Something You Should Know - How to Scientifically Make Your Brain Perform Noticeably Better & How to Effectively Hold a Grudge

Episode Date: January 14, 2019

How many times have you been told you should be thankful for what you have? Well, there may be some profound wisdom in that. I begin this podcast with some great research that shows how simple acts of gratitude can bring you benefits for a long time. http://nymag.com/scienceofus/2016/01/how-expressing-gratitude-changeyour-brain.html While you might think memory loss and cognitive decline are problems only for older people – you would be mistaken. Many younger people are walking around with sluggish, underperforming brains. Why? Listen as I talk with Steven Masley, M.D., an affiliate clinical associate professor at the University of South Florida, a fellow of the American Heart Association and author of the book, The Better Brain Solution (https://amzn.to/2VLIgdO). Dr. Masley explains the 5 things that are causing so many people of all ages to have brain fog and underutilize their mental power. Then he reveals how to reverse it so you are using all your cognitive function and memory. Do you know people who never seem to get sick? While some of it may be luck, a lot of it has to do with certain habits they perform that keep them from becoming ill. Listen as I describe several ways you can better arm yourself against winter colds and other bugs.  https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/wellness/10-secrets-from-people-who-never-get-sick/ss-BBROEI0#interstitial=2 Holding a grudge does nobody any good – right? Well maybe. It really depends on how you define a grudge. Writer Sophie Hannah has a way to use grudges to your advantage. Sophie is the author of the book How to Hold a Grudge: From Resentment to Contentment―The Power of Grudges to Transform Your Life (https://amzn.to/2AD8Rkd). She joins me to explain how grudge holding – when done correctly – can lead to a happier life and better relationships. This Week’s Sponsors -LinkedIn. For $50 off your first job post, go to www.LinkedIn.com/Podcast -ADT. Go to www.ADT.com/smart to learn how ADT can design and install a smart home system for you. -Quip. Get your first refill free when you buy a quip toothbrush at www.Get Quip.com/something -Care/of Vitamins. For $25 off your first month of personalized vitamins, go to www.TakeCareOf.com and us the promo code: something -Geico. Go to www.Geico.com to see how Geico can save you money on your car insurance Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Today on Something You Should Know, you know you should be grateful for what you have. And when you actually are grateful, amazing things can happen. I'll explain that. Then, there's a good chance your brain is not performing at its best. And there are five reasons why. When you think about what are the five things that cause memory loss and what are the five things that would clearly improve brain performance, it shouldn't be surprising it's worse today than it's ever been before and it's happening to younger and younger people plus why is

it that some people never seem to get sick I'll reveal what those people do differently and how to hold a grudge a real grudge in a positive way for us to think you know I'm not holding on to any bitterness, I forgive emotionally, but I'm going to remember that this person is liable to behave in this way so that if they do it again, I'm not going to be newly shocked by that. All this today on Something You Should Know. As a listener to Something You Should Know, I can only assume that you are someone who likes to learn about new and interesting things and bring more knowledge to work for you in your everyday life.

I mean, that's kind of what Something You Should Know was all about. And so I want to invite you to listen to another podcast called TED Talks Daily. Now, you know about TED Talks, right? Many of the guests on Something You Should Know have done TED Talks Daily. Now, you know about TED Talks, right? Many of the guests on Something You Should Know have done TED Talks. Well, you see, TED Talks Daily is a podcast that brings you a new TED Talk every weekday in less than 15 minutes. Join host Elise Hu. She goes beyond the headlines so you can hear about the big ideas shaping our future.

Learn about things like sustainable fashion, embracing your entrepreneurial spirit, the future of robotics, and so much more. Like I said, if you like this podcast, Something You Should Know, I'm pretty sure you're going to like TED Talks Daily. And you get TED Talks Daily wherever you get your podcasts. Something you should know. Fascinating intel. The world's top experts. And practical advice you can use in your life. Today, Something You Should Know with Mike Carruthers. Hi, welcome. One of the things I've learned from doing this podcast over the last couple of years is how listening habits can

change, particularly around the holidays. Each time for the last few years between Thanksgiving and New Year's, listening dips a little bit, presumably because people are busy, their routine is disrupted, they have a lot of things to do, Christmas shopping and all. And then right after New Year's, it goes back up. And in the case of this year, it's going back up not only to where it was before, but even higher. But the point of all this is if during the holidays you were unable to hear all the shows that we continue to produce, as we do every week, two episodes a week, you might want to go back an episode or two or three ago and listen, because we did have some really good episodes a week. You might want to go back an episode or two or three ago and listen,

because we did have some really good episodes in December. First up today, you know, a lot of pop psychology tells you to look on the bright side, keep a positive attitude, or be thankful for what you have. And while there may be wisdom in there somewhere, that last one, be thankful for what you have, seems to have some real power to it. Time and time again, studies have shown that performing simple gratitude exercises like keeping a gratitude diary or writing letters of thanks or acts of generosity can bring a range of benefits, such as feelings of increased well-being, reduced depression, and these feelings will linger well after the exercises are finished.

Now, a brain scanning study is helping scientists understand why these exercises have these profound effects. The results suggest that even months after a simple, short gratitude writing task, people's brains are still wired to feel extra thankful. The implication is that gratitude tasks work, at least in part, because they have this self-perpetuating nature. The more you practice gratitude, the more attuned you are to it and the more you enjoy the benefits from it.

The results of the study suggest that the more practice you give your brain at feeling and expressing gratitude, the more it adapts to this mindset. You can even think of it as your brain having sort of a gratitude muscle. When you exercise it, it makes you feel better for a long time. And that is something you should know. When you hear terms like cognitive function or brain health, maybe you think that's something you worry about when you get older.

Memory loss, mental decline, those are problems for older people. Well, no. It turns out those are problems for all of us. There are a lot of younger people today walking around in kind of a brain fog, more today than ever before. And for the most part, it is preventable and fixable. Dr. Stephen Masley is an M.D. and fellow of the American Heart Association and the American Academy of Family Physicians. He's an affiliate clinical associate professor at the University of South Florida, and he's author of a book called The Better Brain Solution. And Dr. Masley is about to explain the fascinating science of how your brain works and what you can do to make it work better at any age.

Hi, Dr. Masley. Welcome. I'm delighted to be with you. So let's start by addressing this issue of mental decline and poor mental performance as it relates to young people, because I think that people think this is an older person problem, and you say no. More and more often today, young adults even, are having brain fog. They're not as sharp, they're not as productive. They don't focus as well. They forget names. They have to reread passages in books. They walk into a room and they forget why they're there. I mean, brain fog is increasingly common, and it's really strongly

related to our lifestyle choices, especially the food we eat. And so what's different? Is it because we've changed our diet? Why would now younger people be getting brain fog when they didn't 40, 50 years ago? Well, our food, as you know, it's a lot more processed. There's more sugar. There's more refined carbs than ever before. And we're also less active. So I mean, if I think about the five steps in the Better Brain Solution that help improve brain performance, one is food. We're not getting the same quality food. We're eating the wrong foods.

Two would be nutrients. Because we're not getting the food, more people are nutrient deficient today. Number three is activity. We're not as active as we used to be. Four is stress, and I think we're more stressed today as we used to be four is stress and i think we're more stressed today than we've ever been before and last step five is toxins and there's more toxins in our environment so it should when you think about what are the five things that cause memory loss and what are the five things that would clearly improve brain performance it shouldn't be surprising it's

worse today than it's ever been before and it's happening to younger and younger people. So help me understand what it is about those things. Hopefully there's a kind of a general answer rather than have to go through all of them. But what is it, because of the toxins in the food and the whatever, the stress, what does that do specifically to your brain to cause the problem? What's going on? Well, probably the number one cause is what we call insulin resistance. It sounds complicated, but let me explain it so it's simple.

Insulin's the hormone that pushes energy into your cells. So when you eat a meal, insulin goes up and it pushes the energy away and stores it for later. So like, we don't have a famine. And when we eat healthy, that works beautifully. But what if you had cereal or toast for breakfast, even whole wheat toast, a sandwich or a wrap, a whole grain wrap for lunch, and you had a granola bar for a snack, and then you had rice, potatoes, or corn for dinner, you've

overloaded your storage capacity. You can't store, we can't store that much refined carbs. And your body becomes insulin resistant. And for your brain, here's the irony. Remember, in 100,000 years, humans have never really had an excess amount of processed sugar in their lives. That never happened until recently. But today, with all the processed food, it's really common. So when the brain becomes insulin resistant, it literally turns off. It's like a power surge, and you blow the switch, you know, to your light.

So the brain turns off, you're foggy, you don't function well, you're less productive. And they've actually showed that like if a young adult goes out and has, you know, pancakes with syrup or, you know, a breakfast cereal and drinks orange juice for breakfast, they have less productivity, less brain speed for the next six to eight hours. So that's clearly documented. But that's really common. And if it's just a choice, then, okay, say it's just your birthday. Well, who cares?

You're less productive and you're more forgetful. But if it's every day, your brain doesn't function. You're not reaching your potential. You might lose your job for being, you know, kind of brain foggy, and you're shrinking your brain. You're killing your brain cells, and your brain's shrinking, and you're going to be at risk for memory loss earlier in life than it ever should have been. But I like to think that, and my experience is sometimes, that even if I'm not feeling particularly on my game, I can override it with a lot of concentration and get closer to what I need to do and break through that fog with sheer determination.

Some degree, but eventually you're just stressing yourself out and you can't keep up. And that's why the other parts come into it. That's assuming you're physically fit and you have that physical stamina and you work out. That's assuming you manage your stress and that your cortisol levels aren't high all the time and you're stressed out because then you won't have that reserve and you won't have that drive. And that assumes you meet your nutrient needs

and that you have some reserve to handle it there. And it also means you're not being poisoned. So that's how the five steps of this program all come into play. Because you might be able to do one of those steps not so well and recover on the others, but there's five pillars that hold you up. And most people today are falling apart on all five. So this insulin resistance that people have, this is strictly a result of what they're eating, yes? Yes. Well, no, the number one cause is too much sugar and refined carbs. But also, it's worse if you don't exercise.

It's worse if you're stressed, and it's worse if you have toxins. So all of those factors, and nutrient deficiencies cause it too. So all five pillars impact insulin resistance. And insulin resistance is the number one cause for decreased brain productivity, for memory loss, and for heart disease. So what are the foods we should be eating, and what are the foods, and you mentioned a couple, but what are the other foods we should not be eating?

There's 12 foods you could eat regularly that really help and support your brain, and we shouldn't be eating so much sugar and flour. And those 12 foods are? Well, like vegetables. In particular, green leafies. Somebody who eats one cup of green leafies a day, like broccoli, kale, spinach, their brain's 11 years younger than someone who doesn't eat them. It's just one cup.

Berries and cherries, those colorful pigments in these fruits, they're low in sugar, and those pigments protect brain cells in your arteries. They're super important. That nuts, people go on low-fat diets for weight loss, but a low-fat diet in studies has been shown to deprive your brain of fat. You have decreased brain performance and increased memory loss. I want people to eat smart, not just more junk fat, but healthy fat. I want them to eat more nuts, olive oil, avocado, cook with extra virgin olive oil and avocado oil, eat wild salmon, have dark chocolate, smart fats.

Another category would be spices and herbs. I'm a physician, nutritionist, and chef. I take food really seriously, and I like food. And I think spices and herbs taste great, and they improve the flavor of food, but they're also anti-inflammatory, and they protect our brain, especially two of them. Italian herbs like rosemary, they will improve your brain function. They actually help you study. And curcumin that's in turmeric or

curry spices, curry spices, you can improve your brain function within just three hours of having curcumin. And it lasts for a month. You mentioned earlier that you gave the example of, you know, if you had toast and a sandwich and all that, people have been eating bread for thousands of years without a whole lot of problems. Why is bread so bad? Well, we actually have only had bread for like, what, three to four thousand years, kind of tops. And out of those four thousand years, except for maybe 30 or 40 of them, we were farmers. We were physically active six to eight hours a day. So the truth be told is if you're physically, you're like a, you know, you have a physical job

and you're out carrying heavy loads, you're a farmer and you work not with a tractor, but a shovel, you need a lot more calories and you can handle this stuff a lot better but i don't know anybody you know it may be a few professional athletes you know i've got a couple athletes who are patients but short of them i don't have any patients i mean most people struggle to get an hour a day and that's just not enough anymore so we can't get by with not exercising all day and trying to eat bread three times a day like we could 100 years ago. So let's talk about what is normal. Everyone, I think, assumes that as you get older, your brain changes in ways that make you more forgetful. Is that a safe assumption that you can say that?

It shouldn't. That's average. There's a difference. That's a really good point. I'm so happy you're bringing it up. There's a difference between average aging, your brain shrinks and you lose your memory and your brain processing speed drops. And normal aging. With normal aging, you would lose a little bit of speed. It's like someone gives you a very slightly slower computer every couple years. But you're smarter, you have more experience, nobody notices. But you shouldn't be losing your memory. Your hippocampus, the memory center, shouldn't be shrinking the way it is today in an average person.

My 70-year-olds are sharper now than they were when I met them at 55. My 45-year-olds are sharper now than when I met them at 30. Well, why are you meeting them? Why are they coming to you in the first place? Well, I mean, I have a clinic. I have an optimal health center. People come to see me to assess how they're aging and optimize their health. And probably one of the more important things we do is measure brain processing speed and memory.

And when we realize, wow, your brain's kind of sluggish. And to be honest, half of them don't even notice it. It's kind of been a slow, insidious drop. Just gradually over time, they're more and more sluggish. They don't really notice, and what they'll say to me is after they follow the Better Brain Solution for a month, they'll go, wow, I forgot how great I could feel. I forgot how sharp I could be.

Thanks for giving my life back. I want to ask you, what is a sluggish brain? I mean, what does that look like? What does that feel like to have a sluggish brain? But first, here is a New Year's resolution that's easy and pays big dividends. Better oral health by brushing your teeth better. And with a Quip electric toothbrush, this is a resolution you'll stick with. I've been using a Quip for a long time every single day and this is a very different electric toothbrush. It has sensitive sonic vibrations for an effective clean that's gentle on your gums because the fact is a lot of people brush too hard and some electric toothbrushes are too abrasive. The Quip

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The Jordan Harbinger Show. Every episode is a conversation with a fascinating guest. Of course, a lot of podcasts are conversations with guests, but Jordan does it better than most. Recently, he had a fascinating conversation with a British woman who was recruited and radicalized by ISIS and went to prison for three years. She now works to raise awareness on this issue.

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erstwhile monk turned traveling medical investigator. Join me as I study the secrets of the divine plagues and uncover the blasphemous truth that ours is not a loving God and we are not its favored children. The heresies of Redolf Bantwine, wherever podcasts are available. So, doctor, what does it mean to have a sluggish brain? I mean, would I know it? Can I see it? Can I sense it?

What is it? What's a sluggish brain? Well, someone calls out to you a 10-digit phone number. Can you remember it? Or do you have trouble and you have to write it down? Part of that is we're so used to these smartphones, we don't have to remember phone numbers. So I'll admit, that one's complicated. But do you have to read a repassage in a book? When you go to a meeting and someone assigns you four things to do, do you walk out of the

meeting and go, oh my gosh, I only remember two of the four? I mean, when you're doing work, can you just, and people keep interrupting you, can you just power through and despite, you know, 50 interruptions a day, do you keep working at high speed and get it all done? Or I would say the average person needs an extra hour and an hour and a half every day just to get their work done because their brain processing speed is reduced. But there is, and I guess I don't really know why there is, but there is a general acceptance that as you get older, your mental function will decline, and that that is normal. Well, I think we're two, you're right.

That's a really good point. We're two accepting of, okay, I'm average, so that's okay. But remember, the average person today is overweight to almost obese. If you're normal weight, you're almost abnormal. So if you're mentally sharp, you're almost abnormal. So way too many people are having decreased brain speed. So I don't want people to accept, well, I'm average, that's okay, because average isn't very good anymore. So help me understand, though, that we hear that, you know, people get older and

they become forgetful, but then there are some people who actually get a disease or a condition called dementia from which there is seldom, I think, any kind of big recovery. What's the difference between a sluggish brain and a demented brain? Okay, that's a good question. And so essentially you could be at good brain performing speed. You can imagine you're sharp, you're quick, you're alert. Or you could have some subject in, say someone's going to get dementia in 20 years. We can actually kind of, if we could go back 20 years before they got diagnosed, say you're going to get diagnosed at 60 and you're 40. At 40, you may probably don't notice yet, but if we were to do cognitive testing, we would see your testings dropped a bit for the first five years.

Fifteen years before you get diagnosed with dementia, you're aware that you're more forgetful than you were 10 years ago. You're thinking, I'm not as sharp, okay, but this is just average aging, right? It's okay. But you're actually losing brain cells and your brain speed's dropping down. And over 10 years, your friends and coworkers notice it too. But they might accept that, okay, now instead of 40, he's almost 50 or she's almost 50, so it's okay. And then, so that's subjective cognitive, you're aware of it, but you're still functioning. The next, they call it mild cognitive impairment. It's not a good description.

It means you're mildly disabled. You can probably still do your job, maybe not if it requires complex thinking. And you can still live on your own. You're not disabled. That's a really bad sign. Now you're on the cusp, the verge of dementia. And the definition of dementia is you're disabled from memory loss. You can no longer live on your own, pay your bills and function. You need assistance. And that's scary. And you can

kind of reverse that a bit, but you're absolutely right. By that point, your brain is basically shrunk from a grape to a raisin. You've waited way too long. So my goal is if you do have mild cognitive impairment, you know, really you're nearly disabled, you could still get 20% to 25% better and stop losing your brain function. Don't wait until you have dementia. I totally agree with you. But most important would be for the younger folks, go for optimal brain performance. Push, you know, why not be excellent?

Let's stop accepting I'm average because that's not very good. Let's go for better brain performance and preventing memory loss. And then it's not just your brain. The same things help your brains like the canary in the coal mine. It's the first symptom for the whole body. But if you're hurting your memory, you're probably hurting your arteries, you're worsening your romantic sexual function. All that stuff falls apart when you're hurting your memory. So why not feel fantastic and be more productive at the same time? So you're saying, if I get you correctly, and if I do, I think this is a surprise to a lot of people,

that just because you're older doesn't necessarily mean you should forget things and have a noticeable memory loss or cognitive decline. Well, mostly, yes. I agree with most of that. I think you will have some drop in processing speed with normal aging, but no one's going to notice because we have life experience and we can compensate for it. So it should be unnoticed. I really agree that there's no reason you can't be sharp, alert, and fully functional at 75, 80. I mean, by 100, okay, I'm a realist. Eventually, we're not going to be able to keep going.

But I don't see any reason that someone should be dwindling before 80 years of age. So just to be clear, are you saying if someone were to do the things that you're talking about, is it just to clear up the brain fog and get you back to ground level? Or are you saying that doing these things will actually improve your mental function right now? So, in other words, are we preventing a negative or are we promoting a positive or both? Well, average patients, I've had some exceptional responses, you know, like people who are on the verge of losing their job, and instead they got a raise,

because their performance improved so much. But let's talk about average. I think that's more real. Let's be realistic. Let's be realistic. We've done randomized clinical trials where we randomized groups. We picked gym members who didn't come to the gym. I did that because they were somewhat motivated, but they weren't doing anything about it. They didn't eat well. They didn't work out, but at least they were gym members.

I like that. And in that group, and you can probably imagine many of them, we offered them to eat better, eat food meet their nutrient needs add activity do 10 minutes a day of stress management here are some toxins to avoid and we just tested them before and afterwards the control group made no change i mean we said do the same and they obliged they didn't change anything they had no improvement and the average person in our intervention group who followed the Better Brain program improved their brain processing speed 25%. That means their ability to process information went up by 25%.

They could finish eight hours of work in six hours of time. And their attention span, their ability to focus, went up 40%. Briefly, you mentioned toxins. So what toxins am I getting that I need to avoid? Three quick examples. Mercury. If you eat a lot of bigmouth fish, grouper, tuna, swordfish, grouper, you can have mercury toxicity.

10% of my patients have elevated mercury and it's hurting their brain. Pesticides is a second. If your pesticide levels are high, you're 350% more likely to get dementia than if they're low. And there's a ton of pesticides. We need to be eating, and most of it, surprisingly, doesn't come from fruit and vegetables. It comes from animal products, dairy, meat, and poultry. So when you're eating the dirty dozen fruit and vegetables like apples and strawberries and peppers and spinach, they should be organic. You don't have to buy everything organic.

And your meat and dairy and poultry should be organic because that's where most pesticides are. And the last one briefly, nitrosamines. Those are nitrates in sandwich meats and hot dogs and bacon. We used to just think they cause cancer, but now we know they're neurotoxic. They've done studies on rats just really recently and showed that when we feed them bacon and deli meats, they get Alzheimer's quickly. So if you eat deli meats or eat bacon, please make sure they're organic and nitrosamine-free. They don't have these toxins

in them that are really common. Well, great. And Dr. Masley also has more information and a buying guide that you can have for free at his website, which is drmasley.com d-r-m-a-s-l-e-y dot com, which is also in the show notes, as is

his book, The Better Brain Solution. Thanks for joining me, Dr. Masley. Thank you for having me. For a long time now, I've been talking about and taking care of vitamins. Care of is a monthly subscription vitamin service that delivers completely personalized vitamin and supplement packs right to your door. Look, 90% of people fall short of the FDA-recommended guidelines for at least one vitamin or nutrient. And the fact is, it can be really hard to know what vitamins or supplements you should be taking.

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And that link and promo code are also in the show notes. People who listen to Something You Should Know are curious about the world, looking to hear new ideas and perspectives. So I want to tell you about a podcast that is full of new ideas and perspectives and one I've started listening to called Intelligence Squared.

It's the podcast where great minds meet. Listen in for some great talks on science, tech, politics, creativity, wellness, and a lot more. A couple of recent examples, Mustafa Suleiman, the CEO of Microsoft AI, discussing the future of technology. That's pretty cool. And writer, podcaster, and filmmaker John Ronson, discussing the rise of conspiracies and culture wars.

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Listen to Don't Blame Me, But Am I Wrong on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. New episodes every Monday, Tuesday, Thursday, and Friday. I'm sure if you stop and think about it, you've held a grudge or two in your lifetime. And how many times have you been told that holding a grudge is not good? Forgive and forget is what you should do. Holding grudges does you no good. Well, wait a second. Maybe that assumption is wrong. Maybe grudges can serve a valuable purpose. That's the claim of Sophie Hanna. Sophie is a writer. Mostly she's written crime fiction, but she's tackled the topic of grudges in her new book, How to Hold a Grudge, From Resentment to Contentment, The Power of Grudges to Transform Your Life. And she thinks we need to take a closer look at grudges.

Since we've all held one, maybe we can put them to better use. Hi, Sophie. Welcome. Thank you. Thanks for having me on. You bet. So first of all, let's define what a grudge is. How do you define it? Well, the crucial thing is I define it differently from how all the dictionaries define it. So the dictionaries all say that a grudge is a feeling, a dislike or resentment or bitterness, some kind of negative feeling. My new and different definition of grudge is that a grudge is not a feeling, but a story that still has relevance in your life. So, give me an example. So, the story will usually be about a negative experience that happened to you. Somebody did something that hurt you or made you angry.

And at the time, you might have felt upset or annoyed about it. But the grudge itself is not that feeling because that feeling, whatever negative feeling you have, it can pass. The grudge is the story about what happened that you remember. And you can remember that for years and even decades after the feelings from the incident have passed. And the crucial thing is that the grudge story you can then use to inspire you, to motivate you, to do all sorts of good things in your life now. So the prevailing wisdom is that it's not a good idea to hold grudges, that you should let them go, that you're only hurting yourself, that holding grudges holds you back, and about the dictionary definitions of grudges, which most people just unquestioningly accept, then that would be true, wouldn't it? So if we accept that a grudge is a negative, bitter, unpleasant feeling, then of course we don't want to hang on to those.

Of course those would do us harm if we kept them and clung on to them. But if what I'm saying is true, and I know that it is from my own experience, then we can remember our grudge story and get only good things from it. So when I think about some of my grudge stories that date back maybe even 10 years, I have no residue of negative feelings at all, because those passed long ago. What I do have though is a grudge story that has what I call a live relevance charge. The story still feels relevant and important because something about it makes me live and behave and think in a different way which is good for me and good for the world. So let's say I have a grudge about somebody who was once very rude to me. I might still keep that grudge story now because

it will always inspire me never to be rude to anybody, for example. But the feelings you have for the person who was rude to you have come and gone. The feelings have gone. So this is where it's important to draw a distinction between thoughts and judgment, which is in one category, and feelings, which is in another category. So I am absolutely willing emotionally to forgive anybody. I will happily go forward in my relationship with anybody, you know, give them any number of chances to behave well and still like them and still love them, even if I have a grudge about them. What the grudge means is just that they did something or behaved in a way that I want to remember now because it has changed how I think about them. And the reason I call it a grudge, because a lot of people have said to me, hang on a minute, what you're saying is all very

wise and true, but I wouldn't call it a grudge. I'd just call it you've learned a lesson from something that happened to you. Exactly. The reason, yeah, yeah, that's the most common criticism I've had so far. But I have an answer for that criticism, which is that the reason I call these things grudges is that if I have a grudge about somebody, then I might emotionally forgive them. And indeed, I always do emotionally forgive people. I don't dislike them. I don't resent them. But those people, my grudges, as I call them, they do not have a completely clean slate in my mind so you know most people I like and love do have a completely clean slate there's nothing there's no kind of

mark against them there's nothing I think well I need to bear this in mind and protect myself from them in that way or you know I need to have lower expectations of them because I know they have a tendency to behave in this not ideal way. So that's why I would call these things grudges because it's the lack of a clean slate aspect that for me makes it a grudge. is that we don't, you know, we're not obliged to think about everybody in exactly the same way. We're not obliged to trust everybody in exactly the same way. So if somebody has harmed us in a way that was really painful or really damaging, then I think it's okay for that person not to have a clean slate in our minds. And for us to think, you know, I'm not holding on to any bitterness, I forgive emotionally, but I'm going to remember that this person is liable to behave in this way so that if they do it again, I'm not going to be newly shocked and upset by that. Well, that's interesting because

I think people do that. We like to think that we forgive people and we don't hold a grudge, meaning that the person does have a clean slate, but in fact, they never do. You never think about the person the same way again after you've been upset by them, because even though you say you forgive them, you always remember. Well, this is what's really interesting. So as well as having different definitions of grudges, people also mean different things when they use the word forgive. And we don't talk about this often enough. What does the word forgive mean? Does it mean forgive emotionally and forget and carry on as if the thing hadn't happened? If that's what forgive means, then yes, it's very hard to do because exactly as you say none of us

can forget anything that wounded us emotionally in a very deep way if however we think of the word forgive in a slightly different way so you know maybe forgive can mean we don't have any continuing anger or rage or pain in relation to this person we're willing to see them and give them every chance to behave well in future and if they were to behave well in future we would absolutely appreciate that you know that is what forgive means to me it doesn't mean that I'm going to forget those grudge stories I've got about people which still seem to have a live relevance charge. And so to me, the way I advocate holding grudges, which I have to say really works brilliantly in my life, what's good about that is that it does enable you to forgive emotionally and give that person

every chance and even allow that when they did the thing they did that hurt you, they might have been doing the best they could. You you, they might have been doing the best they could. You know, you can even say, I don't blame them. They were in a bad place. They didn't realize what they were doing. All of those things you can allow and you can forgive them, you know, in a sort of wholehearted way. But you can still think, but they did do those things and that was not okay. And this is another big part of why I'm advocating holding grudges in the way I am because human beings are justice-seeking creatures. We just are.

We never won't be. From the age of two, a child can say, not fair. His thing's bigger than mine. I want that toy. He's had it for an hour. We get these instincts. We've got them from birth and a lot of the reason why people have destructive grudges where they hate and they seek revenge and it does loads of damage in the world is because we all have this idea that holding

a grudge is bad and we should all forgive and what that often means is we end up trying to invalidate or repress our own perfectly natural and justifiable negative emotions. So what I'm saying is allow yourself to create and hold a healthy grudge, which is then a sort of symbolic commemorative justice object. And that constitutes that person not having a clean slate. You remember what they did you don't think it was okay you'll learn from it you'll protect yourself with it but you can also at the same time move on emotionally and continue the relationship in a positive way or not or not exactly so you know you you can hold your grudge without hatred, without bitterness, just it's a thing you want to remember because it has a live relevance charge and you can forgive

emotionally and you can decide you don't want that person in your life anymore. That's absolutely fine. There's nothing unhealthy or damaging about thinking I've got a grudge about Bob, and I don't think I want to spend time with Bob anymore. You can do that, absolutely. The only thing I say people shouldn't do is allow bitterness and rage and really unpleasant feelings to consume them, because that isn't a healthy or a necessary part of holding a grudge. There are times, though, in life where things happen, people do things that are horrendous, that are just horrible and impossible to forgive, or maybe people don't want to forgive. They need to hold on to that anger because they've been so hurt and betrayed or whatever. Absolutely. So, you know, yes, I'm not by any means suggesting that forgiveness is always the desirable outcome. In many situations it is. If it's a petty or trivial slight,

then often forgiveness can be the best outcome. But sometimes it isn't. And in that case, there's no need to try and forgive anybody if that doesn't feel right. I would say, though, that even if you choose not to forgive someone, if you are consumed by bitter and hateful feelings, that's never going to be good for you. So however horrendous the thing is that's happened, I mean, we know that many people go through truly awful life experiences and somehow find a way not to let bitterness consume them. And that has to be the best possible way to proceed if you can manage it. I know people, I can think of a couple of people who have been hurt or had disagreements with people, and it ran so deep that years later, it's all they

can talk about. I mean, it's just like, it has become part of their identity to relive and talk about how horrible this other person is. And I wonder, it must serve a purpose, but I can't imagine what that is. And it's awfully hard to be around people like that who sing that one note over and over and over again and cannot let it go. Yeah, yeah, I know exactly what you mean. And I think the reason people become like that is because of our unhealthy attitude to grudges. I think what often happens is this, something wrong or hurtful is done to somebody. The person then is angry and upset, and immediately people around them try to minimize that.

They try to sugarcoat it. They say, oh, well, you know, come on, don't let it bother you. Don't let it get to you. There are two sides to this story. You should move on. You should forgive. Don't hold a grudge. And the response from the world at large seems to be in some way negating the importance of that original

transgression. If, on the other hand, somebody were to say, oh, someone's just done a terrible thing to me, and the world were to respond differently, if the world were to respond by saying, that's terrible that that happened, that's grudge worthy, I don't blame you for being angry, I'd be really angry if that happened to me. Then the person on the receiving end of the transgression would feel validated and understood. And it's amazing how often well-meaning people in their desire to sort of make things okay will basically tell you that you shouldn't be upset about what you're upset about and that you shouldn't be upset about what you're upset about and that

you shouldn't be angry about what you're angry about and that whoever attacked you probably didn't mean it and they're a lovely chap really you know we get these reactions all the time because people want there to be no problem and what that does is it makes you dig in and become more entrenched with those negative feelings now my reactions to people who've been hurt or upset produce the opposite effect. If somebody comes and rants at me about someone who's done them a terrible wrong, I say, that sounds highly grudge worthy.

Here's how you can create a brilliant grudge. Let's create it. Let's then classify it and grade it and we'll get a grudge cabinet and we'll put it in. And just reacting in that way makes the person think, oh, okay, finally someone gets that this thing that happened to me matters. So I genuinely believe that the reason so many people are still going around ranting about tiny things that were done to them 30 years ago, is because we in general as human beings have a tendency to try and gloss over and minimize harm to other people. In many ways,

what you're saying, I think, gives voice to something people do anyway in a lot of cases where they hear that to be a good person, you need to forgive and forget, but people don't forget. People don't have a clean slate anymore. And those of us who don't forget think, well, how do those other people forgive and forget? Because I can't do it, but I don't think anybody really does it. feel that you must not be a good person right and you want to be one so you try and force yourself to forget and to completely forgive when either you're not ready or you just can't do it absolutely i mean i think if we could all adopt a different mindset if we could all think you know what a good person is a good person is somebody who acknowledges that when somebody harms them they're going to feel upset and angry and there's nothing wrong with that. And there's a weird kind of paradox about negative feelings. If we can be positive about our negative feelings, then they will stop being there, they will stop being negative much sooner. So in other words, if I'm walking down the street, someone hits me over the head with a hammer and says something very rude to me.

If the natural surge of anger that rises up in me as a result of that, if I try to repress that and think, no, no, I mustn't think bad thoughts. He was probably having a bad day. I must forgive him. Then my anger gets much more corrosive because it's repressed and it knows it has a right to be there. But I'm trying to deny it now if on the other hand I think to myself welcome anger I know why you're here it's completely fine you stay as long as you want all these negative feelings you're welcome to stay as long as you feel it's necessary to be there then actually what happens is those feelings don't need to dig in defensively and they move along a lot more quickly.

Well, I like your message because as we said at the start of this, holding a grudge in the traditional way really does do no one no good. It doesn't do you any good to hold a grudge against someone who doesn't know you're holding a grudge against them. And so no good comes from that. But your way is a bit different and does serve a purpose. So I appreciate that. My guest has been Sophie Hanna. Her book is called How to Hold a Grudge.

From resentment to contentment, the power of grudges to transform your life. Thank you for being here, Sophie. You're welcome. Thanks for having me on. Some people, it seems, never seem to get sick. Why is that? Well, perhaps it's because they have discovered these little tricks. They have a set bedtime.

Research shows that people who sleep eight hours or more per night are three times less likely to develop a cold compared to people who sleep for seven hours or less. One reason why is at night your body repairs itself and regulates stress hormones that can make you more susceptible to infection. They eat right. Filling up on antioxidant-rich foods like sweet potatoes, citrus and bell peppers, and red grapes and red wine replenish the cells that are damaged in the fight against germs and bacteria.

They take a probiotic. Good bacteria can enhance your immune system, so you may want to consider taking a probiotic supplement, which has helpful bacteria, during cold and flu season. They wash up. You don't have to go crazy with hand washing, but you can reduce illness by 15 to 50% if you remember to wash your hands before eating,

before and after prepping food, after the bathroom, and after sneezing and coughing. Soap and water is preferred, but hand sanitizer is good to have around as well. And they have close relationships. In studies, people with the most social support when faced with a stressful situation were less likely to get ill if exposed to a cold virus.

And hugging, hugging enhanced the immunity benefits. And that is something you should know. You can reach me by email with questions, comments, or suggestions. My email address is mikeatsomethingyoushouldknow.net. I'm Mike Carruthers. Thanks for listening today to Something You Should Know. Do you love Disney? Do you love Top Ten lists?

Then you are going to love our hit podcast, Disney Countdown. I'm Megan, the Magical Millennial. And I'm the Dapper Danielle. On every episode of our fun and family-friendly show, we count down our top 10 lists of all things Disney. The parks, the movies, the music, the food, the lore. There is nothing we don't cover on our show. We are famous for rabbit holes, Disney themed games, and fun facts you didn't know you needed. I had Danielle and Megan record some answers to seemingly meaningless questions. I asked Danielle, what insect song is typically higher pitched in hotter temperatures and

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