Something You Should Know - Strange Origins of Common Words and Phrases & Meet Your Future Self

Episode Date: June 22, 2023

A common recommendation for people trying to control their weight is to get enough sleep. Why? What could sleep have to do with losing weight? This episode begins with an explanation. https://www.webmd.com/obesity/features/cant-shed-those-pounds “Cut to the chase.” “ Made from scratch.” Close but no cigar.” Where did these phrases come from? That’s just one of the things I discuss with Erin McCarthy, VP/Editor-in-Chief of MentalFloss.com author of the book Mental Floss: The Curious Compendium of Wonderful Words (https://amzn.to/443Ihfz). Listen as she also discusses words people hate the most – but use anyway and tells the story of how McDonalds went to war with the dictionary. Ever wonder what your future self will be like? You will probably be a very different person 10 or 20 years from now. So perhaps you should prepare for the future you because he/she is coming. To help you understand who your future self will be and what that person may need or want from you now is Hal Hershfield, professor of marketing, behavioral decision making and psychology at the Anderson School of Management at UCLA and author of the book Your Future Self: How to Make Tomorrow Better Today (https://amzn.to/42Y2G4V) People have been using honey to treat burns and wounds for centuries. Does it work? Actually, it is a little more complicated than you might think. Listen as I explain. https://www.uclahealth.org/news/medical-grade-honey-is-viable-tool-in-wound-care# PLEASE SUPPORT OUR SPONSORS! Zocdoc is the only FREE app that lets you find AND book doctors who are patient-reviewed, take your insurance, are available when you need them and treat almost every condition under the sun! Go to https://Zocdoc.com/SYSK and download the Zocdoc app for FREE. Indeed is the hiring platform where you can Attract, Interview, and Hire all in one place! Start hiring NOW with a $75 SPONSORED JOB CREDIT to upgrade your job post at https://Indeed.com/SOMETHING Offer good for a limited time. Keep American farming going by signing up at https://MoinkBox.com/SYSK  RIGHT NOW and listeners of this show get FREE filet mignon for a year! Now your ideas don’t have to wait. Dell Technologies and Intel are creating technology that loves ideas, expanding your business & evolving your passions. Find out how to bring your ideas to life at https://Dell.com/welcometonow ! Let’s find “us” again by putting our phones down for five.  Five days, five hours, even five minutes. Join U.S. Cellular in the Phones Down For Five challenge! Find out more at https://USCellular.com/findus If you own a small business, you know the value of time. Innovation Refunds does too! They've made it easy to apply for the employee retention credit or ERC by going to https://getrefunds.com to see if your business qualifies in less than 8 minutes! Innovation Refunds has helped small businesses collect over $3 billion in payroll tax refunds! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The search for truth never ends. Introducing June's Journey, a hidden object mobile game with a captivating story. Connect with friends, explore the roaring 20s, and enjoy thrilling activities and challenges while supporting environmental causes. After seven years, the adventure continues with our immersive travels feature. Explore distant cultures and engage in exciting experiences. There's always something new to discover. Are you ready?

Download June's Journey now on Android or iOS. Today on Something You Should Know, how does getting more sleep help you lose weight? Then, where words and phrases come from, like cut to the chase, close but no cigar, and also words that people hate. People hate the word amazing, I guess because it's overused. They hate the word panties, because it seems like both sexual and juvenile. They're not fans of it. Blog, which is a word

that I personally hate. People hate the word phlegm. It's gross. Also, what you may not know about honey as medicine. And do you ever think about who you will be in the future? It's gross. Also, what you may not know about honey as medicine. And do you ever think about who you will be in the future? It's very hard to plan for your future self. We all think of our future selves as if they are other people. I've run some research where we find that the brain activity that comes about when I think of my future self looks more like the brain activity that comes about when I think of another person. All this today on Something You Should Know. At Wealthsimple, we're built for whatever you're building.

Built for Jane, who wants to break into the housing market. We're built for Ted, who's obsessed with what's happening in the global markets. And built for Celine, who just wants to retire and explore the world's flea markets. So take a moment and think about what you're building for. We've got the financial tools to help make it happen. Wealthsimple. Built for possibilities.

Visit wealthsimple.com slash possibilities. Something you should know. Fascinating intel. The world's top experts, and practical advice you can use in your life. Today, Something You Should Know with Mike Carruthers. Hi, welcome to Something You Should Know. If you've ever tried to lose weight or read anything about weight loss, you've probably heard that how much sleep you get can affect your body weight. And you may have wondered why. Well, why would that be? Other than the fact that I guess if you're asleep, you can't be eating and that would be helpful,

but there must be more to it than that. Well, in a study, and this was reported in WebMD, in a study, people who were deprived of sleep not only ate more the next day, they actually had the desire to eat food they didn't even like. Some of the sleep-deprived participants also reported still not feeling full or satisfied after they ate. The researchers explained that because sleep has a big impact on the part of the brain that governs behavior and choices, lack of sleep interferes with reasoning and stimulates the appetite, leaving us more vulnerable to some weird edible impulses. And that is something you should know.

Every day, you use words and phrases to communicate. And some of those words and phrases are just plain weird. Hard to figure out where they came from. For example, close but no cigar. Where did that come from? Or made from scratch. You know what made from scratch means, but it doesn't make literal sense. Why is a big Hollywood movie called a blockbuster?

And when it comes to words, individual words, there are several that people really don't like. Like moist. And there are other universally hated words that we still use all the time. Here to discuss this is Erin McCarthy. She is vice president, editor-in-chief at mentalfloss.com, which is a great website if you're the curious type. And she is author of a book called Mental Floss, The Curious Compendium

of Wonderful Words. Hi, Erin. Welcome to Something You Should Know. Hi. Thank you so much for having me. Sure. So let's dive right in here. Let me ask you about one that I just mentioned in my introduction there, and that is close but no cigar. I mean, people know what it means, or at least what it's conveying, that you were close at what you were trying to do, but you didn't win. You didn't come in first. You didn't hit the bullseye. Close but no cigar. But where in the world did that come from, And how do cigars fit into that? I love this. Essentially, back in the day, before amusement parks were giving out stuffed animals, they were giving out cigars as prizes for winning games.

And if you didn't win, the guy behind the counter or whatever next to the game would say close, but no cigar. And so then by the 1920s, it's a great phrase, you know, so by the 1920s, it had become a part of the vernacular even outside of carnivals. But it's really cool to know that that's where it started, you know, in carnival games. Well, but it's interesting that it that doesn't anymore, I don't think, in carnival games. And certainly the phrase is not used as much as maybe it used to, but it's still around. And you would think that the reference point is gone, that the phrase would disappear. phrases are so evocative. They're just so fun that they stick around on their own merit. And I don't know, I use close but no cigar all the time. So it's still kicking. Yeah. So there are words in English that seemingly seem the same, like mistrust and distrust, or British versus English, or insure, ensure. Why does that happen?

I think it happens for different reasons. You know, sometimes it's because a word sounds really similar. Other times it's maybe because the two words are very closely linked in our minds. So for example, British versus English. If you're an American, you might use those two words interchangeably, but they're actually not the same thing. England is one country on the Isle of Great Britain and the others are Wales and Scotland. And then the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland is those countries plus Northern Ireland. So England is part of Great Britain. So everything English is also British. But not everything that's British is English.

Same with the other ones, you know, mistrust versus distrust. Technically, you can use them interchangeably, but they've kind of evolved to have their own connotations. You know, distrust implies a lack of trust based on knowledge, your own knowledge or experience. And then mistrust is kind of a term that implies a broader lack of confidence. So why is a hit movie called a blockbuster? It seems such an odd word. And yet it's, you know, I mean, no one questions it.

That movie's a blockbuster. The Godfather was a blockbuster. But why a blockbuster. The Godfather was a blockbuster, but why a blockbuster? Yeah. The term initially was used, and this blew my mind when I found this out, to describe bombs in World War II, which I guess kind of makes sense. They were bombs that were so powerful that they could literally destroy an entire city block. And then it became something, a term that meant anything incredibly shocking. It was a blockbuster. And then eventually, Hollywood co-opted it to refer to a movie that was a huge success. I guess Hollywood knows a good term when it hears one. So this is weird. You say that people hate to use the word

moist. And I've never thought of that. I mean, I think of like Betty Crocker's moist cake. You know, I didn't. So what's that all about? Yeah. It's funny that you haven't heard about this before, because I feel like moist is an infamously hated word. Like there have been polls and surveys and it's always up at the top there as one of the most hated words in the English language. And there were actually researchers who studied this. They wanted to find out why. And what they determined through their study was that it has to do with the words association to bodily fluids and also the way that it sounds. But that's only really true when it accompanies positive words like paradise and sexual words.

Then people are like, moist, it's gross. But if you say that a cake is moist, that doesn't seem to have the same gross effect as it does when you're talking about sexual words, I guess. It's really interesting. And there are a lot of words that rub people the wrong way. Like what? Like what? People hate the word amazing, I guess, because it's overused. They hate the word panties, again, because it seems like both sexual and juvenile. They're not fans of it. Plus, another word. People hate the word amazing. Well, it is used, overused, but it's overused, I figure,

because people liked it, not because they don't like it. And panties, I mean. Yeah, yeah. I mean, listen, you get the same kind of reaction when people use literally, figuratively. But people have used literally figuratively for hundreds of years. Some of our most famous writers have done it. James Joyce did it. It was only when English usage guides were being created, it became reviled essentially. The people who were writing those guides were very cranky about the figurative use of literally. And then when the internet came about, people really picked that up and it became a big, a big deal. When you say the figurative use of literally, like,

literally my head's going to explode, kind of, is that what you mean? Yep. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Your head's not literally going to explode. You're using it as an intensifier. And people hate that. Yeah, I've always hated that, but people do it all the time. What are some other words that people don't like, like amazing and panties? Blog, which is a word that I personally hate. That one's on my list. There's just something about it. Just the way it sounds. I. I don't like it. It's not even a logical thing. I just hate it. Phlegm. People hate the word phlegm. It's gross. Again, pus. One thing that we did, we came up with words that you can use instead. If you don't want to use blog, you can just say website. You don't have to call it a blog. If you don't want to use blog, you can just say website. You don't have to call it a blog.

If you don't want to say the word amazing, because again, if you call everything amazing, then nothing's actually amazing. You could say something like, oh, it's tizzy wizzy, which is an old fashioned slang term that I really like. For panties, you could call them underbodies. That's another really fun old-fashioned slang term we found that just sounds better. Talk about some of your favorite slang words and where they came from and what they mean. One of my top 10 slang terms is got the morbs, which is a 19th century word for temporary melancholy. I'm obsessed with it. It's just very, very colorful and delightful. Besmothered is a very old word coined by Chaucer, meaning something spattered with mud. So if you're covered in mud, you don't have to say that. You can say that you're

besmothered. Another one of my personal favorites is slugabed, which is an insult for someone who stays in bed late. But personally, I'm quite the slugabed, and I wear that badge with pride. Another one of my absolute favorite terms that's gotten a lot of play recently is dumpster fire. And so of course, it's been used for quite some time to refer to a literal fire in a dumpster. But the Oxford English Dictionary traced the first non-literal usage to a place, and I swear I am not making this up, to a wrestling Usenet group. And it was in reference to the movie Shrek the Third. The person said Shrek 3 was a dumpster fire. Don't get me started. A total disaster, just a total dumpster fire. Why do ghosts say boo?

So this is a complicated one. So I'm going to give you a little bit of the CliffsNotes version of it. But way back in the day when it was first being used, boo was actually just a way to kind of announce your presence to be like, hey, I'm here, boo. But by 1738, it began to be attached to kind of scary things. People were saying it to scare kids and whatnot. And then during the era of spiritualism in the 19th century, which was a time when people, many people, believed that they could communicate with the dead in a world beyond our own, it got attached to ghosts. So they had their own word.

So yeah, there's a lot more to it. There's roots in Latin and Greek and things like that, but that's the CliffsNotes version. But it used to be just like a greeting, like you would say, Hi, boo. You'd just be like, boo.

Like, I'm here. That was how it was used. So one I have always wondered about, but never enough to go look it up, was why some liquors are called spirits this is one of those those words that has a few different etymologies but there's there are a couple of theories that are prevailing one of them is that it has to do with the word alcohol which is believed to come from either one of two Arabic words which I will probably butcher the pronunciation of,

so I apologize in advance. One of them is Al-Ghawal, which literally means spirit. And the other is Al-Kol, and that's spelled A-L hyphen K-O-H apostrophe L. And that initially described an eyeliner that was made from this kind of powdery material. And transforming that powder into the eyeliner was similar to how alcohol was distilled. So it's believed that then Al-Kohl came to mean anything that was distilled. And when it was absorbed into the English language in the 16th century, it was actually used to describe a powder before it eventually came to mean the distilled essence of something. So, you know, it's complex, but fascinating. Does spirits have a definition as it is separate from other liquors?

Or is it just kind of this generic-y term that applies to alcoholic drinks? Yeah. So, I mean, I think technically when we're talking about spirits, we're talking about specifically like liquor, you know, like your whiskeys and your ryes and things like that, and not necessarily like beer. At least that's how I think of it. But again, other people might have different definitions. That's kind of the beauty of language. We're talking about interesting, loved, hated, and bizarre words and phrases of the English language. And my guest is Erin McCarthy. She's author of the book, Mental Floss, The Curious Compendium of Wonderful Words.

Bumble knows it's hard to start conversations. Hey. No, too basic. Hi there. Still no. What about hello, handsome? Who knew you could give yourself the ick? That's why Bumble is changing how you start conversations.

You can now make the first move or not. With opening moves, you simply choose a question to be automatically sent to your matches. Then sit back and let your matches start the chat. Download Bumble and try it for yourself. This is an ad for better help. Welcome to the world. Please read your personal owner's manual thoroughly. In it, you'll find simple instructions for how to interact with your fellow human beings

and how to find happiness and peace of mind. Thank you and have a nice life. Unfortunately, life doesn't come with an owner's manual. That's why there's BetterHelp Online Therapy. Connect with a credentialed therapist by phone, video, or online chat. Visit BetterHelp.com to learn more. That's BetterHelp.com. So, Aaron, another phrase you hear a lot is cut to the chase.

You know, when you want someone to get to the point, cut to the chase. Everybody knows what it means. Where did that come from? This is also really fun. Cut to the chase comes from the silent film industry. Obviously, at that time, directors couldn't rely on dialogue to move the action forward. So they'd literally cut to a chase sequence just to give their film momentum. It's very, very literal, very funny. And then in the 1950s, it kind of became a part

of our regular vernacular. Because again, people really know an evocative phrase when they hear one. I think it really does speak to how much we just love a catchy phrase. And I think Cut to the Chase qualifies as that, and it really gets the point across. And what about scapegoat? What is a scapegoat? This is a fascinating one. So the word scapegoat comes to us from an English Protestant scholar named William Tyndale, and he coined it in 1530. At the time, he was translating some of the books of the Torah, and he was reading about Yom Kippur rituals featured in Leviticus. And as part of one of the rituals, there was a ceremony where a priest would confess people's sins with his hands on the head of a goat. So by doing that, he was transferring the sins of the people to the animal.

And then the animal was then sacrificed to God. So Tyndale called that creature a scapegoat what's a word or phrase that you came across in your research that you found really interesting or surprising or weird or unusual that you like piggyback ride because I think it's one of those phrases that starts in one place and then ends up as something completely different there's not necessarily one origin, but one explanation for why we call someone riding on your back a piggyback ride is that it maybe came from the 16th century phrase pick pack, which may have referred to like a bag put on your back for easy

transporting. And then there was this kind of like whisper down the lane situation where the phrase became pick back and pig back and pick a pack, pick a back, pig a back. And so the last one sounds a lot like piggyback. So it's an example of how we hear things and how that changes language and the words that we use that I just think is fascinating. Why does the word donut have two different spellings, one d-o-u-g-h and the other just d-o-nut? It has a lot to do with Dunkin' Donuts. It was definitely spelled one way, way back in the day. And then the D-O-U-G-H version of it, because they are obviously

made of dough. And then when Dunkin' Donuts came on the scene, they kind of made the other spelling, the alternate spelling, more popular. So everybody knows what the placebo effect is, but that word placebo, it doesn't sound like any other word. Where does it come from? Placebo means I will please in Latin. And so at one point in time, it was used in Catholic prayers for people who had died. So the prayer was translated as I will please the Lord in the land of the living. And eventually the word came to be used to refer to the entire prayer. And then it went through this sort of linguistic change.

You know, a meaning got added. So by the 14th century, placebo had come to mean, you know, flattery that was intended to make a person feel good, even if it wasn't exactly true. And then eventually, but it took quite some time. It wasn't until the 18th century. It ended up in medicine, and it came to refer to a drug or treatment that would make someone feel good, even if there was no actual medicinal effect. Another one I've wondered about is made from scratch. Everybody, as soon as they hear it, knows what that means. It means, you know, make from original ingredients, but made from scratch. Where did that come from? Yeah. So it comes from sports, funnily enough. Scratch was the word for the starting line in

things like running and in cricket. And then eventually it came to be used in a whole bunch of expressions that meant essentially meet the standard. We don't know exactly when it became a term for food, but the earliest evidence that has been unearthed points to a 1946 New York Times article that was talking about how cooking from scratch was a fading fad. So really, really interesting stuff, a little bit of an etymological mystery. But yeah, it came from sports, which is weird. Lastly, tell the story about McDonald's going to war with the dictionary. It's an interesting story. So in the 2000s, both the Oxford English Dictionary and Merriam-Webster's Collegiate

Dictionaries included the word McJob in their pages as kind of like a disparaging word for a low paid job. And McDonald's really did not like that. They actually wrote an open letter about it. And in the UK, they even considered legal action. But the dictionaries were like, we're not budging. And so McDonald's actually launched their own campaign to flip the term from a negative to a positive. So they had this advertising campaign that used words like McFlexible and McDiscount. And then they topped it off with the tagline, not bad for a McJob. So yeah, they really, they went on a campaign when they realized that the dictionaries were not going to take McJob out.

But I don't hear that word. I don't ever hear that word. Maybe it's one of those words that's faded. But you know, in the 2000s, I guess it was very much a thing, enough of a thing that the Oxford English Dictionary added it. Generation names, baby boomers, millennials, Gen X, where do those labels come from? So the fun thing about generation names is that there's no one way that they get their names. For example, Generation X was coined by an author, Douglas Coupland. And at least once the US Census Bureau gave us a generation name. Their phrase post-war baby boom gave us baby boomers. But I think that was the last time that the Census Bureau ever named a generation. And ever since then, it's been the media and advertisers and authors. But do we know why Z and X and what that refers to? In terms of millennials, people actually wanted to call millennials Generation Y because

millennials come after Generation X. But that just did not stick, was not catchy enough. So millennials was actually coined by authors. And then Gen Z, the Pew Research Center initially tried to call Gen Z post-millennials. And again, it just did not stick. We decided that Gen Z was better. And sometimes they're also called Zoomers. You know, again, it just really speaks to how important it is for language to be catchy,

for things to stick around, I guess. Well, it's certainly fun to hear the stories behind so many of the words and phrases that we use all the time without really thinking about, you know, what they mean literally or where they came from. Erin McCarthy has been my guest. She's the vice president, editor-in-chief at mentalfloss.com. And the name of her book is Mental Floss, the Curious Compendium of Wonderful Words. And there's a link to that book, the Curious Compendium of Wonderful Words. And there's a link to that book in the show notes. This was fun, Erin. Thanks for coming on.

Thank you so much, Mike. It's been great chatting with you. Since I host a podcast, it's pretty common for me to be asked to recommend a podcast. And I tell people, if you like something you should know, you're going to like The Jordan Harbinger Show. Every episode is a conversation with a fascinating guest. Of course, a lot of podcasts are conversations with guests, but Jordan does it better than most. Recently, he had a fascinating conversation with a British woman who was recruited and radicalized by ISIS and went to prison for three years. She now works to raise awareness on this issue. It's a great conversation.

And he spoke with Dr. Sarah Hill about how taking birth control not only prevents pregnancy, it can influence a woman's partner preferences, career choices, and overall behavior due to the hormonal changes it causes. Apple named The Jordan Harbinger Show one of the best podcasts a few years back, and in a nutshell, the show is aimed at making you a better, more informed critical thinker. Check out The Jordan Harbinger Show. There's so much for you in this podcast. The Jordan Harbinger Show on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts.

People who listen to Something You Should Know are curious about the world, looking to hear new ideas and perspectives. So I want to tell you about a podcast that is full of new ideas and perspectives, and one I've started listening to called Intelligence Squared. It's the podcast where great minds meet. Listen in for some great talks on science, tech, politics, creativity, wellness, and a lot more. A couple of recent examples, Mustafa Suleiman, the CEO of Microsoft AI, discussing the future of technology. That's pretty cool. And writer,

podcaster, and filmmaker John Ronson discussing the rise of conspiracies and culture wars. Intelligence Squared is the kind of podcast that gets you thinking a little more openly about the important conversations going on today. Being curious, you're probably just the type of person Intelligence Squared is meant for. Check out Intelligence Squared wherever you get your podcasts. Think for just a moment about your future self, the you who will be you 5, 10, 20 years in the future. Do you ever think about the future you when you make decisions today in the present? Do you plan to make life better for your future self or do you have more of a yeah whatever happens happens attitude? The fact is your future self needs you now according to Hal Hirschfield. Hal is a professor of marketing,

behavioral decision making and psychology at UCLA's Anderson School of Management, and he's author of a book called Your Future Self, How to Make Tomorrow Better Today. Hey, Hal, great to have you here. It's great to be here. I'm looking forward to this. So when you look at the future, when I look at my future, I mean, there are so many unknowns that could happen. There could be, you know, chance encounters, unpredictable events could occur that could alter my future drastically. And I have no control over that. So I think it's hard for people to think that they have a lot of control over their future self, because so much

can and likely will happen that is out of our control. You know, this kind of goes back, there's just some great old research, Al Bandora, one of the sort of, you know, giants in psychology in the 20th century, you know, he sort of talks about the fact that we do have many chance encounters in our lives that we can't fully plan for. But what we can plan for is to be open to the possibility that different meetings and connections will lead to something. And we don't, we don't fully know what that is. And we have to be okay with that. Is your future self, or maybe when you get to be your future self, whenever you get to

be your future self and you look back, are you, do you think, are you the same person who's just evolved or are you somebody new? And maybe another way to ask it is like, like if I met my 10 year old self, would I really have anything in common to talk about? I mean, or would I do better to talk about, you know, people with people my own age? Yeah, that's a, what an interesting thought experiment. The question you're asking is, it's such a deep question. And it's really hard to answer because, you know, you first, if I was a philosopher, I would say, well, what do we mean by the same, you know? And so, I think the way that I think about this is that in many ways, were you to communicate with yourself at age 10 or yourself

at age 85, there'd be many, many things different. You may look different. You may live in a different city. Your friends may be different. You may even have different interests. What I would push on is to say, well, what sort of deep-seated values and traits might be the same some will have changed people do change in terms of their personality over time in some ways and other ways they don't you know so if you were the most talkative kid in your class you may become less talkative over time but you might still be among the more talkative of your group of adult friends.

One thing that I would sort of ask in these sorts of thought experiments that you're raising is what are the core things that you could point to and say, even though I've changed on the surface, I still at the core am a person who enjoys sarcastic humor. Or at the core, I'm still somebody who is kind-hearted or maybe I'm still biting or whatever it is. That is what's known as a moral trait, a core moral trait. Whatever those are, I think you could point to and say that that is what makes me still the same me. Why do you suppose it is that we have trouble, many of us have trouble, providing for our future self? You know, we don't save enough for retirement.

We maybe don't take good care of our health and then suffer for it later in life. What gets in the way? What blocks us from seeing that these are worthwhile things to do and that we should do them. To some extent, and what my own research has been circling around, to some extent, we all think of our future selves as if they are other people. That's an analogy.

But, you know, as an example, I've run some research where we find that in the brain, the brain activity that comes about when I think of my future self looks more like the brain activity that comes about when I think of another person. Now, that matters because of the way that we treat other people, or rather because of the way that we treat other people we don't know all that well. In other words, if a perfect stranger were to stop you on the street and ask you to, I don't know, help them move this weekend, you would probably have a number of reasons why you couldn't do that. I'm guessing you already have plans going on. If you think about it, if you consider your future self as if it's a stranger to you, then in some ways, you know, saving for retirement or eating healthier, exercising, all of those sorts of decisions that have, you know, sacrifices that need to be made right now for benefits later.

Well, the benefits don't come to you. They come to some other guy. You'd almost be forgiven to just do what you want to do today. Now, the catch here, Mike, is that we don't only interact with strangers in our lives, right? I said, if a stranger came up to you and asked you to move, you would say no. Well, if your adult kid asked you to help, you know, for help this weekend, if your aging parent did, if your best friend asked you for help this weekend, you would probably shift some things around if you could and make it happen. And so one of the sort of big ideas that I've been playing around with is whether or not the relationships that we have with our future selves, whether those are what matter for the decisions that we make. So if I feel like my future self is someone I need to take care of, like my adult kid or my aging parent or my best friend, well, then I'll probably be a little bit more likely to do things that

will benefit them later on. So how do you develop and nurture that relationship if it isn't a real person? How do you get to know them? Yeah, I love the way that you said that, right? Because it's not a real person. That's where this conversation becomes, I think, even more interesting, right? Because if we're thinking about the actual relationships in our lives, I mentioned your kids, your parents, your friends, those people exist right now. I can reach out and

touch them. I can call them. I can talk to them. My future self, he never exists. He's just sort of an imagination, right? And so then how do you get to know them? I think is how you asked it. And I would sort of flip that around and say, well, you know, you can't ever fully know them, right? Because we can't know the things that will change over our lives and the ways that we ourselves will sort of morph and alter and become new people. So you can't fully know them, but what you can do is become closer to them. You can feel more of a sense of connection. In my own research with my collaborators, we've tried a variety of things. One thing that we've tried to do is to make that future self more vivid and sort of, you know, with a beating emotional core. And that may sound abstract, but what I mean by that is one thing we've tried to do is show people

what their future selves looked like. We've literally used, you know, age progression technology to show people images of their future self. Another thing we've been doing, we've had people write letters to their future selves. And then other people have had people write letters from their future selves. And again, the beauty there is it really starts connecting you to that future self. So those are just two ways that we can think of to try to get that relationship to be stronger. And have you worked with anybody who's done that? And if so, what's the reward for doing it?

Yeah, so we've partnered with different organizations. Most recently, we partnered with a bank in Mexico. They sent out your standard message about the need to save more. They sent this to 50,000 of their customers. Half of them got that message. I'm glossing over the details. Half of them got all the important points about why you need to save more for retirement and so on. The other half got that same messaging, but they also got the opportunity

to see themselves when they were older in retirement. And the folks who did were 16% more likely to make a contribution to their personal pension, which is basically like a 401k in the US. You know, other groups, other research groups have used these sorts of techniques, not with actual age progression images, but with a visualization exercise with women in rural Kenya, for instance. This is a recent paper that just came out. And found that relative to a control condition, women who went through these visualization exercises were more likely to chlorinate their water, which is hugely important for preventing bowel issues for their kids. And they were more likely to save their wages over time. They followed them over a 10 week period. So, you know, I think there's a lot more work to be done on this and looking at sort

of, you know, for whom do these sort of visualization and vividness exercises work better? And for whom do they work worse? But, you know, one of the things that we're finding early on is that there's some promise to these as interventions. Have you looked at like when people look back who they're now, they have become their future self. They're older. They're in their 80s, 90s. They look back. Do they look back with regret? Do they look back with, I wish I had done this

A, B, C, and D when I was younger? I kept saying I would, but I never did. Or do they think, well, things kind of work now. You know, one of the things that we know from that literature is that the things that people regret as they get older are the things that they didn't do rather than the things that they did do. So, so immediately in the moment, we regret the thing we just did because we're like, oh my God, I'm so embarrassed by that. But over time, what we end up regretting is the things we didn't do because we can spin out all sorts of tales of how our lives might have been different. If I'd done this one little thing, if I'd asked this person out, where would I be?

And so on and so on. So those are the flavor of regrets that come about. Now, your question is a fascinating one. And there's differences between people. We do know that as people get older, they actually become more positive. They experience more positive emotions, fewer negative emotions than their younger counterparts, in part because, you know what, they're facing a limited time horizon. And so they focus on what's meaningful right then and there, rather than trying to change things for a relatively short and uncertain future.

Is this a cultural thing? And are there cultures where there is much more emphasis on your future self and making sure your future self is well provided for? Or is this, on the human nature side, well, from an evolutionary standpoint, we're just not that well equipped to think about a future that's as long as it is right now for us. In other words, our lifespans, our life expectancies are much longer now than they were even 150, 200 years ago. And from an evolutionary standpoint, that's in a blink of an eye, we've been adding a huge amount of extra life that we now have to grapple with. So I think that is a universal. But then your question goes deeper because we can look at different cultures. Now, this is an area where I still need to do the work. We don't know for sure how different cultures experience different levels of connection to their future selves. That said, different societies,

different cultures and countries have different practices in place. So if you're in some countries, there's much more of a robust social safety net, you know, a social security net. Right. In the U.S., we used to have a much stronger sort of employer mandated, government mandated system. And now saving for the future in that particular space. Right. Just in terms of saving. That often falls on individuals, individual workers. Whereas in other countries, sure, you give up so much more of your paycheck to taxes, but then you have a pension and you're set when you retire. Now, that's just one aspect we can ask. Does that happen because of some sort of cultural norms around future selves? Does it happen because

of cultural norms around the ways that we treat and respect the elderly? These are questions that I don't really have the answers to, but I think they're great ones to ask and I'd love to continue to explore them. I just don't know right now. I can only sort of speculate that there are differences, but exactly what they are is not yet known. But doesn't it seem like it's something that, well, you're doing the research, but it seems like something we ought to pay more attention to and people probably have been saying,

yeah, we really need to save for the future. We need to do this stuff for the future. But we don't. We just don't. Yeah. I think we could be forgiven, right? But we don't. We just don't. easily available. Gosh, with buy now, pay later schemes, it almost seems like everything right now can be paid for later. And of course, the danger there is that we're just going to get into even more and more debt, right? So the idea is there, but it can be really hard.

I mean, let's just acknowledge first and foremost, it can be hard for many swaths of society who feel as if there's no discretionary income to save, right? I need it all right now. There's other swaths that may feel that way, but then when push comes to shove, you can look at your spending and say, well, probably could cut back there. I could probably cut back there. You know, to me, it boils down to the, you know, series of individual decisions. I'm in the market for a new car. There's a more sensible one, but it doesn't seem as fun or as cool or has many features or I could stretch, you know, and buy a slightly more expensive one.

Well, maybe that makes sense to do. Maybe you're going to get a lot of pleasure out of the nicer features of that higher end car. The problem arises when I make that sort of rationalization for every one of my purchases. I'm tired, so I should order out. OK, fine. This house, it's a little bit more house in a slightly neighbor, a nicer neighborhood. Sure, my property taxes will be higher and or this rent, whatever it is.

Each of those decisions make sense in isolation. But then when they add up, you can all of a sudden say, oh, yeah, that's why I have no leftover money to save. Well, I wonder if this kind of positive psychology, things have a way of working out attitude that people seem to have that I don't really need to really worry too much about that because things have a way of working out. And many people's experience is that is true. Yeah, I have no problem with that. And I think that is, I think that's very healthy in a way. We know that we have, you know, what researchers call a healthy psychological immune system, we kind of get used to bad things quicker than we thought

we also sort of get used to good things quicker than we thought. You know, the only problem that I have, I think where things become really difficult is when somebody says, I want to be saving more, I want to be exercising more, and I just can't do it. When there's the gap there, that's when I'd say, okay, then what can we do to try to, you know, quote unquote, fix that? If somebody says, look, I don't want to be saving. I'm okay with it. All right, fine. You know, my sort of caveat would be if, you know, let's just take the narrow example of saving and working and retirement. If I say, look, I'm not saving that much, but I'm spending all this money now.

You know what I'll do? I'll just keep working forever. My real worry there is that what is underestimated is the likelihood that you experience a negative health event that takes you out of the workforce. The likelihood that you experience some sort of macroeconomic shock that takes you out of the workforce. That whatever it is, changes in your life and now you can't just work until you drop dead, right? And then now that, you know, laissez-faire attitude of it'll work out. Well, that may not be necessarily the case.

So there's nuance here. You know, I'm not saying everybody should abandon that attitude, you know, nor should I say everybody should have it. It's just more like, I think we need to be careful with what we're planning for or not planning for when we make these sorts of decisions. They will be in the future in very specific ways because that person, he or she, is coming. They will be here. What will they need? What will they want? I've been speaking with Hal Hirschfield.

He is a professor of marketing, behavioral decision-making, and psychology at the Anderson School of Management at UCLA and author of the book, Your Future Self, How to Make Tomorrow Better Today. And if you would like to grab a copy, there is a link to that book at Amazon in the show notes. Thank you for being here, Hal. Thanks so much. It was great to talk to you, Mike. Many a grandmother has used honey to treat a burn or a wound, and that practice of using honey dates back at least to the ancient Egyptians. They not only used honey for wounds, they harnessed its antimicrobial properties

to help embalm and preserve the dead. But if you're tempted to reach for that jar of honey in your pantry to rub on a burn or a wound, you might want to hold off. Your honey is probably not sterilized and won't likely do very much. However, there is something called medical-grade honey. It's a sterile product that has been formulated and processed for safety and efficacy and is less likely to cause an immune system reaction. The specific type of honey also matters. A variety known as Manuka honey contains antibacterial agents in greater concentrations, as well as other several distinct compounds that make it well-suited for healing.

You can find medical-grade honey online. Amazon sells it, as do other retailers. And that is something you should know. We could really use a review from you. If you've been listening to this podcast and you like it, I would invite you to leave a rating and review on whatever platform you listen. I'm Mike Carruthers. Thanks for listening today to Something You Should Know. Welcome to the small town of Chinook, where faith runs deep and secrets run deeper. In this new thriller, religion and crime collide when a gruesome murder rocks the isolated

Montana community. Everyone is quick to point their fingers at a drug-addicted teenager, but local deputy Ruth Vogel isn't convinced. She suspects connections to a powerful religious group. Enter federal agent V.B. Loro, who has been investigating a local church for possible criminal activity. The pair form an unlikely partnership to catch the killer, unearthing secrets that leave Ruth torn between her duty to the law, her religious convictions, and her very

own family. But something more sinister than murder is afoot, and someone is watching Ruth. Chinook, starring Kelly Marie Tran and Sanaa Lathan. Listen to Chinook wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, this is Rob Benedict. And I am Richard Spate. We were both on a little show you might know called Supernatural. It had a pretty good run. 15 seasons, 327 episodes.

And though we have seen, of course, every episode many times, we figured, hey, now that we're wrapped, let's watch it all again. And we can't do that alone. So we're inviting the cast and crew that made the show along for the ride. We've got writers, producers, composers, directors, and we'll, of course, have some actors on as well, including some certain guys that played some certain pretty iconic brothers. It was kind of a little bit of a left field choice in the best way possible.

The note from Kripke was, he's great, we love him, but we're looking for like a really intelligent Duchovny type. With 15 seasons to explore, it's going to be the road trip of several lifetimes. So please join us and subscribe to Supernatural then and now.