Somewhere in the Skies - Flying Saucers 101 with Harold Burt

Episode Date: May 21, 2018

On episode 57 of SOMEWHERE IN THE SKIES, Ryan pulls a wonderful interview from the archives where he and Shannon LeGro, host of Into the Fray Radio, interview UFO researcher and author, Harold Burt, about his "beginners guide" book titled, Flying Saucers 101. The book serves as a reference to the entire history of UFO studies and all the subtopics that come with it. In this particular interview, Burt discusses his thoughts on UFO cover-ups, Men in Black, Area 51, and perhaps most intriguing... structures on the moon. Whether you agree with Burt or not, this is a wonderful overview for newbies and a great refresher for veterans. Guest Bio: Harold Burt stays actively involved with the Orange County Chapter of MUFON (Mutual UFO Network), where he has served on the Board of Directors. He is also the coauthor of Unsolved UFO Mysteries, published by Time Warner Books and an editor of The UFO Magazine UFO Encyclopedia. He is currently working on several other books and educational projects. To learn more visit www.flyingsaucers101.com Visit Shannon LeGro at www.intothefrayradio.com Patreon: www.patreon.com/somewhereskies Official Store: CLICK HERE Website: www.somewhereintheskies.com Order Ryan's Book by CLICKING HERE Twitter: @SomewhereSkies Instagram: @SomewhereSkiesPod Opening Theme Song, "Ephemeral Reign" by Per Kiilstofte Closing song, "Awake" by Tycho SOMEWHERE IN THE SKIES is produced by Third Kind Productions, in association with eOne Entertainment Support this show http://supporter.acast.com/somewhere-in-the-skies. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey y'all. Ryan Sprague here. As you all know, the Somewhere in the Sky's podcast is always free to consume, but it isn't free to create. That's why I've started the Somewhere in the Sky's Patreon campaign. On a monthly basis, you give what you think the show is worth. You'll be helping the show continue, grow, and to be something truly communal. And remember, there are rewards for each level of contribution, and the list is only growing. So please, help somewhere in the skies now by becoming a page. To contribute and to learn more, visit www.com backslash SomewhereSkies. Thank you for your support. And now on with the show. This is Somewhere in the Skies with Ryan Sprague. Welcome to Somewhere in the Skies. I'm your host, Ryan Sprague. As you're hearing this, I'm traveling back to Los Angeles from Nova Scotia, where I spoke at the SOTERICOM. I'll have tons of content from that event coming at you soon. In the meantime, I wanted to bring you a great interview I conducted with Shannon Legrow

of Into the Frey Radio, where we speak with author Harold Bert about his book, Flying Saucers 101. We cover everything from how Harold got involved with UFOs to alien technology, area 51, and structures on the moon. Whether you're new to the UFO topic or a veteran, this episode will surely serve as a primer or a refresher for all of us. I hope you enjoy. Hello, Harold. It's Shannon and Ryan. And hi, Ryan. How are you guys?

Great. How are you, Harold? Such a pleasure. I am doing fantastic. Thank you. Thank you so much for coming on with us today. Well, it's my pleasure. Yeah, I was telling Ryan that we could probably do three or four shows with you easily.

I mean, your book is literally an excite for Pedia. Flying Saucers 101. We were also chatting about the fact that it's a nice big picture synopsis and And especially for someone like me that's not maybe as well first in the UFO subject, this book is a great place. So also, you have the moniker, the UFO guy. You've been in this for over 25 years. So maybe let everybody know how you got started in this field, first of all. I would love to tell you that.

Believe me, when I tell you, if you had told me years ago I'd be talking to people about UFOs and alien beings, I would have told you you are nuts. I had no interest whatsoever in anything like that, no weird stuff. But what happened in 1986, I was working in the corporate world, the rest of my adult life building and managing systems for big companies. My clients have included Pfizer, Procter & Gamble, Eli, Millie, No Bartas, very large companies. Someone gave me, a friend of a friend, gave me an audio cassette and said, here, I think you'll like this. I assumed it had a music on it. It turned out to be a lecture by somebody who said he was a naval officer and it was about UFOs

and an experience he had on an aircraft carrier with a huge craft coming out of the water. Well, I just wasn't interested in that. So I fast-forwarded it, waiting for the music. No music, but there were a Q&A session at the end of the tape. And what was compelling about it was the people on the tape were not asking questions. They were introducing themselves as former military or airline pilots for government employees talking about their useful experiences. Well, some reason, and I don't know why, I felt compelled to find out more,

so I kind of tracked some of these people down and begin to interview them and talk to them and go to some of these events where they were speaking. And it was abundantly clear that this was real. These people were actually, they were really, really sophisticated, they were bright, they were not weirdos, they had very responsible positions in government and in industry. So I began to study on my own over the next year. two years, and at the end of the two-year mark, there's absolutely no question that this was real. I mean, I knew it in a way that you know how to drive a car, kind of fighting or learning how to

fight that piece and tame it. And then one day, you know how to drive the car. You know where it's going. You don't even have to talk about it. Well, that's how it was for me. And like driving a car, when you're driving a vehicle, you can see things you didn't see. So for me, it wasn't just about UFOs. It was about language. It was about other cultures. It was about physics and archaeology and geology and I found myself immersed in all of those topics that I hadn't expected or had any interest in me before. So I did that, I didn't research and meet with people for 10 years. I didn't tell anyone. It wasn't that I was embarrassed.

It was that I didn't want to take the time to claim the things that I've been learning. So at about the 10-year mark, my mom had asked me a couple of questions and I began to look around to find the book to give her some, you know, a context to understand it. Because they had, and all of the books were for people who were immersed already in the topic. There wasn't anything for an everyday person. So that's why I wrote my book. And it's Flying Saucers 101, but the original title was How to Explain Applying a Flying Saucer to your mom. I later changed it because it's kind of a little awkward, and the one was a better title. But the context in my book is to give people a broader context.

I wrote it for the Everton Grand Tits to. I wanted a viewpoint. It happens to public as they. They hear little details, and they're so strange, they're so bizarre, it doesn't. So I people, and I started out to get people who think bigger, see the entire playing field, then they'll understand each individual little thing that they're hearing about, and it doesn't seem so weird. And I hope that makes a little sense of how I got into it, and why I do it. I do it for the average person, and I potentially do it for those people who have seen a UFO,

because that event changes them inside dramatically and they can't talk about it. And the context and an example I would give you, it's negative in nature of it, it's like somebody who's been abused or battered. They can't get any traction. Nobody wants to listen to it. And the same thing happens if people who see you a both, not necessarily in a negative way, but they cannot talk about. So can't use abuse.

And why do you think your friend just out of the blue gave you that cassette tape? I wish I knew. I wonder, Harold, what do you think in relation to NASA about the capital and the Earth-like planet? As $1 a dollar is being pumped into a new setty endeavor. It's sort of perhaps a shift in the right direction for the mass public to maybe get a partial or small disclosure or a, you know, what we call the disclosure with a capital D. Well, no, I don't. I think it's just NASA as a program for the last 40 years, it has been, it's a facade. It's a PR endeavor, and I'm not knocking any of the people work there.

It has been strictly PR. The government is not the government as you're thinking of, the government is not comprise of not only government officials that we elect, but it's comprised of private companies, government contractors, lobbyists. So it's a very broad, big convoluted creature that nobody really has any control over. As far as disclosure of the capital B, I don't think that's ever going to happen. I mean, just like the government didn't disclose that women were capable of voting, they're not going to ever come forward and go, hey, listen, we've been lying to you for the last 75

years, and we're really sorry about that, but he's real. I don't think that's going to happen. And as Stephen Greer and some other other researchers have said, it's already been disclosed. I mean, you know, the American public already knows that they've just chosen not to know more because they don't know what the decision to see. And the only thing you have to recognize, okay, whatever it is that we've been told to date is not complete truth. And if you just took the government documents that are readily available, even those from the 40s and 50s and 60, those alone, you look at them and it's just your refusal, oh, okay, these things are real and everybody else are real. So, you know, it's been disclosed.

I think I spoke in once before, and I pointed out that a number of surveys have been done by key and end time, roper, all the big polling agents. And they all conclude the same thing. And that is 80% of the American public acknowledges that they think that the government knows more than they're telling us about UFOs. So that's 80% of the population saying, we know they're real, but we just haven't been told to rest. That's disclosed. That is an astounding number of people. Do you really think about it?

Yeah, you know, I cannot think of any other survey in which 80% of the American people agree on any one thing. But that has been for 40 years. Who would have thought it would be this topic? Yeah. Yeah. It's really incredible. And, you know, speaking of disclosure, if all of your listeners should go to YouTube and go and pull up the Disclosure Project, just pull it up and a couple of videos will come up. One is a two-hour video. And it's done by Dr. Stephen Greer, who heads up the Disclosure Project. What that project is, Dr. Greer gathered 500 government and private eyewitnesses and military personnel

and had them testify. Now, this was 20 years ago, signed oath, and he put it together in a big book, and they published it. It didn't get much track. And then he went back and videotaped all of them. And the two-hour version is phenomenal. And I've had some people go and look at it. I've had a copy of it for over a decade.

But now it's on YouTube for free. It's two-hour. It will change your life. It's astounding. And when you see that, you now know, okay, now you really know. It's been totally disclosed you. There's no way you can tell you. say it's not been disclosed.

And Herod, your feelings on, if we had, like Ryan says, the full disclosure with the capital D, you don't think there would be a mass hysteria over it, even though they say that there would be and they're trying to protect us. Well, I don't. And I think people are really sophisticated now. I mean, you've got social media, everybody's in contact of everybody else. There's a historical timeline to this. When UFOs first started making their mass appearance right after World War II in 1947.

By the way, they have never not been here. UFOs have been on this planet and around this planet since before mankind. It's in every historical text. However, getting back to 1947, these craft were showing up, flying over our country in craft and police going 18,000 miles an hour. This is immediately after World War II. Our fastest plane could only do 600 miles an hour. So there's a lot of fear that, you know, who are these people?

What are these things? So there was concern, and it was legitimate at that time. The military established really quickly that, number one, they were dangerous because if they were dangerous, they would have already blown us up. Number two, they were intelligently piloted craft, and there were people in sight. They learned that by, and equitably by 1947. As time went on, the approach changed. It became very, very political. It became self-serving.

And the reason for keeping the in public is now in greed. Because once you realize that there are people visiting here from someplace else, you're going to know they didn't stop at the air-cold gas station on the way in. And that's going to change the entire economic dynamic of the planet. And it's just going to happen. So the public is really, really smart. They are attuned to things. Yes, there are always going to be some people that will run.

naked in the streets, but I, listen, and people, if you educate people and you give them information, you know, when I first started researching UFOs 30 years ago, if I mentioned that, if I happened to casually mention it, which I normally didn't, but sometimes somebody would say, oh yeah, Harold's researching UFOs, oh, my God, if we're in a social situation, the look in everybody's eyes was total fear. But the opposite. In fact, I avoid mentioning it because I can't go on with it. with the rest of my evening because they just, that's all they want to talk about.

Okay? And that's a good thing, you know, but it just, you know, but it shows the shift. The public is more than a capable of handling it. Finally, maybe things are changing a little bit, the mindset of at least more than the 80% maybe that would be nice. Oh, yeah, yeah. And you know what? Here's a great thing about it.

You don't have to wait for the government to do anything. In fact, every step of progress we've made in industry or politics has, not come at the behest of the government. It still comes at the behest of the people. Yeah, sometimes we get bled out with hackers, but we still have a modem of control and dynamic to be able to make things change. The government did not invent social media. They did not invent Google. They did not invent Apple or Microsoft. The people did that. Harold, I mean, piggybacking off of government, you covered in your book the 1958 Brazilian in Nafo's sighting.

I think it was about 50 or so Seaman witnessed a large to shape object, and you have a photo in the book, which was chilling, to say the least, or even the president at Brazil at the time vouched for the authenticity of the photos. Now, why do you think it is, and I think

you mentioned later in the book, that Brazil is one of the most open and transparent governments to acknowledge the phenomenon and to study it. Why do you think that would be Brazil of all places? Well, Brazil, and I'll tell you also, Mexico. Right, right.

All of your Latin American countries, number one, they don't have the fear level. I could say that pretty categorically about most other countries. They don't have the fear level that we have in the United States. And I've talked to people from all kinds of countries that have come in. There's a lady that I met for Ukraine, and I asked her when I met her, what's different what did you find surprising when you moved your family here? And she said, you know what? I'm shocked at how fearful Americans are.

They're fearful about everything. And she said, you know, that's why I came here to get away from, and I've just been really surprised by that. But in answer to your question, Ryan, number one, the culture is not a fear-based culture. Number two, these countries, Mexico and Argentina and Brazil, they do not have this overwhelming military presence and focus. And so what happens when you have even that kind of, that heavy footprint, it keeps people in fear.

And many ETs have told people that they've been in contact with. The reason that we don't do a lot of massive flyovers, particularly in urban areas, is because whenever we do that, we get chased away by jets. So that's why we particularly don't fly over the United States as often, as we would some other countries. And so it's the fear of the popular seeing the jets racing out, and they don't want to cause that kind of commotion. They don't want that kind of commotion being caused by chasing them in and out of the country. If you go to Mexico City, there are never not UFOs over Mexico City. Air traffic controllers in Mexico City will tell you, we would be shocked if we ever came to work, and we didn't see UFOs on the radar.

And there have been video taken to the east. Millions and millions of people have seen them. The reason for it is there's a volcano outside of Mexico City, known as Mount Polo, which has the highest electromagnetic field in the world. And so UFOs are constantly going in and out and around that area. They're always over Mexico City. They're never not there. So, you know, it's just a gift of culture.

Nobody's chasing them away. Nobody's fearful of them. Here in the United States, it's the response. You know, people don't freak out about seeing it. you have mostly freaked out about the response. So Harold, I know you say they've always been here. So what then, from our perspective that we know so far, why are they still hanging around, why are there the sightings, and what might they be doing?

Well, I think that all planets go through an evolution, not only, you know, flora and fauna, but cultures, you know, people, human, DTs, whoever's living there, there's an evolution of planet grows and the people along it grows, just like you'd go from adolescence, teenagers, to adulthood. And I think that this planet is going through that stage and an evolutionary stage in which now it's time to be brought into the family. Now, adult, college, now you need to know how to decide. The same kind of thing.

But they have to do if there's a protocol involved. And what I encourage people to do is to think bigger. There's not just one group of people visiting. There are trillions and trillions of inhabited planets throughout the universe. and there have been at least 30 different types of EPC on our planet. Regularly routinely reported, some groups that track that say there have been 60. I think it's closer to 30. I think that, you know, if you add in some of those, some of those are drones, some of those are robots,

some of those are what I would just call creatures, kind of like if you watch your pet talk, things that we've never seen before. But there are many different types of people that have been here. some, and they're here for different reasons. You go to the airport, you see a bunch of people coming through the international terminal, some are coming here at school, some are coming here to take a job, some are here on vacation. They're all here for different reasons, and I think the same with ATs. Some of those reasons we couldn't begin to comprehend.

And some are here strictly for observation, and I think that there are also protocols in place for contact and have to be approved or not approved, just like an indigenous tribe in the Amazon basin. some of those tribes have never been exposed to the outside world, and there are protocols as to how close you can get to observe them so that you don't interfere with that development of that tribe. So it's just bigger. It's not that complicated if you could just think of it instead of, you know, one group of people think of it worldwide, you know,

200 different countries, thousand hundred different kinds of people. And now I wanted to jump into their technology and how you explain how they track. But before we get into that, I wanted you to mention the man that you met in Las Vegas at a convention. His name was Thomas. And he told you an interesting fact about, I guess, his job, about what he had, you know, the interaction he had had had with this specific kind of aircraft. Absolutely.

At the time, I was working for a big medical company. And one of my customers had built a big medical facility in Las Vegas. I had gone out there for the grand opening, and they had this big fancy affair with a string quartet. I had already seen the facility. I'd been in it before the grand opening, and they did a big introduction, and then they took everybody on a tour of the facility. Well, I didn't go on the tour because I'd seen it. So I stayed in the lobby. There was one other person, a man who was also in the lobby.

So we introduced ourselves to one another, and, you know, he asked him what I did, and I told him, and then I asked him what he did. He said, well, he said, well, he said, well, he said, well, he said, I don't, I'm not in the interior decorator of the facility, and he'd already seen him as well. So I asked him what he did, and he said, well, he said, I don't, I'm not in the military, but I do work for the military. So I said, I said, do you work out of area 51? And he was shocked. He said, area 51, how do you know about that? How do you know about that? Because at this time, virtually nobody in the American public heard of areas in the one.

And I said, well, you know, I kind of have this little hobby. I researched UFOs. Oh, my God. Then I said, do you work out of S4? He said, S4, how did you go by S4? which was a really top secret area. Nobody knew about it. And so he pulled me his head.

He looks around. There was nobody in the room. It's pretty common. He's looking around and make sure there's somebody in there. He says, listen, he said, let me tell you what I do. He said, I'm a photographer, and I'm a cartographer, which is a math guy. And he said, I have a bunch of clearances, and he pulled out his wall. And he had 10 or 12 different cards, military debt card.

And he said, I have some clarances, even that I don't even have a card for it. He said, so what I do is they call me, and then they'll pick me up, and they'll board me blind on a bus, you know, a blacked out bus with the windows cover. He said, I was one time boarded on a craft, which I thought was interesting. He didn't say a place. He used the word craft. And he said, I don't know what it looked like. He said,

because I boarded one, I never saw it put me in a window with my camera and my gear. And he said, I went from here, meaning Nevada, to Europe and back in under two hours. What? Now, when he told me that,

that was in 1991. one. And the reason I share that is because that's just the tip of the iceberg. There are, when I say us, I'm just going to say kind of collectively humans on the planet. Usually are U.S. military is involved. We have technology

that is well beyond what you could even imagine. It just has been divulge. And so I don't like to go into too many details until I kind of paint a broad picture. But that is, that's a classic example that's the tip of the iceberg. Many people have come forward.

You know, I said, oh, man, that's nothing. I mean, that is absolutely nothing. I try to keep people focused on, look, let's just stay with the basics. Let's stay with the fact that there's something bigger here that is already available. The technology involved, and I know, Shannon, you have some questions. I'll let you do that. The technologies involve. Some we've been co-developed that they've helped us out with.

And some, they just, you know, they have that they don't share with us. that we've been able to witness, you know, regular people see these amazing while they're out camping, and they're just unexplainable. Yeah, actually, Ryan, go ahead first with yours. It ties in very well. Oh, sure. I mean, well, I think Harold just brought up a good point. It's sort of like the ET technology. It seems as if they're sort of keeping their ace in the hole. You know, they're willing to depart from some of their technology to perhaps influence us. but, you know, maybe not all of it, because then, you know, we're sort of on the same level as then. We may never catch up, but great point, Harold. I also wanted to add about Area 51.

You also covered briefly in the book about the lawsuit that was filed against the quote-unquote base, as it were. Could you perhaps touch on that, Harold? Give us a little backstory on how Area 51 became part of a lot. lawsuit and who sued them in essence? Well, Area 51 as I think they compartmentalize. No one person knows everything because they want the people working there and they fly them in blind every day and they do their duties. Well, there were a number of people that became very seriously ill working on some projects

which were not divulged and they wanted to be taken care of and they wanted to get some compensation because some of them were dying and they didn't work to sure what they're being exposed to. So the lawsuit was to force the government really to pay damages to the people who were injured. In order to do that, they were going to have to force them to open up the books as they were and reveal what they were involved. Well, that wasn't going to really happen, but I think at the time, Bill Clinton was president. And one of the things that came out of the whole lawsuit process was a revelation that area 51 was only, first of all, it's not just a U.S. base. It is a consortium of a bunch of countries around the world, and they have access to information from that, too, and that there are other similar basis in other countries that have classified the same way as Area 51. They just don't have the notoriety, people just don't know exactly where they are.

So that was the basis of the lawsuit. It really wasn't intended to get people to break open Area 51 and reveal its existence. It was really designed to help these people who were getting. Bill and as a result of that, the threat was that it would have to be broken open. But that wasn't ever going to happen. I mean, in terms of also environmental aspects, Harold, do you also mention FEMA. What do you think the connection is with this organization and where exactly all their money that isn't being put into disasters, as it were? Where is that money going? How does it connect to the black budgets in terms of possible UFO technology? If FEMA has,

been a it's a funnel and there have been a number of directors of management of budget who have retired from service in the federal government and after they retired they said you know there's a ton of money that nobody goes Congress doesn't know where it goes I was the director of the budget I don't know where it goes and one of those kept being identified was a FEMA you know this this money I'm tracking this money down 80 90 billion dollars I don't know where it went. It somehow went for FEMA, but, you know, I look at their book that's not there.

So FEMA was, it was basically a funnel for a long time. I think people kind of caught on to it because every time there was an emergency, FEMA didn't have any money. So I think it's been moved around a lot. I'll tell you an interesting story. I have a personal friend. And he had read my book. He said, listen, I don't want to tell you something.

He's a corporate business guy. He said, my dad worked for FEMA. And he said, we lived in the Midwest. And, you know, my dad, this is an ordinary guy. you know, occasionally he would be to a three-age. Just out of the blue, take off. Then you come back. So he said one day after he and his brother became teenage,

his brother of TV said, and he said, okay, Dad, what exactly do you do? So he looked at them and he looked at the TV set, and on the TV set, and on the TV set, and if you see those films right there, I was in the room with them yesterday. I said, well, Dad, what happened? Dad never said another word.

Never said another word. They never repeat. And he had his brother said her take and he said, we still don't know what he did, But we know you work for a PIVA. I love how people who work for these organizations are so, you know, vague and cladets actually get sort of a rise out of it as well. You do have to see humor in it. It's really like a 1950 stopper, but it really happened.

But what's really cool about it is, you know, they're about a document and photographs that have been released. I'm working on a book right now. I've been prodded to do this for many years. I've probably decided to do it. It's almost done. photos that have been given to me by military people. Oh, look. And I like on, just to age-cap, that kind of thing.

And the technology then, it was really different. You know, you couldn't scan at the quality level that you can do. They're actual prints. They're not, they're not negatives. But the book will focus strictly on photographs that were taken prior to, I think, 19, before, prior to 1990 before, Photoshop. Because I, people, and it's the source. stories, it's not, the photos are great, but the key about the photos, it's story as to how the person

went about taking the photo, because that was before cell phone cameras. I'm telling you, as an older person, I have never run into my house to get a camera and take a picture of anything. And most people my age never had done that. Now, it's ordinary because everybody has the camera on their cell phone. That wasn't the case. I mean, there could have been a fire next door. Nobody ran into their house to get a camera to take a picture up. But in these pictures of these photos, they tell the story of this thing that they saw was so phenomenal, so mind-blowing. They ran into the house to find the camera and hopefully that they had one with film in it. So it's the dramatic stories of how the pictures were taken.

They weren't Photoshop because there's a long history of the existence of the photos. and the original photos that I began to get came from Colonel Wendell Stevens, the since passed away, but he is typical. His job was to gather UFO photos for the Air Force. I later found out I didn't know it at the time. He was also involved in UFO recovery crash incidents, many of them. But a lot of these artifacts of photos have been smuggled out of the military and out of NASA because whenever they were collected, they were being burned.

I mean, they were literally being put in a bonfire and burned. And what was the people who were in the military, that was really outrageous. I mean, there's secrecy. There is, you know, maintaining a decorum. But when you start to burn one-of-a-kind artifacts that may be useful historically later, that's like burning the library at Alexander, and they just couldn't handle that. So they would smuggle these things out. And it's happened in all of the major agencies,

some of the folks that smuggled over to Europe. But thank God to the people who did that because the legacy that they're going to leave is absolutely astounding. Great. I really look forward to both viewing and reading that book, Harold. I think it says a lot, too, about, you know, sort of the perception of the witnesses.

You know, you hear these amazing stories about the experience itself and the fact that we'll have photographic evidence to go with the story, that only lets credence to the story. And it also shows us how the perception of the witness can vary from the photo itself. You always hear these cases where they have this amazing story of what they saw and they go into great detail. I saw windows. I saw three distinct lights on each end. And then you see the photo.

And sometimes it doesn't match to what they had seen. again, not saying that what they photographed it, what they saw, but I think that says a lot about sort of the consciousness aspect of the phenomenon and what one individual perceives when they're looking at this object and other might. So great, I really look forward to that. Yeah, and Ryan, and I think what is really exciting, I mean, you know, some of these I hadn't been through a long time since they're playing. I'm out. Oh, my God. I'm about that. And when you see the numbers of them, I mean, just the staggering numbers.

And the story, you know, the people who had cameras with them, like in their car, they were law enforcement of people. They were EMTs. They were architects. They were landscaped. They were all very extremely responsible people. That's why they had the camera with them. Because they were an ordinary person. I didn't carry a camera with me.

They were an inner person didn't do that. And a lot of them were Polaroids. And I used to work for Polaroids. I worked for Polaroid for five years. And what's great about it. Polaroid is, you cannot manipulate it. There is, it's impossible to manipulate damage, and there is no negative to manipulate. So a lot of them, you know, our big customers at Polaroid were law enforcement.

I mean, every police officer, every Highway Patrol officer had a Polaroid camera. They could document evidence and mainly traffic accidents, but they had days of all through the U.S. and Mexico as well. And a series, a series is very, very different. One photo of that, okay, that's great. When you see a series of photos that you can track slowly moving across a bank of trees, it looks completely different. You go, oh, my God, there's no way that got fake in 1968.

So, Harold, what you're saying is a lot of these are previously unreleased photos that most people have not seen? You know what? They've been available. Some of them have been available. But unless you were immersed in the UFO field, you know, UFOs are a niche topic. I'm immersed in it, so I've seen them all. And I knew about them.

And I collected them and I made contacts with people. I would say, I showed them just a small group. Maybe just, I mean, I've got a couple hundred, but I showed maybe five or ten to a couple of friends in my. And they were just shocked. They were blown away. We couldn't even get beyond the five or ten. I didn't tell them I had like a couple hundred. They just went to five or ten.

And they were like, their heads were really. So there are three things that people are not aware of people in the UFO research. field are very aware of them, and they assume the public knows about it, and the public is discounting. But that's not the case. One is photos. They have no idea how many full-color photos there are, how many black and white crystal-clear photos from the 40s and 50s are.

They also are not aware of all of the government documents, which are readily available to the public, and one of the repositories is run by a guy named John Greenewald. It's called the blackball.com. and he has gathered all of each UFO documents. I have a number of them. Just when you see the drawings are from the CIA, they're from the FBI, they're from the NSA and the precursors to those organizations.

And you can see in 1950, 1950, 1970, you know, what they're saying, hey, this is what we saw on the military base. You know, much less what people have told me firsthand, but that, the photos, the government documents, and the other book that I'm doing, I'm doing a book of UFO, headlines from newspapers around the world, which I'd also

collected. I quite frankly, I had forgotten about, have a big file of them, and I started going through. Oh my God, they're staggering. They're just amazing. Because, you know, what happened in the United States is like the 60s and the 70s and the 80s, newspapers started to conglomerate and ensure that, you know, not released local things that were being seen. But that didn't happen in Australia, Germany, France, England. You still had a lot of newspapers who was somebody from the town today saw this thing you know they knew John

they grew up with John the farmer it was their buddy they knew he wasn't lying so they put it in the paper so I had all around the world which are just quite frankly some of them had not even read I just collected as I went back and read them I realized have I read that newspaper report at the time there were some things in there that had never been seen before that never been divulged even in the UFO community and I probably would not have believed it Now, 30 years later, I know that those are true because they've been seeing worldwide. But there were the local newspapers with these full descriptions of what their friends and family and neighbors have been seeing. And it's just a remarkable catalog of history.

That's amazing, man. Yeah, that'll be too exciting releases. So, Harold, do you think those will be out within a year or two years? When do you think? Yeah, no, I want to get them done. My deadline is to get them done by the end of the same. and be published like for January or February. And it really, I mean, I've got all the materials there.

The layout, what takes the time is the layout. And, but that's happening at a pretty rapid clip. So, you know, I'm working at January 1st. That's wonderful. And I'll keep you posted. So as it comes out, I'll send you guys a copy. Great. The perks of having a radio show show show.

That's right. I know. With exclusive divulging of new books as well. That's right. You heard it here first. Absolutely. Harold, in fact, going off that, sometimes the detriment that technology is, as far as people that want the truth and they don't want to just see another fantastically hoax video online,

you know, fluttering on Facebook and YouTube, have there been any videos that have come out recently or even photographs that have caught your eye that you think might be real? Actually, there are quite a few, but I'll tell you what I do. I've made a conscious decision because I do presentations and workshops. And I think what I want to do is make sure that my readers or attendees don't get blindsided or caught in the blitz. I exclusively focus on events that happened before Photoshop because, quite frankly, if I see a video, I can't look at it. I mean, you see a CGI video. I can't tell the difference.

I mean, it really can. I mean, so what I try to do is I try to look, okay, well, well, it's a story. people doing. That really helps a lot. And so I've seen some remarkable things coming out of Europe that go that's real. Not just because of the video, but because there are certain markers that I use that I don't

divulge anybody. Certain things that happen in Europe only this that the public is just not aware of. They never heard the terms. They've never seen it. They don't know about it. So when a person is out in the field and they take this video and they're exclaiming these markers, pretty sure it's real, because there's no way they would have known about it.

There's just no way they would have known about them. Some of them are just inexplicable. And one of the things that I'll share with you that I really like computers. I mean, I like what they can do. But one of the things that's great about computers is they gave us a language and terminology that we can apply to everyday life to describe things that we couldn't describe before. So, for instance, you know, when people see things that they just defy physics, here's the way I like to explain it.

Imagine that you open a document in Microsoft Word. There's certain things that you can type into Word, all right? Now, Ryan may step over and open his computer and open up Excel, a spreadsheet. There's certain things he can do in that spreadsheet that, you know, maybe you can't do because you don't have Excel, you've just got Word. So, but Ryan, if he's got both programs, he can seamlessly move back and forth between the two programs. and do things. Now, suppose Ryan also has Photoshop.

Oh, that's a whole different ballgame. There's all kinds of things you can do. Things that were unimaginable 15 years ago. Well, our ET friends can do that in real life. It's like moving through different programs. It doesn't seem possible because we don't understand the other programs that they have available to them. But once you begin to see that, it's not that copyated. You just don't have that technology level.

So when you see a beam of light literally go through a tree and then to make a right angle, you just can't believe that that's possible. But it is. And it happens all the time. But that's because these people can move through different programs and do a spreadsheet. And we're in a word we can't do a spreadsheet. Yeah. And it's a perfect segue because I still want to stay on technology.

But now I want to go back to theirs. And one of the biggest arguments for skeptics or scoffics is there is no way that they can cover it. that distance in the time that they would have to do, right, in the time they would have to do that. So can you explain how they're able to do that and why it is possible that they're here? Absolutely. Here's my best exclamation. First of all, time and distance are not related. Leave out the way that you think. Let's say we're in, it's 1830. If you had to go from New York to Los Angeles, it would take you six months at best, okay? Nowadays, on a plane, what's what? Four hours? Hey, how about you're on Skype?

It's a couple of seconds. The same thing. You have to get out of the old thinking of things. Listen, 10 years ago, YouTube didn't exist. 10 years ago, the iPhone didn't exist. So you can't judge future technology strictly of what you've already seen in the past. You know, after the Wright brothers blew,

years after the Wright brothers blew, scientific Americans still said flying, everything in the air flight was impossible. It wasn't true. It was very possible. It was already happening. So, you know, we already have technology. far beyond what you think we have.

But let's talk about getting from here to this. First of all, I mentioned Microsoft Word, Excel, and Photoshop. Literally, you know, if you are in, if you have access to all those programs, you can move seamlessly between the three programs. Those are the different realities. I know people like to use the word dimension. I tend not to use that word only because when you say dimension it, it sounds real science fiction-y and everybody has a different idea what a dimension is,

So I'm just going to use the word moving between programs. ETs have routinely told people in the U.S. government and in the individual contacts where they're asked, where are you from? They normally won't answer to that, but the answer they give is we are much, much closer. They're not moving these tremendous distances the way you think. They're moving, or lack of a better term, interdimensionally, and they have different ways of doing that. Some, you know, propulsion is an outdated concept. Look, I like cars. I like propulsion.

You know, it's a guy thing, right? You know, we call them the UFO community we call them the propulsion guys, okay, as opposed to this spiritual people, right? It's the same thing. It's both physics. It's just a different viewpoint of physics, but they both are real, both physics. So I'll give you a concept that you may not have heard. All of these different people move by different.

weights. Some of them have like Delta jet technology and some of them have biplane technology and they hitch a ride. They all do it differently. Not every civilization that visits here is at the same level of technology and it hasn't all been shared across the board. So some

of them hitch a ride on larger ships and use smaller scout ships. There's another aspect about what I call propulsion. Propulsion for some of our visitors is tied to navigation. They're one in the same. So the way in which it works is, how can I put this? It's like sending out a rubber

band to a point in space. So you want to get to Pluto, you send out an electronic or magnetic band, and it stretches out the Pluto, and then you release it on your end and pop you almost instantaneously at your destination. And that's one of the ways that they travel. And that's why there have been so many crashes. There have been a ton of ET crashes throughout the last 40 years. And that's because calculations get miscalculated, and sometimes they come in too hot in the crash. So in the early 1947 years around Roswell, the military determined that our newly developed radar, in fact, would throw off their navigation systems and the propulsion would crash them into the error. So it's not impossible. They just do it differently, and it's not a motor.

You have to get out of this thing about it. It's a gasoline motor and you have to travel these distances. It just isn't true. It doesn't work that way. As far as the moon goes, you bring a point that the moon rocks and the dust seem to be completely different because the moon rocks are over a billion years older than the Earth to start off with, but then the dust is a billion years older than the rocks? Yes.

you know, I'll keep it really broad. The public has just not been told the truth about the moon. It's very similar to back in the days of Copernicus when he discovered that the earth revolved around the sun, not the other way around. And then Galileo, 30 years later, discovered the same thing. Both men were threatened with their lives to not discuss that. And that information was withheld from the public for over 300 years

because it was felt that, number one, that couldn't handle. But number two, how are they going to adjust all the societal things based upon those out-of-date theories. Well, we have the same thing happening now. I mean, if you suddenly tell the public that the moon is not what you think it is, I mean, that's a little disconcerting. There's been no preparation for it, but I can tell you flat out now, if I were a high school astronomy teacher, I would get my class to just focus on the moon.

Number one, focus your telescopes on the moon non-stop. Forget about, you know, let the Hubble take care of the deep space stuff, okay? They'll get you the images. Just focus on the closest body close to you and then do a little research. Just look into the things that NASA has openly acknowledged about the moon. The information I got is not classified. There have been many, many studies. There's a technical report.

It's R277 in which NASA, they looked at all of these lunar events, over 5,000 of them worldwide. And people, astronomers, and big-time observatories were seeing, they were seeing craft moving across the moon that were four and five miles in diameter, lights, bridges being built and put down, and people freak out when they hear this, there are tons of artifacts on the moon. And prior to the Apollo space missions, the NASA sent around Voyager and orbit for spacecraft,

and they photographed every single inch of the moon, including the backside. And I'm just going to remind your listeners that there is no dark side of the moon, of all due to respect to Pink Floyd. It's not dark. The sun illuminates it. It's perfectly visible when you get around there. But the moon is a really odd thing. It does quarter turns so that the same front always faces our planet.

That's very, very unusual. That's exactly the characteristic of a satellite. The same thing that happens with our satellite that we do. launch. It's not a natural spinning like most of the other celestial body. So the moon has a very interesting history, and these things are, they haven't been hidden.

They just haven't been broadly proclaimed because it makes people uncomfortable. The other thing you could do if you're a high school astronomy teacher is go online and start pulling up information from the ESA, which is the European Space Agency.

They have phenomenal things. Just looking at the moon, then you're going to realize a lot of these anomalies and a lot of these things that happen on the moon also happen to other planets in our solar system, including Mars. So now when you start to look at that, when you hear about, oh, there's an obelisk on the moon that clearly was artificially built, it doesn't sound so strange. If you hear it now, most people don't, there's the shard, which is another, it's a five-mile tower, there's a tower of the shard, the obelisk.

There's all kinds of structures on the moon, which clearly are not naturally occurring. And a number of geologists have looked at photographs of the moon taken by NASA, the Space Agency. And they go, here's why this is not a naturally occurring geological formation. And they'll show you the ratios of the angles in the side. And they say, you may find one geometric shape or two geometric shapes naturally occurring in a single rock, but you're not going to find four and five. But that's what you see on the moon and in some places on Mars, that these are artificially constructed things.

And once you begin to see that in the broad context, then the other things that you will learn about don't seem so far-fetched. And I encourage people to do that before I start talking to them about the very specific things, because it ends up being quite frankly and not believable. You just don't have the foundation to understand it. Good point, Harold. I wanted to mention Shannon. I think your approach to that is extremely responsible in terms of looking at the simple facts first. I mean, you could even go so far as saying why was the space race so rigorous we got there. And then it just completely dropped off. We never went back to the moon. What, 30 years? Yeah, isn't that bizarre? That is really strange, isn't it? You start to wonder why. What did they see there? I believe you mentioned Timothy Good, speaking to an astronaut who said that they were warned not to go back by what? We don't know. Was it just, was there another space station already there? Something set up, the bridges, the shards, everything. You have to look at the simple facts first of 30 years. We haven't gone back to the closest object to our Earth. And it's, it's a very fact.

very interesting, yeah. And not only that, you know, I'll tell you what, there are a lot of mainstream discoveries that they appear like, you know, you kind of have to look for them, the printed newspapers don't have them, and you kind of have to look on the back pages, maybe the Huffington Pose, and you'll see a little blurb in the mainstream science section. But some of the stuff is really, really dramatic, it's shocking. For instance, I'll give you one thing that's recently been discovered, and it hasn't been broadly publicized, and not all scientists.

and astronomers want to concur with it, but there have been a group of very responsible scientists that have done all the mathematical calculations, and they have concluded that the moon does not really revolve around the Earth. The Moon really revolves around the Sun, but it does it in synchronicity with the Earth. And that's different. I mean, it sounds a little subtle, but it's a big deal.

It's not subtle. It means that the whole galaxy, our whole solar system, is structured differently. Right. You know, those are things that are, they're available in mainstream sources. And so now, once you put that on top of the broad field, that, oh, okay, you know, we don't know, we haven't been told a lot of things, but here's another one. And you start to put them on a bulletin board. And then you start to see these correlations.

You go, oh, my God. You can also do that for our own planet. Our entire planet, this Earth, is covered with pyramids. They are everywhere. They are in every country. And you only know about the ones in Asia, okay? They're not the only ones. A lot of them are underground and understands, and there are responsible scientists

utilizing NASA space satellites to do kind of like a, you know, like a CSI where they're using an alternative light source. They can see beneath the sand, and they can see foundations. They can see pyramids underneath the sand that have not been uncovered. And they can also see foundations of civilizations along the Nile. So where they thought there was maybe two or three hundred thousand people along the Nile, there's like 10 million. So the history of our planet is not being divulged properly, and the solar structure of our solar system is not being divulge.

and I think it is to the detriment of every young person who hopes to move in the science. There are amazing things, and you don't have to. Some of the greatest scientific discoveries now are happening with amateurs, people at home who are going outside the box and willing to use their young people who are using their computers. Wait a minute, this doesn't calculate right. So I encourage people, the moon is a great place to start. It is a lynch pin to our very existence in the fact that we're not alone.

We never have been alone. And my contention is, Shannon and Ryan, whatever you're passionate about, whether it's ending world wars, whether it's ending hunger, disease, the lynch pin to all of those things is recognizing that we're not alone and we never have been. Once you use that key, everything is solved. Like, boom, just like that. But you're not going to be able to do any of those things totally until you recognize, hey, we're not alone. That would be like us in the United States assuming there's nobody else out there.

That's insane. Exactly. Yeah. Just look at the facts. It's such a profound thing you just said, Harold, but it can be stated so simply. And I think that's exactly what you're doing with your book and with your lectures and the research you're doing. It's fascinating. It's also very refreshing for, like Shannon and I, younger researchers out there.

You know, we're in our early, right, Shannon, early 30s. And that is considered young in this quote-unquote field. And what you're saying that amateurs are the ones making these discoveries, it's because they have the technology at their fingertips to use satellite archaeology, to use certain technologies like this to see what is below the surface and what is, forgive the pun, in the fray. You know, we are looking beneath the surface. And looking at the moon first and working our way out is exactly the approach I think people need to take.

So, again, kudos on that chapter. I think it was great. Well, good. I'm glad you're enjoying it. Yeah. And sorry for the inside joke there, Harold. Ryan and I actually share a birthday. We both were born on August 8th, so that's why we were laughing about.

Oh, happy birthday. Oh, my God. That's fantastic. Congratulations. Synchronicity at its best. That's right. I wanted to reiterate to everybody that this book is fantastic because I have a ton of podcast that I'll listen to in books that I've read. And, you know, you can't help but feel sometimes very, very inept and lost a lot of times when they're talking because they're so just, they're all over the place with names and dates and places.

And you feel like they're already 10 miles down the road and you're just, you're at 0.3. and you can't really keep up. So this is an incredible book. Well, thanks, Shannon. It's available on Amazon.com, Flying Saucers 101. And by the way, there's an e-version, electronic version, but I have it on for $2.99, so it's really easy, downloadable. But, you know, I think the best part,

and one of the things I like most about my book is The Bidreography. No matter what you're interested in, I wanted to make it a resource, because I don't really expect anybody to sit down and read the whole book. If they did it great, but I really, I like to think of it more as like an encyclopedia that something comes up, oh, now what is that about? What is that, Roswell, makes it? And they go to the chapter.

Oh, there it is. And then there's a bibliography. Here's where you can go to get more information. I don't have a lot of links on there. When I first started writing the book, the Internet was still at its infancy, and the links are changing so rapidly that I just listed, you know, the printed editions. But you do, the authors are all there. and you can pull people up. And I might say that the UFO researchers, talking about amateurs,

you know, none of those people, they're not really making any money doing this. I mean, some of your most famous people, Stan Friedman, Bill Burns. I mean, I know all these people, Stephen Greer, Jan Harzan, John Mack when he was still alive, Bud Hopkins when he was still alive. I honestly feel that these people in the molten house, these people are the equivalent of the founding fathers that signed the Declaration of Independence. They are that level. Now, back in the day when the Declaration of Independence was somebody, there were people,

they didn't really know who Ben Franklin was. So a lot of people did, but a lot of people did. They didn't ever imagine that these guys would ever be famous. What's the same thing now? One of these days, these individuals who have done this, and these amateurs have done this phenomenal work, they will be household names. I'm absolutely convinced of it when the public recognizes, oh, we're not alone. Wow, who discovered these people?

Let's go back and look at what they did. So you have an amazing opportunity to, some of these people are still alive. So, you know, St. for even still a lot, Jan Hours, Ann Hauer's aunt, Bill Burns are so alive. So these people are still around and available so you can pull up their websites, look at their body of work. You know, whatever you feel you're interested in, absolutely continue to investigate. And Harold, did you want to also plug your own website?

It's Flying Saucers 101.com. I'm willing to come back anytime I've really enjoyed it. And any time you get... Listen, you don't have to wait to come on air. If you have a question, just call me anytime. Thank you, Harold. I really appreciate that. And thank you so much for coming on with Ryan and I today.

Yeah, thanks, sir. Oh, you're very welcome. Thanks, Shannon. Thanks, friend. That's it for this week's episode. Be sure to check out Harold's book at Flying Saucers 101.com. Be sure to also check out Shannon's incredible. podcast, Into the Fray, on all major podcast outlets, and at Into The Fray Radio.com.

Somewhere in the Skies is on Twitter at SomewhereSkies, and also on Instagram at SomewhereSkies pod. All past episodes, articles, news, and contact information are all at Somewhere in the skies.com. I'll see you here next week, and remember, keep your feet on the ground, but never stop searching, somewhere in the skies. Somewhere in the Skies is produced by Third Kind Productions in association with the Entertainment One Podcast Network. To learn more, visit Entertainment One Podcast.com.