Strictly Anonymous Confessions - 1491 - Mr. And Mrs. Jones Started Swinging After 29 Years of Marriage and Never Looked Back

Episode Date: June 17, 2026

Mr. And Mrs. Jones (from We Gotta Thing podcast) started swinging after 29 years of marriage and never looked back and they both called in to talk all about it. Tune in to hear al the details including how exploring swinging changed their marriage for the better over time, how Mr. Jones view of guy on guy action has changed over time, their first experience at a lifestyle resort and their hook up with another couple, how far they went and how and why Mr.Jones felt jealous afterwards, how he worked through the jealousy and how felt the next time they hooked up with another next couple, exactly hat went down with that couple, rules and etiquette in swingers clubs, how they’ve learned to reject and be okay with being rejected, how and why performance anxiety is very common in the swinger world, Mr Jones’s experience with it and how he deals with it, how and why having a fluid four way connection is rare but one of their fave connections, how they got outed in their church and what the ramifications were, their own virtual community they created for swingers, how to join their swinger community and what they offer plus a whole lot more. GET A COPY OF THE STRICTLY ANONYMOUS BOOK! Strictly Anonymous Confessions: Secret Sex Lives of Total Strangers. A bunch of short, super sexy, TRUE stories. GET YOUR COPY HERE: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://amzn.to/4i7hBCd⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠  or Pre-order audiobook version ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠here⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠   To see HOT pics of SCARLET plus my other female guests + hear anonymous confessions + get all the episodes early and AD FREE, join my Patreon! It's only $7 a month and you can cancel at any time. You can sign up here: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.patreon.com/StrictlyAnonymousPodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and when you join, I'll throw in a complimentary link to my private Discord! To join SDC and get a FREE Trial! click here: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.sdc.com/?ref=37712⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ or go to SDC.com and use my code 37712 Want to be on the show? Email me at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠[e-mail]⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ or go to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠http://www.strictlyanonymouspodcast.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and click on "Be on the Show." Want to confess while remaining anonymous? Call the CONFESSIONS hotline at 347-420-3579. All voices are changed.   Sponsors:  ⁠⁠https://beduc.at/pd2622-anonymous⁠⁠ Click here to take the quiz and  get your personalized roadmap to sexual happiness  ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://bluechew.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ — Buy 2 months of Bluechew GOLD and get the third month FREE! Use code: STRICTLYANON⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠  ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠http://bollandbranch.com/strictlyanon⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Use code STRICTLYANON for 20% off plus FREE shipping ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://Rythm.Health/STRICTLYANON⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠for 15% OFF your first month PLUS FREE shipping ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://LoadBoost.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠- To get 10% off DRIVE BOOST by VB Health, use code: STRICTLY  Follow me! Instagram  ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/strictanonymous/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ X  ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://twitter.com/strictanonymous?lang=en⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Website  ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠http://www.strictlyanonymouspodcast.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Everything else: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://linktr.ee/Strictlyanonymouspodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Real people respond. You go to Singapore, a child, man. You can't not do it. The temptation is just too much. It's real problem. Your friend know that you're banging her or no? No, he has no idea. And anything goes.

The motto of the show, let your freak flag fly. Probably the only good advice I'll ever give you is to re-hide your wits and change. Here is your host, Kathy. Hey, welcome to the strictly anonymous podcast with Kathy. If you want to follow the strictly anonymous podcast. podcast on Instagram or X, follow the show at Strict Anonymous. If you want to be on the show, it's called Strictly Anonymous because I change everyone's voices, people change their names.

So if you have an interesting, naughty secret life that you want to talk about while remaining anonymous or you don't even need a naughty life story on anymore, I'll talk to people with regular interesting life stories for my Sunday episodes. You could be on the show. All you got to do is send me an email at Strictly Anonymous podcast at gmail.com or go to my website, strictly anonymous podcast.com, and click on be on the show. I also have a sexual health Saturday series. So if you have a really interesting health story journey that you want to talk about, email me as well. If you have a naughty confession that you want to leave on my

confessions hotline, you could do that 247. The number is 347, 4203579. Make sure you're in a quiet place. So many people call while they're driving and I can't hear shit and I can't use those confessions. Some of the confessions, though, I changed the voices. I changed the voices. by the way, on the confessions. And some of those confessions make it onto a confessions episode where I talk about them. All the rest go on my Patreon. Now, listen, if you're irritated by my intros, join my Patreon. Because for just $7 a month, okay, you get every single episode. I do seven of them a week. You get them early. You also get them intro and ad free. Okay. You also see anonymous hot picks of all of my guests. That is all over on my Patreon. Like I said, it's only $7 a month.

and you could cancel it any time. Now listen, if you join my Patreon, I always tell people that I will throw in a link to my private Discord. Now, my private Discord is a place where everyone gets to talk to each other. My Discord is super fun. I have over 6,000 people that signed up over there. Everyone talks to each other. People are hooking up over there. We have a lot of contests. We have a dick pick contest coming up. Okay, you can win 350 bucks, I think, is what I give for the contest. That is starting on May 15th. And it will run for a month. So make sure to sign up to Patreon to get into Discord so you could take part in that. You could also get a link to my private Discord if you buy my book. I have a new book out. It's called Strictly Anonymous. Confession, Secret Sex Lives of Total Strangers. That book is available

in paperback as well as an e-book. And the audiobook is finally available for pre-order. It's hard to find because it's still on pre-order. But if you go to the description, the links to the books on Amazon as well as the Audible book are in the description. If you buy the book, just send me a screenshot and I'll send you the link to my private Discord. You'll love my Discord. Okay, it's great. You'll also love my Patreon. It's great. Last thing I want to talk to tell you about is I do have a great free trial that you could use for SDC.com. SDC.com is like the world's largest online adult dating site, but it's so much more than a dating site. I mean, you can use it to hook up with people instead of threesomes and all the kind of stuff that people do on my show.

But you can also use it to find out about meetups and events in your areas, as well as learn stuff about the lifestyle. They have so much information on SDC.com. And if you use my code 37712, you'll get a free trial. That's 37712. Or just go to the description and click on the link. And it'll take you right there and set you up with a free trial. So anyway, today I have on Mr. and Mrs. Jones from We Got a Thing podcast.

Now listen, I get why they have a podcast because they are so well-spoken, well-versed. They know so much when it comes to swinging because they are swingers, okay, but they didn't start swinging until they were like literally 29 years into their marriage. And we totally get that whole story. They dove right in, wait to hear their first experience. And after that, they continued on. And they talk about the bumps in the road. Mr. Jones experienced some jealousy.

Like right from the get-go, he talks about that. But that didn't deter them. They continued on and they talked about how they went to all different kinds of clubs and resorts and hotel takeovers and all that kind of good stuff, trying to figure out what was like the right thing for them. And they talk about what was the right thing for them, which was couples, hooking up with couples. They love a couple swaps.

They talk about that. They talk about so much more. They're very good at educating people on the topic. So you're going to learn a lot when you on this. episode, they talk about, you know, their experiences at swinger clubs, at hotel takeovers, experience with jealousy. Mr. Jones was very jealous the first time he saw his girl with another guy and he talks about that and how he worked through it. He talks a lot about how, you know, some guys have issues sometimes getting it up when they, when in the lifestyle. They talk about

how they were outed. Wait till the end. At the end, they bring up, they were like outed in their church for being swingers. Oh my God. They talk about that experience at the end. And But before we get to that part at the end, we do talk about their whole story. And like I said, you're going to learn a lot. They're great. Like I said, I get why they started a podcast. They talk about their journey more on their podcast called We Got a Thing. They also have a great community. We Got a Thing Community. I'm going to put the link to it in the description. They explain that community. That's where they get all their hookups now. I was like, what dating app do you use to get all your couples because they love couple swapping? It's like,

oh, we don't even need a dating app anymore. They get it through their whole community. They have a big community of people, and they talk about that community, how you could join. That's towards the end. And the link will be in the description. But you're going to love them. I love talking to them. So I'm going to get right to it and be right back on with Mr. and Mrs. Jones. This is the strictly anonymous podcast.

Strictly anonymous podcast. Hi, Mr. Mrs. Jones. Welcome to the Strictly Anonymous podcast. You guys have a podcast. We got a thing. That's your podcast, right? So why don't you explain to people before?

I'd love to get like your backstory because you guys have been swingers, right? Would you call yourself swingers and you've been doing it for a long time? Correct? Yeah, that's correct. We started in the lifestyle, a non-monogamous lifestyle probably what, 13, 14 years ago. And at the end of the first year, I kept, we were a little frustrated because back then, as you remember, there weren't a lot of podcasts out on about non-monogamy. and the very few that were out had a very different style and approach.

And I kept telling Mrs. Jones, I said, you know, one day when we start our podcast, we're not going to do it that way. We're going to tell our story, our way. And, you know, there's got to be other people out there that would relate to our story. So finally, I strong arm for into the idea. I'm a former educator. So, you know, that and Mr. Jones did a lot of public. and knowledge sharing in his career.

So I think we just kind of both approached it. Like, let's pay this forward because we're having to figure out everything the hard way. And, of course, you can listen to all the podcasts you want and still have to figure it out the hard way. But at least we try to give people something to think about. Yeah, we call ourselves a what if podcast and not a how to. So we like to throw out things, topics that we've struggled with and gone through. that way when our listeners email us and they'll say we hit the pause button and we started talking about that very topic. So the idea is, you know, they know what they need to talk about and discuss as they begin to explore on their journey. Yeah. And I don't know about you, but what I notice in the past like I think I've been doing it 11 years now. Like, you know, in the beginning, I feel like I probably had a lot more guys listening. Nowadays, I get a lot more emails from couples that are saying like, oh, you know what I mean? And that's something that's, you know what I mean? And that's something that's, you know,

definitely changed over the years. More women, but also more couples, and they are coming and listening, and they're telling me, like, they're listening together and it's, you know, got them into the lifestyle, or they press pause and they talk about it and all that kind of stuff. And that's, that's sort of new. That wasn't something I was getting 10 years ago. Yeah, yeah, we do have many more ladies and couples. Right? Because we are a long-time married couple. I mean, we were married 29 years before we even Oh, I love that. The lifestyle.

So it was turning the ship of our relationship slowly because when you're together that long and you've got habits that you've formed and the way that you do things, it was a little bit of a struggle that I think most couples that have been married a long time, you know, have to go through as well. But also, you know, we want whatever we do, it's really to benefit our relationship. And, you know, the podcast is kind of a secondary item. We share that in case we can help other people. But we have found that through this whole experience of exploring our open sexuality and open relationship, that it's really helped us as a couple as well. Yeah, that's one thing.

It's one of my favorite things to ask a couple or even if I'm just talking to one person of the couple at the end is like, how has it changed your marriage as a couple who was like monogamous? And now you're non-monogamous. Like, what do you see is the difference? And so many, times it's like the opposite of what the vanilla world would think, right? They're closer because of it. And that's what I always say my show is here to say. I'm not here to say. I'm not even a swinger. I'm like a vanilla person just learning from people this whole time. You know, now I feel like I would be a fucking swinger and I want to be like all the people who call into my show. But like I always say like, you know, I'm not here to say that everyone should do this. Like, you know what I mean? I'm just saying

though because and this is what I think is important that, you know, because a lot of times I hear other people on other podcasts, just regular ones, vanilla ones, talking about. when they hear a non-monogamous couple or whatever. They all just talk about how it's like doomed for failure. Like the regular world out there, a lot of vanilla people think the minute you open up your relationship, it would never work. And I'm like, my show's here to say, like, not only can it work, like you could be closer and better because of it.

And I have 1,400 people that I've talked to who prove that. And I love especially couples like you because sometimes I'll get comments, well, let's hear from them 10 years from now. You know what I mean? You guys are 13 years from then and 29 years or whatever, how many years, right? down, you've been doing it and you're still doing it and you're happier because of it. Yeah, we are. And I think what we've learned after all this time is, you know, at first, it's, it's really exciting. It's a bit of a novelty and it's really fun, energizing. You know,

you're, you're feeling like you used to feel when you were in high school. Yeah, you're running on all kinds of hormones. Yeah. Oh, you get that adrenaline like in the beginning. Right. Definitely. But after a while, just like having sex with your partner, it becomes a little bit more normal. And what we realized, what we did not expect, and I think this is the main gist of our community in our podcast, is we're a social first, sexy, second approach to non-monogamy.

And we have made so many friends, so many lifelong friends, and we have just enjoyed getting to know people for who they are. Because if you can talk about sex, if you can talk about having sex with each other, other people, you can pretty much talk about anything. So it really does accelerate the pathway to a really strong connection with,

and not even necessarily polyamers, but just, you know, strong connections with friends. And really that's become the most important thing to us right now. So it's like you're also love the community, right, is you're a part of it. Like this is, that's why they call it the lifestyle. It is a lifestyle. It's more than just sex. Yeah, exactly. And yeah, I mean, we have our own virtual community, but just the community in general. Yeah, exactly, right?

Yeah, we were at a pride event in our city last Saturday. And one of the guys standing next to me, he's an elderly guy, and he looked out and he says, isn't it great to watch these kids just enjoy themselves and relax? And I said, you know, it's a shame that you have to have a festival to go to a place where you can be yourself. But that, in effect, is very similar to the non-monogamous community. You know, we, we aren't, it's not everywhere and not accepted everywhere. And I think misunderstood a lot. But there is that feeling that you get when you're surrounded by your people, quote

unquote, that you can be yourself and express yourself in ways that you never thought you could. Yeah, I love that. I would like to, I do want to hear like your guy's story. I just want to ask you a quick question because he said you were at a pride parade. And like what was one of the things, and this is just like off topic. It was like one of the things that I was like definitely surprised by when I first started doing my podcast and talking to people about how like there still is a stigma for guy and guy action even inside like a swingers club, even inside that world where people you're supposedly so open minded. Why is guy and guy action still so stigmatized? Do you have any idea or do you see it or is it not a part of like the world that you live in?

I think that's a great question. And unfortunately you're right. I just think that I think it's harder for men to let their guard down. I don't know. You know, society is wired men in such a strict fashion. Totally. I can speak from my personal experience, Kathy. You know, as growing up as a guy, I was never really super proud of my body.

And, you know, I didn't. I was never finding myself attractive. The male physique really didn't. attract me. And he's wrong because he's a haughty. Thank you, honey. But I think what I've learned over the years, though, is that when we're in bed with another couple

or when we're at a clothing optional resort and the male anatomy is exposed to me in a different way and I'm watching my wife enjoy that and he's close to me and we make contact and I realize it didn't change me instantly. And I began to appreciate the

body a little bit more and and over a period of time I'm able to reflect and say now why why is it that I was so anti you know touching another guy or or had these homophobic tendencies but I found that I just needed to immerse myself in this environment for a while and now I see the male body in a totally different way it doesn't wig me out I don't I don't consider myself bisexual but but I can't appreciate, you know, another man's body. And so I think it's just something that we just have to retrain ourselves. Okay. Now, I don't know if you're like me, but for me, okay, good night's sleep is a non-negotiable. How well I sleep affects everything, my energy, my mood,

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Find out more at Cadillac Canada.ca. Luxury sales claim based on S&P Global Mobility Canadian New Vehicle Total Registrations for calendar year 2025 for the Cadillac definition of luxury. Spotify, it's Jay Shetty. Are you one of those media strategy people? scrolling through spreadsheets, searching for an audience that pays twice as much attention to your ads than they do on social? Let me introduce you to fans. And they're here with me on Spotify. Trust me, I know fans. They don't skip. They stay for hours. They don't move on. They manifest. They're not a demographic group. They're fans. Spotify advertising. You're among fans. It's a mistake to have an expectation that this is going to happen and change overnight,

even if we understand, you know, how and how it happens. It's going to take a while. But I have certainly personally changed a lot in that regard. Well, I have a 10-year-old son, and I believe that the younger generation has completely changed already. Like, I think the heterosexual male is, like, the minority in all the shows that I watch with my son. Like, everybody on the shows, we watch all the young kids in high school and all your middle school, they're all like dating. each other. No one's everyone's by. No one's even practically gay. You know what I mean? They're just open. So I think it's definitely different. But I know for older people that stigma still exists. And that was just weird to me that it's still even in that world, you know? So let's get your guy's

story. So now, so how long were you married before you decided to get in 29 years you were married first before you got into the thing or you're married now 29 years total? No, we were married 29 years when we decided. that we wanted to try out a clothing optional resort. Okay. How old were you when you got married? But how old were you guys getting married? You don't sound that old.

We were babies. Yeah. It was arranged marriage. No, I'm kidding. No, we got married like right out of college. Okay. Okay, cool. Okay.

So we, and all we wanted to do was find a clothing optional resort with a sexy vibe. So we could just, you know, kind of go have a sexy vacation and have fun with each other. and the resort we found was lifestyle friendly. And I didn't know what the word lifestyle meant when I was reading that word on trip advisor.

Interesting. There were no pictures? Well, not that kind of picture, right? Yeah, of course. Like they showed that they had like sexy areas and then I, you know, I saw that they had a playroom and I'm like, okay, well, it's not a playground. There's no kids there. Like, what is that? So over time, we started realizing what kind of resort it was.

And I was like, honey, I don't think this is a great idea. I think maybe we should like regroup here and find a different place to go. And he was like, no, no, no, let's go try it out. And we'll just be flies on the wall that we don't have to do anything. Let's just go be flies on the wall. And it's going to be great entertainment. So we were like, okay. But then as we started kind of researching the swinging lifestyle,

then all the scenarios will come up, you know, like the pillow talk. Well, what if this happened? Would we freak out? Like, or would that turn you on? And just these like, what if, like, playful scenarios started coming up all, like, every night at dinner. I mean, luckily we were empty nesters and didn't have to like. I was going to ask right after kids. Right.

Yeah. So anyway, we went and, you know, they had a lot of ups and downs that week, but we ended up meeting a couple about our age, during the headlights as well, they didn't really know what they were doing either, and they were just this super fun laid-back couple. And my goal for the week,

what we landed on is I would find a pretty girl on the dance floor and kissed her. Okay. You know, because that was like your goal. Throughout our marriage leading up to this, like Mr. Jones would always say. I may have suggested this. That would be good at your fantasy.

He would always joke around and say, well, someday when we have a threesome and I'd be like, ha ha, yeah, right. And this was like just the running joke on our marriage. So I'm like, honey, I'll find a girl and I'll make out with her on the dance floor. And then we can check that box. And he's like, okay, here we go. So anyway, we met this couple and it was just really easy with them. Like, sure enough, she and I kissed on the dance floor.

And then I was like, well, that was fun. you know, like what else could like we try out? And she was kind of, they were in the same mindset. So as the week went on, we just played a little bit more each day and kind of talked about things that we'd like to try out together. And it was just way too easy and natural. Well, then we got on the plane and flew home. And then we were saying, what in the hell did we just do?

Because you come back to reality. Well, that's what happens. Like when you experiment with this stuff, when you're like literally, of the country and like not a care in the world for a week, right? Like literally on vacation. You're not in your life at all. Truly. Right. Yeah. Truly. Like the rules don't need to apply as much. So, but then you come home and you're in your face with reality. And then you're like, okay, did we just mess up on marriage? Are we okay? Yeah. And we were and we were both like,

yeah, we're all right. That was kind of fun. Yeah, but let me ask you this. Did you just hook up with the woman or did you guys do like a soft swap? Like, how far did you? you guys take it. Oh, he ended up doing everything. Oh, you're kidding. Oh, it was a slippery slope. In one week. Yeah, in one week. But then we came home and I had a little bit of a bout of jealousy. So we took the next eight months after that to kind of regroup, start from scratch and say, okay, if we're going to do this, we need to educate ourselves. We need to go to different types of events. Let's go to a hotel takeover. Let's go to a club. Let's go. Let's go. Let's go. date other couples, you know, let's go to a house party. Well, to back up, when he had, when he came

home and had his little issue with, with jealousy, he couldn't really like even figure out that that was the word that he was experiencing. Yeah, I got it. It took some time to figure that out. And then as we were talking, I was like, okay, well, we're done. Like, we're done with the lifestyle. Of course, right. Because this is not worth it. Like, we have. a great marriage and we don't need to mess it up by sticking our toe in something that we really don't need to do. But I was saying, well, wait a minute. If I'm jealous, that means I have an issue.

What, you know, what is it that's making me jealous? And I had to really work through a lot of that. And I said, if we get out of it, whatever's bothering me is still there, whatever the root cause of this is is still there. So I'd rather keep working on this so I can figure this out. Interesting. But my instinct was to protect our marriage. Yeah.

You don't want to make your husband jealous. No one not I heard his feelings. Yeah, of course. That was devastating. Yeah, I can imagine. Of course. And you're like, you're, like, you guys had it, like you said, you have, you had a great, like, sex life at that time. Like, this was only going to add to it.

But the last thing you wanted was for it to hurt your marriage, and that's obvious. But let me ask you this. How did you work through that in those eight months, Mr. Jones? Do you know, like, what, what helped you? Or was it just a matter of, like, getting in there again and experiencing. it and maybe seeing it different or something. Like, how did you like work through that jealousy? Well, it was just, I run a lot.

So every morning when I would run, I would just run the scenario over in my head because I have two, it was like I had the devil on one shoulder and the angel on the other shoulder. And I'm thinking, this guy, like, he might fall in love with my wife. And then my sensible side would have like, wait a minute, he's 2,500 miles away. Right. you know how can he possibly do that and then so it was this back and forth and i'm like the reality of the situation was so far from the emotion that i was feeling i just had to convince myself

to let let that go and let's be logical about this and you've got this fear you need to work through and then i thought really the only way for me to work through this is this for us to get back on the bike uh and try again because i think a lot i think what happened to me and what happens to a lot of gentlemen, as we've learned from our listeners, is a lot of men want to get into this because of the sexy fun. You know, they either, you know, they want to have sex with other people or it's just they think they want to watch. They think they, yeah, and normally the ladies are a little bit more hesitant. Well, what, why am I not good enough? You know, why do we want to do this? Well, then what happens is you, the couple decides to start exploring and all of a sudden the female is empowered

by it all of this and feels good about her body and is able to now express her sexuality. And then I'm looking across the bed going, well, wait a minute. She said she didn't want to do this, but now she's getting way ahead of me. Wait a minute. My boy's having sex with another guy. I think guys just don't like play the whole scenario out of their mind. Yeah, we can be, as Mrs. Jones likes to say, we can be, guys can be blockheads every once in a while. So it just took me a while to work through that.

But once I did, you know, then it was we were kind of off to the races after that and able to really move forward and try different things. Now, the second time, like did it come back? Eight months later, you said that's what happened. Like eight months goes by, you decide let's go and see other different kinds of places. Like, what do you do? Did you go to like a swinger club first? Do you remember like the different places you went?

And why don't you explain your experiences of those places and how they were different? Or, you know, or how, what I went down? couple experiences were just dates with another couple. Oh, okay. So using, you know, the lifestyle dating websites to make connections with another couple. Actually, Mr. Jones had a business trip on the West Coast, and we, on one of the websites, she can do like this little rendezvous, and you can look for people like in the zip code that you're going to be traveling to, too.

And we ended up finding just the right couple. And again, they were literally 3,000 miles away from home. And they were just the perfect couple for us. They were like really low-key. Well, they were more experienced. Yeah, they were very experienced. Talking to them was super helpful. Yeah, yeah.

So the communication has always been a key, of course. But we told them, hey, this is our pathway so far. I've struggled a little bit. we really attracted to you guys. You know, if you're interested in moving at our pace, you know, we'd love to do that, and they were gracious. And, you know, so we had that first experience after eight months, and I was holding my breath. And I came out of that and saying, you know what, that was fun.

I didn't experience this again. So let's be a little bit more confident the next time. And let's be a little bit more confident the next time. So to answer your question, we went to a hotel takeover. we went to a lifestyle convention in New Orleans. You know, we just, we started, we went back to the resort, the clothing optional resort. We went to a house party. We didn't have any clubs in our area, but we wanted to try all these different things to

figure out what it was that, how we wanted to engage. What is the most authentic way for us to engage and do this the way that we wanted to do it? So we just tried a little bit of everything. What was it? Yeah, what did you find? You go on. Well, we found that we were having the best connections when we took our time and it was, you know, getting to know a couple first and then playing with them. Like some people really get into that, that just hooking up with a couple, like at a club, for example.

Right. And just having like crazy sex for 30 minutes and then going home. And they're like, oh, look what we just did. Like that was incredible. And that is, that's very fun. But, but I think we were the, have the most, we're most confident when we take a little bit of time to get to know somebody to make sure that they're going to be a good fit for us. And vice versa. Now, Mrs. Jones, have you ever, did you in the early on or at any time ever have any kind of jealous feelings or weird feelings about anything yourself?

Not really, which is so funny. because as we were preparing to go to that lifestyle resort the first time, I'm an only child. And I'm like, I don't know how this is going to go because like, I'm an only child. I don't share. Oh, I've never had to share before. Yeah.

You know, and now, I don't know, I guess maybe now I do have the opportunity to share, you know, after growing up as an only child. And it didn't bother me at all. And I think one of the things that, the swinging lifestyle really does is it really helps women regain their inner identity. I mean, you know, when you become a mom, like, nature just makes you, like, be a mom number one. Like, that's just the way we're wired and that's how we survive as humans, you know? And that part of you, you know, it gets to be put to bed a little bit as your kids grow up and they get on their own.

or you're a wife or you're a career person. Like we have all of these segregated identities. But when you get into the swinging lifestyle, all of a sudden you're looking inside yourself a lot. That's interesting. And you're working in the mirror less and less because at some point you're like, yeah, I could do 50 more push-ups this morning,

but it really ain't going to make it a difference, you know, in the scheme of things. And we want to be fit and healthy, but you also kind of have to accept your body where it is in your life journey at the time. And if people don't find that attractive, then that's fine. They'll move on to somebody else.

Well, and I like to, what I like to say about friendships with women is growing up and coming up in a corporate world like I did, where you go to sexual harassment training. And we're taught, don't look below the neckline and don't talk to ladies in a certain way. you can't compliment them. You know, they may take it the wrong way. And so we're trained to have this wall between the man and the woman that you come in contact

with every day except for your partner. But in the lifestyle, in non-monogamy, I can get to know a female just as like I can get to know a man. I can talk to her. Her husband's not worried about me stealing her. She's not worried about me taking advantage of her. You know, and I'm able to get to. to know her as a person and what makes her tick.

And so I've found that my friendships with females is so much richer now that I'm able to have this conversation freely. And I can admire their bodies and I can compliment them. And my wife says, yeah, I agree with you, honey. She is beautiful. You know, it just changes the whole opportunity to have that sort of relationship with the female sex where before and regular society were kind of

train to keep those lines and those walls up so that we don't, you know, cross any boundaries or upset anybody or have a lawsuit filed or make somebody uncomfortable. Okay, listen, everyone. I have had so many stories on my show about vanilla couples, totally changing the game in the bedroom and having way better sex. And that just proves that it's never too late for anyone to do the same. Because listen, sex is a skill. And like any skill, it can be learned, practiced, and mastered.

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This episode is brought to you by Activia. You might already be eating yogurt, but not all yogurts are created equal. Activia contains over 1 billion probiotics per serving to, survive and reach the gut alive. When it comes to gut health, Activia is the number one family doctor recommended probiotic yogurt brand. Choose Activia. Feel good from the inside out. Visit activia.ca for more details. Totally. A lot of people say, and I think that this is very true, like you have more chance of getting like, you know, sort of treated poorly and have a guy treat you in a worse way in a regular bar than you do in a in a swingers club. Because like from what I

have heard and when people have told me it seems like inside a swingers club like it is like the women's lead the show like they're the boss of the place right like it is a place where they everyone goes at their pace right because you listen you're naked it's like a very vulnerable position to be in so everyone is obeying the fucking rules for the most part right it's just i feel like they're more protected there than in or if they were all dressed up in a regular bar right it's so true it's The irony is so rich there. It's crazy. But yeah, like, if I'm by myself at a regular bar, I feel like I have to keep my guard up.

And, you know, the thing about, like, being at a lifestyle event, the majority of the people there are going to be couples. There are always singles there. And, but as a female at a lifestyle event, if Mr. Jones excuses himself to go to the men's room or to go to get a drink or whatever, I feel very comfortable by myself. because I feel like the other husbands will have my back if I get in a precarious position. Interesting. First of all, that rarely happens. But second of all, I hate to say that I would be a damsel in distress and I can't take care of myself. But it is nice to know that there's other men around that have your back.

And they're going to take care of their wife and they're going to take care of any other woman that needs to be taken care of. And not just the men. Like there was a situation once. We were at a clothing optional resort in the hot tub, and a gentleman had been over-served, and he was by himself. His wife had gone back to the room, and he was acting inappropriately and being a little bit too forward. Well, this one lady turned around and put her index finger in his face and said, first of all, where is your wife?

And he says, uh, uh, uh, uh, you know, she went back. to the room. And second of all, you don't touch another woman unless you have permission to do so. And he turned around and put his tail between his legs and went back to. I mean, he apologized. He apologized. But it's not just it's not just the men that are going to watch out for the ladies. It's it's everybody in there is going to be watching your back. Yeah, which is amazing. A lot of times I do have because I feel like a lot of times, you know, it's not like there's like a sign with rules on it in inside every club, right? And there are a lot of like unspoken rules, right? Like, I love to have a, like, you know, what goes down or like a how to sort of go to a swingers club and what to do,

what not to do episode, because I feel like a lot of people would never know, right? Like, how do you approach or not approach? Like, if there's a bunch of people on a bed, you can't just go in and join, right? But sometimes people, how would people know if they don't, if they don't hear it from somebody, right? Right. Yeah, especially. Well, a good club, the owner will have ambassadors that will take you on a tour. And as the ambassadors are showing you around, they're explaining the rules to you. Like, for example, some of the playrooms at clubs will have doors on them. And if the door is closed, it's a private happening.

Right. If the door is open, that means that you can stand there and watch. And then sometimes they'll have like curtains. And if their curtain is like down, it'll be see-through and you can watch you the curtain. If the curtain's open, you're welcome to come in and join. But all of that is explained to you the first time you go to the club by one of the ambassadors. And even if it is explained to you and I'm following the rules and I'm going into a room where I'm allowed, I'm still going to use my voice and say, is it okay that I join in?

You know, there's still an emphasis on communication and consent. And I think to your point, Kathy, a lot of guys will come into a club like that. And their assumption is, oh, this is a sex club. I can have sex with anybody I want to because the people in here want to have sex with me. And we have had once or twice some intruders. But when you turn around and you say, look, sorry, you're not invited in, or you alert one of the attendees, attendants, and they come in and they escort them out. And Mrs. Jones always says, and I think all the ladies agree with this,

if she's in a place that is clean and where she feels safe, that's when she's most sexy. And that's when women can relax. And they know they're in a clean place. They know that they're going to be respected and it's safe. Then now I can really enjoy myself and let my hair down, so to speak. Right. Now, let me ask you this because you said, like, in the beginning, you had a little jealousy and that was like one of the bumps in the road.

Like what other things in the beginning or throughout the many years, that you guys been swinging that were like learning experiences for you or like things that you learn that would be maybe helpful for other people to hear? Well, getting your feelings hurt when you're rejected. Right. Because it's going to happen. Totally. It's going to happen.

And actually, it's kind of happening to us right now, ironically. We're trying to hook up with a single guy and he's kind of getting flaky on us. You know, I could be like really butt hurt over it or I can just like laugh it off and say, oh my gosh like if this doesn't work out on Friday night my plan B is I'm going to have to have sex with my own husband you know you just you just kind of have to like laugh it off but but seriously rejection is real and it it does sting yeah but you just kind of have to let it go and move on and realize that being rejected is a blessing in disguise because if you would have tried to force that connection and it wasn't really genuine

then it's not going to be a very fun experience. Well, that's the other side of things, like how it's you also, it's not just about being able to be rejected. You also have to reject other people too, which is sometimes hard because you feel bad, right? Yes. And I'm a people pleaser, so that's very difficult for me. Usually I'm the one that has to, you know, I mean, we want to be, we want to be respectful and we want to be direct with people, but, you know, we want to be, you know, it's never

about the other person. It's about, look, there's just not chemistry here or there's. There's not, we don't feel like there's a very strong connection. We really like you guys. It's been nice to meet you. I mean, there's very tactful ways to reject people. You don't say you're too old, you're too fat. You're not hot or, you know, or, you know, you're kind of a jerk.

But, you know, so there's just ways that you learn with experience. Yeah. And I think we appreciate that now because we don't want to waste people's time, nor do we want our time wasted. If somebody is not attracted to us, we want to know. right up front. And I'll say thank you for letting me know because that way, you know, we can move on and no hard feelings and good luck to you and there's more fish in the sea and, you know, all of that. But another thing I think from a male perspective to your question about bumps, and this is really

widespread in non-monogamy, and that is performance anxiety for the gentleman. Oh, that was a big one I was very surprised about. Yeah, well, it's very close. common. Yeah, and it's, yeah, oh, very common because you're having sex now with somebody who you don't know and now across the bed, somebody's having sex with my wife and I'm distracted by that and, or I'm turned on by it and there's distractions in the room or I'm in an environment that's just full of different hormones and sense and sounds and it can be overwhelming. And so all of a sudden. And it's not just a problem that older guys have. No. You know, that's the stereotype.

I mean, obviously, that's a compounding problem, you know, for the, for the older guys, but young guys that are like super fit and healthy and hot will just all of a sudden be like, uh-oh, this is not going to happen because they're in their heads. Yeah. Yeah, and it's the opposite of what you would think, right? Like, this is like every guy's fantasy. They got everything that they want. They'd have an instant boner.

And that was another thing that I was very surprised that not only happened. that it's actually common. And it's not like it would be, you know, and listen, if you get in your head about it, it could become chronic and everything, but it's like it can happen to guys, and it does a lot of the time. Right. And it's really a confidence killer

for a guy. Yeah, exactly. In a lot of ways, that erection is, we're proud of that. You know, that's part of who we are. Look at me. You know, I'm ready to go and I can possibly please you. And now all of a sudden, I'm embarrassed.

I've never had this happen. before my wife is over there trying to have a good time and now she's concerned about me and i and i don't want the other woman to think that that she's not attractive because she's it like all of these things go through your head as a guy and and you just spiral at that point in time that makes it worse exactly yeah so so we've had we've had to learn to have conversations with people to say look you know most of the times things are going to be fine but if it's not i'm going to find creative ways to still enjoy the evening and you know we'll still explore each other and it doesn't have to be penetrative sex it can be other things and and you learn that that's why we call it

in non-monogamy we call it play because it should be fun you know it it's it should be playful and you should be able to talk to I remember the first couple times we played with people and we were laughing and I said I've never heard so much laughter in bed before because If I think somebody's laughing at me, that's really not a good thing. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah, no, I love that. How long did that take for you as a guy to get out of your head and be so cool about it

and accepting of your own body and be, you know, because I feel like it does, a lot of guys do spiral and that only makes it worse, right? But you've gotten to the point where you're able to just accept it that sometimes that might happen and you don't need to get, you know, you just will explain it up front and you're totally okay. And so maybe the next time, 10 times it will. But it could happen. and you're cool with it.

Well, for me, and those who listen to us know my story, I mean, I never had a problem ever. Right. I was really fortunate. But then a few years ago, I had diagnosed with prostate cancer. And so I had to have my prostate removed. And so after that, it was a struggle because I had to relearn how to use my body. Mrs. Jones and I had to relearn how to have sex together. Things were different.

I had to learn about Viagra. to learn about bimix and try mix and all these other things. But I also learned that the ladies that I played with that really cared about us, they weren't as concerned, nearly as concerned about it as I was concerned about it. And once you get that feeling, then that takes the pressure off. And you can enjoy yourself and things, you know, sometimes they work out and sometimes they don't. And that's just a matter of where I am, you know, in my health and my life right now. I appreciate it when a guy will tell me up front, like before play even starts. I'm just going to let you know, sometimes I have a problem.

It is not you. You know, I think everything's going to be fine, but if something goes wrong, it's not you, and we'll just kind of figure it out. And I really appreciate that. Or some guys, maybe they can get hard, but they won't come. you know so they just can't like relax enough to allow that that finish to happen so if i know that going into it then i know that it's okay if that doesn't happen and it isn't something that i've either done wrong or not done that they needed for me to do well and i think the finish and all through

our marriage we had a really good sex life and so the goal was to finish and it really was easy But then we've realized in the lifestyle, we're not goal-oriented anymore. We're experienced. We want to have a good experience, whatever that play experience is, and you don't have to have an orgasm. I mean, if you do or she does, that's great. Of course, you know, who's going to complain about that? But it's not, that's not the goal. The goal is just to make connections with people, you know, enjoy your sexuality and your

humanness and being with other people and exploring, you know, so it's more of a, a fun thing to do and a playful experience. Yeah, I love that. You know, and I have another question for you, but real quick, I just want to say I did, I just started like a sexual health Saturday series where I have like doctors and therapists on and stuff. But I also have people that come on and talk about their like health issues. Like I'm like very into health and fitness and I like all kinds of medical stuff.

So if you ever want to come on and do a whole episode about your experience and journey with prostate cancer, I think that would be like super interesting. I'm assuming maybe you already told your story. your podcast, but if you'd want to come on mine and do a sexual health Saturdays episode, I would love that. You know, I'm happy to do that, Kathy. As a matter of fact, one of the most emotional experiences for me was when I did share it on our podcast and I got an email.

I got an email the next month and a gentleman said, I was listening to you and my wife has been asking me to get my PSA checked and I heard your podcast and so I made my appointment. I went to see the doctor and it's elevated. Now I think I'm being tested for prostate cancer. And if I, if you hadn't had said told your story, I'm not sure I would have ever got that check. Can you believe? Yeah. Amazing.

Yeah. So just that one person made it, made the whole sharing it publicly. So I would be happy to do that. Okay. Awesome. So use the same link or I'll email to you and get it because I love that. I would love to have that story. I mean, I'm sure it's so relatable.

And I just started that series. So I, you know, we'll definitely do that. Let me ask you a question because you said like after you went to all that stuff when you came back from your resort. Like you did decide that you really loved when you had a connection with a couple. Now, one of the things I've heard from many people is like that four way connection meet a couple that everyone's like into each other is like one of the hardest things. Have you guys just been like really lucky meeting like tons of great couples? It is very difficult to find a four way connection. Right.

And usually there is a little bit of imbalance to it. But I think what makes it work for us is that we really do focus on the friendship. Right. And the sex is secondary. So, you know, with the sex not being like the main objective of the connection with the couple, then if Mr. Jones has a little bit more fun than I have or with this couple, I might have a little bit more fun and a deeper connection than he has, it kind of all comes out in the wash.

Right. As long as you're not having a bad experience, you know, and you know your partner's having a good time, you know, we seem to make it work. Well, what I've learned, Kathy, is that I've had to rewire my brain as to what makes me attracted to another person and another woman. And before the lifestyle, probably like most guys, it's mostly physical, physical attraction. Right. So now I've learned if I stop, if I go beyond that, and I have a conversation with the woman and the couple, and they become more attractive as a couple. And then I look at her a different way and I learn about her personality and her sense of humor. And all of a sudden, the physical isn't the most important thing anymore.

And then I've also found that I'm like, okay, well, yeah, we can put it at this couple. I know you're really attracted to him. I kind of like her. but then we'll get into the bedroom and the woman will just turn into a different person in a good way. And the experience is really pleasurable. And I come away from that thinking, you know, I almost missed that opportunity because I was going to close the door because I didn't think there was an attraction there. So there's a lot of it's not a black and white issue about, you know, who you're attracted to and who you're not. And we've learned that if you just make the effort with people, people become a whole.

whole lot more attractive with those soft skills and the other parts of who they are that that you learn about. Yeah, I learned that. Like, maybe 10 years ago I made out with a friend who sat across from me for like 10 years that I never was interested in him in the slightest. Somehow I wound up making out of him. And I swear if you would have stopped the thing right before my lips landed on his, I would have been like, for sure, like this will be the worst experience on my life.

And holy shit, the chemistry. like the best in bed. He had the biggest dick. I'm like, you've been sitting across from me with that, this whole, like, it was like insane. And it changed my life. Like, when my friends come back from a date and they'll be like, oh, I don't, I'm not attracted to him. I'm like, you don't really know. Like, you got to make out with him first because

you just don't know, right? Right. I would, like, you know, and I feel like for you, Mrs. Jones, like, as women, we always, a lot of times, right? You mean, we meet someone and you're not, like, attracted to them physically, but over time, you get to know them and sometimes we could become attracted to someone we never thought we would, right?

Just because we like their personality, right? I'm sure that happens for you. I mean, yes, it does. And people will ask me, like, what's your type of, like, guy that you're attracted to? And I'm like, I think I just like a guy with a good personality. Yeah, yeah. And then you let the chemistry take over. And I don't care how tall he is.

Like, one of my girlfriends always says, well, it doesn't matter how tall they are because everybody's like eight inches tall in bed when they're laying down flat. Exactly. Like, oh, you know, I never really thought about it that way. But what about you? Now, you said you made out with the girl that time. Like, did you get into hooking up with women further? Do you like women to?

Is that something that you're into, Mrs. Jones? I do like to play with women. I don't have to play with women. So if we meet a couple and there's a lot of, you know, chemistry there, and the women is not, you know, by comfortable, so to speak, then that's fine. I just, you know, we won't play. But if I, you know, every once in a while, we meet a couple on there's just a lot of chemistry between me and the other wife. And that is so much fun, you know, because it's just, it's not something

that my generation grew up with. You know, like you were just talking, like with the kids these days, you know, they're, they're attracted to humans. Exactly. And the gender, the gender, the gender is kind of secondary. You know, so I like having the ability to be attracted to whoever. Twizzlers keep the fun going. Yeah, I know. I just stopped whatever you were listening to to tell you that Twizzlers keep the fun going. Well, irony isn't my forte, but twisty, chewy, yummy Twizzler sure is.

So think of Twizzlers as a little palate cleanser for whatever's queued up, which by the way should be coming very soon. Like any second now. Okay, Twizzlers, time to keep the fun going. And again, unfortunately it is still kind of a double standard for many people. Yeah, I always talk about how there was a stigma for a girl on girl auction in my time, right? We know that. I mean, I'm in my 50, so I'm like, I remember when even that was like very taboo.

And then that changed in our lifetime. But like, to me, I don't understand why it still exists for the poor guys, you know. What were you going to say, Mr. Jones? I cut you up. I was going to say, there's also a four-way physical connection that, especially Mrs. Jones, really likes. If we're going to swap, quote-unquote, and the other woman comes with me on my side of the bed, and Mrs. Jones goes with the other gentleman, that's one thing. But also, if the two ladies are connected and playing, and then we begin playing also,

the four of us can be physically touching each other and experience. that physical four-way connection, that's something that is really special and doesn't happen that often either. And then you kind of let your guard down. And at that point in time, I don't know whose leg I'm touching. You know, there's just skin on skin contact, but nobody's really stopping it because it's so fluid

and it feels so natural and the ladies are enjoying themselves. And you don't stop and think what's going on. you just let yourself experience that human sexuality with four different people or more in some cases. It's really a rare experience, but it's also very special. Yeah, I've heard people say that that's their favorite because there's no boundaries. You know what I mean? There's no stopping anything. So I love that word that you use like very fluid. Yeah, that explains it for sure. Do you guys do three some sometimes like with women or just a guy or are you typically doing the swap? We usually play with couples. But,

But we have played with single females before and single males before. Yeah, I think we are more just focused on finding people. Yeah. You know, and of course the single is a different dynamic. Yeah, exactly. But when we are with you a third person, we want to make sure that they feel like they're being treated equally. It's not, they're not a human sex toy for us. Yeah.

You know, we want to know what they want out of it and what they enjoy and what their expectations are. and we want to try to put everybody on equal footing so that it's not two against one, so to speak. What are your favorite apps that you guys use now? I mean, you guys been doing this a long time. Like, which are the apps that you have the most success and that you prefer nowadays? As far as lifestyle dating apps? Well, actually, we don't use them anymore. We have a virtual community, and we got a thing.

And we've got about 1,500 members from across the country, and they come in and interact with each other. You know, we have knowledge sharing. We have virtual meetups. We have a men's group. We have a ladies group. We have special interest groups. We have regional groups. And so as people come into our community, and we get the benefit of being the community

host, so we get to meet everybody. So we've kind of stepped away from, you know, apps that are. specifically for dating and we make connections through the people that are in our community. Dating apps are, there are a lot of work. Yeah, of course. Because, you know, there's really no way to like filter, you know, and you don't know that what you're reading is, you know, it's not necessarily what you see is what you get. Yeah. You know, so it's just, it's exhausting using those apps.

We do have a presence on Cassidy and we do have a presence on Cassidy and we do have a presence on STC. Yeah, and it's hard because you're looking at pictures, okay? So it's very one-dimensional or two-dimensional, and you're reading about them, but you really don't get to know the person or the people or the couple until you're face-to-face. So you can put a lot of work in, and people that are on singles dating sites know this just as well. I mean, it takes the time, yes, or do we think we're compatible? Can we meet up, when, how far are they away? And you go through all this and then you get there and they don't look like their pictures or they're into their DTFs, which, you know, just, you know, they're not wanting to connect. And so there's a lot of

work that goes into that where if you are part of a group, I think like we've discovered, is you get to know people by engaging with them online. And then you have a pretty good idea if you're going to connect when you meet face to face. Well, listen, I love connecting people and giving people like different resources to help them. Why don't you give a shout out to your, your community, how they could join and, you know, what they can expect inside of their? Well, sure. I appreciate that. Yeah. And I'll give a link in the thing. Is it your website, right? Yeah. First of all, our website is as we got a thing.com, W-E-G-O-T-T-A-T-H-I-N-G.com. But also my email is Mr. Jones, M-R-J-O-N-E-S at We Got a Thing.com.

And if somebody emails me, I will send them a promo code for a pretty big discount to come in and try for three months. We feel like it's primarily for couples, but we do have singles in there as well, and we have single spaces. But if you're interested in exploring or you're interested in engaging with others, or if you're interested in connecting with others, we have three different levels of memberships, depending on what you're looking for as a couple. And, you know, you get to meet people as much as you put yourself into it is what you're going to get out of it. Because a virtual community, if you don't engage, nobody's going to know that you're there.

So we try to create events. Like I said, the ladies book club, the ladies happy hour, the men's chats, the virtual zooms that we do, the live streams we do every day. You know, we give people an opportunity to post their photos and celebrate their birthdays. and talk about sex toys that they just got and ask questions about a rough date that they just had or, you know, sharing health issues or exercise plans. And so when you connect with people on things like music and food and your faith and religion, all of a sudden you're a well-rounded community with sexuality at the core of why people are there.

So it's easier to engage with people, let's say when you're a sports nut and you're watching the NBA finals and you can chat with a bunch of guys or couples in the lifestyle about what's going on. So those topics are easier for people to talk about while at the same time they can get to know the people that they're conversing or engaging with. And then potentially, you know, we then we host regional group meetups across the country. Which can be so as informal as like let's say a group in the Washington, D.C. area, throw something out, hey, we're going to go to this winery on Saturday after. afternoon. If you want to, you know, join us. Come on out. You know, so it's, it's kind of like a non-threatening

way to meet up with like-minded people in person. You know, you're not going to a sex club. You know, it's fit for like new people especially. You know, it's so terrifying at first. Yeah. Now I love it. You know, going to a winery and just, you know, enjoying the beautiful day and a glass of wine with like-minded people is just a nice entry point. Yeah. You're kind of lucky that you started this community, obviously, to help people out and create it. But, like, now this is where you kind of meet people yourself, right? And you don't have to go looking for couples anymore as well. Yeah.

That's pretty killer for you guys. Yeah, yeah. That was a benefit. And one thing that I know that we haven't really touched on, but, you know, we were very active in our church while we were in the lifestyle. And we were outed. We were discovered by the church. Yeah, and so we went through a time there where, you know, we had to tell people, because the main thing was, look, the word's going to get out. So who is it in our lives that's most important to us?

And we want to make sure we control the message and the timing and we want them to hear it from us. And I think, you know, when we get into this lifestyle, of course you want to be discreet. Well, I would recommend not starting a podcast and putting your voices out there if you want to stay undercover. or anonymous, strictly anonymous. Yeah. But when we were outed, it gave us an opportunity to say, okay, who do we want to be? Is this who we are? What type of people do we want in our lives?

And now that we're kind of forced out in the open, you know what? The sun came up the next day. I mean, it was difficult to get through, but. I can imagine. We lost a few friends. Yeah, we lost a few friends. But we've learned that, you know, we had friends based on geography before. We had friends because they lived next door to us.

We had friends because they sat next to us in church. We had friends because their kids and our kids played on the same sports teams. We didn't have friends necessarily that we chose because of who they were and how much that we enjoyed being with them. And so it was a little bit easier to kind of jettison some of the folks that were judgmental. And then, you know, all of a sudden say, you know, most of our best friends now are, well, a lot of our best friends are lifestyle friends. But we also learned that the people that cared about us before care about us now.

And we told them and it never comes up in conversation anymore. And they're like, look, you guys do you. You obviously have a good relationship and a good marriage. So it's not for us, but thanks for telling us. And so I think a lot of it, we have this idea that if people find out it's going to be the end of the world. And while I wouldn't recommend people go through it because it was a little bit painful. A little bit? You know, so we've grown through that process as well.

Yeah, that's amazing. I mean, listen, I think you get, you learn. I mean, that's a big thing to get out there, but you do learn in life at some point that like a lot of, like, most of the time, and I explain this to my little son sometimes, you know, everyone worries about what everyone thinks. But like, I'm like, you know, people, other people think of you for like three minutes and then they go back to thinking about themselves, right? At the end of the day.

No kidding. Right. No kidding. Yeah. I can't believe it did it. And then they go back to thinking their favorite thing, which is thinking about themselves, right? And that's what you learned at some point that no one is sitting around thinking about it 24-7. So you could go on. Let me ask you, though, because I think it's interesting because you're a church-growing people and religious, and that's like who you guys were

as well as swingers. Both things can exist. Like, did you stop going to that church, or do you still go? Or did you find another church? Are you still, like, religious in the same way before? Well, we had to realize, and actually we had some amazing pastors and, you know, various people within the church reach out to us and say, you understand that these are humans chastising and pushing you away. This is not God. Right. Oh, I love that. The pastor said that to you. So I think we have to, well, not our pastor. Okay. Well, that there was a pastor. That's a real pastor to me.

You know what I mean? Yeah. Right, right. So it's just learning that your faith is your own and humans run the church. So the church is not going to be a perfect place. Right. And you just kind of like have to make your own peace with the fact that we cherish our marriage. We cherish each other.

We are not hurting each other. And we really try our best not to hurt people we play. And I think we find in the lifestyle that unconditional acceptance and unconditional love, which, by the way, is the goal of Christianity, is more prevalent sometimes than lifestyle, you know, than it is, you know, in a church congregation. Right. And that's the way it should be in the church congregation, right? Right. That's the way that it should be. Yeah.

And so, but in our community, we have a group called Faith Matters. And it's just a place, it's not an evangelism place. It's a place that, because a lot of people have grown up with. some sort of religion and get into this and have to reconcile this non-monogamy with their faith. And so we've got a couple clergy that are in that group that lead it. And it's really, hey, what questions do you have? Here's what we're going to talk about. I love that. You know, what are you struggling with?

And actually, they're even doing a Habitat for Humanity Service project as swingers. You know, so we're watching people who are in the lifestyle. they're out there serving just like they did, you know, at church, but they're doing it with people who they know that they really care about and they can really trust and enjoy each other's company at the same time. Yeah, remember watching Tammy, Tammy Faye Baker. Remember her? She was like, she was on VH1 trapped in a house with other people.

She was on like this real life. And she was like in the house with Ron Jeremy, the biggest porn star on the planet. And she was so amazing. I was like, this is the way every religious person should be. She was like very much like, I don't approve of what you are, but she still loved him and was so kind to him and open and cool. I'm like, that's like to me what a real person who is very religious should be like, right? Exactly.

You know? Well, it's not just religion. I think, I think, Kathy, we get to a certain point and some of us start to question why we were taught what we were taught. So, for example, the pastor's going to teach you something because the church wants some sort of an influence there. your parents are an influence over you. They want you to be safe. They don't want you to get pregnant in high school. So they're telling you not to have sex.

You have coaches. You have teachers. You have friends. You have all these outside influences telling you what does a marriage look like? What does a wedding ceremony look like? What does sex look like? But we get to a certain point in time, at least we did. And I think a lot of other people and say, wait a minute, wait a minute.

Why are all these people telling me these things? and what's behind the motivation for that? And can't I question it? Can't Mrs. Jones and I, can't we sit down and make our relationship what we want it to be? Can't we decide if it's healthy for us and we're both enjoying it

and it's done out of love and we're not hurting anybody, then why can't we do? What's the problem? Yeah, what's the problem? And not only that, I mean, it's also like what's it anyone else's business? I mean, listen, I have a show

where people are coming on and telling everybody their business, but sometimes it's just great for them to speak it out loud because they have to keep it a secret. But a lot of times, like when I had a podcast, a YouTube channel, people would be like, oh, would these people tell their parents what they do? I'm like, but you wouldn't tell your parent. Like nobody, even vanilla people don't tell other people about their sex life. Most people's sex life is their own fucking business.

So it doesn't really even matter what you do. You know what I mean? No one has to accept it. Just like no one has to accept the vanilla person fucking their husband, their wife doggy style last night. Like what's the, it doesn't matter. It's no one's business regardless of what you're doing. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, I had a...

It's so funny that, you know, we just kind of like have been trained to shake off adultery when we hear about it. Right. But, you know, this is such a scandal. Yeah. And that, I mean, that's so freaking backwards. Because when you're committing adultery, you're hurting somebody. Yeah. Multiple people.

When, again, we had an email from... gentleman one time who was trying to prove to us how what we were doing was wrong. And he said, what will you tell your granddaughter one day if she finds out? And I said, you know what? I would tell her? I would say, I hope that when you get older and you're in a relationship, that you have the type of relationship that the two of us have and that you're fortunate to have somebody in your life who cares about you like Mrs. Jones cares about me. And good for you guys for deciding what you want to do in your life. That's how I would answer that question. I love it. So people, people are just so one, it's just difficult for people to grasp sometimes. And I think we have to

understand that. I mean, we've had to tell, we've had people find out what we do, and we think that they're going to react a certain way, and they just, they don't. And we have to realize that we say, you know what, if it took us eight months to wrap our heads around this, we shouldn't have an expectation that new people or the people that we drop this bomb on are just automatically going hug us and, you know, say everything is okay. People have to work, think about this a lot because it's so far outside of the perceptive norm. Yeah, and I think sometimes like, listen, I'm anonymous and I've been anonymous my whole life, not one, like a lot of people my family don't even know. Most of my mom friends have no idea. And I'm, you know, when I had a child, I was glad that

I was anonymous. Not because I'm a private person. I'm actually like a very much an open book all my life. you know, now that I have a son, like I feel like I'm like a realist. Like there are people out there that would judge me because of what I have. They wouldn't let my kid play with them. And like, I don't have to deal with any of that. And that's why I'm anonymous. And it's not because I'm feel shameful about what I do or anything. But I just understand for some reason people are, you know, sex. This is all we're talking about. Sex consensual, happy sex that's a part of everyone's life can be, is still like so stigmatized out there. Right. I know. I have to sleep with one eye open as a, person who has a career built around sex that it could be taken down my Patreon my

YouTube was deleted you know what I mean like a 57,000 followers like I got deleted off of YouTube like you know and I'm like it's it's it's it still is like this taboo kind of a thing and people still take it so seriously but I love that you know in one on a podcast still it hasn't changed we are allowed to talk about it we could be open about it and so many people are grateful for it. I'm sure you guys get the same kind of email. I get emails from people all the time. Like, thank you so much for your show. It helped me in my house, you know, blah, blah, blah, all that kind of stuff. So thank God. You guys are doing what I'm doing. I love that you have a community. Listen, when we hang up, you're going to get a CalMlee. Thank you for me and you're going to get a link to

my private Discord. There's like 6,000 people in there. Feel free to advertise your community to them. I love that. I love sharing, like in giving my community resources to other places to go to. So feel free to sign up in there and you could say like put your link. to your We Got a Think community in your profile there if you want to send people over there. And I'll put the link to your community and your podcast, right? We have to remind everybody that they want to learn more from you guys. They go listen to your podcast. You still talk about your life.

Do you have experts on there too? Like what else do you have on there that so people know to go over there and tune in? Yeah. So the first 100 episodes we did were pretty much the same format. We just talked about our experiences. Then we started inviting other couples on. So we do some called origin stories where we'll have a couple on and they'll tell us how they got into this and how they've managed it. But also we have a partnership with expansive connection.

They are a non-monogamous coaching team. And so they come on and talk with us about from a professional standpoint. Like we'll talk about jealousy and how that affected us. Then they'll come on and talk about the science behind it and what is your brain doing and what this emotion is. and here are some tools to deal with that. You know, so we work with them closely. So we're podcasting with expansive connection once a month and then the rest of it, Mrs. Jones and I.

A joke that they give us credibility. Yeah, they give us. We always say we are not professionals, but they are. Yeah, no, I love that. I've added so many different things to my show. I used to only talk to people. Now I talk to experts and stuff. I think that that's great that you added that into the mix.

Because people are looking for that kind of information. Yeah. Look, we really appreciate your, allowing us to come into your discord and we look forward to that. And, you know, it's kind of disappointing sometimes because so a lot of content creators are a little bit protective and they're not, they're more competitive than they are collaborative. So we do appreciate that.

So thank you very much for that, Kathy. No, I love it. I love having other podcaster friends and, you know, sharing anything that I know, because this is like my life and I love what I do. And I feel like there's a huge audience. and we're all so different. And I, and I, like, literally I do my show to, like, help people. And I feel like I don't do Swinger, tons of Swinger stuff.

Like, I have, like, Swinger episodes. I have, like, Swinger episodes. I have cheating episodes. I have expert. You know, you guys are all, like, so Swinger Focus, which is perfect for people to get more content over by you guys. So I always love sharing other people with my listeners and helping people out because the more the better doing what we're doing, I feel like it only helps, you know?

Amen. Yeah. Yeah. Awesome. You guys were great. Thank you so much for calling. in and Mr. Jones, please, I'm going to text you the link now. Can you make a, like, book an appointment to do the whole prostate, your whole prostate cancer journey. I'd love to have that on my show

too. Okay, we'll do. Mrs. Jones, thanks so much. Thanks, thanks you guys for calling. Yeah, this was fun. It was a great conversation. Thank you. Awesome. Bye you guys. Take care. Take care. Bye. Okay, I just want to tell you before you go that my book, it's called Strictly Anonymous Confession, Secret Sex Lives of Total Strangers, is now available, not only in paperback and e-book, but you can pre-order the audiobook. It's still not going to be out until August 25th, but you can pre-order it. The book is basically 17 different stories taken from my show. I kind of picked one story from each category that I talk about on my show.

Like there's a hot wife story. There's a cuck queen story. There's a cuck story. There's a gang-bang girl story. Like I said, 17 stories. and they're all told in the third person, and they're all true. I took the interview and rewrote it in the third person, and I wouldn't really call it like a total erotica book. Think like Penthouse letters. It's more direct. It's not so over

the top like erotica. I don't really like that kind of vibe, right? But these are true stories. 17 of them. They're really short chapters, easy read. You could read one or two, and then skip around. You could read the whole book. It's available in eback format, paperback format. And finally, the audio book is available coming out August 25th. But you could pre-order it now. And if you buy my book in any format or pre-order it, I will throw in a complimentary link to my Discord.

My Discord does not disappoint, okay? There's no way you get into my Discord any other way than getting the link from me. Okay. I give it to people who buy my book. There's tons of people in there. everybody shares content with each other and that's what you get to do there you can post your own pictures and videos there's tons of channels we have lots of contests where you can win a lot of money it's a super fun place to be it's a total strictly anonymous community and you will love it i will be

giving anyone who buys my book access to my discord it's private like i said all you got to do is email me a screenshot of your purchase whether you did the audiobook the ebook or the paperback send it to me at Strictly Anonymous Podcast at gmail.com. That's Strictly Anonymous Podcasts at gmail.com. And I will send you the link to Discord. So anyway, thanks so much for tuning in. This is the Strictly Anonymous Podcast. Strictly Anonymous Podcast.