Somewhere in the Skies - MYSTERIES DECODED: Live from Alien Con Los Angeles

Episode Date: July 15, 2019

On episode 117 of SOMEWHERE IN THE SKIES, Ryan brings you directly into the seats at a live panel recording at Alien Con Los Angeles. Serving as both a moderator and panelist, Ryan invites to the stage, members of Roswell: Mysteries Decoded and the upcoming series, Mysteries Decoded to talk in depth about both projects airing on the CW Network. Joining him are consulting producer, Alejandro Rojas, executive producer, Gary Tarpinian, co-investigator and co-host of Roswell: Mysteries Decoded, Jennifer Marshall, and Denice Marcel. Denice is the granddaughter of Jesse Marcel, the first military officer on site at the Roswell UFO crash. The group talks all about how the one-hour special on Roswell came to be, what didn't make it into the show, personal stories from the filming, and then they dive in to the other mysteries that will be covered this summer on the CW network with lead host, Jennifer Marshall, as she travels the country investigating some of the greatest mysteries of our time. And yes... Ryan is joining her along the way! Guest Bios: Alejandro Rojas is a writer, podcaster, lecturer, and digital content creator focused on science, space, science fiction, and UFOs. He has a keen interest in the unexplained and is often featured in documentaries, television shows, and news interviews. Alejandro runs the UFO news website OpenMinds.tv, and his articles can also be found in the Huffington Post, Den of Geek, and his personal blog alejandtrojas.com. He is also a co-organizer of the annual International UFO Congress, which he hosts as the Master of Ceremonies. Gary Tarpinian is the chief executive officer and co-founder of the Emmy-Award-winning television production company, MorningStar Entertainment. He is also the executive producer and co-creator (along with his partner Paninee Theeranuntawat) of Mysteries Decoded for the CW Network. Tarpinian has always had a special interest in UFOs, conspiracies, and the unexplained, and created Mysteries Decoded to investigate the greatest unsolved mysteries in recent history. Tarpinian and his partner created such legendary hit series as Deadliest Warrior, Manhunters: Fugitive Task Force, and I Survived. They also produced the highest rated non-fiction documentary to air on all of cable television in 2017: Amelia Earhart: The Lost Evidence. Jennifer Marshall is a proud U.S. Navy veteran and licensed private investigator. She holds a master’s degree in Administration of Justice and has worked in many different areas of her field, including locating birth parents, finding missing persons, workman’s comp, stolen valor, and historical investigations. Jennifer is also active in the TV and film world and has been cast in such shows as Stranger Things, Hawaii Five-0, Colony and Nickelodeon’s Game Shakers. She resides in Southern California with her husband and children. Denice Marcel is the granddaughter of U.S. Army Lt. Col. (Ret.) Jesse Marcel Sr. She learned at a very young age of her grandfather’s participation in the recovery of a UFO wreckage outside Roswell, New Mexico in July of 1947. The Roswell incident has offered Denice many interesting experiences, including being the former State Section Director for MUFON Los Angeles. She has done radio interviews alongside her father, participated in lectures on the subject, and even had a small role in the 1994 movie Roswell. Denice also sat with her father as a witness in the 2013 Citizen Hearings on Disclosure. Her most memorable moment was sharing her father's final visit to the debris field and the kitchen from his childhood where he... Support this show http://supporter.acast.com/somewhere-in-the-skies. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

As the crispy chicken sandwich from 7-Eleven, people always call me loud. And I'm like, yeah, I know. I'm crispy. Did you expect me to whisper? If you want quiet, go eat some soup and reflect. Like, I know I'm a handful. I'm bold, I'm juicy. Throw some pickles and barbecue sauce on me, and baby, I'm a whole meal.

And with seven rewards, I'm just $4. Quiet. No. Krispy, saucy, and $4? Very. Only at 711. Valley 3-226, participating stores only well supplies lastly out for full terms. Hey y'all, Ryan Spreck here.

As you all know, the Somewhere in the Sky's podcast is always free to consume, but it isn't free to create. That's why I've started the Somewhere in the Sky's Patreon campaign. On a monthly basis, you give what you think the show is worth. You'll be helping the show continue, grow, and to be something truly communal. And remember, there are rewards for each level of contribution, and the list is only growing. So please, help Somewhere in the Skies now by being.

becoming a patron. To contribute and to learn more, visit www.com backslash somewhere skies. Thank you for your support. And now on with the show. This is Somewhere in the Skies with Ryan Sprague. Welcome to Somewhere in the Skies. I'm your host Ryan Sprague. AlienCon Los Angeles was one of the craziest experiences I've ever had. I met some amazing individuals who I'm sure you'll be hearing on the show in the very future. While I didn't have time to get any interviews at the event, I did take part in several panels and live podcast recordings, one of which you're going to hear today. I was honored to both moderate and take part in a panel titled The CW's Mysteries Decoded, Roswell, and Beyond. Joining me in front of a live audience was consulting producer Alejandro Rojas, executive producer Gary

Tarpinian, my co-host and co-investigator, Jennifer Marshall, and Denise Marcelle, granddaughter of Jesse Marcelle, the first military officer on site at the Roswell UFO crash. We give you the inside story on how the show came to be, our ongoing investigation of the Roswell incident, and then we discuss the upcoming series, Mysteries Decoded, premiering this August on the CW. That's right. You haven't seen the last of me just yet. Thank you to everyone who came out to Los Angeles for AlienCon, and a special thanks to those who attended the panel. And to all those listeners who introduced themselves, I was so unbelievably touched and honored

to finally meet you face to face. And I hope to meet more of you this October for AlienCon Dallas. To learn more, visit TheAliancon.com. And be on the lookout for an exclusive Summer in the Sky's discount, very much. soon. No outro this week, so follow us on Twitter at SomewhereSkies and Instagram at SummerSkies pod. Subscribe, rate, and review the show wherever possible. And be sure to check out the merch store and represent the show in style. Go to tpublic.com and search for the Somewhere in the Skies store. That's teepublic.com. Last but not least, be on the lookout for a very

special live recording of Somewhere in the Skies witness accounts. That will be coming you soon. In the meantime, enjoy this panel discussion, and remember, keep your feet on the ground, but never stop searching somewhere in the skies. Hi, guys, my name is Ryan Sprague. I am one of the co-investigators and co-hosts of that little clip you just saw there from Roswell Mysteries Decoded, which we're going to be talking about today with our panelists. We're also going to be talking about what was spawned from Roswell Mysteries Decoded, and that is a new series that's going to be premiering on the CW called aptly Mysteries Decoded. So without further ado, I'd like to introduce you to our panel today.

First, we have Alejandro Rojas, and he is a consulting producer on the show, Alejandra. And for anyone that knows anything about the Roswell UFO incident, you're going to know this next person. This is the granddaughter of Jesse Marcel, the first military officer on site at the Roswell UFO crash. That's Denise Marcel. Denise? All right. Next up, this is the man that made this all happen, the reason we're all standing up here today. One of the most caring producers I've ever met of the UFO phenomenon in how it is treated in entertainment. And that is executive producer of Roswell, Mysteries Decoded, and creator of Mysteries Decoded, Gary Tarpini. And last but not least, my partner in crime, my co-host and co-investigator on Roswell Mysteries

Decoded and the host of Mysteries Decoded, Jennifer Marshall. All right, guys. Let's do this. So we're going to start off with Roswell Mysteries Decoded, the one hour special that premiered on the CW a few months ago. And all of you were connected to this project. So I think I'd like to start with Gary. How did this all come about?

Where did your interest in UFOs start? Roswell, how did this project come to be? Well, I've always been interested in the topic, and it seems that it's never been more popular. And what really helped me get the show off the ground is I went to the show last year in Pasadena and heard Ryan Sprague speak. And he sort of had me at hello. And I thought, all right, we need to do a UFO show. And it was a matter of figuring out what it was going to be.

And then we had this wonderful opportunity where we brought it to the CW network, and the rest is history. Yeah, it happened so quick. And that's often how these things happen. And that's how we all get involved with it. And one of those people was Alejandro. Now, for those who don't know, I've been working with Alejandro for many, many years. He gave me my big break in the UFO field, working for his magazine, Open Minds magazine. So Alejandro, how did you get involved with this?

And what was your role with Roswell Mysteries Decoded? Yeah, I've been talking with Gary for quite a while for a few years now. He's been talking about his UFO interests. We've been talking about, you know, different ideas that he's been pitching out there. So I was very happy when they got this deal with CW to work on Roswell. And, you know, when we talk, they, of course, when they're producing shows like the research is the most important part. And so I felt it was important that we show two different things, that first of all, Roswell was a conspiracy and I'll explain why. But second of all, that there's research, ongoing research, that can happen.

happen. And I think that's what's important because a lot of people are like, Roswell, why do we need to talk about Roswell? That was so long ago. What new is with Roswell? On the show, you saw what was new. There are people looking for metals and materials out in the desert. Any day someone could find something and we might, you know, prove scientifically that there's something out there that's truly mysterious. So that's important. Also, there's that image, you know, that was in the show with the memo that general is holding in. And what's on? that memo. We still don't know. So hopefully the technology one day will show us what's on there. But the other part, people don't realize, is that it is a conspiracy, and the Air Force has admitted

that. In their own documentation, they show that, you know, it wasn't the weather balloon. They know it wasn't the weather balloon. They admit, we don't know why. They decided to cover it up and say it was weather balloon when it wasn't. Of course, we have this theory. It was a Moga balloon. That's not necessarily proven yet. But the point is it was a conspiracy. So if they're upset about people calling it a conspiracy, it's their own fault. Too bad. All right.

Now, Denise, when Gary approached me with this project, I was a lot like Alejandro. I was very skeptical. I'm like, what's new that we could really discover about Roswell? And I knew we were going to be going out to the crash site, which we will get to. I knew that we were going to be talking to a Earth scientist and geologist about metals we'd found. he had found out there. But when he said that we were going to be speaking to you, one of the descendants of the Marcel family,

that's when I was like, let's do this. Let's do this. So how is that when Gary approached you to do this show? I'm sure this isn't the first time you've been approached with things like this to cover the legacy of your grandfather and your father, who were both directly involved with the Roswell UFO crash. You know, I was really happy when I was contacted about this.

You know, anytime that I can get an opportunity to talk about what really happened out there. I'll jump at that opportunity in. I was just really lucky that it was you guys because you guys did an amazing job with this. You portrayed my grandfather and my father in a really good light, which I really appreciate because it's, you know, it's a touchy subject. You know, like Alejandro was saying, you know, if you don't agree that it's a conspiracy, it's definitely a conspiracy. My grandfather 100% said that was not what was in that room that of what he found out in that field. And my father saw the same material.

He was like, no, this is definitely not what was in that picture there. So, it was real. I want to say something, too. I think by participating, Denise, you really made our show something special. Thank you. And I think you really honored the legacy of your father and your grandfather, who I believe is an American hero for speaking up. So thank you.

My partner in crime, you're so far away. Jennifer, when we first started this project and I knew I was going to be going out to investigate Rosso, I was like a kid in a candy shop. But you coming from a background of what you do, if you're willing to share with us, what was it like knowing that you were going to be investigating a UFO event? Oh, my.

So for those of you who don't know, I am a military veteran and I am a licensed private investigator in the state of California. So things that border on the paranormal can be really looked down upon in our community. So I had to explain it to my colleagues in a way that focused on the conspiracy of it, because we knew that it was not as the government had portrayed. And then after I had spoken to some of my colleagues and I have actually gone to a state conference this past month, people were very supportive. Because when you're dealing with a historical investigation,

PIs, we don't make a living with historical investigations because who's going to pay the bills? So they were really excited that I got the chance to work in that realm because it's not something often that we have the opportunity to do. Now, had you known anything about the Roswell UFO event specifically before you got involved? I had definitely read into it, not nearly as much as when we started shooting the show and we did all the research that we did, but I had always known that there was something a little off about it, because I think if you pull everybody in the room, if anybody, does anyone here really think it was a weather balloon that crashed?

Right? But I feel like society nowadays, we... Maybe. Maybe. See me after. We live in a society where it's Twitter-based, it's 160 characters. People just know what's put out there. So the government says it was a weather balloon.

And 95% of people will say, weather balloon, I believe it. So I applaud that you guys are here and looking into this and saying, no, maybe it wasn't what was fed to us. Right. And that's another really good point that I'd like to throw over to Alejandro is this idea that when this event happened in 47, the military themselves put out a headline saying that they had captured a flying disc. A day later, that headline was taken away, and it was nothing but a weather balloon. So our own military were the ones to first come forward and brag that we may be the first country to have recovered an alien spacecraft. Next day, that was completely a whole different story.

So Alejandro, being like the preeminent researcher on this case and many others, what do you make of this, the military's involvement, and the switch around within a day? I think there's a couple really important aspects to it. And by the way, there's a lot of researchers who have done a lot more work on it, but thank you. There's a couple really important things that I think we have to keep in mind with it that people, I think, overlook. So, for instance, it was the military who put out that press release. It was Denise's grandfather who had gone and looked at that material, reported it back that this is not a weather balloon. This is something that we don't understand and we don't know what it is.

The colonel on the base decided, wow, we really got something here. UFOs were in the news. So this press release said, you know, we might have caught one of these flying saucers. We recovered a crash disc. The radio reports as well, you can hear these online. You hear, we may have an answer to these. You have the flying saucer issue. I don't know why they talked like that back in the old days on the radio, but But yeah, and so this was a thing. So they very boldly put out this press release that we captured a flying saucer. The next day, you know, your grandfather, Jesse Marcell, was flown to Fort Worth, Texas, where he shows up, and the general, he goes and sees, says, well, we're going to tell people it's this weather balloon, and he walks in a room and there's weather balloon pieces.

And I was good friend with Denise's father, who was an absolute wonderful person, one of the most incredible people. kind and just a wonderful person. And the way he puts it is, you know, he was a patriot. They both were. They both served in the military. And his dad did not question it. He said, yes, sir, that's what I'll do, if that's what I'm ordered to do. So that's what they did.

End of story. And it wasn't until years later when St. And Fridman talked with her grandfather that the story really kind of became famous and got out there. But Colonel Blanchard, the guy who put out that press release, he didn't get in trouble. or reprimanded. In fact, he went on to become a general, a brigadier general, I believe. So he raised through the ranks. He wasn't in trouble for saying, what are you doing, telling people that we caught a flying saucer. No, it was more like, you know, he was doing his job. And you would think that if he told people, we caught a flying saucer when it was just a weather balloon, obviously they'd get in a lot

of trouble and he'd probably be demoted. But that's not what happened. So, you know, there's a lot that supports that there was something to this and that those guys, were not mistaking a weather balloon, that they really encountered something unusual. Denise, I'd love to get your thoughts on this. When your grandfather did what he was told to do, as any military person would do, I know the story must have been completely different at home. So when this all happened, when he has shared things with you, how did that make you feel knowing that your grandfather believed that we were not alone

and that there was possibly something from another planet that had crashed here? Yeah, you know, I had a very, I guess you could say, interesting childhood. My father, he was raised in Louisiana after they moved away from Roswell. And when he was in the Navy and when he got out of the Navy, we moved to Montana. And one of the main reasons we moved to Montana was so my dad could build a huge telescope in a backyard because all he wanted to do was look up at the stars to see if he could see anything out there.

My grandfather, we didn't talk about it a lot because we were told, my grandfather was told he's never to talk about it again. And my father really kind of stuck to that as far as friend-wise. I've been finding out recently that my grandfather actually was talking about it a lot more than what I, I think even than what my dad knew, to some family relatives.

And these family relatives are saying, no, your grandfather was actually very upset. He felt he had absolutely no recourse. And he felt he was kind of done wrong. Even though he was a military man and he was doing his job, I think he expected, like, years later, something like the truth would come out and, like, you know, let's not make him look like he was a bumbling fool, saying, oh, you know, he couldn't tell what a weather balloon was, but that never happened. I think for me, though, it really opened my eyes up to there's so many possibilities out there and so many, gosh, you could be so much life out there.

And we just don't have, know that it's, I mean, we just don't, you know, it's amazing to me. Absolutely. I mean, the first book I ever read about UFOs was Crash at Corona by Stan Friedman. And I was just getting into this thing. And the fact that I was now seeing UFOs may be visiting our planet, but they're also crashing on our planet, that was enough for me to be like, there's something to this all.

And Jennifer, I know when we first started, like we had just met each other. It was very, you know, brief introductions, let's go, let's go investigate. And I knew a lot of sort of the things we would be covering. I had heard rumors that there were possible materials out in the desert and everything. So I'd like to know from you What about this investigation into Roswell

Really stuck out to you in terms of evidence? Well, it was funny when you called me and you asked me if I wanted to work on this with you I was really once we started researching and digging in I was really appalled at how sloppy the cover-up was So if you're going to cover something up do a good job Just do a good job If you look at even the pieces of the weather balloon that were found Those were shiny

straight out of a package. It hadn't been sitting out. There was no mud. There was no dirt. I mean, this is a dusty place that it was sitting. And it was just kind of insulting that they said, well, this is what we found and you guys just have to accept that because there were so many things that it was like, guys, really, this is the best that you can do? And then I think when the Air Force released the report saying it was Project Mogul, it was this big long report, that was kind of a lot to do about nothing. It was this huge report to kind of get people to shut up because how many people are actually going to read the report? Not many. I mean, this thing was, what did they say? 994 pages long, I think. Exactly. So nobody's going to read anything that's, you know, over 50 pages. Exactly. So I think that's what struck me about it. And then kind of just how it went away. It went away and the government said, okay, if you think that it's aliens, I guess people are going to think it's aliens, we'll just let you think it's aliens. And I think that's just kind of a lazy way of allowing it to go to the side. It's just by making everybody think, oh, we're crazy because we think it could be aliens.

Now, I'm not saying that that's exactly what happened. I don't know if that was extraterrestrial in nature, but it's undeniable that a cover-up did occur. Okay. Now, for anyone who's seen the special, we did go to the crash site, and there's been a lot of speculation and rumors about where this actual crash site is, in Roswell. Everyone claims to have been there. We got out there and there's this like placard in the ground that says this is where something crashed in 1947. And a lot of people go there and they're like, cool, this is where it happened. That's awesome. We found out with Frank Kimbler,

a geologist that we had worked with that no, the actual crash site was something like 50 miles away, I believe. And that astounded me. I never knew exactly where this thing had happened. Of course, Roswell is like that case that we all hope we can someday investigate. And the fact that we got to go out there and the way that this geologist found the crash site itself was astounding to me. Would you mind maybe giving us a little bit about how Frank was able to do this? He succeeded where so many have failed. So Frank is a teacher at the New Mexico Military Institute, and he's a geologist by trade. So he was able to look at the maps and determine where it was using topography. So he had several maps, and it took him a long time.

He basically laid the maps over different areas, and eventually he found one that was a perfect fit. So there's no way that you can fake the topography and say, here we're going to build a mountain, and here we're going to build a valley, and here we're going to build a hill. So the way that he found it, I was really impressed. And to me, when we started talking about that, that gave him a level of credibility in my mind because he had done so much research and had ascertained exactly where the location was. Right. And then the next step from there, after finding this location, was he would go out there for weeks and weeks on end with his son. God bless his son for doing this with him. Out to the crash site with metal detectors trying to look for anything they could find.

And we were all out there. Gary, you were out there too. within 100 miles of where this crash site is, there's nothing, absolutely nothing, no life, there would be no reason for anyone to be out there. So I know Jennifer and I were like, oh, we're going to go out there, there's going to be like trash left over, some kids are probably partying, not a single thing. But this was where Frank was able to find a ton of metal buried beneath the ground.

So that was a whole other aspect of this thing that I wasn't expecting going into it. I don't know about you, but what did you think about the whole metamaterial thing? Well, just to be clear, when they said that they found the location, at first I was like, sure, you found the location. Everybody says they found the location. I mean, in my line of work, I'm very skeptical. So once Frank had convinced me that that actually was the location, and we went out there, I said, for sure, there's going to be something that we can tell that people have been here.

There were not animals. There was not trash. There was not a string on the ground. And in the military, we do a thing called a Fod Walkdown. So we look for foreign objects that could get stuck in an aircraft and potentially blow the engine. So I basically looked at the ground and I walked, turned around, looked at the ground and walked.

And I did this for about a half an hour. There was nothing out there. There were barely any insects out there, which I thought was very weird. So I think that I think the fact that Frank was able to find metal out there, it was very odd to me. And not only did he find the metal,

but he also found button. from a military uniform that date back to that time. Yeah, we weren't able to get that on camera, but we did find out later on. He did find, he found military buttons out there. They were dated, and they were back in the 40s. So why was that out there? We sort of thought, probably if these military people were out there,

they were sweeping the area, hands and feet down there, trying to find every little bit of whatever this thing was that impacted on the ground and dragged for miles after that. So imagining that cleanup, it's unfathomable that they would actually find every single piece. Oh, absolutely. And I've done cleanups when we're looking for something, not when a UFO crashes. I've never done that.

But we've done cleanup, and you put everything that you find in a particular bag, and they bag and tag everything. So is it possible you can find every little piece? No, that's generally not possible. So I'm not surprised that he was able to find something, but I'm also surprised, given how barren it was, that he was able to. Gotcha. You know, it's not a very scientific, you know, observation.

But I was there in a place just seemed eerie, like spooky and weird. I mean, didn't you guys feel that? I don't. Oh, yeah. For me, it was like Disneyland. Like, I got to step foot on the actual crash side. So for me, I was like all excited and euphoric. And, yeah, I know for you, though, Gary, you did share that with me.

It was eerie. There's an ominous feel to it, this history. behind it. And I love that the way you pointed out that even the marker for the crash site is part of the cover-up. It's not the right place, which is kind of interesting. Right. Now, Denise, I know a lot of people are probably wondering this, myself included, and I think I asked you this one point. I don't know if it made it on camera or not. There's been so much speculation that when your grandfather brought these materials home to show your father and his wife, that he said this was from an alien spaceship,

and a lot of people have heard that maybe he held on to a little something. Is this something you could clarify for us? You know, as far as I know, he never kept anything. But what's really interesting, though, is in that Roswell, that 994-page report, there is a lady, I think her name is Mary, Mary Cavett. She was married to Sheridan Cavett, who was a person that went out with my grandfather to, the field. And she did reference that they saw a piece of it afterwards at their house,

which, you know, I found kind of shocking. But the one thing that made it like, well, you know, this kind of sounds in a way real because she called my father little Jesse. Nobody, unless you know the family really well, would know to call him little Jesse. So it was like he was out there at the same time. My dad said that as far as he knew, nothing was ever kept either. Okay. But you know what I was going to say about that the out there

in that field? Wasn't the Bureau of Land Management trying to get those pieces back from Frank? Yes. So during the process of our filming, I'd say a couple weeks before, during and after, we had worked with Frank

and the Bureau of Land Management had found out that he was going to be doing this, and they contacted him and brought him in for a special meeting to discuss what he was.

he had and what they found out there. Now they own the land. So that's really interesting. My question is why? My question is why, if it's a soda can, like people have said it is, why are they trying to get it back? That doesn't make any sense. Unless it's something that they don't want reveal to the public, why would you waste government resources and time to contact some quack, which is what they're alluding to, to get pieces of metal back? It doesn't make any sense. They were moderating his Facebook page, too, because I got caught up in that. I did too. Yep. We both saw through a Freedom of Information Act request that we were being monitored on Facebook conversing with Frank Kimbler, the man who found these materials. They had screenshots of our conversations with him, and these were released. Well, what's interesting, too, is the kind of loophole that Frank used was that you can take the material off of the Bureau, off the land. However, unless it is culturally or historically significant,

So if that material is found to be something mysterious, then that may classify it as such. And then the Bureau of Land Management would be able to confiscate that material. So we'll see what happens. This is all, you know, unfolding and will for years. Absolutely. See what happens. That's kind of what I wanted to get to. Now, Jennifer, when we were out there, we spoke to a lot of locals and whatnot about bodies.

This is a very contentious part of the Roswell mystery. So we heard some pretty interesting stories off the record while we were out there, but we also heard some really intriguing things from the family who headed the Roswell Daily Record, the people who broke the Roswell story. And we heard some interesting stuff about that. Do you want to elaborate, sort of wrap up our Roswell part here with that? You know, we heard a lot of things when we were there speaking to the locals. One of the things that stuck out to me, of course, is, you know, they ordered four child-sized cast.

So if there are no bodies, do you need caskets? And if they're crash test dummies, which we've disproven that theory, because those were made after the fact after Roswell happened. Who puts crash test dummies in a casket? Have you ever heard of such a thing? So we talked to several people and a few things that didn't make it into the show. I had talked to someone who was at the New Mexico Military Institute. He's a retired colonel. And he had said that there was a woman who, her Her husband was a veterinarian, and he was called in to vivisect some beings that were found, and he went into the room, and he immediately freaked out and started screaming and was shaking and was uncontrollable. They removed him, and he did not touch any of the bodies. And later, he had some visitors at his house saying, if this were to ever happen, if you were to ever be contacted about this, none of this happened. Everybody will think you're crazy, you'll be run out of town. And his wife told my acquaintance this decades after, after her husband was dead.

And it was never spoken of again. So, again, if it was a weather balloon, there's no bodies. If there were no bodies, there's no need for caskets. It's very simple. It is. And the important thing to also keep in mind is, we're not the investigators who are out there saying Roswell was definitely aliens. That's not what we were about. wanted to seek the truth. We wanted to go where the facts led us. And in terms of the research

Alejandro brought to us about Project Mogul, after we had spoken to him, I did some digging, and I found out that the person who wrote the manual for Project Mogul was really pissed off that the U.S. Air Force was using his project as a scapegoat for some UFO event. So before he died, he did make the statement that Project Mogul was not what happened at Roswell. And that is the last answer we've been given by the government. So I guess the mystery

remains. Well, I think you said it so perfectly at the end of our show that there's definitely a cover up here, but we don't quite know what they're covering up. And then the other thing that I loved is when you said it's really raised more questions and answers after we did the sex.

Unfortunately it did, and we went in thinking we'll be able to figure out what happened, but there was just so many things that came up during the course of the investigation. And when you're doing an investigation, you can't just decide where you want to go and follow that path. You can't do that.

That's piss poor investigation, to put it lightly. You have to look at everything. And so when we were investigating this, there were things that took us off this way and this way and this way. And things that we didn't even think would happen ended up happening. And we really had enough for three shows, but you only have four.

40-something minutes to have a show. There was so much that we uncovered that ended up not in the show. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, and since we're wrapping up Roswell, I'll add one thing that I think is really interesting. I've been pretty skeptical. You never know, like these guys looked into it, not assuming that this is aliens. But we've heard a lot, and it's been part of this event, you know, unidentified, this

Pentagon program that we now know exists. Well, many of us have interviewed people involved with this. program, and a couple of the people, including one of the contractors, Dr. Eric Davis, a physicist, and Lou Elizondo, the guy who ran the Pentagon program, they have both said that they have heard there really are crash retrieval programs inside the government. They haven't been able to get access to these programs. They're just rumors, but they're looking for those answers. I asked Lou, well, you say that. Can you prove it? Or I said, I'm assuming you can't prove that. And he said, no, I'm not saying that at all.

So it seems like if pressed, he believes he could prove there are programs like that. That's pretty telling that the head of a Secret Pentagon program would say that. That's really interesting. Well, Jennifer, I know we're definitely just scratching the surface of Roswell. So many have tried to crack this case. And we're doing our own thing. And we're going to keep going where the facts lead us. So I'm looking forward to keep doing that with you, getting out there back to Ron.

Oswell. If we meet our untimely demise. Yeah. Riot. Riot for us. All right. So, switching gears a little, guys. When this one hour of Roswell Mysteries Decoded special aired on the CW, it far exceeded expectations

of a lot of people. And the CW came to Gary and said, let's keep doing this. and from Roswell Mysteries Decoded, spawned Mysteries Decoded, a series that you're going to see premiere on August 13th on the CW. So I want to sort of get an idea of where we're heading next. We've done Roswell, UFOs, but I know Jennifer has such a vast experience in investigation that it's not just UFOs that you guys want to cover with this.

So as the executive producer and the lead host of Mysteries Decoded, what should we look forward to with this upcoming series? What are we going to be investigating? I want to throw this to the man. Nope, you got it, Gary. He's the boss. First of all, we're so excited to have this opportunity, and I can't thank the network enough.

Thank you, Kyle, for this chance. They've really given us carte blanche, to look at stories that we find really fascinating and interesting, and to really delve into them. And what we wanted to do from the very beginning is to see if we could find the truth and tell a great story. And in a lot of ways, I would have to say Alejandra, I've been inspired by you in open minds. And I think they are the preeminent source right now for any information about UFOs. And what I like about them is that everything isn't a UFO.

It's like we're going to look at it, we're going to investigate it, and maybe 90% of the time we even come up with an explanation. But then there's that five or ten like, we don't know what this is. We need to take a closer look at it. So when we decided to do the series, we want to use that same technique. We're going to look at everything and see where the facts lead us. We don't come to any conclusions before we begin the shows. We don't tell anyone what to say. Not that Jennifer would listen. But we go and we look for the facts and the truth and wherever it takes us, that's where we go. One thing that was difficult for me when I first signed on was, you know, some of the topics are a little more paranormal than I'm used to. And I am a skeptic. I work in investigation. I don't deal with ghosts and paranormal things. So that was really important to me. And I explained to Gary that I'm not going to go into something necessarily believing it. I need to be the skeptic and I need to really look at the science behind things and the proof behind things. And I have to admit, there's been a a few episodes where things have happened and I cannot explain why or how. And of course you're going to have people watching a show and they're going to say,

this is fake, that's fake. No, there's been some things that have happened that I called my husband that night and said, this is what happened and I don't know how to explain it. I have no idea. And months have passed and I still have no idea. Interesting. I know I was going to add to that in terms of, of Morning Star Productions

who produced the show and the CW. It's extremely rare for both a network and a production company to give such control to the investigators. I've been a part of other projects where they're telling you what to say verbatim.

They have a narrative that they want for their show and you got to do that or they will edit you to make it seem that way. That was not the experience with this project from the very start. And we both went into that asking for that. Like, let us do what we do best, and that's to investigate. And that's what I really enjoyed about Roswell and Mysteries Decoded is, you let us do what we wanted to do. There was never an agenda. It was, let's just go do this. So in terms of Mysteries Decoded, you mentioned there were some

pretty paradigm shifting moments for you that really made you think. So I know Jennifer and I went out to investigate Area 51, which, again, Roswell and Area 51, like no UFO investigator gets that opportunity. So I'm extremely thankful for that. Well, get to Area 51, but what else are you going to be covering? And maybe what is one or two of those pivotal moments where you were like, there is something to this and the world is not what I expected. Well, I'm not going to give away plot points, of course, but two episodes stick out to me. One was an episode we've shot about Lizzie Borden. Did Lizzie Borden, in fact, murder her parents or was it someone else? there were things that happened during that episode that

can't explain when you guys see it you'll understand why and then when we were looking at the Bermuda Triangle I went into it thinking it's a clever manipulation of statistics the number of ships and planes that have disappeared there but the more that we looked into it and the science behind it it really blew me away

we talked to physicists I mean, anybody who deals with naval ships, aircraft, we talked to pilots, I really wanted the science behind it. And it was just incredible, some of the people that we talked to in the knowledge base and how deep we were able to dive. Yeah. One of my favorite moments is when we were doing the Lizzie Borden story, her home where her parents were killed is now a bed and breakfast. Wonderful place to stay. And they made me stay overnight at that bed and. and breakfast.

You want to hear this? She slept in Lizzie's bed, which I would have never gone near. Thank you, Gary. Thank you. I told her, you know, people would be disappointed if she didn't spend the night in the place. But then I went to the motel

down the street. It sounds about right. Yeah. But, you know, one of the things that you say, I really take it as a great compliment that, you know, you said we didn't tell you what to say. We didn't come up with a theory or a thesis to prove in any of the

these shows. We went into them thinking, let's look for the facts, let's tell a great story, and see where this leads us. That's the way to do it. And should we talk about some of the shows we have coming up? I'd love to. I mean, we have, one of the ones I was really excited to learn about was the Montauk Project. Now, Jennifer, for some who may not know, you have not just a connection to investigating Montauk, but you were part of something pretty, pretty prominent in pop culture today that was directly inspired by this case you covered. Yes. So could you tell us what your connection to that is?

Sure. So I've been working in television and film since I left the military, and I have, I'm an actor by trade, so I have, you know, several roles that coincide with, ironically, some the episodes we've been doing, but I play Max's mom on Stranger Things. And so when I was in Montauk, which is great, because if they have a show, they can hire a private investigator who understand. television. That's always, you know, great. But most of my living is, as a private investigator, I can help people, and that's really what drives me, is helping people get closure to the things

that they so desperately need closure for. But it was strange when we were in Montauk, the whole Stranger Things series, who watches Stranger Things? Okay, so you guys know, yeah, it's a great show, and it's inspired by what happened at Montauk. So it was so odd being in Montauk and investigating this and seeing my two worlds kind of come together. Montauk was interesting because you have people who say, I believe in the Montauk project. It's like, well, what does that mean? There's so many things that go under the Montauk project. So the more that we looked into it, there's certainly things that I believe have merit. And then there's some things that are just kind of thrown in there for conspiracy theorists. But that was one of the episodes that I replay in my

mind over and over the things that we experience there because it is if you've never been to Montauk, New York, I would say just go just for the experience. It's super creepy. Yeah. Yeah. Another one that I was excited to hear about is Mothman for any John Keel fans out there. We know Mothman pretty well. So tell us a little about that. Did you know anything about the lore behind this beforehand? You know, I had only known about Mothman because of the man who directed it, directed my son in a commercial. So that was my only connection to it. I wasn't very well versed in it. And Mothman was very interesting. One, because of the geography and the culture of West Virginia, Ohio. When we went there, I'm sure most of you guys live in California, if you're

filming anywhere, people say, where's your permit, sir? People don't want you filming. People find it to be a pain in the butt. In West Virginia, everybody was so welcoming and they were so open. And it was interesting talking to everyday people and seeing this belief permeate the culture. It really permeates the culture. And you have people from the very old to the very young residents of this entire area who either know someone who had an experience or had an experience themselves. So that really blew me away. I never thought we would go into this area and talk to so many people with a direct connection. Yeah, I think you don't realize the impact these events have, not just on the individuals experiencing it,

but the community that grew up around this. It's the same with Roswell. I mean, when you go there, Denise, you know, it's a very small town. Like, no offense to Roswell, I love it, but there's not much going on other than this event and the military base is there. So you don't really realize

what kind of a cultural impact these things actually have. Mothmen, the Flatwoods monster, things like this. They permeate and they become bigger and they become bigger than sometimes the incident that actually occurred. And I think it's important to remember

that most of the Mothman-Lore centers around the collapse of the Silver Bridge, and you look at how many people, I mean, imagine, I stood at that spot, imagine you're in your car on a bridge and it starts to collapse, the fear, the terror. And so many people died in that, and people we talked to said,

my grandfather died, my cousin died. And this is very much a town that, yes, It does profit from mothman lore. I mean, let's address the elephant in the room. Of course it does. It's a very small town. But at the same time, this stemmed from a tragedy. And when we were there, it was just so sad when we talked to people and they would explain that, yes, this person died, that person died.

This person was maimed horribly. This person had such bad post-traumatic stress that they couldn't hold a job. They became homeless. It really made it real. So regardless of whether or not Mothman exists in any form. this bridge collapse and the appearance of Mothman that people believe they saw has impacted the community. Yeah. Yeah, it's, again, it's the history. We're also really thrilled that we got one of the last living survivors who saw Mothman in the show.

Okay. Yeah, so we're very excited. I'm looking forward to that. Yeah. She saw it, and she even describes it to our artist who is going to depict what she saw. Nice. Yeah. That's pretty cool.

Cool. I know we're going to do a little Q&A here, but I do want to wrap up Mysteries Dakota talking about our other investigation that we went on, and that was Area 51. Now, the government recently, within the past decade or so, finally acknowledged that this thing existed, even though we all knew it for so long. But, Jennifer, what did you think about Area 51? Ryan and I were in the car. I don't know if this will make the show, but we were in the car saying, we're rolling down the windows, if the government has any software to read our lips, we will not breach the barrier.

We are here just to see. We will not tell your secrets. We were just so scared that something was going to happen because a few months ago, somebody had been shot. Now he crossed the barrier and he had a cylindrical object in his hand, not too smart. And he was shot. So we were very, very careful, how far we went to the gate.

And we were very cognizant that there are cameras everywhere. Oh, yeah. And I mean, again, we had some weird stuff happen when we were in the car heading to the base. I'm not going to give that away. But there was absolutely no doubt in my mind. We were being surveilled within 10 miles of the gate. It's definitive proof, in my opinion, what happened there. So, yeah, we sort of tie in Area 51 to a lot of what's going on today. This modern Navy story that is broken with all these pilots coming forward, the A-Tip secret. Pentagon UFO program. And we talked a lot about Bob Lazard, the person who sort of put Area 51 on the map, along with George Knapp, the investigative journalist who broke Area 51 to begin with. And we found some really interesting similarities between what Bob Lazzar had to say in terms of the technology this man supposedly worked on when he was employed at Area 51, and this gimbal video, if any of you have seen this video, of this cylindrical crash. that seemed to rotate in midair and shoot off.

It was strikingly similar to this testimony back in the 80s by Bob Lazar. So Alejandra, I know you've looked a lot into this too, sort of wrapping up Area 51 for us. What do you make of all this, man? What's going on today? Are we living in a new era of UFO disclosure? And how does that match what we were told 30-something years ago by Bob Lazare? Yeah, I think that Bob Lazar's story is really hard.

to verify. I mean, it's one person with anecdotal information. I think that a lot of the lead investigators question, you know, is educational background. It's impossible to verify that. And so there are a lot of questions there. But what's really interesting, you know, talking about what's going on today with Area 51, is that two of the members of the two-the-stars team that Tongued along, the Rockstar, started that Louise Elizondo, the guy who ran the Pentagon program, this team is made up of two people who have worked at Area 51 and been there quite often. One of them used to be the Assistant Defense Secretary of Intelligence, Chris Mellon. The other one is a former executive with Lockheed Martin Skunk Works.

And Lockheed Martin Skunk Works is the organization that was tasked with finding the location for Area 51 and building Area 51 for the CIA. and now this guy, you know, who's one of the guys at Area 51 is working with Tom DeLong and these others. So they're the guys who would know if anything's there. They've spent a lot of time. But one of the things that I found really interesting about Area 51 is that, you know, it is a real base.

You know, Lockheed, CIA have all been involved. But as euphologists, you know, and we luckily lately have been finding this, we get vindicated. And there were a lot of people, once the news hit that the CIA admitted area 51 existed, you know, we got these phone calls, hey, Area 51 is real. No kidding, we've been telling you that for years.

So it was shocking to me. Some people speculate that they attach this idea of UFOs and aliens with Area 51 to keep people from realizing what goes on there. And if that is the case, it was very effective because just because of that relationship, people did not believe it even existed. Yeah, I think that's a really good way to sort of wrap up

what is going to be investigated on Mysteries Decoded. But we did want to leave a little time if anyone had any questions about the process of our investigation, what we uncovered, stuff like that. Yeah, please, I think there's a mic on either end here if you could go up there. We've got about 15 minutes, so if you could just make the questions a little short and concise, we would really appreciate it.

I don't think they do have mics, actually. Oh, there they're not. Yeah. There you go. So came in a little late, so maybe you already covered this, but I had a question about the analysis of the metal from Roswell, or allegedly from Roswell from the crash. Did you put it under isotope analysis, isotope ratios? Yes, we did. And to be honest, we tested about five pieces of metal.

It was inconclusive, but we have more pieces we're hoping to test in the future. Although, if I could, this is one of the stories, luckily we got to break as early on, the hard part is there's several small little pieces and they're very tiny. And he can't say for certain, you know, every piece is something anomalous. And we have to look at several different pieces, which is difficult. Now, one of the early analysis he got on the isotopes, because that's very important. Essentially, you can look at the isotopes and determine if something was, you know, created here on the planet, essentially. And he did get from one lab a very strange result that said essentially that it wasn't made on the planet. It was within what's called an error range.

And he got a hold of them and said, you know, it looks like in the error range. So do you think you made a mistake? And they said, we do not make mistakes like that. It is way off on the out there. The lab itself was doubtful that that was a mistake. Now that experiment has not been able to be repeated. they attempted to, and unfortunately they didn't get the same results. But one thing that Frank likes to make a point of is in the analysis done in the show,

those who are metallurgists and they were not able to determine that the metal was something anomalous, but they did receive some chemicals that were part of the analysis that weren't able to be investigated. So there's still some possibility that something mysterious could be found. Right, yeah, it's still open. and there's still so many tests that we could do. Again, this was just a metal test. And honestly, I hope that Frank holds on to at least a few of the pieces because who knows where technology will be in 10, 20, 30, 40, 50 years.

Yes, and Frank's well aware that, you know, with a lot of these pieces, they unfortunately have to be destroyed in order to be tested. So Frank is a very careful, responsible scientist. He's got pieces of this stuff locked away that nobody knows about, which is very smart. in my opinion. And he's still looking for more. He's still looking at him. He's still out there all the time. Yeah, I participated. This was weird, too, if you don't mind me sharing this story

where we got a hold of this very prominent USGS scientist who wanted to get involved and help him do research. We got that material sent to a lab that was very prestigious, a university, and I can't give the details. But it broke down because when that university he opened up the box, the materials were gone. And I told Frank, do not mail those. You have to go hand-deliver them. And they talked them into, you know, the logistics just wasn't going to work for him to hand-deliver them. But of course, when that lab got this material open the box, they thought, oh, Frank's a jokester. This is all, we shouldn't have done this goofy UFO thing in the beginning. He was upset because he thought they stole the material or lost it. But it was

still a mystery. We never found out where that material went. Yeah, and I think Frank learned from that, so he handed them to me, and I handed them to the metallurgist to make sure nothing like that happened again. Yes. Thank you for your question. Thank you. Yeah, let's go right here

if we could. The question is for Jennifer. When you went to spend the night at Lizzie Borden's house, did you, I've been there and everything. I was offered to spend the night also, but I declined. Smart. Very smart.

Did you make it to Maplecroft? We did. We did. So Maplecroft, for those of you who aren't aware, that is the house that Lizzie, after her parents were murdered, she wanted to go by Lisbeth. So it was the house that Lisbeth Borden bought with her inheritance. Exactly. And it's a large estate, and it's in a very ritsy part of town. And it's not open to the public, but we were actually able to go there. And it's quite lovely. Yeah, I was there in part of town.

River and we not only went to took the tour of her house, we went to Maple Crop and then we went to her grave site. We did too, yes. I got a picture of me standing over her grave site with an axe. Oh my God. I'll show it to you if you want to see it. Yes, please show me later. That is a morbid sense if you were serious. Let's go over. Anyone over here? Hi, how are you doing? Thank you guys for doing what you're doing. My question, there is a photo out there of a high-ranking military official, perhaps it's a general, he's kneeling down next to this balloon, supposed balloon, and he's holding the little letter. And what I understand, someone tried to zoom in on this and decipher what it is. One, do you know about it? And two, can you share

any contents that you might have found? Jennifer, that's all you. Yes, yes. So that's General Ramey. And what he's holding is referred to as the Ramey Memoir. and we knew that it had been deciphered by other sources. We did not want to have that color our perception of it. So we went in and we had a forensic photo analyst who used to work for the FBI. He blew it up and we went through line by line. My issue with the Ramey memo is,

if this was in fact a weather balloon, why do you need a memo? Why do you need a general there? Why do you need a photo session? There's a lot of things about that memo that just don't make sense. Now it has not been definitively translated word for word or deciphered, I'll say, not translated, but deciphered word for word.

But there's enough on there that it's clear there's something else going on. Yeah. And I have to add to Denise's grandfather, he was brought in, taken out of the room, brought back in, and they laid the weather balloon out and he said, what the hell is this? He said, that's what you saw out there. And he said, no, it isn't. And he said, yes, it is. That's exactly what I heard.

He was briefed on what it really was, still had the letter in his hand, and then they laid out the balloon and did the photo up. Yep. That's what we did. You should watch the show. You can see it still on CWC, and you'll see the whole section. I think you'll enjoy it. There is another gentleman in one of those photos to Colonel Du Bois, who was General Ramey's

right-hand man, and he has come out to some of the Roswell researchers and said, it was a cover-up. It was not a weather balloon. I was aware that what we took pictures of... of what are in those photos was not what was found in the desert. He says, I don't know what was found, but it wasn't what was in Ramey's office

during those pictures. Yeah. Gary brings up a good point. If you do want to watch the special, it's available for free to stream on the CWC.com. Whenever you'd like, please check it out. There's so much more we didn't talk about

that was in that. But I think we have time maybe for one or two more questions. So if we don't get to you guys, I do apologize. We'll be available after if you want to ask us some more questions. but yes, sir. Yes, I do.

My name is Ralph. I'm from the Atlantic City, New Jersey area. And I'd like to thank all of you for enlightening us on all these subjects. But my question is, do any of your episodes feature any information on the Kexburg, Pennsylvania, UFO incident? The Bell and all the other stuff

and not the ties to it and everything else? It's so funny that you bring that up. We don't specifically talk about Kexburg. Ryan and I are actually acquaintances with a filmmaker who's making a movie about Kexburg right now. And surprisingly, he had asked me to be in the film. And I said, this is getting too weird. Too many of my roles are crossing over into investigation.

So he's actually doing a film that's called Kexberg. But it's not in any of our... We're aware of it. We've looked into it, but it's not in any of our episodes. But if we get picked up for season two, that's definitely something I would love to look at. Thank you. That's a dream co-true for me.

Dream bucket list number three for me. Yeah. Yes, sir. Yeah, with the Roswell Crash, I know you mentioned that there was four, you needed four caskets, but is there any evidence or proof that any

of the greys or alien bodies were still alive? So the one, so the colonel, the retired colonel that I talked to whose source was the wife of the veterinarian, she said that when her husband

saw them, that one of them was still alive, which is why I said that he wanted it vivisected. After that, because he ran out, that's all that I've been able to tell, and that's a very, very credible source. He's a retired colonel now, and that woman is long since deceased. I haven't seen the show yet. Is that part in the show that... No, because... No, so what happened with that was I was working as an advisor for another show when I ran into him, and he said, how have you been? And I said, you know, I just shot this Roswell

show and he said, you should have talked to me because I went to New Mexico Military Institute, and that's when he told me and he gave me the woman's name. And I've looked up the woman. Her husband did, in fact, have a veterinary practice in Roswell at that time. So it is a legitimate source, but unfortunately they've both since passed on. And I also heard that, and I don't know if this is true or not, that the U.S. government is also working with the aliens actually at Area 51? Like, is any of that true?

I mean, I've heard stories through the years, but I don't know if it's fantasy or actually any based in any kind of reality. Right, right. I mean, there have been so many claims that there's these alien human hybridization programs going on, that the military is working in cahoots with the aliens. I'm a huge fan of the X-Files. It's probably my favorite show of all time. But it's science fiction. I'm not saying, I'm not discounting any of the claims that that is happening.

but to my knowledge, to the many military officials I've spoken with and governmental bodies, retired people I've spoken with, I haven't come across any evidence myself that that is happening. There's definitely some exotic stuff happening at Area 51, not a doubt in my mind. In terms of aliens working with humans, I think that's a whole other show. And I think, well, Ryan, you know, Ryan's an expert in this field. I have the advantage of being a veteran and talking to other veterans,

and people are more likely to open up to me as a fellow veteran if they're speaking off the record. I have spoken to many veterans, naval aviators, pilots from all branches. I've spoken to people who were a part of the incident on the USS Nimitz in 2004. And they tell me things off the record that I cannot go into, but I will say definitively nobody, none of my sources has ever said to me, yes, there are humans and aliens working in tandem at Area 51. That's never come up. And I've heard some pretty outlandish things. That has never

once come across my radar. Thank you. Guys, I do apologize. We did run out of time here. We're going to be available after if you want to ask us our questions. I know. I wish we could go a little longer. Want to do one more? One more. Oncore. Gary's a by. We're at a rock concert.

Okay. One more. Yes, sir. And thank you for that one more, Gary. I'm going to direct this to you. Gary's your best friend. Who knew? My name is Mick Flair, and ever since 1980, I've been interested in following the Billy Meyer story from Zurich, Switzerland. You did such a wonderful job, all of you, on Roswell, that I think this is a mystery that needs to be decoded by you.

Thank you so much. We'll learn more. Thank you so much for that. I want to thank all of our panelists. I want to thank all of you guys for coming. Please check out. Mysteries Decoded, August 13th, that premieres on the CW, and I know it's only just beginning. So, guys, thank you so much.

Thank you so much. This is produced by Third Kind Productions in association with the Entertainment One Podcast Network. To learn more, visit Entertainment Onepodcast.com.