Sounds Like A Cult - The Cult of The Sims

Episode Date: June 2, 2026

Sul sul, culties. Remove the pool ladder and cancel your real-life plans, because this week Reese is joined by guest host Amanda Kohr (@amandamkohr) of This Feels Bi to unpack The Cult of The Sims. From trapping Sims in windowless rooms for “science” to meticulously designing dream homes we could never afford, The Sims has had us playing digital god for over two decades. But what is it about this bizarre little universe of WooHoo, grilled cheese obsessions, tragic kitchen fires, and suspiciously autonomous free will that keeps us coming back? Reese and Amanda K. dig into the chaos, control, queer awakenings, elaborate lore, and deeply unhinged player behavior that turned a life simulation game into a full blown personality trait. Is this harmless escapism, the ultimate creative sandbox, or a benevolent dictatorship in Build Mode? Dag dag. Subscribe to Sounds Like A Cult on Youtube!Follow us on IG @soundslikeacultpod,  @amanda_montell,  @reesaronii,  @chelseaxcharles,  @imanharirikia.  To pre-order Iman's new book, Once in a Timeline, click here! Thank you to our sponsors! Thanks to Article for sponsoring this podcast! Article is offering our listeners $50 off your first purchase of $100 or more. To claim, visit https://www.article.com/discount/cult and the discount will be automatically applied at checkout. To get your new wireless plan for just 15 bucks a month, go to https://mintmobile.com/cult.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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are solely host opinions and quoted allegations. The content here should not be taken as indisputable fact. This podcast is for entertainment purposes only. mentioned custom content earlier or CC. These are like methods for creators to have a more detailed control over the design of their Sims and their houses. And while some are like really innocent, others include things like self-harm and a DEI remover, which removes LGBTQ plus and non-white players from the game. Oh, I don't think we needed those ones, guys. No.

They've done like a decent job at shutting down those modifications. but the fact that they are still like cropping up, I think it's demonstrative of a larger problem. Yeah, for sure. And I do think that that is a risk that you run when the crux of your game is that you can play God. There are a lot of people who should not play God. This is Sounds Like a Cult, a show about the modern day cults we all follow. I'm Reese Oliver, Sounds Like a Colts resident rhetoric scholar. And I'm Amanda Corr, a writer and host of the This Feels Buy podcast and today's guest host. Every single week on this show, we discuss a different fringe group or guru that puts the cult in culture, from Trader Joe's to Treadwives, to try and answer the big question.

This group sounds like a cult, but is it really? And if so, which of our cult categories does it fall into? Live your life, watch your back, or get the fuck out. Because on this podcast, we believe that cults and cultish thinking fall on a spectrum, and not all cults are bad. Like they romance novels or Bad Bunny. But some modern groups are reimagining control tactics in this day and age and are far more influential and dangerous, like Joe Rogan in the Manosphere.

Or perhaps a cult of glowing plum-bobs, immaculate wallpaper altars, and whispered simlish promises of perfect control, clandestine romance, and maybe a little pixelated chaos. Yeah, baby, we're talking cult of the Sims. a phenomenon of nostalgic fixation in modern fandom that's been captivating and occasionally baffling players for decades. So, Amanda, I am so thrilled to have you here. Tell us a little bit about why you're here to gab about the Sims today. Well, first of all, I'm a longtime listener of the pod, big fan, and I'm also now a podcaster myself,

and I'm Amanda Montel's best friend. She asked if I would jump in on this episode because she knows I am in fact in the Colts of the Sims. So that's why I'm here. And what a thrill. I have lots of opinions about the Sims. I first got into them, I think, as a lot of millennial girly pops did in middle school. Them as in like the Sims as like beings, not the games. Like I felt that was like them as a race. I enjoyed that. Anyway, continue. I mean, we do have our own language, which we'll certainly get into. You know, it was this era of when your friends had like desktop computers. And you would go over to their house after school and you would like sit next to them at the family desktop or whatever and just like watch them play games. And I remember the Sims being a very mischief driven experience at that age.

I really latched onto this idea of playing God. Like, yes, I would build houses in the Sims, which is kind of like what it's known for. But I would also do more of the risque things that I feel like those of us who know the Sims associate with the Sims like drowning people in pools or making them woohoo, which is the Sims version of sex. So that's how I began my journey into The Sims. Yeah, I feel like the Sims is such a perfect space for curious little middle schoolers to essentially be like, what are all the things we can't do in real life that we can make these little fake people do? It's funny, my introduction to The Sims is actually very similar. I was watching my middle school best

friend play The Sims and I never played or got it for myself, but I would watch her play. And I would watch Dan and Phil play online. And both of those things together were kind of my introduction to the Sims. So to this day, I still think the concept of playing was a little overwhelming. When I was a kid with the dollhouse, I liked to set up the furniture. And then the people overwhelmed me. It was too much. And I think the Sims kind of invoked a similar anxiety in me. So I was very much, I'll watch you play Sims. And if you were playing, you were like a builder. You were like, I'm going to decorate this room. And I'm not going to worry about the people in it. Okay. So that's like, you would say a valid way to play Sims that people do?

1,000%. I feel like the Sims falls into two categories, the people who, like, love the design aspect of it, and then the people who, like, actually utilize the gameplay of it. And I know both. I've seen the types in my day. And because there are so many culty corners, the video game world, the Sims feels like a safe way into this culty category of culture. And I'm curious how you think the Sims is culty, even though it might look super

innocent and wholesome on its face. So the first thing that comes to mind is the money. The Sims are constantly coming out with expansion packs and they all cost like 40 bucks unless you get like they have like kits which are a little bit less expensive. But for the most part every couple of months, an expansion pack comes out and the way that it's marketed, it makes it seem like your Sims experience would be incomplete without this new pack. And that price. And that price. to just like continuously buy into the cults of Sims, if we're labeling it a cult. The pressure to like always buy into it, that reminds me of a lot of like modern-day MLMs and that sort of thing. Also, there's one aspect of the Sims that I think is both good and potentially

dangerous. So anecdotally, I will say that I think the main demographic of Sims users are women and queer people. And one of the reasons for that is the game is about relationships and relational power. So there's a lot of space for identity building and the sims themselves are very queer friendly. You can have a gender non-binary sim, you can be a polyamorous sim. So it's a fun place to like try on these different hats and be able to express yourself in different ways. But on the flip side, it also like, as I mentioned, really glamorizes consumerism and also this idea of creating the ideal human. There's always more stuff. There's always more makeup.

And typically you need to like buy those things to make that happen. And also there's this like thing called the gallery, which is where you can download and play with Sims or houses that people have already created. And you'll notice that like the most popular ones are always like Barbie doll girls. They're like super thin. It's like Instagram face but Sims. Oh, that makes me sad. And I do think it is those two things put together because I think having such a free space for like identity exploration could be such an opportunity for, I don't know, just like growth and progress. And I think it is for a lot of people. And I think a lot of people find a safe space in it, but hearing that not only like the consumers a bit attached to it, but also I think

there is something about getting so particular in your creation of other people that I think can maybe create some unhealthy self-image issues. I think if you're projecting your life onto these Sims and these Sims into your life. And I think as you're buying more expansion packs and making the Sims world bigger, I think it's very likely that your world might be getting smaller or more engrossed to the Sims world. Yeah, that's such a good point. And I think that's a common trap. we see with video games and computer games. But the reason why it's like extra dangerous with the Sims is you can build like a castle. And I always think like, oh my God, if VR like makes it so that I can be a witch and play in a castle, like I'm gone.

All they need to do is like give women the pencil and... Give women the pencil. It's so real. It's so real. It can be tempting to just like disappear into your pencil world. No, it really can. All of the differing expansion packs and the differing like, fantasy worlds and it's so customizable build your own. It really reminds me of the cult of fan

fiction in that regard. And I think that's something very wholesome and nice about it, where it's like literally just here's a space to make a world you don't have and you can just have it all your own and it can all be nice if you would like it to. But it can also be kind of sadistic if you wanted to. And yeah, I think there's that flip side. One thousand percent, one of my friends pirated every single expansion pack for the Sims. And because of that, she doesn't like fully know what she bought into. It It was like press the button to download and pirate all of them. And she would like be playing and a werewolf would show up at her house. One of her male characters got abducted by aliens and then pregnant.

Like diseases were spreading. And she was like, what the fuck is going on? You know? That's such a chaotic way to play. And I don't know if I respected her from scared of it. Can you give our listeners a little bit of a history of the Sims for those of us like me who are unfamiliar? I would love to. So, for those of you who may be unfamiliar, the Sims is a series of life simulation video games developed by Maxis and published by Electronic Arts.

The franchise has sold nearly 200 million copies worldwide and is one of the best-selling video game series of all time. So if we want to go back in time a little bit and see how all of this began, it was part of a larger Sims series started by SimCity in 1989 by programmer. Will Wright. And by 1992, SimCity had sold an estimated of one million copies and was, according to an article on Mental Floss, quote, the vanguard of an entirely new genre of computer game designed around building something rather than destruction or battle. It's wholesome, you know, you're just designing. You get to play baby architect. So after seeing the success of SimCity, because that was like incredibly loved, Wright had the idea to make another game, but instead of this one being about the city, it would be about a house and the people who lived inside of them. Similar to SimCity,

there would be a focus on building, but the new game would offer an entirely different method of gameplay. So yeah, like users could build houses and make it all cottage corn cute like we would love to do, but they could also play as the people who live inside them. And this gameplay eventually earned it like the name Doll House. It went on to become The Sims later, but the first version of the game's name was Doll House. And fun fact, also according to Mental Floss, the Doll house game was originally just about building. But then when Will Wright's house caught on fire and he lost all of his possessions, he realized that it was people in relationships that matter the most, not just material items. Oh, coldie. I know. I think of like these cold figures who have

had tragedies happen in their lives. And then they're like kind of cites that the tragedy happened because they can use that to manipulate people. Yeah. I'm also getting vibes of like, all of the new AI assistance and friends and substitutions for real people that these techbras are building. And it's just like, oh, wow, like, you're really in a very weird way coming back around to the idea that we need connection. And you just don't know how to express that. That's sad. That's so real. Because if Will Wright's like, it's people in relationships that matter, you would think he would like, I don't know, become a therapist. But instead he decided to create a game that isolates people. Isolates people and allows you to completely control all of the relationships that occur

in the game. Healthy. And for a while, nobody liked this idea, okay? And Wright had trouble developing the game because nobody thought anybody would want to play where you, quote, clean toilets for fun. Surprise. I loved it. And it wasn't until 1997 when Maxis was purchased by EA games that he was able to actually develop the project, right? And the developers assigned the Sims traits like hunger, fun, and bladder relief, which all of them. eventually factored into their general quality of life. Wright also created a unique language for the Sims, known today as Simlish, Swo, Soul, that means hello, Regis.

So, so, so. I know, I like want to go up to people and be like, so-sul. I think that's a good cult. I don't want to say dog whistle, but because whatever a positive version of that is, a little culty green flag, a little plum-bob above your head. My sweet little plum-bub. Okay, also another fun fact is when presenting the game at the electronic entertainment, Expo in 1999, programmer Patrick J. Barrett was tasked with creating the code to show three scenes of the game. One of those scenes was from a heterosexual wedding. Weddings are a big deal in Sims world where a man and a woman kissed as they are wont to do at heterosexual weddings. But Barrett didn't have enough time to code every character's background information. And so the background

sims were just going to enact their free will or do whatever they want. And even though, EA Games was initially against showing LGBTQ relationships. Ew. Barrett never got around to actually preventing this happening through code. So two of the Lady Sims enacted their free will at this wedding. And to celebrate the love of the married couple, they hardcore made out in the middle of the presentation. And it made Sims the talk of the expo.

Honestly, like, as they should. And I think that that says something really metaphorical and important about homophobia and about like, we're all a little gay until it's put into our code not to be. Come on. I love that metaphor that you've drawn from it. That's so good. Yeah. Yeah. And the fact that like now Sims takes a lot of pride in the fact that you can like customize your gender so intricately. And it kind of like started questionably on an accident. I don't know. I kind of like have. this theory that Patrick J. Barrett, like, quote unquote, I forgot. Yeah, everyone's like, no queer. And then they see like two girls making out and they're like, oh, I'll buy the game. I'll buy two copies. I know. It's like it ended up having, I think, positive results. But yeah, it is demonstrative of some bad behavior. Of course. Tell us about how the Sims continued. So, the success and notoriety went on in 2000 to sell 16 million copies and was the best selling PC. game in the four years following its release until the Sims 2 came out in 2004, the Sims 3 came out in 2009, followed by the Sims 4 and 2014. And in between these larger games were expansion

packs for things like parties, dates, vacations, and even the occult. As of today, the Sims has sold over 200 million copies worldwide. Wow. They're like presidential administrations. Like every four or five years, they're like, here's a new one. Yeah. And there's a lot of, not unlike our current administration criticism because they're not going to come out with a Sims 5. Like they're just going to keep adding to Sims 4. And a lot of people have grief with that. I mean, at a certain point, there's only so much you can do, right? Like, there's only so many more new features you can add before it's going to start,

like, not working on people's computers anymore. Oh, girl. Yeah. And, I mean, I also think there's something to the cultishness of the expansion pack model and the in-app purchase model, the fact that it's not just like a, you buy, at once and you get all of the upgrades, whereas the Sims makes a lot more money selling you each of those upgrades individually, essentially. So I theorize that might factor in. Yeah, capitalism got its claws. It do. And speaking of, we just spoke about it a little bit earlier, but tell us

some more about the entry and exit costs of playing the Sims. So it's a little tricky. The entry cost, it's kind of free. The base game for the Sims 4 is free to play, which honestly, now that I'm saying this out loud, kind of sounds like very colty. It's so MLM. Take the sample. Yeah, it's free. But then once you start playing, it again, like makes you think you need expansion packs. And total costs can skyrocket with numerous expansion packs, game packs, and kits,

with individual add-ons typically ranging from $4.99 to $39.99. And those sales are common. Owning everything could cost well over $1,000 at least. And they come out with new merchandise a lot. So you can end up spending a lot of money on this game. Yeah. I feel like the fact that they're selling it to you in little $5 to $40 doses. It's so nefarious.

I mean, it's not anything specific to the Sims, I think. But, I mean, maybe in some ways it is. I can't think of a lot of games I come out with quite as many different expansion packs just for funsies or anything like that. Yeah. And they come out really, really frequently. Like I feel like every time I, because I play Sims on my video game console or like my, it also controls like my movies and TV and all that. And I'll get advertisements for it. And I will like play Sims for a couple of weeks and then like put it down. It's like the game that I play when I'm PMSing or sick or

something like that. And I try not to play it like every single day. But I feel like a lot of people don't have that same experience, you know? And it almost is like the sunk cost fallacy kicks in. And they're like, oh my God, I spent all this money on this game. Like, I have to play it. And then they're not just spending their money. They're like spending their time, which is an incredibly valuable resource as well. The time and energy, it feels like keeping up with the new show where it's always like, even if you're not going to buy the updates, you have to like at least know which ones

are out so you know whether or not you're buying them. And then you don't think about the money when it's in such small increments. But then having you explained it all as like well over $1,000 owning everything together is like kind of crazy to me when that's like money you could spend on your real life. Yeah, 1,000 percent. And I think a lot of it is hype, almost like, you know, how the hype around the boo-boos kind of came out. And everybody was like, oh, I want to buy this. I want to buy this. But then when you actually have it, you don't really do anything with it. And that's been my experience where I'll, like, buy an expansion pack. I'll play it for two weeks. And then I'll, like, forget about it. And I'm like, this feels like a childlike behavior. You know, I feel like I'm past this. So do you revert back to playing like the OG Sims when that happens? Is there just something about the unskinned version of it that you like? Or is that just when you get bored of the game entirely? and you set it aside for a bit. It's when I get bored of the game entirely. I completely set it aside.

I mean, like now I have the castle expansion pack. I have the mermaid expansion pack. I have the fairy expansion pack. I have every single thing that a girly playing dollhouse could want. And yet I still get bored of it and need to put it down. And I think maybe that's because it can be so big. If there's no limit to it, then like, what's the point? It can be overwhelming.

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Find us wherever you get your podcasts. So since The Sims is beginning, it has obviously exploded into a global phenomenon like no other. And I'm wondering if there is a singular cult leader figure at the head of this group. Okay. So I kind of feel like EA Games is the cult leader. But in the same way that the clergy are the true leaders of Catholicism, like not Jesus. You know what I mean? Not Jesus or God. It's the clergy. You don't ever really see EA in the same way that you see the clergy. But the Sims are the poster child for the game in the same way that the saints are for Catholicism. But like EA is like the puppet masters behind it, you know, and they're the ones making all the money. Lots of good metaphors today on sounds like a cult. We're really getting into it. That is such a good point though about the Sims themselves kind of being figureheads for the developers of the games. Like you were talking about the Goth family earlier, but then yeah, there's like all kinds of

these like cutesy little figures with iconic names that you've kind of grown up with if you play the Sims for a long time. And I feel like because you can form such a parisocial relationship almost with these non-people, the creators of the game are kind of absolved of attention or any perception that could be negative. Because I think when there's a clear author of a game or a clear someone at the head, it's really easy to be like, oh, in this new version of the game, I don't like X, Y decision. Creator, who did that, that's bad. But when it's kind of just this ambiguous force and the only figurehead you have where the game are like literally in the game themselves, it's kind of just the complaints wither into the wind. And that prevents, I think, the Sims and EA games from

taking any true accountability because it is so big and the leader is so ambiguous. Yeah, they can kind of just keep trusting that they have enough people that are already in their own little world and that aren't really going to question much beyond the new expansion packs and are just going to keep buying. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. It's like, okay, we could fix this problem, but we don't really need to because we're still going to make money. And that really clearly lays out their priorities. That sounds like our government. So speaking of the regular buying of the expansion packs, what? other ritualistic behaviors are performed by this group. So as we mentioned at the beginning of the episode just a little bit, Sims do have their own language called Simlish. It's mostly the Sims who talk

like this, but every now and then, the community does too. There's also this thing called events that EA host when a new pack comes out. And it's basically motivation for you to buy and play the new pack within the first 30 days. And it's a way that you can get like add-ons and free stuff. It's like, oh, the Halloween event is going on for the next month. So you better write the game in the next month. And then it gives you like a little mission to track. And people online will talk about the mission and swap experiences with the mission. And it's kind of like this group thing that brings everybody together while also getting

them to spend more money faster. I used to play Animal Jam. I don't know if any of the listeners have heard of Animal Jam. It was like National Geographic version of Club Penguin, but you could play as like any animal you wanted. And it was really cool. And they would do similar events for holidays. And now looking back on it, I really feel like it was just a way to keep you playing year round, even though the game didn't change that much. Nothing's really happening. And there's only so much you can do once you've done everything and you've sat at your screen for like 10 hours and you've built so many Sims and you made them

all woohoo. What else are you going to do? But like you were saying, like something to get you to play right now, something with a sense of urgency to it. I think that that really keeps people hooked. Yeah. And it creates this energy. Giafomo. If you go onto the Sims Reddit board or whatever, then you'll see all these people are just talking about the event and the new pack. And you're like, oh, shit. Maybe I should go. I should go. Everybody's wearing this cool new thing you can only get at the new event. And I'm going to look like a loser if I don't have it. No, honestly, I have my Laboooo in the corner. I have like staring at you. And I'm just like looking at her and I'm like, you're kind of like the Sims.

I bought you because of the hype. And it is funny to me how much that fomo, aspect of the Sims exists, given that it is a rather solitary game. Most of the time you're not really interacting with other people when you actually play. You have to take it outside of the realm of the game, or I guess to events to interact with people, which might also be some of the appeal. 1,000%. That combination of having like this incredibly isolating experience or then going online and communicating with the community and then having FOMO is a dangerous cocktail. It can be a fun cocktail. It can be fun to talk to other people about it, but it can also be a little bit night, Troyish. He can get you into the depths of the coalition is way faster than you may have anticipated.

Or it might get you into some murky waters. So I'm just dying to know, like, is there any real tea or controversy behind the Sims? Like, what's going on behind the games? Okay, honestly, yeah. The game is not just about designing your dream kitchen or drowning your Sims and swimming pools. There's been controversy surrounding the Sims packs from the pressure to buy more packs in order to have a complete collection to community infighting to EA's most recent announcement that they were going to be acquired for $55 billion by a consortium including Jared Kushner's affinity partners. Yuck.

Ew. Yes. You indeed. This recent announcement is causing a huge amount of flowback in the Sims community as number one, people fear Jared Kushner and the company's involvement will make the Sims less inclusive and LGBTQ friendly, which is literally. part of its foundation and like its biggest redeeming quality okay and two according to the bbc sims was sold in the form of a leverage buyout aka a buyout where buyers borrow a large percentage price and make the

company pay it back and historically this type of setup means a lot of layoffs and a lot of cutting corners which the sims has already been accused of doing and while the deal according to the ap still needs approval from regulators and stockholders the transaction is expected to close in the first quarter of the fiscal year of 2027. Since then, multiple notable streamers in the EA Creator Network, which provides exclusive access and other networking perks to Sims-related content creators, have announced that they will be leaving the network as the buyout is against their personal beliefs. Not long after this announcement, several creators announced their departure, and the Sims posted a statement on their Instagram account that included the words,

we deeply respect that everyone experiences the Sims in their own way and will make choices that are right for them. Our mission, values, and commitment remains the same. The Sims will always be a space where you can express your authentic self. So some controversy there. Yeah, this is crazy. This is like the true cult leaders almost like betraying their cult in a way. I'm reminded of, this is like a way throwback, but I'm reminded of our H3 episode, our Kundalini Yoga episode. We're in the leaders of that cult. We're like telling all their followers essentially to behave in one way. acting in a completely different way. And I feel like I'm seeing a lot of parallels with this where it's just like, well, we stumbled in to this space of LGBTQ advocacy low-key. I mean, whether or not

we think that the women made out on purpose or not. But we found our way into this position of LGBTQ advocacy. And now we're just going to like very quietly rescind that. But not at all have that affect the game or like tell any of our, I'm assuming they're not being very transparent about this. No. And it kind of just makes their values really clear. And people have been suspecting for a while that EA Games and the Sims has become a lot more money driven. And I mean, like, yeah, it's a business. But at the same time, like, businesses have values and mission statements for reason. That is literally saying that we're not just about making money. And I think that they're starting to neglect that a little bit.

Yeah, and I think it's cultish for the worst in that they're such like a longstanding community and they really don't need to be growing anymore or expanding anymore or like doing anything more than they're already doing. Like we're saying, they're not even making Sims 5. So it's interesting to me that their priorities as a company can be so backwards, considering who has gotten them to where they are. Exactly. It's like that thing that we see all over in different industries right now where it's like,

we could grow, but should we, you know, we could innovate, but should we? Would that make us more money? And it's not even the only controversy that's like plagued the Sims. They've also faced considerable backlash over the past few years from their online community who accused the Sims and EA games for being buggy and lazy and money grabbing. Users were especially pissed off after EA published an article titled Dag Dag Tag to Lag, which listed off reasons why the game could be running slowly for users. Some of these made sense, like users downloading too many mods or modifications or using too much custom content,

But they also said things like having ponds, clutter, kitchen counters, or too many wallpapers could cause issues. And it's like, okay, what? Why are you giving us all these options? Why are you telling us to spend all this money on all these options if we can't even use them? And that to me felt like EA was blaming the user for making intricate houses when that's the whole purpose of the game. And it's so annoying when the Sims keep pumping out and promoting expansion packs that are designed to make the game feel more intricate and detailed. That makes me angry. And they're like, um, I don't know, guys. I think it's just your fault for using the product as we intended. Like, no, I think your product just doesn't work. That's another MLM parallel here. Yeah, it's like a total lack of accountability. And while the sins has been praised for being inclusive of queer folks and gender identities, its racial diversity is definitely lacking. I mean, when new packs are released, they often resemble an existing country. Cool concept. For example, the fairy pack feels like Ireland. going out clubs pack feels like Germany. The big city pack is modeled after Tokyo. The mermaid

pack feels like Hawaii or the South Pacific. But there haven't been any packs, even though there are so many packs that draw from Europe and America. There haven't been that many packs that draw inspiration from any African countries until the latest pack, royalty and legacy, which was announced right after the Sims were called out for being buggy and gaslighting. So while some people were like really psyched about that pack and excited that it was going to be a more inclusive Sims game. Others were accusing it of being purely a PR move and that there are only scraps of West African culture dropped in. Also I mentioned custom content earlier or CC or mods and modifications. These are like methods for creators to have a more detailed control

over the design of their Sims and their houses. And while some are like really innocent, like adding steampunk designs or having more intricate picnic interactions, others include things like self-harm and a DEI remover, which removes LGBTQ plus and non-white players from the game. Oh, I don't think we needed those ones, guys. No, they've done like a decent job at shutting down those modifications, but the fact that they are still like cropping up, I think it's demonstrative of a larger problem. Yeah, for sure. And I do think that that is a risk that you run when the crux of your game is that you can play God. Like, I think you put it really well. Like, I think that is a dangerous concept to offer. for some people sometimes.

There are a lot of people who should not play God. There are plenty of people. Plenty of people who should not play God. Okay. Getting a little bit more into some culty analysis, an us versus them dichotomy is something that like thrives in most cults. But like we've been talking about, Sims seems to be pretty like a solo experience. So if there isn't us and if there is a them, who are they?

Yeah. I mean, I guess I really do feel an immediate connection to people who play the Sims. It is sort of something to talk about or an inside joke. And when I meet people who play The Sims, I'm like, oh, my God, you know, like, it's a fun, like, little bonding experience and it can create this, like, oh, we play The Sims. Like, we know it, you know, but I would say, like, that is equivalent to having an inside joke. Yeah. I think there's something about the amount of time that the Sims requires to really build a really detailed world that when you meet someone else who is also, like, willing to dedicate that amount of time and energy to this thing that you love, there's something really magical there. So I think that that can definitely create an us as opposed to a.

them that maybe doesn't understand. But I don't know that it necessarily feels harmful or culty. And with that, are there any social costs of not conforming to this group? Missing it on joy? Okay. You know? Yeah. I mean, it's just like not being in on the joke. And I wouldn't say it's like so pervasive that you feel inadequate for not having the sins or you feel like worthless for not participating in the sins. But I have been in spaces where like it's like three of us and two of us play the Sims. And that third person might be like, okay, you guys are. literally talking in a language and getting so excited about this, like, thing that I can't participate in, you know? I don't know what the tongues are. I don't want the expansion packs and

I feel scared and left out. Exactly. I do also think there's something important about Sims. Like, Sims is one of the only video games that I really see, like, adult women getting very into. And I think that that provides an avenue for play that women aren't afforded very often. And I think that there's maybe, I don't want to say a social cost of not conforming to the group aspect of it, but I think that there's definitely something to be said for a joy there. Yeah, I like look at some of the more masculine or stereotypically male focused video games and they're just like guns and violence and then I go to mine. I go to Sims and it's like, I'm tending my garden. You know what I mean? My mermaids are having a blast. Everything's great. My mermaids are having a graduation party, okay?

Love that. So on the inverse, the flip side, what are the most devastating? effects of this cult? Spending money and spending time. It's expensive and it's isolating. And I don't really feel good after I play The Sims. Like I feel like great when I'm actually playing it. But I don't think it net positive contributes to my life if I let it get out of control. I mean, yeah, like there are times like when I had COVID and I had to miss a friend's wedding. Like I bought myself a new Sims pack because it was fun to have like a healthy distraction for the weekend, you know? Or if you're having like really bad period cramps or something like that. And you really want to get your focus off your body. I think in that way, it is kind of nice. But when you're playing it all the time, then you are

missing out on your real life. And that is a huge negative impact. Like there's nothing better than being present in your actual life. And there's nothing healthier than that. So to not engage with that in favor of a fantasy world where you have unlimited resources and unlimited funds and you can create a person that you wish you looked like. That is when it starts to get dangerous. I agree wholeheartedly. And last but not least, just what advice would you give to someone who maybe is finding themselves playing the Sims a few more hours a day than they would like, speaking in Simlish when they shouldn't be? The advice I have to give to myself sometimes, happy to share with others. I mean, remember that this game is so enticing because it allows you to design or play in a fantasy

world or like find community. And there are so many other ways to do that that are IRL and cheap. You know, like rearrange your furniture or get into some crafts. Read a book. Go out and volunteer. Save your money that you would be spending on the Sims pack and buy something nice for your house instead, like your actual real life house. There are so many ways to achieve the feeling that you're getting from the Sims, which is sort of like this possibility and creativity in real life. and I would encourage people to find those things so they can fill whatever void they're trying to fill. And I say that respectfully because we all have voids, you know? We do. That's beautiful.

I have in recent weeks found it very comforting whenever I'm experiencing decision paralysis when I don't quite know what to do with myself. Or maybe I'm like getting a little bit too angry on myself. I'm like putting a little bit too much pressure on myself. I just kind of remember like I'm my own sim, which is just a fancy way of saying like I have free will. But, you know, a girl needs to be reminded sometimes. I don't always remember. Sometimes I feel like there's invisible rules and I don't know who's making them up, but they're there. But it's me.

I'm my own sim. That is so real. I'm imagining you saying this to yourself in your mirror before you like go out for the day. It's really true though. Like adjusting my plum bob. Oh my God. Speaking of Colts, I think a lot about how in college when I was on the improv team in college and when we would join, we would like get blindfolded and like thrown into a car and like driven somewhere, you know, as like the initiation. And my friend just got a boyfriend.

and I'm like, I could do that too. You could. You have free will. Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. I'm like, I pre will. Like, I could do this. Also, like, hilarious that that's the message that I'm like leaving your listeners with on this cult podcast. I'm like, you can kidnap your friends, guys. No, you can. No, I do actually have like a very random question before we get into our game. Do you think that people who like improv are more prone to liking the Sims? Yeah. Especially women. Like, if you are, a girly who likes improv, then I would bet your sweet bippy that you are also a girlie who might like The Sims. It's creative fun, you know? It's fun. It's silly. It's goofy. You get to create a world all your own and live in it and no one can tell you what's wrong for better and for worse.

I literally like made a sorority house and built like secret passageways like all throughout. Okay, whoa. Coltception sorority house in the Sims. That's what you were talking about earlier when you said that you can, there's occult packs. It's just like the Bama Rush pack. I want that. Wait. Oh my God. Bama Rush Sims Sims' expansion pack would be insane. When news breaks about Marvel, D.C. Star Wars, or anything else you're obsessed with, the break room is where the conversation is happening. I'm John Costa. And I'm Zach Huddleston. Together with our co-host, Eric Voss, Jessica Clemens, Brandon Barrick, and Gina Ippolito, we help you digest the headlines around your favorite fandoms, casting, plot leaks, interviews, actors crashing out on social media.

We get into all of it. Plus, we do weekly after shows and Q&As for the break room's favorite shows and movies. We got you covered and we'll give you the context you need to have a deeper understanding of the things you love. With new shows three times a week, you'll be up to speed in no time. Listen to the break room for free on Apple, Spotify,

or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Eric Voss from New Rockstars. And if you want to know what's coming up next from the MCU, you should listen to The Snake Peak, hosted by myself and Jessica Clemens. Snake Peak is your one-stop shop for keeping up with Kevin Feige and his brain trust of nerd producers. It's a weekly roundup of all the most important Marvel news so that you can start getting excited about the MCU's next big movie or series before there's even a trailer out. What should we expect? Not just from this phase or saga, but the next one too.

Part of the fun of the Marvel Cinematic Universe is being excited about the next chapter. And that excitement is exactly why we make Snake Peak. Listen for free on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Okay. I think it's time to play a game. Yeah, I think so too. And you're going to be the victim of my Sims game. I'm never the victim of a Sims game or of any game really on this show, but especially a Sims game. Let's go. Well, today's your lucky day. We're going to be playing your classic cruelty or cringe Sims edition. Are you ready? Am I ever? Let's go, Reese. All right. First, spending an hour designing your Sims house instead of tending to your actual dirty kitchen. I think that's just cringe. Everyone's done it. Maybe I'm just saying that because my kitchen's dirty right now.

Oops. It happens. Making yourself and your crush and create a sim, then having them move in together. I'm going to say something really culty, I'm going to say. Colty, if it's someone you know in real life, just cringe if it's a celebrity. That's so true. I have made Lana Del Rey in my Sims worlds. I feel like everyone's tried to make a celebrity, right?

Yeah. Back before we knew how much of a monster, J.K. rolling was, I made Harry Potter and Phoebe Bridgers, and they were roommates. Oh, wait. Okay, no, I can't download this game. Okay. No, I cannot convince you. That would be the opposite of this podcast. Okay, moving on before Reese buys the Sims, calling your Sims your children. If you're doing this unironically, that's culty. Yeah. Spending more times with your Sims than actual human beings. That is culting.

The world is hard enough. Recreating your ex just to kill them with a pool ladder. That's cathartic. Neither. Yeah, I really like that answer. We all heal in different ways. I support women's rights and women's wrongs. Sorry. Women's rights and women's wrongs, baby. Okay.

Reordering the new expansion pack, even though your bank account is close to zero. Ooh, that just made me anxious, culty. Yeah, I feel like that is the most common culty behavior among Sims players, too. Being so dedicated to building your dream mansion that you ignore real world issues and or corruption. Culty, but I feel like also maybe the goal of the game. conspiracy. Yeah, there's like a balance there, you know, like distracting yourself for a night so you don't have the skewy's so you don't spiral. Yeah, it's a little treat, not your whole life. Exactly. You know, you can't like live in a realm of distraction. We are too adult to do that.

Yeah, join an improv group. Balance your Sims play with other forms of play, I think is the takeaway of the day. Go outside. Touch some grass. Well, Amanda, I think it is that time. Out of our three cult, categories a live your life a watch your back or i get the fuck out how would you categorize the cult of the sims oh man you know i am going to say that pre jared kushner getting involved it was a total live your life now i would say it's like closer to like 75% live your life with like 25% watch your back because you want to know if the organizations and companies that you are participating in are doing bad things. You know, you want to know that. But mostly, let the girlies build their fucking houses. Like, the world gives us so little. Build your fucking pink house and your cottage court,

Tourette and adopted money. Yeah. Like, I know you're not supposed to say no ethical consumption under capitalism as an excuse to just participate in whatever you want. And I don't think you should. But I do think it's hard to find joy nowadays. I think we all deserve a little bit sometimes. And yeah, I think just play mindfully. Maybe you don't need every expansion pack. Maybe you just pick one. Exactly. Exactly. That's a really good way to put it. You know, find balance. Stay updated on what's going on. If things start to go south for the Sims, it could easily become a get the fuck out. But right now, I think it's still in live your life, slight watch your back territory. Beautiful. Okay. Well, now that that is established, thank you so much for joining us.

If our listeners want to find you and your cult, then follow it, where can they do such a thing? Literally, my pleasure. It was so fun to be here. You can follow me personally at Amanda Mcore on Instagram. And if you want to get into looking at the world through a bisexual lens, you can follow us at This Feels Buy on Instagram. I know I do. Well, Colties, that is our show. Thanks so much for listening. Join us for a new cult next week.

And in the meantime, stay Colty. But not too Colty. Sounds like a cult was created by Amanda Montel. and edited by Jordan Moore of the Podcaven. This episode was hosted by Reese Oliver. This episode was produced by Reese Oliver. Our managing producer is Katie Epperson. Our theme music is by Casey Cole.

If you enjoyed the show, we'd really appreciate it. If you could leave it five stars on Spotify or Apple Podcasts, it really helps the show a lot. And if you like this podcast, feel free to check out my book, Cultish, the Language of Fanaticism, which inspired the show. You might also enjoy my other books, The Age of Magical O overthinking, notes on Modern Irrationality, and Rulthish, and Rulish, word slut a feminist guide to taking back the English language. Thanks as well to our network

studio 71. And be sure to follow the Sounds Like a Cult cult cult on Instagram for all the discourse at Sounds Like a cult pod or support us on Patreon to listen to the show ad-free at patreon.com slash sounds like a cult.