sentence, man. Find what works for you. listen to other people's advice, but whatever works for you, you go forward and be the best you could possibly be. Yeah, I love that.

Yeah, and listen to other people's suggestions for sure. We do that in all areas of our life. If I wanted to be a top-notch basketball player, like, probably be good for me to go and talk to other basketball players. Yeah. Like, how do you do it? But I think the thing that is also really important is because we're not doing it a certain way, doesn't mean we're doing it wrong.

Because we find a way that works and it's maybe not what other people are doing or what they see value in. That's how tense. Not everybody has to agree with the way that we make this happen for ourselves. So great message. Thank you, Manny. No, man, thank you, Brad. I appreciate it. And, you know, anytime there's anything I can do, I'm all in for you, man, after everything you've done for us.

100%, buddy. Thank you. Well, there it is. Another incredible episode. So grateful for everybody. who's listening to the podcast. I've been giving a lot of messages about people that feel so alone. And like, nobody understands. And I just want to put a message out there. Not that what I say is going to make a whole heck of a lot of difference in your life. But I want you to know that there are people

out there who get it. There are people out there who will support you. There are people out there who will help you. And there are people out there who will work together with you to improve your life and move away from maybe the life you've known for some time. Like this whole thing is possible. I shared a little bit in one of the episodes there that like I don't know that I really wanted to quit drinking, that I really wanted to get sober. But I was just tired of the way I was living. It just always ended up back the same, like trying this and trying that.

And with time, like Kristen hit on it too. It's like, this is so much easier. It seems like it's impossible mountain to climb that's never going to be possible. And we all had those thoughts. Like, how could we envision a life without alcohol? Like, that was just such a foreign concept to so many of us. But it's so much easier just to not drink, not have to go through that back and forth and all around and trying to figure it out and trying to balance things and the shame and the

guilt and everything that piles up. It's just so much easier to have none. Life is fun. It's beautiful. We get to show up. Be who we want to be. Our confidence comes back. Our self-esteem builds.

And people just really create incredible lives for themselves. Now, the tough part is it all doesn't happen overnight. It takes time. So give yourself time. But getting started is where it all starts. Plug in, get some support. And I'll see you on the next one.