Sounds Like A Cult - The Cult of Starbucks

Episode Date: November 8, 2022

Remember the Juniper Latte? Wasn't it just about the strangest thing you ever tasted? Yet, you still came back. Some might say you couldn't help yourself. This week, Amanda and Isa *roast* Starbucks���s “cult following”—the coffee religion with a church on every street corner—from its savvy marketing tactics and insider-y vocabulary to its addictive beverages and behind-the-scenes corporate ~vibes~. With a Starbucks cup in hand, comedian Jade Catta-Preta adds an extra shot of espresso to this episode as our very special guest. Tickets to Isa's Live Shows in NYC & DC: https://linktr.ee/isaamedinaaTickets to Sounds Like A Cult Live in LA, Sunday, Dec. 4: https://www.dynastytypewriter.com/events-calendar?loxi_pathname=/sounds-like-a-cult-live-3418 Thank you to our sponsors: Get Honey for FREE at JoinHoney.com/cult. Go to Zocdoc.com/CULT and download the Zocdoc app for FREE For 50% off your first Care/of order, go to TakeCareOf.com and enter code cult50 Learn more and save 10% off your first month at BetterHelp.com/cult.

The views expressed in this episode, as with all episodes of Sounds Like a Cult, are solely host opinions and quoted allegations. The content here should not be taken as indisputable. This podcast is for entertainment purposes only. This is Sounds Like a Cult, a show about the modern day cult we all follow. I'm Amanda Montell, author of the book Cultish the Language of Fanaticism. I'm Issa Mendina and I'm a comedian. Every week on our show, we discuss a different zeitgeisty group

that puts the cult in culture, from evangelical youth groups to the Kardashians, to try and answer the big question. This group sounds like a cult, but is it really? To join our cult and see culty memes and BTS pics, follow us on Instagram at SoundsLikeACultPod. I'm on Instagram at Amanda underscore Montell. And I'm on IG at IssaMedina, I-S-A-A-M-E-D-I-N-A-A. Recently took a cleanse detox vibes.

Well, I delete it once every 48 hours. And then I almost get mentally healthy. And then I redownload it and spiral and relapse. I did a full six days and I felt like my brain was a jungle after a big thunderstorm. What you're saying is your brain felt lush and refreshed. Yeah, ideas were just coming out of every field. I know because when you stop consuming, you can start creating your own cult. It is true.

I took a break from the cult of Instagram to create the cult of Issa. I co-signed that. I'll be joining soon. Feel free also to check out our cult on YouTube where you can watch our show or hit us up on Patreon at patreon.com slash sounds like a cult. Hello, culties. Issa here. We're back with some more live comedy show dates on the road.

I'm coming for my New York City and DMV girlies. Shout out to the East Coast. I will be doing a live show in DC at the DC improv November 23rd. That's the night before Thanksgiving. Let's be grateful together. And then in New York City on November 26th. That's the Saturday after Thanksgiving. Get tickets at my Instagram at Issa Medina,

Is-A-A-M-E-D-I-N-A-A or at the link in this episode description. Hope to see you there. And Amanda here. I wanted to let you all know that I'm going to be doing a reading in Los Angeles, a literary reading on November 17th at the Oracle Tavern with the Something Something series. I'm going to be reading some new and unpublished work so you can find information for how to attend that at my website,

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Learn more and save 10% off your first month at betterhelp.com slash cult. That's BetterHelpHELP.com slash cult. Thank you to our sponsor, CareOf. For 50% off your first CareOf order, go to takecareof.com and enter code CULT50. That's 50% off your first CareOf order. Go to takecareof.com and enter the code CULT50. With ZocDoc booking an appointment with a doctor that suits your needs,

fits your schedule, is in your network, and in your neighborhood is easy. Go to ZocDoc.com slash cult and download the ZocDoc app for free. Then start your search for a top rated doctor today. Many are available within 24 hours. That's Z-O-C-D-O-C dot com slash cult. So today we're going to be talking about the cult of Starbucks. It's kind of like the cult of Trader Joe's. Yeah, I was just there today and I felt like a damn cult follower

because I had to be in that parking lot for 35 minutes to get to Silver Lake. Yes. Oh my god, that one is actually a cult. I think it's the only Trader Joe's within like a five mile radius. So how dare they? How dare they? Starbucks would never. Well, also everything is so expensive right now because of inflation.

I went grocery shopping at Whole Foods just because I was too lazy to drive to Trader Joe's and then I was like, I cannot do this again because I spent $70 on like a couple breakfast items. I know, it's really upsetting. Well, anyway, Starbucks is beloved in the way that Trader Joe's is beloved. Yeah. And I don't know if you knew this about me because I am famously among my friends anyway. So yeah, that's not famous. A coffee snob.

Oh no, well I know that because I am your friend and also because during the pandemic you got that espresso presser. Yes, oh my god, I have a mechanical single shot espresso machine where you get to like connect with your coffee. It is funny though. You guys used it religiously every day for two months and now I don't think you've used it in like six months. Well, because the world opened back up and now I am that bitch in the coffee shop

with her writings and her iced oat cortado. Yeah. But I did used to have a Starbucks routine when I worked in the beauty industry, when I was in my conformist era. When Starbucks first started to become popular, I think I was like in middle school. I would get the Frappuccino thing with no coffee because I didn't like caffeine. And it was expensive then. The idea of paying more than $3 for something that you could make at home for 50 cents.

Right. That was like a game changer for my parents. They would only get me Starbucks if it was a treat. Starbucks has completely created this sense of elitism, even though it's basically fast food. At this point it is. I feel like in the beginning it wasn't, but now there's literally a Starbucks around every single corner my friend calls it the convenience stores of coffee.

For sure. And it really does function like a convenience store. They have them at gas stations, they have them in airports, and you can get little sandwiches or like hard boiled eggs, which like, does anyone get those? I know. Those hard boiled eggs look fucking disgusting. I smell like sulfur.

I know, but even though Starbucks is like in gas stations and whatnot, it still has this very elevated energy to it. Oh, for sure. But it's funny that we're covering the cult of Starbucks, it being a coffee cult, because sometimes on our show we've made the comparison that live your life level cults are caffeine. They're like, they can be a bit much, but they're essentially safe for everyone. Watch your back.

Cults are like alcohol, safe for some people, life threatening for others, and get the fuck out level cults are meth, heroin, objectively terrible for everyone. So even though caffeine is a live your life, Starbucks is about so much more than coffee. It's an identity, a community, a culture, and that's why we decided to cover it on the show. Yeah, it's now become like a staple of America. When you go to another country, you see Starbucks and McDonald's, you're like, that's home. There is something like patriotic and yet still sophisticated about it. So we do kind of wear it like a badge of pride.

Yeah. Exciting, but scary. So when did Starbucks start and how did it start? These three guys in Seattle, Jerry, Gordon, Zev, I'm going to call them by their first names. The three blind mice. Yeah, they started this coffee shop, but it wasn't to sell cups of coffee. They started off as selling bags of coffee.

And then they hired this guy named Howard Schultz, who was like, you guys should sell cups of coffee and he marketed the shit out of it. And he's really the genius behind everything Starbucks. He is the mastermind. It's not the people who started the business. It's the guy who came up with the damn marketing strategy. So the first store opened in 1971 in Pike Place, Market, Seattle, I feel like everyone does know that.

Yeah. Have you been? I have. Yeah, I have been too. That's so weird. I don't even think of myself as like in the cult of Starbucks, but I've been because it's that's the American version of like a landmark. Yeah.

I mean, it's a big tourist attraction in Seattle. It's like Israel has the whaling wall, Rome has the Colosseum, and we have the original Starbucks. That's the capitalism, baby. I know. I think something else a lot of people know is that it was named after the first mate in Moby Dick, Starbucks. Oh, Starbucks.

Yeah. OK, literary reference. And the logo is a siren, which I didn't know until we looked into it, but a siren is a mermaid with two tails. So I didn't realize this, but it's like the mermaid in the middle and both of its tails on the side. I know. It is funny.

We just like take that logo for granted the way that we take like a crucifix or a star of David for granted. It is like this very recognizable religious symbol, but it is funny just like Trader Joe's. There is ultimately a nautical orange in the story. Yes, so true. Because so much mythology comes out of the sea. You know, the sea is a dark and mysterious place.

There's nothing inherently nautical about coffee, but there is a mysticism to the Starbucks brand that I think evokes the sea. Both are liquids, so it's like coffee's a liquid. The sea is a liquid. I bet if you like added up all the Starbucks coffee in one big container, it would be basically a coffee ocean. Yeah, that is sad.

I mean, if they really do care about the sea, then they should stop with the plastic. Stop with the plastic. And a siren is famously kind of like this succubus, like beckoning you into their alcove, into their like grotto. And I think that's what Starbucks is trying to do. Yeah, and also to note again, a siren is a female figure. And I think that's funny because that happens a lot. It's like men create these companies,

but then put a female the front of the company so that it's almost more trustworthy and it's easier for people to accept into their community. Absolutely, it feels more familial and personal. Yeah, like Wendy's. Yes. In 1982, they brought on Howard Schultz as their head of marketing. He worked with them to develop a customer friendly sales skills

and he produced brochures and learned about the company's products. He was the first one who really convinced the other guys to say like, hey, let's just not be regional. Let's turn it into a national coffee house. Yeah, why be local when you can take over the world? Yeah, and in 1987, he bought the company and by 2000, they had expanded to 2,500 locations and dozens of countries. He really had the cult-like vision.

Well, ultimately Schultz was the biggest influence behind the cult success of Starbucks. He kind of reminds me of a lot of the capitalistic cult leaders of episodes past when we covered the cult of MLMs and talked about Amway or when we covered various religious cults and talked about the fundamentalist Mormons. But he decided, I don't want to create this like fucked up religion. I want to create a massive coffee business.

And he did that in between 2000 and 2007. The company was opening an average of 1,500 stores a year. So that's when you were in middle school, right? Those were those years. Yeah, yeah. Elementary school. Oh my God, you're so young. Oh, she's younger than me.

So as of January 2022, there are 34,317 Starbucks worldwide with just under 17,000 of those in the United States. Okay, that is motherfucking insane. Yeah, that is a lot of Starbucks. So many locations. Something that we're going to talk about in more detail is that his marketing strategy wasn't just about opening companies. It was about creating a sense of community.

That's right. He wanted to build coffee houses even though they were franchised. He wanted everyone to walk into a Starbucks coffee and say, this is my local coffee shop. And so the way that they train their employees, that's really where it gets culty. Their employees are trained to have that culture of the customer's always right.

That's right. And we're going to get into why that is and can be dangerous. It also really evokes the way that churches operate. It's like they have to answer to a hierarchy within the religious business because it is a business ultimately. But every individual church has its own culture and its own pastor and it feels really intimate and it feels like intrinsic to the rhythm of your life, even though it is ultimately answering to a cult-like power structure.

For comparison, Pete's coffee has only 339 locations in the United States. That's crazy. And Starbucks has just under 17,000 in America alone and over 30,000 worldwide. Yeah. So in between 2000 and 2007, their growth was so astronomical that their sales during that time shot from $2 billion to $9.4 billion. Wow.

So they've got money and we're going to talk about the unionizing of their workers and what they're doing in response. Before we dive more into the cult of Starbucks, I think we should talk a little bit about the cult of coffee in general. When did it become so popular to drink coffee every day? And when did we get addicted to this thing? Yeah. And when did it go from a beverage to a lifestyle?

I didn't know until recently that it wasn't until the mid-1700s that people started normalizing drinking coffee. I say this all the time to defend my coffee addiction. Coffee was responsible for the entire enlightenment. Yeah. Because before that era, when it wasn't safe to drink water, everybody was constantly drinking beer and cider and they were drunk. Yeah.

They would literally wake up and feed their children cider in the 16th century. And it wasn't until coffee came to Europe in the 17th century and they started opening up coffee houses, which were spaces for people to discuss literature and the stock market and science. And something like that became so common that the stock house of coffee houses became the London Stock Exchange. Coffee is literally responsible for people waking up from centuries of alcohol and do slumber and being like,

whoa, if I drink this spicy chocolate bean juice, I can invent the scientific method. It literally coincided with the industrial revolution. And it's almost metaphorically speaking too. It's like as machines became quicker, people had to keep up with that pace. And so they drank more coffee. It said that Voltaire drank up to 72 cups of coffee a day. All right.

I mean, allegedly, if Voltaire had Instagram, he would just be like posting every cup of coffee that he had a day. On his Instagram story would be like 72 slashes and it would just be a cup of coffee. He would be like the ultimate TikTok coffee influencer. We would all be like, oh my God, I'm so inspired. Did you see Voltaire's story? I need to drink more coffee. I've been talking about how I'd stop drinking coffee

and then as we were doing research for this episode, I was like, wait a damn minute, all these geniuses drink coffee. And I was like, I need to be a little smarter. Well, I will say by way of disclaimer that genius and coffee, that's a correlative relationship. It's not cause and effect. However, coffee gets a really bad rap, especially in this moon juice dominated society

where we're like, I want my body to be pure. It's like pure is overrated. Give me that caffeine. Actually though, caffeine is full of antioxidants. The one bad thing that's really, really bad about coffee is that it does stay in your system eight to 12 hours after you drink it. And I know so many people you that are like, oh, I can have a cup of coffee right before bed

and I'll still pass out. But babe, you're not getting your REM. You know, it is true. Like sleep is so important for memory consolidation. I also think it depends when you started drinking coffee. Something that I've noticed a lot with like younger generations, teenagers now have so much anxiety. And I know that we live in a rough world

and a lot of it has to do with the state of affairs. But I also have noticed a lot of people started to drink coffee these days way younger. Like kids are starting to drink coffee at 13. And then on top of that, they're spending their whole days on social media and on TikTok. So it's like two massive addictions as a teenager and you're not getting sleep when your brain is still developing.

And so I think a lot of that is causing a mental health crisis. You're completely right. I mean, I was looking up the other day that TikTok use disorder is a new pathology that has been described and it is fucking with people's memory. And I think Starbucks, if not explicitly then implicitly, is responsible for a lot of that young caffeine addiction

because think about their beverages. Like the unicorn Frappadapa who's a whata. And not only is it caffeine, but it's like so much sugar and Starbucks and TikTok go hand in hand. They do. A drink will go viral on TikTok and then everyone will pour into Starbucks

and be like, I want this Frappadapa doobadooby. And then they're up late on that caffeine consuming more TikTok. Yeah. Perceiving the next viral drink. It's important to bring up when coffee became so popular because I do think it was the first time that coffee allowed for people to break the ties to the rhythm of the sun, to like the circadian rhythm. So that people could not just go to sleep when the sun went down,

stay up late and also wake up earlier, wake up late. And no matter what time it is, you can have energy. Caffeine in America to toxic productivity culture pipeline. It's a straight shot just like my digestive system after I have my first coffee. So it wasn't until the 1950s that coffee really became a mainstream thing in America and that came to be because of the coffee break in offices.

That was like an excuse for people to step out of the office or step out of their office and meet with people in chat. Kind of similar to like smoking cigarettes. It's like God forbid you just take a moment of rest. You have to be consuming a beverage that will then allow you to work for another seven hours. Yeah, exactly. And I mean, I see that kind of coincide with the rise

in people being diagnosed with ADHD. I feel like in the 50s, the rise of coffee was, okay, increased productivity. And now coffee isn't enough for the levels of increased productivity that we've reached. And people are like, I have ADHD and I need Adderall. And it's like, maybe you don't. Maybe you just need to put your feet in grass.

Yeah, and delete Instagram. Seriously, the standards for our productivity are just getting higher and higher and higher. God, I wish AI just would take over already. Yeah, but the thing with AI taking over is that they need to start giving universal basic income if AI does take over. You know what I mean?

Yeah. Well, anyway, we're solving it right here. Literally. That sounds like a code. All the problems. So people started taking breaks to drink coffee to become more productive. And then when Starbucks came into the picture,

they were the ones who kind of brought the rise of espresso-based drink to America. Espresso-based drinks weren't really very popular in America. No. Cappuccinos, lattes. It was all about that drip-drip. Yeah. So it was the 1980s when our marketing cult leader guru,

Howard Schultz, came up with the idea to turn Starbucks locations into cafes. And that's when the whole tall, grande, venti culture was invented and boomed. By 1996, CNN Money described Starbucks as evangelical in nature. There was a quote that said, Starbucks is spreading the gospel of plunger pot

and steamed milk. And if this evangelical company has its way, we will all purify our noisome water with Brita filters and pour earthy, unpredictable Sumatra bungee into stainless steel thermoses while Starbucks jazz wafts into the eaves. So that quote really evokes how Starbucks became far more than just a beverage.

It became a way of life. Coffeehouse culture was not only good for progress. It also introduced the idea that this beverage could bring people together in an almost religious type way. It's definitely something that people commune over and talk about. And you go into someone's home. The first thing they offer you is a cup of tea

or a cup of coffee or God forbid, water. So let's talk about how Howard Schultz created the culture and cult vibes around Starbucks. Yeah, well, we can't deny the special language that is used in Starbucks that makes everybody who goes there feel like they're on the inside of secret code language, feel an elite, feel an Italian, but also a little French. I have never used the tall grande language.

I've always just said small, medium, large, you little rebel. Because I am, I am a rebel. And I love saying the wrong things, but not in a problematic way. If you go into a Starbucks and you call it a small, that is so problematic. Yeah, I'm going to get canceled. Cancel her, cancel me.

I don't fucking care. Well, actually, like speaking of not drinking coffee until later, I didn't drink coffee until I was like 25 years old. See, that's why you have a good memory. Yeah. Because the development years, you weren't chugging coffee, but now you're addicted as fuck. Well, I think I'm actually more emotionally addicted.

It is that ritual in the morning. No girl, you were addicted. OK. If you were to stop drinking coffee, you would break down. I would break down, but again, I think that's more emotional, which is not less powerful. I would get headaches, but like a headache I can tolerate. The emotional void that would be left in my day.

Wait, this just made me think like I'm going to get re-addicted to coffee, I think. Do it. Yeah. So Starbucks terminology, it's so culty. It feels so good. Instead of small, you call it tall. Instead of medium, you call it ground day.

Instead of enormous, you call it venti. There are secret Starbucks codenames and acronyms up the freaking wazoo PSLs, of course, pumpkin spice lattes. There's blonde, skinny, dirty. It sounds like I'm listing porn search terms, LOL. There's also a secret menu. And with Starbucks, the more complex your order, the more insider you seem.

And some of their drinks, I cannot lie, they slap. I'm so excited to see a Starbucks every time I go on a road trip. And my order, just so everyone knows, it was a ground day on sweet and black iced tea with once blended added to it. OK. I love a white mocha with one pump.

All right. Iced. Anyway, Starbucks retail workers, they are called partners, which I think is something very smart for a businessman to do with his retail workers, because it makes everyone feel like they are a part of something and a bigger part of something. The company culture around Starbucks

kind of reminds me of the company culture around Chick-fil-A, in that they, like, get promised that they might be able to rise the ranks and become a manager and maybe get sent to corporate even. Totally. I think Starbucks and Chick-fil-A fall on opposite sides of the political spectrum.

Oh, they're performative liberals. They deeply, deeply are, yes. But what they do have in common with these cult-like groups like Chick-fil-A and Trader Joe's and Disney is that they create this atmosphere that we're all collaborating. We're a family. We're not just workers, we're partners.

And because every little cult of theirs, every storefront is going to have a different kind of cult leader that perpetuates that culture. What they do oftentimes is they hire someone in the managerial role who's kind of fallen more into the cult and believes more in the cult so that they can enforce that terminology and that culture on their younger employees

or on their less invested employees who suffer the consequences of that culture. Right, because they're, like, lower on the hierarchy and they have at least a toe out the door. But not to be on my linguistics bullshit, but language and culture are intrinsically linked and it sounds sort of innocent just to be like, oh, yeah, they call all small drinks talls.

They call all super large drinks venties. But that's where the cult-like influence starts. You create this atmosphere that, like, everybody who knows how to use this language is elite, is superior, a partner is someone who ostensibly has more power than they really do. The language is so euphemistic and hyphalutin. There's also such a specific aesthetic at Starbucks

that corresponds to its hierarchy. It really reminds me of the Nexium Sashes or Karate Belts. Green aprons are worn by everyone, but then coffee masters, as they're called, get black aprons and barista champions get purple aprons. So even though they're just colors, they have no intrinsic value. If you're really getting in on the cult of Starbucks,

you're gonna wanna aspire to have that black apron, to have that purple apron. It's such a sign of cultishness. And what they do is not just perpetuate that cultish culture with their employees, but also with the way they tell their employees to treat their customers. They're one of those companies that functions

off of the customer's always right mentality. And looking into a lot of, like, different stories of past Starbucks workers, I learned that when those frappa-dupey-dupey drinks go viral on TikTok, it's not really great for their workers because people come into the Starbucks and demand that the barista makes them this super complicated order that they saw on TikTok.

And the barista might not know what the heck they're talking about, because maybe it was one thing that someone ordered across the country in another Starbucks 3,000 miles away. Totally. And then they have to make that because the customer's always right. Yeah, the customer's always right.

I've never thought of this, but it totally counts as a thought terminating cliche. A thought terminating cliche for those who are new to the show is a stock expression that all cult leaders use that's aimed at shutting down independent thinking or questioning. So when you're in this atmosphere and something fucked up is happening

or you're feeling a lot of cognitive dissonance or you wanna push back, and some superior in a fucking purple ass apron tells you the customer is always right, that shuts down your ability to question or push back. We're gonna talk about this a bit in the interview, but it is also just a highly sensitive space to be dealing with customers

because they are literally getting their cup of coffee. They are getting the thing that they are addicted to and that they need to function. Like a lot of people, what do they always say about coffee? Don't talk to me before my first cup of coffee. It's like printed on our mugs. Yeah, and so for the first people those people are talking to.

Barista's. In my opinion, Starbucks really does contribute to the romanticization of being overworked and overtired. I mean, think of those mugs that say things like yawn is just a silent scream for coffee. A silent scream, that's like not cute. No, it's not. That's like something you do

when you are so fucking scared, you can't scream. That's what I fear doing. Like if I ever have a bad dream, I'm very vocal, but if I ever have a bad dream, I wake up with a silent scream, you know what I mean? I know, it's like actually so dark. I think something that is worst case scenario when you have that company culture

of customers always right is saying no to unionizing and that's something that Starbucks is currently doing. Yeah, I wanna talk about the union stuff more, but. Speaking of the politics of Starbucks, I think they've always had this sort of greenwashing thing going on where they create the impression that they are not only like indie and intimate and local, even though they're literally a massive chain,

but they're also ethical and sustainable and eco-friendly. According to Starbucks own reports, it wasn't until the mid 2010s that they even started to really publicly prioritize recyclability and a 2018 press release from the company admitted that there are still just too many challenges, some of which aren't totally Starbucks fault,

to making their cups fully recyclable. But in my opinion, their bottom line clearly seems more important to them than sustainability, no matter how many press releases they craft. Yeah, and I think that goes hand in hand with the fact that they are not allowing their workers to unionize, which we're gonna talk about, and that's like the number one sign of a cult.

They present themselves as these good people, but at the end of the day, they are a billion dollar corporation. They not only function as a company, but they also almost function as a bank. That's what solidified in my mind, like we have to do this episode. You know your Starbucks app,

when you load money onto that app, you keep money there because, I don't know, they've convinced us that it's easier to like use the app than to just use our touchless credit cards. It's literally not easier. And they have holdings of over $3 billion in that app. And so if Starbucks was a bank,

it would be ranked the 385th largest bank in America. That's according to the Wall Street Journal. The reason they're able to convince people to keep that money in their app and use their app is because of the rewards program. So they gamify coffee buying that way. It serves the function of getting people that sweet, sweet dopamine that they crave,

giving people that instant gratification of like, I bought this Starbucks product, I got points for it, but also the delayed gratification of like, oh now that I've collected all of my little points and hoarded them away like Gollum, I get to have a free drink. I mean, it's really dumb because 4,800 stars would literally be worth $192.

But that's 4,800 stars. That's like, what do you get with them that you can't get with a normal credit card, a free drink on your birthday? It's so genius truly because they have infused all of these things with no inherent meaning, like the language and the aprons and the star system with so much like fake Starbucks meaning

that's only valuable in the cult of Starbucks. A lot of these things have come out, like on TikTok or Twitter, people have posted long vlogs and stories about like the one time I worked at Starbucks, what it was like to work at Starbucks. On Glass Story, employees have rated working at Starbucks a 3.8 out of five, that's nearly 55,000 reviews.

Damn. So I think something that stood out to me about Starbucks was the contradiction between independent stories that I've seen on social media, like TikTok and Twitter about how bad it is to work at Starbucks versus their squeaky clean image online. Something tells me that all those negative stories are finding you as the co-host of a cult podcast.

No, I feel like it's like stories with like millions of views and likes on Twitter that people are saying and then you look in the comment section and people are being like, oh my gosh, this happened to me too. But in 2012, 13, 14 and 18, Starbucks was voted one of the best places to work by employees on Glass Story.

And it said that 70% of employees would recommend working there. But then when you look into it, a lot of the biggest complaints from employees are low pay for an overwhelming taxing job, poor management slash bad managers and poor upper management. And I mean, those three bullet points to me

sound like really huge, huge issues. You know, devil's avocado, the negative stories will always get more attention than the positive stories because we're attracted to negativity, especially on the internet. But that doesn't necessarily mean that those negative stories shouldn't be paid attention to.

And I think especially now all of this discussion around Starbucks blocking unionization has really showed, you know, where their ethics as a company lie. I think it's important to highlight that when you go to their website and look at the benefits that they offer, they offer multiple options for healthcare coverage.

They offer stocks and savings, competitive 401k retirement plans. They offer paid time off, parental leave, even education. But then when you look at the individual stories, and I know like those might seem like the majority they might not be, but you know, the paid time off, when it has poor management

and they're not hiring more people, they're like, you either have to come into work or you're fired, that's not proper paid time off. We read on SeattlePI.com that in 2008, they had to pay out around 356 workers who were forced to work overtime without compensation. Yeah, I mean, the thing that makes this cult like to me and not just like standard a business being shitty,

is that like Trader Joe's, they're able to hide behind that really elevated image. And when people go to work at Starbucks and feel like they're the cool kids on the block and they feel special in their, you know, inherently meaningless green apron and they know how to speak the lingo, the company can get away with so much.

They can get away with a lot, but like luckily because of the internet a lot has come forward and then they do ultimately either have to choose to deal with it or not. And since December of 2021, over 6,000 workers and 230 Starbucks stores have organized into a union. According to capitalandmain.com, despite the first store voting to unionize

in December 9th, 2021, not one union contract has been negotiated by Starbucks. So by not negotiating or signing into these union contracts, the company is trying to signal two non-unionized stores that unionization is not worth the hassle. I also read on the Starbucks workers united Twitter. The company has continually fired union leaders, which is simply illegal.

So despite their squeaky clean image, despite their brand recognition, despite the fact that they've established themselves as this wholesome, cozy hub of intellectualism, the fact that they're blocking these unionizations really shows that they're just followers of the cult of capitalism ultimately. It's also important to mention that the Starbucks CEO,

despite, you know, all of these negative things that have happened around not allowing workers to unionize, Starbucks CEO, Howard Schultz, is known for a lot of his philanthropic work. He's helped turn cities such as Portland and Philadelphia into better places by providing psychiatric wards or homeless shelters. And so he is ultimately liberal and progressive.

I know there is this public image that larger profitable companies are more selfish and likely to give less, but actually detailed analyses have found that profitable companies are more likely to engage in corporate social responsibility endeavors, even like big bad companies like Google, which has, you know, committed to using 50% less energy

than their competitors and such. But my question is why do you desire so very much power like Starbucks does? Like if you're really that progressive, why would you even want your company to be that big? Which is like a whole other fundamental question. Like I myself would never, ever desire that much power. I think the reason you desire power

is because you get into that state where you're like, okay, no one else is doing it, then I'm gonna make it better because now I have a platform. That's such a collider complex, you know? It's like, why you? Inevitably there are going to be figures in society that have more power than others.

And so Howard Schultz specifically, when he realized he has an influence over people, he has used that to voice a liberal opinion. He's vocally supported same-sex marriage when Donald Trump signed an executive order to suspend Syrian refugees into the US. He vocally wrote a letter to the president saying that refugees play an important role

in the United States. He has taken liberal stances on things, but he runs a business. And so at the end of the day, he needs to turn a profit and allowing workers to unionize is really dangerous for the bottom line. This whole conversation is so similar to when we were talking to our guest

on the Cult of the Kardashians episode, where we were talking about how like, it is so troubling that politics in this country is run by big business, including the Kardashians and Starbucks and the NRA. Like these are our lobbyists. And I hate that our society has become so cultish that a company like a goddamn coffee chain

is influencing our politics, even if we ultimately agree with those politics. The thing to note here is that there is no ethical consumption under capitalism, but Howard Schultz specifically, he's not currently the CEO anymore, but he is worth over $3 billion. So how do you become worth that much money?

Even though you believe in the right thing, you're not taking action that would hurt your benefits. Exactly, all billionaires are cult leaders, period, in my opinion, like the end. So up next, we're gonna talk to Jade Catapretta. She's a Brazilian born comic and actress. She was the host of the iconic E Network show, The Soup. She performs stand up all over the country

in both English and Portuguese. And you can see her regularly at comedy clubs in LA and New York. Right now she has a new show on Hulu called Hotties. It is a reality dating show. It kind of reminds me of like Next. Next meets whatever that hot wing eating show on YouTube is. Yes.

So good, so funny. We're so excited to talk to her. Here's Jade. Before we get into our sponsors for the day, Issa here, I wanted to let my girlies who want to see me do live stand up comedy know that I will be in DC, November 23rd, and New York City, November 26th, doing my solo show where I will be headlining

and joined by some very special guests. I've had so much fun meeting everyone after my shows in San Francisco and LA. I love chatting with all of you. So if you haven't been able to come to a comedy show of mine, again, I'll be in DC the night before Thanksgiving, that's November 23rd, and New York City, let's literally be grateful together.

Get tickets at my Instagram or at the link in this episode's description. I find it so funny when you guys come to a show and are like, I just wanted to see if you were actually funny and if you actually did stand up, I'm obsessed with that. Please roast me, I will roast you back. I want to make you guys laugh in person, is that cult of me?

I could care less, I just want to meet all of you. So go get tickets at the link in episode description and also go to my website, tell me where to perform next. Also go to my website and tell me where to perform next if I haven't hit up your city. Today's episode is sponsored by Honey, the easy way to save when shopping on your iPhone or computer.

I've been using Honey for years and it's probably saved me like hundreds and hundreds of dollars shopping online. People underestimate how much money you can save with like coupon vibes because it's just normally so much more work than it's worth. But I feel like with Honey, no, I know that with Honey, it's just so easy, you can literally download the extension

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then you'll support the show and save money. There is zero downside. Yeah, and we mentioned this, but Honey really does not just work on your desktop. It works on your iPhone too. You just activate it on Safari, on your phone and you save on the go. If you don't already have Honey,

you could be straight up missing out. And by getting it, you'll be doing yourself a solid and supporting this show. I'd never recommend something I don't use. Get Honey for free at joinhoney.com slash cult. That's joinhoney.com slash cult. This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. You know, life is not always easy

and it does not come with a user manual. So it's really important to know and understand your feelings. And that's where talking to a therapist can really help. Yeah, I'm really grateful that conversations about mental health are becoming more accepted and more mainstream and that therapy itself is more acceptable these days than it has been

in the past, thanks to services like BetterHelp. I actually use BetterHelp specifically. I used a code that an influencer that I like shared. At the beginning of the pandemic, when I wasn't able to access my in-person therapist and it really got me through a tough time, which was key at the beginning of the panini. I mean, that's so important

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Anything else you need ZockDoc has you covered. Just go to ZockDoc.com slash cult and download the ZockDoc app for free, then start your search for a top rated doctor today. Many are available within 24 hours. That's ZocDoc.com slash cult, ZockDoc.com slash cult. I was like an avid coffee drinker for like a very, very long time and I really was addicted to Dunkin Donuts actually.

Oh, Trader! I went to college in Boston at Emerson. But then when I moved to LA, I got really addicted to caramel macchiatos, which is just like cake. It's just cake. I don't know. It's literally like 1,000 pounds of sugar.

I know, I just was drinking them all the time, bouncing off the walls. When Brittany shaved her head, she had Starbucks right before. It wasn't even the math that she was on. Everybody remembers the photos. It was bad PR, but it was good PR. It's all PR is good PR.

That's right. I actually cut caffeine out completely out of my life. So I'll have it like every once in a while when I'm feeling kind of sassy. I'll do like a tea. Like a little treat. Yeah, and then I'm that person that's like, I'll have half a pump, half a pump of sweetener.

And they're like, well, all right. Would you at any point have described your relationship to Starbucks in particular as culty? I would say that it was an everyday thing. I really like going to a place where they know your name. Like I love a Cheers moment. The girl knew me, knew how much I liked on my coffee. And it does become like this tradition

that you have every morning, right? You like wake up, you do it, and that's how they get you so. It's church. I did a little research as well. So I got it on Reddit. That's a great place. There's like kind of two subdivisions of this Starbucks cult, right?

Where there's like the corporate kind of agenda of this guy Howard. And then there's also the ideal of like people who just love Starbucks and go on a daily basis, right? So there's like kind of these two subdivisions. There's always like the in cult and the out cult. What do you think is the cultiest aspect of each? The business side, the brand side.

I think the business side becomes almost more like brainwashing because as I was reading like these people are not taking breaks, working as hard as they can to like please these managers climb within the university of Starbucks. Cause there's all these like awards that you can win and become like really managerially successful there. But these people are working nonstop

against these 14 year olds who like don't care and we're also work there. You know what I mean? There's like a teenager that works there versus like a 38 year old. The managers are the ones implementing the agenda of the corporation. And it's because they're the ones

who want to get promoted internally. What differentiates sort of someone who's only going to work there for a summer and someone who really rises through the ranks is just how passionate and zealous they are about the company. Just the people who are like addicted to this stuff. This is the menu in Britain. And this is them.

Like they just love talking about the items on the menu and how they're like, they don't have a mango chutney thing there. And there's nothing that I like that much. It's a RuPaul's Drag Race. Something that a lot of the workers have to deal with that we don't think about is that because a coffee is a drug,

it's like you're dealing with customers who are purchasing a drug. Like they are literally addicts. Especially if it is part of your morning ritual. Like when I had an office job, I would go to Starbucks every single morning. I would want my drink to be the exact same thing. And if that ritual was disturbed,

not only was I addicted to the caffeine, but I was so emotionally dependent on that experience that like it would ruin my day. It messes your day, yeah. It messes your day up. And also I love the sausage. I can't, jeez. Oh my God, I have that all the time.

That's my go-to. If I'm having like a day where I'm traveling for comedy, I'm like, I deserve this. I wonder what your thoughts are on why Starbucks has become so much more than just coffee in our culture right now. Like what do you think draws people to it in a cult-like way? Well, overproductivity is like the whole name of the game,

right? Don't stop, don't stop. Everything is content, everything is an opportunity. And I think that kind of matches that kind of mindset of like, hey, you can come here, get all drugged up, write a million emails. Yeah, and you can find one on every corner. So it's like you always know you can find coffee

at a Starbucks. It's comfort, that's what it is. It's comfort no matter where you are, you can find a place to be productive and to be comfortable. And that way it truly is like church. Like you can find a church anywhere in the world in the same way that you can find an AA meeting anywhere else.

Yeah, but do they have cake balls at church? Sometimes donuts. Evangelical mega churches often have like blue bottle in the lobby because it's the one vice that's sort of allowed in that culture. Besides anal. Yeah. Starbucks resembles a Mormon mission in this way

that like they're just trying to proliferate all over the world. The major difference is Mormons aren't allowed to drink coffee. I think most Mormons break all the rules. A lot of the Mormons that I knew from college, they got to college Mormon and then they did everything by the time they graduated.

Oh, I think Starbucks followers are more loyal than Mormons because they're the type of people who have their reward program. They will not stray. Their reward program. The rewards of Starbucks are so much more tangible than the rewards of eternal salvation. Yeah, you can't see those.

How would you describe the typical Starbucks cult follower type? Well, there's different kinds, right? There's like that teeny boppy person that loves to be at them all. Drinking the pinkity, drinkity. Even my intern the other day, she's younger. She was like, the pumpkin latte's out.

It's also the seasonal people. Well, when I experienced and lived through seasons on the East Coast, I like loved the pumpkin spice latte. But now that we live in LA, I'm like 90 degrees out. The only way you know it's fall is when PSL season starts. Yeah, literally. How much of a cult like hold does Starbucks have on California culture that we don't have seasons

in weather, so we look to Starbucks to tell us when fall is coming. Like tell us what's upside down. And then there's also the people who are like dependent on going there and working there. And then there's also a different part of the cult, which is the employees and the employees who want to like please Father Howard and stuff.

Yeah. I read this Reddit thing where it was like, Father Howard, I thought we called him Uncle Howard. No, we call him Dad Howard. Like they're not really sure on it. It's so cult like when you assign that sort of paternal patriarchal label to a business leader.

I mean, it just evokes Jim Jones, who they would call father and dad. And Father's Day was his birthday. Is they a cult led by a woman? Yeah, for sure. Because I feel there is this paternal quality that makes people want to join a cult. I think it's more so like the way that we exist

in the patriarchy where we're likely to join. We give people the power we think they deserve. So if a woman starts a cult having to do with love or wellness or parenting, we're more likely to follow her, especially if she's white and thin and beautiful. And if a man starts a cult about business, religion, literally anything else, we're more likely to trust him.

The patriarchy pits women against one another as a way of controlling us. Of course. That sounds conspiratorial, but it does work. What do you think a person's rank of choice says at Starbucks about their personality and their beliefs? I think there has a lot to do with comfort, right? Like that thing that makes you feel

either like it's driving you or it makes you feel like, hmm, this is a familiar feel that I need to start my morning. There's definitely those guys that just do like black coffee. It's so easy to just make black coffee. Like I go there for the syrups. Yeah. That's what I like.

And the whipped cream. Yeah. So when Starbucks can provide this sort of identity template of like, this is who you are. You're someone who has a black coffee or you're someone who has a pinkity drinkity. And it's gonna be there for you in your morning before you go to your soulless job.

It's gonna be there if you're in Shanghai. And it's like, no matter how unruly the culture gets, whether there is a pandemic, whether like Trump is president, Starbucks will be there and that is the lure of a cult. You're gonna make sure. Right. It'll be open.

It'll be open really early. It'll be open really late. Really late. If your internet's broken, you can also go there. It can now get it like delivered to your home. I've gotten some Starbucks delivered. Me too. Speaking of like that sense of elitism that you get

or that sense of like transcendence that you feel from having a certain drink order. We learned from a listener that when you order a small black coffee, or I guess it would have to be a tall black coffee in their lingo, they repeat one tall pike place. Pike place is where the like original Starbucks location is. So there's a secret lingo that you get to access

a little hard. I like being a part of something, knowing at least we want to know about stuff. That's what it is. We don't want to feel left out. I have a lot of that because it's immigrant kid. Like I didn't speak English. So I'm always like, what's everybody talking about?

Me too. I originally from Columbia. No way. But I moved to the States when I was like seven. This is why so many cults explicitly go after immigrant communities who are like locked out of a linguistic community, locked out of like the dignified labor market.

They're treated like shit because they like have an accent. Absolutely. MLMs always go after immigrant communities. To bring it back to like Starbucks, I think like they try and like have that idea of like, you want to work here, you like to work here, you get treated well, and then you treat the customer as well.

And like, I don't think there's anything wrong with that like community culture of a company. But I think where it goes south is when they're not treating the employees well, specifically when they have the resources too. And when they've created this culture that this brand is ethical, sustainable, superior, high-end.

Sustainable, come on. I mean, hello. I get it. Like we're doing paper straws now, but like what about the cup? The straw argument is a straw man argument. Okay, so you worked for E-News for a while, right? No, I hosted the soup.

Oh, right. Yeah, you hosted the soup. How was that? It was crazy talking about cults. Oh my God. Like it was like cult classic for many years. Joel McHale was the host of it for 11 years. And so coming into his shoes was definitely a transition

to that, I didn't expect how like people were outraged. Especially because it's like Mantle Woman. Yeah, Mantle Woman. And also like there was a kind of a voice to the show already where it was making fun of reality TV in a very like snarky kind of a way, which is not my sense of humor because I like to feel included

and I like people to feel included. So mine was kind of looking up at the material rather than looking down. I just didn't get to make it mine. You know what I mean? The short amount of time that I had with it. Sometimes listeners will get upset when they don't feel as though we're harsh enough

on a cult of the week. Even if I feel like we're touching it from every possible angle, like we're trying to have a balanced view, but people just want you to one note go for blood sometimes. Exactly, one no. And that's not me at all. It's one of those topics that I'm almost scared to cover

because it is such a worship sort of like untouchable brand in a way. You know, it is the sort of thing where it's like, do I really want to roast Starbucks in public? Because, you know, roast, get it? Because then, you know, it's like you're inviting the wrath of the stands into your life.

So it's tough. But it's also, we're not saying anything negative. We're just saying there's definitely that kind of person that has like the addictive personality. Starbucks is ultimately like a corporation and an entity. They're not as defensive as they are when like we cover the cult of like a person. Like are these reddits even real?

I think about that sometimes. Like are these really smart corporations like making these reddit? Maybe. Conversations. I would say though, I would love if we could talk about sort of like the broader culture that has built up around Starbucks

because a Starbucks to me is not just the beverages and the lingo and like the, you know, toxic productivity culture. For some reason, when I think of the classic Starbucks cult follower, I also think of Taylor Swift and Chunky Sweaters. I mean, Taylor Swift released one of her albums in conjunction with Starbucks.

Yeah. So that's probably why. Oh, because the fall, she loves it. Yeah, she loves fall. No, I understand like thematically, it kind of goes together like that feeling of comfort and warmth and like snuggling in your cart again. It's like basic bitches.

Well, it's sort of like lowest common denominator. If you're like Starbucks and you're kind of trying to take over the world, don't go edgy, go basic. Cause that's what is going to attract the most people. Fucked up. I gotta find my three branding words. I gotta start my call.

The Starbucks marketers are just geniuses at what they do. And that's why this culture has become so much more than just coffee or even just anything that they created because the people really connected to it. And in this time when people are defecting away from actual church and you know, these actual institutions, Starbucks is like there to catch you

with their like warm and fuzzy, choco, drinky, uniformy doopies. Did you guys see that video where like somebody poured a tall into a medium or into a grande and then into a large and it's like all the same amount of coffee. Did you guys see that? No, but I so believe that.

I think they like choose different amounts of ice to add. And that's how they make it look more full. That is literally a metaphor for like any cult hierarchy, like Scientology. You think you're going to get more lessons when you transcend to this next level of courses on your petting more ice. Yeah.

I auditioned for Scientology for those commercials that they do right when I got here. That's classic. Yeah, they like trick you. And I had to go into a room and cry, right? It was like a crying scene that I was looking into a mirror crying. And the woman in the room with me was like,

okay, so you're just going to start. And I was like, I just need a second. The phone rang and she was like, oh, sorry about that. Kind of like, we're in a session, you know? And the phone rings again. She's like, just hangs up. And then the phone rings again.

And she was like, oh, rips the thing off the cord and puts the phone down. And I kind of cried because I was scared. And then I left and was just getting so much stuff from them. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Calls, emails. I had to beg them to stop. So many Scientology courses start as like actor salons,

like acting class and audition. I mean, we talk about this on the show all the time, but achieving like spiritual transcendence and achieving fame in this society are one in the same thing. One is ultimately you're seeking fame and fortune. And the other is like, you're seeking something really intangible.

But both of those things are so hard to achieve that a person could exploit their power to make you think they are. So that is cool until it's not what makes it turn. Exactly. Like what makes this turn? Like what makes Starbucks turn? Like the way they're being treated,

like they're being treated horribly and they're slaves to the system. Or is it just like, are we spending all our money on stuff that's bad for the environment ultimately? Like what's the turn? That's right. No, it's important to talk about

like what is the worst case scenario? And that's how you determine whether something is a live your life, a watch your back, or get the fuck out. Because like, yeah, it's culty and we can easily identify how the lingo and the reward system is. But it's like, what is that sort of drinking

the cyan-eyed lace-flavored moment? And with Starbucks, I'm not sure there is one. I've besides being treated like shit and it can't be good for the environment. I'm buying individual cups of coffee like every day. You mentioned a little bit about how like there's like the workers and then there's the people

who like go to Starbucks and buy it. I think that that moment is like the people who really want to like rise in the ranks of Starbucks. They get like a special apron with like a bunch of little like pins on it. I saw it. They get like a box when you graduate with like all this stuff.

Yeah, I saw some of the Starbucks too like that are really into this guy, Howard, who's not the CEO anymore, right? He's left. But people still build these little shrines to him in different stores, like with a little picture of him. Oh my God, it's like in CrossFit boxes where people build shrines to Greg Glassman.

Well, not so much anymore because he's canceled. But like when people have mascots like Pukie the Clown or Uncle Rabdo, we love a mascot. We want to worship an idol ultimately. Yeah. Do you think that like people like leave the cult of Starbucks, they'll like just join their like local coffee shop or like?

Yeah, I think it is. I think there, if there is a local coffee shop nearby and like not in the mood for something specific, I would definitely go for that first for me personally. I'm just like, I want to support a small business. I also didn't realize until like doing a bit of research on this is that like because Starbucks is like so like make the customer happy culture,

I feel like, you know when you go to like those alt coffee shops and they're kind of like assholes to you. They kind of are addicted to you. I feel like it's like anti-culture. I feel like it's like the anti-Starbucks movement because they were like, maybe they worked at Starbucks and they were like, I don't want to be nice to people anymore and now they're just mean.

I don't like it. I don't like means customer support. It really turns me off. Do you mind if we play a game? No, I love games. We're going to name two Starbucks related scenarios and you're going to have to tell us which you think is cultier.

Okay, which is cultier number one, either being so obsessed with Starbucks, collectible reusable cups that you're willing to travel sometimes out of state to catch them all. Ridiculous. Or the highfalutin fake Italian lingo in place of small, medium, and large. Oh no, the cup one, 100% is cultier.

Are you kidding? Yeah, that's not that bad. That's how it starts. Traveling for a throwaway cup. You're buying Starbucks merch? Oh my God, wrong with you, dude. But you know what, I will say this. When I go to Broadway, which is my like addiction,

I will buy a $40 plastic cup full of wine. Which is cultier, having five or more stores in a three block radius or the entire culture that's been built around pumpkin spice lattes? The PSL. The PSL. Oh man, that's hard because like, there's so many stores, sometimes it's comical.

I'm like, why are there so many? There's a store inside of a store. They should have mini Starbucks. Oh, that's amazing because people order a tiny. I do love a mini. It's hard because I get the pumpkin spice latte thing. Like I get the seasonal comfort thing of that, but people are really wild about it.

And it is a whole type of person. Yes. Like you can tell right away, like you're a pumpkin spice latte person. Yeah. I'm gonna go with that one, even though I think it's kind of cute when people love false stuff.

Yeah. Like Reese, Reese Witherspoon. Okay, which is cultier indoctrinating kids into the brand with glorified milkshakes like the unicorn Frappuccino, or making your drinks have more caffeine than average to keep people coming back. I think that the kid thing is more culty

because it's cultivating an entire new class of like new generation of people who are addicted to it. That's how I got into it. Absolutely. Really? Yeah, I would get like the chocolate Frappuccinos. I see kids with it all the time. I see girls who are like 13, but like taller than me.

And I'm like, look, he's in the food. I see these girls and I'm like, what age are they? Like are they in their 20s? And they're like 13. I'm like, that's wild. Which is cultier, making your stores seem like little indie mom and pop coffee shops, even though they're a massive corporation,

or love bombing your employees into thinking they have the most meaningful, eco-conscious, desirable job in the world, even though they're making not much more than minimum wage. I would go with the latter one because it's a whole like Elizabeth Holmes thing. Believe it until it's true.

And even though it's not true, like what? Yeah. How can you lie so much? It's called an organizational ideology when a corporation is promising that your affiliation is not just gonna mean money or not just gonna mean a product. It's gonna mean something about who you are.

And you're doing a bigger service to the world. That's right. Through working there. I've never had really regular jobs like that. Which is cultier, ordering from their secret menu and feeling all exclusive, or building your entire personality around your Starbucks order.

I mean, the latter, because I love a secret menu. I'm in, like I go to, when people are in, like out of town, I'm like, let's go in and out. I'll show you what it's all about. It's fun when you get to feel that level of exclusivity and that like I'm in. Everybody knows your name. Like that feeling is good for me

because we don't feel connected. Like that's the ultimate truth. Like as much as we are supposed to feel connected because of social media, we're so isolated. I think that having a secret menu makes you feel cool. If you're a Starbucks loyalist, then you don't have to feel chaotic. You don't, you know yourself.

It makes yourself know yourself easier. That's the pull of a cult. I'm driving straight to Starbucks. Yeah. No, that's the pull of a cult. It's like, this is who I am. This is my community. This is my sense of connection in a disparate culture.

I lack that. I crave that. I crave community intensely. Like I take acting class just if, like I don't even go. I just like, you guys going tomorrow? Oh my God. I used to volunteer, not because I'm a good person, but because I liked being a part of something bigger

than myself. Let me know if you do. I'm always looking for stuff. I actually really like it. When I order, what I like to do, you know, the names. We never even talked about the name thing. Like I like to say their name. Like Max used to do it and I kind of copy it.

Like whatever their name is on the board. I'm like Bianca. It's my sister's name. And then they're like, oh my God, me too. Yeah. And then I'm like, I'm lying. I just wanted to connect. Oh.

I just needed to connect. We do really weird things to connect in this culture. Wait, you should show what you did. Oh yeah, I did Slack. On the Starbucks cup, you said your name was Slack. Sorry for the listeners. I was like, Slack? They were like, what?

I was like, Slack. Trying to get it. You know, there's a whole conspiracy happening on TikTok with Starbucks because they've been putting up the gay inclusion flag. And people are like, pissed off about it. Like this one, TikToker was like, where's your American flag?

Right. Oh no. The last which is cultier, Starbucks Reserve or Stealth Starbucks. Wait, what's Stealth Starbucks? So glad you asked. These stores do not exist anymore, but Stealth Starbucks is a name that was created by CNN.

It refers to little coffee and tea shops that don't look like Starbucks, don't have the Starbucks branding, but are owned by the company. And they have the look and feel of like an indie shop to appeal to customers who would prefer that. And it was an attempt to infiltrate like coffee counterculture and attract customers who normally would be turned off.

But they would put like a little sign under their name saying like, inspired by Starbucks, but they tried to hide as much as possible that it was like. Yeah, that's a trick. It's like Reels trying to be TikToker. It's Instagram, sorry, they're TikTok. Yeah, but Instagram not having an identity.

I can see a Stealth Starbucks being called something like needles and pins, but it's like something like really cute and indie. That definitely existed. Yeah, but that's just great marketing. Whoever thought of that, that's smart. Because a lot of, when I think coffee, I think like Portlandia.

You know what I mean? Like that's who I think of. And Starbucks doesn't really fit that brand because that's more like all American, like going to coach the soccer team. I really like the nice Starbucks. Yeah. The nice ones are good.

I like the gold, cold brew. I don't drink it, but I'm like, oh, cool. Yeah. Well, shit. Thanks so much for coming on the podcast. Thanks for having me guys. If anyone wants to like find you or get to know you, where can they find you?

I have a show on Hulu right now called Hotties. It's like a dating hybrid, dating cooking competition show and we feed them spicy stuff. It's great. I'm so proud. And it already premiered. It's on TV right now. It's very me.

It's very raunchy. And then I have my specials out right now on YouTube at Helium Comedy Studios. I just released it like a week ago. Amazing. So go comment on it. Yeah. Healthy algorithm, bitch.

Thanks for coming on the podcast. Thank you guys for having me. This was like great conversation about the culture of the Starbucks. I know. Come be a cult member for me. Look on my website for dates. Yeah.

What is your website? jadecataprata.com Okay. There you go. Amazing. So Issa, out of the three cult categories, live your life. Watch your back and get the fuck out. What do you think about the cult of Starbucks?

Well, I know we always like go hard right at the end of the episode. And it always sounds like I'm going to be like, fuck this, let's get the fuck out. But I ultimately think it's a live your life. I think it's a live your life too. Yeah. I think America is a watch your back.

So maybe by default, any business that's thriving in America is a watch your back. But on our ultimately imperfect and crude, but very fun scale, I would call it a live your life. There's such a high demand for service workers right now. You could kind of switch from one service job to another if you don't really want to work at a Starbucks and they are trying to do their best.

I think the not allowing them to unionize is the one thing that kind of gives me watch your back energy. But the language is so harmless. I know ultimately a lot of the marketing tactics that have contributed to the cult like following that Starbucks has are not that painful or exploitative or high stakes. My recommendation to them would just be

to like lower your marketing strategy and pay your employees more because we all know what Starbucks is. There's a Starbucks across every Starbucks. Why are you like paying for sponsored posts? Ugh, anyway, Starbucks, put your feet in grass. That is our show. Thanks so much for listening.

We'll be back next week, not with a new cult, but with a very, very exciting announcement. We will not have a regularly scheduled episode, but we are gonna have something almost more exciting and new episodes very, very soon. But in the meantime, stay culty, but not too culty. The course is on the way. Sounds Like a Cult is created, hosted and produced

by Amanda Montell and Issa Medina. Michael Dorfman is our editor. Our podcast studio is all things comedy and our theme music is by Casey Colb. Thank you to our intern slash production assistant, Noemi Griffin, subscribe to Sounds Like a Cult wherever you get your podcasts. So you never miss an episode.

And if you like our show, feel free to give us a rating and review on Spotify or Apple Podcasts. And check us out on Patreon at patreon.com slash sounds like a cult.