Strangers on a Bench - EPISODE 29: Mushrooms, Mothers, and Dark Hours

Episode Date: March 31, 2025

**Content warning : this episode discusses self-harm**Tom Rosenthal approaches a stranger on a park bench and asks if he can sit down next to them and record their conversation.This is what happened! Produced by Tom RosenthalEdited by Rose De LarrabeitiMixed by Mike WoolleyTheme tune by Tom Rosenthal & Lucy Railton Incidental music by Maddie AshmanEnd song: 'Losing You' by FauziaStream it here: https://ffm.to/losingyou-soab————————————————————————————Instagram: @strangersonabench Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hello, sorry to bother you. Can I ask you a slightly odd question? I'm making a podcast called Strangers on a Bench where essentially I talk to people I don't know on benches for you up for that? Do you want to give it a go? Okay, we're off. We're flying. We're absolutely flying. Big winners. Big winners. Yeah. Hi. First question. Nice and easy one, the first one. What's your favourite day of the week? My favourite day of the week? I really do like a Monday actually. I'm not going to lie to you. Ooh, controversial.

I know, I know. Tell me why. Because that's when I can actually get my week started. It definitely used to be like a Friday or a Saturday, but I feel like now because I'm very much in the process of finding myself, I'm excited to have the beginning of the week come where I can fully indulge into the things that enlighten me.

So it's a Monday. Love that. You mentioned the process's a Monday. Love that. You mentioned the process of finding yourself. How does one start that process? Did you wake up one morning and go like, I'm finding myself now. Do you know what I mean? Like this is on, it's happening.

I think it was an array of things. I feel like you have to go through certain things to realize you're not in a specific place in what you thought you were. So it was definitely a lot of repeating lessons and a lot of repeated feelings where I was like this doesn't feel right and then it got to a point where I was like in my mind I was doing a different approach but it was never a different approach it was always

the same thing so you can't watch the same movie and expect a different ending and that's what I learned from it. And nothing changes if nothing changes. Yeah. What were you specifically doing wrong? Do you know what I mean? What was it? I wasn't prioritising myself.

I was always focused on other people and how other people felt and how I can conform myself to societal norms. And I used to come out to the park and And I used to come out to the park and then I haven't come out to the park in ages. And this is something that I always used to do. I'd always used to wake up, come to the park in the morning and then that's how I would start my day. And I haven't been doing that.

Going back to my roots and going back to the things that I originally started doing, that's where you're gonna build yourself up. Because if you don't do the things that you know you like doing, then the foundation won't be sturdy at all. I like that, I like that. So who were you giving too much attention to? My ex. Your ex, okay. I was giving her way too much attention and energy and I was focusing so much on getting back together and

having a relationship with her that I started to lose myself to conform myself to her standards, and I lost myself. So now it's like, I'm in the process of finding myself and I'm absolutely loving it. That's wonderful. So imagine a human walks past here in five minutes that is like your dream person, right? And they see you and you're their dream girl, yeah?

And then it's whirlwind, you know, within a week, you're kind of officially together, let's say. What are you doing differently with them having learned what you've learned? I would keep us as separate people. Like when you're in a long-term relationship, a lot of similarities do come up and you might start dressing similar

or you might start talking something because you're around that person for so long but you also need to have that sense of individuality and I would definitely keep my own sense of identity and I would learn them as they come and not try to nitpick and pinpoint the differences about us because people are different and it comes to a point where it's just like, you can't expect everyone to be like you. You have to accept the people as they are

and learn about them as an individual person. That's beautiful. Great answer. Thank you. You mentioned Monday being your favourite day. Can you take me through what would be your perfect Monday? My perfect Monday. And as much detail as possible. Yes. And why aren't you waking up? So I would wake up, I lay in my bed for a little bit because usually I have a dream and then I would make a voice memo on my phone about my dream and the symbolisms and what I thought it could relate to and then that's when my cat usually comes up and he wants some love, he wants some

food so he'll lay with me for a little bit. Cat's name? Solis. Solis, lovely. Yeah Solace. And then I'd get up, open my blinds, make my bed, I would brush my teeth, I would make some warm water with some key lime and then I would have some oranges, some fruit and then I would stretch and then I would probably do like a home workout because I really really I really enjoy those and then I probably come to the park, put a journal a little workout because I really really really enjoy those and then I probably come to the park, probably journal a little bit, I might bring Solace out with me, sometimes he does come out with me. Oh really? Yeah yeah yeah. Just dragging the cat out? No yeah, on a leash and he has a cat bag so I carry him in the bag and I have the bag on my front and then there's like a little window where he can stick his head out and then when like I find like a secluded spot I'll let him out and then he don't like dogs

so he'll be hissing at the dogs. How do people respond to you when you have like... They usually focus on him and not me. Like it's always like oh look at the cat but like I don't really ever get a greeting like a hello like that would be nice you know like I understand you're excited about the cat but literally like without me he wouldn't be here so I just like a little hello would be nice. But yeah. And then I'd probably go home, I would craft something.

Oh nice, you're crafting. Yeah, I love DIY, I love arts and crafts, I love doing things myself. What was the last thing you crafted? What kind of thing or what you want to craft? Last night I made a poem. I'm in a poetry programme. What is a poetry program? So we're going to make a spoken word album and we have a live band as a backing track and this poem specifically

because I've used spoken word as an outlet for my emotions for so long and this poetry program is about mental health and struggles so I literally had to get my head down and work for three hours straight I was really proud of what came out after that because I kept starting and stopping, starting and stopping, stopping and stopping throughout the whole week.

And yesterday I just got my head down and I worked and that's something that like, that's something that I crafted to me. That's something that was so intricate and beautiful and something that I'm really proud of to be fair. But usually like I make jewelry or I like to make things out of clay and I'm wanting to get into crocheting and knitting. Like I've really bought the stuff, it's just about doing it now. So I would definitely do something that I haven't done before and then I really love cooking. I love cooking. So I'd probably cook a meal. After the crafts. After the crafts. And then I'd probably do something musical towards the end of the day.

Like once I get into the flow of things, I get into the flow of things. That's when the day, the hours pass me by and I love it so much. So yeah, I'll do something musical and then to end the day off, I colour, I stretch, and then I meditate and then go to bed. Very solid. What is when you colour? What does that mean? It's like I've got a colouring book. Yeah, I've got this colouring book. does that mean? It's all like a colouring book. Yeah, I've got this colouring book.

What kind of imagery? It's a mushroom colouring book. What, there's different mushrooms? Yeah. Amazing. And what's your connection with mushrooms generally? Well, I've done mushrooms. And that's something that has really opened up my eyes

and broadened my horizons. Tell me more. So, oh. Tell me about, let's go for first time. Okay. What was your first mushroom experience like? My first mushroom experience, I was in Battersea Park and I took it in a chocolate.

So that was about two grams. And it was really nice. I was just seeing a lot of synchronicities and like the ground was breathing, the trees were waving to me, I was seeing images in the clouds. Everything looked so fake, but everything was so connected at the same time and it was

really really beautiful and when I think about that to my last shrooms experience, my last one was in December actually and that was like a whopping five grams. Oh so that's a double to the... Yeah, no yeah. What do you get for five grams and you don't get for two? I had an eagle death and that was so interesting to experience. Your ego literally sheds for that short amount of time and I inner stood that the answer is love and whether that be loving yourself,

loving other people, you can never lose when you give out love, do you know what I mean? And love isn't always like a straight line, love is all around. So ego death. Yeah. What I understand by what you're saying about ego death is that you just like, you float

outside of yourself? Basically. Or you're not yourself, you're like removed from yourself somehow? I guess in a way, yeah. You've got ego and soul and when it comes down to having an ego death, you are consciousness. You are the love. You are the soul that you came with. And you are really able to see yourself underneath all of the insecurities, the projections, the societal norms.

You're able to see who you are for who you came to be. And that was just a really nice experience because I was able to take so many lessons from that shrooms experience. What stops you doing it more regularly? Is that a weird question? No. As in you did it in December but it's not a few months after that? No yeah yeah yeah. I feel like Marrano and shrooms, they're. And you can use it for the properties that it offers,

but if you start to abuse it, then it's not gonna have the same properties. Because I've struggled with substance abuse, especially with weeds throughout a lot of my life. So when it comes down to wanting to do more, I could always, I always wanna do more shrooms, but it's like, do I need to do more shrooms? You know, yeah. Can you talk to me more shrooms, but it's like, do I need to do more shrooms? You know? Yeah.

Can you talk to me more about substance abuse? Yes. So I started smoking weed when I was 13, and that was on and off until I was about 16, 17. And from 16, 17, it was constant. It was basically every day until I turned 20. So I only quit weed when... It was only last month that I was fully like, okay, I'm gonna put a stop to this. Yeah. So really recently? Yeah, 100%.

Oh, amazing, well done. Thank you. How did you summon whatever you needed to stop? It was just about me being truthful to myself because I kept saying I was going to do something and I wasn't doing it and then my words started to lose meaning and I didn't like that feeling for myself and it links back into what we were talking about in the beginning. Nothing changes if nothing changes. Things are going to be hard either way. Being addicted to weed is going

to be hard, quitting weed is going to be hard. Choose which hards you're going to take and I'm going to choose something that's going to better my health. So I just I chose to do better. Amazing. And so far you're feeling good? I'm feeling amazing. So the pitch you paint in your relationship with Weed is one that, you know, you're starting 13, only just giving up around now, so that's your kind of, your whole kind of teenage years. When you look back now, how do you think it coloured your teenage years? Like what would that painting look like without it? Do you know what I mean? Yeah, yeah.

I feel like I use weed as a crutch because me and my family, we don't get along. And it got to a point between me and my family where things were so bad. I was like, well, I'm going to use this as something to escape. And I don't remember a lot of my childhood because of that. And I think it was quite messy, be fair and something that I... I don't know, I'm just really... I feel sorry for my inner child because she felt like that's what she had to do.

But it's also like... I don't know who I would be without it. I felt like I had to go through a lot of things in order to transmute them into the person who I am today. Do you, can you talk to me about, if you don't mind me asking, you said you don't get along with your family. Like, what does that mean?

Me, my mum, and my brother's dad, we don't really get along. Like, my brother's dad has been in my life since my brother was even born. And from growing up to primary school, beautiful relationship. And then I went to secondary school, and then that's when everything just started crumbling down. Relationship with family, you mean?

Yeah, we had a beautiful relationship. Up until secondary school. Yeah. And then? And then that's when it just started crumbling down. My mum's favourite phrase was, I was an angel in primary school, but I turned into the devil in secondary. And that's something that like, it stuck with me because if I had turned out this way,

then maybe let's take a look at my surroundings. I'm just a product of my environment. So what was going wrong at home in order for you to feel like that? And I was growing up and I think because I didn't have that like sweet innocent childlike mind or like, I wasn't the same person I was in primary school. They clearly didn't like that. And I don't feel like they handle my chains very well. So, we started clashing and then I started smoking weed

and moving out at 19 is too young, but I moved out at 19 because I couldn't really handle being there anymore. Yeah. Do you have any communication? No, I blocked her her a couple months ago. Blocked her on? On my number, yeah, so she can't contact me.

I sent her a long paragraph about how I felt and she was just very dismissive and deflective and she was very defensive, so she got blocked. And I was like, you made your bed to lie in it. Yeah. Can I ask about your biological father? Yeah, so he wasn't in my life. He hasn't ever really been in my life. Do you know why?

I don't. He says one thing, my mum says another thing. What does she say? I don't really know. He says that my mum took me and never really allowed him to see me. But I don't really believe that. And then my mum says that he just didn't want to see me which that's something that I genuinely believe because you know if he wanted to he would he's a grown adult and we've been in contact once or twice but he hasn't really made an effort so yeah what is there anything for you like replace these figures who have like kind of deserted you? Myself.

Yeah. And I've had to take that role. I have to go back and that's my inner child. I have to go back and process my feelings. I have to hold my hands and hold my head up high when I'm feeling in a certain type of way based on what I've been through, based on what they put me through. So I've kind of had to step in as a role, as a mother especially, because my mother didn't really fulfil her role

as a caregiver. So I owe it all to myself. If you kind of, I don't know how it would happen, but I don't like a baby fell from the sky into your arms. Yeah. And it was like, oh, that's your, you're their mother. What would you do, what would you try and do differently? I would listen a lot.

I would hold space for their feelings. I would be there for them. I would let them make their own choices, make their own decisions, make their own mistakes. But I would also prevent things that can be prevented. I would allow them to go out into the real world but I would also shape their world in a way that I want to see because with the healing that I'm doing now I realised that my mum didn't do any healing. I felt like she could have done more before having a child.

So if one just fell from the sky magically, it's like, I'm obviously going to be learning as I go along, but I would love my child no matter what and I would do everything I can to support them and make sure that they know that they're heard, loved and supported. I would always strive to be better than I was yesterday. ["The Star-Spangled Banner"] I'm just gonna play like, mother's advocate. You know, there's so like hormonal developmental shifts,

secondary school age is kind of a classic, you know that kind of time and parents can struggle to really adjust to that kind of like new, that independence, that new person, that something things developing and maybe too quickly for them or you know maybe they're struggling in their own life and they just can't, they don't have the time to somehow process it, it's kind of changed being. I have heard nicely, I don't necessarily think this is what happens to you, or who knows, but of the relationship repairing itself

back around the other side, kind of like once a child person's been through that kind of development time. Do you think that's at all possible for you guys? What would you have to do, do you think? Apologize and take accountability. Yeah. She'd have to stop me dismissive, defensive and deflecting the things I'm telling her that she did to me because this is my perspective, these are my feelings, you can't

turn around and be like no that didn't happen. Is that what she says to you? Yeah, 100%. She wouldn't validate me on my emotions so she would have to meet me with sincerity and a heartfelt connection and a genuine want to do it. Do you have an impression at all of how upset or not she is by you not talking to her? She likes to pretend that she feels one thing when she doesn't. So like, she will never admit that she kicked me out.

The way she acts in private and the way she acts in public are two completely different people. I know exactly what she's feeling, but she's never gonna portray that. Yeah. That time when she kicked you out, what do you remember of that time? I just remember coming home from college one day and then like she... I don't know, she has like little episodes so she was just like, get out! I was like, cool! It's like I'm not doing this again with you so I left and I never really came back. I was in a hostel for about a week and then I got my house in.

Yeah it's really quite brave of you to do that. I mean 19 is really young to kind of like I'm off now especially doing it on your own. You weren't moving in with other people. You were just, I need to thin her back. Well the funny thing is me and my ex got kicked out at the same time, so we both live in the same support accommodation. She literally lives upstairs, so she was with me during that whole time. The only support that I had was from my ex. And vice versa, the only support that my ex had was from me. How do you feel if I ask you if you're up for reading out one of your poems? Oh my gosh, I would love to. 100%.

Take your time, go with whatever you feel like you want to. they were... Yeah. This was my favourite one. This is my favourite poem to date. There are two poems combined into one. And this is one that actually I went on Open Mic and I won the Open Mic section so I was able to be a headliner. And it's something that just...

My poems flow through me and that's why I have such a big connection with music. Really? What's the title of this one? It's called Two in One. Two in One. Two in One. Two in One, sorry. Yep, yep, yep.

I used to always look for love in a desperate but I promise in an innocent kind of way. My feelings fell into the wrong hands and well, look what I'm doing today. They'd say, children who are abandoned grow up to love people who abandon them. If that's all you know, then what else do you look for? Hurt people, hurt people. Hurt people leave people. I would sink my claws into the depths of my beloved

as I desperately held on. My heart would fill with terror if me and my lover disagreed, because if I was latched onto you then there was no running from me. Now I could turn around and play my cards if I felt that you tried to slip from me. I would lie, I would creep, but I didn't know it would be this deep, because when I fell for the first time ever, my whole perception had changed and I learned many lessons, so perhaps it was for the better. But the love that I was getting was all the love that I knew back then

So the love that was actually bullets and guns wasn't the love that was sweet and fun I never felt complete and even though my bakery was at home. I was always indulging in a sweet treat There would be no wrong or right. I was right 100% of the times that we'd fight and they'd say When you go up in a burning house, you think the whole world is on fire. So let me tell you, mum, the smell of my burnt ashes will linger for us as long as it requires.

You stitched me together. You connected all my wires. The me that was built by you was the me that was long time expired. You pieced me together. Your picture perfect daughter, the one that you could always brag about, the one that was a good example.

Quiet, obedient, smart, I was every teacher's angel, I was every parent's dream, I was everything you wanted me to be until I wasn't and you hated that. Sticks and stones didn't break my bones but you and him did. I wasn't gently taken apart to be sculpted again. I was ripped from my already broken seams. I was mangled into a skin I did not belong to. The echo from your voice shoved and tackled me into somebody who I was not. The mask that you threw onto me is latched and ingrained in my skin. From the moment you opened your mouth it clung onto me and I tried to rip it out from the root. I begged, I pleaded, I cried, but I was a kid.

Maybe I wasn't a bad person, maybe I was just 13. Maybe if you chased your fingers over my scars and heard the a thousand amounts of words that I never got to say, you would realize everything has changed, but I am more me than I have ever been, and that is because of me. I have to share it with you because it ends with me. Beautiful.

Thank you. How does it feel to read that? Is that one, how recent is that? This was one that I did in September I believe but this was one that like it's empowering to read and it was empowering to write as well because like all of my poems come from a place of emotion. And I think with this one specifically, it was just... It was just a yes all around. It was just a yes, yes, yes. This is it. Poetry is my outlet for my emotions because I didn't speak back to my mum, so I would write in poetry and then just share it with everyone else

because I feel like I'm reclaiming someone my power. So when this spoken word album comes out, I'm unblocking her, I'm sending her the link for the album and then I'm blocking her again. Mm-hmm. Interesting. Yeah. What if you, see, you won't give her a chance to say anything though?

No. Interesting, why? Because if she wanted to pull up, she could pull up. So there are ways for her to get into contact. It's just about whether she wants to or not. Yeah, that's fair actually. I quite like that you've given her a bit of a challenge there. Not the obvious phone-based scenario to loop back around.

I really hope that she, well... I hope she does whatever she feels is right to do. Yeah. Do you think, let's try and say one, if it's okay with you, one positive thing about your mum. What have you taken from her that you like? She's very fiery, she's very passionate,

she's very solidified in her ground and she won't back down, she'll speak up if she needs to speak up. And she will stand up for other people as well. So that's something that I definitely see myself. And at the end of the day, I love my mum as a person. I feel like she is a very independent woman. She is so strong-willed and she has a great wit to her.

So she bites back. She bites back. She bites back. Yeah. Seven okay you mentioned a couple of times earlier on like societal norms and kind of living outside of them or not respecting them whatever you want to call it what do you mean by that and also like what do you think the problem are with societal norms? I feel like this is like a three. Oh really? Oh that's interesting, I like it. You know what?

I really like that. You're the first person that I've given them the scale and then they'd be like no, that's not that number. Really? That's not that number, so respect for that. Okay, what about the last time you cried? The last time I cried. It's more seven? More seven?

It's like a five. Oh no. Yeah. Okay, we can still keep going. Okay, we can keep going. Okay, okay. Let's go for... What has been the darkest hour of your life?

The darkest hour of my life. More seven? Yeah. Yeah, here we go. We got there. Oh, Covid times was horrible. Being stuck in the house with people that I didn't like was so draining and because my mental health was so low that's when like I would resort to self-harm and then my mum would fund my weed addiction as well. It felt like hush money, to be fair. So not being able to turn to anyone, being able to only turn id-words,

not wanting to be here and, like, hating myself. I was just like, what if I just didn't wake up in the morning? There was a time where I did try to act upon that. And I was like, well, I can't really properly go through with this. That's just because I didn't have like the necessities at the time even though I still like attempted to take like a bunch of different pills I woke up and I just felt so sluggish I felt so horrible the morning after I woke up

and my mum because she didn't know that I did that she was like well get out of bed it's 12 like you're being lazy like get up and do something and then it was kind of it kind of hurt because i wasn't actually able to tell her that like you know i'm not feeling well because of this thing that i just did so i just had to kind of like suck it up and i showered and i kind of i don't really know what i did the rest of the day but i just something. If someone was listening to this and they were also enduring a kind of a dark hour, like what would you say, what eventually kind of pulled you out of that? You have to sit in it. You genuinely, you have to sit in it.

You have to sit and accept what you're feeling and what you're going through and you have to want to do better things. You have to want to get better. You have to want to pull yourself out of that hole because it's so easy staying so low because you don't have to do anything, but you're just like further engaging in that behavior which then makes you feel worse.

It's different to like sitting in it and then indulging in it. Sitting in it is acknowledging your feelings, feeling your feelings, like observing your thoughts. Indulging in it is listening to the thoughts and like doing things that won't make you feel any better. Like I understand you might not have the energy to like get up and do things,

but you can at least wash your face. On a day like today, for example, go and sit by the window and just let the sun be in your face. Start with the little things because the little things they're going to add up and they're going to build up and they start becoming easier to do. So that's when you're able to amp it up and that's when you're able to like, okay, maybe I want to go for a walk. Maybe I'm going to cook myself a meal. It's things that we take for granted as well. like actually being able to get up and brush your teeth

is a challenge and a chore for some people. So, you know, give yourself grace but don't allow yourself to take advantage of that. Two pair of bands, sir. Thank you. Two pair of bands, sir. I'm going to ask a question I haven't asked anyone. Tell me if it's rubbish. Okay. Because I think of these questions on trains and stuff and you never know until you actually ask someone. Yeah, exactly.

Is there a question that people ask you that you don't like being asked? Oh, what's it like being vegan? I don't like that question, I really don't. And it's like, the whole reason why I don't like it is because I think it stems from ignorance and I think it stems from being close-minded. They don't, I don't, oh, when they're like, oh, like, oh, are you eating grass? It's not funny, it's actually not funny. At the end of the day, I'm eating healthier than you.

So it's like, I'm not, I'm not fazed, but it's also like, don't ask me silly questions that you haven't gone out of your way to research, and you're only asking because you feel some sort of judgment to my dietary and lifestyle. I think that went quite well. Thanks for being the first and you're actually doing a good job. That's a great answer. Okay, here's something I like to do sometimes because people listening to this would be somewhere we're obviously here only we can see where we are. Can you explain what you can see

and how that makes you feel? I love seeing the different shapes and the leaves of all the different types of trees around me. I love seeing the different lengths of the grass that surround me. And I love seeing all the different places that I've hid before or that I've sat in before. I love seeing all the different trees that I've spoken to.

And you get to be in peace. Especially when no one's here, like a Sunday morning, I love seeing all the families here. Seeing the kids play in the football cage, it brings me joy because one's here, like a Sunday morning, I love seeing all the families here, seeing the kids playing the football cage, it brings me joy because it's like I'm seeing the joy that comes from you guys being here and that fills me up with something because just seeing everyone live their life

is quite refreshing and like even with like the little children, little people bikes and seeing them be kids again, it reminds me that I too was once like that and that doesn't have to stop because I'm not classified as a kid but I can still have that childlike mind and innocence if I allow it to come out.

Beautiful. We've reached the final question. So this one, you can either answer in a kind of like grand way or a kind of just very mundane kind of today kind of way. And that is, what are you going to do next? What am I going to do next? Like today? Well, that's it.

However you want to do. You can do both if you want. You can do today long-term, you can do just today, you can do long-term, whatever you want. I think what I'm going to do next is, I'm going to do my hair. I'm going to go to the shop, and I'm going to go buy some braiding hair,

and I'm going to do something that I want to do rather than like feeling like I have to do this this and this because I feel like experimenting with my hair or something so fun and something that I'm I feel grateful to have the privilege to do so I'm gonna buy I need to buy my cat food and then I'm gonna get back I'm gonna craft something on my head. Fantastic. Well thank you so much for your time. Thank you so much for interviewing me. Yes, that has so much fun.

Ah lovely. Yeah. That's a nice day here, thank you. Of course. There's something in me that wants to be free from you I know what I have to do even if it means losing you I'm sending you Thank you.