Somewhere in the Skies - A Brief History of UFO Materials

Episode Date: November 25, 2019

On episode 136 of SOMEWHERE IN THE SKIES, Ryan is joined by Jason McClellan and Maureen Elsberry, both of Rogue Planet's UNKNOWN podcast, to discuss the latest news in UFO material acquisition. What exactly is the new partnership between Tom DeLonge's To the Stars Academy and the U.S. Army? What materials does the academy have, how did they obtain them, and what exactly does the army hope to do with this possible game-changing technology? The three discuss their own experiences with claimed UFO materials, how challenging it is to actually scientifically test these materials, and what happens when belief clouds the rigor of science? Guest Bios: Jason McClellan is a podcaster, author, TV personality, and journalist with a proclivity for all sorts of geekery including UFOs, space, science, technology, and geek culture. He had the unique experience of serving as a full-time UFO researcher and journalist for more than six years, having co-organized the largest annual UFO conference in the world. As a founding member Open Minds, he wrote for an edited Open Minds magazine. He's also written for Geek magazine, Tech Times, and To The Stars. He's appeared on Syfy, NatGeo, Geek & Sundry, and, most recently, co-starred on History Channel's Hangar 1: The UFO Files. He created and hosts the UNKNOWN podcast and the geek and paranormal media company, Rogue Planet. Learn more at: www.RoguePlanet.tv Maureen Elsberry is a journalist, paranormal investigator, researcher, and media personality specializing in weird mysteries, the anomalous, sci-fi, and geek culture. She was a founding member of the UFO media company Open Minds and spent over six years as a full-time UFO researcher and journalist. She wrote for the internationally-distributed print magazine, Open Minds, and co-hosted and associate produced over 100 episodes of the popular web series Spacing Out! She also co-organized the largest UFO conference in the world, the International UFO Congress, which was recognized in 2015 by the Guinness Book of Records. Maureen starred on the investigative docu-drama Uncovering Aliens. She also served as a paranormal researcher and writer for Tom DeLonge’s (Blink-182/Angels and Airwaves) media empire To the Stars. Currently, Maureen co-runs the geek and paranormal media company, Rogue Planet. Learn more at www.RoguePlanet.tv  ​Patreon: www.patreon.com/somewhereskies YouTube Channel: CLICK HERE Official Store: CLICK HERE Order Ryan's Book by CLICKING HERE Twitter: @SomewhereSkies Instagram: @SomewhereSkiesPod Watch Mysteries Decoded for free at www.CWseed.com Opening Theme Song, "Ephemeral Reign" by Per Kiilstofte Additional back ground music, "Chernobyl Approaching Disaster" by... Support this show http://supporter.acast.com/somewhere-in-the-skies. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Comfort in. It's calling your name. Save on the stay. Oh, and free waffles are yours to claim. Book direct at storeshotels.com. All you curious creatures out there, I'm Amber A. And I'm Andrew McKay. And welcome into the portal, a place where we discuss all things lost,

unexplained, and straight up strange. Ancient lost history, cryptozoology, worldwide myths, and legends are all things to expect when you dive into the portal. Like the time we covered the strange case of giant humanoid swimmers in Siberia's Lake Baikal. Or the terrifying legend of the Braxton County Monster who stalked the hills of West Virginia. Oh, and don't forget about the enduring mystery of Egypt's lost underworld. We dig it all. So join us every week for a brand new adventure into some of the world's lesser-known unexplained phenomena, cryptic creatures, and historical mysteries.

You can find us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google Play, and anywhere you get your podcasts, and of course at Into the Portal.com, your gateway to the bazaar. So come join us. The only question is, will you peer into the portal? This is somewhere in the skies with Ryan Sprague. We're going to spend a little time looking at alleged alien material. Some instances where people claim to possess items that are pieces of a flying saucer or other material that has an extraterrestrial origin.

We're talking about this subject today because alien material has been a subject of renewed interest in the past year or so. Because to the Stars Academy of Arts and Science, an organization we've mentioned repeatedly on this show, announced back in September 2018 that it acquired seven pieces of material that were purportedly from unidentified aerial phenomena. It was during that same announcement that TTSA revealed that a material sample in their possession was on loan to the company, a certain magnesium zinc bismuth sample. Well, in July of 2019, TTSA announced that it had formally acquired this particular sample. In the press release about the acquisition, TTSA Chief Operations Officer Steve Justice explained, quote, the structure and composition of these materials are not from any known existing military or commercial application, end quote. He went on to explain that the company is, quote, focusing on verifiable facts and working to develop independent scientific proof of the materials, properties, and attributes, end quote.

He pointed out that, quote, in some cases, the manufacturing technology required to fabricate the material is only now becoming available. but the material has been in documented possession since the mid-1990s, end quote. The press release also stated that the company was actively seeking partnerships to help research this sample. And as we discussed a couple weeks ago, or a couple episodes ago, depending on when you listen to it, TTSA recently entered into an agreement with the U.S. Army, where the Army is making military labs available to TTSA, to enhance TTSA's research capabilities. And TTSA will share new findings and other research with the Army that the Army can then use to develop enhancements for its ground vehicles. TTSA acquired this material of interest

from former journalist and current UFO personality, Linda Moulton Howe, who herself got the material from the late Art Bell, former host of the popular late night radio show Coast to Coast A.M. The story behind this material is that it has, allegedly comes from a military retrieval of a crashed UFO in 1947 near the White Sands Proving Ground, now the White Sands Missile Range, in New Mexico. Now, Howe has talked about this material for years? She asserts that she's been facilitating various testing for decades, and she's, of course, speaking about it again because of the recent transaction. M.J. Benayas

recently published a story on Vice.com's text section motherboard, on November 14th. And in the article, he explains that Howe believes the material could become a, quote, lifting body with the right amount of electromagnetic static and certain RF frequency. Howe explains that TTSA conducted several tests on the material, but kept running into problems. Then later, Steve Justice actually contacted Howe stating that the army might be interested in the material. So we really haven't talked much on this show, particularly about this material or other metamaterials in TTSA's possession. So, Ryan, I know you've been following this story too. So what are your thoughts about this acquisition, this $35,000 acquisition purportedly?

Yeah, I think it's interesting that how, like even in that article stated how, surprised TTSA was at that price that she gave them. Like they were expecting something like, you know, 100,000, maybe even upwards to like a million dollars for this, this meta material. And when she threw out that price, they were like, oh my God, really? Yeah, it's ours. What a bargain. Yeah, what a bargain on an alien material. But it's fascinating.

Like you said, this material has been tested and tested and tested so many times now. now, but there's, like we, all three of us know, there's always more tests that can be done. And the fact that the most expensive tests are the ones that haven't been done yet, I think it's pretty cool that the Army wants to do that. It's interesting that it's the Army that TSA is now working with. You know, they did so much headway with the Navy in the past, and now they're moving to another military branch. So I think it's actually kind of exciting. I know a lot of people are like, oh, there go, there they go.

They're working with the army now. But look, there's more to the military than just weaponizing things. Will it go that way? Who knows? But I think it's kind of cool. I'm not going to lie. And, Maureen, I don't know about you, but, you know, when I hear these stories, and particularly this one about, you know, people throwing out thousands of dollars

or, you know, alleged UFO artifacts or things like that, it definitely gives me flashbacks to our time at open minds. There were always people trying to get us to buy things, always claiming to have pieces of flying saucers and all sorts of alien technology. And some of it, I guess we did buy. Most of it we didn't. Well, let's not say we bought it because we didn't really have a say

and what was purchased and what was not. I think in terms of on the investment, mint front, I would have advised strongly against purchasing some of the things that were purchased. And I think, I'm very curious how Linda came up with that 35,000 number. Yeah. Like, how much value does this random piece of metamaterial? How much is it worth? But she did say, I mean, I'll give her that.

She said that she's been spending upwards of $600 to $1,000. or $2,000 per year since 1996 when she acquired this from Art Bill. I think that's how she calculated it. Yeah, on studying the object. So she was just basically like, I'm going to get my money back, break even. But yeah, I mean, who's to say if this comes back? Because some of the testing has come back and it's been very kind of like, well, it's nothing like really shocking yet has emerged.

We think it might be able to float in a certain situation, but we're not sure yet. So what happens if we spend all this government money on top of all the money that TTSA is spending? And this turns out to be, you know, as some people believe, like discarded material that was manufactured, that kind of was off, so to speak. Right, the leftover crap, the accidental crap. Yeah. Manufacturing processes. Sure.

Yeah, you know, I think it's all pretty exciting to watch. You know, I'm a big fan of science, lab testing, and physical evidence. So I'm really happy to see TTSA getting access to more resources to conduct further analysis on this material that's received so much attention lately. that being said, I also can't help but notice some logical elements to this entire situation. First, this material allegedly comes from a UFO recovered by the U.S. military. That would mean that the military already has this material. Conceivably lots of this material, right? in its possession. And has since 1947, you know, if we're to believe the story. So it's interesting

that the military wants it, this tiny piece, to do testing on it, even though they seemingly have had it since the 40s to test it and do whatever they're going to do. So anyway, second, it seems odd that if what's really of interest with this material is its alleged anti-gravity potential, Why is the military only interested in using it for ground vehicle armor? Right. Camouflage too. Right. So an army spokesperson told M.J. Benayas in his motherboard article, quote,

if a novel physical phenomenon is discovered or empirical data exists that points us in a certain direction with a given material sample, we will certainly apply the appropriate laboratory and appropriate stimulus to it to study the resultant phenomena and apply it to ground vehicle applications. The statement is consistent with Army comments provided in the press release about the research agreement between TTSA and the Army. So anyway, that's kind of weird to me. I mean, if the thing floats, I guess maybe they could be wanting their ground vehicles to float, right?

Yeah. Have you watched the Jetsons? Yeah. Terminator. It'd be cool. I mean, think about if you have to be cool. one of Tesla's cyber trucks that could like float too. Oh.

That thing would be crazy on the battle gear. Yeah, so totally good. Apparently he still can't figure out bulletproof glass though. So I think he's got a ways to go. Well, maybe that's why they need this material. Good point. I'll figure it out. So anyway, I'm really looking forward to seeing what the results of the testing are.

But it's a really, it's really interesting seeing this new public interest in alleged alien material. Like we already mentioned, this specific. material has been out there for a while now. It's not new information. Linda's talked about it and its testing for years. And that, I mean, alien materials is its own subgenre of the UFO topic. UFO alien material. There have been countless claims over the years from people who alleged they possess a piece of a UFO. So I guess we can talk about a couple of those right now. First, because the TTSA piece is thought to have anti-gravity properties, it really reminds me of a piece of material that investigative reporter George Knapp has in his possession. An alleged UFO crash happened in Russia back in 1986.

George Knapp traveled to the crash site in the 90s, and he was given pieces, multiple pieces of the material reportedly recovered from the crash site. Now, in 2012, when the National Atomic Testing Museum in Las Vegas, Nevada opened its Area 51 myth or reality exhibit, it featured a piece of this material donated by nap. And the information card accompanying the exhibit called it a, quote, authentic alien artifact, in quote. And description, along with this material, stated, quote, three Soviet academic centers and 11 research institutes analyzed the objects from this UFO crash. The distance between atoms is different from ordinary iron. Radar cannot be reflected from the material. Elements in the material may disappear and new ones reappear after heating. One piece disappeared completely in front of four witnesses. The core of the material is composed of a substance with anti-gravitational properties,

end quote. So, here again, this is a piece of material with some pretty incredible claims. Knapp has had these since the 1990s, and they were on public display in 2012. Now, Maureen, you and I covered the news about George providing this bizarre material to the museum back in 2012. And we were both pretty fascinated by the grand claims being made. So why do you think there's seemingly so much more attention being given to Linda's material that TTSA is working on now? I mean, to me, George's material seems just as interesting, if not more interesting. Well, George's material is interesting because that case also fascinates me. That's the height 411. It goes by a couple names case.

Personally, I think that there's a new generation of people that have started getting interested in the field based on Tom's musical sort of status and have dived into this now. And I think there's a lot of people that don't pay attention to, you know, off-centered articles in the – I know I remember. when that article came out, Lee Spiegel wrote about it on the Huffington Post, and there was big shockwaves about the title card that said authentic alien artifact. But I think a lot of people weren't paying attention, and I think people are paying attention now.

And so all these new people who are starting to get fascinated have no idea that these incredible other artifacts have existed and have been public and have been talked about and publicized. So I think it's a new era where we're just having so many new people coming into the idea that there are unknown craft of unknown origin flying around in our air spaces and possibly interacting with us, whether that's military and or something extraterrestrial. We do not know. So yeah, I think it's just based on time. And when that happened, it was probably 2010.

When was that George's on artifact on display? We heard about it prior to the museum getting it on display. So yeah, it probably would have been 2010. I know 2012 is when Lee published his story about it. Okay. And that's when the museum opened too and we went to see it. I mean, that was a long time ago. So seven years, a lot changes, especially in this field.

And I think, you know, we're seeing that. And for us, I think maybe there's a level of maybe annoyance or frustration that people are acknowledging just this one thing that's been around forever that's been tested. I mean, don't get me wrong. It's still cool. And more testing needs to be done. And let's see what happens. but because we were so involved and know about so many other pieces of material

that have been going to labs that have come back anomalous that this one particular people like paying so much attention to it maybe for us is kind of dumbfounding a little bit but in the grand scheme of things you know people are new to learning about this stuff right and Ryan I mean talking about all the way back in 2012, you know, social media was a different thing back then.

The social media landscape is completely different, you know, so many years after that. How much do you think, you know, the current social media landscape plays into that, to the current hype that we're seeing? Oh, it's huge. I mean, like Maureen said, there were articles written in very sort of peripheral, you know, magazines, websites, all that sort of stuff about these topics. now when you have someone like Tom Dong who has the resources to get stories like this working with the army and even the Nimitz encounter everything out to the New York Times, Washington Post, it really changes the landscape of how UFOs are handled in mainstream media. So I think it's interesting that we now live in an age where this news about what to the stars is doing.

we can figure it out immediately. When back then, when NAP was trying to, you know, brought this forward and wanted to get stuff analyzed and tested, it's not as easy to find the labs to get more people involved. So, yeah, I think it's fascinating. And a lot of people, I mean, look at just secret Pentagon UFO program. The government was investigating UFOs. Like, that came to a shock to many people. But like you guys said, we're so used to this stuff that we are like, oh, well, yeah, they did that before like 40, 50 years ago. So I think it does have a lot to do with this information is new to a lot of newer people, younger people.

And I think that's exciting that they can now sort of live that shock and awe that we might have had six, seven years ago. Yeah. Well, Brian, you mentioned, you know, labs and testing. So we can move on to other materials. So, of course, we have the interesting materials collected from the alleged debris field in Roswell, New Mexico, where a craft reportedly crashed back in 1947. And, Ryan, you recently got personally involved with these materials. So why don't you tell us about them? Yeah, so this was right around the time when news sort of broke that Frank Kimbler, the geologist in Roswell.

well, had been doing digs for years out at what he presumed was the Roswell crash site. I mean, how he found the location alone is pretty amazing as well. But I did have the opportunity to go out to that site where he and his son had been digging and digging and digging for stuff. And they found medals out there, really interesting metals. And I did. I got to touch them. I got to hold them. I got to then get them tested at a aerospace lab.

California. So it was pretty big and pretty heavy. I wasn't sure what to expect. It was for a TV project. So I thought, oh, you know, it's all television. Probably it's going to be something, you know, very mundane and we're going to make it really exciting. But what I appreciated about the lab that we worked with and the production crew was that they just did what they could do. And that was to get these tested at a metals lab. And when we got our results back, they were sobering, but they were also really interesting. I mean, Frank says to this day, the tests we had done, and I do agree with him on this, were only a tiny fraction of what could be done. And some of the stuff we found was actually pretty intriguing. I have to admit that. We found that whatever was out in the

middle of this desert definitely came from something that had to do with aerospace. I mean, it's almost unarguable at this point. Frank has had it retested. We only have limited resources to do the tests we did, but I have been talking to him in the past few weeks now, and it's pretty fascinating what he found out there. But again, this isn't making it out to the mainstream because Frank is just one guy in Roswell and he's not tomd along. So I don't know. I think whatever Frank has out there is still worth looking at for sure. I mean, personally, I think that Frank is celebrity status.

I agree with you, Maureen. Oh, my God. I agree with you. So he's one of the nicest people in the world. He is. We love Frank. And Maureen, you've also been out to the Roswell debris field. I am.

you've seen Frank's material and heard him speak about the many times over the years. So what do you think about the stuff that he has? Well, I think that, you know, it's interesting because if you go out to the field and see what it is, I mean, you're in the desert in the middle of nowhere. It's basically government-owned farmland and it's desolate. and you can see sort of activity by a lot of different people who have come through looking for artifacts. So finding things there is neat, and the fact that it's come from sort of an aerospace angle with the testing is intriguing. But I don't know.

Again, it's one of those things where at this point, it's nothing until it's something. we kind of have to wait until more advanced testing can be done. I mean, I say this all the time because I kind of dealt with a different situation than Ryan when I was involved in a TV project and we tested metal that was, I mean, this is a much more far-fetched story, was allegedly shot off of a UFO and melted into a guy's driveway. and it came back. We took it to, it had been tested in various labs. We took a sample to another lab. I was not involved with picking how this testing was going to be done.

And of course, the people who tested it are lovely people. Let me say that first. We showed up to their lab. And the first thing I see is like a giant Star Trek, a, you know, memorial, lots of toys and things. A shrine? Yeah, basically.

And then I found out that they were, in fact, involved in the UFO community. Legitimate scientists, however, there's that bias. And you hear me say this all the time that I think it should be definitely any testing done in labs should be by, you know, third-party sources that have idea what people think it might be and or are involved in the UFO community because there is a bias that definitely comes forward, I think, a little bit, even when the science is there. The metal that we had had unnatural levels of one of strontium. Shoot, you know what? My brain, my memory is so bad these days.

I can't remember what the number strontium it was. was. So it was coming back unusual that it was not manmade. And again, cool, but it could be a thousand things. But the level of testing required to be done on these pieces requires extensive funds. And funds that, well, the Army has. However, most scenarios to test all these metals don't. So we're entering, I think like Ryan,

earlier, you know, this is an exciting thing because the money and the technology is now available to TTSA to have that level of testing done. Now, could there be conspiracy and cover-up? Of course. But, yeah, it's a new era. So, yes, there's all these metals and all this testing's being done. My opinion on all of it is I'm still waiting for the ground shocking news about one of these melt pieces. Yeah, Maureen, you made a good point, too, like, about the science. Like, sometimes it's not even what, like, a high amount of something in these alloys or these metals. It's what's not in it. And at least with us, like, it wasn't, we were looking for this one particular element, malibdenum, which Frank had other tests done that said there was a ridiculous amount of it in the metal and that should never happen on Earth. So we had that specific test done to look for that. element. Now, we came up with a extremely different result, and that was very, you know, unfortunate. Like, we were hoping that was going to be it, but it's actually what we didn't find that was more intriguing. And Frank pointed this out to us that what we found, or I should say what he found, what we had tested, had a huge amount of iron. And whatever it came from, like, shouldn't have had that much iron and definitely was aerospace and was out in the middle of a desert where there's

no life, nothing. So I think that's really interesting too. And another thing to bring up to is that, you know, TTSA in the Army, you've got George Knapp in the Atomic Testing Museum. And then with us, it was with Frank, the government, the Bureau land management, wanted to take his medals. So it seems to always go back to the military and government, these materials, somehow, some way. Lots of places can expose you to identity theft. Oh, no. That's why LifeLock monitors hundreds of millions of data points a second for threats to your identity, which is way more than anyone can do on their own. If we find anything suspicious, like new loans or changes to your financial accounts, we alert you right away, all through text,

phone, email, or the LifeLock app. Get the alerts that could make all the difference. Save up to 40% your first year at LifeLock.com slash special offer. Terms apply. Absolutely. And do we trust that or not is the real question. Right, but they're the only ones who have the money to do it. So it is. It's a really weird nebulous area. Yeah. Yeah. And then there's also the whole alien implant thing. So I don't really want to dive into that today. But briefly, there are several people who over the years have done research on mysterious objects removed from inside people. Dr. Roger Lear is someone who did extensive research in the field, and he and his associates made some pretty big claims about some of these objects, like emitting signals, moving once removed from the body, and other incredible stuff. And some of his research indicated that some of these objects showed signs of being advanced nanotechnology. Jeremy Corbell's film about Dr. Lear's work, Patient 17, is something that I would recommend people check out if you're interested in more on alleged alien implants. But I guess briefly, Ryan, what are your thoughts on that sort of alleged alien material?

I think it's interesting. I mean, I do speak to experiencers on almost a daily basis. I personally have never had any experience with seeing these implants. that were taken out or touching them or being in proximity to them. I remember one experiencer said they had over 2,000 implants in them. I don't know if I tend to believe that. I saw no indication of that. But yet there are these stories where people had things removed and, you know, they went to get it.

And it would like literally almost like it was intelligent. It would go away from the surgeon or the people trying to get it. It is fascinating and it's interesting, but nothing that I would really put my timer efforts into at this point. But again, unless it was taken out and tests were done on it, the one person that we had that could do that is now gone. And that's unfortunate. There are others who are still doing implant removals. Maureen, doesn't Daryl Sims also do? Darrell Sims and Dr. Lear were partners at first.

I don't want to say there was a falling out, but I think there may have been to where they ended up going on their own paths. But, yeah, Darrell has a lot of things that are alleged to be implants and or material of unknown origin as well. And Ryan's, to your comment about not having seen them, the ones I'm not having seen them, the ones I've seen, there's certainly not much to see, right? I mean, they're super tiny bodies. They're like super small. Sometimes they're like grains of sand, really. Exactly.

And, you know, again, like, and a lot of them just look like calcified, whatever, blood or something within the body. So, I mean, again, it's in the eye of the beholder. If this experiencer has a story that they were abducted by aliens and this implant comes out, of course, they're going to think it was put in there by the aliens. But when you have someone who's never told a abduction story and they're still finding these weird things inside people, that's kind of interesting too. But yeah, like I said, it's such a murky territory when it comes to all the implant stuff for me personally. Well, and the implant stuff is so much more controversial too, right?

I mean, this is kind of weird, creepy territory. and Maureen, to your point, especially, I think, with the whole implant thing, what you said about, you know, making sure the science is good is so important, making sure the, you know, people doing the removing and the people doing any sort of testing are not themselves affiliated with the UFO world, right? I think that sort of taints it and causes people to sort of steer the evidence. Right. And like I made that point. the people who were doing the testing were legitimate scientists and I'm not discrediting their science. It's more of the fact that the association with the UFO phenomenon makes me feel like it is less credible to present to the public, even if there's the science behind there. The science can be completely good science, but yeah, that association taints it.

Yeah, and, you know, with the implants, too, like Ryan said, that's very, it's murky territory. And I've seen some really weird things. And I've obviously, like Jason mentioned, patient 17 goes over a lot of detail and science behind a specific implant removal, alleged implant, I should say. And it's fascinating. But unfortunately, you know, a lot of people are very disturbed by this idea. And as Ryan mentioned, you know, he's talked to people who allege that they have 2000 implants. And it's a really big, I think, can be a big mental problem, health problem. And when I say this, I'm saying that people are going to get so scared that they may have an alleged alien implant that they're going to try to get it out.

And I've witnessed this before. And it was somebody trying to like dig an implant out of their. leg and it was really gross and disturbing and I tried to stop it. You know, so I guess my plea is, if you think that there is something going on like that, do not try to hurt yourself to remove an implant. Go see somebody because it is not something someone should do on their own. And maybe it is a natural for an object that has gotten lodged in your leg or where have you. Right. I mean, it doesn't matter what you think, you know, put that there, what its origin is, or what its actual origin may be, if that's the case that some alien put it in you.

That really doesn't matter. Doctors are still going to help you take that out. If you go and say, I've got something weird inside me, please get this out. Doctors are going to help you. Absolutely. And also, like, that goes with hypnotherapy too. I mean, if you think you were abducted by aliens or you have. have a memory of something really weird happening and you need to like deal with it mentally and emotionally, don't go to an alien therapist, go to a real, you know, certified therapist or psychoanalyst or hypnotherapist and have them do it. I feel like no matter if it's hypnotherapy or testing a metal or getting an implant removed, like go where the science is, not where the biased is, I would say.

Yeah. So we all love material when it comes to this strange world of UFOs. It's exciting when you have something physical to analyze. But as with anything else related to UFO research, it's so important to remain objective, avoiding any attempts to force results to fit your desired outcome. TTSA's effort could conclude that the material they have is just a piece of junk. Would that be bad? An expensive piece of junk. An expensive piece of jog.

So it wouldn't be bad. It's just a result of scientific testing. It would eliminate one item of interest, allowing them to move on to the next one. Now, if TTSA's test results in an incredible discovery, then that will be pretty exciting. As far as we're concerned, we're just spectators at someone else's show. We're happy to see a company with the necessary resources taking gambles on things like this, trying to unravel mysteries. It's a fun show to watch regardless of the outcome. Well, that's where I'm going to end it, unless you guys have anything else to add.

Nope, I agree. I'm along for the ride. I can't wait to see what comes of this material. Maybe finally we'll get an answer that Linda's Howe's been looking for for almost three decades. now. Yeah. Seriously. But what, well, what happens if the army then does testing and it comes back super anomalous and they're like, oh, sweet, we're going to be able to have floating cars and do all this crazy stuff with this metal on our ground vehicles. And then it's all black budget and we never hear the results. I mean, that's a concern. Oh, huge concern and a very big

possibility, I think. So again, it's hard because we know that to the stars wants to look at UFOs, but at the end of the day, I keep coming back to the fact that DeLong is trying to paint a better picture of the military. And people seem to keep forgetting that. That's kind of the end goal with all this, is to find interesting technology, to benefit humanity, and also paint a better picture of the U.S. military. So I don't know, Maureen. That's a really good point. Even if it does get tested and it's anomalous, will we ever even know or find out? We'll probably be left in the dark. Yep. And again, I mean, that's another big thing, too, you know, being able to get to the application stage, right? Because even if you find out the material

is anomalous or may be extraterrestrial or has signs to indicate that it was manufactured, not on this planet. That's interesting news. It's stuff that makes us scratch our heads or makes us go, wow, that's so rad. And we tell our friends and we discuss it and talk about the possibilities. But that's it, you know, just because you found a piece of material that's weird, doesn't mean all of a sudden that we can build flying saucers. Yeah, that's a good point.

I mean, we also know that at the beginning, Tom DeLong wanted to build a spaceship. So maybe this is a way we're getting there. Yeah, what if that actually happens where we, in our lifetime somehow, a UFO, well, it wouldn't be a UFO, it'd just be a spacecraft, you're right, that is, yeah, that is easy to and fast to get around the galaxy, or not even the galaxy, the universe. Yeah, I mean, I don't think that that's that crazy. Look at how far technology is coming in the last 10 years. But yeah, I don't know. It's crazy. Well, in especially since, if what I said earlier about the military, if they did recover, you know, this crashed UFO back in 1947, imagine what they, I mean, I assume it takes a long time to reverse engineer, but maybe they already have something cool. And now they just need an extra piece. One more extra piece to make it super tough and have great armor. It's just missing the cup holder.

It misses a cup holder. A cup holder with a cup full of Element 115. Exactly. That's what it. Actually, the pilot has to drink the Element 115 concoction in order to fly. Boom. Humans can now fly. All right, guys, that's going to do it for this episode of Somewhere in the Skies.

Jason, Maureen, thank you so much for joining me, guys. Jason, what do you up to these days, my name? in and where can we find more of your stuff? Oh, I'm up to all sorts of strange things, doing some plotting and some scheming, and I don't know. I guess I'll tell you, I've finished the introduction of my next book.

Hey, that's more than most of us authors can say, so I'm happy to hear that thing. So, yeah, you can follow along everything I'm doing. Twitter's the best place at Acentric, also on Instagram, and, of course, rogue planet. dot TV. Awesome. Morning. How about you been traveling a worldly person lately? Yeah, I just got back from a month and a half in Europe and did a really long road trip around

Scotland and tried to see some of the most haunted and paranormal UFO locations in the world. I mean, Scotland's got a lot of old history there. It was incredible. Other than that, I've been hiding under a rock. I've been avoiding social media and kind of staying out of the news, in fact, too. So I would say I'm a little bit uninformed these days, but catching up, I guess, would be what I'm up to now. Sometimes uninformed is better, trust me. Awesome, guys. Well, I got to thank you again for coming on.

And to everyone out there, check us out on somewhere in the skies.com. and remember, keep your feet on the ground, but never stop searching. Somewhere in the skies. Somewhere in the skies. Oh, that heavy metal one's going in. Somewhere in the Skies is produced by Third Kind Productions, in association with the Entertainment One Podcast Network. To learn more, visit Entertainment One Podcast.com.