Something You Should Know - How to Beat Distractions That Eat Up Your Time & A Positive Way to Fix Problems

Episode Date: September 16, 2019

A lot of people claim to be allergic to penicillin. In fact 1 out of 10 do. Most of those people are wrong and this episode begins with the explanation why. https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/do-you-really-have-a-penicillin-allergy-2019022616017 More than ever, it is so easy to be tempted by distractions. So how do you stay focused and on task when temptations abound? With some really good suggestions is Nir Eyal. He is a writer and investor who has taught at the Stanford Graduate School of Business and his is author of the book Indistractable: How to Control Your Attention and Choose Your Life (https://amzn.to/2O5mEaT). Nir joins me with some very practical advice that will help keep distractions away. When thin families sit down and eat together, they do it a little differently than everyone else. Listen to discover how their eating habits help them stay thin as a family. http://www.eatthis.com/meal-habits-of-thin-families Do you know about positive psychology? It’s the idea of – rather than focus on what’s wrong and try to fix it, it is best to start by identifying what’s right and build on that. Tal Ben Shahar is one of the leading proponents of positive psychology. He is a writer and lecturer and author of the book Choose the Life You Want (https://amzn.to/34KXuUX). He also offers a course to become a certified happiness trainer. You can learn more here: https://www.happinessstudies.academy/ This Week's Sponsors -Native. For 20% off your first purchase of Native deodorant go to www.nativedeodorant.com and use promo code: SYSK  -Daily Harvest. For $25 off your first box go to www.dailyharvest.com and use promo code: something -Babbel. To learn a language go to www.Babbel.com and get a whole year of access to Babbel for as low as $3.50 a month! -SimpliSafe. Get free shipping and a money back guarantee go to www.SimpliSafe.com/something -LinkedIn. For $50 off you first job post, go to www.LinkedIn.com/podcast Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

As a listener to Something You Should Know, I can only assume that you are someone who likes to learn about new and interesting things and bring more knowledge to work for you in your everyday life. I mean, that's kind of what Something You Should Know was all about. And so I want to invite you to listen to another podcast called TED Talks Daily. Now, you know about TED Talks, right? Many of the guests on Something You Should Know have done TED Talks. Well, you see, TED Talks Daily is a podcast that brings you a new TED Talk every weekday in less than 15 minutes. Join host Elise Hu.

She goes beyond the headlines so you can hear about the big ideas shaping our future. Learn about things like sustainable fashion, embracing your entrepreneurial spirit, the future of robotics, and so much more. Like I said, if you like this podcast, Something You Should Know, I'm pretty sure you're going to like TED Talks Daily. And you get TED Talks Daily wherever you get your podcasts. Today on Something You Should Know, a lot of people claim to be allergic to penicillin, and almost all of them are wrong. Then, how not to be tempted by all the distractions in life.

The studies find that only about a third of people out there actually even keep a calendar. Well, the fact is you can't call something a distraction unless you know what it distracted you from. So if your calendar is just white blank space, you have no right to say you got distracted. Plus, the interesting ways thin families eat together and understanding positive psychology and how it can help. So if I go to a therapist today, a traditional therapist, the first question she'll ask me is, what's wrong, what's not working in your life?

Where positive psychology differs is that it starts with what is working. So a positive psychologist, a therapist, will begin by asking, what's working in your life? What's going well? All this today on Something You Should Know. Since I host a podcast, it's pretty common for me to be asked to recommend a podcast. And I tell people, if you like Something You Should Know, you're going to like The Jordan Harbinger Show. Every episode is a conversation with a fascinating guest.

Of course, a lot of podcasts are conversations with guests, but Jordan does it better than most. Recently, he had a fascinating conversation with a British woman who was recruited and radicalized by ISIS and went to prison for three years. She now works to raise awareness on this issue. It's a great conversation. And he spoke with Dr. Sarah Hill about how taking birth control not only prevents pregnancy, it can influence a woman's partner preferences, career choices, and overall behavior due to the hormonal changes it causes. Apple named The Jordan Harbinger Show one of the best podcasts a few years back, and in a nutshell, the show is aimed at making you a better, more informed critical thinker.

Check out The Jordan Harbinger Show. There's so much for you in this podcast. The Jordan Harbinger Show on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Would you ever write an email telling someone how much you like a deodorant? Well, I've actually received email from listeners who have heard me talk about native deodorant, bought it, and loved it. And it's no wonder. First of all, it works, which is the main reason I use it, and anyone would use it. I mean, it's got to work. Plus, it's made from ingredients found in nature.

Coconut oil, shea butter, tapioca starch to absorb wetness. And it was developed with no animal testing. I use it because I've read ingredient labels on other deodorants, and I just don't want things like aluminum and other chemicals being absorbed into my skin. You probably don't either, and it's risk-free to try. They offer free returns and exchanges in the USA. Their classic deodorant scents include coconut and vanilla, lavender and rose, cucumber and mint, and eucalyptus and mint. Now for 20% off your first purchase of Native Deodorant, visit nativedeodorant.com and use promo code SYSK during checkout.

And maybe you'll write me an email telling me how much you love it. That's 20% off your first purchase of Native Deodorant. Go to NativeDeodorant.com and use promo code SYSK during checkout. Something you should know. Fascinating intel. The world's top experts. And practical advice you can use in your life. Today, Something You Should Know with Mike Carruthers. top experts and practical advice you can use in your life today something you should know with mike carothers hi i i don't know if i sound funny to you i i do to me in my own head because

i've been sick for the last several days had the flu i think and and this just happened to me because i had the flu i went to the doctor. And as often happens, the doctor asked me, are you allergic to penicillin? And I'm not allergic, never have been allergic to penicillin. But the fact is that one out of ten people claim they are. And as it turns out, almost all of them are not. Why are so many people wrong about being allergic to penicillin? Well, one reason is, like other allergies, you can outgrow it. But more likely, a doctor told you you were allergic

to penicillin when you were a kid because after taking it, you may have developed a rash or an upset stomach or some other symptom. But these are not allergic reactions to penicillin necessarily, they're just side effects of it. And the only way to tell if you're truly allergic is to be tested by an allergist. Penicillin and similar antibiotics can be very effective, but if you keep telling your doctor you're allergic to it, you may be settling for a less effective and more costly drug, and it may be completely unnecessary. So if you think you're allergic to penicillin, there's a good chance you're not, and you should probably get tested. And that is something you should know.

Okay, so the premise here is that we live in a world full of distractions. And isn't it interesting that those distractions take on this allure and desirability at exactly the time when you don't need them to? How many times have you had to do something important, but all of a sudden you have to go check Facebook or Instagram or the weather? Distractions are so often the enemy. They keep us from getting the important things done. So what can we do to coexist peacefully with distractions since they're not going away anytime soon? Well, enter Nir Eyal.

Nir is a writer and investor. He's taught at the Stanford Graduate School of Business. He sold two technology companies, and he is also a successful author. His latest book is called Indistractable, How to Control Your Attention and Live Your Life. Hi, Nir. Thank you so much. Great to be here. So why are we so easily distractible? But not only that, why do distractions become more attractive at exactly the wrong time?

Why, when you sit down to do your taxes, do you all of a sudden have to clean the closet that you haven't cleaned in three years? Well, it turns out it's not a new problem. Socrates and Aristotle talked about akrasia, this tendency that we have to do things against our better interests. So while we may think that it's Facebook and YouTube and Google doing it to us, there has been this constant problem of distraction for as long as recorded history. designed for satisfaction. What makes our species so amazing and keeps us striving for more is this perpetual disquietude. The fact that we always want more means that we are never satisfied. The idea, though, is to harness this innate tendency that we have to never be satisfied for good as opposed to letting it get the best of us. Yeah, well, that certainly makes sense. It does seem, though, that today there are, I mean, if you lived 300 years ago in a cabin in the woods,

the number of distractions would be seemingly limited compared to what they are today. That today, in particular, the possible distractions are almost infinite. That's right. And I think that Kierkegaard said it really well when he said that anxiety is the dizziness of freedom. We have so much choice these days. We have so many options.

There's endless websites and videos and news stories to consume every day. It's dizzying. So while these technologies are new, and the fact is these days, if you don't figure out how to control distraction, if you don't figure out how to put distraction in its place, there is no doubt they are going to get you. I mean, they understand what makes you click and what makes you tick better than you understand yourself.

That doesn't mean that we're powerless. And in fact, you know, what I like to tell folks is that the antidote to impulsiveness is forethought. So we can use some very basic principles to put technology and put all distraction in its place. So we're not powerless by any means. And so how do you do that in a maybe in a philosophical way? I mean, what's the general principle of putting distraction in its place? Yeah, so I really wanted to map out the psychology of distraction because, you know, if we really take a step back, we all basically know what to do to get the things we want in life, right? If we want to be healthy, we have to eat right and exercise. If we want to have close relationships, we need to be fully present with those we love. If we want to do well at our job, we have to just do the work. However, what I think we don't talk about enough is why don't

we do these things? What are the barriers to doing what it is we know we should? And it turns out that there are these four basic strategies that when we use in order, allows us to become indistractable, allows us to put distraction in its place. The first step and the most important is understanding that distraction starts from within. That we like to blame the latest technology as generation after generation has done, right? From the iPhone to the television to the radio to the written word. All of these things were supposed to melt our brains and make us more distractible. But it turns out that really distraction starts from within. And so that has to be the first step because, you know, if we start at first principles,

not just why do we get distracted, why do we do anything? The reason we do anything, you know, most people will tell you that the seat of motivation is the desire for pleasure and the avoidance of pain, you know, the old carrot and stick. Turns out that neurologically, that's not actually true. That neurologically speaking, it's pain all the way down. That all human behavior is a desire to escape discomfort. It's called the homeostatic response. And so that means, if that's true, that all human behavior is a desire to escape discomfort, even the pursuit of pleasure, by the way, desire, wanting, craving, feels uncomfortable, that's what spurs us to action. If that's true that all behavior is a desire to escape discomfort, what that means is that time management is pain management. And if we don't start with what are we trying to escape with distraction, right? In my case, I was with my daughter one day and I found that I was checking my device

as opposed to being fully present with her. I wish I could say it was Facebook and my iPhone doing it to you. But if I'm totally honest, the icky, sticky, uncomfortable truth is that I was looking for emotional relief, for emotional escape from that situation. And so that's where we have to start. That's the very first step. I mentioned in the beginning that phenomenon that happens when you have something that's important to do, that that closet that you haven't cleaned and haven't bothered to clean

or thought to clean for years, that all of a sudden you've got to clean that closet. Well, why? What is that? What's going on there that makes that chore become so desirable to do when it hasn't been for years? You know, that's a very good segue into the second step of how we become indistractable, which is about making time for traction. So in order to define what is distraction, what does that word even mean, it's helpful to look at the opposite of distraction. The opposite of distraction is traction. So traction is anything you do with intent, anything you plan to do. And I'm not one of these, you know, people on their high horse that says, you know, my pastime is morally superior to your pastime, right? That video games are somehow bad and, you know, watching a sports game on TV is somehow good and morally superior. I don't think that's correct. How people spend their time in whatever way, fashion they choose is up to them if it's consistent with their values and done with intent.

So I like to say that the time you plan to waste is not wasted time if you planned that time. So in my case, for example, I had this very bad habit of constantly checking email throughout the day. And this was coming at the cost of spending time with my friends, my family. I was constantly getting distracted from something I wanted to do, even my work, right? You know, a lot of us, we lie to ourselves and say, oh, email, that's productive. That's kind of a worky thing to do. But if what you wanted to do was to work on that big project or concentrate on writing that report and you constantly check email, well, that too is a distraction because it's something you didn't intend to do. So that's the idea. It's not about moralizing these technologies as good or evil.

It's about asking yourself, what do I want to do? What's consistent with my values? And then making sure you do the things you say you're going to do. I'm speaking today with Nir Eyal. By the way, he spells that N-I-R Eyal, E-Y-A-L. He's author of the book Indistractable. Contained herein are the heresies of Rudolf Buntwine, erstwhile monk turned traveling medical investigator. Join me as I study the secrets of the divine plagues and uncover the blasphemous truth that ours is not a loving God

and we are not its favored children. The heresies of Rudolf Bantwine, wherever podcasts are available. People who listen to Something You Should Know are curious about the world, looking to hear new ideas and perspectives. So I want to tell you about a podcast that is full of new ideas and perspectives, and one I've started listening to called Intelligence Squared. So I want to tell you about a podcast that is full of new ideas and perspectives, and one I've started listening to called Intelligence Squared. It's the podcast where great minds meet. Listen in for some great talks on science, tech, politics, creativity, wellness, and a lot more.

A couple of recent examples, Mustafa Suleiman, the CEO of Microsoft AI, discussing the future of technology. That's pretty cool. And writer, podcaster, and filmmaker John Ronson discussing the rise of conspiracies and culture wars. Intelligence Squared is the kind of podcast that gets you thinking a little more openly about the important conversations going on today. Being curious, you're probably just the type of person Intelligence Squared is meant for. Check out Intelligence Squared wherever you get your podcasts. So, Nir, you spoke a moment ago about being intentional, and I think that's really interesting because a lot of times, oh, I can speak for myself that I will succumb to a distraction under the guise of I'm taking a break. I need to take, I can't work eight hours straight.

So I'm going to take a break and maybe check Facebook. Well, am I taking a break or am I being distracted? So great point. So the question is, did you plan to do that? So in my schedule, every evening after dinner, it literally says on my calendar, social media time. That's the time I devote to checking Facebook and YouTube and Twitter. I enjoy it. They're great. They add a lot of value to my life. They help me stay in touch with my readers, with my friends. They're wonderful.

But I use them with intent on my schedule, not with the app maker's schedule. In contrast to what I used to do, every time I was, you know, I've been a writer now for several years, and every time I start writing, it's hard, right? I frequently feel these internal triggers, these uncomfortable emotional states, boredom, anxiety, fatigue, uncertainty, and I want to escape. And so what I was doing is, oh, let me just check Facebook for a minute, or let me just check the news for a quick second, or let me just Google something. And that was a distraction. So the idea is, if you make time for these things, you know, the studies find that only

about a third of people out there actually even keep a calendar. Well, the fact is you can't call something a distraction unless you know what it distracted you from. So if your calendar is just, you know, white blank space, you have no right to say you got distracted because you didn't plan what it was you wanted to do. So now I use this technique called time boxing, which basically uses this psychological technique called setting an implementation intention, which has been studied time and time again to be a very effective way to make sure you do what you say you're going to do. And that blocks out literally every minute of my day. I have this template that I use that allows me to understand what is the difference between traction and distraction for me.

If it's on my calendar, if it's what I plan to do, by the way, traction and distraction for me. If it's on my calendar, if it's what I plan to do, by the way, it can be planning to do nothing, right? It's totally okay to put time on your calendar, to daydream, to go on a walk, to meditate, whatever it is you want to do. But now you know the difference between traction and distraction. Now you can look at it and say, if I'm doing what I plan to do with intent, it's traction. If it's anything else, it's a distraction. Yeah, but wait a minute. It does seem somewhat personality-driven in the sense that I could never plan out every moment of my day.

I couldn't do it. That's not who I am. I've never done it. The thought of doing it creeps me out. And so why not just build in breaks into your day that, okay, at this point, I'm going to take a break and decide then whether it's going to be Facebook or go for a walk or whatever. Sure. If you want to put time in your day to say break time, that's totally fine. Again, I'm not going to tell you how to spend your time, but I advise to spend it with intentionality. Now, what you mentioned about, you know, that's not who I am. Respectfully, that's actually a myth. It's one of the things I talk about are the three steps that you can take

to master these internal triggers is to reimagine your temperament. So many of us, myself included, before I did this research, had these these these these self images that we carry around with us that are actually not really based on fact there is no such thing as this is who i am the only thing we know that psychology supports is the big five personality traits but what we tend to tell ourselves is i have an addictive personality or a short attention span or I like to be spontaneous. And that's all fine and well if it's serving you.

But if you have this problem of distraction, as many of us do, of I don't get done everything I want to do in my day, I constantly am taking to-do lists and moving them from one day to the next to the next, if that's a problem for you, then maybe I would ask you to consider is that temperament, is that self-image that you, then maybe I would ask you to consider, is that temperament, is that self-image that you have for yourself really serving you? One of the most pernicious myths that people believe out there is this idea of ego depletion. Now, they may not know it's called ego depletion, but a few years ago, there was these studies done that willpower is a diminishing resource, like a gas in a gas tank. You use it up. Well,

it turns out that recently, psychologists can't replicate these studies. It turns out that ego depletion, this idea that you run out of willpower, is really a myth. And, you know, I used to believe, I didn't know it was called ego depletion, but I would come home after work, after a long day, I'm so tired, I'm so exhausted, I'm spent, and I can't make any more decisions. I can't, you know, expend any more willpower because I've run out. So I'll go on the couch and watch some Netflix and grab a Ben and Jerry's pint of ice cream. It turns out the only people who are actually affected by ego depletion, according to these studies conducted at Stanford, are people who believe in ego depletion. So if you believe that your willpower is spent, you act accordingly.

And so this is a really important thing to remember, especially in this day and age now that, you know, we're being told that technology is addicting us and hijacking our brains and there's nothing we can do about it. The big bad algorithms are going to get us, that type of thinking is actually hurting us because it is making it true. It's called learned helplessness. And so what I want to do is to empower folks to be able to counteract these distractions but know that they have the power, that there are some simple things we can do, these four basic steps to become indistractable.

All right, and well, I think we got to number two, so let's finish them. Sure, so step number one is to master the internal triggers. Step number two is to make time for traction. Turn your values into time. Spend that time however you wish, but make sure it's on your calendar in some way, shape, or form.

The third step is to hack back external triggers. And so these are the things that we are very familiar with, you know, these things in our environment, the pings, dings, rings, and things that prompt us to either traction or distraction. So if you receive a message on your phone while you're with your daughter, as I was, and it pulls you to check Facebook, well, that's a distraction. But an external trigger can be very helpful if it pulls you towards traction, if it helps you do something you wanted to do, like go exercise or meet with a friend, whatever it might be. So the idea here, it's not that all external triggers are evil.

It's to ask yourself this fundamental question, is this external trigger serving me or am I serving it? And for the ones that are harmful as opposed to helpful, we have to excise them from our life. We have to hack back. Now, most people think, okay, well, that's my cell phone and my computer, but it turns out that these external triggers are everywhere, right? Probably the worst culprit is the open floor plan office, where people can stop by your desk and interrupt you in the middle of doing focused work. And so I give people techniques for what to do about all of these external triggers. There's eight different types of environments where we encounter these external triggers, and so I help people hack back those

external triggers. And then finally, the last step is to prevent distraction with PACs. PACs are another very well-studied technique where we can use a pre-commitment device. We can make a promise to ourselves in some shape or form to make sure we don't do what we didn't want to do. And we see this all over, right? If we do an advanced healthcare directive or if we invest in a savings account that we can't access without a penalty before we retire, these are pre-commitments. Well, we can do the same thing when it comes to our day-to-day life around distractions. So we can use what's called an effort pact to make a behavior we don't want to do a little bit more difficult.

We can use a price pact to have some kind of cost associated with doing something we don't want to do. Or finally, we can make an Identity Pact where we shape how we see ourselves in a certain way that we want to be consistent with in the future. So those are the three big ways that we can form these pacts. So how do you, though, like in my case in in the work that i do i am often interrupted by phone calls or urgent emails that are not planned i don't have control over who calls me or who emails me with a big so are those distractions or those are just part of my job i guess well it it depends you know what you intended to do with that time if you have time in your day where you're available to take incoming calls, then terrific. But then you say, well, what if it's an emergency? What if it's truly urgent?

Look, there are some reasons that you will get distracted. Becoming indistractable does not mean you never get distracted. It means you strive to do what you say you're going to do. It's about living with personal integrity. You know, so many of us, we would never dream of lying to a friend, right? To be called a liar is a terrible put down. But we lie to ourselves all the time. And so the reason we don't get done what we say we're going to get done, why we don't exercise, why we don't finish that big project, why we don't make enough time for friends or family, is because we don't follow through with what it is we say we're going to do. And that means, sorry, carving out time for the things you really want to do. So if you make yourself available all day and night for just

anyone in the world to capture your attention, they're going to do so. Whether it's your boss, a colleague, your family members, Facebook, what's going on on Twitter, the news. Someone is going to eat up your attention unless you are intentional about carving it out for what you want to do. And that might mean saying, you know what, for 45 minutes, no email, right? That's on my calendar. I'm going to take 45 minutes to do focused work. When I talk to folks and I ask, hey, is doing reflective work part of your job?

Is coming up with creative novel solutions, is that part of your job? Absolutely, they tell me. Well, is it on your calendar? Is time to think, to focus on your calendar? No, I just try and find it somewhere in my day. But of course, it never happens. That time never comes.

And so we have to use these tactics to make sure that we can become indistractable in concert, right? It's about these four basic steps. So if there really is an emergency, if your house is on fire and someone needs to call you, they'll reach you through some means, right? They'll use your phone. They're not going to email you or go on a Slack channel if there really is an emergency. And the nice thing is that today we actually have these technologies that help us filter out the really urgent messages. So I'll give you one very tactical thing you can do. So when I do my focused work, so I, you know, writing to me takes a lot, for me, takes a lot of focus and concentration. When I do that, I push one button on my iPhone and there's this feature that comes with the iPhone that's do not disturb while driving. Now you can customize this message that people will get if they driving. Now you can customize this message that people will get if they text or call you. So someone calls or texts me while I'm doing my focused work time. They get a reply back instantaneously that says, I'm sorry, I'm

indistractable at the moment. If this is urgent, text me the word urgent. And if they text the word urgent, then the message comes back to me. Then it breaks through and gets to me, right? So there are tools and techniques, most of them are absolutely free out there, that we can use to make sure that we get the time we need to do the things that are important to us while still making sure that if something is actually truly important, then that can come through as well. The much more common scenario is the perception, the fear that someone needs to get to you urgently. And in fact, you know what, they can wait 30 minutes or 45 minutes.

Nothing terrible is going to happen. So really, there are two kinds of distractions from what you're saying. There's the kind of distraction where we distract ourself, we let ourselves get pulled away to something else that catches our attention and the kind of distraction that is somebody else very purposefully trying to distract us to do what they want us to do. There are only three reasons why we ever get distracted. Either it's an internal trigger. We distracted ourselves. That's the number one cause of why we get distracted. It's because we're feeling something. We want to escape.

This meeting is boring. My family is boring. I'm stressed about work. This project is hard. And we look for escape. That's the number one reason we get distracted. The second reason is an external trigger. A ping, a ding, a ring, a colleague stopping by, something in your environment that prompts you towards distraction.

The only third other reason is a planning problem where something you wanted to do took longer than you expected. So it's not about beating yourself up and saying, I'm a horrible human being. Oh, my God, I can never become indistractable. With kindness, what we do, we sit down at the end of the week, we look at that template for our ideal week that we made, and we revise it. And we perfect it over time to make sure that we have more time for the things that we didn't get done the week before.

So many of us believe this myth of the to-do list. Just write it down on a to-do list and magically it'll get done. It doesn't work that way because that's the output of our work, not the input. The one thing we have control over is the amount of time we put into a task. So keeping a to-do list is great, but it's only half the job. The other half of the job is to make sure we plan time accordingly on our calendars to do the things on our to-do list. Well, this has been some really good advice on something that affects everybody. Everybody gets distracted and it seems more easily today than ever before.

So it is good to have some ammunition to help fight all the distractions. Nir Eyal has been my guest. He is author of the book, Indistractable, How to Control Your Attention and Live Your Life. You'll find a link to his book at Amazon in the show notes. Thank you, Nir. Oh, my pleasure. Do you love Disney?

Then you are going to love our hit podcast, Disney Countdown. I'm Megan, the Magical Millennial. And I'm the Dapper Danielle. On every episode of our fun and family-friendly show, we count down our top 10 lists of all things Disney. There is nothing we don't cover. We are famous for rabbit holes, Disney-themed games,

and fun facts you didn't know you needed, but you definitely need in your life. So if you're looking for a healthy dose of Disney magic, check out Disney Countdown wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, everyone. Join me, Megan Rinks. And me, Melissa Demonts,

for Don't Blame Me, But Am I Wrong? Each week, we deliver four fun-filled shows. In Don't Blame Me, we tackle our listeners' dilemmas with hilariously honest advice. Then we have But Am I Wrong?, which is for the listeners that didn't take our advice. Plus, we share our hot takes on current events. Then tune in to see you next Tuesday for our Lister poll results from But Am I Wrong? And finally, wrap up your week with Fisting Friday, where we catch up and talk all things pop culture. Listen to Don't Blame Me, But Am I Wrong? on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts.

New episodes every Monday, Tuesday, Thursday, and Friday. So when you think about the whole idea of self-help, the prevailing wisdom or assumption seems to be that what you do is you identify a problem and work to fix it. You figure out what's wrong, you try to make it right. And that's what leads to a happier life. Well, there's this other approach called positive psychology that comes at this a little differently. Rather than start with what's wrong and try to fix it, why not start with what's right and build on that? Well, one of the gurus, thought leaders on this, is a gentleman named Tal Ben-Shahar. He is an author and lecturer who's taught two of the largest classes in Harvard University history.

One was called Positive Psychology and the other, The Psychology of Leadership. Today, Tal consults and lectures around the world to executives as well as the general public, and he has written several books, including one called Choose the Life You Want. He also offers a course in happiness studies that helps people become certified happiness trainers, and I'll have details on how to sign up for that in just a bit. Hi, Tal. Thanks for coming on. Thank you, Mike. Great to be here. So I like this whole idea of positive psychology because I and I know many other people have probably thought that the idea of just dwelling on what's wrong and all the problems and trying to fix why we don't get along and why this doesn't work and all that, then there may be benefit to that.

But why not look at what's right? Because there might be some real answers there. So explain more about what positive psychology is. Yes. So positive psychology essentially is the science of happiness. And the essence is captured by the questions that therapists or researchers or anyone who's creating an intervention asks. And what do I mean by questions? So if I go to a therapist today a traditional therapist the first question that you know she'll ask me is that tell what's wrong what's not working in your life or if I go to a couples counselor with my partner you know the the counselor will ask what's

not working in your relationship or an organizational psychologist will usually begin with what's not working in the company, what are your weaknesses as a manager, as a department. Where positive psychology differs is that it starts with what is working. So a positive psychologist, a therapist would begin by asking what's working in your life, what's going well. A couples counselor would ask what's working in your relationship. You wouldn't be here if nothing was working. Similarly, an organizational consultant would begin by asking, what are your strengths as a manager, as a leader? What's going well in your department and organization?

Start with that and then build on that. It's not about ignoring what is not working. It's simply about starting with and focusing on what is working. And the benefit of doing that is what? There are two benefits. The first benefit is that you do become happier, you do perform better, you accentuate the things that are working. So that's one element. The second element, which is no less important, you actually become more resilient. In other words, when you focus on what is working, you're better able to deal with the things that are not. It strengthens your psychological immune system. Now, what is a psychological immune system? You know, a strong

immune system is not one where we don't get sick. It simply means we get sick less often. And when we do, we recover more promptly. Similarly, when we focus on the positive we strengthen our psychological immune system we become more resilient so it's not just about accent accentuating what is working it's also about better dealing with what is not so so positive psychology doesn't ignore what's wrong it just starts with what's right yeah you. You know, Jack Welsh was once asked, CEO of GE was once asked, what advice do you have for young up and coming managers? And he said, my advice is reality, reality, reality, learn to face reality. And this is what positive psychology is about. It's about looking at reality. The things that are not working need to be looked at, need to be addressed, and the things that are working need to be

addressed too. No less important. And in the world today, are there some things that are not working that are particularly true today that maybe weren't true before that is responsible for a lot of the problems that you see in people or that people talk to you about? Many of the challenges are a result of progress, specifically technology. You know, for example, we know that the number one predictor of happiness, of well-being are relationships, not virtual relationships, but real relationships and unfortunately the relationships are taking a back seat a back seat to a quantifiable success and also backseat to virtual relationships and and and we're paying a very high price levels of

depression anxiety unhappiness in general are at an all-time high because we do not emphasize, because we do not focus on, because we do not cultivate real, genuine, intimate relationships. Something else that technology has led to is that people are more sedentary. They move less because, you know, we can get everything delivered. And there's a price to be paid for that because just as we need oxygen and minerals, we also need to be physically active. It's part of our constitution. It's a human need. And technology has also brought us things like video games and FOMO and all these things that seem to just suck up so much time, which, you know, may or may not be horrible. But if you're doing that, you're not doing something else.

Right. You see, so here's the thing about technology. It really is a double edged sword because on the one hand, technology can be great. I mean, the fact that we're chatting now and that people are listening to us, thanks to technology. I just met my best friend from when we were 12 years old through technology, through social media. And I hadn't seen him for 35 years. So there are many upsides to technology. The issue is the quantity. In moderation, it's great, but we are far exceeding moderation. Our children are far exceeding moderation. And that's where we pay the price. And yet it doesn't seem to be changing. Nothing

seems to be getting better. People are spending more time with technology, not less. No one is seemingly getting any kind of wake-up call about this. Yeah, I think more and more people are talking about it, but in terms of action, very little is being done. And I suspect and fear that things will have to get worse before they get better. Do you think, because I've always thought, that part of the reason that today we have so many problems in relationships, in families, at work, everywhere, is there's this push for perfection,

that everything has to be perfect, it has to be perfect the first time, people can't make mistakes and learn from them that everything must be perfect. And that is, in fact, fueling a lot of the stress today. We're a culture that's been invaded by the perfectionistic mindset. And what does that mean? It means that we're not allowed to fail. We're not allowed to feel sad. We're not allowed to make mistakes. And when that happens, then we also don't experiment and don't learn and increase levels of unhappiness. Because paradoxically, it's when we embrace painful

emotions, it's when we embrace our anxiety and sadness and envy and anger, rather than reject these emotions, that they actually go away. So a perfectionistic mindset is a mindset that cannot accept any deviation from the straight and narrow. And the straight and narrow is usually defined as the life as depicted on social media. You know, constant smiles, perfect family, perfect work, perfect vacation. Everything is just right. And, you know, life is not perfect. So what, in your view, is happiness? What does it mean to be happy?

You know, there are many definitions of happiness. And many people have basically given up on a definition and said, well, it's like beauty. You know it when you see it. I do think there is value to defining happiness and to understanding it for various reasons. The first and probably most important reason is the following. So there's research by Iris Mauss, which shows that people who wake up in the morning and say to themselves, I'm going to be happy, being happy is important for me. These people are actually in the long term, less happy, meaning they actually become lonelier and they're more susceptible to depression. So just saying to ourselves, you know, I want to be happy without understanding what happiness is, is problematic. Why? Because if we want to become happier, we need at the sunlight and it hurts, it burns. However, if we break down

sunlight through a prism into the colors of the rainbow, then we can look at it, then we can enjoy it. It's the same with happiness. If we just see it as, you know, one sort of a black box, we don't know what it is, we just know that we want it, that won't lead to happiness, that will actually hurt us. So going back to the definition, I define happiness as comprising spiritual, physical, intellectual, relational, and emotional well-being. In other words, it's looking at the person as a whole, the elements that make up a person. once again, the spiritual, the physical, the intellectual, the relational, interpersonal, and the emotional, and aspiring towards well-being in each one of these domains. Now, the acronym for these five, just to make it easier to remember,

is SPIRE, spiritual, physical, intellectual, relational, and emotional well-being. Now, when we wake up in the morning and say to ourselves, I want to lead a more spiritual life. In other words, I want to lead a more meaningful life or be more present. You know, that can actually make us happier. If we look at physical well-being, I say to my, well, I'm going to exercise more, eat more healthfully. That will increase my happiness levels. Intellectually, I want to learn more. I'm indulging my curiosity. I am learning more. That contributes to intellectual well-being as well as to overall happiness. Relationships, spend more quality time with people I care about

and who care about me. And finally, emotions, giving place to painful emotions and cultivating pleasurable emotions like gratitude and joy and fun and excitement. These are all indirect ways of becoming happier, just like the rainbow is an indirect way of enjoying the light. So in other words, just trying to be happy doesn't work, but working on the individual pieces of happiness is what makes you happy. Exactly. Exactly right. So just trying to be happy actually will make us less happy. It will backfire.

I've never heard anyone explain it quite that way, but when you think about it, it certainly makes a lot of sense. Because happiness is such a, how do you get your head around that? How to be happy? Well, what is that? You know, how can you be sad and happy at the same time? I mean, people think of those as opposites, but everybody gets sad. Even happy people get sad. That's exactly right. There are actually two kinds of people who don't experience sadness or envy or anger or anxiety. Two kinds of people.

The first kind are the psychopaths. The second kind are dead people. So experiencing painful emotions at times, it's actually a good sign. It means we're not psychopathic and we're alive. Unfortunately, in today's culture, perfectionistic culture, we don't accept this fact. This has got to be particularly tough on younger people, kids, and as they grow up with this kind of pressure, it's got to make, and all these temptations of technology and other things, it's got to make that very difficult. Life's got to be, I would think, harder. I think about this a lot. I have three kids, two of them are teenagers. And

I do think being a teenager today and being a parent today is more difficult in the past. But having said that, I think previous generations thought that too. So I'm not sure if, you know, there is a bias here. But looking at it without comparisons, it is very difficult being a kid today. You know, the magazines and the pictures that they see are of, you know, perfect bodies and perfect lives and immediate success. That puts a lot of pressure on kids as well as on adults because we also, we have a misunderstanding, most adults have misunderstanding of the roots of happiness. The roots of happiness are not getting into a top university. The roots of happiness are not about making a lot of money. The roots of happiness are about cultivating

relationships and leading a healthy life and about finding things that are meaningful to us. These are the roots of happiness, not the external measurements of success. It does seem to me, and it's always interested me, that so much of what seems to be the problem is worrying about the future. And yet we also hear about people towards the end of their life saying that one of their biggest regrets is that they worried too much, and that we all worry too much. And yet it's, for me anyway, it's pretty hard to turn that off. Yeah. So, um, you know, worry is always about the future. If we're, if we are present and we're not worried about the future or, uh, beating ourselves up about the past. Um, so ideally we want to be

in a state where we're in the here and now. The question, though, is how do we get to the state or how are we most likely to get to the state? And paradoxically, it is actually for most people and certainly in the West, it's about having compelling goals that we pursue. Let me use once again an analogy. Let's say I go out on a road trip and I have no idea where I'm going. Well, every minute I will look ahead of me to make sure I'm not, you know, falling down the cliff or look around me to make sure I'm not lost. I won't be able to enjoy every step of the way. In contrast, let's say I know where I'm going. I'm going, you know, northwest in the direction of a particular mountain.

I know the direction and I'm walking towards that mountain. Now I can let go. Now I can let go and just enjoy the journey on my way to a destination. And this very much relates to what happiness is about. Happiness is not aimlessly meandering around the mountain. Happiness is not about being focused on getting to the peak. Happiness is walking towards the peak, walking towards a destination that we deem meaningful and important. And once we have that destination in mind, that's when we can let go and simply enjoy the journey.

So waking up in the morning and saying to ourselves, okay, today I'm just going to be present, not focus about the future. I mean, that is unlikely to work for most people. However, having a compelling goal and then saying, okay, I know exactly where I want to get to. Now let me get to work on it. That's when we can be most present.

What's the, either the one piece of advice or the one thing that you've heard or the one thing that people hear from you that kind of brings it into focus, that kind of makes it a little more understandable or manageable or interesting that really brings this all together? A very important finding in the research, the research on change, is that small changes make a big difference if, and this is the important part, if applied consistently. In other words, it's not about the big aha moment that I have, the big revelation, the life-changing workshop or book or eureka experience. Rather, it's about small changes that we implement over time consistently. And if applied consistently, over time, they actually rewire our brain. Small changes applied over time. That is the key to change. It's also the key to positive change. Well, it certainly makes you think. And it's a refreshing way to look at making changes in

your life that focuses more on the positive rather than what's wrong and how to fix it. Tal Ben-Shahar has been my guest. He is an author and lecturer. And his book is called Choose the Life You Want. And he is offering a course in happiness studies that helps people become certified happiness trainers. His website is happinessstudies.academy. And there's a link to that in the show notes. Thank you, Tal.

Thank you very much, Mike. Eating together as a family has a lot of benefits and is something every family should try to do more often. But when thin families eat together, they do things a little differently. First of all, they make the meal last four and a half minutes longer. On average, thin kids spend 18 minutes at the table, while heavier kids spend 13 and a half minutes. Eating slower means eating more mindfully and not shoveling food

in an attempt to get back to whatever you were doing before dinner. They put the electronics away. Parents who let teens use electronic devices or watch TV during family meals tend to serve less nutritious food and have poor family communication, according to a study by the University of Minnesota. Thin parents ask kids if they're hungry. Did you eat enough or are you still hungry, is better and more conducive to teaching intuitive eating habits than simply saying, are you done?

They don't rely on fast food. Researchers at Texas A&M University say dads carry the most influence here, largely because when they take their kids to some fast food place, it's often as a treat, which enforces the idea that unhealthy eating is a positive thing. And thin people drink more water. Study after study show that people who are dehydrated tend to think they're hungry, and that drinking water before a meal leads to smarter eating habits. And that is something you should know. And that's the podcast today. I'm Micah Ruthers. Thanks for listening to Something You Should Know.

Welcome to the small town of Chinook, where faith runs deep and secrets run deeper. In this new thriller, religion and crime collide when a gruesome murder rocks the isolated Montana community. Everyone is quick to point their fingers at a drug-addicted teenager, but local deputy Ruth Vogel isn't convinced. She suspects connections to a powerful religious group. Enter federal agent V.B. Loro, who has been investigating a local church for possible criminal activity. The pair form an unlikely partnership to catch the killer, unearthing secrets that leave Ruth torn between her duty to the law, her religious convictions, and her very

own family. But something more sinister than murder is afoot, and someone is watching Ruth. Chinook, starring Kelly Marie Tran and Sanaa Lathan. Listen to Chinook wherever you get your podcasts. And though we have seen, of course, every episode many times, we figured, hey, now that we're wrapped, let's watch it all again. And we can't do that alone. So we're inviting the cast and crew that made the show along for the ride. We've got writers, producers, composers, directors, and we'll, of course, have some actors on as well, including some certain guys that played some certain pretty iconic brothers. It was kind of a little bit of a left field choice

in the best way possible. The note from Kripke was, he's great, we love him, but we're looking for like a really intelligent Duchovny type. With 15 seasons to explore, it's going to be the road trip of several lifetimes. So please join us and subscribe to Supernatural then and now.