Something You Should Know - Why You Have So Much Stuff and What to Do With It & How To Be A Great Communicator

Episode Date: April 6, 2020

Need something to pass the time? This episode begins with an activity you and the family can do that will kill some time and also put money in the bank. http://lifehacker.com/what-to-do-with-all-that-loose-change-youve-been-hoardi-1792821108 Unless you are careful, it is easy to accumulate a lot of stuff. It is not a stretch to say that Americans have too much stuff. So how did we get it and what should we do with it? To the rescue is Peter Walsh. Peter has been helping people organize and declutter - as a coach, a TV host, a writer and on YouTube. His latest book is called Let It Go (https://amzn.to/3dKkb0a). Listen as he offers some incredible insight into why we accumulate so much stuff and has some great techniques that can help you evaluate whether you should keep it, toss it or give it away.  How many times have we all heard about the importance of good communication? So how does a good communicator – communicate? Leadership and communications consultant Alain Hunkins, author of the book Cracking The Leadership Code (https://amzn.to/39vSAMB) joins me to explain what it means to be a good communicator and offers excellent suggestions that will help you communicate better. His website is www.alainhunkins.com  Chopping onions is one of the most unpleasant jobs in the kitchen because onions make you cry. But they don’t have to. Listen as I explain some simple ways to chop onions without the tears. https://www.lifehacker.com.au/2013/04/tested-the-best-tear-free-tricks-for-cutting-onions/ This Week's Sponsors -AirMedCare Network.Go to www.AirMedCareNetwork.com/something and get up to a $50 gift card when you use the promo code: something Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

As a listener to Something You Should Know, I can only assume that you are someone who likes to learn about new and interesting things and bring more knowledge to work for you in your everyday life. I mean, that's kind of what Something You Should Know was all about. And so I want to invite you to listen to another podcast called TED Talks Daily. Now, you know about TED Talks, right? Many of the guests on Something You Should Know have done TED Talks. Well, you see, TED Talks Daily is a podcast that brings you a new TED Talk every weekday in less than 15 minutes. Join host Elise Hu.

She goes beyond the headlines so you can hear about the big ideas shaping our future. Learn about things like sustainable fashion, embracing your entrepreneurial spirit, the future of robotics, and so much more. Like I said, if you like this podcast, Something You Should Know, I'm pretty sure you're going to like TED Talks Daily. And you get TED Talks Daily wherever you get your podcasts. Today on Something You Should Know, we start with a great way to kill some time while you're at home and put some money in the bank. Then what to do with all your stuff and the reason you have so much stuff in the first place. For example, houses today are double the size they were in the 50s and families are half the size they were in the 50s, and families are half the size they were in the 50s.

And it's a recipe for disaster because, oh my God, empty shelf. I've got to put something on it. Then the solution to one of the biggest kitchen problems you have. And what does it mean to have good communication? At work and in relationships, it's harder than you think. The whole goal of communication is to lead to understanding. good communication. At work and in relationships, it's harder than you think. The whole goal of communication is to lead to understanding. The amazing thing about that, and I think George Bernard Shaw probably said it best when he said, the greatest problem with communication is the illusion that it's been accomplished.

All this today on Something You Should Know. Since I host a podcast, it's pretty common for me to be asked to recommend a podcast. And I tell people, if you like Something You Should Know, you're going to like The Jordan Harbinger Show. Every episode is a conversation with a fascinating guest. Of course, a lot of podcasts are conversations with guests, but Jordan does it better than most. Recently, he had a fascinating conversation with a British woman who was recruited and radicalized by ISIS

and went to prison for three years. She now works to raise awareness on this issue. It's a great conversation. And he spoke with Dr. Sarah Hill about how taking birth control not only prevents pregnancy, it can influence a woman's partner preferences, career choices, and overall behavior due to the hormonal changes it causes. Apple named The Jordan Harbinger Show one of the best podcasts a few years back, and in a nutshell, the show is aimed at making you a better, more informed critical thinker. Check out The Jordan Harbinger Show. There's so much for you in this podcast.

The Jordan Harbinger Show on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Something you should know. Fascinating intel. The world's top experts. And practical advice you can use in your life. Today, Something You Should Know with Mike Carruthers. Hi, welcome to Something You Should Know. Listen, if you have a business or a product or a service that you think would make sense to advertise on this podcast, particularly in this

coronavirus time in our history, Feel free to contact me. I'd love to see if we can find a way to work together and benefit the audience here as well. We have close to a million and a half downloads of this podcast every month, and maybe it could work for your business. Just drop me an email at mike at somethingyoushouldknow.net and let's see what we can do.

First up today, I have an idea for you if you're sitting around the house looking for something to do, and that is to count and organize all that loose change sitting in that jar somewhere in your house. What you may not know is, in many cases, you can't just take that jar down to the bank. Bank tellers really hate that. In fact, the U.S. Department of the Treasury says banks don't have to accept change if they don't want to. And there are a few reasons they don't want to. All that change takes up room. It's heavy to transport.

Coin counting machines are expensive and may not be available. So it's best to check with the bank. There may be a small fee to bring a bunch of change down there, and many banks require change be put in paper rolls first. So there's something you can do to kill an afternoon. Put coins in paper rolls. You could also use that CoinStar machine in the front of most supermarkets. The machine will count it all and give you a voucher for cash at the store checkout, but just know that they

take a little more than 10% of the money for their trouble. And that is something you should know. Since so many of us are spending a lot of times in our homes, surrounded by all our stuff, let's talk about your stuff. Why you have it, what to do with it, how to organize it, and maybe how to get rid of some of it. There's nobody better to talk about stuff than Peter Walsh. He's been helping people get organized one-on-one and in TV shows and in books. I think he knows more about people and their stuff than just about anybody. His latest book is called Let It Go, and he's here to talk about your stuff. Hey Peter, so everybody knows that we probably all have too

much stuff, or most of us have too much stuff, how much stuff do we have? There are two statistics I'll give you here. One is the average American home has 300,000 items in it, which is just mind-blowing. And the other stat is of the items in your home, you tend to use only 20% of them. Now, I've spent over 20 years helping people organize and declutter their homes. And without exception, when I go into people's homes to between 70 and 80% of the stuff that people say, oh, there's nothing to go, close to 80% of stuff leaves the house. When you get people to get rid of 80% of what's in their house, stuff that they say, I couldn't possibly part with,

what is that conversation that goes on that gets them to loosen their grip and let it go? It's fascinating that the stuff that people own, the stuff that we hold on to, is just a measure of who we are. And particularly when it comes to downsizing, and I see this a lot with older people, that having spent a lifetime accumulating stuff, when you ask people to let go of stuff, for many people you're asking them to let go of a dream or a vision of who they are. Let me give you a really quick example.

I worked with a woman recently who had two teenage boys. When I came to the house, they wanted me to build storage in the garage to store all of the baby stuff that those boys had had as babies. And they were in their teenage years. All the baby's clothes, all the toys, cribs, bassinets, and the boys were 15 and 17. Crazy. The first question I asked her was, are your best years with your boys in front of you or behind you?

Are your best years with your boys in front of you or behind you? Are your best years with your boys in front of you or behind you? She immediately started sobbing and couldn't talk to me. That's because when you or I looked at those babies' clothes, what we saw were babies' clothes that hadn't been touched or used in 17 years. When she looked at those baby's clothes she saw her value and her worth as a woman, as a mother, as a wife. And for you or I to ask her to let go of those clothes she had to let go of what she saw as her most valuable time as a person in that family, memory clutter.

That's what we were looking at. And so when you are working with many people asking them to let go of their stuff, you have to first work with them to let go of what the stuff represents to them. And so letting go of clutter is often not about the stuff, but about what the stuff represents. I recently had this experience. My family moved to a new house, and I had some furniture. And I love this furniture from my old house. It was a real find. It was gorgeous. I loved it. It reminded me of a great time in my life and I had a really hard

time letting it go. I agonized over it and then I got rid of it. And you know what? I haven't thought about it since until now. It was so hard to let go of, but once it was gone, it really wasn't that big a deal. And for a lot of people though, Mike, they can't get past that moment. In your case, it wasn't a hugely significant moment, but for many people, that moment might be tied with inheritance. I was given that furniture. I inherited that furniture from my parents. And the let go of that means let going of that memory or worse still, dishonoring my parents.

And so you have to help people see that that furniture is not their parents. And that can be a very difficult moment for many people because for many people the stuff is the memory, is the person. That's the complicated piece in helping people let go of stuff because all clutter is not the same. It's often either what I call memory clutter, and that's the stuff that reminds us of an important person or achievement or event from the past,

or it can be what I call I might need it one day clutter. And that's the guy, for example, who has a shed full of timber, lumber, that he knows he's going to use in building someday or, you know, my mum who had a cupboard full of recipes that she knew she was going to use one day but when she died that cupboard was still full of all those magazines and recipes that, you know, she took to her grave thinking one day she was going to cook the perfect, you know, strawberry, but she never got to. So for many people, it's helping them deal with that future they're hoping to hold onto the stuff for, or letting go of the values of having someone like you, is

when you come into somebody's home and you... I just have this sense that people are looking for someone to give them permission to get rid of it. And you come in and you say... You basically give them permission

that it's okay to let this go and that's all they need to go, okay, fine. It's so weird that you say that, because one of the most amazing things is that one of the fundamental things I do is I give people permission that they won't give themselves. and very often, you know, people will ask me a question and I just look at them and say, the very fact you've asked me the question tells me that you've already made up your mind about this. You know, I recently had a woman whose mother said to her before she died, promise me that you will never let go of this this sideboard with this china you know a full

china set for 20 people that the mother's mother had given her it was the most horrendous china set you've ever seen i mean it was grotesque and this woman who'd never had a dinner party and who'd never married, had carried cross-country three times. She hated it. And yet her mother had said to her on her deathbed, promise me, this poor woman had carted this monstrosity. And people, we're going to get, I'm going to get hate mail for this, I know it, had carried it cross-country three times. And it was a burden. And she said to me, what do you think I should do? And I just looked at her, and I said, you know what you should do.

Do you think your mother was fair? And she said, no. And I said, do you like it? She said, no, I hate it. And I said, what do you think you should do? And she said, I think, and she started laughing, exactly what you're doing. And I said, what do you think you should do? And she said, I think I should she started laughing, exactly what you're doing. And I said, what do you think you should do? And she said, I think I should push it off a frigging cliff.

And I was like, let's do it. And, you know, it went straight to goodwill after 20 years. So, yeah, you're right. You know, but many people are tied by this chain of obligation. And, you know, I say to people, you people you know people will a woman I just recently worked with her grandmother died 26 years ago when her grandmother died she put everything in storage and has held it there for 26 years no one who loved you wants you to be tied down by their stuff. And this chain of obligation holds so many people to feel obligated to keep their stuff. Stuff can be a terrible burden. And, you know, as you say,

sometimes it's just a matter of nodding, smiling, and saying, you know what you should do. Another thing that's interesting to me is that houses today, compared to houses, you know, 50 years ago or so, have a lot more storage in it. And there's this sense, because in the house that I now live in, there is a lot of storage and there's a lot of empty drawers and empty shelves and empty. And you almost feel like you're not like you're like you're doing. You're not you're doing the house a disservice by not filling up everything. The thing is that houses today are double the size they were in the 50s and families are half the size they were in the 50s. And it's a recipe for disaster because, oh, my God, empty shelf. I've got to put something on it.

And it's this crazy thing. And it's complicated by the whole marketing machine. And there's this thing that I call the product and the promise. And the problem is we go out and buy products, for example, the exercise machine, but what we're actually buying is the promise. So we buy the exercise machine, but the promise we're buying is that somehow when we put it in our bedroom, we will magically start using it and get thinner. We buy the skinny jeans but the promise that we're buying is somehow when we put them on our butt will be a lot thinner. We buy the beautiful

set of kitchenware but the promise that we're buying is that somehow when we get them home we will suddenly have a beautiful round table dinner like Martha Stewart's magazine. And so suddenly all those shelves and cupboards and closets are full of all these products, but our lives and our homes are littered with all these empty promises. And so you're absolutely right that we feel this compulsion, particularly with cheap products, to fill our homes with these products and the shelves are full. But the lesson that I've learned is that every single time that I have decluttered a home where there are children, every single time when children come back into an empty space they start to dance every single time kids start to dance and that's because i think that kids have this beautiful innocence that they

understand that an empty space is a place where they can celebrate with joy and enthusiasm because it gives them a lightness and openness and a joy that a cluttered full space just cannot. I'm speaking with Peter Walsh. He's an organizing expert and author of the book, Let It Go. Hi, this is Rob Benedict. And I am Richard Spate. We were both on a little show you might know called Supernatural. It had a pretty good run, 15 seasons, 327 episodes. And though we have seen, of course, every episode many times, we figured, hey, now that we're wrapped, let's watch it all again.

And we can't do that alone. So we're inviting the cast and crew that made the show along for the ride. We've got writers, producers, composers, directors, and we'll of course have some actors on as well, including some certain guys that played some certain pretty iconic brothers. It was kind of a little bit of a left field choice in the best way possible. The note from Kripke was, he's great, we love him, but we're looking for like a really intelligent Duchovny type. With 15 seasons to explore, it's going to be the road trip of several lifetimes. So please join us and subscribe to Supernatural then and perspectives. So I want to tell you about a podcast that is full of new ideas and perspectives and one I've started listening to

called Intelligence Squared. It's the podcast where great minds meet. Listen in for some great talks on science, tech, politics, creativity, wellness, and a lot more. A couple of recent examples, Mustafa Suleiman, the CEO of Microsoft AI, discussing the future of technology.

That's pretty cool. And writer, podcaster, and filmmaker John Ronson, discussing the rise of conspiracies and culture wars. Intelligence Squared is the kind of podcast that gets you thinking a little more openly about the important conversations going on today. Being curious, you're probably just the kind of podcast that gets you thinking a little more openly about the important conversations going on today. Being curious, you're probably just the type of person Intelligence Squared is meant for.

Check out Intelligence Squared wherever you get your podcasts. So, Peter, it is interesting, and I think people can identify with this idea that the clutter happens little by little every day, but getting rid of it is like a big effort. It's easy to bring it in. It's hard to get it out. And that is absolutely true. But here are two simple things that I will say to you that you can start today to do that you will say, that sounds like crap.

I don't know how that can make an effect. But here are two simple things. Number one, today, stop using the word later. I'll put it down later. I'll put it away later. I'll finish that later. I'll fold the laundry later. I'll wash the laundry later. I'll wash the dishes later.

Stop using the word later because the moment you use the word later, you delay doing a task and you start complicating your life. I'll open the mail later. I'll read the mail later. I'll file that later. I'll read the mail later. I'll file that later. Stop using the word later. And I promise that will start making a difference to how you live in your life. And the second one is don't put it down, put it away. Don't put it down, put it away. So instead of putting your coat on the floor when you walk in, instead of putting your dirty laundry, your washed laundry on the bed, fold it and put it away. Instead of

putting your dishes in the sink, put them in the dishwasher. So if you stop saying later and don't put things down, put them away. I promise if you just start with those two simple changed mindsets, I guarantee that overnight you will start to see a change in clutter in your home. It sounds ridiculous. Try it for a week and you will start to see a change. Sometimes I think people think, well, okay, so let's get all this crap out of the house, so we'll go rent that storage locker and put it all in there. And it sort of makes sense, at least it's out of the house, but I imagine you're not big on that. Look, I think storage lockers are a great idea for a short-term problem. You know, if you're moving and you've got stuff that you want to go through, then by all means, if you're painting the house and you need to get stuff out,

if you're selling your house and you need to depersonalize it, great idea. But put a timeline on it i've had people who've spent you know tens of thousands of dollars on a storage facility who have three or four or five storage facilities and have spent over a hundred thousand dollars it's a very good reason why there's a saying out of sight out of mind the moment you put stuff in a storage facility there's a huge danger that it stays there and you know within a year you haven't used it the truth is you don't need it and very quickly it becomes you know like a gym membership where you pay month after month and it just becomes you know one more thing that you pay money on and And within a year, the money that you've spent is worth way more than the stuff that's in the storage locker.

And before you know it, you know, you're featured on one of those TLC shows where people are emptying the storage locker and saying, why on earth would people store these clothes from 1995 that look like crap and have moths around. So from all your years of experience doing this, what's this advice? Because I think people think, all right, where do I even begin? If I decide I really want to clean this mess up, how do you do it? The first thing is 10 minutes a day. Just start with 10 minutes a day. You have to start, there are two steps. One, stop the inflow. A lot of people use shopping and buying stuff, even thrift store shopping as kind of a recreational thing. Stop that. Number one. Number two, start with what I call the trash bag tango. Get everyone in your house today to get two trash bags, set a timer for 10 minutes, run around the house, everyone,

one trash bag you fill with stuff that's trash, you know, old newspapers, old takeout containers, anything, broken toys, anything like that. And the other one you fill with stuff that can go to goodwill. If two of you do that for one week, at the end of a week, you'll have 14 bags of trash and 14 bags for donation. If two of you do that for a month, you'll have 60 bags of trash and 60 bags of stuff for donation. 10 minutes a day for a month will have you with 120 trash bags leaving the house. 10 minutes a day for one month will make a massive difference. Start there, my friends, and I promise, I promise, I promise, you can start to see a massive difference.

I have a 10-minute-a-day challenge on my YouTube channel. Just start with 10 minutes a day, friends, and I promise in a month you can start to see a massive difference. Start small. What about the stuff that, I mean, you can fret over this stuff for so long. For example, I have a pasta maker. I used it in 2015, and I made pasta, and I enjoyed it. I haven't done it since. I might want to do it again. I should probably get rid of it, but I don't want to get rid of it because there could come a day where I think,

hey, maybe I ought to make pasta. It was fun five years ago. Okay, here's the deal. It's not my job to tell you or any of your listeners whether you should keep a pasta maker or not. But let me ask you two questions that I think would help you decide whether you should keep it or not. Do you like having the pasta maker, yes or no? Sure. I mean, I don't like it or dislike it. It's just sexy. That's fine.

Do you have room in your kitchen or in your home to keep the pasta maker? Yes. Okay. Does it cause any stress or anger or discord in your relationship at home having the pasta maker? Well, that's a good question, because here's the thing. It probably wouldn't and doesn't, except that when I look at it, I think of people like you. And I think, oh, but Peter would want me to get rid of that, because... Don?

Because I don't use it very often, and it's just taking up space, and I really don't need it. This is where you've made a mistake about who I am, as many people do. I'm completely neutral about it. If I go into someone's home who's even a hoarder and I ask them, are you happy with the way you're living? Are you happy with this situation? And they say, yes. My response is, I'm really happy for you. And I mean this genuinely.

Then live the life you wish. It's not my job to tell you how to live your life. That's the ultimate arrogance for me to think that that's my job to tell anyone how to live their life. On the other hand, if they say to me, I'm drowning, I really need your help, I'll move heaven and earth to help that person. And in your case,

if you're happy with that machine, if you have room in your house, and if it doesn't cause you any discord in your relationship, it's not my job to tell you whether to keep it or not. But if you meet those three criteria, you have room, it's not causing you stress, and you feel happy enough having it in your home, knock yourself out. Put it in a cupboard. If you don't use it often, my suggestion would be to keep it up high out of the way. The next time you want to use that pasta maker, make an extra bag of it and freeze it and send it to me via FedEx so I can have a dose of it as well. Well, it would be interesting to see if now that people are staying at home and surrounded by all their stuff, if in fact they look at their relationship with all their stuff and maybe make some changes.

Great. I think what's going to come out of this is this is going to be an amazing reset button for us all to look at what we have what we own and what's important and i'm seeing that very much in the you know in my own in my own social media life and in people who are contacting me that that suddenly we realize that stuff is not as important as it once was and that social contacts and the life, the real life that we live is what's most important. And, you know, you do an incredible job. You're a great interviewer and, you know, I'm really humbled and thank you for having me on the show. I love the podcast and I love the way you interview and thanks so much. You give

people great insights and I really value this moment. Thank you. Well, thanks. Thanks. That's very nice of you to say. Peter Walsh has been my guest. You can check out his YouTube channel and his latest book is called Let It Go. There's a link to that book in the show notes.

Hey, everyone. Join me, Megan Rinks. And me, Melissa Demonts for Don't Blame Me, But Am I Wrong? Each week, we deliver four fun-filled shows. In Don't Blame Me, we tackle our listeners' dilemmas with hilariously honest advice. Then we have But Am I Wrong?, which is for the listeners that didn't take our advice. Plus, we share our hot takes on current events. Then tune in to see you next Tuesday for our listener poll results from But Am I Wrong? And finally, wrap up your week with Fisting Friday, where we catch up and talk all things pop culture. Listen to Don't Blame Me, But Am I Wrong? on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts.

New episodes every Monday, Tuesday, Thursday, and Friday. Do you love Disney? Then you are going to love our hit podcast, Disney Countdown. I'm Megan, the Magical Millennial. And I'm the Dapper Danielle. On every episode of our fun and family-friendly show, we count down our top 10 lists of all things Disney. There is nothing we don't cover.

We are famous for rabbit holes, Disney-themed games, and fun facts you didn't know you needed, but you definitely need in your life. So if you're looking for a healthy dose of Disney magic, check out Disney Countdown wherever you get your podcasts. How many times have you heard that good communication is important? It's important in relationships, at work, with your friends and your family. We all need to have good communication. So what does that really mean? Alain Hunkins is a communication and leadership expert,

and he's author of a book called Cracking the Leadership Code. Alain, by the way, is the French, or my version of the French version of the way you pronounce Alan. Hi, Alain. Welcome to Something You Should Know. Thanks so much, Mike. So what does it mean to communicate well or have good communication? Where do we start this discussion? Communication may be one of the most underrated subjects out there. Everyone thinks of it as a real vanilla thing,

like why would I need to talk about communication or think about it? It's kind of like your internet connection. You don't really think about it until it's not working. And the fact is, communication is a lot harder than it looks. So making sure that we know why we're communicating and how we're communicating is really key to success. The fact is, better communicators have better marriages. They make more money, they have higher self-esteem, they land better jobs, they come from happier families, and they have well-adjusted children. Those seem like pretty good reasons to be a better communicator. And so where does that process begin to be a better communicator? What is it that people are doing wrong or not doing right?

What is it preventing us from being better communicators? Sure, yeah. So what's preventing us from being better communicators is realizing that communication really isn't a goal in and of itself. I mean, you don't communicate for communication's sake. The whole goal of communication is to lead to understanding. And the amazing thing about that, and I think George Bernard Shaw probably said it best when he said, the greatest problem with communication is the illusion that it's been accomplished. I mean, the fact is, because we have eyes that see and ears that hear and mouths that talk and fingers that type, we assume that if we're working in all the right ways that we're

communicating well. And the fact is, just because we're moving information from one place to another doesn't mean that understanding is actually happening. And so how do you make sure that it happens? How is a good communicator going to make sure that what I'm saying is what you're hearing? Sure. Well, that's the exact goal. So the holy grail of communication is, in fact, getting to this place of shared understanding. And for me, definition of understanding is being able to see reality the way I see it or hear it the way I hear it or feel it the way I feel it. And that's a lot easier said than done because there's one major challenge with communicating well to get to understanding, which is, well, Mike, you're familiar with the game of horseshoes? Yep.

Right? So in horseshoes, the goal of horseshoes is to throw a ringer, right? To get the horseshoe around the post. And that's called a ringer. Well, in communication, the goal is to get three ringers in a row. And if you think of the three rings, it's what I say, and then there's what I mean. And then the third one is what you hear. And to actually get 100% understanding, all three of those things need to be in alignment. But that is rarely the case because there's so many things that can get in the way of that. Like? For example, it's just interpretation of what we hear. So, for example, let's say that I give you a sentence like, um, is he driving to California tomorrow?

Well, depending on which words you interpret in what I'm saying, it's not going to necessarily mean the same thing. I can say, is he driving to California tomorrow versus is he driving to California tomorrow? Or is he driving to California tomorrow? Or is he driving to California tomorrow? Or is he driving to California tomorrow? You see, I've said that sentence four times, same exact words, but very different meaning each time, depending on how it's being interpreted. So that's just the tone of voice. That's just a simple example of something that can get in the way.

And something else, because I think everybody can relate to that. I mean, and that's often the problem with written communication is we don't know where to put the accent. And so we make the assumption that you mean California is the word you're putting the accent on. When it's driving, you're really putting the accent on. And so, so how do you? Yeah. Another big challenge to communicating is just particularly in this day and age is just overload. I mean, the fact is we're dealing with all sorts of sensory input and in a given moment, I mean, just consider that just every single second, there are more than 8,879 tweets tweeted. There's 81,000 Google searches. There's 83,000 YouTube videos. I mean, we're drowning in information, but we're starved for insight. And I noticed that just for myself, like I can be at home and my wife can be talking to me and I'm checking my phone and I literally have to stop and say, I'm sorry, were you

talking to me? Because I didn't hear a thing that you just said. Because one of the hardest things to create understanding is scattering of focus. If we're not focused on what's actually happening in front of us, it's very difficult to come to understanding. So this whole sense that we can be multitasking and being distracted by other things and keeping up with everything or getting the gist of it,

it actually doesn't work. Well, I've always thought that, you know, you could be a great communicator. You could be being extremely clear. If the other person's, you know, on their phone and not really paying attention, well, you know, it's the, you know, if a tree falls in the forest, does it make a sound? If nobody's paying attention, you're not really communicating. So the challenge then is what do you do to make sure that you create the right environment for people to be able to hear what you have to say and truly listen to that, which is again, easier, easier said than done. And that's just if you're, you're, that's in person. I mean, obviously when you're further away, when you're trying to do this remotely or doing this via email, it gets even harder. It gets even harder. And it's

amazing how much people don't realize what they think is super clear oftentimes isn't. Yeah. Well, who hasn't misread or misinterpreted the meaning of a text or an email or a letter or whatever, or a memo. It's just, it's human nature. Just because I'm reading the words you wrote doesn't mean I'm taking away the meaning you meant. Yeah, exactly. Is that what happens is when we're starting in communicating is realizing that, you know, we want to get to this place of

shared understanding. And what happens is we jump to these conclusions or assumptions and we generalize. And what we need to do is get more specific. So, for example, if I said to you, you know, Mike, let's meet for Saturday. Let's meet for lunch on Saturday at noon. Now you say, OK, let's do that. Well, the likelihood that we'll actually show up at the same place at the same time is not very likely. Now, if we compare that with, all right, Mike, let's meet for lunch at noon, Saturday, July 2nd at Ellen Stardust Diner on the corner of 51st Street and Broadway in Manhattan, you notice that we have so much more specificity and then the likelihood of us following through is going to

show up and make it happen. So. As self-evident as that is, it often doesn't happen. It often people don't, aren't clear about, you know, like you said, I mean, it's happened to me so many times where I'll, people don't follow through, they don't follow up, they don't get that specificity. So nothing ever gets done. Yeah, we make these assumptions. We make these assumptions where we assume if we just talk in general about a subject is that people know what the end goal is. And psychologists have this great term for it. It's called the projection bias, where we unconsciously assume other people have the exact same thoughts and feelings that we do. I mean, if you've ever met with somebody, and this can be in a work setting or just as a friend,

and you say, hey, let's get together sometime, it's not going to happen. And so creating clarity. Now, one of the techniques I like to use and teach people is really simple. It's called asking for a receipt. And if you stop and think about it, what are receipts? I mean, receipts are confirmation of a completed transaction. And in general, in life, the more important the transaction, the greater likelihood we'll ask for a receipt. So for example, if you buy a candy bar, you might not get the receipt from the store, but you would never dream of buying a car without getting a receipt. And so in communication, asking for a receipt is a way to confirm that what you've been saying is actually what's being understood. And there's a great example of the power of asking for a receipt that comes from the fast food industry, actually. So back in the 1980s, in fast food, it was very common for people to go to the drive-through and order through the

intercom. And then when they drive up to the window, that their order would be filled with mistakes. And this was consistent across the industry for years and years. And then all of a sudden, drive-through mistake rates just suddenly plummeted. And there wasn't any new technology that was invented. It was actually a really simple solution. What happened was the employees started asking for a receipt. That is, after a customer would place the order through the intercom, the employee would repeat the order back before they'd start making it. I mean, super simple. And then someone could confirm and say, yes, you've got that right, or no, I didn't say that.

So we can all use that simple technique with people in our lives, just asking for a receipt. Am I hearing what you're saying? And then confirming that. Because if we don't confirm the action before we leave and separate, there's a pretty good likelihood that we'll be going off and doing different things. And then we're working at cross purposes. One of the things that's interesting to me is, is how people sometimes think that when you're trying to communicate something, that the more information you give the better, that somehow the more arguments you give somebody or the more details or the

more benefits or the more whatever that that makes you more persuasive. And yet my experience is that that's not true, that more is not better. Well, exactly. In fact, less is more when it comes to communication. In fact, another principle I teach is around this idea of having a clear central message. And that's not central messages. It's one specific central message. I think it was Winston Churchill that once said, if you have an important point to make, don't be subtle, don't be clever,

use a pile driver. Hit the point once, then come back to the same point, hit it again, and then a third time, give it a tremendous whack. So in journalism, they call this not burying the lead. So for example, if I wanted to tell you this story, Mike, about this exciting thing that happened to me when I went to Starbucks this morning, it probably wouldn't be a good idea for me to say, so, Mike, I went to Starbucks this morning and there was this big line of people in front of me. And I was trying to decide if I wanted to get a Vente or Grande Cappuccino because I've noticed I've had a hard time sleeping lately. And I'm wondering if the caffeine is impacting that. And then I noticed this woman's in front of me online. And then in front of her, there's Brad Pitt. I was like, you would be so tuned out and bored by the time I got to Brad Pitt. I mean, the fact is what I'd start and say, hey, guess what, Mike, I saw Brad

Pitt at Starbucks this morning. And just being really clear, that's the point I want to make. Everything else is getting in the way. Another way to think about this, if you think about a motion picture, you go and see a feature film that's, you know, two hours long. They have shot, you know, 20, 30, 40 hours of footage. Most of the footage is on the cutting room floor. And these are professionals who are great storytellers and communicators. So we have to start thinking about how do we edit ourselves. And it's a lot harder to edit than it is to continue to keep on talking. I once had a professor who told me the story about

how someone had submitted a term paper and they said to her, said, dear Professor LeBom, I'm sorry that my term paper is seven pages long. I didn't have time to make it three. So the power of editing and being concise is crystal clearly important when it comes to communicating effectively. on. And like you say, they bury their message because they think that more will make it better, make it so. But there must be other things. What else? Yeah, there are. So one of the things when it comes to communication, and this is a big trap, because look, let's face it, people are very good at many things, but mind reading is not one of them. And so if we want to make sure that people are walking away with understanding, another super powerful technique is to make your implicit assumptions explicit. So if you expect someone to do something or be somewhere or do something in a certain way, don't just hope and

hope that they're going to get it somehow just because you think they should know. The fact is, if it's important to you, tell them, be really overt. So for example, let's say you're working with somebody else and you say, I need this right away. Well, right away means different things to different people. So it comes back to being specific. So what are some things that you're going to say or do to be really explicit about how you're going to work. So if you have certain expectations of other people, what does that look like? And I think most of us appreciate it when someone asks us and says, so is there something that I should know about how you prefer to communicate? Because

what they're realizing is that we're all different and we all want to be treated and talked in the way that works best for us. And so that's a really useful technique we can do is to make the implicit explicit. Who do you think is a really great communicator? Who does all this stuff really well that I might know? I think an example of someone who communicates really effectively is Oprah Winfrey. If you think about when Oprah shares stories, she brings a certain simplicity to what she's saying, and then she brings an authenticity to the way she describes the story. But if you look at most of her work, there's simple messages that she continues to come back to and reinforce. So I think she's an excellent example of a good communicator in that way. Do you think anybody can be a good communicator? Is there a bit of a gift to this

or is it all learned? You know, it is a learned skill. I think some people may start off in a certain category where they're better, but the structure of having a clear central message, making things explicit, also building supporting points, there's a logic and a structure that people can learn. And it's not magic. I mean, what ends up happening though, is when people do it really well, it comes off looking really natural. So we'd assume that, oh, they're just a really gifted communicator. And I'll let you know that behind every phenomenal communicator is a lot of practice. I mean, if you've ever seen a great politician giving a great speech, that is a lot of practice in there. And obviously, they have professional speech writers who have worked with them. But it's

something that any of us can learn at our own pace. And it's something that if it's important to you, you can get better at it. And if people are particularly concerned about public speaking, well, there's lots of opportunities for people to get out and practice speaking in public. In fact, anytime you speak to somebody else, it's public speaking. So I think the biggest thing is being intentional. So for example, beginning with the end in mind, when I'm communicating to somebody, what is it I'm trying to do? Am I trying to educate them? Am I trying to inform, persuade, entertain? What's the point of what I'm saying?

And so starting with the intention of where I'm trying to get to, most people don't do that. Most people are pretty unconscious and they just, I call it the laundry list. They just kind of go through their day. They just kind of spew, talk about two or three or five or 20 things, and they don't get to the point. So if we start to structure things, we're going to see a lot more impact in our communication. You talked about supporting information, and I think people get confused here because how much is enough? Where does it go? Do you build the case and then deliver your message? Do you deliver your message and then explain why it's your message?

How much is enough? So talk about all that. Sure. Yeah. So when it comes to how do you construct your message, always start from the point of view of who's your audience and you want to build your agenda based on their agenda. So if I'm your audience, what's in it for me to listen to you? Why?

What are you saying? How is it important? Do you know where I'm coming from? And so what you want to do is, like we said before, don't bury the lead. Make sure that you give the upfront what's in it for them to listen very early on. And then as you build your supporting points, you want to build a logic that makes sense to your audience. So you may be the subject matter expert compared to them. You may have 18 wonderful reasons as to why they should support your idea. But you know what?

If you share 18, they're going to get overwhelmed. And so you need to step back and go, okay, of my 18 points, what are the top three? And maybe it turns out it's a really good idea for me then to find someone else and practice this and get some feedback because in a lot of ways communicating if it's verbal communication it's a lot like writing your first draft is going to be messy in fact your your main central message when you first put it on paper it's going to be messy so no you have to work through what i call the ugly phase it just get through the ugly phase get it on paper, it's going to be messy. So no, you have to work through what I call the ugly phase. It's just get through the ugly phase, get it on paper, and then start to edit and to shape and to sharpen your points so that by the time it's game day and it's time to communicate the message, you're ready to go when it really matters. Yeah. Well, that makes all the sense

in the world. And yet people seem to really struggle. You know what I think, too? Sometimes it is, well, people will think, yeah, I understand that, but what I have to say is different. And what I have to say is going to need all this other stuff, or it's going to need to be explained this way. My message is different. So I need to throw out what you say and do it my way. Yeah. It's interesting how people will think that, you know, and what's the challenge is when we're communicating from that point of view of, oh, this is different, but you don't understand actually what's coming across here in that

moment. It isn't the message. It's actually their ego. The fact is what ends up happening, and you see this in the business world all the time, when people get up and what their central message is really is, I'm going to impress you with my many syllabic words and my vocabulary to impress you with how smart I am or how powerful I am. And so what we have to realize is, no, we're not the exception to the rule. The point of communicating this stuff isn't for me to hear myself talk. It's for, and it's not even for people to listen to what I have to say. It's for them to understand the meaning so then they can walk away and take action. And so we have to learn how to make

things simpler. I think Einstein said that everything should be as simple as possible, but not simpler. And let's face it, it takes work to make things simple. And I think too many communicators are frankly too lazy to do that work upfront. And that's what ends up happening is they push all of that complexity onto somebody else. I'll give you an example. I mean, just this is a metaphor for what it's like. But I'm sure you've had the experience, Mike. Most of us have had where I call it subject line phishing in email where someone forwards on something that they've gotten from somebody else and they forward on something else forward.

And it says forward, forward, forward. And of course, the subject line has nothing to do with the content. And then what they write above, it says, FYI, see below. And they just make you dig fishing for what the heck this email is really about. Now, everyone hates when that happens to them. However, lots of people confess doing it. And why do we do it? Because in the moment, it's so much easier just to press the forward and send on that email than it is to stop and think about what do people need to do. So in some ways, communicating well is a question of doing the work up front because it ends up saving time down the road. So we have to understand where do we invest our time and our effort so that people ultimately walk away with the best actions?

Well, being in the communication business, I find this really a fascinating topic. But as you said at the very beginning of our conversation, people don't think a lot about it as a topic of something. We just communicate. We just say what we say. We write what we write. And we don't give a lot of thought to it. And I think you've given people pause to reconsider that how you communicate makes a big, big difference. My guest has been Alain Hunkins. He is a communication and leadership expert and author of the book, Cracking the Leadership Code.

You'll find a link to his book in the show notes. Thanks, Alain. Well, thank you so much, Mike. It's been a pleasure. Whether you're an experienced cook or not, there are times when you have to chop onions, and everyone knows that chopping onions makes you cry. Why? Well, when you chop onions, they release a chemical compound that irritates your eyes and triggers your tears. Some people are more sensitive than others, and some onions are worse than others. There have been a lot of home remedies recommended for cutting onions,

but scientifically speaking, these are probably the most effective. First of all, store onions in the fridge or at least chill the onion for 15 minutes. A cold onion doesn't release the chemical compound as easily. Position a fan to blow across the cutting board. That will blow away the released chemicals before they hit your eyes. And if you're really sensitive, wearing swimming goggles really works. It looks ridiculous, but it works. And that is something you should know.

I've been getting a lot of nice emails from people who've been binge listening to a lot of episodes of this podcast to pass the time. I appreciate that. The best way you can support this podcast is by doing business with our advertisers and telling a friend about it, sharing it with them. I'm Mike Carruthers. Thanks for listening today to Something You Should Know. Welcome to the small town of Chinook, where faith runs deep and secrets run deeper. In this new thriller, religion and crime collide when a gruesome murder rocks the isolated Montana community. Everyone is quick to point their fingers at a drug-addicted teenager, but local deputy Ruth Vogel isn't convinced. She suspects connections to a powerful religious group.

Enter federal agent V.B. Loro, who has been investigating a local church for possible criminal activity. The pair form an unlikely partnership to catch the killer, unearthing secrets that leave Ruth torn between her duty to the law, her religious convictions, and her very own family. But something more sinister than murder is afoot, and someone is watching Ruth. Chinook, starring Kelly Marie Tran and Sanaa Lathan. Listen to Chinook wherever you get your podcasts. To be continued... that ours is not a loving God, and we are not its favoured children. The Heresies of Randolph Bantwine, wherever podcasts are available.