Social Work Spotlight - Episode 103: Sharon

Episode Date: February 16, 2024

In this episode I speak with Sharon, who has worked as a caseworker, groupwork coordinator, child and family counsellor and primary school counsellor and is now an Accredited Mental Health Social Worker in private practice. She provides supervision to other social workers and students, is trained as a Systemic Couple and Family Therapist and facilitates both standard and youth Mental Health First Aid training.Links to resources mentioned in this week’s episode:Kate and Emma novel (Monica Dickens) - https://www.bloomsbury.com/au/kate-and-emma-9781448203109/Mindsight (Dr Dan Siegel) - https://drdansiegel.com/mindsight/This episode's transcript can be viewed here: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Z5IlEDVdoDAxhIZDwZ3GUzT9-S8m_AxybrSiqvtgki8/edit?usp=sharingThanks to Kevin Macleod of incompetech.com for our theme music.

I begin today by acknowledging the Gadigal people of the Eura Nation, traditional custodians of the land on which I record this podcast, and pay my respects to their elders past and present. I extend that respect to Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people listening today. Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples have an intrinsic connection to this land and have cared for country for over 60,000 years, with their way of life having been devastated by colonisation. Hi and welcome to social work spotlight where I showcase different areas of the profession in each episode.

I'm your host, Jasmine Lupus, and today's guest is Sharon, a client-centered and trauma-informed practitioner, passionate about working with people to assist in optimizing their quality of life. She has worked as a caseworker, group work coordinator, child and family counselor, and primary school counselor, and is now an accredited mental health social worker in private practice. She provides supervision to other social workers and students, is trained as a systemic couple and family therapist, and facilitates both standard and youth mental health first day training. Thank you, Sharon, for meeting today. Really looking forward to having a chat with you about your experience. Very happy to be here. Thank you for the opportunity. Yeah, I always ask first, when you started as a social worker and what drew you to the profession?

So I started as a social worker in 2012. I worked in the sector from 2006, but I sort of did things back to front, unusual to most people, but I got married very young and I had my work experience working with the Sydney City Mission Beat and just absolutely loved it when I was in year 11 and I was ready to change the world. And I remember seeing the social worker was like, oh, the social worker, you know, in the Sydney City Mission, you might not ever get to meet the social worker. And so I was all in awe of the social worker and never ever thought that I could be a social worker. had a bit of a rocky academic. My mum died when I was in year 12 and it sort of rocked me rather substantially. So academically I didn't perform very well and then met my life partner when I was 16, which is crazy.

And got married at 20 and had my children. And every year there was always that feeling of, is this the year that I can start to study? You know, I felt. like I wanted to have a career but I never I was never really sure when the right time was and eventually it got to the point where circumstances changed and there was an opportunity when my son was in year one I started to study I went to TAFE initially and did Diploma of Community Services and thought okay I'm not a complete loser I can do this so maybe there's hope for me yet. And after I finished that, I did it part-time, working around family because my husband has a very big career. And it meant that I was the primary carer. So I needed to be flexible

around my study and work and all that sort of thing. And then I started university. I'd started with a Bachelor of Social Science, Social Welfare, thinking that would give me what I wanted. and then when I finished, just ascertained that it wasn't going to, which was a major bummer, and then looked for a postgraduate degree because I did want to go into therapy and do counselling, but it just didn't, it wasn't going to be an easy pathway and certainly wouldn't give me the Medicare rebate

because my whole objective in studying was to be able to provide quality care for people that are potentially priced out of availability, they can't access quality care, quality therapy. So I wanted to be able to be eligible for everything I could get so that clients could come and see me. Yeah. So then I started a master's. I was very excited.

The Charles Stewart University and Relationships Australia offered, I don't think they do it anymore, but they offered it once at a very affordable rate and it was called the Master of Human Services Practice, systemic couple and family therapy. And when I started, I quickly realized that I was with social workers and psychologists. And as someone who hadn't done either of those disciplines in my study, it was like they were speaking a different language. So that was a major shock. They shouldn't really have accepted me. And it was a major blow because I had to literally start from scratch. And I felt, I felt very deskilled. And as it transpired, I ended up having to do, and this was torture.

They ended up finishing the degree before I'd been able to complete it because I was behind the eight ball and I was trying to catch up all the time. So I was one subject behind and I wasn't able to graduate with that degree. So I ended up having to do my Bachelor of Social Work, do my undergraduate social work degree and my Master of Social Work degree with the credits. at the same year full time and do a three day a week placement for six months. Oh my God. And it nearly killed me the same time that my son was doing year 12, my baby. Oh, man. So it was, I think I put on 10 kilograms and I was very antisocial.

Yeah. But I did it and I was also, I took 2011 off, I think. that I could complete the degree, but up until them, I'd also been working part-time. So I started working in, out-of-home care doing supervised visits, and then I, once I finished my social science degree, I got a part-time caseworker role, and I really enjoyed that. I did that for a couple of years, and then I transitioned into brighter futures and loved that job. That was probably one of the highlights of my career working in brighter futures at the time because it wasn't anywhere near as prescriptive as it is now. There was a lot of creative license and I wrote programs, group work programs,

and my manager was incredibly releasing and we had an absolute blast. And I did a lot of intensive family support work because a lot of the caseworkers were young and didn't have the same sort of life experience. So when there were real complex cases, I kind of stepped in and supported the younger ones helping them with their casework and coming up with ideas and things like that. So that was probably the best job I've ever had, I think, working for an organisation. And after that, once I graduated, I became a child and family counsellor out at Riversden. and loved that. That was with just a family support service. Did that and then I moved on to

primary school counselling with the Catholic education, did a maternity leave role. And during that, I started private practice and I've been in private practice for 10 years. I attained my accredited mental health social worker status in 2016, I think. It might have been earlier than that. I can't remember to be honest. Was that before the exam was in place? Before the exam, yeah, thank goodness. Yeah, I hear that's a killer. Yeah, pretty rough. And I've been victim services approved counsellor and I do mental health first aid training which I absolutely love. I love presenting and I just think it's such a great I'm with a not-for-profit organisation who provide training for the community for free.

So they pay me at a very low rate compared to what would normally get, but I'm more than happy to do it because I think that educating society to be less, you know, demystifying what mental health first aid means and how to have difficult conversations with people and do it well and respectfully, I think is critically important. and it's something I'm very passionate about. So, and both of my children are social workers, which I'm rather, rather proud about. My daughter's 33 and my son 30. He's just graduated. Very proud of them and their journeys. They've, they've had, you know, everybody has a journey and they've had their own to travel. But they're, yeah, super, super proud of them and the course that's

course that they've chosen, the path they've chosen. And I love, I'm loud and proud social worker. I think that the scope and the breadth of what the degree can, the diversity of roles that a person can have, it just, it's so great. It gives people so many opportunities to really find their niche and be able to run with it. And I also love the way that we're trained to think, I think, you know, it's quite unique, the systemic way of thinking or systems theory. And I think it's so holistic and it spreads out into every aspect of my life, the way I solve problems, not only professionally, but personally, the way I unpack things, the way I make sense of the world. I'm studying permaculture now. So, and I've been an avid gardener and I'm very, very holistic in the

that I approach life. So I did a year of nutritional medicine and I'm just really passionate about living our best life and finding what works for every person. And, you know, we're all so unique and we all have story. But we can, I think that there's always a way forward. And being able to be part of that process for people, as I have in the therapeutic space, has been a tremendous privilege. and understanding trauma and helping people understand the impact of trauma and what that means for them and how they can heal and recover and move forward. It's something I'm really, really passionate about. It's taken a huge toll on me.

And so I have taken a number of extended breaks. Over the years, burnout has been, is unfortunately an all too familiar friend. no matter how hard I try. So I've actually chosen to stop providing counselling for clients directly and I provide supervision because it's particularly working as a sole trader. So I work by myself and I've worked from home for the majority of that time. It has its limitations and you just don't have. the incidental conversations with team you don't have the backup of a team to to be able to

debrief with or you know it's a very isolating and i've always had external supervision but once one hour a month is not enough when you're dealing with really high intensity clients who you know victims of crime it's full on so hope that's not too much hope that's not too much hope that's helpful. I have so many questions. If we go back to that point where even before you started studying where the social work profession was kind of this elusive thing that was, you know, held up as, oh, almost untouchable. At what point do you think you understood what a social work role was? Because you obviously need to have a bit of an understanding before you move into all the years of study you've gone through. Yeah, well, I think when I was in year 11, I think that there was

because we're talking a long time ago, you know, we're talking 40 years ago. When I was in year 11, there was a very clear distinction between a welfare worker and a social worker. And a social worker was sort of like the top. The welfare worker was more someone who was on the ground, on the coal face, metaphorically speaking. And social workers were more the people who did a lot of the, this is how I understood it when I was young, who did a lot of the, they understood the bigger picture and were more able to influence and sort of manage the overall case, whereas a welfare worker was on the cold face doing, going the distance, I suppose. And, you know, a social worker had

a degree, whereas a welfare worker back then would go to TAFE. And it wasn't, even now, it's the TAFE courses are probably considered they have more credibility than they did back in the day. So I always thought I could never have done social work. I wasn't bright enough for that. I didn't have the confidence academically. And I did grow up in an era where certainly within my family, we're talking, what would it be, the 70s and 80s, there was still quite a conservative traditional approach to I was just going to get married and have babies, which I did.

But it wasn't like I planned to do that. It's just that I met the love of my life and that was it, you know. But I was always hungry for more. And I'd always seen myself as a helper, someone who, you know, a lot of my identity is linked to equipping and empowering others. And that was from a young person, you know, just from a kid. I would always be drawn or wanting to support people who might be struggling. It's interesting though, because what you then had to do was you'd gotten some experience in the industry,

but then you kind of had to put all that work experience aside. If you're studying full-time plus doing placements, and then you had the disappointment of realizing that, hang on a second, I can't graduate with my cohort. What do you think it was that then pushed you to keep going through and get that qualification? Well, it's a very good question. I mean, my placement was horrendous. So I had the most dreadful experience on my placement for a number of reasons. I think that I just, I started studying in 2001 and I finished at the end of 2011.

Wow. So I was studying a really long time. Yeah. And I was determined. I was just really determined to be able to, you get to a certain point and it felt like I've just got to do it because I've put so much effort in. It would be, I just couldn't imagine not seeing it through to completion, although the placement nearly took me out.

Like I was nearly, I nearly bailed because it was just so hard and not nurturing at all. and I wasn't being supervised by a social worker. And that was really bad because I was more qualified than the person that was supervising me even though they had counselling experience. They didn't have the same breadth of, they didn't think the same way, they didn't have the same language,

they did not understand the world as I had been trained to see it. Yeah. So it was very, very difficult. And part of what I love about supervising students is I had two wonderful placements, and I want other students to have those opportunities as well and be able to get excited about social work and be able to develop their own identity. And I can say, yes, this is how I do things, but encourage you to think about what you would do and what your values are and what your practice might look like.

I'm guessing if you don't have the front facing at the moment, you wouldn't have as much capacity for students, but have you in the past? Well, I'm actually, I've transitioned to supervising students on placement. Oh, fun. Okay. Through two learning institutions, one university and another college. So I absolutely love it. I love it.

And I think, you know, interestingly, you had a positive experience. I had a dreadful one. And the thing that motivates me is that I don't want, I don't want students to feel bereft, you know, or left forced to endure something without support. So my motivation is the flip side of yours. I want to prevent young students from experiencing what I went through because I did that as a mature person and it was really, really difficult. My goal is to give them as positive an experience as possible and support them through. through that.

Yeah. So given that experience plus your experiences of burnout, I'm guessing also that you're probably able to identify it much more quickly than even they would. If they're going through a difficult experience, you'll probably see it before they realize. Oh yeah. I think so. And I think thankfully, you know, my experience with the two, I'm not going to say who they are, but the two, the two organizations that I'm working for are very, very different in the

the sort of the quality of... Approach. Quality and the approach at this stage, one is still very much evolving and at a very sort of early stage of getting things right and the other one is very reputable and has been in the social work game for a very long time. So it's nice to have both

because I feel that the one that's really established and strong can help me to support the other organisation. that needs a little bit of bolstering. So yeah, and it just felt like a really natural transition for me to be able to go into that space. And, you know, at my stage of life, it's very seasonal, so you only have the semester work. The pay's not fantastic,

but it's not so much about that. It's about being able to invest in future generations and I'm still providing supervision, external supervision to other social workers, which, you know, I have a handful of them. And, you know, I love that. I really love that. And the other thing that I was going to say was when it comes to the old self-care and the, I've really enjoyed witnessing my children go through their study. and I've seen a dramatic change in the, I've seen a dramatic change in the way that social work is being taught

and the emphasis upon being able to go the distance and not be isolated and be able to care for ourselves and be acutely aware of that instead of that sort of self-sacrificing a lot of the time. It's very unhelpful. the irony of being a social worker is that we want to be a helper and it's almost natural for us to put others before ourselves but seeing my children come through as a next generation and seeing their approach i found it really encouraging in that they just seem so much more balanced and

understanding around the importance of their own well-being yeah which is great it's really really good to see i do remember it being almost token when we were going through uni of you know there's this thing there's this self-care thing it's your responsibility to make sure that you manage your self-care and you monitor for burnout and I didn't feel as though there was much of an onus on those support structures or the system and yeah I feel like that's changed for the better definitely I'm seeing that as well and it is super encouraging because from a sustainability perspective you know even the social workers that I've been supervising younger people who I've helped through supported through their accreditation process and things like that.

There's still a tendency to forget, I know from my experience of burnout, you don't realize. It's like a horrible metaphor, but you know, that whole, the lobster in the hot water. They just gradually raise the heat, the temperature and then all of a sudden that's been my experience of burnout. And I've become a lot more attuned to being able to identify indicators much more sensitive to that than I ever used to be. What support would you say you require now then? You've said you've kind of taken some extended breaks to manage the burnout, but you're not working for an organisation. How do you stay connected to people? I have a support group or they're all psychologists.

And I have my own supervisor. and I said to her, I made an observation recently, I've never worked with social workers. I've never ever worked with another social worker. And that just is baffling to me to think that I've got through my entire career and I've never ever worked in the same office as another social worker. But I do have a couple of long-term friendships with ladies who work in private practice. and they are psychologists, but they've been a tremendous support.

We have a little WhatsApp chat and we'll communicate that way. And I mean, having my kids is kind of handy. Roo of supervision at the dinner table. Not that I obviously disclose critical information, but just being able to say, oh, I had a really crappy day, blah, blah, blah, blah, that can be nice without obviously. going into the details. But I wouldn't say, I don't think that the way that I've done it in retrospect is a really sustainable approach. I left organisations because I struggled with systems.

I'll be honest. And I had trouble working within a system. I'm not proud of that. I don't think that's a good thing necessarily. And I also liked the flexibility of, I can put the washing on in between the session, you know, I can do my gardening or go for a walk or things like that without any sense of guilt or feeling like I'm being judged for it or anything like that. So I have really enjoyed the autonomy and the flexibility, but it certainly has had its drawbacks. And I mean, expenses wise, working from home certainly has its advantages. I don't have to pay rent or things like that but i do have to screen people well if i'm doing face-to-face sessions yeah so i'm not sure that i would say categorically what i know the way that i've worked

wouldn't work for everyone and would i say that it's worked for me beautifully probably not when i think back to you know the years and the and covid and i worked i worked my butt off during covid yeah that was all on line, exhausting, absolutely exhausting. At the same time as, you know, everybody's got families and ageing parents and personal things do come into the equation when it comes to your capacity. So when I've worked with people or I've had supervisors who've talked about wanting to go into private practice, we have a really good conversation about that because I think that there's, there are tremendous advantages, but there are tremendous disadvantage. as well. So I make sure that they're across those because I don't want them to have to go through

what I have. How did you then develop your business model? Did you have some sort of coach or I imagine your supervisor would have been quite instrumental in that. But if there aren't sort of those networks around you, how do you figure out even just what templates to use? How much to charge? There's so much to think about. Well, fortunately, I had quite a broad experience base so I picked up templates along the way and I'm pretty innovative and pretty and I'm not saying that to kind of boast but I love to learn so anything that I'm confronted with I will overcome and conquer just because I love I love the challenge yeah so you know I did get someone to help me set up my website I guess I am fairly

determined and motivated. I want to do a good job. So if I, if that means feeling silly and asking questions about something I don't understand, I'll do it. If it's a means to an end and it means that I can provide a really good service, then I'll, I'll do that. I'll put in the effort. Yeah. Yeah. There are a couple of podcasts I listen to and their tag, well, one of the, the titles is no stupid questions. Another one has a bit of a tagline of ask smart people, dumb questions. So I'm very much a proponent of there is no silly question. It is just, sometimes it's just having the confidence to ask the question in the first place or what is the question I want to ask based on what I'm hoping to get out of this and that's something that

would definitely come with time. And in our mental health first aid, one of the things that we say is a little acronym called aqua rock and the acronym is all questions you ask are okay, which is kind of Cool. I love that. Yeah, aqua rock. All right. I've done the training myself and it's wonderful, but in your experience of facilitating the training, what are the types of companies that you most enjoy delivering to or the most interesting sector or what's something that perhaps surprised you or you didn't expect? That's a good question. I think that for me, I am in the enviable position that you know, I don't have to make a living. I don't have to fund myself, earn lots of money. So the idea of being philanthropic is something that is very dear to me because I can. Not everybody

can. And I see that as a tremendous privilege. So being able to work with not-for-profit organisations that, you know, there's no hidden agenda, but it is largely due to the fact that they're wanting to educate society and support others to have confidence in being able to support loved ones or even within a corporate setting, know how to take care of people who may be struggling to access the help that they need. I think they're the people that I want to do work with. You know, they're my kind of people. I'm not into charging thousands of dollars to deliver training because I want the money or need the money. And I do say that carefully because I know that some people do need to make a living

and I'm at the latter end of my career and it's not as critical to me. The thing that makes me want to work is more around being able to leave a legacy or be able to, you know, I'm a little bit altruistic, I suppose, when it comes to all that stuff. But I can. I can be like that, you know. I'm able to be and not everybody is in that position. So I would rather work for less pay in an environment that I can comfortably align myself with than just deliver a service without any real attachment to the organisation that I'm doing it for.

Do you know what I'm saying? Yeah, yeah, that makes sense. What do you think you find most challenging then about the work you're doing at the moment? Because it sounds like there are lots and lots of positives, but yeah, where do you find you need to put the most work in? I think at the moment the impact of burnout seems to have had quite a, seems to have left a lasting impression on me. So my ability to cope with stress is a lot has been diminished. And I'm not sure that I will ever be able to function to the same degree that I used to,

but then I don't want to either, you know? Sure. And I'm older. So there's also that component to it. but that can't be ignored. But the quality of life, being able to balance quality of life, I think it's always been an elusive thing for me to feel that I can get the balance right, that work-life balance. You know, I think I can feel like that,

that I've done it for a day and then it's gone again. So for me, that's probably the most challenging part. Feeling like I can get the balance right between making a work, worthwhile meaningful contribution whilst maintaining my well-being and the quality of life that I believe is best for me. Yeah. How then do you find that balance? How do you structure your day? What does a typical day look like for you if there is such a thing? Yes. Well, I love my garden. So I'm very much into the I think the social work principles align beautifully with permaculture in the sense of it's all about living ethically and responsibly and I grow a lot of food I'm very big on I often

think it's quite funny that when I had my most recent experience of feeling really really worn out I did actually try some counselling but I actually found gardening better for me and I here I am a therapist kind of ironic but I spent six months in the garden literally just yeah and so on a day-to-day basis I like to get some sort of physical exercise I do Pilates I garden I do walking and I'm working back on getting into jogging again I endeavor to eat a whole food plant-based diet and I detoxify two or three times a year quite significantly you know for a number of weeks so trying to get that balance that's kind of like you get out what you

put in yeah that holistic health i want to be able to model what i advocate to others as being important if i can't do it then i don't really have the right to be encouraging others to be doing the same i do practice mindfulness i'm a huge believer in the benefits of mindfulness i do journal all the things that I encourage others to do, I try and implement myself. Obviously you have your stages where you do it more frequently than others. I have my little nest in the morning. I've got a beautiful bay window and I look out at my garden and watch the world go by and have a cup of tea.

So I need a lot of time on my own, a lot of downtime. Yeah. And I always have, but I know that I need it. I know that it's not just a choice. It's I'm best when I've had that quality time on my own. I'm very aware that many people don't have the outdoor space. So it is obviously a wonderful thing to be able to have it. But I absolutely love being in the garden as well.

There's that aspect of mindful meditation, just being able to disconnect. You know, I'm sitting here looking at my spring onions and my parsley and my green beans and, you know, all the things, the spring veggies that are kind of out immediately in front of me. And it is just so calming and comforting. But I wonder if you've reminded me, so the agency that I did my last placement with had a volunteer program called Garden Care. And they would send volunteers out to people's homes, mostly older people, people who were less mobile and assist them in creating raised garden beds. but the idea was not to do everything for them. It was to involve them as much as possible in the process

and show them how to do something similar themselves or just give them some agency in the process and kind of teach Amanda Fish kind of thing. But I wonder if there's scope for you potentially in the future to build a service around permaculture. What do you think about that? You know, I've thought about that. I've thought about that.

there's a whole horticultural therapy is a real thing in America. Where the therapeutic element, I mean, it's fascinating. What we've learned now is that when we engage with dirt, the microbiome in the dirt interacts with our own microbiome in our gut. It's just remarkable how we are so intricately connected with nature. I find it so awe-inspiring, really. But that's why, you know, it's so therapeutic because we, when we interact with nature and get our hands dirty, literally get our hands dirty, there's a relationship. There's some kind of process that happens that is good for our body and our brains.

So I do, I have toyed with that. I know that there is a lady in Melbourne who runs a practice, a private practice, a social worker who runs a private practice in that arena. And it is something that I'm, you know, I may do. I've also got bees. I love my bees. They're honeybees. I do want to get native bees, but these ones are honeybees. Yeah, so that's a whole other layer. I'm studying beekeeping as well. So. Oh, amazing. Yeah. There's a gentleman just down the road from me on my street who has native bees. And just every now and then when they're out and about, you just kind of walk along the sidewalk but you walk through a swarm of natives and it's just i don't know i love it's a very stop and smell the flowers kind of moment it's really nice it's really precious

and i have chooks so my gals oh they're so fun we hang out and fresh eggs so again putting in what you want to get out yeah yeah my parents have chucks as well so no shortage of fresh eggs that's very nice very nice so I guess that's these are all things that I've introduced into my life because I know the benefits and I'm passionate about being able to live my best life yeah I thought about I mean the idea of having people come and then be able to give them fresh produce after a session or run little workshops or things like that I may yet do that one day not quite ready yet. That may well be somewhere where I go in time. What are some projects or programs that you're working on or training you're delivering? So mostly it's the mental health first aid, which I only

really do two or three times a year with one particular organisation that I'm aligned with. I'm not really big on promoting myself. I never have been. It's more word of mouth and things just sort of the opportunities within the college, I'm hoping to be able to do a little more work then next year and hopefully be able to be influential around the standard of the course delivery and things of that nature. There's quite a lot because you've got you've got all the training delivery, you've got your own practice, you've got the supervision for the university students. So that's three part-time jobs effectively.

And I'm sure you've got more bits and pieces. If something pops up, you'd probably have a good think about saying, yes. I'm primary carer for my mother-in-law as well. So she is currently living independently, but she is declining rapidly. So there's a lot of, I puree all her food and do all a shopping and take her to a hairdresser appointment and organise, coordinate the care. for her and I'm going to be a grandma next year so that's really exciting so I don't want to fill my life up too much. No that'll keep you busy and it's good having someone in the family

who understands the age care system to a degree and can help advocate where your mother-in-law needs help yeah my husband and I we're the only well he's the only child now so it falls very heavily upon us but she's been was wonderful to me obviously I didn't have my mum and she was tremendous when my children were little. She was incredible support. So there's no hesitation there around being able to be supportive of her at this time. Yeah. It's a no-brainer.

Given that the kids are very early in their careers, what are you hoping for them in terms of the social work profession? What changes would you like to see over time that might make that experience better for them? I do have concerns around, I think, the litigation side of things. You know, when it comes to people being, complaints being made and the processes that people have to go through and the stress that can come and the vulnerability that seems to be, it feels like it's worse than it used to be. Across my entire career, I never had a complaint.

It's not because I was perfect. nobody ever made a complaint about me or there was never any allegation anything like that and yet it seems to be far more common than it used to be okay and that's that's troubling because it adds a whole layer of stress working in private practice you know you're really vulnerable and i think that causes me a little bit of concern when it comes to my kids but it looks like they're both going to be working within very big systems. Yeah. Which I think, you know, there's a degree of protection that comes with that.

And I think that's a good thing. Yeah. I don't know. Is that something you've, in the span of your career, have you noticed a shift in that area or not? Not really, but I wonder if what you're talking to is more just a culture of self-advocacy and stepping up and talking about things if things aren't right from a service user perspective. Yeah, I'm not sure. Because it's not like we're in the States and we have a culture of litigation, for instance, but yeah, it must be really exhausting, constantly second-guessing yourself and trying to,

you know, the work is hard enough without having to have that extra cognitive load of, is this going to come back or fall back on me? And in private practice, it is something that you have to think about all the time. But I don't have an issue with, you know, I think empowering people to speak up is a good thing. That's not where I'm coming from. I think it's more there can be injustice there in a sense as well when it comes to particularly with the nature of the people that the demographic of people that you can be working with. Yeah. It's not always straightforward and things can be perceived incorrectly. That can be very difficult for young social workers who may not have the

experience or the wherewithal to be able to think more broadly about that, if that makes sense. Yeah. Yeah, especially the ones who are wanting to get into private practice quite early in their career and they don't have those years of experience behind them or the network developed to say, hey, I reach out to my friend, does this sound right or, you know, could I be improving things? So, and especially if you're not then paying for your own supervision, be it individual or group, that's going to be really hard feeling as though you're supported. Yeah. I guess I'm coming also, particularly having worked in the complex trauma space.

There's a lot of, it's a very tricky space to work in in the sense of people can be triggered or people can be, have a certain lens in the way they see the world, which has been informed by their experience. And it may not necessarily always be accurate. I don't want to be controversial or feel like I'm saying things unfairly because that's not my heart at all. But it's a very vulnerable space for everyone, including the practitioners. When you're working with people who are how they see the world is very strongly informed by having gone through very difficult situations. That's, you know, it can be a real challenge.

Are there any resources that you'd recommend people check out if they're wanting to know more about either the area of work that you're in or even some of the self-care types of things or resources that you use, anything that you think you'd like to share and pass it forward? Even if it's got nothing to do with social work and it's just helping you zone out every now. From a resource perspective, I guess my encouragement, and I think it's a real burnout prevention, is maintaining curiosity. So continually having a curious posture when it comes to, oh, I wonder why I reacted like that, or I wonder what that was about. I wonder what was the reason for that, or having that ability to continue. ask questions, that critical reflection, I think that can be a real protective factor.

And I read a book for the sake of it, a book called Kate and Emma, which was written by Monica Dickens, who was the granddaughter of Charles Dickens, as a matter of fact. This was the book that really motivated me to do social work. Okay. And it's quite an historic book, but it's to do with the daughter of a judge and the daughter of a from a very different socio-economic environment and seeing how they develop a friendship and just what happens but as far as resources go i mean there's nothing really that people would you know social workers wouldn't know about i think the mind sight the dan seagull mind site books really

good i think mindfulness is something to really explore and to understand the breadth and the depth of its benefits. It's not just about being able to navel gaze. You know, there's so many benefits to the brain and advantages. And I've seen that how that's helped me over the years in creating greater self-awareness and understanding. I trained in sensory motor psychotherapy and the thing that I love about that is being able to appreciate. There are many different ways to support a person through their trauma healing journey and talk therapy can be very overrated and i do say that carefully for me it's all about i think knowledge is power and being able to be first for knowledge as a clinician but also encourage that of others and the people that we work

with i think it's a very empowering space for everyone Yeah. Yeah, I guess going way back from day one, you've wanted to provide quality care for people who have fewer financial resources. So that's kind of carried you through your professional experience. But you've got this capacity for creativity in some of the programs that you've run, like the brighter future programs and the family support and you're really proud of your social work identity. But yeah, that also speaks to the diversity of the profession, is that you've got that really strong identity, but you understand that there's a breadth there. There's applicability elsewhere. You've, over time, being able to develop your professional confidence and the belief in your own capacity, and you've been able to develop a role that really provides a lot of autonomy and hopefully a bit more balance, which is what you're needing at this point in your career. But that sheer tenacity and curiosity around developing your own business, it's a slok. It's hard. and without the right people around you, it would all fall apart.

So you've done a great job of getting that together and being able to keep that focus of supporting people with fewer resources. And I love the resources that you've shouted out, which are mindfulness and curiosity. They're free resources. I think we just don't tap into them enough, right? Yeah, absolutely. But yeah, incredible story.

And, yeah, just I guess before we finish, up is there anything else about your experience or words of advice that you have for anyone? I'd also encourage people to really find their thing. You know, what is it that really does it for them when it comes to replenishment? People joke about, oh, go and have a pedicure or a manicure or have a bath, but, you know, there's something more, or eat chocolate, you know, all of those things are great, But there is something for everyone, I think, that really, to the point of a soul thing, you know, it really, you spend 10 minutes doing it and it's like doing two hours of something else. So I would encourage people to not be complacent about finding what that thing is for them.

Because it will pay dividends when it comes to sustainability and being able to see our career as a marathon, not a sprint. Yeah, I sure. It's just funny. I was interviewed for another social web podcast. The host is Marie Vicarcas, who's down in Melbourne. And the title of the episode is I hate baths. She started talking to me about self-care and what I do. I'm like, I don't want to have a bath. I've never used the bath in my house. Like, it's not exactly, like it doesn't speak to me. It's not the thing that brings me joy or replenishes my energy. It's, yeah, you really need to find your thing and stick to it, even if it's completely anti-social, even if it takes financial resources,

whatever it is, find exactly, find that thing and just grab onto it for dear life because no one else is going to do it for you. You really need to, yes, there should be external responsibility in terms of systems and organizations and protections. to a certain degree. But ultimately, yeah, you need to also find that thing and use that thing and not be afraid to just disconnect from the world if that's what it takes.

Because you said you spent 10 years studying, like that's a huge investment. And if you're gonna spend 10, 15 years, the same amount of time in the work and then burn out and not be able to do the thing that you set out to do in the first place, then what's the point? So yeah, you're gonna spend out to do.

You've got to think long game. Keep that in mind. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Well, Sharon, thank you so much for sharing your experience. It's been a wild ride. You well and truly started behind the eight ball, but you've gotten so much done within a short amount of time,

and it's really wonderful. I look forward to seeing where it takes you and also your kids, seeing how they develop, how they grow, and how they form their own identity, and hopefully they get just as much out of it as you do. But yeah, thank you again for the time to do. this. I really appreciate it. Yes, it's been a pleasure and a privilege. Thank you so much. Thanks for joining me this week. If you'd like to continue this discussion or ask anything of either

myself or Sharon, please visit my anchor page at anchor.fm.fm slash social work spotlight. You can find me on Facebook, Instagram and Twitter, or you can email SW Spotlightpodcast at gmail.com. I'd love to hear from you. Please also let me know if there is a particular topic you'd like discussed, or if you or another person you know would like to be featured on the show. Next episode's guest is Victoria, a social worker and peer worker living and working on stolen counterland in Adelaide, South Australia. As a recent Masters of Social Work graduate, she has been active in the youth mental health sector with a passion for working collaboratively with multicultural LGBTQIA plus people and those with intersectional identities. I release a new episode

every two weeks. Please subscribe to my podcast so you'll notify when this next episode is available. See you next time.