Some More News - Even More News: The Christian Right is Taking Over; Joe Pardons Hunter

Episode Date: December 6, 2024

Hi. Talia Lavin, author of the new book “Wild Faith: How the Christian Right Is Taking Over America," joins Katy and Cody to talk about Joe Biden pardoning his son Hunter, the Supreme Court's apparent approval of laws targeting trans youth, and why the Christian Right is now an even bigger threat during a second Trump presidency. PATREON: https://patreon.com/somemorenews MERCH: https://shop.somemorenews.com Blueland is on a mission to eliminate single-use plastic by reinventing cleaning essentials to be better for you and the planet. To take advantage of their best sale of the year for up to 30% off your entire order, go to Blueland.com/MORENEWS Founded and led by an all-woman team of skin longevity scientists, OneSkin is redefining the aging process with their proprietary OS-01 peptide, the first ingredient proven to help skin look, feel, and behave like its younger self. Get 15% off with code SMN at oneskin.co. Get the world's news at ground.news/SMN to compare coverage and see through biased coverage. Subscribe for 50% off unlimited access – their biggest discount – through our link. AG1 is offering new subscribers a FREE $76 gift when you sign up. You’ll get a Welcome Kit, a bottle of D3K2 AND 5 free travel packs in your first box. So make sure to check out DrinkAG1.com/morenews to get this offer! As a special holiday offer, Whisker is offering up to $100 off Litter-Robot bundles. AND, as a special offer to viewers, you can get an additional $50 off when you go to stopscooping.com/MORENEWS. This week only, you can take 50% off any new SimpliSafe system with a select professional monitoring plan. This is your last chance to claim their best offer of the year. Head to SimpliSafe.com/MORENEWS to claim your discount and make sure your home is safe this season. Control Body Odor ANYWHERE with @shop.mando and get $5 off your Starter Pack (that’s over 40% off) with promo code MoreNews at Mandopodcast.com/MoreNews

Hello, welcome back to Even More News, the first and only news podcast. My name is Katie Stoll. It is Katie Stoll. Hi, I'm Cody Johnston. Cody Johnston. Oh, hello. So good to Johnston. Cody Johnston. Oh, hello, so good to see you, Cody Johnston. You know who else it's so good to see? This week's guest, journalist and author

of the new book, Wild Faith, How the Christian Right is Taking Over America. That's right, we have Talia Levin. Oh. Chachachacha. Chachachacha. And of course, Jonathan is also here. Jonathan's also here. Hi, made it back.

Yeah, we all made it through Thanksgiving alive, it seems. Yeah. I was almost eaten by a feral turkey. What? Uh, no, just kidding. Uh. Tell me more. I was swallowed into the cavity of a turkey, nearly roasted alive.

But you made it. It was a whole picaresque, but I survived, and I'd rather not talk about the traumas of war. I'm so glad that you're here. And we're going to blow right past the Thanksgiving holiday to talk about another holiday. And it's fine. Friday, December 6th is National Pawn Brokers Day. Okay. Yay!

Let's get out there. Roll the pawn brokers. Your grandmother's brooch may be priceless in your heart, but if you need a fast 150, there's always pawn shops. Get out there. When I was a baby in LA, not quite a baby, but young. When I was a baby, I pawned all my pacifiers. Brand new in LA, I had this really abusive boss

who was very rich and tended to curry favor, pit people against each other. But then she would give lavish presents and she gave me a very beautiful watch that was expensive and I didn't want it. So I tried to pawn it and I never heard back from them or thought about it until last night when I was reading through our doc.

So I should follow up on that. Yeah, you gotta hawk that watch. 18 years. Wait, did you leave it there? Yeah, it's all like you put it in the shop and then they're supposed to tell you that they sell it. Wait, so they stole the watch from you? Yeah, I guess so. Yeah, apparently.

They stole that watch. Yep. Was it gave them your watch? Yeah, apparently. They stole that watch? Yep. Was it a pawnbroker or was it like a dude on the corner? It was a store in Marina Del Rey. Well, was it a storefront or was it a store? It was a store, I think. Okay.

It was that cheesecake factory in Marina Del Rey. I make that mistake all the time. Talia, we're definitely gonna dig into your book. It's very prescient and topical, unfortunately. I hate it, I hate it. Relevant to all of our conversations, but we wanna create some space towards the end of the show to really dig into it,

but I'm positive it's going to inform our conversations throughout the episode. But for now, we're gonna start by digging in to the news. The news. And first up on our docket, Joe Biden pardons Hunter. The president? Biden, his son. Yes.

The president pardons his son? Yes. Okay. He did. I'm sure all of our listeners already know about the scandal of the millennium. Joe Biden pardoning Hunter Biden. He will now avoid sentencing on those federal tax and gun convictions. In a statement, President Biden said his son was selectively and unfairly

prosecuted and he noted that the charges that were levied against Hunter are rarely filed. What is wrong with me today? They're rarely filed. Yeah, Jonathan is also here. I know. I'm usually also here and speaking in sentences. Not today. He left out some information on a gun form. He was late paying taxes and then paid them back eventually. So there seem to be a couple camps reacting. There's more than a couple. Because I kind of consider myself in a middle third camp

of people that are either- A third wave camps, if you will. A third wave, a new wave. Not left, not right, but- People who think this is a horrible thing and other people who think it was the right thing. Like I said, I'm kind of in the middle. We were kind of discussing this yesterday.

If it was me, I would have done the same fucking thing. Let me be clear. My son's being, his trial has been politicized to the millionth degree. Obviously there's other things that these people want to pursue, that they haven't been able to get a foothold on in terms of what they're trying to say Hunter Biden is, who he is.

I mean, they keep doing investigations and not having any evidence of anything. Right. And this pardon ends up being for a 10 year period. So he will be safe from this. If I was the president of the United States and my son was troubled and all, you know, I probably would want to do the same thing. And it did make me cringe as well, partly because of how many times he explicitly promised that he wouldn't. It was all in this attempt over the last four years to give the appearance of him not being political.

And the same thing, the same reasoning behind the way that they've handled all of Donald Trump's many charges and cases brought against thing, the same reasoning behind the way that they've handled all of Donald Trump's many charges and cases brought against him, the appearance of not being a political. And it didn't work. It didn't work. He did, in fact, commit these things, do these things, the tax evasion and the gun thing. And the reality is, is that those charges would probably come with probation, not serious jail time. I also have always felt not good about the fact that Hunter Biden, who I have a lot of compassion

for, there's a lot of addiction in my family. And I understand what this relationship is like and how hard it is for your family and how much you want to help and support them. He never should have been given a job working for Burisma when his dad was vice president. That's my opinion, I think, that if we're gonna call out shit like that, we have to call it out on our side. Sure, but also like, but his dad didn't give him that job. Like, it's not like.

But he got that job because he's Joe Biden's son. Yeah. Not because of his qualifications. Well, sure. The whole thing makes me want to like, get a Maylocks, like it gives me heartburn. I don't want to think about it. People are like weirdly emotionally attached to Joe Biden and this whole narrative about his sons. And I'm like, president is not your friend. He's not your buddy. Like, this is, it's kind of

gross. I'm not like gonna like lie awake tormented by it. I think it's stupid that it's this like, it's being treated as this epical scandal. And it also reminds me that like the press does know how to cover scandals and like what has selectively been chosen as a scandal and blown up as a scandal and like a lot, like as opposed to the sort of learned apathy around like even the most egregious shit like Trump does. Yeah, so I mean, but like it doesn't feel it's not great. It doesn't feel good. One of my life experiences when

I was young and adventurous is I did a Fulbright grant in Ukraine and I was there the year before the Maidan revolution. You walk around a country, this is in the waning days of the Yanukovych administration. I was like half, you know, most of the people I was talking to couldn't afford bread. And then you walk around Kiev and like the most beautiful spots are marred by these presidential helipads. Yanukovych had this ridiculous mansion, Mezhikira, that had literally a pirate ship that he'd installed to entertain guests on. So you have that level of corruption. Everybody

knew that everybody on top, from the opposition to the people in power, were these figureheads, these pawns. And then it trickled down. Corruption was just a part of everyday life. I had to pay a bribe to get my purse that I'd left in New York shipped to me. I bribed the Ukrainian FedEx contractor. And this was just life. You bribe to get a residency permit, you bribe to do this. And when you have that as your operating principle, it's so deeply corrosive. It's,

and it breeds like this, this deep bone deep cynicism, because how can it not, right? Every interaction you have with a nurse, with a doctor, with any sort of element of public life has this like, do I have to learn how to give like the Bakshish, you know, the Vziatka is how you say bribe in Russian and Ukrainian I learned, which means like the take, you know? And the following year, like that really,

it was really corruption and also sort of, uh, taking away even the possibility of like moving in an anti-corruption direction that, um, uh, that broke the populace that finally, like everyone was flooding onto the streets. Yanukovych fled his, his mansion with the pirate ship got turned into the museum of corruption. And that was a really powerful moment. But it really, the whole experience, that whole year sort of made me realize the poison that is corruption. And it's, and, and there are ways to deal with corruption because it will

inevitably happen. Like, uh, you know, Bob Menendez is eventually going to go to jail possibly, but the ways our system has not dealt with this poison and the rampant elite impunity that we're seeing everywhere, from all the cases against Trump getting dropped, all of them, like hot potatoes, to, you know, Eric Adams is still mayor of New York, despite him being like, I'm in the pay of Turkey and everybody knows that. Just like there's this culture where, like, to all the like shady shit Elon Musk is doing with straight up illegal.

Absolutely. And, oh, we'll send, we'll send a strongly worded letter. And I think unpunished corruption is a plague because it scarifies you. You wind up totally civically disengaged because when someone is on the take, and when you have to be on the take to survive, you know, of course, this isn't going to be a fair system. Of course, this isn't going to deliver you what you need and what you want. Corruption is poisoned to idealism. And so in that sense, I think I see the Hunter Biden issue

as sort of symptomatic of a much broader problem and just like a gross little boil on the postustulous face of American corruption. Stan Mallow I think that's why I have such a strong like who gives a shit reaction to this one because I know how much worse it's about to get. I know that Trump just appointed Charles Kushner, a criminal who he pardoned last time. Who he pardoned.

Who's his son-in-law's father to what? Ambassador to France? And like and Charles Kushner so fucking seedy to the shit he was caught for. Yeah, absolutely. It's it's like, oh, and he's from my community. He's modern, Orthodox Jewish. And I'm like, I'm so ashamed of of that whole situation. But just like because, you know, when you're like a minority religion, you don't get to be like, that guy's not, has nothing to do with me. Uh, but no, he's a Jew from New Jersey and like, he fucking like was recording, he was like sting operating his like brother with a prostitute.

And he's like so shady. It's like really the incoming administration is the shady landlords. You know, Trump is a shady landlord. Kushner is a shady landlord. There are so many people like the I like I understand like I'm sympathetic to the argument of like, well, this is going well, I'm actually not because like the argument is like, oh, this is going to like open up like like give Trump Trump carte blanche to do whatever he wants with pardons. He's gonna be able to do this and this and this.

He was always gonna do those things. This pardoning. He's already in carte blanche. He's already done that, this pardoning of Hunter Biden for again, reasons where it's like, well, that makes sense. They want to appoint this bizarre maniac to go after all of Trump's political enemies. It makes sense and also this isn't leading

to a conversation about should the president be able to do this. If that were the case, I'd be a little more, I would believe it a little more. Like I see like Nate Silver out there, like this is maybe the Dems have gone too far. I don't know how much more I can take. Get real buddy.

Don't vote for any Democrat in 2028 who doesn't repudiate the pardon within 48 hours, Nate Silver said. I promise you that will not be top of mind by 2028 in terms of our conversations we're having. The thing is about this is like a scandal. Oh my god, like I can't believe this. Presidents pardon people. That is just a power that they have. It's not like- Well, I would like- I would like to see Biden, this move would have gone down a lot smoother for me if you'd been like,

I'm pardoning Hunter. I'm pardoning all of Death Row. I'm pardoning every single person in federal prison. Fuck all y'all. If this is his fuck it we ball move, this is his, I'm a lame duck. I can do whatever the fuck I want, fuck you. And it's like, well, like, yeah.

And look, deranged maniacs have been posting pictures of his son's penis for years. I get it. But you know, but if you're gonna use that fuck it, we ball instinct, fuck it and ball. But he doesn't wanna do those things. Well, that's the thing, that's the hope. That's the hope that he's going to eventually,

but he probably won't. And the timing of it is not good. It doesn't matter, I mean, eventually sure, it doesn't quite matter to me in the fact that he goes out there and makes this big show of pardoning Hunter after we have so many recordings of him saying, absolutely not, under no circumstances would I consider pardoning my son.

And again, I would do it, but to just say to literally march out there and have it only be about that leaves me feeling a little, I don't know, like heart burning like what Talia said earlier. And again, I agree, hopefully he should, he needs to. I think that he will and that will help and everything. But, and I also like, I go back and forth on this, what I'm about to say, because ultimately I don't think it matters.

I know that this just increases the division and saying like, ah, you guys are, you got, all the Democrats are corrupt and stuff. And it's like, there's nothing, there's no amount of us pointing, but Trump saying yes, but Trump that will stick. It's such a double standard and all of that. And again, I would want to do the same thing. It just doesn't change anything. It's like, like there's no, like there's no world where like he didn't do this and then the discourse was healthy and we could actually talk about things in reality.

Nate Silver was begging for a reason to be like, don't vote for Dems anymore, this is too far. It's just, I don't know, the whole thing. I don't even disagree because it's like, all right, it's not a great look, but what's a good look now compared to what's going on and what's coming? And again, I just think we also just blow past the deeper, more important conversation,

which as Talia pointed out is the corruption creep, just the pervasiveness of it, how it happens. And again, I do not think that Hunter Biden with his vast history of really tragic addiction, which I say with compassion should be given a job working for a foreign government or not a government, it's an energy company. Regardless, you get my point. He got that job out of with no qualifications other than being Joe Biden's son. Well, he was a consultant that could help them, they thought, get a curry favor with the vice president.

Yeah, because he's the vice president's son. Nobody's saying, and I think we basically say this in our Hunter Biden episode from like two years ago, like, yeah, he was trying to use the fact that his dad was vice president to make some money and never delivered anything for them. And then, yeah, Joe Biden was kept clean on that because there's no evidence that he did anything to help. Well, that's the thing because, I don't know, this is the most corrupt thing a president's ever done.

No, it's not that. The president's pardoned people all the time. But he maybe shouldn't have said over and over again, absolutely not, I will never pardon my son. Wouldn't that be great if Joe Biden did a thing and then we were able to have a discussion about why a president has pardon power in the first place? I mean, it's in the Constitution, so you'd need a constitutional amendment to take it away.

That's not gonna happen. Also, they don't want it to, because they want Trump to do their pardons. He's gonna pardon all the January 6th people on day one. Probably. Yeah. Right. You have like, you know, there's been this frothing like right wing sort of self contained mythos of the Biden crime family and like this sort of obsession with Hunter and like, I don't know, I assume that every conservative commentator in America has all those hog picks just in a drawer.

Ready to go, yeah. Just ready to go at any moment. And it's always been used as this sort of like cudgel of equivalence, right? And I don't think it is equivalent. Uh, like the, you know, we're about to see an orgy of corruption that's going to make, you know, like your hair stand up, but it is, Yeah, they're going to loot the entire country. Like it is, it, it isn't an opportune time to like, uh, like, you know, whatever. I mean, keeping the high ground has been a dubious strategy.

But it's like, really now, this is the time you're going to like, you know, in the waning weeks of your administration, this is the time you're like, yeah, moral high ground. And again, like, parents. Also, can he fall asleep in a meeting yesterday talking about exploiting? Yeah, I'm pretty sure it's his only visit to Africa. Africa. He fell asleep for part of it.

Getting in there for some batteries, economic development, fell asleep. But again, like, pair this with other, like, fuck it, we ball moves. Like, pardon a bunch of people who deserve it. Yes. Along with this. Were you joking yesterday when you said,

pardon the January 6 people? Biden should do it and then say, oh, Trump told me he wasn't going to, I'm going to. Just fill the place with lies, lies, see if anything sticks. Trump doesn't care about you, he was gonna leave you in there to rot, but you're heroes, I'm freeing you.

See if it needs chaos. That's your fucking Wee Ball news? Come on. He's joking, he's joking. Would be funny. Also, yeah pardon everybody. I mean expand the court would be mine I guess. Can he do that now?

Yeah come on, like I don't fucking know. Do something crazy. Like we have this ruling, the presidents of total immunity, like I don't know. But also like, He's too sleepy. There's an element of also like, there's so many things going on.

The president pardoned his son for something that wouldn't have been an issue if it wasn't the president's son. And that's, sir, this is not who we are. It should be issues. But my point is, we've been talking about this for like 15 minutes. It doesn't ultimately matter.

No one's gonna care about this in a week. Biden's been like extending contracts for like immigration, immigrant detention centers all year. They just, there's a Guardian report about that today. There are all these other things that like are so much worse than this and more important. And like you have all this, this media class being like, so this is not who we are, this is, oh my goodness. And it's like, it's, I don't know, it's like, cause I don't even disagree with you, Katie,

about all this stuff you're saying, because yeah, it's like not a good look, and like this and this and this, but also Jonathan, I don't give a shit. You know, like it is all these feelings, and he should have done this, but ultimately it doesn't matter. Boy, the holidays sure are messy. After Thanksgiving,

my house is covered in turkey. In the kitchen, on the walls, the bathtub just filled to the brim. Honestly, I have no idea why. And I am absolutely sick of burning through plastic spray bottles to clean. That's just making more trash. And that's why I want to tell you about Blue Land. They are on a mission to eliminate single-use plastic by reinventing how we clean. And this holiday season, Blue Land is having its best sale of the year so you can save and shop sustainably for your friends, family, and even yourself.

It works like this. You get a Forever Bottle, fill it with warm water, and drop in a Blue Land tablet, and blammo! You got yourself a cleaner! Everything from hand soap, to toilet cleaner, to laundry tablets. No more plastic waste! Just set up a subscription with Blue Land,

and you are good to go. Refills start at just $2.25. One of my favorite things about them is that all their cleaners come in nifty little organized tins. It makes cleaning itself feel clean. And for a limited time, Blueland's Hand Soap is offering these festive chocolate box themed gift sets with scents like toasted vanilla and sweet chestnut. Make your home smell like nut. So to take advantage of their best sale of the year for up to 30% off your

entire order, go to blueland.com slash more news. You do not want to miss this. blueland.com slash more news. Once again, that is blueland.com slash you guessed it more news. Hey, how's your skin? Look, it's important to me that the people around me have smooth, healthy skin. I'm always peering at the flesh, assessing the value. And that's why for this holiday, I'm going to give the gift of OneSkin and their

limited edition holiday bundle. OneSkin is the first company to target skin health at the cellular level. They are formulated with a proprietary OS01 peptide designed to improve your skin on a deeper level than other products. Superior cream for skin that Katie approves. Because OneSkin believes that skincare is about optimizing your skin's biology at a cellular level. It's like science. You love science. Real talk folks.

Uh, I have been using this and the other day, a friend came up to me and said, your skin looks so supple. So check them out. Get 15% off with code SMN at Oneskin.co. That is 15% off Oneskin.co with code SMN. After you purchase, they're gonna ask you where you heard about them and please, please, please support our show and tell them we sent you, because we did. Invest in the health and longevity of your skin with one skin. Your future self will thank you. Hey, you know what sucks?

The news. More than ever, it's bad out there. Sometimes it's too much to handle, but that's exactly why you should check out Ground News by going to ground.news slash SMN. That's a sponsor we at the show sought out. It's both a website and an app that aggregates news from around the world,

from the entire political spectrum, and allows us to compare coverage and verify our information. Because the news hates us, but we don't have to hate the news. Ground News gives you the tools for keeping a cool head, like a factuality chart that shows you how subjectively a story is being covered.

And you can check that out, plus context on each publication over at ground.news.smn. With that link, you can save 50% off unlimited access, their biggest discount of the year. They are subscriber funded after all, which means no ads. So again, that's ground.news slash SMN for 50% off unlimited access. The link is in the description, go to the link.

Because again, like this was the impetus for this move, seemingly was the new like attempt at a new FBI director. Like that seems to be where a lot of this is coming from. The weirdo who's going to go after whoever's on the enemies list. Yeah, I mean he's already weighing preemptive pardons of Anthony Fauci who has not committed a crime that we know just because they all hate him and they're going to go after him. That's what they want to do.

Preemptively pardon Adam Schiff. Yeah, Donald Trump has nominated Cash Patel to be the FBI director. Yeah, I mean, has he specifically said he should dismantle the FBI headquarters. Oh, well that's- Turn it into a museum of the deep state. Oh, well, okay. Well, maybe that's a good thing. Dismantle FBI headquarters, that's great.

So that means that he wouldn't have gone after Hunter Biden if he was dismantling it. No, no, no, no, no, they'll be room. They'll be room to- There's always room for your political enemies. So when he says dismantle the FBI headquarters, it seems like maybe actually means like make the FBI a little more insular and a little more focused and targeted and aggressive in the ways that they want to be again with these enemies lists that they have as opposed to

what they're implying. I don't know, there's like, there are all these promises that like, of like, we're gonna do this, we're gonna dismantle this, we're gonna do it. No, no, no, no, no, you're gonna just make it for yourself. That's your plan. It's not to dismantle anything,

it's to make the bureaucracy work for you, it's to make the FBI work for you. That's what's going to happen. It's interesting, like, because a lot of my work is like tracking the extreme right. I wind up spending some time in the like alternate realities created in right wing media. And like, the FBI is too woke has been like a running line. I think because like some of the more like egregious crimes under Trump 1.0 got investigated. But it's not exactly like the DOJ has been like speed running, prosecuting like the most obvious crime guys of all time. So it's really just very deranged and disconnected from reality, but like, you know, at the same time it's symbolic

of like just how like poisoned and siloed our information environments are that like, oh yeah, of course he's going to dismantle FBI headquarters because, you know, the FBI has been too woke, right? For years. And it's just like this. And I'm like, these are the guys that killed Fred Hampton. Like, what are you talking about? I know.

It's absurd. Okay. And like, you know, just like more Joe Biden legacy that he didn't fucking bother to like dismiss, you know, Trump's head of FBI. Like, they intentionally did it so as not to seem like they were going to criticize it. He's got to dismiss his, but Trump will dismiss him. It's just like, and yeah, or even like the postmaster general who's like, I'm going to fuck up the mail.

Uh, still there. I mean, I think just like the, in bridging the, the two topics, um, just, I think ultimately Joe Biden's legacy is that of like the sort of senescent gasps of neoliberalism. is that of the sort of senescent gasps of neoliberalism and its impotence. I truly hope that it marks, in some sense, the death of this milk toast, field of honor, means tested centrism that has never done a good thing for anyone without, you know, forms and triplicate you have to fill out in the wazoo. Seems to not be helping. No, and it's like, you know, thinking about why Trump got reelected. Obviously, there's many, many reasons and we're going to be dealing with the fallout

of this for like the rest of our natural lives. Um, and so on and so forth. But like, I think, you know, to Biden was not a popular president partially due to the, like a very hostile media environment, but also just like he, he stood for nothing, accomplished little and promised more of the, you know, and, and, and Harris by virtue of her position, essentially had to offer more of the same. And I just, I'm, I, I hope, I, I think there's a big consultant class with a lot of financial stake and no significant reform or change happening. Absolutely. But like, we don't have an opposition party, we don't have a left party, and people are

breaking, you know? Like, this is not a steady situation. And I much prefer a world of voting to a world of like, years of lead. I don't glamorize revolutions. People die in those. And many terrible things happen in those. But it's like, so I think I would hope that Dems are burned to the ground and then from that fire stripped soil, something new grows. Yeah, because there are things you can do to avoid that world, that violent, dangerous world that we seem to be heading towards of instability

and I feel like vigilante justice we'll probably get to later. Probably. But we're in this, precarious, wealth inequality is very bad. And if you have a party that their goal is to sustain that basically, that's going to tense up more and more. And cracks are going to show more and more.

And you're going to have another party who's like, we're actually going to, you know how frustrated you are? We're going to dismantle everything. But they're not going to dismantle everything. They're going to maintain it. I want to leave time to talk about Talia's book, but before we do that, I think it's very important that we discuss SCOTUS and how it's signaling

support for anti-trans laws. The Supreme Court heard oral arguments on Wednesday where conservatives on the Supreme Court appear to signal that they were likely to uphold a Tennessee law banning hormone therapy and puberty blockers to trans youth. There's a lawsuit that was challenging that law that came up to the Supreme Court. It was brought by three trans teenagers, their parents and a doctor. They argue it violates the Constitution's equal protection clause of the 14th Amendment,

which it obviously does, but there were arguments anyway. It's likely to be either 5-4 or 6-3. The one conservative holdout could be Neil Gorsuch, who authored the majority opinion in a 2020 ruling that protected transgender people from employment discrimination, but that was a separate legal issue since that didn't deal with the equal protection clause. And of course, people like Samuel Alito asked questions very much indicating that they would

like to let the Tennessee law and 20 or so odd other anti-trans laws or laws targeting trans youth to stand. It feels like this should be obvious because specifically they're talking about a classification of drugs that are available to youth just not trans youth. Not trans youth, yeah. Like yeah, you can use it if like you're 12 and you don't want to grow boobs yet because you're or or nine or whatever, you can absolutely do that. But like, you know, if you're, if you're, if you're.

So if you're a cis child, young woman, little girl, you can take these things to delay your puberty, growing boobs, is that what you mean? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And that's not, and that's, yeah, exactly. If you're like, I'm nine, I don't want to like go into full pubescence yet. You know, I want to be a child for a few more years. That's fine. You know, or like the other, there are other reasons, um, you know, height, uh,

like, uh, like people are like, okay, we'll put you on puberty blockers and see if you'll grow a little bit before you're sort of locked into your adult height. Um, that sort of thing. Um, there are all sorts of reasons. That's not under challenge, but it's like, if you might not want boobs because of your mental health, um, you know, and, and, and, and, uh, you know, then that's not permitted and, and, and, and, you know, or because you're trans and a couple of things we're revealing, like one, you know, Alito is the same, like ultra conservative, but like deeply Christian asshole that he's always been. Amy Coney Barrett is like, oh, there isn't really any, you know, discrimination against transgender people. And then you dig deep into her statements.

Well, if you dig into her statements and it's clear that what she really means by that is like, transgender people don't exist. And that's the reality they want, like that transness is not real. Yes. And that's the reality they want to sort of mandate. And then of course, needless to say, this functionally will ban adult trans care. you know, a lot of the people that the, you know, so much of the medical profession has been running an X a masterclass in complying in advance, uh, with regards to abortion stuff. And you're going to see just like refusal of doctors to do any gender affirming care. This is a signal towards that.

And, you know, it's just, so this really imperils the health of adult transitioners as well. To sort of, like you were talking about Amy Coney Barrett and sort of like this idea that like they are trying to operate as if trans people don't exist. And I know that the Supreme Court is different from like podcasters and conservative pundits. But as we've talked about many times in the show, there is a marriage there.

There is a relationship there. We might even talk about it in the future when we talk about your book. There's a speech that Matt Walsh gave and he, you know, the idea that they want to pretend is like, well, we just care about like kids transitioning and at a certain age this is this. But actually their goal is to eliminate all trans people. He gave a speech about how the phrase he used was like, and we're not going to stop here. We're going to eliminate trans ideology altogether. One of the other Daily Wire freaks, Michael Knowles, said this a while ago too. And that is what they want to do.

If you can't get rid of trans ideology, trans people do exist. And you have to contend with that. And their whole operation is meant to not contend with that to pretend like trans people don't actually exist to pretend like it's just this it's just this like mind virus. It's just this like idea that we need to get rid of. But if you get rid of the idea, then you get rid of the people because they do exist. Not to say that Matt Walsh has power over the Supreme Court, but it is very similar to the way tell you like you were talking about how the justices are talking about it and This alarming

Something to be aware of although the language that they're really using is not so much the daily wire eliminationist freaks who are of course their job is to like Say the quiet part out loud or whatever like that they've been openly declaring their intentions to absolutely no repercussions for for years. But the people that I frankly think have a real responsibility for this horror is actually the New York Times and their relentless, relentless stream of the Times, the Atlantic, this relentless stream of sort of quote unquote respectable, but ultimately, you know, journalistically barren and deeply flawed, deeply biased, deeply transphobic coverage.

And that, for years, and that has sort of smuggled this stuff into the realm of respectability. And it's always under the guise of like, has this gone too far? Is it too easy to access gender affirming care? As if it was too easy to access literally any form of healthcare in the United States. And I think they have, whatever odium they've received is not enough because functionally they have made a bigotry against a very small and marginalized group, respectable, they've given it fancy new clothes. a very small and marginalized group, respectable.

They've given it fancy new clothes. A measured reasonable civil response, yeah, exactly. Exactly, and so then SCOTUS can go ahead and take away the rights of this small, embattled, courageous minority, knowing that they have, courageous minority, knowing that they have, in essence, the imprimatur of many of the nation's intellectual elite. And I think that's an absolute disgrace.

We're all creatures of habit. For example, every time I take a shower, I cry. I also start my day with a big sexy glass of AG1. Or often, I'll drink them on the show. You've seen, because AG1 goes down smooth, like my tears down the drain. It's creamy, delightful. You could mix it with your morning smoothie,

or pour it on your waffles if you're messed up like that. It gives an extra boost of nutrition and aids in gut health. So you can go out there and conquer your day. Be that crying in the shower or crying in your car or crying in public because you want them all to see. And it's perfect for the holidays. Their travel packs ensure that you can stay healthy while crying at your parents' house.

So this new year, try AG1 for yourself. It's the perfect time to start a new healthy habit. And that's why I've been partnering with AG1 for so long. And AG1 is offering new subscribers a free $76 gift when you sign up. You'll get a welcome kit, a bottle of D3K2, and five free travel packs in your first box. So make sure to check out drinkag1.com slash more news to get this offer. That's drinkag1.com slash more news

to start your new year on a healthier note. Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, New Year on a healthier note. That's crying. That's me crying. People generally don't like having boxes of poop in their homes. Trust me, they hate it. And yet, cats are a thing. Amazingly, we love cats more than we hate boxes of poop. It's a vexing mind puzzle it is.

But what if I told you that the Litter Robot by Whisker can fix this philosophical dilemma? Their Litter Robot automatically self-cleans after every use, be that a cat or whoever. It sends a notification when it needs to be emptied as well as information about the health of whoever pooped in it. Cat, usually, not saying always.

And as a special holiday offer, Whisker is offering up to $100 off Litter-Robot bundles. And as a special offer to our listeners, you can get an additional $50 off when you go to StopScooping.com slash more news. This is Litter-Robot's best offer ever. It's time to make your home smell like it doesn't contain a box of mostly animal feces. Or perhaps this holiday, give the gift of not smelling like poop.

And that's with the Litter-Robot by Whisker. So again, that's up to $100 off Litter Robot bundles and an additional $50 off when you go to StopScooping.com slash more news. That is StopScooping.com slash more news. Arrgh! Them holiday winds are blowin'! Disgusting, smelly winds. I watch them blowing through my yard. Some holiday winds are blowing! Disgusting, smelly winds.

I watch them blowing through my yard. I sit in my home. And I watch them and I learn. And I do that thanks to SimpliSafe. They are the easiest and bestest way to keep an eye on your home. Because while crime isn't high right now, there are many reasons someone might want a little extra protection. And with SimpliSafe's Active Guard Outdoor Protection, they can be alerted before something happens.

Their live agents can see and talk to people in real time. There is no long-term contracts and no cancellation fees. I like things that are easy. And this, my friends, a one of those things. And hey, Simply Safe is extending its massive Black Friday deal for our audience. This week only you can take 50% off any new system with a select professional monitoring plan.

This is your last chance to claim their best offer of the year. So head to simply safe.com slash more news to claim your discount and make sure your home is safe this season. Don't wait, this offer won't last long. Keep your home, your family, and your peace of mind protected with Simply Safe because that's right. Hey, it's Cody.

I don't know about you, but all this news makes my balls smell. It's hard news carrying all this news, hard on the balls. That's why I like a good spritz of Mando and their whole body deodorant. That's deodorant for anywhere on your body that they claim is clinically proven

to block odor for up to 72 hours. They have a starter pack. Mando's starter pack is perfect for new customers. It's right there in the name. It's the how you start, the pack of how you start. It comes with a solid stick deodorant, cream tube deodorant, two free products of your choice, and free shipping.

Enjoy their many nose flavors, like Mount Fuji, Clover Woods, and bourbon leather. Make your balls smell like a fancy couch. Like a couch that the president would sit on, or a couch that the vice president would be a little too cozy with. And as a special offer for listeners, new customers get $5 off a starter pack

with our exclusive code. That equates to over 40% off your starter pack. Use code morenews at shopmando.com. That's S-H-O-P-M-N-D-O.com. Please support our show and tell them we sent you. Because we did. I think it is time for us to discuss your book while we're talking about Evangelical Christians and Christian nationalists trying to actually their beliefs on everyone. Mm-hmm Well, it's yeah, it is an interesting like

in many ways the current makeup of the Supreme Court is You know, you've got your Catholic extremists, you've got your evangelicals. In many ways, it's sort of the apotheosis of a very long project of judicial capture from the Christian right that's been ongoing, like, since, you know, the 70s, and this is where we are now. And to me, it's not at all coincidental that one of the, you know, that some of the landmark horror decisions they're making are about gender roles, stripping away bodily autonomy, because if you look at a lot of the internal texts in these highly religious

communities that form like a huge part of the Republican base and and more to the point, the part that always turns out to vote in a country where not turning out to vote is always the big winner in elections. Um, this highly motivated religious minority is fucking obsessed with policing how everybody does gender and sex. Like, um, and they have lots of theological rationales for it, but essentially they want to make it illegal to do gender and sex in any other way than like overweening patriarchal father, submissive co-enforcer mom, pathologically submissive co-enforcer mom, and children as property.

And that's it. That's the one family model that is permitted. And keep tabs on on a masturbation app. I mean, come on. Sure, why not? Who among us? Talia, in your book, just gonna remind our viewers and listeners

that it's called Wild Faith. Wild Faith, Wild Faith. Keep saying it, let's make it a best seller. In Wild Faith, you describe a war that's going on that we're all a part of whether we like it or not. Tell us a little bit about this war, please. Who are the people waging this war? Who are the warriors?

You, Katie Stoll, and you, Cody Johnson, and you, Jonathan. Little did you know this, but you are a soldier in Lucifer's army against the just and good. I'm a demon. We were drafted by Satan. They're literally calling me a demon. No, you're just in the thrall of demons. It's a little different.

You may have some demonic influence. Sure. You yourself are probably not a demon. I mean, hard to tell. But demons come not, you yourself are probably not a demon. I mean, hard to, hard to tell. Uh, but you know, demons come in many guises, but, um, essentially the, the doctor that, that I kind of open with is, um, is called spiritual warfare. It's really like common in among tens of millions of Americans, especially the most politically engaged ones

who form sort of the most robust base of the Republican Party. And the fundamental central belief is that there's a small, righteous Christian remnant who are wielding, who are waging this war for God and to make America a kingdom of God. And they're fighting against the pernicious influence of Lucifer and his minions and the demon krauts, which, by the way, for a lot of people is a totally literal. Right. That's the thing. Because we use the term demon kind of liberally, and we have fun with name calling, I guess. But that is-

Progressively. Yes, exactly. Wokely. But they do mean it many times. They do actually mean it. Like literal demons. I'm sure you've seen Tucker Carlson talk about the demon attack that he experienced. That was fascinating.

Yeah, and the thing about that is that Tucker is very good at knowing which way the wind is blowing on the right and knowing who to appeal to. And there's a reason why he's talking about America needing a spanking and he's claiming to have these demon visitations. He is appealing straight to the priorities of the Christian right. This, and particularly the sort of, like, very florid, very politically active, charismatic wing of evangelicalism,

of evangelicalism that is really obsessed with the idea that, you know, we're all engaged in a war of the spirit at all times. And you have to don the whole armor of God and make a kingdom of Christ on earth right here right now through policy and through acquiring temporal power. So that's what we're up against. And it sounds outlandish, but like I did so much reading and so much talking to so many folks who came out of this world. It's not outlandish is what I'm reacting to.

It's just that it's not necessarily in everybody's face on a day-to-day basis, but it's so much more pervasive than I think so many people even can wrap their minds around. In my experience, so I wrote a book about neo-Nazis, cult culture warlords, I then wrote this beautiful thing. Wild faith. Wild faith.

On sale now. The big lesson I learned from nearly a decade of kind of diving into the most extreme of the extreme is like when someone tells you what they believe, they probably believe that and especially when you're looking at internal texts within communities so that like if you're looking at novels and manuals and sermons by and for evangelicals like that's an authentic expression of belief and so many people in the media class and who just like don't believe that the world is engaged in a Manichaean spiritual conflict between Lucifer and the embattled soldiers of Christ are inclined to think that's nuts and weird.

And I get it. Like, it is informing politics right now. Uh, you know, so that many of the decisions about voting and some of the decisions made by these political appointees are informed by the set of beliefs that again, like may see are very alien to the secular rationalist perspective, but when we say like, Oh, they can't really believe that, you know, when everyone's a secret secular rationalist, it's a very profound myopia that I've experienced among the media class and sort of the general kind of liberal class for a long time. And the people who are the most insightful about this are former evangelicals

who are just like, I came out of that world, I walked through fire, and I'm telling you, this is what they believe in, this is what they want to impose. And they want to make this a kingdom of Christ. And so you really see this desire to control politics and family, you know, and win these arenas over for God and media and all this stuff, really to make these part of God's kingdom. You see it in, you know, it's like people will say like, oh, well, what about the separation of church and state? I'm like, what about it? What about it? If you live in Idaho and if you live in Iowa, if you live in Kansas, if you live in any

state with a red trifecta, you're functionally living in a theocracy, a Christian theocracy. I mean, I was thinking that as you said it, like, what about that? I'm like, yeah, I do always think about that. But yeah, you're right. What about that? I'm like, yeah, I do always think about that. But yeah, you're right. What about it? I mean, that means something to me. And it, I would think that it would mean something to the rest of the country because just like, oh, your right to bear arms are right to freedom of speech. That is a founding principle literally baked into the identity of American culture. But that's the one that's gotta go, not the guns.

Yeah, well, the Christianity in this version that we're talking about is in so many people's minds, that is the foundation of America. Oh, I know, I know. And it's so apparent. Yeah, and like you're talking, Talia, I was struck by this one part of your book where you're talking about,

like as an example, in Oklahoma last year, there was that bill to ban physical punishment of disabled students. And Jim Olson gave a speech basically saying like, no, this is a bad bill. God wants this. And he like read some scripture to prove that actually abusing kids is actually kind of good. And he read the scripture and the bill did not pass. Right, yeah. And it's like that is just everywhere in these areas and they don't pretend to not have these views.

They use them to affect legislation that was going to protect disabled students from being physically punished. Like it's wild. So it is wild. And you're right. That's myopic. Not being able to see how much this does actually tangibly influence policy, people's lives

on a day-to-day basis. Also think that framing this as a war is very important for people to understand because someone who is from this world may soon be, maybe still in charge of the Defense Department and the Pentagon. Pete Hegseth is a, there's a New York Times headline today, Pete Hegseth and his battle cry for a new Christian crusade. There you go. Crusades. Yeah, Deus Volt, which is beloved of white supremacists, white supremacist Christians, all of that.

I mean, yeah, and he has also ties to some real nutty folks, I mean, whatever, not to insult them mentally, comparing us to this group. No, there's this Idaho, nothing good ever happens in Idaho. I mean, they've got some beautiful nature. Built to spill. And good potatoes.

Built to spill. But every, as someone who's just been researching far-right extremism for so long, like Idaho comes up like way more often than it should, given it's relatively small population. Anyway, there's a sort of project, they're called Christian Reconstructionists and they're building something called the American Redoubt

in the Pacific Northwest. It's centered in Moscow. The American what? Redoubt. Redoubt. Like a fortress. Great. R-E-D American what? Read out. Read out. Like a fortress. Great. R-E-D-O-U-B-T. It's led by this guy named Doug Wilson. And it's sort of like this idea of we're going to build like a little Christian kingdom in the Pacific Northwest in Idaho.

And they're explicitly believe that in Christian reconstructionism, which is this theology that explicitly believe that in Christian reconstructionism, which is this theology that like, um, uh, American jurisprudence should be based on biblical law. Um, so that sodomy should have the death penalty of, of stoning to death, for example. Uh, and, and Hegseth is like, I'll tie it up with these folks. Like, yeah, he's really the, like at the bleeding edge of the, the Christian nationalist, uh, crew. I mean, I hope his own, like, he's like at the bleeding edge of the Christian nationalist crew. I mean, I hope his own, he's too drunk for Fox News. No, his mom says he's fine.

On his third wife. His mom says he'll be nice. And on his third wife, that he's cheated on all of his wives. So whatever, I mean. Look at the good Christian man should. His mom says he'll be nice. After she called him abusive, an abuser. Like hypocrisy rarely ever matters to people whose will is power.

And like, it also drives me wild. But also the power of an accusation of hypocrisy matters to the like matters in inverse proportion to the standing of the person who's issuing it so that if like you know so that if you are within this world of Christian nationalism you view people who are outside it as heathens or demon aligned or whatever like in other words like if someone that you don't care about and that you think is an idiot and that you think is possibly malign or evil is like, you're a hypocrite, you're just like, shut up. Who are you? Go away. You're chaff and I am golden wheat. But like the thing is, Ron DeSantis is the the the backup, right? And that's interesting to me. Backup to be humiliated and then cast aside. He was obviously a lawyer at Guantanamo Bay during his much vaunted military service, which is I think like the, like, torture

lawyer is like the least like dignified, like, like military service you could possibly have. But, but, um, the other thing about DeSantis, and this is what I say about him in the book, is that he never met a suit that liked him or an evangelical that didn't. Like he launched his campaign for president at Hillsdale College, which is like one of the most,

like they're sort of really into this Christian reshaping of the American education system. They're really prominent. He's been a stalwart ally to evangelicals in Florida. He is very enmeshed in the Christian right power system. So it's like, yeah, you either get the guy with the deus volt tattoo and the drinking problem, or you get the guy in like the, you know, like cowboy boots with lifts in them who like also is really close friends with, with, you know, these same people.

So- Both bad. The torture lawyer. Well, Donald Trump is a dove, you see. He's anti-war and he's gonna, he's gonna bring us into a new age of prosperity, you see. Please stop, my eye rolling muscles are going to get strained. Oh, I'm so sorry.

No, it's just interesting. And people also, you know, the hypocrisy thing has been interesting. These folks have been with him since 2016. I mean, this is the third election in a row where white evangelicals in particular gave like Saddam Hussein voting numbers to Donald Trump. It was 82% to 17%. I mean, that's like, that's Ba'athist right there, right? That's like, you know, oh yes, the mayor of Kursk is elected, you know, and is affiliated with Putin's party. What a shock. But these are the numbers.

And it's like, okay. The sort of why of it hasn't really been a question since 2016. But basically, this is a very savvy, power savvy crew. You know, since the 70s when they were like, okay, we may have initially mobilized when the IRS decided to strip some Christian segregation academies of tax exemptions, but we got to find a new struggle, teamed up with the Catholic right, adopted abortion as their struggle. I mean, as late as 1973, the Southern Baptist Convention voted in favor of Roe v. Wade. They're like, that's fine. Abortion is a weird Catholic issue. We don't care about it. But then, you know, they were like, okay, cool. We can feminism, and also get this moral imprimatur

of like a new civil rights movement for the unborn and like give a lot of gravitas to our being weird about sex and race. So like the sexism and the racism have well have always been intertwined in this movement. And in many ways, what we're seeing is the full efflorescence of this movement. But there was in 2016, this moment where, you know, okay, can we as like the sort of self appointed moral guardians of America vote for the grab them by the pussy guy? You know, what a week. What a week that was. God. And there was some hesitation. And especially in a movement that's really inculcates all of its kids with chastity and purity and and all this stuff in ways that later come to scar them forever. Lots of fears. Yeah.

And then they're voting for this sexual assault or adulterer. And the way that that was justified at the time is you had all of these figures who were aligned with the modern prophecy movement, who consider themselves prophets. And they were saying, well, you know, the best parallel with Trump is if you look at like the, you know, the book of Isaiah, there's prophecies about the Persian emperor Cyrus, who was a heathen, but nonetheless allowed the Jews to return from exile and build the second temple. Setting aside the whole evangelicals think they're the real Jews thing, which as a Jew I find kind of weird.

But the idea was that Donald Trump, like Cyrus, was a heathen, but God's vessel, right? Exactly. That was 2016. And then the question was how can they stick with him throughout that? I'm like, he gave them what they wanted. He's doing exactly what he did. He gave them what they wanted. He overturned Roe.

He's serving their purpose. He moved the, you know, the embassy, the American embassy from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem, like specifically to like further their weird and times apocalyptic just fantasies. Absolutely. Uh, yeah. And so, and so the answer to like, why have evangelical states are loyal to Donald Trump

is because, um, that's a mutual backscratching like, like kind of situation. He's like, I kind of think you're weird freaks, but I'll get preyed upon and preyed over, and I will do whatever you want, and that's fine. Yeah, he's a deal maker. And I'll sell you my Bibles. Yeah, and I'll sell you Bibles, and also, it's not like the oppression of women and children is something

that's gonna keep him awake at night. So it's like a win-win. So, you know, the question of like why, why these, they have flocked to him and their millions is like not particularly mysterious. It just becomes, it only becomes mysterious if you take them at their word, as much of the American press does, they are in fact the sort of moral guardians of the US and the real Americans and the soul of America, etc. etc. The moral majority. Which they're fucking not.

They're just weird about sex and they want to be weird about sex by law. Yeah. And make you, you have to... They want you to be weird about sex too. They want everybody to be weird about sex. Yeah. They want everybody to be weird about sex, too. They want everybody to be weird about sex. Yeah, they want everybody to be weird about sex. And entrapped in horrific things. So what you're going to see from them going forward is first,

it starts with trans rights because they're this visible minority because all of this respectable commentary has been put forth, you know, casting doubt on trans ideology. But you're going to immediately see a call for the repeal of gay marriage. You're going to see an attack on birth control. You're going to see attacks on no-fault divorce. There will be travel bans on women, you know, seeking abortions in other states as Idaho. Speaking of my favorite state, their travel ban for minors

going to other states has been instated. And it's very hard staring down the barrel of this and knowing what's coming because I've been researching this stuff for years. You've been researching this for so long. Yeah. It's like watching the train coming, approaching, approaching, approaching, and now it's here. I would say this, and my big argument for why you should read my book even though it's

a rough ride, first of all, I'm as angry as you are. I'm as weirded out as you are, and I am as furious as you are. And second of all, you can't dodge the train that's coming if you think it's a motorcycle. If you don't know the shape of the things that are coming, you don't know how to defend yourself. Yeah, for sure. Well, we have to wrap this up. I mean, I could keep talking about this for a long

time, but we got to get this to our editor so he can release it tomorrow. Talia, thank you so much for joining us and working with us on schedule stuff. Please, please, please tell our listeners and viewers where they can find you, where they can find the book, follow you, all the things. Yeah, well thanks again for having me on. I think the last time you had me on, I had also just released a very depressing book. You had.

Right before US election. So, you know, I got the timing. Everyone's like, cool, I want stuff that will make me sad right now. Depressing. Like I said, forewarned is forearmed. Even if you're only four weeks forewarned. But anyway, you can find the book wherever books are sold. If you enjoy the dulcet sounds of my voice, I actually read the audio book. Nice. I did little voices.

I did Texan accent for Rick Perry. So that was fun. And then I also write a newsletter called The Sword and the Sandwich. It is on button down, but search The Sword and the Sandwich. Just rolls off the sandwich. It is on button down, but you know, search the sword and the sandwich just rolls off the tongue. But I write about politics and I also write about sandwiches, like very literal sandwiches. I for years, literally now I have been documenting Wikipedia's

list of notable sandwiches in alphabetical order. I'm up to my one8th sandwich. You have to do, you have to cover the sword and the sandwich, otherwise you'll go crazy. Absolutely. It's about balance in this life. Yeah. And so if you want like a piece of writing that might bring you some comfort in this moment, I wrote an essay about grilled cheese that's in this year's best American food and travel rating. And Padma Lakshmi said it was so beautiful it made her cry. So that's- That's some high praise.

I'm dining out on that. I'm dining out on that for the rest of my life. I'd be like, I've peaked. Yeah. That's such great praise. Yeah. Well, thank you so much for having me on. Thank you. And take care. And yeah, before I go, I have to tell you guys at home,

and I mean it this time. Maybe not the other times. I guess I've always meant it. Oh, whoa. I don't know, I was trying to be funny. I'm just gonna tell them that I love them very much. Much. I knew it. So do.

["The Star-Spangled Banner"] For years, Tim Ballard has been championed as a modern-day superhero. The first time I saw one of the kids from the video, and it like changed my life. He was the face of Operation Underground Railroad, a movement that inspired hope around the world by rescuing children from human traffickers. However, Ballard's crusade to save innocent lives has always hidden a darker secret. Well, I think he's a pathological liar. Beneath the accolades and the applause, a dark storm has been brewing.

I mean, I can't find a time that he's told the truth about anything. Shocking allegations of sexual misconduct have surfaced, casting a shadow over his once unquestioned reputation. I am host Sarah James McLaughlin, and in this new season of The Opportunist, we explore the rise and the fall of Tim Ballard. Join us this October for Tim Ballard Unmasking a Hero. Subscribe to a new season of The Opportunist now, wherever you get your podcasts.