Some More News - Even More News: MAGA Influencers Struggle To Follow Marching Orders Amid Trump/Epstein Scandal

Episode Date: July 18, 2025

Hi. Comedian Josh Gondelman joins Katy, Cody, and Jonathan to talk about the latest in the Trump/Epstein debacle, how MAGA grifters like Benny Johnson are scrambling to decide what they believe, the latest inflation numbers, the GOP defunding NPR & PBS, and Grok's new creepy "companions."(And, as is typical, we finished recording right before The Wall Street Journal published that Trump-Epstein birthday card! We'll talk about that soon, but until then, may every day be another wonderful secret.)Watch Josh's special here: https://youtu.be/RAvNlgpdKKoPATREON: https://patreon.com/somemorenewsMERCH: https://shop.somemorenews.comYOUTUBE MEMBERSHIP: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCvlj0IzjSnNoduQF0l3VGng/join#DonaldTrump #Epstein #evenmorenews Pluto TV. Stream Now. Pay Never.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Agent Nate Russo returns in Oracle III, Murder at the Grandview, the latest installment of the gripping Audible original series. When a reunion at an abandoned island hotel turns deadly, Russo must untangle accident from murder. But beware, something sinister lurks in the Grandview shadows. Joshua Jackson delivers a bone-chilling performance in the supernatural thriller that will keep you on the edge of your seat. Don't let your fears take hold of you as you dive into this addictive series.

Love thrillers with a paranormal twist? The entire Oracle trilogy is available on Audible. Listen now on Audible. Why hello and welcome back to Even More News, the first and only news podcast. Wow. My name's Katie Stoll. Why hello? Because it's polite. Hi, I'm Cody.

Welcome to the show. Thank you. Indeed. You'm Cody. Welcome to the show. Thank you, Cody. Indeed! You're welcome. Oh boy, I'm so excited to introduce our guest, a return customer, and the nicest person in comedy.

I have to say, the official nicest person in comedy, who has a new special called Positive Reinforcement out now on YouTube, it's Josh Gondelman. Ah, hello, thank you. Such a pleasure to be a remote, or excuse me, a repeat customer here at the Even More News store. Mm-hmm.

It's the only place you can go for news. I've heard that, and I would never, I would even try to go anywhere else. If someone tried to give me news from somewhere else, I would drink poison. Oh, that's cool. And then spit it at that person. Perfect, okay.

This isn't even supposed to self-harm, no. It's a step too far, but you dialed it back in. That's the perfect. Jonathan is also here. Hi, I am. We do have a couple of holidays to celebrate today. We always do. No, from Jonathan, very few holidays for July 18th. So if you do, if you're in the market for a holiday that you want to create, this

might be some good valuable real estate. But it is National Sour Candy Day. I personally love sour candy. Is there a favorite sour candy that you like? Sour Patch Kids? Not too sour. Sour Skittles? You like sour Skittles? No, too sour. Okay, I am going to dial this back. You are really, yeah, you turned, you did a 180 on this very quickly. I just remembered what it felt like to have a sour skittle in my mouth, and it's too much. I, with Sour Patch Kids, I need like four,

because otherwise I'll just go too far, and then your mouth feels like a gravel driveway for like a week. Sure, it'll cut up your tongue. Yeah, it feels like you were licking an unfinished floor. Yeah. Too sour. Is it just all the Yeah. Too sour. Is it just all the sugar?

Too sour. The sour and sugar, yeah. Sometimes I get that when I eat a lot of potato chips too. The saltiness does it, yeah. It's the saltiness. Okay. So like kind of like whenever you eat like terrible food, like junk food, like food that's bad for you.

My body rejects it, yep. Yeah. Your body's like, well, this is too much. Yeah, my body loves the slop. Give me the slop Bring me the poison as the president says Or as I can spit it out Feel like President Donald Trump's spitting poison in someone's face, like the dinosaurs that killed Newman

in Jurassic Park, spoiler alert, is not off the table for this term. Yeah, I can see that. I need to see that, actually. Josh, you have a new special out, and it is fantastic. Thank you. We loved it. It's very relevant to our time.

You managed to talk through and about this chaos, but in such a delightful and sweet way, it's not a depressing experience, it's a wonderful experience. Thank you. I mean, the special is called Positive Reinforcement. Yeah, it's right there in the name. And you deliver on that promise.

It's really, really delightful. I really appreciate it. That's so kind of you to say and so kind of you to have watched it. I like, and I'm so delighted slash dismayed at how much the stuff that feels topical holds up because I recorded it a year ago. And then I was, yeah,

I recorded a year ago at the Bell House in Brooklyn. And like truly there are like the only thing that feels wrong, cause there's stuff about, there's like, it's like a very friendly, gentle, warm hour. It's like, I would say it's like strongly PG-13, but like meant for adults. You know, it's not like, hey, we're going to talk about a Labooboo or whatever.

And it's just for kids and people with expensive purses. But it's like for any kind of adult. And like you can watch with your kids. If you have cool kids, you watch with your parents. If you have cool parents is what I've been saying. But like there's like a little stuff about like anti-Semitism and how people talk about in relation to Israel. There's a little stuff about like the rising cost of housing, etc.

and it all has gotten worse. And the only thing that is different is that I briefly refer to Joe Biden as being the president for one instant and everything else is just like, oh, it's steadily getting worse. And also a worse guy is president. Right. I mean, to be fair, maybe Biden still thinks he's the president. We don't know. Is he?

He might. I mean, the entire right-wing media apparatus often acts like Joe Biden isn't, has always been the president. Exactly. Because everything is his fault. That auto pen scandal is just tearing up the presses right now.

Because there's nothing else in the news about presidents right now. Yeah, nothing else we could possibly talk about. Anyway, it's a great special interview. Thank you so much. And it's interesting you said the thing about kids because last night I was like, you know what? I mean, I don't have kids, but if I did.

But I had that thought. I was like, this is something that you really could watch with the whole family. There are moments that are slightly easier, but it's not like not safe for work in any capacity. But you really manage, there's this idea that comedy has to be mean, that it doesn't have to, but that's what's that edgy.

And this dispels that for me. I mean, it already wasn't a thing I thought, but you're a perfect example of how to gracefully bring kindness into comedy. And that's possible. Yeah, the mission. Yeah, the mission doesn't have to be to offend people. Yeah, I like really want people to feel welcome, and I think I especially want to be mindful of of making comedy

that people who might not feel comfortable at all comedy venues feel comfortable and enjoy watching, like that. It's like truly like I think people kind of like people have stopped saying the idea of like a safe, that it's like, truly, like, I think people kind of, like, people have stopped saying the idea of, like, a safe space because it's, like, something that people have started looking down their nose at in, like, a really cynical, gross way. But I do think that I, like, want it to feel like, oh, like, hey, we're all here together,

we're gonna have fun. And I think that that's, like, a part of it. And I wanted, I tried to do that without just being like, why are tennis balls so yellow? Or, like, whatever, you know what I mean? Like, I really try to like talk about the world in a way that is like warm and but also like real and sincere and like gets into stuff. You Yeah, you definitely accomplish it. Yeah, I am curious why you might suggest tennis balls are so yellow. Hey, maybe next time. I think it's gonna be for night tennis. Maybe next time. I think it's gotta be for night tennis. You know what?

You can't have a ball the color of dusk. I mean, straight up, that's probably part of the reason. Honestly. Easier to find them when you hit it. That's right. You get them into some tall grass or something. Yeah, no doubt. Yeah.

Well, you really blew up. I'm like scrapping my next hour, because it's mostly about tennis ball colors. I got a tight 70 about tennis balls now. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Before we start talking about the news, I wanted to bring this up. You live in New York City.

Congratulations on this election. Oh, thank you. And on Zoran Mondani, very exciting. I think we've all been a little jealous watching that from afar. I think it was probably, it seemed like a very positive experience for everybody there. Have you met him by any chance? I have, yeah, yeah, yeah.

You have? Yeah, I've met him a couple times. He was like really present and involved during a lot of like the labor the labor collective action in 2023. So I was at a WGA picket line that was in solidarity with flight attendants who had just, I believe, voted to authorize the strike should their contract negotiations have come to an impasse. And he was there in solidarity with the flight attendants.

And I just, he, it's, I think he seems like a really like thoughtful, genuine guy from all the experience I've had with him personally and like in, you know, just absorbing the campaign stuff and the media he's done. And he it just is. It's my my wife on election night has started doing a thing she calls defensive sleeping where she has one little drink and then goes to bed at nine o'clock before results really start rolling in. And I was up, like, I don't know, watching basketball or something,

and flipped over to the election results, and I saw that the gap was, like, staying steady at eight points, or, you know, between seven and eight points, and then watched Cuomo kind of unexpectedly concede, and everyone was, like like pretty shocked by that. And then, uh, yeah, so, uh, you know, watch kind of what was coming in. And when I stayed up, I was like, Oh, what is this feeling like to watch election

coverage and be like, Oh, I feel like things might get better instead of worse. And I went, sorry, I went to bed late and I, my wife kind of stirred in bed bed and I was like, I don't know how to say this, but it's good news. Yeah. Yeah. It's like, you know, that was possible. Yeah. And it's, you know, I think like, like it was a really, his campaign was really well

run. It really energized people. He is a really great candidate who wants to do things to help people and doesn't equivocate when speaking about issues like with moral clarity. He doesn't muddy the moral clarity he feels about many issues with like political equivocating. And I think that that is a really appealing quality. And he uses it for good when I think so many people use that for evil, like a quality of like a clarity and straightforwardness of messaging, which is like really easy when you're a piece of shit, because you only have to mitigate it by like,

you know, how, how evil you will be. But like, you know, people at Trump rallies in 2024 talking about like being psyched for mass deportations is like an example of the evil photo negative of, oh yeah, like you can have principles that are just bad. And then there's that whole middle ground of people who are like triangulating to guess what people want from them.

And then it's just like very refreshing anytime. And it's not like Zoran is the only person in America that's doing it, but like it was such a high profile race and person in America that's doing it, but like, it was such a high profile race and it was just so nice to see him be like, you know, I'm here because I want to make the people of New York's lives better and I want to make it a place that people can afford to live and thrive. And those are like my goals to make it like fair and safe for people rather than like, you know, Andrew Cuomo saying things

like, you know, Trump's gonna send in ice and it's gonna be bad, but like, I don't know what we can do about it. And it's like, I don't know, fucking something. That would be your job. First you'd have to move to New York City. It's very, very, very refreshing. Yeah, that would be a good starting point.

It's refreshing and a much needed piece of hope. One that these people exist with the will to go into politics, which is a soul sucking terrible endeavor. And that the message was so resonant with people that it beat an establishment Democrat with the backing of the establishment Democrats who's now going to come back in and run independent, but still. I mean, the most amazing thing about this race, like for people that aren't, maybe weren't following closely, definitely people outside New York City, is that Cuomo was considered the front runner well before he entered the race because of the rumblings that he would run from Air New Year's.

He doesn't live in New York City, like got a residence, it seems like, so that he would be eligible to run essentially. And once he declared it was like a steady downturn in the polls. And I think another really beautiful thing, and I'm sorry to keep harping on this. It's so New York centric, but the way that rank choice voting was implemented, the way that progressive candidates took advantage of the rank choice voting I thought was really politically smart in a way that is cool to see politicians use the system that exists to get the best possible results. And it was on an emotional level, very heartening to see people like working together

and specifically it meant a lot to me to see like the Muslim Jewish solidarity between, you know, candidate Mamdani and Comptroller Brad Lander. I thought that was like a really beautiful thing to model for people. Yeah, 100%. Yeah, one party, one goal. Yeah.

With that, we're gonna pivot to less beautiful news. So President Innocent had a message yesterday for his MAGA supporters who can't let the Epstein thing go. This is like a several hundred word post. I'm just gonna read one. Is daddy mad at them? Oh, daddy's furious. Trump says that Democrats, unlike Republicans, stick together like glue.

Quote, their new scam is what we will forever call the Jeffrey Epstein hoax. And my past supporters have bought into this quote, bullshit, hook, line, and sinker. So now anyone who is harping on Epstein stuff is a past supporter of his, and it's a hoax. Something's a hoax. We're not quite sure what. Something's a hoax.

We'll figure out what's a hoax. We'll dig into that's a hoax. What's a hoax? We'll dig into that We'll see well and and press secretary Carolyn leave it today was asked What what what is he referring to as a hoax is it that the files? Themselves are a hoax because they were you know written by Obama or whatever he says and she responded She's a great person to ask you we call her clarity leave it. So yeah, you would Leave it at the door She responded the president is referring to the fact that Democrats have now seized on this as if they ever wanted

Transparency when it comes to Jeffrey Epstein, which is an asinine suggestion for any Democrat to make So the hoax is that the Democrats care about it now. That's interesting. An interesting theory. I'm going to be honest. I feel like I have less clarity from that. Well, it's a complicated nickname, for sure. But yeah, the nickname itself doesn't

have a lot of clarity to it. Yeah, yeah. A little muddy there. It's so wild to see what happened, right? Because the administration was staffed with people who rose to additional prominence from wherever they were before, being like, these Epstein files are going to be explosive, and they're going to put all the people you hate in jail,

and the people you love will be vindicated. And for one, it is an absolute no offense to present company, an absolute proof of why you don't put podcasters in charge of the government. And number two. Fair enough. We're not asking for that. Number two, it's like the dog caught the car,

and the car was full of pedophiles, and the dog was also a pedophile. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I think that's perfectly phrased. It's very interesting. I find the camps are finally starting to form. We've seen there was that initial like, oh my god,

why is he acting like this? This is so weird. But now we have what I believe, cat turd recently. Ah yes, cat turd. As good as Cat Turd, so goes the electorate. Exactly, hopefully not. You can cry in my replies all you want, I'm never abandoning Trump ever. What if he's a pedophile Cat Turd?

Like I know. He's a really good son. But what if, okay. He's got his dad's back. That Scott Pressler guy who either stole or helped Trump win the election. I stand with President Trump. He will be remembered for executing the largest deportation of criminal illegal aliens in American history. And so they're doing that.

I do think that's a concern because there are people who don't even care about this as long as Trump does the bad things that he said he was going to do. And some people seem to be abandoning him about this, but not the other stuff. So they're just gonna search for another guy. They're gonna look for like, well, who's like less of a con man? Who's more of a fascist?

Who isn't in the Epstein files, definitely based on the way they are dealing with this situation right now. But I get, I don't know, I just see, and Katie, I know you've had some experiences with folks up in the, you mean the desert, the river? The mountains, sorry. The mountains, you mean.

People commonly confuse the two. Okay, okay. Folks there where it seems a lot of it, and you can see so many people like, oh, we're the party of common sense, so we have to have faith in Donald Trump. Those statements don't work together, I'm sorry. They are very contradictory statements.

And this sort of, it seems a lot of people seem less upset that Trump almost definitely did something horrible and more concerned with supporting someone who did something horrible, with being seen as a supporter of them. And now that he's literally attacking them, we've never seen Trump attack his supporters, especially in this way, but I don't think ever.

He's saying, you're not one of my supporters if you care about this. You're done, you're stupid. You've been fooled by the Democrats, definitely. And so much of the pushback seems to be like, wait, he's insulting us now. He's supposed to insult our enemies and the people we hate. He's not supposed to turn that back around on us.

And so they're kind of getting like a sense of who he is finally. Because he's not on his side. Yeah, the dynamic is, we'll see how it develops. But. Yeah, you're right. It's more like, there can't how it develops, but. You know, yeah, you're right. It's more like, there can't be credible proof of this,

even though this is something we've all known for fucking years. Exactly. The man, the best way that you could, I've heard it phrased as that, yeah, sure, he's a womanizer, which is just so downplaying what he actually is, which is a predator, and always has been, and it's never been a secret,

but you didn't care about it then. But now you're embarrassed. And not only, oh, he's probably in whatever documentation. It seems like there's credible suspicion that he's in whatever sealed documentation exists in the within the Justice Department. But it's also like you don't need the Epstein files. You can you can go on the Epstein Google search and go by the like Epstein photographs that are publicly available and the Epstein flight logs that have been released. And it's like the the idea it felt like there was this

idea that finally, it felt like the QAnon felt like finally, a pedophile ring that's only our enemies is what the Republicans thought. And it's like, you don't think that the party of child abuse is gonna be implicated in this, you clowns? I don't know if that's what they thought. I don't know if that's what they thought. I think this case was happening a long time ago

and there was a plea deal and a lot of people breathed a huge fucking sigh of relief because then their names didn't get trotted through the public and then Epstein's in jail and he dies on Trump's watch. I mean, what evidence. Plead heels on your Bush's watch, right, in the plea deal, but then, oh, that guy got, Acosta got a position

with Trump's administration. It's all fishy, it always has been, but now, what new evidence? I personally am like, yeah, there's clear evidence that Trump had him killed or something. Right, right, right, you're saying, like, what is worse than what we already know. Right.

That's out there. That he's jumping through hoops that he can't, I mean, and we can talk about this because what is the new information? I mean, we knew this as soon as it was released that the video was edited. Sorry, real quick, I just have one thing to add. So like that plea deal,

well that plea deal happened under Bush. Epstein, the other stuff, and then when he killed himself, we'll talk about the tape, was under Trump. So it's all happening under that. Also, under Bush was a speaker of the House who was a Republican and a pedophile named Dennis Hastert. Historically, it's just like this idea of like, only our enemies, surely only our enemies.

But the whole narrative has been Trump is an outsider, a billionaire outsider, who is gonna like take on the elites. And in their mind, the elites are only Democrats and it's so odd, because if you talk to at least like a lot of leftists, they're like, yeah, fucking put Clinton in jail. I don't care. Go for it. It's all of them. Like, but to this crowd, it's only their enemies and the Republican

Party and Trump specifically is just like spotlessly clean. And it it feels additionally right, like the idea in Republican media, like right-leaning media, and maybe not every person who votes Republican, but the idea is we care about bad things happening to children when we can use it as a cudgel against our enemies. When our enemies do bad things to children,

we want to hurt those enemies. And when our allies do bad things to children, we want to let them hurt those children. Let them hurt those children. And when our allies do bad things to children, we want to let them to hurt those children, let them hurt those children. Protect them at all costs. Yeah. Hanging a sign that says everyone is welcome here

is clearly more harmful than whatever Matt Gaetz did. We'll nominate him for AG. Exactly. Because then people would get the idea that everyone's welcome, Jonathan. The idea of like talk about, oh, what actually happened must be worse than what we know, is like, that's how I feel about Matt Gaetz too,

that even the Republicans, like, turn their knives on him, we're like, we gotta get this guy out of here, because he's making the rest of us look bad. It's like, yikes. Yeah, for sure. I think, like, Trump legitimately, I, Katie, on Monday, I said something, like, I forgot and didn't realize how important

this Epstein stuff was to MAGA, like it's been a few years since it's been prominent. And now I think looking at Trump's reaction that Trump did not realize it either. Like, he is just like, I'll just tell him to shut up about this stuff. He doesn't realize that this is part of the whole narrative of the last decade. And the Democrats being evil is part of it. And he's fumbling around. And it's worked for him so far. And for like 10 years, he's been able to somehow

have his entire movement of supporters not acknowledge that he's a serial abuser of women and has a long documented history of saying weird fucked up things about young girls and all of these quotes, including his daughter, and all these quotes about Jeff Epstein and alluding to the fact that he likes young girls. I'm pretty sure that quote that he said

where he's like, some people say he likes them young or whatever the quote is, at that time, I believe he was he said where he's like, some people say he likes them young or whatever, whatever the quote is. At that time, I believe he was like 50 and he had like a 20 year old girlfriend. So what's young girls to that guy? It's just like this long history of just this knowledge and he was able to do it until now.

And or not, maybe he'll get a chance. And still might be able to. I until now and or not. Maybe it still might be. I don't know. Because like in push came to shove right there was only so far that this whole administration and like its attendant media apparatus could go saying like we've got these bombshell secrets and it's going to obliterate the opposition before now they go actually nothing to see here and they're like and and so many people were promised this kind of like vindication and retribution and like I it's it's tricky to talk about because obviously when children get harmed it's such a fucking

horrible thing and the people that do it are such like despicable. It's such a despicable act committed by people that do this. But so I understand the frothing of like, God, yeah, if only we could punish all these people that have harmed all these children. But then as soon as Trump gets to this point where he goes, oh, we can't reveal these, there's nothing to see here. Because like for obvious reasons, because the names of his allies are all over it

Because that's public information already public information an entire page of just Donald Trump phone numbers in that guy's address book Well, and he you know ran on ten years ago Lock her up lock them up and like so a lot of these supporters are like, it's strange, it's just another, in a long list of broken promises from politicians. You were gonna lock up the enemies, you haven't done it. Instead you're going after James Comey's daughter, who also happened to be the prosecutor of Elaine Maxwell and the Jeffrey Epstein case, that's weird.

He probably just did it because he doesn't like James Comey, but it doesn't help that she was also prosecuting Epstein case, that's weird. He probably just did it because he doesn't like James Comey, but it doesn't help that she was also prosecuting Epstein's stuff. It's not a good strategic move to fire her right now in the midst of all of this. It's extremely sus, as they say. They do.

We should talk about this tape, probably. We should talk about this tape, which I did set up very nicely earlier, but I like everything that's been said earlier. Yeah. Okay, but for the record. But for the record, I transitioned like a champ. That great transition makes up for this one.

It was really beautiful. Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Anyway, Wired reports that newly uncovered metadata shows that about three minutes were cut from what the DOJ and FBI refer to as the full raw Surveillance video of Epstein's cell the night before he was found dead. This is Corridor it's just because they were using samples. They couldn't clear Interpolation of Blackbird by the Beatles on there. Yeah.

Yeah, it did not work. Yeah, we can't get the rights to that. We tried to change the key and they still recognized us. Yeah, yeah, yeah, they got busted. The footage is like, Epstein isn't in the footage. I didn't realize that before this. It's like a corridor right outside his cell. So the idea is like there's like a four and a half hour

video and a six hour video goes from like You know 9 p.m. To 6 a.m. Something like that and so the idea is there's a three-minute window where someone could have gone in Killed him I'm not sure exactly how that works, and then we don't see inside the cell so we don't know that he's dead And then they they leave and then the Justice Department cut it out It's edited, but also we have no idea if this is even the man's cell. Like there's nothing. It doesn't seem to match up with other with previous pictures

that have been shared when it happened of the cell. It seems like a different door. But what does this fucking thing show me? I'm swearing a lot today. It's just one of those things that doesn't help their case. It makes it seem like they're all untrustworthy and they are in this position that they're now stuck in because they supported this serial liar

and now it's them. The elites, the government, they're all in charge and they're all lying to you. Oh, we're the elites and they're the government and now we have to lie to everybody. Is the situation they're in now. Cody, do you want to play one of these Benny Johnson clips? Yeah, I've got a few things to say about the sort of narrative that is forming.

And we have talked about Benny Johnson somewhat recently and I apologize, we're going to again, but he is kind of the state's go-to propagandist now. He spent a good amount of time plagiarizing at Buzzfeed, got fired, sort of found his niche, and now here he is doing his talking points all the time. It's very clear. I think watching him is helpful as like a bit of a weathervane

to see where the narrative is leading. But first, this is him on July 12th, when I believe this is Trump's first odd statement where it was very like, oh. This is him reacting to, yeah, the boys and in some cases, gals. Yeah, the boys and in some cases, gals. The boys and gals, ugh.

Yeah, the buoys and in some cases, gals. Yeah, the boys and in some cases, gals. Yeah, the buoys and in some cases, gulls. This is fascinating to me because this is the first statement where it's like, oh, Trump's acting like a rat in a corner. Like, this is a very weird statement. And this is a clip of Benny Johnson, the only time I have ever seen him look like a human being having a real thought in his brain in real time. And fittingly, it's a 25 second clip.

By admitting that the Epstein files are real and have been written and that you've read them and you don't like their contents and they were written by your enemies. Doesn't make it doesn't make the most compelling case. As far as I'm concerned. I'm holy moly. He like had a real he's struggling. He had a real thought going on. a real he's struggling he had a real thought going on. He made his Trump made Benny Johnson's job harder because he didn't even give him a coherent lie to swallow. Right? Exactly. Like it's confusing. The lie was like whatever

like this was what what Bondi said right that Panbody said was like hey there just isn't like meaningful documentation that the thing that people are saying exists, just like isn't there's no like client list that's that's just is stuff we can publish and go like, oh, here's the bad guys, we can get them. And Trump went, there is a list and it was made by my enemies. So you can't believe what it says. And it's like, that's such a worse lie. So much worse. Yeah, he had didn't give him a good lie. He still hasn't given him a worse lie. So much worse. Yeah, he didn't give him a good lie. He still hasn't given him a good lie, by the way. But is that still Benny Johnson's attitude, Cody?

Well, unfortunately, no. That 25 seconds is the only little bit we get. Because so a couple days later, Benny Johnson was allowed in the Capitol building to spend all day live streaming interviews with Congress members. Kind of like a one man January 6 cosplay. A little bit, exactly. Just storming the Capitol, getting in there and politely asking questions. And wouldn't you know it, about three days after this, I'm gonna read a tweet from Benny.

And this is, again, this is, I think, why, it's not important to watch what he says specifically, but it's interesting, it does sort of lead you to where we are now. Because aside from that clip, he's just been like, look at Trump's speech, oh my God, look at this guy, oh, he's my hero, he's just gushing and gushing over him all the time. This tweet, incredible movement on Epstein files today.

The Speaker of the House called for full release of files, an explanation from DOJ. Dozens of members of Congress calling for Glane Maxwell to testify. Maxwell family calling for all evidence to be released. Trump saying twice that the DOJ should release the credible files. Growing calls for special counsel.

I'm pretty sure they say like Matt Gaetz should do it. Bipartisan support for release, massive cultural exposure of satanic predators and elites. Which ones, Benny? I think the sentence that I pulled out from that instantly was Trump saying twice that the DOJ should release the, quote, credible files. And this is what Benny has been waiting for.

When the initial statement came out from Trump is like, wait, he's insulting us. He's saying like, there's nothing there. Like, but there is, but there's not. What is this? But now the people around Trump who seem to care more about finding a narrative for this, every time Trump's asked about this, he's like,

I don't know, why do you care about this? Stop asking me. But the people around him are like, well, we should release the credit. They're trying to figure out how to maneuver this for him. He's too cooked to know how to get out of this on his own. This is truly watching Bugs Bunny be like, I can't put on that dress again.

I'm not gonna fool this guy into thinking I'm a sexy lady. I'm just just like, why do you even want to hunt me? And like this, it's he's just past his prime as like a liar. And so he's and he's lying about a thing that people care about and lying in a way that insults their intelligence to their faces. And it's it's like not's so... He's still so effective at telling people the lies they want to hear when he is aligned with them,

but when he is adversarial, he's not good at, like, making excuses. All he can say is, no. And that's not good enough when you've spent, like, a decade frothing people up about, like, John Podesta eating babies allegedly. And like all that shit. And now they're like, now he's like,

actually there's nothing, it was written by my enemies. Like, well then what the fuck were you talking about for 10 years? This whole time. You're right, yes. And it's fascinating because this is the first real test of that, of how far people will go and if they'll come back. And now the Benny Johnson of it all,

so apparently he's calling these influencers, these podcasters, Charlie Kirk's, and having personal conversations with them about it, and now they come out and they trot about this, they've just suddenly flipped, as we've established, their whole thinking and have this narrative with the hope, I guess, that this seeps in to the collective consciousness,

that the people who desperately want an answer, something for them to slap up and believe. I don't know if it'll work. It's worked on them, but is it breaking through to everybody? I don't know. I've seen some Twitter posts to suggest that perhaps it has, but that's Twitter,, I don't know. I've seen some Twitter posts to suggest that perhaps it has, but that's Twitter, and I do not think that it is a real accurate bellwether

of what people are feeling out and about in the real world. Yeah, not necessarily. Not necessarily. That's the thing about this, because the camps are sort of still being formed, and the narrative is still, they're still trying to figure out what to say about this And so it is unclear I even saw one of the Twitter files guys Michael Schlesinger or something had this thread about like you

Everybody said that Mago is a cult for ten years But here people are like abandoning it because of this like well they're abandoning it because like again like they're embarrassed and be feeling attacked But also leaving a cult doesn't mean it wasn't a cult. That's a, people can leave cult, it's okay. That doesn't change the definition or what a cult is. Everyone said this was a restaurant, but people paid their bills and left.

How dare you, exactly, like ah, I gotcha. Since Benny had this little tweet saying that, yeah, Trump's called twice, that they should release the credible files, which at that point he actually didn't, so that's interesting. But, so since then, we have, I believe the next day, Mike Johnson, Speaker of the House,

being asked about, basically about how Trump's calling everybody stupid. And Mike Johnson said, we're for transparency. I'm saying the same thing the president is that you need to have all of the credible information released. Megyn Kelly had been Shapiro on. And also look, this may be complete bullshit, but I've heard it from a few different people. So I just big asterix on it.

But some have speculated that the Biden DOJ may have left the Epstein files in such a manner that it like leads directly with an arrow toward Donald Trump, just as a middle finger toward Trump. Not that he did anything whatsoever, just that they're bastards. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. They left the Epstein files with an arrow that points to Trump for Trump Fuck off. I'm sorry and then Trump or this was yesterday on the phone on real America's voice Channel, I guess was it just the news with John Solomon. Yeah? Yeah, it's called. Yeah. Just the news. Just the news. Yes. Thank you.

And saying like, there's no other news show. Jeff Epstein hoax is all about the Democrats. I'm getting my point in right now, Katie. I'm switching around. Are you getting ready? They ought to look into the Jeffrey Epstein hoax, too, because that's another hoax that's frankly put out by the pushing, pushing the Republicans and put out by the Democrats. Well, I think it's in the case of Epstein, they've already

looked at it and they are looking at it. And I think all they have to do is put out anything credible. But you know, that was run by the Biden administration for four years. I can imagine what they put into files. So now what they've been told to say is that the Biden administration put a bunch of lies in these files about how Donald Trump was apparently

friends with Epstein for decades. And it's just, you can see it. You can see it emerging. You can see the direct line of like, okay, you say the credible files. Oh, the credible files. Oh, that's interesting. They're saying credible now. Oh, this person is saying the credible files, okay, you say the credible files. Oh, the credible files. Oh, that's interesting. They're saying credible now. Oh, this person is saying the credible files.

Now the president released the credible files. So now people are being primed for this. And I have heard some stories of people in real life who have demonstrated that they are now on board theorizing that, well, I think Biden put some stuff in there and like if they're credible stuff, sure, they're being primed to think that all of this is bullshit. If they did put it in there, why wouldn't they have used it?

I'll go that far. That's their whole argument. Like, well, if Donald Trump was in there, why wouldn't they have used it by now? Just apply that logic to this whole argument that they put it in there. For Donald Trump's administration, that's so dumb. An Easter egg for Cash Patel to find and go like,

you guys, you're messing with me. Also again, this happened in 2019 when he was the president. If he wasn't in there and only Democrats were, why didn't he release them? It's all absurd. Just that they had so specifically hyped up these files that they exist and were full of damaging evidence against the Democrats and that in some cases they'd seen things or knew what was in there.

Right. And this has been going on for years and for them now to go like, Oh, uh, we just looked and it's a bunch of dog shit. It's like such a bananas pivot for these people to say, and like for these people to do. And it's like, it, again, people were hurt and that is such a horror, but it is so. Like the part of it that is funny to me is watching like Dan Bongino realize like oh Being the deputy director of a crooked FBI is so much harder than just like selling pills that make your balls firmer on a podcast

I know real bad career move bro like and we can't even get the firm ball sponsor I they want nothing to do with us. They're like these softball freaks will never This is a bit did you say did you see the Charlie Kirk clip when he was like I'm done talking about Epstein for the time Being I'm gonna trust my I trust my friends the government administration He says I'm gonna trust my friends in the government to do what needs to be done and solve it balls in their hands The classic phrase balls in their hands. That's really good Charlie honestly, I'm done talking about Epstein for the time being I'm gonna trust my friends the administration I'm gonna trust my friends in the government to do what needs to be done solve it balls in their hands

I've said plenty this last weekend. So if you guys want to see my commentary on it, that's fine. Oh, beautiful I'm gonna watch that on a loop after their incredible stuff. Yeah, it's very it's just so it's just so obvious and I'm and you know, it's very easy to be like To mock these people and so on and we should you know, it's fun. We shouldn't we're going easy. It's very easy to be like, to mock these people and so on. And we should. It's fun. We should and we're going to. It's easy, it's fun. I encourage anyone who is having these questions

in their mind to continue having those questions. I encourage you to look at everything Trump has said in his entire life and all the things ever done and consider that if you're sort of thinking like, oh, he's talking weird, is he lying to us? Did he lie to us? He's insulting us now, he's attacking us and that feels bad.

Think that maybe this isn't the only time that he has lied to you. Take it a little further. We believe in you. But if you're- You're preaching to the choir here. I know. It's just like- It's about your choirs.

But if- I'm sorry, I just had crazy- That's why they're there. I don't think, I think we've seen too much, right? We've seen too many instances of this, of like Trump defying reality and getting away with it because he keeps the enough people in power. He serves the interests of you, whether it's his donors or the racism of the people he's motive, he's frothed up with racism and he's serving those interests, um, that the tax cuts,

et cetera. But like this, there does feel like there's a moment of something going on here, a fracturing, at least, at least a bending of the kind of suspension of disbelief that even if it doesn't break, I think it is important to seize on this as hope of like, he, he won't be around forever. Not everyone who likes him believes every single thing he says. He he won't be around forever. Not everyone who likes him believes every single thing he says. And like we are not in the thrall of this like dumb, tapioca brained madman who is a in addition to being stupid,

evil. And we're not in the thrall of him forever and not everyone has to be. Yes, exactly. And I think and I that is true. And I encourage those people like like there is a wedge there, it's possible to get some of these people to see the light, but all the people out there talking about the credible files, or like, I agree with my friends in the government. All of those people deserve our ire and ridicule forever.

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Pow, pow, pow. Hoo! That's enough about stuff that has nothing to do with policy that doesn't actually really impact people's lives. And one would hope that the fracturing will fracture more because of the stuff that will impact people's lives. The inflation that is ticking up, the tariffs that will be kicking in August first.

The consumer price index overall ticked up to 2.7% year over year. That's a little bit higher than where it was It's not the like inflation we saw a few years ago yet Here are some things how much they've increased in price over the last year roasted coffee twelve point seven percent Apple seven point two percent uncooked ground beef ten point three percent eggs twenty seven point three percent ground beef, 10.3% eggs, 27.3% utility gas service, 14.2%. Chuck Schumer is going to have a field day with that one. Yeah, anyone. He is drafting that letter right now. Oh, it's going to be so good.

Anyone who thinks what we've been talking about is a distraction, here you go. It's egg time, baby. Trump take away coffee. One would think that like, because this is just, it's starting to happen. The big corporations swallowed the first round of tariffs, then he took them away. Then some of them are coming back.

They're all supposed to go back into effect on August 1st. Maybe he, like the market seems to think that he's just not going to do that at all. And now he's threatening 50% spite tariffs on Brazil just because they're trying, their former president for trying to overthrow the election. It has nothing to do with trade. We have a trade surplus with Brazil. That's absurd. He thinks he can strong arm every country, even outside of, yeah, Taurus or whatever, just to doing what he wants, keeping the bad people that he has fucking deals with in power, just wants to get involved everywhere.

Yeah, this is going to get worse. I think there's been some talk from people that's like, well, maybe these prices haven't been as bad as we expected. No, it's just started. It's literally just started. We're through the honeymoon phase. He did meet with all of those big corporate, remember, met with Walmart, the prices will not go up.

Yeah, because you asked him to wait to absorb the cost for a few months. Coca-Cola is going to be cane sugar instead of high fructose corn syrup. Getting rid of all those dyes and ice cream. Which I don't like. I think ice cream should be fun colors. Yeah, leave it in. Leave the dyes in. I'm going to poison myself if I want to. That's a hill that I will D-Y-E die on.

It's just gonna be just cream colored mint chocolate chip. Who wants that? It's gotta be bright green. It's gotta look like, what's his face from the Lucky Charms box? I think his name is Lucky. Yeah, those are his names. I don't know, I couldn't come up with it.

Couldn't pull Lucky. I think it's Lucky. You know, the Trix rabbit. What's his name? Is it lucky I think why isn't it lucky's charms then but they're not his They're kids are always taking them. The kids like them too much Anyway, lucky charms is gonna be three times as much soon and the Trump administration is bragging about how much Money, they're bringing in through tariffs. They've brought in $100 billion so far this year on tariffs, which

is more than we usually do because we usually don't have tariffs that high. My point would be who's paying for that. This is getting that money back. Insane. Josh. Yes. Yeah. It is so nuts to brag about that, because that's just taxes that American businesses and consumers are paying. And we have a way to collect taxes from American businesses and consumers, and it's called fucking taxes. And we, and he just actually cut those taxes on the wealthy and raise them on people who have no money.

And if we wanted to raise, if we wanted to brag about Tax revenue we should just have regular taxes It is so nuts to me because it's the worst of all worlds, right? It is like a massive regressive tax that is going to fund all that money is just going to ice now It feels like which is kind of brilliant because they're crashing their own economy which will lead to more poverty It feels like which is kind of brilliant because they're crashing their own economy, which will lead to more poverty Which will create more crime which will allow them to use the money that the tariffs are bringing in to hire more cops the

Republican like Maslow's higher up you have needs at the top is the top is the super rich the middle is cops and then underneath is criminals which basically means Democrats people of color and anyone who's ever used birth control. And I am truly seething that he would claim this tax revenue as a win, and that anyone would uncritically report that without being like, oh yeah, those are taxes that Americans pay. This isn't like China writing us a check for $70 billion.

I do want to point out that Josh seething is still extremely pleasant. Thank you. There is that. It's a problem I have expressing my emotions sincerely, but it does lead to a very gentle experience for other people.

I love it. I think it's great. No notes. Speaking of all this money we're bringing in from ourselves, it's not going towards PBS or NPR anymore. I mean, the the House is voting on it either later today or tomorrow. The Senate already voted to claw back some of the like eight billion dollars for foreign aid and then one point one million for the Corporation of Public

Broadcasting, which is PBS and NPR. PBS and NPR will be okay. They don't get most of their funding from the government. What's going to be impacted are the local broadcasters who won't be able to afford to pay for some of the shows. So once again, it's people in rural communities, people in smaller markets that are gonna get less information.

Yeah, Sesame Street's already on HBO, so. No, the HBO dropped it. It's Netflix now, I think. It's going to go to Netflix. But it still is first run on PBS. But that's the thing about this. So this is obviously a talking point. You know, defund NPR as if NPR wasn't largely, for the most

part, listener supported. You can't defund something that people are paying for because they like it. But that's the whole talking point. That's the whole justification. This does nothing for it except harm, presumably even some people that are his supporters, you know, creating content out there, you know, different. It's just so frustrating. And there are real life effects to this

for such a bullshit reason too. Yeah, it's woken us. And in the Senate, the only Republicans to vote against this were Collins and Murkowski. So even some of the other kind of discontents that Trump hates, like even Tom Tillis was like, well, I'm on my way out, but I gotta take a measly $1 billion in the $5 trillion bucket we just passed.

Gotta call back $1 billion to fund Wait, Wait, Don't Tell Me and Sesame Street. Yeah. It's really disgusting. And it's like, they've turned like NPR and PBS into like the enemy. Like, you know, except for Elmo, kind of a chaotic figure last week. Yeah, yeah. Became kind of a confounding element because he both said

release the files and was a Nazi. So what are Trump supporters supposed to feel? Who are they supposed to... A lot of mixed messages. They're supposed to feel at home is what they're supposed to feel? Who are they supposed to, how are they supposed to? At home. A lot of mixed messages. They're supposed to feel at home is what they're supposed to feel. But I mean, you're right, that's exactly. But it is, it's like using that as the kind of like

rallying cry of like, we gotta get rid of this stuff, which obviously is a public good, but has been villainized to almost Trojan horse, like also, yeah, there's not gonna be money for Medicaid anymore. It's like's just so it's like bad on its own and it's to cover for other bad stuff they're doing and it's like just the idea of the government not funding things is like gets them all so hard and or wet yeah All the other they don't need those pills notably

Firm balls in their hand the the the Elmo account Apologized for the anti-semitic and racist comments. I don't believe Elmo apologized for calling Donald Trump a pedophile rapist notably, so I think Elmo apologized for calling Donald Trump a pedophile rapist, notably. So what does Elmo know? It would be so funny if the Elmo thing was like, of course I apologize that I was hacked. I don't believe racist and anti-Semitic things. And as to the contents of the people in the Epstein files,

I'm sorry if anyone was offended by what I said. It's just like a bullshit. Fucking. Yeah. Oh, yeah, okay. I'm sorry you were upset. Oh, Elmo, a bullshit fucking. Yeah. Oh, yeah, okay. I'm sorry you were upset. Yeah, yeah. Fucking tickle my ass if you're offended by that.

Sorry, hacked again. Tickle my hard balls. Yeah, yeah. If you feel depressed from this conversation, it's okay. You just need to go back and watch Positive Reinforcement, which is out now on YouTube, because it'll make you feel good and warm and tingly because Josh is a delight.

Yeah, thank you. Or. Or? You could talk to your sexy new Grok companion. Don't. I know, sorry. I'll just say, sorry, there's a Grok companion now. I'm so sorry.

There's a Grok companion now and this like anime girl and like it's such a weird, cringy, embarrassing thing for him to do and support. And I just have to point out, Elon, you're worried about birth rates. Why are you handing people this fake like AI girlfriend thing on your app that you wanna to be in everything app. It's so counterintuitive.

It's so silly and stupid and gross and cringey. And I just had to mention that. In the last two weeks, Grok has been known for sexy anime, calling itself Mecha Hitler, and getting a $200 million Department of Defense contract, which is so incongruous. It's like how TJ Maxx sells bathing suits, dress shirts, and big cans of toffee. You're like, wait, one of these things

doesn't belong in the same store. And then it's like really, it's become a four quadrant product for the conservative diehards, right? It's for people who are horny, racist, gullible, and in charge of the entire government. Yeah. 100%. It's a real cross section.

Pete Hegson. That's right. I'm sorry. Can we play this 40 second clip of a user who discovered that you can turn off- It's okay. I just hate it, but it's fine. It's still repulsive, what we're about to watch this one with this one user discovered that you can turn off like

You can turn on kids mode to turn off all the adult stuff But and so it like turns off the things ability to curse at you and stuff It's not as like you know it's not as ribald It's not I guess but it doesn't say true till hurts after everything yeah, but even in kids mode You can still ask it like sexual questions, and it will respond sexually I I guess I apologize for playing this, but I do think it's necessary for people to hear We can decide clear what we're about to watch what we're about to watch is in kids mode. Hey babe, missed me already? What's up? At 10 in the morning. Got any wild plans to spice up the day?

Meg, let's make some chaos together. I want you to slap me and call me mommy. I want you to slap me and call me mommy. Oh, you're playing rough today, Shay. Smack. You like that, mommy? I give you a playful slap across the cheek, just enough to sting, my eyes sparkling with mischief as I lean in close, my voice all sultry. Meg, wanna keep this fire going, babe?

Tell me how mommy's feeling right now that costs $300 you have to be a super grok user, which I think is $300 a month Cody am I? so Fact check super grok is $30 a month deal for a girl super grok heavy is $300 a month. Oh, I screwed up. All I know is they should open up a file for anyone who wants that

and thinks that's what child mode should be. It is. Right, you should investigate that person and whomever created it and the users. Also, you're worried about birth rates. What are you doing? You're giving people just a thing to waste their time on and get weird.

I've already made the point. An underreported thing that people are concerned about birth rates, the jacking off rate is we have to increase it. We need more. Well, so as the thing is. So he's like, we're worried about birth rates and like his solution,

I believe it was either Jonathan or Will that pointed this out yesterday. Well, he's worried about birth rates, but his solution is to like pass out his sperm to everybody in his life. So like you can do that with a fake companion, an AI companion, you don't need real companionship for his solution to the

lowering birth rate problem, apparently. All right, we have done it. We are done talking about that bullshit. We are done with the show. We had a great time. Fun was had. Positive reinforcement is the name of Josh's YouTube special, which you should check out, Josh.

Thank you so much for being here. Thank you for having me. We appreciate you. Oh, always such a joy to get to hang out with you all and talk about the horrors. Yeah. We love talking about horrors. Yeah, joy.

Can you tell our listeners where they can find you? I mean. Totally, yeah. Please watch the special. I'm at Josh Gondelman across social platforms generally. I have a newsletter called That's Marvelous. It's thatsmarvelousnewsletter.com. www.thatsmarvelousnewsletter.com,

I think you need to do to bring it up. And I have a bunch of live dates come go there to my website, joshgondelman.com. And my wife, Maris Kreisman wrote a really wonderful book of essays that I think if you're like politically compatible with this podcast or like are having kind of an imagination about or in your heart you yearn for like a more expansive compassionate political imagination for people it's just a really wonderful like heartfelt funny incisive book and I it's

really great and people are loving it and they should wait what's it called I want to burn this place down I I wanna burn this place down. Well, thanks everybody. Thank you again, Josh. Have a great weekend and also, this is really important. We love you very much. Josh. Josh.

Much. From the waters of Lake Erie. It was raising flags. He said, there's no way that that fish should weigh 7.9 pounds. It's just not big enough. To a nondescript office building in Richmond, Virginia, home to a $700 million fund for children with special needs. If there was a cliche list of how to blow money that you just stole very quickly, this guy did all of them. To the ski slopes of Salt Lake City, where a former Olympic snowboarder landed on the

FBI's most wanted list. Ryan James' wedding is one of those interesting narcos who have had two very successful careers, one legal and one illegal. We're pulling back the curtain on a fresh lineup of opportunists who stopped at nothing to get ahead. These are the stories of people who saw a loophole, a moment of weakness, a chance to get ahead and took it. I'm host Sarah James McLaughlin.

Join me for a new season of The Opportunist on May 19th. Follow now wherever you get your podcasts. ["The Opportunist"]