SoccerWise - MLS Edition: Vancouver Celebration! Other MLS CCC Woes & Ali Curtis (MLS) Interview

Episode Date: March 13, 2025

The Whitecaps have saved the day JUST AS DAVID CALLED IT (sorta) and so Michele rejoins the show to keep the good luck. They dig into the sad results in CONCACAF as well for Seattle, Cincy & Columbus. Then they preview the weekend coming up with some huge matches. Finally Ali Curtis SVP of Sporting Development of Major League Soccer joins to talk about using MLS Next Pro to build a pathway and growing the league.1:30 Vancouver Victory In Mexico13:00 MLS CCC Woes25:00 CCC Bracket Preview Who Can Win It31:30 Dissecting FCC Loss36:00 LAG Find The Goal40:30 Weekend Preview Top Games To Watch1:05:50 Ali Curtis Interview On MLS Next Pro In 2025 Soccerwise Live 2pm ET Every Tuesday/Wednesday/Thursday on Youtube/Twitch/Twitter

David Goss and you know who, Michele Giannone back at Soccer Wise to celebrate what is Vancouver Whitecaps Day across Conka Calf. It is the best day of the year. Michele, we were texting last night. I was like, you got to come back on. You got to feel the vibes with me. We were ready for this. And after Tuesday night, the Vancouver Whitecaps

resuscitated my hope in CONCACAF competition and brought me back. It's been fun. Thanks for having me back, first of all. And second of all, we witnessed the biggest upset in Conca Champions history. I don't want to be prisoner of the moment but what Vancouver did last night in Torreón, they didn't play Monterrey but it's same thing, in Mexico against the second most expensive roster in the continent. Monterrey is

almost a hundred million dollars just below, guess what, Club America, of course. They're the two biggest rosters when we talk about salaries in the continent. I'm going to go back to yesterday, Tuesday show, and I'm going to quote myself. And I'm going to eat all the crow. It's an impossible task, quote myself. It's, and I'm gonna eat all the crow. It's an impossible task, quote unquote. That's what I said about Vancouver Monterrey. And then, you know, and I'm pretty sure you did the same thing, and a lot of people did the same thing.

You put the game on, okay, you have it on the background. Let's see what's gonna happen. And then Sergio Canales scores a minute four. Okay, like this is gonna get ugly. a minute four. Okay. Like this is going to get ugly. No. Vancouver started matching up the intensity. They didn't give up after you. I mean, you received that goal against Monterrey in Mexico.

You say, okay, done. Now let's just finish this and get back to MLS. No. They started pressuring. Cuba's was awesome on the midfield. Vite was a menace. Ali Ahmed, legend. Ahmed, Ocampo with that banger of a goal. I mean, but let's go back for a second. No Ryan Gold, no Nelson Nelson Brian White starting from the bench You get scored on minute four. I don't know how they did it. They started matching the intensity

They started controlling the ball controlling the midfield again. Cuba's was he boss Monterrey midfield among the rate that played their starters, including Sergio Ramos at center back. I don't know how they did it, but I'm happy. It's awesome when you see this. I don't want to offend anyone, but this is like a legit Cinderella story, because I don't think anyone gave Vancouver a chance, not even maybe their own players. But I'm so happy, because he was going to start, I mean, Conca Champions. It was starting to look terrible for MLS this year.

So now they have this awesome story and I'm so happy about it. To be clear, I said on this show last Thursday that guaranteed Vancouver would beat Monterey. So some people- No, you didn't say that. Don't lie. You didn't say that. It's on video. I 100% did. Tom was trying to egg me on.

I was like, no, I'm happy to say it. It is 100% true. Whether I was serious or not is another question and you could go into the tone if you want to. I'm just saying it's on the record. But what you were saying there, it's like soccer, anything can happen, right? We say that all the time.

It is literally not true in CONCACAF Champions competition between MLS and League of Mechs teams. Not anything can happen. And when things happen that are good, there's like one script it follows. Either you're protecting the lead, you get an early goal, you sit in. Everything about those bingo cards that we all have

that you can check off, which obviously the center is disappointment, but you can check off as you go through games, was not the case in this game. Like you said, like to start by giving up that early goal and then it's like hands in the air. You had how many yellow cards, how many free kicks conceded in the opening 20 minutes

in the attack or in the defending third for Vancouver. And so you've got Monterrey with good momentum. You have them sort of playing on the front foot. You are trailing the game. So now you have to open up and go and get it. None of it fit the script of how an MLS team steals results in Mexico. And yet Vancouver were able to overcome all of it.

They concede that goal, they get bombarded, they find their feet again, they sort of settle going into halftime and then coming out of halftime they make the two substitutions. Not Brian White! Jaycee Nogondo and Mathias Laborde are like, you're still hanging on to your starting striker. Then he finally comes in on the goal. Ocampo scores and they cut to the sideline and that's when Brian White is up putting his stuff on and you could see Yes, for Sorensen be like, oh, we've got a shot here Like he was already subbing white in so credit to him

But you could see his reaction to white of like let's go. Let's go. Let's go. Like let's do this And you named a lot of the people who played fantastic in this one. Ocampo gets the goal awesome But the way he's played right now at right back to end the game right wing back to start the game Like everything Monterey did was coming down the left wing and his pressure high and the way he stayed connected to the game Forced Monterey to go long and that's where they lost their flow. They started to go long Vancouver's eating up those earth, you know those first balls Kubas is working in midfield. Sebastian Barralda is working in midfield and then Vancouver starts to play higher and higher. And Ali Ahmed is like an unbelievable story of where he's come from, getting cut by Toronto,

not making it through, comes back with Vancouver, two-team into the first team, and just like manipulating the game. It looks so easy. He's so comfortable with the ball that he can stop on a dime. He can cut back. He can take on two defenders. I do need Richie Larray to give him some penalty merchant tricks because he had that one on the end line where he sort of like slipped himself and then put his hands up like, Oh no foul.

It's like, no, you got to start rolling around. Olly Ahmed, we need more CONCACAF from you. But his ability to keep getting to the end line, so then he cuts inside and all the defenders crash on him. And Vite, selflessly plays it off to Ocampo, who lasers that thing in, but it was because of the way the defense got sucked in by Ahmed and Vite that created the chance.

And I said last week like you can't win a CONCACAF Champions Series starting Daniel Rios and they did that. They started Daniel Rios again and they did it. So I was completely wrong. Apologies to Daniel Rios. And this just like, it had so much use. Then they get the second goal and as you said, Kubas presses himself, wins it back, creates the chance and then Brian White, what a perfect 48 hours. You get called up to the CONCACAF Nations League final roster for the USMNT and you score the game winner in Mexico and like show everyone why you should be there. Because this is the level.

Like this is the conversation in CONCACAF stuff. It's like, who should the US be calling up projection, all this stuff. What Brian White did yesterday is what's going to be asked next week. This is the level of most of the Mexico national team players. This is the level for Panama. You could argue Canada maybe has passed all this but like this is the level and he shows he can compete. You know what I've noticed and I hope that MLS teams start doing this, is that, yeah, we are always in awe about the roster and the quality of the Mexican teams. We know that, especially when you have the second leg at home, they're going to try to dominate, pressure you, destroy you, and they have the quality to do so.

But we saw with Columbus last year, we saw with Seattle when they won this trophy when it was called Conca Caff Champions League, that if you have the talent and you have the willingness to say, no, we are going to be the ones that are going to boss you at midfield, that are going to pressure you. We're not going to sit back because we have the talent because Mexican teams, they have so much talent, especially on the last third that they leave open spaces on their own, on your final third to attack and to win second balls at midfield. So if MLS seems like again, Columbus, Seattle in the past, Vancouver last night, if you are not afraid of trying to do that, these things can happen.

Because Mexican teams are going to leave spaces for you to do that, especially when they're playing home, because their mentality is, oh, you're an MLS team, you're a lesser team, we're just gonna try to roll you out, let's go. Like that NFL play that is all the wide receivers, how do you call that? That just run. Hail Mary. Yeah, just run and attack and all the weapons up top.

So Vancouver had the personality and they weren't fearful of doing that. And you can take advantage because yeah, these teams are great, but they're susceptible to receive calls and don't absorb pressure because they're not used to it. Yeah. Yeah. Especially because again, there's this mentality of, oh, we're Monterrey. You're Vancouver.

It sounds simplistic, but you we're Monterrey. You're Vancouver. It sounds simplistic, but you speak with everyone in Mexico. And nobody today wakes up still thinking, what happened? This is not supposed to happen. Right. Right? But again, if MLS teams can do this, and they can if you have the talent, and again, the las pelotas to do it,

then things like this happens. Again, because they're very susceptible, especially the bigger teams that just want to throttle you, and they're going to throw everything at you, and they're going to leave spaces. In the back end, Vancouver has the players to do that, because Vite, Ahmed, and especially when you have a guy like Cubas. I don't want to disrespect Vancouver, the players to do that because Vite, Ahmed, and especially when you have a guy like Kubas.

I don't want to disrespect Vancouver and I'm apologizing on the forefront, but when you see guys like Ryan Gold and Kubas, because they play in Vancouver, they don't get the credit that they deserve. They're both best 11 quality in Major League Soccer. If Kubas would be playing on LAFC midfield, he will be the talk of town. Right. Every game. And same thing as goal, right? So I'm happy that Vancouver is doing this.

And now they're going to face Pumas or La Jualense on quarterfinal. It's not crazy. It's not crazy to think that they can get to a semifinal now. It is a definitely reasonable route. Now we do have one of our favorites, Maria, in the chat right now who is a Pumas fan, so Goya, Goya, on that one. But it is, as you would say, a reasonable route. We did the season previews and the Seattle one, I sort of said the like, oh Seattle didn't

have to beat any of the Gigantes and the run to the win and Jeremiah yelled about how good Pumas was and how dangerous they were and all of that and he was 100% right. But if you are talking about the dangers of playing in this competition it does not start with Pumas right. It starts with the Cruz Azules, the Tigres of the World Club America and so for Vancouver to avoid that and then We think potentially play an MLS team. So Lafc knocked off Columbus to finish out their series. They went in up 3-0 from the first leg

They ended up hanging on They got a 2-1 win late on in Columbus They will play the winner of inter Miami Cavalier, which we assume will be Inter Miami. So the idea is you will have three MLS teams on that side of the bracket with just Pumas. And then on the other side of the bracket, you have Club America, you have Cruz Azul, you have T-Grace, and then you have the LA Galaxy because of our other results. Because I was so excited, by the way, about the Vancouver Whitecaps, I forgot to mention that we have an interview

coming up with Oli Curtis of MLS and MLS Next Pro about MLS Next Pro, this new season, all the different initiatives they're working on, all of that. If you're watching live on YouTube, that will be in the podcast. If you're listening to the podcast, you will hear that at the end of the show.

And there were a lot of different results on Tuesday that were trying to bring me down that Vancouver was able to save me from. Let's start with Seattle, because I think Seattle it's one of the big disappointments along with Cincinnati and we sort of had this conversation about how many of the clubs are you confident about. And that felt like the big one with their depth, their experience having been here before. They outplayed Cruisesville in the first leg, they don't get the goal. That was the danger they set themselves up in going

into the second leg. And then it was as bad as it possibly could be. Paul Ariola goes down with a knee injury early on. Jordan Morris pulls up with a hamstring injury. You lose to Cruz Azul and Seattle gets eliminated. It hurts them for longer stretches of this season. Ariola, we haven't gotten an update yet, but it does not look good for his potential to play. And it was a more classic concapt experience of like,

Seattle were good enough. They deserve a lot. And then they went down, they played a little scared. They didn't, they wasted their opportunities in the first leg and now they're eliminated. It's basically what we're saying about Vancouver, right? And you just nailed it with that last comment. They look scared for a second and they let the game be gone from their hands.

And honestly, I need an explanation of why Smetzer did the Ferreira sub when the game was 1-0, they brought up, he put in Dani Leyva and took out Ferreira sub when the game was 1-0. They brought up, he put in Dani Leyva and took out Ferreira when you need goals. I've been talking with Seattle reporters and Seattle people and nobody has an idea why he did what he did. But at the end, it's again, we're saying about what the Vancouver personality, no fear. Maybe Vancouver is a team the Vancouver personality, no fear. Yeah. Maybe Vancouver is a team that they play with no pressure. And Seattle had pressure on them being once a champion of this cup

and having that pressure of being, quote unquote, one of the MLS, at least MLS favorites for this tournament. And for everything that you said, the roster depth, the quality on the players. I, for example, picked Seattle to be my supporter shield winner because I saw the roster and I said, they can, even though they have a lot of competitions this year, including the club world cup, they have the roster depth to do so and to compete, but now Polar Rihola, like you said, it doesn't look good. We're fingers

crossed, but I don't think it's going to be like a Ryan Gold situation. I think Polar Rihola's injury is going to be probably, I don't want to speculate, but it looks bad. It looks bad. And now also Jordan Morris comes out injured. Jesus Ferreira hasn't had the start of the season that we thought. Actually, he hasn't been playing much in MLS. At least he's not starting. So I think now the roster death has created, and it sounds ironic, but has created a problem for Schmetzer because I don't think he has found the ideal

rotations for this team. De la Vega didn't make the trip. So now how do you start to figure all this out? Yeah, we know that the transfer market is still open until April 23rd, but is Seattle going to go and spend money? We don't think so. Yeah. They have all their DPs spot fulfilled. Now you don't have a riola for the rest of the season.

Again, apparently. So I think actually it sounds again crazy, but I think Smetzer hasn't done a good job or balancing and figuring out his best starting 11, his best formation. And we saw it against Cruz Azul. job or balancing and figuring out his best starting 11, his best formation. And we saw it against Cruz Azul. And when you play scared in Mexico against a big Mexican team, you're going to pay it. The, I think there's a lot of truth in what you said. And I think this Seattle team has not chilled yet.

They actually, normally this is where they find themselves is like, oh, we have to play Alex rolled on a ton of minutes. Now Alex rolled down as a crucial part of our team. they actually, normally this is where they find themselves is like, oh we have to play Alex rolled on a ton of minutes. Now Alex rolled on is a crucial part of our team. Oh we have to play Christian rolled on a ton of minutes. Now he's a crucial part of our team. Paul Rothrock, like all these players, that doesn't mean it's a good thing. I think I saw over the course of this week again the obvious disadvantages of this timing of the season, like Cincinnati and Seattle are not cohesive yet. They both had players, a ton of players who are new early in the season.

They both have it. Yep. For Cincinnati's case, a ton of players who weren't here, whether it was because of holdouts like Orojano and Kubo or because of Vandor didn't get done until later. You also did see the limitations of what Major League Soccer has created. And while Vancouver papered over a lot of it, the fact that Cruz Azul can just roll Mateusz Bogusz into their lineup and an MLS team just like can't find the mechanism really to properly put him in their team, it showed you the gap.

And the gap, I think, while it feels closer sometimes because of League's Cup and closer sometimes I think because of like confidence confidence like what you talked about with Vancouver I think there's a lot of MLS teams that aren't scared of whether it's the matchup or the environments as much anymore The roster configurations are still not there you look across most of these teams start with Cruz Azul You are talking about four to five million dollar players at every position up his spine. Yeah. Bogus was a 10 million dollar player. And when LAFC turned him into a 10 million dollar player, they no longer had the mechanism

to keep him in their roster and had to get rid of him. And you've got a league MX giant saying like, yeah, we know that guy's good because he hurt us in league scup and has hurt us in concrete, like not us specifically, but other League MX teams, we know this guy can play. And I think this week was one of those weeks where you look at it and it doesn't feel like MLS has taken the steps. It has to, to get to the level it can. And it comes in the grander scheme of Paul Tenorio and I believe Felipe were the two

that did the MLS anonymous survey about the World Cup. And our MLS team is taking advantage of the World Cup. Is Seattle prepared for a club World Cup? And like, believe me, I watched Champions League this week. They're not gonna beat PSG at Let it Go Madrid simply, but are they being enhanced? Is this a moment for them to jump off of and then say, look, we can build a greater team because of this. And I understand the balance of parity.

I don't mind that. But there's gotta be other mechanisms to help players stay in the league. And one of my examples I think of this week is like, I think Yamar is the best center back in major league soccer. At least in the conversation. Every team on the league MX side

that's playing in this competition has two Yamars, right? Two in their prime South American borderline internationals or full internationals from Columbia and Paraguay and Uruguay and Argentina and all these countries or Mexico. And on the MLS side, you just don't have the mechanisms to spend that type of money. And if you do, you can't keep them. Ouseum should be on FC Cincinnati, right?

Like there should be roster mechanisms available where they hit that signing, they nailed it, they nailed Miazga, they convinced Miles Robinson to come and teenage Hedebi is unfortunately a large reason why they don't go through in this series. Like he got dunked on in the first leg, he struggled in the second leg and like that's not a knock on him,

that's the reality of the level of this competition. Cincinnati should have had the ability to retain those players and go, whether it's going into a luxury tax or having bird rights or whatever it is, there should be more mechanisms to build great teams. Yeah, and yeah, there's a lot to digest there. But I agree with with everything. And it's something that we've been talking, I'm happy that coaches like Steve Sharondolo, Tata Martino last year, like they spoke about it. And fans don't like it sometimes when your team plays and loses this way because they say, well, no, it's just excuses. No, it's true. It's like Jovalic should be at LA Galaxy right now.

Right. Chicho Arango at his moment should have stayed at LAFC. But, and then again, I go back to Monterrey in America and even Cruz Azul. But America, it's their roster, their salaries. It's over 100 million dollars per season. Monterrey is just shy of a hundred. I think it's like 98 millions. Boggush. Yeah, he goes, yeah, great.

It's a great business move for LAFC. They turn a player from one million to 10, but here's the caveat, Bogus got his salary quadruple. Yeah. Quadruple from what he was making at LAFC to Cruz Azul. Jaco Makis fromFC to Cruz Azul. Jaco Makis from Atlanta to Cruz Azul. He got his salary double or triple. Chichu Arango from LAFC to Pachuca.

It's not just having the means of buying players because teams can buy. Like Inter Miami or Atlanta United, and they've done it, they can go to Europe or Columbus, whatever, and spend 22 million for La De La. What fans need to understand is roster construction. It's like, oh my god, how did Leon destroy LAFC on the previous, for example, taking that final

of the Conca Champions? Yeah, because LAFC has the three DPs that make a lot of money, then maybe two, three players of of of town money, and then the rest, with all due respect, it's it's filler. And then Leon, like you said, they have 20 players that are making $2 million, and they have preposition and Club America, if they need a right back, they go to Pachuca and they buy Kevin Alvarez for $10 million. Yeah.

It's just great. It's just absurd. And now they're coming to MLS. And at least, that's what I love. And I know you like it. And a lot of people have praised the cash for player trades. That's how Jovalich stayed in MLS. But the major point is that, yeah, we're thankful that Jovalich stayed on MLS. He should have stayed at

Galaxy. That's the point that people are missing still. Yeah. So I'm hopeful that now, at least with that rule, things can expand and fix that. And to your point of what you see in Mexico is the direction is like someone plays well at a San Luis or in Nacoxa and then they get sold to Club America. And that's sort of that where Jovalich is at the champion and then he has to get sold out to be a DP at a different team that sort of sets

a ceiling on that group. Like I liked day on Jovalich, but his best was playing around three DPs and then he's scoring goals. Now the responsibility falls on his shoulder. It's a thinner roster and like there is steps that Major League Soccer has taken. I was reading again the U-22 initiative piece that Ben Wright put together which I think is really interesting. One of the fascinating parts about it is the big sales have been through home groans in

MLS. That's been the real success and I think it's something that Should be recognized of like, okay How can we push this and I will talk to Oli Curtis about it in a little bit of what MLS next pro is trying To do but there is still it feels like every time MLS bumps up against this Okay, we're this close to league MX. what's next? League MX and the clubs in League MX conservatively take a jump and the MLS team say, or MLS says, well, if we keep on this steady path,

we'll get there. Well, it's not a sitting target. Like other clubs around the world are gonna continue to move. You have to move with them. And it feels like over the last five, six years, there's been moments for MLS to take big jumps, Messi being one of them, the Apple deal being one of them.

I think the pandemic being one of them of the support of like billionaires that could sort of carry things when other teams were taking half steps back. And now you've got the World Cup coming up as well. And as fun as the Vancouver experience is, the fact that it is such an upset is a little bit upsetting at the same time of like where it sits. Now let's dig into the bracket. Now that I've gotten all that off my chest. Uh, so LAFC hangs on against Columbus. I think a little bit of the goodwill from the first leg of like you got over your demons and all of that maybe went away.

We had someone in our discord who was said they live 10 minutes from the stadium and they were like, I'm watching college basketball tonight. If they call him, this scores early, maybe I'll jump over. Then they scored early. Then they scored again to make it two zero did not have enough to get over the line. Still struggling somewhat to replace Cucho. Like I think a year ago, if they were down three zero, I think a lot of people would have taken Columbus because Cucho was so special

on top of everything Nanses built and you see what Nanses built that it was still very close but couldn't get over the line. LAFC able to see it out in the end, Buonga gets the late goal and I think we're about to get an LAFC-Inter-Miami matchup which is fascinating. We have not seen it since 2023. LAFC feels built perfectly to take advantage of Miami's holes. But that game in 2023, LAFC got blown off the field in LA. So now we're going to learn to see, I think, has LAFC perfected what they want to be.

And that was what felt like the whole off season was, was getting those transition players, getting players that can cover ground, that are quick, that can get out on the run and be Steve Turon little style of player. And all of that would be the formula for beating an inter Miami team that is gappy in transition and loses the ball and they have mental lapses and all of that. And now I think we're going to get to see two of the best at what they do go up against each other. This bracket showed exactly what people like, I'm pretty sure you have this issue too,

or at least this criticism, why people still dislike how this LAFC team plays. On the first leg, you saw what they're capable of. Yes. And then on the second leg they reverted to their okay we're gonna sit low we're just gonna play in transition which is fine which they kind of did in the first leg they just do it from a higher line with a little more bravery but then you have the three zero caveat on your favor and they do it multiply by a thousand right and then you are against the wall, two zero immediately.

Hugo Lloris was awesome. Yeah. The, the safe on, on, on top of the line, it's diving one hand. It was one of the best saves you've, you probably ever see. But with LAFC it's, that's the issue, you know, you, you're like, you can be so much better than this, but again, that's the issue. You can be so much better than this. But again, that's the way they play. That's the way they've been successful. That's the way every year they get to a final.

Even if it's a CONCA Champions or US Open Cup, they're always in the playoff. They're winning the Western Conference. They get into MLS Cup. They won MLS Cup. So how do you criticize that? But again, now with, the roster was short, which I will give that.

Now with Zengiz Underwood we saw, her first minutes he assets Buanga for the goal that eliminates Columbus. Very much seems to understand how the team works. Like he was immediately picked his head up and was like, where's Buanga making the run? And it's a player that fits that specific Cherondolo ball player.

Like you're fast, you're kind of small, you can run, you can blue by people 1v1. He's still young, he's 27. Yeah. And he feels older because he's been on our life. He went to Roma very young and he did great. He has a great shot from out of the box. He's a starter.

I don't know if he started, but he's always been one of the big pieces of the Turkish national team. So he's a legit player, right? And he's on alone until the summer. So he has hungry. So he's hungry to show that he can do well and then maybe pick up his option, right? So I think LAFC is gonna get better by default because now you have better players and more players

that fit what Shiron Dallow wants, but still you always have that taste in your mouth that you can be so much better than this. And maybe Miami, it's like you said, it's a great matchup because Miami's going to give them a lot of spaces, right? Because Miami's going to play, they're going to want the ball.

And LAFC, it's yeah, you get the ball, we don't give an F, we're just going to kill you in transition. So I think that's honestly, it's going to be an awesome, awesome matchup. Yeah, I'm super excited for this one. I The fact that we didn't see it last year is bizarre, of course That's like the weird roster stuff and so to get it in a knockout competition in this way I think is just really really fun

And I I don't I can't pick one way or the other like my guess would be I actually think Lafc's form right now. I think they have a really good shot. But it's hard to pick against Inter Miami in big games and big moments. This is all in saying that we think they win in Kingston tonight, which is not a guarantee because as we learned from last night, you never know what's going to happen. So that is the top. Messi's traveling, by the way. Yeah, I know. Messi's going to happen. So that is the top- Messi's traveling by the way.

Yeah, I know. Messi's traveling by the way. He's like super into it. It's like this whole experience everyone's going through. This is my Roman Empire, by the way. It's like when David Beckham had to go on Kalkiav Champions League games, I still remember Torristen Frings playing Real Esteli

in Nicaragua and being like, this is the craziest thing that has happened in the world. And so Messi now being a part of that is Huge so this is one half of the bracket as we mentioned So it'll be LA FC Miami if that's the case Vancouver and then Pumas are all of Valencia Pumas leading to zero in that leg on the other side Yes, no, no that this reminds me of like the most concagaff thing that ever happened to me with the USMNT When we played Cuba at Cayman Islands It reminds me of the most concaged thing that ever happened to me with the USMNT when we

played Cuba at Cayman Islands. Do you remember that game? Oh, Cuba. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Cuba in the Cayman Islands. Yeah. Oh, no, like high school field with no stands. Well, I think-

It was the best and the worst. I think Canada hosted a home game at IMG in Bradenton for 2022 World Cup qualifying against like Bahamas or Bermuda and won 13-0. And that again was like, I could have walked up to the field and recorded the game with the camcorder like 1996. And that would have been the broadcast of the game. Just imagine a high school field in the Cayman Islands. Just imagine.

It sounds like a dream. Anyone could have just walked by and said, oh, there's Christian Pulisic playing a Nations League quarterfinals or something like that. I don't even remember. So the other side of the bracket, Club America smoked Chivas in their rivalry game. We mentioned Seattle Cruises all. We did not really talk about Cincinnati Tigres. And I think the awosium thing I sort of got into, but Cincinnati were fantastic for 45

minutes in this game. This was one where I do think they were really hurt by the lack of cohesion as a group, the lack of the moment of season they're in. Their high line of confrontation dropped and dropped and dropped as this game went along. And then you look at it and one of the cliches in this that you go to is depth and substitutes. And so for, I think it was Aziel Herrera, I was trying to find the name and remember, sub Don first touch goal, second touch assist.

And that was in the 65th minute and you're looking at a Cincinnati team that doesn't have the same depth, can't bring on the same options. Origano was fantastic in the first half, Kubo was pretty good off the bench but like you're taking out Bucca in a really big moment, one of your best defensive pieces, one of your players who has the ability to slow the other teams attack and you could not stop the bleeding as it went along and it was like you know 10 minutes of chaos and all of a sudden this series is over where as usual top-end talent Cincinnati were as good. High-level moments, the way they want to play, all of it was there. They just didn't have the depth of the

energy to keep up. And it's really unfortunate because I think in September, they will be a team that could get there against the Tigres. Coming back to the Liga MX market and the death and the roster and the salaries, I'm pretty sure that 99% of people listening to this, they don't know who Osile Herrera is.

And Osile Herrera is a fringe, kind of not lately, Mexican national team player, especially on the youth teams. But Tigres had one good season with Atlas and then Tigres went to Atlas and paid like $15 million for him. It's like pocket change for Tigress. That's the problem that we're facing with MLS and Liga MX. And it's going to sound like a broken record and it sounds like excuses. But like you said, Tigress.

Okay, it's like imagine Cincinnati if they have Anne van der to sub Evander with. Right. They have another Origano on the bench to sub Origano with. That's what Tigre has. And they have two or three players per position. But again, now I'm gonna be critical of Cincinnati. I think that they sat too low too early.

And going back to what I said about Seattle and Vancouver. You are one zero up. Just keep the pressure on. I know you don't have the men, but you have the talent. Evander Orellano, you have the talent to hurt a Tigres team that now is chasing the game and it's leaving spaces in the back. But you decided to just park the bus and don't use the talent and have the pelotas to go and find the second one before it was too late. They black out for 10 minutes, the avalanche came in, three goals, bye. Yeah.

I mean, but the other thing is when Elvis Powell is your first sub off the bench, like to have the energy Yeah, yeah, and the desire to do it now. I think for Cincinnati you look at it and you say Could you have been up to zero and like could you have taken advantage of another opportunity? and then that gives you the opening to try and get through it but Tigris is a monster to try and deal with and Cincinnati not able to get over the line and I think me and Tom did this last week like we both figured between these two teams one would get through and I think you saw why in the competition but then the fact that neither gets through sort of brings you back to reality of like this is where

it sits we've got some questions about 10k in the chat I think the questions are out there I am still impressed by him Ike in the chat. I think the questions are out there. I am still impressed by him. I think the way he moves, I think the way he strikes the ball, I think his willingness to cover some ground and go and find the game, but he's played with Origano for like a week. Like that's what you're still waiting to see

at its highest level. So I wouldn't give up on it at all. They definitely overpaid because they paid to get him in at the time they paid to get him in, but that doesn't make him bad or that doesn't mean that it's not gonna be worth it In the end the final one to talk about is they like Galaxy who found the goal finally for the first time Julian out a with the opener and I thought he was fantastic in this game

Yeah He did a lot of what Mickey Imani does and Imani right now out with injury so Harbour Miller getting the starts at right back. Yamane often will pinch in and become another center mid to change shape, to help them possess the ball, to allow center mids to push a little bit higher, but then also has to understand when to go outside. And so I thought you saw the balance in that first half. Aude comes inside on the goal. He had come inside a few other times,

but Diego Fugundes also likes to come inside sometimes. And Audey recognized the moments and he was able to give them the width to make Diego Fagundes dangerous. So I thought there was a lot to like for this galaxy team besides just the results. And they're gonna have to rely on some of these young pieces.

So you need to get the Isaiah parentes of the world some experience. And I think to do it in this setting and to have it be positive is really really Strong for this galaxy team. Can they compete with tigress? I have no idea I think I said to you before we got on this feels like a potential bloodbath the way the season has gone so far But your one thing for the galaxy is it's a little further down the road Can you get a little healthier? Can you get a little more cohesive?

it's a little further down the road. Can you get a little healthier? Can you get a little more cohesive? Christian Ramirez gets a goal off the bench. Like, can you get everyone sort of hitting and then stick to your guns when you go and play them? And it's a victory that also serves for morale. They've lost everything they've played until last night, right?

And we're talking on Tuesday, what will be a good choice for Vani to do with this game? And you said, well, just play the kids and see what happens, right? Or you say something like that. And then again, Miller, they had a good game, at least in the first half, on his debut at MLS last Sunday. And then again, Aude, who lost his starting role last season to Nelson for because of injury.

Now he has he finds the goal and he reminds everyone that what he's capable of. Important also for morale that Barry Peck and Christian Ramirez specifically scored so that gives you a boost and confidence you know. They have a tough tough matchup this weekend at Portland and we got to remember that it's three losses in three games. So I mean, yeah, play the kids. See what happens.

And you still have the talent with Peck, with Fagundes, with Cerrillo to help those kids out. And they all play great. Lepley, Miller, Yoshida bounced back. I thought he was terrible against um against san luis last last weekend i think he was the worst on that um back four of the galaxy and he had a good game parente had a great game with two assists yeah more minutes for serrillo to try to to cement himself at that as as the guy i think he's there to cover ground. And I think he's the guy.

Yeah. I think you saw in this game the way that midfield interacts. Obviously, he was the most senior player of the three. But you can see his confidence of he's happy to stroke the ball around the field. He doesn't feel stressed. It is why. And I still have some Brandon Cervani stock and love to see that he's playing for DC United.

But it's why this generation that came through at Dallas, the technique is such a high level that they can all play. Like Edwin Serio, whether he covers enough ground, wins enough tackles, there's questions. But you play him under pressure, he's going to keep possession. And I think that's the starting point. And now he's gotten comfortable enough with the game. And I think you saw a really good performance from him here of like understanding as the senior member now of that group

with no Mark Delgado available, no Brugman. And it won't be the case that he sort of understands how to run that whole part of the field. And that's huge for the Galaxy, cause they will need it. I, we got those GAM numbers, right? The Galaxy have no GAM and Doyle talked about changing goalkeeper to maybe try and generate some GAM. The quickest way to do it is cash first. And so they did it with Dayon. I wonder like

what it would be already to just call and be like, we'll take Harbor Miller. Like I understand that's not the point of all of this, but if you're another account or if you're another club You're like, you know, we can play an MLS, you know, he's got a high future he's a really dangerous attacking fullback and the galaxy are desperate and Like is this a way that you could take advantage of that and then the galaxy get to fill whatever it is You know a million dollars whatever it is and some level of sell-on at this point I think we'll start to see teams play with this stuff a little bit more as they get used to it.

So that's our CONCACAF right there. A lot to dig into, a lot of excitement. Congrats once again to Vancouver. Let's do a little weekend preview action. We've got a Canadian national team roster and of course, Ali Curtis coming up on the podcast. We sort of dug through some must-watch games for fans this weekend.

We put down a couple that we're both super excited about and to talk about, and let's go through them. So I think I started with San Diego Columbus. Like I cannot wait to see what does Mikey Varas the San Diego team look like against Wilfred Nance? You know what you're gonna get from Nance? Does San Diego team look like against Wilfred Nance? You know what you're going to get from Nance. Does San Diego open up and match them? One of the big notes is Patty McNair went off hurt against RSL.

If you look at the passing pattern for this team, their best build outs come from McNair at right back playing into central midfield and then they go from there. So they're already missing Andres Reyes. Now they're missing McNair. Is that the chip in the armor for this San Diego team that has only conceded once in their entire history? And can they find a way to balance those issues with then opening up and going and playing against Columbus is to me, one of the most fascinating

questions of the weekend. Absolutely. And it's, it's two things with San Diego. We gotta remember actually on the pre-season, and we're talking about this on Tuesday, when you ask, especially Mike Ibarra, hey, what's your identity going to be? Like, what are we going to expect from this team? And he said, no, it's on our DNA to have the ball. We want to mimic Columbus.

And they named Columbus crew. We want to be what Nancy does with Columbus. And now they're going to try to look themselves in the mirror and try, and now they're going to play against the team that they want to be, which is fascinating. And it's funny because it feels like it's again, it's like a broken record with San Diego. It's like, okay, first test.

Yeah, right. Your first week one against the champion. What are you going to do? Okay. No, no, no. Week two. Now it's the real test at home with the nerves, with a San Luis team that it's difficult to crack.

Okay. Okay. Well, no, no, no. Now the real test comes on week three. They're playing at Salt Lake City and with the altitude it's a difficult field. Okay, okay, no, no. Now it's Columbus.

Now it's the real test. So I mean it's... It's super Mario Brothers. You got to beat every boss to get to the end. We're waiting for the housing. It's like 34 weeks of tests, obviously. I think it's the center back. I mean the defense and the center back, it's a real issue because like you said, there's no Andres Reyes still available.

But in McNerney South, so now they're going to play with McVay and a roster pick. First one roster pick as they're starting centerbacks. No Chuky Lozano at least for another two, three weeks. But I'm going to give credit to Mike Ivaras and I'm sure that they're going to try to do this. They're going to try to keep their identity and it doesn't matter that it's the team that they want to be in front of them. They are going to try to boss the midfield, try to build from

the back, pressure Columbus and try to dominate possession. Again, like they said, it doesn't matter against who. Where we're playing, when we're playing, we're going to keep doing our thing. And I'm really excited to see what Sandigo can be and do against the team that they look forward to be. Yeah. And I think if they do that, then we're all going to be lucky as fans watching the game. Like that's the exact soccer we want to watch.

Of note, Taha Barun, heavy minutes in the CONCACF Champions Cup game midweek. You know I'm a huge Taha Brun fan. I'm hoping for the best. I'm hoping he now gets inserted into the rotation and gets an opportunity. Of course, Columbus a little bit thinner of a roster and so if Wilford Nantes trusts you and you're in, you're playing a ton. If not, it's hard to scratch into that top 16 or 17 on his team So something to watch out for for this game. I could have put this in a better order I'm gonna try now and go to an actual schedule and look at the schedule So of note for everyone this weekend actually a spaced out schedule two games at 230 on Saturday a 345 game

Then you've got Saturday night full of action, 7.30 through 10.30 Eastern time kickoffs. And then three separate windows on Sunday as well. So an opportunity to sort of sit down and watch a lot of these games. If you are not, subscribe to our Patreon to get you access to our Discord. That's where we've got our live chat hanging out.

People were enjoying CONCACAF all weekend, or all week so far this week. NWSL is going to be fun in there as well coming up this weekend. So make sure to subscribe. It gets you access to our Discord and that's how you get in there. It also gets you access to our depth charts as well. I did have that opening game on Saturday on the list. Red Bulls against Orlando. I think these are two of the teams, Orlando a little shaky, but I think you see a lot of the positives of what they've tried to build.

Posilic has fit in perfectly already. And the Red Bulls, they get the unfortunate news that Lewis Morgan is undergoing surgery. He'll be out for six weeks, which is massive for this team, but they are deeper this year. I think they are more dangerous. I think they are more prepared to cover an injury like this

with Julian Hall being fully inserted into the group with Chapa Moteng being available for them and being a more dynamic, throwing a versatile player who can push the front line, drop off, create a little bit. And of course having Forsberg in there as well. So I'm excited to watch this one because I think these are two of the teams we're going to be talking about for a home playoff game when we get all the way towards the end of the season.

Yeah, and it's a game that promises a lot of goals, especially because Orlando has shown that they have big, big defensive troubles. Gaiusse seems to have lost a step or two. No, Gaiusse just does have lost a step or two. So we know. No, Gaiusse just does this for three games every five months. I've talked with people in Orlando and I think this time it's a little bit different. They're not as confident. That he's going to bounce back. This season that he's going to bounce back as he normally does. Hopefully they are wrong because I think Gallese can still be above

average keeper on MLS. I mean he's been for the last few years one of the best. And when he's on he's a match winner. Yeah absolutely but Orlando like you said I love Ojeda. I think that's a fantastic number 10 that he can also play on the wing but I love that he's like now playing as a number 10. Pasalic has been fantastic, a great left foot. At the end with Orlando, and it's funny because everything that I hear that I talk with people in Orlando is that during the week in training, like Muriel, it's incredible. Like he's like amazing. Yeah. He's like, if you see him training and during the week, it's incredible. He's like, amazing.

He's like, if you see him training, and during the week, he's like, okay, this guy is gonna score 25 goals as our number nine. But then the weekend comes, he sometimes plays, he doesn't play, he hasn't shown to be as much as a professional as he should be, especially when you got here, he got a little bit weight on him, to put it lightly.

But I do think that Orlando has a real issue with the center back pairing. I think Oscar Pareja, Papi Pareja, has made it clear with the choices that he has made. So I think this is a susceptible team with a Red Bull squad that when Forsberg is on, he's a game changer. And I'm not like again saying something that nobody knows. It's something obvious, but we've talked about like how important it's when a player like Forsberg can make or break your season. It's like we were saying with New York City right now with Maxi Morales. It's like it's Maxi Morales or boss, right? And I don't think that's the case for Red Bulls, but it makes a big difference when Forsberg is healthy on, and now you have a partner up top like Chopa Moutin

that seems like he can do very well on this league. I still don't like the fact that he's a DP, but if he keeps scoring goals, yeah, you know, it's a good thing for them. Robin Janssen back for Orlando, which is a huge help. And I think you saw in the NYCFC game, even though they lost, they were not the same structural breakdowns on the goals as what you had seen against, obviously, Philly, which was a train wreck.

And then the goals they conceded against TFC as well. So I think this is going to be a really fun one to watch. Then Saturday night gets started with Charlotte against FC Cincinnati The question can Charlotte bounce back from the loss to Miami up the player for over a half and for Cincinnati They struggled against Philadelphia knowing coming off Concordia champions cup Like I think their depth will be questioned, but they know this is probably a big game in the Eastern Conference. So this is one to watch to sort of see what you get. And again, from this week, as you say, not saying anything new, look, Orojano's must watch. Like if he's on the field, he's must watch.

Evander's in that category as well. And so if they're going to get starts, like you have to put these games on. Yeah. And now Saha also is a must watch, right? And we talk about Saha and Charlotte on Tuesday and what we thought they did wrong last weekend on MLS, especially like how Saja got double teamed sometimes and he didn't know how to get off the pressure and he didn't know how to assist or get in touch or linked with like Pebiel or make a very service to to acumen like Charlotte needs to service acumen. We already know the presence that he has in the box, but he needs service.

Right. And, and I think that Saha showed a little bit of his week. I mean, he's a fantastic player. He's going to be a player that is going to make the difference. He already made the difference and on first game that he played in week two with the goal and the assist, but he's a winger, right? And they show that if you can double team him, triple team him, and he doesn't know how to get off the pressure or use that or the team to use that spaces that that double team or triple team is going to go against Saja and if the whole

Charlotte game is going to go through Saja they're going to be easy to to to like you know to how do you say in English I'm losing my my I need help here they're easy to predict so they're easy to predict yes easy to predict so I think we saw a Charlotte team that if they play that way They're easy to predict. But if they can get Pet BL more involved in Saja to be more in sync and link Yeah, before he gets that double or triple team and again service Ackerman in the box I think the team can be really good. We didn't talk about it as much but they did bring in a left back This week, so they brought in Suleyman Dumbia a left back for on loan For the season from standard liege originally out of the PSG Academy. I think that is a little bit of a sign that

They are looking for other spacing options as well. Tim Ream is not going to make the overlapping run Which doesn't change the defense and how they have to react to Zaha and I do think we talked about a little bit on Tuesday I do think there's some conversation there of like how can they change things up a bit? The other thing to note is that next week there's full MLS games during concat nations league. So Patrick Oshman won't be available He has started every game at center forward I don't know if Edan Toklamati gets the start at center forward I don't know if maybe they slide Zaha or Abbada into that space and bring Karwin Vargas on the field Like it is gonna be we'll talk about it next week

It's gonna be a weird weekend of MLS with national team stuff and all of that But that's a big one because not just have they left Patrick Ajamon as the starting forward and not brought a DP, they haven't really put depth in that position. And so this would be a good time to try and steal a result and to get one against Cincinnati would be huge as well. The next one on Saturday night, FC Dallas, Vancouver, we've got the two perfect teams left. Vancouver and Philly. Both of them are on my list. I think for Vancouver, it's like, how do you come off this game? How do you now ride this momentum?

I wanted to put out the meme of Legally Blonde where for Jesper Sorensen and be like, Concaf, is it hard? Like I've just gone, I beat Soprisa in the first round, which is not an easy tie. Then went undefeated in MLS then knocked off a Giant in Monterey and if they can go to Dallas and get a result in this one It is going to be huge for this team so to see them continue and then Dallas

They're must watch because they're either gonna give up goals or score goals 3-3 against Colorado 3-1 loss with the eight-minute span against Chicago in the second game like Dallas is must swatch right now Absolutely and with Dallas it feels like they're they're a very unpredictable They have like this purse for good and for bad When and we saw it against Colorado against Houston on week one when they won in Houston Like for five minutes you get that Lucho Acosta spark. And then Peter Musa is so big, but he's so, for me, Peter Musa is like Jokic. He's a big, big man that can assist. Yeah.

Like the pass of the assist of Musa to Lucho Acosta on one of the goals against Colorado was something that just Lucho is the one that should have been doing those things to Moussa. But again, they're not consistent. And that's the problem with Dallas. When Lucho Acosta and Peter Moussa don't have those links and those sparts that doesn't last normally a lot of minutes. This team is very susceptible to lose the battles on midfield and receive again a lot of goals.

They've gotten seven goals against in three games. So that's very concerning. And makes it must watch as well. Vancouver trying to stay perfect. Then on Sunday, Philadelphia hosts Nashville. They try and remain perfect as well. I like this Nashville team. I've enjoyed watching them so far.

It is not as dangerous as I'd like it to be, but I think they are a very cohesive unit. I think Tagseth is the type of player I like, quick, clean in possession, sort of keeps the game moving, keeps it connected. Qwossum looked really good on the weekend. And my hope is at some point, all of this opens up Hanimukhtar to be his best self.

We haven't seen it like a year and a half. At this point, I don't think it's gone. And I just think at some point, you're hoping teams get a little more scared of the other pieces. And that's what opens it up for them. But they're gonna have to go in and try and slow down this Philadelphia team.

And I don't know if that means you sit in and try and force Philadelphia to have the ball. That goes against the identity BJ Callahan is trying to build and it goes back to the San Diego thing of like, you've set out this goal. When are you gonna step away from it? When are you going to be realistic about these moments? This is one of those big games to ask that question of like what are you willing to do? They were behind too

early against Red Bull to really have that because then they had to go and get the game and Red Bull sat in a little bit more but now against Philadelphia from the start you sort of get to set the tone. I'm curious to see what BJ Callahan does. Good thing for, for BJ is like, like you said, we haven't seen the best of honey and some storage, so that's a good thing. You got your first two goals. You got the PKs that they missed, which is not good, but, but we know what

they're capable of, right? And I don't think we are ever going to see what the, that MVP campaign that we saw went from, from honey two years ago, but he's still a difference maker. Right. It's interesting what, and this is a sign of a good head coach or at least a head coach that is willing to try to get from the squad that he was given the best.

Like we already know BJ Callahan is from the Greg Berhalter tree, right? And that 4-3-3, that tactical system that they're in love with. And when he came to Nashville, he said, I cannot play a 4-3-3 here, right? So he switched it up to a 4-4-2 and it's starting to gel. But yet you haven't got sealed the contribution from Surridge and Muktar. I think they still have, they need another piece of midfield that can relieve that pressure from Muktar to having to drop all the time. And I mean, we can go back.

I think the number is crazy. Since Nashville started as an MLS team, we had to remember that Muktar was their first DP. He's been there the whole time. It's an absurd number, like 65% of the goals that Nashville has cored in on every competition has been a contribution from Muktar, which is insane. So they're like, it's Muktar's Mugtar plus 10 honey dependent. So I think they need another piece on midfield where I really liked tactically

what BJ is done. And they're showing that they can be at least a bubble team to make the, the plane or even the playoffs in on the Eastern conference and Eastern conference that is really hard or it looks tougher than the West this year. Yeah. And the Philadelphia team that I didn't really have in that calculation and now they're leading Yeah, and it feels like they've nailed their next set of signings and everything's going right in the right direction They're playing young pieces as well, right Westfield giving them big performances Quinn Sullivan's been awesome so far to start the year.

They're really fun to watch. There's a ton of energy around the way they play, and I think this is gonna be a really good matchup as well. And then closing out, the weekend, Sunday Night Soccer, you will be there, Atlanta against Miami. Some big questions for this Atlanta team. They haven't scored in two straight games. Emmanuel Lateloth, as we talked about on Tuesday,

in concussion protocol. I haven't seen an update, looking around, didn't see any reports at all either way. I don't think that bode super well and then Jamal Thier was injured and was unavailable last week for this team. So center forward could be a huge question mark for them against the Miami team where I assume Rokos Rios-Novos will be in goal because Ustari picked up the red cards that will be suspended for this game. Drake Callender still coming back from injury.

And so it feels like- Is he? Is he? He is not the starter right now. He did not come off the bench in the last game. Can we talk about that? Sure. Can we talk about that please? Go for it.

What in the world is happening with Callender? And I can tell you what I know. Which is it's going back for weeks already. And yeah, I think Rocco Rios is going to start. I don't think there's any doubt about it. Is Calendar going to be on the bench? Because he was on the bench in Houston, and then he wasn't on the bench because he was on the bench in Houston. Yeah. And then he wasn't on the bench this last week.

So what I know, and I can tell this is what sources tell me, is that Mascherano told Kalander, Ustad is my keeper. Even when you come back, Ustad is my goalkeeper. Obviously Kalander is not happy about it, right? Because he said, well, I mean, even Kalender is one of the captains of the team, or at least he was on the field last year after Messi and I think Busquets or Alba. He's one of the captains of the group.

And Kalender, I think, to his point, is like, hey, I shouldn't lose my job because of an injury. Right? And then this weird, Mascherano said something, Kalender said this on Friday before the Houston game, Mascherano told the press on their weekly media availability pregame, Kalender told me that he's not ready. That was, I was told by people that that wasn't exactly 100% truth. And on Sunday, Kalender was ready on the bench against Houston. And then he's not on the bench last week.

So I think the injury thing has been a kind of an excuse to find a solution. I will be shocked if Callender stays in Miami for the rest of the season. I think they're trying to to find a solution. He wants to start, but Mascherano wants Ustadhi to be his number one. And Callender is not happy about that. But I don't know what they're going to do. I mean, who's going to be on the bench this weekend? I don't know what they're going to do. I mean, who's going to be on the bench this this weekend? I don't know.

Yeah. The so I have the same feeling and from people I've talked to as well about chopping him around and seeing what they can get. Because the other thing is, Ustar is part of this like, yeah, I'll go play with Messi. And Drake Calendars had some really good years. You're talking about goalkeeper of the year finalists. He was he is on the national team He's on the nation's league 60 man for the US and yet isn't generated camp and he was in January camp Yeah, and yet is not getting appearances for his own team The issue right now is there are not a lot of MLS teams that need starting goalkeepers, which has not always been the case

There are a few, I think Sporting Kansas City's in that conversation. I think Houston should be knocking down the door. He fits their system perfectly. You don't have to use the international roster spot because he's domestic. As we know, they sold one permanently and are always chasing that.

He makes a ton of sense there. And then you could say there are some other teams where maybe you're thinking Oh, we could just make this position a little bit stronger Or maybe you're making future moves if you are you Chicago thinking that at some point Brady's gonna leave Do you make that move now? Whatever it is? I would assume he will find a starting spot in Major League Soccer and that it's not on Inter Miami this year I'm glad we're both on the same page with that one.

It's a huge question mark for Miami either way though. And reminder, this is of course the revenge game from the playoffs last year. We had Atlanta beat them. I think the regular season as well. This was like a three, two game open electric stuff. The crowd's gonna be awesome at Mercedes-Benz. So that's all for us here.

Real quick, let me plug, let me plug, let me plug. Apple TV, Sunday Night Soccer, on the Spanish broadcast, we start at 6 p.m. Eastern Time with La Previa, and then at 7 p.m. Eastern Time, me on the field in the sidelines with Sami Sadofnik and Diego Valeri, El Capitan, on the Spanish broadcast. Don't watch Weeby, watch me. Watch McKelly.

Don't watch Weeby, watch McKelly. We got a lot of people reaching out saying, you have to have McKelly back on the show, and now I have you back on the show. Weeby doesn't come on, you know? Maybe second parts are not as good, so hopefully we deliver today. Yeah, me.

The sequel's stronger. Now that we've really gotten our flow, season two is always better We've got Nations League coming up next week Canada put out their roster the final roster to come out Just continues to get stronger and stronger under Jesse Marsh. I talked about it when promised David You know officially committed to Canada and of course Jebison the big one So that attack continues to grow. This Canada roster is awesome. Ismael Kone on loan is starting to get minutes at Rens.

You've got Derek Cornelius and Mois Bombito who are dominant. There is so much talent in this group. It is so deep. They could legitimately win this thing. They got runners up, what, two years ago when they lost to the U S they haven't technically won anything since the 2000 gold cup You don't get anything for winning qualifying which a lot of Canada fans talked about going into 2022 of like where the kings of concaf We were the first place team in qualifying. You just don't get a trophy for it So this is a huge opportunity and a huge moment. Of course, Mexico trying to reestablish themselves There are not very many meaningful games left for these

Squads before the World Cup. So this is a big week coming up We'll have your coverage here at soccer wise US Open Cup kicking off next week as well We will talk about will continue to cover cocky F Champions Cup. Let's go menace the more menace My guys a lot of guys on that group Oz see Ozzy's the one you're going with me Well, Ozzy Dax Sasha and BWP. Yeah, but you know, I'll see I said it I think one AJ De La Garza is playing I think yeah, but I'm talking about the people that work with me I know I'm talking about the people that I like in the world as well

Benny Falha we're gonna play as well. So a lot to look forward to. If you're listening to the podcast, Ali Curtis coming up in just a moment. All right. Well, we like to cover soccer at all levels, of course, here at Soccer Wise. And it is the season of kickoffs. We saw Major League Soccer kickoff. We saw USL Championship kickoff, USL League One, Super League, NWSL around the corner, and MLS Next Pro as well. So to talk about it, we have the Senior Vice President

of Sporting Development at Major League Soccer, and Mr. Ali Curtis, someone I've known for a long time. Ali, excited to have you on the show. Excited to be on the show. Thanks, David, it's good to hear your voice, see you. It's good to be on the show. Thanks David. It's good to hear your voice see you. It's good to be here. I go all the way back to my first broadcasting job of professional soccer was the New York Red Bulls 2 team that you launched as a sporting director. You had the vision back then to push something that we wouldn't really see in soccer and now it feels like you've taken sort of that side of yourself and it's what you're working on full-time. What do you think about when you think

about your new role, your role in at MLS and sort of how you've tried and want to push the game forward in the US? Well that was a fun team I'll say because you know I was on the front end working at the league office on kind of trying to build You know what that would look like and then I quickly moved over as a sporting director and got a chance to work with some Amazing players and amazing staff. So you know that 2014 2015

timeframe was was really great, you know what we're seeing in MLS Next Pro and kind of, there's so many different touch points, but in soccer and how players develop, but everything's connected. And so, one of the beautiful things about MLS Next Pro is that you see some of the top young players that are playing in the game whether that's from the academy whether that they're on an MLS Next Pro contract or whether or not it's a player that's on an MLS contract that's being loaned over to Next Pro and seeing those guys week in and week out has really been

a lot of fun. We've seen a lot of progress and development so you, we're really excited about what's been going on. So from 10 years back, you said working on it from a league point of view, then from a club point of view, now back the league point of view. Where is the pathway in your mind of what you want it to be and sort of what are the next steps forward now? I think that like, you know, as a young person or as a young player, you're trying to find your way, you know, as a young person or as a young player, you're trying to find your way, you know, and that's not specific to soccer. You know, that's whether or not you want to be a doctor or a lawyer or someone in the

business world. And in order to kind of achieve and be the best version of yourself, it's important that that pathway is very clear in terms of what does it take to get from A to B to C and so on and so forth. And that's what we're trying to establish and continue to evolve in MLSNext Pro, especially as it pertains to people that want to make a living in the soccer world. And that's not specific to just players. It's also coaches. It's folks that work in the medical area, it's sporting staff, broadcast and media folks,

but as a young person, how and what do you do to develop and what's the next step going from the academy to MLS Next Pro, to MLS, to the national team, to potentially to other teams after that, we've tried to make the pathway very, very clear for players and I think when you have clarity, then you can focus on execution as a player and really reach your full potential.

Yeah, it was interesting to hear Paul Rothrock this weekend, I think, talked about him pushing into the first team and saying, it's not always easy, but as long as you keep working, you know you'll get your opportunity, but that now exists. And we talked about on SoccerWise, the Tacoma Defiance to Seattle connection and how it's helped Seattle have the ability

to build rosters that have a Jesus for era and a Paul areola because You've got a Georgie Mnungu and a Paul Roth Rock Making a difference for you and filling out those rosters as MLS tries to compete and have their teams compete across what feels like now 15 different competitions sometimes yeah absolutely, and There's a lot of different competitions. There's a lot of ways to kind of make it to the first team, but MLS Next Pro, I remember when I was, I always view things through the lens of sometimes it takes two years, two and a half years to really

kind of make it. You see it in college where players are kind of really blossoming and taking a leadership role kind of in their junior year. You see that in high school as well. You see it sometimes it takes, and you see it in other sports, it takes you know two to three years, but if you if there's repetition and you're in a professional environment week in and week out, that really helps. And what our clubs have been committed to is creating as professional environment as possible so that these players are challenged on a week in, week out basis. They're close to it all, whether that's the academy or whether that's the first team,

so they can see it, they can feel it, and it's competitive and it's an optimal environment for them, like I said before, to be the best versions of themselves. And the player that you mentioned before, Paul Rothrock, I think I may have drafted him in Toronto and he may have been there for a year. You should have had that research. Yeah, so you're seeing an MLS Next Pro team in Tacoma providing an opportunity for a player that maybe didn't work out in one club, but maybe it works out in another club. It's the same thing that kind of transpired to me when I launched the Red Bull 2 back in 2015 where it wasn't working out for a player like Aaron Long and

brought him into that team. He was able to play there for a couple years, signed to the first team, eventually become defender of the year, playing a World Cup and all those types of things. It has been fascinating to watch as MLS Next Pro has grown. You mentioned it's not just about players. I say this all the time. More soccer jobs is great, to have more teams. And now we are seeing as the expansion continues. So we have seen the two independent clubs in Chattanooga and Carolina become a part

of things. They'll play in US Open Cup once again, which is very exciting for everyone. And now the conversation around the next stage of expansion. What do you sort of in terms of the league office look at when you're looking at what the right group will be to add to MLS next pro and to add into that ecosystem? I think the form, you know, there really been three pillars that MLS has really looked at as it pertains to expansion, you know, dating back to when the league launched

back in 96, and to now, and I don't think that those have changed. You really are looking at ownership group and what that looks like, stadium plan and what's the plans for stadiums so that a team can have a home and a place to play, and then what's the market like. And nowadays, because MLS has thrived so well over the last 29 plus years, there's so many

different markets that can support professional soccer and that are good for professional soccer. So you're really evaluating, you know, what's the stadium plan, at least the long-term stadium plan, and then what's the ownership group, how engaged will they be, you know, what are their plans? And so, you know, that, those three pillars have kind of been the blueprint. And we've, we're, we have a very aggressive and optimistic plan in terms of what expansion looks like. We want to grow the league numerically in terms of the number of teams. We want to grow our footprint so we can be in other, call it primary, secondary,

and tertiary markets. We've got a number of other teams that are going to enter the league, but a lot of this is a function of, it's one thing to get the team in and then it's going to take some time for those teams to build a stadium and those types of things. But we're very excited about Grand Rapids. We're excited about Connecticut. We're excited about Jacksonville and Cleveland. You know, good ownership groups, really, really dynamic owners that are excited. And that will add a lot to our board and to our league.

And it'll be fun to be in good, and it's important for us to be in those markets. So that's the tip of the iceberg. We have very aggressive plans to expand MLS Next Pro in a meaningful way. So we're busy all the time, but it's a good kind of busy. How does that central role then from a league point of view operate in terms of balancing having development be key to MLS Next Pro and then having these clubs that are these standalones that are going to attempt to build robust fan bases

and push for championships and all of that. Yeah, I think that both are super important in terms of, you know, even when you think of development, you have to always play to win, you know? And then all of the conversations that we've had with different ownership groups, they have an appetite to develop players as well. And that's important. And so, you know, it's, you know, life is, you know, soccer is no different than life,

that it's about balance. And so having that balance of development, but then also doing everything we can to win, call it on Friday, Saturday, Sunday, is going to be ultra important. It's important for our fans and to have viable clubs that are doing all the things necessary off the field. But then also kind of getting the business done on the field is important as well. So finding that balance is something that we kind of manage on a day-to-day basis, week-to-week basis, and we build that kind of in our tactical

and strategic plans and have those conversations. But I think all of our teams wanna win, and that's where it starts and then it's about kind of building a roster both on the short term and in the long term. We got on the field last week first week of action in MLS Next Pro. What has you most excited on the field for 2025? Man I love seeing you know these the next, this is the next generation of stars. And so it's just, you know, the first games have just started, so we're gonna see a lot more

than what we just saw this past weekend, but they're exciting, you have a lot of hungry players. Coaches want to employ different game models and, you know, seeing the diversity of play is really important and it's exciting. So it's really about kind of seeing you know these hungry players that kind of want to make it to to improve, to develop, make it potentially to other levels or other leagues and other teams is all very exciting. So

you know right now it's it's only week one. So it's, you know, we've got a lot of league played it. What, one of the other things for MLS Next Pro that you have been aggressive about is using it as a space to test different concepts, whether it's rule changes or ideas around the game. What should fans know about what to watch for in 2025 and how these conversations go of like,

what's the process of from ideation into implementation? Yeah, so we were implementing a rule called only the captain and that's really to improve communication between players and the referee and then also kind of improve kind of the image of our game in terms of, you know, especially some of those instances where you see, you know, tons of, it's an emotional game, it's an emotional sport, and it should always stay that way, and we're not trying to change that.

We just want to evolve certain things. And so, you know, from this rule change, it will really help improve some of those instances where the referee is mobbed or there's those types of situations where you've got tons of players kind of all congregating. So we're trying to reduce those instances. We look at all different areas and parts of the game.

We have an innovation committee where it's a group of chief soccer officers as well as coaches. Before we implement any new rule, what we do is we convene that innovation group. We speak to a number of different CSOs. We speak to other coaches. A lot of times we'll engage the federations as well, but we really try to incorporate as many people as possible in

thoughts and ideas on potential new rules. We have a group that works with an MLS that does a ton of different research on data to get background, and then we try to have those discussions with the governing bodies, which is FIFA and IFAB. And then we kind of let it go and we test it. And so, you know, with the off-field treatment rule, we feel really good about that. The time substitution rule,

those rules we think are good for player safety. We think they're good for reducing gamesmanship. So we're excited about it. But also just in terms of our competition format, which is really exciting. We've got, you know, I think it's called, I want to say it's called choose your own opponent or pick your own opponent and it's for our playoff format and so you know the top teams that finish the regular season they're able to select who they play against rather than the standard you know want the the number one seed plays you know the the worst seed so to speak

so we think that works really well for us. We think other leagues should adopt it, should adopt it. And we're excited. It also makes becoming the captain and choosing the captain, by the way, very interesting. I hadn't thought of it before. And someone said it to me last week of like, if only the captain gets to yell at the referee becomes competitive of who gets to be that captain. becomes competitive of who gets to be that captain. No, it's always competitive who wants to be the captain, but the referees encourage to still maintain communication with all players. It's out there on the field, it's important that the referee and players are able to kind of build this, have this dialogue

and have a conversation throughout the course of the game. It's really some of those tense moments and certain situations where you want to engage it. And you know they tested this in some of the European competitions last year went really well. I think in the Bundesliga it's in or in Germany it's in you know the first division second division also in women's soccer. So it's gone well. We're not first to the market, at least on this particular rule, but we're also very, we're bullish on it. One of the things I wanted to ask you about

was we saw sort of last year, teams trying to move players between Academy, MLS Next Pro, but mainly MLS Next Pro into the first team. And there are limitations on how often you can bring players up and move them around and obviously the famous story of Columbus not having a goalkeeper and having their whole issue. How do you sort of plan out as a league from a big picture point of view of what the flow of players can be and how you're trying

to give young players enough opportunity without sort of filling rosters incorrectly. Yeah, you know ideally we it comes from place of you know how can we have you know our top players optimizing every single meaningful opportunity and so you really want your top players in your academy, in your MLS Next Pro team, and in your first team. You want those players playing in all the games, in all the top games. And so it starts there, and it's important that, at least from a Next Pro perspective, that we're connected with MLS Next and what that scheduling and what that schedule looks like. We're also connected with MLS and what that schedule looks like so we can optimize what

the best schedule is for MLS Next Pro because we have players that play in MLS and then we have players that play from the academy. So really we try to optimize the schedule but then there's a number of different variables. It's not just the games that happened in Next or the games that happened in MLS. we try to optimize the schedule, but then there's a number of different variables. It's not just the games that happened in Next or the games that happened in MLS. There's national team call-ups, there's injuries, there's all those types of things. And then what's also most important is that we have a really great game, and it's really meaningful. And so our rules and our roster rules have to be flexible enough so that we can accommodate those players,

but also they need to be constructed in such a way that it encourages the team to put the very best product on the field. And that process is a process of starting there, but then also engaging our teams and speaking to coaches and CSOs and other people within the soccer environment and landscape so that we can, you know, put our best foot forward in having, you know, having a great game, having a great season and having a great league. For you, when you see the young players that have come into MLS Next Pro, whether it's Academy players making their pro debut in Next Pro or Next Pro players making their MLS debut, What's the sense of pride? What's the feeling as you're sort of watching all of these young players develop and sort of take advantage of the pathway you've built? I think that like there's, it's exciting. You know, I think that all of us that work in the space want to make a difference and want to have an impact. And so it's exciting to see, especially, you know, to see people improve, whether that's,

you know, towards the latter end of their career, because we're always learning and developing, or seeing a young person really take to coaching and learning and developing and they become something even more. They're really kind of coming into their own both on the field and off the field. I think that's great and we have a number of different dedicated people that work in this industry and they work at our clubs, they work at the league office, they work in different media folks, and they're all kind of dedicated to trying to improve and trying to have an impact. And so I use the word exciting, and there's probably a better way to describe it. And you feel a different way or a certain way in different moments.

And it's very rewarding. And I've been able to experience it now on a lot of different levels. As a player, having worked in the league office and then having worked at a number of different clubs and those clubs having really super talented young players, it's been very, very rewarding for me. And personally, I hope that I've been able to have a positive impact on those players, and they've had a very positive impact on me. Last year, you handed the trophy to North Texas

in their victory. You've come a long way from being a player on the field, Duke, and then going into the pro ranks all the way through as a CSO and now league executive. What's it like to be that person? The person who hands the trophy over as that team wins and sort of have that responsibility of helped put it all together at this point in your career. Well, usually it's, uh usually it's usually in the winter, so it's kind of cold and chilly.

Um, it's, listen, we've got, we have, I've been fortunate to work with some incredible people and I continue in different roles that I've had and then in the role that I have now. I work with a lot of great people and I know how hard it is to get to win a trophy. And so, you know, it is an honor, to be honest with you, to be able to hand a trophy to someone, to shake someone's hand, because you know how much hard work that players and those coaches

and those club staff they put into it. It's a long journey and so you know if you're honored to be able to hand a trophy over to someone that's a really special moment and you know you so you know it's it's I keep using the word exciting it's fun it's amazing and keep using the word exciting. It's fun. It's amazing. And, you know, it really is a recognition of all the, all the hard work of so many, so many people. So really, really special moments.

Well last year it was North Texas against Philadelphia, two of the soccer hotbeds, unbelievable playoff run from Philly, an unbelievable finish from North Texas to win it all. And Ollie Curtis was the one to hand it over at the end, the senior vice president of sporting development at Major League Soccer, one of the best minds in the game. So thank you for taking the time to join us here at SoccerWise, and we'll have to do this again soon. Appreciate you, David. Thanks, man. you