Strictly Anonymous Confessions - 275 - Peter is a Addicted to Being Seen Naked by Others

Episode Date: March 18, 2019

Peter is a hardcore exhitionist who has been living a very secret life for over 30 years. When and how did he first realize he was an exhibitionist? What were his first exhibitionist experiences like? What kind of experiences followed? Tune in for all the details which include stories about his experiences at nude beaches, as a nude model, at nude parties and orgies and a whole lot of other nudie scenarios all masterminded by two doms in his life. Who are they and what are they all about? You'll find that out too. **To see anonymous pics of my female guests + hear anonymous confessions + get all the episodes early and AD FREE, join my Patreon! It's only $7 a month and you can cancel at any time. You can sign up here: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.patreon.com/StrictlyAnonymousPodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and when you join, I'll throw in a complimentary link to my private Discord! MY BOOK IS NOW OUT FOR PRE-ORDER!!!! Strictly Anonymous Confessions: Secret Sex Lives of Total Strangers. A bunch of short, super sexy, TRUE stories. GET YOUR COPY NOW: https://amzn.to/4i7hBCd To Join SDC and get a FREE Trial! click here: https://www.sdc.com/?ref=37712 or go to SDC.com and use my code 37712 Want to be on the show? Email me at [e-mail] or go to http://www.strictlyanonymouspodcast.com and click on "Be on the Show" Have something quick you want to confesss while remaining anonymous? Call the CONFESSIONS hotline at 347-420-3579. You can call 24/7. All voices are changed. Sponsors: https://bluechew.com Get your first month FREE! https://butterwellness.com/ Try the Butter Wellness perineum massager and use code STRICTLY for 20% off your entire order Follow me! Instagram https://www.instagram.com/strictanonymous/ Twitter https://twitter.com/strictanonymous?lang=en Website http://www.strictlyanonymouspodcast.com/ Everything else https://linktr.ee/Strictlyanonymouspodcast Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Welcome to the Strictly Anonymous Podcast. Strictly Anonymous Podcast. Conversations with online strangers. We place ads online. The Craigslist is definitely like the gift that keeps on giving. Real people respond. You go to Singapore or Thailand. You can't not do it.

The temptation is just too much. With real problems. Do your friend know that you're banging her or no? No, he has no idea. And anything goes. The motto of the show, let your freak flag fly. Probably the only good advice I'll ever give you is to rehire. your wits and chain. Here is your host, Kathy.

Hey, welcome to the Strictly Anonymous podcast with Kathy. If you want to follow the strictly anonymous podcast on Instagram or Twitter, follow the show at Strict Anonymous. If you want to be on the show, this is a call on a vice show where I give total strangers unprofessional advice, as well as just a place for total strangers to come and reveal their secret lives, their naughty lives while remaining totally anonymous. So if you want to be the show. Send me an email at Strictly Anonymous Podcast.g.m.com or go to my website, strictly anonymouspodcast.com and click on B on the Show. Last week, I had a Panyos guy on who, and we put out a contest. Like if you could find him on Instagram because he had a

private Instagram and he wouldn't give out that, the name of that. We said that he would give somebody his wife's panties. And apparently there was a guy who won, but he didn't want the panties because he was in, or not the panties, the Pannios, sorry. He was in a relationship. But there was another guy who emailed me and was like he was like on it and looking for them and he eventually found him and he was a second place guy and he uh won his name is jeremy i am not going to get out his last name i don't even know if his last name is real in his email but anyway congrats to jeremy who did win one of uh that guy's paul peter paul harry i don't remember fucking people's names on my podcast because they're all like made up and then they have email

names that they email me with which are made up and then they have the real name so I'm always dealing with this is way too many names and I don't remember names to begin with uh so anyway congrats to jeremy on winning that today I have a guy named peter I think his name is Peter and he's like a hardcore exhibitionist and when he wrote me in I was a little nervous because he sort of said he was like on the verge of maybe doing like illegal things like to get his fix of being an exhibitionist and I was a little bit like, oh no, am I going to be talking to, like, a fucking criminal on? Like, I've never really had anybody on who's, like, cross lines and is doing something that's, like, really bad, like, pedophilia or something.

You know what I mean? And, like, if it's, like, a guy that's, like, literally jerking off in bushes and scaring people, like, that's not good. Like, I don't know, you know, how I would deal with that kind of a call. But it turns out he's not really that hard core. He's not a criminal. He's just a regular guy who has this very secret life of being very into exhibitionist. exhibitionism and how it sort of came about how it progressed and what he's done uh is fascinating and

i mean the podcast is long i taped it in two sessions it's about an hour and a half but it's like a it's like a really good story and it unfolds and there's a lot of times i'm like surprise and he's got these two characters we call him uh his cathies and they're fucking fascinating i just really want them on my show the stuff that his Kathy's got have gotten him to do because besides it exhibitionism exhibitionist he's kind of like a submissive maybe that always goes together I don't know I'm learning just like you on these episodes when I talk to people um but that's what we talk about it like the whole story how he got into it what he did how I mean he's married and like I said this is like a very secret life and what his two Cathies have got him to do during his many many years of

exhibitionism and it's fascinating the shit that they do that goes down that people do is never ceases to amaze me anyway so sit back relax and I'll be right back on with Peter. How are you doing all the way over there in Australia? Doing very well thanks Kathy

and thanks very much for finding some part of all sitting. Yeah it's a little hard because of the time difference but we figured out of time and you emailed me right you were you found my show and you have I mean, you'll explain the whole thing, but your thing is you're an exhibitionist, right? You would consider yourself an exhibitionist, right?

Well, that's certainly what I consider myself these days. So I think that's the best definition. But at the end of the day, I think I'd describe myself that as somebody who's been to a pretty interesting journey in a search for what works for me. And I don't think that's unique. I think that's everybody. But I have made a priority to sort of explore that side of myself. And so through my life, I would have described myself as very different things.

But right now, I think that's probably the best description in terms of what works most for me in terms of sexual gratification. Yeah, but your thing was, is you have always been into being seen naked, right? Started like you said, like in the beginning, it was like nude beaches and posing for art students, right, in our classes, like was good enough to sort of fulfill that part of you, right? but then eventually or even more recently, it's like you have to do more and more to sort of get yourself off. Yeah, and I think that's partly, it doesn't mean that I can't still be aroused

and, you know, jerk off afterwards thinking about something like a modeling for an art class. But for me now, I just continue to look for that additional boundary, I guess that additional adrenaline, like the first time you meet a new partner and, you know, the butterflies, etc., I guess I'm an adrenaline junkie, but I'm not somebody that does high diving or things. I'm somebody that looks for avenues through, I guess, my fantasies and more recently through, you know, real life fulfillment of some of those.

But I should stress, Kathy, that it's the complete antithesis of what I was for the first 22, 23 years of my life. So virtually the first half of my life, I was the exact opposite of that. and I was painfully shy, extremely poor body image, a very strict Christian upbringing with all that. Oh, interesting. That come with that. So it really took me a long time to, and yet I have memories as young as a five-year-old,

being in my bedroom, getting naked, pying my hands up with my underwear, and enjoying that feeling of being bound. But not knowing what that meant, and I don't think there would have been an erection or anything with it. And so I still had inching fantasies, if you like, or, you know, my freak flag was flying, I think in my very early age, but I didn't have any way to define it or understand it. And, you know, I have early memories of the girl next door who was similar age to me and were about seven,

and, you know, me pretending to be asleep behind the back shed in the backyard. And then she would pull my, you know, my pants and underwear down. and I'd be somehow excited at the knowledge that she could see my, you know, my wiener at the time or whatever. And yet that was an age where I was making in front of family envelopes and that wasn't sexual. So there was all these sort of contradictions that I can look back and see that there were things that excited me around nudity and certainly being exposed. And I also love seeing other people exposed. So it works for me to watch as a voyeur that sort of scenario as well. Right.

Yeah. Yeah. But that's pretty early on to have, like, you could remember those sort of things that remind you of, like, what you're into now. So they were there then as well, right? Yeah. But as I said, I didn't really know what they meant. But with my Christian sort of background at that early age, at five, I was, I wouldn't have known anything or how to judge it. But I remember sort of at 10 and 11 battling with what I thought to be.

bad thoughts and just knowing that it was the exact opposite to my, you know, the persona that I had to everybody that knew me. You know, I was a, I was literally an altar boy at the church and, you know, doing all those sorts of things that at home was, you know, 14, 15 year old, masturbating obsessively and all those sorts of things. So very, very, very, very interesting with different parts to my persona, even from that very early age. So did you feel like you? you were living like a double life even back then? Back then I probably just felt like I was a sinner. I was somebody who was praying about these things and laying away at night,

you know, praying that I cured from these sorts of new addictions and interest. So that's how I saw it and feel much older. And then I think I got into that point. So when I was late teens and started to discover the nudist beings. because we were just on a coast of town. And it was then that I started to, I guess, start to have a double life where I'd be sneaking off to watch things or to later be exposing myself in those sorts of environments,

but still having this very persona to everybody that knew me. I think sometimes when you're trying so hard not to sort of allow yourself to have a thought, makes that sort of thought stronger, right? And that's where that saying comes, like what you resist, persist, right? Because in a way you're trying not to think about it, but you're just thinking about it more, right?

Yes. So you probably like rewired, like you probably wired those desires into yourself, you know, at a young age because of the guilt surrounding it. Don't you think maybe? The guilt, yeah, yeah, the guilt and just, just a, a really strong curiosity.

Right. I just didn't have access. You know, this was, I'm almost 50 now. So this predated access to the internet and corn. Yeah, yeah. And in a small town, I was too nervous to go and, you know, buy a Playboy or a penthouse from the news agency underage or whatever. Yeah.

Nobody did. I remember it. Yeah, look, I remember my mate and I used to ride bikes all around. and this was when there was still drive up movie theaters. Yeah. And we found a spot where we could hide behind that. You would go behind the movie theater. Yeah, we'd drive behind and ride our bikes and pull up there.

And one night there was what must have been an R-rated movie. And I remember that was the first time as an aware teenager that I sort of saw images of naked women. And whilst we couldn't hear the sound, it seemed to be something about women that were captives. And, you know, there were men with guns leading them. around naked for whatever reason. But that's still a memory in my mind back then. But even then, I think whenever I saw a reference like that deep down, I was imagining myself in that scenario as the naked person,

as the person being exposed. And even if I watched a family program and there was some implied assault or rape or some, I remember Charlie's Angels, I used to be madly in love with Jacqueline Smith. Yeah. And I remember there was some episode where they had to get into a nudist resort to interrogate somebody. And I think it was actually Cheryl Ladd or whatever, who took one for the team and went in naked. And again, I'm thinking, wow, that's a legitimate scenario where she had to be naked in front of other people to do her job. That's fantastic.

because it was a, you know, I was always looking for ways that it could happen without being illegal or without crossing boundaries. Because back then, I sort of thought, that's the way I'd have to find an avenue for these things, not knowing that there was such a wide smorgasborder sort of stage opportunities that I, you know, I've been years. So all that sorts of memories are still in my brain from those sort of formative years. Yeah. but for so long just not having any real-life reference points. And then my mates and I at the end of year 10, so year 10 is just about to go into sort of senior high school from a US perspective.

So around about the age of 16, we all went on a surfing trip at the end of the year and this beach was the middle of nowhere. That's a great thing about Australia and many, many beaches. And two older women, in inverted commas, they were probably 18 or 19. you were naked on the beach one morning and that was just

for me that was just absolutely unbelievable. I was still a virgin at, you know, at 16th. Yeah. So that was the first real life naked walking, talking ladies I'd seen but it was very soon after that that I started to join the dots on the fact

that we had a nudist beach at the town that I lived in. It was actually quite close to the centre of town but it was a sort of a difficult walk around and a bush track, which meant that it was still able to be a clothing, optional beach, so close to town. So that was when I started to actively look at going there. But still too body image shy to think about actually strutting around naked on the beach.

It was more furtive. You know, I'd sit on the headland and see if there was anybody there naked that I could look at. And then if I sensed there was a space or there was no one on the beach, Then I might run down, get my kid off and just love the thrill, you know, the feeling. But, yeah, I was very skinny, very skinny as a youngster. It sort of genetically right through my family. And so I'd exercise a lot. I was very fit, but I just remained, you know, really, really skinny.

I now know when I tell my son who's now 15 and, you know, he's an excellent swimmer, but he's still got this thin body, and I see him have. having the same sort of thoughts as I had that I say to him, you know, son, don't worry about it because it's actually great genetically for the rest of your life because I turned 30 and 40 and still had. By then I filled out that I haven't had the battle with obesity that so many other people have had. Right, right. You know, I said, get through it, buddy.

Because it's going to be, it's going to benefit you. Yeah, it's a beneficial later in the long run in the long term. Yeah. So you found the, so when you found the nude beaches right, you were like, 16, you said you were like still a virgin, right? When did you start? And you weren't like sort of participating yet, right? When did you start participating?

Look, I didn't really, sorry, in terms of getting naked on the beach and being by others, you mean? Yeah. That didn't start until I was at university. Right. Okay. So I went right through high school where it was still 40. And I was just too, so many of my friends were into the beach and the,

sort of culture. I was just too paranoid about bumping into somebody. There was a friend in our year that got caught on that same headland sort of with a Zoom camera. So, you know, I was, I heard about that and I was nervous. He was actually proud of it, but again, he didn't have the sort of background that I was

trying to hide. Let me ask you this though, real quick, because I know, like, I had a girlfriend from Sweden, and in Sweden, it was, like, a very normal thing for families to go, and it was just, like, very out in the open and normal for the, that culture to be naked and a nude beach. So I don't know about Australia. Like in Australia, is it like in America where it's not like the common thing to do?

People go and they are around, right? But it's not like families don't go. It's not sort of like the norm. Is that how it is in Australia? It's not the norm. Right. But there is certainly a percentage of families that do live that culture. I mean, Australia is such a multicultural sort of melting pot.

Uh-huh. You know, so many Europeans over here now where. And for them it's normal. Yeah. But for them it's normal. Yeah. For me, it was, it was, you know, it was kinky. It was unusual.

And there was a, there was a perception that it was mainly old men, walking around the beach, probably looking for other men. That was, that was sort of the view. And I must say that when I went down there, there was a disproportionate amount of men. But at the time I considered to be old, they were probably in their 40s and 50s, sort of strutting around. and probably trying to bump into people and hook up. Yeah, yeah, totally.

So you, so when... Yeah, please go on. No, so you were getting to the point where when you started to sort of go and do it yourself and to take your clothes up. Yeah. So I went to university, moved to another town. Yeah.

It was an inland town. It wasn't on the coast. But even then, and this was a pivotal moment because I think I was still painfully shy. I moved into a residential college, over 400 people co-ed. It should have been where things just exploded. Yeah. But I sort of hooked up immediately with the local Christian chapter at the college

because that was easy and I made friends and by definition they were sort of welcoming. And so straight away I'd labelled myself again as one of those guys. And to me now, that was a real lost opportunity in terms of things could have really opened up for me then because it was all going on and it was all happening and you know there were the the oh week rituals there was the fun sort of hazing stuff that happened and and I was watching all those things and secretly thinking wow but you're not participating but what did happen though I think all that was pent up and I would then get back home for holidays and of course when you're at university you get so many months of holidays in a year and and then I showed a safety around the fact that

By then, most of my friends had also left our small town, and I got more confident to get onto that beach and then to actually get my new off in front of others. And initially that in itself was a sense of triumph. But then over time, that became my playground and then, you know, where I started to, I guess, try to initiate circumstances that might create the opportunity to either act with other people whilst I was made.

it. Right. And did you, I know that you said you also did like modeling for art classes, right? Did you do that around the same time? No, that was all in my mid-20s. So all through this university time, I was, I was still a virgin. I was, I was masturbating phenomenal amounts of time. And look, I was a happy, I was a happy guy. I wasn't, you know, I wasn't, I wasn't, that concerned at this stage around what it all meant. I desperately wanted a girlfriend, and I was too shy to try to initiate that. Yeah.

But I had a good circle of friends, great family, and a happy life. So none of this is a sort of traumatic thing. Yeah, yeah. And it just meant I was a little bit of a late bloomer. Mm-hmm. Right. I think it would be fair.

So it was only after I finished university, and then I moved to Sydney. So, you know, by Australian standards, that's the big city, you know, seven, eight million people. that's where you can start to get anonymous. Right. Safety in numbers. So that was where I could actually go on by a porno magazine

or buy a nudist magazine and start to see images that actually really appealed to me. And also see images of naked men in front of women because I'd never seen that. You didn't tend to see that in the playboy. It was all naked women, right? Right. And then I would look and see it, my God, that was a female photographer, photographing that man. Wow.

Oh, so you would like look at that guy. That would make you hop because you're thinking it could be you. Like you're putting yourself in that scenario. Correct. And look, I'd also joined a very big company. And this was before we all had laptops. So I was still sitting at a desk writing things out. And then we had a secretarial pool.

Yeah. And at the age of about 23, it was very clear to me that one of the secretaries was interested, but I didn't know how to do anything. But thankfully, I had a perceptive boss. he was noticed and literally coaxed me and coached me and coached me and he finally said if you don't ask her out today I'm going to tell the whole officer okay so I thank him now at the time I was horrified and so I asked this very very cute blonde typing pool secretary if she'd like to go out into my great relief and amazement he said about bloody time

What a good boss you had. Yes, I'm sure he, well now, he may later not want to claim credit because we did subsequently get engaged at sort of about, I was about 24, she was 21, and then I lost my virginity with her. We fell in love. Well, I thought I was in love, but I was probably in lust. It was probably all the pent up waiting so long for. friend. But when I look back in hindsight and look back at what I consider three other loves that I have had in my, you know, in the span of my lifetime, it was a different feeling to that. But at the time, I thought I was in love. Yeah, it was the first experience. It was the first girl you were aware.

Absolutely. I was probably a very grateful puppy. Yeah. But, so, look, we, we, we, we, we, She wasn't a virgin, but we went through that whole process, fumbled around, and I started to learn and started to, I guess, become a little more normal in terms of getting my sexual gratification through a partner. But that didn't last for more than about a year. So very fast, I look back now and think, what was I thinking, but I had engaged, got engaged, that was broken off. But that had given me some confidence, and that had sort of convinced me that perhaps females could interact with me and find me attractive.

And perhaps I wasn't going to sort of die alone. Yeah, that's good. Yeah. So for the next couple of years, I had a couple of girlfriends. Most of them I met through work. It was a really large company. So it was a pretty useful, low-risk approach, if you like. Yeah.

And it was big enough that I wasn't dating people that I was directly working with. And there were no nude beaches around. So it wasn't like, right? You weren't, where were you again at this point? I mean, were you doing the nudie thing on the side too? Or no? So initially not. I was in Sydney.

I was renting a small apartment with another guy, not a lot of space to do stuff. Yeah. Still didn't have the internet. There are a few official nude beaches in Sydney, but the one I'd heard of were very small and not, they didn't seem to appeal. Okay.

I learned in later years that there's some other new beaches that were more hidden, and I've certainly had lots of experiences there, but at this stage, no. Okay. I was really working and starting to figure out how girls kicked as much as I could and having some relationships. Yeah, that's good. But I did move out of the city in terms of where I lived and started to commute from another beach town about an hour or so north of Sydney, and during that time,

a bunch of people from my company we'd commute together we'd play cards and as I started to work out we were starting to flirt a lot as well and there was one lady in particular who was married a couple of years older than me

but the four of us had been playing each trip and we'd start to joke about we were playing cards but if you lost the hand you'd take an item of clothing off and stuff and we'd be just joking about this the other commuters must have thought we were nuts and you know halfway through the trip we'd be

and out, ah, you're naked now sort of thing and be playing. So harmless stuff. Yeah. One, her husband traveled a lot to work. And one afternoon or evening, I guess, for the time we got back to the station, she lived in another spot about 15 minutes from where I was up the coast. But she asked if he could use my bathroom before she went home. So I feel naively and innocently gave her a lift back to my place,

which was just a small granny flat in the back of an old gentleman's house. And I was sitting in the lounge room. The next minute she walked out naked. Oh, my God. You hit the jackpot. Well, it sounds like one of those penthouse four of me. Yeah. Sounds like a porn.

But I was so stunned. But I literally, I remember sort of, it just came towards me and said, you know, you must have known I was in. interested. And I said, no, you're a 10. Well, we've been joking, but we've all been joking. And I just had no idea. And this really flawed. And then anyway, I, I can't believe it, but somehow I sort of took her gently in both shoulders, holding her arms length so that none of her naughty bits were touching this. We can't do this. You're married. I'm really sorry. Yes, I'm attracted to you. I'd be insane if I wasn't.

Oh, my, yeah. But this doesn't feel right. And somehow, somehow I got her dressed again and dumbled her back into the car and took her home, me apologising all the way. But needless to say, despite taking the moral high ground on that first time, within two weeks, we were having an affair. Oh, thank God. Okay.

I agree, thank God as well. And in hindsight, she was my real first Mrs. Robinson. It's not that she was much older, but she was experienced. She knew what she wanted, and she taught me a lot. So it was a really, really good time. I still struggled a little bit with Bill. By now I think I'd reached my own sort of conclusions around my religious beliefs, etc. I wasn't, I wasn't racked by guilty in that sense anymore, but I was,

still struggling a little bit with, you know, the married piece, etc. Yeah. But at the end of the day, I guess I reckon. Your desires took over. Were stronger than. My desire on my side. And she clearly had time to go back and think about it after I was buffed to the first time. And the fact that she was still interested, I, I, I probably became a challenge for her.

And you know what? I think I've learned over the years that I think that was the thing I was giving off to some women unintentionally at the time, but what was painful shyness and perhaps a hangover of the sort of poor body image, etc. From when I was this scrawny, runky sort of, you know, 60 kilo guy, to still having that same mindset and not realizing that sometimes the women were genuinely blurping because they were interested, et cetera, and they were just thinking I was playing hard to get. Yeah, you were, for the girl that, let me just tell you,

a girl that comes out of the room, a married girl who's cheating on her husband that will take the shy guy off the train and go to his house and walk out naked is kind of like a little bit of a predator, okay? So the only thing you did by saying, no thanks to her and apologizing the whole way home was give her more fuel and more desire

to get you to fuck her. Do you know what I mean? Like that, you were probably way hotter to her, even more, you know, because that's probably what turned her on to begin with. You know what I mean? This is telling you.

Oh, if I knew, I'd known, but it's probably good I didn't know because I probably would have stuffed it up if I tried to play any game. So wait, so you learned all that stuff with her

because like, really, like, listen, I mean, I haven't brought this up yet, but like where you're at now, right? But we're going to still start off with this story from here and go.

But where you're at now is like your sort of exhibitionism, quote unquote, like, you know, progressed into something where like you're at the point now where you're almost like afraid you will cross a line and get like arrested because that's kind of like you need more and more, right? And that happens all the time, right, to sort of get yourself off, right? And that's where you're afraid you're going to go because you took this sort of exhibition aside from the news. beaches to a lot more places, right? Like when you started, the next thing you did after that was like you started posing in art classes, right? You did that to sort of get yourself? It wasn't long after this.

So, I mean, to just close the chat to meet with that lady, that last probably six months or so. Yeah. She then, her and her husband went on a trip around Australia. So that was sort of probably very fortunate because, you know, I was developing feelings for her, trying to keep it. She really sex, but, you know, but she was a lovely person. And then, you know, we've been really good friends with all that banter on the train.

Right, right. I think that her moving away was tough, but probably the easiest way to rip the Band-Aid off. Yeah. But after that, I did have some more confident. And it was actually the next person that I dated. She had a real curiosity. about everything. And she's still a friend today,

and she's the only friend I have in Australia that knows about what I do. Right. And she often gets involved in the planning of things, make suggestions, etc. Interesting. She may not see it herself, but if you like,

she's my own little Kathy, if you like. Right. Enjoy being debriefed afterwards and how did you feel and what happened? Yeah. seems to enjoy that. Interesting. So she was the next person I dated.

And whilst we didn't date very long, we've remained fast friends. But it was her that actually said that I should go and, it was actually a dare, go and do a nude modeling thing. Because I think she could see during that time that we were dating, that she could just see that I was busting,

the breakout and do something. So at that stage, she said, why don't you go and model an art class? So I did it. And was it like the biggest turn on? It was terrifying initially, even just ringing up. So I didn't know how to do it. And, you know, I was looking for classifieds.

I was, you know, trying to work out, how do you put an ad in the paper? Yeah. How do you do it? But I finally sort of started to find either art schools or there's a lot of evening colleges that meet after school in high schools, et cetera, and do all sorts of things. And then through a process of elimination, I'd start to find which place. ran life classes. Some places only wanted female models. And this is one of the things, Kathy, that's really fascinated me through this journey that despite Australia, I think,

being a fairly aggressive society, and I think the last 20 years most important of a lot of things, I've still observed that a lot of the raunchy X-rated things and a lot of the nudity revolves around females still and the assumption that men are the only ones that have visually stimulated. So, you know, what I found was that a lot of art places only had female models. I thought how bizarre. But I did find a number that looked for male models. And a lot of them said that they had a surprising number of males that would apply, but then not turn up. Oh, really, interesting.

Maybe they were a little bit like me. They like the fantasy. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And they chicken out. Right. You got cold feet of the reality. Yeah. Uh-huh.

So what I found out was that I found a little niche. And once I sort of sat in the car park for probably 40, got there 40 minutes early, nearly left about 10 times before the class, watched people walking in thinking, my God, am I really going to go in there and stand in front of them all in a very confined space? But overcame the fear and did it. And it was so liberating. Right. Because I think up until then, you know, by now I've been naked on beaches and doing things like that. but it was still mainly 30 glances, right? There's a politeness, there's sort of a code on a nude beach

that you don't walk up to somebody and stare at the genitalia. Right. That doesn't tend to go down well. But in an art class, you know exactly what they're looking at. And that sometimes led to the cliché challenge around because of a particularly good-looking lady in the class sketching you from two meters away and you're sort of elevated standing on a wooden box facing her.

So, you know, there's all those concerns. But you learn to count sheep and think of other things and control it. Yeah, I was going to say, how do you keep it not hard, right? How do you not sort of show that this is turning you on? Yeah. Look, to be honest, for me, the hardest, the hardest ones were when you're in reclining poses where you're actually effectively lying on your cock. so there's friction on your cock.

Right. And then if you're looking at a group of women that are drawing you and then things grow, but it's sort of obscure it. The challenge then is art classes tend to have a series of very short poses, you know, two or three minutes where the artist will muck and just do very quick sketches. Then you get into sort of 10 minute poses and then you might have one or two longer poses. The challenge was always sort of having an internal clock so that I could enjoy the erection enjoy the feeling, make sure I didn't ejaculate, of course,

but then know that I was sort of two minutes away from changing pose and I better start counting true. Right, right. But to be honest, there's not a lot else to do when you're holding a pose. So those were the sort of games that I would play virtually and it kept it very interesting. The other thing I became was sort of a prolific compiler of all the things that I was taking in during the session

so that I could then go home and jerk off to it. Yeah, and I started keeping statistics of number of women that had, you know, I had posed in front of, et cetera, even at mid beaches, I'd do that. I'd out how many and, you know, all that sort of. It was just all, in my mind, this, it was almost a game. I'm a competitive person. I love stats. Yeah, obviously, your numbers person, right.

So I was even keeping tallies of all these big longs and lost, but at the time they were things that just kept it interesting. And when you call up your Kathy, would you call up your Kathy and tell her about it? And, like, you would be able to, like, sort of, like, tell her, like, how turned on you were in the class and all that stuff. Because you were honest with her about it, right? She knew the girl who told you to do it. Absolutely. And Kathy, too, if we call her.

Yeah, let's call her here, Kathy. Yeah. She was very happy to then push the envelope and give me additional suggestion. So I think she legitimized. personally, I think she legitimized some of this and helped convince me that it's okay to, it's okay to do these things. It's okay to push your boundaries. Yeah.

And as, you know, as long as I'm, yeah, back to your earlier point, as long as I'm not crossing a line that ends up hurting somebody else or gets me. Right, or it's doing anything illegal, right? Because there's a line there with everything, right? And you just don't want to cross that with something like this. exhibitionism. Yeah, but she was also my barometer on, you know, some things I suggest. She's like, nah, that just doesn't, that doesn't interest me. So I think, okay, well, it doesn't interest her, again, there's a wide pool of people.

And I know women are all wired differently as well, but it just helped me think, oh, maybe this is a good one. And then occasionally we think of something, and she says, I really like that. So, so we'd go down that path. So what do you think was her thing? Like, what do you think about it was that she lot? Like, what was her, like, what kind of thing? fetish did she have, I wonder.

Well, for a long time there, I thought, is she enjoying the dominant role? Yeah. Yeah, you're right. Yeah. That's like a dom thing. But having said that, you know, I've offered and invited many times to come over and give me a good spanking or whatever, but

that stuff doesn't seem to work for this. So I think she likes being the puppet master. I think she likes seeing how far I will go. Yeah. She loves, she loves seeing me say, there's no way I would do that. Uh-huh. And then I'd do it. Interesting.

So she loves that. And she does love scenarios where they're frankly funny and embarrassing, too, which is something I had never really thought of, right? So maybe I can sort of explain that. But some of the scenarios that I found myself in have been awkward. and initially embarrassing or even I thought, oh, I'm in the wrong place. So I'm terrified about that,

but she's actually engineered that. So I've been told to go to somebody's house and get naked on the front porch. The door will be open, going to the hallway and start jerking off. Wait a second. Oh, my God. Wait, wait, wait, hold on.

Sorry, I'll probably jump the long way forward. Yeah, she's a lot more involved. Wait, she's a lot more involved. Maybe we should pull back on that for now. No, I don't want you to pull back on that. this is a shit I want to get into. So she's the person who is pushing you. So what kind of scenarios would she tell you to go do?

She would tell you, go to this person's house. She would give you an address. Yes. Okay. And so I would, and initially, again, these would start fairly tainly. So sometimes she would saw somebody that's interested. Sometimes by now I've got the internet. I've got chat rooms.

I've got some other avenues. So I'm starting to test and look for perspective. females that are open to this sort of thing and boyaristic or, you know, up for a challenge. So I would sometimes source them, sometimes she would know somebody. But by the way, once I'd source somebody, I would still talk to my Kathy and she'd say,

well, here's how I want it to play out. So she would still have involvement and give me some suggestions around that. Sometimes she would get hooked up with the person that I was going to meet and they would arrange something without me knowing, again, to create a surprise element and a bit of a shock element, or sometimes an embarrassment element because they, that amused it.

Yeah, that's like a thing for them. Yeah, I want to talk to them. Yeah, and a power thing. I think it was like, look, she knew that anything that turns on the woman is my fetish, if that makes sense. So if I'm doing something visually or just the fact that I'm doing it, and sometimes it might be something that some people would consider humiliating or a little bit demeaning.

But within certain parameters, if I'm doing those, but I know that it's just turning on that woman that I'm prepared to do that in front of her. Or it's fascinating or, gee, I never thought I'd see that, and I'm glad I did. That's a turn on for you, to turn her on, right? That's a turn on for me, right?

Yeah. I got rid of the desire to, you know, walk through a park and flash somebody because, you know, I've had lots of nudity on beaches and in art classes, so that's not what's working for me. that's become sort of my norm. Yeah, for sure. It's got to be something that's got a new angle.

So that was a sort of scenario. So this particular one I referred to, she had sent me the address. So she'd made the contact. I think I had sourced the person, but she had made contact with them and said, we'll organize it and then we'll text you the detail. So go to this place. There's like a porch. You're going to take all your clothes off, put them in a box at the front door.

and then you're going to find the front door open, walking to the hallway, and there's a full-length mirror there. You're going to stand in front of the mirror and start to jerk off. So I did that. But then three people walked up the hallway and acted completely shocked. They acted not being shocked, horrified.

So I'm like, oh my God, so I'm sort of trying to cover things, et cetera. and they start interrogating me and what are you doing blah blah blah and it was probably only a couple of minutes but it felt like in a lifetime and I was thinking I just run out of the door

but my mind said that's going to make me look more guilty so I'm sort of trying to explain oh apparently a misunderstanding I'm such sorry comical now but at the time I was pretty terrified but the really funny observation

from this was after trying to explain it for two or three minutes they then said, no, they admitted that it was a set up and I was in the right place. So I then relaxed. And then one of the ladies sort of pointed and said, look at his coffee, still completely hard. And so that to them was amazing that during this two or three minutes of object fear. Right. You were turned on. I was completely aroused still.

Yeah, you don't lose your heart on. And that was a bit that my Kathy found fascinating when I shared that observation. And then she's like, well, that's really interesting. I think for her, it was a little bit of a, I don't know, a psychology experiment. I think I've been a psychologist for the last 25 years, but these are the sorts of things that she'd like to pick up on those movements, and then trying to think of another scenario next time that's leverage is from that, to see what else happened, et cetera.

So that was just an example, but a fascinating one. She is the puppet master this one, this Kathy. I think so. Yeah, so wait, so you did that. And then did you realize that, like after that experience, right, when you went home, like them sort of seeing you and being horrified? Like, did you play that over and over? And was that like a real turn on to you? Initially, look, I'm still, this might sound strange, but I'm still a fairly conservative person outside.

You know, I've got a, you know, demanding sort of business career. You know, I lead big teams. I've been, you know, so I'm the sort of prim and proper person. I think I'm a fun person. I think people would describe me as fun and don't take myself too seriously, but I still am always concerned about not making people uncomfortable. So for a little while I was still feeling the altercations around,

oh my God, imagine if I did walk into the wrong house, or this is an example of how it really could go care-shaped and suddenly we don't have many guns in Australia, but, you know, I could be accidentally shot or something. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, okay. You look like a rapist standing there with an erection in somebody. a hallway, right? So that bit played, but certainly there was, as that sort of settled down a little bit, then it was, it was a turn-on and the idea of getting that initial sort of shock element. And it even

reminds me of, even when I was living up on the coastal town but commuting down to the city, I did find up there a nudist beach where it was actually a fully-closed beach with a sort of little new dissection down the end. And then it reminded me to, What I love there was sort of the families and stuff that would go to picnic or whatever, or the couples and the older ladies just walking. And then obviously coming across the nudist section, but not even realizing that this beach had that. And that shock element.

And then often, you know, some would just continue to walk. Some would shake their head. But then it was the ones that would come and casually sit down 10 metres away. And that was the stuff that was really exciting to me. Because I thought, you know, there's a little bit of curiosity around it. So I guess at a strong, this was a much more in your friend. face confronting moment, but it was that same sort of seeing somebody perhaps react as as society normally reacts, but then seeing that underneath all that,

I'm kind of into it too. Yeah, kind of into it too, yeah. But I know that you said that, like, you now it, you really need for, or to get off, right, you want people to see you jerking off or humping, like in public, right? Does that ever, and I'm assuming you haven't crossed the line, I'm assuming you just do this with people that you set it up with and your Kathy sets it up with, or I don't know. Or have you been crossing any lines where you're doing this kind of stuff in public to people that maybe aren't, didn't know that they were involved in the setup? Do you know what I mean?

So I think I'm starting to push the envelope, but still in a way that hasn't concerned me yet. So I will, after the age of sort of 25, which was where this sort of all started to happen, and sorry if this is a little long, a bit of explanation to what you just asked, but I ultimately met the woman that I'm madly in love with and is my wife and would be married for nearly 20 years. Okay. And now we have our two children. But this stuff still sort of happened in parallel.

But the real change for me where things went up another level was, I took a role in Southeast Asia and moved the family with me. Yeah. And then we were in a very different play pool, if you like, or playpen. Where there were a lot of different dynamics. And there was the opportunity there to somebody that we identified, if you like, an Asian, Kathy. Yeah.

Where we found somebody who is actually, has been doing this stuff for a very long. time and she how did you find that person well let me ask you this quick question wait quick question your wife that you married this woman that you were did she know about all this stuff and then you guys were open with each other and then when you say we you guys met the new kathy or did the old kathy help you meet the new kathy okay yeah regrettably regrettably no i would so who's we sorry who's the we with um so we was the kathy in australia and and and Oh, okay, so she's still helping you. You're still friends.

With the Asian cat. Okay, interesting. I love it. A lot of this at this stage was kill through the internet and also Craig Lewis at this stage. Yeah, for sure. To my disappointment, a year and a half ago, Craig Lewis stopped. I know. Yeah.

Right, as I'm sure you're fully aware. So that's one of the reasons I think in my email, I said I'm struggling with some of the legitimate angles now because that was my long time. You had to field it through a lot of nonsense. but I was patient enough because, you know, I found that one in 30 people was worth it. That's where I got all my guests from when I first started my podcast. I've been doing this podcast for four years. So in the beginning, I didn't have enough people calling in, right? I had to go find people.

I sent emails out. I, for the first probably two years, that's how I got callers. You know, I sent them emails and I went on Craigslist. It was like I always said that Craigslist was the gift that kept on giving. And then by the time they went bus, it didn't matter. Thank God I have so many listeners, people just write in. but, you know, for a while there was the greatest thing. And that's where you could find like-minded people

that were into the same things you were. So you and Kathy were still friends behind your wife's back, right? And you were doing this shit behind your wife's back. So you were living a double life, right? I absolutely was. And my wife knew when we met, she knew that I'd done muddling and that side of things. But she had a very conservative Muslim background

because she's Asian. and so we've got a wonderful relationship, but it is a very vanilla relationship. Okay. And very happy sexually, but again, very vanilla sex, et cetera,

and wonderful. And so that's, it's probably my greatest fear, even more than the arrest fee, although one would lead to the other. I would never want to do anything that jeopardized our relationship. Right,

well, that's what the arrest thing, like you said, it would lead to that, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So look,

I think our, I think our, relationship would endure anything I've done. I really believe that. It's not somewhere. I wouldn't want to put it through what I know would be a very painful period of realization before we perhaps got to that point. And I'm not prepared to risk our relationship if I'm wrong on that.

Let me ask you this quick question. Maybe that will change. Because you're into the whole nudie thing and being an exhibition as being out in public, naked, jerking off all the stuff. Does it ever involve any kind of like sexual acts with other people? Like, are you cheating on your wife? I mean, I know she would consider being naked in front of other people and drinking off cheating, but like, do you ever also have sex with people or does it lead to things like that as well?

It has. Okay. Okay. Yes. Yes. And that took quite a long time, but ultimately, yes. Right. And again, I'm not going to try to moralize it.

But I think it's been that continuing to push the envelope, one of the things that a lot of women, wanted to watch were two people fucking. Right. Or a person sucking off somebody else, et cetera. So inevitably, as I made these contacts, and particularly when I was in Asia, I just found that I got into sort of an escalating set of events where it inevitably did move a lot of these boundaries. Right.

And that your Asian, Kathy, helped? She helped. She participated. she participated. Right. If she, if she, if she rang in to you, I think she'd have her own series. Yeah, for sure. She's a very, very unique lady who came to terms with who she was sexually, I think,

from the very early age and has no inhibitions that I can uncover whatsoever. But also the financial means to get up scenarios that, frankly, in Australia, just you'd never contemplate. So as a result of that, she would host charity events with, you know, little, what she called New Olympics, where a bunch of guys would do certain events while the women watched paying women do things for charity and all that sort of stuff. But all sorts of things that, again, I don't think whatever happened in Australia is just too logistically difficult and probably too expensive to arrange. So she would, so you would do these kind of threesome, like, because you said some of these women that were open. into sort of watching you jerk off.

They wanted to see you maybe fuck somebody else. So like you were sleeping with this, Kathy. Is that what you would do? Or she would maybe find somebody else and you would have sex in front of people and they were watching. The Asian Kathy, yes. Yeah. No, the other one.

Right. That's what I mean Asian Kathy now. Yeah. So the Asian Kathy, yeah. So you would have sex with her. Maybe other people would watch. And now did you find that you also enjoyed being watched like having sex too? I'm sure that was a part of it.

That was a turn on for you, right? It was a turner. Look, the first couple of times I was suddenly, like I've forgotten how to do it. Yeah. Because I was, I was the mechanics of, oh, I've never really considered what's like to look from that angle sort of thing. Yeah. And probably some of that was the legacy of my modeling days because back to that first time I turned up, I thought the scary thing was getting my kid off. Yeah.

The scary thing was when they said, now start doing some poses. Right. And I was like, oh, I assumed someone had come. and say, put your arm here, do this, put you hit like that. They didn't. They expected me to know how to turn my torso, create negative spaces and do all that. So I think it's given me sort of an awareness of the aesthetics of all this.

So then get into the scenario where you're suddenly having sex in front of people or even just a blow job or something, thinking about how do I do this on an angle so that they can actually see what's happening and it's not just a bad porno where all the action is being blocked sort of thing. So the first few times it felt a little mechanical and probably contrived. But no, I think quickly got over that and, yeah, massive, massive turnoff. Right.

And how long did you live there for? Because you're in Australia now. You're calling me from Australia, right? Back in Australia, yes. So we ended up being there for around six years. So I thought it was going to be shorter, but the work went well. So stayed there for quite a long time. So that's why I had to be.

enough time to sort of escalate and and and to develop quite a few scenarios and what I did find was a lot of Asian women had a curiosity frankly around the Western cock and and I think they heard all the all the you know the the fairy tales that they were different or bigger or whatever yeah and and the reality is I don't believe any of that I think statistically we're all pretty pretty close but it was it was almost a reverse I don't know how to say this. I think what I learned when I was in Southeast Asia is despite the fact that they are going gangbusters economically these days. And, you know, a lot of the largest folks in the world is coming out of those regions.

There's still been a lot of that historical conjugation by Western countries, largely, you know, from the US during World War II when they came in and sort of occupied the Philippines and all those regions. So there's almost a view that Western has considered themselves superior. Yeah. even though I never felt any over and animosity. And so there was a real curiosity about what? So the gunwashed was going to be, you know, nine, nine Asian guys, and there's going to be a Western guy? Oh, that's interesting.

And they actually found that quite fun. And again, some of the things were a little more demeaning or a little more comical. There was one Olympics event where Asian Kathy arranged a couple. couple of my Thai guys, so they were expert martial arts

guys, and it was sort of a dude wrestling thing, and they were half my size and I just got my butt kick literally,

and then at the end of that, you know, had to, I guess, get penetrated by them as the final piece because I lost.

Whoa. You got penetrated by the guys. When did you start fooling around with dudes? I've missed that in this story.

Well, through, through this, and I realized that we hadn't, we hadn't gently into that, but again, it was through, it was through this whole visual process. So it was a line that if we'd spoken 15 years ago, I would have said to you. No fucking way, right. Never, right.

Never. And I'm sure you could probably have other callers that have had a similar position at some point in their lives. It just, I saw absolutely no appeal. I just didn't get it. But initially, for me, the changeover was, well, even when I first went to art classes, course there were males for him. And it was like, okay, I don't like that, but it's necessary either. So I'll put up with it.

But with some of these events, there would inevitably be sometimes a couple of males that were watching with the Asian shows. And then, again, the two Kathy's plotting in the background started to push the envelope. So look, there were a whole lot of little steps in that. These, wait, these other Kathy's are a breed of their own. I really need to get a Kathy on my show because these are, I don't know. I mean, this is like, interesting, they're very interesting, like, what they did to you, how they pushed you, what they were into and how there's more than one of them.

So there's probably lots of other Kathy's out there. It's like, I don't know, I'm really interested in them in their mindset. But so they really pushed that and got you into it. And I guess because you're kind of like a sub, right, if we want to give some sort of term to this. Like, you just, you, that part of the turn on is sort of doing what they want you to do if you think it will turn them on, right? Correct.

And that's the challenge with so many ladies that I have met. They're lovely and I think they're game. You know, I used to, back in Yahoo chat days, I chat to a girl and say, you know, this is what I'm into. I'm harmless, blah, blah, blah. but I just love to be naked if I'm in front of me, and if you were comfortable enough, I'm going to get hard and funny or to jerk off,

that would be, you know, for me, awesome. Yeah. And I do a good massage, I'm a qualified Swedish massus. Yeah. But they'd often be really hesitant and say, oh, we'll meet in a coffee shop first or something. But occasionally, and I remember this one lady, chatted, chatter, chatter.

She said, I'm going to drive over, sort of 30 minutes from her suburb to mine. She said, but I don't know. I don't know about this. And I said, well, here's the code. I said, here's my mobile number when you get. to the bottom of the building, you either say I've arrived, in which case I'll enter the door fully closed, or you're going to say, and I brought my umbrella, and I'm going to answer

the doormaker. Interesting. To my great shock, you know, hired so-and-so, I'm down at the lobby, and I bought my umbrella. And I would have, I would have bet a million dollars that she wouldn't have done that. Right, but she did. And so I knew that she was my sort of girl because she was sort of boring enough to direct and take some initiative. The ones that just don't work for me are the ones that say, you do a way.

whatever you want. Right. And I'll just watch. Right. And to me, that's like, well, I could be doing something and you just don't like it. And that doesn't turn me on. No, you really like the girl. You really like to be directed.

You really like that Kathy at your life. That's a thing for you. It does work, even though I hate to admit it to her because she loves that, that acknowledgement by me. But even though she really frustrates me sometimes. I said I won't do that, but she's like, yeah, you said that so many times and look where we are now. Oh, my God, and all of a sudden you have a dick in your mouth. I mean, you know what I mean?

Like, come on. Like, if she could get you to do that, that's pretty good. You got to high-five her. I mean, she'd probably pat yourself on the back. No, absolutely. Absolutely. She would claim all the credit for anything I've done well and anything I've done badly, then that's entirely my fault.

Wait. So let's just get back to the guy thing. I know that you said that like if this was 10, 15 years ago, like you, this would, you would have like swore like it would, none of this shit would have went down, right? But the whole guy thing was there ever, like when did it start to occur to you that like maybe you were by and you were into guys? Like, you know, did the Kathy start kind of bringing it up and like planting seeds in you or did you start having an attraction to men? But that's a great question, Kathy. I think for me it was never, never something that I was consciously aware of.

But with my exhibitionistic side, I would still start to look at images of, you know, naked guys with erections, etc. But for me, it was that whole, you've heard the term CFNM? No. There's a lot of fetish sites. So it stands for closed female, naked man. Okay. And would you believe there's websites full of those sorts of. of images. So there's a lot of people that have that sort of exhibitionistic bent and like the

idea of the women being in control and clothes, some of the scenarios are clearly staged when you look at the websites, but it'll talk about all sorts of things. And so for me, that was something that was of appeal as soon as I found that sort of site because it was appealing to my sort of exhibition existing side, but it wasn't that I was turned on by the naked man. It was more that scenario with the woman in control. And you would be the main. man. Right? Absolutely.

Yeah. So those sorts of things and some of that footage that I would see in videos or the images would, of course, have multiple men. And ultimately, sometimes the men servicing each other while the women clearly controlled that and looked on. So I guess I had those sorts of images playing around in my head. But, no, it took fairly active, I guess, coercion from particularly Asian. Kathy.

love these gathers yeah yeah to get to get me to the point where I would even contemplate sort of I think same room activity where I was even servicing myself in front of men was something that initially I was not not predisposed to what to do so it started is that how it started it started with you just like sort of maybe jerking off with other men in the room and then a blow job or I don't know like how did it where did it start and how did it progress I mean I know So it started. Yeah. Sorry.

No, you go. So as I mentioned, I think I'd mentioned before that Asian did a lot of fundraisers and things. So inevitably, some of the events I did initially as she was clearly, oh, you could turn grooming me or, you know, getting me, perhaps for the sorts of things that she enjoyed were all female audiences. But inevitably, it would start to be some men attending some of those. And I think that was her way of starting to,

perhaps change some of the hard wiring that I'd had through my life. And so at first I thought I'm not even going to be able to get hard on with the guy watching, but as I continued to focus on the women, that proved to not be an issue. And ultimately, at one of the events, it was actually an audience member that she got to come out and effectively, I was told to, you know, give me moral. So that was the starting point. And that was your first blow. Wait, but let me ask you, was it like a turn-off?

I was terrified. I actually didn't think I'd want to do it. I had all sorts of concerns that I'd be physically ill or whatever, and that I wouldn't know what to do. And yet, when I think about it, that's sort of bizarre. If I'm not a cock, I sort of know what feels good on myself, just hadn't really given it conscious thought. So look, instincts kicked in, and I'd like to think I did a fairly good job.

the thing the thing that I remember was there was that bit where I could start to feel the spasming in the abdomen and I thought he's going to come so I sort of took him out of my mouth and I remember very clearly Kathy taking the back of my head and forcing me back over him and making me actually take the load so there was no discussion but I didn't resist and I think I think that's the key thing

it was always very clear that I could walk away at any time. Right, right. You know, I was a guy that was heading off, and it was just this constant pushing the envelope to see where it would take us. And it took us a lot further than I would have ever expected. And then once you did that, did that just sort of open the doors, that you were just like game and down, and then they always sort of, they just created more scenarios for you

because they knew that you'd go there? Yeah, look, I never felt that I was going all down every time I was still rather a group of women, but they knew that it was within the parameters and that they could push it. Yeah. And what I learned very early on with these ladies was the more I said I didn't enjoy something, the more they went down that route. Yeah. They're perverse fun.

Some of this was amusement for them. And then, you know, that scenario is this is the type of girl you're in the wrong place? No, but this is the type of girl you're attracted to do. that girl from your child, like when you were super young, the girl that you worked with, that like, you were like, no way, we can't do this. You sent her home. She walked out naked and you turned her down. And then she just like came at you like now she needed to like force you to do it. Like that's like your thing. That's like the relationship you play out over and over again. That's like. Correct. I guess it's the opposite to my real life relationship, but it's the fun

side. And it does play on. And some of the best conversations I've had a weekend. out into Australia and Kathy, the time when I was living in Southeast Asia and doing these things with Asian, Kathy and her entourage is just, I just heard laughter. Just on the phone going, my God, does she really get you to do that? And her anticipating, without even seeing it, just vicariously, being able to see that image. And then that I would subsequently learn that they had engineered that and exchanged emails and, you know, that are delighted that have played out, perhaps even more amusingly in their

opinions and are intensified. Where does it, like, let me just ask you this. Where does your wife, like, because it just seems like this is such a, like, a rich private life for you, like, meaning like there's a lot of, like, like, I don't know, these charity events

and all these things, you know, like, I don't know, it just seems like a lot of time that you were sort of doing these things and this is a double life that you're living, right? Like, you have a wife, you're married, you have a whole, and this is like a secret life. So, like, where does your wife think you are when you're doing all these

things and how have you been able to get away with it for all this time? Look, I've had some pretty senior roles that have involved a lot of travel. Yeah. And particularly when I was in Southeast Asia, I would often find myself in multiple countries during the course of the week. And in fact, the Asian Kathy actually had a home in two different countries and had sort of an option, putting between one of the things, another one, you know, another season. So there was opportunity in scope.

Everything to spell it to place for you. And, you know, the advantage these days, of course, is with the cams, etc. It's always very easy to phone home and have all that continuity in my life. So a lot of this was mental planning and logistics, but really the ladies did most of the hard work. I really just would be told where to turn up and often that would be all I would know. Did you ever, like, take it in the ass by a guy? Or did you say that before? Like, are you a bottom?

Are you a top? Do you do both because the Kathy's tell you to? Yes. So, look, I didn't. I haven't mentioned it yet, but I look, I think it's fair to say. I'm almost blushing now, but I think I've, every scenario you can think of. You've done. Experience.

There's no bad. I've taken it in the, I've taken it in the arts. I've taken it in the art. I've taken it in the art. Multiple men in on one event. Yeah. So like a gang bank situation? They used to do a conga line and have four or five guys literally joined us to

cop and have this parade around while the women were sort of putting money in a hat and all that sort of stuff. Wow. Visually they'd just come up with bizarre things as they could think of and the audiences would just enjoy it. And it became a little bit of a, you know, there were people that I would recognize in these crowds routinely. And, you know, I figured they were probably, you know,

crazy rich Asians that movie that's come out recently, but I think some of these people were pretty well funded. I know the money was always going to charities, and so there was always this, well, how are we going to top off what we did last time? But to my amusement, you know, I was becoming older, and I was over there for a million decades and thinking, well, you know, are they still going to want to see this Western guy amongst at all, but the novelty didn't seem to wear off. And in fact, they enjoyed, I think, the embarrassment.

And I would be quite theatrical sometimes and looking like I was protesting, if I could tell that was the reaction that was wanted. But ultimately, you know, whatever it was commanded happened. So I think they enjoyed almost my good sports ownership through it all, but ultimately the fact that I was offered the foil of the joke or the setup. So, yeah, it was obviously a mutually beneficial relationship, and I had many hours of sort of subsequent pleasure

when I would remember it all and read with it and jerk off with some pretty rich material over the years. Yeah, I can't believe these kind of events go down. I mean, this is the first time I've ever hearing of something like this, like the whole events that this lady put on with all these women watching. Like, I don't know.

Like, it sounds like it's from like another time period. Like, I can't even believe it. But this is why I love doing my show because it never ceases to amaze me. I always hear something new. And, you know, this is like this is going down, right? I mean, like, you weren't the only person there. It wasn't just the other Kathy.

Like, how many people would be attending these events? Look, look, a lot of them were smaller. A lot of them would have been maybe half a dozen to 10 people watching. But there were a couple of really big things that she did where there were, it would have been more like 30 or 40 people. Now, some of those were tamer and we might be behaving as nude waiters and things like that. But things inevitably as the alcohol flowed, things, would still even end up quite wild on some of those.

So, you know, I think she had to test the limits of the attendees, etc. But she was a master of manipulating everybody. And she often participated herself, by the way, and absolutely stunning and an incredibly sexual woman who could orgasm multiple times. I mean, I can't tell you what she taught me about the female anatomy. And basically, he made me practice and practice and practice until I was giving her what she wanted. So I think, you know, I don't think we've touched on it yet, but, and I'm not saying,

I'm not saying this with any reference point for what anybody else does, but the thing she taught me about how to, you know, give her orgasms and multiple orgasms and to be patient until, until the woman had enough meant that I was able to sometimes, I'll use the term, service, some women that had problems in that area and had had orgasms. And over that time, I found that I was able to, sometimes it would take a few visits, but I would end up being able to give them a climax that they'd never enjoyed before, which was also very satisfying. I actually found I loved that.

Right. It wasn't so much a turn on necessarily, but to have somebody actually received that pleasure and see that sort of look at astonishment, that was a, yeah, I'd walk home pretty proud of a fuck after that sort of scenario. Yeah, there's power in that. Where the fuck is this Asian Cathy now? Is she married?

Is she a single woman? Is she all, like... So when I knew her, she was married, but a very, I think a very loose marriage, I think perhaps her lifestyle was funded. Yeah. So she was a woman of leisure, but a very switched on lady. But to my latest update I got, I believe that she is now single, but single, we're busy. Yeah.

But still having fun? Oh, my God, what I do to get her or your other Kathy on the phone? Oh, my God. But wait, let's get back to you because I'm going to. wrap it up soon but we still have a little time and I want to talk about how like because you said in your initial email to me that like you're at this place right now where you're afraid you might cross some lines right and get into like territory that's like like illegal stuff because you're so you've been doing this stuff for so long that you're at the point now where like you need more and more right

it's like anything right and so now you're like at that kind of place where maybe you need stuff that might be like, I don't know, are you like doing your exhibition and stuff in like places where people that will see you that aren't supposed to see you kind of thing, you know, like that kind of situations? Am I making any sense? So that's, no, you're making perfect sense. Look, firstly, after I wrote that, I sort of reconsidered and thought, but that's where my mind is that.

I think the reality is, I think I'm too, despite everything that I've talked to you about, I think I am still basically a rational individual who knows where the lines should be drawn. I'm getting some pressure from the two Kathy's at the moment because I think we're all a little bored. And, you know, I haven't seen Asian Kathy for, you know, four years in person. We've done a few things via cam or whatever. But they're trying to push the envelope. But the thing that I keep saying is these days there's cameras everywhere, right? So there are even suggestions around go and get an erection and, you know, in front of the opera house or some of the famous, you know, places around city.

I'm saying, look, that might sound relatively straightforward, but it's the mechanics. No, that you will get in trouble. Yeah, you'll get in a lot of fucking trouble. And so there's a sorts of things I'm talking about. So I'm certainly not proposing that I'm going to start flashing and terrifying. I thought that's what you meant. Yeah, I thought that's what you meant. But like after talking to you for like an hour and something, like I don't.

Like I don't get that sense from you either, like you say. You know what I mean? Like you seem like this is just all, you know, you're in a fine place. Like this is your thing. This is a fetish. You sort of have done a lot and have enjoyed yourself doing all your stuff within proper boundaries, right? I wouldn't listen to those. I'll be your third, Kathy, until you don't fucking listen to those bitches when they say to go jerk off in front of public.

This is just because they're bored because you're going to wind up being arrested. You have a wife. I mean, they have nothing to lose. Like, you do not. Like, you have to have a line with, you have to have a boundary with them. That's what you really have to do. And, look, ultimately, ultimately I will. And I'm sure I'll stop short.

But I guess what I'm looking for is the next way that this could play out and morph itself. And, you know, we talked about, obviously, Craig Bliss isn't a source of contacts these days. So certainly if you, Kathy, ever get any ideas or avenues or anybody contacts you from down under and says, boy, we wouldn't mind watching someone like this do some stuff. I mean, I've done. Let me ask you this. Are you open to virtual stuff? Because I'm sure I'll get hit up by people if you're putting that out there. If you want to use my show, I mean, other people have done it.

I do a lot of that. I do a lot of that at the moment. And look, I go on to sites like Free Chat Now. And women, there's a whole thing around doing top tributes at the moment. So women send their photos or photos of their friends, and they enjoy seeing a guy get hard and photograph his direction in front of their photos. And then inevitably, some of them will say, well, will you jerk off while we watch on a cam and stuff? So that stuff is, for me, it's a...

You've been there, done that. But I'm happy to do those sorts of things. I think I said at the beginning, anything that turns on a woman and anything where a woman's initiating it and making a suggestion. So she might think, oh, look, that's quite tame and this guy's done so much more stuff. But if that's where she is on her journey,

and for her it would be a giggle and very daring to send her photo close, you know, her photo and have me come on it or whatever, then that would still work for me and turn me on because that's where she's at. And then I would have in my mind maybe over subsequent weeks we could take that further. So, yeah, I enjoy and sort of respect.

everybody's journey around these sorts of things and I'm happy to be involved and there was a lady in Thailand who I met through a photography site and she was a virgin in her early 30s but she had met a man and she was dating him sort of virtually and one thing led to another and I ended up in a hotel room just jerking off for her and letting her just handle opinions for the first time because she didn't want her first time with this guy had no idea and she's now happily married with and enjoying a great sex life. So for me, that was great. I still got off on what I enjoyed doing.

It wasn't purely altruistic, but that was a great thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I would look on back on that very fondly. Well, yeah, that was very nice of you to do it. But like you said, I mean, you got something out of it, but like you were helping her, right? I mean, you both sort of had a need

and you both serviced each other for what you both wanted. I think that that's great. So if there's people out there that are listening. Real win-win. Yeah, if there's. people that are out there that have an idea of what they'd like to do with you, okay, considering all the things you're into and open to, which is a lot, right? Or guys, I mean, let me ask you this.

Do you take direction from men the same way? Like, would you be into that? From guys? Look, I do. If I've got a woman and a guy contacting me at the same time through a site like through chat, now I've always opted for the women. But I get horny. I get worked up, I get bored, and then things go out the window sometimes.

Yeah. Often, I'm pretty certain that the person that's claiming to be a woman is a guy. Yeah. And normally the giveaway will be they'll send a few photos of women. I'll do my cop tributes. Then they'll say, can I watch on can? But it's amazing how many people say that their can't work, they can watch only, and I can't hear or see them.

Those are dudes. It's a guy. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Are there a lot of women? I'll still do it. But how many times? I mean, do you find that there's a lot of women that are on the other end of those cams

actually really watching guys doing stuff like that? I would say that I've probably contributed about 2,000 women in the last year. I just did it on Valentine's Day. February last year, I did it for fun to try, and I did it as a Valentine Day sort of joke. You know, if you're a home alone, you don't have a partner. let me show you how much I appreciate you.

Where was your partner? This was the middle of the night. Okay, she was asleep. I don't sleep a lot. It's probably mainly women with your accent on the other side of the world that are all made. Yeah, yeah. But can you believe your poor wife?

She better never find out anything. The fact that you're like online on Valentine's Day doing this, oh my God, she'd be horrified. But wait a second. Could let me just tell, can you, just explain this whole, this is what we're going to end with, but I want, because I feel like there's a lot of guys. It's like that whole, you know, those guys that are always just sending girls or dick picks. And most of the time they're sending to a girl that doesn't fucking

care because most women don't, right? But in this place where you go and that you found, there's like thousands of women that this is exactly what they're looking for, right? So I think that this is like a really interesting thing to tell guys about so that you could stop sending it to girls that aren't interested and don't really want to engage, right? If you want to sort of do this, this is what I, I think a lot of guys would be into this. So could you explain where you go and what this is all about and how they could do it themselves? Sure. So look, the site that I stumbled on, you know, not long before that Valentine's last year is a site called Free Chat Now.

So it's literally one word, free F-R-W-Chapnow.com. Yeah. And basically it has a whole lot of chat rooms. But it will typically have thousands of people on there at any one time identified by gender, although that can obviously be fake. And you can talk about virtually anything. But even within that site, Kathy, I find so many guys will just start sending dick.

And you'll see the girls posting. I don't just want to see your dick. So my advice to guys is be a little bit imaginative and look for an angle. And I'm amazed how many guys, because what I'll tend to do is I'll go in and post a sentence to say, I'm available for cock tributes. But then you can post photos in the general chat

that people can cook. click on. So I'll post some photos of pop tributes I've done. People then have a look, see my erection. I've got a little bit of a unique erection that curved up. There'd be a real sort of thing and they seem to say I've got a nice, a nice head so, you know, attractive if you're into that sort of thing. Yeah. And, you know, it's only 5% of the women on there are interested. You still probably got 100 women at any one time that are looking, clicking on that. And then ultimately they send you private messages. Yeah. They send your private messages. And then they start sending your photos and you take it from there.

And again, you respond, you say, I say you're in charge, it's up to you, you, you send me what you like, you've got to close photo, if it's a photo, it's a photo of a grip of you and your friends and you're going to show them one night and have a chuckle, then let's do that. And then I find that they might say they've got one or two and then they'll say, hang on, I'm going to find some more. And often I'll do 20 or 30 photos for one way, and then you might talk about do you come on the photo or on the people.

And I tend to say, well, that's not real practical on my iPad screen or my phone screen, but so I can print your photo out and then maybe we jump onto a cam app like Rubio, for example, where I just send them to delete. So there's no risk of them having to be backed down and they click on it. And then we take it from there. And I've had some very kinky girls on there who have had me going and humping the bonnet of my car, you know, doing all sorts of things. Yeah.

That's where the girls are that people are looking for. I mean, you know, I feel like it's like there's a lot of guys out there with these dirty minds and they can't find the right woman to sort of express that, right? And I feel like this is like a great place to do it, right? Because that's where those kind of women are. But be patient, be patient, be imaginative, and be prepared to send some photos as proof so they can have a look and say, okay, this guy is genuine. He's not pretending to do this.

Like, I think there's a lot of fakes. Yeah. You know, there's a lot of people just want to wallplay in these chat rooms, so they don't really want to do anything. Yeah. So I post a few photos, so they go, he's the real deal, and we take it from there. Now I'm on freechat. Freechat.com.

There's like all different links. Where do they go? It's like cam chat, camsax, live sex, adult chat, sex chat. Where are you? Okay. But if you go, if you click on sex chat, that will then take you to the main section. But there's a whole lot of different rooms once you're in there. Right.

Where do you do the cock? Where do you do the cock tributes? Where do you go to find the women that are doing these cock tributes? I mean, you seem to have a name for it. I've never heard of this. I would jump into that sex cat room because it's always the busiest room. Yeah, okay. But once you're in that room, once you're in that room, there's sub-indexes where you can put around.

So there's porn room and there's role-play room and there's adult chat. And I just will jump into each of them post a sentence, put in a few. examples and then I just sit back and get hard and get ready and get busy. And so this cock tribute, the cock tribute thing, like this is something like, this is because, I mean, I don't know, did you make up that name or is this like a sort of term used by people in these chat rooms right now? Look, I'm saying, well, I certainly don't think I made it up, but I've seen a lot more people saying that they will do it since, since I've been doing it over the last 12 months.

And so they'll either say cop tribute, which tends to be, you know, you're a lot of. a wrecked cock and balls in front of a photo. But then there's others that we'll be talking about come from tribute. Okay, so there's cop tributes. And you'll see a lot of ladies on there saying that they're looking for someone to cock tribute or cum tribute. Yeah.

And then you'll also see quite a few ladies that say they just want to watch a guy jerk off on can. So there you go. There is a care map within the free chat. I find it doesn't work on my iPad, but that's where I just send a gruvio link and post that. And then they click on that. It's anonymous to anybody else.

you do it through a private message. And so you're controlling your audience. Sometimes if I'm really horny and haven't found anybody, I'll just post that on the public. And I might get three or four men and women jumping on and watching. So there you go. So if anyone's interested in, you know, or they have a freaky side, an exhibitionist side,

or maybe, like I said, you're just a guy. Because I don't know. I mean, I've had guys send me dick picks, you know, and you have the time you're like, who the fuck cares, you know, right? And I just feel like, but and there's some that, like, They do it incessantly, right? So it's like a thing for them, right? And I feel like this is the kind of place where they could go and sort of do that and find like, like, like,

like, like, minded people. You know, there is, I mean, I haven't even touched upon, like, the humiliation aspect, right? To, like, what, I could talk to you for, like, another hour. Like, we're going to probably have to eventually do a part two. Could you ever come on with your Kathy? Could your Kathy and you ever come on as it together? I can certainly, I can certainly pose the question. I think the better chance would be

to get her love. To get her love? Yeah, Asian Kathy. Oh, the Asian Kathy. Oh, my God, I would love her. Her English is a little halting, but I find it endearing. She will just take over the show. Logistically, that might be challenging, but she would be fantastic.

I think the Australian Kathy might be a little reticent, although I believe you do change. I change the voice, yeah. I'll change your voice. I could change her voice. I would ever know. She remembers because she hasn't seen much of it, but she's heard all the detailed updates.

She remembers more vicariously than I do because sometimes it becomes a little bit of a bullet. Right, right. She'll remind me of things. Yeah, I'd love to get at work on that. Yeah, so she even reminded me on the story I talked about where I ended up in hallway. She said, you know, don't forget that the laden was drinking cups of tea to make it even look more. I said, you know what? I hadn't even remembered that.

Right. So she remembers a lot of details. Yeah, I want her on. that she finds amusing. I want her on. All right, listen, Jeff, we'll probably do another episode with you eventually because, like I said, we're at like an hour and a half. And I just feel like you probably have so.

No, no, no, I don't apologize. I mean, like, you know, how do you cram everything in? You've done a lot of stuff. We're talking about many, many years of, like, interesting stuff that you've been doing that I love to hear about and people like to hear about. So we'll eventually, I'd love to have you back on and we talk some more. And work on those Kathy's. I'll do that.

Yep. And if anybody... If you ever need a photo, coctributed, I'm ready. Okay, yes. And anyone wants to do a cock tribute with him? Email me, strictly done his podcast at gmail.com. If you live in Australia and you want to, like, you know, hook up or do something with this guy, right? From you because you're like-minded or whatever.

Email me, right? Absolutely. And I will get you in contact with Peter, right? Is that your name? I forget. Is that your name? Peter? All right, Peter.

Thank you. much for calling in and I will send you any emails we got and we will talk again and work on those Kathy's for me in the meantime. All right, we'll do. Thanks very much. Have a great day. Thanks for calling in. Bye. Pleasure. Okay. I just

want to tell you before you go that my book, it's called Strictly anonymous confession, Secret Sex Lives of Total Strangers, is now available not only in paperback and ebook, but you can pre-order the audiobook. It's still not going to be out until August 25th, but you can pre-order it. The book is basically 17 different

stories taken from my show. I kind of picked one story from each category that I talk about on my show. Like there's a hot wife story. There's a cuck queen story. There's a cuck story. There's a gang being girl story. Like I said, 17 stories. And they're all told in the third person, and they're all true. I took the interview and rewrote it in the third person. And I I wouldn't really call it like a total erotica book. Think like penthouse letters. It's more direct. It's not so over the top like erotica. I don't really like that kind of vibe, right? But these are true stories. 17 of them. They're really short chapters, easy read. You could read, you know, one or two and then skip around. You could read the whole book. It's available in eback format, paperback format. And finally,

the audiobook is available. coming out August 25th, but you could pre-order it now. And if you buy my book in any format or pre-order it, I will throw in a complimentary link to my Discord. My Discord does not disappoint. Okay. There's no way you get into my Discord any other way than getting the link from me. Okay. I give it to people who buy my book. There's tons of people in there. Everybody shares content with each other. And that's what you get to do there. You could post your own pictures and videos. There's tons of channels. We have lots of contests where you can win a lot of money. It's a super fun place to be. It's a total strictly anonymous community and you will love it.

I will be giving anyone who buys my book access to my Discord. It's private, like I said. All you got to do is email me a screenshot of your purchase, whether you did the audiobook, the ebook or the paperback. Send it to me at strictly anonymous podcast at gmail.com. That's strictly anonymous podcast at gmail.com. And I will send you the link to Discord. So anyway, thanks so much for tuning in.