Somewhere in the Skies - BONUS EPISODE - Movie Review Edition: Justice League

Episode Date: December 6, 2017

On this BONUS EPISODE of SOMEWHERE IN THE SKIES, Ryan is joined by Nicholas Westemyer and Chris Moss, hosts of the Two Dumb Dads Podcast. The trio review the recently released Warner superhero film, JUSTICE LEAGUE. Fueled by his restored faith in humanity and inspired by Superman's selfless act, Bruce Wayne enlists newfound ally Diana Prince to face an even greater threat. Together, Batman and Wonder Woman work quickly to recruit a team to stand against this newly awakened enemy. Despite the formation of an unprecedented league of heroes -- Batman, Wonder Woman, Aquaman, Cyborg and the Flash -- it may be too late to save the planet from an assault of catastrophic proportions.   What did the guys think of this latest installment in DC cinematic universe? Tune in now to find out!   Patreon: www.patreon.com/somewhereskies Website: www.somewhereintheskies.com Order Ryan's Book by CLICKING HERE Twitter: @SomewhereSkies Instagram: @SomewhereSkiesPod Opening Theme Song, "Ephemeral Reign" by Per Kiilstofte SOMEWHERE IN THE SKIES is produced by Third Kind Productions, in association with Antica Productions Support this show http://supporter.acast.com/somewhere-in-the-skies. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Ordinary people are seeing extraordinary things in our skies. But how has it changed those involved? From author Ryan Sprague, Somewhere in the Skies, a human approach to an alien phenomenon, is a personal journey that also weaves together a story of stories, furiously pumping new blood into the heart of these mysteries, one experience at a time. Now available on Amazon in paperback and ebook.

For more information, visit somewhere in the skies.com. This is Somewhere in the Skies with Ryan. Gather together from the cosmic reaches of the universe. Here in this great hall of justice are the most powerful forces of good ever assembled. Just like a bat. I dig it. Let's do it. I'm lining.

Ride ain't over yet. I'm mad. What are your superpowers again? I'm rich. Hey guys, Ryan Sprague here. And today is a very special bonus episode where I say, sit down with two of my close friends and podcast colleagues, Nick Westermeyer and Chris Moss, hosts of the Two Dumb Dads podcast.

And today we are reviewing the recent Warner Brothers and DC film, Justice League. Now, despite this film involving evil aliens, it doesn't really fit the mold of UFOs, which you're used to hearing. And that's because you are listening to a new edition of the show, where I bring guests on from time to time to review movies. We did this once before with the remake of the movie It. We had Andrew Sanford on. So this is something I'm really looking forward to doing.

Moving forward with someone in the skies is veering off every now and again and talking about something very close to my heart, and that is movies. As some of you may know or may not know, when I'm not podcasting or hunting UFOs, I am a professional film and stage writer. So cinema has a very special place in my heart. And so do comic books, Batman in particular. So as you'll be able to take. tell in this review, I am very

passionate about the Caped Crusader, and superhero films in general. And so are my guests Nick and Chris. I think it goes without warning, but this is an extremely spoil-heavy review. So if you haven't seen the movie yet and plan on it, you may want to wait till

after to give this episode a listen. Either way, I think you're really going to dig this one. Stay tuned for more bonus movie reviews, and also stay tuned for more news on the upcoming Two Dumb Dads podcast, host by Nick and Chris. That'll be available soon by Third Kind Productions. So, without further ado, did Bats, Soups, Wonder Woman, Flash, Cyborg, and Fishman live up to the hype? Was there any hype?

And what is going on with Henry Cavill's upper lip, seriously? Come together right now and tune in to find out. Come together! All right, guys, welcome to Somewhere in the Skies. I am Ryan Sprague, and today is a very special day. If you haven't seen it already, I highly suggest going out and checking out this movie, whether you like it or not. We are going to be talking Justice League. And with me today, I have the two hosts of the upcoming Two Dumb Dads podcast. Chris Moss, Nick Westmeyer. What's going on, gentlemen? Hey, not too much. How are you doing, Ryan? I am doing great. I first of all, I have to thank you guys for taking the time to do this. I know all of us have been talking about this movie for a while now.

It's come, it's gone. We are going to debrief today about what the hell happened with D.C. But... It's a cinematic tour to force, guys. Come on. It is.

It's more of the rings level. I think this is not the podcast people are going to expect. We all have very different feelings on this movie, which I think is going to be interesting. But before we even get to that, guys, please tell me what we can expect

from the upcoming Two Dumb Dads podcast. I love the title. Yeah. we were very excited about it. Honestly, this kind of comes out of the last year of our being parents and realizing that this stuff is hard. We wanted to come up with something that would kind of honor the idea of complete and utter ignorance about parenting. You always expected that when we became parents that suddenly you get that magical knowledge that we always thought that. Oh, that was certain it was going to happen.

and I was going to wake up one day and suddenly become my dad. And it turns out I may have become my dad simply because I have no idea what I'm doing. And so I like, we decided we're going to start up a podcast and kind of cataloged that, kind of keep track of our ignorance throughout the years and see how it goes. In an interesting perspective of two people who grew up together, when you know, went to high school, went to college or in similar careers. And then also, but also came from very different upbringings and how that has affected parenting and how we view things and how we handle things.

but then also just how life's changed as men and like how we handle that and what's different in our lives than it was, you know, a year ago or even two years ago or in the plan of having kids, et cetera. So it's just kind of a chronicle of who we are and what we're going through and, you know, also some crazy stuff like this. Right. And that's what's really cool too is I was able to sample a preview episode of your guy's show. And what I think is very exclusive. Very exclusive. To the point where you even called me out in the show, I was very honored. But first of all, good point, Chris, that, you know, we do believe that our parents are perfect, you know, that they are some sort of wisdom giver.

But that's not necessarily how it goes. Parents learn as they go as well. And what is also interesting is that in that preview episode you guys gave me, you guys do disagree on different ways and aspects of raising. We disagree on pretty much everything. That's kind of the driving force of it. Look, it's not my fault. Nick's always wrong about things. No.

Well, guys, I'm really looking forward to that. You're both first-time dads. That's correct? Correct. Yeah. So this is... I hope so. Yeah, right.

That you both know of. Yeah, that's a terrifying thing, right? No, I assure you, everybody out there, this is the first time, my only time. We'll see what happens after that, though. Well, I do look forward to that, guys. You know, I may not be a parent. but I think everyone can clean something from something like this, especially when it's, you know, it's two young guys living in one of the craziest places in the world,

or should I say next to one of the craziest places in the world, and raising a child. So I think that's very, very interesting as well. No, no, I assure you, New Jersey is far crazier than New York. Oh, yes. We have bears, guys. Guys, I have been binge watching Sopranos. I know how crazy it is. See, everybody should know.

Listen, the real bottom of being is not far from where we live. Yeah. I might just have to make it over there. We'll see. We'll see. We miss you, Ryan. We miss you. I miss you guys.

You've been to this neck of the woods. I have for quite a while, yes. So the real reason we are here today is to talk about Justice League. Before we even get into that, guys, I kind of wanted to ask you about your history with, I guess, comic books in general, and the D.C. universe, as opposed to these huge expansive universe that we've grown to either love or hate with Marvel. So yeah, maybe you could give me a little background on what you guys, what is your connection to the DC universe? Sure.

Nick, Nick, do you want to go first? Yeah, I'm totally wrong with first. No, so my connection with comic books go back to being a kid, so my dad bought comic books for some of the youngest of five for two of my brothers, the one closest to me and the one before him. So we had over 15,000 comic books in our kids. house growing up. So I've been pretty much steep in this since I was a little kid, but I've always, always, always loved Superman. I mean, it has been, I'm quickly like I'm adopted. I'm from the

Midwest. I just related a lot to that. It was my dad's favorite character and my brother's favorite character. Christopher Reeves in the first Superman film was one of the reasons I, like, wanted to become an actor. I was like, how do I be fucking Superman? And my dad was like, well, he's an actor. I was like, great, I can do that. I just didn't grow up to be six foot two. and, well, you know, minor problem. He certainly did not. I can exist to that.

Yeah, I know, sadly. But, um, it's all right. Wolverine wasn't five foot one, so it's okay. Yeah, they still cast a six foot guy. I'm still bitter about it. Um, love you, Hugh Jackman. So anyways, it's really was a big part of my childhood growing up, and these stories influenced everything from how I played to what I wanted to read.

And also being a kid who's dyslexic, that was kind of what got me into reading, because I could look at the pictures and it would help inform me of what was going on in storytelling. So it became my primary source of, like, reading material as a kid. So I have been hugely vested in the superhero movies, both the DC and the Marvel, because it basically was like my childhood coming to life, and in the case of Marvel really successfully, and in the case of DC, a little bit bumpier. Though that's probably what we'll get into as we go. Like, I still love seeing these people on screen, because it's like getting to be a little kid again. Again.

Sure. And selfishly, I'm always like, maybe I'll get cast in it one day. Who knows? So that's me. How about you, Chris? I'm kind of similar, but I like to think of myself as a mid-tier comic book nerd. When I was young, I, of course, was first introduced to comic book characters the same way. I think a lot of people of my generation were through the Tim Burton Batman movies and the Saturday morning cartoons, the X-Men, the Spider-Men.

And so it wasn't until about high school that I realized that these amazing characters I love so much came in a comic book. And so as soon as I found that out, I started buying every book I could find. I was at the point where I was spending my entire paychecks every week at the comic book shop, buying I think, you know, $40, $50 worth of books back in the day when they were $1 or $2 a book. So I was buying everything. If it came on a book and it had a superhero on it, I bought it. it. And then that lasted me through about college when, you know, everybody goes broke and so did I. So, um, I haven't been reading as much as I used to, but I still keep up on the old Wikipedia. I try and follow along what's going on with the new 52. That's now the old 52, but there's a new,

new 52. I don't know. It's all confusing. Um, it again. So it's, you know, they're just, they're, they're, they're reccomting everything for the one millionth time. Uh, but the important thing is I love these characters. I've grown up with them. I was a huge Batman. fan all through high school, college, and really ever since I saw the initial Tim Burton movie. So I don't know. I love this stuff. I enjoy the stuff, and I love to discuss it. Awesome.

I think all three of us can really agree that, you know, it really started with us with Batman and Superman. Nick, I knew Superman was a huge part of your upbringing. Oh, yeah. Chris, like you, Batman was huge for me. I read the detective comics. I grew up on the Tim Burton in the original movie. Mm-hmm. So that, seeing that character come to life for the umpteenth time now in cinema, uh, was

refreshing no matter how the movie panned out. Um, was that your guys' first movie? Because it was my first movie going experience was seeing Timber of Batman. First movie? I would have to say it was one of my first for sure. I know my grandmother had a VHS of it shortly after it came out in theaters and then got on tape. And I wore that thing out.

so much. So yeah, Batman was huge. It was huge for me. And I do believe it was one of my first cinematic experiences. And, you know, again, we've got the Christopher Nolan ones. We've got Adam West. We've got Michael Keaton. We've got the horrible in-betweeners that we won't mention.

But there's those. There are those. But even this new one, guys, like you said, Nick, just seeing these characters come to life, no matter who's playing them, no matter how the movie pans out, it is exciting. And I think we will get into that as well, no matter what we think of this movie. It's amazing to see these characters come to life. Absolutely.

At first, I didn't think it was real. I woke up to this blinding light, and I was transported to another place. Pluto TV! Then I heard a voice. Come with me if you want to live. There were thousands of movies and shows, and they were all free. The truth is our scene. It's just so beautiful.

On Pluto TV, free streaming of Terminator 2, Fringe, The 100 NX files may cause excitement, loss of sleep, and sudden belief in extraterrestrials. No credit cards or alien encounters necessary. Pluto TV. Stream now, pay never. I never thought I was seeing Aquaman on screen, let alone seeing the idea of a realistic, serious green lantern, which I thought was amazing, seeing those guys in the background, the big war sequences.

The big Easter egg? Yeah. Yeah, we will get to that. But I guess for any of our listeners, first of all, we must warn them. This is going to be an extremely spoil-heavy episode. I guess I already spoiled that part, huh? Sorry about that guy. Oh, no, not at all.

Yeah, you got to be watching for that, though. That's like a watching for thing. It really is, yeah. If you blinked, like, you wouldn't have seen that Green Lantern part, I feel. So, well, let's give a little premise here, guys. I'm just going to read the pretty brief summary of this movie for the listeners. So here we go. Fueled by his restored faith in humanity and inspired by Superman's selfless act, Bruce Wayne, enlists newfound ally, Diana Prince, to face an even greater threat.

Together, Batman and Wonder Woman work quickly to recruit a team to stand against this newly awakened enemy. We'll get to that enemy. Despite the formation of an unprecedented league of heroes, Batman, Wonder Woman, Aquaman, or Aquaman, as Jeremy Irons calls him, Cyborg and the Flash It may be too late to save the planet from an assault of catastrophic proportions. Okay. So is that the plot you guys got from this?

Yeah, maybe. So, first of all, we are at a 41% on Rotten Tomatoes for this movie. So not exactly the best higher than I expected. Where's the man of steel, higher than Batman versus Superman? Exactly. So let's talk about that first.

We got, we had, the man of steel, we had Batman versus Superman. Then we had Wonder Woman which... No, then we had Suicide Squad. Excuse me, I totally forgot about that. I never even saw that one, guys. That was a brilliant piece of cinematic history, which I think will live on

for the ages. In the worst of ways. Please never come back, Jared Lido. Moving on. There's that. Oh, my God. It's horrible. And then we got Wonder Woman, which was an incredible film. I mean, pretty

revered from what I can tell. I think it was a good film. I had a lot of problems with the depiction of Wonder Woman for the most part. It really bothered me how childish they portrayed her throughout the entire film. Where it seems like every little, they had a book on the island that would explain every minor nuance with a man that didn't exist. But as soon as she left that island, oh, I'm sorry, we wear clothes now. Please explain to me, young man, how do we wear clothes? Oh, I'm... But hold on, but that makes sense because that's not something that we explained in the Amazon culture when they're how many thousands of years behind what she's walking into. Like, it's this idea of discovering,

discovering a new world, discovering. It's all about her not being sheltered on this island, which she's been sheltered for, let's say she's 30 years old, right? Right. So, yeah, you would have all this discovery. It's not just going to be like, oh, yeah, people in suit jackets and pants and slacks and shoes and dresses.

Like, I'm cool with that. I know. all that stuff. In a film about having a god come down and do whatever a god is doing, it seems as though you can make a certain leap of whatever and say that, okay, it would make sense for her to be childish and naive, but maybe just maybe. We're going to take this feminist icon and make her knowledgeable about the world and have her lead the way through this story instead of having her be handheld by the man. But that's different than the whole story.

The whole story is her discovering a new world. So it makes sense in the context of that story. Yeah, that's fine. But if you didn't like it then it shouldn't be a story about her first getting off the island. It should have taken place. So then you have a different movie. You have what essentially is going to be the sequel to the first movie, which that's fine. But I'm just saying, like, if you're going to have her off the island immediately,

you're going to have some naivety. I just think it makes sense in storytelling. To me, that makes sense. He wouldn't know what everything this is around her. I think I see both sides of that, for sure. And then she kicks a ass through a trench warfare. Yeah. But quote unquote, the action was amazing in that movie.

I thought that was terrific. That I can definitely agree on. The cinematography was gorgeous. Well, in terms of that, let's move on to what came next. Do we have to? We do. We do, gentlemen, because we do. We have some stake in this.

We are comic book fans. One of us might be friends with one of the superheroes in this movie. Can't wait to hear his reaction at this podcast. He did a good job. I'm sorry. He did a great. Great job. We will get to him for sure.

He did. What I want to talk to you guys about before we get to the overall plot and what we think of it is there were two pretty big controversies before the movie came out. Now, one, we have. the horrible tragedy that happened to the director, Zach Snyder, who had to leave during the, pretty much towards the end. Am I correct in that? Of filming and or editing?

There's a lot of debate with that. Some people are saying that, and this is something that's happening now with this film with the call for his cut of the movie, is how much was done when he had to leave. So I was under the understanding, also from a friend of ours, a big portion of it was pretty much shot.

And if that's the case, then, you know, are there basically two versions of this film kind of floating around? Because when the new director came in, We'don, he did extensive reshoots. And I thought that might be because he also as a comic book writer was like, this stuff needs to go in a different direction than where it currently is. Yeah. I don't want to speak ill of somebody who's going through a major life crisis because, I mean, nobody deserves to go through what he's going through. but I feel like you can kind of watch that movie and see Josh Wheehan's hand in that film pretty clearly. It's like he's on the script, I think.

Like, he got script-writing credits. I wasn't sure. I was trying to pay attention at the beginning, but this is another thing. Zach Snyder's openings are always very interesting. No matter what you think of him as a filmmaker, I think he really can draw you in from the beginning of his films, whether it's through music or just the way he shoots it.

this one had a really interesting one as well. Oh, did you definitely get into? Yeah. Can I say before we really dive in, this is my, can I give like my overall thought? Because I think it will pepper my opinion of it as going forward. Yeah. It was the most comic booky movie that I've seen, both in positive and negative ways. I totally get what you're saying.

I felt like, you know, like you get a comic book, you can get comic books that are just really bad, the storylines, or you can get comic books that are just amazing, right? They store outside your expectations. there's a lot of comic books where you're kind of like, okay. That's kind of how I felt. I was like, but it felt, there's a lot of things that felt like a comic book to me. And I did appreciate that. I can expand on that as we go, like moments that felt that way.

It felt like a comic book to me in a lot of ways. And maybe that was Weedon's influence over Snyder's additional vision, which maybe did or did not work in some parts. Yeah. And the other thing that I think may have worked or not worked was the choice of music. Now, we had an entire score apparently done for this movie. and then was scrapped when Weeding came in. Is this something you guys know about?

I didn't know anything about that. I think the guy who scored it was the gentleman who did, the guy who did Wonder Woman score with the guitar like, and I think Whedon came in and brought an Elfman, which I think that was a great decision, because Elfman brought in themes from the original Tim Burton Batman, which I thought was awesome. Yes.

And also brought in stuff from the John Williams' Superman themes. I thought changing the musical choice was, good because I did not like the score the dude did from Wonder Woman in Batman versus Superman. He used it, but I would much prefer for a movie like Justice League or Avengers like that kind of big orchestra

classic epic over like I'm going to throw some electric guitar in there because it's cool. I'm close, I mean I think I disagree with that. I'm not saying I liked it by any means, but I'm saying I think it fit the styles of the film. These aren't

classically shot big sweeping panama panoramas, whatever. These are very CG, very green screen, very empty films. And I think those electric guitar riffs that you're talking about

really play into the style of the action and the feel of the films that Zach Snyder is going for in the first place. You'd rather have that over of Danny Elfman? Oh, no. I would rather have none of these films and have all of Danny Elfman. But I

I think what he's doing is fitting the Zach Snyder mold. Yeah, I completely, I, again, this is another, another time where I could see both sides of it. And it really depends on if you're leaning more towards a comic book movie or a cinematic experience, which they can be married together, but I just don't know when it comes to the music. Well, at this, like, did you guys think, so I definitely, I don't know if this movie knew what it wanted to be. I don't know if it wanted to be a Zach Snyder film or Josh Whed film. I don't know if that's because... No, it didn't. And that was very clear.

There was no... They never came through and blended those two styles together. They shot whatever they shot, and then Joss Whedon came in, did some reshoots, and it was very clear, because there would be a very serious moment that all of a sudden seemed to take on a completely different tone and then return very abruptly to the very serious moments. And it was very clear. It didn't feel funny. It felt really awkward and hamstrung. Yes. I agree with you completely.

Chris, this is a movie where it's clear there were two writers and almost two directors, I guess. And you could tell almost shot for shot who did what, and that is the sign that this movie was not ready to be released. I don't

think it ever was. And let's talk about that. Now, we have the Marvel universe that has been so carefully planned out for so long. We got the origin stories of every character pretty much that led us up to we're almost at Infinity War, something we probably none of us ever thought we'd

think. Oh no. You feel so warm and fuzzy inside. Me too, man. Me too. I loved it. But then here we have another franchise who has such a rich history with two of the most iconic superheroes of all, maybe three, I should say.

Three. I would say you could argue three. Yes. Wonder Woman Batman and Superman. Yeah, it's a Holy Trinity. Everybody is supposed to know those three characters in comic books. Exactly. And they rushed it off the top.

They rushed it off the top. Fast as possible. And also we get a few other of our Justice League members. And we don't know, we've never met these people before. Why are we going to give a shit about them? So let's talk about that. We have an opening to this movie where we get introduced to each character. Now, what did you guys think of the way they handled this in terms of bringing the team together?

We get to see all of them before this happens. of them really stick out to you as good or sincere? What are your guys' thoughts on that? I felt like they were trying to do a good job with it. And I think that destroyed the movie. And what I mean by that is that they took, I think, an hour and a half or something to get all of these characters together, which makes sense because we've never been introduced to them. characters like Aquaman and Cyborg are kind of well they've been around forever they're kind of abstract to most

regular average people who don't follow comic books and what's awesome. Aquaman's the joke of non-comovic fans the dude that's fish you know what I mean? Right and I think because they had to take so long to bring these guys together that it took the entire film and so the film suffered because they had one insanely long first act no second act and then a big battle for a third act and that was that.

Oh, there's a second act. It's the Superman act. No. No, it's not a second act. That's just the end of the first act where they're bringing the team together. Oh, I can't wait until we get to that part. Something too is Warner Brothers made them, from everything I've read, because I've done as much as I could about the film,

that was one of the big issues, is Warner Brothers made them cut that film down just under two hours. So they basically were like, yo, you can't make a long movie, which I think, you know, when you're trying to, tell this huge story and you haven't introduced all these characters like you said, Chris, you're screwed, just like, okay, well, I guess we'll just

like, throw it on the screen. I'm sorry, why the fuck would Warner Brothers with the biggest movie that they're making with all of their characters, why would they choose this movie to make one of the shorter ones? And that makes absolutely

no sense. Because they're worried about Marvel and the worried about, I think, Zach Snyder's pacing the storytelling after everything with Batman versus Superman, we're like, oh, it's boring. No, did you guys actually hear there was a new report out recently that may address this? They said the big reason why they couldn't go back

and delay the film was because producers' bonuses were tied to this. Oh, my God. But then they also had a bonus to it being successful, so it's like... Yeah, essentially what it came, what it sounds like it probably came down to, is that there's some sort of a merger or a buyout

or something that may or may not happen. And subsequently, if, they push back the film, they may not be with the studio anymore. And so if they're not with the studio anymore when the film releases, those bonuses go away. Now, of course, the same thing could be true of the

if it's good. So even if it's good and they get that, you know, whatever rotten tomato box office, whatever bonus Nick's talking about here, if they're not with the studio, they still don't get that bonus either. So they kind of... But it doesn't touch out why they cut the running time. Why, you know, why you would be like, we got to get this thing

under two hours, guys. got to get it out the door I think that's it Like we live in such a world now Where we consume things so quickly We want it short and sweet And like you said They're trying to sort of go off the Marvel platform

Of shorter is better And I just think they can't With the writers and directors They're choosing for DC They can't do that They need three hours to tell their stories And Marvel has the added benefit Of ten years worth of movie

and being like, well, you already know these stories, so Avengers can be two hours and you can be happy with it, because it's just, as someone on my Facebook wall put it, it's just action figures going smash, which I'm okay with. Sure. Well, when it comes down to it, guys,

that's what it is. Like, when we really think about it, a lot of these movies are made to sell toys, to sell comics, to sell merchandise. That's what it is. Now, I would say that Marvel does it a little bit better of a job of actually, like, caring about what they're doing. And I do sincerely think a lot of people at D.C.

care about these people, these characters. But the question is, does anybody care of Warner Brothers? That's the difference. That's a very good point, Chris. Not only that, but that money plays such a big part in all this. And the movies are suffering in terms of which characters someone can use. Oh, wait, Sony has this. We can't use that.

Marvel has this. We can't use that. This story is inevitably going to suffer, I feel, when it comes down to that. Now, we're seeing with Sony and Marvel that they are able to make something like that work. So that's good. That's cool. Whatever. Yeah.

I want more of those Spider-Man Homecoming movies to come out. They were, that was awesome. It was great. It was fun. Yeah, but then we're moving back over to the darker, I would say, of the comic book franchises. And Warner Brothers just doesn't know what they're doing. Well, they really don't seem to because I, God, I think that, I think that, I think that, I think the biggest condemnation I can make of this film is that they took five of the biggest superheroes

in all of comic books. They took the entire armies of all of these groups, and they made a film that felt small. Yeah. Which should be impossible. Completely impossible. I was talking to my brother, and I felt like I was watching a CW, a $300 million CW film. And listen, I like the CW universe. as a comic book. I can get on board with that. If I'm going to go to the movie theater, I do not want to see the $300 million CW film with Ben Affleck in it. Like that's not what I'm looking for, right?

It should be something better than that, I guess. Well, let me ask you guys this. Before we go any further, you did bring up Ben Affleck. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. If he wasn't in that cowl, I could swear someone had a gun to his head every line this dude was making. Do you do you guys think we're going to see him

in any more of these movies? No. He did not want to be there. They're already rumored that Jake Jelenhall is the next one. I saw that.

I, okay, so first off, I'm a Ben Affleck apologist. I like Ben Affleck. This wasn't his best performance, and you're right. It looked like every

line he said, I saw him just thinking, God, it's Daredevil all over again. Yeah. Except, except when he's talking to Wonder Woman, where you see this vulnerability come through.

And I don't know if that's just Ben Affleck thinking Gal Godot's hot, or if he was literally directed to have this schoolboy sort of crush on Wonder Woman. That was the only moment where I felt he was any sort of a character. Do you wonder if maybe that was supposed to be ultimately building towards the Batman Wonder Woman relationship that I think was almost immediately prior to the New 52? Oh, yeah. I think that's definitely what they're building towards. I mean, everyone alludes alluding to it.

Alperds alluding to it. By the way, Jeremy Irons, give that dude a fucking Oscar for these movies because he is one of the best Alfreds I've ever watched. He takes his shit and owns it. I agree with you, Nick. Jeremy Irons is incredible,

but they give him nothing to work with. I know, but he still like him. Even though there's nothing there, I'm just like, Alfred's on screen again. He has no purpose to be in these selves. Why would you cast someone like Jeremy Irons if you're going to cut every one of his scenes and have him staying in the fucking bad?

cave the whole time. Zach Snyder actually used Jeremy Byron pretty well. I will give Zach Turner credit. Like, when you watch Batman versus Superman, he's a really bright spot in that, his Alfred. He did have some agency in that one, yeah. Yeah, sure. I still like watching him.

I'm just like, you're a cool offer. I can get on board with you as Alfred. Mm-hmm. And your cool glasses. While we're on that, let's talk about Commissioner Gordon. Oh, I was excited. I'm sorry, was he in this film? Yeah.

Who? Commissioner Gordon. That's from Batman, right? I've heard that. Who's Kastner Gordon? Again. Because I'm two big back-gold movies, so you know. You cast an incredible actor, and then you don't use him.

He was in, what, two scenes, and essentially his job was to flash the bat signal or something? He did nothing. How was that position? Right. And the big thing was everyone was talking about how much he was working out before this movie and, like, how jacked he got. And they're like, is he doing that for this movie? Oh, my God.

Is he going to, like, kick some ass? And then they put him in a baggy trench coat, and then he just, he flicks the bats. signal on once. I'm doing it for the movie. He came out and say he was doing it just because he wanted to get in shape. Yeah. If you want, I followed that storyline because I'm a geek. You're a health nut, Nick. We get it. I am. It's true. So, okay, all right, I guess we're kind of going on a tangent, which that's what this is all about, guys. So, um, yeah, let's just complain for an hour. That's, I like that idea. There are some good things about this movie. We'll get to those. But let's talk about, okay, the Flash on CW is one of my favorite shows. I love it. I love it. I love it. I love Grant Gutson. I love everything they're doing with that show. I hate, hate this version of The Flash. Really? I fucking loved Ezra Miller in this.

I was, I'm a little what you're saying. Chris? Oh, I thought. I agree. I thought it was pretty rough. I thought he did exactly what they wanted him to do, and I was like, you know what? That doesn't mean that what they wanted him to do was good. I laughed.

He at least was funny. I at least was entertained when he did shit. Here's my thing. I think he was good. I shouldn't say, hey, Ezra Miller. I hated Joss Whedon's lines inserted for Ezra Miller. I think that's fair. I thought all of the performances from everybody was good.

As I said, I'm even a bad, a Ben Affleck apologist. Oh, God. I didn't think Henry Calvill was great, and I love Henry Calvill, Superman. I mean, was he even there? We'll get to that. Right. Yeah, well, yeah. I have a whole diet to him about Superman.

Was his upper lip even there? I'm not sure. It was with a little. added flesh to... So I saw this... I think I think I saw it differently than at least one of you. I saw this in...

I don't like the whole IMAX super 3D, mega-Oplex, whatever. So I saw this in a good old-fashioned rundown movie theater. And I didn't even know... Like, with the exception of the terrible opening of the film, which is, oh, I have a phone camera.

And I didn't even realize it was Superman for a while. I didn't even notice that there was anything wrong with his lip. Is this a weird thing that happened in the 3D? No. I had heard that if you saw it on IMAX or in the ultra-hate high-deaf, the uncanny valley

with his lip was way more noticeable than it was if you saw it in like you did, Chris, and like a standard, like a regular theater, right? Most people from what I read the song in the regular theater were just like, Henry Calvillow looks different. Like, he just looks different. Let's tell the audience what we're talking about here. Like, what happened? That's probably good.

I got this. Yeah, you got this, Nick. So Henry Calvill is currently shooting Mission Impossible 3. and when Josh Wien was brought on, Mr. Special 4? 72. Yeah, the next Mission Impossible film. And when Wien was brought on to reshoot,

he wanted to do massive reshoots, and that meant everyone coming back. So Calvo came back, obviously, for the Superman reshoots. But it was in his contract that he could not shave the mustache that he had grown from Mission Impossible. So what they had to do then

was digitally remove his mustache, which cost something millions of dollars to do, number one, and number two, normally takes six months of editing. So they had to, like, super rush this thing to still get out on time. And what this caused for most viewers was an uncanny valley effect where, like, it just looks off and actually can be kind of unnerving. And just makes you, like, look at him and be like, you don't look like Henry Calvill, which upon the second viewing, because I've seen this movie twice now, you realize that almost

every single scene of Superman, that's present, which meant Josh Whedon re-shot almost every single scene with Superman, which I'll get to, and I actually think might have been a good thing, because Zach Snyder's Superman and I don't get along very well. Yes. I thought you loved his Superman. I liked Man of Steel, but I'll get to that. We get to Superman in that whole situation. But anyway, that's what happened.

He had to have his mustache or his beard mustache digitally removed prior to the release, quickly. Okay. So we've got that. We'll get to where Superman lays in this entire. plot of this movie. But let's talk a little about our two underdogs here. I want to start with Aquaman. What did we think of Memoa's performance? Go ahead, guys. Tell me what you think. I love this one. Yeah. I thought, I thought, because like everyone said, like, you have to, like, how do you make this character? I mean, the comic book, he's a super interesting character,

but he's, he to me, is a very comic book character. Like, he's a, he's, he's, he's, he's a character I wouldn't introduce in this movie, even if he didn't have a stand-alone movie. Like, bring him in because people are like, Aquaman, but I thought the changes they made, making him a little bit darker, making him kind of the outsider.

I thought MoMA did great. I found him funny. We're in the trailers. I thought he was going to be awful. I was like, no, he kneeled it. I want to see his movie. I want to go see that movie when it comes out. I was totally like, I'm ready for Aquaman.

It's going to be cool. Yeah, I'm on a similar page. I thought that, I thought Jason Momoa was amazing. I thought he was, I think he did something that nobody else in this film was able to do and take lines that were

supposed to be funny and make them work. I thought Ezra Miller just ruined a lot of those jokes. Same with and with all due respect, Ray Fisher. I thought they just didn't work. But I thought, like, Jason Mamoa's snide kind of

stabbing humor with a lot of his jokes just actually worked in a way that didn't work for anybody else. And I thought that was really charming. And while I don't necessarily like what they did with the character of Aquaman a lot of the time, I thought his performance. And I thought some of his scenes worked better than a lot of the other characters. Oh, that's the same when he sits on the lasso truth.

Oh, my God. Oh, my God. I hated that. Did you really? I just wanted to throw up in the movie theater. Oh, man. That's one of my favorite scenes. I liked it to do.

It went on too long. It went on way too long. I'm like, that's a comic book. That's a comic book. I'm like, I ate that shit up as a comic book fan. Yeah. And he stopped after the first time he said, like, an actually revealing thing.

Right. But then they kept going on for five minutes. I just sat there going... It was a family guy. It doesn't make sense. But he sells it so well. Like I said, his performance is great. Agreed.

But I hated what they did there. I think Mamoa, more than anyone in this movie, understood what both Zach Snyder and Josh Whedon wanted. And I think he did that. to the utmost professionality. And I think you're right. He pulled it off. Good for him, man.

Whether or not, yeah, exactly. I think he has a bright future with this character, if they even make it to his standalone movie. They are. It's already in post-production. Okay, that's good. Now, one movie that is not even in production yet, and let's get to it,

this is a very controversial, not performance, but just the way that they handled this character of Cyborg. Ray Fisher. An up in newcomer in Hollywood, this is his first major motion picture, which is incredible. Yeah, absolutely. For anyone who doesn't know, we know Ray Fisher, he's done a bunch of plays in New York. We have a very close friend who is practically best friends with him. He was his best man at his wedding.

We knew about this long before they even announced that he'd been cast, and they could not have picked a better dedicated actor to play this role. But in terms of that, how do you think he did, guys? Or how do you think they portrayed the character of Cyborg? Nick, maybe you should hate this one. I need to form my thoughts. All right. It's because, you know, I'll talk off my ass and Chris can follow me up.

So here's the thing. I thought Ray did a really good job with what he was given, if that makes sense. And I think that they put that character in a really hard spot as, like, the exposition character, who had to tell us everything that's. going on. And frankly, I think in films that that just doesn't work all that well, that's like the TV thing, right? Like when you sit down to watch like a CSI, New York, I'm picking some random procedural, right? There's always that scene where like they come in and the one person's telling them everything you need to know watching it. So you're like, okay, so the killer did this and they

found some fingerprints and they found some hair and that's all great. And it's a TV show. So you're like, okay, that's kind of what I felt like cyborg was. Okay, so there's a motherbox and I have all this technology. Now I can do all this weird shit. And they're a TV show. And they're a TV show. me me and okay then I'll go and here's what's happening here's what we have to do and because that was all of his scenes I'm like well that you just wasted a really good actor sadly but I will say I thought he did it well as well as you can do that shit it's hard to do and I think that's bad screen writing too yes but I'm not a writer so what do I know no I'd have to agree yeah it was in the writing here Chris go ahead yeah so I should point out I don't actually know Ray I've never met him

I've heard a little bit of these stories before, but the way I know Ray is that I know you guys, and that's about it. So I'm free to talk a little bit more openly here. Oh, yes. So with that being said, I think that, I don't want to call them problems,

but I think Cyborg is a very difficult character in a film because he is everything and nothing all at the same time. Yeah. His entire purpose in the story is to essentially solve the box that the writers write themselves into. Okay, so we have a piece of technology that's completely unfathomable. We have a giant robot that can do anything,

so he's just going to touch a thing. Oh, we have this earth-based robot. He can make a Kryptonian key. It'll work. And because of that, his primary role in these films is just to solve the problem that nobody else can solve just because of who the characters are.

And as far as that goes, when all you're there for is to be a plot device, you don't really have a lot of characterization put into you. I mean, they did the best they could with those scenes between him and his father, but they just kind of felt flat. And as far as Ray's performance, the perform, I don't think it was his fault. I think it's just these characters largely are suffering

from the same problems that all the characters are suffering from. And that's the deep depressed. that these films exist with. The idea that nobody is allowed to have any joy or happiness. And subsequently, when you think of Cyborg, you think of the old Teen Titan Go films. You think of this fun character who's like, boom! And then the only boom you get is a very subdued celebratory boom at the end of the film.

It just goes, boom. Yeah. So, question, you could have been better served, like, to have that character be, like, Martian? I mean, this is diving deep into comics. Like, be a Martian Manhunter or be even Green Lantern. Like, having it not be Cyborg and saving Cyborg for something. Yes. I, sorry, Nick, I didn't mean to drop.

No, no, no. The entire time I saw Cyborg as he was becoming a member of the team, I'm like, he would have made a good villain for a movie. And then make him, you know, as he's. As he's becoming more machine than man, this is the whole thing with Cyborg, this, you know, singularity aspect, or Frankenstein's monster even. Sure. Like, seeing someone who is no longer in control of their own everything, their mind, their heart, whatever's left of this man, it would have been interesting to see him be almost an obstacle for the Justice League and then bring him in when things get even hairier. And we got to bring him in the Greenland.

What they do with Superman, Cy W? Uh, yeah, we'll get to that. But yes, I think, I do think that Cyborg's character suffered greatly in his film, and he was almost like a day as mock you know in a way. Yeah, and a lot of those decisions just didn't make any sense. Like you're talking about it, they treat him like a Frankenstein's monster, and is he good, is he bad, is he in control? And none of it really pays off in any substantial way.

Yeah, it was problematic. Don't they even mention the Frankenstein monster? Like, he's talking to his dad, he's like, you're afraid they'd see the monster. He's like, no, no, no. not you, he's like, you assume I'm talking about me. It's like a direct-ruff did that idea. Like, no, you're the monster for doing this to me. Yeah.

Well, let's, let's, one more thing, too, which I thought was pretty interesting. The actor who played Cyborg's father, he was also the dude from Terminator who made the fucking Terminator. No shit. It wasn't really. I'm almost positive. Are you talking the, the Terminator three? No, the original. Or is it two?

I think it was two, where, you know, he goes. goes back and gets the hand and everything. Okay. I think... Like, if I'm... Yes. If I'm wrong on this, I will edit this out. But I think it was the same actor.

Snyder's all about that stuff as a director. Yeah, holy crap. Terminator 2, you're right. Yeah. That's amazing. Oh, God bless the internet. Yeah, so that was a pretty interesting nod. If it was even intentional.

I don't see how it could have been. Yeah. This guy's like, oh, I'm the father of all singularities. This is the role I'm going to play for the rest of my life. I'm just robot guy. That's my own life. Okay.

So, we have the Justice League forming. We have this villain who we haven't even brought up yet. So let's get to him before we get to Mr. Soups. We've got, we have a villain from, am I correcting this? I don't know the mythology of Wonder Woman well. This is a, is this a Wonder Woman? No. No?

You can handle this one. You're good at this history. No, it's even dumber than that. Okay. Give it to me. All right. So Andrew Sanford will kill me for that. because I'm going to be, I'm going to

flip ball so much again. So Steppenwolf is the general of Darkside. Darkside is part of the new gods and apocalypse and they go around and you know, fuck up planets. So essentially the villains. Yeah. So DarkSate is Thanos. Actually, Thanos is based on Dark Side. So if you want to get some

context there, Marvel is like, oh shit, that's a good villain. We should make our own. Bring you Thanos. Way cooler. But this is my problem. So Steppenwolf is like, I'm trying to think Like, he's a legit villain, but he's, like, running up, someone give me one of the, the bat clan that's not Robin or Nightwing. The Batwoman? Batwoman.

Batwoman. It's like running up Batwoman against, who's still cool and can still kick some ass, running up Batwoman against, you know, Superman. I don't know. Okay. You get my point, like, it's a villain. It's a villain, people know, but it's not like the villain. Okay. And so, it's like you're sent, you're sent the epic building, epic movie, and not even bringing down the big fucking bad.

You're bringing down, like, his crony. For Justice League, yeah. For Justice League. To be fair, it's basically what they did in Avengers, right? It's, all right, so we have to have a big bad here. So let's just, I don't know, fuck it. Let's just have aliens. What kind of aliens?

But Avengers, Avengers still have Loki. And you can make the argument that Loki is the villain who they set up. And Loki is a legit Avengers villain that you have invested in and watched in, and you have feelings about. And this was just like. I guess that's right. He's not the villain at the first Thor is. I keep thinking he is.

Like the aliens and Avengers are the parodemons in this, right? And they worked really well for me. They were great. They were great. They were great. Right? But the problem was the actual villain,

I was like, eh, and then the CGI sucked. So you're just like, well, no I have huge to the CGI. And the villain that I don't care about, I'm not invested in. Why do I fucking care? But like, I know who Darkside is, who has one mention in the film. Just make it dark side. Yeah. And have Steppenwolf be a part.

part of that big epic battle. I get why you don't use Dark Side right here. I think you know what you're doing here if you're making this film. You realize you're rushing this. You realize nobody has any investment in anybody. So why waste the... Don't do Doomsday again. Don't bring out a fan favorite villain and just waste them for 10 minutes at the end of the movie.

I mean, in my opinion, doomsday would have been the better villain for... Agreed. Because this is basically the story. of Dooms, right? This is basically Superman Returns, but without Doomsday. But he fucked Doomsday up in the last film. So, oh, God, sorry. I'm breathing. I'm breathing.

All right. Well, let's get to that, guys. All right. So, for those who did not see Batman v. Superman, we have an ending where the man of all man, the legend Superman, dies, supposedly. We get a small... No, he's dead. I think he's dead. Yeah, okay. He's dead.

He's dead. Sure. Let's just say he's dead. He's dead. So we kind of had an inkling that when this film was coming around, that this was not going to be the last time we saw Superman. Whether or not it would be in the way that we got in this movie, I can't say. But Nick, I want to hand this one over to you, the Superman fan.

Let me just get up in my seat here and get ready to... How did they bring this guy back? Oh, well, okay. So I have to know. Let me go back to Batman v. Man so I can set this whole story up. because I'm very passionate about this. So they kill Superman, right?

Kill him. Kill them good and dead. They also kill Clark Kent and have an open casket funeral for Clark Kent, which I'm going to get to. So they kill Clark Kent, my problem number one. Superman's dead,

so now we come to Justice League. And there's these things called the motherboxes, the whole big thing the film's around, and they're like, oh, well, the mother box can create life. We can just bring Superman fucking back because there's an embryo tube in the ship that was left over from the Kryptonians and Man of Steel.

Right, which is how they create a doom thing. So all of this is essentially from the comic books, though, right? Kinda, kind of, yeah, kinda. Like a bastardized version of what happened to the comic books. Yeah? So, yeah, kind of. Anyway, they're like, you know, Batman's like, like, yo, we got to bring Superman back. Fuck it if he's bad or not, because immediately all the Superman fans in the room are like,

you're going to make Superman bad, aren't you Zach Snyder? Because you hate us and all of us that like Superman. He might be bad. Okay. go to the ship, Cyborg makes this little key, they put Motherbox in the embryo thing, Flash has to, like, hit with some lightning, and boom, we got fucking Superman back.

But Superman is bad. Zach Snyder's like, this is all I ever wanted in life, guys. I wanted to make the injustice video game movie. Duman comes out and, like, oh, by the way, PSP Philthus has happened, everyone's someone Batman, you're a fucking idiot, don't bring him back because he's going to be bad.

And he is, and, like, all of a sudden, he gets all scared because Cyborg might shoot him. And then there's a big fight, right? And which also is one of my favorite scenes in the movie. Do anyone else not like the part where they're in a big fight? And, you know, everyone realizes that he's Superman, so we're fucked. But Flash is like, I'll run really fast and Superman sees him. And you had that, like, realization that Superman is fast enough to see the Flash.

Yeah. That's one of my favorite parts. Oh, yeah, the look that Flash gives. Yeah, that was pretty great. I enjoyed that moment. He goes to just, like, push him and falls back into the fucking stones. Yeah. Come on.

That's great. Nick, tell us, all right. Oh, yeah, keep going, my man. The biggest part is how Superman comes to be Superman again, but we'll get to. Oh, yeah. So anyway, so big fight, right? And everyone's losing it. And then eventually, like, which makes sense.

So the end of Batman versus Superman, while there's a reconciliation between Batman and Superman, clearly there wasn't like a conversation about how, like, you tried to fucking kill me. You're a doucheback. And so he sees Batman, he's like, oh, I remember who you are. so I'm going to fuck your shit up too and then he goes after Batman and there's a quippy line that's clearly a Whedon line

about him bleeding and shit and Lois Lane comes out Oh no that is a Snyder line all the way You think that was no Because he's not in that scene I've seen it twice Oh it feels like a CG It feels like a Snyder line It's so obvious that they're just like

Oh let's have a call back to that Amazing film that I made No first of all it was amazing It wasn't a good line It was just... Maybe, but I'm telling you, it is, it is CGI. Yeah, because everything is CGI in this movie. Because he reshot all of his fucking scenes.

I do think Batman's follow-up, though, of like, yep, something's bleeding. I'm going to bore with that. That was pretty funny, yeah. So, look, he's basically, he calls him Lois Lane. That was his plan. Lois Lane wakes Clark up and is like, hey, let's fly away and go back to the barn. And then you have this big fight scene over, and Superman, like, awakens. It is all of a sudden, thank fucking God, the Super Bowl.

that every Superman fan out there, mine is Andrew Sanford, sorry Andrew, wants to see this hopeful, like, I'm fucking, I'm hopeful and I'm good and like, I'm going to.

And promptly negates any tension this film may have had going to fall. But I'm still going to say, as a Superman fan, I was like, thank you fucking Christ. Now maybe I'll get a Superman fan, Superman film that I can fully enjoy

and not have to like justify in my mind like I do Man of Steel. Yeah, I got that. And you know, I also got, we'll talk about the end, I think Zach Snyder gave a big middle finger, or Josh Wien gave a big middle finger

to Zach Snyder's Batman for Superman. So this film may as well have been called Superman 3. Let's get some friends. Agreed. With no Superman. No. He's in the entire film. No, he's in the entire film.

The entire film is centered around, oh, no, we don't have Superman anymore. We don't have Superman? We should find friends because we don't have Superman. Wait, you're coming down because there's no kryptonian? I can't come down now because there's no cryptonian. The entire film is about the complaints of not having a Superman and how worthless everybody is because there's no Superman. And then they fight things and oh, they just get demolished because there's no Superman. And so they're like, okay, let's team up.

Let's team up. And so we can take this thing and all they're battling him. Oh, it feels like they just might make some headway. And then Superman shows up. And so I'm just going to destroy everything. The end. The end. With this pretty much common book, right?

That is. Which is, of course, the argument. against Superman in the comic books as well is that oh well the act of having a Superman negates any tension a story can have exactly which is why you have a doomsday who can fuck up Superman Superman he didn't he had to have a

a kryptonite weekend Superman to even stand a chance yeah well I mean listen some of us like Superman guys here's here's my thing with you know Superman aside The team building that this movie did, I thought, was pretty good, actually. It was the one arc of this story that I actually really enjoyed was...

I think that's Whedon, by the way. I think it was. And while I hated most of, I'd say, 99.999,999% of Wiedon's dialogue in this, I really enjoyed the way he brought the team together, although I think we should have had six movies before this. Yeah. I did like the small tensions, the little biting each person did with one another. The little mistrusts here and there between one another.

But then in the end, realizing we have to do this together and not knowing what's going to happen in the foreseeable future. None of these people are going into this team thinking, we're going to be doing this for the rest of our superhero careers. It's like, we're doing this once and we are, you know, except for Batman maybe, who wants to bring the team together for good. they're all like, we're going to do this and then I'm going on my way. Yeah, I think that's fair. I think that was arguably the thing that was done well here. It felt very much like when these people finally did come together, that the way they did it made it feel as though they actually were coming together. Starting with that Aquaman moment where he finally joins the team in the sewers of Gotham or whatever it was, you could see them starting to have faith in each other. You can see them starting to trust.

And I think that was developed and justified well. I agree with that. I also really love the point with all that when Wonder Woman fucking pushes into the plane. Yeah. But, yo, we'll cover for her. It was a really nice moment of being like, you know, Batman's still an asshole. Like, he could probably have been more of an asshole, but like Bruce Wayne's still kind of an asshole. Which I think Ben Affleck didn't really drive home enough for me as Batflick.

Though I do think he's a better Batman than I ever expected him to be. Agreed. He doesn't give a shit. but in it's sad because he he does he he he is a great Bruce Wayne and Batman I think I think he out of any of them that have played the this role throughout their film careers he is the first to really be able to tackle both ends of it very well nuanced it sucks that he's in these movies because it's clear he doesn't want to be there he was given a second shot to be a superhero and this is what he has to deal with but I think he's good in Batman versus Superman I think he I think he no he was I think he clicks with what Snyder wants, but I think Snyder wanted to make a fucking Batman movie. See, I disagree. I don't think he clicks with what Snyder wants.

I think he clicks with what Ben Affleck wants. And I think the only reason he's in these films is because Ben Affleck thought he was eventually going to direct a Batman film. And once he saw what being Batman meant, he didn't want to direct a Batman film. Yeah. Or once he saw what DC and Warner Bros. Wanted to do with these films, he was like, nah, bitch.

So is he out? I don't know this. He is not out. He is sending conflicting messages of like, yeah, of course I want to do the Batman film. Of course I want to be Batman. And then in other breath, he's like, well, you know, I think that I should exit Batman in like a cool way. So he might still do the standalone movie and like call it a day. It'd be cool if he did a one-off.

Yeah. Which would be the Batman movie, right? Like a Logan type thing where it's like it's technically continuity, but it's not. It's not at all. I've heard that's what they're doing though, isn't it? Isn't that kind of what's in the realm? I have no clue. I think that'd be great though.

they did. I think that's what the guy wants to do who's directing this Batman film. It's in the continuity, but you won't see any other characters in it. It's just Batman. Whereas Aquaman and Flash, I know in the Flash movie Wonder Woman is, because now she's the thread, right? They were like,

yo, she's really good at this role and people really like her, so we need to like build with her smart, smart move, but she's like going to be in the Flash movie, which is having a ton of issues too. And I'm going to assume I bet she's in Shazam. I would put money. She's in the Shazam movie. Okay, okay, stop right there.

We just saw a Justice League movie. You have every opportunity to make incredible, incredible solo movies with each of these characters if you wanted to. So what are we gonna do? We're going to bring you

a Shazam movie next. You have a Zachary Levi, guys. Come on. What about him, Big? Tell me what is good about this, Zachary Levi. I don't see the appeal. He's such a big geek.

It's like me getting to play Superman, guys. I think having a Shazam is basically like saying, you know what, we really need more Superman. Yeah. And let's not make another Superman movie because God forbid me to that. What? What I want to know is where's Martian Manhunter and all this? Me too.

Me fucking, he's in Supergirl. That's where he's at. Yeah. I agree. That is a character that I would have loved to have seen in this. Can't raise Martian Manhunter. Are you like, wait, Martian Manhunter, go for it. It would have been great.

Would have been great. Are you guys familiar with the animated Justice League? New Frontier? Yes. Not really. I've no other. I haven't seen it. I watch with a one-year-old son.

It's fine. It's good. It's... Yeah. But it has Martian Manhunter as one of the main characters. Am I correct? Yes.

Yeah. So why couldn't we have done that? Why did we have to get a small glimpse of Green Lantern and then such a weak cyborg? Give us a Martian Manhunter who can bring that extraterrestrial feel to this movie. I feel like that's kind of what they were doing with the pair of demons. Can I bring in the... like the controversial take on this and you can edit me out of it's too bad because I think they want

they were like well he's black and then we have a black person who's young in the film okay that's that's completely understand you can't do that with marish and manhunter well no I agree with you they can I just think they were like well no because then he's green we wouldn't see him yeah or even the john stewart green lantern like but I think they're just afraid of green lantern I think they're like that shit was a mess so we all like stay away from that but I think that might be a big part of it they were like we need to have some more diversity in side of this cast. It's a bunch of like white dudes essentially and one one lady. Yeah. So, um, Cyborg? Cyborg. He's in Teen Titans, right? Yeah, he's in Teen Titans, right? Great. Well, then

people already know who he is. Do it. Yeah. They've officially promoted him up to the Justice League in the comic books too. Yeah. So that's probably, yeah. So it's a good time. Possibly because of the movie. Who knows? Right. Yeah. Right. But still, I think Marshall Manhunter is as dynamic and as interesting and power sets are really cool and would have would have worked in this film really well and probably could have done a similar served a similar plot device in a lot of ways because he can shape shift like i don't know i think he'd be a better character for this particularly and i would have loved it as a comic fan like that's to me that's justice league is superman batman wonder aquaman green lantern and marchion manhner like those are my justice league that's what i remember

yeah yeah well i mean not that they care but who knows Who knows, Nick, they might be listening to this. No, they don't. It's fine. Whatever. The last character, guys, I want to sort of talk about before we sort of wrap this up is Lois Lane. Oh, good. I'm glad. Yeah, what do you guys got for me? Honestly, there's really nothing to say. Again, so underused.

From the strong character that we saw in Batman v. Superman, where I was just blown away by, like, the agency they finally gave this. character. They did in the Christopher Reeves movies as well. But it wasn't the same. The one they gave her in these was much better. It was much better. I agree, Nick. But then we get to this movie and what the hell? Why did she even sign on to do this? Because it's probably in a contract. Yeah, you're right. Yep, she signed her soul away. But yeah, she basically, the only reason we had her here was to make Little Bad Superman good Superman again. Yeah, she's pot device. Like Chris says. It's, well, Chris, can you, I know I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, Bogartian, we've talked about before this, can you talk about your major problem with most of these movies? I think that sums

it up, like, the alien... Oh, sure. So my problem with most of these films in general is that there's no humanity in them. None of the DC comic books have any humanity. They're all focused around the supernatural.

Batman, or Man of Steel is purely an alien film. It's largely about aliens who come down to Earth. For example, Superman, what makes Superman charming is that he's a human who finds out that he has superpowers

because he's actually alien. But the way they present him in these films is as an alien who is battling largely against being human. You look at Wonder Woman and she's a fish out of water. It's largely about this Amazonian

who's not actually Amazonian but is a god. And let's really focus on that. It's about the Battle of the Gods and it's not about the humans who are there. They make you think it's going to be about that, but then they completely pervert that in the last moments of that film. And the same can

be said with Batman versus Superman, and especially in Justice League. Justice League's I think the biggest problem with Justice League is I never felt like there was really anything at stake. It felt like the only people who were in any danger was that one small,

I'm going to say Russian family, Which, look, I loved those moments. Western European family. Western European. Whatever it is. Eastern European side. Yeah, that would be the... Yeah.

Either way, my point is just... There's three human beings in that film who might have some sort of a problem if this happens. You never see you, like, running in the street. You never see people. And look, I realize it's because 90% of this film, if not more than that, is shot on a green screen, and it turns out you can't have 100 extras running around on a green screen.

But it makes it feel like there's never anything at stake. The only people that are ever going to be heard is that one small family. And at that point, I say, okay, I'll sacrifice you. Sorry. That's a really good point, though, Chris, that this movie, again, Justice League, the big one with an alien enemy, we are seeing the only threat to Earth with this right now is like three people. Yeah.

You know what I mean? Like we are not seeing the gravitas of what this enemy could potentially do. We're seeing a huge team of superheroes battling him for what purpose. I know we hear about what he could potentially do, but we're not seeing that play out. Yeah, they're like turning the world into his world, like in that montage that began in the film. But we don't see that. We don't see any threat except for these parad demons scaring some children. children. Like, you know what I mean?

The guy at the beginning of the movie, you're like, really? Yeah. I didn't even understand what's happening until it was over. That's when I knew I was like, oh, no. But it's funny because it's the exact opposite of Avengers, right? I know we're comparing these, but you know what? God damn it. Compare them. That's what common books are.

Like, you're comparing, like, one, like, who's doing it better? DC or Marvel? Disney or Fox? Or Disney or Warner Brothers? And, like, when you watch the first Avengers movie, and even the second one, even though I know I probably have less problems with the second Avengers a movie than you do Ryan. Chris, I think you and I are probably close the same page

with it. Like, there are people at risk. Like, when you watch that First Avengers, like, New York gets fucked up. And it sets a precedent then for all the other movies. And I think that, like, after Man of Steel, because everyone was like, yo, Superman killed a lot of people

in that movie. Yeah. Warner Bros. was like, oh, I guess we can't, like, we need to avoid that at all costs. Yeah. And then they were like, so just like, you're fighting this big place where there's no, like, you have to save three people and Superman saves like an apartment complex really quickly, which I like, because I like seeing Superman, so I like seeing Superman save some shit because he's Superman.

And ever for a second, believe there are people in that building, though. I believe there might be some people in that building. Superman saved them, Chris, let me have my Superman. God damn it, I've waited this long. I think you're right, Chris. Like, there's nothing that, like, those Avenger films, at least there's things at risk, right? at least like when this ultimate team up happens, like I felt they were fighting to fucking save something.

Even if it is just a lot of Hulk smashing, they were trying to save something, right? And like, Justice League was like, well, we're just going to fight them when we were saving something. Well, and the difference between those films, I think, aside from the fact that they were significant built, like, look, the Avengers films have no real story either, but it's because they are the third act.

Like you build up the first and second with the films leading up to Avengers, and then the Avengers is the big battle of the third act, and I'm fine with that. But the reason why you actually feel like there's stakes, like, Rand, it's only New York that's at any risk in Avengers won. But you see the Thor, like, catching giant, like, bricks about to fall on people. You see Captain America diving to save a human being, and all of these people in the surrounding chaos leads you to feel,

feel like, oh my God, people might die here. Whereas in Justice League, it's like there's a purple worm that's chasing one family. And there's no other cars on the road. It's not like there's a person getting out. And like, you never see one of the parodemons like pick up a person in the background. How hard would it have been? A CG, a random human being that a peridemone was picking up. Just like, no.

Yeah, even if they like just like sprained an ankle, like give me something. Give me something. Chris, you bring up a good point that, you know, we have superheroes. We have this mythology of this superhero for a reason. And that is when there is no hope left within humanity, something can rise above and help us and guide us. And I think that's what's most important about any comic book, any superhero franchise. And I think that's where we're kind of losing our way. It's no longer about that.

It's about, yes, it's about these characters, these superhero characters and what they go through. That's very interesting. But I think we're losing what the human condition means within all of this. I think, well, it's like Superman. So one of the whole points is Superman, the reason why I love him is, here's an alien that crashes on Kansas and is raised by these older, first of all, I'm raised by older parents too, by these older parents. And they do kind of touch on this in Justice League, but not in the way that I think it's too late. Like he's more human, or he represents the idealized thing that we want. to be as humans better than any of the fucking humans.

And you lost that. Like, he would save those people. He would fly in. And, like, there's no heroics, right? Like, where's the heroics in Justice League? Yeah. Yep. That, Nick, that is a perfect way to sum it up.

There was very little heroics being done. It was, it is what it is. But there's a lot. I will say, though, because I'm the one I think I like this the most of the three of us, because I actually chose to see it again. I still had fun at times. Like, I still enjoyed, like, I still liked the big booms, and I liked when, like, Superman flew in and punched Stepmoor from the face. I like the Batman Wonder Woman fight.

Like, there were moments where I was like, man, I really, really, really want to watch this movie. And maybe, like, if it's on TV, I'll watch it just to have some fun because there are some fun things that happen. But there's nothing that makes me care or that I'm invested or that I would be like, man, I can't wait for Justice League, too, guys. Yeah. All right, here's the thing. You couldn't pay me. Well, maybe you can pay me, but you could not beg me to watch this movie again. If I bought you a free ticket, you wouldn't go again.

If I was like, Chris. No. No. Oh my God, no. I almost walked. If I didn't have this podcast to record, I was about to walk out in the first place. What? No, can I just say I felt my favorite part of this film was the preview for a quiet place?

Did you guys see that preview? Oh, my God. That looks so good. It looks so good. What if it came with the free ticket to see Avengers Infinite War? Infinity War. Okay, but then I'm not, I mean, I'll take a nap. It sounds like a great time to take a nap.

Nick, Nick, that's... Oh, sorry, Chris, go ahead. But I want to jump off of the Infinity War thing for one more moment. When you're done, Chris, please. Okay, so I do, look, as I said, I feel I don't like this film. But I do want to say a couple kind things about it. And I want to say that first of all, I thought for all of the controversy there was about the Amazon costume design changes, and it's justified.

I will say, I thought those battle scenes were terrific. I thought they were amazing. It was the best scene in the film, right? And I will say that I did think that in spite of all of my problems with Superman, the fact that he finally punches something that is theoretically as strong as him, I mean, clearly not. but theoretically as strong as him was kind of nice can I talk about so this is like

there's one thing that we didn't did I think ween did I haven't got this question answered by my inside source as much as it is a cluster fuck for a sequel he brought Clark Kent back because Clark Kent is Superman and I hate like those are my biggest things like the end of that film when like you get Clark Ken

I was like good love it I don't know how you're gonna fucking justify this but like fuck you Snyder for killing him I don't care that you don't like Clark Kent I do and that's what makes him awesome. So big middle fingers, Zach Snyder, Clark Kent's back, and you can't do a good goddamn thing about it. That's good. He's

forced into the corner now. If there's anything I appreciate about Weedin, it's that he's trying to raise the bar, I think, for Snyder to try to fix this. I think Snyder's gone now, guys. I think that ships done. Oh my God, please for love of God. Please get rid of him. That might be

it. One more thing about Justice League before we get to our final wrap up here, guys, was the after credit scenes. Now, I have to admit, I had an emergency when I had to go see the theatrical release of this film. So I did have to do a little, well, we won't go there. I watched this movie from my home. I'll put it that way.

You had a private screener. I had a private screening. Listen, you know an screener, whatever? So what I did was, guys, I watched a private screening, and I recently got a early Christmas gift for my girlfriend from drinks by the dram. This is a shameless plug. This is a, what is it, a 25 days of Christmas Advent whiskey. I saw that.

That's awesome. So if you want to sponsor to you dumb dads, I'm just saying we're looking for sponsors. Absolutely. I will send him a little bit more than man. And that night specifically, I was drinking buffalo trace bourbon. Oh, I just had that while we were talking. Oh, good. Yeah, by the way.

Right now I am drinking. It is called That Boutiquee Whiskey Company out of Ireland. Okay. It's pretty good. It's an Irish single malt. let's see two to three year two to thirteen year old that's a big gap

which is it about $50 that's the difference yeah exactly exactly Chris I'm going off on a tangent here we'll have to do a whiskey episode let's talk about these let's talk about these after credit scenes now I miss these I know what they are

but explain to me what happened and where it's leading us Oh Chris take the first one because you loved it Okay, so I'll take the first one because I enjoyed it. And I'm going to be honest, I'm a sucker for this because they do it every time the Flash and Superman get together. So the first, the mid-credit scene is the usual scene where Superman and the Flash race. And it's really charming and it's really happy. It's, God damn, it's the only happy thing that has happened in what are we at?

Four DC films now? Yeah, one, two, three, four, yep. Yeah, so at the very end, they get together. and they're sitting out in the middle of, I assume, Kansas, and they're looking both ways, both of them in costume, and they're stretching, they're getting ready to go, and they go, okay, so where are we racing? Which coast?

And they go, I've never been to the West Coast, all right, and then they race. And it's beautiful, it's charming, the banter is good, it feels like they hear each other, ah, whatever. But it's the only moment of joy, an unadulterated happiness that has existed in any of the DC films, and I loved it. Do we know who wrote that scene? I don't, but I can only assume.

It's by the fucked up Superman face, Whedon. Okay. That's how I forgot who wrote what this entire movie? Somebody smiles. It was Whedon. That sounds awesome. I want to, hopefully I'll be able to see that once the Blue Ray comes out. Again, it's a true comic moment.

Back to the fact that this movie is very, very... bookie because that's like straight Chrisette straight out of the fucking books. So, okay, so our end credit scene, who came back, guys? Give it to me. I have to say that when I saw the movie, because I went opening night while we were all waiting

for the scene, someone did cry out, that was the best moment of the entire movie. Oh, Jesus. Put that on the marquee. Right. I should note that one of the big things this movie was the fact that we didn't basically cut all of Jesse Eisenberg's stuff. And so people thought that Jesse Eisenberg wasn't going to be in the film.

So the end scene opens up with this, like, they go to Luther's cell, and you see a ball dude who's clearly older than, you know, our current Lex Luthor, and I was like, oh, do they make Lex Luthor older? Is they going to be a different actor? Please, please, please, please, please, please, please, please be a different actor.

Maybe Brian Krastan's going to spin around. I can be really excited. But no, it spins around, it's just a crazy guy, and clearly Lex Luthor has fucking escaped his prison cell, and now there's a boat, and you see dead, Deadshot. No, wait, no, no, that's right. That's true.

Destro. Dead stroke. Dead shot. Looking just, Destro, looking just fucking badass, walking up to this boat. And there's Jesse Eisenberg's Lex Luthor, who finally looks like a comic book Lex Luthor. He's in a white suit and a tie on this really expensive boat. And I was like, okay, once again, I think maybe Whedon was like, guess what, guys, we're going. I'm going to force you into a different direction with all of this.

And so he's basically like, hey, we should form a least. League of our own. Bum, bum, bum. And I was like, fuck my life. I don't want to see that movie. It's the only time a sequel is going to get smaller than the original. Yeah. Because, you know, don't use Darkside that you, you know, would be who you should have used to begin with or alluded to.

But also, I read that that's where they're going to take this. Is they're going to do a spin-off that's the Legion of Doom and not Justice League? I'm like, no one wants to see that. Oh, great. Because, you know, D.C. did a wonderful job with making an entire villain movie. Yeah, no one wants to see that movie, but it did look cool. Deathstroke looked, I mean, yeah, Deathstroke looked great, so there's that. Yeah, he did.

He looked fucking great. I saw the screenshots, yeah. Can I just say, I'm actually a suicide squad apologist. You're an apologist for Affleck and Suicide Squad, aren't you? Yeah, I like all the things that people hate. I look, it wasn't a great movie, but what I'll say is a lot of the problems I have with the DC's films, they didn't bother me there. Like, yeah, there's no humanity in this film, but it's about a bunch of bad guys. Of course there's not going to be.

But it's like the most sexist film of all of them. Oh, yeah, no, that was atrocious. That was really, really bad. They could have given somebody some shred of clothing, some woman, some shred of clothing eventually in that film. And that would have been nice? Yeah, why would you want to do that? No, no point. I'm so happy I missed that movie.

Oh, yeah, don't. I caught it on each point. drunk one night maybe watch it, but aside from that. Okay. Well, all right, so we might be getting a Legion and Doom movie. Cool, fine, whatever. Here's what's pretty interesting, guys. We had Thor, Ragnarok, come out, what?

Two weeks before this one? Oh, yeah, just really ruined this film. Probably should have pushed back this fucking movie so it didn't have to compete with anything Marvel ever does. Exactly, Nick. Chris, and to your point, too, what a fuck you to DC Marvel did with this? First of all, Thor, Ragnarok,

probably one of the best Marvel movies, in my opinion. Hilarious, awesome, endearing, heartwarming, very comic booky

space astral sort of, just romp. I fucking loved it. And then... I did too. And then, what does Marvel do

the day Justice League releases? They drop the Punisher. What a goddamn middle finger really good so far. I just finished it. It's terrific.

I'm on a guy I'm such three or four. Yeah, I'm taking my time with that one. It's, it's, it's hard. It's hard with everything that's going on in the world today to watch someone just annihilate people with bullets. But you know, dealing with like the PTSD thing. I was like, way to keep it topical.

Absolutely. Absolutely. And bring Punisher into like the current day. I was like, look at you, Marvel. Still not sucking. Yep. Yep. You know, they've had some hiccups. But in terms of that, like, here's, here's the thing.

Thor, if Thor hadn't been so goddamn funny, I think Justice League might have done a little. better. I'm not going to lie, especially with bringing weeded in. But when you have someone, like the gentleman who did Thor Ragnarok, his name's escaping me. Taika,

Waititi? Waititi? Yes, that we do. Who was in the Green Lantern movie, ladies and gentlemen. What? Cal George's best friend. I did not know that. Oh, that's right. That's right. That's how the shake weight got into

Thor Ragnar. I read an article about it. That's fair. Again, brilliant writer, director, and actor. He was in Thor's Rack and Rock as well. Without him having such a home run with that movie, I think Justice League suffered because they tried so hard to put some humor and light into this film. They've changed the tone of films. I mean, in some ways.

Yeah. And everyone went to see Thor, and then they went to see this, and it could not, it paled in comparison to the humor that we had just seen two weeks prior. And I think, Chris, you nailed the, like, there's no humanity, right? There's no humanity in these films. And so you're just kind of like, well, great, it's funny, but like, great. so you finally made something you tried to put some quippy humor in a movie that's not working I got more humanity from a Norse god than I got from any human superhero in Justice League

let's put it yeah yeah there's literally zero human beings in that movie it depending on whether or not you count Hulk but it still felt more personal and more human than anything that happened in any of the DC films and it shows you that Marvel can change tonality completely change the tone of a film and like whether you like that change you not it still works because that director like, I'm doing something completely different. And you were like, they were like, okay, as long as you still do the things we need you to do to push forward Avengers,

go for it. Exactly. I have one more thing. Sorry, do anyone else notice, like, sorry. No, no. As much I love we didn't be like, yo, Zach Snyder, Clark Kent, back, go fuck yourself. Do anyone else notice the fact that, like, the Kent's home forecloses

at the beginning of the fucking movie? After Bruce Wayne pays for Clark Ken's funeral. And then all of a sudden it takes to the end of the movie when he basically brings Superman back to like just buy the fucking bank so that their home doesn't foreclose. Do you think that Bruce Van would be like listen, pay for your son's funeral,

sorry you're losing your house. Yolo, see ya. I was just like, Bruce May would have been like, yo, I bought the house. Yeah. Don't worry about it. Because you already know I'm Batman. So fuck it. Honestly, I was more caught up by this whole thing with Batman. I was like, no, you shouldn't feel like you killed Superman. No, you

you kill super you literally killed Superman right before that fight he was suffering from the kryptonite gas crab and Lois goes oh no but you're too weak from the super and then he goes off and gets beaten the crap out of and kills like no yeah Batman

you literally killed Superman own it yeah yeah you killed him sorry own that shit all right guys final thought does the DC slash Warner Brothers franchise do they have a future? Are we going to see more movies? And if so, are you going to see them?

Chris? I'll make it. Okay, I'll go first, I guess. So to start with the first question, is there a future? I think yes. And I think until all of comic book movies start to decline, I think there will always be more DC films. The question for me is whether or not they keep making them at this scale. And I think for the foreseeable future, the answer is, yes. I think there's just way too much money to be made. I don't think we're going to see a lot of the creative teams back. I think you're going to see less focus on Henry Calvill and Ben Affleck and more focus on Gal Godot and Jason Mamoa. I think you're going to see a new director. I think you're going to see a new take. I think you may even see a largely revamped storyline, which I think that

the idea of a Legion of Doom film is largely alluding to. So I suppose in in jest and I should I simply yes there's going to be lots more am I going to go see them I'll probably see them on HBO Netflix wherever they go

and I'll see the big big big ones in the movie theater when Nick drags me to them Nick? Yeah I think there is I think that I think Chris is right I think tonality I think two things are going to happen I think you're going to see Wonder Woman be the flagship

of the franchise, which I think is a really smart choice, and I think DC, they hit that, right? They got that first. They were like, listen, we finally made a good, strong, Chris might debate, a good strong female-centric liege. Like, we've got this. We've got this on lock. So we're going to run with that. I think you're going to see them build out from there. I do think you're

going to see another Superman movie because there's directors who want to do it. Matthew Vaughn has come out and said, I want to, I want to do a superman film, but I want to do an updated version of the Christopher Reeve film, which you know, Superman will in fact punch something. But then also, he is still a symbol of hope, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

Which, to all the Superman fans out there, we were like, yes, fucking right. So I think that, like, as Chris said, I think as you see the Snyder creative team depart, and you see these new teams come in, the Patty Jenkins, as they, as Jeff John gains more control, I think you're going to see, yeah, you're going to keep seeing them, and I think that they might start taking the turn. My fear is that I don't know if they can rebound, like, if Aquaman's not good, I think you might see it start whittling down to like Wonder Woman and just And like maybe some of these other offshoit characters like Shazan

People that are less known they feel they can do more Chances with but you're never going to see Batman go away He's too much of a moneymaker Yeah I mean and I think the Superman I think is because people want to make that movie And I think that our directors that want to make that movie Right I think you're still going to see them I just don't think it until they slow down and they're like we're going to take our time You're just not going to see it reach the level of what Marvel's able to do

but we're always going to be on like phase 14 and still making good movies. I agree. I think I would have to say that with DC, the future is definitely female. I think Wonder Woman is going to be the anchor for this franchise for the foreseeable future. Whether or not Ben Affleck comes back, I do see Batman also being another one. And yeah, I have to agree, guys, would I pay to go see another one of these movies? I don't know. Oh, I will.

I will. I'll see them all. I see all that shit. throwing money at it. You know what? I mean, at the end of the day, guys, it's superheroes on the big screen. I think you make a good point, Nick.

I say that now. But once those trailers come out, the hype begins, the, you know, you want to see these characters living and breathing. I probably will,

but I'm not... I guess that's... I'm not, you know, waiting with Bata... Guys, it's like Superman symbol. It's hope. I just have hope. I just,

I go there with my Superman's shirt and I go, it means hope. And I guess that's the point. As long as there's hope that they'll turn it around and make a better film, there's every chance we'll keep coming. Exactly. And if anything, guys, we've got Star Wars in a few weeks.

Oh, God. Just giving more of that money to the other side. That's right. Oh, my God. Take all my money, Disney. If you buy Fox and make some X-Men movies, you can have my money there too. Yeah. Well, I'm calling it now, guys.

You're coming back for the Star Wars episode. Oh, please do. I'll be there with those on. Absolutely. I can't thank you enough for coming on today for hashing out this movie with us. I really am looking forward to this marriage between third kind productions and two dumb dads and what you guys got going on over there. So when you have any information coming out about when you're going to release that, please let me know. Any dads out there, whether you're a veteran or a newbie, I think you'll definitely learn something.

I did. And I am nowhere near having a kid. Or if you just like you can, I argue about shit, because that's part of it. Yeah, most importantly, if you're a veteran dad, please, call in, listen, email us. We are dying for any recommendation you can give us. Oh, that's perfect. Well, guys, where can we find each of you if any of the listeners want to reach out? Oh, sure.

I was going to say, I'm C. Moss 55 on, oh, what the hell is the big one? Twitter. The Twitter? Not the Twitter. I am. I'm honestly not sure if this is the right Twitter account. I should probably check before I say that. But yeah, I'm on the Twitter somewhere.

You can find me tweeting and twatting and whatever you do on that thing. Yeah. So I'm kind of all over the place. First of all, Ryan, thanks for having us on this very long episode. Yeah, thank you. You can find me at. Well, thanks, buddy. You can find me on Facebook.

I have my personal one. I have my actor page. Instagram. That's pretty much just pictures of my kid. I'm on the Twitterverse at N. Westie or N. Westemeyer. And soon as we get things moving, you can find probably Chris and I both at Two Dumb Dabs, which we'll have a Facebook group and Twitter and all that. So we're both around and, you know, we're kind of connected with the hip now.

Though we've been for the last 15 years, so what can I say? Yeah, we need a surgery. Love it. Awesome, guys. Thank you again for coming on somewhere in the skies. And remain hopeful that D.C. has a future and we will speak soon. There it is. Thank you for having here.

Where in the skies is produced by third-kind productions In association with Antica Productions and the Antica Podcast Network To learn more, visit anticaproductions.com Right, okay, here's the thing. See, I'm afraid of bugs and obnoxiously tall people and murder and I can't be here. It's really cool.

You guys seem ready to do battle and stuff, but full transparency, I've never done battle. I've just pushed some people and run away.