Song Exploder - Nathaniel Rateliff - And It's Still Alright

Episode Date: March 25, 2020

Nathaniel Rateliff is a singer and songwriter from Colorado. He’s released four solo albums, and two with his band, the Night Sweats. Those two Night Sweats albums were produced by Richard Swift, who passed away in 2018. In a statement, his family said that he "suffered from alcohol addiction, and it’s ultimately what took his life." Nathaniel Rateliff’s new solo album, And It’s Still Alright, was supposed to be produced by Richard Swift as well, but Richard died before they could work together again. In this episode, Nathaniel breaks down the title track, which was inspired by his own complicated relationship with alcohol, and by his friendship with Richard Swift. songexploder.net/nathaniel-rateliff

You're listening to Song Exploder, where musicians take apart their songs, and piece by piece, tell the story of how they were made. I'm Rishi Kesh Hirwe. A quick note that this episode contains explicit language and deals with some heavy subject matter, including alcoholism and death. Nathaniel Raitliff is a singer and songwriter from Colorado. He's released four solo albums and two with his band, The Night Sweats. Those two Night Sweat albums were produced by Richard Swift, who passed away in 2018. In a statement, his family said that he, quote, suffered from alcoholics. and it's ultimately what took his life."

Nathaniel Raitliff's new solo album, and It's Still All Right, was supposed to be produced by Richard Swift as well, but Richard died before they could work together again. In this episode, Nathaniel breaks down the title track, which was inspired in part by his own complicated relationship with alcohol and by his friendship with Richard Swift. I'll be damned if this old man don't start to counten his laws,

but it's still alright. I'm Nathaniel Riedliff. I was in a hotel room in Portland, Oregon. I had just flown in, and I got in early, and so I was just kind of taking advantage of having time to myself. I don't get that a lot. And so I was playing around with the chords, and then, yeah, it was kind of a simple progression,

but I was like, yeah, wait a second, I should probably record this. You're playing sort of mimics your emotion, or just like you're feeling that day. I was trying not to get bummed, and I thought, you know, working on something would keep me uplifted and keep me focused on trying to work. I was definitely thinking about Richard Swift, who I was going to make this record with.

Richard Swift was a musician in his own right and a great songwriter in his own right, but also a fantastic collaborator and producer. I met Richard years ago backstage at the borderline in London when I was opening up solo for Delta Spirit. I felt like I was kind of just treading water as a musician at the time. So I was just kind of overall discouraged. I had just finished playing, and he was the only one backstage.

We were just having to drink. He's like, hey, man, sounded good. I was like, thanks. And then I didn't really hear or see much of Richard for a while, you know. And then when I started the night sweats stuff, it was just demos that I was doing in my attic. I always loved to just do, like, kind of crappy garage band recordings. So I sent him like two or three. And just kind of out of the blue, he gave me a call.

Or he texted me and was like, man, I really dig this. And then my A&R guy kind of came back to me and was like, would you consider Richard Swift as a producer for this record for the Night Sweats? And I was like, yeah, I've already been talking to him. So it kind of just happened naturally. And we did the first night sweats record. That album includes this track, SOB, which became a breakout hit. The song, went platinum and the album went gold. And then we did the second full length. And then it also talked about doing this record,

which I was really hoping to do, you know, you always felt good around Richard. When he left the room, you know, it's like, oh, the good times just left the room, I guess, you know. For a lot of friends and musicians, they felt Richard's loss as something pretty devastating. And also at the time, you know, I was going through a lot of stuff personally.

Personally, my marriage of almost 10 years was falling apart, and it led to a divorce. And I don't know, I just ended up having a lot of stuff I wanted to say as I went through all that, and then, you know, Richard's passing as well kind of added to things that I wanted to talk about. It was so heavy on my heart. I couldn't, I couldn't not write about it.

The next variation of this recording is another voice memo, where it starts to have a little bit more shape and form to what the song ends up being in the end. that's the next day that I was still in Oregon. Close your eyes. I knew there was a lot of stuff that I wanted to say about he and I's journey together and like kind of the struggles that we shared. And so I wanted to be able to like tap into those feelings that I think we had in common together.

It ain't all right, you keep spinning out ahead, which I was like referencing Richard, like he kept spinning out. In the same way I would do sometimes, it's like you're holding it together and then you like fall back into the same bad routine or ideas of yourself or habits or whatever, you know. We talked a lot of both about being sober. The second record we did with the night sweats was very drunk, excessively so. Like I think our first day was like we went to the bar and then came back and then started tracking. There's this energy that happens when there's a lot of, you know, there's like eight of us

in the room and Richard so you have this feeling amongst each other and you just keep like pushing and that pushing also has to be like well let's keep drinking tequila street you know like it was exciting and fun at that time but i didn't know how much it would contribute to my own personal hardship and even richards you know i went to richard's studio to start making this record in march of 2019 just after st patrick's day he was based in cottage grove oregon which is just south of Eugene. And, you know, the spirit of Richard is still there. Nathaniel met his bandmates Patrick Meese and James Barone at Richard's studio, National Freedom. Patrick Meese is a drummer for the night sweats. And James Barone is a longtime friend.

And actually, when I'd gotten, like, divorced, I was just kind of homeless and, like, moved into Pat's basement. So him and Pat and I are all living together at the time where we were making this record. When I, you know, first talked with him. Patrick and James. We had all worked with Swift, so, you know, felt confident in our abilities. And also, you know, he kind of, like, trained us, really. You know, he was, like, always eager to show us what he was doing.

So we were definitely trying to make it sound like he was there with us. After working with Richard on the first record, I really fell in love with the way he made things sound, with just kind of letting mistakes be in the takes and not editing them out. Not being perfect, add some humanity to. of it, you know. It makes the recording process so simple. I play the song, sometimes just once,

and Richard would be like, all right, man, that's great. What else do you have? So for most of this record, I recorded it in a couple of takes. I'll be damned if this old man don't start to count on his laws, but it's still all right. The initial take was with a steel string. I have this like older Gibson LG. that I really love and I write on it a lot and record with it.

And then I usually end up adding another guitar. It just kind of needed an extra flourish in the beginning. And I've had this fucking electric 12 string laying around forever. And sometimes you're like, oh man, this thing is an easy answer for everything. And it never ends up on anything. But every once in a while, you're like, yeah, that's exactly what it needed. So I'm a horrible pedal steel player. So we had a buddy come in and do just like really subtle things.

And then Daniel Kramer is actually playing organ on it as well. Sometimes I'll sit down and start writing lines that I just sort of like spit out. But then even as the words come out and I'm writing them down on the paper, it's like kind of a surprise. It feels like you're allowing yourself to be vulnerable to another voice that's different than your own. All the lines, it ain't so funny now, say, Time's a heart to get this far, but it ain't the way that you want.

Counting all the lines is actually like a reference to just like counting the lines in your face. But then also it ain't so funny now is kind of talking slightly a reference to drinking. And that's obviously a reference to Richard and a bunch of the other things was happening at the time. When I was first making the second night sweats record, my marriage was really falling apart. And I was also drinking far too much. Even as the night sweats, everything we'd do is just, I think people think of us as a party band. Our first big song, SOB, became sort of this like anthem for people who drink when it was really like, I wrote it about having delirium tremors.

You know, I was having like hallucinations while I was deep. detoxing. And I was young then, too. I was probably only like, man, 30, 31. But I just thought that was the kind of thing that happened to, like, old men. I'm surprised I made it. You know, I was... So we jumped right back into this tour, you know,

and then kind of just, like, eating whatever comes your way, whatever drugs you can fill your head with, you know, and kind of spinning out of control. And it's a little hazy to remember. But at the end of all that, I was supposed to go right out of that tour, right into the studio with Swift. And I was just like, I can't, I am falling apart. So I did. I just, like, pushed it back, our sessions back by about two weeks.

And I went to Tucson, Arizona to this, like, sort of, like, retreat. And I just made a decision not to drink. And then started talking with Swift, and he's like, I am on the same boat, man. I've got to knock this off. So I was hopeful Swift and I We were excited about making a record But I knew he was having a bit of a hard time

But there's that kind of ups and downs thing And I think he You know, saw things the same way I did It's like, is there a way to You know, be sober at mind And still have an occasional good time Or, you know, some wine or whatever, you know But it's a very fine line, you know

I've worked really hard try to change my relationship with it. You know, I take long breaks. I've had, like, bouts where I won't drink at all, or, you know, be completely sober for, like, six months. But it's really hard. Drinking has its own darkness. It isn't like anything else, I feel like.

It was cold outside when I hit the ground, say, I could sleep here, get all the fear. It would take time to grow. It was cold outside when I hit the ground was like me talking about me fucking up. I refer back to a memory I have that no one else knows that I was like walking home years ago, drunk from a bar. And one of those things you do when you're really hammered

is to like only take the alleys home, which is really stupid. And I fell in the snow and I passed out. But I was at kind of a low point and I was like, well, it doesn't really matter if you get up. I remember laying in the snow. the ground, I'd be like, if you just fall asleep here, it's, you know, everything, you'll just be a memory to everyone. It won't. It'll all work out. You'll be safe. You know, all this horrible shit that you're feeling won't exist anymore, you know? Something kind of inside of me, like,

forced me to get up out of the snow. I don't know if that's just, like, sort of like, some other instinct that takes over that tries to keep you alive. Let's me playing guitar. I was trying to create a guitar solo that wouldn't sound like a guitar solo. I intentionally left the space there to have sort of a musical section. So I kind of turned it up pretty loud and it has no distortion or anything.

And then I roll the tone back on that. Then I did another take which sort of follows the same melody but then it sometimes competes with it so it's slightly dueling. But then it, you know, panned left to right kind of has this weird sound. we were trying to add flourishes to it to like to build and just create tension and we felt like it needed something going into that section you know the organ was there but it just needed something else and we had been trying for hours and jokingly I leaned into the juno and just went and we were like that's it keep that so it made it in the song so yeah and so the song kind of you know like I was just so excited and I was just so excited and I was just so excited and I was just so excited and

that I had finished it, like, you know, it's some tasks that have been on my mind for months. But then I just started to realize what I was talking about, and I was like, oh, man. You know, line by line, you're listening to it over and over again. It just continues to sink in, you know, and you're just like, fuck. You see, you learn a lot out there. How to scorch and burn. You only have to bury your friends. And then you find it gets worse.

Standing out on a ledge with no way to get down. You start praying for wings to grow. Oh, baby, just let go. There's a handful of lines in there that are definitely, you know, just feeling like you've arrived, you know, it's something you struggled for forever. And, you know, it's not what you thought it's going to be. It's not all it's cracked up to be.

It's not as easy as you thought it would be. With each hardship that you get over comes, another one. So how do you, how do you look at life? How do you measure some success in there without just measuring hardships? It's that question of like, man, I've worked so hard to get here and then it's just still so fucking hard, you know, and those like things that you feel personally, they never go away. So those things that were a whisper become overwhelming. That's kind of a greater reference. That's kind of a greater reference. to like somebody kind of calling you out on your shit and telling it you're like hey man like

you know you're only fucking yourself up by getting fucked up because it's just a waste of your time and this whole time in the dark the only thing that you have to show for is you're not doing anything but it's like but it's still all right you know like I keep trying to tell myself like I'm it's still going to be okay you know it's like there's a reason to get up off the ground and get out of the snow you know but it's still all right you know I wish I don't know if it would have helped Richard, but I sometimes think that if you would have had, you know, a way to talk about all this more openly,

that I don't know, maybe he would be here, maybe he would be different. But I feel like it's, you know, important to at least start a conversation with myself, you know. It's not always very fun. It's like training and drinking for running doesn't sound very fun, you know. But that is the reality of your life.

as you walked through it. But I do feel hopeful, and I just want there to be a more sense of hope. It's just dark times living in, it feels like to me. So I want to put something out there that accepts the things that look hopeless, and then, like, continuing to move forward and fighting our own struggles regardless of, you know,

circumstances surrounding us. You know, I have my own demons, but I really want to be around. You know, I want to be around for a long time. And now here's, and it's Still All Right by Nathaniel Raitliff in its entirety. All right, the hardness of my head. O's your eyes, we spin around, say, part time you could find out.

It ain't the way that you want. But it's still all right. A lady at night, you lay around wonder around. I'm old and not funny now, say, Time's a heart if you get this far, but it ain't the way that you warn I'll be damned if this old man don't start to counten his laws How to scorch and burn

You only have to bury your friends And then you find it gets worse Standing out on the left With no way to get down Start praying for wings to grow Maybe just let go Outside I'll say

I take time to grow Think about 20 an ounce Glass is clear But all this fear Starts a leaving a mark On your time in the dark Visit

Visit Visit Visit You'll also find a link to stream or buy this song Richard Swift was on an episode of Song Exploder With his band The Arcs

If you want to listen to that It's episode 55 from November 2015. I have a new album of my own coming out on April 24th. It's been about 15 years since I last put out a full length, and this is the first one that'll be out under my own name, Rishi Kesh Her Way. I started making Song Exploder when I was feeling lost in my own music career. And then for over a decade, I've gotten to have these incredible conversations

about the process of making music talking to other artists, and it made me completely rethink my relationship to music and my way of writing songs. and this album is the product of all of that. It features contributions from some of my favorite artists, including some folks that you may have heard on this podcast, like Iron and Wine, Kevin Morby, Vagabon, Fenlily, and the producer Phil Wine Rope. I'm going to be on tour playing in cities across the U.S. starting in April,

and I'm trying to bring the spirit of the podcast with me. So every show that I'm playing will begin with a conversation about the album with a different amazing guest moderator in each city, like Adam Scott, Samin Nasrat, Jason Manzuchas, Josh Molina, Minjin Lee, Ken Jennings, John Roderick, Austin Cleon, and more. They're all going to be my conversation partners on stage, and then I'll play with my band. The album is called In the Last Hour of Light, and the first couple songs are out now. You can listen to the music and get tickets for the shows on my website, rishikash.co. Or just go to songexploder.net slash live.

That's songexploder.net slash live. Thanks. Song Exploder is made by me and producer Christian Coons with production assistance from Olivia Wood and illustrations by Carlos Lerma. Song Exploder is a proud member of Radiotopia from PRX, a collective of independent creative podcasts. Learn more about all of our shows at Radiotopia.fm.

You can find Song Exploder on Twitter, Instagram, and Facebook at Song Exploder. My name is Rishi Kesh Hereway. Thanks for listening.