Sounds Like A Cult - The Cult of Dancing With The Stars

Episode Date: October 6, 2026

This week, Reese and Iman cha cha slide straight into the surprisingly culty world of Dancing With the Stars, where celebrities come for career rehab, pros become stars in their own right, and millions of viewers suddenly believe they are qualified to critique a Paso Doble from their couch. Joining them is pop culture commentator and So Bad It’s Good host Ryan Bailey (@sobaditsgoodwithryanbailey), who went from openly mocking the show to rearranging his schedule for the East Coast feed and contemplating DWTS merch. We get into the TikTok fueled voting wars, old fans versus new recruits, parasocial shipping, and fan favorites survival in the ultimate popularity contest. And a five, six, seven, eight... Subscribe to Sounds Like A Cult on Youtube!Follow us on IG @soundslikeacultpod, @amanda_montell, @reesaronii, @chelseaxcharles, @imanharirikia.  Pre-order Iman's new book, Once in a Timeline, here! Your pre-order helps make more books possible! Sounds Like A Cult is coming to you LIVE from The Elysian in LA on October 15th! Get tickets at soundslikeacult.com! Thank you to our sponsors! Get free shipping on your order and 365-day returns. Download the Quince app for app-exclusive offers, or go to https://Quince.com/slac Thanks to Article for sponsoring this podcast! Article is offering our listeners $50 off your first purchase of $100 or more. To claim, visit h⁠⁠⁠⁠ttps://www.article.com/discount/cult ⁠⁠⁠⁠and the discount will be automatically applied at checkout. If your glasses are overdue for a refresh, now is the time. Use code PODCAST15 for fifteen percent off your first order at ⁠bit.ly/3⁠⁠OdtU5X Download Whatnot today and get $20 off your first purchase  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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cult, are solely host opinions and quoted allegations. The content here should not be taken as indisputable fact. This podcast is for entertainment purposes only. Culties, I have been waiting for this. Thank you. I am calling voice noting from Phoenix, Arizona. And I think that the cultiest thing about dancing with the stars is, frankly, now the social media almost mandate that these folks have to follow. Like it becomes a cult following because of the voting element on the show. Obviously the performance matters a lot in terms of who's staying, but as we saw last year with Andy and this season now with Guillermo, fan favorites really do well on the show and the voting is a huge part of it. And right now with the social media culture

that we live in, these folks, it's like they're creating nonstop. I mean, as a fan, I'm not one scrolling on everyone's TikToks or Instagrams hoping to find the next real, but my algorithm is saturated with this stuff. They're just constantly on the clock, and it's not only culty for them to be inside of it, which there's a whole lot of things to unpack there in terms of nepotism allegations and relationships, and there's a whole can of worms there. But it's culty for the viewers as well on the entire show with this actually cult following of the celebs themselves, the pros themselves. It's kind of a commodification of dance in the biggest way that we see in

pop culture. So those are my two cents. Dance is very, very, very vulnerable. It's visceral. So it's important that we keep it safe and responsible. Thanks. This is Sounds Like a Colt, a show about the modern day cults we all follow. I'm your host, Reese Oliver, Sounds Like a Colts resident rhetoric scholar. And I'm Imondari Kia, author of female fantasy, the most famous girl in the world, and a hundred other girls. Every single week on this show, we discuss a different group or guru that puts the cult in culture

from dance moms to roller derby to try and answer the big question. This group sounds like a cult, but is it really? And if so, which of our cult categories does it fall into? A live your life,

watch your back, or a get the fuck out. Now, I don't know if any of you guys have noticed, but the show has been running for quite some time, you've covered a lot of different culty groups, and they come in a lot of different shapes and sizes. There are chilling ones that reshape your life and routines like tradwives and incels,

and then there are like the really low-stakes chill ones, like Plant Parenthood and Chick-Belay and Stanley Cubs, whatever. This week, I think we're going somewhere in the middle. We're learning us a little two-step, a little cha-cha, a little samba. Yes, that's right. We are dancing our way right into an episode about the cult of Dancing with the Stars. a show that somehow managed to bring Apple co-founder Steve Wozniak, Jackass's Steve O, rap legend Lil Kim, and Olympic gymnast Sean Johnson together on the same season. Do you watch this show? Are you a member of this cult?

No, I do not. I was grown up. My denomination of dance reality television was dance moms. Oh, I guess I was non-denominational, but does not into dancing with the stars because I like dance moms. and I watched a lot of So You Think You Can Dance. Oh, yes. The ancient text.

The scrolls. What about you? Dancing with the Stars? Honestly, I'm a new viewer. I watched this past season because it seemed to have a huge resurgence amongst Gen Z and within like online spaces. And I have the worst fomo. So I just had to know what everyone was talking about.

And it honestly was a really fun fandom to just kind of like audit. Do you think audit? I love that. Yeah. I feel kind of. Similarly, I kind of caught a ride on the social media side of things, but I didn't watch this season. So we're going to get into some history. Dancing with the Stars, you know what it is. It's a dance competition slash reality TV show.

Pretty low stakes, drama-free show, despite having four Jersey short cast members, having made an appearance thus far. The show premiered in 2005 and ended its 34th season in November 2025. Holy shit. It originally was on NBC, recently made the switch to Disney Plus, recession indicator. According to Newsweek, the show had a record 72 million votes in the latest finale. That's not viewers. That's people that are actively dialing on their phone and voting. Fucking crazy. Very likely, it'll be coming back for another season. Yeah, I don't see a world in which it's not. The latest winner is Robert Irwin, son of the late crocodile hunter, Steve Irwin, of course. Robert Irwin's story on the show is a pretty heartwarming storyline and he's part of a winning family.

His sister, Bindy, won the 21st season Star Power. Okay, genetic. But he was just a little, little kid, which is so sweet. That's a really touching and really awesome story to be able to tell. Like, I watched my sister when I was a kid and then I was like, I can do that too. And then I did it. I'm going to grow up to be just like you. The sister's like, fuck.

I always steal like thunder. Literally. As of season 34, there have been 408 stars and boy have they run the gamut. Actors, reality TV stars, politicians, washed up celebrities trying to make a comeback, looking at you in at LV. And recently a lot more social media celebrities. Hey, Mom Talk. This season had two members of Mom Talk, Miss Jen and Miss Whitney. I would like to give a shout out to Jen for doing this season like three weeks postpartum or something insane like that. True. Underrated. Funky. Wild. Whatever you have to say about Jen, I applaud for that. I actually did kind of tune in for the parts of the previous season that focused on Annadelvie because I had just published a book that was inspired in part by Annadelvie. And it came out on the same day that the the Dancing with the Stars season premiered. And I thought it was a sign from the gods when she showed up in her outfit in ankle monitor. And when she was asked, what did you take away from your experience on Dancing with the Stars?

And she looked deadpaned to camera and said, nothing. I was like, wow, couldn't have written it better myself. No, no. And that's what you come to Dancing with the Stars for. Chaos that isn't really chaotic. You come for all of your favorite Bachelor and Bachelorette franchise members that have won. or been in the finals, all of your housewives and your bravo liberties, all of these members and figures of cults that we've covered in the past, hella athletes, especially gymnasts and figure

skaters have done pretty well because, like, duh, they're dancing. So, amon, tell us how it works. So there's a cast of pro dancers who partner up with the stars. Most of them return every single season and have become celebrities in their own right. You know who we're talking about here. The judges have changed a little bit throughout the years, but there are people with dance. background. So former pro siblings, duo Derek and Julianne Huff, aren't on the dance floor anymore and help judge and host the show. How the show actually works is the pro dancer choreographs and teaches the star a dance every single week, which is unbelievable. And there are classic ballroom routines that they have to learn like the tango, the jive, and the waltz. They perform these dances

for the judges. They're scored one out of ten. And that score is then combined with votes from North American viewers. So the two couples with the lowest scores are named at the very end of the episode and then the lowest couple is eliminated. After more or less like 10 weeks of competition, the winning pair get a mirror ball trophy and all of the glory. Beautiful, simple, gorgeous, and it all sounds nice and squeaky clean and as we've discussed, it mostly is, but no cult is without scandal. Otherwise would we be talking about them? Meethinks not. Absolutely no. Can you tell us some of the controversies? I would love to.

So first we're gonna get into Dancing with the Stars as a tool of image rehabilitation. A lot of stars will turn to Dancing with the Stars as a mechanism of rebranding, hoping that the cult of DWTS will let them in and sometimes, sometimes they're let in. So for producers of the show, it's all about numbers. So they're obviously just wanting to get whoever the biggest names are gonna be on the show,

no matter what. So even if that means casting actual criminals, problematic people, whatever. Also, you're on reality TV. You need a villain that's just going to get you higher ratings and mobilize fans of different stars against each other. Also, something that's really attractive about this show, you can have different fandoms interacting. And there have been some truly terrible people on the show, like boxer Floyd Mayweather with a history of battery domestic violence. Celebrity Chef Palladine, who was fired from other jobs for saying several racial slurs was still able to get a job with dancing with the stars.

Former White House Press Secretary Sean Sicer tried to go from the cult of MAGA to the cult of Dancing with the Stars. and he did like pretty good and he made it to sixth place, probably with some help from Trump campaigning for him. And of course, Tiger Kings, Carol Baskin facing allegations of her former husband's disappearance was on the show. And as a mom just outlined for us, Froster Anna Delvey competed in season 33 of the show and was pretty much immediately booted because everyone was so upset she was on the show in the first place.

Not to mention the ankle monitor that she could not take off because she was literally on house arrest while doing it. The ankle that, she's like doing like foetes. It's like hitting her in. the ankle. Yeah, I never realized that Dancing with the Stars is kind of like the Avengers of Household Names. Oh yeah. And like I think similar to the Avengers, like how all of the stars of those go and all these super crazy like training regimens. Can you tell us a little bit about how these cast members prepare? Honestly, it's not easy to be on this show. And once people

are a part of it, they can be pretty intense about it. It is a competition show. So it makes sense why people get unbelievably engaged like right off the bat. But the level of training to compete, Pete. I mean, it is a lot. They spend hours every single day dancing and learning the choreography. They have to live in LA for the entire time they're filming. Ugh. Grooling. Oh, God. That's so hard. But sometimes, you know, they're isolated from their friends, their family back home. It can be like pretty all-consuming for the weeks that they're on the show. People have lost weight and suffered injuries while they're doing it. And it can also be quite the emotional roller coaster for those involved. According to the Cassie Marie on TikTok, stars will often talk about how the experience

did change their lives and they care so much about winning that mirror ball. Honestly, dare I say, it's giving theater kid energy. Except as a theater kid, there's not really anything, I mean, what, like the Tony? Is that the award you win at the end? I feel like, at least there's a tangible goal on an end point here. Yeah, absolutely. It's finite. It will end at a certain point. But there's an escape. But, you know, much. Like theater kids, there's lots of shipping going on, lots of canoodling, if you will. People on the show, they're spending a lot of time together. Sometimes they're performing with pro dancers, and things can seem pretty steamy.

Like, have you seen these ballroom performances? The hot and heavy folks. Shipping pairs or fellow stars is like a really common thing in the dancing with the stars fandom. And there are some actual relationships that have come from the show, mostly just between the pro dancers, but more often than not, people are just like hoping something will happen. And honestly, that gets really weird. Why are we shipping people oftentimes who are already in relationships with other celebrities, like Olympic gymnast, Stephen, the guy from the vault, the guy from the vault photos.

I'm not going to pronounce his last name. The cutti pituity. The kitty patooty. You guys know what I'm talking about. Him and his dancing partner, Riley Arnold, got asked about their onstage chemistry, like, a lot. And Stephen has a long-time girlfriend. Y'all, that's weird. That's not cool.

So for a lot of people, it seems like it's hard for fans to separate the active people dancing together from real life. That makes sense. And you know what has not improved that little facet of dance? with the stars, the TikTokification of the show. So on the one hand, TikTok has definitely helped the resurgence of dancing with the stars in the mainstream, but where TikTok goes, rabid fandoms are sure to follow. So in the show's latest season, fan of TikTokers Alex Earle said online that they were going to make tons of fake email addresses to cast more votes for their

fave. Some older fans of the show say it's turned into more of like a popularity follow contest rather than anything to do with the actual skill of the dancing competition. But to a certain extent, hasn't Dancing with the Star has always been a popularity contest? It's not dancing with the no, and also the audience vote is ultimately what determines who gets booted. But there were also some campaigns to kick off others that aren't so favorable in certain social media personalities like Mom Talks own Whitney Levitt. Relatedly, Whitney and partner Mark Ballas got the ire of online stands when they announced a social media giveaway during the season to fly out a fan for a taping of the show. The contest seems to have gotten quickly shut down by production,

probably because it wasn't their ticket to give away. But before it ended, fans were upset because they saw it as the pair trying to buy votes, according to Cosmo. I guess I get it. And that's just one of many voting controversies that have popped up around Dancing with the Stars. So the way the voting works is viewers, can vote for a few hours after each live showing East Coast time, as we've learned, up to 10 times with their email addresses or phone numbers. The official number of votes is never announced, which has led to some fandoms warring against each other or are politicking for votes pretty hard. There are always fights about someone staying on the show too long because of their fandom.

This season, it was comedian Andy Richter, who people thought outlasted some far better dancers, but, you know, that's a pretty common critique. Dance is a subjective art form. During season 11, Republican politician Sarah Palin's daughter was on the show. And despite not being a very good dancer, she made it to the top three. There isn't any evidence her mom's supporters were stuffing the ballot box, but like people were not happy with this and came to their own conclusions, clearly. There was one guy in Wisconsin who was so upset about Bristol success that he shot the TV. Wow, that's some dedication.

Someone I'd expect from someone real passionate about Sarah Palin. That's some cultiness. I haven't heard the name Bristol Palin in a long, long time. So yeah, obviously where there's smoke, there's fire. The cult of Dancing with the Stars is the manifestation of a bunch of other cults, reality TV, competition shows, all of these sports, a bunch of different culty avenues. Well, I am so excited to be able to talk about this with our special guest today. We're so thrilled to get into our interview. Here to join us is Ryan Bailey, who is a pop culture commentator, actor and host of So Bad It's Good with Ryan Bailey, where he has covered Dancing with the Stars pretty excellent.

extensively. Let's get into it. Dustin from Sacred Symbols here, you know when you're in the middle of a heavy recording session, editing a show, or just trying to get real work done on the go, and your laptop starts slowing down or burning up in your lap, it's the worst. So what does it actually feel like to switch over to a better laptop like the Dell XPS powered by Intel Core? For starters, it's built with a premium design that's incredibly thin and light, so it feels smooth, meaning far less weight on your shoulders when you're packing up for travel. Then you open it up and the responsive touchscreen makes scrolling, zooming, and swiping feel completely

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Hi, my name is Annabel. I'm calling in from Massachusetts. I think one of the cultiest things about dancing with the stars is that fans will ride or die for older male contestants, but not give the same grace to older female contestants or other contestants on the show. You'll often see comments online saying how cute and funny the older male contestants are, and they should stay because they're trying so hard. And this sometimes can result in contestants who are showing higher levels of progress, get eliminated before the older male contestants who are not showing us. much gross. Hi, this is Debbie Pierce from Seattle. And I think the most culty thing about dancing with

the stars is the fact that so many of the pros have either been Mormon or are Mormon currently, how many of them know each other from being Mormon and our family. So yeah, I think that's super culty. Ryan, welcome to Sounds Like a Colt. Could you introduce yourself to our listeners? Yeah, my name is Ryan Bailey. I host a podcast called So Bad It's Good, which comes. covers pop culture and reality TV. And I'm super excited to be a part of the cult. Awesome. Follow up question. What is your relationship to dancing with the stars? Okay, so this is going to sound crazy. But I always looked at dancing with the stars as very cult-like. And I kind of turned my nose up at it. You know, my parents used to watch it.

And then I would follow it online or if a Bravo Leopardy was on like Ariana Maddox after Scandival. I would tune in to support a Bravo Leopardy. But I really thought that is not my thing. And then this season, I was like, you know what? Let's cover this in pop culture and see what it's all about because you had a really kind of interesting cast that went into influencers and a little bit differently. So I started watching it. And I was making fun of it for the first two episodes.

And then by the third episode, I was fully in it. And then my fiance got in it. And then the obsession grew. And that just shows you how quick a cult-like mentality can grab you. And then every week, we found a way to get the East Coast feed because we're in the West Coast and we wanted to be able to vote. We wanted to be able to be on top of things. And then we started looking at, you know, the dance instructors, the host.

We got into the whole history of it all. And we've gone back now and studied older seasons. I mean, we are so in on next season. But I have not been more excited about a television show in a very long time. No, that's great. That's the cultish energy we want. We want you planning the induction of a birth around bringing the baby to the finale live. We need that.

We will give our child to dancing with the stars. That's basically what I'm saying. energy is honestly infectious, and it's so interesting to think about dancing with the stars evolving alongside pop culture. So as pop culture sort of changes shape, so does dancing with the stars and the discourse around it. Who do you think the cult leader of this group is? Do you think it's more so the stars or the pros? Before I watched this show, I would say the stars, but as I've gotten so deep in it, I would say the pros. It's like completely changed for me where I didn't even pay attention at all. And now I'm like, oh my God, the art of the dance. I need to learn to do

a Pasobleau. Those guys really know what's going on. So it really shifted for me halfway through the season where I'm like, wow, their stories are fascinating as well, because how many opportunities do dancers have in primetime television? That's interesting. And I think that is something super culty and that's something we see a lot with these more commercial cults. You know, it's kind of like the U.S. government. You have the president or like your cult leader that you show to the world. Like this is who's running the show. And then you have who's actually making the decision. You know, but I think that is definitely a show of something a little bit culty. And also, like, as a fan, that's a way that you can be like, oh, well, I'm in deep enough

that now I know not just about these flashy names that y'all are watching for, but I'm in it for the art, baby. I'm here. And that's when you know it's got you when you actually make that switch and then you dig into the history of it. And not having any sort of dancing background, you really feel almost elitist that you're learning a new art. You're learning a craft per se.

And then what's even scarier, for me, it always, like, I know when you're something's got me when I'm like, ooh, I need merch. I should get a t-shirt to show people that I love dancing with the star. That's how serious it got for me this season. So I almost feel like, you know, I need my fix right now. I need some sort of dancing in my life. And it's done for the season. Yeah, you need merch so that other members of the cult can identify you and say, one of us. And then you can talk about it and then it tied you over. One of us, exactly, yes. Okay, so just kind of off the bat, what do you think the cultiest thing about dancing with the stars is.

I mean, one of the things is that I think it gives the average viewer, somebody like me, that I feel like I can talk about a Paso DuBlais by the end, or that I even, once I start watching the performances by the end, I was like, no, no, no, Robert Irwin didn't extend his arm enough. You can see exactly, he didn't extend, he didn't do the jazz hands exactly correctly. Like, all of a sudden, I felt like I was an expert, and it puts you in the driver's seats where me, a schmuck that can barely, you know, hike a couple miles anymore, I'm the captain now.

It's putting me in the driver's seat. I think that's the cult-like thing. And the obsession, and I guess this kind of stands for America with the voting. You know, it's like, man, by the end of it, I think there was what, like, they were getting so many same-day votes that I was like, God, is this the future of American elections, just do a same-day vote with an 800 number that you can only vote 10 times? And then it was like, I was like, oh, my God, is there a stop-the-steel? They're not showing us the exact number of votes.

How can I trust this service that they're giving us the correct information? And then you understood. Yeah. And you have, by the way, now said Paso dople twice since joining us, Ryan? Do you want to tell us something about the language used in Dancing with the Sars? It's that insider lingo that only real cult members know about. Well, see, and I'm new. So I know the people that have been with this from the beginning are probably looking down on me.

But, you know, you have the announcer. It's like dancing the Pasadobles. We have Alex Earl. And they'll announce, like, if it's a five. ox trot or like a ballroom dancing style. And so you get all of these different dancing styles. And then there's like the 10. 10. You know, if they flash the card that says 10, that's like a big one. It brings the house down when you get triple tens in that room. But, you know, there's just a lot of verbiage that just goes along with dancing that I still am trying to get a hold of. And I'm also hearing a lot

about the voting and the interactive component as a very big part of the culty engagement of dancing with the stars. What, if any, other rituals or ritualistic behaviors are performed by your cult? Well, I mean, I think the voting is the main thing, but to your point earlier, is that social media is such a huge part of this. If you are not expousing your opinion online, and if you are not going ten toes down for your contestant, I mean, there was knock down bloody fights about Andy Richter this season. I mean, you all of a sudden had a huge fan base called the Fandies. And, I mean, What I noticed was old school dancing with the stars viewers were like, get Andy Richter out of there. He is disrespecting the art of dance.

And then you had me and my fiancee, and we love the story. We love the thought of an average guy, obviously very humorous, but an average guy giving it all, and you could tell that it meant something to him. And I thought that story was beautiful. Like he brought out his daughter and you got to meet her. And there were so many emotional moments, but you had to fight it out in the comment section. There's something for everyone, but whether that thing is love or hate, it's up to you to let the people know. Yeah. Wait, you talking about the new viewers versus the old viewers,

I'm wondering, an us versus them dichotomy thrives in most cults, but in this specific case with Dancing with the Stars, who do you think the us is and who do you think the them is? Well, I mean, normally you could say like production would be the them and us would be the fans, but I almost think this season brought in so many new viewers like myself that all of a sudden we're so new to this cult that we saw it in a different way than the people that had been with it for 34 seasons. So I noticed online that there was a lot of trash talk from the older viewers going, you newer viewers don't know what you're talking about. You got to keep out of this. You got to stop it. You don't understand. You got to get Andy Richter out of there. That is disrespectful. And you have not been here

long enough to be putting your opinions out this way. And I noticed that with a lot of people. It seemed to be like they wanted to keep this little jewel for themselves, even though it was already a huge show, but it was so personal to them. And I can understand why now. But at the same time, new viewers are what makes this show or a cult thrive. You need a new injection of, I guess, ritualistic blood. So that was something I noticed that it became fan versus fan by the end. Okay. And what is your take on this rift between the newer viewers and the longer time viewers?

Like a lot of people don't think it's really a good thing. obviously you're a new reviewer. So do you think it's like for the better? Or do you see yourself in five or ten years being like, you guys don't remember Whitney leave it in the number? Like, do you think that'll be you one day? I used to have to DVR three hours before the East Coast. No, I think, you know, as you get older with any kind of fandom,

you do turn into that person. I think there's unfortunately no stopping that. But I think what happens is that there's usually some kind of like equilibrium at some point, hopefully next season or the season after, where we realize we're all one. But the other thing that was weird about that was, and I hate to be political, is that I think what I found very charming about the show was that in the times that we live in, I feel very insane right now. You really could go to this show that

had like lights and music and sea level stars and people that knew a craft. And for an hour and a half to two hours, and I laugh at myself when I say this, you really could be swept away. There was just such a form of escapism, but it is funny because then we tend to make everything a war. So then you would fight it out over your favorite contestant of why this person deserves to go another week into this. And I found that I was like, God, even in the most charming of circumstances or even in the most escapism of venues, we will still find a way to argue with each other. Speaking of which, what were the most devastating effects of this cult? Do you think that there were more so devastating or positive impacts of your time as a cult member? Well, I lost touch with all my

family and friends. And no, no, no, no. I think for me personally, it was very positive. You know, I think there is something to be said, especially for me who watches so much television a week, to find something new that had already been so established and also something that I made fun of. I think a lesson that I learned later in life is the things that I turned my nose up at when I was younger, you know, to maybe not do that so much, to open yourself up a little bit more. So I found it really exciting to actually look forward to something and to really take an interest. in something that I've never been interested in before. There was this one guy, a new dance instructor, Yon.

And Yon, to me, he was one of our favorites. They found him on the Taylor Swift Erez tour. And my fiance, especially fell in love with him. You know, we would just watch then TikTok after TikTok because he would do all these Instagram lives and he was hysterical. But even him, he had to deal with hazing from the other dance pros on that show.

You know, there was all of this other stuff going on behind the scenes on podcasts where other dance pros were talking smack about Yon saying he doesn't have enough experience. But anyways, overall, it was so extremely positive where it was one of those things that, man, every week, we would come together and we'd be so excited to watch it. And then we started recapping it on my pod. And by the end, we were just so into it. I think there's a magic in that. I guess that really is like a cult.

Absolutely. And speaking of Yon, who I remember, it was huge news when he left the Ares Tour and joined Dancing with the Stars. Do you now have a dream casting for the next season of the show? In terms of pros or stars? Yes. Either. Both, please. Well, listen, I want Yon Back desperately.

I almost don't know if he's going to be too big by then. I don't know if Taylor's going to do another tour. But I would love Yon Back. Mark Ballas has been there for so long. And the history of him, it's so insane. And he had been injured and he came back. And like, he's won it now a couple times. He was paired up with Whitney Levitt from Secret Lives of Mormon Wives.

And I got to be such a fan that I even listened to Caller Daddy for the first time because Whitney Leavitt and Mark Ballas, they were there, and they got to perform their final dance that they didn't get to do because they weren't voted through. Mark Ballas is now on this season of the traitors. Well, and I saw that and Whitney Levitt is now the next Roxy Hart. Hello, Chicago on Broadway. Which is crazy. To your point, you know, Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, I did not love Whitney Levin on that show. And this gave me a whole different respect for them. Like, it really does change your perspective. Alex Earle was the same way. I really never gave Alex Earle much thought in terms of I knew she was an influencer. I wasn't in to get ready with me's.

But this, I saw how hard she worked and how good she was at it where I was like, man, I have such a different respect for her that after the show, when she went back to her normal content, I was like, the magic is gone. Bring it back. Let's get back to doing something, you know? But in terms of celebrities, I just think this is a show where you can rehab careers that have stalled out. I think this show got such high ratings, higher ratings than it has in a minute, that I think

publicists are probably beating down the door to get their clients on this show. We had Corey Feldman start off the season and he was cut immediately. He didn't take it seriously. But I mean, I'm friendly with Carney Wilson from Wilson Phillips. I think she would be great. I work with Jeff Lewis on the Jeff Lewis show. I think Jeff Lewis would be hysterical on that show. There are certain people that you want to see on there to see if they can push themselves. And there's a couple of them. You know, I think Jake Shane, another influencer who's like BFFs with Alex Earl, I think there's a chance Jake Shane will be on the cast next season. Oh, I'm tuning in. No, for real. I think he will be there. I just wonder, I mean, there's always a couple of athletes, and I'm not super into sports, but you've got your

athletes, you've got your pop singers. They had a singer from Fifth Harmony on this season. You have your 90s icons, your early aughts icons. They have Danielle Fischel from Boy Meets World this season. So really, it's a who's who. And even if I'm not excited about them, I found reasons to like them during the show. I am so excited to tell you about Zeni. Zeni is an online eyewear shop with prescription sunglasses, regular spectacles, and customizable lens options starting at under $30. If you have been listening to sounds like a cult for a while, you know that I am in love with my Zeni prescription sunglasses. I wear them every single day.

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33-inch display and an immersive 19 speaker AKG surround audio system. This city demands agility, and Optic delivers with precision to make every drive extraordinary. Let's take the Cadillac. Find out more at Cadillac Canada.ca. Luxury sales claim based on S&P Global Mobility, Canadian New Vehicle Total Registrations for calendar year 2025 for the Cadillac definition of luxury. This is Alec from Boston. I think the cultiest thing about dancing with the stars is the herd mentality of the fans and the voters. People will go on social media and mass vote for a really bad dancer just because they love them. or will agree to not vote for a really good dancer because there is some other beef or they want to cancel them.

My name is Ashley and I'm calling for Marilyn. I think the cultiest thing about dancing with the stars is the fan base. If you look at social media or Reddit, you will see that the fan base is not welcoming or kind to new viewers. Speaking of shows and scoring and how's that transition. That's a beautiful transition. We would love to play a game with you today. Please. Usually we call this game What's Caltier,

but we are doing a little Dancing with the Stars spin on it today. So today, in honor of what you said earlier, we are calling this game, 10, 10, 10. So it's pretty straightforward. We are going to give you the name of a cult we have covered on this show, and you have to give us a score from 1 to 10 of how culty you think it is. Okay, got it. Perfect. And 10 is the most culties.

Yes, 10 being the cultiest. Okay, I'll start us off. Bravo-holics. Oh, that's hard because I think you were going to go with a, like, a scare. I am a bravo-holic, but I got to say, for me personally, that's a 10. Like, it's an obsession, and it's ruined a lot of things in my life, but also giving me great, great joy. Self-awareness, we love it. Yeah.

What about Love Island? Ooh, I'm a little bit of an older demographic. For my demographic, I'm going to say a 7.5, but if I was 15 years younger, I would crank that up to a 9. Precisely. Okay. Dallas Cowboys cheerleaders. Oh, gosh, I enjoy the reality show, but I'm going 6.5. Fair enough.

America's next top model. That's an oldie, but a goody. Like, if it was on during the time, the score would be higher. But what we worry about with pop culture is that we're not keeping the torch alive for America's next top model. So at this point, sadly, I have to give it a five. You know, I think if it was on during its airing, I would have cranked that up to an eight. Oh, yeah. Tyra at her peak is an eight, for sure.

So many memes are still used about that. but I see the younger generation not realizing where those memes are from. We were rooting for you. We're all rooting for you. Yes. Exactly. Okay. The Duggers.

Okay. So the Duggers as a pop culture phenomenon, seven. But the Duggers as a family, as a cult themselves, a 10. Yes. Good answer. What about Reddit? Straight 10. I mean, 10's a cry.

10! Bruno Tavioli. Ten. 12. The Bachelor? Currently, I would unfortunately, rate at 7.5. Oof, Celebrity Bachelor, that's a strange world we're entering in, for sure.

What about wine moms? Wine moms. Oh, gosh. I think a seven. Enough said. Is that disappointing for you guys? No, no, that's good. That's good.

I like it. Nickelodeon. Well, Nickelodeon itself, I mean, I think was the right amount of pop culture where it didn't, I mean, cult-like, I would almost, the cult-like of whom am I thinking of, like, the Dan Schneiders of the world. That raised that cult to me to a real nine where there's still so much suspicion and mystery about what went on behind the scenes at Nickelodeon, but the Nickelodeon fan base for just the shows alone, I feel like that is that that's a great bunch of people that never fully scared me. A different kind of mom, dance moms. Are we talking the fans of dance moms

that watch it or the dance moms themselves? You can answer both. I mean, I think the fans of dance moms, it's going to be a 7.5, and I would say the fans are 7.5 as well. Okay. Swifties. Oh, man. That's 11. That's 11. That's a 13. More than Reddit. That's a 13. If you could harness the energy of the swifties, I mean, I got scared Donna Kelsey, Travis and Jason's mom was on the traders. And I think a lot of people were legitimately scared that if somebody did Donna Kelsey wrong, that Taylor would send the Swifties after them. And that's a real thought. That's like kind of funny, but it's a real thought nowadays. Taking the fun out of things, for sure. And I think they're right to be afraid. Like, I could totally. see that happening. Yeah, correct to feel fear. So I don't know what's going on, but I'm only asking you about moms. Hashtag mom talk. Oh, mom talk. I mean, gosh, that's so of the moments. And the parisocial relationship that TikTokers have with mom talk itself aside from the show, I mean, it really

is in that 9.5 to 10 range because, you know, you've seen Jesse this week. I don't know if you saw Jesse. She got an upper blef and a lower blef. And she like really, she put fat from her eyes into her face and she dissolved her filler and it's not going to look normal for six months and I think they're still filming. Like that's insane for potentially an audience to make you feel like you have to do all of that immediately. So I think there is such a weird parisocial thing happening with mom talk that the fans and the ladies themselves that it's one of the weirder reality shows I've ever seen. Okay. Two more here. Podcast hosts. Oh, sadly, that includes me. And there's a sickness. And I really do agree with a lot of people of we need to stop giving.

men microphones. I really do agree with that. I include myself in that, but I got into this like six years ago, and I'm part of the problem. Grandfathered in. Unfortunately. And finally, the groundlings. Did you know I did that? We do our research. We had a sneaky suspicion. Groundlings, okay, groundlings really is a 10, man. That is insane. There's such a dark network underneath there and all the classes are so competitive and it takes years to go through and you just keep paying more and more money for this shot. And I will tell you, you really do learn a craft, you learn how to write, you learn how to do basic improvisation. But the behind the scenes things, it's so dark and competitive.

I mean, it's like Bravo Lebrides and stuff. People are stabbing each other in the back all the time. They have, like, the alumni come in to judge your performance to see if you go to the next round. And it really was this version of a chorus line that made me stronger, but also it was one of the scariest bunch of years of my life. Wow. Okay. So it was trial by fire, but you feel now like you're fireproof. You made it through. Yeah. Oh, I'm definitely not fireproof, but my God, that actually did make me stronger. I was like preparing for like Scientology. I was preparing for like...

No, these are cults we've covered. These are our kind of cults. You didn't bring up Gwyneth Paltrow and Goup? Do you want to tell us? Would you like to do Goup? You know what? I think Goup was in a trajectory of being way more culty than it is now. I almost feel like Gwyneth Paltrow took her foot off the gas a little bit. I just read this great Gwyneth Paltrow biography by Amy O'Dell, and she took her foot off the gas, I feel. And I felt like if she had kept going where she was with the vagina candle and the Yoni egg,

it was really headed towards a 10. And for some reason, I don't feel that same energy anymore. Well, she just opened a goop lab in New York City. So we'll see if she plans to use that to carry out Colty Nefarious Steeds. Goop Lab, Goop Kitchen, what's next? No, I hear great things about Goop Kitchen. So do I. I hear wonderful things about Goop Kitchen.

We must check it out. All right, well, thank you so much for joining us, Ryan. If our listeners want to follow you and your cult, where can they do that? Well, I hope I didn't scare you ladies too much. Thank you for giving me this space to talk about a new love of mine. But it's called So Bad It's Good. We do so many episodes a week. We're covering the traders, Salt Lake City, Beverly Hills.

We do random general pop culture. We just covered the Golden Globes. but pretty much anything. So just pick and choose. We have interviews as well. We had Amanda Montel on. That was amazing. And we'll have a lot of Bravo Lebrides coming up.

But it's very silly, but at the same time, I think we make some points. So it's always there if anybody needs something to get them through the day or night. Perfect. Thank you. Incredible.

Thanks for joining us. Amon. Out of our three cult categories, live your life, a watch your back, or get the fuck out. What do you think the cult of the dancing with the stars is?

I think that this is a very obvious live your life. Dance your life away, baby. Yeah. Shimmy. It's good for society to come together over something that is not very harmful. It sounds like a lot of washed up celebrities have been getting their mojo back. And as long as no relatives of politicians are stuffing the ballot boxes, this gets an A-OK from me. Yeah, I think we just need to be a little more strategic picking our celebs.

And all shall be well. Why don't we make sure to do a deep dive into the background, to hire someone to do a third, check of all the social media accounts. Yes, please, bare minimum. Well, Coltys, that's our show. Thank you so much for listening. Join us next week for a new cult. And in the meantime, stay culty. But not too, Culties. Sounds like a cult was created by Amanda Montel and edited by Jordan Moore of the pod cabin. This episode was hosted by Reese Oliver and Amon Haririu Kia. This episode was produced by Reese Oliver. Our coordinator is Meg Farrell. Additional research for the this episode by Lexi Peary. Our managing producer is Katie Epperson. Our theme music is by Casey Cole.

If you enjoyed the show, we'd really appreciate it if you could leave it five stars on Spotify or Apple podcasts. It really helps the show a lot. And if you like this podcast, feel free to check out my book, Cultish, the Language of Fanaticism, which inspired the show. You might also enjoy my other books, The Age of Magical O overthinking, notes on Modern Irrationality, and Words Slut, a Feminist Guide to taking back the English language. Thanks as well to our Network Studio 70. And be sure to follow the Sounds Like a Cult cult cult on Instagram for all the discourse at Sounds Like a Cult pod or support us on Patreon to listen to the show ad-free at patreon.com slash sounds like a cult. What you want a vision? I was an Avenger, but I'm not a hero anymore. It's like I'm losing my...

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