SoccerWise - Inter Miami Win Their First MLS Cup, Caps Travel Big, LAFC Hire New Coach & WORLD CUP DRAW REAX

Episode Date: December 9, 2025

An all-time weekend in the North American soccer sphere has finally come to a close. And I am not just talking about Tom going full Miami vice. The guys sit down to recap everything they saw in the swamps of Fort Lauderdale. After they decompress from the last game of the MLS season they look at the big news around the league starting with LAFC's new coach. And of course they break down the big news for USA & Canada form the World Cup draw.4:30 Miami Gameday Experience14:10 MLS Cup Game Reaction37:30 What It Means For Inter Miami44:05 Big MLS Offseason Coach & Front Office Hires LAFC, NYCFC, SKC, STL & ATL1:03:44 Offseason Player Preview

What is up everybody? Welcome back to Soccer Wise covering the final MLS game of the 2025 season. And our first ever here at Soccer Rise that we've covered from start to finish. It was our first preseason and it was into our first MLS Cup. And what a moment it was. Me Familia, my people here in Miami that you got to experience winning it all for the first time ever, knocking off Vancouver. We were both in the building.

We have a lot to talk about. A lot more going on. Coaches have been hired. Coaches are being interviewed. Players have been traded. Players have been signed. Players have been extended. and, of course, we've got a World Cup draw as well.

The World Cup is coming to North America in 2026. Tom, it was good to see you this weekend. It was great to see, obviously, because you weren't in Miami when I first arrived on Thursday. Like you, old school rappers used to have to do with Uncle Luke, Uncle Loozer. I had to call you, asked for permission. Am I allowed to enter your city? Just want to pay my respects. And then when you said yes, I said to the plane, okay, we can land them.

You went to Highline, right? Oh my God That was pure electricity So shout out the Sessa Cyclones Mike Ryan, Chris Cody The Levittar Show guys Owned that team The other team

It was owned by Ray Lewis We won I'm saying weeks I felt like I was in the owner's box There was probably 15 people There nine of which were us Celebrate in every point Being respectful

Thankfully Ray Lewis did not even glance at us Because if he did You would not have heard Another sound from us But the sport of my life, pure electricity. It's a scary prospect.

I looked over, I was like, that's funny. That guy looks like Ray Lewis. It was like that day. You know, like a Ray Lewis type, like a classic Ray Lewis looking person. That's wild. Yeah, so that's near where I live. So you were encroaching near my territory. And you're lucky.

I already have your permission, though, so. Yeah, you were lucky that I was able to get all the clearance through to all my people. So they could wave you through. It was wild weekend in Miami It's Art Basel for anyone who doesn't know Which is the biggest weekend of the year A week of the year So it was like not probably the most convenient time

To impromptu hosts a final in the city Not that Chase Stadium is anywhere near actual Miami So it led to some people spending some really good time on I-95 Which is always a fun thing to do And of course Vancouver getting to get the full vibes Of the Miami experience There were so many Vancouver fans I saw them in the Miami airport.

I saw them around downtown Miami, which is so far, as I said in the stadium. I saw them all over Fort Lauderdale. I mean, I think Brian White might have been the second most popular athlete in the city behind Messi over the course of the weekend. So we'll talk about all about that game. As I said, we'll talk about all the big coaching news. We didn't get to a lot of the off-field stuff last show because we had a lot to talk about with Paul Tenorio, who has officially announced the Messi effect is available for presale. So go out and get it.

if you are looking to promote. We also have something to promote as well. We launched our World Cup series. So we have been working on a podcast, 10 to 15 minutes, about every single country that has qualified for the World Cup. It is called Kickback 26, our entire World Cup package. We also did a live World Cup draw show at Legends Bar and Football Factory last Friday. We were putting out group analysis as a podcast.

You were very missed up. Also, it would have been dangerous because... Early day. The owner, Enda, who was so nice to have us there. He came on the show, actually, as an Ireland fan to talk about Ireland, potentially qualifying, super friendly. After the show, he's like, can I get you anything? I was like, you know what? I'd go for a hot toddy.

It's cold out. I've been talking for a while. I could use it for my voice. I don't know, maybe a glass of hot whiskey with a sprinkle of honey would be what he called it. And the third one was coming out by the time I had put the first one down. Like they were refilling magically, and that was still a. at 4.15 p.m. in the afternoon. So the 7 a.m. flight down to Miami on Saturday was a bit of a miracle for me to even be on

that plane and get there. But we've got a lot to talk about on the show. I just want to start for your experience, because I've been to a few Inter-Miamy games. I live down here. Not just MLS Cup, but the Inter-Miamy experience. What did you make of the game day, the atmosphere, what the team is like in this city? So I'm just going to back it up even to just the whole 48 hours, essentially, that I'm I was there. Friday was a World Cup draw. That was kind of the first full day. I was in Fort Lauderdale. I went, I was into

Miami for the draw because I was on the Dan Lebitard show which was a dream. I felt like I could make a wish kid just being around there. And then it was everything that came with the draw and everything that it can highlight that day. That was the best part. And I enjoyed it a lot. So I felt like I was ducking in and out of interviews or just either making content or listening to content, essentially

the entire day, which again was a lot of fun. But I didn't didn't get to, that didn't feel like an into Miami day because of all the other things that was happening around it. Saturday, getting into, getting around the stadium area, it was really cool. The, where the stadium is, there's like a lot of like neighborhoods around it. And so all of a sudden, you get off the highway and then there's just like a row of houses and you start seeing $20 parking, $30 parking, $40 parking, just like people around the area. And just so many vendors selling knockoff Miami gear messy gear Argentina gear

Barcelona gear whatever it is great music every time I walked past something there was something that smelled delightful on a grill like the tailgating experience but just like has it slowly built as you're getting towards the stadium and all the music all the noise the buzz would felt like a big big game as it should it felt like this in in Los Angeles Carson with the Galaxy last year it felt like this in Columbus the year before in 23 but every city is different

and Miami obviously Fort Lauderdale had their own flavor and it felt local to them and this is one of my favorite parts about MLS Cup being hosted by the team with a better record rather than it being a predetermined neutral location. You don't get this

at a neutral location or you get some sort of facsimile of it that isn't as authentic no matter how great the fans try and MLS isn't at a point where what was it 2012 the last time that it was a neutral field and it was in Toronto and it was terribly cold and neither

team was from the area. So I love the competitive aspect of Miami gets to host this game because they had the better record than Vancouver and you do it in front of your fans and it's just another way to make the regular season important. But for the fans, for the off the field stuff, for the authenticity around the game, I just think this is so much better than a neutral

site. A hundred percent. It is a necessary experience. I would argue one of my issues coming out of it and I don't know what you're experience was the first time I went and what I've learned more and more as I've gone to enter Miami games is like it is a truly South American inside the stadium experience and the way that that plays out to me the most interesting part is how knowledgeable most fans inside the

stadium are with the game day flow and music and chance and all of that that you see in a lot of South America and so when the supporter section starts getting the drums going most people sing and most people sing like long songs and you know classic soccer songs and a lot of them come from Argentina and I think that's the best part of the game day experience there plus the fact that because the stadium is a piece of metal that's falling apart you can hang on the everyone stomps on the ground every time messy goes to take a set piece and it gets pretty loud and is a pretty cool experience but in saying that I thought MLS as an entity coming in and taking over game day operations and building it out sort of crowded out a lot of that. And there was like these really cool moments where, you know,

if you go to an Inter-M Miami regular season game, they do the Massey, Massey, Massey, Chet, 14 times a game. It's maybe a little excessive. It happened maybe once. And that was because every time it started, all of a sudden some weird music is playing. And the white stripes are on. And you're like, what are we doing?

We're in Miami. Why is this happening? The post-games trophy lift took, I don't know, two and a half hours on top. of all of that but I just felt like there's these moments and I've said this a couple times you know we get asked all the time to do interviews and talk about the league and they're like what do you think needs to happen what needs to shift and one of my big things now is there was a 15 year period where the league structure as a league office had to be the strongest entity

because the teams were not professional enough to really run themselves at a high level and I would argue now that most of the teams are better experts at their market than the league office is And I think a lot of that stuff gets in the way of the league being at its best. What you just said, which is MLS Cup should always be a display of that fan base because the game day atmospheres and the fan bases are so good and so unique. And I'm getting texts from Inter Miami fans saying, I'm a season ticket holder. I can't get a ticket. My ticket's not in my section.

Like everything gets shifted around for this one game. And you could say, yeah, everyone does this. The Super Bowl does this. The NBA does this, whatever. Those leagues are 100 years old. and everyone already cares. Like, if you are selling something, part of what you should have been selling on Saturday

was that game day atmosphere to the world. Like, look how this is, and then to America, right? Big game on Fox, in between college football, like, whatever. Like, oh, you like watching Indiana and Ohio State fans sing and chant and whatever? Like, take a look at this. And not that it didn't happen, I just think the little ways that people got in the way of it were unnecessary. Let it roll, let it be its thing. And so I thought a lot of that was frustrating, but I'm glad you got to experience that whole, like, parking on the things.

My parents lived in Miami in the 1970s, 1980s. They used to go to the Orange Bowl, which is now low-de-po, which is the same thing because it's in a neighborhood. Like, there were families that used to, most of their income would come from parking on their front lawn game days throughout the year. And they would just charge 20 bucks and you'd leave your keys and they'd move the car. It's like a true Miami experience that Chase Stadium has. It is, we think, the last game that will ever happen at Chase Stadium, which is probably a good thing. Last MLS game.

This will be the home of MLS Next Pro. Oh, wow. Wow. So it goes from, and while I'm going to make some critiques of the stadium, overall, how fast they got the stadium up and available for use, and how it's not. what they want. Miami Freedom Park,

it's going to be a beautiful place. They're all talking about that. This is obviously going to, this was like an underqualified MLS stadium. It's going to be a vastly overqualified MLS Next Pro Stadium. And again, for all the things that I can joke about

and the little things that were annoying, how fast they got this up. And like, it didn't take away from the game yesterday. This stadium has already hosted some big, big games after Lino Messie has joined. So while it wasn't quite like being at one of the best stadiums in league

because it's not, it is still, on the macro view, impressive that they got it to where it is right now to be usable for an MLS Cup. I joke about this a lot with, like, Columbus, where it's like, we lived in a world where it would be a miracle for an MLS seemed to get a stadium, and Columbus owns two. Like, yeah, popping up a stadium is not easy, and having an actual stadium is not easy as Vancouver is experiencing right now. Let's go into the game a little bit.

Two teams come out, as you'd expect. It was a lot hotter than I expected for the game. So for anyone who's like, oh, it's just hot in Florida, about two, three weeks ago, the humidity went away post the rainy season, and it hadn't come back until this week. And it was humid and the sun was strong. And, of course, it being a 2.30 local kickoff didn't help at all as well. And I think that did kill a little bit of the energy out the gate. But I don't want to go blow by blow in this game because everyone watched MLS Cup, unless you want

to. The one thing I want to ask really quickly. So living in South Florida, are you just covered in a vat of sweat at all times? That's just existence? Sort of, but also it hadn't been like that. That's my point. It's like about two weeks. I haven't lived here very long.

I haven't done a full year here ever. And about two, three weeks ago, I was like, oh, now I get it. This is why everyone comes now. Like right now, today, it's cool and breezy and like maybe 70 degrees and no humidity. And you're like, yeah, this is the cool part. And that's why, like, we be texting me last week. And he was like, so it's really hot. And I hadn't been here in two weeks because I left for Thanksgiving.

I hadn't come back yet. And I was like, no, dude, don't be dramatic. Grow up. Like, get over. And then I landed, and I was like, what is happening? Coming from New York, too. It is 30 degrees with like a feels like of 22 this morning in Brick, New Jersey. I just like that Brick, New Jersey got shouted back in.

And I like that now I rep it to people. They're like, oh, you know, like, Mid Jersey, like I'm down the shore or whatever. And I'm like, oh, do you know Brick, New Jersey? Oh, of course I don't know, Brook New Jersey. What am I crazy? So now that's one of my legitimacy points that I get to use. It was, yeah, so no, I'm not normally like that. Also, most places, oh my God, most places in this area are kind of built.

They're basically like fairly indoor, like AC bumping type stuff. We did like the three things that weren't over the span of 12 hours. And yeah, I was dying through all of it, as I think Vancouver Whitecaps were for a little bit as well. I had a lot of thoughts on the game I'm sure everyone watched it and as I'm understanding what happened Own goal to start 1's here at halftime for Miami

Vancouver equalizes The triple post From Emmanuel Sabby Off the right, off the left pops out and then his rebound shot Into the post as Falcone Colons closes on him He had a Falcone game

Come on Tom He had a foul conony game When he got shoved by Brian White I was right there where that happened And I leapt because I was like, whoa, that was a huge hit because you just see his two feet are above White's head as he goes down on the ground. And then you see the replaying and you're like, Falcone to a team.

White is standing over him like with his like, it was classic. It was like he did everything but the little like a salient. Yeah, come on. What do you want for me? Come on, bro. That made it 1-1. Rodrigo DePaul, the goal after Messi picks Kubas's pocket to make it 2-1. I and they put the sealer on to make a 3-1

and into Miami lifted the trophy so overall I would say to me the opening 15, 20 minutes were defined by Messi I thought Messi dropped into pockets on either side of the center mids and just started playing these blind balls over the top and that's where Silvetti and Iendi have changed this team

because he doesn't need to wait for those runners and he knows that at worst they're putting pressure on a defender who's facing his own goal and you're talking about turnovers, free kicks, goal kicks throwings and attacking half. Like, and, and while Eddie Aracompo holds I-N-A-on for the goal and Messi helps create that chance early before the flick pass over the top, there was four or five chances, some called off, some not, where it was like, okay, there's a clear idea that there's space behind this

Vancouver line, and Messi doesn't, I mean, he probably knows where everyone is on the field, doesn't even pick up his head, he's going to start finding that. My overall thought on the game is Vancouver, over the 90s. minutes and like in the pace of play they were the better team but miami deserving champions because finals are one in moments one in loss in moments Miami came through in the moments which is something that is typical for a team that has lino messy is that when things come down to moments you have a significant edge andre's kubas has been one of the best players in mLS this season inexplicable uncharacteristic and a completely devastating mistake yeah he had probably five

six seconds before Messi was anywhere near closing him down because Messi was trying to counterpress he just wasn't near him at the start of that play he took several touches he had multiple passing options and he decided to try to dribble sideways that Messi jumped picks off plays the ball through and it's it's 2-1 this is three minutes or whatever after sabby hits both pose that was unlucky for Vancouver but what wasn't unlucky is the moment that kubas had and kubas had multiple moments like this in the Conca Cap Champions Cup final against Cruz Azul. They lost 5-0. He wasn't the only reason, but

he certainly was a reason that they didn't win that game. It is, I feel for him, it's unfortunate and people aren't, and this isn't even a white cap joke. This is just an M.S. is a long season joke. Andres Kubas in May

against FC Dallas, he could play 10 out of 10. There's not as many highs on that game as there is this, as there is the Cruz Azul game. He was excellent against San Diego, but what we're going to remember is that moment. And legacies and finals and trophies are determined by moments. And they didn't come up well enough there. Really quickly, though, on the savvy one, it's both posts. And then a third time, I really appreciated both head coaches speaking about this in the post game press conferences. I'm going to start with

Javier Mascherano. They were both super, you can see that there's a very clear respect between Maserano and Sorensen, which they both went out of their way to be respectful to the other. and say, hey, great, you know, all these nice things. And Magirano, in his opening statement in English, part of it is, like he said, you know, they were a very difficult team. He goes, quote, it was very lucky when the ball touched the two posts and didn't go in. It's the luck you need to beat champions. That's not him saying we didn't deserve to win.

That's him acknowledging something that you can't control no matter how hard you try. And Jessus Sorensen said something like that too. He goes, quote, it was very close to us scoring and it could have been different, but that is football. We have come out on top on different occasions with good friends. fortune and today we didn't and i think that's the story of the game moments and even the greatest of all time needs a little bit of luck so i agree with some of what you said the one thing that i came away from the game with and i think i'm in the minority on this is i was underwhelmed by vancouver's performance especially in the first half and to me it was less

about execution issues and more they i felt they played scared in their version of how they play. Interesting. Like, Vancouver is an outlier in my mind of their willingness to play through lines, to play direct, to attack, and I thought they played slow. I thought they held transition moments. I thought they played around the outside way too much. They played into Brian White's feet maybe once in the entire first half.

The second half starts, Brian White goes and finds Noah Allen and just puts them on his hip. I mean, we're talking about Patrick Ewing and his prime right now on the block. Like, that's that disadvantage. disadvantaged though and they never played through that they had one or two balls early to sabi over the top that were outside in runs and then that completely went away and i felt like kubas and burrhalter both kept dropping in between the centerbacks trying to find space on the side of the midfield and they never played into the teeth of intermiami and that's where you make them

stress good point one of intermiamy's biggest issues is not a lot of guys win tackles not a lot of guys actually put in the game, the winning tackle in that moment, even if they do even close them. Then you see in the second half, Sabi picks up the ball, floats by five guys and hits two posts. That was there the whole game. And that's where all of last week, I kept saying, Ahmed and Sabi are going to dominate their space, there's chances, take guys 1v1, go after the game.

And I thought Vancouver took themselves out of a lot of that. Interesting. The first half, they had one big chance created. They had three shots on target. We barely ever saw late runners coming into the play because they barely cut in off the wings. Eddie Ocampo didn't get high, take away the own goal and holding a guy on side. He was barely a part of the attack as one of the best attackers in the league and arguably the best attacking fullback besides Jordi Alba.

And I understand some of that pinned Alba and he was a little bit less dangerous. But I was let down by the way Vancouver came out in that first half. And I thought, like you said, even if they had more possession, the result was fair at half that Interimmy deserved to be up 1-0, then they woke up. Oh, my God. ...25 minutes of the second half.

You're like, oh, right. This is the team that went to a CCC final. This is a team that went to Mexico and won second legs. This is the team that already beat Inter Miami and his Canadian champions and all of that. And that's where they started to find the game.

And I think part of it is, I think Thomas Mueller is clearly carrying some injuries. And so he's not the best option to play through in a central area. But also, he doesn't really want to run past Brian White right now. No.

And so it just felt like an absence of anyone taking control of the game in a way that Vancouver had done all season. Yeah, I will give Miami's midfield the credit, some credit as well for forcing Burhalter to be trying to pick up the ball in channels. But to your point, the runners, that was something particularly in the first half, I noticed that even when they would get the ball in dangerous situations, Miami's defensive structure was very good. But Vancouver, it seemed like a lack of movement that I really haven't seen so much.

while they were still, but again, I still thought that they played well in the first half, but it was lacking that, like, extra edge. Second half, they completely blitzed them. On just a general tactical point, it was very clear that the instructions for the centerbacks from Miami was Falcone, when Mueller drops and goes into space, follow him. Don't let him pick up the ball and turn enough space. So he did really well, I think, at controlling or at least limiting Thomas Mueller best he could, and the injury probably helped the other side of that, too.

But the trade-off of that is you leave Noah Allen, Brian White, by themselves, on an absolute island. They didn't play the ball into White enough. That's how the first goal came from, and he gets the assist to Ali Ahmed. But Noah Allen, man, he deserves a lot of credit. I say this as a complete compliment. He has learned how to be a dickhead centerback, and that is so crucial because he's giving up size to a lot of center forwards. Brian White is one of the best physically dominant forwards in the league. He's got a bigger frame, but it's the way he moves.

It's what he does three seconds before he comes in a frame. I was watching them off the ball a lot. Noah Allen constantly shoving him, constantly, anytime Brian White tried to, even before he's about to post him up, because if Brian White posts you up and gets both arms behind so you can't do anything, you lost. So Noah Allen knows, I need to be an asshole all game.

He's shoving him, puts his elbow, his back like if Brian White takes a step back he's a swim move and just the entire time that was a constant battle that if Noah Allen let off like the goal that happened Brian White got the better room there if he let off that's where Vancouver was going to kill him and Noah Allen did well enough uh can you hear me so I can hear you know I wish you told me before my microphone wasn't on so I'm going to have you do another monologue and I'm going to leave and I'm going to come back. Your microphone has been on, your microphone's been on the whole time. Yeah, but it's

on my laptop microphone, not my actual microphone. Oh, it sounds fine. I think you sound great, David Goss. This is going to kill me for the rest of the day. This is going to drive me insane. Yeah, I agree with you. I think Noah Allen's ability to hang on and do just enough of the things he's not good at means that he can be out there to do the things he's great at. And there was a really cool moment after the game where the moment the final whistle blows, Falcone, Noah Allen,

and one or two of the other defenders all, like, had this group hug of like, we're a unit, and like, we did it. We made it through. There was a lot of weird moments after. Jordi Alba collapsed after the third goal. I don't know if you saw this. He just like collapses on the field. Yes, yes.

And I think it was just the emotion of it was his last game and they'd finally broken through. Because once Iynde scores the third goal, you kind of know it's over. And just to watch him and Bousquet's go through that experience of like, wow, this is their life. Like they're never going to play soccer again. It was really, really fascinating to see. One of the things I want to bring up, and it was brought up in the chat, and I agree, which is the substitutions for Vancouver, I think, were a huge game changer. So it seems like Ralph Pryso was struggling with a cramp, which was the reason he was brought off. That's correct?

Yes. Yes. God, the drop off. Now we know why Ralph Riso is playing centerback all season, which, by the way, Ralph Rousseau was really, really good in this game today, too, I want to say. Awesome in this game. I would argue it was the better of the two centerbacks. I thought Blackman struggled

a lot in possession and out of possession. And then Poupe comes in? That's our pronunciation on that. He's played four minutes. I'm not even going to make a poncho. He's played four minutes all season, and he had no business being on the field in this game. He couldn't close down. They couldn't win second

balls like one of Vancouver's big issues i think in this game was their lines got stretched in ways that we hadn't seen this year and anytime they went aggressive any ball that popped out they lost that first ball and so they weren't able to bring pressure back again and also Miami was not to get in transition moments because Vancouver wasn't tight enough and he was even worse and a lot of that they were really uncomfortable passing around the back him and blackman just both looked that they didn't want the ball the entire time in that second half and it changed the lot of lot of the spacing. But to me, one of the things is, why not put Ali Ahmed at left back and play Laborda at centerback at that point in the game? And I don't really care about

yellow cards. You need goals. You need chances. Ali Ahmed has played left back in MLS for over a year of his life. And he scores the goal and creates chances. And maybe he wasn't as good as I had hoped he'd be in this game. But if you're going to bring Ryan Gould or, uh, Jay Nelson on, like, you needed more in this game, not less. And it felt like that's where Vancouver bumped up against the wall. And I think that is the amount of games they played. I think that's the energy that they had left. And I think this is where we really saw the injuries and what all the issues they have in terms of player personnel coming to play,

which was they didn't have the depth to take another step. They didn't have a second tool in their back pocket. They didn't have another punch. You hoped Ryan Gould could be that. but like nothing else about the changes they made was like oh okay now vancouver is going to pick it up again and now they're going to attack it and i think over the last 10 minutes after ready to go to paul's goal they had zero chances they barely from the double post on they were in the attacking third maybe once for a 25 minutes and in the end it was just a couple hopeful long balls yeah exactly

this this the depth was like when ryan gold came on i was i was tweeting like oh my god like this is a season that he's uh essentially missed almost all of and he still has the chance to get back a moment here and vancouver being where they are even taking another step back being where they are in a season where rankle vessel lervis goes down with torn ACL midseason Pedro vete leaves midseason Ryan galled is a non-factor all season because of the injury Brian white played less than 2,000 MLS minutes yeah Tristan blackman picked up an injury i forget like i didn't vote him defender the year because of the minutes that he And I think he played 23 games.

Yeah. Yeah, something like, that's like a little bit over half. I'm trying to think, Adikoube, essentially been injured all season. Tate Johnson is in and out. Laborta had his suspensions or whatever. Like, Yohei Taco Oka was like the only person that started all this whole entire season, like off the top of my head right now. Like they had a couple others.

But for the most part, it wasn't guys having 30 starts in MLS and having seven of them. It was a constant scramble all season. and solving issues. They got to the point in this game in MLS Cup. So when Ali Ahmed goes out, when Ralph Preeto goes out, when Thomas Mueller is playing clearly with a knock or something, when Ryan Gould comes in and he's not Ryan Gould totally off the bench,

it was just like one thing too many. And yet still, while Miami were deserved winners, Vancouver very much could have been the deserved league. They could have been. It was not. it's just so so impressive that they've gotten to where they are and they're going to have some headaches in the offseason because a lot of dudes deserve new contracts.

Chief among them, I think, is going to be Tristan Blackwood after winning Defender of the Year. So they are going to have some headaches, but I trust this front office. I trust Jasper Sorensen to make it work. I trust a lot of things with this team. So there's going to be some headaches, but I can't say enough things about how impressed I was.

You mentioned for Kubas, how tough that moment is, Messi takes the ball off him. He slips Rodrigo DePaul in. It's not an easy finish at that point. It's a high level finish at speed to go to the far post for Rodrigo DePaul. And then the crowd just goes like nuts. He does it right in front of the supporter section. And he's just like, he is a showman.

He is miserable on referees. I think he's probably miserable to play against. That time he decks Sebastian Baralter, he straight up was like, it's time for me to deck you. Like, I had to do that to you now, and that's how it works. and Sabi and Don't take it personal Mueller after were like

What the hell And he literally is laughing about it He's like This was the time of the game I'm up to one Where I'm gonna blow a guy up And I'm like dude Respect it

Because that's how I play Where I was like I don't have a yellow card It's an 85th minute Let me see if I can grab one Oh dude And that's how it felt like DePaul handled that moment

But I think I put this on blue sky Like Messy picked four or five times To press And all four or five times It either created a goal or it threw a easy moment for Vancouver out the window where it's like, oh, we're just going to play out of the back quickly and then we'll get into the attack.

And then he puts pressure on Takayoka and now of a sudden the ball's out for a throw-in and Miami takes it over and once again. And it's like, yeah, he's the greatest player of all the time. He's a genius. He does all these unbelievable things. But in person watching it was just another example of like his soccer IQ, whatever his physical ability becomes, whatever it is right now versus what it was and whatever it becomes going forward like he's always going to be in games because he's got the best technique he's got the best

touch but his soccer IQ just allows him the map to field and make decisions that are always going to help his team it's we've obviously mentioned messy throughout the the scope of the game because he had the two assists and the third goal the first goal the opening goal he created uh he's not he doesn't get an assist for it because it was an own goal and where the action happened it was far far away they he dropped in invited the press dances around a few players plays the ball and behind Eddie Erro Campo holds the line, keeps that play on side, and then ends up with their own goal.

So Messi got two assists on the game, sent pretty much attributed to all three goals. Messi had six goals and nine assists in six playoff games. Nice. That is 15 goal contributions in six playoff games, which is supposed to be when you're playing the best of the best. Tadio Iende set a new record for postseason goals, and yes, they're playing more games because of the best of three,

but it still kind of averages out. But still, like, record-setting post seasons from a couple of these individuals and it all is centrally to messy. He was, in the first half, he kind of drifted in and out of the game. It wasn't like a classic messy dominated game. And then at the end of it, you go, oh, all three goals they scored was pretty much all through him.

Yeah, that tracks. And Rodrigo de Paul scoring the game-winning goal. There's something poetic about it because Rodrigo de Paul is not on a DP deal right now because they had to structure the deal to be alone with a purchase option, the same way that Thomas Mueller is in a much, much different situation, but there's a club, air quote, option for Thomas Mueller this winter,

the same way there's a club, air quote, option for Miami to pick up Rodriguez to Paul's purchase. That fee is around $17 million. I'm assuming he's going to be one of the very best paid players in MLS, and he scores the goal when he was being signed a lot of fans in MLS were like this is a farce, this is them getting around the rules,

it ends up being completely legal because of loopholes, but it ended up being a loophole and it's Rodriguez-to-Paul that scores the game winning goal. Yep. It helps to have extra talent on the field. It's one of the reasons

we have talked about expanding roster rules to allow for more talent for every single team as well as I think you hear most sporting executives say. it now, it's in their interest to have the best talent they possibly can in one specific way where maybe a business side person is like, well, do we have the extra $2 million to spend on that?

I'm not totally sure, but you see the talent on the field. You see, I think, again, with some of these MLS cups, we talk about strengths first week spots, felt like a game with a lack of weaknesses, even though I've sort of lamented for Miami's defending ability. like you're still talking about Ian Frey and Trudy Alba fullbacks and you go back through the years of MLS and it's like did that team really have 11 starting quality players in an MLS Cup did teams sneak in and did teams not so there is something

I think special about the matchup we saw the quality we saw it was chippy it was physical I love that I love that there was a lot of guys down often I would say there was no obvious big moment missed, but there was 15 moments where you're like, could that have been upgraded from a tackle to a yellow card, from a yellow card to a red card? Like, you were on the line a bunch of times,

and I think that showed how much these teams were putting into it and how much they cared and how close it really was. And I think the acknowledgement from both of them that it would be. Whoa. Was that a quick Black Friday buy for you? He's holding up a pro shirt for anyone listening to the podcast. Ref said a good game today. Oh, Saturday.

Why I keep saying today? Refed did a good game Saturday. It was chippy, and I'm glad that they weren't flashing yellow cards at all times. The Brian White one was unfortunate. You had to give a yell card, though. But that impacted how the way that he could play, because how physical he is. I thought he handled well, too, like, like Rodrigo DePaul and Mueller played really good defense on Rodriguez-Depal getting to the referee as best as he could.

But not being influenced by both more so Miami, but when there would be both teams complaining about stuff. games like this should be tense it should be chippy and I thought they did well well as I unmuted I was ready to cough tough it has been a long few days for sure I will I want to throw this out for Brian White

goals come from special moments quick passing quality of passing quality of shooting taking defenders out 1 v1 Brian White's half turn his ability to pin a center back and open up into the middle of the field and then lay it off for Ali Admit that's the elite moment of that goal and that's the way in which

he plays a position different than other guys but he's been one of the best center forwards in the league for a reason and those are the things he's so good at when he presses the way he closes the 50-50s he wins his ability to use his head like he does things a little differently but he does them at such a high level

and that was that moment he creates that goal it comes all from him and it's because he can physically just dominate other centerbacks other players and he opens up in the right space and then that causes the chaos because he's in the middle of the field, which was a credit to him. Didn't get maybe as many touches as he would have liked, and probably Vancouver would have liked.

Another shout out to Vancouver's traveling fans, as I said. Oh, yeah. Just crazy section inside the stadium. 2,000 people is what we're hearing. It's the furthest trip in Major League Soccer you possibly can take. So first of all, shout out to the fans. Shout out to the club. The club brought chartered flights for fans.

And that is awesome. I love that. And Vancouver, I've done this before, I believe. and it's one of the things that I hope that this is a constant. And the Red Bulls, I believe, did this last year with the Galaxy. Yes. I'm sure that there was something with LFC. So just because that I don't have this info on the top of my head,

I don't mean I'm not taking anything away from those clubs. But Vancouver doing this, particularly like you said, the furthest away trip that you can have at MLS, going from Vancouver to Miami or vice versa. I do hope that this is just the standard for all these clubs, that whatever tickets are allocated, that they fill every single one and they're able to help bring fans along. Yeah.

So we talked to Paul last week, who's better at this than us, of the big picture stuff. He literally wrote a book called Messy Effect. But Interm Miami wins their first MLS Cup. That's the story coming out of the day. Messi gets to lift the trophy alongside David Beckham. The whole team gets to do it. Sergio Bousquet and Jordi Alba, their final soccer games of their illustrious careers, is going to be winning MLS Cup.

And this team that has this project that's bumped up against some. some big moments and faltered in U.S. Open Cups in Concord Calf Champions situations. They got, of course, the League's Cup. They won a shield, but this feels like the biggest trophy they've lifted and the moment that they've all been geared for. What do you take away from this? What does this mean? It's huge.

First, I want to say, I believe this is like the 48th major trophy in Messi's career. And listen, we know we're almost Homer, so I'm going to be reasonable and objective about this. If you're putting it in the context, it's obviously not big. than Argentina winning the World Cup. But so probably the second most important of his career trophy that Messi, that Messi's won, right?

Right up there ahead of the Champions League. But there is something so special. Like, on a personal, I can't wait to see people to take it seriously. There is so many, like this was a really sweet one for these guys, because it's not just all of just winning Emma's Cup, right? And knowing that this is a pressure

and what you came for. Two of his best friends, Jordi Alba and Sergei Busskes, that was their last game. Louis Suarez, might have been his last game. He didn't come off the bench. And to go out with the people that you've been doing this with for two decades that you love

like family, that people who are family to you, getting to win a trophy with them, lifting the trophy with them, that makes it sweet. The other side of this is for him in Miami, like, he's going to be a co-owner when he retires. Like, this is his club. And this is something that, like, looking at the stadium, like, when he signed his contract extension and they did the press release photos from the, where this, you know, the new stadium is going to be.

This is legacy stuff. David Beckham, speaking of legacy stuff, David Beckham becomes the first person to win MLS Cup as a player. Then as an owner, he spoke with the athletics very own David Orson.

It's him, Kevin Durant on the list, right? Well, it's MLS Cup and... I know here. No NBA. But, like, that's cool, too. Like, even he was like, he was like, this is one of the,

like, the best days of my career. David Beckham. Yeah. He's done everything throughout his career. And that's the kind of legacy that Messi is hoping to have or hoping to leave on this league on this club and what it means for the club is if they lose that game all offseason

all of 2026 every day it's talking about why can't they get over the hump why couldn't they do this why can't they do this um and instead we're it's it's them it's them trying to defend a title i think the biggest moment in the history of this club maybe second biggest after messy debut is going to be opening the new stadium next year yes yes thing is minor league it like i said to people I had some people who came who weren't soccer fans who were like, hey, I got tickets. Like, what's it going to be? I'm like, I think it's going to be

one of the best soccer games we've ever seen. But like, don't text me and tell me like, hey, is this how, like, I, because I know the message coming. It's like, this kind of feels rickety. Like, yeah, it is rickety. So now they're going to come into a custom built building in what I would say is a better location because I can get there 15 minutes on the train.

Oh, and it is because this location's horrendous. You get the jokes of like Carson with L.A. and New Jersey with the Red Bulls like, this is, for people that live in Miami or particularly if you're a little bit south of Miami, it's brutal. For people that live in Fort Lauderdale, it's brutal because it's not actually near anything.

It is like literally, it's like the Meadowlands. Here's the airport. So to open the stadium with a pennant or whatever goes up and to debut the star in your first game in your new stadium, which is now we are here to stay. Because as much as you can say, the teams arrived and all this stuff until you have the building you are not here to stay

and once that happens that you couldn't have done it the same if you had lost this game so I think for the trajectory of the club winning this was as big as possible and afterwards I think you saw the emotion of what it meant to everyone especially the people who have been around the project for so long we had one of the organizers of the black herons with us on the kickback community show last week talked about being at the debut game and, you know, living through all of this up and down through COVID, what not. It was a huge moment for all of them and it was a big one. So, Tom, are we ready to move into some news now?

Have we put the bow on MLS Cup? I think we are. I think we are. I do want to reiterate this was a great final. And I do believe these were the best two teams in MLS from, you know, day one to the end. And like LFC, I think particularly after Sun arrived. And again, how how easily that game could have went the other way between Vancouver and LFC. For this final to end up as Miami, Vancouver, it was a great representation of the 20, 25 season that was, which

doesn't always happen because that's why we love playoffs or upsets that happened. And I thought this was an excellent MLS Cup final. And just in general, credit to both the teams. And this felt, this felt like a deserving representation of the season. The only thing I haven't seen is I haven't seen anything about a trophy celebration, a rally, a parade, whatever. I think my understanding, what, Don's going to do the MVP award tomorrow? I wonder who that's going to, yeah. Yeah, for sure. Which I think my guess has got thrown off because of the World Cup draw, because normally it's like a day or two before MLS Cup.

But I think that got, this is just me speculating from the outside because the commissioner was in D.C. and the World Cup draw, happened and they didn't no one was going to notice it so I think that's the part of why it got shoved back and probably because they were playing in the game I don't know if that will be in conjunction with some form of rally or whatnot I thought I saw the wording on the release say it was at Chase Stadium which I think would be unfortunate I would like to see it as somewhere like near the Kasea Center downtown whether or up in Florida L and Las Olas whatever it is like do it somewhere where people are you don't have to do it at this building because again is the worst location

and no one needs to be around that any more than they have to. All right, let's get into some news last show. We didn't have enough time to do the off news, so we're going to do that to start. Then we'll talk about some players and then we'll talk about the World Cup draw. Let's start with the most breaking news,

which is that Mark Dos Santos has been officially named as head coach of LAAFC. You put this report out there that he was the frontrunner, so we talked about it a bit. Anything different or change that you've seen or thought about since he's been made official? No, I think that this is a continuation of what LASC have been since Bob Bradley left.

Again, John Thornton is one of the very best sporting executives in the league. I think that front office with, again, Thornton, Neil McGinnis are the two people who run it, that their scouting network is very vast, particularly when they started this club. MLS clubs continue to try to one-up each other, but LFC still have a really strong scouting network. I say all of that to say is that is the foundation. is the foundation of the team more than like people I think are disappointed

because the hero of the FC they just signed son young men they've had Keelini they've had bail Denny Buong has been one of the best players in the league you go through he had they have Hugo Loris who they've agreed a new contract with so he will be staying at the club and maybe that created the expect to end there was some rumors that were incorrect about

Ange post the Calglu and it was like oh man maybe it'll be him what about Jose Marino when you know obviously before he'd better figure so people are just thrown out names and it created an expectation that was never reality. I would hear random stuff about Airquil big-name coaches,

throw them to sources, and it'd be like, there's just nothing in that. Or, hey, their agent called us, and that's exactly where it ended. So I think fans are disappointed at what the name is, but Mark Dos Santos,

he was here for Bob Bradley's first season, their inaugural season, then he becomes a Vancouver White Capset coach. He's come back as an assistant on a Trundolo. What this team is, starts from the front office and down, and the coaching staff, Marto Santos deserves another job in MLS as a head coach.

And I don't see any issue with this in any way. In fact, I think it's a good hire. And just because it wasn't a big name, that we're going to see exactly what we've seen from LFC since Toronto took over in the general sense. I hope that there's some tweaks to the game model. I hope that he's more adventurous and aggressive. But it was a false premise to start this thinking, like,

oh, why isn't it Jose Marino or Ange post-a-colo? Yeah, it is, this fits with everything. become LAFC's ethos. They don't go huge name for the sake of going huge name. They continue the train going forward and hiring Mark Dos Santos is the epitome of all of those decisions. So that's what they chose to go with. And that's kind of what we said when we heard when you reported it. It was like, okay, that makes sense. This is the model that they have followed every step of the way. And it's been successful for them. It has potentially limited their ceiling at times. there is no question that it has raised their floor.

They are in so many finals. They are contender every time because they keep things cohesive. There could be a bigger boom of, okay, well, we could be elite if we take this risk and we take this chance. But then the flip side is, if it goes wrong, the whole thing craters, and it all falls apart. And they seem to be unwilling to take that risk. And I think that's fair. Like, I think they've put together such a good team that the belief could be there. They got triple post against Vancouver.

who went to MLS cut. There's no reason for them to leave this season saying, we're not right there, and we only had son half the year, and what could we be capable of? And some of our younger players will get more experience and maybe fit a little bit better. And if Aaron Long's healthy and what to far I did coming on later in the year, and now we get the news that Hugo Lurice has extended his contract,

like there's every reason to say, I think most of us will have them probably top two in our preseason power rankings for the Western Conference going into it. I want to talk about one of the interesting, moves that did happen, which is Todd Donovan, long time, head soccer, whatever, CSO for Sacramento Republic, long time LA Galaxy player has as many MLS cups as anyone on the field. Five. Five. And past guest of this show when we previewed the Yeagermeister Cup a few months back that they made the final of, has been hired as the chief soccer officer for NYCFC to replace

David Lee, who left to go take over at Sporting Kansas City. Both of these moves are fairly unconventional. Yeah, Lee moving the way he did, and now Todd Donovan. And so this has been a fascinating one for me to watch from afar, Tom. Fascinating was the word I was going to use, and even without the context of- And even without the context of Dave said, like, you're right, it was not, it was more abnormal that going CSO to CSO at different clubs, like, without being fired, like, just kind of leaving doesn't happen all that much like Columbus is with Tim Best Bichenko I think we might be able to

see more of this in the future but so there is that side of it I'm fascinated by the process that NYCFC and with Todd Donovan I think Todd Donovan is very deserving and I am excited to see how he goes but let's just be real here MOS clubs generally look down at at USL they Troy Luzane was the head coach of the year whatever was 2019 2020 he had to leave to become an instant coach at the Red Bulls before he ended up getting a chance in this league. There were so many, like Danny Cruz is somebody whose name who's in these coaching searches. I never have hear about like front office people going from CSO to CSO. Like that's, so I didn't have this on my radar in any way for any of MLS club, much less

NYCFC of City Football Group. I just assumed it was going to be the chief scout at Palermo or Horon, right? And that would have been fine. And that like that's not. Which is what they've done on the academy level, by the way. They've like stayed internal, European, CFG, known people. Yeah, and I think it is smart. I think it is smarter that they went with somebody with MLS experience.

Pascal Jansen, excellent in his first season as head coach. You need to find a balance between the coaching staff and the front office. There has to be some requisite amount of longtime MLS knowledge and appreciation. I think you could go foreign or somebody who's not familiar with MLS. For one of those two, it can't be two. So yes, Pascal Jansen now has experience an MLS. but it's only a year. So going with a front office member,

and so they did this, like when David Lee took over for Claudio Raina, he had been at the club since literally day one, like in 2015, their first season and worked his way up. Yeah, and that was, I think, very important for the success of this team and why David Lee then gets the job with Kansas City. So Todd Donovan, this was, I was really surprised by, and I'm excited by the prospect.

A couple of things for people, if you don't pay attention as much to know, is, so Sacramento, perennial contender. They've been able to maintain a really high level, especially through some big coaching changes that they've gone through. And obviously, from the club point of view, Todd Donovan managed them through getting an MLS bid and then losing that MLS bid,

and then they end up in a U.S. Open Cup final is the first lower division team to do it in 10 plus years. They end up an Iager Meister Cup final. They've been a top three team in the West pretty consistently off and on. They are a club that has one of the best academies in the country.

not just in USL, and they push young players into their team. They create the space so that their coaches have to play young players. And they're playing 17 and 18-year-olds in big-time games, in big minutes, in positions of value. And that's with an academy that has been picked dry from every MLS team because they're technically an open space. And MLS teams come in and offer players this and that and this and that. and some of the best young players across MLS next are Sacramento Academy players. So in losing all that, they still push players into their first team because they've got a process, they've got a plan.

We talked with Todd about it on this show. That's something I could see appealing to NYCFC because that's who they want to be. So I think his experience in structure and what he has built clearly had a lot more value than the level at which maybe you'd consider it being done. And I think that's totally fine. If his process is right and he's good at what he does and he's thoughtful about the way he does it, I think if you're at NYCFC, you should say, well, we have the resources to help you figure out these million-dollar conversations you've never been in before. Or to figure out maybe some of the roster rules on the MLS side that you haven't worked in as an executive over the last few years because he did it as a player and then coming back.

So it has the potential to be really, really good. I hope it opens the door for more of this because there are good soccer people. in a lot more parts of the country than just MLS that I think could be really, really helpful to a lot of teams. And from the conversations I've had with him, I think he's going to be really good at this job. And for NYCFC, this was a bit of an odd unknown for me of like, okay, where do they go? Like, what's the future? Because similar to Thornton, like you mentioned how long Lee has been there, that's been

consistent. And I think a lot of the good things that's happened for NYCFC has been like, well, we always have this strong base. We build a good spine. and made some smart moves for Americans coming back, the Keaton Parks, the move for Andres-Praereer. Like, there are smart little moves in there that have kept them above water when they've been bad

to allow them to be great when they've been good. And I think Todd Donovan has the ability to keep them in a similar situation. You mentioned David Lee. So let's just real quick, do some Kansas City. Yeah, let's do it. That is a job opening as Kerry Zavagnan has officially left the club at the season as interim, yes.

He mutually left the club the same as Miller Light mutually leaves the bottle when you have it in your hand. Sporting Kansas City are down to three finalists of their coaching search sources have told me I've got one name it is Rafa Vicky the former Chicago fire manager the former Swiss International former Chivas USA player that's where he ended his career after he left Chicago he went to go work with BSE Young Boys where he won he won some trophies with the Swiss club he was also head coach of the USU 17 national team since leaving Chicago I do know that that he's had an eye on wherever his career takes him and he would like another shot in

MLS. That's something that motivates him because it didn't go great in Chicago. It didn't go that bad unless that I'm just the sands of time. I've eroded some of my memories there, but like they missed the player. He takes over December 2019. Bang, pandemic happens. Bang, you're working for literally the worst front office in the league and it's not close with Gay Orkites. And the team wasn't that good. They didn't make good signings. Well, he can't turn water to wine. What is he supposed to do with that team? And they were still okay. Um, the second year wasn't great. It was pretty bad, I should say. I shouldn't even say it wasn't great.

It was bad. But for me, I don't think that that was something that he could have completely controlled. And look at every other head coach this team has had in this era until Greg Berlter took over. Nobody was successful. So I would like to see him get another chance. He is one of the finalists for S.K.C. Yeah, I think the justice for him coming out of that is they were just as bad after he got let go than they were while he was there. So the full blame doesn't go towards him.

could he have done more probably have other people done more with equal or less yes but he's he's an interesting profile of a person like he he has this extensive history in europe on both sides as a player and as a manager was a national team player like i think carries gravitas when you're in a room with him like you know he is the manager like he again carries himself in that way speaks a bunch of languages because he's Swiss which is always helpful and then has that weird part of that. He's slightly played in this league, which is rare for guys like that. I mean, he played, what, a year?

Yeah, I think it was like nine appearances. He played more than Velko Ponovic, but he played less than, I can't think of another person. Marcelo Gallardo. Yeah, who casually, yeah, exactly, who casually stepped through the league. So it makes sense for a name where it's like, okay, can SKC get a little bit of what they want, which is I think they're a club that wants some MLS experience. But if you go international and it goes well. you can probably overshot shoot where you sit in the pecking order of like the best options probably

aren't going to SKC right now in terms of the MLS sphere. So if we were to name the three most likely candidates for any job and other teams had openings, SKC probably doesn't win that battle right now. So maybe this is a guy who can overperform for them and put them in a pretty good spot and obviously a huge signing for David Lee. Let's do another coaching and then we'll get into one more executive. Let's talk St. Louis on this one. St. Louis, they are, I believe, at a finalist, they are at a finalist stage, and I've got a handful of names that are currently in contention.

Former, or the current Columbus crew assistant, sorry, Joanne DeMay, former Atlanta United assistant and interim manager, Rob Valentino, former CF Montreal head coach, Laurent Coutois, L.AFC, assistant Ante Razoff, I don't know if he made it to the finalist, but I know that there has been conversations there, and St. Louis interim head coach, David Critchley, is one of the finalist. So we think about GM Corey Ray and his, like his connections. He brought Laurent Couttswa to Columbus as the second team head coach. He worked with Couttswa in Montreal. DeMay, obviously, he worked with him in Columbus. And then after he takes the job, he's around David Critchley and has done the analysis of the team, how they played under him.

So those are all the names. And Rob Valenzino, I don't know if there's a connection there, But I did know that what they are valuing is domestic MLS experience, less knowledge, all that, plus somebody with a clear and defined style to build around. And those are the two most important components for this head coaching search that, again, is at a final stage. This is so fascinating. This club is going to take a 180 from zero MLS experience in anywhere, no MLS experience really in the team, super foreign base player pool to we're going to go get Rob Valentino and Corey Ray and we're going

to build a completely new roster and set things up differently. My guess would be from afar that Lauren Cortois and DeMay are the two leaders in this one. They're both coaches that are really highly thought of. And as you said, Corey Ray has experience running teams that both of them have coached. So you know what you're getting. And I think Lauren Corto obviously was a little bit hands tied by in his back in Montreal because he didn't have the talent he wanted and we didn't have the executives around Corey, right?

The consistency that he would like to around the club to build what he'd like. And Yohan's amazed an interesting one just because what, he's been the youngest coach in MLS like three separate times because he's been an interim for FC Cincinnati over and over again. But from everything I've heard from everyone around the league, he was highly valued by Wilfred Nonsei as an assistant

and is very well connected to him. And so if you're trying to build something similar to what Columbus was able to build, he is an obvious candidate. And while he's very young, he has a bunch of experience around a lot of clubs and has big ideas of the way he wants teams to play. So if I heard that either of them got hired, I think if I'm a St. Louis fan, I'd be excited. You want cohesion through the entire from the front office to the coaching staff right now because you're trying to make a big leap really fast. You're trying to shift things pretty quickly. And this is the list you'd expect for St. Louis. Again, Olaf Melberg didn't go well.

You're probably not going to go overseas. And you are not the top of the list when it comes to MLS coaching candidate spots right now because of the way the club's been. And so you're not going to go in and get the heaviest hitters of heavy hitters. And so these are the names you'd expect. And I think a lot of them could do a really good job. It would be fascinating to see Rob Valentino get his own team and not be a rah-rah interim guy. What is what are his, what's his game model from day one in, you know, preseason and all that type of stuff.

We've got a question about Nonsei stuff in the chat. I forgot Columbus has an opening as well because Wolfrad Nonsei has gone over. He lost his first game as Celtic head coach. You would assume part of this process for St. Louis now is we probably have to, if Yon-Dame is the guy, he's definitely getting interviewed for the Columbus job as well. So now there's a bit of an arms race between the two clubs if that's where you want to lean. Yeah, DeMaye is in the mix for the Columbus job. I don't know exactly where they're at in this.

just reiterate what I've said on previous shows. It's not like they were taken by complete shock that Wolfordansi was a coach of interest for European clubs and Celtic ended up being the right opportunity for him. So they've definitely done some pre-work and planning. So hopefully they're able to do this in an efficient manner, but these things do take a little bit of time. Don't know exactly where they are,

but I do know that DeMay is somebody that's going to be under consideration for Columbus as well. Last one that we didn't get to hit last week that I just want to do real quick, which is that the official announcement came through that Garth Lagoe has stepped away. from the from atlanta united been let go from his role as president where he sat over both sporting and business decisions it on the field hasn't gone well in his time there and i know it's one that

we celebrated a lot everywhere that i worked uh when the move was made i think garthogway is one of the best executives we've ever had in major league soccer i think the proofs in the pudding the rsl teams he put together the seattle teams that he put together i'm still shocked that this didn't go better and we're hoping for the best for his health fully separate of any of this sporting conversation. I'm so really surprised how poorly this has gone. It felt like could he take what he did in Seattle and add $10 million to everything? And that's what they tried, but all the big money signings went poorly and it just tanked this team from the start over and over again. Yeah, it just feels hard to talk about the soccer around Girl Thalgaway right now. Again, he's going

under treatments for cancer. Garth is one of the most universally liked people around MLS. He is statistically one of the best sporting executives in this league's history. Again, things have not gone, hadn't gone well in Atlanta, but that doesn't change his legacy to me. And again, I just, all my heart goes out to him and his family about his treatments and just hope like hell that we get good news. And again, he's somebody who's got.

A lot, a lot of fans within MLS circles and the people who I respect the most, all of him. And Chris Henderson will step now pretty fully into that sporting director role. And obviously, Tata Martino taking over, Tata's not sitting around being told the players he's going to get. Tata is going to be fully involved as well. So that is now the brain trust of the sporting structure going forward. Listen, look at what we've seen. San Diego and expansion year are a little bit different. Philadelphia went from out of the playoffs to a shield win.

Vancouver has gone from an eternity of being at best mediocre to the second best team in the league and the second best team in the region. So jumps can happen fast. I will be curious to see how Atlanta decides what next year looks like and what they can put together and how much better they can get with the group they have, how much it has to change, and how much maybe Tata Martino can affect it just as an individual. Let's do a little player news and then we will do some. I was going to say, I can just run through all this. We've got a lot more stuff to talk about it. Not enough time to talk about it, so I can just monologue

and wherever you want to kind of pick it up. Boom, let's go. Most recent. Let me say this. So Stefan Cleveland is going to Sporting Kansas City. Sources have told me, Austin has traded them for a deal worth $50,000 game. And Cleveland has signed a new multi-year contract with Kansas City. Kansas City, I believe now we'll have 16, maybe 17 players on a contract.

They're going to be one of the most interesting teams to watch this offseason. Stefan Cleveland, good goalkeeper. I wonder if he'll have a chance to push John Polskamp for the starter. Polskamp was not good last year. He should. I think he's got talent, so I'm assuming it's going to be an open race there. On the trade market, it's been a little bit slow right now, but after MLS Cup, I think this week is going to really, really accelerate.

One name to watch on the trade market, Dato Valenzuela, FC Cincinnati homegrown, 21-year-old attacker. I think five or six teams that I know have in MLS have called about him, to Sinci. Sinci will be open to moving him for the right price. They want him to, again, if he's not going to play over Avander. And Pat Noonan hasn't showed much interest in front three of Danke, Avander, and Dada. So it makes sense for all for the right number if that's something that could happen.

Another name to watch on the trade market, I reported this a while ago, but reupping it right now. Daniel Elrim, and I know a lot of teams have called the Red Bulls about him. The Red Bulls have a glut of central midfielders, particularly after Bergen was signed in the summer. You still have Stroud there. Ronald Dankor, I thought, was quietly very good this year. So it makes sense, and he's somebody that could fit at other MLS teams, and he's a very good player. They have too many MLS starting level of Sutter Mids. It makes sense that there could be a trade. So that's another one.

I'm going to expect the market to keep going. I've reported a while ago Brian Vera to Rielsel Lake 1.5 million game. I don't think that one's been announced. The free agency starts on Wednesday. That's going to be really, really interesting. There is still no contract between Minnesota and Dane St. Clair as far as I understand. Nothing's been announced, and I don't believe that anything is quite there, but I'm going to be working on that info all day and everything going to Wednesday for some of these guys who, Christian Espinoza, I know Santos they wanted to keep them, be shocked if they were able to. A couple more. Alvaro Bariol, he's on loan at Santos.

Sources tell me that he will be staying there permanently. Laurel Failer first reported this, that this deal, that his purchase obligation was triggered due to performance-based objectives. sources have told me that that fee will be four million to Cincinnati for Avara Boreal who stays with Santos, who narrowly avoided relegation. Another trade at Land United will receive 500,000 gam for Noah Cobb. Noah Cobb was on loan at the Colorado Rapids. He will now stay there permanently. What I was told, poor sources, is that they were trying to wait for as many decisions as possible before they get a head coach.

What I'm told is that they are at the final stage of their head coach search, and there was alignment on Noah Cobb staying. the rapids are big fans of him but they didn't want to do this and then have a head coach come in and go well actually I don't really like him that much but there is alignment all the way there is there anything I miss

now I'm just scrolling through my own Twitter which is funny Brian Gutierrez Oh my gosh yes I forgot about that Chivas finalizing a deal to sign Brian Gutierrez from the Chicago fire for a few around $5 million I would have expected a little bit more That's still very good money

and hopefully that's a good move for Goody it hasn't quite worked out for some dual nationals going to Mexico Cade Cowell, though he did play a lot didn't quite work for him at Chivas Frankie Amaya Toluca is so good

he never really got a chance to break in there Frankie Amai ended up going back to M-West on loan so hopefully for Goody and Goody's career it'll work out a little bit better for him San Jose earthquakes finalizing a contract extension

with Chicho Arango I reported at some point over the last four or five days Chicho this comes when there was bids rejected from Pumas there was interest from Tijuana what I was told throughout that whole process that they they chicho most wanted to stay but if no new deal came then he then he would

leave timo verner we keep on getting asked about that in the comments last i was told about a week ago was um don't know where these reports are coming from he's not an option for us right now that doesn't you know we'll see how it's fluid seem to be more agent driven than reality based um and i think that's it on my end i think that's most of it um i'm excited to see the trade market here i think as i go through our depth charts which by the way are updated and I think the best resource to stay up to date and understand what's going on with teams and I find it fun to just scroll through and I look at every roster spot on every team and go who would I want to be a starter and anyone who's not a starter I'm like well where else could they land and where else could they end up.

Dato Valenzuela is one that would be at the top of that list. I've loved these games since the first time I saw him play on the academy ranks and Stephen Jimenez was sort of the big name for them and Valenzuela overtook him and was able to push into the first team. He's big and I think physical enough to hang at the MLS Pro level, but he's silky and he's skillful and that's the strong suit of his game. So can he find a place where it's a team maybe that spends a little less but is looking for some support in the attack and he could provide that. I don't know if it's an RSL. I don't know if it's a Houston, but one of those teams like that where you're floating around a playoff line and you're saying, well, this is sort of where we could get a little

more attacking, which means he gets some opportunity and gets some minutes. Let's do a little conversation around the World Cup draw before we get out of here. Let's do it. It's the biggest sporting event that's happened in North America. It will be. I think the draw was one of the biggest moments. We don't need to talk about the actual draw, because I don't think we have

any interest in discussing it any further. Anyone who joined us on the live draw show, we appreciate you being with us. Huge shout out to Eric Crackauer, Heath Pierce, and Claudia Pagan who managed through four plus hours with me. Big shout out to Ben Pagel, who sort of kept everything on the rails, kept everything going.

Kian as well, one of our favorites at Kickback, who helped me through a ton of stuff. Brandon as well, who edited 9,000 features that we ran. Shout out to what, Eliroo, Brianna Pinto, pitch invaders down in South Africa. I'm trying to think of the other interviews we did for all of that, but we had some really great people. Join us, Jaime Macias, one of my favorites right here in Miami as well. So Canada and the U.S., let's focus there for our fans and what we love in the this show. Let's talk Canada first, because I think a lot of people are talking U.S.

Canada will get a UEFA playoff winner at Toronto at home, of course, to start off the World Cup. The possibility that it could be Italy in Toronto, which is juicy and interesting. I texted my TFC group friends and was like Italy in Toronto, and they sent me the meme of the guy hitting the first domino, and it was signing Sebastian Jivenko in 2013, leading to hosting Italy in a World Cup game at Bimo Field 13 years later, and those are the dominoes that fall. They'll then play Qatar in Vancouver and Switzerland in Vancouver. I think it's as good a draw as Canada could have gotten in terms of I think Qatar is weak and that's three points.

And if you get three points, we've never seen a 4018 tournament. But when we've seen them at the youth ranks, 90% of teams that get three points go through. So like that's your bare minimum line. If you win a game or tie all three games, you are probably. going to the next round of the World Cup at worst case scenario, which for Canada would be the first time ever. And so from that point of view, I think it's a positive, but I also think these are all teams that don't really have a defined style and don't dominate games, and Canada does

and will. Interesting. And so if I'm Canada, I want to play teams that are going to choose, let me dictate, because now I can put my imprints on the game and let's be real. Jesse's going to go after it no matter what it is. So you might as well play against teams that are going to sit back and sort of absorb. before the draw jesse marsh spoke to the athletic and pretty much set out the expectations of barement like have to get out of the group no matter what the group is but we're not just showing up

to try to get the three like we desperately want to win the group because if we win we get to stay in canada for the knockout rounds and that is something that is very very important to this team for the country for the fans for everything else they would get to control that that destiny if they top the group this group is fascinating to me because it's it's the euro playoff is the pop four so that's a bit unlucky that that's italy's pathway so it could be a group of Canada Italy Qatar Switzerland everybody maybe not Qatar so three teams will be like Switzerland is got to be hell yeah we got drawn with the US Canada or Mexico those were the three teams that if you're in pot two that that's who you wanted to mean because the host nations are the

weakest of that pot A and Italy is probably saying awesome same thing for us so Italy and Switzerland are both going into this very happy and and hoping to win the group the same way Canada is I that's why like this isn't a group of death air quote but it's a group where there's a lot of different scenarios that this could play out so Canada Canada I think should be happy and they have every chance in the world but while we're saying this they're whatever the Swiss version and Italian version of soccer wise is and probably the guitarity as well are saying the same exact thing soccer vise I think is what they call it in in Switzerland so but when I went into the draw I had six teams as a void in pot two Switzerland wasn't one of them

and I had three teams for would be a dream draw in pot three and Qatar was one of them and one of them Scotland will have great support in Canada if they had ended up there because I think the Scottish communities in Toronto and Vancouver are as big as any around the world

and so in terms of that I don't think you can complain about this no matter what happens with that UEFA spot and if it's not Italy even better I had one Canadian friend saying I kind of hope it's not Italy because I want that first game to be about us from like a culture point of view, and if it's Italy, now it's sort of like a split vibe in the stadium

and all of that. But man, imagine three months of preview of Canada, Italy to open a World Cup in Toronto, like right next to a little Italy in Toronto, like, that's going to be huge and that's going to be awesome. Lorenzo and Senior come home. What an opportunity. I mean, Burn is going to be front row. Did he side anywhere? Blonde dredge just ripping a vape in the crowd, just letting it rock. he was billed for it to be a dignitary showing up later on for things a la everyone at the FIFA event over the last week plus and then obviously the distribution of those games Toronto did really well in terms of the quality of games coming to that city Germany Ivory Coast I believe is one of the games coming to that city like a really good setup for them and then as you said Vancouver will have that that knockout game that Canada will hope to be a part of then on the US side there was a moment during the draw show where I thought Cape Verde was the fourth team into the group, and I thought it was going to be Paraguay, Australia, and Cape Verde.

I've gone back and looked a little bit. I still don't really know. It's because every group needs to have a European opponent. Oh, because there would have to be three European teams then in a different group because of that. Correct. At that point of the draw, I think. No, no. So if, let's say instead of...

Oh, right, because you had to have 12 then, yeah, right. And then, sorry, I was thinking a second one. If they got Scotland in one of the other parts, then. that would have been Kimberd. So instead, the U.S. has to get a European opponent, which is still a note because of another UAFA playoff. We love a UAFA playoff in this neck of the woods. The U.S. gets Paraguay and Australia.

Two teams they just beat in Friendlies. Tom, it could have gone slightly better, but barely. Like, he can't feel better about a group stage of two teams you just beat. Yeah, dream draw for the U.S. for avoiding the best teams in the second pot and the third pot. And that's no disrespect to, like, Paraguay and Australia, again, doing the joke of the Paraguayan and Australian versions of Soccerweiser saying, hell yeah, we got the United States. There are no easy games at the World Cup, but there are harder games at the World Cup. And this, and particularly the familiarity with the opponents beyond just the like, oh, like that seems like a good draw.

It's like, oh, no, we literally just beat these teams in the last two windows. The Europe, I think in terms of the European playoff winners, this, I. I think Turkey is the best team that's available in all three. Like I'm saying in, so this is, Oh, you think they're the best team left in playoffs? I would rather play Italy than Turkey. I would say Denmark is the best team, but I would agree with you. I'd have Turkey right behind them, though.

Yeah, so like Turkey, I think that's fair. So many good players, man. And so this is another group. I think Turkey. And a team that smoked the U.S. a year ago? Yes. And that game ended up 2-1. It was not that close.

Was it 2-1? Yeah. Wow. You could have told me it was. It was four, no, I know that. You could have told me that both were. Yeah, me too. I thought this, but, so Turkey getting, like,

Turkey in the United States should be the favorites for this group. If, again, Turkey gets through, that there's a lot of ifs. And the other, the other possibility is the Kosovo, Romania, and Slovakia. Yeah. The three points has to come against Australia and Paraguay, right? And then the last game of the group stage would be against whoever wins the European playoff. And again, if the United States, if they top, this group, they will play a third place team in the round of 32 that they damn well better

be favored against, and then potentially Belgium in the round of 16. This draw, borderline could not have worked out much better for the United States. So now they have the expectations that come with it. You've got to win the group, got to get through, but particularly feel strongly, you've got to win the group because the past of the quarterfinals is wide open. Yeah, quarterfinals should be the expectation. That Belgium group, Belgium, Egypt, Iran, New Zealand might be the worst group at the World Cup. Yeah. So even if Belgium is having strong performance, of all the options there, you would,

of every pot one team, probably them in Germany or the two, you would take that are non-hosts. And if some reason Belgium slips up and someone else sneaks through and they make it all the way there, this is as good a scenario as you could get at that point in the tournament. The only fear for me, which is opposite of Canada, is I don't know that I know the U.S. is style right now, except under Pochitino, they've become much more competitive and hard to play against. And as you were in the building, that Paraguay friendly, it was like, well, we don't have a million ways to pick the lock. These guys don't care. They had the one goal where, you know, no one put pressure on the ball, deep ball to El Miron, gorgeous touch. That's the one goal. And then the

fight and whatever in the U.S. ends up winning. I say all that and saying, this is a dream matchup because these teams are not going to come out and beat you. But the U.S. has to figure out who they are over the next few months because they're going to have to impose the style on these games. And they have struggled in Concorda Calf Nation's League semifinals, in Concord Calf Gold Cups, to break down teams who are going to sit in on them, even if they have superior talent. And that's now the task that's been asked where there was the potential in a different group if you're against a Senegal or an Ivory Coast or you ended up with Japan or whatever of, well, actually, they might dictate the style a little bit more.

And that's going to be the test for Mariso Pochitino and his team. But it was a dream day. It was a cool weekend with all of this combined to be like, soccer's having this moment and we are really excited about all of it. And that's why we love doing this show and being here with you. We've got another show coming up. Tom mentioned the trade windows firing free agency opening. We'll be back on Thursday to talk about all of that with you.

Send us any of your questions or comments if we didn't hit them coming out of MLS Cup because we still got a lot to talk about in that game. And of course, we'll continue to cover the national teams, the World Cup and everything else. We've got a ton more content for you over on the kickback committee side of things. So thank you to you, Tom. Thank you to all of you in the chat, especially the ones who right after I responded the chat. Ask if I check the chat. And thank you to all of you listening via podcast. Apologies for any coughing or sneezing that you had to live through. And we'll talk to you again.

Very, very soon.