SoccerWise - 2025 MLS Season Preview CIN, ORL, FCD & NYCFC

Episode Date: February 18, 2025

The next installment of our MLS season previews is thanks to the big #10 dominos falling! First we chat with Kevin Wallace (Cincy PostCast) about surviving the Lucho exit, Evander excitement, and 2025 expectations. Then Michael (Orlando Lions Den Podcast) stops by to talk about all the big additions to OSCS's attack. Next we dig into the other side of the Lucho sweepstakes with the celebrations in Dallas. We check in with Buzz Carrick (3rd Degree) who knows all things FC Dallas better than anyone. And finally Andrew (Hudson River Blue) checks in to chat about what NYCFC will look like under new manager Pascal Jansen.2:13 FC Cincy w/Kevin Cincy PostCast34:43 ORL w/Michael Orlando Lion's Den Podcast1:14:12 FC Dallas w/Buzz Carrick 3rd Degree1:51:19 NYCFC w/Andrew Hudson River Blue Soccerwise Live 2pm ET Every Tuesday/Wednesday/Thursday on Youtube/Twitch/Twitter

Welcome everybody to Soccer Wise. David Goss, Tom Bogert with you. You will hear that a couple times over the next few hours if you are listening. This is one of our season preview episodes. We've got four different segments coming up to help preview four different teams. Tom, we've already put out 16 different previews already broken up into four different shows. We are having a lot of fun. The timestamps are in there for everyone to go find them.

I think we're really enjoying getting out and getting to talk to a lot of different people around the league. You more so than me, because I've missed a few of these so I appreciate you David Goss as always for being the glue, the foundation, the everything here, the skeleton, the bones, whatever you want to say. That's David Goss for you. My favorite part about Major League Soccer, and I'm going to ignore the nice things you

said as I'm supposed to do, is that it's like, okay, I put together the lists, we put together the list and then it was like, all right, these teams might still have big moves coming so they push those down the road. Down the road is like 13 hours before the season starts. Maybe these teams are going to make some big moves. We're still doing that with some other clubs as well. But the Domino effect was very strong for this show. So we've got Cincinnati, we've got Dallas in this one, and we've got NYCFC as well. We believe Santi Rodriguez is finally gonna move on. And then we're gonna talk about Orlando City,

who have made some big moves. So a really, really fun show. If you haven't, go listen to our other ones. Please follow all these shows. I think for sure on social media, it's the best way to follow the league. Like you're gonna get news out of trainings and conversations and transfers and all that type of stuff from all of these

sources across the league not the number one source Tom Boger but you know other people are working as well and then if you have any interest in knowing more about these teams it's the place to go listen and follow maybe even the week before your team plays these teams or if you're watching games and you're like huh I'm actually kind of interested about St. Louis. And you can go check out the Ball Watching Podcast, who we did a show with yesterday, or any of these other teams as well.

So we're really enjoying things and let's get into it right now. Let's get started with Cincinnati, Tom. We've been waiting and waiting and waiting to do this preview segment. We've got Kevin Wallace coming up in just a moment to chat about this team. He's been waiting longer than us as we've been messaging and it's been the Lucho

stuff once again. It is finally done. How do you feel about how it's all gone down and where Cincinnati stands? I love it. Look, it was clear that the relationship between Lucho Cosa and this team had to be done. Both sides I think tried to keep it going or leaving open the possibility and then, I don't know, after his fifth different interview, it's saying that he wants to leave or saying why he's being pushed out or whatever, there's just no road back. So I love that for Dallas that they were able to get him. What delayed this is the Sudiantes made a bid, well guess what, they don't have any money, so that slowed things down, so that's why nothing was signed there. So it

was drawn out more than I think everybody would have wanted it to be. But at the end, everybody got the result they wanted, which includes FC Cincinnati getting a Vander. So Lucho Costa is a former MLS MVP and an MVP finalist, I believe last year, or was at least in the mix. Aander isn't an M1 MVP yet But he's absolutely in that conversation for one of the best players in the league Somebody who can go thermonuclear at any given time and carry a team I think Avander is gonna fit even better with Cincinnati because he can do all this heliocentric stuff and They have the defensive structure behind him. That's better than what Portland had begin with these three center backs. I

cannot I'm honestly like around you know 35 to 40 goal contributions is not a crazy number for a vendor I forget exactly what he had last year, but it wasn't far off. I think I think he was at 30 last year was he okay? So maybe 40 is probably a little bit of a stretch 20 well I can check he was third by the way in voting for Major League Soccer Yeah last year. So like he has those credentials. Sorry. He was at 34 Okay. Yeah, I'm expecting more this year. I mean again, that's that's pretty ridiculously unfair to this player But I think he's gonna be better in this system at least have more chances

He has Kevin Denke with him now to again briefly was a league record and must transfer between Denke and and Evander It's like 28 million dollars plus of two new attacking talents. This is the narrative around the scene this winter has been Lucho Costa Oh, Luca Oriano didn't show up either and Yuyakuba was the most surprising holdout of all time in soccer for preseason. Why are they doing this? Oh, they need to sign a left back thing.'re like, there were a lot of fair questions. How is this going to get resolved? So the narrative has been like questioning things. I think now you can take a step back and be like,

this was one of the best off seasons in league. It is true what you are saying. I am then trying to counter that in where this team wants to stand, you can't really afford to have anything out of place. Like if you want to contend for a supporter shield again, you're chasing a team that set the points record last year. Getting a new DP in the door six days before the season starts isn't really the way to do that.

If you want to contend in Conq.F Champions Cup, getting the new DP in the door three days before your first game isn't normally the way to do that. If you want to contend in Konkukov Champions Cup, getting the new DP in the door three days before your first game isn't normally the way to do that. Now they've got more structure in place and they are bringing in a more known quantity in MOS than maybe ever in Major League Soccer history for a move like this and they have a really good track record of being able to maintain performances. So I think you're right in from the moment Lucho said what he said after the last game of the season to 12 months later, well they will stand at that exact point, which I think will be still in the playoffs rather than out. It has all

gone really well. Where I sit right now today, I'm not as sold in like where they're going to hit day one. You are though, right? Yeah. Yeah, this is my shield pick I don't think that there's gonna be a big ramp up time for a Vander Dekay everything I've heard he's been awesome Like just watching him in individual training like Pat Noonan came out and said yeah Maybe we're a little bit behind where we want to be and I think that was him just letting his frustration about Oriano and Acosta and everything else kind of boil over like We we want all this to be happening so we can be working with Denke and the players

He's gonna be playing with well Lucho's out of Anderson two really good attacking players Particularly the individualism that Evander has and like the creative joy that he has I don't think it's gonna be very long for him and Kevin decade to get on the same wavelength And Denke's almost gone under the radar through this whole thing transfer 24 years old entering entering his prime, coming off some huge seasons in Belgium and like much needed for this group. So I'm excited to watch them play.

I've said this a couple of times, never been to TQL. It's one of the few I've never been to and the atmosphere looks incredible. Obviously I've heard about the march to the match just once or twice, but I've never been a part of it. So I would love to see this team play deep into the season for us to get the chance to go to some big games there. And while Columbus, or while Cincinnati

was slightly melting down, Columbus was melting a little bit deeper. So that's a positive in Ohio for Cincinnati as well. All right, let's get into our segment here, previewing this team. Let's go to our conversation with Kevin. I guess we haven't talked about them much. I don't know if you've heard, but there is a Major League Soccer team located in Cincinnati, Ohio. They like to stay under the radar, super quiet, super casual.

And it's finally time for us to talk about it because the Dominoes have finally hit. So we've got Kevin Wallace, one of my favorites here from the Sincy Postcast. If you were listening here on Soccer Wise, go listen to them. They do an awesome job covering. Kevin, what has become one of the most entertaining shows in MLS? Look, this is for some people, this may be flyover country. For me, this is the epicenter of MLS storylines. Has been for the last couple of years.

2025 is no different. I was telling you before we got on here that I wouldn't throw away all the coping mechanisms you've learned. I would just hide them, put them to the side, put them in the attic for a couple weeks or a couple of years. What has the last few weeks been like in FC Cincinnati land? It's been, I mean, a roller coaster is a cliche, but a cliche for a reason. This has been a very weird ending to the Lucho Acosta time here in Cincinnati. He's a, he was, is a club legend, won an MVP, a captain, the team to a shield. You, you had people this off season talking about, you know, is he the first statue?

Is he the first name you retire in a ring of honor? You know, this was a guy that was poised to be the face of FC Cincinnati, of soccer in this city, a sports legend in a town that has a lot of sports legends. And now people are asking themselves, is it okay to wear a Lucho Acosta kit to a game? The turnaround in vibes is weird, bizarre, and honestly at this point, I think most fans who have been keeping track of this saga are happy to see him go. I'm sure you know this off the top of your head,

but May 28th, a team called FC Dallas goes to TQL Stadium. I think a lot of those questions are gonna be answered around then. I do wonder on cross all sports, maybe US, maybe global, the turnaround between newspaper article taken out, newspaper ad and leaving the team, if he broke the record. Because of many people, we've mentioned this a couple times on the overall Soccer Wise show. But Lucho Acosta had a

contract negotiation a year ago, took out a full page ad when he signed saying, I am Cincinnati, this is where I live. I love this club. This is where I'm going to retire. And now is going to be playing for a different MLS team about 12 months after that normally we dig through the transfer window stuff We get into our Doyalism's then we've got Weebies over underlined, but this is just too juicy and Kevin We've been messaging about this for a while just because I was like we can't do this until it's resolved And it felt like it was never gonna get resolved We are at least a week out from the season and it has finally finished And you messaged me, said,

okay, it's time to record. Let's go do this thing. That was the final domino that Tom didn't touch on was we were waiting for the South American money to come through, for Evander to move, for Lucho to move, for a French player to move to then finally record our podcast was the big key. And what's incredible about this whole thing, I guess one of the 15 incredible things, is it overshadows the fact that FC Cincinnati broke the transfer record earlier this off season. Like this has not been the only story in Cincinnati. Kevin Denke, if you don't know, 24 year old coming over from Belgium broke the MLS transfer record at $20 million, I believe it was when he signed since Atlanta

has broken it again with Emmanuel Latelot. So you only get to do it for so long. That's the nature of MLS. But he was supposed to be the big offseason. That was the big ad. It was the replacement for Brandon Vasquez and Brenner and the failed Bupens and all the other things in between to take this team into championship territory once again. Yeah, and it was a funny moment like through the offseason you have folks being like, you know, all wins FC Cincinnati gonna make a move, you know, we're waiting for, you know, something to happen here. Set aside the Lucha stuff. And you had to just keep reminding people, hey, the day after they were knocked out of

the playoffs, they broke the MLS transfer record and brought in a striker that what looked like most of the rest of the league was shocked was a guy with a profile that was willing and able to come to MLS. If Denkay is about what we think he will be, he could be one of the best strikers to ever play in MLS. That is the profile of player that he is. And he was brought on to be the almost literal cherry on top of the formation to take this team to trophies.

And it was walking off of the field of that playoff loss where Lucha said, yeah, this was probably my last game in Cincinnati. Whoa, all right, man. This was all built around you. And so Denkay's coming into a team without its talisman. And Denkay said in an interview, he saw the chances that the team was creating.

He got to watch that last NYCFC playoff game. Yeah. And he saw everything that was there just without that killer striker up top He was excited. He was excited to play with Lucho And he won't Just won't won't be what happens here And it's credit to the club that they probably did they may have spent an even higher number than they had to to get the work Done early to get him in preseason

I mean they basically signed him before the January transfer window opened in a way that European clubs normally don't do. MLS teams will do this because the seasons are over and players are going to move in all of that but normally European clubs are not saying yeah yeah like they want the player for three more months and then they want to see what the open market looks like so to blow a club out of the water to say no no no just sign right now meant that they went really big on it. And it should be exciting. It's not, I wouldn't say it's the same resume as Cucho, but it's in the same ballpark of entering that time of your career, the position he plays, the different ways I think he can play it and affect the game. Coming from Belgium, a little

different than coming off Watford, but like not in totally different worlds. It just depends on who scouts you and what they see on any given day. And so there's a ton of excitement there. The other moves in the off season have all been really strong. A U-22 initiative defender in Gilberto Flores from Paraguay, a new left back, left wing back to be the starter in Lucas Engel coming on loan from Middlesbrough and Luca Origiano signing a permanent deal. It was touch and go for a couple moments, but that was the reason I still had confidence in this team around the whole Lucho stuff was. Origiano was an

elite attacking piece last year and whether it has to fill in at the 10, play as a second forward, play off the wing, whatever it is, you know you're going to get a really high level of production from him. And now we finally know that the final piece will be a Vander in all of this. A Vander pushing his way out of Portland. They become two of the first cash furs or Kades or whatever we're going to choose to call it. I just want them all on the record in case history proves me right or wrong in either direction as we go forward.

And I made the joke about the coping mechanisms because Evander kind of just did with what Lucho did. His relationship with the club is a little different. Lucho's been there longer. He's won an MVP. He's won a trophy. He took out the ad. Evander hadn't done any of that, but he had an MVP caliber season last year and then turned around and said, I can't be back here. I can't play here. He had a game in which he had five goal contributions against the galaxy and didn't celebrate. And I thought it was cause he was annoyed by how good he was. It turned out he didn't really want to play that day for Portland.

And yet he still had five goal contributions. There's a lot of talk about him. We did our over under show with Doyle and Tom talking about these teams. And I think their feeling was the club is better with Evander than Lucho. What do you make of this swap and sort of how long it might take? Yeah, I've had the same thoughts that this team could be better, that Evander could be an upgrade in this position. You know, Eastern Conference team, we don't get to watch a whole lot of Western Conference teams tried to watch highlights go back and look at all the stats I can get but he looks to be a better shooter on the ball

He doesn't seem to try as many little tricks as Lucha like to call them of just trying to take on guys 3v1 dribbling There there should be an upgrade there Evander also will have the advantage of getting to play with Kevin Denke, a striker that Lucho Acosta did not have last year and hasn't had since maybe the combination of Brenner and Vasquez back in 2022, 23? Yeah. It's, it's, it certainly has the makings for an upgrade. Again, if he's bought in, if Evander starts doing the,

hey, I wanna go back to Brazil, hey, this isn't exactly what I signed up for, it could get messy. But I also think that even without Evander, that this roster is deep enough that they'll still be good if, say, something weird goes wrong, right? Like I think that this team with Yuya Kubo

as a backup to literally everybody now finally back in pre-season, I think overall this team is in a much better position depth wise than it was last year, which is gonna help Evander more than Lucho had last year. Yeah, I mean, one of the things is now having a full-time left wing back to start the year, you have Origano to be a little bit of a flexible piece. And that, I think, as you're saying, adds that depth of, okay, you can move things around, you can put people in some different roles, and then Kubo can fill in wherever you need to all off all of that.

I'm a big dot of Valenzuela. I'm not saying you're putting an MLS Cup game on his shoulders, but I'm excited to see him play even more this year. And so I think that should be exciting for this team. And I have a little bit of Corey Baird stock this year of just like it dropped so far. And now you have the options, which is the focus is never going to be on him. Can he just be that hard runner again? Can he stretch the field? Can he make hard near post runs? Can he pull some players around? And I

wouldn't be shocked if he gets a couple numbers this year. For Evander two years ago, fitting into MLS, he had nine goals and five assists. That was his badge year. And then last year he had 15 goals and 19 assists and was an MVP finalist. You saw the talent year one 15 goal contributions, basically. That's not even terrible. So if he's uninterested, if he's disengaged or if it takes him a while to fit in, then he can still put up some numbers. And the reason I think for Cincinnati that they went in this direction and not overseas is the assumption that it will be a quicker transition because he understands the league. He understands the physicality. He understands the speed. And my only worry is the style, just how much different Cincinnati is from Portland. And I think one of the things

I think has gotten overlooked is yes, Lucho was not a pressing maestro, but he had bought in. As a 10, he had bought into what was happening out of possession. Evander wasn't asked that in Portland and Portland wasn't good because they couldn't defend. And so that's the only thing I need to see from Evander this year. And that's my only big worry. I do think defensively the team is better. They traded Awaziam and Ian Murphy to Colorado to help cover some of the cap. I love Awaziam. I think he's one of the best passing centerbacks in soccer

or in MLS. He is not though the defensive stalwart. And so bringing Matt Miyazaki back for the full year, having Miles Robinson, having teenage Hedebi, having Norbido again, Buka, all of those pieces I think makes them really, really strong. The other moves to note on the way out for this team, besides Lucho Costa being sold, Nico Gioachini's loan ended, Emile Assad does not have a deal right now. And if you remember his

name, Alvaro Barriel, once again, loaned out from FC Cincinnati, signed probably another contract extension, and will be there forever. So the big question for this team is just how long it takes. How much does this affect the club, the group internally, and then how long it takes to sort of get over it? Or if there are any things that are broken. If you're a star player making a statement where he calls out your general manager and then leaves, if there's any lasting

effect to the rest of the team. And I think it got sort of combined with the Luca Orojano and Kubo stuff. And then you see the list of names that, uh, that Lucho put out there that have left. But myself and Tom on soccer wise, if you didn't listen, when it came out, we went through those names and we said all of these players overperformed their contracts and therefore had to leave because they weren't good. The LA Galaxy won MLS Cup and then sold their starting center forward and traded their youngest best prospect moments after winning because that's the nature of the league and that's the salary cap monster. Yeah.

I mean, those guys that Acosta mentioned, bar y'all wanted to leave he forced to move Vasquez tripled his salary going to to Mexico Arias was outbid or FC since I was outbid for Arias He went back to to Brazil and Junior Moreno took a massive pay increase to go play in the Middle East He ended up signing a supplemental deal last year with Houston. They didn't pick up his deal. So like, I don't know, like all of those moves made perfect sense and I'm sure it's annoying to like lose your boys or whatever. But like at the end of the day, the the moves that were made corresponding, like Bari Al left or Ashana was brought in. Arius left. Yedlin was brought in like Moreno left and Bucana was brought in. Arius left, Yedlin was brought in. Like Moreno left, Mbuka was brought in.

Those were all perfectly good, adequate replacements, if not upgrades in certain places. So yeah, absolutely. It was a little ridiculous. I mean, Lucho changed his story, just to go back to that for a second. He changed his story through the off season. It was originally he wanted to go play and win championships, or he wanted to play with his friends, or he wanted to

go back to Argentina. He wanted to go home. He ends up in a place where, as far as I can tell, none of his friends are. He's further away from a championship and he's not in Argentina. What happened? So the other addition though, and I feel like I let you down because I didn't throw this in the notes, I think could be key to everything. Brian Anunga signed from Nashville. FC Cincinnati has not had a backup defensive midfielder that wasn't Yuya Kubo, who is not a defensive midfielder, since like 2019.

And he put in like 1500 minutes for Nashville, a pretty good defensive team. Pavel Buka put up like the fourth most minutes in the league last year for a non goalkeeper. He needs to take a break every once in a while. And if Anuga can keep him a little healthy or at least a little more rested, this team will be off to the races. So just that little bit of depth there in the defensive part of the midfield is gonna be key. And Nunga let go by Nashville because he doesn't progress the ball,

but he wins tackles and he covers ground. And Cincinnati don't need him to progress the ball because everyone else on the team will do that. As well as the style is just different. Nashville was playing against set defenses and blocks because they don't create chances and Cincinnati is going to open up the game. So I think that's a really good ad. He's a player that I've been a fan of since the USL days and this feels like the cleanest

fit he's been in so far. Reminder for everyone because every team is different and it's chaos. For cup competitions for Cincinnati has a good team last year. They are in Concacaf Champions Cup. They will play against Matagua for a chance to face off against Tigress. So Tigress already won their opening round of Concacaf Champions Cup. So that would be what's coming up for Cincinnati. And then on the leagues cup side of things, they will face off against Monterey, Juarez and Chivas. And then insanity will happen with standings and then at some

point we would find out if they moved on to the next round who they play, where it would be and all of that type of stuff. But those are a lot of big teams. I mean Tigres and Monterrey, arguably the two highest spending teams in Mexico. Chivas, the biggest team in Mexico and then in the US from a fan base point of view. So those are some high profile, some big games. We've seen TQL bounce for some of those games. So I'm excited to watch this. CONCCAF Champions Cup probably feels like a step too far

so quickly with all the moves that have been made and Tigris, they are the giants in that, but you're not going to bet against this Cincinnati group and bet against a lot of the pieces in it. Let's go into our Doyalisms. We'll listen to that. We'll bounce off the back of that and then we'll hit Andrew Wiebe's over underline. Yeah, the Cincinnati's are just clearly one of the top teams in the league

based upon their overall talent, right? Like all the focus is gonna be on the addition of Kevin Denke up top and then Evander as the number 10. I think both those guys will be upgrades. Evander is just a little bit more disciplined in his movement than Lucho Acosta has been. So I think that'll actually help. But it's the guys behind them, Pavel Bucza and Obinu Ndewodo in central midfieldfield and that back line, you know, Miasga and, you know, Miles Robinson, DeAndre, like nobody in the league has invested as much in their defense as Cincinnati have. And we've seen that in the results over the past few years.

Like they went from the worst defensive team in the history of the sport to one of the best in MLS over the past few years. And if they stay healthy, they will probably be top two or three again this season. And that gives your star number nine and your star number 10 and guys like Luca Origiano gives them a chance to just go out there and ball out. And it works. We've seen it work at a really, really high level. And I know some of the the, you know, faces are new and different. But I see no reason to think this is going to be anything but an excellent team in contention to win every trophy they play

for. So there it is from Matt Doyle. One year ago, if we did this show coming off of shield, we would have said trophies. That has to be the conversation. It sounds like Doyle, one year ago, if we did this show, coming off of Shield, we would have said, trophies, that has to be the conversation. It sounds like Doyle is still there. Is that how you feel right now? Yeah, Albright has said that this is a championship window for this team. The team recognizes that, and we've said all along

on our side of things that it's just trophy or bust. You gotta come home with a piece of silverware. I don't care what it is. If I was picky, I'd say not the supporter shield, give us something new, but I'll, I'll take anything. Right. I will say this though. I've, I'm going to be annoying here to FC Cincinnati fans. Let me just very briefly lay out the case for why the wheels might fall off. Okay. Everybody is praising this team. I know Tommy Scoops

picked this team as a shield team. Let me just throw some things out there. Chris Albright has yet to bring in a good striker. All of the good strikers that have played for FC Cincinnati since 2022 were brought in by Jared Nykamp. Bupenza and Giochini, not great. Baird, Santos, haven't lived up to expectations. You have Obinowobono took a step back last year, and if he takes another step back, he starts to enter liability territory. Another concern, Miozga, Haglund, we're all excited about them. Both were injured last year. Both haven't featured in the preseason yet. I don't know how healthy they are and I don't know how good they will be coming back.

They're not necessarily young guys. And Evander's a question mark. He has not had a season as good as Lucho Acosta did. If that's a downgrade, we've seen what this team looks like with a not interested Lucho Acosta. It's not great. So there I think there is a path for the wheels to fall off, but I don't think they will. To be clear, I don't think they will. I just I had to play devil's advocate. Look, there was way too much optimism around this team from around the league. I just, I had to put it out there. So if things go wrong, you can, you can say I warned you. I think that's fair. I would blunt some of it with of the strikers you named,

who pens is really the big one. Like Joe Akini was backs against the wall, had to make a move, happened in that moment. And you were hoping to get anything out of it. Santos was a backup piece always, whether he could have been more is debatable, but like that was the idea. And then Baird, I think a little bit. So I think some of that's fair, but I think for the most part,

this is in a profile outside of just Pupenza that hasn't happened before. And so if your hit rate's 50%, then you're going to get this one right. You didn't get the last one right. And that's where you sit right now. And I would say as well, this is a group that has done well at the center back position when they've been up against it, right? To bring in the guys they've brought in over the last few years on loan, late moves, all of that. So I wouldn't totally put Gilberto Flores out of like the potential of having to play if he has to be being bad.

And also this front office being able to scramble and say, can we find a center back on loan for the rest of this European season until Matt Miyazaki is fully healthy and all of that going forward. So I think that's all fair. The Noel Bordeaux conversation is going to be a big one. I think as Doyle said, it feels like the structure in the spine makes his life easier once again, and he can start to do the things he does really well. And you wrote down for her rundown, the strength of the attacking trident. If teams have to keep up with Denke, Evander,

and Origano being elite, that changes game states very often for a defensive side. Yeah. No, I'm to be clear, very hyped for this season. I just, I was, it was, I don't know, maybe it's the Cincinnati fan in me. We've seen this team spend a lot of money and then go and finish last place before. So I just, I'm trying to brace myself for the worst here. Let's go to the line from Andrew Reaby because I think it sets a lot of this. His line is goal differential for this team. He has it at 20.5 over or under in MLS.

So the context is last year for Cincinnati, it was 10 plus 10 goal differential. On the supporter shield winning team, it was plus 18. LAFC last year, first in the West, but not a shield winning team, 20 plus 18. LAFC last year first in the West but not a shield winning team, 20 plus 20 and Miami and Columbus were plus 32 and plus 30 because they played insane soccer and were outliers and all that type of stuff. The question here is, is this a good team or is this a great team? And if it's over that line it's a great team, it's a shield contending team, it's a championship contending team. If it's under that line like it's a great team. It's a shield contending team. It's a championship contending team. If it's under that line, like last year,

they finished third in the East. It could still be very good. Like two years ago, it could still be very, very good under this line. What do you make of the line? And where do you think it falls? I like the line. It's a good line.

Weeby does a good job with the lines. I'll tell you this. At the end of the year every year When the schedule drops for MLS we go in and immediately pick every game and we pick the score of every game We did this before Lucha was gone. We did this before Amanda was it. This is what we like Francesca would love it This is we we do not we do not care about the externalities. It's vibes only as we look at the roster, or look at the schedule. This is what we came up with plus 22 gold differential, a 65 point season. And we're in the running for a shield.

Weirdly, not as high of a gold differential as I would have expected. Just again, predicting on vibes, all of the scores of the game. So now Lucho Lossavander brought in, it stays around that line, even if it comes down by one, you're still over 20 and a half. So you're taking it?

Yeah, I think the idea is that the defense should be better. Roman Celentano didn't look amazing at times last year, but also, and I'm ashamed, I haven't got to mention this yet until now, the team literally did not start the same starting 11 once the entire season until the playoffs. That chaos for a goalkeeper trying to communicate and organize a back line was doing him no service. So I think the defense actually takes a step up from last year. The offense, if they can just hold pace with what they did last year, this will be a very good team.

Yeah, we've basically never seen Miles and Miazga play next to each other. Those are two MLS defenders of the year. And so to have neither to never have them together and Miles then dealing with international call-ups and all that type of stuff last year, not as consistent as you'd like, I think that should be a huge step. Also, Roman Salentano had a really clean catch in the Jersey release video on the,

what do you call it, streetcar? What's it called? The streetcar, yes, yes. Yeah, so that's like really promising for 2025. And so I'm gonna over invest in that. I'm going to say below on this line. And I think they are a top three team in the Eastern Conference. I just don't know. I just wonder how long it takes to hit. And I'm not quite sure the way the league plays out. We did our points over under. I just don't know that there's a lot of bad teams.

And so I think there's just more close games. Even if you are better defensively, I don't know that there's a lot of bad teams and so I think there's just more close games Even if you are better defensively I don't know if it opens up as quickly as we think with the dengue and a Vander Fitting in and scoring 500 goals and all of that either way They are probably the top of the list for must watch for non Cincinnati fans in terms of like watchability and all that stuff type of stuff They are high up there on the like drama and experience thing as well. So FC Cincinnati is going to be one of the teams we are going to be talking about a ton on soccer wise. If you are new to us, because you are here for your Cincinnati preview, we stream three times a week talking MLS and NWSL. Don't

worry, we will talk about expansion a lot and hopefully one day that is Cincinnati. Included in all of that, we put out four to five shows a week every single week. We've got five million coming out leading into the MLS season. So come and join us if you are listening on Soccer Wise and you have not listened before. Go the other way. Listen to Sinse postcast. You can listen to Kevin and his co-host talk all things FC Cincinnati and just read through schedules, which is like the best thing you could possibly listen to. So make sure to go over there. Kevin, I appreciate you taking the time to join us

and let's do it again soon. Yeah, awesome man. Thank you, this was a blast. ["Purple Lions"] Tom Pogger, David Goss at SoccerWise. It is time to talk about the Purple Lions. Orlando City. We're going to do our segment coming up with Michael, one of the hosts of the Orlando Lions

Then podcast. A New York Mets fan living out in Colorado currently. Let's go Mets. It is shocking. I didn't get that in in the NYCFC conversation. So I had to do the business here just to make sure I get that one across. They do an awesome job covering this team. And Tom, I think fairly there's some excitement about this club.

They've let Facu Torres go, they sold him as was sort of the time, but it seems like they've covered themselves pretty well and there's a lot of potential in this roster. Yeah, there was a lot of questions going into this offseason. Again the Fugundo Torres deal was coming together pretty early and you knew that they were gonna bring in a DP winger and that ends up being Marcel Pasalic, a Croatian international coming from the Croatian League. He looks really good. I've talked to people at other clubs who have been like, yeah he's really good and that's always a sign for me that it's not just coming from the team who signs the

player who obviously loves them. So I always like to hear that. They also made us really surprising move to bring in Edward at Tuesta. I really, really like that. Like we said on our watchability rankings pod, like he both improve, like really improves the watchability for this team, but also gives them more questions in defense of transition than with Wildercott de Hanna. So for the neutral, that's going to be super fun. I don't doubt that Oscar Pryja is going to figure out a way to make sure that there's enough engine in this team because that's how Oscar Pryja operates his team. So I'm very excited about this team and I had more questions about them going into the offseason than I think coming out.

There's a you know a different reality for Orlando last three years and what their time was in Major League Soccer Like they hit the scene and it was like this is one of the really fun teams in MLS They struggled to be competitive every single year Nani helped turn things around Oscar Bray has been the real big piece Tom Do you feel like it's the year like do you feel like there's a level of pressure different? They won the US Open Cup, first trophy in club history. They made the first postseason.

They won the first postseason game. Last year finished oddly. It was an Eastern Conference finals for the first time, but home against Red Bulls felt winnable. They didn't. Like what's the feeling around Oscar Pereja, Luis Muzi and the whole structure for this club? Yeah, I mean the infrastructure of Muzi, Ricardocardo Marrera and Oscar Brea is really really strong

and I'll say I saw some fans saying like, oh like is this the ceiling? Have we reached it with this kind of triumvirate? And I think I take a step back and say, take your last three, four years. How many teams at MLS would kill for that? A lot of them. So they were all disappointed that they didn't get to MLS Cup. They thought if everything shook out right,

they were playing really well by the end of the season. And the three seeds ahead of them all got eliminated, so they got to host the conference final. So going into that game, they were obviously confident. Obviously, like, hey, this is a great opportunity for us. Didn't happen. They were all shattered. The locker room, everybody shattered, disappointed.

But I think getting a little bit of time since the playoff exit is like, man, we got to a conference final. Like you said, guys, a couple of years ago, they won an open cup. Before this trio took over, they didn't make the playoffs once. So be careful what you wish for. The grass isn't always greener. I think that this has been extremely successful in this era. And'd be very very hesitant to breaking it up. Is Marco Pasalic and the talent on the team the fair replacement? Like I think it's unfair to say Marco Pasalic is a Facundo Torres replacement because the numbers are different right? They're not in the exact same reality. They already had Ojeda, they've obviously spent on Luis Muriel. Like is this a team that is pushing for that next level?

Yeah, I mean they know they're in win-now mode right like that was why again Luis Muriel didn't work out last year, but that's why you sign a guy like that That's a win outside move Marco Paschalic coming in what he's like 24 years old. Yep, Croatia International again Facundo Torres had a really big pedigree in talent already But part of that transfer was potential and yes Marco Paschalic can improve Yes already but part of that transfer was potential and yes Marco Pasalic can improve yes there is gonna be resale value in a few years if that's the route they go if he doesn't stay here for a decade but this is more of a finished product than what Facundo Torres is when he came. Martino Heda was along that line as well like he's in his prime right now.

Ramiro Enrique is is him and Duncan McGuire are hitting their prime age years as well so this is a win now team They know they have the talent for that the roster they have the coach for it all that They're doing everything they can to try to give themselves as many chances as they can Well, I will try and get up to Orlando as much as I can this year. I did not last year I've been a bunch of times for some big games I guarantee I will be there for the end of Michelle challenge cup Which I believe they go is on March 7 Orlando Pride, of course, the reigning champions.

You mentioned that Eastern Conference Finals. That was 12 hours after their club won the NWSL Championship. I think there seems to be positive momentum under the Wilfs and the hope is that it continues this year. But for more on it, let's go to our segment with Michael. I was tempted, tempted to go Andrew Weeby and do the full Orlando. And then I was like, why would I do that? Why would I be that person? But then I brought it up anyway to make it as miserable as possible. Yes, we are talking Orlando City. We're talking the Lions and the purple, everything good about it after a big season, Eastern Conference finals appearance and a lot to break down a lot to dig into we've got Mike here from the Orlando Lions then

Podcast one of the many hosts of the show Mike. Thanks for being with me. Appreciate you have me I'm excited to meet you and be on the show I've been listening to soccer wise since you guys got it started and Yeah, I'm happy to let's get dig into it. It wasn't stated to me originally when we were introduced to each other and That you were a Mets fan. So now we're gonna talk Pete Alonso for about 15 minutes We'll probably pull in a little bit of just we'll watch Francisco Landor's Grand Slam I basically wake up every morning. I watch Edwin Diaz's walkout I watch Pete Alonso's home run against the Brewers and I watch Francisco Landor's Grand Slam. And then like Robin Ventura's Grand Slam comes back up on YouTube and you're

like, yeah, fine. Yeah. I mean, I'll go deep cut. I still love watching, you know, some old 2000s highlights. You know, give me some, give me some, you know, Mike Piazza. I used to have a Mike Piazza way sign in my bedroom. Give me some Benny Ogbiani. Love Benny Ogbiani. Mr. Hawaii himself wearing number 50. Giving balls away to fans when it's not even the end of the game. No one is enjoying this besides us two.

So I'm glad we were able to do that. That's why I had to get the deep cut name in there. Yeah. Disclaimer for everyone listening. We are recording this before the Friendly Against Miami, which is coming up I think tomorrow night as of us recording at Ream and James Stadium. we will obviously see a lot because that's going to be a more heavily watched preseason game so some of the stuff we say might be wrong

and some of the stuff Doyle says probably is wrong that's not my problem I'm not disclaimering for that he could go do that himself if he wants to for anyone who hasn't listened to these shows before we will run through all of the transfers we'll talk about the off season a bit. We'll talk about the cup competitions this team's in. We'll go into our Doyalism where we get to sit at the foot of the MLS Sage and have him speak his knowledge into the world.

And then we'll talk about the team off the back of that. And we will finish with our over underline from Andrew Wiebe. This one is chaos in like 15 different directions. So we'll see where that conversation takes us when we do eventually get there Let's start out with this uh for the transfer window the Density of the moves the amount of moves may be not huge but the magnitude of them is massive for this club

so on the way out Facundo Torres, one of the biggest signings in the club's history, one of the biggest sales now in the club's history is headed back to South America. That is the one big move of this off season. Some other pieces as well, Felipe and players like that,

Mason Stujdar traded to Salt Lake City, Luco Petraso signing with Montreal as a free agent, some other moves in there but Faku Torres is the big story Mike and I find this fascinating because when he was brought in it was a changing of the guard for Orlando to spend that amount of money and a changing for the league to spend that amount of money at a DP spot on a young player like that and to build a roster around him. He went on to play three full seasons for the club, an Eastern Conference Finals, a US Open Cup victory. He finished, I believe, with over 9,000 minutes played

in Major League Soccer. What is his legacy? And then what is it in the context of the way he has now left in this off season? So I think that a lot of us, first off, when you, that the second part of that question, when you talk about his legacy, we all are pretty cognizant over the fact that MLS is becoming a selling league more likely than we are a buying league. When you're getting these guys in who are young, we know that they're

going to have aspirations to want to go elsewhere, whether it be Europe or a South American giant like Paul Maras. I think that we look at that as, you know, we did the job for him. He did a job for us, we did the job for him. He's a club record signing on the way out. And as far as that, I feel like we're all relatively happy for him. And we felt like if we were going to make this move, now was the time to do it. Coming off of his strongest season at the age that he was at is probably the best value we were going to get and I feel like you know you kind of have to look at the terms of it and feel like it. We

overall realistically got a pretty good deal. Now when it comes to his legacy, I feel like with certainty, you kind of can't have a Mount Rushmore of Orlando City players that doesn't have Facundo Torres on it. Right. I look at our legacy realistically three players that are the locks on it for me starts with Kaká. He was the person who obviously right back here. He's got his own scarf. Yeah, I've got one right there. You got it too. We match. Yeah. Yeah. You gotta get rid of the rowdy's jersey

though. I'm sorry but Kaká. He got it too. We match. Yeah. You got to get rid of the Rowdy's jersey though. I'm sorry. But Kaka, he's the one who put our club on the map. He's the one who made us a household name. People knew about us. People saw the purple. Kaka is important. Nonny is the second name that's on there and he's on there because he's the guy who turned

the culture around. We were a perennial loser. Even with Kaka and how great he was, we were a perennial loser. Uh and then Nani was one of those ones who helped really kind of shift the stigma of maybe this club can be something more. And Facundo Torres was the one who got us into winning culture.

Obviously, Oscar Pereja goes hand in hand with that. But as far as the player that you symbolize with that, it's Facundo Torres. And I think that's what his lasting legacy. He got us our first MLS era trophy. Um he's our first MLS era trophy

He's our leading goal scorer in the history of the club Record sale in the history of the club. He's got a lot of things up towards the top And I know a lot of people say that he's maybe was a little bit of like a PK merchant for us I just I disagree with that, but it's not bad to have a guy who's rock solid on PKs So no, it is not a bad thing Especially if you're gonna win tournaments, which is what ended up happening for Orlando City. Is Pedro Gaias say the fourth right now? If I need you carve it in stone.

I think he is for a lot of people. I would say because especially if you're keep it's important to note you keep it to players because I feel like if you don't keep it to players like Oscar Pérez has obviously on there. But yeah, I would say it's the two players that I think are most likely on there. It's either Pedro Gaiasé or Robin Janssen. It's one of those two that are most likely on there. I hear some arguments every once in a while for Mauricio Pereira, which I don't mind either. But I think that Pedro and Robin have the stronger resume for it.

It is very telling for what the reality of this club is that all the names we are saying are current slash very recent names except for Kakaids. I think it's a good reminder for people who aren't Orlando fans or newer fans to understand that there was excitement around this club from day one just because of the USL experience as well as the fan experience. Like Orlando is one of the most, I think, market relevant clubs in Major League Soccer and they were one of the first to be that. And you went from big crowds at a football stadium to then building one of the first walls in MLS and having that entire atmosphere and all of that, which has always served the club very well and has been a reason why national teams have played there on the men's and women's side and hosted big friendlies and all-star games and all that type of stuff but a lot of the success on the field is newer. It's

why the lack of moves makes sense but also I think it's a little worrying in like where this club is going and what the next direction is on the not one of the outbound players but in my notes that I had to put was a reminder that Wilder Cartagena has picked up an Achilles injury and will be out the entire season is the expectation. It is why the two biggest inbound moves are a replacement for Faku Torres and a replacement for Cartagena as Marco Pasalic signs as the newest designated player five caps for the Croatian national team, just 24 years old coming in as a like for like out on the wing.

And then Edyatu Esta is the other big edition in this off season, was an LAFC original, got sold to play in South America, has been come back on loan with LAFC over the last year, and now a full-time addition to this Orlando team. What have you made of the work this club has done? so first I just want to my slight beef is that

Just guys just tell us if he's out for the season if you're putting him on SEI like because There was an interview today, and they said that you know they're still waiting on updates I was like guys he already had surgery like he posted pictures surgery it's an it's a ruptured Achilles from everything we saw like he's done for the year let him rest like it's okay but I really like the at to Westa move I will say he is it's important to note for our fans that he's a very different player than Wilder Cartagena is Wilder Cartagena is much more of a bruiser. He's gonna get stuck in there whereas Atos is a

little bit more of an eight. He wants to progress the ball, be in possession a little bit more and get a little bit more forward. I am hoping that that ends up being a positive thing. I feel like we tried to be a little bit more attacking minded at the beginning side of last year and we had a really rough go figuring out how things were going to go. So I'm hoping that he gets in with enough time that they get it sorted because otherwise after Arajo and Cartagena before Atuesta came in our midfield depth was not great. We have Jaron Gurbay who came in from

Clemson in the draft this year and Colin Guski who I think just turned 18 out of OCB But I love his game. He is a very good player. I know that there's a question about young player late later He could get mentioned, but maybe not But Pasalich To me so as to us I like a lot I hope that he is a he Continues to play his game the way that he likes to play the game and Poppy doesn't try and make him be something that he's not.

For Pasalic, already in the first little bit of preseason action that fans actually got to see him in, he's a Poppy player. He tracks back in defense. He likes to have the ball at his feet. He's not afraid to cut in. And I will say I think he's less afraid to shoot than Faku was. He takes a little bit more shots. My big worry is the production. Obviously if you take a look at the Croatian league, I think it's around the 25th ranked league in the world. MLS recently was, I think Opta put us as like the 9th ranked league in the world. So it's not necessarily as high of a quality league and in the last two years, Facundo

Torres had 34 goals and 10 assists in all competitions. Pasalich is coming off of 16 and 9. It's a jump in competition and a jump in production. That's a big ask from someone who's going to be coming to a new country. And you've also seen this when it comes to players coming from Europe. Sometimes European players take a little bit longer to adjust in MLS. South American and players from Liga MEC, he's tend to usually adapt a little bit quicker. So I'm hopeful that he's going to be the guy. The numbers suggest that he's got big shoes to fill.

And I don't know that he can can but I'm being optimistic about it. I also do will say that Nicolas Rodriguez the U-22 winger from Colombia I like him as an addition to come in as well and sit behind him and learn and be that additional guy off the bench he looks like he's a really pacey kid so I think he will be a fun piece to see coming in at the end of games. Yeah, I should have added that one that U22 move is the change in MLS, which is and not that they're like for like, but you don't have to sign a Facundo Torres as a DP anymore. You can sign both, which is sort of the idea of what Orlando has done is use both of these

initiatives to bring players in one for the future, and you're hoping one for the present. Yeah, as someone who is nuts about the rules in this league, last year, I don't know if you remember, because the fact that that rule didn't come into place until mid-season, we had to buy Cesar Araujo out of his U22 initiative spot to accommodate Luis Muriel coming in and then they change the rule mid season. So just as someone who loves the rules so much, ah dude that pissed me off so much. It's part of my part in the language. But yeah, Don't worry. I have a friend who still texts me about how MLS wouldn't let Seattle move Flaco Fernandez off of a DP deal in 2013, but let the galaxy do it in 2014. So you've got 10 years of griping to get to a point

in which I will probably tell you, do not bring up Flaco Fernandez again in my life. So that will be you in about 10 years. So you've got plenty of time. I'll still remember it. I can guarantee that. I mean, then we also lost a U22 guy in the expansion draft. So which that's just, there's question marks,

but I don't have enough time to really go into that because we never saw him play. I was going to say sometimes that move feels like they may have gotten a get out of jail free card on that pick. Although if you sign a young player, you have belief in them. But we never saw him on the field. It's one of those things though. Like is it is it a get out of jail free card if you spent one.5 million dollars to only get 50,000 an allocation money in return fair Yeah, it's a very good point. That is a very very good point on the two signings that we talked about I think the atoesta stuff is interesting. He's a different player. Like you said if

You were going to try and fill the hole that you had lost with some MLS experience, on paper it's as good as you were going to do. A guy who's been borderline best 11 in Major League Soccer, just played in the league, is oddly available because his club in Brazil had too many internationals and so they had to get rid of him and you got him on a good deal. A lot of that I love, but it will require a shift in midfield to accommodate him. He is an elite passer. He is not a defender. He is not a guy who covers a ton of ground

and wins a lot of tackles. I think a lot of that can be okay. Some of it will fall to Cesar Araujo. And I talked about it when the move got made. I think it switches from two center mid standing next to each other to one behind and one in front a little more. We're at two S's a place higher

and Araujo can cover ground behind him and Dagger Dan, maybe he starts to come inside a little bit more from the right back spot rather than trying to stretch the field wide to be sort of a second support in that midfield. I think some of that can be okay. And on the passelage side, I think the question marks are very reasonable. The easy comparison is Hannes Wolf, who last year came into NYCFC and was a similar like Bundesliga starlet who never really made it and then came to MLS as a second opportunity

but still entering their prime. And I thought we saw great flashes from Wolf. I'm still pretty high on him. You didn't see consistency. But the one thing that's different for Orlando is what we saw from Ojeda last year means that Pasalic's role is going to be very straightforward and very simple. His role is not going to be to create the game. It's going to be take advantage of 1v1s and finish opportunities that are created for you. I think that's a

comfortable way to come into the league. And I actually think there's the potential of the positive, which is we started to see moments where Ojeda and Torres would run into each other, and you're going to take away that confusion inside the group. I guess in my head, he's Ivan Angulo times 500 as a potential straight line runner,

field stretcher slash finisher, but with the finishing part. I will say that I do love the pace on the wings because obviously Angulo has got to be one of the fastest players in the entire league. How we managed to get multiple fast guys on the flanks in our time because we also had Juan first, also one of the fastest guys I think we've ever seen in the league. So I do really like the pace of Pasalic and Angulo. I feel like that can end up, if we find like slower fullbacks or center backs that get

drifted out of position, that's something that's going to be a big way to try and take advantage of it is with that pace. And you know, Ojeda getting a full year playing at the 10, I think is going to be huge to see how he dictates the game from there. Yeah, it's a big opportunity for him, a big role for him. A note for this team, we have to do this with every club in MLS because it's chaos and confusion. The two cup competitions for Orlando are going to be leagues cup and the US Open Cup. 16 MLS squads playing in US Open Cup, so not the full 27 that should be available

but up from the 8 that played in it last year and of course that is the only competition that Orlando City has ever won. I've talked about it with pretty much every fan base, every team that I've done this with that's in this. You gotta look at this as one to push for and like something that's winnable. You are two or three wins away from big time home games in a quarterfinal, semi-final, and then the potential to host a final which we saw two years ago how special that can be, how big that can be for the fan base and for the market. Let's dig into our Doyalism now and then we'll talk off the back of that. Sure. I think I like this year's Orlando City team a little bit more than last year's and for one big reason. The addition of

Edward Atuesta in central midfield. He's just been one of my favorite players in the league to watch over the past seven, eight years now. His ability to conduct the game from deep, but also just add value pushing forward. Like he's kind of a playmaker, but he's also, you know, pure orchestrator type of thing. And they lack that. If you, if you look at the way they played last year, it was almost segmented into two halves, right? There was a deeper lying midfield and the defense, and then there was the attack. And the only time they were really combined is when one of the fullbacks

but usually the right back, Dagger, Dan, Thor, Harson, usually when he was pushing forward, he was able to connect the two. So I think Atwesta is gonna do that. And I think that it's gonna make up for the loss of Faku Torres who was really good in the box but didn't do a ton else. My real concern with this group though is do they have the depth to compete across hopefully

ten months? If you look at when the season starts in February and it ends, ideally, the last game of the season in December, that's a long time for a team that looks thin to me. So I'm bullish on the starting lineup, but they do need to add more quality players. So what do you make of the depth question first? I mean, it's something that I feel like we've kind of all been questioning, especially like before Wilder Cartagena even went down, we were saying this team needs to add two midfielders,

you know, like we needed that. Obviously getting at to us to in is good. Gerbet looks like he actually can do a job in midfield, the rookie out of Clemson. So, we do like him but you know, when Faku went, we're like, okay, we don't really have many right-wingers left aside from maybe a Yutaro Sakata out of the draft last year. When you look at the backup of at the ten position, you have Martino Heda and then is it going to be Luis Muriel or Nico Ladero that's going to be fitting

behind him. If Ladero is playing in the midfield a little bit further back he kind of showed last year he's not really as well versed in that position. So the spine which has been our strength over these years I'm a little bit worried about the depth of it to be honest and I will say that for me I think one of my biggest areas of concern is goalkeeper honestly, like I love Pedro Gaias say, but we know that we're going to miss him for

multiple games due to international duty. And Mason Stadihar, who's our longest, you know, reigning homegrown. If you haven't seen the story of him, his story is awesome. I recommend you go look it up. But losing him as our backup goalkeeper, who was very serviceable anytime he actually got a chance to get on the field. Now we're sitting with Javier Otero, who's another homegrown, but not really a lot of minutes. OCB gets some time there. He's done all right. But he is a freak. He is massive. He is gigantic. gigantic i will say that he's already been called into venezuela's sort of national yeah they're they're they're a camp cupcake camp cupcake team uh their

version of it but yeah i i mean i like him but we haven't seen it at the highest level yet which is where we kind of you know worry about losing losing mason a little bit so i wouldn't i wouldn't hate seeing us get a backup goalkeeper who's more of like an mls vet I wouldn't hate seeing us get a backup goalkeeper who's more of like an MLS vet For those times that Pedro's away on international duty Also, good luck to RSL trying to contain the cannon of an arm that Mason Stadahar has I don't know if you ever seen him unleash a throw that goes 80 yards through the air And now at altitude and now at altitude. Yeah, the thing's gonna float The Todd Helton of Major

League Soccer. I was on the call for the running of the wall when he made the penalty kick saves in the open cup previously before they went on to win it. That was technically Grinwiss. That was Grinny. Oh, was it Adam Grinwiss? Yeah. Yeah. Rochester Rhinos legend Adam Grinwiss. I can't believe I just messed that up. That actually makes me so unhappy with myself. I think the depth question is fair. Totally. We talked about this a little bit on the show we did our over unders about the team. Bricolo has to hit just because of what they spent and what they went out to get. If he hits now, you've got Schlegel has a little bit of depth. You're probably still looking like you said for that veteran central midfielder.

Basically what Felipe ended up being when they went and got him. I think that's a role you can fill over the course of the next five months if necessary, right? Like when you look at, and I yell at Weeby about this all the time, when he's like, well, what's the depth at center back for this team? No team has depth in most of these roles.

That's not the way the rosters are built. I think if this is the starting 11 and Bricallo is the center back they thought he would be year one and you have that pairing in front, you know, behind that midfield and Paslich then can sort of fit in and find his role. It's really interesting. It takes us to, I'm going to go sort of to our over under line. Weeby's cooking for his kids. And so he sent me like 97 things about Luis Muriel and the forward line and everything. So I turned it into this and I think this is the interesting part of this team. There's not a team in MLS with depth at center forward.

Orlando's worried about depth and yet they have three potential starting center forwards on this roster. Weeby wanted us to list the top five goal scorers in order for this team. I wrote it down as over under that two and a half of these players are on this roster by the end of the year and it was Ramiro Enrique, Duncan Maguire, and Luis Muriel. The question being will all of these players play a role and And then if not, is the way to solve some of these problems to move one of them for the pieces that you need maybe inside the league? Yeah, so I mean, realistically, I think that all of them are going to play a role. So first, when it comes to Duncan McGuire, he is going to be out at least most most likely

from what we're understanding until mid or end of April due to shoulder surgery from him separating his shoulder at the end of the playoffs last year. So we told me at media marketing when I asked them about it. He's like, Yeah, I've done it before in my life. I knew exactly what it was. And then you played. Yeah, that's the thing is, which first off, to divert for a second, you have to love having a guy like that on your team. Yeah, 100%. Like you literally sprints to the sideline with his arm dangling, just like pop it back

in. I got to go score. I want to take a PK. You have to love that kind of guy. So I'm hoping he's back on that timeline by end of April, realistically. Enrique should be the guy going forward. I expect him to be the starter, and I'm curious to see what it's going to be with him. And I'm sitting here holding a Luis Muriel card because I need your Gauss theorem magic

to wear off on him and for us to get more out of him. Sprinkle it. I appreciate it. Sprinkling it as much as I can. You know, but realistically when you're saying I think they're all going to play a role because I could see Marielle kind of slotting back to the ten a little bit to relieve Ojeda at times. But it's going to be a lot more of the Enrique and Duncan show I think. And you know you kind of said that two and a half over under 2.5 how many are gonna be here next season

I think it's gonna be under And it can go one of three ways it could be Duncan wants more playing time because Enrique's been too good So you move Duncan it could be Enrique's been too good. So someone wants to buy him and he gets a big move It's been that ownership is tired of the fact that Morial hasn't done anything and we use a buyout because now it's a year later so it's half the price that it was. You know? Like I could see all three of those things being a probability and you know? I mean there's that many things that are a probability one of them might happen. I agree with you. One, I think there are ways for a lot of these pieces to play together in interesting roles. I've said it a couple times.

I didn't hate the Duncan McGuire, Lewis Muriel together minutes. I don't know that it's not the best role for Muriel, but like I saw some of the quality in trying to make the game from a little bit deeper. And then you'd have McGuire sort of you'd have Duncan like rolling to the far post and Muriel sort of like slices that ball or hits it that dipping ball to the far post Causes a little chaos for defenses. It's not what you're paying four and a half million dollars for but like it can do things So I don't hate the like he plays a little deeper and fills in some of those roles I think to me Duncan Maguire's the big one

Which is just there's not a team in MLS paying a guy $1.1 million to not start. And there's not a team that's paying a backup center forward, something like that, and not trying to move him or him not saying he wants to. Now, I understand and spoke to Duncan McGuire already of like he wants to be in Orlando. He's committed to it. He likes being there. I don't think it's any of that. I just think at some point it's a numbers game. And you look around and you say, you know, Enrique is under contract still after this year. So it's a really good deal. And I think there will be teams in MLS that need goals and will be willing to give something

up especially when you now bring in the cash first or Kate's or whatever you want to call them. He's sort of what we're seeing with Ted Cudi, Pieth on Jack McGlynn. He's a prime option for that. Yeah. And it's one of those things that makes you really curious like what his perceived value would be. Like if it went gam trade, would it be close to what Leo Campana got? If you went cash for is going to be close to what Blackburn's failed alleged purchase option might've been close to. I put all those adjectives in there

because what a mess that was. But like, you know, I wonder what his value would be. I would personally love to see Duncan McGuire remain in Orlando and be that guy that says, you know, this is my club, this is my team and take it over. But I think we're just going to have to wait and see, you know, once he gets healthy, if he's competing for the starting job, because I will say, I feel like it's going to be Ramiro's to start the season. But at the same time, you're paying Luis Muriel a lot of money. I also wouldn't be surprised to see if they try and find

a way to make it work and get him on the field to start the season too. With that being said, though, Oscar Pereira has also never shied away from benching someone just because they make a lot of money. He is Oscar Pereira is one of the best in MLS. You talked about what he's brought to this club. He's a floor raiser, he's a grinder, he's passionate, he's locked in. He's never won MLS Cup. He has talked about it many times.

I have friends who have worked with him closely who bring it up as well. It's not a thing he ignores, it's not a secret. It's the reason he came back to the league. It's the reason Orlando was the right role for him. It's the reason he's staying and the club is sort of all moving in that direction. If that is the goal, and it should be, it changes also maybe some of the moves you make of like, well, what's the best long term versus what's the immediate need? And it'll be interesting where all that falls.

Dejan Jovalic just bought for $4 million. Jeremy Obobici traded for 1.1 million allocation money. Those are like the two, I think comps, if you're talking about a Duncan McGuire move. The cash for would probably be less because Jovovich just started and scored in an MLS cup and all of that, but also required a huge contract after Kansas City went and got him. Anabobis was a different time in MLS, but you'd think that only makes it even more. And you mentioned Leo Campana and sort of what he went and earned in a trade from New England. So a lot to think about there, a lot of interesting storylines. By the way I think it's going to be really fun to watch this Orlando team. If you are new here, if you are listening because you're an Orlando fan,

welcome. We're Soccerwise. We stream three to four times a week. We put out about five shows a week covering MLS and NWSL. So we have all your NWSL coverage if you are an Orlando Pride fan or anything else. If you are listening here, go listen to Orlando Lions then podcast. It gives you great coverage of Orlando and everything else going on. And Mike, if you're in the area, there's an event that people can go to. Yeah. So coming up on the 8th of March, so that's the first away game of the year, Hourglass Brewing in Longwood, Florida. We're doing a re-release of our beer, No Mango, No Party with them. We're going to do a watch party for the game against NYCFC that night. So Cappy's food truck's going to be there. So if you're an Orlando local, you know Cappy's.

Adam's going to be there with the food truck. No Mango, No Party is's gonna be there, so if you're an Orlando local, you know Cappy's. Adam's gonna be there with the food truck. No mango, no party's gonna be there. We're gonna try and get some giveaways and stuff sorted and give out some cool stuff. So come hang out, drink good beer, and enjoy the game. So. Literally could not think of a better night. Could not think of anything negative there. Let me ask, is there any NYCFC rivalry anymore?

Do people care that they came in the league together still? I would say that they are still like on the rival list, but when you look at, you got the Miami, you got the Atlanta, those I think kind of took precedent and then obviously since then there was the red wedding and all of that fun stuff with New York. So I feel like, uh, our other rivalries intensified. But I will say I'm pretty sure the first home game ever in our new stadium was against NYCFC and some fans stole a chair out of the stadium. So obviously that's something that supporters

don't forget. So you were ready to do young players. Do you want to talk Tommy Williams or Alex Freeman for a second? I was gonna say you I brought up Guski. It is not him. Alex Freeman is the guy to watch this year. I Tom Tommy Williams. I'd love to see him take a step forward. He looks like he's put on some weight and some muscle, which is awesome But Alex Freeman from everything that I understand He's in line to get some minutes this year. Um you know II can't say for certain where he's at on the depth chart but I think if we need an attacking threat at right back and we are gonna move dagger

off the field. Uh Freeman's the guy that's coming on. Absolute athletic freak. Father was a wide receiver in the NFL. Um you know, he's a monster and I cannot wait to see him actually get some minutes. Because I think he's going to be one of the first, like I say real home-growns because Benji Michel was a home-grown, but he wasn't really from our academy fully. He's going to be the first real home-grown that I think makes a big impact for the team. Yeah, it's there's a lot of excitement around the club. I know Oscar Pryor has kept tabs on him. I know Oscar Pryor is really high on Tommy Williams as well. I say that every year, every year he

doesn't play and then every year I'm told super high on him still. But as you said, there are steps he needs to take to get on the field. But Freeman is a game changer already at the right back slash wing back position, depending on how it's set up. It's the defending that's the question mark. But at at 16 years old at 15 years old He already looked like a professional soccer player as you mentioned his dad won a Super Bowl I think with the Packers. So yeah Bad pedigree and he also had like as a as a right back last year I want to say he had like six or seven goals for OCB

Yeah, like on top of assists as well Like he's he's a real attacking threat not scared to take people. And again, like I said, he's strong. He's a big kid. I want to say he's like six, two, which is pretty big for a right back. But he does not look like a right back and he has never. And it's one of the things I talk about with the Academy structure now of now you have people in the room who are adults. He would have been a 10 or a center forward 10 years ago playing at whatever club was local and scoring a ton of goals. And then maybe at 23, a coach would have been a 10 or a center forward 10 years ago, playing at whatever club was local and scoring a ton of goals. And then maybe at 23, a coach would have said, you're not going to play here, pick a different

position and we'll try you out there. Now you have people in the room being like, what if we make you an expert at this on top of what you're naturally great at? And I also, my understanding is I think the OCB coach has now moved in as Oscar Pérez's assistant. And I like when clubs find that connection. One of the big issues MLS clubs have, and I think one of the issues Orlando has had

because they've had some good young talent over the last few years is who at the first team level is focusing on those young players continuing their development while they are first team pros trying to fight to get into the team, IDP, all that type of stuff. I think Orlando is taking the next step there. And some of the not full homegrowns is tough

because they've sold players out of the academy. So like, what are you going to do if someone offers you a million dollars for a teenager? But it feels like this could be a breakthrough year. And I think that is a huge part of where is your depth. If you can get three homegrowns to give you legitimate minutes, it changes your roster completely

and where you can spend money and all of that. So I think a lot to be excited about for Orlando fans. I cannot wait for the season to get started. I just moved to Florida, so I'm gonna be heading up for some games as the year goes along and starting to get familiar with Brightline or the Highway or whatever it is in between. But thank you, Mike, for taking the time to join us

and let's do this again soon. Sounds good, I appreciate you. Time to talk FC Dallas. If we had done this show 48 hours ago it would have been different. 86 hours ago it would have been different. A week ago, two weeks ago, it has been arguably the most hectic offseason of any team in MLS. That wasn't a hundred percent what we anticipated. Thomas, not far off, right? They let their manager go. They had an interim. We thought there would be some moving pieces in this off season. It's got an off plan and yet somehow has come back on plan all at the same time. Yes. So this was a team that was connected to me by sources around the league for Lucho

Costa. When a studio on taste bid for Lucho Costa, I was told that number was somewhere like 10 million range, which is a lot for 31 year old right? Like again, we all love Lucho Costa. That's not quite the market value rate. Dallas loved Lucho Costa. But it was like, hey, man, like, if you got 10 million, good deal. We're not coming close that Let's not waste our time I'm not gonna waste your time and then when it was you know there's questions being asked about that group the foster

July group of they don't everybody like it's like hey No, no, no like you don't need to bid 10 million to get this done like and Lucho would want to go there If we if we can work this out like Talk to Cincinnati again, and they get this deal done for 5 million plus one million add-ons I think it's a fair price for since II Dallas is a no-brainer They have struggled to kind of get to the next level and they kind of took a step back when we thought they're gonna take A step forward Alan Velasco is a surprising so a transfer abroad for 10 million to Boko, Jr They've revamped their defense right they brought it brought in. Oh size a oog hog hide again

I can't be pronouncing that right but I'm doing my best that here it's all you can ask. Lucho Ocosa Peter Musa I don't care if you put Tom Bogard and David Goss on on the other wings that front two is gonna score a ton of goals you don't even need a third or fourth guy so I'm extremely excited to watch this team play in 2025 and like you said Goss a week ago I was like woof this team looks rough. Since then, they brought in a three and a half million dollar center back and Lucho Acosta and a couple other like center back depth.

A few other signings. This is a team that you could be pretty pessimistic about a week and a half ago. Right now, I got a lot of optimism. Yeah, they're one solid piece away, I think from really inserting themselves towards the top of the Western Conference conversation. And they're in a good spot in which that piece could be at a few different positions. Yeah.

And like now that they've got Lucho done and they know that, now you think, okay, they can go out and be aggressive. Maybe I'm a little surprised they're not in the Josh Atencio conversation, but maybe they don't want to spend U22 spots in capital on a different young player when they want to spend U22 spots in capital on a different young player when they want to be promoting from their own academy. They could be a Hasani Dotson team too.

Interesting. Yeah. I hadn't thought about that. It's not the solve for everything, but if he comes at the right, if they can get the right deal because they're the only one in the market, then it's worth doing it. And then maybe there's still space to make another move or two. Am I playing on the left or the right? Wherever you want guys. Because if I'm playing on the right, you know, Lucho is gonna set the ball up clean for me.

I'm hitting a first-time cross every time I touch the ball, whether it's trying to wrap it around the back line for Moussa or it's that early open football for Moussa to get on the end of. I'm hitting that every time. If I'm playing on the left I have no left foot, so I'm coming in on the right and I'm trying to hit a slide rule through ball for Moussa to cut across or Lucha to cut across. I just want you to know that now. Well, but why haven't you talked about lobbing the ball into the back post for 5'7 on athletic Tom Bogert? Where did that not fit in the equation? I would take Tom's determination not to let me down on the far post over 80% of major league soccer players and what they're doing anyway.

I'm hoping Dallas is back. When Dallas has been good the last few years, the stadium has been filled post the construction on the American Soccer Hall of Fame. It's been a cool atmosphere. If you are in the area, that's a must attend. I've been a couple times. I have a great time there all the time I wouldn't choose to be in Texas because I'm from New York and it's like the antithesis of everything I would do But when I'm there, I enjoy going to an FC Dallas game and being around Toyota Stadium as well Hopefully again this year. It'll be a must attend. We've already talked buzz Carrick a ton on this show He was the one who published the story about the unknown FC Dallas player who played a game or two on your Division III college soccer team all the way back in the day.

And now we get a chance to have him on himself. If you don't already follow third degree, I don't know what you're doing. They're the best covering soccer in the Texas area, in Dallas specifically, and they're covering so many teams now. North Texas, of course, a Super League team on the USL women's side, a couple USL men's team apparently

coming in to the scene and then like it is a such a strong lower division scene in Texas with having these NPSL and UPSL teams and all the other things as well. So follow them and let's go to our segment with Buzz right now. Well we're recording right now on February 14th and it has been a long 2025 for FC Dallas fans. And we are barely into the year, but it is time to dig into this Texas club that has had arguably the most eventful off season of anyone and there's no one else to do it with.

And Buzz Carrick of the Third Degree Podcast, Third Degree Net, as well for all your Dallas coverage across what now? Super League, MLS Next Pro, MLS Colt, everything going on. Yeah, we're on our way to seven or eight professional teams here in Dallas. So we're getting stretched pretty thin, but we're trying to do our best

to keep everybody covered up. It is, there's now the new USL team as well, which is like in Plano, Texas, right next to it. It's in Garland, which is, you know, within like a 30 mile distance of FC Dallas. And there's also some behind the scenes discussion of a USL team coming to Fort Worth. And we have three or four, you know, USL to PDL teams. And, you know, and one of them is launching a women's WBSL team.

So it's just piling on more and more as people try and get in on soccer. Well, for the World Cup. Yeah, we do know that the population is there. So the potential for it to succeed would be odd. It seems odd to me to make the decision to pick the exact same suburb as the one that already exists. But let's talk about the one that already exists. And it has been all over the map. We have been waiting for the dominoes to fall so we could do our Cincinnati and Portland

and Dallas previews. And finally, it feels like someone pushed that first domino and the rest went with it. We like to do our transfer updates right out the gate and then we'll get into our big storylines. We'll play a clip from Doyle. His thoughts on the team, I've been calling them our Doylisms. And then we've got an over underline to close things with Andrew Weeby. There has been so much happening that I kind of forgot about one of the record sales in MLS that started the offseason, which is Alan Velasco being sold to Boca Juniors for up to $12 million.

He was supposed to be the center of this team because Jesus Ferreira and Paul Areola were traded to Seattle right before that. It is a long list of pretty big names going out the door at FC Dallas and Kosei Tafari traded to LAFC. Sam Junko traded to RSL and then allowing some starters like Asier Iramendi, Juan, Eugene Ansa, Liam Frazier, and Imat Tumwasi to walk out the door. So the rebuild is on. It was probably stretched a little faster because of the sale of Alan Velasco.

Let's go back into some of these moments. What have you made of this offseason as it's gone? And I guess how surprised were you with the magnitude of the moves? Well, not surprised at all. The Hunts have had how long had a, making the playoffs is sort of a minimum requirement here. And we all know the value of DPs or U22 initiatives, the high caliber, high end players that eat up,

that use these mechanics to get big salaries under cheap ways. And when you're not good, the best way, the fastest way to change is to vacate those spots and get new players in. They planned to try and move Jesus and wanted to move Jesus for over a year, maybe even going all the way back to the World Cup when he and his people expected a bounce off the World Cup, which didn't happen, of course. You know, when you have a player of his caliber who has been declining in productivity through various injuries or whatever it is that wants out and you're trying to rebuild your team

You got to start with that So they needed to vacate that DP spot and and make him happy and give themselves an opportunity to do some things and the same Things true with Pauli Arreola that massive contract was an albatross That 1.7 because the buy down that required so I wrote back in October that both those contracts needed to be out So not a surprise at all. The one that's a surprise was as you said Alan Velasco contracts needed to be out. So not a surprise at all. The one that's a surprise was, as you said, Alan Velasco. Nobody expected that.

The club had been dealing with these Boca rumors or these river rumors for years. And so they gave him this new contract expecting that to squash that. And instead it was like throwing gas on the fire because Boca was like, oh, so you do value him. Here's 12 million. At that point, 12 million for Velasco is ridiculous.

You cannot pass that up. You know, a young, interesting, exciting player. But the pure goal in assist productivity was never there. A is coming off an ACL. So that's a no brainer, but caught them off guard. So that was not part of the rebuild plan. He was going to move inside and be the 10 in this new system. So now you're scrambling.

And they got, in a sense, a little bit lucky that here comes this new rule that you can buy a player inside the league. And we all know the risk factor of a foreign signing versus a known commodity inside the league domestic. You know exactly what you're getting. You know the properties there, particularly from Lucio Acosta, who's been in the league for quite a while for various teams and done it. It has a green card.

You know, it's a no-brainer deal. Now, it's been reported by a lot of people, not me, but that they put in 12 million on Evander. They obviously did not win that. They probably obviously would have liked that better. But Lucio Acosta is an amazing fit. It's a perfect linchpin for this next three, four season cycle under Quill. And you can build the whole thing around him.

And his numbers replace Paul Velasco and Jesus combined. He replaces them just along on his numbers. Yeah. He really goals and assists. So you have to feel really good about the offense being at least the same as last year. Yeah. Unfortunately, that's only half the problem.

Yeah. It goes to the magnitude of the moves. I just want to talk for a moment about Jesus for error because I think with Dallas and you know as well as anyone right the They became this Youth factory and they had this incredible talent. I've said it a couple times I think unfortunately, but fortunately for them I think it was a bit of a golden generation

Not everyone is going to be Ricardo peppy and Bryan Reynolds and Paxton Pompical and all of that Jesus Ferrera was then put in an interesting spot where they turned him into the DP and it felt like he was gonna be the One to stay for a little while and then become a huge move that probably covers a couple years of maybe not as many moves To then get the next generation ready to push through and start to sell of maybe not as many moves to then get the next generation ready to push through and start to sell consistently. And this is not how the plan was to trade him inside the league to get him off a DP contract to potentially a rival in Seattle. Just like how do you see how this has all gone down and how maybe it will affect the way Dallas operates going forward? Well, I think you might be right that we might've been looking at between 99 to 03,

which is basically packed into Peppy. That might end up being a golden generation. It's very possible. It's also true that everybody else has gotten better. Dallas was an early arrival in the idea that the Academy would work. So they've doubled down after the Nico Estevez, I hate kids sort of era, which is not quite fair,

but you know what I mean? North Texas wins the championship because he, I hate kids sort of era, which is not quite fair, but you know what I mean? North Texas wins a championship because he pushes all the kids down and there's no longer this playing up happening, cascading effect. Well, they're now doubling back down to that. They signed six home runs in one day. So they're back to that idea.

The depth here is back to being kids, which is the way it should be for this club. That's their identity, that's their DNA. That's the way they can compete in the league, is by having these kind of things. So there will be more guys to come. Again, you might be right about the golden generation, but as for Jesus, you know, he often talked here

about wanting to, you know, live, it was in his dad's shadow. He's been here since he was nine years old, and he wanted to sort of outdo his dad in terms of FC Dallasdom. But when you've been here that long, at some point you're just like, I need to try. I mean, eventually I need to do something else.

I've been here a long time. He kind of was getting, so it was like, you know what, it's not happening here. I need to kind of go. And he's long wanted to go to Europe eventually. So he didn't quite get the outdo my dad bit here. But at the same time, like they had the Russia 12 million offer that got nixed by MLS. And then the window after that, they had a $3 million offer to the Spanish team, Las Palmas, that fell apart because they didn't get money in the last second.

So Jesus for like a year is like, I'm going, I'm going. And then now he didn't't so now he's like, oh my god, so he needed a greener pasture and Just to sort of refresh himself because post not even the World Cup post gold cup He had sort of you know Faded and he's been dealing with some things and he just needs to go somewhere where he's not have The weight of his name and the world on him and it turned out that MLS is the best situation for that I think the deal is a little undervalued for him, but you're stuck with the mechanics of the league. Some of my perceived value will be what Leo Chu is.

If Leo Chu is 2023, maybe we're excited. If he's 2024 Leo Chu, then that's not a good return. If Zonata can do his businessy, selly thing and turn that into a couple mil or something to Brazil or whatever, then oh, now we feel a lot more better about the money. and do his businessy, selly thing and turn that into a couple of mil or something to Brazil or whatever, then oh, now we feel a lot more better about the money. But in the meantime, it's a case where I think everybody was ready. They were ready. The team was ready.

It was just time. Yep. We saw with Kellen Acosta, and I think it worked in the long run, moving him inside the league. He got more successful and then Dallas can try and turn those assets into more talent or money or whatever it is down the road. I'm excited to watch Jesus in Seattle. And as you said, it felt like it was probably time. Let's go to Lucho now.

Like Lucho burned down the bridge behind him to leave Cincinnati. Now he lands in Dallas. And I asked Tom on our show last week before this happened, but as the rumors got heavy of like, I'm looking at a depth chart and you throw Lucho in and I'm interested already. How quickly does it take for him?

What do you make of what he's gonna be and sort of what this team can be around him? You know, the big part with him will obviously be buy-in. Like he ran into a little bit of, you know, kerfuffle at the end of his DC United days too. So, you know, but again, like Zenota, Zenota, I should get that pronunciation 100% right, says that, you know, he's dealt with these kinds of players before. He was there when he sold Neymar and things like that.

So, you know, this is not a guy that he's unused to. Some of the questions will be how will Quill handle him. But I think Quill has a lot of respect for a player like this. This is a guy who you know can deliver. It's not a question. It's just as long as he buys in and they talked a lot about a Zoom call they had with him on Super Bowl Sunday where they were like the buy-in is here. He's excited.

We're excited. Everybody's selling each other on the project. And so, okay, that's great. Let's go. Obviously when you have a guy like Petter Moose in front of you for a guy like Ujona Costa, that's probably very exciting I mean, that's a big-time goal scoring goal, you know slightly above his XG But you know that that's the kind of guy who you know, the post shot XG is even better

So like you know that if you get to the ball him in a good spot He's put it in you know, some of the other wings are a little bit more of a question But there's some exciting pieces there, you know, there's it's a double pivot behind him So he doesn't have to complain a lot of things even though that's one of the big questions are a little bit more of a question, but there's some exciting pieces there. You know, there's, it's a double pivot behind him, so he doesn't have to play a lot of defense, even though that's one of the big questions is, is there any of six around here? It's a whole bunch of eights. Yeah.

So we'll see how that goes. But you know, in the end of the day, it's like, if he buys into what Eric is selling and what they're trying to do tactically, I think it's going to be a perfect piece, the perfect kind of piece to have the whole offense, you know, rotating around him and flowing past him and through him. And that's really exciting for fans because Quill's going to play a very open

offensive attacking game. You're going to see higher scoring games. You're not going to see one nothing. You're going to see four three. You know, it's going to be open on both ends. So we'll it'll we'll see how it goes. But I think everyone is so excited about that. You have a lynchpin guy that is's gonna be in the conversation with Mario Diaz or David Rodriguez. The best tens that ever played here

Yep, his worst year in Cincinnati was 17 goal contribution seven goals ten assists Otherwise, he's pretty much blown that out of the water 2931 and 34 goals and assists combined. I Imagine he's going to start the year playing off and that's like an ideal situation for Dallas fans, whatever happened in Cincinnati, whatever happened in DC, it takes a little while to get there. So 20, 25 is probably not the concern or not the issue. And as you said, it is as fortunate as you could get to replace Arreola, Velasco and Jesus with this

one piece and he's been durable. He's been healthy. He's been consistent. He knows the league. He knows a ton of the responsibility. He is along with a few other pieces, some a ton of additions for this team. You mentioned Leo Chu who came in the trade Anderson Julio as well came in a trade as an option along the front three. Shaq Moore comes back to Dallas in a trade from Nashville that it just never really worked out for him there but partially that was on the transfer fee that they paid for him and now he sort of fits the proper role of he's a consistent right back maybe not a game changer. And then two big signings at center back that just happened. I'm gonna go Alvaro Augusto

and I'm not sure how to pronounce, Osazi Uragide. Very good, that's good. There we go. 24 year old center back from Amiens and a 19 year old center back from Porto Mayense. How real are these pieces you think Dallas expects for 2025? Well, that's the big question because the defense was the stated

thing that had to be fixed. Way too many goals against last year and I don't know if today you can say the defense is any better. Yeah. Because Shavar isn't an upgrade but he's an offensive upgrade. Is he a defensive upgrade over what they had there? I don't really think so. Marco Farfan is what he is. Sebastian Ibiaga is still a lock starter here. Your ma's may vary on what he is. Sebastian Ibiaga is still a lock starter here, whose your mom's made very on what that is worth. Nikosy Tafari, I thought was better, but they couldn't handle him, so he's gone. Abubakar is definitely falling off and is and should not be a starter anymore.

So now you're looking at like, is a 24 year old kid legit? And I looked at the highlight clips and there's power, there's size, there's strength, very aggressive. He hits hard, like recovery speed, like lots of good things there. But I also just described Nicosia Tafare. So you jettisoned the guy and got the exact same guy.

Well, hopefully this guy's actually better at 24. You know, he's not gonna peak for three or four years as a centerback, because they peak even later than your normal player. So the idea is to, I'm assuming, is to build with that guy for a couple of seasons. Yet you still expect him to walk in and start. The other kid, Augusta, is a fun story because Dallas went to Portugal, short bodies. And so they called up some local team and said, hey, send us three players.

I need a six, a left back and a center back. And they sent them three kids and the center back. They were like, oh, this kid's six, three and Portuguese Brazilian, 19 years old. So they kept him for the whole camp. But he played in a couple scrimmages and they're like, you know what? We're buying him. So they bought him on a discount, but he's 19. This is the fifth center back on the roster.

He's going to need lots of North Texas time. This is not a guy you should think about. I mean, if he's playing, then we got real problems. If he's playing this season, this is just a it's should think about. I mean, if he's playing, then you got real problems if he's playing this season. This is just a, it's like a, almost like a homegrown, in the sense of like where you have to think of him. Cause they just found, he was playing for a second division French, sorry, second division Portuguese teams, U23 team.

So not even their first team, their U23 team. That's how raw and off the radar he was. But you know, when you find a kid, whatever, it costs you, I don't know, a hundred grand or something or something so they went for it that's fine, but that's not a player to worry about. He plays at Porto Maense and I've actually that's where he was playing I've actually been to a game there I was on vacation it's in the Algarve it's like the only team not in one of the two big cities in the Portugal area so one credit to Dallas for picking a

really cool place to go on vacation and do the preseason and I'll talk for to my answer one day when I see a real goose I'm at an MLS all-star game the something about him is that he has played a little six so maybe we think oh the feet might be all good so that's that's kind of cool if you don't know missing them so so a bunch of question marks on the field yeah I want to start on Eric Quill off the field though like you've been around him because he's been a Dallas guy, North Texas championship manager, went to took the number two job in Columbus to get into the MLS ranks and then the head coach at New Mexico where he had good regular season success, not the postseason success. Either way, I think people would say he

was one of the best managers in USL last year. What is he like? What is his personality? What should Dallas fans expect? What's his interactions like around the team? Well, he even played here too. So he knew 100% what he was getting into and buying into and he wanted to be here, which is key. And I predicted it back in April that he would be the coach even before they fired Nico

that he was gonna be the coach this year. So part of the question is like the hunt's tradition of hiring like Nico's the first guy they've hired that wasn't Nico Stavis that wasn't part of their tree and their pathway of coaching. Yeah, obviously they didn't feel good about how that went. So they're going back to that idea. And the second thing is the buy in like the fact that he wanted this gig when he didn't get it against Nico Stavis, he, as you said, went to Columbus to improve his resume.

So what is he like? As a player, he was an extraordinary athlete, really fast, but also technical enough that he got recruited by IX when he was in high school. And this was way back before, in the earliest, earliest days of MLS, so the parents aren't on board with that. And so he stays and goes to Clemson,

and he's like a Project 40 guy, US Youth International, that stuff. So he's a real admirer of the combination of what probably is considered very American, both size, power and skill. So like not going to be Tiki Taki, Barcelona, two point whatever. This is going to be verticality, pace, athleticism, power and skill. He's the one who made Bernie Kamungo be Bernie Kamungo when he was here.

So like also was involved in the progression of Ricardo Pepe, Tanner Testman, Jogo, Jonathan Goh as if for people who don't know who Jogo is, you know, was involved with getting these guys through the team. Almost always plays a four, two, three, one variation of some kind or another, wants to be aggressive defensively in moments,

like press triggers, but not gonna chase you all over the field and wear you out. The team will probably mostly look like Oscar Perejas teams where they'll be patient, but once they get it, it's on, it's a track meet and we're going fast at you and coming at you vertically. But yeah, also with some skill.

So as a person, he is very, very demanding. Demanding of fitness, they've done a bunch of fitness work, demanding of effort, demanding of focus, no lollygagging around. He will call you out in public, in your face, in front of your team if you're not up for it. He's also the guy that a minute later is then arm around the guy, patting on the shoulder. People seem to love to play for him because he is not

just lollygagging around. He's got intent. He's got purpose. And most importantly, for me, I think, and the thing that I think was really what separates him is that he has won things. You know, he won a D.A. championship with Chris Richards and Chris Capas and then recognizes that that talent has exceeded what he has and then hands them to FC Dallas. You know, recognizes the importance of that progression. Picked Chris Richards when Luchi Gonzalez had passed on him. So recognizes young talent, wants to play young talent, wins an MLS next, sorry, USL One Championship playing a 15, 16-year-old at left back, an 18-year-old at back. So we'll play kids and has won those things. If he'd have stuck with New Mexico, I think he would have won something there eventually.

Yeah. So to me, like you can talk about a lot of dudes that would have fit the profile here. And that's one thing that I particularly like is like it is hard to win. And a guy that even, even though it hasn't been MLS, it's been like a couple of steps along the way He knows what it takes to win things and I think that Even if he doesn't have the money here behind him that a Seattle or an LAFC or Toronto Even though it hasn't worked out or Miami has you know, he knows he recognizes how this team can win Which is what he did with North Texas. So it's a really good fit in that regard. It's It's gonna be an interesting season. I am excited to see him get the opportunity.

It's sort of what we're hoping for, of like let young coaches get their feet wet and then give them the opportunity and don't just panic and say, well, we need someone who has a resume so that we have cover for ourselves if it doesn't go well and all those other things. As well as, I think part of my conversation around the Golden Generation with Dallas is

I think Oscar Preja and Luigi Gonzalez and Eric Quill and so many other pieces around this were so key to the recruitment. And I think they've maybe taken steps back. And part of that is Austin and Houston coming on the scene. Part of that is, as you said, everyone else getting better. But I think in Eric Quill helps Dallas maybe reset themselves and say like, no, we're gonna go back to what worked with us and we're gonna be able to convince

the best young players to come here. Yeah, you can go back. We can talk for hours about what has happened to the FC Dallas Academy, but you lose guys like Lucien Gonzalez is not back there. Great talker, teacher, educator, charismatic. Javier Morales was here at the time, Peter Luczak was an academy coach.

The Bazan brothers were academy coaches. You know, those guys knew how to sell a product and knew how to recruit and get guys in. Like the best guys, Alex Aldaz is now the U16 national team coach. Mikey Barris, who was in the academy at that time. When he was with the first team, everybody thought he was just Luchi's yes man.

Apparently not. Apparently that dude can coach because now he's done with the national teams and he's done at San Diego. So like all these great Academy guys that could recruit and get dudes in and develop have gone. And what's here now is what's left. There hasn't been like a purge or a clean house. And I'm not suggesting they should just wholesome fire the staff, but they definitely took a way step back in recruitment. And to their to be fair to them, post covid, they have gone hard at recruiting. And now the current 18 team, there's like four kids left from 13. So they're aggressively recruiting all up and down the ranks and revamp things.

Yeah. And so the next group of like, I mean, I saw they missed on ice stone. You know, there's Norris is a U-20 guy, but is he got the next thing? And then behind them, there's a one or two years that are, but then there's guys that are just, there's some Honduras U-17, a Jamaican U-17, U-20. Like there are other countries and other guys, but you're right. We're in this gap where they sold Pepe, they sold Testament, they sold everybody. Yeah.

And they just haven't quite the next group, which is Nolan and Tark Scott have not come through yet So like is again is it the golden generation? I mean probably not but you know, there's gonna be some stuff there It just won't be like a what else yeah for cup competitions Just the one US Open Cup because the struggles last year, but it does allow the club to focus a little bit Let's get into our Doyle ism and then we'll bounce off the back of that. I mean, anytime you can get an MVP caliber playmaker who's in his prime, you've probably had a pretty decent offseason.

I don't think any of this went in the direction according to any sort of plan that Dallas had beforehand, but they've done so well in the transfer market moving players on at a profit that they were able to go out and get Lucho Acosta when it was clear he did not want to return to FC Cincinnati. And Lucho Acosta is an MVP caliber player. He was the first half of the season. He was the entirety of the 2023 season. So that should make them better.

The other thing I like about this is that Eric Quill, the new head coach, has preferred a pretty vanilla 4231, and that's not derogatory. Like I still think a 4231 is the best, most flexible sort of formation for like 90% of MLS teams, especially ones that are built around a number 10 because it gives lucia the chance to roam but stills keep structure like very easy banks of four it keeps that around him uh... and that's

that's what he's best uh... and we saw last year he roamed too much in that three five two uh... that that since he wanted to play it kind of broke their shape and I don't think they're gonna have that problem and then you add a high-scoring number nine to the mix I have high hopes to Bernie Kamungo coming in from that right wing like there's suddenly a lot more fun in this team than it felt like there was going to be a month ago at the same time just massive questions across that back line, but especially in central defense

and some serious questions at the mid as well. So it's hard to get out too far over your skis about this one. So a lot of question marks there. I think interesting from Doyle of the work that Dallas has done over the last few years to set themselves up with Lucho Acosta and a reminder for everyone,

Lucho signed a new deal with FC Cincinnati. So he's locked in for 25 26 and then a team option for 20 27 a little over 4 million dollars so Dallas has some time now to play him whether they sell him for something in the end or just get pure production out of him it's all pretty strong I think it goes into just the open cup with this sort of Doyle talked about the up and down the back line versus the attack and what can be there. What should expectations be for this club this year? Well, I think he's right about the 4-2-3-1.

That's pretty clear. All their right backs are vertical, get forward kind of guys. And the left backs are Marco Farfan and right now probably Nolan Norris who are not get forward, aggressively kind of guys. So like if you're talking about a modern getting into the WM that everybody does, you know, Farfan will slide in a little and your right side will go up and they have a couple of wings on the right. Bernie, not Bernie, but you know, Padrino at their mirror, some guys that

can play like a false and slide underneath. If they use Logan Farrington in that capacity, he does the same thing. We have seen that at adaptation. So you can look for the right side overlap if you want some of that more tactical kind of Flux forward kind of bit. He's totally right about the lack of a six at this point Everybody on the roster is like a more of a six eight guy or puree like legit I mean right now they're using almost two eight tens in legit and seeking assembling because that's all they have available because Ramirez been hurt Show cap a man has been sick and is still not training with the team. He's only training on the side. They let your your mini go.

So there's a massive hole other than Nolan Norris. There's only real six they have on the team. We're really excited about Diego Garcia and like what he's going to bring to the table, but he's an eight. He's not a six either. So spot on about that analysis of the big questions about the defense are related, of course, to all those bodies. And you know, I don't know that you can think Lucio Costa

is gonna immediately turn this team around and turning it into a contender. That's not that, but I think it gets him back to where they were last season, which is they scrapped at the bottom of the playoffs. I think they're probably a team that's gonna fight for that seven, eight, nine, if they do nothing else. But they also have tons and tons of gam available

and two open senior roster spots if they want them, the 19th and 20th spots. So they, you know, there's still talk of getting a six. There's talk of maybe a U22 winger. There's a talk of another center back maybe coming in. So they're not done on the press conference on Wednesday. Dan Hunt specifically said, we're gonna bring in two, a couple more players.

And Zanatta pointed out the window goes to April. So I think they're actively in the market still, they're not finished. So you can make a call about where the team is right this minute, what they're gonna get, at the money they're gonna get that they have left is not gonna like turn you into Seattle overnight or Miami overnight, but it can make you more of a solid

five, six, 7 firmly than it would be. Like right now where you're thinking maybe you're just ahead of that playoff line, you only need to drop five or six points maybe in goal differential, cut five or six, add five or six, and you're right in there from six to eight in terms of the standings because the West is not elite. There's a lot of questions in the West. So this is the first step getting back to where they think they should be. So we've set our line on Golden Frenshall at fifty five and a half.

I believe this is goals against last year was 56. Am I right about saying that or was this supposed to be? Yeah, this is supposed to be goals against. So he's asking that question and sort of going into the center of what's been an issue. I think while you think about this one and we decide if the line's good and where we land, I think from an attacking point of view,

there should be belief that it's much better this year of just, I think Kamungo is gonna put up numbers easily comparable to Areola or Jesus. I think Logan Farrington is gonna put up some better numbers this year. I think Anderson Julio can do a job off of Lucho Acosta. My expectation is this team scores at least 15 more goals than they did last year.

And that is also Pedro Moussa having half a year trying to figure things out and get his feet under him. And then none of the pieces around him being available from the moment he found his feet. So from an attacking point of view, I have high expectations for this club. I think they're going to be fun to watch. I think it's all going to work pretty quickly. And I think we're going to see some elevation of the game of Kumungo. I think Leo Chu could be in that. I think Anderson Julio could be in that as well.

From a defensive point of view, though, the question right here is, is it better or worse than last year? Last year was 56. so 55 and a half golds against. What do you make of this line and where would you fall? I think that line is fair because I honestly think the defense right this minute is not better than last year. I think it's the same. You know, the relative value of the guy coming in versus the people, the coach who defied the adjacent

is relatively speaking the same, I think. French League Two is not coming out of the Premier League or even the championship. Like there are questions to be asked. Now it could be that the kid ends up being amazing and then we're all people in a way and how awesome is that gonna be? But we've talked about the other problems on defense,

and not having a real dominant six. There's just too many questions. There are too many players that we don't know exactly what they're bringing to the table. We don't know how good they are. If all the ifs hit, if Chu is better, if Anderson Hootley becomes a full-time legit starter, he looks great so far, if Chu is better, if Anderson Huda becomes a full-time legit starter, he looks great so far. If Bernie comes back, if Logan reproduces his stats off the bench, or if they make him a starter,

Sebastian LeJette led the team in the lists last year alongside Ferryton. What is his role now that Acosta's here? Now that he is he gonna be an 8? How's he getting into the mix? You know, still a player that you think of at 900k plus salary ought to be a big time player. What's going on with Paxton? A million dollar player. If Paxton comes back mid season and all of a sudden is the Paxton of old, that's a totally different question, too. So there's there's still, you know, Lucio Costa, we know who that is. Pettiboo. So we know who that is. Everybody else is an if and a question.

And so you can't really to make some prognosis, they're going to be this great team. I'm with you on maybe adding, you make some prognosis, they're gonna be this great team. I'm with you on maybe adding, you know, 10 goals compared to last year, but the defense I think is basically the same. So that's what I said, like, Quill is gonna be very aggressive. You're gonna see these games that are four, three.

So both those numbers could go up, you know, in terms of the grand picture. And so that's why it's about the goal difference. If you can take the goal difference from minus two to 10, then you're in the playoffs, and you're probably like fifth, right? So that's the balance is the question. And that's where, again, there's just, it's chaos here. Uh, we joke on our podcast route for chaos. Like what a fun year it's going to be.

Cause it's going to be chaos. There's so many questions that need answering going into the season. I am excited to tune in early on and see how it all goes. I'm going to agree with you. I think both numbers go up. up so I'm gonna go under on this or over on this. Sorry, I think they're gonna concede more goals. I think they're gonna score more goals as well. I do think they'll get a little closer to that plus number on the goal differential and I think they will contend in that five to nine range in that playoff conversation. And I, one of the things that's tough to sort of figure out

with teams is what would have last year been if they aren't out of it? Like how much effort are you getting at the end of the year? What was the firing a coach bump? How bad was it at the end there? Like if you kind of smooth all that out, was there four more points in this whole thing for the team and then you're hoping even better

with Lucho coming in and some other pieces around it. Either way to follow it, you've got to follow Third Degree. Follow them on all social media, listen to the podcast, go to the website Third Degree Net as well. Buzz, I appreciate you taking the time. Stoked to do this with you. I'm a big fan of everything you do and let's do this again soon.

Yeah, thanks man. It's been a real pleasure. I've been listening to all y'all's new bits and I love what you're doing And you can tell Doyle that Dallas had 60 points in 2015 and 2016 back-to-back and he from the last one He texted very sadly last night and I responded. He said this if you haven't heard in our points over under show He said no team had gone back-to-back 60 points and asked him out, Miami He texted last night and I responded do we have to redo the whole hour and 56 minutes show?

Because the premise was flawed at the foundation of all of it. So, yeah, I think we all gotta blame Doyle for all of the problems in our life. This time to talk about the 2021 MLS Cup champions, the blue side of New York NYCFC. They are always sort of on their own timeline when it comes to offseason and preseason CFG operating in their own world, doing their own things. And once again, NYCFC late in the window, making some big moves. Tom,

let's start here. And then we'll get into our conversation with Andrew. But Santi Rodriguez, it feels like is out the door for a pretty big number. Yeah, he'll be joining Botafogo for a deal reported in Brazil at 17 million. CL Merlos at 15 million. Either one of those numbers is probably five to seven million more than I think that they would have gotten. So 15 or 17 is a wonderful, wonderful deal. It in the micro. This sucks for right now for the 2025 NYCFC because he's the guy he is their guy but the other side of that is he can't really turn down 15 17 million and

and I'm pretty sure he would be pushing for this move too so it was one of those situations where it's a good deal but it's unfortunate that it makes you worse right now yeah but it's the one you had to do It is a number outsize what you would expect for this player. Um, and so Like you said, you have to make the move bota fogo are in a weird spending place right now We saw with tiago amada they are entering the club world cup as well So there's like a ton of time sensitive stuff going on there where they're looking for a piece that's ready to roll and St. D. Rodriguez is that for them? And so you're getting this huge number. It is also in an offseason in which you've kind of moved around some of the bigger names you've brought in of young

pieces because they have not fit or that next move was there for them as well like a Christian McFarlane. So there's a lot of question marks for this NYCFC team. Do you think they make a big splash to replace before the season starts and what's your expectations? for year one under Pascal Jansen, so I I'm just assuming that they're working right now because this team This is not a playoff level roster if you don't bring in another DP and so even before st. Rodriguez left or is leaving I should probably say they could have they could add a DP but talus Magno does not count as a Designated player while he's on

Loan right now, and he's doing well in Brazil the expectation is not gonna come back again There's no guarantees because it's an option not a permanent deal But the planning would be he's not coming back the same way the planning was when they loaned Tati Castellanos under different circumstances To Corona that he wasn't gonna be coming back after that loan that he sold somewhere else So whether talus Magno stays in Brazil or goes to Europe or does whatever I'm not expecting to come back So now that they could bring in two DPs I've gotta imagine that they're gonna bring in at least one and Again, I have heard some rumblings around that hey if this price comes in for San Diego Rodriguez

Whether it was in within MLS or abroad we would we would do it So I've got to imagine that they are they were planned for this exit and are working through targets and again looking at this team they have to add a DP level attacker. Hudson River Blue is the place to follow all things NYCFC I think it's one of the best platforms covering Major League Soccer a lot of the the stuff they write a lot of the stuff they talk about on their podcast as well researched and as well thought out as anything around MLS. I'm a huge fan. We had Andrew Leon to talk about all things NYCFC as well as the new stadium. Pascal Janssen, what he's like as a character and what he will mean to this club. So let's go to that segment right now.

We continue on with our season previews and we are talking about NYCFC right now. And of course, you know, I I gotta go to one of my favorites Hudson River Blue whether it's the podcast or the website they are the best covering this team and covering I think large parts of the sport in this country. Andrew thank you so much for taking the time to join me and I'm excited. I'm happy to be here happy to talk about NYCFC before the season starts. What is the overall emotion right now around the fan base? You finished the year on a, I don't know if you know, but a loss to the New York Red Bulls,

a bit of a rival. You've got stadium news, you're kind of, we'll go through the transfers as we always do. We've got our Doyleism to come and Andrew Weeby sets our over underline, but it's a bit of a quiet transfer window coming in. A new manager, just give us a vibe set of where the fan base sort of sits right now I would say it feels a bit like purgatory like you're waiting to get into the gates of heaven in 2027 when you have a teahouse park opens and the new stadium is there and shiny and you're done playing in a baseball stadium after over a decade

And I think that also kind of relates to the transfer activity and that you're waiting for them to add to the roster, which I think was rebuilt after the mass exodus that occurred once they won MLS cup in 2021 and once a lot of those players moved on, um, I think now that they've spent to bring in Pascal Janssen, um, who has a pretty successful track record in Europe, he's been the biggest addition as the coach, which I think they're putting a lot of faith in him getting more out of this squad in 2025 than what Nick Cushing got in 2024, because most of the core players are back with a few exceptions. So you're looking for progression from the younger guys that they invested in sort of

two transfer windows ago and almost like before that in 2023. Um, that's where they're going to see their returns so far, because the vibe right now is where are the signings? Where's the replacement for James Sands and what's going to sort of actually help this group progress beyond, you know, they finished six in the Eats last year, so the fans want to see improvement and sort of the push to go up the table. Right now it feels a bit like status quo with actually costly subtractions more than improvements.

So I think that's what it's sort of a waiting game. It's a waiting for the actual stadium to open a couple of years. And it's also waiting to see the roster progress beyond what they're kind of working with right now. Yeah, it's a fascinating moment. I kept bringing up NYCFC as a Greg Burrhalter club because I said this stadium opening is like this huge moment that's going to happen and so you're looking for someone who has the vision to say can I build something going into it? Can I

make sure that we hit the ground running when we get there? And so as you said to go out and spend on Pascal Janssen he's got experience across a number of different leagues in Europe, highly touted as a up-and-coming coach, not one that played right, a coaching expert is really interesting. I am excited for the stadium to open. I'm jealous you either get to walk through Mexican food on the way to the stadium or go to the game and then leave and go get dumplings and everything else on the flushing side. Obviously I'm a Mets fan so it's an experience I'm very familiar with and very excited about. But let's do the transfer stuff

before we get into the stadium. You mentioned on the way out, James Sands sent on loan to St. Pauli. This now the second time he gets this full-time European loan for the season. Mijatovic sent on loan as well to Belgium. Christian McFarland sold to Manchester City, the parent club.

Nicholas Acevedo and Andrade both out. Acevedo sold, Andrade taken in the expansion draft and then sold. And then I love the line that you all put at Hudson River Derby. On Santi Rodriguez, will he stay or will he Botafogo? It was fantastic, so I'm going to steal it now and use it as much as possible. That is this huge looming question, but let's start with the work that's already been done. They all make sense in a vacuum. Young players need opportunity. Christian McFarland has an English passport, so he's going to go to Manchester City. All these things make sense.

When you roll it all together, though, it's a very tough off season, I think, to swallow. I think especially knowing that they have, Sanz being the biggest departure and that he was such a key part of what worked really well in 2024. Him paired with Keaton Parks in the midfield, I think was the sort of base that they worked off of when they were in possession, when they needed to sort of regain possession. Those two guys were very good at that for them last year. So that's the biggest hole I think that remains for them to solve because they have internal options to replace Sanz as a defensive midfielder but I don't think either of them that have MLS experience in Justin Hacker,

Andres Perea really are on the level of Sands in that position and I think his departure is the one that sort of stands out the most and I think the Yovon loan to Leuven in Belgium is just the end of a sort of tough year with him in NYCFC. Arrived with a lot of sort of hype and expectation. Big star with Red Star Belgrade coming up as like an 18 year old striker scoring goals. In the Champions League they paid I think near their club record fee to bring him over and it just never worked. Like he never really got settled. David Lee, the sporting director of NYCFC, spoke to the media sort of before the, or at the

beginning of the preseason and basically implied that he never was sort of comfortable being in America playing here away from home for the first time, never got the sort of run in the team that I think fans especially expected never scored the goals that he sort of expected to score himself here. So that looks like another sort of aligned with Tyler's Magno honestly of a player they spent a lot of money for who was young, who had a lot of promise, who came over with a big transfer fee and did not actually live up to it and is now sort of moved on on loan. And because a lot of that has happened where they've loaned out some of their bigger money signings

that have not actually panned out, they still have money invested in these guys but they're not actually producing for NYCFC in 2025. So again you're looking for where the goal is going to come from. They got a great season out of Alonso Martinez a season ago in 2024. You're relying a lot on him again, especially if Santi leaves to go to Botafogo, which has been the sort of slow moving transfer saga for the last couple of weeks where supposedly a big bid came in for him as the replacement for Tiago Almada, who Botafogo said goodbye to recently to go to another one

of their club teams. It's very ironic to see Santi potentially move from the city football group universe to the Eagle, John texture one and with crystal palace and all those teams. But I guess that's the marketplace that we now exist in as modern soccer followers, but it would be very costly because he was the biggest other attacking player besides Alonzo Martinez in 2024, where they got all their production from basically he and Santi carried the load for the whole season. So losing one of those guys right as the season begins would be a huge setback to have to then work around that for Janssen because Janssen I mean I think part of it with him is David Lee the sporting director also said this, that they wanted to give Janssen enough time with the new group that he's basically inherited to figure out what he wants, what he needs, what he thinks they need to focus on in the transfer market.

So the fact that the MLS transfer window goes until April 23rd gives them leeway, but you're then looking at your months into the season and you're still reforming your team. Basically, you're, you're kind of recreating your team on the fly, which they again tried in 2023 to not good results because that was the only year besides 2015 when they didn't make the MLS Cup playoffs. So it feels at this moment a little bit like you're trending towards that direction with these, especially with the rumor that Santi might leave. But I think there's a lot of sort of work in progress feel around the team for sure right now. The one thing in NYCFC's advantage is as Joe Lowry says, every single team makes the

playoffs in Major League Soccer. So that opening still exists if you make moves as the year goes The one thing in NYCFC's advantage is as Joe Lowry says, every single team makes the playoffs in Major League Soccer. So that opening still exists if you make moves as the year goes along. I want to dig in on one real quick before we move back to Santee, which is Christian McFarlane, sold to Manchester City, obviously CFG, all that connection. I saw a little bit of conversation around it of is it right for NYCFC to make that move at the time? Like, was NYCFC operating as an independent club making the right decision for them and the player, or were they making the right decision inside of CFG? What do you make of this move or what it tells you about the wider conversation around how NYCFC is being used as a function?

It's always the weird experience of following them because McFarland was almost ticketed for Europe from the first moment he signed his homegrown contract. Like I think it was like 2022 when he was still, you know, 16 teams from Germany were supposedly interested in him. And like he was almost like destined that when he turned 18, he was going to go to Europe somewhere because he had that British passport and because of the fact that he's this well regarded prospect kind of like internationally, the thing with whole the inter city football group dealings are nothing strange to people who followed NYCFC. They've done this with so many sort of young players starting with basically

like Jack Harrison when they took him in the super draft and like the sort of like they set their own schedule and their own price and their own sort of plan for these young, basically youth players that they bring into their system. And I think following McFarland's development, you always knew he was going to be very briefly involved with NYCFC. So the question, I think, is the bigger question that MLS never really solved of, like, how do you handle these transactions when it's the inter, it's the company buying its own asset or moving its own asset around. But I think for an NYCFC Observer's perspective, this was like almost exactly what happened with Joe Scali. Joe Scali played seven times for NYCFC, but like, I think even before he had an appearance for the first team had made an agreement to go to Brucham, Munchen, Gladbach and like on his 18th birthday similarly. So I think we're kind of used to it from having seen this formula played out.

I think MLS, it's a weird one just because of the fact that NYCFC can convert the transfer fee that they got from McFarland from their own sort of owner into GAM assets they can use in MLS this season. So it's a weird one, but also something that sort of becomes par for the course when you follow a team that's a part of the weird multi-club model that they are a part of, unfortunately. Yeah, the one thing I will say for NYCFC fans

in terms of maybe over frustration or worry about it is, we saw this with Tyler Adams and the Red Bulls. Unfortunately, you have to compare the two. The sell-on percentage ends up being big, right? Manchester City, for whatever they are, they get money for the pieces they move around. And so I think with McFarland, there's a good chance that the impact to NYCFC

comes two and three steps down the road. And your hope is that that's all set up the way it should be set up. Let's talk to Andy Rodriguez. You think he will play for NYCFC this year? I think they're following the formula they follow when they've gotten a legit transfer offer that they're actually trying to make happen. So I would say the odds of him actually playing

are very low at this moment, as we're speaking, where it's been, I mean, since Sunday, basically, that over almost a week of him heavily rumored to be going to Botafogo. So I think that it probably will end up where he leaves. I think this is their chance probably to get a big fee for him because of the fact that there's so much interest

and that he's coming off such a good season. And I think it was always sort of a question of would he actually be a designated player when they sort of bought him permanently at the beginning of 2023. And I think he's on the lower end of the sort of salary range of designated players just based on what he makes per year. So I think he always was sort of brought back in 2023 with an eye towards this towards some lucrative move. So I think the thing is like, you're taking him away and you're taking away a lot of goal contributions from 2024 in right on the eve of the season.

So I think that's where it's going to be really difficult. I think the one positive thing is that they do have a lot of young attacking players that part of Pascal Janssen coming here is to get more out of those guys like Augustino Heda, like Julian Fernandez. Um, I think that if they lose Santi, that even increases the importance of those guys actually being able to See more minutes than they saw in 2024 and actually produced more in 2025. Yeah, which is I really need to succeed I don't think I don't see them climbing the table from where they finished last year Unless they get a really big breakout season from one of those two guys. Yeah, I think that's fair

I think the timing is tough. I do think I think they offer that's coming in is as high as it's gonna go and I don't think Santiago Arrigo is gonna play for NYCFC for his entire career in the next 10 years. I also we have seen already out of Argentina the money being spent by club world cup sides because of the money they think is coming in. Thiago Amada moving means Botafogo has to fill that spot because they are playing in that giant group of death with Seattle Sounders and Atlético Madrid and PSG and so like it feels like a bit of an outlier offer and that's one you have to take advantage of I think if you're NYCFC I also as good as he has been I don't think the ceiling

is there to be Lucho Acosta a Vander level producer in MLS and so if the offer comes in the way it sounds, I think that's a really good one for this to take. On the end so far, it's not much. I put Prince M. Pansa in this because I love Prince M. Pansa. Watched him at the youth ranks, watched him in college. Would love to see him be a starter at some point

as a center back for this club. But it goes to show sort of the one direction things have gone so far because the big addition has been Pascal Jensen. Before we touch on that and we'll hit our Doyalism reminder because every team is different and MLS is chaos right now. The cup competitions for NYCFC will be League's Cup and US Open Cup. So no CONCACAF Champions Cup because of the way they finished last year. League's Cup will be against Puebla Leon and to Luca and then after that

Some insane standing stuff and we'll figure out if they move on or not based off teams They don't play and whatever else is going on in US Open Cup 16 MLS teams are playing in it You would argue NYC FC coming in there one of the highest rated teams from last year in that competition Competition, it is a winnable one We have I have talked about it with most of the teams that are in it of like two wins gets you into a semi, three wins, you know, like it could be a real way to make a splash this season without really maybe being

as consistent over the course of the year. But the big story is the new coach. Let's go to Doyle's thoughts on all of this and then we'll jump off the back of that. Yeah, the big, the big addition for NYCFC is the head coach and Pascal Janssen. He was brought in, I think, pretty explicitly to develop all those young guys

that were riding on the bench last year. I mean, NYCFC between summer 2023 and winter 2024, between those two transfer windows, they spent $25 million on new players and most of those guys just didn't factor at all and when that happens and you don't win things and the coach tends to be the guy who who pays and that's what happened with Nick Cushing. So new coach brought in not a lot of new players, barely any new players, but it'll feel like it's refreshed

because I think Augustino Heda and Julian Fernandez in particular, those two guys are gonna get a lot more run. And then the other variables, like the real variables are, was Alonso Martinez, was that goal scoring real? I think it was, he got a lot of tappings and that's the measure

of a guy who's gonna be a consistent goal scorer. So I am a little concerned about it, but not throwing myself off a building here. I might be throwing myself off a building about the situation at DMIT. I think Justin Hack has been a pretty good player the past 18 months, but he's not James Sand's level. And if there's a real weakness in this team, that's a spot

and that's not a spot where you can afford to be weak if your plan is to win things. So there's reason to be optimistic, this team does have a lot of talent, but there's a couple of pretty clear reasons to be at least a little bit pessimistic heading into this season. I guess I should have said to Doyle, he doesn't need to give us a reason to jump off a building at all, but he somehow found his way to get there over the course of that. A lot to talk about on the field. Let's start with Pasco Jansen though. What have you heard from him?

What do you make of him as a personality, as a manager, as what it feels like is going to be a major central piece of this club? The players have described him as raising the intensity during training, raising the level of expectation basically during the whole preparation for the season. His basically sort of marching order is to raise the team up a level, which he's repeated a bunch of times. He said he's wanted more intensity out of the players. He said he's wanted them to have a much more sort of resilient outlook and have the belief that they can win wherever they go to play,

which I think it's a lot of more sort of the emotional side of the game versus he's not making drastic tactical changes to how NYCFC operates. I think part of the reason why they wanted to hire him is because his tactics and his sort of approach to having his teams play is pretty similar to what city football group wants all their teams to do. He usually uses a four, two, three, one. I think they're going to still be in that, which increases the importance, as Matt Doyle said of replacing James Sands, which I do,

I wouldn't jump off the building, but I definitely think that is where they have to desperately sign somebody like actually close to the level of sands. I think that's the biggest transfer need. If you're going to talk about like transfer needs since January 1st, I mean, it's been almost two months since that since he left at this point. And I think that's what's calling out for reinforcement. But I think that that's what Janssen is sort of in the process of figuring out

while he's there in training camp right now of who can actually get the job done for what he's looking for. And I think he's no nonsense. He's not going to sort of go into a sort of long yarn about why he's doing things. I think he's much more. This is what I expect. This is what I want the players to do. This is what we're trying to do this season. Um, and I think the fact that he's had a really good track record at Azad Alkmaar with younger players and in the Netherlands in general with a lot of younger players. Um, Kirk has from Burnmouth, the left back. He was a coach for him when he

first made his debut in the Netherlands. He coached Cody Gakpo, I think, too, before he went over to Liverpool at some point. So he's got a lot of experience with like high level young talent in Europe. And I think that's what they basically are bringing him over to do, to whisper in the ear of Augustinou Heda, Julian Fernandez, even like Malachi Jones, who's had a great sort of rookie year before he broke his leg in the summer last year. I think those are the guys that they expect Janssen is going to bring something else out of and sort of mold into the sort of next core of attackers that can actually score goals that makes it so that you're not relying on Alonso Martinez to score 16 goals every single season. Right. There is obviously a ton of promise and there, you know, Maxi Carrizo we see starting for the U17s captaining the team

As long as they play the us virgin islands like he'll be fine in MLS action Um, and there's a ton of promise inside the NYCFC academy as there has been for a lot of years I'm a big fan of Johnny Shore. I like his game drew by era as well We've seen push in at those fullback positions There is there should be a constant flow of young players coming into this team, both via the transfer market because of the way they've chosen to spend

and the academy because the tri-state area is a massive soccer region. And the hope is that Pascal Janssen's the one to tap into that. I think Patrick Vera, that first step of getting the Jack Harrison's on the field and pushing some young players. And then it has kind of wavered up and down as they've gone through coaches and now your hope is

that there's some consistency here to be able to get that done and it's going to be necessary. What do you think this year the ceiling is for the young players that we're talking about the Augustino Hedas of the world? I mean I think the ceiling is actually becoming consistent starters. Neither Hoheda or Fernandez really got long runs in the team last year. I think, I mean, Matt Doyle touched on it too, of just that, I think Fernandez played like 22%

of available MLS minutes. Ojeda was probably a little bit above that, but not much above that. They were not used for long stretches of the season. And I think just the opportunity being there, and I think actually accepting that they're not gonna sort of immediate, there might not be immediate returns. I think Cushing's situation last season felt very much

like he was in I have to win games and reach certain targets to keep my job. And he relied heavily on Maxi Morales at age 37 last year. He's back again in 38. I think Maxi's still a legend of the team, probably the best player the team's ever had in MLS. But at the same time, he started pretty much exclusively down the stretch at Central Attacking Mid at the end of 2024 while they shunted Santi out to the left wing.

I think that was an example of just, we need to get results in order for me to keep my job from pushing to some extent versus the balance of developing these young guys. So I think Janssen comes in with the fresh start and with the sort of longer leash of, I don't think they're expecting him to suddenly be pushing the team to the first seed in the East right away this year. I think the ceiling is there for them to get into the top four, potentially,

if those guys all sort of click under the new leadership of Janssen and actually take a big step forward. But I do think that there are too many holes currently still in play, the main hole being the James Sands hole, for them to actually confidently say like they're gonna be a top four team in the East this year. So Justin Hack was one of the big prospects in the Academy.

It's taken him a while, a bunch of loans to USL. He finally stepped in and found his feet at center back last year. Is there not belief that, okay, he's found, he was a defensive midfielder, he was converted to center back to cover. It felt like over the course of the end of the year, he found the MLS level, like physicality,

speed of play, all of that. The job is different now, stepping back into midfield. Is there no belief that now he's figured out MLS, he goes back into his normal skill set and no, he's not James Sands, because James Sands is potentially a Bundesliga starter and a US Men's National Team starter, but is a good MLS player to be able to hold the fort. I think the thing with Hack is he almost suffers from his versatility to some extent because

of the fact that like you said last season, he ended the year as the starting left centerback, took the job from Burke Risa, basically was paired with Thiago Martins during their playoff run. But I think, I mean, they also used him at left back last year randomly when Kevin O'Toole was hurt and they needed somebody to fill in. Like he became the Swiss army knife of the team to an extent that I think sort of his flexibility

means right now in preseason Tiago Martins has not played any games, he's got an injury. He has been out the entire preseason, probably gonna be not 100% to start the season. So it might be a situation where they need hack in defense because Jansson thinks that he works well there. I think there's too much uncertainty even within the roster to know for sure what role Hack is gonna fill yet. That said, I think he could fill in for James Sands, but every time he's gotten a sort of opportunity, he's been solid, but I would say not a guy that you think

he has fully won this job and this is gonna be his job for the rest of the time he's with NYCFC. This is the last year he's under contract with NYCFC, so this is sort of his last big hurrah to try to fully carve out a spot, I think. I do think that he progressed a lot in the last two seasons, but I just remain unsure and unsold if he's going to be truly the guy to be the number six, like

throughout the season. I think the fact that he could bounce between defense and central midfield somewhat makes it me assume that he's going to be viewed as that kind of like rotational piece more than the tried and true starter. Yeah, we saw it center back. I think his he's a high level passer, but it was easier for him facing the game than having players around him 360. And I think he was able to operate inside of some of his limitations of athleticism covering the entire field playing

at that center back spot where most of the game you can sort of anticipate, but he's tall enough to be effective in winning 5050 duels in that spot. I was excited to see him fill in there. I don't know as well if defensive midfield he can do it. I do feel like he is a top 13 roster player right now for an MLS team. The question is at what position,

and if it's not at D-Mid, is there a spot for him for NYCFC? This takes us to the next big question that you and Toro have posed which goes into our line from Andrew Weeby. He set the Alonzo Martinez goal scoring for this year the over-under at 13 and a half goals on the season. That's just inside of MLS regular season. Weeby put in the caveat this is with the assumption that Santi Rodriguez will not be there this year. What do you make of this line and where would you fall? I don't even think you need a caveat.

I think it's a fair line just based on what he did last year. I'm based on how effective he was in front of goal once he became the sort of out and out starter at striker. I would probably take the over for the line again. I think he's consistent enough. He doesn't really, so when Moose that for car started out last season as the starter got a ton of rope as the striker and Really had a hard time on my golden boot draft team and

We're all upset about it. Yeah I mean I put the thing about him was that he was always in the right position He ended up with the ball at his feet in a great chance to score more often than not in many of their games and Just could not find the goal almost to a like is there something psychologically going on there extent of just like how do you miss some of these chances and so I think once they turned to Alonzo at the striker spot and he took it and ran I felt like it was less of fluke and more

like a final they found the right person to fit in the way that they wanted to play from the outside in where where he was opportunistic, he could force teams into mistakes by pressing, he could capitalize on mistakes once a team made a mistake and actually finish almost instinctively. Like he didn't really take many touches on the ball, it was a sort of turn, shoot, goal, a lot of the times with him.

And I feel like the just natural instincts and his abilities just to find the right spots and find the right shots that are sort of high efficiency, good shots for him that ends up converting frequently, those are skills I think that will hold up. And I don't think it's as much of a fluke as much as he needed to be put in the right spot at the right sort of time to succeed.

And I think now they're gonna expect that to continue. So I think over 13 and a half, I'm taking that comfortably. Yeah, I'm gonna take it as well. I think even if you're a little more pessimistic about this, it took him seven games to become the full-time starter last year or to become the starter. So if you take that away and just say he's starting at this point, even if he takes a step back on 16 goals last year, he should still finish at the amount of minutes he'll play, whatever his finishing rate ends up being,

he should still finish around 12 or 13 goals. And if you have any confidence then in him, which I do, I think a lot of the stuff you talked about his pressing ability, I do like his ball striking. I think when he gets over the ball, he shapes his shots really well from around the 18. So a lot of those finishes off turnover moments where he's quick and ready to shoot before a goalkeeper set and before defense sets. I think all of that still holds and then you have the hope that if Jansen can tap into some of these young playmakers or Maxi Morales is more healthy and available that there's more then chances created inside of the system for him to score.

So I'm going to take the over there as well. I think in general then the belief that Alonzo Martinez is for real and for everyone out there who's doing your golden boot drafts he should be high on the list because he's going to play when healthy the bulk of the minutes for this team. Gold Cup is a factor because he is probably in national team conversation and potential there so that could change things a little bit but I think in general pretty high on him and an unknown season for NYCFC but if you want to follow it do so at Hudson River Blue both the website follow them on all your social channels especially at Blue Sky and the podcast as well for all of your news and everything else that's going on the stadium news continuing Andrew any thoughts or updates on what's going on

with the stadium? Oh, they broke ground in December, right before MLS cup. So it's officially under construction underway got the shocking everyone in the world. It's going to be named after Eddie Hod, who apparently have a long standing relationship with the owners of NYCFC. Maybe you've heard of that in the past. But yes, Eddie had Park will be opening in 2027. So you can now start counting down from, you know, two seasons from now of the number of games left that will be played at either Yankee Stadium or city field. I know this is the biggest sore spot for many people who come across NYC

FC and are shocked and horrified to see base soccer being played on the baseball field. But it is the shelf life is rapidly decreasing for that. So we're almost at the end of the tunnel for that one. Yeah, I sat at the Milliker Brewing in Wrightfield of City Field before a game, right before I moved here, and across the street is the construction site and it was a little sign and it had the NYCFC logo on it and I was like, oh right, this is a real thing. This is not just the thing we talk about online and people yell about in all of this. Here's the site, here's the spot. So I think it's really

exciting because it's gonna be, I think, one of the top environments in Major League Soccer in the country for sports and all of that. Once it gets built. The big thing with NYCFC is it gonna really, the fans especially are waiting for the sort of transformation of the team. I feel like everybody has talked about the need

for the stadium and that it's gonna be this huge thing, rightly so, for the league and for NYCFC, but I think the fans are waiting to see the way that it transforms the team on the field, which obviously we still have two full seasons to get through, but I think that's the big one that people are like are we gonna get back to the days of signing the biggest names from European leagues? Is it gonna be this sort of like different approach when the stadium opens? I think that's the one that's sort of like an unanswered question still

that will hopefully answer soon. But I know the last year and a half has been a drop-off, but overall post the you know via Lampard pure low days. It's been a good year, years, moment, years. Yeah. Consistently. This team is a top five team hands down, right? The assumption being there, the potential for more, I would hope that they're able to stick with some of these young pieces through this. And so in three years, you're talking about fully fledged starters and it's not the Santi Rodriguez move where it's the moment they get good, they get sold. And then I can understand similar, I hate to keep bringing it up across the river of red bulls of like, okay,

then can you sign one or two adults to fill the gaps that you've recognized? But spend the next two years letting the young players figure themselves out to find those holes and not acquiring players above them. I don't think NYCFC is ever going to be that team again and I think it's a positive. I think overall they've shown they're a better team. They won MLS Cup not being that but it is about managing the team to be successful in itself and not just a part of CFG from top to bottom.

Overall, it's going to be a fascinating fascinating year, cannot wait to watch it. Thank you once again for joining me. Let's do this again soon. Thank you.