SoccerWise - Live From The GA Cup w/Calen Carr & MLSNP President Charles Altchek

Episode Date: April 15, 2025

A massive episode of Soccerwise for all of you live from THE Generation Adidas Cup. The premier youth soccer tournament is one of David's favorite events of the year and he gets to share it with Partner In Soccerwise Calen Carr. They chat about all Calen has experienced in Florida so far, some of the best young prospects & his favorite MLS moments so far (and of course field notes!) Then David sits down with the head honcho of MLS Next Pro Charles Altchek to talk about the process of advancing youth development, added divisions in MLS Next Pro, expansion and much more.10:30 Top GA Cup Prospects So Far23:55 Calen's Field Notes Series (https://www.instagram.com/p/DGg0dY9xCgk/?hl=en)38:33 Charles Altchek On MLS Next Pro Soccerwise Live 2pm ET Every Tuesday/Wednesday/Thursday on Youtube/Twitch/Twitter

It's SoccerWise debut, is that correct? Absolutely. This is the first time, a long time listener of course. I feel like I'm well represented by Mr. Bogert. Mr. Scoops has done a fantastic job, of course not just in the drafts, but just week to week grinding out results, continuing to push us forward. yeah it's awesome to be here and I flew to Florida to do this well that's the headline I'm in your hood now at G8 Cup of course as well but that's the big mainly this is a soccer wise is a home turf to be clear I had to drive like four and a half hours to get here I brought I probably traveled

more than you did to get here. So thank you though for saying that because you know Andrew Wiebe comes to Miami, doesn't check in. You came to Miami. I did. I did during the rookie symposium. I have to apologize but I knew this moment was going to come. You wanted to save it for all of it together which was not just soccer wise but my pride and joy GA Cup. I was expecting to see, I haven't seen the trophy yet, so I'm expecting to see the David Goss. It's an Alfred Hitchcock of me. Autograph on the bottom of it.

The Gosse Sau is what we call it, the big Goss. Well, you did make an appearance on the broadcast today. I did. This is our first time broadcasting together. That was big. Is that true? Yeah. Wow, I wouldn't have thought of that.

Well, this is my first GA Cup. No, I know, and this is all I do. No, this is the only time I roll it out is for GACup. You are on all the games. I am not here. I'm just here right now doing a couple of interviews. You'll hear some of those interviews over the course of the week, as well as later in this episode, we're going to have the president of MLS next pro Charles Olczek. Um, I like to have people who interact with high wealth net individuals on the same show.

So Kaylen and Charles onto the same show. I interviewed him at GA Cup, talked a lot about youth development, the expansion of MLS Next Pro, the future of the league, the future of soccer in America and all of that. So we'll have that coming up. But you are here calling every game. You are living the dream. Not every game, but a lot of them. Tell you've done five games a day for 10 straight days. You've not the dream. Not every game, but a lot of them. Until you've done five games a day for 10 straight days,

you've not been there. We're just barely, by the way, to timestamp this, I think, out of the knockout round right now, into the knockout, or into the knockout rounds, rather. You're done with the group stage. Yeah, done with the group stage. And it has been a ride already. I've been gone from U16s to U18s, double days.

I feel like I'm back in preseason, particularly because this is where I would come to do it in Bradenton. So it's funny. This is the, I think, the prettier side. I'm staying in Sarasota. It's fancy. Yeah. And also the infrastructure and all that, the audience, the crowds.

It's a little different. It's a little bit different. It is absolutely absurd. I just had a conversation, I think it was with Jale. It's a little bit different. It is absolutely absurd. I just had a conversation, I think it was with Jaleel Anibaba, another legend, and he was saying like, they have better masseuses on the academy team than we had at the pro level. What's a masseuse?

Yeah, it is wild, how far, and like from a youth soccer tournament point of view of like, we played in tournaments. Yeah. It was fun. Yeah. And did not have any of this. No, I mean, I was thinking about my 16-year-old self and been like, if I scored a banger in this tournament,

you know I'm going right back to the hotel. I'm turning on YouTube. I'm clipping that. I'm putting it out. I didn't even have Instagram, nothing. Right. Especially if you did it against Palmaras or Inter Milan.

All on a broadcast. I was going viral in my mind back in the day. But there was nobody watching. And that's the other component of it. I remember playing youth soccer and I had a good club team. Chris Wandelowski. Heard of him. Who was here yesterday.

I watched the second half of San Jose playing against I believe of Santos Laguna. I think they lost that one two to one, but I got to catch up with Wando. And I was thinking back about him and I going to NorCal State Tournament. Neither of us made the ODP teams or anything like that. And we were always kind of imagining that a coach or

a scout would be watching. Now he is a coach Gonzalo Cigarres another former teammate of mine is U17 national team coach I've been talking to him about players. Boneyak Garcia I just did Houston against Palmaras. The legend. El Presidente Boneyak was you know on the staff coaching and Jeff Larenowicz so many you know legends in MLS that have been a part of the game that are now around. And that was the component that was most exciting for me, frankly, was I knew there was gonna be really good talent.

I knew there was the international component of so many top teams and storied clubs from around the world coming here. But then for me to see so many former players around and being a part of scouting and what that would feel like to be playing if you're Houston and the u-17 men's national team coach is watching you play and You know so many different Opportunities agent scouts media. There is a part of that. That's like how do you handle that? Yeah, the mental side of it that as a 16 year old I think would be difficult to navigate

Yeah, but also a part of, I think that's an important part of player development. It's like wild when I watch a GM that I'm like oh that's the GM of this professional sports team walk by and like give a fist bump to a 16 year old kid who's like just playing on his youth team and you're like oh that could be his future boss that technically is the person you're looking like that's such a weird dynamic that we didn't deal with but like is as said, like so tough for kids. And that's part of all of this is like putting them in pressure so they learn how to deal with pressure.

So you deal with it better. But it is like fairly immense on a lot of these kids. Yeah, but they're not far off and from actual being on Apple TV or. So that's different where I remember that being my rookie year. I think the first game I ever played in MLS was off the bench the last 10 minutes. It was the big home opener for Dallas against Chicago Fire. Shout out to the Brimstone Cup. The realest soccer wise crew will feel that. But RIP to the heat. crew will feel that but RIP to the heat. It was on it was on ABC and I remember thinking during the match oh snap this is on ABC national TV and like that's a

part that I hadn't really developed as far as somebody watching it by that point I'd been around scouts and I'd been around you know professional environments I trained with the galaxy I trained at Arsenal I'd been around you know professional environments. I trained with the galaxy. I trained at arsenal I'd been I could play but it was that extra component Nicholas Bender. That's right the legend knew you could play I mean if you can survive my week with Nicholas that's gonna be the undock Yeah, the unauthorized documentary at some point, but But yeah, I think that that's a new piece of it I think is, I think pretty normal for these guys at this point. Obviously everyone's been thinking the whole time.

You mentioned Boniak. Are the twins in the academy? I was like, just bring them off the bench. They were down a goal against Balmeras. You need a goal. I think there's a lot of substitutions now. Twins, two for one, put them in. Like throw cautions. No, I think they're still a little young for that. But two for one put them in like throw it throw the caution sit now

I think they're still a little young for that But I did ask about them boney act and I see them scoring goals on Instagram. Oh, so it's Instagram real still yes Okay, yeah, so the hope still lingers. Oh, there's time. Yeah, the US and Honduras can fight over absolutely dual national He said he was Olympia right yeah, Olympia, and I think he said they was Olympia right? Yeah Olympia. I think he said they're both fans of the other team. Oh really? That's what I had been told very recent or not very recently at some point that they were like oh we like I can't remember Real España I don't know who else the other team is. Yeah. Maybe probably in like your dad likes this thing so you like this. Yeah that's tough I hope they don't turn on the dynamo then that

would be tough I can take it. Yeah they that's tough. I hope they don't turn on the dynamo then. That would be tough. I couldn't take it. Yeah, they might end up being FC Dallas fans. That would be tough on everyone involved. Let's talk a little bit about the experience you've had so far and what you've seen. From a soccer point of view, this is your first time. And so I think for me, it's like I'm used to it a bit. But watching the game play out and watching this level

and enough of these games, what have you seen, what have you felt? The standard has been really high. I didn't know what to expect. I've done a mixture of the U16s and the U18s. To me, I at least just on a small span, the U16s have been a little bit more interesting for me. And I've seen some 14-year-olds playing up in that division. And some that actually have gone playing with U18s, but actually are deciding teams prioritize.

They want to go with the U16s, but they're strongest foot forward. A few that stood out to me, PSV was my first game that I did. That's a pretty good one. Yeah, they had a couple guys the Sky Appia who's a little winger technical scored a really nice goal and then there's a guy Ezekiel Amaga who is 14 he's a big boy but he didn't really play using his size he was just so smooth on the ball and it was pretty casual it didn't seem over odd at, but then a few things where he just

took off and kind of broke lines with the ball at his feet and you're like, oh, that's why he's on the Netherlands Youth International team. But I think that's a different component of if you're an MLS team, and I think that was DC United, you don't get exposed to that much, even in the course of your season playing in MLS Next and I think that's part of the development too piece that you need to get exposed to where the first time that I really really faced in a real tournament format or anything serious was when I went to Brazil when I was 16 on my own and I just had to have my mom ask a family friend who was Brazilian

can I crash with you? I went and stayed in Rio for three weeks by myself. The woman I was staying with who was a cousin of the guy my mom knew left, she was like 27 and left for like four or five days at a time and would leave some food in the fridge and I was having to commute on my own to the Zico Futurball Academy. Wow. And it was an awesome experience, a humbling one because I realized like oh I might be good in Berkeley or Northern California but

there's a bigger world out there and if I really want to make this and I didn't even know what that really meant at the time I knew that I had to step my game up and develop some things and I did partly there but it was also you know a part of that where when I went to MLS, Conqueaf Champions Cup, those were some of the more difficult moments where you're playing in Panama, you're playing in Mexico and the style is different and all of a sudden you're like well why are the referees against us or why is this player going down this way or and you're like oh no that's clever right and if you haven't really been exposed to that

much it becomes difficult where now I see here at GA Cup you play against Leicester City you play against PSV you play against Palmares maybe in the same tournament and you have to adapt and how do you keep your own way about it and your own philosophy but also understand like hey you know the game for this 15 minutes might be on their terms and how do you deal with that. Some other players that stood out to me just going through like Kervon Kerr from Toronto FC. He's Deandre Kerr's younger brother and Toronto had... We love a brother in Canada. Yeah I mean mean he was so many siblings in TFC's Academy. Well, you know, I'm always looking for I spend a lot of time in your country. The six Canada represent and the home of Top Chef.

I would like that to be put out there too, because I'm a Top Chef fan. Yeah, well, he he scored like him. He's been scoring goals for fun just in the research that I've been doing leading up to. I hadn't seen him play live, but just the ease at which he moved in transition, scored a really good goal, Toronto FC ended up losing that game. But that stood out to me as like, oh, there's a pipeline. And he also, for me, the way Toronto played

reminded me of their first team. They had like a little inverted left-footed player on the right who was kind of doing some Bernadeski things. Same hair? Did not have the rows, fortunately for everybody involved. Kids shouldn't. LAFC had a kid, Horiki, who was in the U16s, who also was direct, dribbled one-on-one. I'm always kind of looking for one type of player you might be able to tell. Yeah, you like like a stay-at-home six that sort of controls the game.

Oh, Of course. No, I just like, I think that the one critique that I would say I have but also is pretty consistent from a lot of people that I've spoken with is, yes, we've advanced a lot, but as you advance as a soccer culture and, you know, on the field, these players, you talk to some of the young guys, and I do this the rookie symposium every year and they can speak about the game in ways that are well beyond their years they know when the ball comes into the eight or that how the six is gonna bounce it back to him and then you go out to the other you get out the other side or the six drops in and they can

talk about the game in ways that is really advanced, but also sometimes feels a little programmatic. And you want to have creativity in the game. And so I love when I see some of these young guys within this context even of the pressure. It's competitive, obviously you're trying to win a trophy, but also are still going to express themselves. And there's been a few guys, one other kid from RSL Hashimoto I saw that clip going around my commentary didn't make it. Matt Doyle put it out. Doyle put it out? So you knew it was a big deal.

That's how you know it's legit. Then RSL thanked me for putting it out. Did they? They thought I did it because me and Doyle get confused and that sucked. You're getting credit. you're getting credit. It's a community. Normally you don't want, you don't want to be associated, you, it's very rare that you get positive for being confused. The Iguayin brothers. Yeah, for sure. Yeah, you didn't know people was in the building? Yeah, and then I haven't seen all the teams yet. The other team I've been wanting to watch more is the Philly U18s. I saw a half of theirs yesterday.

The center of the ballpark. Why can't I remember his name right now? It's a Bosnian last name. Oh yeah. Yeah, there was two strikers up top actually and then a little eight behind them. But that was the thing that stood out to me about them was it looked like a Philly team. The two strikers, the one guy underneath, their even the right back was like combative, getting forward, like the personality of the group was there.

I think this was the same group that had Olney and Kevin Sullivan and that group. And I was scary to think of what that would look like with all of them together. But I think I'm going to see them as we advance into the knockout rounds. Orlando City also, I think probably one of the top teams KK Spivey on San Jose I had to go watch Wando and say what's up and I was like oh what's up with the Bay Area kids and he had some nice moments as an 8 in the midfield and so I think you know some of these guys are gonna see soon in MLS and it's cool to say okay I saw them and I know you you had that

because I asked you who are some of the names that sit out to you in the past as your GA Cup experiences or you said okay well this was the sort of the breakthrough moment for them. Yeah, Weston McKinney was the one I brought up when we talked on the broadcast which is like always weird to me of like look where he's ascended to and I don't even know if you told me then I don't even know I would have thought any American could ascend to that of like, look where he's ascended to. And I don't even know if you told me then, I don't even know I would have thought any American could ascend to that, right? Like playing for Juventus would be like mind blowing,

starting for Juventus. Yeah. And then obviously the NYCFC team, Joe Scali and Gio Reyna together, where it was like, I think, I think they're all good, but I can't think all of them are good. And then you look back on some of these teams, you're like, oh, five pros came out of that group.

Like someone had watched you and Wando and like, oh, I think all these kids are good, but you can't think all of them are good. And then you look back on some of these teams, you're like, oh, five pros came out of that group. Like, someone had watched you and Wando, and like, oh, I think all these kids are good, but you can't pick all of them. There are some teams like that where you're like, oh, these guys are like really impressive beyond their years, like pressure. I mean, Geo was playing up age groups. So he was winning championships at this,

playing up an age group in ways that other Americans had never even won. And you're like, okay, well, the formula here feels pretty obvious that he's really special, where he ends up playing professionally now, I don't know. That's what we'll do on Soccer Wise, is figure out where Gio Rini should play. I think that's the job of all podcasts.

I think that it's literally all we're fueled on. Those are like the two that stick out. The one moment, I think I've told this story before, is Lucha Gonzalez gave a presentation about like they did were doing positional things the coaches on off days at GI Cup back in the day they had Luchi give a presentation about the number 10 pox and pomecul was his 10 and Paxton went to the end line. It was tying his shoe during a throw-in and then as everyone looked away He stood up they threw it into him He like breaks into the box and puts a cross in. And it didn't score, so it doesn't really

make the highlight reel. But then Luchi brought it up and showed it. And I was like, that's crazy. But the one funny one that now I remember back when we're talking about this is in that same positional thing, someone did a presentation about Sean Zawadzki as a six. And he ended up making Pro like 10 years later. He still went to Georgetown the full time and then ended up making pro like 10 years later. Like he still went to Georgetown the full time,

and then ended up figuring it out. I think Javi wants to talk to me. What's up? Okay. And like that's a funny part of this too, is like not every, and look at Seattle. Like look at Paul Rothrock and Jackson Reagan. Not all of them are gonna be pros in three years.

And some of them might end up being national team players still, which is something we still need to have space for, which I think matters. You talk about the personality, I'm going to put you on the spot now. You talk about the personality, and you talk about your experience in Brazil. Yeah.

I talk to a decent amount of people here who are of, let's just call it your generation. And I think there's a feeling that it's, while it's still difficult, it's so straightforward for these players or tracked that maybe they lose some of the personality which follows them into the pros. And then I think people talk about the issues with the national team coming from either you didn't have to find your own track and battle through those things and live in that house in Brazil by yourself and figure out that trip,

or and then you don't have that personality on the field. Do you worry about that or do you see any of that in the way you see the game right here versus what you grew up in? I think you have to be careful here. You're leading me down a dangerous road where I'm gonna be like Isaiah Thomas ranting about LeBron with his shirt off warm-ups.

There was a moment where I sort of flashed into that where I saw a kid warming up with one air pod in his ear and I was like, the team was already bumping some good music and I was like, oh, you just want to hear something different? Take over the aux, but also it's warm-up. Anyways, I held off from that moment. I regrouped yeah and I'm not gonna go down that road again did 10 push-ups old man I was like Pat on stack give me a like give me a bear hug bro no it was uh I think there's a part of it that there is something to the the sentiment of like I remember having been playing when nobody was watching where I was dreaming of that.

And then I remember that Ziggy Schmidt brought me in to train with the Galaxy with Kai Kamara and rest in peace to Ziggy. And I remember like the first day Landon was there, Kobe Jones was there, Joseph and Guenya gave me a pair of Nike boots. And I was like, wow, this is amazing. But I remember, and this will come across as sacrilege considering what would happen in my career, but I remember them laying out the Galaxy training gear and being like, can I put that on?

I'm gonna put that on to train today. Because we'd been training on the complex at Home Depot Center at the time, but with the Orange County Blue Stars, with Sasha Clutchton and his brother Gordon and- Basically, Des Moines Menace. Yeah, the whole Des Moines Menace squad, which I have, I wasn't invited, but I, you know-

You want to? No, I have retired- You want to play in that SPT2 weather? Too many times to do that. But I think there is something of like, how do you keep that hunger when you already kind of have everything as far as the, but you also need those things to develop.

So I think that's the challenge more for clubs to try to manufacture that hunger. But some of it also comes from the players. And I even, when I watch some of these guys where maybe I talk to a scout and it's like, hey, keep an eye out for this guy before the game. And when the game's not going well, how do you respond? How do you get involved?

How do you stay active mentally? And like you said, it's not linear. We've seen a lot of guys even, you know, go onto the national team, have success, fall down, up again. And I think it's the ones that continue to stick through it. I mean, Chris Wandelowski is probably the best story of that in MLS history, of having to wait for so long

and wait and wait and wait. Well, at least Wandel never had the downs because he never had the ups until it finally got his spot. When you score, he was scoring the same amount of goals in the reserve league. I was playing against him and he was banging him in. And he's still not getting his opportunities. And then he scored goals when he got minutes.

Still wasn't going to. Now granted, it was like Chingy and DeRosario up top and not easy 11 to get into. Also, shout out again to Joseph Nguyen. Oh, yeah. To Joe was the, I'll never, I'll always be indebted to him. And I tried to pay it forward a few times when I had the opportunity.

To Zimbabwean internationals? If I had any coming through. I want to talk to you a little about MLS in general. I think one of the things that we just were talking about was there's a poster of Julian Hall on the clubhouse that they have for the players. So one, he's what, 17? Yep. So he's the hero for the kids who are also 17.

Johnny Schor also posted up there. Which is like so funny, but I will say I've been here in past years, especially, so last year obviously Kevin Sullivan, like the other kids were taking photos of him and it's like they're older than him, which is just an absurd concept by itself. And then in years when there's been like big CONCACAF U-17 World Cup qualifying, you see like the u-15 kids like taking pictures of the kids they saw on TV and go that kid That's the kid. Yeah, I fast do and you're like, mmm Yeah, it's not a big deal, but it's cool. I think that's clever though from Adidas where yeah, of course You know, I'm looking at a poster here of Leon Almec. See over your shoulder and it's like that is aspirational

No doubt about it but it's almost so far out of reach that you can't even really conceptualize it and it's almost more impactful when there's proximity you have Julian Hall who's playing here or Johnny Shore is playing here on these same pitches. Hall was here last year. Yeah and now you see him with the first team and you know that that's a piece for me where they're doing an MLS Next Pro Game tomorrow night here and that's the next step right for most of these players if they want to get to a first team it's like you mentioned Sawatsky, you mentioned there's a Jason Russell Rowe like these guys have gone all the way through this pathway and so sometimes like I hope

that they're showing up to the next pro game to watch. And I was kind of like, hey, yesterday, I was like, hey, we got to get MLS on one of the TVs here. So when you're not playing, you're watching. And so I think that's kind of the next step, too, where you can watch these things. And it can be close to you. But yeah, I mean, it's funny because it's

not crazy to think of like a Julian Hall or Johnny Shore emerging I think Julian Hall is like there's not many 17 year olds playing first team football like regularly in the world yeah it's just not happening yeah especially from a striker position and he's doing well still like he's with the Red Bull to scoring goals important goals and So I got to know him a little bit. I spent some time with him calling matches Do I get to do it do it plug it baby? You can you do it for me?

Yeah So if you want to know more about Julian Hall But you also want to feel cool and you want to have an enjoyable experience because you like watching high-level, high-quality produced, edited art around the game of soccer. You should follow Kaelin Carr on Instagram because it's the only way to find it, right? That's right. I don't exist anywhere else. And he's been, he put together, is it the two so far? Yeah, two.

You're cooking three? We're cooking. We're in the lab. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I could feel, I could feel a little bit of a boil over there. Called Field Notes that Kaelin's put together, one in Atlanta and one in New York. Combining his experience as a broadcaster, a little bit storytelling with the team, the city. They're phenomenally done. If you ever watched the movement in the past, it's a similar feel.

That's what Kaelin worked on back in the day. But this is a little bit more social media friendly, it feels like. Yeah, yeah. A little bit of social media friendly. It feels like yeah. Yeah, well, it's a tighter cut what's a one-man band, so it's just rip and run grab a Camera hit up jewels after a game and be like hey, man. You free during this week. Can we hang? Can you take me through the neighborhood and now I appreciate it, man

That's why I pay the big bucks to get the promos on on soccer wise but yeah, I think that's a part of it is like, you and I get to see firsthand, like these experiences of being behind the scenes and being at games and seeing the next generation of talent. But yeah, just trying to get creative and having some fun with this so far. It is obviously, as you said, like we're lucky to travel to all these cities, see all these things. I mean, just watching yours about Atlanta, I haven't been to a game in Atlanta because I haven't been very good since pre-COVID.

Yeah. But for the three years before COVID, when they were in the league, I thought it was the coolest thing in the world to go to an Atlanta United game. And like, I felt that, and I felt it when I watched your thing of like the way the subway, the Mark 10,

what it means to the community and the soccer, you know, underneath the fields, and then the city culture and vibe that's been mixed into MLS, it's like, oh right, this is why this is awesome. Yeah, no, absolutely. What's been one of the bigger storylines that have surprised you so far this season in MLS?

Or maybe not surprised. You're asking me questions? What are you hosting then? Flipping this around, man. Whoa, I think Vancouver's an obvious one. Ah, yeah. Because I was trying to figure out today what interviews to line up and what to talk about

and what to look at. And it's like, I mean, we're in a group chat in which there is some emotional love being expressed for Wilfred Nansay that feels borderline unhealthy. And yet Jesper Sorensen or Mike E. Vars might be coach of the year this year. And I think a lot of what you talked about with playing a foreign team here, learning how to, I feel when I watch Vancouver. I'm like Vancouver is playing their game in both settings,

both in MLS and outside of MLS. In a way we, I think I've only seen Toronto do in that 2016-17 run, Seattle do in the win. And you could say LAFC in the COVID year, but it was a bit different because of bubble, of like the pure belief and understanding of how what you do at your best fits in with what they can do, what a League MX team is going to do against you,

and then to be able to execute at a high level, especially on the road is like absurd. Yeah, I think they have 10 different goal scores so far on MLS, and everybody was lauding the diversity in the attack and then Brian White was like, oh, well, let's hold it up a little bit. New Jersey Mario Gomez is in that. Yeah, no, there's still a nine here.

But I think you're right. And I think in some ways it means more to see Vancouver do it. There's been a few stories of like, I remember Montreal, your home city or whatever. One of my 14 home cities. Their run was was was special in the past and I remember Salt Lake before that and kind of my era of MLS and but I think there's something more where when it's not LAFC when it's not Miami when it's not LAFC, when it's not Miami, when it's not Columbus, who

sort of in that upper echelon clearly, but it's Vancouver. I should say, by the way, Columbus played that soccer last year too. They did, yeah. They played their game. Yeah, Wilfred Nancy was bold as usual, which I love. But I think my buddy, I have a friend who's a Raiados supporter in Mexico, and I was texting him today because I did their U18s earlier today. But they were pissed because it was Vancouver.

Yeah. They're like, we're one of the big clubs here. We have all the money. We can't lose. I know it was not at home because Shakira had a concert, which actually made it so much better. Because that feels. It's the most Vancouver thing could happen. It is.

I was going to say MLS, but yeah. Yeah, no, it's straight up Vancouver. Shakira obviously elite to a motocross competition. Yeah. But still getting kicked out of your own building. Oh, no, Taylor Swift was booked on the same date as like MLS Cup or something like that. They should check the schedule for this year.

Yeah, well well clear your schedule because this team is legit. I think I will say with all that said, I know everybody's kind of enamored with the new managers with Sorenson and Mikey Ferris and I think they've been awesome. There's a part of me that's still kind of like, are we taking for granted what's happening here in Columbus?

Cucho Hernandez, how many managers do we see across the league that are like constantly, not naming names, but being like, hey, I lost my DP, I lost my number nine. Do you want me to name the names as you say them? There's, oh, we had this happen to us, and oh, we have multiple competitions to manage. And look, I think most of those, I hear them,

and I'm like, that's fair. That's legitimate, actually. 33% of your budget. Yeah. That's your big piece. I get it. But Columbus has been the opposite. And that's partly where I'm like, OK,

we'll for Nancy what he's doing. And also, it ties back to G.A. Cup, where it's like the players that they have brought through from here with Jason Russell Rowe, Zlotsky, all these guys, Schulte, all these guys that have come through. And now Taha Brun getting his opportunities and like filling in minutes. Oh yeah, so I didn't come in last night. Yeah. And then say he's like, I'm gonna trust you.

Yeah. If you're gonna play in these settings, I'm gonna trust you. Yeah. And so I just think, I understand you didn't name him, but Doyle, I think he put it in the chat. Should we call him out? Yeah, we should. He said he was gonna cry when Wilfred Nansen leaves MLS.

And I was like, I laughed at it, but then I was like, he might be serious. Yeah, he followed up by saying, I seriously think he might cry. So I think he might be serious, and he's not wrong. And like you said, when Cucho left, I just, he felt so singular to what they did. Yeah. Like so the whole team's important.

They have really good depth. They have a ton of options. I had him for MVP last year. Yeah. Yeah. He was the best player that wasn't a messy, but he was the best player in a way that like set the tone for Columbus. When games were against them, they would, you know,

Cucho would float out left and hold the ball a little longer and draw a foul and change the game or get a shot on goal. And now you could press a little higher. Like all the things you just talked about of like these young players, Cucho does that at the elite, elite level. And you watch him with Real Betis and you're like, this guy's the center, genuinely the center forward

for a top six team in Spain. Like this guy's good. He's for real. And so to lose that and not have replaced it in any way and have yourself be undefeated is pretty absurd. And now they have Gosdok. What's your Gosdok? Here, cause it's, you know, heart of ETR style.

So they've played six games already, right? So there's 28 games left. Is that right? Is it six games? No, MLS is more than that. I'm on six games into G8 Cup right six games into G a cup right now. Yeah, so you're not allowed to think I was gonna pull this up while you said that So MLS they played eight games so far. So that means they have 20 Whoo

26 league games left Daniel Gosdok scoring goals for Columbus over under at league games left? Daniel Gosdok scoring goals for Columbus over under at nine and a half. Nine and a half? Yeah. Oh, he'll go over that. OK.

So double digit goals in basically 25, 26 league games. Yeah, I think that's pretty conservative. Really? Yeah. OK. I think he could get up 13, 14, 15 goals. All right. Is he on the Tommy and Caitlin team? That's a good question. I think you could get up 13, 14, 15 goals. Is he on the Tommy and Caitlin team?

That's a good question. Not one you would know the answer to. It's not saying that I'm not as involved as a part of the group. Yeah, you're an emotional piece of it. But I trust Tom with my life here. Yeah, obviously. I don't wanna mess this thing up.

We're on a roll right now. But the part I like about that is like, one, I just love the rule that you can change teams, like those acquisitions are possible at all. And like, the way, it used to take teams like years to recover from losing a player like Cucho. And now it's like, oh, we lost Cucho Acosta. It's like, all right, let's go get a Vander. Right. So you got to bring the next guy in. They have to fail.

You have to sell them to buy the next guy who takes a year, class theorem style, to get settled. Totally. Jovlich going to Kansas City. And the other part of it, from a fan's point of view, and even from an analyst's point of view, it's like, you know who this guy is. So it makes it a lot easier to be like, oh, OK,

I've got to look at like YouTube highlights and figure out like how's this gonna fit into Columbus's system. It's like, no, we know exactly who Gazdag is. I may have, you know, rooted against him if I'm a Columbus fan, but now it, it creates a little bit more where you have to pay more attention to other clubs, because like, we might get this guy next. And the other part of it just from their playing style is, like, we've seen what

Nancy can do with players that have been in other positions Maybe not played consistently whether I'm thinking of like an Amundsen a Kamacho and Or have played consistency and but but you know been good, but he's like I could do something with them Like Izzy Jackson some of these guys where they come over and you start to see them begin to flourish. Diego Rossi we saw with LAFC and we've seen him with Clums. He was just sick at both, but I kind of like the idea of like, you know, what could he do with, how can he elevate top end talent that we've seen in MLS and other places, but Gazdog is, I wouldn't say he's like in the very sort of upper,

the top tier of the best players in the league, but just below that, I think he's clearly right there. And the other part of it is like, he doesn't have an ego. So I think he fits from the personality of the team. He can play in possession, but he doesn't care too much to like drop deep or get overly involved when he doesn't need to. And then the other part from Columbus is when they win it, they go quick. And they bring numbers into the box always.

Every time I see a highlight, it breaks down like four or five guys in the box. You're like, how is the center back? Marrera in there, finishing at the back post. It's like, they're not shy about committing numbers. And that's exactly where Gosdag is most dangerous is as that third man often, or fourth in Philly, the way they play.

And so, yeah, I'm excited. The fact it's in the Eastern Conference, I'm like, ooh, that's tough to go up from a Philly perspective. But every time I doubt Philly, and I'm like, they shouldn't have done this, they shouldn't have done that. They seem to still be flying, so maybe we'll see some more young guys get their opportunities with them.

I talked to Chris Albright, I'm going to run that interview later this week. Cousins father is the father of Quinn and Kevin Sullivan. So we talked about them and he talked about how good the two of them have been and Kevin might be one of those people that fills in those minutes, is crazy to say but yeah and I think Quinn Sullivan his older brother is probably also another big reason why they feel comfortable yeah kind of like giving the keys to him yeah he has been lights out you know and Chris was saying I think he deserves a national team call-up and it's hard to debate because he's producing more in MLS than some players who are getting

called up from MLS right now. So I don't know if I would agree, but it's a debatable point. And if you have a young player doing that and you're a club that wants to say we promote young players, then you create that spot for them. Sucks for Daniel Goslog. I think Ernst Tanner told Tom in a piece,

forgive me, sport, but I'm not 100% sure where this was or whether it was set out loud or not, but I think it was, that he was was like we were hoping it was a West Coast team and when it wasn't Columbus was the team left. Yeah but that that goes back to the rule again of like there's that extra bit of intrigue of can you move this guy across to get him out of the way a little bit because I could I could see those teams meeting in the playoffs and that one being yeah being interesting.

Or maybe it was Issa Tal that said it. One of the two directors, whatever it was. Okay, anything else that you want to talk about, dyingly, or you feel good? Let me dig deep into the U16 pipeline. No, I'm honestly, I'm a rook here, so I'm sort of blessed to be welcome into the elite company that is the analysts of GA Cup and nothing better than David Goss and Soccerwise and first appearance on Soccerwise. The best place to do it and I love the show you guys are doing.

The volume of it is like amazing, but knowing you and Tom and just your productivity in the chat, I'm like, these guys are built for it. Tom more than me. Tom is high volume. Tom's a different animal, different beast, but yeah man, I'm really happy for what you guys are building. And obviously you'll only do in person ones,

so if I want you on the show, I have to in some way be in the same city as you. I need a full case of Moss Plus drinks with Lionel Messi behind us, which is a good backdrop between these 12 fields here in Bradenton. Listen, you need more. Let's crack one open. When you're ready to go, you need more, and Moss Plus is the way to do it. All right, we've got an interview coming up with Charles Olczek, the president of MLS Next Pro. And then we've got more interviews built in for you coming up later

this week. We'll drop some as they come along. Obviously, I will be back with Jordan Angeley on Wednesday to talk NWSL. We finally got the league back this weekend. Chicago somehow won a game. Gotham got off the snide. So we will talk about all of that. And I think there is US Open Cup this week as well, which I knew there was one other thing in my head. So we will obviously have all your coverage of that coming up probably on Thursday. I think Tom is out once again. I think Tom felt like if Kaelin came,

Tom had to recess back in, so then I got to get him back out of the coral reef and back into the world. So it's a whole experience, but as the sun sets here at GA Cup on the group stage of the 2025, Kaelin, welcome to the club and thanks for joining us. Happy to be initiated. We are here at the Generation Adidas Cup, my favorite time of the year. And this time we are honored to be joined by the president of MLS Next Pro,

Charles Olchuk, to talk a little bit about the work you're doing and the work that's being done here. How's it going so far? Great, great. This is an event that we look forward to year in and year out. And being here, watching the games, feeling the energy, it's a reminder of how far we've come, but also the work that we have ahead of us. Watching our players competing against top club teams from around the world is exciting. And we win some games, we lose other games, but the competition

is fierce. And it's great to be able to benchmark our players from these players from around the world. And I think it's a testament to the owners in MLS, you know, years ago coming together and deciding as a group that building at our academies was gonna be a core strategic imperative. And we've come a long way since that happened back in 2007, but we also know that there's a lot of work ahead of us. And, you know, as much as we're here for the event

We're also here to do some of that work. We have a Group of chief soccer officers that are coming in From our teams from around the country to have meetings tomorrow to talk about the future of player development and and how we can continue to make progress in all facets of what we're doing with our academies, with our MLS Next Pro teams and ensuring that we're providing the best environments for these players to reach their full potential. I've been around, not as long as you, but some of it and there's always conversations that are happening which are focus here, focus there.

The French Federation course was a huge part of bringing in higher level coaching and creating MLS Next Pro was a huge part of bridging the gap. What are the focuses of the conversation right now? I think a lot of it has to do with increasing the level of competition in all phases and ensuring that in every, you know, whether it's in every age group or in

every different type of competition that our players are being tested, are being pushed, and are not comfortable because the game around us continues to evolve and when you're turning on, you turning on games in other leagues in Europe or in other places, the players are getting younger. And we need to keep up. And the only way to keep up is to continue to progress. So we can never sit here and be comfortable with what we're doing because the landscape continues to evolve around us.

So specifically in MLS Next, how do you ensure that the best players in each age group are being pushed every day, whether it's in their training environments or in regular season play or in the different events that we do? And then in Next Pro, how do we, even though we're only in season four, how do we ensure that the level of competition continues to increase? I was just talking about this with one of the chief soccer officers from one of our new teams in MLS NextPro. And if you're a top 16, 17 year old,

you now have multiple competitions to choose from. You could play with your colleagues in your age group in MLSNext here at the GA Cup or in regular season competition or different tournaments that we have. You could be called up to the next pro team or you could be, if you are close to or signing a contract, you'd be training with the first team and getting ready for that level. So it's a very dynamic environment overall. And our job is to try to provide the best opportunities for our players, you know, in all different phases. How does the ideation come about in a conversation like this of, is it the different clubs thinking about this and you come together and talk?

Is it outside groups coming in? How do you go about the process of saying this is where we are and these are the new ideas we should introduce or these are ways to create more competition? It's a great question. Our job at the league office is to provide a platform for teams to execute their plans. Because at the end of the day, each team has its own strategy, has its own people, has its own ideas, has its own philosophy, its own game model. controversial in different circles. But you know, our job is to allow for those teams to express themselves, those clubs to express themselves within, you know, within our different competitions. And so we come together as much as we can to get feedback from the teams. We do it through individual meetings, of course, but also through committees,

whether it's player development committees or MLS Next Pro committees or MLS Next committees. And it's a continuous discussion that's happening at all levels. And then what we try to do and what we try to achieve is to create some consensus and then bring those ideas eventually to ownership through the Sporting and Competition Committee,

which is managed by Nelson Rodriguez and Todd Durbin. And Nelson is here this week, you know, overseeing all this. And then eventually to the board. But as I mentioned earlier, the landscape continues to evolve board. But as I mentioned earlier, the landscape continues to evolve quickly. So we need to be on our toes and never be comfortable. When you talk about your role as MLS Next Pro and president, you are connected to all of this.

How does the interaction work of like, we are this league, but also we are part of MLS through MLS Next? Yeah, and we're you know, we're, we're the link. We're the we're the the connective tissue between our academies and our first teams and all credit to Ali Curtis and his team for when they were building the plan back in 2001. And they've continued to iterate. But when they were building the plan, the the most important thing was

that it was built with flexibility in mind so that our teams could move players to their system when they were ready on short notice and be continuously providing opportunities for players whether it was the best players coming out of the academies who needed to be tested in a professional environment, whether it was the players in MLS Next Pro under contract and being sure that they're where they need to be, and then of course whether it was the players that are already under contract with the first teams who need games and being able to have those players play in MLS NextPro on a consistent basis. So that foundation is set and our job now is to be continuously taking input from the folks who are running the academies and thinking about that group, the folks and the leaders who are thinking about our first teams and how to be thinking that group, and ensuring that what we're doing in Next Pro

works for everybody. That's hard to do. It's a lot of parties. It never is perfect. And on top of that, we have other objectives with MLS Next Pro. It's not just about player development. That's an important part of it, of course, but we're also building a league with

a real focus on bringing professional soccer to new markets. I was in Chattanooga last week or the week before for the US Open Cup game between them and their local rival. There were 13,000 people there celebrating soccer in that community and that was a great event you know part of a historic competition and there are players that are playing for Chattanooga FC that have come through their academy that are gonna hopefully keep progressing in their careers and maybe make it to MLS one day and you know another example they had played in different parts of the soccer landscape in amateur leagues

and in another professional league. Now they're in MLS Next Pro. Now they're thinking about their future, where to build their academy. They're about to open a multi-million dollar HQ and they're building their training facility, excuse me, and now they're launching their academy in MLS Next this fall and it's all about building those foundations so that the next generation of players from Chattanooga and from that region

can compete at a really high level and make it. So we're building a league that works for our MLS affiliated teams and also for our independent teams and bringing that all together you know takes is a collaborative effort. Are the independent MLS Next Pro teams required to have MLS Next Academies? No but they all will either do or will and we think that's great and it's you know and I think it's an example of the of what's possible for for ownership groups that are really committed to the sport because they're in it for the long term and whether it's you know building a training facility like they have in Carolina core building the the new

headquarters as I mentioned in Chattanooga FC or building stadiums which is what's happening in Cleveland and in Jacksonville and in Connecticut and in Grand Rapids. These are long term investments that these ownership groups are making. And it's about doing it for their community and providing a platform for the young people in those regions to be exposed to the sport through, you know, professional games but also providing them opportunities for those who want to

make it to reach their full potential. I live in Florida so I've actually been thinking about this a lot recently of the model and sustainability and the reality of minor league baseball and then soccer coming in. It feels like those are the two hand-in-hands to me of baseball has the most reach across the country in terms of all these minor league teams and systems and in markets that we wouldn't consider high level pro markets and soccer has that ability and we're seeing it built out. You mentioned some of the markets and of course the open cup Portland, Maine all of a sudden

is selling out high school fields and all of that. What is the conversation with ownership groups about why soccer and not baseball or basketball or whatnot and what being an MLS Next Pro team looks like for an independent club? Yeah, you know, this is my 11th season in MLS and before I was focused on Next Pro, I spent time working in the commissioner's office on expansion in MLS. And I would say that from that time to now, the background of the owners, it's a different league of course, MLS is different than MLS NextPro, and the requirements are different, and you know, that's first division versus third division but the background of the ownership groups has evolved in that many of the folks that we're talking to now grew

up with the sport, certainly grew up with MLS as part of their you know adulthood, late childhood even because we have some young, younger, you know, entrepreneurs who are now at the point in their careers where they're thinking about owning a professional sports team or building a sports team in their community. But many of them grew up with the sport as part of their upbringing, their kids are playing, they might have played, and that's really dynamic. And it makes for a different type of conversation because they are watching, they're engaged. And I think you're seeing that across the country with soccer, you know, coming to new communities in a way that may not have been possible before.

And not just because the ownership groups are engaged but also because the public officials are focused on soccer and It's part of the daily conversation and you know you think about the shows like welcome to Wrexham or Ted Lasso or just the amount of soccer professional soccer that there is on TV Not just MLS, but all these other leagues from around the world. It's part of the daily conversation now and that's coming through certainly in the meetings that we're having across the country and the excitement that there is for what we're doing in growing out MLS through MLS Next Pro and then also at the Academy level with MLS Next. So, you know, it's, we're just in the first kind of half

of season four in MLS Next Pro, we've made a lot of progress. We're really excited about where things are, but in many ways we're just getting started. You know, we're, there's a lot of things that we've done right. The competition on the field is working really well. The ability for players to transition

from the amateur level to the professional level to the top level to their national teams to being transferred abroad, that's all working. Now it's about matching that energy both on and off the field so that we're playing in better stadiums in front of more fans and in front of bigger crowds and that takes time. But that's what we're spending a lot of time thinking about and working on. I know your background with expansion and I think you said it was to Joe Larry that your goal is to be a 40 or 50 teams and I'm going to ask the next pro, what does that footprint look like and what's the idea behind that growth? Well in a very basic level what we'd like to have over time and you know

we're gonna take our time to make sure we get it right, but at the same time there's a lot of interest and a lot of demand. So you know we're trying to be very thoughtful about how we do it is to have two divisions under MLS so you could have two divisions in MLS Next Pro, a third division, which is what we have now, and then over time when we reach scale, you know, rough numbers, call it 40 teams total, a second division as well.

And, you know, clearly you wanna have geographic diversity. We already have that now. You know, we have 29 teams playing this year, but you add another 10 or 11 teams to that on the East Coast, in the Midwest, on the West Coast. And then you can get really creative with different competitive formats and things that we've thought about and maybe things that we haven't thought about. When you bring in new ownership groups into the league, they come with their ideas as well. And we're spending a lot of time with all of our teams and a lot of time with potential

new teams to understand what's important to them, what ideas they have, what things that they've seen and other businesses that they're coming from that might make sense for MLS Next Pro. So the good thing is, is in many ways we've got not a blank canvas, certainly. We're a league that's operating. We've got a dozen games every weekend or more. But we still have a lot of wait space. And so when we meet with our owners, when we meet with our committees,

we always say to them, we're open for business. Bring us your ideas. We want to hear them. We want to engage with you on how you're thinking about how to evolve the sport alongside of us. When you look at the landscape right now, and obviously alongside what you're doing is what USL is doing.

And you talked about multiple divisions. They're working on that as well. What is the relationship between the two entities and what you guys are trying to do and what they're trying to do? You know what we, at a high level, what we focus on certainly is what we're doing as opposed to what other folks are doing. Like everybody, I read the news and see what's happening across the landscape. And there are teams in all levels of soccer

who are doing some really interesting things. And we try to learn from that and see what works and see what doesn't, see what types of stadiums work well in different types of markets. Location, size of stadium capacity, what kind of fan amenities they have, what's happening around their stadium. So we're always kind of learning from what we've done, certainly in MLS, what other folks have done in other leagues, and trying to build off of that.

So what we do know is that, you know, and I was in, I think I mentioned earlier, I was in Chattanooga for their US Open Cup game. These local rivalries really matter. And so that's something that we know from MLS certainly, and that at the lower levels, whether it's through the US Open Cup or other competitions that we've not thought about yet, those are things that we're going to be thinking more about in the future. Fans want to engage with their teams. They want to have, you know, villains and heroes and they want to, you know, be part of games that matter.

And what we need to provide for them through what we're doing is games of consequence, you know, interesting matchups, different types of formats. International competition is an important part of what we're doing as well. For the last few years, we've been testing different formats with teams from Europe and teams from Mexico. We obviously have a great relationship with League MX through Leaks Cup at the MLS level. So there's a lot that we're thinking about and what MLS Next Pro looks like today I think is, it will likely look, you know, continue to evolve and look different in the future certainly. I know you said you want everyone bringing ideas and you don't know where it's going

to go. Do you though have your dream chart of in 25 years if we sit down in this exact same office with hopefully the walls still standing and have this conversation what MLS Next Pro looks like? Yeah we'll have to check back in in a few years and go through that. But yeah I think we have you know we have different paths that this league could take. And what we do know is that getting more teams into better stadium situations, secondary markets where there's demand for professional soccer that may not be met at this time

with dynamic fan environments, commercial opportunity and excitement. That's what's going to really be important for us as a league to continue to grow. And we have examples of that now, whether it's in Huntsville with Nashville's team or coming online next year in Mansfield, Texas with North Texas FC Dallas' affiliate. We have the blueprint ready. We just need to continue to work with our teams to bring more of that to MLS Next Pro. You worked on expansion for a long time at the MLS level. I always laugh because I remember Atlanta's, you

know, announcement ceremony and everyone kind of as it was happening being like is soccer gonna work in Atlanta and now it's such a huge success. Do you have any memories of moments where you were like I don't know what this project looks like or no one believes in this and it did work? What do you sort of think back on in your time in that role and looking back and saying like wow I can't believe this market didn't happen or this one worked and it was the way it worked out. Yeah, I've been fortunate to have gotten to work on many of the recent expansion projects in MLS and now in MLS Next Pro.

The way we think about it is we try to make it simple in that there are three or four really important things to look at and to be really focused on. And for me, it really starts and in many cases stops with the ownership group. And if the ownership group's vision for what they want to achieve and objectives Align with our vision for the league and what we're trying to achieve and our objectives if we're aligned That's a really good place to start if we're not it makes everything more challenging So you spend a lot of time with the ownership group and get to know them make sure that they get to know us understand, you know what our values are what our what our You know our plan is. And if that makes sense to them, then we're off on the right foot.

And then you focus on the stadium because even if you have the best ownership group and the best market, if you don't have the right stadium, it's very, very hard. And it's even harder at the minor league level. Yeah in lower division soccer So we spent a lot of time with the ownership potential ownership groups Then we spent a lot of time with them on what their stadium their vision for a stadium plan is and then from a market Perspective, you know, you mentioned Atlanta earlier We think that if done right with the right ownership group and the right same plan Most markets if not all markets in this country can support soccer at different levels. And we're seeing

that now. You know, we're seeing that now. You'd mentioned Portland, Maine earlier, you know, great brand, great kind of positioning. You know, there's really cool things happening all over the country and in different leagues and in different competitions. And I think it's an exciting time for the sport. And all of us are focused on the here and now, but also thinking about what the World Cup will mean and how to provide for all those fans that are focused on soccer now, but also the new fans that will be coming in during and after the World Cup.

Yeah, it feels wild that 10 years ago, we wouldn't have said like, people were not saying, oh, if you do it right, soccer works everywhere. It was like, ah, you have to find this perfect alchemy formula, and now it's like, just do a good job and build a fun building and let people go to a soccer game, and they'll enjoy it, which is really, really cool. I appreciate you taking the time, really cool. Yeah.

I appreciate you taking the time. Thank you. Look forward to 25 years from now when we do this again. And I'm sure you'll look exactly the same and I'll look even older and that will be fun. Appreciate it. Thank you.