SoccerWise - SKC Post Vermes, RSL Ownership Change, CCC & USOC Preview

Episode Date: April 1, 2025

Never a dull moment in the sphere of North American soccer. SKC have parted ways with the longest tenured coach in MLS history, Peter Vermes. Tom & David jump on after listening into SKC ownerships press conference to discuss where this club goes from here. Then they talk about all the other big stories going on from RSL's potential sale again to CCC quarterfinals for MLS sides,  a second shot at CWC for LAFC & USOC 2nd round action.11:00 Tom's Reaction To SKC Parting With Peter Vermes30:00 SKC How They Move Forward42:20 RSL Potential Sale To New Ownership51:30 Chicago Fire New u22 Signing57:45 Big MLS Weekend Takeaways For Colorado, San Diego, NYCFC & ATL1:10:00 LAFC CWC Playoff & CCC vs Miami Preview   Soccerwise Live 2pm ET Every Tuesday/Wednesday/Thursday on Youtube/Twitch/Twitter

Soccer Wise is back! David Goss and Tommy Scoops with you here for another great week of coverage here at Soccer Wise. I did my weekend recap show yesterday if you want to go back and listen I recorded it and then I went and I re-recorded it because Sporting Kansas City for the first time basically since muskets were replaced with actual rifles have changed their manager and Peter Vermeese is now out the longest tenured manager in MLS history we will talk all about it coming up we've got a lot of coverage for you we've got CONCACF Champions Cup to preview US Open Cup second round some signings made in Chicago and Seattle a potential ownership change in Salt Lake City No rest for the weary Tom. How are you? How was your weekend? How much did you miss me?

I'm good. I always miss you guys. What kind of question is that? How was your weekend? How you doing? I'm good. The New York Mets are in town. I think I was talking about it last week. So baseball started and I went to the game yesterday for the first time to Lone Depot Stadium and I walked home. Is that what it's called now? Yeah, it is called Lone Depot. And I walked home.

That's the dream, right? Basically, it was basically Highbury or Anfield. That's what happened to me. So you like basically walk out and you're just in a little Havana. Yeah. And I don't live that far away. So you wander around and maybe grab a beverage or two. The weather's nice.

There's chickens screaming everywhere. It was like the full on experience and I was hyped about it and I was stoked because I was like Tom would love this because I went in to bodega grabbed a drink or two Thought about Miller lights and was like no, I don't need to just for the bit I can drink whatever I want and then I walked out and walked home and it was a really good time Otherwise this weekend I spent watching soccer on top of soccer on top of soccer It was a pretty good time a lot of spacedstyle games to an NWSL and MLS

So I enjoyed those guys that was nice. Did you pick up a torpedo bat while you were there? He had a couple fingers. I did not pick up a torpedo bat. What's the comp? For cuz like this is what everyone has to do that. Yeah It's like let's take a thing that's socially relevant and let's turn it into our bro Oh, I gotta say is even before going to that, you know, nerds take it just... Bro, back in my day you just took steroids like a man and ruined your body. You didn't hire an MIT nerd to work within the rules and create a new baseball bat. Yes.

No, for sure. You know, game is totally ruined now compared to that. We did have a couple fans I think that sent us pictures of their car playing cards they had of the Tommy scoops baseball player that was funny performed on the show last Thursday Which was good to have my guess would be it'd be something in cleats Like being able to put something that allows you to strike the ball a little bit harder in a cleat court cleat a court cleat Yeah, just a small piece of slate like right on the inside above your big toe So that what it strike through a ball it explodes Whatever steel Christian bentake clearly has under his forehead like we need to check if that's actually a skull cuz that is that is a

Lethal weapon and just an absolute cheat code. So maybe that's it Kaylin Carr helmet that yes the ball fly Even faster even stronger. Oh, hold on. That's, we should get off the baseball game before we get into the real show. Of, I got to play soccer last night with uh, former MLS legend Stephen Kiel. I got him. Whoa. Got him in to come to my main thing. Three in the holster?

I was so happy. And I've been, I've been trying to like, like when, when we transition over 30 I was like keel like I know you're not that far Do you want to play it was like hey? I don't know if I can commit to everything and like in reality We he needed to make sure to see that the team was was good enough for his standards dude I don't think he had a single bad touch He was nothing but positive to we won just everything

He's a force of nature And I was just so happy to have keel on the field and then in normal keel Fashion like we're just talking after the game and I'm like hey man. Thanks again for coming. I hope you enjoyed it I hope it was up your standard because you can come back literally whatever you want And again, he was the best player on the field obviously and then steal his text back to me He's like ah dude. That was so much fun. Nah, man. You played great. What about what about your goal or like? When it was like ah, man? What a leader what a leader I need to give him sporting director jobs except nobody wants that for a men's league team

But um that brings it because the Kailin and we're talking in the group chat after and I was like man as As desperate as I was to leave a positive impression on keel I'm worried about playing with Kailin Carr and thus ruining the mystique around the group chat Pickup stories not for him because I know he would kill it. It's like would he be disappointed in Just that I either didn't get in a fight get a red card or do something Like extraordinary in just an average game, so I'm worried I would say if you were playing with that level of worry the odds that you don't come in late on a tackle and cause a fight are probably pretty low. And then am I just doing this to impress Kaylen? Yeah. And in reality he's probably like your loot tick.

Also, he's the last person who wants that because the thing I found out when I played with him is as games get more physical it's worse for the most skilled player on the field. So his life gets worse, you get more physical. So there's no like, oh, defend me type stuff. It's like, please ratchet that stuff down so that when I meg people and when I cut back on people, I just love the first few times I played with him, I was like, oh, you can play out on the wing, you can play up top, right? I watched you play soccer. And then like pretty early in every game,

he's like, yeah, I'm gonna play in the middle because I'm the splur on the field and you're like oh okay well that's not what your MLSsoccer.com card says it says you're a forward so I don't know if you could play nines in central midfield right now and oh yeah right then we could just play to your feet that will probably work as well that was so that was Keel was like hey man where do you and I was like you're Stephen Kiel you tell me where do you want to play? He goes I'll just help with the team. However, and I was like, this is nice cut the shit Where do you want to play and he was like, I was like, okay. Well center back or center mid I'm leaning center mid, but if you want to play in the back, that's cool, too

Yeah, he gets on the field. He's like, where do you want me to go? I was a stand in the middle, please now I will say this it is not a guarantee I have put together some squads, especially when it it was like all right we don't have anyone can people fill in of like former professional players where it does not go well there's like a level of expectation that they're like I'm only gonna do this and so you have to do all these other things or expectations of like oh if I just ping this full field cross you'll bring it down the back on your second touch like yeah sorry that's not normally how we play so sometimes it can be I'm just

saying it's not a guarantee so you got a good situation kill kill did he do did you win we won yeah did he do three in the pocket no he did no no he's probably trying to be reserved trying to be respectful he did have the wristband on and when I saw him put it on when we were near the bench, like putting on our cleats, I was like, oh my god. I'm so juiced. I just wanted him to bring back his old, didn't have a haircut if he didn't for like six months.

Get that back. But I can tell you, man, pressing with Stephen Kiel, I felt like I could have played for the Red Bulls. Because he was like, hold, go, hold, go. And I was like, yes. And then my goal was on a pressing sequence with Kiel. That's just something that He was like, hold! Go! Hold! Go! And I was like, yes! And then like that, my goal was on a pressing sequence with Keele. I was like, I want you to narrate everything I did. Anyway, shout out to Keele. Tom closes space quickly. Gets the head down, wins it back, goes to goal. What a moment

from Tommy Scoops. He just jumped in his Keele's arms. It's inspirational. I have to shout out Colorado right now. I would be remiss, because I think my brother-in-law grew up playing with Stephen Kiel in Colorado, on like the ODP teams and stuff. So shout out to the great state of Colorado. And shout out to the loons in the chat who says,

my dad always said when he was a kid, there was a kicker in the NFL who was missing half his foot. So he had a flat pitching wedge type serve which he was able to hit them from. Nick Murray, of course, the legend follows up with, that was Tom Dempsey, who used to hold the record for longest field goal. I don't think cutting off half your foot is the same as creating a torpedo bat.

There's a bit more commitment to that and I don't think as many people are going to do that. I understand the concept, but I think this would be a bit more. You still get the grind, bro. Yeah, this would be a bit more of the the cleat change I can't I mean, maybe it would be goalkeeper gloves that are a little bit different. I Can't really soccer doesn't really have that type of stuff right more of the stuff is like, oh

Someone lays down behind the wall now all of a sudden two months later in the world. Everyone lays down behind the wall It's like stuff like that where it's a bit more ingenuity of like style of play or things you do than actual equipment but if anyone has a good idea of what the torpedo bat version in soccer would be I would absolutely take that and would be happy to steal it as my own idea create it sell it to a team put a patent on it and then make everyone freak out about it. Just say you want to my one freak out about it Just say you went to MIT and you got it. I Did go to MIT if you say you went to MIT and just said that you did this long-standing deep analytical research on why actually

Playing for four two and lumping it forward mate is the way to go analytically I think you could convince somebody to like get it started so somebody like You know, I may be a lower level where they don't have the resources to check your work. This would be like, if someone went the full long throw-in route and was like, all I do is train long throw-ins. I teach people how to take long throw-ins. And I can come to your team if you pay me enough. And then I can teach you all long throw-ins.

And then is this you showing dudes how to curl? Pretty much. But I would be there being like actually throw ins are kind of lame Just throw it in quickly and start playing I hate throw ins and I know there's I think there is some statistical Ideas now of like any time it's in the attacking half try and throw it into the box you gain an advantage all that stuff I find throwing so boring, but that's why we have to do it that way But you need to do it that way that makes it less boring it's still boring just eliminate it you play it restart play you play on the ground you can't put the ball in the air and no

I'm gonna say within three yards and then we play that's stupid that's stupid I didn't I don't sign up to watch people throw the ball back in that's not what I'm here for is this is this a thing that really needs to be fixed? I feel like there's a very small part of the game that I think is going to be okay. Interesting. Well, you you have to have a product committee, right? You always have to be working on something. This could be something that Peter Vermeese could take over in his free time. Now let's move into our first big topic here of the day. I did my weekend recap yesterday. A big thank you to some of the awesome members of our Discord

community who are sporting Kansas City fans and they were putting their thoughts in in the morning and I recorded then I went to re-record so that I could redo the show and lead it with the massive news that Peter Vermeese was stepping down and I used a bunch of their comments to sort of give what I thought was a really accurate description of how KC fans were feeling and how big a moment this was and the reality of what was occurring yesterday. I took this quote from, or at least this line from,

I think it was Alex Abnos' piece at The Guardian, one of our good friends, shout out to Abnos, who wrote that, Vermes at 58 was the longest tenured skipper in MLS, having originally taken over as interim coach in 2009. He also owned the fourth longest active managerial tenure in the world before his firing. His 15 year, 7 month, 24 day tenure stands as the 38 longest tenure by any soccer manager in the world since the second world war. When you are using world wars as reference points, you are in rarefied air. Peter Vermeese coached 609 matches for Sporting Kansas City across all competitions, more

than half the games in the club's 30 year existence. No figure in MLS history has coached more. He is third all time and MLS regular season wins. He is the only person in MLS history to have won an MLS cup as a player and then as a coach for the same club. He was originally sporting director, then interim coach, then head coach. He won four troph director, then interim coach, then head coach. He won

four trophies, three US Open Cups, and the MLS Cup in 2013. But of course, this team didn't make the playoffs last year. Their winless streak, as I said yesterday, runs back 10 matches now through the end of last season and the opening six matches of this season. And so Peter Vermeese has parted ways with Sporting Kansas City, and they are into a new reality. We were on the press conference call with ownership a few moments ago. Big J Journalist.

Yeah, Big J Journalism there. I asked zero questions, because I didn't want to get in the way. I'm, you know, purely observing everything that's going on. But Tom, just sort of give me the idea of when you first heard this coming around Your thoughts your reactions and what you've sort of digested about this over the last 24 to 48 hours The I got a lot of texts from people across the league

coaches GM's front offices like agents right the overwhelming Like sentiment was I can't believe they actually did it, or this actually happened. We have, even as this show, Gus, we haven't had a discussion of should he be fired or should there be a change? Because it would just be then particularly, it was last year when he signed the new contract, it was just like, this is a waste of time. This is an exercise in time wasting. Why are we talking about something that is not going to happen? Let's use resources

on other things. So that was the overarching feeling. Given the results, particularly over the last year and a like, whatever, what? 13, 14 games dating back to last year, but even going back to their 23 season where they had a strong end to the year and beat st Louis in round one of the playoffs like even then it's been super shaky What ever since what 21 22? I believe that he deserved several continuing chances or to continue to go Like you wasn't gonna be a quick trigger and he's earned. So it wasn't about whether or not should this happen on merit. It was, I'm surprised that that it did because there hasn't been a time, like, first of all, sporting Kansas city does not exist without Peter Vermeese.

There is, I don't think that there is a singular other person in this league that is so synonymous with one club and one club success that it just feels weird that We're taught we just did a sport in Kansas City press conference and Burmese wasn't on it We're gonna watch the game this weekend where he's not on the sideline. There's gonna be press over to me discussions It's just It's gonna take a minute to get used to because this is all this club has ever known This is all what we've known in terms of consuming this league first as fans and then as as media members. So it's a gigantic shift. It's one that I think is the right decision to happen. I would have, you know, we're going to get into it deeper,

but I will say where things should have been different, I think over the last year, where changes other changes could have been made to better prepare for this day. But we'll get into that later. It's just the overarching feeling that I do want to go to is this is a legend of this club obviously legend of this league there are few people as important to American soccer to Major League soccer I should say then Peter Vermeese and I do hope that that's his legacy and I do think with a little bit of time more people are gonna say like this right now it's oh my god like if you're a fan that wanted him out the Casey Cauldron their supporting other supporters

like formerly like said that he should resign this weekend and then he was fired and so there's a lot of that sentiment but I think as time goes more and more people are going to be talking glowingly about Peter Ramiz as they should be I? Think that's right. I think it's it's There are very few times or sports legacies end on a high it's just hard because a lot of times they wouldn't end then and That I said yesterday on the show like a couple different times a couple different ways He to his credit probably got let go because of the product of the success he had

and the expectations he created at the club and the belief that the club should compete for trophies and they should compete at a high level in MLS and across continental competition and he was hoping cups and all that type of stuff. And so in failure to do that now, he had set the bar that he was no longer matching. There are a lot more things going on, I think, with sporting Kansas City than

just Peter Vermeese. But when you talk about him, like you're talking about someone who should probably have a statue and if not, there should be a stand or an end, whatever it is. He, of course, crossed over in a really interesting time in major league soccer, right? He took over a team and I think I haven't't read it so I apologize to Matt Doyle. I think Doyle talked about the Man U friendly

at Arrowhead and all of that. And I think Weeby talked about this in his thread that he sort of did, talking about first covering the team and everything. But they played in the Minor League Baseball Stadium or they played in an empty NFL Stadium. They were irrelevant in Major League Soccer. They were irrelevant in Kansas City.

And he then crossed over into a period of gaining relevance that Sporting KC led Major League Soccer in. It was the LA Galaxy in Sporting Kansas City from 2010 to 2013 and 14, RSL in there as well, that like pushed the next generation of the league. Seattle was a huge part of that. And then Toronto getting Javinko and changing sort of their trajectory was a massive part of that. And then that brings Atlanta and LAFCs and,

and a ton of other clubs that have done it really well into the fold. But I remember watching from afar when sporting park, Livestrong Park, I think it was at the time, open and thinking it was the coolest thing I'd ever seen and what he built in a soccer style, right? The high pressing high intensity style then transitioning to possession style success Expectations it was stuff that had never really happened before or hadn't happened in that way in MLS And DC set a mark early early in the 90s under Bruce Arena and the galaxy shifted that a little and continued things on but

What sporting Kansas City became when they changed to sporting Kansas City and I said yesterday Columbus has now done it But I don't think any other original team Has regained relevance the way sporting Kansas City has done it going from Kansas City wizards to sporting kc Peter vermis's fingerprints are across all of that and he was able to a really large extent to stay relevant for a long time as the league changed then really quickly. Like the league has shifted so much in terms of spending and global exposure I remember an interview with Peter Vermeese that I did where he said

recruiting players used to be 80% agents coming to you and 20% scouting. And it has now flipped in MLS because we have the resources to scout, which to his credit means he shifted the way he operated and worked as the league grew and as it moved forward. He built the training ground, which is a huge thing. Up until US soccer finally now putting shovels in the ground in Atlanta, funded by Arthur Blank,

it was like the only national training center that had been built and it was built for the purpose of coaching education, which is a massive issue in the United States and probably one of the main ways we take steps forward, as well as I think refereeing education. So a ton of work that he did on and off the field has changed the game and changed that market.

Like Kansas City is gonna be a World Cup market. I don't know that Kansas City is in, when you talk about markets in the United States, elevated into that category very often, but their strength as a soccer community has allowed them to sort of battle maybe above their weight in many different conversations when it's hosting Copa Americas and Gold Cups

and massive USMNT games, US Women's National team games, and now a World Cup as well. So he's involved in a ton of that. But as the league has shifted, I think parts of sporting Kansas City have fallen behind. A hundred percent. I think some of that falls to him, and I think we're about to find out how much of it is him papering over cracks. And I think when you talk about a lot of managers like this, and I think to the arson vengers of the world and all of that, the manager and the face of the team becomes pain sponges. But if the sporting Kansas City ownership group wanted to come in and spend

25 million dollars on Emanuel Latte-Loth, I don't think Peter Vermeese was gonna say no. And in the press conference that we were just in, Jeff Carlyle read a quote from Peter Vermeese this offseason about how they haven't really caught up in spending in the league and things have stagnated. And a large part of Peter Vermeese's success, I talked about this a little yesterday, was off this core of Superdraft picks

that were able to play for him for basically a decade three World Cup starters in Graham Zussi Roger Espinosa and Matt Beasler the Kai Kamaras of the world the CJ Sopong's Dom Dwyer's and then some other really smart moves inside of MLS in which they were able to miss and hit off and on on big international signings But they were able to maintain success because their core was really strong. And as that core has now gone off and retired, they haven't been able to replace them and they haven't been able to hit as well

on newer signings. But I don't know how much of that extent is Peter Vermeese's failure in identifying the right players or coaching them? And how much is, a lot of the DPs I named yesterday that didn't hit, those are TAM level players. And so part of what Sporting Kansas City has done has not really been operating in modern MLS. That's the thing. They had, they did not find a way to transition into

the next, on probably two eras of Major League Soccer. The Galaxy were much worse at failing to go into the TAM era. Obviously they were much worse at failing to go into the Tam era. Obviously, they were completely back after winning M. West Cup, but it took them a while to adhere or adapt to the new league. And that, hey, just because you're the Galacticos, the Galaxy, you can't just go, hey, Beckham and Robbie Keane and Lance Dobson, that worked out great. All right, let's do Gerard. Let's do not young Let's do whatever right and these ones that didn't work out and then Oh Douglas Costa, of course Yeah in 2012 that was sick not in 2022

And so it took them a little while and again Kansas City was in a different way because that's not how they built their teams But the Super draft has less and less of an impact. It is still a way that you can find undervalued players if you're really good at developing, which Peter Vermeese and this Kansas City group was, you can still find players. But it is never going to be the backbone of a team like it was for that dominant Kansas City run, their best run. From 2011 to 18, they made the playoffs every year. They won four major trophies, one MLS Cup, three Open Cups. That was all in the backs of Zusi Beasler Espinoza As the foundation and then Dom Dwyer for a little bit or again

Kai Kamara wasn't a Superdraft pick but he was somebody that got from CJ Wise Yeah, like all like these players like that the foundation of that team was the Superdraft Whereas now if you get one dude in the super draft that becomes a regular guy That's a great success. See even a free fo was somebody that Great super draft pick not only is he not Part like the core guy. It's just him like he's like Doyle wrote this really well and and you alluded to before I read that piece was excellent piece and Doyle really laid out this timeline where it was like pretty much like two times over the last decade they've gotten a regular starter or a key contributor in the Superdraft

so they haven't adapted the new league and you go to spending and Mike Ilitch took that question from Jeff Carlisle and that was the first time that he kind of like bit back just a little bit where he was like I don't know that there's been a time where Peter asked for something and didn't get it. More as like why is he saying this in an interview that we're not spending more when he could have like and two owners like they did do the Gattacinda and Alunplito was the same window that was like you know 12 million dollars in transfer fees that was significant. But it was then and then it was this winter when they brought in Jovovich, Manu Garcia,

right? Like everything else has been, as you say, 10 level players and you cannot compete in MLS like that. And I don't know that Jovovich and Manu Garcia is competing at the high end of MLS in terms of spending. It's not, but I don't want to be the podcast that sits here and says that every team has to spend like Atlanta or every team. And like, and cause then, you know, Columbus becomes an air-quote low-spending team.

And it's all relative, right? There is a baseline for me, just so that we keep moving the goalposts every year of like, well, somebody else did a 4 million, now you have to do 5 million, and now you have no ambition even though you had ambition three years ago. There's a baseline to spend that they have not hit. And again, this is going to mirror in some ways so much real conversation in that of like again we're not asking you to sign a ten do ten million dollar fee for Alampleto and somebody like that every year every two years it's like but you need to be doing it every couple years of like it can't just be a one-time

thing it can't just be a reaction to oh well we stunk this year okay here's all the money right like so that's where they went wrong and not being able to adapt and my last point Because I've been rambling too much. I still think if and I did this is a false premise because there's no way he would have agreed To it He earned all the control if there was a way to hire a sporting director that was actually above him and not whatever Mike Burns is Now not the Brian but like they work for Peter or worked for Which wasn't, Mike Ellington didn't deny that. He said, we brought Mike Burns in to sit alongside Peter Vermeese and Peter Vermeese was our CEO

and final decision maker. If there was a way to get, again, insert Ernst Tanner or even, you know, Chris Albright, John Thornton, name whoever your favorite sporting director is, of course. A guy like that, to be the sporting director and and Peter Vermes, you can still have a say, but it's not your final decision. You're the head coach. I think he's still coached, because I think Peter Vermes, the sporting director, is much more at fault than Peter Vermes, the head coach.

Yeah, I wonder how much of it is split responsibility. I do wonder if, let's say he decides he wants to be involved again, if another club looks at him, where they choose him. Like I do wonder now going forward, does a club hire him as a full-time sporting director and let someone else coach? You think that everyone views him as a great coach and a not very good sporting director. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. All right. I think that's fair. And I think you see that in a lot of the signings as I went through on the on our depth Charts and looking at salaries looking at where they spent

The high-level tam signings for them have missed over and over again I mean center back is a clear one we talk about but we talk about center back They're paying eight hundred thousand to a million dollars to a lot of players who have paid Played center back for them who have not been able to play up to the level. They've elevated a lot of players who have played center back for them, who have not been able to play up to the level. They've elevated a number of players they had already signed into high level TAM signings, some deserve, some not. You know, you look at a Daniel Shallowy

and you ask $1.3 million, like, is that what he's worth? And what does it require for a player like that to be good where that you then have to go spend other places, which means? You know, can you have him on that salary cap number and a lot of other pieces for them like they have struggled to replace Positions across the field and they've struggled to do it where they've made some tries on signings now a lot of their guys Have been high salaries free signings like they haven't paid transfer fees

and so maybe the salaries are elevated but they had this belief that they could like find these diamonds in the rough and it has worked sometimes like in Ilié Sánchez although again they didn't put him in the right position to be super successful for them and it hasn't worked more times than it has and that's where I think you talk about things getting stale and maybe Peter felt like he had to go and look for these things. I thought that quote was really interesting like you said because the comment was I don't know a time when Peter asked for something and didn't get it and so now we're stuck in a world post-Peter where the question that we're asking is was this Peter Vermeese holding the team back or not wanting to

spend more and not feeling like they could or not doing it well or is that where the club stands and is that who they are they as I talked about the training grounds and stuff right they were pretty progressive in building out their academy and their two team for anyone who wasn't around at the time the like recruiting run to get Johnca Busio was a huge moment where this was a player from at the time in unaffected regions, so he could go wherever he wanted. He had this future a lot of people expected. He chose to go to Kansas City

and they were able to work him through their farm team, through their system and then sell him on, Eric Palmer Brown and all of that. There has not been nearly enough output though, from that system for them to be able to stay in. Because the reality was, even if you talk about MLS changing with SuperDraft, from 2000 to 2010, no one was hitting

at the rate that Sporting Kansas City did. So the odds that that were gonna continue never happened. And my idea always was great, you're ahead of the curve. Now you have time to build your academy system out so that the next set of Graham Zussis and Matt Beaslers and Roger Espinoza's come through your academy and you can rebuild that core. And they were never able to do that.

And that is, I think one of the huge sticking points for them was you were either supposed to build those players in and have them be the next version. I think Jake Davis is gonna be one, but you need five of those or you sell them and then you use that money to reinvest in that 27 year old center back who's going to be there for four or five years and helps other players come

through. So there's a lot of issues there. There has been it seems like an insistence on style over results at times as well. Over the last five, six years. And in saying all of that, they got to the playoffs two years ago, they beat St. Louis in the opening round. And that's going to be like a seminal moment in the history of that club

because that is this regional rival that they finally had. And then they made it in US Open Cup last year. So even when they've been bad, there have been some high water marks. And I think that kept Peter Vermeese there even long. But now the question is like, what happens and what ownership sounded like today. And what I talked about yesterday,

and I think you're probably hearing the same is, he was so ubiquitous across the club in so many ways that it is going to take a little while to figure out how this club charts their way forward. I am worried about that. Because the other side of, you know, build him a statue for everything he's done, they're not at this position without him in any way. But he's, it's his hands on all decisions, not just major, like mine, all the details,

right? Like, there is not like a sporting decision that was made that didn't go through him and and like that extends to the training facility to I'm sure the the methodology and everything else right like all of this is Built on Peter Vermeese and as we're saying like things needed to change You don't change the managers slash soccer czar without there being a reason to change things because it got stale or things need to be different one quote from Mike Illidge was yeah we like I will give him credit that he was honest for a couple he's like look we haven't done a coaching search we don't like we're gonna be like like learning on the job he wasn't saying it as if he doesn't know what he's doing but he's like I

don't know exactly how it's gonna go because we haven't been in this position like this is new for us too right and he was saying a couple of those things, but then he goes, yeah, well, the first thing is if you want something changed, you need it to be different. I was like, yeah, that makes sense, except then Kairi Zavagnan is the interim coach, which great, except he goes, this is Kairi's job to lose. Okay, so the new era without Peter Vermeese is potentially Kairi Zavagnan, head coach, who's been here longer than Peter. He was a player from 2008 and then immediately in 08 after retired, 090s on the coaching staff. And then Mike Burns is the CSO calling the shots who, again,

I talked to people who were interviewed or potentially considering this job that Mike Burns eventually got. Well, for Gavin Wilkinson and then Mike Burns. It was clear you work for the head coach. And so you're not getting the top number twos in the league because you're still reporting to somebody. And particularly the head coach makes it even more difficult. And they knew that, or they assumed if things go wrong, I'm the guy who gets fired, not Peter Vermes. So they weren't getting the cream of the crop of the next potential CSOs.

So the future of the brand new Sporting Kansas City without Peter Vermeese is his longtime assistant who's been there even longer than he is and his friend who they hired to be the sporting director who I don't even know if he got an interview in MOS since he left New England. This is just going to... My fear is this is going to be a watered down version of Peter Vermeese's Sporting Kansas City. And my fear is that it ends up being a lost year. And even if and when they do make big changes for either a CSO or a head coach or whatever that like we're already we're going to be talking about this again next year of like, okay, then next year is going to be the transition year. And then so at what point are they the

air quote finished product? Or at what point do they have the you know, we're not transitioning anymore? We're we're we're into our new era? When is that going to be? You know, we're not transitioning anymore. We're we're into our new era. When is that gonna be? it's really hard to understand because in this convo of like you said Carries a vagin in that convo of like oh, it's his job to lose But they also said they're gonna go out and do a global search They've never done it before and not one but two consulting firms. Yes Well, I would assume part of that is because they have to fill two roles.

And part of that is because they've never done this before. And I say that in that whenever these things happen, we always start to jump into a Rolodex and we're like, what are the connections? Who is the soccer connections for these people? Is it people that have played for that ownership group or a CSO or with a coach or whatever? And as you just said everything here goes back to Peter Vermeese

So for them to get outside of their echo chamber They probably need to consulting firm to put together lists of people a lot of power I think also I would like to put itself forward as a potential third concern Why don't we start a podcast and not a stupid consulting firm? We could just do both. Why not do both? We'll talk about it both sides. If we were smart at business, that's what we would've done.

But we are not, which is why we do a soccer podcast. Good at business, you know? Wouldn't be able to say things like consuming the attacks? The way forward for this is very confusing because then the other side is, you talk about the lack of options at sea for a sporting director last year because you knew the reality.

What about coaches now? And like we've said Jim Curtin's name a million times, he's gonna pay a lot of money to not coach. Why would he take this up? But anyone like him, why would you take a job if there's no CSL? Because whoever you end up working with and reporting to is not hired and so you don't have buy-in from them.

So I don't understand how you hire in this position for coach before CSO. Maybe did you interpret or maybe there was maybe something I missed like I'm assuming Mike Burns is CSO but like. It was not worded that way it was worded that a lot of Peter Vermeese's role will fall to him in that front office space but they're still not really sure it was not worded that it wasn't worded in a way in which Mike Burns is running a coaching search that was never said and it doesn't feel like that's a reality so I think that's another dangerous spot this team's in.

The only, so there are a few, like, in a vacuum, I don't think that the CSO head coach dual role makes sense. But nothing is ever black and white. Chicago doing that for Burrhalter, it doesn't make a ton of sense. You're not getting Burrhalter without that. It's just not happening. And while Burrhalter-

Having someone who's not paying attention to CSO was not worse than what they had going on before. And Burrhalter too brought in a lot of front office people as well, which I think is a good thing because he knows a good thing. So while I'm certain that he still has full control of everything, there's more delegating there to do. And like Bruce Arena, same thing. In San Jose, that's how they're going to get him. That's how New England was gonna get Bruce, right? There are spots where it makes sense The only way that I can see a scenario in which Jim Curtin considers Kansas City is With you have full power and if you're Kansas City after doing like that with Peter from East which again

Particularly at the time made a ton of sense everything like completely right You'd I would not do that again. And so if you like if I'm Jim curtain, I'm not even taking that phone call again Um, I said this in the soccer wise page discord, which again you can subscribe to the patreon Or maybe it was a chat regards. I'll say it now Anyway, this is my point that I'm I flippantly said things like yet Jim turned down at land united And I don't know if that was completely widely known. He wasn't offered the job that I'm I flippantly said things like get Jim turned down at land United. And I don't know if that was completely widely known. He wasn't offered the job.

But from my understanding it was made very clear to him. If you interview the potential at the end of this is you're the highest paid coach in the league. You're our number one. So you're our guy. We want you. And he politely declined that. If Jim Curtin is turning down that job for that money with that owner and that front office and that flexibility on the roster, there is not a job that he's about to jump at let alone the sporting Kansas City one. All my reasons for that, there is no reason to talk about potentially Jim Curtin for this job.

This would be a hilarious clip if in a month from now he has a press conference. But um, and funny, ironic that I did this whole spiel to let's not waste time talking about Jim Kurt. This is why. And then I did it for seven minutes. This is why we did the podcast and we didn't start the consulting firm. We'd have to charge someone for all that time you just talked. No, but maybe that'd be better because then it's working by the hour. But no one would hire us and that would be the other problem. I Though would add and what I was sort of getting to was I think the rest of that list of like experienced people

Who could be the head coach? I think a lot of them say no right now Because it's not a great situation to go into without a CSO in place now Ownership can say we're we're the CSO and both Mike Burns and his role now or whoever ends up also going into that front office. I don't know that how that will work and the coach will both report into us and like that's how we're going to set things up. That's not how most clubs are set up and so I just I think you go back into a waiting game which is where you got to figure out the role you need, game, which is where you got to figure out the role you need, the roles you need.

You have to figure out who gets hired. You have to figure out what the org chart is. And then at that point, you have to go through interview processes and find people. And so we can throw out names. I think Josh Wolf's been thrown out pretty quickly. Makes a lot of sense. Geo Cyber races, of course, going to get thrown out. Makes a lot of sense. Gios have races of course. Gonna get thrown out, makes a lot of sense as well. I've got some Adrian Heath texts from people

so you could say his name as well. Sounds like you don't wanna say his name. It sounded like you put them to somebody else to say his name. Somebody else says his name. I don't know. That feels maybe. I wouldn't mind it. A little far fetched to me but it could be.

Laurent Courtois of course would get mentioned cause he got let go last weekend so he's available. There are a couple names in all of that. I just I can't see this getting done anytime soon. So you you end up in a situation just like what just happened in Austin right? Rodolfo Burel took over. Josh Wolf was not as higher. So he eventually as things struggle they part ways he goes out he gets his coach.

That's the way most sporting directors work, is they want someone on their soccer brain, they want someone with their background, whatever it is that they're looking for from a coach. It's very rare that it comes from two people who are hired separately. And if it does happen in some worlds, a lot of times they're both like Chris Albright and a Pat Noonan, who are from the same background and have the same connections and sort of are going to do a project together. So we can go through names and lists and all of that

as people continue to ask. Hell yeah. Yeah, we can do that over the next few months because I think it's gonna come up for a while. I don't think it's gonna get solved anytime soon. For the team on the field, they host St. Louis this weekend. So for the first time since 2009,

without Peter Vermeese on the sideline, they're gonna host a St. Louis team who's also struggling in what is a pretty big rivalry match. They then host Portland the following weekend, and then they travel to San Jose and FC Cincinnati to close out the end of April. So those are the next four games for this team. I watched back again, the Dallas game, they score,

they give up two goals within five minutes, they go down two one. It's a lot of what I've said about KC. I like Suemov, I like some of what you see from him, helps create the goal. I like some of what you see from Jake Davis, Montego CS talent, Jovalichc, you know, can finish. There's pieces to like.

I don't know how different carries of Agnin can put it all together, but you'd hope if you get a new coach bump of like effort and energy because you have to, and a change up of the environment that maybe you can be a little bit more competitive. It's actually probably a good thing to have this St. Louis game.

This weekend, if you're gonna say like, oh, it's a new season, let's restart things. you can be a little bit more competitive. It's actually probably a good thing to have this St. Louis game this weekend. If you're gonna say like, oh, it's a new season, let's restart things. Having a high energy game is probably a good thing. And a win there probably feels bigger than just a standard win in an MLS game. Sure. And yeah, that could all be true.

This is not a serious team for 2025. Like they don't, like again, all the things you said you like I agree with that They don't have a defensive structure the the personnel in from go keep it a six Those back five six spots. I don't think that they're anywhere close to being a serious team And again, maybe they go in a run MLS nine teams out of 15 in each conference make the playoffs. It's early It's a plenty of games left. That's all possible. That's, I think it's unlikely, but I don't think that it would solve anything if they snuck in a ninth or whatever, right? Like I still think that this

needs a pretty serious defensive overall. Let's move on to our next big topic, because as if Peter Vermeese being let go is not big enough, we also potentially have an ownership change for What would be the what second time in five years in Salt Lake City? The reports came out I think via Sportico that RSL and the Utah Royals, of course Real Monarchs owned underneath all of this Are on the verge of being sold from David Blitzer and the Blitzer Group to the Miller family. The Miller family owned the Utah Jazz from 1986 to 2020

when they sold it to Ryan Smith, who is currently the minority owner of RSL and the majority owner of the Utah Jazz, where I think the Millers are minority owners. Not really sure how all of that works. And of of course David Blitzer owns a ton of other sports ventures around the world. The reports are that the Miller family will become the majority owner of both RSL and the Royals with Blitzer staying as a minority owner inside the club. I would assume part of that has to do with Blitzer

soccer group staying connected. So I would assume there's some desire to stay a part of the link to the other clubs that he owns which are Augsburg, Bronbee, Audio Den Hag, Beverein, Estoril, Praia, and Alcarrón in Segunda. That is like an absurd grouping of soccer teams. They are all very similar, which are like kind of a team you've heard of in a kind of good soccer country, sometimes second division,

sometimes standard first division, like competitive but not super high level. So all of that is a part of this. And the reports coming out are that David Blitzer originally bought the team for $400 million. He, with that, got Real Salt Lake, Rio Tinto Stadium, Real Monarchs,

the training ground, which is one of the best in the country, and the option for the discounted expansion fee that they used to go and purchase the Utah Royals and bring them back into NWSL after the original team had moved on to Kansas City, which is now the KC Current. And then the belief is that Rialta-Salt Lake is now worth 525 million and the Royals are worth 70 million. So in total you're pushing around 600 million dollars which is like not that huge a jump because

$400 million and NWSL expansion teams are now worth $110 million. It's like kind of where you'd expect it. Either way, this was a team that was pushed to be sold in 2020. Blitzer finally closed in 2022. To now turn around and sell it again in 2025 is interesting times, I guess you could say in Salt Lake City. Yeah, this is um, yeah, it's been a weird one, right? Um, so this has been in the works obviously for a bit. They are, like, I knew that they were close to a deal to being agreed to be sold. I didn't know where it was. So the Miller family, like you said, with that they sold the jazz that Ryan Smith bought. And what I was told is Blitzer is still gonna be involved and don't know about Ryan Smith

So it sounds to me that the Miller family comes over to take a majority Blitzer becomes minority and then Ryan Smith would be out That's as it was described to me with the caveats that nothing is totally done yet and things are still being worked through I know it's been closed for for the better part of a month. So it's an interesting one. It's unfortunate because as you said, not just that the team got sold, it was the way it was getting sold last time because Delroy Hansen forced to sell the team just because of bad things. And it took a while. The team was shoestring budget for a couple of years. Remember, Freddie Juarez was the manager left to take an assistant coaching job at Seattle because being the assistant in Seattle was more attractive

than being the head coach in RSO because of all the unknowns. So that is the backdrop for Blitzer and Smith taking over. The fans went through that tough time. They still showed up. The team somehow was still competitive on the field, which is a credit to Pablo Mascherani, which is a credit to the front office, Elliot and Kurt Schmidt was still there and now Kurt Schmidt is CSO like the people in that building for them to guide them to still be competitive and then you go through that window and the new owners do their new owner press conference and we're gonna up the spend yeah everything sounds great you win the press conference and then for it to change again in a couple

years like again this it doesn't mean it's going to be a bad thing it could be a good thing and particularly if blitzer didn't want to be the majority owner or not like if Ryan Smith didn't want to be there anymore not like then it is good if change happens but I think you see it in in Chichol Rongo was bought for six million dollars and how much transfer fees have been spent beyond after that like Goncalves was with three million like that was at least they were still doing that. But the whole press conference promise of raising spend, everything's going to be better, we're doing all this.

And then, yeah, actually, I think we're out, right? Like, that's unfortunate for the fans. And I'm very hopeful that this will end up being a positive for the club, for the fans. It's just unfortunate that they've desperately needed a striker for a couple months. And when I was alluding to things are pretty difficult for the front office right now, this is why.

Like they couldn't go out and spend the $12 million that they got from the Andres Gomez deal. Yeah, it's been brutal. And it's just been like this waiting game of when are they gonna actually finish their team because they haven't done that. And that's been a huge sticking point for this season. I don't have like a obvious chart or fix for any of this, but we've talked about ownership

a couple times this year with the announcement around Vancouver selling and obviously I was on a Montreal podcast on Sunday and they were asking about Montreal and what could happen there. And the only thing I feel somewhat strongly about is if you can have someone who's locally tied, it's an advantage. I think if you look at teams that have owners who don't know the market and don't really care for the market and purchase teams from further away, those are where you've run into more trouble.

And I'm not saying Blitzer did anything wrong, but I think the lack of connection and desire to be around it and how quickly it all changes shows that. Really quickly, like, Blitzer was saying, like, in the initial press conferences, he's like, I wanted to do this, but he goes, I wasn't going to buy a team without a local investor

with me, which Ryan Smith. So like, they had that, or they thought they had that. Yeah, but Ryan Smith bought an NBA team on the side of that and maybe is a little bit focused on that thing. And also BYU, like the connection between the BYU NCAA run and the Jazz and Ryan Smith. So that whole thing, I remember Dunny doing a press or interview with them during the broadcasts of the first game when they were owners and they were sitting there

And it was like nice and they were into it, but they were talking about how Big of sports fans they are and how when they're together doesn't matter where they are They're always checking on how their NBA teams are doing and you're like, okay cool. So you're The soccer game and proving you like it by talking about the Philadelphia 76ers and the Utah Jazz. I don't know how this is going to end and now you see how it turns around so quickly. I don't know if the Miller Group's any better. I could tell you very little about them except the thing I read on Wikipedia, which was that they acquired the Utah Jazz in 1986 and then sold them in 2020 to Ryan Smith. I would assume they were approached originally about buying RSL because as you told the story,

Deloitte Hansen was basically, the owner or the league was trying to find someone else to take the team because Deloitte Hansen was considered no longer an acceptable owner in the league and there wasn't really a ton of good mechanisms to push him out. And so you ended up in what was kind of a Sterling, Steve Ballmer situation of like, if we can just find a good offer then this can go away and

that person can take over the team and we don't have to no one has to fight about it so I assume the Millers were probably the start of that because they owned the Utah Jazz and they owned the minor league baseball team in the market so they are locally based the biggest sports owners I don't know they got out of sports, decided they wanted to be in it. This is a cheaper way to come back in than of course, trying to get back into the NBA or maybe the NHL. Uh, and so this is the way they choose to go about it. And this is three, four years later, their version of trying to get back into sports.

I think for RSL, it's just like, again, frustrating that you have to go through this again. And just like the inefficiency of the time it takes to take over and set a plan and then have that plan play out a little bit and then be punched in the mouth and decide where do we actually want to go from here? And which road do we want to take and who do we want to be? That all I think ends up being frustrating.

Maybe the hope is if Blitzer stays connected and his soccer group stays connected because there are people who work inside that soccer group that are not specifically at the clubs and can give a little bit of expertise that maybe that speeds things up and maybe that makes it a little bit better for RSL. On the signing side before we get into some, Ryan Kent went official for the Seattle Sounders. We talked about it last week. He is signing for the rest of 2025 with a club option for 2026. So a pretty ideal contract for the Seattle team

to get to test them out this year. Hopefully he can fill in for some of what they're losing in Paul Arreola. And then if it's successful enough, you already have the term set for next year. And if not, both parties can part ways. And then Chicago it's successful enough, you already have the term set for next year. And if not, both parties can part ways. And then Chicago Fire have signed an under 22 initiative player, a Ivory Coast Central midfielder

from the Portuguese second division. I have zero idea how to say this. I have not heard anyone say it. Tom, you got me? Jej Javila. Okay. What do you make of this signing and sort of how this came about for this team? Yeah.

It's, it's a, from what I was told was something in the region of $4 million in terms of transfer fees. So it's a significant investment. And I think we're seeing more and more, particularly the bigger spending teams, using the U22 initiative on a guy who's turning 22 next month, who's already had something like 100 career appearances, and for a significant fee rather than $2 million for an 18-year-old who kind of just broke into a team. So we're seeing more and more 21, 22-year-olds on the U22 initiative, and then they stay

on the U22 initiative for a few years. It's teams trying to use it on... It's always going to be a roll of the dice, even this side, too. You can mitigate risk by going a little older by going a little bit more experiences more data and everything else It's still gonna be a risk. That's the nature of this Mechanism, so that's what I have on this one. He's played in the Portuguese second and third division It's they needed another central midfielder The good news is they have they have have a starting group. They have enough players

where it's not like, oh my God, he immediately needs to come, he immediately needs to start. Even if he's playing bad, well, we don't have any other options. These are the ones that I like. I think in the makeup of the Chicago Fire group, if he hits, that's going to be really, really good. They spent $5 million on Fetty Navarro back in the day. They've done this before in putting kind of a significant fee into the 22 initiative into a central midfielder So I've got high hopes I trust this front office the the scouting department and everything else and and for all sort of kind of put him into the team Nobody goes 100% on signings, but I'm I'm giving you the benefit of doubt for sure

He's played in the UAE second division I'm giving it the benefit of the doubt for sure. He's played in the UAE second division, Portuguese third division, and then Portuguese second division. Wild ride on transfer market there. It is a very weird route to get to this point. I thought it was interesting in the press release about this and like you can read into this stuff

however you want. Greg, it's Greg Broughton, right? Yep. The sporting director underneath the chief football officer, Greg Burrhalter, talked about how great it was to work with the clubs specifically and how they're hoping it leads to a future. My guess is that they're trying to create connections with other clubs and this is Portugal, a great youth developer and a place then also where you get players coming in from outside of Europe to try and get into Europe for the first time.

Maybe they see this as a door to potential other signings as well. Obviously, this is the team that signed John Duren, which ended up being arguably the most successful signing in MLS history when it comes to a transfer point of view with the sale to Aston Villa and then the money on the knock-on effect from going to Saudi Arabia. So it seems to fit a bit of that model, the hope being that if Burr Halter is there long enough and was the one who identified this player that he fits into a style and there's a clear idea of how he could be a part of this team going forward. I think a little unfortunate this weekend for Chicago, the 1-1 draw against Montreal, a little bit of a new coach bump. I thought Montreal played with a little bit more weekend for Chicago the 1-1 draw against Montreal a little bit of a coach bump I thought Montreal played with a little bit more spark pushed the game a little harder Dante Sealy got the goal pretty well deserved playing on the front foot Zin Cronagos looked really good so you talk

about hitting on signings that's been a good one so far Jonathan Bomba looks really really good in the things he's great at and then doesn't do the other stuff. He basically doesn't shoot. He doesn't try and get in on goal himself. He doesn't try and create chances for himself, but he's been dangerous helping press and he's a menace down the left wing. And so there's a clear way this team's playing

and I think Zinker Nagel's figured it out in terms of when to come in field, become another forward, sort of hoover up chances around Hugo Kipers. I agree. Yeah, this is it's been a really good start to the season. Again, I was hoping to see a win over Montreal at home. Again, this is MLS, like we can do this all the time where, you know, this things happen like this doesn't need to be a big negative on Chicago's. They didn't win a home game that they should have won.

But just with their strong start start the momentum was really building and now the schedule gets a bit harder so we'll see how things continue to evolve with the Chicago Fire team like they're at Red Bull's home to Miami first Cincinnati at Nashville I can keep on naming teams but like because I was trying to wait until when is it when is this light up so over the next looks to be like 11 games they're playing only teams that I'm either firmly expecting to be in the playoffs in East or pretty close, right? Like it's Red Bull's Miami since then, there's Orlando, Atlanta,

Charlotte, like, yeah, this is, it's it's gonna be a difficult run. And we'll see, I guess, what they're made of what's going what's gonna happen with this team. But but I'm I'm bullish. And again, I had him before the season as aoff team and nothing that they've done has changed my mind on that I like boroso. I think that's one they've hit on as well Nika four in the chat had this comment and I marked this down in my notes as well So jonathan bomba got subbed off in like the 90th minute He comes off the far sideline at Soldier Field Giant Stadium. Weather is terrible

He starts signing autographs in the tunnel While the game is finishing up and then he goes up the tunnel The way he was signing autographs was not like I'm marching off the field and I'm pissed Like it felt like he kind of was like I'm already here. I'm not gonna go back over there to come back here But I also noted that and thought it was a little weird while you're Needing a goal. Yeah, so just something to watch out for I guess and any potential in that We were gonna do some big takes from the weekend and and some big things that stood out to us That can all be one of them

I think the big one for me right now is that Tiago Martins needs to hire messy security guy because the one group of people I wouldn't wanna piss off is the goalkeeper union and they are out for blood. Tiago Martins is in the sniper rifle right now. As he should be. For all goalkeepers. That was, and again, I'm gonna steal something that

Doyle wrote Doyle said that he talked to a former professional goalkeeper who said I would fight him in the locker room for showing trying to show me up like that and that distracts from the point like one you shouldn't be treating it team I think that but two that wasn't Tiago Martinez's fault you have a Manuel Latelot on your back um Matt Fries isn't close to you kick the ball away and then don't stand there and scream at the goal like that was your fault pal like what are you what are we doing um that bothered me again the way he handled it and like not to use this as a captain too the captain DP center back who's been fine but like he's not Walker Zimmerman of 20 now we're tearing it's like all right bro like all right you wanna you wanna be

bro if Matt freeze wasn't the goalie last year They I don't know if they make the playoffs like not maybe not that drastic but he's one of the best players in the league Yeah, oh and like oh, it's it's I don't know how many like didn't See Tiago Martins was just somebody else who literally passed the ball into his own goal. It was Martins So should should Matt freeze have just ran up and screamed at him and just gesticulated this is your fault? That one was a crazy one where he hit like a weird softly hit ball. I think it was at City Field and Sean Johnson was outside the goal and had to chase it back and doesn't get there. I was taught in both situations by the way.

One, you never call the goalie because the goalie is the one who sees the whole field so the goalie decides That's I think what all goalies that have reached out to me again goalkeeper union is out for blood right now that's what they've all said is like you don't make the call I make the call and So if once I've not come and this is the tough part Freeze doesn't come Martins is holding off the ball, holding off Latte a lot to the point where the ball hits him in the chest. At that point, you're taking a touch. So you might as well take a touch.

And it's the same. And then I was taught as well, you don't pass back to a goalkeeper inside the post. You just safely do it on the outsides of the post. So if that happens or they make a mistake, whatever, it doesn't go in the goal. So yeah, you can kind of throw those on there if you want. What's amazing about this conversation as well

is it was about 20 minutes after, 15 minutes after we were about to have a week of Atlanta is a tire fire. They're down three one. Sam Jones is taking victory laps on how he came on the show and said it could all blow up in their face and wasn't sure. And like, that's where the convo was. This was an NYCFC team up 3-1 in 53 minutes at Atlanta

with a fairly full-strength Atlanta group on the field. Keaton Park scores one of the tougher own goals you'll ever see, right? Sliding clearance attempt from like way far away from goal that goes in and then Miguel Almirón sparks the rest of the game and I said yesterday you could feel his DNA on the field. He looked like 2018 Miguel Almirón and I think that's kind of one of the first times we've seen that and so even with the mistake and the gift it was 3-3 at the time. I think all of the energy of that game shifted really quickly.

And for Atlanta, it was huge because if Ronnie Dylah loses to his old team in that way at home, 3-1, whatever it is, I think it's going to be a really tough week for Atlanta. I agree. And just like how defensively frail and like obviously they scored four goals, they still gave up the three and like we're that's still gonna be a thing that they need to solve But it feels a lot better to try to solve it after a heroic comeback win Giving up too many goals the goals that they're conceding are so easy. It's too easy It needs to be better. The midfield is too easy to play through

Like I liked more on Chuk on the ball a little bit deeper because that solves some space issues up for the field But like you're not playing a double pivot of Moran Chuk and a Johnny Fortune. I don't even know if you're doing it in like a 4-3-3 with you know click or sleaze there and then you have to take off another attacker or actually not really whatever right but just like dropping Moran Chuk back like that could help with will help with possession and maybe getting more out of Moran Chuk but it's not going to help defensively and that is the biggest thing that they need to address anything even think ronnie dial a set in his press conference i'm not worried about going to school

it's it's defensively and that's what they need to fix and look that doesn't go away because they want but but it's and that's we that's what we would have been talking about a little full blown meltdown if that's out ended uh... for me colorado cooked uh... georgeave, which is is legitimately a best 11 type player. And I said this last year too,

but like the structure seems even better now around them. And Zach Steffin has been really, really good that center back pairing of Chinoise, Awaziam and Andres Maxu. And then the addition of Josh Tencio in that midfield and continued Growth from Ali Laraz. This is a very good team I do wish that they were able to upgrade on the wings But Teddy Guru Pietro hasn't debuted for this team because he's injured Maybe he's the upgrade and regardless if George Mihailovich stays fit all season and continues playing like this

Exactly like this or somewhere within the region of this Colorado are going to be one of the better teams one of the best teams Probably in the West that is very wide open from the top through the middle, pretty much everywhere towards the bottom, right? So this is a year where Colorado, with this formula, with this guy leading the team, can be very, very good in the West. I watch a lot of Colorado games, and normally my notes in the first 15 minutes say Kevin Cabral's pushing the

game he's a huge factor but can't finish anything off and end at some point in my notes saying I can't believe Kevin Cabral still starts for this team and that's not like a spending issue. Omer Fernandez is more productive when he's on the field for this team in the same role than Cabral is. And Ted Koudelka-Pietro is supposed to be that player. And so maybe that's the fix. It feels like they're starting games from behind because they insist on starting Cabral. And like, as I said, I get it on eye test.

You watch him play when he's aggressive and taking players on and trying to be dangerous and helping lead the press and he's a huge outlet and it never ends well and they continue to need subs to come off the bench and help change the game because of that and so I don't know how long you can stick with that a lot of the other stuff though is really fun to watch I was in the discord talking about Ali Laraz who has a ton of sauce to his game I love him I like Cole Bassett I love what I'm seeing from Georgie. I think Hoffa Navarro plays his role really, really well. And if you give him runners,

he'll be a chance creating danger. And if not, he can finish off chances as well in the box. So it was a good weekend for Colorado as well coming off the Portland loss, which it was like, okay, is this a flash in the pan or is this gonna take this team down at their knees and it didn't? So I think that's a really, that was a really important one and a really big moment from that one.

Anything else stand out to you from the weekend that you want us to talk about? I mean, I don't know how long or how much more we want to do. I could like Portland, big win, like again, again home at Houston right now the state that Houston's in Thomas the win, but they needed to keep these points and they did so job well done They need to just keep again treading water till you keep getting you know I can't cost I think is very good waiting for Jonathan Rodriguez Come on when all the pieces kind of come back when you feel like because again that this whole season has been about

Adding one more guy every week seemingly. Like from DeCosta coming in to a couple injuries, like they were killed by attacking injuries in the preseason. It's really difficult to build up that way. So as long as the wheels didn't fly off, then they're gonna be fine. So that's one.

And then like San Diego, it seems crazy. I don't know if you have any strong thoughts, I'll cede it to you. It was an experience to watch that game It's a fever dream dude, and you're like 20 minutes in and you're like how good is San Diego FC? And I don't think that really went away right LAFC the first goal is like one of the best strikes of the year and There's no way CJ CJ dos Santos is gonna save that and you could argue about closing space a little more but like

That's the one in a million strike. And then LAFC get the late goal in the first half. I would have been fascinated to watch this play out if Igor Jesus doesn't get the red card because that's where San Diego, okay, now you've given up two goals. You go into the locker room. You haven't won yet at home. How do you feel?

How does this team take pressure? And I think a lot of that went away because LAFC didn't have the pieces, but I said on yesterday's show The way they struggled against Austin. I thought LAFC would be able to do similar things and San Diego Refound themselves as a compact shape So they were not stretched and able to be played over and played through and then inside of that they refound their possession that makes them dangerous and Playing into tight spaces and always having a second option and being able to create chances from all of that and like yeah Hugo lorries gives them a little bit of a gift but

Lafc are a tough team to get three points off of. And so for, again, an expansion team, it feels like Super Mario Brothers, like this boss, this boss, this boss. I think LAFC at home was a big one for this team to win. And looking at the starting 11, to even go back to the macro sense of, on our depth charts going into the season, there is at least three, if not four,

maybe four or five players that we didn't think was in their best eleven Like Valakari was a false nine Alex might and got Got a start right a good toy has been really good for this team I I personally thought that he was gonna be more rotation veteran right like he's been really important for this team He's been very good. So it's not just loves an expansion season He's been very good. So it's not just loves an expansion season Every expansion team should be putting just like already allocate the allocation money that you're gonna be giving so that good I will come play for you But so even even beyond this like I think that we thought it was like all right like hey

I don't you know, you don't know exactly how this is gonna look in practice than in theory But all right I can see a scenario where Chukwila Zano is just incredible and he's like, you know, San Diego's Vela in the expansion season and they're winning and you're Luca Delatorre with more responsibility, right? And you know, the back line, Andres Reyes, who we thought was gonna be started right with Patty McNair, all of the ways that you would say this is how this team is going to be good beyond like the possession based ethos that they're doing very well. There's like this isn't exactly how we saw the pathway forward. So I think that's impressive too, where where again, I don't know if this was exactly their plan a for how everything's working out

Yeah, but the getting the right I know that Valacari has a false 9 was not the plan a right and they're adapting along the way And they're doing really well. So I've been really really impressed with them I'll do one more to say that Anyone who didn't know Chuky Lozano came back. Yes. And this one came off the bench. Yes. Which was big for them. And then LAFC we're going to talk about in just a moment because we're going to do a little CCC convo as well as the reports about Club World Cup. Yeah. Okay. Then we don't even need to go deep on this. It is still too early in the season to take too much away from expected goal difference numbers and all that. But

it is worth being pointing out. Minnesota United first in the league right now in expected goal differential. They have the most ex-G the league right now and expect a goal differential they have the most ex G in the league they have had a softer schedule than like I could probably the average one if you look at the games I think this is legitimately one of the best teams in the West as well and again going back to the Colorado conversation the West is so wide open that like why not Minnesota to come towards the top or you at the top right and I think we're gonna learn more about them as a month as you know the month and two goes on here.

But a lot of people, including us, were high on Minnesota coming into the season and that's what we've seen. Not only was their schedule soft, the field was soft this weekend. It was a swamp in Minnesota. Yeah, that was gross, dude. I think it was delayed coming out at halftime

because they were trying to clean it up or whatever weather was flowing through I mean the weather everywhere was a train wreck this weekend and it was like really tough to watch a lot of these games It's really tough to take a lot from a lot of these games, but it was Important and the points count all the same. Let's talk about all of this other stuff going on So for LAFC they play against Inter Miami on Wednesday in CONCACAF Champions Cup. That game is 1130 PM Eastern Time. Vancouver Pumas is the opening game on Wednesday night. Vancouver hosting leg one 930 PM Eastern Time. So it's a 630 local kickoff, which is a little bit odd to me, but it's CONCACAF. So it makes

a ton of sense. The LA Galaxy get things started tonight for MLS teams. They play Tigress at 1115 Luckily day on your let's not on the field like score five goals against them But it will still be a tough one for an LA Galaxy team that has not won a game yet In MLS this season and America Cruz Azul is the opening game in CONCAC Champions Cup quarterfinals today, later tonight. The reports, let's start here, coming out I believe from at ESPN, it was Jeff Carlyle and Lizzie Benchera, was that LAFC and Club America will have an opportunity in a one-game playoff to determine the replacement team for Lyon at the 2025 World Cup. So León, we've mentioned on this show, is understood is being removed from the Club World Cup because they

share ownership with Pachuca and both teams are in. FIFA does not allow shared ownership groups to play in the same competition, so they were told to fix it, which the understanding was to sell one of the teams. Grupo Pachuco chose not to do that. And so Club León was the one pulled out. Don't really know the reasoning behind why that team was chosen. And then my guess is LAFC finished second in the CONCACAF Champions Cup that year to León and Club America finished second in Liga MX, so therefore they're being allowed to play each other. I don't know 100% why that is and so there is the potential that MLS might have a third team in this Club World Cup. So FIFA

confirmed to myself and Ben Jacobs, yes this is the plan assuming that Club Lyon lose their appeal. They're going to that early May, I believe that's gonna be set, to try to stay in the tournament, but FIFA are planning for Club America versus LAFC. The rationale is, well, LAFC lost to Club León in the Carcaff Champions Cup final, which was how León qualified for this tournament. And Club America are the highest team in the coefficient in the Carcaff. Right.

That's what it was. Yeah. It just coincidental that Club America is the biggest team in the coefficient. Oh, right. That's what it was. Yeah. It, just coincidental that Clube America is the biggest team in this hemisphere and that LAFC is another big, big brand with big, big stars. I'm sure that's just all coincidental, mind you. And I'm sure that they didn't pick the teams and then find the reasons to go backwards. I'm sure that if Rialis-Salt Lake finished lost in the final of the conference, they would have this opportunity. I'm sure.

So we'll see what comes of this I'm just glad it's not out in a seer because I just kind of figured that that's where this was gonna Shout out to alow and say for raising this issue and hope fighting a good fight Hoping that they were gonna be the ones that that got in because they won What's the tournament called? They're like whatever the Europa League is for talking camp champions. Yeah Regardless shout out to alowens a fight in a good fight I'd be stoked about that by the way they're pit like they're like we should be us and people like let's do a mini tournament maybe maybe that's how it's gonna be it's

gonna be alowens and then alnus here and then it's gonna be a four team tournament to qualify for the 32 team tournament and then at that point maybe you could just do a 16 team pre qualifying tournament to get to the 32 team tournament and then maybe expand that next year to 64 and then who knows God fans are going through it a little bit We've got some in the chat right now because crew was Towards the top of those standings and had been on the verge of getting you know being the number one team Coefficient wise don't try to follow it logically is on and I It's like I was talking to Ben

Jacob like it was glassy goes. Oh, dude, like what do you think about? I was like, I don't have any thoughts he goes like well What if he's like you want to reach out to Philadelphia and see if the field of and I was like It doesn't matter if they think they deserve it or not It's going to be whatever the hell feet decides like and so I'm not doing any legwork I will say I am looking forward to to be whatever the hell FIFA decides. And so I'm not doing any legwork on this. I will say I am looking forward to the Copa de Campión, non-Campión de Copa that will be played at SoFi Stadium between LAFC and Club America for the opportunity to play at

the Club World Cup. Also, I think the games are already set. I think Club León is playing in Nashville. So it will be interesting that then LAFC, if they get in, will be playing only on the East Coast where Seattle and Miami are hosting as Miami, as you know, American based clubs that are hosting this competition.

LAFC, I assume would not get that same opportunity. I don't think they can change the schedule this late in the game, but also you never know. And so it would be like, it would be a huge deal for LAFC. To be a part of this is massive. I think what we saw was, if you can get a result in the group stage and participate in this thing, you're going to get like $2 million. If you go to the group stage and go 0 for 3 and get killed, you still get like 9 million bucks. and then it's a million for a draw or 2 million for a win That's what we should get paid. We should get paid 2 million dollars for a draw. That's what we deserve I was gonna look at the schedule just to remind myself who Leone is playing and while doing that I'm gonna Chelsea

Chelsea a team from Tunisia and Artificate the 13th. I was on lock I was with our pals on lobbying scorchers this morning and we were talking about this because Nella and Ari are just rooting for... Oh cool. This is another final that we can root against LAFC. Flamengo, Esperance, Esperance the Tunis is the team from Tunisia, but they go by Esperance, and Chelsea. So it's not an easy group either. The games right now... You could get one result. Maybe. The games the games right now, but you could get one result Maybe the games are scheduled right now

So it's Atlanta against Chelsea would be the opener for this team that gets in LAFC or Club America If this ends up being what happens then Geodes Park for the second game Against Esperance and then you'd play Flamengo in Orlando, which is going to be an absurd crowd which is going to be an absurd crowd. Awesomely beautiful. I think Orlando is the biggest Brazilian community in the US, and these teams don't really come and play competitive games, so that would be pretty wild to be a part of, but either way, I think LAFC, right,

what they've done over the last few years, what they've done since their creation, has pushed themselves to be elevated onto a platform like this Seattle earned their way in inter Miami is in however you choose to read that For LAFC would be a huge moment to be a part of this And so this is like this big chance and as you said for everyone who's a hater out there It's another opportunity to root against LAFC in a final which they've become experts at playing in

Going up against Miami in this quarterfinal What do you make of that matchup right now where these two teams stand? That's gonna be interesting I think that this is gonna be like having such a big game with big stakes this early in the season and these two teams that These are the two teams that might like preseason predictions of my M West Cup or at least you know They're gonna be in the mix both of these teams so having games of consequence having you know again the chance for either of these teams to try to win this competition and I think that these are going to be two worthy ones I don't know over two legs like what exactly to make of this it is LAFC going to be able to really kind of

threaten Miami in transition Miami have done done really, really well this season, pretty much after the opening week or two, of having more control. And the transition to the Javier Mascherano era has been pretty seamless and really quick. And it's been very impressive, both with him and his style and what he wants from the team and the new signings that have come in.

So Miami, I was worried that they might start a little slow. They're not, man. Like they're in kind of like mid-season form. They're not, man. They're in mid-season form. They're playing pretty close to their peak or whatever their peak would be. So, Miami have to be taken seriously for this tournament. And LAFC have a big job on their hands in this series. And I wish I had something more interesting to say. I'm just really looking forward to these two games because these are two of the best in

the league in MLS. And either one, whoever gets to the semifinal, is going to be a great representation of the league and have a legitimate chance to win this tournament. Miami probably more than LAFC just based off the form and obviously having Messi and everything else. But LAFC, we know that if they hit their A-plus game, they can hang with anybody in this region. Yeah, I think for Miami it was a really good sign the way they handled Philly this weekend of like a direct style a non-possession style to prepare yourself

But the individual quality and attack for LAFC is a little different than for Philadelphia And so well, I thought it was a good test proven this weekend going into this tie It is still a challenge out there of how do you deal with buanga and Ken Tillman get turned upfield and running at you at pace and under and all of that. So there's, there's a huge potential for LAFC I think in this, but at the same time they have to play open. Like they have to go out and try and win this game. If they try and stay in a tight block and sit deeper and give Miami a ton of possession,

I don't think they're going to have the opportunities to win this game because right now with the way Miami have cleaned things up in the back, they're not making self-inflicted mistakes and over time they will break you down. Some of the stuff Miami's doing is absurd. Like the way Jordi Alba is saving balls on the end line in the 90 first minute of games, like they are fully committed to this. There's a ton of talent in there. Thought Redondo was really good against Philadelphia. And that's one of those huge question marks is like, who's gonna cover ground and do work around Bousquets

and behind the attacking front and all of that. And you assume Messi will start this game. Like came off the bench, what? He was good for 35 minutes this weekend. That probably means he's good to start. And so that again, put you on your heels and put you on Your back foot in LAFC I think need to get the win in this leg and they need to open up the game to some extent and

Try and put Miami under pressure especially early on and And they have in Miami to one and limit Miami to one goal Honest because away goal is still count in this competition. I'm like the way for Champions League at the moment so you have to one goal on it's just because the way goal is still counting this competition I'm like the UEFA Champions League at the moment so you have to remind yourself that and be careful because a 3-2 game you come in with a with a plus one, but that means a one nothing on the road like So I think that's gonna be fascinating too

Like you said that they do need to step up they if they try to defend deep I think like you said Miami will break them down But they also can't be too vulnerable because a couple of way goals really kills you. Yeah you assume Hollingshead back into the starting lineup after being rotated out this weekend you assume Igor Jesus is starting all these games because he'll be suspended for the MLS game on the weekend obviously a ton of talent in this LAFC team a ton of talent in this inter Miami team this is as you said like just a really fun game

for us to have. For Vancouver, this is a huge opportunity. Like Pumas struggling in the league, this is your chance to potentially go to a CONCACF Champions Cup semi-final. This is the most winnable tie Vancouver has ever gotten in these stages of the tournament, because they've been here before,

and they're always lined up against the t-grace And it is always difficult and so Vancouver as well as they've played has to see this as this big chance Vick for all the years of Vancouver got drawn with t-grace in the first round in the beginning of February three weeks before the major league Soccer season started all of that goodwill that they had to sit through all that the bad bad karma They deserve this deserve to be playing This Puma steam instead of another giant or a team that's in better form like like little America or whatever right like so to your point Absolutely, and why not man like don't doubt this Vancouver White Cubs team um I mean dare I say like I'm

Expecting them to go through because of the states of where both of these teams are which is Probably the danger spot to be in once you have any expectations or have any hope goes away But I don't know man. I'm really hopeful for this Vancouver like depth team It's just been such a fun run at the start of the season and it like and getting to a concord of Champions Cup Semi-final would be awesome. It would be incredible and then you'd be lined up against an MLS team. So again, you talk about opportunity talk about winnable games I it was a Brutal experience for Vancouver to have to go play Toronto in like hail. She's I don't even know if it was rain at that It was just one of those games where you're watching it and you're like, I don't want Vancouver to be here right now

Like let them take this gun just put down a tie for both of them before it even starts. Go back let them get ready for this game and you saw some rotation for Vancouver as well trying to stay fresh for this one. This is such an exciting game for them huge opportunity. Those two games on Wednesday night and then tonight coming up the Galaxy against T-Grace. Galaxy at home you talked about what you need to do at home and all of that, T-Gras are gonna give them the ball. Like T-Gras are not a ball dominant team in moments like this. And so if the Galaxy are ever gonna find their way,

Payne still comes back this weekend. Christian Ramirez gets his first goal. If they're ever gonna have a chance and find their way, it's gotta be really good in this first game. They probably need a two zero win at a minimum coming out of this one and that probably has to start with Gabriel Peck being the best player on the field and your hope is if Payne still comes back and gives you a vertical threat and that starts to shift Tigress's defense

a little Peck starts finding the spaces that he was really good with last year. I completely agree that's the formula. And it's integral to get a positive result and probably a shot out in leg one. And we'll see where they go from there. But it's obviously been a struggle in 2025 for the reigning champs. Someone in the chat says CJ Nagando has become one of their favorite players. Love CJ Nagando to the point of which didn't realize that he wasn't, had no Canadian eligibility. I was like, when does this guy get called up? Turns out he's French so he can't get called up to Canada and that is a huge hit to all of my hopes

and dreams. As well this week US Open Cup so matches tonight and tomorrow some big ones that I put down. Monterey Bay against El Farolito tonight. Charlotte Independence against Carolina Core so a little US LMS next Pro. Cros, I find it harder to get excited about the next Pro 2 teams playing against full professional squads. It's exciting to see some young players in those settings, but from a matchup point of view there's not as much juice. Portland, Hearts of Pine, yes, are playing Hartford tomorrow, which is an awesome one. USL League 1 against championship in that New England

area. Chattanooga, the Chattanooga Derby is tomorrow evening as well. And then Des Moines Menace, many of our good friends, facing off against our fellow Owls in Union Omaha. I know, it's a tough one for us. Quokkwa, quokkwa. Back to back years. That's what we normally do. We're a big Union Omaha show here. We love our owls We obviously have enjoyed watching Des Moines menace. My documentary has just been picked up And so we're really excited about the potential there. So a lot of fun soccer to watch We are gonna be in the discord all the time watching it with everyone else. So you don't already subscribe to our patreon I'll be back tomorrow afternoon with Jordan Angeley to talk all things NWSL as well as

US Women's National Team, which has the Friendlies against Brazil coming up. And then Tami and you will be back here on Thursday. So we'll have a ton to talk about the CONCAP Champions Cup to react to as well as US Open Cup and whatever other news comes. If another team gets sold, two managers have been fired in six weeks so far in Major League Soccer and that's why we like to be here at SoccerWise. Thank you to all of you in the chat for watching live. Thank you to all of you for listening via podcast. Please go rate, review us, subscribe anywhere you follow us and all those types of things. We'll talk to you all again very,

very soon. You