SoccerWise - Paul Tenorio On Kevin De Bruyne & Axel Schuster On Whitecaps Success & Future Stadium/Owner

Episode Date: April 17, 2025

Tom is out but the show goes on with a loaded Soccerwise episode. David is joined first by Paul Tenorio(The Athletic) to discuss where Kevin De Bruyne could land off the back of his reporting. And bigger picture where MLS stands in the push for signing players of his quality, the schedule change vote, and MLS's preparation around the World Cup. Then Vancouver Whitecaps CEO & Sporting Director Axel Schuster joins for a deep dive convo on a range of topics from their coaching change & on field success to the future of the club off the field through ownership changes & stadium plans.3:00 USOC Recap & Draw9:00 Paul Tenorio On Kevin De Bruyne’s Future36:23 Paul On Potential MLS Schedule Change45:25 Vancouver Whitecaps CEO & Sporting Director Axel Schuster51:50 Jasper Sorenson’s Influence & Moving On From Vanni Sartini1:04:20 Whitecaps Development Process1:12:20 Ryan Gauld Health Update1:16:40 Pedro Vite’s Future1:20:19 Process Of Sale Of The Whitecaps1:23:05 Details Around A New Vancouver Stadium Soccerwise Live 2pm ET Every Tuesday/Wednesday/Thursday on Youtube/Twitch/Twitter

Welcome everybody back to Soccer Wise. David Goss here with you for what is a packed episode. No Tommy scoops today. He's busy with some other stuff. So I was able to call in a few reinforcements and we have an incredible episode coming up for you We have one of our favorites, of course from the athletic Paul Tonorio our good friend He broke the news around the four MLS clubs that are in conversations with Kevin De Bruyne So Paul comes on to talk about KDB where his future could lie what it would mean for all these different clubs where his future could lie, what it would mean for all these different clubs, where MLS stands in trying to bring a player like that in

instead of Saudi Arabia in that conversation, all these other good talks, as well as some conversation about what happened coming out of the board of governors meeting and a potential schedule flip that was not voted through this time. So a really good conversation with Paul in just a moment. And then after that, we have the CEO and sporting director of the Vancouver

Whitecaps, Axel Schuster with us. The Whitecaps have been the story this year on and off the field quite honestly. And with his role as CEO of the entire organization and then sporting director on the soccer side, Axel Schuster was the perfect person to have on and talk to because we talked about the ownership change. We talked about the process, how it's affected the club. We talked about the news around the new stadium. We talked about the schedule change and how that could affect the new stadium, where that announcement came from. But we also talked about what Jesper Sorensen has brought,

the process from moving from Vanni Sartini to this new manager, the talent they've been able to unearth, their developmental process, and of course the challenge that now lies in facing Inter Miami in a CONCACAF Champions Cup, and the growth of the sport in Canada, and what it would mean to win that,

as well as of course the upcoming World Cup, the launch of NSL, a new women's professional soccer league that launched in Vancouver at BC Place last night and so much more. So it's a really good show because Tom was not here not doing a live show. It also means we're not going to dig in to some of the other big topics going on. So I think for starters, if you have missed the news, a heartbreaking story coming out of the Far East as the news came that Aaron Bupenza, former center forward

for FC Cincinnati, passed away in a tragic accident falling out of a roof on the 11th floor and passing away earlier today. So our hearts go out to his friends, his family, of course, anyone, especially in our little soccer community in the Cincinnati space that had a relationship with him or was able to cheer him on and support him on the field. Everyone hurting a little bit from this one. So we wanted to touch on that first. We of course have massive news around the US Open Cup coming out of the latest round, a round that was filled with late-grit game drama.

It felt like every single match last night went to penalty kicks or went to extra time. Some unbelievable results, the Chattanooga Red Wolves, a cup set over the Las Vegas Knights, Las Vegas lights, excuse me, in a penalty kick shootout. Tampa Bay Rowdies outlasting FC Naples here in Florida, nine to eight in the penalty kick shootout after a one-one draw all the way through stoppage time. Phoenix Rising beating another USL championship side

in a shootout themselves. Colorado Springs switchback were able to hang on against USL League 1-1 Knoxville SC for their progression into the next round. And that comes off the back of the first day of the third round where we saw a couple of cup sets. Ourselves, Union Omaha continue to be perfect against non MLS sides in their clubs history in US Open Cup beating San Antonio FC So USL League one against USL Championship 1-0 and AV Alta FC a brand new club launching this year

In USL League one out in California knocking off Orange County in a penalty kick shootout So that was all the action we saw. We just got the draw for the US Open Cup going into the next round. I highly recommend that you go look this up so you can read it because what we got in this draw is we got the next round but we also got the brackets and in the brackets we got the pods of the 14 setups so we know what the matchups would be and the hosting order for them into the round of 16. team setups so we know what the matchups would be and the hosting order for them into the round of 16.

So when you look at this 2025 US Open Cup draw, what you will see is you will see groups, groups that are named after US soccer legends, Kobe Jones, Landon Donovan, Clint Dempsey, Paul Calaguri, Casey Keller, whatnot. Inside of each of those groups, you have four teams. You have the two matchups in the round of 32, and then you have set the hosting order inside of those matchups for the round of 16. So that means we know exactly the pathway

at least to the quarterfinals. For all of the teams left, of course, a number of MLS teams, 16 of them. Now enter the competition and they all push into this portion of the competition. These games will be on May 6th and May 7th with the round of 16 on May 20th and May 21st. There are some tasty ones in there. Of course, you get San Jose against Sacramento. That's one that you're always going to be excited about. There are a couple of these local ones. A weird one in that same Casey Keller group is Tacoma. Defiance, of course, the MLS Next Pro side

for Seattle Sounders against the Portland Timbers because Seattle not paying in this competition. A tasty one. Phoenix Rising hosting the Houston Dynamo. The Dynamo, it sounds like are on the verge of adding another attacking piece. Signing an English forward, currently playing in Scotland with St. Myron in Toyasi Olusanya, a 27-year-old center forward, has nine goals on the season. So a nice little bonus or boost to the roster

for this Houston squad. And it sounds like he will join before the end of the Scottish season. So we'll be able to join pretty quickly with the window closing next week in Major League Soccer. But for the Houston Dynamo, a matchup against Pamo Dukas Phoenix team on the road. That is super special.

Louisville City hosting Minnesota United is one that I am excited about. Minnesota has been so good this year. We are working on an interview to cover this Minnesota team here at Soccerwise. They have been one of the best teams with a very unique style against the ball, very direct. Kelvin Yoboa has been awesome as has a lot of the talent on this team and they will face off against a Louisville City team that is the class of USL Championship and to do it at Lynn Stadium is going to be so fun to watch. St. Louis City hosting Union Omaha. So two of the newer clubs in the Midwest facing off against each other, which will be really

cool. Nashville hosts Chattanooga Red Wolves. So an all Tennessee match up there, the Tampa Bay Rowdies in that same group will host Orlando City. So could we get another Nashville Orlando knockout game, which have been pretty eventful over the last few years? Or do you get a situation where Tampa has the opportunity to host in a big game? We've got all North Carolina Set up in Clint Dempsey group with North Carolina Hosting Charlotte FC and DC United against Charleston battery on the other side of that a

Tasty USL set up here with Rhode Island Finalists last year. They will be opening their stadium right around this May 6th date a brand new stadium Tidewater Stadium right on the banks of the river in the Pawtucket area and they are hosting the New England Revolution So what a cool opportunity Connell Smith, of course a former Rebs player Everything's been trending up for this Rhode Island team early on playing a revs team struggling in MLS And then you get the Chicago fire against Detroit City on the other side of That Kobe Jones group so we've learned a lot here today

This is the obviously the largest draw we've had to understand what could happen going forward So I recommend going to the US soccer Article to find it. Of course, you should be following like at US Open Cup or OpenCup.us which has been a really cool spot to follow everything US Open Cup as well. So that is all of our current news let's get into our conversation with Paul Tenorio about Kevin De Bruyne, the schedule change and all things MLS. Tommy scoops out today so I had to go to the number one newsbreaker in North American soccer, Paul Tenorio the legend legend from the athletic, he's the one who had the story originally about KDV. Paul, thanks for elevating our game today. Yeah, yeah. That's a nice way of saying that like you

had to go to the bench. Which like it's funny like things come full circle because back in the day it was like you know we did the same thing to Sammy stay school, you know, and now I'm getting Sammy stay schooled by Tommy scoops. And I, you know what? It's an honor. It's an honor to get Sammy stay schooled by Tommy scoops. I will, I will gladly be, you know, the guy coming off the bench to replace a mustache like that. You could, uh, we, I could call you bird dog if you want, but that would really go back deep into the chambers. You know what?

You know, Sam's going to hate that I say this, but he he stole that from me like I sold him on doing the bird scooters And then he took us as as he typically does no you did you were the original bird guy was the original bird gang But you know what it wasn't the bird gang part. I told him I had done the scooter in California on a trip to see my friends. I I did bird around Venice Beach, and I I told him it was awesome. We were in Atlanta. I don't remember if it was All-Star or MLS Cup. No, I think it was Cup because we recorded a video of Sam. And so Sam, later that night, took a scooter and then it took off. And I've left it alone for years now. I've not said anything.

But now it's off your chest. But now it's off my chest and I'm sure that Sammy stays cool We'll give me a call to say that that's BS You know your your typical Tenorio trying to steal my thunder as usual, but whatever let it is what it is Sammy boy Well, I would say this first of all you went to Northwestern your capital J So you couldn't lie it would be physically impossible for you, right? And also like it wasn't telling him about the scooter that really was the bird gang right like Only Sam stays cool could take that and turn it into what it to into a movement into like I start

Here's the thing though I would say on the bird dog thing because we be the one who started calling him that I don't even know if we be Knows why he calls him that oh Boy, cuz that's a whole nother monsters like we yeah Yeah, well you wouldn't want it with that. We don't have time to get into his head on the show I'll tell you that much we we've got lots to talk about we have actual Schuster coming up later in the show Incredible interview sitting down with him a lot of really deep topics He obviously is a CEO and sporting director of a club that is currently on the verge of or working on a sale

Announcing stadiums playing in a concaved Champions Cup semi-final There's a little bit to talk about in there and that was gonna be the bulk of or working on a sale, announcing stadiums, playing in a CONCAP Champions Cup semi-final. There's a little bit to talk about in there. And that was gonna be the bulk of the show, except the number one news breaker in North America had to go and do his job and do his thing. And now we've got to talk about Kevin De Bruyne for like the 15th time in the last three months,

but probably the most exciting time. Paul, cause this out of your report, it feels the most tangible, the most exciting time Paul because this out of your report it feels the most tangible, the most realistic and I think the most interesting to me of not the generic European report of like oh he wants to go to the MLS he'll either play for the Cleveland Cavaliers or the Green Bay Packers or maybe a team in LA and it it's not, can Inter Miami find a way to shoehorn him in? This feels more real of like, this is how a player like this ends up in MLS.

Yeah, I mean, look, I love this too, because it's like, it shows that, you know, I am not a fan of the discovery process in general. I understand- You are on our list, by the way. Why, yeah. It's on your on our list by the way. Why? Okay, good Yeah, I'm glad that you have a claimant on me But I think like this shows why it's kind of a silly thing and I think in some ways that the the discovery process

Has cost teams more money than just like it not existing would have cost them and having to trade allocation for players rights Here's the reality, there are multiple teams that want this guy. There are multiple teams that can afford this guy. So let's not have the league stand in the way of him coming to MLS. Like it's in the best interest of Major League Soccer for Kevin De Bruyne to play in Major League Soccer.

And I think that's the stance that the league is taking right now in regards to discovery rights. Not that they're trying to screw Miami out of a payday if he doesn't go to Miami. Not that they're trying to say to Miami, I saw a couple people commenting on Twitter on my story that the league is acknowledging that if they did sign De Bruyne, it would be against the rules because they're saying that whatever. I think what the league is really saying is we are not going to allow discovery rights to stand in the way of a team signing it. Like Miami, if you are going to, you know, if De Bruyne decides he wants 12 million in July,

and the fire can give him 12 million in July, and you can only give him 850,000, we're not going to allow a protracted negotiation between the Chicago Fire and Miami over its discovery rights to stand in the way of this deal. We're gonna say here's what the cost is, here's what you have to pay, boom, or something to that effect. And I think that's the smart decision. But yes, it means that like this feels real. This feels like somebody is gonna land Kevin De Bruyne and he is gonna be playing in MLS come the summer. And I think that's an exciting thing for Major League Soccer This is a guy who when you look at his numbers in terms of chance creation

Still in the Premier League is the very very top Certainly, I think we'd all agree he doesn't have the legs that he once had but you know, he's also had injuries He's had issues like maybe a little bit of time to recoup bring some of those legs back and he shouldn't need the legs That he needs in the Premier League In MLS either so I think it's an exciting prospect I live in Chicago It'd be awesome for me if he landed in Chicago and make it make traveling for the press conference a lot easier it

Or DC and then you got to move back to DC. That's yeah. Well, it's great I the company saves on hotel costs when I go to DC because I just stay in my mom's house with all my nephews and nieces. It's great. So it feels tangible. It feels real. Let's talk about the, I believe the term used was preliminary interest, right? Yeah, they're not at a point where they where they're putting contract terms on the on the table

This is what we're willing to pay you. This is the number of years. It's not that advanced yet So it's it's hey if you're interested in coming to Major League Soccer We're interested in being the team that you come to and and and that's kind of where things are right now And I you know my feel for this right now is that the bruinness is going to let this thing run for a little while, right? It's in their best interests, you know, they're in no rush. He's not out of contract until the end of June anyway You know, let's let's go and see how we can generate the most amount of money You know, what's the best Saudi offer gonna be? What's the best offer in Europe gonna be? What's the best offer in MLS gonna be? Let's make sure they all know

via, you know, Tommy scoops or whoever, what those offers look like so that the number keeps going up as we get closer and closer to the summer and like fair play to them. That's what they should do. So we're at the beginning of this saga. Okay. I don't think that we're gonna know one way or the other. I would say, you know, I would be surprised if we know before like June 1st. Like I don't think there's any way. When you bring Saudi Arabia into the conversation, would your thought process be, or the scale of what we're talking about?

My understanding from what we've heard from the outside, and I know someone who's researching some of this stuff, but like Messi didn't take the same deal in MLS that he would have gotten in Saudi Arabia, although he then got buy-in in multiple areas. Would the feeling be that a number that Kevin De Bruyne would get in Saudi Arabia would still dwarf a DP number that a Chicago or a DC or NYCFC would give him? Yes.

Yeah. Okay. Also because it's tax free, right? As long as you stay for the life of your contract, whatever number they're giving you is net. And that's just not how it works here, right? So like, you know, they offer you $20 million a year in Saudi, it's $20 million a year. They offer you $20 million a year here at Chicago to match that. Well, you know, Uncle Sam's taken a big bite out of that apple, right?

Just by that alone, it's not going to be the same. I think that Saudi has the ability to say, okay, you've got a $15 million a year offer from Chicago gross, cool, we're going to triple that, right? They'll just do it, And it's not a problem. So it, you know, I don't think like you can think about Saudi in the typical way in terms of competition. Like you've just got to hope that, you know, you can sell the lifestyle of living in America over living in Saudi. Some people want the lifestyle by the way of living in Saudi. Like it's not like, you know, that, that, but some people don't. And some people also have aspired to live in the United States for a really long time.

Like, I think there is also, like, we've seen it before. Like, I think, like, you bring Kevin De Bruyne to Chicago on a recruiting visit, you put him courtside at a Bulls game and you tell him, like, hey, we're going to give you 15 million a year plus season tickets courtside to the Bulls. Like, that has an impact on these guys, right? Like, I mean to see Mateus Buzellas get crushed in a playing game like that's a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity. Right, like, you know, you sell them on the idea of Jordan. Right, you bring them to the statue on

non-game day. Right. And you're like, this could be your life. Like, it's the Bulls, dude. And then he comes in and he's like, wait a second. Yeah. Then you got to buy the Bulls and remake them to make them competitive. Yeah, it's not the same Kobe, but you know, it's just as fun to watch them sometimes. Yeah, that is true Laflamma Blanca on that one. So We're talking about Chicago because I think One you live there but two it seems like the most logical step of these three to me Is that your feeling as well? Yeah, I mean when I think I'm so ridiculous at this sometimes. Like I'm so biased in terms of my own personal experiences,

but like I go back to 2015 when I was in Orlando and they signed Kaka and it was an incredible signing like Kaka was Kaka and like he was he had gone back to Milan and he was playing again and he was playing well in Syria, but he still came to MLS and they didn't have a roster around him to fit and maximize what he could do. They were the youngest team in MLS that year. They played the youngest roster of anyone by a wide margin.

It was like by like 8x FC Dallas in terms of minutes for young players. And when Kevin Molina went down from an injury with an injury, Kaká basically had no one else to play with. Like people, the value of Kaká seeing where to play the ball two seconds before anyone knows that he should play the ball there in a second before he even gets the ball is only valuable if there's someone that's going to move into that space to receive the ball. And that wasn't happening very often in Orlando. And the person who eventually got there and who benefited the most was Kyle Lahren, who scored a ton of goals. But Chicago is set up to have a player like De Bruyne. They have a fast winger who, you know, he can just play balls into space and let Bamba run onto him. They've got a striker in Kuipers who's his whole like value really comes from his movement and his understanding of how to

play. And, you know, I think when you just look at that kind of fit, you you can put him in and take this team from being like a good MLS team into a contender. And that should give you enough reason if you're Joe Mansuado to be sold on it right away. You're not kind of like saying, Oh, let's just take the star and stick them into a team because he's a star and he'll be sells tickets like no, like, this guy will take the pieces we've already bought and make them better. And I don't know that that's the same for Miami as it is actually I do know it's not the same for Miami as it is

for Chicago. And so yeah, like, I think that he would be the best fit with the fire It also feels track record wise DC are currently not a team outside of Rooney that has ever done this before and so feels less realistic with them and NYCFC For the good or bad like this is not their ethos right now And you put the names in the article that you wrote with Pablo of, you know, these are the big names. And there's a clear line of demarcation and time of that was then and this is now. And I think the sale and I said it, I said it when Greg Burralter was looking to be a coach, an MLS of like everything should build towards the new stadium in 27 and all of this.

But nothing NYCFC has done has proven that this is something that really interests them Yeah, I mean but I do think that the model is dictated by the business reality sometimes right and like right now the revenue in MLS Doesn't justify these expenses unless you're signing messy like they really just it doesn't But I do think when you're opening a new stadium, star power resonates. You know, the new stadium becomes the cool, sexy thing that everyone wants to come check out. Just like it was the sexy thing at Yankee Stadium

when NYCFC came into the league. They had great crowds, right? And then they had star power. And so all these great crowds that were coming in were buying those jerseys. It made business sense. And then it was like, okay, it doesn't make business sense as much.

We can go get good players. We have city football group scouting network and they won MLS cup doing that. So let's keep doing that until we don't until it doesn't make sense anymore. And I think they're right on that line of like, okay, now is the time to start thinking about the right star to help us open the stadium. And so it makes sense that they're like sniffing around De Bruyne or They have the relationship there.

You know, there are ways to make it work. You know, he is, I think, like somebody who could help any team. You know what his personality is like. You know his approach. That's the hard part with some of these signings. And so I think it's an endorsement for every other team involved in this

that the city football group team is involved in this Right, like it's like the check marks on like personality how they are away from the field all that they are not scared about this Yeah, they're not they're not there about that, right? So so that's how I feel about that part of it But yeah I mean like the fire is interesting too for Greg Berhalter because it's like when he went to the Chicago He was a very good MLS coach in Columbus He went to an MLS cup with you know, not a high budget, you know with an owner who we knew was

had eyes on another market and Part of the appeal was like, okay Let's see what he does with it with an owner who is willing to spend like okay like that's what this would be, right? It's like, you know, we've got you a superstar and two other high paid DPs. Like can you actually go and win an MLS cup when you are supposed to? That's the next step. And I think also like the fire are gonna try

to open a stadium too. They're further away from that. But what you have to start doing from a business standpoint in Chicago is building momentum. And the best way to build momentum is to win. So if you have a superstar who's going to help you win, then you're playing with something, right? And like, I go back to your point on like the trends of who are these teams and what is their MO. They went and got Schweinsteiger in 2017. He stepped in, immediately made that

team better. I was on the sideline for that run. The stadium was full. The team was playing really attractive soccer and you know, they kind of self sabotaged frankly that team that season. But you had a comm you had Schweinsteiger you had Nikolic. They were fun to watch. They were really good for a long stretch and then they blew out in the playoffs and they were primed. Like if you take that momentum and you add to it in 2018 like the story of the fire is a different take that momentum and you add to it in 2018, like the story of the fire is a different one. And they didn't add to it.

They did not add to it. And so they halted completely the momentum. Like the game plan, they had done so much right to that point, and then it just completely downhill from there. And so like, this is the test for the fire. It's like, you're starting to build something. You know, you want to make this work, you've got to build momentum. Like that's why it's not a surprise to me that they're in on Neymar that they're in on De Bruyne.

They understand they've got to win games, but they've got to start getting people into the building, they've got to get people starting to talk about the fire. So when they open the stadium, they're not kind of starting from square one. Or even the momentum to get the stadium done of like yeah obviously you have an ownership group that is powerful and influential in the market but it helps if more people are wearing Chicago Fire jerseys and talking about them in the city when you go into meetings to have a question. Let me ask you this which you can tell me I'm being a nerd too much in this. Let me ask you this which you can tell me I'm being a nerd too much in this

With Greg taking over the Chicago Fire and where they sit right now where the league sits right now this feels a little MLS 2.0 to me and it's almost like I guess my expectation would be that Chicago would Elevate a Cucho signing because I look at it and those were still kind of all waiting on the like who's gonna be the first team to sign a 26 year old in their prime from a Champions League level team starter not superstar and like make that player decide to come to MLS and I thought Chicago might be in that category with Joe Mansuado's money and Greg Burrhalter and while I would be

excited to watch Kevin De Bruyne play on this team and I think he fits what they're doing right now, it's still not that. Yeah, but it's hard to sell that when you have the Fires history. Like a player is going to look at where the Fires have been for the last dozen years and be like, nah, I'm not leaving a Champions League team as a starter at 26 to play for you guys like That's just not gonna happen Like you have they are three years of winning away from being able to do that

All of the rest of it will work like their training facility is insane If they build in stadium in Chicago, it will be at that level like that's just how Joe Mancuedo works. And then you have an owner that's willing to plunk the cash down and a coach who typically usually gets his teams to play pretty decent soccer. I think in three years, yeah, that would make a lot of sense. But they need to win for a couple seasons before I think you put yourself into the conversation for that.

I think Miami could do it whenever they see fit, whenever they're ready to move away from the kind of older player model. I think L.A.F.C. could do it. You know, I think the galaxy were on the precipice of being able to do it. You know, they were there. I mean, they kind of did with Pooj in a way. I mean, he wasn't a starter, but like he was like a sign that like, you know, L.A. still has that cache. Atlanta. I think the big challenge for Atlanta is turf like yeah, it really is like, you know I know people in Atlanta have said that to me

You know, I think that is a real challenge But like the fire for me need to win a couple years before they can really put themselves I think they can get a seat at the table right now because money talks But I think to really truly convince somebody you need the whole package and and I think they can get a seat at the table right now because money talks. But I think to really, truly convince somebody, you need the whole package. And and I think Toronto is probably the best example of that with, you know, the fact that they were able to convince Joe Vinco when they did was such an anomaly. Yeah. But like with Michael coming, things were turning. They could sell. OK, you're not alone.

Here's where we're going. Here's the crowds. Here's what we did from last year or two years ago to last year. Like the trajectory is going this direction. You need a little bit of that narrative. And I think the fire are just like, it's just a little bit too soon. And that's where I think, like, sometimes these decisions are made about winning now and like, and that's where I think like sometimes these decisions are made about winning now

and like and that's all that it should be about and Sometimes it should be about building towards something and like the fire are in a mode where win now is the same thing as building Towards something. Yeah, like they need to change the narrative in this market and nationally and globally to really be able to start to like turn that into a real team. Because like realistically, man, it hasn't been that. Yeah, no, you're not wrong. And I think if you're saying that

bridge is that timeframe, that's probably all you're gonna get from KDB. So it's kind of perfect. Yeah, and then you're opening a new stadium, right? Like if you win for three years with KDB, and the building is opening, and then you're going to Spain, or France Like if you win for three years with KDB and the building is opening and then you're going to Spain or France and you're pulling from that pool of players, what are you selling then? Hey, look, we were almost at MLS Cup or we made it to MLS Cup and check out this new stadium we're opening. Like you're going to be taking the mantle from De Bruyne. You know, like that sells right now. I

mean, you show them clips of the crowd against Miami. You you make a sizzle reel where the crowd shots are all from the same game and then you hope you know you put a storage of highlight in there as well, but if you do some digital work to clean it up. Yeah. Yes. Schweinsteiger you can create don't you Shakira is like just the Miami game from two years ago or he scored a bunch of goals and and you know shit like Shakira is doing someone a huge favor

Which is whoever this player is whether it's the burner or not can bring the Shakira number to the table and be like Yeah, so this is what you did for this and I'm here So this number has to be at minimum at minimum in proportion to this. Yeah, to that point, they're not getting a discount right now either. Right? Like, that's just, you know, it's that's people talk, I think we're gonna talk about this idea of like, you know, ownership and, and De Bruyne and like Miami, of course, it'd be Miami, like, Miami's earned the ability to

tell the Bruyne like, hey, we're gonna have to shoehorn you in this way. And him being being like I'll think about it Right. So Let's talk about has the ability. Yeah, which is I mean I came on this show and sort of said and I've said this in The past around the galaxy in a little with LAFC of like I think teams to an extent have earned This right which fans say to us is like oh, it's cheating. Oh, it's unfair. It's only for these big markets it's only for these teams and I sort of said of like everyone's a billionaire Cincinnati or Denver chose you know if Colorado chose to do this like I guess the point being in the league's best interest it is to

have these players come in whatever format they want to do it in and to have good teams what do you make sort of of that reaction to Inter Miami being in this convo with the way their structure is with the three DPs already and like what other teams could do or if they if it would be possible outside of these three markets to be in this situation. Yeah. I mean it's one of my least favorite things about like MLS you know know discourse, right? Like I get frustrated at fans that tweet at me or in the comment section complaining about Miami or their owners or whatever Like I love that Miami is like the evil Empire like I love that. Everyone wants to beat them

I think that's good for the league I think that it's always good to have kind of like the one team that everybody hates that's all winning Yeah, you want the Cowboys or the Dodgers or the Yankees, however, you want to think of it. I think that's a good thing. And so I'm not discouraging hate, hating on Miami. But like, I think that this narrative that like, the league has favorites or whatever is BS. Like, to your point, like, I go to the BOG meetings, I see who walks in the doors. The number is one of the wealthiest collection of sports owners anywhere in the world. MLS is up there with the NFL and the Premier League in terms of the ability to spend across every single market in this league. So big market, small market, you have for the most part, maybe there's one or two exceptions, your owner can go spend big on players. Your owner can go get, maybe they won't get De Bruyne, they can go get Cucho.

They can spend to go do that. Columbus is a great example of that. No one is like, I want to move to Columbus. They're all like, where the hell is Columbus? And then it's like, oh, you wanna pay me $8 million? Sweet, is there a direct flight to Columbus? No, I have to connect through Philadelphia, no problem. Delta, no problem. Let's go. And that's the reality of this, man. There are multiple cities in Europe that people don't want to live in, but the money is right and they go

and they play there. I said this to you before we went on air, Jesus Ferreira wasn't considering a move to Russia for the sights. He was considering the move for the money like money talks. So every team is capable of doing this one to I Think this is a great example of why these rules You know the people think these rules are in place to limit the high spenders and they are Like they are definitely done so that some teams can spend the bare minimum of what they want to spend and still be Competitive enough to make the playoffs so that they can say, well, we made the playoffs. We had a shot at the championship. Great. But in reality, the big one of the bigger advantages that

these big markets have is now that these rules are so restrictive and more owners are willing to spend money, more often we're confronting this reality of teams that have their DP spots and U-22 spots completely filled and what does that lead you to? Well, Miami and LA and probably New York can get a discount. They can convince a guy like Hugo Luis to come and to pay play for a million bucks or 850 or whatever his numbers. I think it's like it's ridiculous. I haven't looked recently, but it's ridiculous, right? Like that's not going to probably not going to happen in Kansas City. It's probably not going to happen for Houston.

Like those people that know those big cities are going to say, yeah, like, all right. I'm at the end of my career. I'll take a little less money. I want to live in L.A. and be by the beach. Yeah, I want to live in, you know, I think San Diego could benefit from this. For me, it's the greatest reason why going with a cap and a floor with still one or two DP spots within that gives the smaller markets, the lesser known markets, the less sexy markets a better chance to compete in today's MLS because the million dollar or two million dollar players that are out there that can't come to MLS right now because they are too expensive for tam slots and they're not good enough to be DPS. All of them all

of a sudden will be eligible, not just for the small markets, but for the big markets too. And that will benefit the level of play for the league. But if a big market's already signed to Brenna as their fourth big start, they don't have the money to sign to Colombian International Center. And you know, the whole theory is if you have a team that is balanced, that has six or seven million and a half to two million dollar players, five million dollar players, and like, guess what, you have a homegrown territory or you have done a better job scouting domestically or whatever, that you can compete better with a team that's top heavy.

And so, you might not be able to get the beach discount of Miami or LA, but you don't need it because you can go sign a $2 million player from Italy that nobody knows until he gets there but is a difference maker. Or you can go find the kid from Paraguay who is a four million dollar player that doesn't fit you 22 and you don't have DP spots. But now that you have a ceiling and a floor, you can fit them into your team and it works. Like it gives I think some of those markets a better chance to build under their models. And so like I think the rules are not just standing in the way of the overall growth of the league

and the quality of play. Like I think they actually stand in the way of the models for a lot of these quote unquote smaller market teams who feel like it's a lot harder and a lot more expensive for them to get the big name stars. You mentioned the board of governors. The meeting was last week. I believe obviously the huge topic on the table was the schedule flip in which MLS chose to kick the can down

the road. So they did not adopt it. But with the intention of talking about it again in the future, it feels like a big miss because the World Cup felt like this. We have no choice opportunity to test it at a minimum and say, what else could we do? The largest soccer event in the world was coming to our shores in the middle of our season. Like we had no choice. And I think that's where a lot of people thought it was going.

What did you make of sort of as you watched it go down and what it came out with? Yeah, I think I understand why the meeting ran the way it did. I understand why there wasn't a vote in the end. I think it was still a productive meeting. Like, you know, I think we quoted Larry Berg basically saying he, you know, he told me, I asked him straight up, like, are you more optimistic leaving today than you were coming in about the schedule flip? And he said, yes. So like, I think this is going to happen. I would guess that there will be an announcement at the BOG this summer at the All-Star. I am hugely disappointed that this is not happening

in time for the fall after the World Cup because I think that MLS has a lot of big issues that it faces, a lot. And one of them is the quality of play, which I think over time will help the league gain more fans and will get more people to watch, but I think has less of a short term payoff because the casual soccer fan is probably not going to know that million dollar write back from Serie A that all of a sudden you can afford if you do what you should do, which is completely tear down the rules and rebuild them in a way that makes more sense. And so like, you know, to convince an owner, hey, we're going to increase your bill or we're going to sign more of these guys with no guarantee that it's going to bring more revenue in the door in the stadiums is is is tough when you saying also like the payoff on the TV numbers is going to be a bit of a slower burn. But the league is set up for that right now.

The TV deal with Apple goes for a while. You have time to let that slow burn of quality of play happen, first of all. And second of all, that is why the value of the World Cup was so important. Flipping the calendar and flipping the calendar coming out of the World Cup presented an amazing opportunity for a short-term gain. And that was a chance to go out during the World Cup and tell everybody that was watching this sport that doesn't typically watch the sport, or that maybe they do typically

watch it and they don't think MLS is very good. They say you are not good enough. You are a minor league, you are not the Premier League, that actually we're better than you think. And not only are we better than you think, but we're the new MLS now we're actually we're getting so much closer to the rest of the world that we flipped our calendar to get on their schedule so that we can be more active in the transfer market because we are closer and closer to their level. That's a compelling story. The new MLS, the new, and you just hammer it all during the World Cup. And the greatest part is you

can do it at a discount because every news station across the country every local newspaper Every local sports broadcast and even the national ones are gonna be saying we have to talk about this World Cup thing. It's huge It's taking over the whole summer. Yeah, who do we go to? Well, we're gonna go to our local soccer teams So you have all of this earned media and all of these free opportunities to go on air and talk about oh while you're watching there's actually 180 players from MLS playing in the World Cup, and when the game's over, come out and watch the new MLS. It's a new, you know, we're flipping the calendar, it's a totally new era of MLS, it's better soccer than what you think it is, like, come watch us.

And they're gonna lose all of that, and they're gonna kick that can down the road. And, you know, there's's this idea that oh, like this actually happened before 1994. MLS was supposed to launch in 95 coming off of it. And they didn't they launched in 96. And things turned out okay. Things turned out okay is doing a lot of work. Yeah, sorry. They almost went bankrupt. And some saved them. And they're still in the same place now that they were 15 years ago in terms of their place in the kind of consciousness of the American soccer fan and the temporary mutiny in the

Miami fusion would love to disagree with that, right? So like and not only that but how long ago was 1994? How much work has been done to talk about what the Attention span is of a normal person now versus in 94. You know, the the year of weight has a greater cost in today's marketplace than it did in 94. Yeah, in 94. There wasn't the Premier League on every Saturday morning. There wasn't the Champions League on wasn't sorry times from there weren't summer tours. The relevant lawsuit just got settled right there. You know, you think the Premier League and the and the Syria and La Champions League on wasn't so retires from there were in summer tours. The relevant lawsuit just

got settled right there. You know, you think the Premier League and the and the Syria and La Liga aren't going to be trying to take advantage of the post World Cup moment. And you're going to be like, no, it's not that important. It's a very romantic idea that you think we should link it to the World Cup. I get why you think but actually, we want to make sure we do this right. So we're going to wait till 27. I'm just, I just, as you can see, I very strongly believe that a big part of doing it right is getting the timing right. And this isn't a surprise to them.

The U S got rewarded, awarded the world cup a long time ago. The fact that they're acting like this snuck up and bit them is a joke. And I do think it's a huge mistake that one year wait is a, is a massive mistake. And I think it it's a huge mistake that one year wait is a massive mistake. And I think it also causes hardship. You have a natural break in the calendar already.

You're taking the time off. And now you're going to ask the league to do it again the next year. And you're going to have a mini sprint season in the spring. And you're going to disrupt things again. Why you have the natural opportunity to do it. And I think it's a missed opportunity. I think it, you know, I am encouraged by the fact that they are going to do it. I recognize the business challenges of doing it.

I think that sometimes the risk is worth it. The way the league is going now is not sustainable. You cannot spend the way they're spending on players on a model that is completely game day revenue dependent you have to start getting TV ratings and Those things don't work together, right? Like you have to spend more to get better TV ratings and there's no guarantee that you will but like the way you're doing things Now is not doing it So like I respect that they're recognizing that and that they're saying this is a huge risk

We have to do it and and it comes with enormous amount of risk, but we're doing it anyways. But like that doesn't erase the fact that the best time to do it is coming out of the World Cup, and you're not going to do that. And so like, that will always be an asterisk for me on whether this works or not, or whether it takes seven years longer than it should have to work, or whatever. Like, you had this moment, you had plenty, you had ample time to prepare for this moment. You didn't in the fashion you should have. Messi arrived, he's been here for 21, 22 months, whatever it is now, you didn't even use that to fully accelerate it to the point you could have. And now you tried to you tried to get this last little sprint and it didn't work and and it's just too bad man and and

You know, maybe someone will grab this in 10 years and pull it and say look Tenorio You're an idiot and you know, you're talking about I'll be happy if that happens Like I will like I cover American soccer. I'm writing a book about it. I spent I've dedicated my career to it I want it to grow. I want to do better. That actually benefits me personally. I am not rooting for this to fail. But that is why I am so frustrated because I felt like this moment was primed for it. And I am concerned about the implications of missing it. Yeah. I think that's the feeling for a lot of us that are close to this and around it of, um, it feels like there are some obvious steps to take, uh, and the

lack of desire to do that. And then the push pull of the decision making and who's pushing forward and who's pulling back and everyone in the room and whether or not that's the right move, um, we're going to have to have you on again in the future because we're hearing rumors around messy extensions. We've got a CONCACF Champions Cup semi-final coming up for this Inter Miami team. We've got a Club World Cup coming up, USMNT, all of that.

But Paul, I appreciate you taking the time to do this with me today. And next time you break some big news, we can do it again. All right, we'll bench Tommy scoops once or twice. I know you're watching out there, Tommy. He's 100% going to listen. And I realized that like five minutes in where I was like, is this going to ruin Tom's day? And I didn't do that. So he knows I love him.

He knows I love him. If he's still hanging on, we love you, Tom. And for anyone listening, we're going to go into our interview with actual Schuster. We talked about schedule flip We talked about the stadium plans the sale with them the success under yes per Sorenson We talked about Ryan Galt's health as well as Pedro Vita's future So stick here for that and it's a nice long episode for all of you. We haven't been live this week So for all of you. We haven't been live this week so for all of you out there enjoy it. Alright well here on Soccerize we like to talk about the biggest stories in soccer in North America and as you have noticed over the last few weeks there is no story bigger than the Vancouver Whitecaps making a historic

running CONCACAF dominating in Major League Soccer. Big news on and off the field so we had to go straight to the source. We have now the CEO and sporting director of the club Axel Schuster for the first time ever here on Soccer Wise. Axel, thanks for joining us. Thank you for having me. So last week around when the stadium news came out I put together this list of what the last four months have looked like for the Vancouver Whitecaps and it was an endless set of headlines every at a minimum three weeks. It was intention to sell, new head coach, old head coach and then once the game started

it went from strength to strength. Knocking out Saprisa, dominating at Portland Portland being the last perfect team in Major League Soccer beating the holding champions knocking off on fellow Canadian team the two results in Mexico that are historic in their own right and we'll talk about it how you doing how's the experience been how has it been living through all of this yeah it's a great week to ask me this obviously this is the first week since a while where we have no midweek game and we can maybe really enjoy it for a second and we can think about it for a second. So far, it was really going from one game to the next and I actually felt a little bit

for everyone who is involved here in the club because we never had really time to even enjoy it for a minute. Yeah, I had to say thank you to everyone in this organization. I think we had a meeting, I think two weeks ago, where I said thank you to everyone in the organization because in December when the news came out, I told everyone nothing will change. We will not change our goals. We will not stop competing for a high bar. And we have to fill this with life. We want to play at the best season. And they filled this with life.

So it's not me doing this alone. And it's easy to say that in a moment then of course I have to go first and I have to be an example for that but that everyone in this organization as showing up in this moment this way makes it so amazing and yes I had a few conversations also around the board of governors meeting where people said, but that's not normal. You know, everyone expects, okay, this becomes a transition season, the club is on sale and you also have a coach change and all of this.

And then you are doing the complete opposite. I really believed in it. To fill it with life, it's not only me, it's a lot of little pieces that are coming together right now. And it's probably the first week where we all really can think about it. And at the same time, we obviously don't want to lose momentum and we are aware that we haven't even played 25% of the season yet. That's wild to say with everything that's happened already. You said you believed in it. What was it though?

Like when you looked in December November of last year Of course when you had to make the decision to move on from Vanni Sartini There was clearly something that you felt more could come from this roster of this squad If you had put that on paper or thought about it, where would that have been? Would it have been first place in the league right now into a CONCACAF semi-final over two Mexican squads? Yeah, no, I could try to sell you that I'm genius and I saw this all coming and I was 100% aware where we would be. No, that's not true. But you know what, I'm living this every day. I'm traveling with the team to every game. I'm in the locker room. I'm everywhere where the team is.

And I felt the energy that we have in this group. We all felt that we have put the pieces together that are needed. We all thought, including the players, and I could hear that in all the exit meetings, that last season was a missed opportunity. We all thought we could have done better. That we missed a little bit to finish higher understandings in the last seven games of last season. Then we found our energy back in the playoffs. And the game against LFC was a game of inches.

So we all had the feeling, if we do this right, then next season all of the puzzle pieces can fall in the right place. The players were very self-critical. The players were also still full of energy for the next season. In regards of the goals, it felt still a little bit like to really get to the real highs, that it would need some new and fresh ideas and maybe a little bit of a reset from outside. That has led to the coaching change. So I would say my belief, but I would not have guessed that it would go that well. My belief was that if the things come together, that we can definitely compete for a top four spot in this Western Conference.

And it's nothing more than that yet also. That we have not to be shy to say we can play one of those seasons where a team ends up very high in the standings where everyone has not seen it coming before. We had this examples with St. Louis, with Colorado, with Salt Lake last year. But if you would have asked me before and told me that with all this travel, with all those games in the Champions Cup as well, that we would have such a start, that we would play a game against Austin like we did last Saturday, I would not have believed it.

Yeah, every week it feels like when I'm ready to close that list of like, here are the great things, then it's five goals against Austin and it just keeps growing and growing. I want to talk about that outside force Jesper Sorensen and what he has brought. How did you land on him and what is it that he has brought to this club that has allowed this group or helped this group take this next step? There are two things.

The one thing is his profile and the other thing is the coaching change in general. I would say let's speak about his profile first. He is somebody who has a proven record of making teams better by making players better. Something that I think is super important in this league because we have, that's naturally in our roster, not all the players on the same level and we have a lot of players also from the domestic player pool who need development. We are not, we're not Real Madrid or Manchester City where you solve your problems by just buying one of the best players in the world. You have to solve the problems also by developing players.

He had also a proven record of making teams right away better when he took over a second-tier team in Denmark and promoted with them right away into the first tier. He took over Brandby, which is the biggest club in, or is the biggest club in Denmark. And they were in the middle of the table and one and a half year later they missed the championship by one game. So it was this combination of having been a U21 coach, having been a player developer, and at the same time being somebody who has an immediate impact to a team, to a team performance, who doesn't need before, you know, it is sometimes unfortunate for a coach who is coaching a team for many years.

And Renny Zatini is part of the story why we are where we are now. He has helped to build this over three and a half years and we had constantly progress in our development over the three and a half years. But then in professional sports it is three and a half years is already a very long time, way, way longer than the average coach stays with the club. Actually, the average time a coach stays in a professional league in the first 20 leagues is in all other leagues than MLS, less than a year. Said that it's the nature of a change that things get shaken up again,. Everyone gets hold accountable in a new way. Players who had not that much

playing time, they see a new life and they come back with a lot of energy and they want to show up in the best way. That means that players who have played, they get feel challenged and they have to show up in a very good way. And everyone has to compete again for something. And also, even if you say the same thing with different words, it sounds suddenly new and you listen more carefully to it. If a coach is there three and a half years and he explains a certain thing, it's the way he explains it. And players who are with you longer, they sit there. That's the same how I was in school and was the same teacher.

And I said, yeah, I have heard that already. I know all that. So there's now somebody else coming in and he speaks a little bit different and he explains things different. Of course, there's also no next coach who does it exactly the same way. And it also gives, he comes in with a different view and he maybe questions things that you never questioned before because they were actually okay, but with a different approach they might be even better.

So that's just the nature. So it was important to do this and And that was actually what I what I felt that we need after three and a half pretty good years for the club, not excellent, not great, but good years. We made the playoffs, we won three championships, we have been more successful than this club has been in the past. but we all still thought there's a next step. And then it was very important to bring somebody in who can do what is needed in our club, making players better, but also can immediately have an impact because we didn't want to have a transition year, as I said before, for various reasons. One of the things it feels like that has helped

this development forward, and I want to talk about some of the players you mentioned, especially the domestic players, but on an overall feel is the style and the confidence that it feels like has been breathed into the players and the belief that has come with this style. And I don't know how much you pay attention to all of us talking about it, but it feels very Columbus. It feels very Wilfred Nansay has gone into Columbus and told players like,

I believe in you. You can play through pressure. We're going to play out of everything and they can. And that's a lot of what it feels like with Vancouver and what we've seen right now from Vancouver is doing it in places MLS teams have never done it to go do it in Mexico. That style, is that a style that you felt had to be played? Or are you one of the people as someone who set sporting direction who says there's a right way and wrong way to play soccer and it's the way emotionally you feel it? Or was this Jesper Sorensen was the right guy? This is his style and he's free to play it.

Yeah, there are again two things to that I want to say to it. So first of all, there is there's for me no right and no wrong style. There's only a successful style or whatever team you have. This is for me a little bit like and I always try to explain that people who maybe are not the soccer experts, I try to explain like, if you want to run a restaurant, you know. So you have a wonderful place, you want to run a restaurant. And so you have to decide what this restaurant should be. Is it an Italian cuisine or is it a Japanese cuisine? And you cannot mix those two things. You cannot say it's an Italian cuisine, but I hire one cook, a chef who is Italian and I hire another one who is expert in the Japanese cuisine, for example. So the

important thing is that everyone is on the same page. That's what we do and that it is the fit for what you have. So said that, that's the one style that is the right style for you. And that doesn't mean that not around the corner there's another restaurant with a different cuisine and that's working very well there. So, the style, it's depending on a lot of things. So, what kind of market you are, what are the people, what does people like in your market. There are so many different successful styles in the world but you want, do you want the people to buy in in your market into it. So I always say the best example for me was all the World Cups that I went to and before you would say that for example a team Germany played several times, Argentina

in finals, and you think like Argentina plays a complete different style. But in the matchup of the two teams, it was equal. It was tight games, although two complete different styles played each other. It's about executing your style to perfection. And then to be successful in your market to have a style that people like. That's different. Our style here in Vancouver is definitely based on hard working, on fighting, on having a work ethic and also good team spirit, mentality and discipline. spirit, mentality and discipline. It doesn't matter if you have the ball a lot or not. That are the core principles that also people want to see. People want to see a hardworking

team. We are a hockey nation here. People are used to a hard, rough game where you fight for your result. Regarding the second question, is this something where the coach is free to do, look, my job is not to control my coach every day. And that's maybe interesting for people to understand. People sometimes think that I go in the coach's room and I discuss with him the lineup. I'm not doing that at all. I don't know the lineup. I know it a little bit earlier than all supporters. I know it a little bit earlier than the supporters,

but I learn about the lineup like a fan because I'm not there on the training pitch. I don't coach this team. I don't have the time to watch every training. I don't know who has the better momentum. I also don't analyze our opponents. I don't know what is the biggest strength of them and how we maybe have to adjust to this. I don't know what is the biggest strength of them and how we maybe have to adjust to this. So this is a coaching decision. I always say in the locker room and on the pitch, the coach is the boss and he makes all decisions.

No player ever has to come to me and say, oh, he hasn't played me last weekend and I don't think that was fair. I have to say you have to figure that out with your coach. My job is to look at the greater picture. Are we working towards the right direction? Are we improving? Is this all in the whole concept of the club? And then now I go back a little bit to style. Yes, my job is to hire a coach who fits to what we think our market should be, what our culture is, how we want to position the club. That was actually the first question that I asked when I came to the club because the one thing that I don't like, that's my opinion and everyone in this business can do things different is if you hire a key person like me or the coach and you just give him the

key, you just give him the keys of the club and say do what you think is right. Because that means you have to change maybe every time you hire somebody new. That goes back to the cuisine, the kitchen and the restaurant. My first job when I came to the club in end of 2019, beginning of 2020, was to speak with supporters, with the ownership group, with employees, with former players, alumni, to understand what does this club mean for you, what does this city stand for and what do you think this club should do to make people happy and make people coming to the stadium. And then I take it from there and my job then is to execute it.

And so I have to hire a coach and I have to hold him accountable that he does it within the guardrails of our direction. But if he's in this, he's completely free. And if in this general approach he wants to play with more possession, he thinks we have the players out, he can convince the players to do this and he can give him the belief that we can do this, fine, I come back if it doesn't work and then I will hold him accountable and have him with him discussions what we have to change or not. You talked about the domestic players, which I want to key in on because you've had great success with some big international signings. Obviously, Ryan Galt has had MVP caliber seasons, Pedro Vite having a huge year up the spine,

but I think the exciting part about what's happening for a lot of people from the outside is the Ali Admeds of the world. The Sebastian Berhalt is JC Nagando out of a draft. What is it about your process that you feel has been so successful of, whether it's identification or development, that these players have stepped in in ways that we don't see very often players from these profiles

make differences for MLS clubs, but especially not from all these profiles in the same team at the same time. Yeah, you know, don't forget Tate Johnson, by the way. No, I wasn't going to, but I was giving you a little more time just because it's his first Year. Yeah, I got a rowdy's Jersey behind me It's still his first year. I know but you know, it's It's a little bit a combination of everything I don't think you you you cannot just go by developing domestic talent. You cannot just go with your homegrown players.

We, way early when I arrived here, were speaking about what should be our scouting approach and what should be the mix of players that we should have at every time to build this successful for our market. So you need always a few experienced key players who build the skeleton of the team because having only young up and coming development players will not make you successful because the nature of them is that they have ups and downs and also it's that they are inexperienced and so you need some players who can take them at their hand and guide them in the game. So that's our now Brian White, Ryan Gold, Andres Kubas, Rango Vizelinovic, Sam Adekuba. So you always need them. Then

our homegrown market and our domestic market gives us a certain number of players that we can identify and can bring in with that we can work. We're not there that we can fill every other spot with them. So we have to be open-minded to also look into potential next players that we can develop here from from other markets. That's that's the that we can develop here from other markets. That's the Eddie Ocampos, Pedro Vitas, Ranko Vez and Ljumic when he came here, he was only 20. So it has to be the right mixture. And of course, we enjoy a lot if it is a kid

from our academy or it is a young kid from Canada that we have found because we are a Canadian club and a North American club and we also want this game to grow and we know that excitement is also built by having local talent and domestic players. But I don't think that the whole market, the whole game is there that you can only rely on that. So from the beginning, we always had, like I would say, the three pockets that we were picking from. And we still do this today. And if one player leaves from a certain pocket we want to replace him with a player that fits in the same category and the player can grow from one in the other category.

Rakovic Ninovich for example grew obviously in a different category and Zerb Berhalter is a player who's on the path to grow in the next category. The most important thing in our whole process is that we now, after five years, can prove to players that we have enough examples, let's say this way, to lay out a plan for a player to say, look, we can do this we we have done that and We can lay out a plan for you that if you come here that we are a good organization to come to Because you can grow here you have stability here. You get the time here Yeah, and then you can jump at some point into another category in our club

What gives you a different contract or maybe somewhere else if you think that's the right thing to do. Doing this consistently and over a long time, sustainable is obviously what then in the future makes it actually easier to have new players buying into it or getting them hired because players always, always look into what happened to other players and that I would do this because if you try to hire somebody, they normally look into your team and see how have you how have other players done in my category before and If you move players every year, then it is much harder to convince a player to come. We've kind of seen colorado do this um, and and it feels like the path you're following there and

And those I assume this is the convo you're having with the jaden nelson and asabi and a ralph preso of We believe that you can be the next, you know, pieces that we've had and come here. And I would assume that's a large part of the pitch to them to joining Vancouver. Yeah, you know, the thing is, to be as honest as possible with them right from the beginning. And then maybe somebody doesn't sign into it and doesn't like it to bring a player in like Valfpiso and say look we don't promise you that you will play here more minutes than in any club before right away. But we can show you that we had

brought in similar players and we gave them time to go. We have individual player development programs here. We actually have laid out a full plan for you and we have PDFs that we go through with them. We have presentations for them. We go through that with them and say, look, in the first six months, this is what you have to expect.

In the second six months, that's our expectation where you should be then. And then in the second six months That's our expectation where you should be then and then in the second year That's where we want you to be and if not we come back and we will sit down and discuss why you are not there and and That's we actually do this also with players that we sign from outside of the thing We were speaking with a with a young player and we we told him look of the thing. We were speaking with a young player and we told him, look, don't expect that you play any minute in MLS for the first six months. You are only 20 years old. If you come here, you play first in our second team. If you don't like it, don't come because

we don't think it makes sense. This is obviously something that comes with, would say more proof the longer you do it and you longer you do it successfully because then players come with the right expectation and you know that they come with the right expectations and those who have a different expectation that's fine this is a worldwide game this is played in 190 countries there are a million of professional clubs and there's another platform that might be the better platform for these players because the biggest thing in hiring and scouting and signing is those who you don't sign. That you don't sign those who will not be the right fit for you What doesn't mean that they cannot be outstanding players on Wells? Yeah I could talk about development and the two team and all of this for all day

But people would be mad at me if I don't ask some of these questions first one being Ryan Gould what's the expectation of timing for him? And then you talked about those guardrails and that identity for veterans it feels like Ryan is a huge part of this what has it been like working with him and watching him be sort of this leader and the Stalisman for this group? Yeah the timeline is that we cannot risk anything we haven't played 25% of the season and we cannot risk anything for one game. So the timeline is that he most likely will not be available for the first game against Miami in the Champions Cup. And then we have to see how far he is for the second leg.

That's the timeline and Medici and player recovery, there's one truth that I have learned over the 26 years. Nothing is 100% and every player is different. So you can never predict it exactly. That's not possible. So the range is from the week of the second leg till a week later. So we will see where we see where we land. And we have also to be careful that we don't risk anything because of one match and then he's out for another long time because that would hurt us. What he means for us and I would

put him together with Andres Gubas. For us, those key players in our market, it is super important and the approach that we have here, that there are role models to what our basic principles are. So we don't need a player who can at every given time, let's say every second game, he makes a difference and scores this goal. But other than that, he's not within the principles of the club. He's only a game changer from time to time because of his quality. Our lead players, those two, they have to be the first who run and work hard and help to win back the ball, who have to follow the rules that are implemented by the coach means having the discipline, having the work ethic, being good teammates, but also being guys who are

not shy of telling a younger player what to do, being somebody who helps a younger player next to them, giving them structure. That's for us a very important thing, and both of them are doing this. Ryan Gold was, for all the seasons he's here, the defensive best in all stats, defensive best number 10 attacking midfielder in the league. And that's what makes him so good for us. Because the other things we see anyway, you know, the other things, the many goals that he scores, the many assists he has, the record numbers he's putting in for the club, they are great and obviously helpful, but what makes him so important for us and how he pays in into the whole system and makes the whole system work is the other things

that he's doing. That you can have a player in his position in our U16 and U18 who say, you have to look what Ryan Gold does. And if you cannot do this in the U16 or U18, you will never make it here in this club. And that's how we hold players accountable, because that's also what happens, that we tell players, yeah, if you tell us I'm so good offensively and I have scored so many goals and I cannot work every time back, we say, but Ryan Gold is doing it, so why cannot you do it?

And that's how it works and that's what we need from them as well and that's what makes them perfect for us. The working class MVP which we've loved absolutely and we are excited to see him back out on the field. One of the huge pieces that stepped in or has elevated his game I think you could say in his absence has been Pedro Vite and it feels very obvious now from the outside After hearing you explain the six-month processes of what his growth was from this, you know Exciting high-priced signing attacking mid to the way he got on the field the last two years a little deeper and has now elevated His game in that final third there are reports and rumors connecting him to some huge in that final third. There are reports and rumors connecting him to some huge European clubs as well, which you'd expect with his performances. Our number, our charts say that he's in the final year of his contract. Is there any

conversation around his future and how does the potential ownership change or the success this season change the way you handle a situation for a special young player like that? There are conversations about the future of every player at least every six months, as I have described before. So we are in constant discussions with him, his agent, about his future. I can tell you that a lot of those rumors might be true, the clubs internally discussing that,

maybe shared this with somebody, but the latest rumors, no one has reached out to his agent or to us yet. So yes, we had laid out a plan, and I can say he's an amazing example for that, because I would say one and a half years in, his agent actually told me that he reached out to Pedro and said, hey, you haven't played that much and should I speak with the club and maybe discuss alone or

whatever? And he said, no, no, I'm fine. It's all good. I know I'm speaking with the coach every day and I know where I am and I'm perfectly fine with the process and I believe in this because they are honest to me. I think that has made him so successful now because he was always buying in in the process. He was doing it 100%. He was coming in every day with conviction, doing everything he was asked to do. So he developed this consistency that he is showing now. We are super, super happy for him

that he found his way in the national team because that is important for him. And I can tell you from my latest conversations that he is very, very happy where he is. And that means the club, the position on the field, also performance-wise. And we are discussing with him what's the best next for him. We have laid out what the possibilities are here.

There's a World Cup coming next year. Ecuador is almost qualified already, and they will be qualified at the end. So there's also this question, how much risk you want to take so shortly before World Cup while you are now having a very important role. You play every game, you perform on a high level, you can make your case for the national team coach because every change to a bigger club also comes with a little bit of a risk that needs transition time and you don't have the playing minutes. So if he dreams of doing the next step, it's the

best moment not for that, maybe after the World Cup at some point. So we're working through this. I shared a little bit of insight, but I think everyone understands that I cannot share more than that at this point. Absolutely. Let's go off the field though. And hopefully you can, you know, explain a little bit your experience so far since the announcement in December of the ownership's intention to sell the team because of things going on inside of their family and the process of where it stands right now and sort of what are the steps it needs to go through.

Yeah, it's a interesting thing for itself, interesting topic for itself. I have to say the most important thing and what also gave me the belief from the beginning that it will not have an impact to the club at this point is that our ownership group loves this club. Our ownership group is mostly here from the city. They are fully committed. They have done an amazing work to have the club where it is right now and they are not running away they have not given up on this club they do this because They they think that it happens naturally at some point anyway that to have to head over the cup and they want to

Do this at the right time and they want to do it with time to find the next good owner who takes it from here and takes it for a long next period of time. And so it was a starting point of a process that can take for longer. It wasn't in a rush. It wasn't they are all on the way out and whoever comes first they will sell to. And so this is a very thoughtful and intense process that is in place right now. I would say, are we in the middle of it? I don't know, more likely closer to the middle now.

Not any longer at the beginning, but there's not really something that I can update on every given month because, as I said, it's an intense and thoughtful process and there are a lot of little steps and those little steps, they're not really something that you can speak about, that you can update people about. The only thing I can say and continue to say is that the plan hasn't changed. We want to find somebody who doesn't turn the club upside down, who doesn't do completely different things, somebody who takes the club from where it is now and who then continues to be a good

ownership for this club and allows the club to sustainably grow from where it is now. A huge piece of the news that came out, and I think it's been part of this emotional swing for Vancouver fans up and down over the last few months with these high highs. And then some worry in it was the news around a potential stadium to come out. Is that a situation where that is parallel to this conversation about ownership or is this fully tied in of the city saying, like we want the Vancouver Whitecaps to be a part of this

and that you are the driving force behind getting this project done? Yeah, there are two things to it. The first thing was after we announced this, there was a very positive and great reaction in our market. That also gave me and gives our ownership a lot of energy right now because a lot of groups in the city came to us, including city and province and other groups who said, look, we heard about that. Is there anything with what we can support? So do you need us at a certain point in this process to help to make this successful and to do what I said

before to find the next good ownership group that is committed to do this here long term. And so we have been pretty clear that an option for a new stadium and not just a dream, a pretty concrete option that really can be executed would be very important to have. Because we can improve our situation at BC Place, and BC Place is a World Cup venue, and it's the best stadium in Canada, and it's our stadium, and the contract that is now up to negotiating is is 15 years old So it's a little bit outdated so we can get to a better contract that fits better to the times that we are living in now But the new stadium is always a game changer and we have seen that in other markets We have seen how big of a game changer the stadium in Cincinnati for example was on Nashville. So

there is no question that the stadium of the Bengals is a great stadium in Cincinnati, but having their own stadium was a big game changer for FC Cincinnati. So to have that on the table. So why we went public now, even if the talks with the city for having a ready-to-go plan are also in the early stage, was that this market had a very bad experience with a professional club that told everyone that the club will not be moved and that the club will stay in Vancouver and that have been the Grizzlies. Everyone was coming to us and say, yeah, we heard all of this and we hear what you are

saying but we went through all of this and six months later the club got moved away from Vancouver. So we also wanted to send a sign, a message into the market and say, no, no, you can't believe us. What we say is too, we are working only on plan A and even part of that whole process is even working with the city on such a solution. And getting some excitement in the market in a moment, that is not an easy moment for the market. Sporting-wise, we're doing great. Right.

There's still, we got confronted with the same questions again and again and again. So we needed to send something into the market to say, hey, take us by our word, we're working only one direction. And there are a lot of exciting things part of this process. And we want to give you a little bit of insight into that. I think it definitely worked because I think we definitely felt the reaction, which was the excitement.

This might be way too far down the road or too specific, but I'm curious in the conversation about a stadium in Vancouver what the Requirements would be around a potential roof or being indoor and how much the schedule Change or non change in the vote last week to delay it would be sort of considered in all of that Yeah, you know, of course everything is considered and everything is thought through and we will continue to do this. I have to say that by my experience now five years, we are living in one of the best weather markets in MLS because yes, in winter it rains here, but the amount of weeks where you wouldn't be able to play are maximum two, I think. We train outdoor all year long, and we had like a one week with snow on the pitches.

You could have cleaned the pitches. It wasn't even really cold, but there was a week of snow. That's the thing that you have here in Vancouver, downtown Vancouver. I'm coming from a world where you play through the winter and you play in crazy cold conditions. We played in Toronto a couple of weeks ago and I tell you the weather there was worse than it ever becomes in Vancouver. So we are the last market that has to be worried about weather conditions. I think the whole West Coast is similar to that. We also don't have humidity in summer that becomes crazy hot.

So we always say to the league, look, don't be worried about us. Whatever the calendar is, whenever you want to play in Vancouver, you can play. If you have a roof or not, you can play. The weather in Seattle or Portland is not very different to ours and they don't have a roof and they play all year long. So it's possible. I think we have to look what's the best for the league, what is the best in the greater picture in the whole, I would say, world of soccer and find a solution and our market is up for the right solution, whatever it is.

You've talked about it a little bit, but it's been five years that you've been a part of this project. You've lived in Vancouver. It is five big years for soccer in Canada. Overall, some massive highs, qualifying for the World Cup, playing in the World Cup, winning an Olympic gold medal on the women's side. Some lows as well because of some of the chaos

we've seen around CSA and question marks around some of the professional clubs and all of that. What's your feeling about where the sport is, where, how it's growing, and maybe your and the White Caps responsibility inside of all of that. Look, yeah, we had a few setbacks, I would say. And I don't think that anyone who is involved in the game in Canada is happy about them, because it felt like we had a great momentum qualifying for a World Cup, and everything was going straight upwards, and then you had a few setbacks

that first needed to be solved. I have to say that we're back on track. That's how it feels for me. I think the new leadership of the CSA is doing an amazing job on cleaning things up and at the same time focusing on what are the important things to set us up for success for the future, to use the momentum. We are a little bit late to the process because we got holed up by a few things. But now it feels like we are back on track. I feel, I think that we are responsible, like

everyone who is a bigger player in the game in Canada, to now work closely together, to sit all together at one table and think what can we all do together to use this one momentum to make it a game changer to having the World Cup, to having a national team that is one golden generation and the excitement that exists around the sport. How can we use that to make that a game changer for the future? And I think we are getting to it. We have very good conversations between all professional clubs and I mean the three MLS clubs, the CPL and the NSL about what can we do from the professional club side, how can we help and how can we support the CSA. Because if we don't do it right now, then this is a big missed opportunity

that maybe doesn't come back for many, many years. I would say the most positive I can say or the very positive thing that I can say, let's say this way, is that the players that are sitting at this table, they all agree on we have to do what is good to grow the game and then our benefits will come afterwards. We don't have to look what is our benefit today and tomorrow. If we are so short-minded, the only thing about that we will not get anywhere. But we are really now, we came together and we think about what can we do now that will help us in three years, in five years, in 10 years. And I think that's the right approach. And that makes me optimistic that we will catch up on the time that we have lost and that we will be in a good place next year. What would, and final one, because I know you're busy and I appreciate the time.

It's been really fun to talk to you. But last one would be what would the Vancouver White Caps winning CONCACAF Champions Cup this year mean in all of that? We've seen Montreal make a final, we've seen TFC, you're on the cusp of it. It's not going to be easy the next two steps, but everything we've seen so far has proven you're capable of it. When you think about what it would mean to have a final in Canada or to host, to lift that trophy going into this year and a half plus,

what does it make you think about? Look, first of all, I ask everyone in my organization always to put the bar high, to dream of things, to visualize them for themselves because that's how you get to it. You have to believe in it. You have to believe in it. You have to dream of it because it's a good feeling that also gives you power.

But then I always ask everyone to come back in the reality and think about what's the next step. And the next step is to win and get a great result in the first leg. Somebody asked me for the season, how do we get deeper into the players? I said, look, the first thing is finishing higher in the regular season standing, and the first step to get to that is to win the next game. So I dream of it sometimes and I think how amazing that would be and for a lot of the players that might be the best day in their whole

career. It would be definitely a push and it would be a jump for all what we are doing here. But then my job is to hold everyone accountable for what we are doing today, to get everyone back to Earth because the only way to get there is to remain focused and work on what we can do today to get there and then after that we can celebrate it if we done and executed very well. So honestly I don't waste too much time because I don't want anyone to waste too much time and to be very focused for the game on next Saturday in St. Louis will not be an easy one. It's another new long travel in a great venue with amazing support there. We have to prove and set us up again for being in a good mood and having a lot of confidence to go into the Miami game with a lot of confidence and a good feeling.

Then we can celebrate later. It has been special to watch. It's been fun to watch. Congratulations so far. Look forward to continuing. I know a lot of the people that watch this show and enjoy this show, we talk a lot and we are all enjoying it from afar.

So good luck in the next few stages and hopefully we'll have you on again soon to celebrate some of these things coming to a completion. But once again, the CEO and the head of sporting, sporting director at the Vancouver Whitecaps, Axel Schuster, thank you for joining us. Thank you for having me and have a great day. Well, thank you once again to all of our guests today.

Thank you to Paul Tenorio. Thank you, of course, to Axel Schuster and the Vancouver Whitecaps as well for taking the time to talk with us. Tomorrow, we've got another fantastic interview. Chris Albright sat down with me at the Generation Adidas Cup. We talked some of the similar topics

that we talked about with Paul and Axel, talked about the schedule flip. We talked about Evander and Lucho and Denke and the success of Cincinnati so far and where that club sits as a market in the MLS ecosystem as well as in the bigger world. And of course, his cousins, two kids, Quinn and Kevin Sullivan who are doing good things and the Academy structure that has grown in leaps and bounds very quickly for that Cincinnati club. So

that's something to look forward to you for you tomorrow next week we'll be back normal schedule we'll have your weekend recap we'll have your live shows with Tom and with Jordan we've got some special things cooked up as well we're gonna continue to cover all of the great soccer that's going on across North America. So thank you once again to all of you for listening and we'll talk to you again very soon.