Somewhere in the Skies - Thomas Jane: Hollywood, UFOs, and Advanced Alien Visitors

Episode Date: July 27, 2026

Ryan welcomes acclaimed actor, director, and author Thomas Jane. Best known for The Punisher, The Expanse, and several Stephen King film adaptations, Jane has also become a prominent voice in the UFO community, recently speaking at Contact in the Desert and authoring the upcoming book A Human's Guide to Advanced Visiting Aliens.Jane reflects on his career in Hollywood before diving into UFOs, government secrecy, advanced alien intelligence, and whether non-human visitors may have been here all along. A fascinating conversation you won't want to miss. Join us at ANOMACON on September 12th: http://www.anomacon.com Send us a voicemail: https://www.speakpipe.com/SomewhereSkiesPod Patreon: http://www.patreon.com/somewhereskies ByMeACoffee: http://www.buymeacoffee.com/UFxzyzHOaQ Substack: https://ryansprague.substack.com/ All socials and books: https://linktr.ee/somewhereskiespod Follow Suzanne on X: https://x.com/csuzannelanders Email: [e-mail] Opening theme song by Septembryo Closing song by Per Kiilstofte Copyright © 2026 Ryan Sprague. All rights reserved. #Hollywood #HollywoodAndUFOs #UFOs #UAP #ThomasJane #ThePunisher #StephenKing #Alien #Aliens Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hey y'all, it's Kelly Clarkson with Wayfair. Ever order furniture online and wonder what if? Like, what if it doesn't hold up? That sofa was four days old. You should have ordered from Wayfair. With Wayfair, there's no what if. Just style you love and quality you can trust. Visit Wayfair.com.

Wayfair, every style, every home. Hello, gentle listener. The Nocturnal Transmissions Podcast, your friendly provider of delightfully dark short horror fiction, has a new episode available. and it goes a little bit like this Stella would be in bed by the time he arrived

but he would lean over and kiss her sleeping cheek then he would undress and climb into bed beside her in the morning when she woke Stella would have no idea that it was a stranger who lay beside her in bed that it was in fact some thing from off the moors. The Nocturnal Transmissions Podcast.

Come get some. While our government's official position is not to speculate on this subject, we can choose to let our minds explore other possibilities. To use our imaginations. For if we consider that astro-scientists agree on one point, that the possibility of life elsewhere is not only quite probable, some field is there without a doubt. Let us suppose them that these objects are real space vehicles, extraterrestrial origin, and not an illusion of the mind. This is Somewhere in the Skies with Ryan Sprague. Welcome everyone back to Somewhere in the Skies, and a huge warm welcome to first time.

guest, Tom Jane, I can't believe you're on my show, man. This is like a dream come true. How are you doing? Right on. Yeah. I'm hanging in there. I'm hanging in there. Sunny Silver Lake, California. I love it, man. I love it. Well, hey, you know, some people are probably wondering why you're on a UFO podcast. And we will get to that for sure. You've been making some waves in the UFO research community. And a lot of the times when sort of celebrities get involved with this topic, people kind of say, oh, they're just, you know, they just got interested. They think they know everything about it. But then someone like you comes along with like 15 years of experience with this topic. It's very clear from the work I've seen you do on the UFO topic.

So I'm really excited to dig into that stuff. But I have to ask, as a playwright, as a screenwriter, as someone who's dipped my toes into the Hollywood world, can I ask you a few actor questions? Is that cool? Yeah, you got it. Shoot. Awesome, awesome. So, you know, I guess the easiest question, the most obvious would be, what got you into acting? What got you into the entertainment industry? You probably answered it a million times. But, yeah, how did that start?

I was a juvenile delinquent in high school and got involved with the arts program. I played football and then I also got involved with the art crowd. So I was this weird guy who would hang out with the jocks and the art nerds. And I started painting sets because that's what we did. We built and painted the sets for the high school play. And I would, you know, we'd always make fun of these idiots. would get up on stage. But I was always cutting up and, you know, playing practical jokes and stuff.

And then my friends thought it would be hilarious if I auditioned for the play, got a part. And then we had this elaborate scheme where we were going to destroy the set during the production, right? And it was, you know, but we needed an actor on stage to be able to pull it off. So we were really serious about this. And I auditioned and I did get the part in the play. And as rehearsals went on and as we were building the sets and stuff, and I, you know, oh my God, like, I got to get up on stage in front of people. Like, this is like serious.

So I started memorizing my lines and rehearsing by myself. And I came to the conclusion that, you know what, this is super fun and a challenge. And so I went to my carpenter buddies and my art guys painting the scenery. And I was like, guess what? we're not going to destroy this set. Abort, abort, that thing is off. And we went ahead and did the play. And it was sort of a miraculous experience for me.

I changed my life. And I suddenly knew what I wanted to do with myself. I think I was 14. That's so cool. Well, you know, time progressed. And, you know, you started doing films and television and all that stuff. And a lot of our viewers probably will know you as I do, mostly from things like you were, you played the Punisher. You played Mickey Mantle.

You've been in several Stephen King adaptations. Three of them. Yeah. Yeah, that's pretty awesome. But a project that really is near and dear to my heart and a lot of the sci-fi nerds out there obviously is probably the expanse. Not only you starring in this show, but you also had the opportunity. to direct it as well. So what was that experience like being on sort of the other side of the camera?

Well, they made me earn it. You know, I expressed a real desire to direct an episode. And because I love directing and I wanted to get into it. And I knew it would be a good experience. And also, you know, just a tick on my resume. So I could do more of that kind of thing. And because I was, you know, part of the reason how they got their financing in the first place, I was the first actor they brought on board to sort of green light the thing.

They said, all right, we owe you one so you can do it. But you got to shadow one of our directors, Brett Eisner, terrific guy, and really, really took me under his wing, you know, as far as television, the art and the craft and the politics of directing television. But they made me shadow this guy for a month. month. Wow. Like, and, and he had said, you know, he's like, you know, every now and then an actor will express a desire to direct. So we ask, you know, that you have to shadow the director. And usually they, they do that for about three days. And then they decide, you know what? This isn't really what I really want to do. And thanks very much. But I had showed up five days a week for four weeks. Put on my pants at five o'clock in the morning. Went out there and sat, you know, in the, chair next to the director and followed him around through all the production meetings and all the rehearsals and and all of the pre-production and then i was stuck around and and as he filmed the uh episodes

so you know they were kind of i'm probably hoping that i would have the same reaction that all the other actors did but now you know i was like all right so now what and they gave me an episode and I absolutely had a blast. I'm really proud of the episode. It's season five episode, oh, Jesus, three, I think.

So, I mean, every job I would imagine on a set has its own you know, actors respect what a director does, directors respect what an actor does, but what was that like? Like, when you're the director, you're kind of the head of everything. It's your vision, kind of going

into it. I had to have the final say in a lot of stuff. Was that a lot of pressure? I found that, you know, the directings have been around sets for so long that, and I'm a visual guy, have done graphic novels and always played around with a camera. So that part I knew my way around. I worked with a storyboard guy. And as far as like plotting the episode, it's like, that comes, I can do that in my sleep.

And it's like the most fun part. The other part is managing all the different personalities that. And also when I stepped into that role as an actor, which the great thing about the expanse is all the crew came back year after year because it was such a great environment. So when we would get greenlit for another season and start production, all the crew was a great crew. So they were always working on something else.

They would drop that, find themselves. of replacement and come up come over and and start the expanse with us so we had a core group of people that came back year after year so it was a really tight-knit group that i knew very well having done four seasons as an actor but stepping into the director role everyone has a slightly different reaction you know some people think you know it's vanity other people are jealous because they want to do that and you're doing the thing that they want to do We had to negotiate some of that, but with a good sense of humor and over preparation, you know, because there's always a little bit of a test, like, does this guy even know what the hell he's doing?

I mean, that's true every time you step in to a set, whether it's film or television, for sure. But, you know, people sort of want to kind of get a sense of whether or not they're wasting their time. And a lot of times you are. But there's a certain shift that happens when a crew realizes that they're not wasting their time, that this guy is passionate, that he, you know, seems to know what the hell he's talking about. Then people will go the extra mile for you. Right. And that's sort of the other thing. As a director, you want to be able to prove in a way.

You want to be able to demonstrate that you know what the hell you're doing. doing they have a specific vision that you can communicate that vision to the crew and to the actors and that they get on board with it they're like you know what that's a good idea let's do that yeah and if they don't think it's a good idea you want to create the freedom for someone to be able to you know even if they don't say it even if they just kind of cross their hands and you know kind of look look off in it in their eyes glaze over then you know okay I haven't sold these these folks. I haven't sold my DP on this shot. What's wrong with it? And then you can create that dialogue where, you know, hopefully you're doing a job where what comes out at the end of the day

is better than what you would have been able to come up with on your own. But to do that, you have to have a vision. You have to have a specific, usually, or at least from my point of view, an emotional vision of what you want to communicate. And there's always several different ways of getting that emotional point across. But you have to know where you want to make that point, how to get there, what the buildup is, what the climax is, and then what happens after that. And I find that if you can get people on board, then it becomes a celebratory process of discovery instead of sort of the work-a-day kind of grind that making movies can be if you're just

kind of going through the motions. Okay, so the Punisher is my fiance's all-time favorite comic book character. So again, she freaked out when she heard you were coming on. But we also are huge arrested development fans and our favorite episode is the one you were featured in. So could you briefly describe the experience

of being on that set, what that was like? Your character on that was just, That was a lot of fun. They asked me to do it. I think that I was the second actor that they asked, whoever they asked before me had passed. So they were happy to have me. And, you know, because it was kind of like the part of going on

and playing a version of yourself. I found those guys to be super bright. The set was very fun. It was full of creativity and ideas. And you just knew, you know, walking and you're like, okay, this is a good show where people are passionate about what they're doing. And they appreciate a good sense of humor. So we had a lot of fun.

Awesome. That's good to hear. Like, it's always good to hear that actors have good experiences, especially if it's just like a cameo or like one type of thing. And I just wanted my kids back. Thank you for that. That's going to be the clip that I put out there. So thank you, Tom. I appreciate that, buddy. Okay, last two actor questions before we get into what we're here to really talk about.

That's UFOs. Can you tell us a little bit about Renegade Entertainment, this company that you've created? So getting into the second half of my career, I started a production company. And we're, you know, you've been around for a while and sort of know how things run and definitely have something to contribute to the production side of things. So me and Courtney Penn, who's a terrific producer, who I have known from working on another project that we didn't get off the ground. But what we did do is form a really solid working relationship. So Courtney and I have been at this since right before the pandemic.

2019, geez, almost five years now. We've done several films. We've worked on Amazon Prime Tropo. So that's something that I also produced. I started and I also directed a couple of the episodes of Tropo, which I'm really proud of. Great Australian production crew, great story. The novel is called Crimson Lake. It's a series of, I think there's three of them right now by Candace Fox.

So any crime people out there, Candace cut her teeth with James Patterson. He likes to recruit young writers and do projects together. Candice is sort of her child star. I say that she's in her 30s, but she's full of ideas, wonderful novelist. So the Candice Fox Crimson Lake series is highly recommended anything by her. She's done a great job.

And so we had a lot of fun adapting, developing, and creating this season of Tropo. It's a detective thing. It's, you know, my partner is this crazy 25-year-old lady who just got out of prison for killing her best friend, and she decides she wants to start a detective agency. And I play this cop who's hiding out from the world because he was accused of this terrible crime and, you know, got splashed over the tabloid. So he, like, took off into the jungles of Australia.

Northern Australia is actually really tropical because it's closer to the equator. And there's alligators and giant spiders and snakes and it's just a nasty place to try to shoot a show. But it looks great. I call it jungle noir. I love it. I read this little jungle noir up there.

You birthed a new genre. I love it. I love it. So the Hollywood Disclose. Alliance. This is pretty cool as we get into UFOs. We've had Dave Foley on the show a few times. Yeah, I did a show with Dave. He's great. He's awesome. So what is this? Can you kind of give our audience a feel for what the Hollywood Disclosure Alliance is? Right. The HDA. We just started it in November last year. But what the idea is that every now we've we started with I think 12. Now we're up to

130 members. All of the, you know, really big names. And you've, you've, you know, are now members. And the idea is similar to something called the Science and Entertainment Exchange, which was started, I don't know, about a decade ago, but they said, you know what if we could inject a little bit more scientific realism into movies? So when people do stuff like Interstellar, they can get to Kip Thorne to help figure out, you know, what would the time dilation around a black hole and how that would really go down. And then as producers and writers, they'll change it all back and it'll all be Hollywood fantasy.

But at least you have an opportunity to be hooked up with a particular scientist from whatever field it is that you're telling a story about or need a piece of to inject into your story. And the hope was that when kids and people watch movies, they get a little bit of the flavor of the real science. behind a phenomenon. So the Hollywood Disclosure Alliance has done the same thing with uphology, with, you know, UFOs, alien intelligence, and Hollywood. So when people have a story, we're trying to sort of bring a little bit more realism into television and film. So we can hook you up with if you're a producer or writer, where you've got a story that you're working on. We can hook you up with people who really know their way around,

uphology, the history, the field, the state of the art of what people are thinking about today and hopefully inject a little bit more realism into the stories, which kind of sounds like an oxymoron, you know, when you talk most people still today,

when you're talking about UFOs and aliens, you're like, that is fantasy. you know but the truth that couldn't be further from the truth actually right so the world that we're really living in the actual world reality you know reality that's what my dad was I was such a kind of a daydreamer as a kid my dad used to slap his hands and go reality I'll never I'll never forget that But the reality of the situation is that we do live in a universe populated with advanced intelligences, and that some of these are visiting our planet.

That's the truth. That's reality. There's no debate about this. This is not a debate. This is if you're not, you know, you may have never been to the Amazonian rainforest and metapigmy. trust me that you know they exist like we know they exist we trust the people that have been there we've seen them on camera we we've watched some documentaries they're not actors they're real little pygmies that live in you know either in africa or in the uh amazonian rainforest

and just as i have never been to the amazonian rainforest but i know that there's tribes that live there. Well, you know, I may have never seen a UFO with my own eyes, but I know they exist. And I know that they are piloted by intelligent intelligences that aren't human. That kind of brings us up to Tom. You recently spoke at Contact in the Desert, an event I've taken part in a few years ago. And this is where a lot of big conversations happen out there and like Springs and whatnot. What was that experience like? What was that experience like? What was you gave like a lecture, a workshop? Like you were all in on this man.

What was that like? I did. I was very honored to be invited. And I showed up with bells on and I worked really hard on my 90 minute presentation. It was called When Worlds Collide. And I worked really hard on it. And I got a great response from the audience. So it was very gratifying.

But for me, it was great to be able to meet some of the people that I've been following. for several years now. You know, the people that I really admire, like Richard Dolan, like, you know, Paul Heineck, Steve Bassett, who's pretty much spearheading the disclosure movement. Linda Moulton Howe, you know, Avi Loeb phoned in at one time. We had, I think, 60 of some of the top UFO researchers down there and getting to be able to sort of talk to them and exchange ideas and sort of get the lay of the land. It's a way of, because apparently this particular,

I've never been to another one, but this particular UFO conference is designed to kind of be able to put you in close contact with these folks. I had a fantastic time. It's a great show. Apparently, it's the best UFO Congress in the United States, at least on the West Coast. It was a terrific time.

It's so good to hear. like that communal sort of process. Like, you're right. A lot of the times you go to, you know, whatever, comic book conventions or even a lot of these UFO conferences, it is very like, you are the audience, they are the speaker, they're right, you are the one learning. But it's going to know that like everyone can kind of be on the same page and an equal footing there.

What did you talk about, if I may ask? So you might notice I'm calling these modern things seen in the sky UFO, call them whatever you like UFO, UAP, you do you, man. I'll stick with UFO. Why? To preserve the lineage of the pioneers of uphology that came before us, I ask you to Jay Allen Heinex study, UAP, Stanton Friedman, Frank Edwards, Donald Kehoe, Dr. James MacDonald, Amy Michelle, Jacques Valet, Wendell Stevens, Bob Dean, Jim and Coral Lorenzen,

Leonard Stringfield, I mean, so many. And that's not even mentioning the abduction researchers. Anne Druffle, who remembers her, John Carpenter, Barbara Lamb, Raymond Fowler, Hopkins, Mac, Jacobs, I mean, the list goes on and on. So out there they can argue whether UAP or Russia or Chinese, we know what they are, thanks to the people who came before us.

Now we want to know why. We want to know who are they? We want to know why they've been here for 80 years. Why are they so elusive? Could aliens help us to learn to survive what Carl Sagan called our technological adolescence and become a sustainable civilization? Are they here to help us or hurt us or something else? Why do aliens want us to know they're here?

We have some new clues, I think, to some of these. fundamental questions about aliens. So I think it's time to start exploring the hard problems of uphology. My interest, you know, I wrote a book that we're working on for several years. It's called a human's guide to visiting aliens. And my interest lies, you know, we're limited in sort of how much we can actually learn about aliens because that I have a huge interest in what is that, what is an advanced alien society? What is, what is an advanced alien society? What is their technology like, how do they run their civilization? What are their goals? You know, as a civilization,

do they have any? Are they like us? Because we're pretty much a rudderless society with no real overarching goal except for making money, right? Which is a complete sham and that's falling apart and it's not working for us. And it's not going to work for us. You know, we can see the end of that train. Whatever we're doing out here, what we're doing is making trash. We're really good. I mean, if you go to these trash piles, they are massive. This is really one of the biggest human constructions, if not the biggest, besides roads, is trash. I think there's an island the size of Texas of trash in the Pacific Ocean. And that's just a fraction of the trash that we make ends up in the ocean. So we're trash people living on a trash planet.

And I don't mean to denigrate the beautiful things that we do. And we have wonderful life experiences. We certainly do. And the personal sort of experience of being a human being is very rewarding and a lot to learn. And incredible. But as a society, we can tell that we're running into a dead end. So the question is, you know, what I don't think is that aliens are going to come down here and hand us some, you know, free energy machines because we just figure out how to

blow shit up with it. But I also think that they have, just by their presence on the planet, have allowed us to start asking bigger questions. So by studying alien intelligence, what little we know, we can learn, what we do learn is about ourselves, about what it means to be human, about what the universe it really is, you know, then you can get into consciousness, you can get into evolution, right? Because if humanoid aliens are running around on our planet and they're presumably from other planets, then what does that tell us about evolution? We don't know, you know, because there's a couple of different explanations for humanoid aliens. One of them is that their avatars, their created entities, their extraterrestrial biological organisms that have been

manufactured using genes found on this planet in order to do work on this planet. But my feeling is, and it's just a sense, is that the aliens that are creating these biological organisms very well may be humanoid themselves. And I think that we've also met some people on this planet have met aliens that are, you know, actual sort of genuine organisms. If you can, if that's a, if that's a concept that we can get behind, what it does is open up some fascinating avenues that we can pursue in order to better our, understand the universe that we live in and ourselves and thereby create a world that may be sustainable and actually give us a shot at becoming an advanced civilization ourselves one day, you know, because obviously we're at a bottleneck right now. There's several

bottlenecks that societies go through that may or may not kill off that civilization. And we're at one right now. It wouldn't surprise very many people if we said we have a, we've, we've got 50 years left or 100 years left, you know, to sort of figure this out. We're at sort of a crisis point. And I think that whether it's by design or not, by taking alien visitation seriously, we can bootstrap our way out of this mess. Hello, this is Ryan Sprague, the host of Summer in the Skies. If you're enjoying our podcast, our live streams, and our videos, and you'd like to support the show, there are several ways to help while unlocking exclusive perks.

Join our Patreon community for early access to episodes, priority guest questions, exclusive articles, bonus content, and access to a growing community of fellow UFO enthusiasts. You can also subscribe to someone in the sky's premium on Apple Podcasts. for ad-free listening, early access, and exclusive premium content. If you're watching on YouTube, consider becoming a channel member to unlock bonus content, members-only posts, batches, and so much more. No matter how you choose to support somewhere in the skies, your contribution directly helps fund our research, our production, travel, interviews, and the continued growth of everything we do here.

So, to learn more, check the links in the show notes or the video, description. And real talk here, guys, thank you for listening and supporting us for almost 10 years. And thank you for supporting independent content. And I hope you'll continue to join me somewhere in the skies. I think everyone can sort of feel it, you know, that we're on the brink of something when it comes to our own planet. And when it comes to possible, like, contact with something that might not be from here or, or, or, right. Or from a different time even. You've got the whole aliens or us from the future.

I did talk about that in Worlds Collide. And my understanding now, and of course it evolves, my understanding now is not what it was a year ago, is not what it was two years ago. But my understanding right now, and I love to hear what I think about this a year from now, but I think that there's a reason, why visiting aliens have made them, see, the major question is for me, not that, you know, aliens exist,

but why do they want us to know that they're here? Because they certainly have the technology to hide themselves completely and may have done so in the past. But these stories about UFOs and alien contact and alien encounters, they're numbering in the thousands, the hundreds of thousands, the millions over time. And that can only mean that they want us to know that they're here. So why? Why do they want us to know they're here? And why do they want us to know that they are here now? Are those, Tom, are those questions you're still, I mean, I'm sure they are still asking yourself. Or do you think you might have some ideas as to why they're here or why they make contact? Yeah.

Well, you have to go through when the phenomenon started, which is in the 40s. You know, we've got the, what is it, the Missouri crash in 41. And then you've got Roswell and 47. And the 47, it just explodes. Suddenly they're everywhere. And it becomes front page news. And I like to point out that our society was more openly talking about U.S. in 1952 than they are today.

So even though it feels like this great opening or awakening or relaxing of the secrecy has happened over the past four years, we're still not at the point where we were in 52. Military government were much more open about the phenomenon and what they didn't know in 52 than they are than they are today. So we haven't yet surpassed. So in other words, just a merry-go-round. Yeah. And whether we surpass that or not, then we can say, okay, now we're getting somewhere, you know.

But as far as, yeah, so 47, the atom bomb is the big sort of, you know, calling card that most of us say aliens are certainly attracted to. the great book, UFOs and nukes, highly recommend. Anybody check that out. And they have a long and storied relationship with our nuclear weapons. They also have a long and storied relationship with aliens communicating very little to humanity. But some of the things they do communicate, one of them is you're screwing up the planet. Thanks very much. Did you have to fly all this way just to tell us that? We know that. But we are. you know, and they're telling us that. So what does that mean? So I think that we are at an inflection point. That's why they're here. I think that maybe it's not so much nukes as it is the technology

that nuclear energy nuclear weapons represents. It's your playing around with reality at the atomic level. That is going to unlock vistas of new technologies that we're still exploring now and you get into nanotechnology, you get into quantum mechanics. I mean, we're really starting to play with a fabric of reality. And that potentially makes us dangerous. So I think that part of the reason they're here is to monitor us because we could acquire sort of too much technology too fast and make us dangerous. We're one scientific revolution away. And we've already done it, in my opinion, in secret programs, already cracked. gravity, you know, and we're doing that thanks to the craft that aliens have left behind.

That's not accidental. Aliens don't accidentally drop their trash off and go, well, that's okay. They'll never figure it out. Anyway, we're smart enough to figure stuff out. We might not be able to replicate their technology exactly because we don't have the tools that construct reality at the atomic level, the way I believe that alien technology is constructed. that, you know, 3D printing. Imagine a 3D printer that's building with quarks and atoms, you know, instead of sort of

aluminum, right? You look at concrete, you pour some concrete, you cut down some trees, you build a house, you know, if you dig in, it's very crude materials that we're still working with. Yeah. You know, but, you know, we are now learning quantum tunneling with this crazy thing. We're using quantum tunneling to store information in this incredible machine. So we're not that far away. And in secret, I think that Russia, America, maybe the French, China, most probably, that's probably a certainty.

Maybe the French have already built reverse engineered alien technology. You know that they're doing it. America is not the only place that they've left these craft behind. Right. They've been left. The Chinese are really tight-lipped. It's hard to get any information. But we do know that UFOs have crashed in Russia.

We do know that people are obviously trying to figure out how these things work. And they've, to some extent, it's allowed humans to think about physics in a new way, right? Aliens know this. You have to think, whatever we know, not only the aliens know, we know it, aliens want us to know it. There's no other explanation. They're okay with us knowing this stuff, right? So that, so they may have handed us technology that we can use ourselves to change our civilization, but the rest is up to us because that's been, as Dolan calls it, sequestered in a breakaway civilization, this technology, right? And why is that? I'll tell you why I think that is.

It's because the people who control the power structures of the world want to stay in power. And this technology represents a complete democratization of power, of technology, of the control of reality. And that's not okay. We're still living in medieval power structures here. We still live under kings, queens, knaves, slaves. That's us. That's our world. We've changed the names.

We've pretended that the slaves are free. We told them that they're free. We're not free. The hell were free. You know, it used to be chains. Now it's blockchain. That's what's tying us down. And the people who are in power, have been in power for a very long time.

And they want to keep it that way. So of course, they're going to keep that technology secret because it's a threat to the power structure of our world. So aliens have given us the opportunity to realize that we haven't figured everything about reality, that we don't need to fill up our rockets at Exxon to get to the moon, which is what we've been doing until now. We don't need to do that. So they've kind of given us the keys to the kingdom, but it's up to us to implement it. So the only thing that's missing from the equation today is spreading the word, you know,

of raising the consciousness of society to the point where metaphorically we rush the gates and open the warehouses and then democratize the information that, you know, aliens have, you know, left lying around in the desert. or in the mountains, you know. So obviously alien intelligence respects our civilization enough to allow, to give us the opportunity to figure these things out for ourselves. There's a good reason why they don't come down and land in the Walmart parking lot and start handing out, you know, free energy generators, right? There's a good reason for that. Because if we don't figure it out ourselves, we'll never.

own it, it'll always be handed down, right? So when things are handed down, then that automatically creates a sort of a subservient slash master relationship. And obviously, you know, it wouldn't be too difficult to do if aliens wanted to create that kind of relationship. But I think that, you know, the strongest civilization that would might eventually have something to offer the, um, cosmic ecology out there would be a civilization that's learned to do these things ourselves, you know? Yeah, absolutely. Well, I mean, that kind of brings us up to now, Tom.

I mean, you have things like David Grush swearing under oath that he knows or these craft are. He knows who is working on them. And he kind of wants this embargo, you know, kind of what you've been talking about. He wants these people who are in possession of this. technology to come clean. So do you buy what Grush has brought forward and all of the intelligence official stuff? What has been brought forward only reinforces and reiterates what we've already known. If you've studied the subject, if you've taken interest, if you've bothered to listen to people

who have had firsthand experiences with either technology or the aliens themselves, we know. So nothing that Grusha said is a surprise to any of us who have studied the subject. So it only reinforces what we already think we know. So it's great. What he's done is sort of created a mouthpiece. He's created a bullhorn to sort of project some of this information to a wider audience. But what hasn't been communicated is the seriousness of the stakes, you know, and we're building a movie or a character. The first question is, what are the stakes? It has to mean something, you know?

That's why Hollywood, like, it's always like, if we don't, if we don't stop this guy, the world will end. Like, can you get bigger stakes than that? How's that? You know, that's why the studios love that. You know, if these sharks get out, they're going to eat everything in the ocean and we'll all be dead in five years. Like, we have to stop this or the world is over.

Like, what are the stakes? And the stakes are world changing. The stakes are the difference between a collapsing civilization, chaos, and a continuation of sort of the robber barren society that we're all living in now, or freedom. you know, and hope and a new understanding, a Copernican revolution in our understanding of the universe of our place in it. So we haven't had a revolution this big since Copernicus, right? And they kept him, they kept that idea under wraps for, I forget how, like hundreds of years. They were able to keep that information sort of in the closet for a good many generations before it finally sort of took over and became the Copernican revolution. We're in a similar place today.

Okay. So the importance of when you dig in, you find that there is no other topic. This is the only topic. There is no other subject. This is the only subject. there is no other case. This is the only case. That's a quote from the verdict.

Well, I've got a couple listener questions. If you're willing to squeeze those in for me, I appreciate that. So our Patreon subscribers get priority to ask guest questions. So I'm going to start with them. Alex P on Patreon asks, The Expanse deals with colonization. And there has been talk of colonizing places like Mars. How far off do you think something like the expanse is?

And do you believe we should be colonizing other planets? When you ask Musk about aliens, he says, I see no evidence. And that's on point. That's on target for his colonization project, because the only reason to start to colonize other planets is the continuation of the human species. And if aliens exist and there's thousands of other civilizations out there. there, then it's not so important for the continuation of intelligence in the universe, whether or not humans survive. And indeed, it's not. Intelligence, beauty, appreciation of the universe,

science, all that will continue when the human race is gone. So it's not crucial to the survival of intelligence in the universe that human beings survive and thrive. But it is crucial. But it is crucial. to us. We'd like to continue. We would like to continue and create a new chapters and a new history in the evolution and be a part of the evolution of the universe in whatever form that takes. So it's very important to us. So it's important also that that Musk stays away from the topic of other alien intelligences out there. That's on point. We have bigger problems. on this planet right now. And the main problem is, and possibly one of the reasons,

if we are being sort of modulated, managed by an alien intelligence, one of the reasons for that could be that we don't know how to take care of this planet. So if we export our civilization to say some other world, say we discover anti-gravity, and by the way, once you unhook matter from, mass. That's interstellar travel because light travels at the speed of now. The distance, it's only from a human perspective that it takes 100,000 years for a photon to cross the Milky Way, right? From light's perspective, there is no time. So if you were able to create a craft that was massless, you would travel from your perspective in zero time. Once you turned on the

switch and then turned it off again. You're anywhere you want to be in the universe in zero time. A million years may have gone by on your home planet, but who gives a fuck about them? Honestly, you know, it's only us on Earth. We're like, oh, my God, I won't get to see. They will never come back. It's like, no shit. They're gone, you know?

I would take that deal in a heartbeat. Would you? Yeah. Someone offered me, yeah, go out and, you know, I'd want to say goodbye to some people, but hell yes, of course. I'm sure a lot of people would. So Rodrigo B on Patreon asks Tom, are there any other actors or celebrities you speak to about UFOs or that have had UFO sightings? Do you guys ever share stories when you're on sets or anything like that?

No, no. What do people think of your interest in the topic? I don't know because I've just, I wouldn't have, well, I wrote the book, so I do want people to read it. I think it has something to offer that other books don't. which is why I wrote it. So I want people to read it. So I knew that eventually I'd have to sort of start talking about this stuff. But if I had my way, I wouldn't, you know, this would be a private pursuit.

And I'm perfectly happy with that. A private pursuit for 15 years. So it's a transition. I don't know what other people think about it. I don't really care, you know. It's sort of like, you know, the priests who came, you know, to Copernicus and told them all about God. it's like, yeah, thanks, which is great. And there might be a God, but we're not the center.

You know, we're not in the center. And that's all he was saying. We're not the center of the universe. It's all he was saying, you know. People had a hard time with that for a long time. But now we can incorporate all of our religious and spiritual ideas into reality. And that's, by the way, where it lives. If spirituality lives in the universe, it lives in reality.

So it's us that needs to catch up to it. You know, which is the same thing, I think, the relationship between us and aliens. We need to go to it. It is obviously offering the opportunity for us to do that, but we need to take the steps toward alien intelligence. They are not going to, put it this way, if they do, you know, suddenly you start seeing UFOs hovering over every city. That's a really bad sign. I was just going to say that. Can't be a good thing.

Yeah. 100% I agree. So all things unexplained on Twitter asks, might we see you reprise your awesome version of the Punisher in any part of the MCU's universe or anything like that? I don't think so, but I'd love to direct something like that. I really have a soft spot for that kind of story. If anyone hasn't seen it,

I did a short film called Dirty Laundry on YouTube. So check that out if you want. want a little bit more, Frank Castle, from me. But I've always been looking for that. I love those stories that came out of the 70s, the anti-hero and all that. And I think that there's a pendulum, and I think that we might be swinging towards the anti-hero a little bit more today and over the next few years. So I would love to always got my ear to the ground for a good anti-hero story. Awesome. Hey, we're rooting for you. Michael H on Twitter asks, last listener question,

do you remember visiting Cape Girardo in Missouri to film Killshot? And do you know how significant Cape Girardo is in UFO history? I think you mentioned that crash earlier in our conversation. 1941. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. Yeah.

No, but I didn't know that at the time. Okay. At the time I was there filming with Mickey Rourke and Diane Lane, who's terrific, terrific lady. Mickey's great too. But no, I was absolutely oblivious to the significance at that time. And if I ever get a chance to go back, that's one thing I'd love to do is sort of hunt down, sort of where that happened or where people think that happened.

I think that would be a fun field trip. It would. Well, Michael H., he actually's added here. I'll give him a tour if he ever returns. So I'll put you guys in touch for sure, Tom. Last question before I let you go. I know you're a busy man. Where do you think this is all heading, Tom?

I mean, disclosure-wise. Is disclosure even a thing that you think will ever happen? Disclosure is not a thing. It threatens the power structures that control our world. They will fight it tooth and nail. But I do think that it's important enough that people on the inside, maybe in the Pentagon, maybe in the military, maybe even in some black projects, do realize that this is a world, that the stakes are the survival of the human species.

And so they are trying to open some doors, let the truth out. But the problem is what we're up against is the power structures that have controlled the world since the beginning of civilization, right? They don't want that to change, right? They like giving you the illusion of change. choice. You think you can, you're, you know, it's George Carlin, you know, you think you're voting for one. You like the puppet on the left. The puppet on the right. I like, wait, there's some guy. He's holding both puppets. That's the power structure, right? They're holding all the puppets. And this is a

serious threat. So the only way out is doing what we're doing right now. And that's why I'm doing this. You know, one more voice, you know, in the, in the, in the, in the, in the forest, in the desert of what we just we need all the voices that we can we need to start taking it seriously spreading the word slowly indoctrinating people getting them over whatever um psychological philosophical hump that they need to get over in order to try to sort open up to reality we've done this before as a society uh as i mentioned the copernican revolution this this can happen But it happens when, you know, it becomes self-evident, right? Like scientists think you're crazy and then they resist you.

And then at some point, usually after you're dead, they accept what your argument was as self-evident. You're like, we've always known that. That's where we need to get. And we can only do it with each other. Okay. We can't wait for daddy to open our Christmas presents for us. We have to do it. It's the only way. Yep. Tell your own shoes, kids. I love it. Tom, when can we expect a human's guide to advanced visiting aliens?

And where can we find what you're up to? I'm editing that book now. So I'm hoping to have that out by the end of the year. I've got a day job. So I'm consistently working on this thing. And I've almost got it finished. So you will see it. And check out to my new season of Tropo on Amazon. which drops, I think, July 5th or somewhere in that area after the 4th of July, new season at Tropo on Amazon. Awesome, man. I'm proud of, very proud of.

As you should be. I'm going to go check it out. Well, hey, man, we are so happy to have you in the UFO research community. I know it's taken a long time, but 15 years is nothing to shake a stick at. You've clearly done your homework. I'm so happy I got to talk to you. I hope it's not the last time. And I want to thank you, man, for coming on somewhere in the skies today.

Yeah, man. I get the book out. We're going to do this again. Please, please. I would love that. All right, Tom. Thank you. Thank you.

Thanks, everybody.