SoccerWise - US Soccerwise | The USMNT Has Some Juice: Mexico Win, Canada Next

Episode Date: October 5, 2026

The USMNT is looking pretty fun. Cavan Sullivan made history, Julian Hall keeps scoring, and the U.S. put three past Mexico. David Gass, Tom Bogert and Matt Doyle break down the win, the standout performances and what it all means before looking ahead to a big match with Canada and wrapping things up with little MLS chat.0:00 USA-Mexico, Anthony Davis & Banter4:43 Breaking Down the 3-0 Win9:52 Cavan Sullivan Makes History20:27 Julian Hall & the Youth Wave27:11 Sebastian Berhalter’s Growing Role38:56 What’s Wrong with Mexico?49:46 Canada Up Next1:06:54 Chicago, Lewandowski and Mbokazi Back1:11:43 The U22 ConvoFor the sharpest coverage of American soccer, we’ve got you covered:https://linktr.ee/soccerwisehq

Hey, everybody. Welcome back to Soccer Wise for a big episode. USA versus Mexico. It is the biggest game in the region. I saw some nickname around Classico that I had never heard before coming into or out of it. What was it? Was it Clashico or something like that? And it was a decent attempt. Yeah, it wasn't strong. But, you know, it's the game. Shoot. Yeah. Yeah. We're excited. It was the big game on Saturday night. It felt very MLS and that it was driven right in between baseball playoffs, WNBA playoffs, college

football. It was AEW leading into it or if you went over to where True TV where it said the pregame was it was an Anthony Davis prank show which I didn't know existed. And if you're going to play at a prank show, what better personality to have be the center of it

the noted person whose biggest attribute is their eyebrow, Anthony Davis. Yeah. I mean, you see Anthony Davis coming. You're like, oh, I'm definitely not about to get pranked. Yeah. I'm about to deal with something very serious.

And also, this is going to be a barrel of laughs. You see him coming and you assume DNP injured. Yes, Tom. No, no safe space for Anthony Davis on this show. There's not going to be a lot of space. Well, he's an Eastern Conference rival for you guys now. Yeah. I mean, I think we use the frame rival loosely.

about all teams in the Eastern Conference when you sit so clearly above in rarefied air, which is how right now the U.S. feels about Concaf. Nailed it. That was really good, yeah. Jesse Marsh would disagree, and we're going to talk about all of it to come up.

So we'll talk about the USA-Mexico game to start. We will then help preview the Canada game coming up on Tuesday night, which will then have a reaction show for you on Wednesday. And then we're going to sprinkle in some MLS conversation because, of course, there is. a Tuesday evening international break MLS game between the Chicago Fire and the Vancouver Whitecaps.

And there's a lot to talk about going on around all of that. If you don't already, subscribe to Tactics Free Zone. You would have gotten Doyle's player grades immediately after the match. There was one line in there that I really, really liked. It sounded very similar. It was word for word my line. And I was an attributed, Doyle. And I'm just going to leave it there.

You can go find it. You can think about what you've done. and you can go find it. Okay, that's fine. No respect to journalism anymore? Doyle doesn't remember it. He's not what you said, but what he wrote. That is correct.

That is correct. There might have been a few frosty beverages involved during the writing of, well, the watching of the game and then the writing of the post-game newsletter in which apparently I plagiarized David Goss from the group. Noted writer, David Goss.

It's not as if somebody, I said something like talking to one of the players' moms, word for word and a feature that might have been on the athletic a couple of days before. It's really coincidental. And if you don't already follow Tom on all forms of social media and you could read his record at the athletic and you could use it as your own information

when you want to go out there and sound really smart. Tom, you guys have been grinding on the kids. Is there a feature about all 11 players that didn't have a cap before? it does feel that way. We were targeted because this felt like a big moment to try to introduce some of these guys that, you know, listen, MLS fans well known about Gavin Sullivan, Pierre, Aji Mamedi, Julian Hall and all that,

but maybe the wider fans don't know. And of course, the point was to talk about their upbringing, like what makes them tick who the people in their lives are. And we were happy about that. And it was funny. Doyle said something very nice to me about the Ajoram Mehdi feature and was just like, I want one. like I read Henry Bushnells on Cabin Solvin, which was fantastic.

And so it goes like, all right, like, you should do the same thing on Julian Hall and Neil Pierre. I was like, actually, Tenorio is publishing one on Pierre today, and I've got one on Julian Hall coming out tomorrow. He's like, all right, sweet, perfect. So maybe we need to get to Matisse Albert, Justin Ellis, and a couple of other boys next. There's plenty of time because all of these players are seven years old. And we, along with the Mexican national team fans are going to be watching them from a distance for what it feels like is. a really long time. Let's stick into it. Three zero victory for the U.S.

out in Phoenix, Arizona. This was, we sort of talked about it last week. This was the opportunity to have a win and that's all that matters game. We talk about process a lot. We talk about development and this team is geared around

a lot of that with young players. And there was a bunch of that in this match. But the experience was in high intensity, high pressure, just go and win the game. figure out how to do it. Uh, and Doyle, through the first 45 minutes, I didn't think that the U.S. understood that on any level.

It was one of the worst 45 minutes. I watched this team play outside of the Belgium game. Really? Yeah. Absolutely. I disagree with that. Yeah. I thought the first 20, 15, 20 minutes were bad.

And I think Potch actually called that out in the halftime interview. I forget who that was with, but it was something about his smile. Um, but it, uh, he said, we didn't. match their intensity through the first 15 minutes. And that was true. And then I thought the intensity came up around minute 20, but that came in conjunction with shifting Malik Tillman out of central midfield into the left and bringing Gio in to central midfield. And look, Gio is not going to sprint, though he did get close to a sprint on the first goal,

but he always wants the ball, right? He is always going to come to the ball and give more options. and when you're being man pressed, which is what happened from the gun in this one, you need someone who is going to come back to the ball, bring his defender with him, and give those options. Malik Tillman just wasn't doing that.

Malik Tillman might have popped a Kulud before the game, man. He just was not up for it at all. He's still so talented that he had a number of, like, highlight real moments, and of course he got his goal at the end, but he was not, look, if it's a friendly, you're probably getting 60% of Malik Tillman at best. And I don't know if Mexico planned for that or just took advantage of it. But for the first 15, 20 minutes, it was bad.

And then it got, actually, I thought, pretty good. I thought the final 25 minutes of the first half, once the U.S. started running into the death, and once they realized, hey, like, we're not going to play through this. Like, neither Burrhalter nor Adams can really play on the half turn. and even with geo in central midfield, you're just kind of making it a numbers game. You're not actually going to like slice through them like Spain would.

So you have to have the wingers running into the depth and you have to attack that space in behind and create dynamic superiority. And the U.S. did that. Starting right at like a 23rd, 24th minute, it was actually Kevin Sullivan, who made the first run into the depth. Like two minutes later,

Burrhalter finds Alex Freeman and then, Gio Raina streaking into the sides of the box and that ends up being 1-0. For this Mexico team, Tom, this was a huge moment, Rafa Marcus first game. We had all hoped it would be Kevin Sullivan versus Gilberto Mora the first time,

which we think will be the next 10 to 15 years of the region. Didn't get that with Gilberta-Mora's injury. But coming out the gate, the first question with Potch was the lineup. When he play the kids, would he trust the kids? How would he mix it and match? And he seemed to hit that one on the head of like the experience they needed with Richards and Adams and Raina and Tillman along with giving Kevin and Julian Hall and guys like that their opportunity. Listen, I think Poit Latino has been a plus this window.

The results speak for themselves. The performances speak for themselves. But the symbolism and the way that he's managed moments and helped create moments like little things, man, Julian Hall is Julian Hall, Justin Ellis is playing in Orlando. Julian Hall starts the next game. Aj Mamedi comes on for his debut, taking off Tyler Adams, somebody that he said is his idol.

When they're doing media availability, it's Mimedi and Adams. It's Ellis and Alex Freeman. It's, you know, Ellis has done stuff with Gio Rain. Like, I think these, like, are little things, and it's easier to say when you win, but I think that it's important. Cabin Sullivan starting the first game,

because if he didn't, that would be all the questions. And let's be clear, he's earned it, right? And then he comes in off the bench in the second game, only for like 10 minutes. and that to me showed that he was going to start this game against Mexico, which I was very happy about. Chris Richards, Tyler Adams, Anthony Robinson, Sebastian Berlter, all of them starting, I thought was exactly perfect.

There's a lot of games in this one. There's a lot of minutes to manage. I think Pochitino has nailed just about every one of these decisions. I liked this lineup. I liked the balance of the lineup. Like you said, Doyle, being able to get in behind was important. And Cabin Sullivan is somebody who can do that. Giorina, he started all three of these games.

He started seven consecutive games for the first time of his professional career. I want to talk about Gio Raina in depth a little bit later because I've been impressed this window. And I was getting to the point of maybe not being dismissive, but of just like, I don't want to talk about this in theory anymore. I want to see something. And that's what he's done. But we've been remiss if we're not talking about Captain Sullivan here. I thought he was very good. And in the second half, he gets his moment by leading a press, which was very cool.

He jumps a bad pass from the keeper. but like, Cabin Solvin baited that pass. Yes, the keeper made a mistake, but it didn't just fall into his lap. And he takes a touch and then immediately lifts it over the keeper. What an unbelievable moment for a kid who knows how to meet the moment. He's after the game, Henry Bushnell wrote a really good piece about Cabin Sullivan and, like, talking about visualizations.

And like, that's something that his dad and his family have spoke to him about for a long time. Like, that is part of his pregame rituals. He didn't know he was starting until the morning of the game. Calls his parents and he said, admitted he was nervous in a good way. and then put his phone down and did his pregame routine, which included, yeah, I saw myself scoring today. No, I didn't think it was going to be a 30-yard chip, but, like, I envisioned myself sprinting to the corner flag

and doing a knee slide. And then he joked that, like, the grass was really dry and my knees are cut up. Like, if I was actually genuinely hurt. But what a moment for an absolute star boy and a kid who, as you said, Goss, is going to define this rivalry, as we hope for the next 15 years. And for the same. reason we had this conversation two weeks ago that it was exciting is the goal is a great moment

and he breaks the record that Mati Albert set four days ago for the youngest goals old enough to remember that wow that was U.S. 17 history and a goal in the celebration if you took the goal away the first 45 55 minutes whatever it was he deserved to be on the field like it's not flashes with him right does all the things to be a good part of a team at 17 while he's still figuring out how he can in the future be the only game changer unit or the game changer like he stays within the unit he presses he challenges for 50 50s in the air he tries to connect passes even doyle the moment you mentioned which i think we all remember he's selfish in those right moments where he knows he can beat a guy and try and make a play

and he misses on the past, but it was the first moment a U.S. player took someone on and tried to affect Mexico's shape. And that's where the like trust and belief with Kevin is pretty high, which is even if he doesn't score the goal, he's not going to hurt you at this age at 17 at a full international level. Yeah, not unless he's challenging for a 50-50 off a corner right in central midfield because that was a bad miss and that ended up being a breakout going in the other direction.

But he, and I thought his touch was off for the first 20, 25 minutes, but that was true of everyone on the U.S. Because Mexico did come out with more intensity. But even within the scope of that, you could see him rising to meet the moment. And the first time it really showed, he got the ball on the right flank, and he was able to sort of evade a couple of defenders and come inside on his left foot. And he almost found Tillman on the side of the box. It took some good, you know, back checking defense from the Mexican right. back to cut that out. And that was like the first sign of intent from the U.S. And then it was the off ball stuff with the runs into the depth that sort of kind of tilted the field a little bit.

And eventually you have to start using a team that's manmarking. You have to use that against them. The fact that it was a 17-year-old who was the one figuring it out quicker. And then setting the tone at the start of the second half, like he nutmeg the guy, you know, put Mexico into emergency defense. Then there was another one, a second later, where, like, he and Raina and Tillman were, like, all in the box, but all not on the same page. And it was like, if that, I think if Gio had been maybe a little less selfish, um, that could have been one of them slipped through for a one v1 with the keeper and like stuff like that. It's like, oh, he's finding the scenes. And you don't want to over index on it, but also like, we just all saw this happen over the last

three months for the Philadelphia Union. Like he took the measure of the game and he figured out how to run the game and you could see it happening in real time against Mexico, still the U.S. team's biggest rival. And yeah, it was a friendly or an impact match or whatever the hell they are trying to rebrand it as.

But it matters. And so when the time came and he, you know, he got that gift and he made the most of it, I actually, I think I tweeted to our buddy Jeff Ruder who was, you know, there in the press box, he earned it because his pressing was effective all night. His pressing was really, really good. And like, it's still union-coded.

If you watch sometimes, his pressing shape is really narrow where the rest of the U.S. is kind of spread out. And I worry against a better team that that could actually be a problem. But I expect him to figure that out eventually too. Yeah. You know, like, and I hope that Paul is able to look at the tape. say, okay, here's what we're doing. Here's why it worked, but here's why it might be dangerous.

But in the, like, it, I think I gave him an eight out of ten in the, for the grade. And that, like, if anything, that was a little ungenerous. Because it wasn't just the goal and it wasn't just the energy, but it was the fact that as he was figuring out the shape of the game, he was kind of bringing the rest of the team with him. And goddamn, that's an impressive thing for a 17-year-old in any situation. And then we've said it over the course of the last few weeks. He kind of says the right things too.

It's not perfect. Like he's cocky. He's a 17-year-old playing on the U.S. men's national team. And he just won the MLS player of the month because he deserved it. But like it all kind of goes together. It just feels very natural. It doesn't feel put on. It doesn't feel fake.

You know, I've talked to people who have been around him for a lot over the last few weeks. I think there is kind of an agreement that because of Quinn and his parents and his brothers and the way they can sort of treat him, it can rein in some of the guys we've seen go off the rails in the past as Doyle did his top prospects. And what, Doyle? Three of the 10 of them had like quote unquote made it. Yeah. In what you put together. Like, I don't remember exactly what it was, but there were some bad outcomes there.

Yeah. Because it's tough. It's really hard. Of course. For his 17th birthday, he was on national television being interviewed by every person in every language because he is the face of the team. And already, you know, the face of this game and this matchup and all of this stuff. But it does, you just get these feelings over and over that if anyone can handle it and limit it, it feels like it's going to be hit. Goss, like to your point about the family, I think that is so important.

And you talk to, I guess, in some of the reporting that I've done on a couple of these guys, like, you. talk to, uh, academy directors and, and they'll say like, yeah, like, that stuff is from home. Like the parents, the families, beyond just the like literal sacrifice of time for driving, for everything that you need to do for a kid who's a high level player that's getting into academy, getting to youth national teams. Um, they're the ones who set the foundation of determination, grit, work rate, mentality, all that stuff. And Kevin Sullivan has a great family around him. And a family that was built for this, quite literally, like his, from his grandfather. Like he's, there, you're going to see.

a lot more people with Sullivan relations around MLS going forward. I was talking to somebody and there was like, yeah, like, Cabin has a second cousin who's in like the Quakes Academy and I was like, how the hell did that happen? It's like, we got Sullivan's everywhere, bro. And he has a cousin. I think she's the starter for Drexel and goal. That track, yes, that tracks. His two brothers are playing for Bangladesh and then Quinn. And for St. John's. And Quinn obviously is doing everything that he's done in MLS, which like, and on the fringe of of the national team. If he didn't have a torn ACL,

I think he'd be at this camp, right? Like, he's just coming back from that and getting back into the rhythm of it. His dad and his mom, like, his mom was playing a really high level as well. And the way that they hold him to account, like, there's stories of, like, you can be confident,

but you can't be in a whole. Like, and they've found that line with him to, like, let him be himself and let him be confident, like what you need to do, and particularly it's the youngest boy of four boys where you're getting knocked. around when you're trying to play with your older brothers.

If you're too overconfident around your older brothers, your older brothers are going to kick the shit out of you. And as a younger brother growing up who had a bit of a mouth, I learned that lesson repeatedly. And it's like a lot of this, like the family stuff. That's why when he was breaking through, right, like you never know with a kid that young and Doyle we've joked about, you know,

we make it a point not to watch like compilations of like a U-13 game because it just feels wrong, whether it is like, So many things can change. When Calvin Sullivan is different, and yes, it's everything that you see on the field. But what I was most confident that he was going to make it was the makeup of him and the people around him and how he's gotten where he is today, that if it doesn't pan out, it's not going to be because he gets lazy. Because that's not going to be allowed in his family. And it's not who he is. And over the arc of a career, you have these milestone moments.

For Landon, a lot of his breakout moments were against Mexico at a really, really young age. And then the rivalry fueled a lot of his sort of like mythology, R or whatever. I think you could say coming out of COVID when the U.S., it felt like reset under Greg Burrhalter, it was the Nations League final, right? It was Pulisic's penalty. It was Serginio Death starting fights in Weston McKinney, getting beers thrown at him. But like this is for us, this is the fires you can get. forged in. There is no bigger game. There's no more pressure. And I think as a player growing up, who wants to play for the U.S. national team, this is the thing you're looking forward to being a part of.

This is the dream. This is the goal to get to. And to start it out already with the goal and then the celebration and everything else combined with it. Like there's already mythology around Gavin and he's 17. And there's a lot more to come from his side. And I think there's going to be a pretty good opinion of him from Mexico fans for a while. Let's not miss on Julian Hall, though. Let's talk Hall and then we'll get into some other stuff. Scored a goal. So three straight games to start his national team career with goals. Don't know not the hardest goal to score, but to stay connected in the game and have your moment is big. I put out on Blue Sky right after, because I remember Josie and his first appearances. He scored against Mexico in his first

appearance as well. They're not always the most complicated, but as an American, you watch a goal score finish and it's like oh thank god this is really cool i mean ask santi himenez how complicated complicated yeah give him give him another chance come on man uh look i i've said a million times like the if you can be at the right place at the right time as a center forward then at the baseline you're going to be productive right because consistent goal scores don't other than messy it's not about winding up from 20 yards and bending to the back post and Messi has plenty of tapins too, right?

You've got to find those tapins. And what we've seen from Julian Hall is those one touch finishes in the box. And if that's all he ever does, he could be Chichorito. You know, like that's the baseline. And that's all he is right now. He struggled in his hold-up play.

I realized what line you were referencing, David. His pressing angles were weird. I don't think that. So to be clear, because Tom was hot and bothered on Saturday night, so I didn't even get into it. I didn't think that was his fault. I thought that was Pach's fault. It didn't feel like there was an explanation of where you're sending things.

And part of the reason I think the Raina Tillman stuff worked is when everything got pushed to Mexico's right, Raina doesn't close down. He's not there in advanced. And so it was easier, I think, for Rangel to get out of stuff in the first 25 minutes than it should have been. But I didn't think that was Hall's fault. I thought, I thought that was Pachitino because I don't know. I feel like Julian Hall probably knows how to fucking press,

having come up through the Red Bull Academy and playing for the New York Red Bulls. I don't know. Have you watched the Red Bulls this year? They're not a great pressing team. Like they play on the front foot a lot. It's not super effective for them. But look, even with the issues that he has rounding out his game. And, you know, he drew a couple of files.

But for the most part, he was a non-factor in terms of, of link play. Um, he still attached space and behind. He finds those one touch finishes. And the other thing that's striking about him is his movement off the ball isn't selfish, right? Like there,

we've had center forwards in the past, like Jossi Zardas was a really good center forward. Scored 120 professional goals, whatever it was. Um, every run he made was designed for him to get the ball, which is fine. But it has like,

there's a ceiling on how, effective you can be for your team in that situation. And it's, it's like, if your team is on the front foot and those are the runs you're making, you're going to score 120 career goals. If your team is on the back foot and those are the runs you're making, if your team is not able to control the game and those are the runs you're making, you are never going to get the ball and you are not going to help your team. Well, even when the U.S. was on the back foot and not controlling the game in the first 20 minutes. I thought Julian Hall was making the types of runs that open up space underneath. They're not designed for him to get the ball. They're just designed to cause a little bit of

dislocation between the lines for Mexico. And I think that speaks well of his overall soccer IQ and feel for the game and just general unselfishness. And it's not something that is typical of an 18 year old, especially an 18 year old who's putting the ball in the net as often as he is. His movement is his best trait for me right now. I think that is what is separating him. The technique, the physical traits, everything else. But like his intelligence of movement and the timing, pretty relentless,

Doyle, to your point, watching the game against Chile, there was nobody else who was going in by everybody else on the field because of the way that that team was comprised in the first half. Everybody else was checking the ball. So Julian Hall was the only one that the Chilean defenders had to worry about going vertical. So there was a lot of times where there was a few defenders around him and they should have been able to either pass them off, two players go with him. Like, he shouldn't have had as much success as he did. And he was consistently putting them on the back foot, consistently getting

through behind. He missed a couple chances in that Chile game. That's fine. What I care more about is how often he was getting there. And like, he rounded the keeper and put it wide. It was the right decision. He maybe went a little too wide. Right. Like that's fine, man. Like, he's going to score that 80% of the time. It just happened that he didn't there. in this game, right? Like, it wasn't, it was a gift from the goalkeeper, a goalkeeping mistake. He's still making that run, man.

And there were still other moments where he's getting himself in those dangerous spots, where Doyle, I think you've done well educating people that listen of, that is impressive when you're getting Tappins. That is the sign of you doing the work leading up to it. Think of his first goal in his debut. That was a fantastic cross by Burrhalter, but it was really smart how he got to the best. backpost and was alone and had to crash and dive and made it a good to happen. People won't remember

the technique or the movement and everything that came with that. Julian Hall makes that. That ball didn't find him by accident. It was an unbelievable assist, but it takes two on that play. And that is indicative of what Julian Hall can already do right now. He had five passes completed in this game against Mexico over 65 minutes. He took 15 touches. And he was still really impactful. And I think that's a big compliment to what he's about. And someone said this. in the chat and it's sort of, to me, the whole story as you come into this is like, last week, as everyone should, it was more against Kevin and all the like sort of stories around it. And then the next 10 prospects in the game are American.

Like, it's not one guy and it's not even then just Julian Hall, right? It's Justin Ellis, who should have had an assist or a goal, but either way comes on the field in his first international camp and shows that he belongs at the. this level and it's all the other guys who have played and I think that's where it's really exciting for a U.S. team and then you add in Alex Freeman still just a kid and Giorina still just 23. Tillman's what, 24, 25? 24 24. Like if he was Mexican, he would be in prospect for the future right now and someone that could be

someone who could change the program. I want to talk specifically about one other guy and Sebastian Burrhalter. He drew the red card. He helped create the first goal. We had a long conversation last week with Walker Zuma and Vani Sartini who know him better, obviously, than I do.

And they both, you know, I kind of had said, like, based off the comments from Potch, he's like, sounds like a captain. And it was like, well, I don't know that you can have a captain who doesn't start every game. And I don't know that he can start every game. and he gets to start alongside Adams, Doyle, and he does a lot of things really well.

Can it work? Can he be a full-time starter for this group? No. And I think that Potch would say there are no full-time starters in this group, and I think that is the right attitude to take. But there are some limitations from said Burr-Halter in that spot. And the big one is that he's not great on,

on the half turn, right? He struggles to receive the ball against the press. And so does Tyler Adams. And before when Tom was saying A plus to punch for this window so far, I'll knock him down a half grade because I thought the obvious move to make was to drop Tillman into the double pivot because he can receive on the half turn. And playing him as a number eight is kind of what unlocked him this summer. So there are options.

And because we're the U.S. and we're not Spain or France, none of our options is perfect. Right. We just don't have that type of talent level yet. And so it's up to the coach to sort of mix and match the right pairings, the right triangles, the right triangles, the right formation, which I think was probably the correct call in this one, and against the right opponents. and that's scouting and that's knowing the player pool, but it's also experimentation. And so even though I didn't think Burrhalter was particularly good in this, he wasn't bad.

And it was worthwhile, it was worthwhile data to get against a team like Mexico that's going to press us, a double pivot of Burrhalter and Adams is going to limit our options going forward. Now, because our wide players are so good, Jedi, even though Jedi struggled the first 20 minutes, he was Jedi for the rest of the game. Jedi and really kind of Malik on the left for the left, you know, for the rest of the game. And then Freeman, who was probably the best player on the field for the U.S. and Kevin on the right,

like we have other options to play out. But what we saw on this one was Burrhalter being kind of limited in the way that we all thought. it's okay because he's a smart player and he still found a way to impact the game positively with that ball over the top to Alex Freeman that led to the game's first goal but it's like it's we're still the US

we're not France we're not we're not Spain we don't have just like an endless supply of perfect central midfielders to to drop onto the pitch and I would add here is that the most important aspect is he still makes an impact and that's why

he's going to get a ton of minutes. He's a coach's dream. Like, Pochatrino said so many good things about him, and he could play so many different roles, and that gives you flexibility within the game. Dolly, if Potentino did want to drop to him into the eight, well, Burhalter can go be a pressing 10, and then he'd find a way to create the game.

Or, okay, you want to play in the middle, and you and Gino-Rana will swap whenever Raina wants to because you'll fill in the space because you're intelligent enough and your motor is high enough. I just think he's a guy that- and be a set-piece team in no matter what. Yes. He makes things happen, man,

and maybe it's a little bit difficult to draw it up, but like games US Mexico, they rarely play out to script or they rarely play out to theory. And whether he can or can't be a full-time starter, I kind of just reject the question because how many conversations after CUVA did we have about full-time starters?

How many times did we say, Raina, Pulisic, Adams, McKinney, just wait until we get all of them fit and available. How often do they start together? Basically never. And like, RAP to Josh Sargent. Josh Sargent was in the conversation for a long time. I don't think those five players started a game

for the senior national team together, if maybe one. But my point is, is that, yeah, we can talk about... Tom RIP to 25-year-old millionaire. We can talk about the theoretical Best 11, who should and shouldn't be a full-time starter. It doesn't exist. One, because of that's how Pocetino wants to run the program,

but two, because in reality is, even if they're all available, they're playing four games in 10 days. Or they're also something... And to your point, they're never all available. Yeah. Like the odds that everyone's going to be... Okay.

But if they were all available and everybody was fully healthy and rested. And we had, no, if they were all available, everybody's fully healthy and rested, and we have a game tomorrow for the championship of the universe, does Kevin Sullivan start? Yes. I agree. Yes. I do too. I was going to be burled.

It was an easier answer. I mean, it says something about Kevin. It says something about Kevin Sullivan. It says a ton about him. Also, there's an unnecessary. conversation that's happened between already Kavin and Pulisik, which I think is I reject the premise of that one.

You mean about Kavana and Pulisic? Well, people pit them against each other as if there's one option. And if you look at the data, their natural positions are on the opposite sides of the field. Also, the number one thing Kavana does is come inside and slip players in going from left to right. And the best goals Polisick has scored his entire career at Chelsea and at Milan is that exact moment and movement where he comes from the left and makes the run across the

middle gets slipped doesn't have to take a lot of touches and finishes coming at pace it makes a hundred percent sense that the two of them would fit together and could fit together there are other pieces to figure out if everyone is healthy and bolligan's there and west mckinney's there and all of that who it all is but the piece on burhalter is he could be the first option at three positions behind all of them and the odds that all of them are going to be fit and healthy all the time are pretty low. And you end up in a situation, which is what 2026 was where he played 80% of the minutes. And I think he leads the team in goals plus assists combined. Yep.

Because he's constantly getting on the field. He's always available. Yeah. And he's also got the right mentality where he doesn't take a personal if he's not starting. He's just going to come in and give you more energy. Yeah, yeah, exactly. He's somebody that you pretty much want on the field. Again, whether it's 70 minutes or people.

You need a few golden retrievers in the locker room. And, you know, it's a different type of ex-dog than we usually talk about. But Burrhalter has that other ex-dog as well. Let me just, Tom, real quick, in the chat, we got a question, who would not play with Kevin starting? We saw it. I think it's telling that Desk did not get off the bench in this one. Well, he's not a winger, right? He's probably not a fullbacker, back, right?

So he's perfect for the three-of-the-back system. But I think the right side of this team is freeing. and Sullivan is as much as you possibly can. I think that those two games are so very complimentary. And Freeman, I would take Freeman over desk right now, right? And we saw what he did at the World Cup. He's going to keep improving. But even, like, Freeman was talking about this after Cabin's debut in the opening game of this window

where he was like, he likes to cut inside on his left foot and I love to overlap. There was a lot more here. And he was just kind of matter of factually. And you saw that the best of that against Mexico. A couple more random things I want to say, Burrhalter, you talk about ex-dog. These are, so as silly as it is that we get

into like the emotional side of the game. Thomas drooling. That red card doesn't happen. It's go, Tom. Everybody turns and whines at the ref and goes, wow, he kicked him late. Burrhalter went in, put chest to chest, and draws a red card.

That's value. But also, Tom, he dove as well. He got a little double grassy's. But yeah, but Weston McKinney has to learn from that. Like, they tried to choke Weston McKinney out multiple times, and Weston never went down. And so he never drew a red car. Yeah. It's a birdhalter has seen the film. He knows how to die.

And, and like, that's, well, he played with Richie for a little. That's true. That's right. Remember Richie Lorette in Vancouver. It's fantastic. But it's funny, like, maybe it was just because of where it happened, but the angle that the camera took on the replay, Kevin Sullivan is one of the first people off the bench I was like right in front

because he had been substituted at that point and I think of the linesman like put his hand and for like don't do don't do anything stupid stay on the bench I kind of thought was funny too so so I like that's that's not nothing man and that's that's like gets

he's somebody who can help get teammates going and stuff it's just somebody that you want when you're in the foxhole and it's one of my highest compliments like Adams is the same way obviously we all know that a couple other things Giorana I like I said before I think he's By the way Richards is the same way

the play with Sancy Hamannani and it was pure gooch-coded. Sancy Bezos gets taken down. He starts talking, they push him, and he looks over like, there's not a world in which you're going to do something to me. Like, I'm not even going to move because you're just not going to do anything to me. Sorry, I had to get that in. No, that's great.

And that's why I didn't, like, some, some, there was some, the reaction to the end against Chile about, like, oh, my God, like, fake tough guys, you're overreacting. And it was, I loved it. You always protect your goalkeeper. Right. And all the time, like, it's stupid. And yeah, it got overblown, but like it was a really stupid transgression from the Chilean player.

And I like that instead of everybody turning to the ref and whining, a couple, like Richards and Adams were there immediately. And sure, you don't want anything stupid to happen. But I'd rather it be like that than I think in the past we've seen too passive. And then you just get kind of bullied off the field. Giorina, I think has been good and really good in this window. I'm very impressed that he started seven games in a row. I'm impressed that he's started three games in succession in this window. And he was talking about it after the game of like people say that like rest is better for recovery.

Like maybe it's better to just keep going. Like he joked like, yeah, I'm pretty sore because I haven't played three games in seven days in a long time. And if he can sustain this and it's a different version of what he was when he was 18 when he had that famous highlight against Mexico where he dribbled a bunch of guys. But he can still be a very useful player for this team. And I was dubious of that coming out of the world. Cup and full credit to rain. I was a little bit dubious of the move to Strausberg. I didn't see the the obvious playing time given it didn't work at Glodbach.

And I was wrong. And I want to give full credit to Gio Raina on that. And Alex Freeman, we haven't talked a ton about him, but he was freaking awesome against Mexico. And he's just a really good player. One of their mentioned coaching got his first ever start, made one huge save that he had to, the reaction save. was it from Romo the shot? I can't remember.

Oh, no, sorry, Alvarado made the reaction saving the second half. I thought in the first half he put some teammates under pressure in possession unnecessarily. And I think also the U.S. as we've talked about, didn't really have a clear idea of how to deal with the first line of pressure when Mexico came out with energy, but got better as the game went along. And it is a position with opportunity.

Like all of these guys, if you play well, well, you have a chance to win the spot. And so it was a pretty good start for him off the out the gate. Let's talk about Mexico for a second before we move to Canada stuff. Rafa Marcus taking over as first time, first time manager for any senior team. He managed youth sides in Barcelona. And then he was a gare's assistant with Mexico. Then the plan was always for him to take over coming out of the.

World Cup. So three games, draw against Peru, draw against Chile, and now a loss to the U.S. And I think in personally watching this game, and I watched pretty much every Mexico game, and I have for, I don't know, almost 18, 20 years now, there is like a clear spot this team sits in. It is, they have a really high floor. They are pretty good in possession. there is no danger or threat except for two individuals in the entire pool. One, 17 years old, and the other one's from Columbia, which is not a knock saying Keenonez is not Mexican and shouldn't play for the team. But the point is there...

It's a knock on Mexico's developmental system. There are no solutions that the Mexican football hierarchy is building into players to solve high-level problems. Paneda, Roberto Alvarado, even San Di Hemenas, like, there's talent there at the level. aka at times against Guatemala, at times in Concaf Champions League, but at the highest levels, I mean, look at the World Cup even. Like, goals came from crosses because they were at home in dominating teams and pummeling

teams and came from Keenone's moments of brilliance and a little Raul Jimenez's ability inside the box. There should be a ton of worry for Mexico fans. I think there was, you know, you had the Rangel reactions. which were gifts, but at the same time, there wasn't a moment where it felt like Mexico was going to win this game, even when they were the better team. It felt like a domination by the U.S. because it was,

and the caveats of, it's a friendly, the caveat of, if Santa Jimenez finishes it happened, that game of inches, wherever cliches of Rangel, it was a mistake for the first goal. Maybe things are different, right? But looking at the talent on the field and the way this game played out, it felt to me like Mexico or levels below the U.S. And things can change quickly because I felt this way in the inverse,

the Gold Cup final in 25, when Pochitino had a group without Pulisic, without Musa, without whoever. And it was a really bad time for the national team. That was after they got their teeth kicked in by two European opponents going into the Gold Cup. You had the Pulcic controversy, the war of words with him in Pochitino publicly. And they were like not very good during the goal cup. they should have been eliminated a couple times

before they get to the final. They played well for the first 10 or 15 minutes and then Mexico, like, it didn't feel like the two teams should have been on the same field. And it was, oh my God, Mexico are levels beyond the U.S. So things can change quickly, but the difference right now is

if you, like, over the next four years, players that you'd want, and you took the Mexican pool and the American pool, would 65, 70% of the first 20 to 30 picks be Americans? I think so. and so Helberto Mora and Cabin's over. I think Cabin's a little bit better, but Moore is an absolute gem.

Let's put them in the same kind of category. The next category after that, you have Hall, Ellis, Gozo, Miller, Mehdi, maybe coaching, maybe Raines. Did I say Albert yet? Did I say Ellis yet? Pierre. Pierre.

Sorry, Pierre. It's absolutely in that group. I just named 10 players. For Mexico, for the, Jose for that age group, maybe Sandoval. Obed Vargas? And like, that's three versus 11, and that's just the next wave. You look at the in-prime guys, I think Chris Richards is the best centerback in the combined

pools. I think Adams is the best events in midfielder in the combined pools. And then you have, you still have pool sick. You still have McKinney, guys that didn't play in this game. And yes, Raul Jimenez is still very good. Julian Kenyonez is awesome. He's probably the best wide player in between the two pools. but on the balance of it,

I think if you did, I call it 30 players between these two pools, I think 65 to 70% would be American players. This is a failure of League of Mekis. Because a guy like Hugo Camberos is barely playing for Chivas, and he's 19 years old, whereas a guy like Xavier Gozo gets a ton of minutes for RSL and gets a $15 million move to a Premier League team.

And Gozo is, is basically the odd man, one of the odd men out during this camp. And they're the same level of talent. We were talking about this before the show. Pachuca is the only team that reliably plays young players, develops and plays young players for League of MXis. Maybe Karetero is kind of getting there a little bit.

But for the big teams, for, you know, Chivas and Club America and Tigris and Montereyre Monterey. They are always so active. They have so much money. So they're so active, just buying veterans that kids don't come through those academies. And they, or if they come through the academy, they don't break into the first team until they're 21 years old. And then by then, they're just getting recruited over. So then they drop down to Tijuana or, you know, one of the other, Puebla, something like that. So it is a really circuitous developmental system that they have for their best talent.

And it's not serving the national team particularly well at all. And we've had, we're in this bizarre era and long may it continue, where domestic players are getting all kinds of opportunities in attacking positions in MLS. And you're seeing the fruits of that with guys like Gozo moving to, you know, a Premier League team or Sullivan and Ellis and Hall all making names for themselves with the national team this window. It's not happening like that for League of MECI's, and thus for El-Tree. And it's kind of a crisis because I actually think the talent is there. And if you watch the U-17s and you watch the U-20s, like unmistakably the talent is still there for Mexico,

but the clubs and the national team are misaligned. And that is something that needs to be addressed. Look, Mexico stalled out the past 20 years, right? Like 20 years ago against Argentina in the Round of 16, Mexico played one of their best games ever. It was an incredible performance. And everybody was like, next 10 years, Mexico is going to break through. They're going to get to the quarterfinals. They're going to get to the semifinals, maybe.

giant in waiting and they plateaued and now they're going in reverse and we're seeing it every time the national team plays now and i was talking to a friend during the game and um was saying that 06 you had borgetti towards the end quantumac blanco great players obviously guerdado comes through then you can think back because i was at the 2009 goal cup final giant stadium where the u.s lost 5-1 and it was a thousand degrees in the upper deck and getting annihilated and then 21 i was i was lower deck. Yeah, I did not have the money back then. And then 2011, Gio Dos Santos, Chips, Tim Howard. I sold plasma, okay? Did you sell your trombone or your oboe to get it? It was a cornet, and I played it up that game. Yeah. I always forget. But, but so there was two pieces, right?

You had Vela and Gio dos Santos and sort of reaching their primes or what ended up being their primes with the national team, Chichorito. Then you always had the Israel Castro and the Ribeau Peraltas of the world, which was, that's Mexico's strength, which is League MX is a legitimately powerful league. And guys who start in League MX from 25 to 35 years old are good enough to hang for the most part at the international level. The problem is they have not since then, outside of one player really, produce special players who are difference makers.

And to me, it feels like a huge piece of the problem is teams that aren't America and Tigress and Monterey, they just signed 30-year-old Colombian players because they can afford it and Paraguayan players and Peruvian players. And then they don't go compete for trophies. Where on the flip side, R.S.L has to play GOSL because there's no other reality for them. And a lot of MLS teams, Nico Securis and, you know, even Daniel Muni and Reed Roberts and all these guys, a lot of the MLS teams have sort of been put in a space where they have to play these kids. And I think about it in what we did last week with the U.S.

Global versus Domestic Team, where I said, like, there's not a ton of these, like, veteran Americans who are playing that could help me at an international level, the Aaron Longs of the world and whatnot. Then you look at like Israel Reyes and these players from Mexico, I thought was fine in this game where it's like, yeah, this guy's a consistent, clean player. That's the floor. Mexico hasn't raised their ceiling. in 20 years. And that's the part, as you said, that feels like a crisis

and is pretty scary for them. Yeah, and now it's all on the shoulders of one kid, right? And Mora is special. And this game probably would have looked different if he was out there. But he's not going to be out there every single game for 90 minutes.

And there's no depth of talent coming up behind him, or at least if there is, it's not getting chances at a professional level at a young age And over and over again, we've seen it. Like, the best predictor of future success is high-level reps at a young age. And, like, Mexico needs to come to Jesus' moment about that.

And because they are going to continue, like, the gap between them and the elite has only grown over the past two decades when it should have gone in the other direction. Because they were set up in 2006, 2007, 2008. They had a great performance of the World Cup and they had guys like Vela and Gio and Guartado coming through and it went the other direction. We're going to talk about the gap in Concaf because we're going to talk about Canada coming up for the U.S.,

which you could argue is the hardest matchup in terms of quality of opponent of this window, which no one would have thought you'd be saying five, 10, 15 years ago. If you're listening via Sirius Radio, we're going to have to cut off here because we're going to run a little bit long, so go search the show on the on-demand,

player anywhere you get your podcasts. The U.S. will face off against Canada in Minnesota. So I guess neutral territory. I don't know if that's offensive at all, but it's as close as you can get to Canada to play a serious game. Try to Detroit. Yeah, maybe outside of Detroit.

And Jesse Marsh comes in, as he always does. And he's got like no thoughts on the U.S. He has nothing to say. He doesn't want to talk about it. Now. Yeah, stop asking me. My guess, Thomas, he got asked.

Like, for, all the complaints about Jesse talking about the U.S. Men's national team always. He does get asked in every press conference about the U.S. because you know why? He gives answers like this every goddamn time. It's like at the World Cup, I got to do a little bit of Canada. And it was almost like a joke of, all right, who's going to ask about the U.S.? Because he'll just give you the best answer. Like people know that.

If he actually didn't want to talk about it, this would go away or this would be lessened. Or he would find a way to not say these things. But he did an interview with the Guardian. and it was a really good piece. Check it out. And he just went on this rant about the Balgan situation, which, by the way, and Pochitino should stop talking about it. Stop answering questions about it. Like, for the U.S. side of things, we wouldn't be talking about it much.

Jesse Marsh probably wants to talk about it. And that's why he answered this question. He gives a long answer, and he goes, quote, as Americans, we've been inundated with propaganda ever since we were young. We're the number one country in the world. We deserve everything. Number one in every aspect of life, this is what we've been told. So when things happen, and we don't feel like we're in control of it,

we feel like we deserve to be treated differently because we're Americans. That's one of the things that infuriates me, infuriates the rest of the world about Americans. And then he said that the Balgan overturned wouldn't have happened for any other country, and quote, this is why everyone around the world hates America. And then he said that that was kind of where everything switched for the United States and maybe it played a pie. I just think that they got outplayed by Belgium.

And sure that that played a part, but like Balgan, no Balgan, red card, no red card. I don't know if that makes up a three-gold difference, but I digress. Jesse is going to say what Jesse is going to say, and he's going to get fired up, and he got kicked out of a game against the U.S. at the Concaf Nations League. Like, yeah, there's going to be a lot of juice and energy around this, which is all a good thing. They're like, both these teams need that. They spent four years with just the Cope of America, no World Cup qualifying. Jesse has talked in this window about how he's working on.

He's talking to their sports psychologist about dealing with referee calls better because he knows now they have to go to Conccaf, which they didn't have to do for the last three years and how it's a new challenge now for this group. I think for both these sides, though, like, this is why you schedule these friendlies to have some juice around these games. Yeah. Look, it almost feels like a mini tournament, this window. I was skeptical about the four-game window when they made the switch. And now Doyle's a four-game guy. Yeah. Well, you were right. because between the way it increasingly amped up

like Peru just got run over but Chile turned into Chile the final 20 minutes of the game and then Mexico is always going to have juice and now Canada's got juice as well and it's like okay there are emotional moments that you need to meet here that make it feel like the group stage of a tournament

so I'm enjoying this I think that Canada's enjoying it as well other than maybe the national anthem before their last game. And look, Jesse, Jesse's like Porch. He doesn't want friendlies. He wants every one of these games to be kind of nasty and mean.

And I think Tuesday's game is going to be kind of nasty and mean. And I like that. Yeah, I agree with you. And I think for Canada, there's like this ability to try and retain attention. The crowds at BMO and Stutz put up in awesome, like much better than they were pre-World Cup. So there's clearly a connection that's happened with the team. And to go and beat the U.S. is another way for you to continue to be noticed.

And it's probably one thing you can do in a window like this where you're not playing a big European team to break through. Although, I will say, if they had beaten any form of a Chilean national team, five years ago, it would have been a miracle for this team. Like they were going and traveling to play Cernam on their own dime or playing Cyprus or whatever it was in some of these windows. and now it's a whole new reality. It is not a fully fit Canadian team. Alfonso Davies not in the camp because of his honeymoon. And then, of course, the injuries we know to Mois Bombito and Ismail Cone. Alster Johnson has not come back yet to start the season.

So that's another one report coming out three minutes ago, eight minutes ago, that Kyle Laren and Tejohn Buchanan have withdrawn from the roster. So Marcus Caldera and Theo Corbinu, Corbinu, Corbinu, Corbinu, Corbinu, Cabanu is in the team now. And there's a lot of young players who have gotten some opportunities in this Canada group. Canada's in a spot. The U.S. is not, which is you look at them putting Chukua on the field. That's the Canadian national team managing youth development for the clubs,

because the clubs are not doing it at all times for themselves, where for the U.S., all of these guys are already getting minutes, and they don't have to do that. but it's going to be an interesting matchup. Doyle, what do you think about as these two teams sort of take the field from a tactical point of view? You know how Canada is going to play, right? It's going to be the 4-2-2-2. It's going to be an all-out press.

They're going to try to keep the game small on that side and make the U.S. play probably over, maybe around, but definitely not through. And the U.S. has to be ready for that. and they have to be ready for the intensity of the moment, which they weren't against Mexico, right? And that was, again, something that Parch called out at halftime, and he justifiably praised his players afterwards for bringing their level up. I don't think he'll be pleased if they go through that same sort of process again. I think he's going to want to see them sort of setting the tone from the kickoff.

And I think that's more important than any tactical adjustment. Like to borrow a line from Jesse Marsh, you have to make them feel you. And the U.S. hasn't always been super great at that. I expect it to be close to the first team again. I don't think we're going to see. I think this is another Tyler Adams game. Really? Don't you?

I just, just from all of the, because they, Gio Raina's the only player who started all three games He was the only one who went game one and game two And Tyler Adams came off the bench right like I'm assuming I had assumed basically nobody was going to start more than two games Maybe a couple guys with two And so maybe but like I think it'll be more like game one and game two Where there was 10 games so

So if you were rotating the US team Do you think Matt Free starts? Yeah If you're rotating and goal I would say that I think camp will play again Desk probably does, maybe Brooklyn Raines. It'd be cool to see Gozo get a start. It's funny that he has.

It's not funny, but it's interesting that he has. And Peyton Miller, right? I think some of those guys are going to see. And maybe... You think Richard starts? So he didn't... He obviously wasn't available, the first game. Yeah, it didn't dress.

He played like 15, 20 minutes, a second game off the bench, then he starts. The issue for me is the turnaround time. Yeah, Saturday, Tuesday is a tight turnaround. And like, they're friendly. and the thing you need is all these guys should be playing for their club week in and week out coming out of this. So it's like,

are you going to risk Tyler Adams fitness and health for friendly? I don't think Pouch things like that though, right? You 100% could be right. And Tyler doesn't think that way. Right. And Chris Richards doesn't think that way. And Raina was just saying it himself too. Like I'm sure that all these players want to start,

which is what you want. But I mean, for me, I think it'll be more of a water down 11 or a lesser of maybe some of the guys. and just from naming the established veterans there. And again, Alex Freeman accounts as that now. I think it's more likely to be rotated, maybe not as stark of game one to game two because he was trying to get basically everybody minutes

in the first two games and then reassess as we got to Mexico. And I don't know, things have went so well. And it's going to be difficult to take, like, Julian Hall and Kavanaugh and Alex Freeman off the pitch. But maybe the young guys can go again. But I think it won't get to be a moment as well. If you sit Tyler Adams, let's say that Adam,

Reina and Richards all sit, right? And we'll say Freeman does as well because he's locked some minutes. Then who starts in their place? Is it Pierre starting at right center? I think it'll be, I think it's more likely to be Campbell. Okay. Campbell and then is it Mehmeti starting for Tyler?

I don't know. I think Reins would have earned it given like just looking at those two players. I think you think Burr-Halter plays again? I think he's a machine and I think if I don't know. know of Burrow play on Friday. I think he could play 90 minutes against Canada on Tuesday, fly back to England and play 90 minutes on whenever the next time Burrow plays. So maybe he's a different

case. But like Matisse Albert probably could get an extended run here. Peyton Miller. I think for sure Peyton Miller starts. I think Jedi has like, I mean, I think we know from the last two years that he has dealt with these like chronic injuries. I don't think you roll him

out there for another start. And that's kind of how I do. You start left back. I think Peyton Miller does. So I think I think Miller starts, I think Neil Pierre probably starts.

Listen, there's a world. And like if, if Poach wants to go back to the back three, right. Then Desk is playing right wing back or gozo

and then left wing back is Miller. And like that probably makes life easier for Neil Pierre if he's joining a back three. And then that kind of solves a little bit Doyle, the central midfield question because now you're starting two there. I don't know. Like I think that there's a lot of optionality.

That's actually interesting. Yeah. Because you could do, you could do Pierre. as the middle of the back three and then Campbell on one side because he'd like you know Campbell's a good ball carrying centerback and then

trusty on the other side and then you would do any of the like I don't know Raines and Tillman or Raines and Burrhalter yeah and then you could do Kevin there's not really a place for Gozo or you don't think Gozo's right wingback yeah I think Desd is right wing back yeah him

him or Deson and I would hope that if he actually played this formation that he would give Gozo an opportunity to start. What do you think it says that goes out has barely, barely played so far? And Campbell hasn't played at all, I think. No, Campe? Oh, Cole Campbell. Col Campbell.

Yeah, yeah. He was on the bench against me. He wasn't on the bench for the first two games. So, I, listen, maybe I wouldn't want him starting. And we're really getting into the weeds because it's like a friend, like, it's, like, Justin Ellis. No, it's good. But I agree, but like, I want to be clear that, like, if he does start, I'm not

going to be like, oh, what a stupid decision or whatever, right? Like all these things. I think that there's, they have earned this spot given how well that they've done this window that you've earned a lot of goodwill. And as long as you don't run Tyler Adams and Anthony Robinson or Chris Richards into the ground or like, God forbid, one of those guys picks up a knock. You'd feel really stupid. But I think a lot of guys have earned minutes. And that's why there's not enough starting spots for all the players who, if, you know, hey, broken rain starts, yeah, he's earned that. And but it's like, all right, well, like, if Adam says he's good and he wants to keep playing,

like there is Musa, I think he's done fine, he's done well. And Justin, Justin else, he scores in the opening game and he hasn't started since because Julian Hall has been so freaking good. Yeah.

So on the Gozo side of things, I think first game, it didn't make sense because Kevin is ahead and Freeman is obviously ahead. And then I think you get stuck in a spot where it's not a wingback, it's a right back. And so you start Frankie Westfield there, but you got to, play desk if you've brought him cross

to play and he was a part of your World Cup so now you play Desk on a winger position which I actually think is the right spot for him at this point of like he's just not but he's not impactful he's not impactful he's he's more dangerous for you than against you from that

position yeah at the right back position this this is me but there's a joke about how bad Jeremy Fringpong has been for Liverpool where it's like he attacks like a defender and he defends like an attacker desk isn't quite there yet but like when he's at the wing it's like all right like there are so many other players Yeah, but he creates the, he, he has the assist on whatever the goal was against,

was it Chile, right? Where Hall lets it run. After, he comes in from, he comes in from the left wing. He beats two guys. No, he did. This is, he was, he's been so lackless. He's not a friendly player. It's like, too casual.

But even in that moment, listen, it worked out. Um, he played, I think it was, I think it was Raina. Whoever he played, it was three touches too late and it ended up working up. It was just like, I, maybe, maybe he saw. all that and like let me try to draw defenders if we're being charitable. But like even in that moment, it was like you, you released that ball way too casually. And then it ended up working out. Don't disagree with dinner.

But if you go back and watch that, everyone was scared to step to him because he's technically very good. And around the box, you don't want to make mistakes around him. And he's capable of taking advantage. So I think Gozo got stuck in because I thought about the whole, because every time they show the bench, he's like right in the middle of the bench sitting there. And you're like, man, dude, you were the guy seven months ago. go and now you're getting this opportunity also at Crystal Palace. He's played off the bench at

center forward on the wing. And if we're talking about a back three, Palis sees Gozo as the three, four, two, one on the two line. Like they see him as a wide attacker, not a wingback, primarily at the moment at least. So there is a possibility that him and death and then him and three get interchanged. Again, I think that there's a whole lot of other potential attackers and maybe doesn't make sense in this system. But it's not out of the question where I think that he would make more sense as a wingback in that in that scenario but it's not out of the question that him and desk could play together uh on the flip side ralph preso is going to be the most important player in this game what he's done at center back it'll probably be him into fugur rules uh sigora right back

is a good player man uh do you think so you think pablo masher any think so too i think i think is i think is you shouldn't message rsl and tell them that so that they could play him and he could get some minutes uh saliba and eustacio in central midfield the stat line on the state line on on Schaffelberg, the last game. I don't know that I have it with me. He basically, he scored two goals. He didn't complete a single cross. He had like six crosses uncompleted.

I think he had five take-ons. He completed one, like one was successful, but he scored twice. And he looks like a Canadian legend, and Jesse Marsh loves him. And now he's down Tejohn-Buchanan. So my guess is him and Miller probably both start. And then it's probably promised David and Jonathan David. I don't want to be dismissive, but like the talent disparity between these two teams, given how many players Canada are missing?

Like, this is closer. Yeah, but you could argue. So I think you could argue that Canada is better in central midfield, right? Or you, I would. No matter what the pairing is with the U.S. I would take Ossacchio and Nathan Saliba over anyone the U.S. puts out there. And Jonathan David is probably the highest ceiling player currently on the field, right? So those are two, even though he has struggled to finish with Canada, those are two lines.

of the field that you could argue Canada is better. And if Tejohn was here on his day, you could say he's the most dangerous one-by-one player. Cabin will get there, Julian Hall will get there. Ellis will get there. That's a charitable view of the Canadian team. And that's what we expect from. That's okay.

I think your bias is showing, David. You were raised in a way where you just believe Canada was the best at everything. Canada's number one. And if they're not number one, they deserve to be number one. That's just how you were brought up. I just like the idea that

Diego Simeone knows less about center forwards than we all do. And therefore, Jonathan David's not that dangerous. What? What? I'm just saying. Who said that?

I'm just saying the resume speaks for itself. So this game's going to be Tuesday night. It should be, as we said, pretty fiery. It should be the perfect close to the window. Big question marks for both groups in terms of roster decisions, who plays where, and then, of course, obviously, injuries and fitness and all of that will come into play.

Before we get out of here, we were going to talk MLS for a minute because there's, of course, a Tuesday night Chicago Fire Vancouver game, in which Robert Lewandowski will be available because he is suspended for Poland after picking up two yellow cards in UF Nations League play.

He had a hat trick against Romania and something else. No, that is like, I mean, talk about being committed to the program. He went and got two yellow cards. could get back to Chicago for this game against Vancouver. But the big news is that Mbo Kaze came back in the previous match, which was during the international break. Johan Gomez had the winner, 1-0 win at Charlotte for this team.

We have praised Mbo-Kaze. I just got my U-22, 22-2-2-Ballet. He was one of the first names that I moved over and is going to finish in the top five in my voting, is how I feel right now, just looking at it. And I guess the question is, coming back from injury, we don't know how perfect he'll be how quickly, but how much does it change your perception of Chicago in the Eastern Conference? I mean, it raises them.

Four months ago, I think we were talking about Chicago maybe pushing into that top group of true contenders. They didn't do enough in the summer window to get there. And like maybe if Andre Franco had gotten healthy three weeks ago, we could talk about it, but he's still not back yet. So I don't think they're at that level. but he and Jack Elliott together in the middle of the defense, both those guys can defend and do so in like complimentary ways.

And then both of them can break lines with their passing. And that's what we saw in his return. I think he just, if you have a defense like that and one of the best goalkeepers in the league, which is what Chris Brady still is despite his less than stellar performance against Chile, and you have Robert Levindowski up top, you can win some games. I question whether they can control the games at the level they need to against the Nashville's, Miami's and eventually St. Louis or Vancouver's of the world, to be like a super, like, inner circle contender. But with him back, they're at that, I'm confident they're at that next level,

and they're probably going to start winning some games and showing as much. Tom. Yeah, and Bocazi being back is huge. The initial fear was that he was out for the season and towards like the summer window deadline. I was catching up with somebody in Chicago trying to figure out what they're doing. And I was like, anything at centerback, like given him because he was like he's going to be back in like four weeks. Like what? I thought he was out for the season. No, like he's going to be 90 minutes ready to go by the playoffs. So he's even ahead of what they thought was ahead of schedule given that he played 80 minutes last week. And it's, you can't overstate how important he is for their chances in the playoffs this season, right?

Like the balance of him and Elliot is really good and his ability to solve problems off script, like just sheer physicality and ability to eliminate space. And that is the best version of the fire. And I think the only serious one right now is with your first choice centerback pairing. And that's a credit to how good MBOCAUSE has been this year. And also just the reality of MLS that if you're missing your, you know, high tier centerback, like,

it's really difficult to replace that, particularly somebody who his skill set is not something that you can just plug and play in. So the fire have their issues. I wish that they did. I wish they were more aggressive this summer. They weren't. They believe that the best way for them to continue growing the scene was to add a few players rather than trying to finesse a DP spot in and they give Zincranago a new contract,

makes them a DP. They'll be good, but I just always thought that they had one more level in them that they maybe haven't showed yet. to Tom's point about eliminating space and really controlling space, the amplifying that effect that has on Andrew Gutman, who is the second best chance creator on the Chicago fire, and I think the second best attacking left back in the league behind Kai Wagner, who is only the best attacking left back in MLS history. Like that gives Chicago a type of multifaceted attack.

that they've kind of lacked since Mbocazi has been out. Because Gutman, if it's not Mbocazi back there, he can't go forward as relentlessly and with as much effect. So I think what we'll see, and hopefully they can all stay healthy, what we'll see over the next month is like Gutman going forward more often and with more confidence, and that may be opening things up underneath for Zincor, and then most importantly,

Robert Levindoski. And because they top five on my U-22, just skimmed through it, like just got it today and was looking at it. It has become easier and harder. The easier part is like all of these guys play now. Like it's not prospect plays, but I don't know sometimes what to do with a guy

where it's like Taha Bruin and Johnny Shore like starters over the last two years in Major League Soccer where there are, prospects that I like, Irvin Torres, where they might never get there just because of the nature of the way a career works. Tom, how are you thinking about a list like this and sort of where it stands right now in MLS? I feel like I have the same refrain every year where it gets more and more difficult and it gets better because exactly what you just said. All these guys are playing. I remember some of my first ballots, there would be a lot of room at the bottom half to be like,

hey, like this is a kid that hasn't broken into the first team yet, but like I, I would try to, I wouldn't have to try to find space. It would just be there naturally for, all right, these are three of the guys who like, I would wager are really going to make it. And they have high enough ceilings. I don't care. They haven't played really first team minutes yet. There's somebody that when I look back on my ballot, I want to see them there. And then year by year, it got more and more difficult to do that to be like, all right, I'm going to, like, I think last year I was like, I was trying to find one spot for like maybe not cap and stuff because we don't know about him but I don't even remember who it was of like all right like this kid hasn't played much in that

month join hall might be a good example like he had minutes last year but he like wasn't there yet and it was just like all right like I I know that I feel really strongly about this kid having a really bright future I need to find a spot at the bottom and then it's like well all right well this guy's played 1500 minutes and he's been pretty good that doesn't feel right to like move guys around and this year it's more the same maybe now like there is absolutely no room. for guys who have not broken into first team soccer. And there are, like, a lot of the list will pick itself, but I can't wait to dive into it and have the arguments in your head of like,

all right, who's three versus four. Hey, like, this guy's played a lot of minutes, but I don't know about his ceiling versus somebody who's done less or positional. All these things. Like, it's so deep. It's so deep. Yeah. Matt Corcoran is a perfect example.

He's a starter for a team that is going to win the supporter shield and might end up on 75 points. and I'm going to struggle to have him in my 22. Harbor Miller's played 2,500 minutes at the first team level. I like Harbor Miller. I think I'm across the last two years. Okay. Like I like Harbor Miller.

I think he's a good player. Is he a national team guy and a big championship player? Probably not. But it's also hard to say that a prospect ever gets to that level. Right. And that's the flip side. Like Jude Terry has had some good moments for LAAFC. And he's a high level kid who we've all heard.

about for three, four years, even though he's just 17 years old, I'm not sure I have a spot for him. And these are the types of, these were not challenges that we were facing five. Doyle, when it started, it was 24 under 24. Yeah. I think that's indicative of what you are. It only became 22 under 22, I think in 2018 or so. It was married to me getting into the MLSSogga.com.

That's right. Tom changed the American side of developmental pipeline. well done Tom you then also have the pack and I bring this up every year of like a large part of what we talk about with young players or players in general is like what's the transfer revenue

you're going to generate where are you going to go you have you 22 initiative players who have generated $10 million in transfer revenue which again Harbor Miller probably never will do but would I take him today over some of those guys probably and he'll probably have a better career than most of those guys based off the hit rate

for Nathan Harrio is one he's somebody who I would kind of have, like, mid-tier. I was like, if he doesn't improve at all, like, he's good, solid M-Less player. And, like, he's still, he still is. Like, I think, that Harryl is 25 years old. I'm saying in the past.

Oh, got it. Like, he was, he was a good example of this, like, of like, he's an obvious, he's got to be on the list, but then it'd be like, yeah, I know he's like 2,000 more mid, like he's starting for a good Philly team, but I was like, ah, like, you know,

gozo or insert whoever would have been at the time, like, breaking through of just like, but like, I don't want to, I don't want to yada yada over he's starting for one of the best teams at MLS at the time. Right. That is that is no joke. And like that is, it's, it feels almost disrespectful sometimes when you're splitting hairs over these guys. And like it's, it's just a really good place to be.

I got to tell you, Doyle, I think Cochran's underrated. Okay. I mean, he probably is. I think, I think he's starting for the best team in the league. So I might be wrong about this. And central midfield too. And he doesn't look overwhelmed. He is not a game changing.

and it's hard that Yazbek was the guy he filled in for who is a game breaker with the things he can do. But if you can do what Cochran does at this age, I mean, he should be able to do it for the next 10 years at a minimum if he doesn't get any better. And that's what that's exactly what Tom saying, right? Like getting those types of players, like the Nathan Harriol type of players who it's like, oh, this guy is going to be able to start for a really good, a winning team for a decade. And he's not going to break the game. but like if we start if we get 20 MLS teams you know just like churning out that level of player it's going to help the league is going to help the national team it's going to make it easier to produce the next Julian Hall edgimetti Neil Pierre Kevin Sullivan and on down the line

and that's you know that is a good place for the league to be it um and nothing I look I've been really frustrated at MLS for the past three years because I thought it was the time to sort of go in, go all in, because we got messy. We had the Copa America coming. We had the World Cup coming. You know, add that rocket fuel and they didn't. And that will always bother me because I do think it was a missed opportunity. But even within that, I'm still bullish on the league because of how good the league by and large has become at producing excellent young soccer players. And now those guys are getting more minutes, even for teams like the Galaxy or Portland, who have always been allergic to putting those guys on the field.

I mean, my top 10, you've got players who start every game for teams that are top four in their conference. Yeah. Right? They are legitimately making Shield, MLS Cup pushes. is and these guys are both prospects like Peyton Miller, but also producers like Peyton Miller. That's really, really exciting now for that to be the reality. And again, drops onto the national team.

I mean, as you would expect, if you're listening to this, half the guys we've talked about, the 11, 13 players getting their international debuts over the last two weeks that play in MLS are going to be on this list because they're the future for a lot of this. I mean, to contextualize it, right? 2018 was Alfonso Davies. He was the number one prospect in 22 under 22. He left after that season. 2019 onwards,

Kevin Sullivan would have been the number one guy on the list. Like this year's version of Kevin Sullivan would have been the number one guy on the list. So would Audrey Mametti, who's the number two guy. So would Julianne Hall, who's the number three guy. So arguably would Neil Pierre, so arguably would Mbocazi. That's five guys.

who would have been the best prospect in every 22 under 22 list for the past seven years. You could probably add Shakuris there as well. You could probably add Justin Ellis there as well. That is the breadth and depth of talent that we're now seeing in this league. And I think it's going to be the new normal.

You're never going to automatically produce guys like Kavan and Mehdi who are so skilled beyond their year. in a way that you just can't plan, well, you can't make it happen again and again. You need that special gift and you need the right circumstances. But what you can control is the environment around them. And that environment produces Nathan Harrials and Maddie Corcorans and signs and Boccasis and gets Neil Pears onto the field at 18.

And if you're doing that, you're doing something really, really right for the future of soccer in this country. I mean, at a worst case scenario, Cooper Sanchez and Johnny Shore, available on this list for the next four or five years. So even the guys who are sort of flirting with this list now, if nothing changes and they're the same that are around, which won't be the case because there are more players coming through. Will it all hit at the same time like it is this year for all the guys and the big attacking positions, whatever?

Probably not, right? There's going to be waves of this in and out. Guys will play a second year or have that first year like Hall did last year where you sort of get comfortable and then you find more opportunities. We're going to talk Seattle Sounders as well, but it's gone pretty long. So I think we can come back to the Sounders. We will have your entire MLS sort of revamp coming up later this week as we get back into the playoff swing.

So it's the sort of race to the decision day, drive to the playoffs as we've been talking about via Continental Tire. We have all of that coming up on the Thursday show. We will have reactions to the USA Canada game coming up on Wednesday as well. I'm Jordan Angelie's away this week, so we've got some big-time guests, including gold medalists and World Cup winners to come and talk a little bit about some of the biggest stories around NWSL. And then the U.S. women's national team faced off against Spain on Saturday. So we're going to preview that game with Casey White, who you hear on a ton of the MLS broadcast, has covered NWSL coach with the U.S. women's national team. It will be a part of our coverage and help us sort of dig into all the stories around it.

So thank you to all of you who were in the chat, hanging out with us and watching us live. shout out to everyone listening via podcast. If you have friends who heard of Calvin Sullivan and don't know much else, send them the show. Please rate and review us and talk about how great some of us are, if not all of us. But I won't impose the full love, just partial love, so that people can help find this show and we can get more people in the fold. And thank you to two of you for being here with me. And we'll talk to you all again very, very soon.