SoccerWise - Concacaf Strikes Again & USMNT Questions

Episode Date: May 7, 2026

David Gass, Tom Bogert and Joe Lowery of Backheeled and Total Soccer Show dive into Concacaf Champions Cup, sprinkle in some MLS chatter. Then Gass welcomes Matt Doyle for the latest on the USMNT, player form and Paraguay, the Americans’ first World Cup opponent.0:00 Intro4:20 Mexico Camp Controversy10:05 LAFC-Toluca Leg 218:26 Tigres Past Nashville22:25 Does MLS Care About Concacaf?27:35 Toronto FC & Inter Miami35:03 Clash at the Top West39:25 Save the Caps Latest42:55 Yapi, D.C. United & Nashville47:00 USMNT with Doyle1:02:40 Talkin’ Paraguay

Welcome everybody back to Soccer Wise for a huge episode on this Thursday. To everyone listening on Sirius XMFC, welcome. Thank you for being here. We've got a big show coming up. We have match oil as we do every Thursday as we head towards the World Cup, where we do our deep dive on the U.S. men's national team. And we are starting our opposition research. So we are talking Paraguay today,

and you will find out how often I mention the War of the Triple Alliance in 1846 over the next hour or so of content. We have the most comforting feeling in the world, which is pure disappointment and pain for any MLS fan as they are in Concaf competition to talk about, and we will talk about Toronto FC's Pathetic Canadian Championship run and the games that come up this weekend. So a lot for us to hit, and man, am I excited?

Not only to have Tommy Scoops with me, grateful dead hat on, feeling the vibes. I've got the one and only Joe Larry with us. What's up, Joe? Oh, what's up, man? Thanks for having me else. I am, I'm happy to get to mourn MLS and Concca Cap. That's what we do every year around this time, right?

I think that's what's on the calendar. Listen, I'm going to put all my cards out there. I don't really root for teams that win things. Winning is more uncomfortable to me than losing. And this is a thing I'm facing right now is the New York Knickerbockers embarrass the Philadelphia 76ers in every single way possible as they potentially move on to the next round. So when MLS teams losing Concaf, it just, it kind of,

feels comforting at this point. That's like a warm blanket. Yeah. Yeah. But on a real note, do you ever think about how your basketball team is named the Knickerbockers?

Like, does that ever sink in for you? We think about it. You think about it. Okay, got it. Just filed away. Because it's like when I say the New York football giants, it's just saying the knickerbockers

makes me happy. Yeah, I like that. At this point, of all the negative mascots people have had, having an old Dutch person who wears high socks is like the least of our problems compared to everything else that's happened in the North East. It's a great point. with logos over the last 50 years or so.

So we're going to dig into Concaf in just a moment. But Joe, you're here for a special reason. Ha ha. Let's do a little plug. Yeah, let's do a little plug. Why not? If you listen to this show, you might know about a show called the Total Soccer Show, which is a show I'm on all the time.

We are doing a live show in Los Angeles on Thursday, June 11th. This is the opening night of the World Cup, the night before the USM&T's opener against Paraguay, where you can hear about that war that I definitely knew about it. I'm not at all embarrassed to say that I'd never heard of before because I'm an uncultured swine. The night before the U.S. takes on Paraguay. This will be at the L. Ray Theater in Los Angeles.

Tickets are $25 plus fees. It's a proper venue, as Grand Ruffin's been telling everybody, and he's right about that. It sounds cooler in his Scottish brogue than in my regular neutral. Yeah, but he doesn't say L. Ray as smooth as an Arizona. That's a good point. That's a really solid point. It's going to be tons of fun, man.

We did a live show in 22 in New York for the World Cup. That was a blast. This is our first live show since then. you guys have kicked butt on live shows and so much fun to come and watch you guys I hope that people come and enjoy watching us in the same way if you are in the LA area if you are a US fan who's traveling

I have talked to a bunch of people who are traveling to be in markets but don't have tickets to games this is the thing then you should be doing get together with other fans hang out get the vibes I will note it is my birthday that then so the section in which you guys celebrate and honor me I think it's

going to be one of the highlights of the show yeah it's crazy because I have the Order open. We already have the show built out for the most part. And even before you mentioned that live, I already had written down David Goss' birthday special. We're going to sing and then I think there's going to be some haiku preparation. I'm not that those details. Oh, is we be writing the high cute? Yeah, there's going to be a whole thing. You'll probably get it around January then if it's coming on time. I see 2026. I met 2027. My favorite. For the women's World Cup. That's normally what he plans

around. But 100% of you're there. Obviously, you should be listening to TSS as well. You should be reading back yield as well. We always have to shout it out with Joe. And if you're going to be in the LA area, what else could you possibly be doing? So go to the live show and go hang out. Okay, we're going to dig in now to a little bit of Concaf, which I think will probably be connected at some point to the disappointment we will probably feel with the U.S. ones next team going forward over the next few months. But we are back to where we know best. We'll talk big picture sort of at the end of this, because I think that's where everyone falls, where, okay, two MLS teams get to a semifinal.

They both come up against the wall. That is, heigantes in Mexico, not traditional ones, but modern ones in Toluca and Tigris and the challenges that they face from a monetary point of view, from a scheduling point of view, from a physicality point of view, and everything else in between. But let's start with the two games. I want to start L.A.F.C., because that's the more recent one, getting dunked on more interesting, too. what I wrote at La Bonoenara in Toluca.

There's a lot of non-socker things to hit in this game. I'll start pregame and then we'll move through things. So we start here. On Monday, we mentioned that Alexis Vega and Jesus Gallardo would not be available to Toluca for this game because they had been called up to Eltrane's national team camp, which started on May 6th. So they were unavailable to play.

And they, like the other 10 players, that had been called up, were unavailable for the first leg of the legia last week. And you thought it was straightforward, right? I said a thing, there was rules, everyone was going to do the thing. Then Mexico decides that they're actually going to release Vega and Gallardo for the second leg of this Concaf Champions League match against LAAFC. Why, I don't know. Now, you could argue with me, because I've had this argument in text.

Okay, we're a federation. Our job is to push the game locally, a team here beating a team from another country to get to a championship. final, it has value to Mexican soccer and the FMF. There's no chance that was any part of a conversation anyone actually had. I'm having it from the outside. Immediately, the director of Chivas goes, oh, I didn't realize the rules were open. He tweaked out publicly, not text, to his five players to leave camp and come for the second leg of the legion next weekend.

Okay, if we're doing whatever we want to do, then screw this. then there's this weird pause for a couple hours. And then the FMF puts out a statement that says, the time is the time. And if you have not arrived by, I don't remember what it was, 7 p.m. Central time on May 6th, you are not eligible to be a part of the World Cup roster anymore. And in perfect Dave Goss fashion,

these players showed up at 6.56 with the deadline at 7, four minutes before they were required to be there. For like two months, they pull into a throng of reporters, and they show up at Alexis Vega. So Alexis Vega and Hazis Gaird couldn't be replaced on the game day roster for Toluca. That's how tight they pulled this, where they were clearly trying to negotiate them out of this up until the last possible minute. I assume someone at Google Maps open being like, okay, it's traffic hours and 51 minutes. So if they don't leave now, they're not going to get there.

And this is the time we got to call it. And then they posted a picture of all of them eating a plate of pasta with hard-boiled eggs together. at the end of the night because now they're all happily into the camp. This is too good. This stuff's too good sometimes. Dude, it's

in different ways the three federations hosting this World Cup are trying to one up each other of who is the most dysfunctional. It was Canada with the, with the CBA with the players and everything that goes on there.

It's the U.S. with just ineptitude on the field and things being weird. And Mexico's like, you thought that was good? How about this? Because there was not, nothing better for Alexis Bega and Jesus Gallardo to get ready for a World Cup than getting to

train every single day with Hiro Torres and not do anything else. Gotta do it. It's invaluable. Like, I feel like this, is this the third time we're talking about it on Shogas? And like, I've gotten increasingly, like, as it went from, oh, that's happening, that seems weird. okay. To, like, it happened.

And it's like, this is, explain to me, genuinely explain to me, how does this help Mexico win one more game at the world? World Cup. I don't understand the rationale. Tom's ability to manufacture rage for something that we all know he doesn't care about at the finest is inspiring. If you're somebody who's

a stakeholder Toluca, whether that's you're on the staff or just a fan, I'd be furious. So, I fully get those vibes. I will say, because we had Eduardo Seracho on, and he said in the interview we did with him, Javier

Gary came to every club over a year ago. And I think this is, well, right, but I think at the time this is one of those things where you're like, you don't know if it's, if there's going to be 20 players in League MX who are going to the World Cup, then there is value to this, right? If your team is actually playing together every day and you can go, me and Joe did a 2002 World Cup preview together where we both called Qatar like a club team. That was going to be their only potential advantage was that they played together for three years. It turns out they suck at soccer, so it didn't work. But like South Korea did this in 2002 and it worked for them. So I understand having the conversation to put into place a plan. When you come back around now to there's only 12 players that are coming.

Most of them aren't starters. Five of them play for one team. So they're playing together all the time. You're not really creating chemistry and like cohesion with just what you need. And that's where it would be cool if someone in the room could be like, could we logically have a conversation instead of just backchew? handling everything. So this was the grounds that this game approached on. Then the TIFO was elite. It was a reverse of the LAFC Tifa, which means in the last week they made this thing.

And it was the devil of Toluca holding the angel baby of L.A.F.C., which is great. Also, I don't know if you guys saw the photos of the tunnel you walk out to. And just like the devil painting on the wall. And it's kind of like Orlando City style where it's like poorly lit or dark lit back, whatever it is. So like full intimidation there And then they get out into the game Timothy Tillman misses a sitter God It does the thing Toluca does

And then Tom would you like to take us post game Before we dig into some of the on field And talk a little bit about some pressers Yeah so Turkle Muhammad after the game Or as the game was ending Is just playing to the crowd It was like full WWE style

He's just going nuts As Toluca are scoring two goals It's stop it's time he's turning to the LFC bench and dancing. There's this incredible video that I've tweeted with the story of like he's doing like a salsa dance as an LFC assistant is like screaming angrily at him. And he's just kind of laughing and then pointing back at the crowd. Like he's going full WWA. Postgame press conference, Mark Dosanchos switching mostly in Spanish but a little bit of English and occasionally mixing in some Portuguese.

He goes, quote, there were clowns on the bench. you have to have class because the world turns very quickly. He is older than I am. Sick. But if he is listening right now, I believe that having class when you win is a quality of a strong man. What he did after the game today was clownish. Una Paiasada in Portuguese, sorry. Dos Santos continues, I have class as a person.

I know how to win. I know how to lose. I want to wish Coach Mohamed and Toluca. Good luck in the final. And Turgo Mohammed was asked after the game too. I guess Dos Santos came out first. Maybe Turco was still dancing to the crowd. He gets asked about Dos Santos' quotes.

And he in Spanish also goes, the thing is, when we lost over there, leg one, they danced. They took a victory lap, and they celebrated quite intensely. We felt that was excessive. That's why I shouted when we scored. I shouted very loudly.

I usually never shout when a goal was scored. And then pretty much said, hey, we were just returning the favor. So that was in and of itself was very, very fun. and the rest of Marto Santos's press coffers, which was six minutes, by the way. He packed a lot into this. So, um. Well, at altitude, he couldn't last much longer.

Yeah, to get in L.A. Galaxy and San Diego in the previous rounds, each went to Toluca, each had four goals hung on them. LASC eventually got that as well with the two stoppage time goals and a four nothing loss on the day. So before the day traveled, he was asking San Diego and Galaxy for, you know, their experiences, you know, tips or whatever, which is, I don't know what San Diego and LA Galaxy said. I get that it's MLS for all kind of thing here, but like those are the clubs two rivals.

So that was, that was a surprising choice. Everyone's in the industry. And I'm sure the answer was the altitude sucks. Bring your own toilet paper. Good luck, pal. Yeah. But I'm sure it's the same answer for everyone. So he goes, Dos Santos in this press comments, quote,

I heard this place was hell. Now, I'm a Christian. I have a different concept of what hell actually is. This place is more like the Disney of football, you know? The atmosphere is incredible. If you love football, this is exactly where you want to be. It's nothing like hell. It's not even close.

But it's a great atmosphere with a great crowd. But then he, because he can't help himself, he's like, but the pitch isn't like a UAF or a world. It's much more like the pitches that we see in Concakef. Yeah, because of course it is. And also, Toluca had the ball the whole time. What do you care of the pitch is anything? Oh, my good.

And, like, sorry, like, we talked about, so they were without Vega and Gallardo and all of that controversy. This is a team that is currently in the Ligia playoffs. And this comes a week after Mark Dos Santos just lit up M.S. scheduling and stuff. And Turkohmoha Muhammad is like, cool, I'm going to dance. Yeah. What a vibe. What a vibe.

3.95 XG for Toluca. So it was close then. It was close game. It was close. Hey. This is the manifestation of Joel M. Beed losing by 40 complaining about fouls while getting more fouls in the Knicks. Nice, Tom.

That is a great callback. And that is a great way to insert that into the show. And then, but not a low one for, I mean, 1.22 for L.AFC because there was a huge opportunity for Tillman. And Buonga obviously was one-on-one when it started. This is in the eighth minute. It gets saved. Tillman misses what is essentially an open goal on the rebound from the shot. And LAFC had some half chances otherwise.

I still don't fully understand what happened on the Obesi chance laid on of like what was offside and when the flag went up and what was called in which Buonga also hit the crossbar. on that opportunity, but Joe, we've seen this now three times in CCL, which is what Toluca does to you at home, it's pretty hard for anyone to hang with, especially these MLS teams coming down in a second leg. Yeah, and the weird thing is, I thought actually LFC did a decent job for the first half of this game. They had one of the best chances of the game period in that Bwanga, then Tillman double-miss that we talked about already.

And that whole sequence comes from Porteus breaking lines to Sun and then Sun threads the ball and behind. and you can see, okay, LASC are not going to be dictating this game. It's not really what they do anywhere, but they are going to have a few moments. And they had a few of those moments, and they largely kept Toluca, like, reasonably quiet in the first half. Obviously, all of the goals end up coming in the second half. Tulka have a bunch of shots in the first, but they're not really dangerous. I think Lurice made eight saves at halftime. Yeah, but even so, like, Fottmob has it as 0.72 XG for Toulika in the first half.

And I think that tracks grain of salt with single game XG, let alone single half. But I think that that like squares with what we saw on this game. And then the second half happens, and Schaffelberg was playing as the left wing back to start the game. And then Hollingshead comes on for him at halftime, and you're thinking, all right, this makes sense. Like, this guy's the veteran. Penalty.

And at that point, it really feels like it unravels, for me, at least, in this game. And the quality that Toluca have is just different. Like, LASC didn't have enough horses. When you look at this, Toluca side, this is not news to anybody listening to the show. But they are an absolute wagon. And Marcel Louise, even playing on whatever, half of an ACL he's got into whatever need that is.

He's the best player on the field, man. He is absolute class. And Tuluka have one of those players in every line of the field. And L.EFC, the reality is just didn't have on the day the absolute fortitude to make it through. I don't think there were miles separating these teams. I really don't. But at the end of the day, once Tulika got a little bit, they had an inch. They took a mile.

Tom's not outing me, so I will. I texted at halftime in a group chat and said, why is Ryan Hulingshead not starting this game? You know he's a big game player. He should have been on the field from the start. And his first thing he did was give up a penalty, which at that point put them behind the eight ball. They had to score at that point.

They didn't chase, I would say, but they started to open up a little bit more. I thought Sun was actually very good in this game. I think especially once a bobbcy came on, you can see a back forward where he dropped in and the back line was trying to clip balls into him over that first line of pressure. And then Son puts his head down, he starts striving and he can, we know this from his career.

He can make great decisions at high speed. So instead of like, oh, you're a slow playmaker where the game's going to sit in front of you and then you're going to pick passes, what Sun's going to do if Obobacy is healthy and he doesn't have to sort of lead the line is he's going to be a high speed chance creator for this team. But like you got to finish you. This is the same start with Nashville, leaving me it on the book. and you have to finish chances.

Polino is probably, you could say Marcel Ruiz is the best player on the field. I think Paulineo is the most dangerous player in the region right now. And like efficiency of movement with some of his stuff, like there's nowhere to go unless he takes his touch perfect and he turns perfect and he strikes perfect. And he does it multiple times a game, which is absurd to see. So Toluca, they end up, there's the red card with Fortius late.

there's chances all over the place. L.A.F.C. are throwing stuff forward. They end up losing 4-0 in this game, which is absurd. So they lose the series 5-2 after leading 2-1 out of the first leg. And they're not going on to the final in which Tegrae is going to be the team on the other side. Tell me if you've heard this story before. Nashville goes down to Monterey. They were better than expected.

They held segments of play. Then Tegrae sort of took it back but wasn't super dangerous. and then Nashville doesn't have enough to get over the line. Have you guys ever heard that story before? First time for me. You and I were texting about this game because I didn't get to watch it live, and you said it's the same game you've seen 100 times, and you're 100% right about that.

Nashville did good stuff here. Like, they did some good stuff. The problem is they did good stuff if it was a nil-nil-nil coming into this leg. They never, I mean, they had one shot inside the box in this entire game. They were not threatening whatsoever, and that's not a huge shock, right? I mean, no Sam Surridge. And when you don't have Sam Surridge, Christian, it's been. knows it gets nerve for like 50% right because he's not a score despite the fact that you sort of

think of DP right-winger okay this guy's going to be a a real box threat he's not he he is the one playing the final ball and he needs to target in order to do that and have it actually matter and he didn't have that in this game madrigal is not not that player then you lose a body in midfield with the assback in warm-ups and it just gets bleaker and bleaker and national defended well yeah and they didn't make a ton of mistakes outside of the the sequence on the goal but even then it's got to be like mistake after mistake after mistake in order for that to result in a and that's exactly what happened as it turns out. But they just did not have the horses in any way Nashville to actually make a mark in this game.

Yeah, and I would throw in. So Patrick Yazbek went down in warmups and was pulled out of the starting lineup. I would throw in not only is that the curveball you don't want of like you haven't game planned. Now you've got to play Brian Acosta who played pretty well in this game and is one of the worst rotation players in Major League Soccer right now. But I think Yazbeck is a difference maker. And like for all the possession of. what he does the way he burst out of midfield second runner stuff um the way he leads counter pressing

like if you sorry can i can i can i do a yosbeck thing real quick just right right that's a supporting point for this when tom you and paul did the executive survey right for mLS this year is that right uh like paul paul did did most in heavy lifting i was not that paternal leave okay oh there we go there we go time time is a flat circle yes tom is a child that makes sense in in that in that survey one of the questions is who's the best midfielder or whatever in mLS and someone answered yazbeck and that kind of dunked on in some circles that I'm in. Nice. I don't know.

He's not the best and it's still an absurd answer. But the dude has been really good this year. He's been like top, top tier. It would not be crazy if he was an all-star, but he'll never be because that's how this whole thing works. That was like an appreciate pick from somebody. And yeah, they really missed him in this game, guys. Absolutely. I like, I'm thinking as I'm watching the game, I think if you told me the five biggest game

changers for them, and I wouldn't put Schwaki in that because I wouldn't say match winners, but like who can who can create a moment for this team it would probably go like honey surridge espinoza and then yesbek and the heart would probably be the next two so two of those four players are missing like that's just unsustainable for any mLS team and to account for one of them missing you need the other one and so they were behind the eight ball when started that doesn't include any tag seth who came off in the 18th minute of the first leg and he was unavailable for this game, which loses a little bit of control in midfield for you. And I think just a little bit of confidence because tax that's the guy who doesn't lose it

when Nahar wants to get forward, when Revit wants to get forward. So I think it takes them a half step back because they don't want, they're not sure that they can actually go and push into the attack. And so, yeah, and Tigris doesn't care. They don't care the way the game is played. And that is like worst case scenario for a Nashville team in this setting where you needed them to make a mistake to open them up. Madrigal had the one run in the first.

first half that drew the free kick. And shocking that Chuck Mohammed and Wuban's past ias didn't take down Tigris in a concaf semi-final in this one. So frustration, I think, across the board for a lot of people, it led to the thing we do. What is MLS doing? Another year, the graphics went out, however you wanted to do it, of red X's with one green for Seattle, with Mexico flags, with one U.S. for Seattle. Whatever it is you want to do, MLS teams lose and that's what they do in Conquitcaf champions, whatever it ends up being called the year that it is. Joe, do you have any vibes, any juice for this conversation of what's going on?

And I don't know if MLS even cares? I mean, it's the same story, right? Where if MLS wants to win these sorts of games, if they want to be the force in North America, the model of how teams are built now, even as MLS continues to improve, and I think certainly the league is better now than it is before. and there's more money in the league now than there has been at any point. It's still not enough, right?

And there's a couple different ways you could look at this. One way you could look at it is, I think what Doyle talked about, of give everybody more DPs and a little bit more money and you're rocking and rolling. I think that's fine. Another option is what people have been rattling on about for years and years now, which is if you let teams spend money how they want to spend money, then there's opportunity. I was thinking about the LASC game, and part of this is because the centerback quality for Toluca is

ridiculous. I mean, Bruno Mendez is an Uruguine international. I mean, he is, I believe he's going to be at the World Cup for Uruguay. So, LFC you don't have that player. With respect to Tafari and Long and Pugus. Yeah, Porteous is a good player, right? He's a good player. But they don't have a guy who's even on the field for 90 minutes in that role, right?

So I think as a general rule, we can say the depth and quality across the board for these League of NEC's teams is higher, right? And what if it's the same argument we talk about all the time? What if you could split up your whatever money you're going to pay your top NDP into three or four players? You know, and all of a sudden, you maybe have the centerbacks to either in Lafc's case or defenders, LFC's case not to concede a penalty a few minutes at a half time in a crucial game, or when you are then trailing and needing to push for goals, not to get hung three more on you between then and the rest of the game. I mean, that was the story for L.AFC, right?

So you can look at them, you can look at Nashville. I mean, Mohammed and Paceas, that's not Concaf Champions Cup winning depth. It's just not, right? So we know the solutions for this. I'm certain MLS knows the solutions for this. The specifics of how they get there is a different story, but the reality is the same as it's been and change is going to be required to actually change that. And Tom, one of the things I ranted to you already this morning about is like,

I, for all of the debate and what's going on, I don't know that there's anyone who really sees this and cares. And I'm not saying that's not sporting directors, right? No. I bet you John Thornton has 18 emails drafted up right now that he's ready to throw in for the next Exco, whatever thing to say, this is how we can get better. I'm sure Will Coons is thinking about it.

I'm sure Mike Jacobs is thinking, like I'm sure all of them are. And there are some people, but it just feels like the direction of the league is not, okay, what can we do to make sure that our teams catch up here? It's how can we round off some edges and make it all look better and can we throw a league's cup in, which will make a little more money and all that type of stuff? Yeah, that's the cynical view,

and I think the one that is more rude in reality is that the people kind of controlling these decisions are looking at it as what's more valuable, competing better at Champions Cup, and again, there's no guarantee that this would be the solution, I think that it would be, but you could argue that maybe there's no guarantee.

What's more valuable? That or the space for a big star, something to that effect, right? Yeah. I talked to sporting directors, particularly in doing the survey with Paul, that's always a great time to really talk about like some big picture stuff.

And I tell you what, man, to a man, when you ask, what shall recap roster changes would you make? I believe it'd be like 90% of the people I spoke to said something to the effect of just give us, say it's $20 million and two DP spots, because we get it. The league should always have deep. There should always be spot for a messy, for a Griesman,

for a name or if you go for or whatever. But like outside of that, just take away all the buckets and restrictions and just let us spend it how we want to spend it. Yeah. And Joe, to your point about the centerbacks, this is something that I, this is something that's been the case for 20 plus years,

which is Club America will buy the best Chilean, Colombian, Ecuadorian, Uruguayan centerbacks in South America, who are 28 to 30 and ready to win today forever. And it's something we talked a little bit about with Eduardo Soracha. That's a player that's unattainable for MLS teams because that's a DP contract. And no one's going to spend that because of the structures that it is. And the one thing MLS has figured out is the Lucas Harrington's of the world and the Adelson Melendez.

But then you've got to flip that money back into another Lucas Harrington. And you don't get the opportunity to like build it up and say, now we can afford. to go get this guy. And it doesn't make sense based off the salary structure. And those are the sixth to 14th best players that are better on every League MX roster, team for team across, not from Mazatlan to L.AFC, but Mazatlan to Philly or I guess Montreal, I don't know who we're talking about at the bottom now, SKC, then has ever been the case.

And I think that is one of the huge frustrations as well. Anything else here before I move us on to another embarrassment? Move it. Toronto FC lost the second worst team in CPL in the Canadian championship this week. So they lost to Athletic Ottawa, and a name you're very familiar with, Blue Tabla, FC Barcelona's own with the hat trick from the 70th minute through to the 90th whatever for a 3-1 win at Bimo Field. It was a pretty rotated team for Toronto.

Walker Zimmerman made his return, Mazel Tov to him on the birth of his new child and getting healthy and being back into the team. one of our own here, kickback committee, and then like DeAndre Kerr, Derek Etienne, I don't know that you would consider a lot of them full-time starters. And there were like 16-year-olds in the starting lineup as well. And so they lost. And personally, if it was me,

if my team was sitting outside the playoffs and I was hosting a World Cup in a brand new venue, and I was three wins away from winning a trophy, I probably try and win a Canadian championship game in the first round. Am I out on my own on this one? Am I crazy? I'm with you, but if they, what is more likely to bolster Robin Frazier's job security,

beating Miami this weekend or winning this game? And I would say, yes, there were a lot of kids, yes, there was a lot of rotation. Toronto was dealing with a ton of injuries. You should still win this game. Like that's kind of how I'd look at it. Like that's not an excuse to them, and they should be taking this competition seriously.

But at some point you can't, play everybody every game. So it had to come down to a choice. And I don't know. I think that would have been fair if you made it. Or maybe if you start what you believe to be your strongest available team and you hope to God it's three now at halftime and you could pull off five of your most important players to only play 45 minutes.

But I don't know. It is the second win in this calendar year for athletic Ottawa. So just throwing that out there. They're flying. They're flying. And as you said, Messi comes to town. So this weekend, big weekend of MLS action. Reminder, full midweek coming up.

So we'll be back on Monday for all your weekend reaction, all that coverage. And then next Thursday as well will be a big midweek of MLS games. So the quality will be elite at that point because then you get the insanity. But we get a lot of three, threes, four, fours, and five goal comebacks and all of that. And the first game is the 1 p.m. Eastern time on Saturday. Messy coming to town to Toronto. So I feel like with everything we know from these. Toronto early games, the way into Miami's played, and what's happening to Toronto.

Joe, this is going to be like a six to five game at a minimum. Feels right. I'm still, I don't know where you guys stand on this. I'm still quite bullish on Miami. I think they've been better than the results have shown. Recently, there's a lot of chaos in that Orlando game obviously was nuts. But I still think even with all of the insanity happening around coaching changes and things of that nature, I still think this team is really, really good.

I mean, last year we had this whole discourse about Luis Suarez, should he start, should he not? and they didn't start and it worked. I don't know, man, Louis Suarez is back in the team and it's working right now. Clearly they're not as effective defensively with Suarez and Messi on the field together, even with Bertrami doing some of the hard running. But for a Miami team that has not rediscovered themselves in possession to their full extent without Alba and Bousquet's, I think Suarez has kind of been a useful addition to this team because it doesn't seem like they can really find the balance on the wings without Region

because he's been a walking injury so far this season and without obviously Alba now and you don't really have true winger. Even Silvetti, he's probably the closest thing they have to a true winger, but he's not really that. Aende is like an inside forward or a wide forward. How do you want to think about that? He's a vroom, room in behind, put the head down and let's go kind of player. So why not just lean into trying to dominate everybody centrally?

And I think that's what Suarez has helped them do. To me, when I watch this team, they look better than the run of form. I think the East is pretty weak. Toronto is not a good team right now. I think Miami are going to handle business. I think Toronto is more 24 than 24. Like, I was still surprised that they won the shield in 24 because of how, Miami.

There we got, man. You said Toronto. Miami. Miami are, viewing them more 24 and than 25 where they're just a better team last year. And that was even before benching Suarez. But in 24, you just kept waiting for them to drop points. And I think the performance against Orlando was similar to a lot of the ones. Like, I vividly remember, like in the regular season, they played at,

Atlanta and they were just wide open. And there was a couple games where they were getting late winners in when I didn't think they deserved it or at least thought that they were extraordinarily vulnerable. And then they lose in the first round to Atlanta. And yes, that was a shock, but I didn't expect them to win how much cup that year. Last year, that team was on a warpath. And I think, again, we talk about the coaching a lot, but have your match run as a good coach. And this current coach says things like, I'm just a guide for the best coach in the world

in Lino Messi. And when we talk about these issues, you can't find the balance. They don't know how the pieces all fit. Well, that's what the coach does. And substitutions is what the coach does. And he didn't make any when the game was completely going away from them in the last 20 minutes against Orlando. So I agree with you, Joe. This is still a really good team.

You could, like, you'd actually be a thoughtful tactical tactical coach. I don't know. There could be a mannequin on the sideline. And I'd still think this team is going to finish top three in the east. It doesn't matter. They could cook themselves like a men's league team. Yeah. If they're looking for coaches, I will tell you, after soccer on Tuesday, we went and got

pizza. and there's multiple coaches that were sitting at the table who had the solution. So I will say the... Props to you are for getting pizza and not hard-bolled eggs and pasta or whatever that nonsense meal

that you told about the Mexican plate. That hurt me to my course. The pizza is the better call. Yeah. So everyone has an input, but the one thing that we did talk about, which is true, is they played five in the back for a couple weeks and they were cleaner defensively

and they didn't. They put up three goals against Orlando and they conceded four. And that's where the balance for me right now is tough is there does not seem to be a way. And this has been an issue, I think, since Messi has arrived, because of the lack of some attacking players' ability to help defensively. And then the lack of some of the defenders that they have chosen to sign to be able to defend in any sort of isolation. So you really can't play straightforward. You have to overcompensate in one direction.

And it's a new group that now has to figure out where are they overcompensating. and what makes them successful. One of the things in all of this is, Rodrigo de Paul is not playing up to the level that I expect of him. He does not connect the game. He does a lot of complaining. But besides that, he does not connect the game, and he is not playing at an elite level.

And if you are a team that is guaranteed where the DPs have to carry you and all this stuff, on top of Bertrami, he's also not really carrying his load. On the other side for Toronto, I don't know what is happening. Like this is one of the teams I feel weirdest about, but this is a big opportunity for them to probably be in front of a bunch of fans and maybe for the last time for a while and try and clean out the taste of that Canadian championship. For this weekend, me and Doyle will talk coming up in a little bit about POTCH's staff hitting a few games in MLS. We'll sort of speculate on who they're watching.

I don't know how this is news. I don't understand how this is not just every weekend. I don't know what else you're doing, why you're not going to games, especially in the league. where most of your players play, but that's... It happens a lot. I wouldn't sweat it, yeah. Yeah. Top of the West Clash, though, is the big one.

10.30 p.m. Eastern Time on Saturday night, San Jose against Vancouver. We'll do a little caps update in a little bit, but Joe, all in the field, Securus goes down hurt last week. We don't know about Timo Verner. And I think this is what we've been asking the whole season, which is how long can San Jose sustain this? Yeah. First of all, do you guys ever do this thing where you think back to how you would have thought

about a San Jose Vancouver White Caps matchup? like four years earlier and think, man, this league just is never in the same place for too long. Sometimes I get flipped reverse, which is I was looking at this weekend, I'm like, NYCFC Columbus. Oh, yeah. Champaign football, baby, and then I'm like, uh, probably not. It happens so fast. I mean, for San Jose, I think they are going to be in a really difficult place against

this Vancouver team, even with a full 11 that I don't know the injury status of Verndor and Securis. It seems like they might be without one or both of those guys. It's tough, man. I mean, it's gone underrated, I think, because of how enticing Sechiris has been, and he's been really, really good. Werner is like an MVP-level attacker in this league. And I don't think Shakiris is quite there yet, which is fine.

That's not the expectation for him. But Werner has been amazing, and for them to lose him in Open Cup, it hurts a lot, and it hurts a lot. And you could tell how much they missed him against Toronto. Even without Werner, they're still a good team. Like, I think they're still absolutely a team that can play at a comfortable playoff pace without even their best player. Against Vancouver, man. I assume Thomas Mueller is going to be back

after his illness against the Galaxy, though I don't know. Even without Mueller, the white caps are still unbelievably good. And I think that's still where San Jose are a level or two underneath. I think we're going to see that play out on the field on Saturday, too. I would agree with that, Joe, where they are impressive even without a couple of their now top end guys. But the talent deficit this weekend, I think, is going to be stark with Vancouver. and you can get away with that against some other teams in a league.

Yes. Not the Vancouver White Cubs. So I will point out this is the second time these two teams are playing, San Jose 1-1-0 up in Vancouver, but that game came off the Champions League second leg in Seattle that Vancouver lost after they had played, you know, multiple games and multiple midweeks, so not exactly in like the best state of form. It's unfortunate the injuries to San Jose because this is a fascinating,

like how do these teams match? up moment just because so much of what San Jose does is their pressure and the chances they create. And I would say Vancouver is fairly comfortable playing through that. I think they would be one of those teams who they could find gaps in you because you invite yourself forward rather than what we've seen, I think, in a lot of games, Joe, where teams have panicked and made mistakes which have opened up opportunities for San Jose. Well, that's what special about the caps is that they're literally good at everything. In every phase of the game, we've seen them execute at an elite level in this league at all of them, whether it's breaking down a block

and against a low block, they're good at that, whether it's attacking in transition, they're good at that, whether it's attacking on set pieces, they're good at that, defending in a high press, they're good at that, defending in a low block. Like, they can do it all, and that is what I think makes them so special. Of course, that is made possible by how much talent they have. I mean, against the Galaxy, they trotted out Bruno Accedo, who looks amazing, by the way. He looks absolutely phenomenal. Bruna Ciceroian, former U20 international, someone along those lines.

He's brilliant. They tried to him. He's a weapon. Kenji Cabrera. He is like a human weapon. He rules. Yeah. Yeah, he's amazing.

He's absolutely amazing. Cabrera and Aze Jackson. They just brought all those three guys on the field in a line change hockey style in the second half against the galaxy. And it just crystallizes how talented this roster is. Even without Mueller, none of those guys were in the starting lineup. And it didn't matter. Vancouver were still the better team in that game against the Galaxy. So Vancouver can do it all.

And in San Jose, we're going to learn more. I mean, I still, Tommy talked to the talent disadvantage that there's probably going to be too much to overcome. And I agree with that. I mean, soccer's weird, right, so anything can happen. I certainly agree with that. At the same time, I think we all do recognize Bolivou looks like he's continued his status from last year as a real breakout player. Now he's a reliable top tier number eight sort of in this league. They have the pieces of centerback.

They're getting quality production out of the fullbacks. Preston Judi is that guy. They still have a lot of pieces. So I think this team can stay floating, but the caps are just on a different level. Okay, before we move on here, just to mention, so Axel Schuster did a media roundtable earlier this week, comments coming out from there sort of talking about there is no specific timeline. They haven't been given the deadline by Major League Soccer. They're still working through some things. They are not looking for handouts, but they are attempting to try and find a plan that works for them to bring in the proper revenue so that the club can be sustainable going forward.

as we've said many times it feels like no one is really a great option in terms of rooting for in this scenario except for the team to stay actual Schuster was not exactly I don't know endearing in what was said

and it was kind of a like we don't want a handout but look how much we do for local soccer so we deserve this and all this stuff and you're like fine whatever and then news coming out on May 6 that a BC minister the jobs minister

Ravi Cologne says that the government's been approached by a local group that wants to buy the Vancouver white caps. So we're back into a situation we've learned a bit from Save the Crew where there's probably a lot of conversations that are going on. My understanding from some of the reaction from this from some crew people is there's probably like three serious convos happening, but over 100 that were rumored and reported and connected. And most likely the person who's the loudest about it can't actually afford the team. They just want the publicity of being a part of the conversation. but I guess any news is good news at this point out. Yeah, I mean, any news that isn't, hey, we've accepted a bid from the goose of sins to move the team to Las Vegas. The absence of that at this point is good news just because of how dire everything sounds and everything is.

Yeah, and it was the Vancouver White Caps who said that they had serious conversations with over 100 groups. Like you said, Gus, how many of them really have the money or the poll or whatever? to make that happen. It's obviously super complex because it's local politics, taxpayers, a bunch of billionaires, MLS owners, MLS office, the white caps, all of that. But it comes down simply if they get a stadium, they'll stay. I feel pretty confident in that. I don't know if I feel confident that they're going to get the stadium.

And conversations are ongoing and they've been slow and reiterating some points that we've said on the show before. like the mayor is talking about that he wants the white cops to stay and then trying this long shot to get MLB there and there's no MLB stadium and I was speaking to somebody high up around the league that was like yeah the mayor seemed to like offer potential stadium solutions for an MLB expansion bid that they did not talk to us about for the white cap so it just shows that you can fairly criticize MLS for doing this for greed or business standpoint of like hey maybe it'll be more valuable to have a stadium and a team in Vegas in Vancouver but like

the Vancouver politicians are looking at MLB is like, oh, that's more valuable than MLS. So it's just like you started there, Gus. Everybody stinks here. If you want to hear a little bit more, our first touch episode this week is coming out. Me and Susanna went and reminisced about the memes of the 2014 World Cup and the Internet in 2010 back in a happier time. But the other half of the episode, we talked to Michael McCall of AFTN, who we've had on this show before up in Vancouver about this situation. So if you want to hear more, that's coming out on Friday morning. For the weekend, a full slate of games, three games on Sunday to know about.

I want to say a quick shout out. Congrats to Darren Yappy, who got a U-22 initiative deal, signed with the Colorado Rapids. I watched him play as a young player, was excited. Coming into MLS, I was worried. He felt very much like a player who his physical advantages at the youth ages weren't going to translate. He's really become a much better soccer player over the last few years. just the fact that he can go out and play on the wing for them and be productive. And I think he's only going to continue to get better.

So I think that's job well done by the Rapids. Congrats to him and a huge opportunity. And DC United signed a midfielder from the English championship, one of the top divisions in the world. Joe, Tom, I didn't know which one of you had the scout on him. So wanted to give us the full breakdown. Yeah, proper football, mate, right, Tom? Exactly.

Yep. There you go. In prime free player, free transfer, I should say. We'll see what he looks like when he comes here, and that they need as many potential news starters as they can get. The least interesting part of this was the Port Smith manager two days ago saying, nothing signed yet, you know, nothing's determined. And then I think DC made the announcement like 12 hours after he had that press conference. So good, good stuff, mate.

Did you help break that news? And was he coming, was he climbing back? Do we have issues in the champo? It is anytime I report on an English club that I haven't yet before, it's like I get screenshots from people who are like Discord like a Reddit Of like who the hell is this guy This guy doesn't know he's talking about

We had one in the Discord that was like a Reddit post That was like this is what the report's been Don't know who this Tom Bogart is though Yeah He's he's copying Wilford Nanteses flow Yes there you go Listen just learn the name It's on you at this point

To learn the name DC United by the way facing off against Nashville We'll talk about this more over the next few weeks Nashville legitimate shield contenders. Yazbek, I assume, this is me guessing, is out through the World Cup break, and it's heartbreaking if he's out for the World Cup. Because talking about the way he played,

I think he was a starter for Australia. He didn't come to MLS so that he could be here for the World Cup, but it was not disconnected, as he told me at media marketing, of like, I wanted to be comfortable in the U.S. I wanted to know what this was like before I go into that experience, and he's the type of guy that in Australia wants in a group stage, where you're up against it. He's a danger on set pieces,

the way he breaks out in midfield like we talked about. So heartbreaking for him, Tag Seth and Surge, it seems like, are also out. So, Joe, I think there's a real question of, like, can Nashville sustain this with that loss of talent over the next few weeks? I think if this is a shield hunt, yeah, I do think so. Maybe there's going to be a dip in the next few weeks

before the World Cup break. But after the World Cup break, when there's a little reset opportunity, I mean, the East is horrible this year. It's horrible, right? There's points to be had. There are lots and lots of points to be had. I think the best teams right now are very much in the Western Conference.

I mean, there's a number of them that are probably, I mean, National is probably in that top tier and maybe Miami, but really stack to the West. But if you're a shield contender, you want to be playing easy games. And Nashville are going to have a lot of quite easy games between now and the end of the year. I mean, they're facing the fifth best team in the conference this weekend at home in D.C. United. Going up to the World Cup then, they've got midweek on the road against the revs. then they host L-AFC next weekend, and then they host NYCFC to close out the stretch.

So I think for them, it's can you stay within touching distance of Vancouver and San Jose and maybe L-AFC in the Western Conference by the time you hit that mark? I wouldn't expect them to do a ton of business in the summer. I think most of these guys are staying. Like there's not a clear obvious, oh, this person's on the sale. And if that's the case, there doesn't seem like a ton of room to add. But can you get healthy? Can you get reset?

and then play the soccer that you started this year playing coming out into the second half of the season. Okay, we'll continue to roll on now with Doyle. But thank you to you two for being here. And Joe, we'll have you back soon. Thanks, man. Well, we are back for our USMNT segment that we were going to be doing every week leading up to the World Cup with the man, the legend himself, Matt Doyle. Every Monday, a little bit of news off the end of the show, just to get you a reminder of everything going on around USM&T land. And then on Thursdays, we dive a little bit deeper.

and we are going to start digging into some opponents because we're in the timeline. We're under, what, 40 days to the World Cup? So we're going to start talking about Paraguay, Australia and Turkey, specifically, Andrew Eby, feel free to send me notes on pronunciations and geopolitical issues around Turkey. Turkey and everything else. Yeah, if Erdogan wants me to say it, he can come find me himself. Otherwise, he might. I think there's a really high chance he would.

And I don't think they would be very nice people who would come talk to me about it. So we're going to dig into those teams in order as they're going to play. One note, if you live in the west coast of Florida, you can go see Australia because they're going to be trading at IMG for the next few weeks. They've called in eight players similar to what Mexico did with less drama, shocking, that it's less dramatic for Australia than it is for Mexico. But eight players for them, obviously the English championship season is done. And a lot of Australians play in the champo.

So they're going to be heading over for that. the A league has finished as well. So they're going to have a little bit of an extended camp and then players as they're eliminated from the leagues they play in. We'll go up and join that Australia team. So we're going to be talking about all these teams going forward. But first, for this episode, let's talk a little U.S. specific off the top. And then we will get into Paraguay. Report from Doug McIntyre coming out this week that U.S.

men's national team assistant coaches, Jesus Perez, Perez, and Miguel de Agostino will be scouting MLS. based World Cup hopefuls this weekend. So Perez will be at R.S.L. FC Dallas. Mm-hmm. And then DiGiGas, and L-A-F-C-Hustin, and then DiGasina will be in attendance for NYCFCC-C-C-C-C-Lumbus. So RASL Dallas. That makes sense. We're talking Logan Farrington here, right out the game.

I mean, they're obviously big listeners to soccer-wise. What David Goss says goes for U.S. national team coaching staff. It's obviously Diego Luna, who I think has leveled up. this year, not necessarily on the ball, but his off ball movement has been really razor sharp since he came back from that injury. And remember, he missed the camp in March where the U.S. got brained by Belgium and Portugal.

So, like, he was a big winner from that camp, just by virtue of not being a part of it. But the other thing that we're all wondering from this is Xavier Gozo. Now, Zavir Gozo had a bad week two weeks ago. I thought he looked a little bit overwhelmed versus Inter-Miamy, and then I forgot what the game was they played.

played after that he just wasn't sharp and was maybe a little selfish and Pablo Mastronei called him out without calling him out and then this past weekend against Portland now it is Portland and they are terrible so grain of salt but Zavir goes oh was awesome and what he's so good at is largely missing from our like he he beats guys one v one he has the type of gravity that gets opposing defenses into a scramble, into rotation, and creates spaces for guys like Diego Luna or maybe Christian Pulistic, if he could ever get into the attacking third again.

So look, man, we've been saying it Allspring. If there is one player in MLS, in the potential pool who could come from nowhere and be a part of this 26-man roster, it is Xavier Gozo, and it is very obvious why. And I really hope that is what they're, they're looking at this weekend. It's a big weekend then for him.

Like the pressure's on, which is what you want, because if he's going to be in a World Cup, the pressure will be on. So here's an opportunity where it's like, you know they're coming. You know this is you're trying to shoot the moon. You can't make mistakes at a time like this.

Like you can't slip up in any way. And I think we've said this about a couple other players where the window for them to make this World Cup roster is so now, if it's even open, that you need to do something special. If there's even a window, It just might be a wall day. 100%.

100%. Now, in saying that you're in a situation, Memo Cho is about to get called up for a sixth World Cup, injuries happen, things change really late. Like, there has to be contingency plans and Gozo can work himself into those convos. Or you come out and play the way you've played 90% of this season.

You overwhelm everyone. I mean, there's a chance he's lined up against a Swedish national team starter in this game. How else can you prove that you deserve to be at a World Cup than to go totally? to toe with someone who will be starting at the World Cup and play well. So it's a huge opportunity for him. The Luna stuff, I think the off ball stuff is huge just because there was segments of time with RSL where he was the only option. And so ball would come to his foot and everyone would

stand up still and he could beat guys 1 v1. That's not going to be the story at the national team because he is not that high on the pecking order. And he has not proven he can do that at that level, the work he is doing around the game and to come back into an RSL team that was already playing well and fit in and like grind and run off the ball and work hard. Exactly. That's the example you need to say, okay, you could play alongside McKinney and Poolec and Poulissick and Wayo was what I was going to say.

Right. Not Weston. And I think that's been huge from Diego Luna on top of he's just got a lot of shit to him. And for a team that's looking for personality and a team that's looking for whatever. You just love the fact that you're going to get to root for a guy with the exact same body type. you at the World Cup. It's like perfect for you. He was 14, so it'll be nothing new for me.

And he, yeah, he, he's what you want on the national team. Dallas, I made the joke about Logan Farrington. There isn't really a name there that they're watching. It feels like this is an RSL one. And then LAFC Houston's an interesting one. Because I think on Houston, you're talking about Jack McLean. That's like really the only person. And on LASC, I think on the surface, not watching anyone.

and then I guess you get into a Tim Tillman, a Mark Delgado, maybe an Aaron Long. So let's do the McGlynn thing first, right? Because the way Tanner Tasman played in March opened the door for McGlynn to get back into the picture. Because I think it's those two guys would be fighting for one spot, which is the relatively stationary central midfield orchestrator. The doesn't move spot. The doesn't move spot, right? The Valderrama role. And, you know, I still think Tillman's ceiling is a little higher because he is more mobile and he can add a little bit of value defensively that McGlynn just does not.

Yeah. But men, Tillman really struggled in those two games. And when you struggle like that in the final two friendlies before the World Cup came. You're right by Tasman. Yeah, sorry. What did I say? Tillman. Tillman.

Tillman, geez. Yeah, Testman. When you struggle like that, then you leave the door open. And McGlynn has played well enough in his return over the past couple weeks to deserve a look. I like that is why they're there. I don't think any of the LAFC guys are really in the picture. Yeah. Though if one is, it would be Tillman.

Yeah. Because of what he did against Uruguay. And if you think back to that game against Uruguay, the US won 5-1, it was Tillman who set the tone. with an absolutely crunching tackle within like the first four or five minutes and just like, oh, we're going to boss this game physically and we're going to impose ourselves and we're going to make the types of plays

that swing the balance. And the US was kind of missing that in the March camp. So maybe this is Potch thrown up his hands and saying like we just need some more X dog in this midfield. And the guys who are supposed to be the guys didn't bring it. So get eyes.

on Tim Tillman again because he earned it with what he did back in November. And you're assuming this is a guy that is last on the bench, deep on the bench, he's going to come out and play with energy, right? He's the amount of ground he'll cover and the speed he'll do it at late in the game is going to be an advantage. Or he's a guy when you think the game's going to be against you. Like he's a guy that you start in a knockout game against a better team where you think you're going to be trying to find traps.

to press and trigger on and then go in transition. And that's the things he's really good at. If he gets more than two seconds on the ball, it all starts to disintegrate. So games where you're knocking it around, which we're going to talk about Paraguay and we're going to talk about Australia, that's not going to be his strength. And so that's part of what you have to balance with him is like,

what do you think the game states will be? Just throwing it out there. Long coming back from the injury, three starts. He's only played at most 67 minutes so far. that was last week against Toluca. Miles Robinson's been hurt. Tim Riem is hurt. Obviously, Carter Rickers been out forever.

You are probably one injury away from saying we don't have a true backup centerback that's not a fullback that we're converting in unless we bring someone who's been outside the pool over the last few windows. So that's the line you're sitting on right now. Yeah. And it would shock me if Aaron Long stepped into that

because when he was at his peak since his, original injury. He hasn't been a national team player, but we're probably at that point scraping the barrel. And so maybe if you have the opportunity, you go see him play and knowing Mark Dostentos, he'll probably play 90 minutes midweek and play 90 minutes again on the weekend. So that will be, and then Columbus seems obvious. It's Max Arvston, maybe a little bit of Patrick Schulte as well. Am I missing anyone there? I mean, would be nice for Taha Harbun to have three goals and two assists in this game. But, you know, I don't, I think we're a cycle away from, from him being a factor.

Or Tavon Gray could be a shit starter if the U.S. had picked him, but they did not. Yeah, certainly know. Keaton Parks, we could talk about again for another five years. I think we, I think that ship has sailed. Me too. All right, let's hit one more thing on the U.S. side before we talk Paraguay. We mentioned on Monday, Sergenio Des made his first appearance since March 6th off the bench for PSV Idenhoven against iax so there's two games left in there a de viz season for him to play um he has been a

staple starter for the u.s when he's been healthy he really hasn't played much under marisa pocettino so we don't know how poch would use him and i say all this because dest is a unique person and player and poch also is on a bit of an extreme with the way he functions and the way he operates and i wouldn't think there's a ton of crossover between the two and so i do think it's fascinating to try and figure out where Sergenio Desk falls in all of this if he's fully available. Yeah, that is a really good question. But I think with the way the centerback situation has shaped up, the best part about Sergenio Dest coming back means you could play him at right wing back and it makes it easier to slide Alex Freeman into that right center back role

that he has played off and on for the U.S. Now, Freeman's best performance for the U.S. was against Uruguay, where he was an attacking right wingback, and that is kind of his natural inclination, but he has showed since he first started getting call-ups about a year ago that he can slide inside. He's a smart enough soccer player, and obviously he's talented enough on the ball, and physically he can be overwhelming to check all those boxes and to play right centerback at a pretty high level. And if it's, you know, if he has Tyler Adams in front of him and Chris Richards next to him and Sergenio Dest or Tim Way it to the right of it,

you're suddenly surrounded by a lot of experience. And any, like, it doesn't entirely mitigate the, you know, the newness of the position for Alex Freeman. But I would be comfortable with it. Like, Alex Freeman has shown me enough that he has the mentality and the skills to go out there in a big game and play this position that he hasn't logged a lot of miles.

at, but still be a net positive for the U.S. And frankly, with the way everything is going, I think the U.S. needs him there. So, Desk coming back makes it that much easier to just say, right center back in that sort of hybrid three that Pachitino plays. That's Alex Freeman. We're good. Because in your mind, if Desk isn't back, Alex Freeman is the starter at right wing back? Well, you just get a little thinner, right?

So it's probably- Because way has obviously started there in friendlies. It's probably Wea there, but, you know, I don't think Wea has looked like a lock starter at any point over the past four years. And, you know, maybe you need Wea at left wing back, depending on how that goes. Jedi Robinson is in and out of the lineup with Fulham and didn't look like the same player for the – hasn't looked like the same player since that injury last year. It's a lot of stuff that's in the air, which is why – you know, it's wild to me that people are worrying about end. Anything other than the defense at this point in his cycle. The defense is like a five alarm fire.

DefCon 2 at the very least with the defense. The rest of it, even with Pulisic being in the toilet, the rest of it is relatively stable. The other thing Desk gives you is that flexibility because he can play on the left side because he's two footed. So it does potentially open up a spot to be able to play with a different position if you want to in terms of depth for Maricio Poitititino. it will be interesting to see how he interacts with the rest of the group

because one of the things with Des, I mean, Burrhalter tried it when he could have. He's so clean on the ball that you can bring him inside and play into his feet and buildouts and stuff. He also takes risks. So you have to balance that. But does that change what we just talked about with the Timothy Tillman,

who you maybe think you can put in midfield because Desk can take some of the responsibility of possession and build up and trying to get you into the final third? it also makes a situation where if he's starting at right wingback, you probably won't weigh on the field because he's going to have to cover at times over the top coming back. And you know he will where I don't know if everyone in the attacking field, looking at you, Giorina, is potentially going to do that or capable of doing that.

Professional soccer player who plays real minutes, Gio Raina. Yeah. So he, he, I think, affects a lot of things. we're still at a point where his natural talent is something that's really hard to leave off a field, although people are talking once again, as we have about Johnny Cordosa, who just playing in Champions League semifinal and maybe left off the entire roster. So there are parts of the U.S. that have changed from the past, and there are parts that I think you're still kind of stuck into, which is a guy that good is going to be on the field.

He's a game breaker. His ability in possession, the way he can take defenders out of the play, the way he can serve balls, all of that is stuff that could break opening. game for you that not everyone is capable of. So he's clearly going to be a part of the roster if he's healthy. And the assumption is he would be a starter. And the thing with the Freeman stuff is let's start talking about Paraguay now. He feels like the right fit for a group stage game where you're probably going to have to break open the game. But let's do a little bio on Paraguay. We're going to start with the Triple Alliance War of 1846. And then we will continue from there.

there was a pretty good chance I was going to do that. So for anyone listening, if you haven't yet, we have another podcast feed called First Touch Kickback 26. We did like a 10 to 18 minute bio episode about every single team at the World Cup. We finished three of the recent qualifiers. We've got the other three that we're going to put out. Some have interviews. Like we interviewed Diego Valer about the culture of soccer in Argentina. We interviewed Jaime and Macias, someone we both worked with about the history of soccer in Ecuador.

we interviewed, I'm trying to think now, we interviewed players on Jordan and on Australia, Canada, all of that type of stuff. So, but we talk about all these stories of how culture affects the countries, how the sport has affected the history and all that. So if any of that interests you, if you heard me say Triple Alliance and you perked up, or if you're a bear wise person,

I've heard a lot of feedback about our bear segment on Monday, that's the show that you need to go listen to. And I think it's the perfect show for anyone who's like, maybe I'll care about the World Cup, I'm not sure, that you can send over to them. But can I give you the one fact I know about Paraguay? Sure. Paraguay is the one country in South America where an indigenous language has a plurality of speakers, and that language is Guarani.

It is actually the only country that is technically bilingual. Oh, all right. So legally, every country in South America has one language, and Guarani. being the second language alongside Spanish in Paraguay is the only country that is technically bilingual, and as you said, it has a majority of people that still speak it, which is partially, I think, because the War of the Triple Alliance eliminated 60% of the country's population.

So everyone left spoke the same thing and continued to speak it as the country progressed and move forward. But for Paraguay, I think they get looped in with the other countries around them fairly often and don't get specifically pointed out, it's something they talk about a lot, and it's something that is pretty true. So this is their ninth World Cup appearance.

It's their first since 2010. So 2010 to 2015 is really the bright spot of Paraguayan soccer history, and it was, of course, under Tata Martino, who, as an Argentine, went and took over the national team. They made it to the quarterfinals of the 2010 World Cup, which is the furthest they've ever gone in a World Cup, and they qualified for the two before. So that stretch is the most successful.

in country history, and then they made it to the 2011 Copa America final losing to Uruguay, and they ended up going deep as well in 2015. 2015 is the last time they've won a Copa America knockout game. So they haven't been to a World Cup in 16 years. They haven't won a Copa America knockout game in 11. It's been a dark time for soccer in Paraguay, and it looked like it was going to continue. So they lost in 2024 Copa America to Costa Rica in the group stage. They were the worst team in their group.

And the coach of Costa Rica was Gustavo Alfaro. And Paraguay said, that guy looks good at what he does. So Paraguay finished sixth in Conmable. They were the last team in auto-qualification, but it was a four-way tie from third through six. So they weren't worse than the teams around them. And El Faro was hired when they sat in seventh place. So in the playoff spot at the time.

and they had only won one game in the opening seven match days over what was like almost 14 months of qualifying because Conma Bowl takes so long. After he took over, they went nine games undefeated. His first game was a road draw at Uruguay. His second game was a home 1-0 win over Brazil, and they ended up also knocking off Argentina at home. And then they finally clinch qualification in the zero-zero-dra

against Ecuador, who also ended up being the second-place team in World Cup qualifying. but they were the second lowest scoring average team in Conmable. Notice everything I said was 1-0-0-0-0. That's how Paraguay plays, and that's the way they've been built. Gustavo Alfaro, if you don't already know him, he took Ecuador to the 2022 World Cup. He's Argentine himself.

And then from Ecuador moved on to coach Costa Rica from 03 to 23 to 24. So did not go to a World Cup but went to that Copa America. Guess who scored against Paraguay? the opening goal for Costa Rica. Calta Borgas. No, I'll give you a clue. Always shows up for Costa Rica and doesn't show up for anyone else. Francisco Caldra.

Okay, love it. Love it. Opening goal. So yeah, Alfaro, 63-year-old Argentine and then has taken over Paraguay. They are in talks currently. I forgot about this. Paraguay is a host of the 2030 World Cup because Paraguay, Argentina, and Uruguay are hosting opening games there and then everyone goes to Portugal, Spain, and Morocco for the rest of it.

So they are already in talks with extending Alfaro's contract and the reports are that has nothing to do with the performance at the 2026 World Cup. They believe in the process and they want to continue it. They have, in their most recent window, lost 2-1 to Morocco in France and then they beat Greece 1-0 in Athens to close out the 2026. friendly windows. And obviously they will have their friendlies coming up in June as well to get ready for the World Cup.

But if all of this sounds familiar, it is because the U.S. and Paraguay faced off, of course, in the final window of 2025 in Philadelphia. It was a two one win at Subaru Park. And your god, Giorina, scored the opener in the fourth minute. He then didn't close down a defender at midfield and Paraguay equalized. Defense is for ugly people. He calls in the 10th minute. And then Florian Balligan had the winner in the 71st.

But the big flashpoint was the fight to close out the game. It was Alex Freeman heavily involved on the sideline. Full kind of like groups of players pulling together, trying to pull each other apart. I don't know, maybe some stuff thrown, nothing that we ended up really seeing. And that's Paraguay to their core. The Guarani is the grit. That's what they call themselves. That's their own nickname for themselves.

and that's what this team is built on. Diego Gomez, the biggest name on this team, many people will know from his time at Inter Miami. He is currently on a knee injury, expected to return this season, was the report this week out of Brighton where he plays. Season is running out real quick, man. Yeah, there's three games left,

four games left, depending on the team. And he, yeah, so he is the big star alongside Miguel El Miron, and then Julio and Ciso, who is getting the full Blueco experience. was signed by Bluco has moved around all of the Chelsea owned teams currently at Strasbourg, 22-year-old. I think they bought him outright at Strasbourg, right? Everything I've read is Bluco owns him, which I think is illegal. So I don't know, I don't know which team owns him. The strength of this team, though, is the centerback pairing.

So Omar Alderete, 29-year-old. He has started 30 times in the Premier League for Sunderland, his first year there. He's played as a starter at Hattafe, Hertha, Valencia, and. Basel over the last 10 years and then the Palmeiras captain Gustavo Gomez been around forever 367 appearances for Palmerish in his career and this is a team that won't beat themselves they will make you work for everything and the example I said to you before we got on is that November friendly it was the US 57% possession Paraguay 44 teams had equal shots the US had one more big chance created.

Paraguay is comfortable in that. They are not elite, but they are very good at what they do. Yeah, they are. Like if I said mid-table, commie ball qualifying Paraguay, and you asked me to, you know, sight unseen, describe the team. I would say probably lowish block 4, 2, 3,1, probably have veteran centerbacks. One of them plays at either Palmarish or Flamengo or South Paulo. or Boka.

Yeah. And the, well, not anymore, right? Brazil has just left Argentina in the dust on the league level.

And then the other is like a decent mid-table, you know, big five league type of guy. Like, and that is, that is it. The spine,

they have a good goalkeeper, the guy from San Lorenzo, and they have a lot of guys in midfield who work. And, you know, all of it is, all of it, the idea is to end up with Enceiso or Maricio, who's also from Paul Marish,

or maybe even Miguel Almiron, getting that moment to put the team out into transition or semi-transition even and create chances off of an opponent that has overstretched itself, trying and banging its head on the door repeatedly to no avail to try to create chances against that veteran very good defense and that's it and that is a totally fine way to play as an underdog who's just trying to get out of the group the U.S. went up against that in November and that's exactly how Paraguay played the U.S. did really really well with it and it started with matching the energy and physicality and I think that for Patrachino probably his favorite moment as a coach was that fight at the end of the game because the U.S. did not back down at all.

And that surprised me because frankly, this U.S. team can be a little soft at times. Yeah. It is not a team that is like, oh, we're developing for the future. Like most of the guys rotating in and out of the rotation that aren't the staple stars like Gomez and whatever are 30, 35 years old. And the huge problem for Paraguay right now is the lack of a true center forward. So Antonio Sanabria was supposed to be the face of it. Plays in Syria has one goal, one assist on the season.

So in the last friendly, he was replaced in the starting lineup by Gabriel Avalos, who plays at Independiente, who's 35 years old. And as I said, in the friendly against the U.S., Alex Arce, scored the lone goal who's 30 years old who plays in Argentina. So there is not like an emerging excitement in the attack, except there's no Roque Santa Cruz on this generation. There's not one coming.

Yeah, there's not one walking through that door. And there is not like a 21 year old where they're like the talents there, the experiences and do we try them? In all of this though, I think coming out of the draw, the excitement of Australia and Paraguay, great. Because everyone else from those two regions

probably is better. Maybe not Asia because you've got Jordan and Saudi Arabia and whatnot. But they are built to be exactly what they're going to be at the World Cup. And we talked about this with L.A.F.C. and Kanky-Kaff on Monday, which was a little different conversation where it's like, this is not a good team that's going to have to say, can we figure out how to bunker against the home World Cup team?

This is a bunker team that's going to go and do the thing they do best. And that has to be the biggest fear for any U.S. fan. Yeah. I mean, it's, there's no, you know, they don't put on airs, right? They know who they are and they embrace it. They're not trying to change the way the world thinks about Paraguay and soccer. They're trying to go out there and wear you down and find that opening and hope that one of their attacking midfielders or wingers

can turn that opening into a goal. And that is it. And the U.S. has to know that. And they got a good test against it. And it was a high-level friendly. Still friendly. Right. Even the most intense and most bad-tempered friendly,

the gap between that and the World Cup is a chasm. And so the U.S., like, they are going to, Paraguay is going to make the U.S. carry possession and use the ball and break them down with the ball. And it has been hit and miss for the U.S. forever in that situation. But this is, like, this is the job. This is why Mauritio Pachitino was hired. And this is what this golden age of American talent, Christian Pulisic, Weston McKinney, Gio Raina, Tim Wea. this is a flow bolligan Tyler out this is what they're supposed to do this is the level that they're supposed to bring us to and this is their chance to do it at home in the world cup and we have talked about for years like there should be a concaf team playing Costa Rica is different than trying to knock out the Netherlands in a world cup there should be the this is tough and gritty verse this can be pretty and in possession or there should be a difference with such a gap between a home team and an away team playing at honduras is so different than hosting honduras at tq l's stadium. This is sort of goes into that conversation and we'll have it over the next month of how do you

go about these games? How do you play them? Like I talked about, Alex Freeman as right centerback gives you a different attacking force. Also could be huge on set pieces. These are the types of games where one chance changes everything. You score the first goal. Now Paraguay has to open up at some point. Now they have to come after you. And so a Weston McKinney and an Alex Freeman on a set piece can be like a huge deal if you can get that opening goal. My thought, and this came somewhat over the last few days as like doing this research, re-digging back in. I've been reading a bit as well and watching some stuff on Australia. I think you end up with you are not going to be a great ball dominant team. Try and sort of make the game states a little against the ball. Counter press, press, get messy and just like win these

games by a goal, tie these games. It doesn't matter. I think you start the world. Cup playing the way you're going to end playing, which is don't say, oh, I want this guy in for the group stage, but then when we get to a knockout against a Senegal or in England or whatever, then we'll tweak things. And, you know, now all of a sudden, Mark McKenzie's coming into the team, but Alex Freeman's starting. Start the group that you think is going to be the team you're going to play. Play the way you think you're going to play, obviously with tweaks to your opponents. And it should be enough to grind to a result, which is what's going to happen anyway. There's no world in which you start Sergenio Dest at centerback,

and it's your greatest attacking team, and you smoke Paraguay or Australia off the field. It's just not going to happen, so don't even fake it. Yeah. The starting lineup from that 2-1, Matt Freezing goal, the back, it was a 3-4-2-1 for the U.S. Miles Robinson, Tim Ream, and Joe Scali across that back line. Max Arsson, left wingback,

Sergenio Des right-wing back. Testman and Christian rolled on deep. Gio Raina and Brennan Aronson underneath Flo, Balagan. And then at the 67th minute, Freeman and Luna came. It was one one at that point. Freeman and Luna came in. So there was a little bit of a tactical tweak. And Baligan got the winner a couple of minutes later.

And then the final 20 minutes were, you know, axe handles and machetes at 10 paces. It was pretty great. The only thing I remember about this game, and I will forever remember, was that Tom was in the stadium. There was a brawl and Tom did not get into it. He's soft.

He's soft. It's just mid-Jerzy stuff. Just mid-Jurzy, North Jersey, they'd be there. Mid-Jurzy, no chance that they could find it. All right, we're going to keep doing this over the next few weeks. So we'll talk Australia next week. We'll do Turkey the week after. We're obviously going to continue talking about the U.S. side of things.

And then we're into roster full conversations because we're going to be in the week of the roster announcement. Then we're going to get it. And we've got a lot to do here at Soccerwise. We're going to have a ton of World Cup coverage for you over the course of the World Cup. But we hope to be your home for all USM&T coverage. And we'll get some Canada stuff in there and probably some Mexico as well. So it's going to be a really fun trip.

Doyle, once again, thanks for being here. We'll see you soon.