Spinning Plates with Sophie Ellis-Bextor - Episode 119: Kelly Hoppen

Episode Date: January 29, 2024

Kelly Hoppen is an interior designer who is renowned for working with big celebrity names and is known for her signature neutral palette.Kelly started her business aged 16 and a half, just afer her father died unexpectedly, and she told me that the feeling she wants to create for her clients is the one she had from her grandmother's home where she remembers learning to crochet and having tea.Kelly has spoken openly about being dyslexic. When we met at her office, just before Christmas, she described how music is a massive component in her design process, and that she will often ask a client which song would sum up the look of the room they want her to create for them.Kelly had her daughter Natasha when she was 23, and became stepmother to Sienna and Savannah Miller when they were teenagers, and the three girls ended up going to boarding school together. She says being a stepmum to Sienna and Savannah is one of the greatest achievements of her life.Spinning Plates is presented by Sophie Ellis-Bextor, produced by Claire Jones and post-production by Richard Jones. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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Peloton all-access membership separate. Learn more at onepeloton.ca slash running. Hello, I'm Sophia Lispector and welcome to Spinning Plates, the podcast where I speak to busy working women who also happen to be mothers about how they make it work. I'm a singer and I've released seven albums in between having my five sons aged 16 months to 16 years, so I spin a few plates myself. Being a mother can be the most amazing thing, but can also be hard to find time for yourself and your own ambitions. I want to be a bit nosy and see how other people balance everything. Welcome to Spinning Plates. Hello, honey bunch. How are you? It is Friday afternoon. I am in my usual spot, actually.

I'm in the room that's Mickey's bedroom and my dressing room. And it's looking unusually tidy. This morning I had Joe Elvin, who was filming for Lorraine, a wardrobe, a little piece about my wardrobe, basically. And so it looks really tidy because basically I knew a little camera crew were coming over to look at my sparkly outfits, but I didn't really tidy, I just scooped up armfuls of stuff in corners, in piles, on the floor, on chairs, on the sofa, and put them all on the floor in my bedroom,

so I'm just about, after I finish speaking to you, I'm going to go and get all the clothes and bring them back and maybe try and actually hang them up. I want to have a tidy space. It's just time, isn't it? I'm sure I've said it to you before, but I just sometimes think just a sort of week of time in the house with no one here. Like they can come in in the evenings, like after school and stuff, but just if I have a week off, basically, an empty house during the day,

I think I could get on top of a lot week off basically an empty house during the day I think I could get on top of a lot of things but that is not the life I'm currently living and probably as well if I was living it I'd probably be sad because it would mean my work had gone quite out so I'd have a day of like woo and then I'd be like why does nobody want me so anyway um I'm planning what to wear for tonight and tomorrow. I've got two things this weekend. I'm singing tonight for an awards thing, a sort of work awards in Telford. I know.

And then, get this, my weekend is Telford to Paris. I know. Yeah, typical, you say. What a usual trip. So tonight I'm in Telford and tomorrow morning I'm on the train to Paris because tomorrow I'm singing on a show called Star Academy. Or Star Academy, as I said to my son last night. And he was like, say it in a normal voice because he couldn't understand what I said.

But Star Academy is basically like Fame Academy. So there's all these contestants and I will be singing with one of the contestants who's in the semi-final on Fame Academy in France. And then I will be performing by myself. And then that's it actually. That's me. Two songs. And then home for Sunday lunch.

So all will be well. And I'm working out what to wear. So I've got a little pile of stuff on the bed and I'll figure it out. I'll figure it out. What else have I been doing this week? I've been songwriting. I've been recording. I recorded my first new podcast of this year because today's guest, who is Kelly Hoppen, I actually spoke to last year just before I started my UK tour, so in November. And it was actually really lovely because it turns out that Kelly's office is very,

very near to where I grew up and where my mum is. But you know when you're in your area and then you find out about these little muses on back roads, down residential roads. So I went down a road I hadn't been down before, even though it's very close to where I lived. And then turned left and a right and there was her office. And it's beautiful inside. It's her office and it's beautiful inside. Now, I know Kelly is an interior designer, so I shouldn't be surprised by this, but it's still so nice to walk into an area and just feel calm.

And Kelly Hoppen's signature style is, I suppose, what you might call neutrals, or she's been associated with the colour beige and mushroom and taupe because she basically deals very well in these soft, soothing, calm spaces. And I think it's really important as well to note that when Kelly began doing those things, it was very much a new look, a new style. So she really has got a signature style that is very much associated with her and it's really gorgeous I mean look I'm a maximalist and I like my color but I do very much appreciate that aesthetic because I could actually physically feel it when I was in the space I just felt calmer and I think you know my environment maybe is a little bit more

well when it's good it's stimulating and beautiful, well, when it's good, it's stimulating and beautiful and joyful. And when it's not, it's actually like a bit much. I guess you'd say the same thing with something being calm and clutter free and thoughtful, and then it can get, you know, you need to have enough personality in there. So I guess every, every look, every interior has a happy balance. and it's a bit like music genres I can actually like anything from any genre if it's done well so I very much like what she does because it's done so tastefully and beautifully and gloriously Kelly herself is very vibrant and wise and fun to be around. So we had a really lovely chat about her career,

about where she's found herself now. She started very young, 16. She's now a grandma. She spoke about grandmotherhood or glammyhood. She's a glammy to her grandson Rudy and she has her own daughter Natasha who she had when she was 23 and she also is stepmother to two other adult women uh Sienna and Savannah Miller and she's very proud of her stepmother uh stepdaughter relationship with them and they their relationship with her daughter which is really nice to hear, especially because I don't know if that was necessarily quite such a, I think now we're better at navigating blended families because there's more conversations around it. But Kelly said that when she became a stepmother, she didn't really feel like there was the same transparency or acceptance about what that role might look like and how it would work. So I think she

feels very proud of how she and they have navigated it. Anyway, so when you're listening, I want you to picture me somewhere calm. And I'm trying to remember what her office was like. I think there were lots of calm, nice tones of grey and warm wood and nice black and white art. And yeah, I have to say it's quite grown up as well. I mean, I'm definitely a bit more kiddy, say it's quite grown up as well i mean i'm definitely a bit more kiddy but it's lovely it's very beautiful and as we listen to ourselves chatting

i will also be um bringing on full clothes back into this room too i'm gonna miss it being a bit calmer and clear in here maybe i just should just i don't know organize some sort of sale let's just not even that to give it to charity there's just so much stuff i don't know, organise some sort of sale. It's just, not even that, just give it to charity. There's just so much stuff. I don't need this much stuff. But anyway, here I am. There you are. See you on the other side. Well, why don't we start with the hero now, Kelly? It's really good to see you. And before we started recording, I said, how are things? And you said, very busy. And sometimes in a week, you find one of the hardest things is actually get the opportunity to get into a design studio, designing. I suppose it's funny, isn't it? Because your job probably started with one job description and now it's morphed into a whole load of other things I mean the thing is I complain a lot that

I'm too busy but the reality is that my uh I love challenges and I love every day is different but I'm I've taught myself how to design and do things quickly so I kind of look at my schedule and I'm quite old-fashioned it's all on computer, but it's also on paper because then I circle things and move things and drive people mad to try and make more space. But I've learned that if I can get what I need done in a week, I'm much calmer. It's when I panic about like, how am I going to get, how am I going to let someone down? How am I going to manage it? But actually it's just who I am. And people ignore the fact that I get into a state about it, because they know I'm going to get it done in the end.

And I do. So I'm sort of juggling that and my home life and family and all of those other things that women have to do. Plus get your nails done and get your hair done, you know, just to kind of make yourself look nice. But somehow I fit it all in but there are moments like this weekend where Sunday I just didn't get out of bed till 10 30 and that for me that is heaven it's time that does sound like heaven I did once see a meme that said um being an adult is just saying don't worry it'll all calm down again in the week after next over and over until you die well basically that's, that's my life, yeah. It never calms down, really, until Christmas.

So this is the best time of the year for me because I can come to an end and then I can have time off because the whole world stops. And, you know, often people say to me, you know, it wasn't COVID dreadful. I said it was awful. But those first few months, even though I was running a business remotely with sort of 50 I said it was awful. But those first few months, even though I was running

a business remotely with sort of 50 people, it was heaven because I didn't have to go anywhere. I didn't have to kind of feel like I had to be somewhere. And I think that's the thing is that I think the older you get, you realize that you can choose what you want to do and the people you want to see and what really makes you happy. So I'm in a fortunate position in my business to take on jobs that I really want to do and be surrounded by people that are appreciative and have an amazing team that you can kind of nurture. So, you know, like you said, when you arrived, are you good at delegating? I am, but I'm only good at delegating because I have a great team that can do it. And I think that's really key. Definitely key. key yeah you need that support network around you for sure but

the kernel of it all so I guess is the heart of it is your relationship with design and what's that like now I mean it's just amazing you know sometimes it makes me laugh I'll meet people they go you know do you ever go into into your, do you ever work? Like, I'm like, no, this machine doesn't run without me designing. I mean, 45 years later, I'm still designing. And that's the thing I'll never give up. I love that. I love the relationship between the client and myself. If it's a private client, if it's a commercial job, it's understanding the

how it's used and who's going to be the end user and trying to, you know, I've got this amazing visual, like imagination, I can be in a place two weeks from now and actually know what I'm going to wear and how I'm going to feel and how I need to change something. You know, I was born with this ability to get into people's heads, extract the information, and I can see a room finished before I've designed it. I can actually move things around in my head. So that's the magic that I have. All the other bits that actually make it happen, which is the draftsman downstairs, people pulling it all together. I don't do that, but I'll come up with a concept with my design team on certain ones, some of them, I do them on my own. And, and that's my

mothership is the design. But off that comes product design and new collections and charity work and mentoring and you know, all the other bits that I still love to do that feed me um but basically design came from when I used to go to my grandmother's home like that's where it all stemmed from I know it was it was the feeling of of how I felt in her home uh when I was sat when she taught me how to crochet and we'd have our tea and we'd go and pick flowers and we'd lay the table and having family over and friends, that was what I put in a bottle. And, you know, at a very early age at 16 and a half, decided to start a business after my father had died. And, but it came from that little bottle of feelings, 100%.

But what's interesting is when I was looking across you know different interviews with you and your signature style I thought this is someone I imagine you've always known very much who you are like the kernel of you seems like it's very consistent and that sure-footed sense of who you are not everybody has that actually but when you're talking about your grandmother's house and that feeling I mean I imagine that your grandmother's house wasn't also the place that visually looked the way you designed. It was a complete antithesis of how I design it was dark it had lots of you know I often say I should bring the pictures

into the studio to show my team it was like a a proper grown up old house with antiques and stuff. But it had a smell. You know, it had the cedar wood. And I don't know, it was just all of those things. But I think that was my happiest time. And because I hated being at school, I was always bullied. So when I used to go back there at Christmas. But it was just the way she had created a home out of years and years of collecting and finding

things and putting them together. And there was no, she was not an interior designer. She didn't have an interior designer. It was just an innate sense of comfort and practicality, actually. of comfort and practicality, actually. And I think that was what I wanted to try and capture. And, you know, right back at my first book that I wrote, I said it was always the experience that I wanted to create for people. But obviously, I wanted it to look beautiful. And I guess over time, over the period that I've been designing, there are moments I look at when I was designing and it was all too structured. I've become way different now where it's all more about comfort. And we've just moved into a new house and we have designed it specifically for us, which is what I always do for clients. And I think prior to that, I was designing for us

knowing people would see it right this house we won't show anyone other than who comes to it and it's quite interesting how it's changed but I think it's better that is interesting yeah so you just trying to break that down a bit so the other things almost felt like it had to be a sort of flagship of what you could do and how you're to sort of showcase that yeah I think something more private yes and it was only decided you know sort of towards the end where you know John and I just said should we just keep this private so I hadn't designed it with that in mind but it was um I don't know, it just felt different. It felt like most of my clients would feel. So I was experiencing something that I hadn't really experienced before

because it was always a given that I'd have film crews and people in my home, which until now I didn't realise was quite stressful. It was just the norm to be on a thousand front covers and your living room and your bedroom. Everyone would know what it looked like. Now it's so private. But I think that design is what I do is such a private thing. You know, I handed over a project on Friday night and my clients cried, you know.

And if you knew who they were, you would be surprised. But the joy that I had managed to capture that now that feeling that I had in that very moment if I could bottle that and drink it every day that that's what why I do what I do but how wonderful that you get those experiences also so recent so you must be feeling quite topped up yeah I'm really topped up yeah and I get to go there for dinner on Thursday night you know and I can experience their friends in it and everything else and you know I always say the joy for me is getting into someone's head extracting the information and just getting that boom okay yes I know what to do and then I just go off I put my music on because I have to design with music. And then I know I'm done.

And then my team deal with all the intricacies of getting it done. And then the next thing is the install and the handover. And those are the two things, beginning and end, that I love most in my job. And if I could do that every day. And I always say to people, if you're a hairdresser, somebody comes and you get your hair done. And they go, oh, God, that looks amazing. And a hairdresser gets a compliment an hour later. I sometimes have to wait four years. You know, for somebody that's as impatient as me.

So that's why I take on so many projects so that I can get that feeling at different times. Otherwise, it becomes a bit soul destroying that you don't get to the end quickly I get the impression that you've been very good at kind of recognizing how things are working for you and what what feels to you and what is your kryptonite so that you can actually get the right balance and I want to touch on what you're just talking about with music so if you're starting a new project how frequently is music one of the first sort of components well I mean this is quite funny because I only started talking about this a few years ago but I hear sound and the sound changes into design

I know this is going to sound really weird it's extraordinary so you know with boy George for example who's a musician um I said if you could give me a song what would it be for your bedroom and he got it the same with many other people or it can be a shoe I've had a client say those shoes you're wearing that's the bedroom and I get it and I can't I cannot explain it but I have to design that music for me is a beat and it's always soul jazz funk but it has a certain beat to it and that puts me in the zone to design and they laugh at me upstairs because the young kids have always got other music on and if that stayed on I wouldn't be able to be creative so I have my own playlist that I put on and the minute that song I can literally get lost um but it has to be a certain sound like I'm not good at going to the theater but I'm very good at going to a musical because I'm watching it because I have stability to watch and listen and think about something.

My brain can be in 10 different places. I've sat through opera and designed a whole house in my head just because I like the sound of the music. So it's very, very important to me, music. music well I think a lot of these things are you know like a venn diagram and if a creative folk the way your brain is ignited and how it all crosses over yeah I think everybody's got versions of that um but like the reason why I like hearing about it is because well I suppose first of all I know you've spoken before about your dyslexia and I think sometimes if you're someone who's uh someone who has those, your brain processes in a different way.

It's quite common to be visual and audio, and it ought to feed into something for your imagination. And that ability to look at lots of different things at once as well. Yes, exactly. No, 100%, because if you ask me to read something and memorize it, I can't. But if I read it, and every line I put a song next to it or a visual I can remember that from that yeah that's incredible which is uh and I've taught a lot of young dyslexic kids and explained to them like if you're going to have to learn something

for school when you're learning it read something and think of something that you'll remember so that when for example that question is given to you an exam you'll think yes the cuddly toy on the floor that was that moment so you can relate to something that so that you remember it yeah that makes any sense at all it makes complete sense and I think um well then we you know there's lots of um research has gone into how memory works and how you access things. But I think also maybe the little bit of what you're talking about is also a bit of synesthesia with, you know, if you hear music and it produces an image in your head. And I think all that sort of stuff is fascinating. And I'm worried if we were working together, I think I'd be messaging

actually no can I change my song not that one clients do that all the time they change their mind all the time but they don't do it like that but it would probably be easy

if somebody went no I'm talking Marvin Gaye more and I'd be like oh totally got that I'm worried I'd be like Benny Hill oh I didn't mean that that would be a problem

I don't even know what a room based around that theme gym would look like. The mind boggles. I know. So if we go back in time to when you had your daughter, so you were only 23 when you had her. 23 years old. Same age my mum was when she had me actually. So what was going on with your work then? So I'd had the business since I was 16 and a half. That's so young. Yeah. Got pregnant and I guess six months into it, just closed it down. I remember I was in my studio in Lotz Road and just shut it down.

Didn't work for a year because I just wanted to be with her. But towards the end of that year, I just wanted to be with her but towards the end of that year I was gagging to get back to work but I had the ability to work from home which I did until she decided to go to boarding school with Sienna and Savannah I think 11 or 12 I can't remember and it was just so weird because you know everyone always used to laugh and say your phone was never off. You know, I never I always took her to school, picked her up, did homework, did used to work at night and built a really strong business. It was small. And when she went to boarding school, I was like, I've just got so much time on my hands, you know, and that's when the business really took off.

But the priority was always Tash. But you juggle. And I see the way she juggles with my grandson now. And, you know, when you're a working mother, it's hard. And, you know, I listen to some women over the years saying, oh, it was a piece of cake. And I'm like, you know, you're losing your memory. It wasn't. It was hard work. And you're always beating yourself up that you're never doing it

good enough and never there enough and all of that. But it makes me laugh now because Tash always goes, oh, you know, I wasn't. Like every mother has the same thing. You know, we just deal with it in different ways. But I think women have this incredible ability to multitask. We really genuinely do. We can be cooking and on the phone and watching and learning and thinking about next week all at one go. And it's how we're made up. The downside of that is that you become completely exhausted. downside of that is that you become completely exhausted. And I think what women need to do as well is factor in time for themselves. And I still am taking time to learn that every single day. But I think it's really important that you like every morning, I have an hour in the gym, that's my hour, that my phone's always on still, and my's 40 just in case she calls like you're born with

that thing where you're always protecting and available and ready but it's I wouldn't have changed it and I admire someone like you with five children I mean you know that is like how do you juggle that but I guess you get into a sort of routine of the chaos that becomes normal yes I think there's something yes and actually now that my youngest is approaching five I'm realizing that the thing you're talking about with the prioritizing and time for me is something I've really let slide. So I've been trying to factor that back in, just giving even little bits here and there,

just making sure I'm keeping an eye on myself too. Well, I think we lie to ourselves. Like, there's two things here. One, if you say to somebody, like somebody says to me, like, are you really chilled? I go, I am the most chilled person. And then if you ask that question to your children they say the complete opposite it's the same if you ask your

partner or husband they go they say to me have you kind of slowed down with your work I'm like yeah I'm doing half what I used to do and John will go she's doing more so you see yourself in a completely different light because that's how you've been able to survive. We have this way of surviving, women. So we kind of put things out of our mind and just we're on the straight. But actually, it's the people around you that care about you and love you, the people that kind of suddenly go, hang on a minute. No, you just need to stop.

Take the weekend off. Let's do this. Let's go out for dinner. Let's go on a date night. Oh, I'd rather be in bed. No, I will go. And you feel better. Or taking time to go and have a lunch. So many of my friends have lunches. I never do it. And then every so often, I'll go, do you know what? I'll come. And I have the best time because girls together have such a love. And I think, why don't I do this more often so it's just feed you know what I mean feeding those things that you need but balancing it I think that's so wise about the lies thing

because it's like a narrative you tell yourself about how you're managing yeah I think that's very very true um and I don't know if I find it scary well I suppose there are moments aren't there where you feel quite overwhelmed and I imagine with you with your work and everything it's quite hard to filter because look you want to be working you've worked hard to get the opportunities you have so it's very hard to to sort of start to close any of that down because that goes against instinct but that does also mean that I don't know I suppose I always have this feeling of like I just think I'm going to look back on certain bits of my life and think oh that was a lot I was taking on for and you will and you have I look at what you do and I'm in awe of how you manage it but I think for me what happens is I just get to a point and I know I need some time off So I'll take a weekend or I'll just something that I know

myself. And, you know, I think health is really important and, and just taking time to eat breakfast and, you know, like simple little things that instead of running out the door with a piece of toast in your hand, it's like, what is another 20 minutes? So I think it's, it's like what is another 20 minutes so I think it's it's about managing that and then when you can just have have a break yeah I think recognizing that is good and actually it goes back to suppose the same thing you've done here with your work ethic but having those people around you as you say just to keep an eye on you like it sounds like John's very good at doing that for you and just saying I think maybe you need some time or your girlfriend saying come on do come out for lunch with us yeah and I'm a lot better now because, you know, being a Leo,

I'm not very good at taking criticism. Now when John will sort of say something, I actually sit and I listen and I count to ten before I answer. Whereas in the old days I would have gone, I know you don't know what you're talking about, but actually it's really important to listen to people and hear what they're saying and kind of digest it. And I count to 10 a lot every day because I think that, you know,

it's kind of a bit of my mantra. It's so easy to answer quickly. And I think you have to be careful. And I think when people know you really well, they tell you the truth. And sometimes it's not what you want to hear, but it's important. And I have the same with my staff. I'm like, take time off. You know, one of my staff said I'm going to work from home today.

I went, you know, you should because you've just worked so hard last week. You're a bit run down. Work from home. home yeah you know so it's you know if you give that ability in your work environment as well you end up with a much better base and platform for people to work so you look after people they look after you and the people that are not meant to be here leave and you end up with an environment that's important and I've always maintained that the people that we have working here, we have created something very special and I couldn't work in anything but that. So I think the people you surround yourself with are so important to,

as a woman, to how you get up, get dressed, how you feel every single day. Yeah, and I guess what you're talking about is a bit of nurture actually, nurturing all the things, you know, all the factors that let you do what you do, but also lift you up. You mentioned when Tash went to boarding school with Sienna and Savannah. So these are your stepdaughters. I want to talk to you, but I think it's amazing how you talk about your relationship with them and being a stepmother. amazing how you talk about your relationship with them and being a stepmother and also I think we haven't really had many conversations with the podcast actually about when being a stepmother continues after you're actually not with dad anymore but I guess you must have put so much

into that relationship what was it like well my mum always says the thing she's most proud of is the way that I brought up Sienna and Savannah within our life. And so when I met Ed and he kind of moved in, the girls moved in because Joe had breast cancer and was very sick. And to this day, Joe always says, you know, I'm indebted to you because you helped me over those couple of years. So it was very kind of like immediate and at first the three girls who are sort of two years apart one and a half years apart it was a bit like a great sleepover and then it was like with Tash was like well hang on a minute like you know this is my house and then the other girls were like but this is my dad and so Ed and I worked so hard because it worked to make it work with the girls and he brought up Natasha literally because her dad wasn't around at the time and you know gave her

away on her wedding day and all the rest of it and I was there for Sienna and Savannah and I've never understood when the Daily Mail or the press have said, you know, Sienna's ex-stepmother. Because if you love a child and you're there for the majority of their childhood, you don't just switch that off. And Ed and I, you know, parted on good terms. And, you know, Savannah calls me Mama Kay. And, you know, Savannah calls me Mama Kay. And, you know, Sienna calls me Celtic Wizard. You know, we have nicknames for each other. I'm seeing Savannah tonight.

And Natasha and the two girls are like sisters. They fight like sisters. They get angry at each other. They love each other. All the kids, you know, are together. But it was one of the greatest achievements of my entire life being a stepmother um and it's hard and you've got to remember I'm 64 and when I was stepmother to them that was not normal you know these kind of extended families

so when I used to stand at the school gates I was very kind of frowned upon as the other woman and it was hard for me um now today everybody's got a ex-wife a new wife at this and you know everyone's having Christmas we used to have Christmas together with Joe but we were looked upon as this kind of very odd family but we just you know rose above it um but it was it had its challenges and everything else but you know we were together for over 16 years and it was amazing and I love the girls you know um and they helped me be a better mother because um Sienna and Zavala were very natasha didn't want to go to boarding school but they talked her into it because they didn't want her to be living at home without

them okay so you know if you look at it the best choice the best thing they could have done because they were there to protect her and it was the making of tash it killed me for the first two years. I hated it. But they've, that was a great grounding for them to be on even territory, so that when they came home, it was normal. You know, they still complain that I used to dress them in the same leggings and t-shirts, you know, when they were younger and stuff. But, you know, we used to, we still laugh about the BFG, which was our big, friendly, giant car. And we used to sing to laugh about the bfg which was our big friendly giant car and we used to sing to lisa stansfield and the other day when i saw sienna she went i still remember how you still put your lip liner on like you used to i used to watch you in the car you

know like all the memories are there um and i wouldn't change it for the world well i think it's so lovely to hear that i mean mean, I think what you were talking about before when people say things like ex-stepmother, I think there's a lot of casual tactlessness that surrounds lots of different family setups, actually. I've got my brothers and sisters are all my half-brothers and sisters, but I think of them as my full because we grew up together.

And then if I get corrected or say, I'm not your real brother or sister. It's so yeah because to you it's it's it's different yes but then you realize that a lot of people who make the judgments aren't the people that spend time with you privately you know that would be there when you're around the table you do absolutely but I do also just think what you've done with how you've approached being their stepmother is so brilliant to hear, because I think it can be a really rewarding relationship. But, you know, I was definitely raised, I've got step parents on both sides and they definitely helped raise me. But I think it can come with some real challenges.

And a lot of it comes without a guidebook because you're walking into something when, you know, you're navigate something did you always think you'd be a mum yes yeah I did and you know if I hadn't had Sienna and Savannah I would feel really kind of gypped that I didn't have another child um but we had an instant family but literally overnight there was three kids and um so but I always knew I'd have a have a baby you know and Natasha is like you know I'd die for her like there isn't anything I mean she could be a pain up the ass like any kid can but she's amazing and now I've got this extraordinary grandson Rudy which is the most unexpected love affair of my life. You know, you just, you, you, you, unless you're a granny, you don't understand. So it's a club and you know, everyone was like, Oh, you know, you're, you won't want to be called granny. I said,

you can call me anything he likes, but he ended up calling me glammy because I think Simon gave him that, you know, name, but call me granny, granny, Nanaana I don't care I don't care and when I'm with him my phone is off and I'm on the floor he gets the phone off I am lost literally in his world and you know he'll see me I'll go glammy should we go and build the house and do the thing he'll remember everything we've ever done and I will play make-believe with him for hours hours and hours you know and it's a joy and it's it's something so special um and I know that Tash with my mother and I know what I was like with my grandmother and I think it's a very special relationship that you just have to nurture I totally agree with you and this might make you happy actually not too far from where we're sat my mum lives in the house I grew up in where my

eldest boy my 19 year old has just moved in so it's the two of them living together now so I think you're right about that bond actually oh that's made me yeah it's really lovely isn't it and they get on really well no arguments they just they've always been very comfortable each other's company you know it's a non-judgmental unconditional love situation and lots of good advice going back and forth it's a weird thing though you know I just I wonder what it is that makes it I think because it I still panic for Tash if I know she's anxious about something with Rudy. Obviously, that's normal. You're not, you know, but it's, there's a way of detaching that emotion that you had as a mother

where you can just be something else. And I can't really explain it. But, you know, Sarah Standing, I bumped into her at Anya Highmarsh the other day and she's like, oh, how's Rudy? And, you know, we have that kind of conversation. It's like your own little club. You know you you actually don't have to say anything you just go oh he's and she goes I know it's like you don't even have to speak it's just

grunts and you know what that grunt meant you know that's so lovely and lucky Rudy too because I think that's really special um I did want to talk to you about, so you've mentioned when you were 16, this was a really, I mean, teenage years are formative for lots of people, but to have gone through, you said, you know, school was really tricky, bullying, and then losing your dad very suddenly at 16. I'm so sorry that happened to you. And he was only 48.

That's no age at all. And at the same year, you start doing the thing that you end up doing the rest of your life so when your daughter approached that age did it make you see sort of recognize how little you were to have gone through all that no it's only now I think my father's death was such a shock and a surprise it It took me years to actually deal with it. You know, I ran away to South Africa and hooked up with a band and was doing all the things, you know, was a backing singer and God knows. I mean, I was literally like not in a good place. But

I think because I was brought up in a certain way, my mother eventually managed to get me back to London and I think it was through fear of what I'd gone through and feeling so let down that he had died and feeling so vulnerable that I created Kelly Hoppen the person at that moment which was I will never rely on anyone ever again I will make my own money I will do this I will that. And that through all of the tragedy that I'd gone through, that is who made me the person I am today. But it took me many years to take away all the armor around me that I had created to be a much softer, more vulnerable person and happier. But I can look back now when someone will ask me a question about my father and I said it to John the other day and I went the thing is I didn't really know him now that I said you know 16 years is not a long time to know someone and so I kind of grasped at so many

memories and tried to put them all together um that I'm sure some of them were totally manufactured and not even real, you know. But you survive it. And so out of anything bad comes something good. And so I think I put a lot of positive energy into that. My mother was, you know, an extraordinary woman, but I was closer to my father. So it was quite difficult. And I hadn't seen my mother for nearly nine months and saw her at my father's funeral because we'd fallen out because I decided I want to stay the night with my boyfriend. She said I couldn't. So I ran away and went to live with my dad, you know, usual teenage rubbish. So it was a troublesome time. So I just absolutely put all my energy into my work. And it's interesting because whenever something bad or I'm anxious about something, the first thing I do is work. I dive into my work because I know I can block everything else out. that I got, although now I'm much better at not doing that and kind of dealing with whatever it is and hitting it straight on the head. But I found a passion of something that I love that I

could earn a living from and be really good at. And so it worked out. Yeah. And I think, you know, I'm no psychologist, but I think if you experience a loss that significant and throw yourself into something like work the same year, it's probably a correlation like that. Yeah, definitely. But it is also, it's incredibly formative. And I've spoken to quite a few people now who've lost someone unexpectedly.

And I think it's the shock and the grief, as you say, something has to come out of it that helps you seize the opportunities you have in the day, really, because otherwise it's all so sad and awful. Yeah, and I think I've sort of grown up living my life every day as it comes. And I've always said it was because my father

died so young but I think I took that to a few extremes when I was younger using as an excuse you know I live every day um that's probably a whole other conversation there's a whole other Kelly Hoffman that people really don't know about when I was younger but but yeah and I think that you know somebody said to me on the weekend, do you have any regrets? And I go, absolutely none. Because if you regret anything you've done in your life, you can't move on.

Exactly. You have to just look at it and learn from it. We learn from our failures, from our fears, from things that go wrong. And we just become stronger and better. Yeah. No, that's very true. And I think also if someone you care about

hasn't had the opportunity to grow old then the chances you get to to live past that is really significant isn't it and every day like every birthday is such a gift I love birthdays oh good yeah me too me too so I mean I think it's just such a nice, it's funny what you said about the armour, because when I was reading through stuff, I did get the impression that there was almost a version of yourself that had been put out there. But then over time, you'd actually said, look, I've actually got quite a lot of eccentricity and I work in this much more madcap way than you might imagine. And I'm a lot more artisan and there's a lot more layers going on yeah I'm a bit like an onion it just keeps on peeling you know and that makes sense but I think yeah I think there was a certain person that had to be and that's what was expected of me And I was always very different behind the scenes.

And then I think you get to a certain age and you just go, sod it. You know, like, I just want to be me. And this is who I am. And there's no filter. And I think that it's so much more comfortable to be that way. And I think that we all have this awful thing where you look at someone and you make a judgment. Yeah. And we've all done it over the years.

And the amount of times that people have come up to me and met me and gone, you're so much nicer than I thought you were going to be. You know, and I'm like, well, what did you think I was going to be? It's like, or they go, you're much smaller than I thought. Or you're much, you know, like people's perception of other people that are in the public eye. People have, they've written exactly who you are, but they don't know you. Don't know you, yeah. And, but that's fine too.

I don't really care about that anymore because I'm happy in my shoes. I love what I do. I'm in a place that makes me happy now. And I think I'm, you know know I've started to grow up a bit and I'm more sensible um in knowing what works and doesn't work and I think and I've learned to say no that's a big important step isn't it big thing because I love to say yes to everything I'm like a kid in a candy store every day it's like do you want to do this yes yes yes and then like you know people that are you know really sensible sit down and go,

you haven't got time. And I go, oh, okay. But, you know, I'm better. Yeah. And so it kind of works out in the end. And I guess some of that security and feeling good in your shoes is about having around you the people as well, the people you work with, but also I think family can do that. Yeah. Because it's your people your tribe isn't it oh yeah family can be the most critical and awful can't

they they can say exactly what you don't want to hear but it's always the truth well sometimes I still filter it but I think it's funny you said you're like an onion because that actually fits in with a lot of your color schemes yeah I know do you know the other day, the other day, this lovely girl, Jules, that does my nails, and I always say to her, how's your son? And she goes, well, you know, I'm really struggling at the moment. He'll only eat cream or white food. And I was like, how fabulous. And every time she comes over now and says, has he eaten something else?

He ate a piece of broccoli. Well, I'm okay with green. A small bit of green is fine. Well, the last thing I wanted to ask you actually just back to interiors actually what's the most the main thing people are asking for when they come to you wanting you to design something for them for their home um it's not the main i just think that since covid people have changed um how they want to live in their homes. Not necessarily the way it looks, but definitely how it feels. Like people are much, much more practical

because we lived through a couple of years where we were stuck in our homes and no one's ever had to do that. You've always been able to open a door, get on a plane, go somewhere else. And I think that people, and I've talked about zoning in people's homes from the second book I wrote, which is you've got to figure out how you physically use it. It's not just about how it looks. So I think that that's the main thing that people ask for. And they just want it to feel like home. They don't want it to look like a certain way. I mean, some people do, but it's just slightly more eclectic

and mixed and fun, which I think is a good thing. And how did you cope when you had, like, three teenage girls in your nicely curated home? I think I was probably the most awful mother stepmother ever. But, you know, we had white sofas. I remember from Conran, the we had white sofas I remember from Conran the big Burnham sofas and we just used to wash the covers all the time um and I mean Natasha is the messiest person so is Sienna actually Savannah they're all messy I don't

know how I survived I think I just cleaned up after them constantly you must have done and Rudy gets away with it all presumably Rudy can come and smother anything he wants on my thing. They're coming over to stay. And I was actually thinking about it last night when I was in the kitchen and looked at the suede stools. And I thought, should I move them? And do you know, this is the God's honest truth. In my mind, I want, I don't care.

He can do what he likes. There you go. He gets away with everything perfect exactly what it's supposed to be like yeah thank you so much thank you

wow what love wisdom you don't like the hairdresser analogy you don't have to wait four years for a compliment I can give you one now thank you very much thanks so much

perfect conversation so what I mean about a lot of wisdom in there how brilliant and how much vitality and warmth and kindness is there in kelly i really found her a very sort of generous spirit you know she really uh was happy to share things but also reflects nice things back at you so it's nice to be in her company and uh I'm gonna be honest with you I didn't while we were listening I didn't actually go and get all my clothes I just potted around and enjoyed having the space and the quiet in this dressing room because it's so much nicer with less stuff in it but I do have to bring it all back and actually I'm kind of hoping to find things I've lost a couple well misplaced a couple of outfits I just don't know where I've

put them maybe they're the thing I need for Telford well they're the thing I need for Paris so I better go and find them I was actually in Paris as you know a couple of weeks ago with my mum and brother and sister we had so much fun and in my head when I picture going to Paris tomorrow I'm like oh I can go back to the shops but the reality is we sort of get there at lunchtime get ready sing sing finish sleep come home so I'll have to take little snippets of Paris from looking at windows of taxis I think rather than actually experiencing much but I'll give it a shot I'll give it a shot I'm trying to think what else is coming up I've got a 15th birthday to organize, Kit's birthday is on the horizon. I have got, where are we at now?

Two more weeks worth of guests for this series. And then I've already recorded the first one of the next series, which is what I do to make sure that I complete my contract of 10. It's not a contract with anyone, by the way. I mean, like my hypothetical contract. The contract I have with myself, about 10 episodes and a month off. That is the way I started. I like them rules. I think if you don't have rules for things, it gets a bit amorphous and you know, it's really important to me that I keep being present with the podcast because I really love it so much. And actually only yesterday I recorded another one and I loved it. And I just think there's just, I get a certain kind of buzz

from the conversations I have. So thank you very much for being part of it all and for letting me continue doing what I do because it really does make my heart happy. Anyway, have an amazing week and I will see you next week if you have time for me again, which I hope you do. A few of you did message me with podcast guest suggestions. Really good suggestions. Keep them coming. Honestly, I read every single one. And it's hugely helpful.

Because you know what it's like. I've got my ideas. But hearing other people's ideas can really be something to bounce off. So please, please, please. I want you to think to think sometimes with my kids maybe I told you this already I think what would be a crazy job for like you to be doing while you're also raising raising a family and then the kids have said that's where I got the idea of speaking to um the lady that was a gamer um I think I think doing things like that is really fun. And Fish, her name was.

And I was thinking, you know, stuntwoman, astronaut, this kind of stuff. So just think outside the box and inside the box and sitting on top of the box. If the box is a really lovely neutral colour, I would fit in with a kelly hoppin interior i don't know where i'm headed right thank you so much for your time thank you to lovely claire jones who does all the recordings with me uh thank you to richard for doing my editing and being patient with me with the sound thank you for um lma's beautiful artwork which accompanies

what the podcast looks like. And thank you mainly, of course, to you for giving me your time and your ears. And I will see you very, very soon. All right. Lots of love. Bye. Thank you.