Soft Skills Engineering - Episode 504: Should I quit my AI job before my first day and professional button-clicker

Episode Date: March 16, 2026

In this episode, Dave and Jamison answer these questions: Hi Jamison and Dave. Eight years into my software engineering career, all of it at Series B and C startups, I’ve been craving two things: a recognizable brand name on my resume and the chance to work on real scale problems. After a long search, I finally got both. The catch? I got them in the wrong order. I accepted an offer at one of the hottest and fastest-growing AI companies in the application layer space. Exciting work, smart people, real momentum, but not quite a household name yet, and not quite facing the kind of scaling challenges that come with a billion users yet either. Two weeks later, I finally heard that I cleared the interviews from a big brand name tech company. I’ll be honest: it wasn’t my first choice brand name. I bombed interviews at a few others and this was basically my consolation prize. Here’s the thing about this mega tech company right now: the culture has … shifted. It feels less like a tech company and more like a social experiment with a $1.5 trillion market cap. So now I’m torn and the clock is ticking. My start date at the AI company is in a few weeks and I’m currently in team matching at the mega tech co. Do I renege before I even badge in? Do I start, survive team matching, and then quit? Or do I just honor my commitment and forget about the brand name for now? More broadly: under what circumstances is it ever okay to renege or quit shortly after starting? Have either of you been in this situation or been on the receiving end? I need stories, I need wisdom, and honestly I need someone to just tell me what to do. I’ve changed from a java developer role to OIC integration on oracle cloud. I’m not sure if that was a good move as it doesn’t feel like I’m doing much coding but lots of clicking. I was thinking that having cloud experience would benefit me but now I’m not sure. I’m not sure if I should run back to a java developer job or give it a chance and how much time would be a fair chance?

it takes more than a vitamin d supplement to be a great software engineer this is episode 504 of the soft skills engineering podcast where i'm your host jameson dance i'm your host dave smith soft skills engineering is a weekly advice show about all the non-technical things that go into the technical field of software development like how to make up for my chronic lack of sunlight yeah it's true i got an unrelated blood test and it's everything's fine by the way you are really low on vitamin d like yeah occupational hazard like i probably should have assumed that i don't know if you realize this jameson but you did poetry at the beginning of this show but it got edited out so jameson had a little stutter and he kind of slowed down and stopped and i just thought

that is so fitting for episode 504 gateway timeout oh yeah i experienced beautiful brain level gateway timeouts quite frequently so i have mechanical sympathy there dave do you want to thank our patrons yes i do thanks to those that are contributing at the level where we shout out their names every week and extra thanks to those who have completely sacrificed the coherency of their patreon profile name for the sake of my recording session which is just really just the best thing ever it's like your money i loved but your weird patreon names i am just absolutely just head over heels in love with yeah okay here we go the first one is my name is bread because i like toast brian wolford is in germany angel wood instead of will angel seth angel i thought

this was a funny name but you didn't laugh now i feel self-conscious we have jamie sundance go ahead run your own mail server what are you chicken bok bok my actual name on linkedin is yammy debugging in the dark canny the mobile development ordinary first of his name jacob shandling admits that shame is a powerful motivator and so has changed his patreon name again sometimes when a new episode drops i just listen to the patreon list and listen to the actual podcast later the missing semicolon christy the world's ok as programmer change your name in a funny way for a chance to win 400 real talk 80 frank advice 6 000 peso my mind or 90 you're off better quitting wow and then in parentheses you said words and now i hate my job i love people

just putting parentheses around everything now nick molyneux embedded engineers treat assembly the same way typescript engineers treat javascript javier gonzalez chewy ted timbrel oh no okay i ike chicken i ike i ever but the difference between an uppercase i and a lowercase i i can you d i ever oh my gosh or is it an uppercase that's an uppercase i it is he replaced all the lowercase l's with uppercase i's well done fortunately the the font we use actually makes those very clear so it just kind of freaked me out but the question was i guess was i going to notice and i did okay moving on a single open parenthesis dan from drone deploy never is not just a crater on mars flamingo emoji i like chicken i like liver miyamix miyamix please deliver

swiss python again this october kyle boss kent c dodds this podcast was recorded at 1970-0101-0000z or later jenny kim these i didn't okay i have a question about that one we had a time stamp that was kind of checking and updating yeah did that time stamp break and now this is what it it fell back to yeah like overflowed and wrapped to this yeah i guess it would have changed though i don't know i think the hacker got the information they came for and moved on and this is just a copycat joker i don't know who knows yes we don't know who these people are we just love them i've never felt so much love for someone i don't really know other than their profile name on patreon all right yeah jenny kim the stochastic parrot how many angels can will angel will if will angel can

will angels oh i actually saw this one come through in the in a change notification and i just i thought this is that's a great one irish and jonathan kings and i beautiful functional user documentation will devil will angels great grandparents name of angel got mangled at ellis island oh it's angel and angle well angel's great-grandparents name was angle not angel maybe is it pronounced data or data braden canes john grant britney ellick closed parenthesis followed by a single literal closing parenthesis thank you so much to those that contribute at that level and thank you more for your names and if you want to join this crew of people whose names we say just what a weird thing that we offer yep pronouncing people's names as a service go to soft

skills audio and click the support us on patreon button where you can contribute any dollar amount to get access to our slack community full of wonderful kind-hearted wise sage wisdom and actually a little bit of mania because these are the same some of these people are the same people who wrote these profile names in Patreon. Behold their descent into madness. Yes, and if you contribute enough, we will say whatever your Patreon profile name is. All right, shall we read our first question, Jameson?

Yes, I will do it. This is from a listener who claims their name is badge in or bail out, but I don't believe them. Hi, Jameson and Dave. Eight years into my software engineering career, all of it at Series B and C startups, I've been craving two things. a recognizable brand name on my resume, and the chance to work on real scale problems.

After a long search, I finally got both. The catch, I got them in the wrong order. I accepted an offer at one of the hottest and fastest growing AI companies in the application layer space. Exciting work, smart people, real momentum, but not quite a household name yet. And not quite facing the kind of scaling challenges that come with a billion users yet either. Two weeks later, I finally heard that I cleared the interviews from a big brand name tech company. I'll be honest, it wasn't my first choice brand name. I bombed interviews at a few others, and this was basically my consolation prize. Here's the thing about this mega tech company right now.

The culture has shifted. It feels less like a tech company and more like a social experiment with a $1.5 trillion market cap. So now I'm torn, and the clock is ticking. My start date at the AI company is in a few weeks, and I'm currently in team matching at the mega tech company. Do I re... Oh, how do I pronounce this word? I know what it means. Renege?

reneg that's how i've heard that reneg all right reneg do you do i reneg before i even badge in do i start survive team matching and then quit or do i just honor my commitment and forget about the brand name for now more broadly under what circumstances is it ever okay to reneg or quit shortly after starting have either of you been in this situation or been on the receiving end i need stories i need wisdom and honestly i just need someone to tell me what to do well you've come to the right place the two most indecisive advice podcast hosts on the planet here's what you do quintuple your patreon contribution to the soft skills engineering podcast question answered okay i want to make sure i understand this right if they're in team

matching have they accepted an offer at the mega tech company already no i think okay i think typically at least the way i've been through the process is you go through all the interviews then you go into a team matching phase and then once you've chosen a team and they chose you then you'll get an offer like an actual formal written offer but it's sort of an informal offer that we want to hire you and yeah i don't know i don't know you know what is that right let me pull up my notes it is yes it is essentially an offer uh but i don't think it's like signed sealed and delivered the fact that the question asker said renege makes me feel like they at least said yes informally to something at least to the next stage right yeah i have a few thoughts about this

one thought is it's a very different problem to scale up than to join something that is already a large scale so if this company has a 1.5 trillion dollar market cap it's probably not gonna i don't know quintuple in the next couple of years right i don't know maybe it will stranger things have happened but there are a lot of problems of scale that already have some solutions and a lot of the scale you're working with is just keeping this gigantic complicated machine going not necessarily oh we're being crushed under this traffic weight and how do we how do we deal with a billion users you already dealt with those problems to reach that scale in some way and kind of fixing them and improving them. And there's some experiments with new product directions and

new areas where you scale up a little bit, but a lot of it is fitting into this enormous machine that has a lot of solutions already. And I feel like you learn more about organizational scale and communication overhead and coordination than you do about just raw, how do we work with 10 million cores and because there are probably teams working on that already and they probably have an answer yeah not only right not only are they working on it but it was solved years and years ago yeah we did it yeah we did it before anybody else did because that's how we got here absolutely can still be valuable i remember that when i was at a mega tech co i remember that same story where i was like oh how exciting we get to do thousands of transactions per second and all

this stuff and i realized like it's actually easy once someone else did all the work yeah not only that, but you don't even really get exposure to how it works. I remember my team, probably no one on my team, really had a deep understanding of how all the infrastructure was working to service that high a scale. And we just kind of worked in the system and everything was great at that high scale. At my mega tech company job, we actually did work in a part of the system that dealt with a ton of traffic. We worked in this application proxy layer and much of the traffic for people paying dollars to this company went through this layer it also had a ton of stuff above it and below it so we weren't like the only important piece there but we were we were close to

this scale and i still feel like i just worked with a lot of solved problems and incrementally improved stuff and tweak things and interesting yeah having said that i do look i am so glad i got to work at one of these companies i learned so much that has i mean just literally okay last week i had to write a real high stakes incident report it was going to be published publicly a lot of like real high stakes situations involved anyway big deal i wrote it it was an effectively job well done got a lot of positive feedback from various organizations and and people who would know and someone on my team asked me like dave how did you learn how to do that isn't this your first time doing that and i was like no i wrote many of these and read many of these at that

mega tech company and i'm so glad that i did because it was like i don't know i just once you see the work done and you work in that it just changes you for the better that's true i think i'm probably undervaluing even though i didn't have to solve from scratch all these problems it did help calibrate things a little bit and just seeing the existing solutions was super interesting and valuable oh yeah definitely so i i i'm probably being overly negative about the importance of it But you shouldn't come in to expect to join the team and then be handed this unsolved problem of we can't possibly keep up with this scale. You go scale it up for us. Yeah, definitely.

That's way more likely at a fast growing small company. Yeah. And isn't that the interesting tradeoff you have to make? So if you join one of these well-established megatech companies, you're not going to solve the scale problems, but you will get a front row seat to see how they were solved. but then if you decide to join a smaller company you will have to solve all the problems but only if they happen and there's kind of like this 50 to 1 chance that your particular startup will actually encounter those problems because the chances of it being crazy successful and getting that many users it's kind of low yeah i mean you mentioned a billion users how many companies have a billion users you can probably count them on your hand yeah exactly and of those companies

it's probably a vanishingly small fraction of employees that that sort of like we're on the bottlenecks of scaling up to that so even then yeah it can be tricky to land exactly that experience totally so if scale is your thing that you really want to get that's just not in my opinion there's just not a reliable path to get it yeah i i have my own biases to this question which is i would absolutely join the fast-growing AI company because it sounds like fun. And joining a $1.5 trillion market cap company that's an established name that has some, I don't know what it means that it feels like a social experiment, but it doesn't sound, it sounds like there could be some downsides. I guess I'll put it that way. There's some downsides to every job, but there might be

some internal chaos or politics. I don't know. Once your market cap is $1.5 trillion, then governments matter a lot to what you do yeah i don't know well i was gonna say the good news is if you join this fast-paced startup and you're in team matching at this megatech company just like let the team matching go because it might take a few weeks or months for that team matching process to all the way go through and by then this startup might actually be out of business so this could work out well and you also said you said ai application layer and that's like that's like the riskiest place to be in ai yep you could be a prompt by then yes exactly opus 7 or whatever your whole product could be a prompt on one of the uh big ai labs oh boy i think there is

it just generally feels like a a somewhat dishonest thing to do to to accept an offer at two companies at the same time sort of let it play out if you haven't actually accepted something. I mean, you could use this for negotiation. If they really want you, then maybe there's a dollar amount or a specific team at this megatech company that would make you feel better. I think it's possible that there will be connections that will look unfavorably upon you if you accept and then renege. I'm going to keep trying to say that word so I remember how to pronounce it later on. But the good news, the company will be fine. They'll be okay. If they're that big this is a situation they have probably been in many times before and so you're not going

to leave this team in the lurch or anything like that but at some point there is some reputation risk to being somewhat dishonest with your commitment to join this company that then evaporates i would say in that one like follow your ethics your ethical code your own internal conscience more so than the reputation risk these companies are huge they interview so many people And if you do something weird where you're like, oh, this thing, whatever, got another offer or not going to actually proceed with it, they're not going to remember you. Like, there's no institutional knowledge. Nothing is personal for these companies. And the recruiter you worked with probably won't even work there next year.

Yeah, I guess that's a good point. Yeah, I think I would just join the AI company. It's one of the hottest and fastest growing. That sounds good. Sounds like you're scaling. and even if you're not at a billion users yet going from a thousand to 50 000 is still that's quite a scaling problem yeah it'll be it could be really fun really cool yeah it's not it's not all about the magnitude that you end up at sometimes just the the like percentage difference is is a

fun problem of its own and jameson guess what i have an answer for you on the sequencing of events oh between offers and team matching and stuff so i interviewed at one of the big tech companies and the offer came after the team matching like the formal offer okay now this i actually didn't i decided not to accept the offer so i never got it on in writing but i had a verbal call and it's interesting the verbal offer actually came about a week to 10 days after maybe even two weeks after all the team matching meetings i did like five or six team matching meetings where i met with various team managers to ask about their team and see if it's a good match and it was like yeah it was probably like four or five days after the last one where i

actually got the call i hadn't even chosen a team yet and they gave me like the verbal offer so probably this person doesn't even have an offer in hand yet okay i'm sure this differ or can differ from company to company but was the verbal offer for a specific team so we did the team matching and this is the team that no the offer i don't think the offer was team specific i think it was okay just it was just and then and then you'll join one of these teams probably yeah exactly like whichever one you i think after you basically the way it works is after you meet with each one they express an interest level and then you get to pick and if your interest aligns with their interests then you go and i think they might have even told me like these ones don't want you

or these ones do want you but but realistically the teams all the teams are basically super trusting in the hiring process at the like the global level and so if you got to the hiring process they want you and the reason they're meeting with you is because they have an opening yeah you know so it's not like they're going to be like well i know you passed the extremely rigorous and painful interview process but i didn't like the way your left eye twitched every time you said the word chrome yeah it is made a bit trickier by the fact that you have accepted the offer at the ai company because otherwise you could also just bring this up in a discussion with them and say i really want to work on these kind of problems i have this this other thing i believe

will turn into an offer and at that stage it's i think very wise to say i want to make the best decision for me like what help me how can how can this company be the best decision for me you're not you're not i don't think you're being evil or sneaky or unethical by doing that if you've accepted the offer already it's a little bit tougher to go back and say actually i need more money to keep my acceptance or i need to make sure i work on this team or something like that you still can yeah that one that one is trickier oh that one is painful the smaller the company the worse the reputational damage and the more painful it is and i've had people do this where i had a verbal agreement with someone and then i went to go prepare the offer go get it approved

you know which you know takes time and effort and then i prepared it got it all written up sent it out to them in writing and then they came back then they were like i want more and i was like you know the time to ask for more was when we were talking about it you know so that that's And the smaller the company, the more they'll remember. But having said that, walking away from an offer before you start is, in my opinion, no problem. If you find something else between the time you got the offer, even if you signed it, and then your start date, just take the better offer. I think people get super, I don't know what the right word is. They feel like they've signed something more than what they actually signed.

when you sign an offer letter, all you're saying is, I acknowledge the terms of employment at this company. And remember, in that very offer letter, it says to you, your employment is at will. We can fire you at any time for any reason or no reason. To be clear, this is either in space law or the United States. It's very possible you have a much different contract in other areas. Yes, I think you're right. You're definitely right about that. But so in the US, if you sign an offer letter, you have not really committed to anything. The company has made a commitment to you to pay you a certain amount. Um, and you have agreed to things once you start, like there'll be some kind of employment contract you typically have to sign, but between offer letter and start date,

you're under no obligation. And I've actually hired people to join me who were in already in that window with another company and it works out fine. Like it's just not, it's just not a big deal. Yeah. I don't know if I've hired people that way, but I, I've definitely, I remain pessimistic about them actually joining the company until their start date yeah for sure check in and try to avoid this happening to me being aware that it could yeah i do that a lot too it's like oh every whenever i sign an offer letter for someone and their start date is like more than a few weeks away i'm like oh boy this makes me nervous right because we're gonna we're gonna shut down the recruiting machine right and yeah that machine takes time to get going again

and so if they bail between that it does create pain for me but it's also like within it's perfectly within their right and in my opinion it's perfectly ethical too now having said that this question is is not really about that time window between offer letter and start date this question is after start is it ever okay to renege or quit shortly after starting and that's where things get a little more tricky reputationally and ethically i mean you agreed to join this company at a negotiated salary and and offer terms and for you to show up like a week later after starting and say, well, I want more money. I think the manager is going to think poorly of you because they're going to be like, look, your, your highest leverage time for negotiating was

before you started, because are you going to quit? You know? And I guess your answer is actually, yes, because I have this other offer. So I think you need to make a commitment and just ethically and like my own personal preferences are once I commit to a company, I, I lock in and make that successful. And it would take a really, really big unplanned event to change my mind on that. Well, have we answered the question? Oh, I think we did. But what did you say? Just tell me what to do.

You said go to the AI company. Oh, yeah, go to the AI company. And that's what I'm saying too, because this big tech company will be around for a long time. But opportunities like this to go work in AI, that's like a once in a generation probably. Yeah, it will be around. This specific team or this specific company

might not even be around, but there will be more big tech companies. They're always hiring. And some of the attraction, I think, is this perception that there's a there's a different bar which there definitely can be and you've at least proved to yourself you can exceed the bar you could probably do it again right you could yeah probably get another offer yeah good luck right best of luck let us know what you choose yeah if we end up using your product then make sure my prompts get extra

prioritization they get the expensive model at the cheap model price yeah yeah put in a good word with the robots for me okay dave all right you want to read our next question yeah let's do it this comes from an anonymous listener who says i've changed from a java developer role to oic integration on oracle cloud i'm not sure if that was a good move as it doesn't feel like i'm doing much coding but lots of clicking i was thinking that having cloud experience would benefit me now but now i'm not sure i'm not sure if i should run back to a java developer job or give it a chance and how much time would be a fair chance great question click ops is what you've pivoted to you've heard of devops yeah but have you heard of click ops i'm trying not to sound

snooty oh i don't think i've ever worked with a person employed to click buttons in cloud uis like this maybe i have and i just don't know it maybe jobs can be changed into this type of thing but i guess i i don't understand why that role needs to exist if it was like a a i don't know professional services role i could see you doing this work as part of professional like on behalf of an external yeah or sales engineering or yeah i don't know dx or something like i could see this being part of the role but just you get work requirements passed to you where the way you fulfill those work requirements is by clicking around in oracle cloud ui feels both like it wouldn't be very satisfying and it maybe wouldn't teach you that much about general cloud things

and here it comes if anything could ever be robotized that sure could every everyone's building clis or mcp servers or just prompts where you could literally do computer use that feels very risky and handing your your agent a a working ui to configure cloud resources but guaranteed somebody's doing it so but you're saying that maybe this job will exist to just check on that robot maybe or undo the deletion fix all the damage yeah oops we accidentally your database uh oh i'm very you're absolutely right i i should not have clicked the button the shameful confession that you did if you tell a robot and i'm really sorry do that yeah you're right i absolutely should not have done that i've seen a few of those example

prompts from people yeah explain why you did that it was just a mistake yes where i wake up every morning and i'm like am i in an episode of the twilight zone is this really what computers are now yeah they can be if you are naive enough in your trust yep i was thinking that having cloud experience would benefit me yeah it would but to what end to the end of clicking yeah i don't know this sounds like a bait and switch where the you took a perfectly happy java developer who's just cruising along writing all the java code having a great time probably even using some ai to write the java code and the java developer's like hmm i'm sick of writing all these desktop swing applications yeah it's time for me to time for me to get into the

cloud and so you get a job and it's a little bit of a bait and switch like yes come to our cloud environment and it's like we we work with the cloud yeah yeah and and i've actually worked on teams it's been 10 years but i've worked on teams where there were developers who wrote the code and then there were operations people who took that code in like built form and found ways to deploy it securely and scalably in the cloud environment. And those were two separate jobs. And it was kind of like a pass it over the fence kind of thing. And that might be what's happening here. It's like, oh, my job is when the developer teams need a new whatever stack or, you know, a new compute or new data store or new whatever, I click the buttons, make it happen, and I send

them credentials, you know, and that could be exactly what's happening here. But for a long time, the trend has been moving away from that model where there is no line. And that's actually what devops is supposed to be it's supposed to be where your developers do the ops not i'm a devops person or you know that was like the whole point was that the developers do the ops not that you have a devops person yeah so i suspect that this person got trapped into that kind of a scenario yeah do you think they work at oracle or they work at a company that builds on oracle cloud probably probably the second one right maybe it's some kind of service provider or something I mean, I could very easily see this just being someone building applications at some random company.

They're running on Oracle Cloud, and this person's job is to set up the Oracle Cloud stuff. Yeah. And there is room for this to a certain extent because many developers do not have the expertise on things like network configuration and routing and DNS and some of the more, I'll just say, hardcore infrastructure stuff. Yeah. Like they understand like sockets and HTTP and things like that, but they don't necessarily know about like network peering and tunnels and private links and all that stuff and route tables and ASNs and all. Anyway, and so that could be where this is going is more of like a network administrator role. But either way, I think that you would probably be happier to go back to the Java development role because if all you're doing is clicking and clicking, I don't think this is a job for you. There are nuances to all the different cloud providers.

They all have different products. They all are trying to convince you why you should use them instead of the other thing. There's certainly some common functionality between them. So I think there's utility in knowing your specific cloud provider in detail. I think even if all of the docs are in the weights of all the models and there's, I don't especially if you're creating and destroying resources, I feel like that's going to be an important area for humans in the loop for quite a while.

But if you're doing all that by hand... You mean like six to 12 months? Maybe. I don't know. Yeah, every pronouncement comes with a huge grain of salt. But if you're doing it all by hand, I think there's an opportunity, even if you are staying in the same role, to automate that.

and that's the way you can demonstrate value. I think what you don't want to do is just keep doing it until someone squints at you and says, I bet we could prompt our way out of your headcount. Yeah. If you are instead doing it all in terraform, and so there's this framework that you can use that frees you up to do other stuff with your time.

Can you take it a level of abstraction higher so that your manual labor is not as required or important in the day-to-day execution of these tasks. Yeah, I mean, there's a real value add there to be had. Yeah, and there's always, I think, a fear that, well, if I do that, what is my job? Then maybe I don't have another job. And there's a long history.

Yeah, you got to ignore that fear. Yeah, well before AI of people automating themselves out of their current job, and they immediately find other important things to do. Yes. Especially because you've demonstrated you are a capable person who can do important, useful things

that are high leverage like automate a job that used to take a whole person great it turns out we don't need that specific job done anymore but there are a ton of jobs that could be done by someone capable enough to automate a whole chunk of of work that used to be one person's job so you're saying you can be not only responsible for eliminating your own headcount but that of all your peers as well no i i think that's that's the thing i'm arguing against that's unlikely to happen It's more like there's a ton of stuff that your company would like to do that they haven't because they don't have capacity. And now you can say, well, I've got some. I could do that thing.

That thing you thought we couldn't do. It's true. And the same creative mind that is capable of turning a manual job into a fully automated job by identifying the problem and then solving it is not maybe by its very nature, but definitely by the skill acquired is the kind of person that will identify other really cool, really valuable things that can be done. And there seems to be an infinite amount of demand for that kind of work. Yeah, at least for the next six to 12 months. Right. Yeah, so I think I agree with the broad point

that just staying in this job and doing it as it exists is not a good move for your experience and growth and just career. And I think it would be better to go back to writing code as a job than that. But there are some opportunities to stay in this same role and turn it into a better role. Agreed, for six to 12 months.

Yes, for six to 12 months. And then you get to do something even higher leverage, maybe. Or maybe the bottom has fallen out by then. You get to clean up the mess somehow. I don't know. Or maybe tomorrow you show up and AIs have deleted all the resources and it's your job to fix them all. That's the next six to 12 months for you. Yep. Well, have we answered the question? I think we have. Good luck. Good luck. Let us know how it goes.

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