Sounds Like A Cult - The Cult of Feet

Episode Date: July 20, 2021

A slightly NSFW episode of your favorite cult podcast comes courtesy of this week’s two special guests: the ever-so-charismatic podcaster/writer Gaby Dunn and actor/sex worker Bree Essrig, who both have experience with the “cult” of foot fetishists. Most of our episodes focus on seemingly harmless groups that might actually be more sinister than they appear, and this one’s all about a seemingly freaky, underground community that might actually be quite positive! After listening, be sure to follow Gaby and Bree on Instagram @gabyroad and @breeessrig, subscribe to Gaby’s pods Just Between Us & Bad With Money, and feel free to check out Bree on Only Fans :)

This is Sounds Like A Cult, a show about the modern day cults we all follow. I'm Issa Medina, a comedian and documentarian. And I'm Amanda Montell, an author and linguist. Every week here on the pod we pick a different fanatical fringe group from the zeitgeist. From Tony Robbins diehards to new age influencers to try and answer the big question. This group sounds like a cult, but is it really? Amanda, why did you want to do a foot fetish episode again? Well, I mean, I think all of the episodes we've done up until this point are groups

that seem really innocent but actually have a darker underbelly. The foot fetish community is a group that is kind of the opposite. It seems really deviant and secretive and underground on the outside, but actually might be more wholesome than that. Yeah, I feel like I always see foot fetish stuff on TikTok as like a joke. People are like, oh, that would be funny if you did this trend with your feet. And I'm like, aha, that's funny because it's a joke, right? But it's not a joke.

Our for you pages are very different. Mine's literally all cats. Yeah, mine is literally a mixture of everything, one thing will be like really fun and light-hearted and the other thing will be like, are you sad? Yeah, no, I have the are you sad videos too. If you've lived in this world for the last five years and don't have are you sad videos on your for you page, you are not paying attention. I mean, should we just go ahead and introduce our guests because the foot fetish community

is something that you and I didn't know anything about. But then when I overheard this other podcast episode, which we'll talk about in a second, I realized, oh, shit, this might be unexpectedly a good topic for us to do. Yeah. Okay. So I was listening to Gabby Dunn's podcast just between us, Gabby Dunn for those who dare not to know is a media presence journalist, podcast host, YouTuber. They had Brie Esrig on their podcast and Brie Esrig is a performer turned sex worker.

And they were talking about the foot fetish community. And I was like, oh, this seems like it could be something different to throw into the mix of sounds like a cult, because there are a lot of things about the foot fetish community that seem culty on the outside, but actually might go against what people might think. Awesome. I'm so pumped to talk to them. They're both just like hot and smart. What more could you want?

I love hot and smart. So up next, we're going to talk to Gabby Dunn and Brie Esrig. Gabby is an author, comedian, TV writer, podcaster, host of Just Between Us and Bad with Money. Brie is an actor, writer, model, and host of the Dirty Deets podcast. We talked with them all about the quote unquote cult of the foot fetish community. Then we played a quick game, super fun, stay tuned. Thank you both so much for doing this.

This is so fun. Thank you for having me. I'm a big fan of your work. Same. Oh gosh. Likewise. Do you guys want to introduce yourselves? Yes.

My name is Brie Esrig. I'm an actor, writer, host, and sex worker. Hi. I'm Gabby Dunn. I'm a writer and director and podcast person and all kinds of stuff. I've been on the internet doing all the internet things, including sex work, which I guess is just part of the having been on the internet for 15 years. Yeah.

Gabby does everything you both do, which makes the intros difficult and I admire your succinctness. Oh, thank you. I first kind of wanted to have a little conversation. How did you guys start talking about foot fetishes? Because Amanda came to me and was like, we have to do an episode on feet and I was like, what? Brie is more of an expert than I am.

Brie and I are like old friends and she brought me in on some sex work stuff, very kindly, and then we did foot night and foot stuff, whatever which Brie could tell you about. But I'm literally the sidekick. Everybody knows everything. Gabby was a quick learner, a true pro. Why does that not surprise me? I mean, obviously. First off is a foot fetish like the accepted terminology here.

Is it not foot kink? Because I know language in the kink community is a huge part of the culture and telling who's an insider and everything. So I want to make sure I'm getting it right. Yeah, foot fet. Foot fet. Yeah, foot fetish. I mean, it's the hashtag that is the most popular.

If you look on Instagram, you can see which fetish hashtags are used the most. Foot fetish, foot kink, foot job. It's not one that has gotten like a elevated name. It's not one where people are like, we need to make this palatable. They're like, you got it. We know what it is. Branding done. Oh, OK, OK.

Yeah, so it's not elevated enough that it could even be politically incorrect. It just is. Right. Exactly. How do you each get involved with the foot fetish world? The way I got involved with the foot fetish world was I was doing sketch comedy on YouTube and I started a foot cooking show. It was like, you know, a pun literally on BuzzFeed.

We call it BuzzFeed. They're tasty videos. We call it toasty. But it was just like literally the same exact format just with using feet like to chop limes and stuff. It was terrifying. I thought it was so funny and people were like, this is either really disgusting or, oh my god, this is the sexiest thing I've ever seen in my life.

And I was like, OK, so I do have good feet. Then I went through a breakup and I was like starting to explore a little bit of kink, BDSM fetish stuff. And I kind of just Google foot fetish events just to see what was out there. I didn't even think I could get paid to go to these events. I just thought, I don't know, I'd want to try it out and see if I'd like being worshiped. And I did. And you can get paid.

So that's how it got started. Just Google foot fetish events near you. They're everywhere. OK, that sounds amazing. I'll be right back. I had said that on my podcast with Bree. I thought it was going to be this underground thing. And then when I rolled up to parking for foot night, I was like, hi, I'm here for the where-do-I-park.

And he was like, foot fetish thing, it's over here. No, didn't care. I mean, I went into doing Snapchat sex work sort of being like, OK, this will be tits or whatever. And then Bree was sort of like, foot is the number one. The people love foot. If you're not paying for feet, I'm wearing socks. Yes.

Now I'll see, friends of mine will put stuff on Instagram that's like, oh, here's me just hanging out my bare feet thrown up in the background. And I just see money falling out of a window. I'm like that now too. Ever since I listened to that episode of Just Between Us, I literally joked about this when we got our little headshots taken for the podcast. I was like, we have to put on socks because feet are money. Yeah.

Or blur the feet. Blur the feet and say, for the uncensored version, DM me. That's genius. Ponsor us. The thing about Bree is she's a business woman. Always. First and foremost. First and foremost.

Yes. We love the entrepreneurial spirit. So I was shocked to learn, first of all, how common foot fetishes really are. Second, how robust this community surrounding foot fetishes is. Why we wanted to do this episode or why I really wanted to do this episode is because a lot of the episodes that we do focus on communities that seem really harmless, but actually have this kind of sinister underbelly. And I think this community is the opposite.

Like it seems really underground. It seems really devious, but actually it's kind of pure. For outsiders, could you give us a window into this foot fetish world? Can you talk maybe a little bit about the rituals, these bonding events, the online practices? It really seems like this whole invisible community and we'd love if you could kind of paint a picture of it for us. Well, everyone's there for something different.

It's a little bit surprising because if you think about foot fetish, you're just like, okay, men like to lick women's feet, but that's not always the case. Some people are there for the humiliation aspect. Some people are there for the trampling aspect of it. Some people just want you to boss them around and tell them what to do. And some people just get off on making you feel good. And it's not even about foot. It could just be like, I give great massages, everyone loves the way I rub feet, I'll rub

your shoulders if you want, like some people want you face down with just your feet, don't want to talk to you, don't want to look at you, they just want your feet. Some people want to look at you in the eyes. It's just so different. It depends on what they're looking for. There's so many deeper subcategories of the fetish itself. When you say people are there for all different kinds of reasons, what is there? At an event.

Literally, it's like an event hall like where someone the day before had a quinceanera. Like no joke. Absolutely. Also, what is trampling? The trampling is a different kind of foot fetish that involves you putting your full weight onto somebody's body and jumping up and down on them. Like their stomach, their face. Some people want you to break their nose with your feet.

What? So I know you talked a little bit about this on Gabby's podcast, but speculatively, where do you think the foot fetish derives from? Is it because your feet are always supposed to be hidden? Is it because they're phallic looking? What is it? I actually think it's because they're not hidden. Because a lot of the times, women, specifically mothers, you know, would put on heels or like

boys would watch their moms put on sexy shoes or something. I don't really know where it comes from. I don't think anyone quite knows the details of where that fetish comes from. But a lot of it starts in their formative years of watching their mom put on shoes and take off shoes. I also think it's just kind of innocent. It's like sexual in the sense that it's not something that's out all the time unless you're like wearing sandals or whatever.

You could see it on the street, but it's not necessarily as taboo as like a boob or a vagina. It's got a little bit of like playfulness to it or whatever. It's like a little bit like sweeter or something. Is the vibe. It's like what you were saying where it seems like feet, but then it's like mostly adorable. I agree with you on that, but I also just because there are so many different kinds of foot fetish, it's hard to really pinpoint where that comes from because the trampling guy, I know they have a foot fetish, but I think their fetish, I mean, it's a little bit deeper.

They work experience pain, even to the point of like bleeding or bruised or whatever. And I feel like that might come from a different part of their psyche. Does the foot have a nipple? Like what's the nipple of the foot? The soles. The soles? Yeah. People really like, especially like scrunched up soles because you know what you can show

your whole tit on Instagram, but you can't show your nipple. Yeah. Well, that's the most hidden, right? Because if you see a girl walking around on the street, you could see her toes. I feel like also it's a part of the body that you see when you're intimate with someone. So like if you're like dating someone or if you're with them all the time, they're like hanging out at home with their soles up or whatever. So to me, the idea of it was always like this perceived intimacy.

There's vulnerability there and people are attracted to spaces where you get to be vulnerable. In general, what do you think could be one of the cultiest things about the foot fetish community in both good and bad ways? It's a good question. I think it gets shamed a lot. Like that's the first joke that people make. They act like it's creepy or something. I feel like I hear so many just like boring straight girls be like, I need a foot fetish

and it's like, and they're talking as if he was a murderer. I'm like, what? I know. I guess I'll just have to sell foot picks online. Like I hate that. I hate that. I hate that. First of all, you should.

And second of all, it's always the people who are like literally half naked on Instagram who are like, I would never sell foot picks. I know. I'm like, okay girl, well, I guess you hate money. Yeah, it's so interesting because in my mind, when I like formulated that question, I was like, I want to hear the dirt on what's culty about the foot fetish community. But you're like, I actually know heteronormativity is the cult. And just because this is like an alternative sexual practice doesn't mean it's a cult.

Yeah, which I think is a pretty good metaphor for life in general. Just because this is freaky doesn't make it evil. Because non freaky things are actually evil. Well, it's a cult because I feel like they're all friends. I would compare it to a cult in a way where it's sort of almost like a religious experience. And I think the foot models are more of the cult leaders than the customers. Technically, you're worshiping somebody's body and that is kind of religious in a way, for sure.

Especially when you call someone like mistress, queen, goddess, it's definitely has a lot of that language too. Do you think that there is space for the power dynamics to get blurred? I think in any form of BDSM that happens, I think it really takes clear communication to establish the boundaries and the type of relationship that you want. And there's always going to be somebody who doesn't have as much experience or someone who takes advantage of the situation. But I think at the end of the day, it is just like, we need to really spell this out before

we start, we play the scene and then after the scene, we talk about the scene, what we liked and what we didn't like. Bree, who's like the big foot fetish only fan sex worker? Is there like a number one? No, actually, it's mostly celebrities who are unaware that they are even part of this community or on wiki feed. There are a lot of like models who are on Twitter who have a lot of followers that specifically will do foot jobs or stuff like that.

But I think a lot of porn stars and OF models, it's just part of the package. Like they'll do most other forms of sex work and foot stuff is just part of that. I know in the underground fetish communities, they're like foot stars, but I wouldn't say, I wouldn't really say there's like specific foot fetish porn stars per se. That's actually a really good sign because when a group doesn't have sort of like one unified charismatic leader with all the power, that is typically a good thing because then you can't have one person exploiting everyone else. Also something you said reminds me of a little analogy I make in my book, if I may, something

that I think people who are involved with kink and people who are involved with like alternative spirituality have in common is that they're perceived as being really deviant, but really they're just kind of like these nerds. Totally, they're just interested in experimenting in sort of like non mainstream, maybe not that cool corners of the human experience. Foot fetish folks are like sexual nerds and people who are interested in sort of like woo woo spiritual practices are spiritual nerds. But what both people need to have down pat is this consent element.

Like you need to be able to check in with your partner or your community at any point to make sure like, is this okay? What is this about? And if you can't do that, that might be a sign that you're in something more culty than you should be. That's all they wanted. I mean, Brie was making fun, but like what they wanted to talk about was horror movies and politics.

There's like niches, I feel like I really honed in on your geek girlfriend as like an experience. Yeah. Totally. Oh my God, that's so funny. They're like sexual nerds, but also just like straight up Star Trek nerds who want you to be their geeky girlfriend. You really are.

You're also giving them a girlfriend experience as part of the exchange if that's what they want. Like there are some men who just want to give you a foot massage and talk to you about their lives. So there is that element of like we're having this intimate exchange and it would be like we're in a relationship almost. It's nice. Just for that like brief period of sort of sacred time and then everybody goes back to

their real life. It is a misconception of the FFC that you think. Oh, I abbreviated that to FFC, but meant foot fetish community. I like it. I like it. I got it. I like that. What's a misconception of the FFC that you think is important to dispel?

That people are dirty and gross for liking feet. It's like we talked about, it's really wholesome, like there's really not a lot of like dirtiness to it or like pervertedness, which you know, as a fellow pervert, I feel like I can say I'm into like some freaky shit. And for the most part, foot stuff is not as freaky as most other BDSM stuff. Hands are feet. If you really think about it, literally worse, you touch everything with them and my feet are in socks.

My hands are not in gloves. Yeah. I also don't know if like this is entirely going to make sense, but I feel like I'm Colombian. I'm an immigrant and a lot of like immigrant families, you take your shoes off when you come into the house and your feet are like really clean. I mean, just in general at like BDSM stuff, sex party stuff, there's like Lysol spray and everything gets wiped down and it's good practice to like when you're done, wipe everything off.

If you were just like at a bar touching stuff, you would get dirtier. We're talking pre COVID too. Everything is getting wiped down, which hazel on your feet between each customer. This is like the cleanest you can possibly get. This is what I'm saying. It's like folks who are involved with kink typically just have like a much better understanding of like boundaries with one another's bodies and consent and asking questions. And I just think that's a very positive thing.

Okay. We have one more question and then we have our little game. Do you think that the FFC as we've called it, it sounds really legit too. It does. It sounds like a government body. Do you think that the FFC is a cult? And if so, out of our three cult categories, which are live your life, watch your back and get the fuck out, which one do you think it is?

Live your life. Live your life because you can get out of it at any time. I would say people who worship butts are more culty in a weird way. The only thing I could think of is that it could be addicting in the sense that then you're paying for a lot of foot picks and putting money into things as culty. But generally, no, I think it's just a special interest. Yeah. Like the worshipful aspect is maybe a little bit culty, but people as it seems have that

really good grasp of the boundaries and tapping in and tapping out like the foot fetish lifestyle doesn't take over your entire life. Right? Yeah. It could if you had like a, it could. Yeah. Well, that's something we talk about too. Like with some of these more innocent ish culty groups, you as a participant kind of

have to be responsible for your own boundaries. So like, you know, meth is bad for everybody, but alcohol is only bad for some people. So it's like heaven's gate, bad for everybody, flat earth tourism, bad for everybody. But like, you know, some of these groups are only bad for some people. I have a quick question. The people that they like worship, does it matter what their face looks like or do they literally only care about their feet? For the most part, it's only about the feet.

I mean, foot knight is mostly in the dark. Yeah. Cause then that also makes me think like it's harder to worship someone you don't even know. Well, people worship God and the Lord knows he doesn't have a face or she or they. There are a lot of non binary foot models and more mask leaning foot models who are, you know, shaved head, butch, don't give a fuck. And they are like the top, the top of the top. He's got to worship those feet, mostly because they're really, really good at bossing people

around trampling like the kink stuff. So I don't think it has to do with like a specific type of look, outer beauty, you know? Yeah. I was just curious. More of an energy. Okay. Now we're going to play a game called which cult followed figure has a foot fetish. Oh, love this.

I looked this up online, so it's not a hundred percent fact checked, but it'll still be fun. All right. So for the first round, which cult followed figure has a foot fetish? Is it Justin Timberlake, Pharrell Williams or Usher? All of them. Gabby, you're just like all of them. Yeah. I mean, truthfully probably.

Bre, do you have a guess? Oh, I want to say, I think my instinct is telling me Pharrell Williams, but I want to say Usher. That had gone with the instinct. It's Pharrell Williams. That's why he's so happy. I'm happy. Oh. Because he's happy.

That's why he's so happy. About the feet. Happy feet. Happy feet. Oh my God. Quick. Put the strings together. In the conspiracy theory.

It's all making sense now. All right. All right. These next two rounds are a little bit more like high brow. Okay. Which cult followed figure has a foot fetish? These are writers. These are novelists.

Is it JD Salinger, James Joyce, or Jane Austen? Is it Jane Austen? I hope it's Jane Austen. Salinger. I'm going to say James Joyce. It's Joyce. It's Joyce. I knew it.

Yeah. Joyce enjoyed using footplay in his work, including a passage in Ulysses in which the character Gertie boasts of using her feet to make men spend. Oh. Good for her. Yes. Is that fun? Cha-ching, cha-ching, cha-ching.

All right. One more round. Which cult followed figure has a foot fetish? Jackson Pollock, Robert Maple Thorpe, or Andy Warhol? Warhol. Who was the first one? Jackson Pollock. Jackson Pollock.

Maybe Pollock. I'm going to say Jackson Pollock. It's Andy Warhol. Oh. I thought Jackson Pollock because in my mind I was like imagining him putting paint on his feet and walking around, which like, that's not how he did his paintings. Why did I think that? Yeah.

Go with the instincts. Yeah. Yeah. I got to go with those instincts. You guys have good instincts. Both of you. Where can our listeners find each of you? You can find me on Instagram, Twitter, Patreon, OnlyFans, at Brie Srig and Little Summer Ho.

I'm at Gabby Road on Instagram and then I have a podcast called Just Between Us and I also have a podcast called Bad With Money. Amanda's episode of Just Between Us is like one of our most listened to, so go check it out. Oh. Thanks to you both. Bye. Bye.

What a fun conversation. I love them. They're so great. You think the foot fetish community is so freaky and then you talk to folks like Gabby and Brie and you're like, I want to go to foot night. Yeah. I see you there. Are we carpooling?

Who's driving? Out of the three cult categories, live your life, watch your back, or get the fuck out. What cult category do you think the foot fetish community falls into? I mean, I feel like we kind of gave a little trinkle away in the beginning, but I really, I don't know what, I feel like a trinkle is like something that the foot fetish community would be into. Yeah. It's like a little foot treat, a trinkle.

It's a, I don't honestly, I'm going to claim ESL on this one, I don't know what I meant to say. I like it. It's like a portmanteau of treat and sprinkle. Exactly. It's a trinkle. I feel like we gave a trinkle away about the foot fetish community and personally, I think it's a live your life.

I'm totally with you. It's a clear live your life. These folks have solid boundaries. They're not making promises they can't fulfill. They're not, you know, taking over your entire life. They're just trying to give you a good trinkle of time with your feet. Exactly. Honestly, they have more boundaries than me in general.

Like I have fallen into more dangerous communities in my lifetime for sure. Oh yeah. We've discussed many of them here on this podcast. Exactly. Well folks, out, speaking of my foot fell asleep. Oh my God. Oh my God, that's a sign. That's literally a sign your foot fell asleep.

It's time to reawaken your feet. Yeah. That's our show. Thanks so much for listening. We'll be back with a new cult next week. But in the meantime, stay culty, but not too culty. Sounds like a cult was created, produced and edited by Amanda Montell and Issa Medina. Our theme music is by Casey Colb and our production assistant slash intern is Courtney

Archer. And if you like this episode, feel free to give us a rating and review on Apple podcasts. Brie was like, you have to send a picture ahead of time to get approved for a footnight or whatever. So I like took the picture, but I was like, they're going to reject me and my slug has toes. Then they said yes. But I was nervous.

They were going to be like, what is the aspect ratio here? And then I would get rejected. I feel like that's even more cranky because like the fact that it's like a unique toe. I guess, dude. I feel like that application of even sending a picture though is more just for their spank bank and not even for you. It's like if someone were to be like, send me a new just to check that you have tits. Totally.

All right.