Strictly Anonymous Confessions - 350 - Married Dave Hooks Up with Men on the Side

Episode Date: August 24, 2020

Dave is married but he occasionally hooks up with guys on the side and he calls in to talk all about it. When did he first realize he was into guys? When did he start hooking up with guys? And what does he like to do when he meets up with them? Tune in to find out plus hear all about his early hook up with guys and how he tries to recreate them now, ,how drugs play part in his secret life, how the ups and downs of his rocky relationship coincide with his secret hook-ups , his submissive, slutty side fantasies and a whole lot more. **To see anonymous pics of my female guests + hear anonymous confessions + get all the episodes early and AD FREE, join my Patreon! It's only $7 a month and you can cancel at any time. You can sign up here: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.patreon.com/StrictlyAnonymousPodcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and when you join, I'll throw in a complimentary link to my private Discord! MY BOOK IS NOW OUT FOR PRE-ORDER!!!! Strictly Anonymous Confessions: Secret Sex Lives of Total Strangers. A bunch of short, super sexy, TRUE stories. GET YOUR COPY NOW: https://amzn.to/4i7hBCd To Join SDC and get a FREE Trial! click here: https://www.sdc.com/?ref=37712 or go to SDC.com and use my code 37712 Want to be on the show? Email me at [e-mail] or go to http://www.strictlyanonymouspodcast.com and click on "Be on the Show" Have something quick you want to confesss while remaining anonymous? Call the CONFESSIONS hotline at 347-420-3579. You can call 24/7. All voices are changed. Sponsors: https://bluechew.com Get your first month FREE! https://butterwellness.com/ Try the Butter Wellness perineum massager and use code STRICTLY for 20% off your entire order Follow me! Instagram https://www.instagram.com/strictanonymous/ Twitter https://twitter.com/strictanonymous?lang=en Website http://www.strictlyanonymouspodcast.com/ Everything else https://linktr.ee/Strictlyanonymouspodcast Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Welcome to the Strictly Anonymous Podcast. Strictly Anonymous Podcast. Conversations with online strangers. We place ads online. The Craigslist is definitely like the gift that keeps on giving. Real people respond. You go to Singapore or Thailand. You can't not do it.

The temptation is just too much. It's real problems. Do your friend know that you're banging her or no? No, he has no idea. And anything goes. The motto of the show, let your freak flag fly. Probably the only good advice I'll ever give you is to rehire. your wips and change.

Here is your host, Kathy. Hey, welcome to the Strictly Anonymous podcast with Kathy. If you want to follow the Strictly Anonymous podcast on Instagram or Twitter, follow the show at Strict Anonymous. If you want to be on the show, this is a call and advice show. I say it's a call and advice show, but, you know, it's basically a show where people call and talk about all kinds of things. I give some people advice.

I listen to people talk about their naughty, private, secret lives a lot of the times. This is called Strictly Anonymous because I change. everybody's voices, everybody's anonymous, including me. So if you want to come on the show, send me an email or go to my website strictly. Yeah, just go to my website, Strictly Anonymouspodcast.com, click on Be on the Show, and send me an email, and we'll coordinate a time for you to call in. Let's see. I have on a guy.

I still have so many backed up episodes. I tape this guy like early on in COVID, lockdown like March. His name is Dave. He's by. He was a listener of the show or found my show, I think, because he had found another by guys episode and was like hey i got a story for you too he's another guy that has it as a secret life he we talk about when it started for him when he first started hooking up with guys when he first started realizing that he was into guys he's married and has and has been seeing guys on the

side we talk about you know how he keeps that going where he meets these guys where when he's first started hooking up with them what he likes to do with them how the whole submissive thing comes into play with him when he's with guys and all that kind of stuff it's uh you know i think a lot of people will find this podcast and will be listening to it because maybe they're in the same boat that's what typically happens when i air these episodes i get another by guy who's living a secret life that listen to this and was like oh my god i could totally relate so a lot of you will be able to relate to him a lot of you won't be able to relate but it's a fascinating story so anyway i'm going to be right back on with dave how are you today um good thank you uh thank you for having me yeah no problem you're

another guy that's living a secret bisexual life, right? Is that your deal? Yeah, you could say that. Yeah. Why don't you explain your story and why you want to call it? I mean, this is like a topic that, I mean, every time I have a guy on like you, like I just, I hear from like 10 others, you know, and it just turns out after six years doing my show, I have so many guys on that are copying to this kind of a story. But everyone's, you know, and everyone's, you know, and it just turns out after six years doing my show, I have so many guys on that are copying to this kind of a story. but everyone's is unique right so why don't you just explain yours really quickly like in an overview and then i'll ask you a bunch of questions sure uh yeah so i mean basically the like uh mostly into women you know um like beautiful girls and whatnot always dated girls um never been interested in dating any guys or anything. So mostly straight and like, you know, the way most people will consider. But the thing is, I mean, I kind of also find a dix to be attractive.

Uh-huh. Just like just the cock itself. Mm-hmm. So, yeah. And you're married, right? Yeah. And how old are you? You sound super young to me.

I know. I'm 32. You're 32. Now, how long have you been married? for? About six years. About six years. Now, does anybody besides me and all my listeners now that are listening know about your life? I mean, you said that, I think you said that your wife kind of knew, or does she knows about a couple experiences, right? Is that true? No, she has no idea. I only mentioned that

I had some experiences. Oh, okay. It wasn't that she knew about them. Okay, right, right. She doesn't, but she has no idea. And does anybody have any idea besides the people that you're with? No, it's totally like just something I keep to myself. Right. And now how long, like, when was the first time that you hooked up with a guy? Well, I can remember that really clearly, actually. I was, sorry, you said hooked up.

Yeah, or even just started, like, playing around with guys. I was going to say, like, when I first kind of had, like, a first thought like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Let's start there. sure well I was kind of like in high school and I think I was about 16 and well it's kind of like the story is kind of intertwined with drugs honestly

a lot of my story is but so that day me and like some friends were just hanging out of her friend's house and somebody pulled out like some pills and it's like oh what's this it's like oh these are whatever you know they're pretty good they're kind of like speedy kind of things and I've had a you know long history of just being open to that stuff you know along with my friends so kind of just naturally everybody popped a pill

and we just hung out and you know it was the first time I'd done that that particular thing so we were all feeling good you know just talking a lot felt like we were walking on clouds or whatever that kind of thing and we decide to go to like a friend's house I just different friends house so we all pick into the car and there was like four of us in the back seat so we're all guys and um just to kind of like make more room i remember kind of like putting my arms around both guys that were like on either side of me right right so that your arms were up and away right okay exactly exactly and like right then i was like oh man i feel good and then i thought But if they wanted, I would not mind, like, just sucking their cocks.

Really? And that was the first time that you remember. I mean, because you're 16, you're older, right? I mean, you could have, like, you don't remember before that ever, like, when you were maybe Googling for porn or, like, jerky off. Ever thinking about guys in any way, shape, or form? Not really. I mean, I think I might have, like, even before that, been just like a trend. reacted to the site of like a hardcock.

So when I watched porn, and this is like in hindsight, I'm trying to think. Yeah. Maybe I was just, you know, I was also interested in watching like the take as much as the girl. Right. But you didn't put it together yet until. So now you're like high on drugs. You're in the backseat with all these guys. And then all of a sudden you could remember even now that at that moment, like what clicked in your brain that you were like, oh, if they did something, you'd be into it.

Yeah, I mean, it was just like a kind of like just a lovey feeling more than like lust. And it was kind of like in line with like the way we were all feeling and the way I was feeling. You were just like, yeah, you know, I wouldn't. It's not that I want to, but I just wouldn't mind. You know what I mean? Like I would be happy to like kind of just like make them feel better. And then of course I was like, hmm, that's a weird thought. You know, not really kind of like my bag, but okay.

And I just brushed it off. Okay. And then what happens? I mean, like, so that's like when you're, like, so that's like when you're, 16, right? Now, like when you're, when you come down from that drug, do you ever like in the next couple of weeks or even that night, like, think back to like how you were feeling in that moment and wonder or make, like, did you, oh yeah. Okay. Oh, yeah, sure. I mean, so from like that point onwards kind of thing. Like, it's, it's something that I, you know, kept thinking about and then, like,

increasingly so. So, I mean, like, you're asking if I kind of like checked out porn and whatnot. Yeah, that's when you started afterwards, right? Exactly. Uh-huh. So it's. So it's. So it's, At that point, I definitely started to, like, check out more kind of, like, I think I started out with, like, maybe, like, she-mails and that kind of thing. And then, like, that move to, like, probably just looking at, like, bisexual porn. You know, if there's, like, a guy and a girl and whatnot. And then, you know, and then I think I eventually started also watching just, like, straight out gay porn. I mean, I watch all. And, like, to this day, like, it kind of varies.

But so I kind of, like, moved in that direction. direction. Yeah. And then it just became like more a part of my life and like more part of like more something that I kind of couldn't deny. Uh-huh. But how did that make you feel like, what? Did it freak you out? Were you like super confused? Because you're kind of young at that time, right? And that's like when you're just starting to date girls, right? You know you like girls. But now all of a sudden, I think it might be a little heavy to have those thoughts and not have anyone to share it with. So like you're probably super confused. Oh yeah. Absolutely. I mean, and like more. I'm, I mean, so confused was one part. And then, like, I think, you know, on the other hand, I also just kind of, like, shut it out a little bit. Or at least the, kind of, like, trying to explain it away. Like, I thought either it's like a phase or it's just like a fetish or...

Right. You know what? I'm just trying to kind of, like, justify it and think, like, okay, well, I know I like girls, so it can't be that I'm gay. Yeah. What could it be? And, you know, there's a bunch of different ways, I guess, I thought about it. and the main one was probably just to kind of like ignore it.

Right, of course, because it's hard to come to terms when you're that age. You have so many other things going on that you've got to figure out and come to terms with, do you know what I'm saying? Like that's a, to put that on, it's heavy, you know, and it's a lot to take in, right? Because what does that mean? Like, you know that you're not gay, right? Because you like women. But to understand that you're bisexual, probably at that point is hard to swallow. or really even understand, I think.

Oh, yeah, absolutely. Because that's a long time ago. I think it's a lot more, not common, but more known, like bisexuality, what it is and what it means. And, you know, nowadays it's more out there, you know, and there's more information. Whereas, you know, when you were 16, 15 years ago, I don't think there was many. I've been confused about what that fucking means forever. I was called out by many people here and I actually have two podcast tapes. I haven't aired them yet for.

guys that were like, hey, listen, I want to come on and just, like, explain to you that, like, you've got it all wrong. And they were, they really made me see the way, because I was looking at bisexuality very wrong, too. So I think it's like, it's more clear now what it, what it means, right, if you're bisexual, but not when you were younger. Now, did you, so you're like 16, you have these sets. You start, like, Googling porn. You're, like, assuming, like, when did you lose your virginity to a girl? And then I want to know when you lost your virginity, if you have, to a guy. Sure. So to a girl, I think I was about like 19.

Uh-huh. Just like in high school. Yeah. Hot girl that I like kind of thing. There's like super typical. Nothing like strange about that at all. Right. With guys, it's a little bit more complicated because it's been like more kind of

like isolated experiences. I mean, there's been a handful, but they were each kind of like smaller. Like I wouldn't. I mean, it was the first time. I would, had done something, but I don't know if you could say that I lost my virginity, because I don't. Right. Have you ever had like full on, like, I mean, well, would you consider yourself a top or a bottom, first of all? Do you know? Well, that's an interesting question. Well, it's, so basically, like, when I first started out, and, like, definitely, I think the thought was more, aside from, like, not understanding it, it was definitely more like, well, okay, you know, if I'm anything, it's, like, a top.

and like, you know, attached to that would be kind of like the guys that I found attractive would be kind of like slender and like effeminate and whatnot. But definitely over the years, I think it's kind of like changed a little bit and it's adjusted so that if anything, yeah, I'm a little bit between both and if anything really I'm kind of submissive. Oh wow, that's interesting. It's changed over time. Yeah. So now what was the first, because you said like your experience. experiences where guys were like, you know, a little bit here, a little bit there.

What was your first actual little bit experience, you know, the, the experience you had with a guy the first time? Because you didn't have any before you were 16, right? No playing around or experimenting when you were little that you could remember. No, so not at that point, but then, like, soon after that time when I was 16, I was like kind of like 18 or something. Uh-huh. We actually did a bunch of friends and I actually did ecstasy for the first time. And that was just kind of like a total revelation. Because when I did, it just, I really felt like super, super feminine and like super submissive.

And like, yeah, I just felt like, you know, if I could have my way, it was completely up to me. This was like in a club, right? I would just be like, you know, I would take like five different guys to like the back room and like blow all of them. You want to be like a slutty girl. Yeah, I mean, it just made me like just really slutty basically. But slutty in like a effeminate way and like a receptive way. And in particular to like the idea of like at that point I don't think I had any interest in like getting fucked or anything. It was just all about like blowing guys.

Pleasing a guy. Right. Now so at that club that night, did you do anything with some? Did you take a guy to the bathroom? No, I mean, I tried. Like, you know, I kind of like walked around. Yeah. You know, it was just like making eyes at everybody.

But, you know, maybe it's just, it wasn't meant to be. And it's kind of a little difficult in that state because you don't, you feel great, but maybe you don't look so great kind of thing. Right. Uh-huh. And so, yeah, it's just difficult to kind of like coordinate yourself and kind of like, you know, pursue things, really. Right.

So after that, like, when was the actual, like? Yeah. So the actual first. time was in college and like basically because of that time when I did X-C and I turned everything on. Yeah. Like I got really into kind of like pursuing good and just like finding people who'd be like suitable or whatnot. So looking at Craigslist, that's what was on back in the day. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, that's where I used to get all my collars from Craigslist when I first started out. So that's where you went looking to hook up with like a real guy? Exactly. Yeah. I mean, at first I was just like, you know, like perusing and then perusing like more seriously and then like you know, actually reaching out to people, you know, that I thought were, like, attractive and, like, talking to people and then, like, chickening out.

That happened, like, pretty frequently or, like, several times, I should say. Yeah, I'm sure that's more, it's very common. Yeah. And because I was just, like, really intent on, like, screening, really hard, you know, and I was just, like, interested in, like, because, like, I said, it's all about the dick, you know what I mean? So it's, like, I just really want it to be, like, perfect. And what is perfect for you?

Um So I used to kind of like all races. Yeah. I'm not, you know, it doesn't bother me. Yeah. But like the ideal has definitely like kind of solidified into like a white cock. Uh-huh. Cut and straight.

Uh-huh. And, uh, yeah, just like, you know. Do you like I'm extra big? Do you not care? Like, is size important to you when you were looking on Craigslist? Yeah, I mean, definitely like bigger than me. Uh-huh. would be nice. And what about age? Do you care what it was attached to or was it really just about the cock? Like, did you care if it was an older guy or not? Or did you have any preference? It didn't really matter. But like definitely like if I had a choice, it would be like, yeah, like more on the youthful side. Yeah. But I mean, if it was like an older guy was just an absolutely like perfect like cock, then that would be fine. Right. So now you're weeding out a lot of guys, right? And you're chickening out a lot.

who was the first guy that you actually said okay to and why was it do you think it was just the right timing or was there something about that guy that made you feel comfortable that you decided to meet him? Um maybe maybe a little bit of like all those things. You know it had been like enough times had gone by that I chickened out and like the person the guy was like nice enough it seems. Yeah. And then you know he sent me a picture of himself and he's had like a really great like beautiful cock. So I was like, oh, and then I think he was willing to like come to where I was. Yeah. And like pick me up and we would go to his house.

So it was just all, you know, like it ticked off all the boxes kind of thing. Yeah, all the stars a lot. Yeah. And also I didn't have to kind of like worry about like how to get there at that hour because it was kind of late. So it just ticked everything. And now was he an older guy or do you remember how old he was? Because you were young, right? You're like 18 at this point.

Yeah. I think I was like 19. Uh-huh. And he was a little bit older, so he was maybe like 30, 31, something like that. Right. Now, are you dating anybody at the time? Like, do you have a girlfriend while this is going down, or are you single? Um, I think I was like on and off.

With somebody, right. I mean, I was. I can tell you that for sure. I just don't remember if it was on or off at that exact point. Oh, right. Okay. Right. Uh-huh.

Yeah. So, yeah. So it was, I was saying. So the guy comes and picks you up. Now, let me ask you this. Were you responding to people's ads that they had placed, or did you place your own ad in Craigslist? I think it was more responding,

though I might have, like, placed one once or twice, just kind of like myself. And so this guy's ad that you responded to, was he looking for a blowjob, and is that what you were going to do with him? I think, you know, probably I made it, or I'm sure I made it clear to him that, like, this was, like, you know, I'm not sure exactly what I want to do,

and, like, you know what I mean? Like, we'll probably, like, it could just be that we'll kind of like jack off together. Yeah. So he was cool with that. So we went in with like that kind of understanding. And so he picks you up like and you see him. Was he good looking?

Did you feel comfortable immediately? Was it uncomfortable? Were you super horny? Like what was going through your mind? Because I would say after all this time, you know, you had built it up right? And now you're finally like in a car ready to have your real first experience. Yeah.

I mean, I remember he wasn't, like, particularly good looking. But, like you say, it had been, like, really built up at that point. Yeah. And I was just, like, really kind of looking forward to it. And then also I knew, like, you know, what he was going to be working with kind of thing. Yeah. Because that was important, not so much the face. Like, that kind of just, you know, even though I wasn't that attracted to the way he looked, you know, I was fine with going ahead.

Right. And so he brings you back to his house and what happened? Well, we basically just started like smoking, I think. You know, just like smoking a joint and he put on some porn. We started like jacking it off. For the most part, that's what happened. Like we kind of like jacked off or whatnot. But I did ask him like, oh, you know, do you mind if I like reach over and touch it or whatever?

And he was like, you know, go ahead. It's all good. So I did. yeah but you know I just gave it like a couple strokes felt kind of different to what I was expecting and I was like oh okay cool so I'm good for now that's interesting that it felt different considering like you know because you have a dick right

I mean to feel is like yours I mean how did it feel different well the thing is it's that like when you touch your own one like obviously like the skin moves but like there's kind of like a corresponding feeling when like it moves versus like when I grabbed another guys I was kind of super like I guess that's so interesting that it would be like a almost like a dildo kind of like I would just my hand would just go up and down it yeah yeah perfectly smoothly but then the skin like moved you know what I mean right yeah it's like oh it was unexpected but you know it makes sense I guess yeah that's kind of interesting I mean I don't have a dick right but I've stroked a lot of them

so for me it's like it is what it is right but that's interesting that from somebody like you who has one that you were expecting something different, which I wouldn't understand. But when you explain it, I totally do. So you didn't blow him or anything, right? You guys kind of jerk off. Do you ever wind up seeing him again? No.

No? Never again. It was a one-time thing? Yeah. Was it like really hot to you that first time, that first experience? It was. It was definitely. But at the same time, I was just kind of like a little bit weirded out and didn't, you know, at first

time didn't really know what I was doing and it kind of it also you know went against in a way at least you know what I thought of myself you know straight guy so like after you come you're like what the fuck did I do and where am I kind of thing so I actually I think purposefully I didn't come oh okay yeah and like kind of just you know we just like enjoyed a little bit talked a little bit um like while we were you know doing the thing and um yeah and then I just kind of said that I had to leave and he was like okay um and I did um and then it was only like when I went back home that I kind of you know did anything and and I definitely yeah I definitely felt a little bit weird uh-huh but not as not as like revolted as I would have thought right so it was

all good kind of thing mm-hmm yeah and then what's your next experience like is it because you went and you had this experience but it what like you didn't blow somebody and you still had these desires. Were your desires more because you finally experienced it? Or did you feel like just meeting that guy kind of like, you know, gave you your fix and you could go a while without being with another guy? I don't remember, like, particularly being, like, amped up or anything. Yeah.

Probably I was, like, kind of, like, satisfied for a little while. But, you know, not too long, obviously. Like, I was back within, who knows, like, a couple days or whatever. and just looking again, you know? Uh-huh. And then what happened in your next experience? So the next one, well, actually, so like I said, I used to kind of be much more open to everything in terms of preference.

Yeah. And so the next guy was black. Uh-huh. And, yeah, he, you know, talked to him for a while, asked him, like, a bunch of questions. Like part of the thrill was asking the questions. because it was like a world that I'm, like, not privy to. So it would just be like, oh, like, you know, what about this? What about that?

And, you know, he took the time and answered all my questions and whatnot. But what kind of questions were you asking him? Like, what, I have no idea what about this and what about that means? You know, just things like, I guess I just ask, like, you know, how old were you when you first did it? And, like, how was it? And, you know, like, did it live up to your expectations kind of thing? or like what did you do like you know

maybe trying to live vicariously I guess you could say or learn about it I think that's interesting that you were like trying to get you know learn about what you were going through from somebody else

who had maybe been there for a little bit longer I mean yeah I mean they're the only people that you can talk to really yeah yeah so people who were kind of in the same boat or similar

so anyways I mean you know he was a cool enough guy and like he came over and everything but it was like basically again the same deal told him that I wasn't sure what I was going to be comfortable with. Maybe we'll just kind of like jack off.

Maybe I'll like blow you. Like maybe whatever. So he did and he came over and everything and that's exactly what we're doing. And then he actually got a call and had to like go outside for a couple of minutes. And when he came back in like at that point, I was kind of like, you know, I had like built up enough nerve kind of thing. So I like asked them if, you know, I just asked them like. like, okay, can I, like, suck your dick kind of thing? Uh-huh.

And unfortunately, he had to go. So it was, like, such a frustration, yeah. And, um, but, you know. He didn't even say, okay, just do it for like a minute. He's like, no, I got to go. Yeah, yeah. I mean, that, like, I don't know. So, like, maybe he just wasn't, like, intimate kind of thing.

Uh-huh. You know, he's, like, seen enough. Like, that's, yeah, I wonder if that's the case. But, you know, yeah, he basically had to be able to go away. Yeah, but he could have been married and that was his wife calling. I mean, there's a lot of things that could have happened and he got freaked out. You know, I mean, it's not necessarily that he wasn't into it, you know? Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah, that sucks, right? You must have been a little frustrated, sexually frustrated. Yeah, but, you know, on the other hand, like afterwards, so like when I came, I was kind of like, oh, wow, I'm glad that doesn't happen because, like, you know, how would I would have lived with myself kind of thing? Right. You would have felt it weirded out by that you actually. actually did do it and had a dick in your mouth. I guess, yeah.

That's what you were thinking. Have you, well, no, I don't want to, I don't want the answer yet. Okay, let's do it this way instead. I'll get the answer eventually. What's your next experience after that one? And, you know, now when do you meet your wife? How old were you when you met your wife? So I met my wife, like, I think like second year of college kind of thing.

So, yeah, and we just, you know, we had a kind of college sweetheart kind of thing. and stay together until, you know, a couple years after we graduated and got married. Okay, so now you're still, I haven't met your wife yet in the story where we're talking about you hooking up with these guys and everything, right? I think I had, honestly.

Oh, you had. So when you were with that black guy, you had already met your wife and you were dating her, and this is all being done behind her back. Yeah, and like behind her back slash when it was off or... Oh, she was the one that you were on and off with.

Exactly. Oh, I didn't realize that. Okay. For everyone out there, the girls... I mean, normally I would think if something's on and off, like how do they ever wind up actually married? You just think like, oh, it's a garbage relationship that's never going to work out.

It's interesting that you had on and off and then you guys actually wind up getting together and got married and, quote, unquote, leave happily ever after. Yeah, yeah. I mean, and that's... Yeah, that is the case for the most part. Uh-huh.

So, yeah, I do agree with you that, you know, there were, like, avenues for me to kind of get out. But it's not like I wanted to and, like, spend the rest of my life kind of, like, pursuing, like, the secret life or anything. Like, that wasn't my goal. Because, like, I said, I'm, like, at least equally, if not more, into girls. Right. So now after that guy, when was the, like, when did you get to be, like, did the next time that you're with a guy, did you wind up getting to experience giving a guy a blowjob? So, again, the next time. I mean, I kind of basically just like fell into this like pattern or like habit of, yeah,

because it kind of allowed me to avoid confronting anything like uncomfortable but kind of still kind of like enjoying myself. So, you know, starting with the first one, there was like a whole string of like guys that I would just kind of like jack off with. And for the most part, it was, I mean, a lot of it also involved like, you know, I told you that the first time when I had that experience with ecstasy, it was kind of like, um, revelatory. Uh-huh. So I kind of one thought that I always had was like, well, I mean, if I could have that again,

then, you know, like, I would make it happen kind of thing. Like, it would definitely happen that day. And indeed, like every, like a handful of other times that I've done ecstasy, it's been like, it always be like, wow, you know, like, I can't believe today is going to be the day, you know, just be so, like, sure about it or whatnot, but, you know, it wouldn't happen. Um, so part of it was trying to like emulate that and you know find something that would be a substitute so when I was like on grinder looking for people um a lot of people would mention uh like partying and like Tina which I had never heard about. Yeah I've never heard of that what's that? So it turns out that that's like a mess. Uh-huh. And you know I looked into it for you know saw that there was

definitely like a big impact on libido that kind of thing. Um so I was like yeah like why not you know and I would kind of like tempt these guys to kind of so I would like screen for people who had it and were like willing to share and it would kind of be like oh yeah you know like I'm a straight guy coming over and I just want to kind of like jack off like do you want to like watch me like maybe you can like blow me that kind of thing but um in return you know I'll be like smoking or whatever and then you know we'll just we'll just kind of like kick back and have a good time kind of thing. So in all those, like in that string, it was never necessarily that I was like interested

in the guy or that they were attractive. I wasn't screening for that. It was just screening for the experience of like getting like the drugs. Getting, yeah, but not for its own sake. Right. But recreating that maybe that backseat moment high that you had that felt like at that point like top of the mountain kind of thing, right? Exactly.

And then just enjoying what like what would come in its wake. You know what I mean? So like in that kind of like heightened sexual like yeah drive like you know whatever happens happens kind of thing. But the funny thing about it is that it doesn't like it does amp you up. But at least for me, not towards like men. So I would find that I would do it and I would just become like fascinated by women like beyond like far beyond like how I am in normal life. Oh, okay, right. But you're with a guy when you're doing it right.

But yet you're how do you realize that you're just. fascinated with women if you're all alone with a guy in your house? Well, I wouldn't be all over the guy. Like, I'd come over. It would always be that I would go over and, like, they would kind of, like, smoke me up. And then once it kicked in, like, you know, remember, the guy was supposedly getting enough just by kind of, like, having me there and, like, watching me kind of, like, jack off. Uh-huh. And I kind of couldn't care less if he was there because I was just so, like, it's, like, such a, um,

overwhelming kind of drive that comes over you. So you kind of like, you can just stare into the TV, into the TV's like soul for like four hours. Right, and you're fulfilled. So that's all you need. And every girl looks like more beautiful than the last. Oh, okay. So you're watching TV.

So it's on TV. The porn. Yeah, the porn. And jacking off and just like enjoying that whole. And this is meth? This is what Tina is meth? I guess, yeah. Like I said, that's not my thing.

So I've only done it like a handful of times. It would always be like with these guys. Yeah, this kind of experience. Yeah. Through Grindr. So yeah. But it would be the same thing every time. Just like totally into like jacking off.

And just kind of like hanging out there and like, you know, you know, like exhibiting myself and kind of like talking to the other guy and just being like open. I'm surprised none of these guys ever tried anything more with you. I mean, definitely they were. It would be like, oh, you know, like, can I do this or can I do that? And I'd just be like, oh, you know what? Like maybe in like a couple minutes kind of thing or maybe in a little while. And then honestly that time never came. Right, ever with any of these guys.

So you were always able to keep it in that safe zone for you. Even when you were like high on Tina or whatever the fuck you want to call it, you were able to keep it in that place that you had kept it in for all that time. well yeah except for one time which is kind of like the furthest that I ever went I guess yeah and that time kind of went over to a guy's house and the whole deal that day I think was that like I made it really clear to him again that whole kind of like feel but for like a change kind of thing I was like oh you know what like I guess I'd be down to like kind of like kind of come on your face or whatever like when I'm done if that's like something you'd be interested in yeah and like even before I got there he's like oh well you know maybe I'd be like

I can just suck you a little bit. I was like, look, the most second promise is, like, you know, to kind of, like, you know, just give you a facial or whatever. So that's what I went there on the understanding I would be doing. Right. But then I just got caught up in the moment, actually. And I was just like, hey, like, do you want to, do you want to blow me? And he did. Uh-huh.

Yeah. I have not much to say except it was, like, a really good blow job. I was going to ask. Yeah, it was like, shocking. I don't know. But, yeah, and it didn't take me too long, really. I mean, I'm not, like, I can usually go, but that was, like, really good. So, you know, just kind of, oh, I kind of remembered something else now.

But so I kind of, I think before I asked him to blow me. This was one of the guys I told you about, like, that I kind of, the type that I like, which is like thin and effeminate. Yeah. Especially at the time. So he was like that and he had like, you know, very kind of like soft legs, long legs, like a nice ass kind of thing. Uh-huh.

So I asked him to kind of like just bend over in front of me like kind of while I was jacking off. Uh-huh. Kind of just like, let me see all that. And he did and he was like, you know, what's it kind of just like looking back and, you know, trying to look enticing. Yeah. And yeah, you know, I had to, like, reach out and grab his ass because it looked identical to, like, a really hot girl's ass.

Yeah. And, you know, it didn't feel weird at all. You know, it didn't feel uncomfortable. And, yeah, I think I actually kind of fingered him a little bit, too, which I was really surprised about at the time. But, like, in that moment, I just didn't think twice about it. Right. You were horny and just, and you were all so high. Yeah.

Uh-huh. Yeah, so, I mean, did that for a little bit. He was, like, moaning or whatnot. And, you know, I got my fix in that regard, at least. And, like, you know, kind of just went back to paying attention to myself. And then, yeah, like, towards the end, I was like, oh, well, how about, you know, do you want to, like, try something? Or do you want to blow me? And he did.

Right. So that was that. But you didn't blow him. No. And he wouldn't have been the kind of guy that I would have wanted to. So, like, I told you, that's one kind of guy that I liked, the effeminate guy. but if I was going to be doing, you know, what I would really like to be doing, which is to be the effeminate guy myself,

that would just be a completely different kind of, you know, look or type that I would do. Right, it wouldn't be that guy. That guy is not the guy that you want to be on your knees in front of. Exactly. Right. So you definitely, it changes when you want to be the bottom and be more submissive, right, per se.

You have a certain kind of guy for that fantasy. and what you were doing with this guy was the opposite, right? So he blew you. Exactly. So you still haven't blown a guy? No, unfortunately. I mean, like I think about it like 500 times a day. I don't know if it's unfortunate.

I think it's by your design. I mean, I don't like I think you might, you could say, oh, it's unfortunate, but it's not like you haven't had a lot of opportunities. It's like you're the only person that's in the way is you, right? Well, yeah. I mean, well, so you're right, absolutely. But, I mean, I will add that the, I guess, the big kind of motivator there is because I worry that I would, like,

pick something up and give it to my wife. Uh-huh. Or to put it differently, like, if we lived in a world without any kind of, like, you know, STDs or whatever. Yeah. I would definitely blow a guy today. You would. So it's more the fear of, like, oh, so you could catch something?

Not that I'm worried about it myself. Yeah, of course. Like I'm married. Yeah. You're worried about getting caught. Exactly. So kind of damaging her, you know, to whatever extent, and then getting caught. Oh, yeah.

The ramifications are huge. Not just like you lose your wife. She also knows your secret, right? You're outed. I mean, there's a lot that goes down if something like that happens, right? Exactly. Exactly. Yeah.

Right. But before, I mean, I just feel like, because of just certain things that you said, I feel like you might be afraid as well. Like there might be this other thing going on where, or maybe that maybe you would like it to, like you're afraid to really like experience it because that would be really admitting that maybe it was something that you liked. Maybe that would freak you out. I mean, does any of that make sense? Yeah, I mean, I know what you mean. And for a long time, that was definitely the case. And, you know, to some extent now, perhaps, like, that is the case somewhat.

But I think the thing is now, like, I'm kind of cool with doing it anyways, no matter what it means. You know what I mean? Like, it's something that I want to do. So I might still keep it a secret, but at least I think I'll be fine with it. Like, the way I am in fine. But you just said you wouldn't do it because you're too afraid of the disease, though. Now that's the thing, right? Exactly.

Right. But don't you think you're just now you could use that as? as the reason, but it probably underneath that is, because listen, they could put a condom on, or I could tell you I've sucked a lot of dicks and I've never gotten any kind of people are probably laughing at this, but like I've never gotten any disease transferred that way, you know, I don't know. Yeah, I mean, I've thought about it.

Yeah. On my, like, hornier days, like, I'm definitely, like, all up for it. And, you know, yeah, I mean, you're, you're, probably not wrong. You're definitely not completely wrong at least. Let's say that. Yeah, no, listen, you're you. I don't know. I'm on the phone with you how long, you know, I mean, I don't have you figured out. You know yourself, right? I just, because a couple times, more than once, you said, like, when you were explaining those first experiences that, you know, you were happy it didn't happen because the ramifications of how you would have felt if it did. And, you know, you didn't feel

so bad because you didn't go really all the way that I think there's a little bit of a fear in you of how yeah I mean there's there's definitely a little bit like um I just mean that I'm I'm a little bit over it like to your point um yeah like conservative background kind of thing like internalized homophobia kind of thing yeah it's you're still it's interesting that it's like you're still I think a little I don't know if confused is the right word but you know know, you don't maybe want to fully come into it, like make it who you are or sort of accepted about yourself, you know? I don't, right?

I think somebody else in your position would probably know better how to put it, right? Because there's probably a lot of guys like you that are either where you're at now or past where you're at, but was where you are now, right? And like I said, could explain it better or maybe see what it is, right? I mean, because you're in like a weird position, even though it's so many years later, like I said, and bisexuality is much more acceptable, accepted and people know more about it, right? You're married. Your wife knows you for who you are.

You have this secret that you have that, you know, what would it mean to really buy into the fact or really say, I'm bisexual, even to yourself first, right? Where do you go from there? You're in a marriage with a woman that doesn't know, right? So I think it's like, you know. Oh, I see what you mean. So you're, oh, so you mean the ramifications of admitting that to myself? Yeah.

Like as it relates to like my marriage and everything. Well, then that's the next thing, right? Because like if you fully come into that and you fully accept it and you say like, you know, you let your freak fly fly, even for yourself, then what is that, what is that? How does, how do you integrate that into your life and who you are now? Like, where do you put that? Do you keep it on the side? Do you make it? You know, there's a lot of, and I don't know what happens if that happened.

But I'm just saying it just leads to so many other things that you have to figure out and think about, right? So that I think if you just sort of stay in denial of it a little bit and it stays in its place, right? It stays in the closet. Whereas if you open that up even to yourself, then it's like, now what do you do? Now it becomes there's all these other questions, right? And it becomes complicated. It's complicated. Yeah, absolutely.

Absolutely. I agree with that. Right? I mean, you've listened. I know that you said that you had, you know, found my podcast and then you were like binge listening. I think I made like a whole buy playlist on, um, a YouTube. I should. I have to include more.

I have so many episodes. I hear this story so many times and with it more so with guys that are even way further down the line than you are, right? That, you know, you, you know, and I'm sure that's why you're listening to those stories, right? to hear from the people, even like when you said before when you met that guy, I think was the black guy that you said you were asking questions, you asked this or that. And like those questions at first I thought were like sexual questions, you know, but it turned out that you were like asking him questions about, you know, him being by and coming to terms with it, really. Like, that's kind of like you're questioning him, right? It's like you're trying to learn about it.

Yeah, definitely. Definitely. Maybe a little bit of both, but definitely there's a lot of just like learning about it. For yourself. Yeah, because you're like living with this very alone, right? And having a secret. I mean, it must. I mean, I wonder how it's going to be really interesting for you when you listen back to this.

And I think it will be very cathartic having to spend an hour or just really just talking about it out loud for the first time. But I think it'll be a slight turning point for you. It'll be helpful. Yeah, probably. I mean, that's kind of what I hope.

I guess. I don't know what I'm expecting altogether, but definitely thoughts of that, you know, are something I hope for, you know. Yeah, because what do you do? Like, so since you've been married, when was the last time you fooled around with a guy? So the last time I...

Or met up with one, yeah. Yeah, that whole, like, jacking off and reaching to porn kind of thing, like in the company of another guy. That was, like, maybe, like, a month ago. Oh, really? So where do you meet these guys now that you're married and you live with your wife?

Always at their place. For sure. Yeah, so it just comes down to like a time when I'm in the mood and like also like later at night and maybe when I can get away with it. Like she's traveling or, you know, it's so late at night that she's asleep or whatever. Now you never had a guy come to your house, have you? So that black guy was actually at my place, but this was when I was in college. Right. It was before you were living with her.

Exactly. Right. But I'm saying while you've been married, it's not like your wife goes out of town and you have a guy over. No. Right. I've heard some pretty fucked up things, I got to tell you, of stuff that guys do when their wives go packing and leave for a business. I remember one guy, it was like he was really into, like, sniffing, like having people sniff his wife's panties, like another guy. And he would meet, he met this guy.

He told me this story about, you know, his wife went on a business. business trip and you know the guy came over and they both let each other smell their wives panties and they were jerking but i was just like oh my god imagine like that wife you know no yeah you know what i mean like oh shit that goes down when you go out of town you know i mean it listen it happens when you know guys leave town too you know shit goes down but i was just like oh my god but um so how like how often do you have those experiences with guys like since you've been married like i know you You said you were with someone last month.

Like, do you do it, like, once a year, or is it, like, more than that? Like, what's the... No, it's about, it's about maybe three or four times a year, I would say. And how do you feel afterwards, like, when you go home? Are you, like, more... Are you so pro at it now that you have no conflicting feelings? It doesn't really bother me, particularly because, like, usually when I go home, like, you know, that high, like, lasts for, like, a long time.

So, like, I'm still in the midst of it kind of thing. Right. But then, I mean, even, like, the next day, I don't particularly feel bad because I do, like, I do wish that I wasn't cheating. Uh-huh. But, I don't know. At the same time, like, by the same token, I'm not, like, fully cheating. And I also can't get what I want from my wife. So that's how I justify to myself.

Do you know what I mean? Yeah, yeah, totally. And you don't cheat on her with women, right? I think I did one. but I was just like a drunken encounter kind of thing. Right. Was that early on? Yeah, that was earlier on.

Right, so a long time ago. And I have to say, that's funny, and I bet she would disagree kind of thing if you asked her, but, like, it doesn't, it feels a lot more like cheating if I were to hook up with girls. Like, I've had that situation where some girls, like, flirting with me, gives me her number, starts texting me kind of thing. Uh-huh. Like, it's all kind of clear, like, where this is all leading. Yeah. And for some reason, that feels really, like, a big betrayal.

So much so that, like, I usually don't go through with it. Yeah. Versus, like, when it's just hooking up with these guys, um, obviously it is a betrayal, but it doesn't, I don't feel. Yeah. It's a totally, right, because it's, it is very different. The betrayal is different. More like, if she found out you're with a guy, it would be,

more like the betrayal is that you you she didn't know that this was a part of who you were right whereas when you do it if you did it with another woman the betrayal is you know I'm I'm I don't know it's it's I'm like doing something with someone else like what exactly what I do with you you know you're being intimate you're it's it is different I listen I think if your wife found out and if women are listening to this right now they're like oh cheating with a guy is cheating too, of course, right? But I could see why you separate it the way that you do and how you could, you know, how it's in different compartments, like how you compartmentalize it makes sense, right?

I get it. I don't even know how to fucking explain it. This is right. No, I know where you're going. I can't even fucking say it. Somebody else, and we need a third person on this call to say it better. What? I said, we agree it sounds like.

Yeah, we know, but we don't know how to put it into words, right? and I get it. Not that is, but, you know, it's a betrayal. You know, but it's just, so like, where do you, where do you think you go from here? Like, is it something? Because I've heard from some guys where, you know, they always feel it's like an itch and it just gets bigger and bigger than they have to scratch and they go, but they just feel like it keeps building, right?

Like for you, do you feel like you have it in control? And if you just for the rest of your life, you know, because you're super young, that you every now and then, you know, jerk off with a guy. and that's enough for you? Or do you feel like you're going to eventually need more? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, the short answer is no.

And like similar to those guys, like it's definitely been like a kind of increasing desire. Uh-huh. Like age. Uh-huh. So, I mean, basically, I mean, I feel like, yeah, it's just a matter of time kind of thing. Uh-huh. It's just about when I can manage to do it, like, safely slash, like, get away with it. And it's also kind of thing of like, you know, my wife and I, we, like, we have a kind of a rocky relationship.

Uh-huh. So it's always like, well, you know, it feels like this desire is like more permanent than my marriage. You know what I mean? Oh, you're still on and off? Why do you have a rocky marriage? What do you mean by that? Well, we just, we're just both hot-tempered is one way to put it. Uh-huh.

Or, you know, we just, maybe we need to work on our communications. skills or our interpersonal skills like I don't I don't really know you know what I mean but we yeah we just argue a lot right and this has been since day one I'm assuming because of all that off and on stuff I mean this was the girl that you said you were off and on do you have kids uh yeah twins oh wow how old are they uh they're like four right and so did that make it did that create more tension in your marriage uh yeah absolutely Yeah, it always adds a strain, right? It's harder. Yeah. Yeah, I definitely, you know, but it was, it was just more the same kind of thing.

At least, like, no, we had kind of, like, maybe a better reason to fight. You know what I mean? But what about your sex life with your wife? Pretty good, actually. We're, like, I mean, there's a lot of chemistry there. Right. That hot temper thing is, like, also just adds to the, that you have good sex, but good fights, too. Right? I guess, yeah.

Listen, that's what probably keeps you together. Because if you had bad sex and you're arguing all the time, you'd both be like, see you later. I guess, yeah. Right? I've always made jokes because, like, when I think about all the guys that I dated and the ones that I really liked and the ones that were really hard to get away from and the ones that were easier to break up with. Not that the breakup was easy, but I walked away and was, I could stay away. in the ones that I could never like those were the ones that I had the worst

relationships with but the sex was so good I couldn't like leave like the sex to me if it's good is sometimes something that keeps you together more than an emotional connection without the sex do you know what I'm saying yeah absolutely I mean that's definitely the case with us you're right on the money

that's one area that doesn't need too much improvement right and thank God it's good there and still good after yeah maybe you guys both need to work on your, um, your communication. But so for you, the reason why, like I, I would think, you know, but maybe it's just because I'm wired this way, like more revengeful. I don't know. But like that if you, you, because you're in a rocky relationship, or maybe you do do it in this way, you know, when you're sort of arguing with her, having these bad times, that also helps

you justify what you do or that's when you tend to be like, okay, fuck you. Like, I'm going to go see a guy tonight. You know, then you don't, you feel less bad about it because you're not, absolutely. You're not feeling close. Yeah, I mean, definitely I think the times when I have, um, so like I'll, I'll look every day. Uh-huh. Or at least every time I'm, you know, like jacking off or whatever. Yeah. Um, but, you know, there's different kind of like intentions behind looking. Yeah. Yeah. But the days where I'm like, okay, I really want to do it today. Yeah. Um, those, those tend to like follow fights for sure. Yeah, that's what I would think.

A bit of that, like, you know what, kind of fuck you. Like, you know, I can like understand myself. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, totally. I get that. That's how I, that's if I was like acting out that way, that would help me justify it or would be push me in that direction, you know? Like, for sure. So when you say it's kind of building up, is it that you want to finally, you know,

either be a bottom or a top with somebody it's the bottom that you're you've come to realize now right you're in the place where you realize you're more you like to be more the sub right or and or a bottom yeah it's I mean and I feel it's not like traditional kind of bottom like I think and like usually that means like really kind of into like into the whole thing and like into kind of like getting fucked which is not really something like too like keen on yeah but It's definitely about being, it's basically, it's definitely about like serving like a cock, you know what I mean? And like, it's like masculinity. Uh-huh.

Uh-huh. Yeah. And you being, though, does it, do you like the feeling a little bit feminine yourself? Uh, yeah. I mean, like, as far as I can imagine it, you know what I mean? Like, it definitely seems. Because I've had a lot of guys. I don't know.

Have you listened to some of those ones where a couple of them, yeah. How they really. It was super interesting to me because it wasn't something, even though I'd been doing my show for so long, a lot of, I'm sure I had other guys on that maybe felt that way, but they didn't really express it as clear as some of the guys that I've had on recently. You know, and it was such an interesting way to hear, you know, that experience. I mean, I didn't know that that existed, but it seemed like they liked to be with a man where they felt a little bit like a girl, right? it was like that kind of situation. Yeah, and it's like, you know, I don't, I mean, I guess some guys really like to kind of go all out and they're looking like a girl kind of thing. Yeah.

You know, maybe like putting on a wig or whatnot. Yeah. And I don't think that's for me at all. Yeah. But it's, it's really just more about being on my knees, kind of like worrying about like his pleasure versus mine. Uh-huh. Being, like serving somebody. Serving somebody.

I mean, I was going to say that I like oral sex, like, you know, with all genders. So I like, you know, eating out of a girl, too. Yeah, yeah. And that's mostly because of, you know, I like to make, like, my partner feel good. Uh-huh. So part of it is like this idea of like, well, it would be nice to make, like, a dick feel good. Yeah, yeah. But then part of it is just aside from that, just the whole kind of like subservient of, like, being on your knees.

And, yeah, that whole thing. no I would assume and I think I asked you like or you said you know you were like in the beginning you were like am I not I'm not gay because I like women you know and stuff like that but like now because you've been with a bunch of guys you're with your wife have you ever

like because what I've learned about bisexuality is that it means that you can not only just to you know be sexually interested in a man or a woman you could also be romantically interested in a man or a woman do you think that you'd be able

to be romantically interested in a man as well as be physically interested in? No, not at all. Right. You know, like I allow that it's possible. It wouldn't be the weirdest thing in the world given everything else.

But I just, I wouldn't think so. And like, in general, there's so much about men that is not attractive to me. Right. It's hard to imagine, like, actually being with somebody and, like, you know, like, I'm sure this would sound weird to a lot of straight guys,

it's almost like touching like a muscular arm. Like I would prefer to touch a dick than to touch a muscular arm. Like the, it's almost like the muscular arm is like more gay for lack of a better word. Uh-huh. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Right, because then it's like more about the, but it's more like that's a man, whereas like the dick is like it's just a dick.

I don't know. I don't know why I keep getting in this position with you, but I feel like I know exactly what you mean. But I can't even put it into words. It's another, you know. Yeah. Well, I don't know. No, I mean, I totally understand why there would be that, you know, how you see things that way. You know, and so you've never kissed a guy.

You just wouldn't, right? When you're just jerking off, nobody knows about this. Have you ever been attracted to any of your friends? Like, not like their faces or whatnot. Uh-huh. But, like, kind of. Yeah. Like, I mean, I do think that like an absolutely kind of like ideal kind of like masculine form can be attractive.

It's just not the like the most important thing. But yeah, so like I had like one or two friends who were like very just kind of like well built. Yeah. And yeah, it was a fantasy kind of thing. Like, you know, if we were both like totally kind of like up for it and whatnot, then. Yeah, I wouldn't mind. Do you feel like, is there a part of you when you hear people like on my show, if you've listened to some episodes where they're like very open about who they are?

Like, is there a part of you that wishes you could be open about it or are you totally happy with always keeping it a secret? No, not at all. Right. I mean, I feel like I might have to always keep it a secret, but definitely I would like much prefer if I could be open about it. And if I could like, you know, live it. If I could kind of like indulge in it, you know what I mean? Right.

Mm-hmm. Yeah. And so is your wife like open-minded? Do you think that you could ever explain to her that? Well, let me ask you this. So I was going to ask you this before because I always worry for people when they're like, you know, because you're like hooking up with guys. You're texting with them.

You have to have communicate. You know, where do you do all that stuff? And is there a chance that you could get busted? I mean, I guess there's always a chance, you know? Uh-huh. But I definitely try to cover my. tracks and you know if i do anything online it's always in that kind of like um anonymous mode kind of thing yeah so it's not i don't have to worry about like my browser history kind of thing right but i mean

do you have tinder on your phone well i have grinder yeah so but so the app is on your phone well like hidden away right okay kind of like you know a file within a final kind of thing oh okay so she would never be able to see it on your phone. Yeah. Right. Yeah. Most likely kind of thing, but there's always the risk, you know? Yeah, totally.

I mean, that would be, that you never want to happen, right? No, not at all. No, you definitely don't. I mean, I warn some people when they come on my show and they're at the point where they really are ready to come clean, but they haven't yet, or, and there's a big part of of them. So, yeah, I'm always like, you know, watch what you wish for. Because if you don't then get ahead of that, what would happen sometimes in that kind of

situation is that you wind up getting busted by accident, right? It's like the person that's always complaining about the job that they hate and then they get fired, you know? You're not at that place. Like, you're still just trying to figure it out, right? And I don't see that for you, but I just, you know, I always like to tell people like, make sure you're really not sloppy with what you do because sometimes it's not because somebody goes looking or snooping. It's just that something pops up or they, you know, the other person finds out by accident. And you don't want, that to happen because like, you know, if your friends or like her, like, I mean, I don't know, just from like talking to you, you sound just totally normal, right? Like, I mean, if somebody was

sitting next to you, would they ever think that you're into guys or like, would your wife be completely shocked? I mean, is there any? Um, so I think, uh, definitely people would not suspect it. Yeah. Like, I definitely have the kind of like typical straight guy like affect. Yeah. And my wife, I think she would be really surprised. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, she's also kind of conservative, although like she's kind of open in the bedroom, I got to say. Yeah. Uh-huh.

But I think this would be like, you know, a bit too far for her. I don't think there's any chance that she would like be okay with it. Right. And now the drugs, is that still a part of your life or was that more so when you were younger? It was more so when I was younger. and then I mean it's like a huge part of my life when I was younger and like other kinds of drugs as well

but these kind of ones that like go well with like the secret life just by their nature almost like they're not what I used to like what I'm really into they're not really my jam yeah um so I mean that's why I'd have to even like go on Grindr to find it because like I don't have any connections

oh so you're still doing the Tina quote unquote when you're now? I mean, like, so, so if I, like that time I told you the last time I went, like about a month ago. Yeah. I did, yeah. Yeah. Interesting.

And so when you say the high doesn't wear off, it's the high of the drug. You're still, that's the high you're talking about. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Oh. But so she would never, though, know that you're high on that. I mean, so the thing is.

like our history is definitely dotted with like my like doing drugs that I shouldn't have been doing. Oh really? Like her like finding out. Yeah. Yeah. Because it's not really her thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But so, I mean, basically for the most part, all that stuff is behind me.

Yeah. With the exception of this kind of like crime of opportunity kind of thing that I'll maybe do like once in a blue moon. It's just a part of the experience for you. Yeah. It's really, it's kind of connected to like the sexual side of it. It's really not. Yeah, I mean, it's not something I do. Do you feel like you needed to hook up with a guy because you're uncomfortable, or is it just something that you like or does it add?

Because it adds to the horniness. So they're really different like the two. Like, but the meth is, it's like its own experience and it just makes you like really, it just, it just rams you up kind of thing. Uh-huh. So that's really enjoyable, like even if you're kind of by yourself, honestly. Yeah. but I mean are you killing two birds with one stone when you do that like you're getting you're sort of living that younger part of your life where you love drugs and you like to be high and experiment and you're getting to fill around with a guy yeah yeah for sure right right you're being doubly naughty because your wife doesn't want you to do drugs right and she doesn't know you're with guys yeah exactly right and so you're super conservative like outside of this uh no I wouldn't say that Oh, okay.

Probably the opposite. You just grew up super conservative, right? Yeah, basically. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Well, there you go. I mean, is there something else, anything else you'd like to confess while you're on? Because I do think, like, in situations like this, right?

When you hang up the phone, like, most of the time I'll get an email from someone saying, like, oh, my God, that was so great to finally, like, just speak the truth for the first time, right? And then after you listen to it back to hear yourself talking about yourself, yourself. your own story like in the third person like you're going to get even more out of it you know for sure yeah it's going to be even more interesting this the conversation is always even more interesting to me when I hear it back as a third person right um and it's not even about me right but when I go to edit it I'm always like oh this is like a great episode when I hear it outside of my you know as like I said the third person and when you hear your own story you know I can't even imagine what that's like because, you know, and especially for you where I think there's like a cathartic thing

that will happen for you, not only just now while you're saying it, but maybe when you listen to it back. Yeah, hopefully. Hopefully. I mean, I guess you're asking if there's anything else. Yeah. I guess I would just add that, like, myself, like this has been something that, you know, as long as it's been there, I've always had, like, so many questions about it.

Yeah. There's not really a wealth of information about it, like the specific situation where you really feel pretty sure that you're mostly into girls, but it's undeniable that you also like, you know, men or at least a part of a man. But I would say that, yeah, if you feel that way, it's definitely you're not alone. Yeah, well, listen, I mean, there's. Yeah, and I'll give you a link. I'll email you a link to my older episodes because there's a lot more than what's available when you. look at the last 100. I mean, I have over 300 episodes that I've taped. So there's...

Oh, yeah, that would be great. Yeah, there's a lot more that you haven't listened to. And I feel like, you know, you could get a lot by... I'm sure you get a lot of information or education when you listen to these other guys actually living it, right? And I've had, you know, so many guys on with all different kinds of experiences. Some where they're still doing it, you know, secret. Some where they've let their person know.

Some where they got divorced. and the second person that they were with, they let them know, right? I mean, there's just all different people to hear. I don't know what you're, you're still super young, right? A lot of times I find that when guys turn around 50, they're like so sick of keep, you know, if you wind up, keep me in a secret up into them. That's when they're like, that's like the point where they all just like, yeah, they've had it.

They just want to be themselves and they don't care anymore, you know? Yeah. So who knows where you'll be by then or what will happen with you in like five years, you know, but I'm curious of how you'll feel about everything when you eventually do get to the point where you cross the line and do more with a guy, right? Because you sort of kept it, like, in check in a certain place, like I said, a very safe zone for you for all this time, that if you really cross that line, had a dick in your mouth, or you were penetrated or any of that stuff, like, you know, how you would feel after that. And if you do that anytime soon, you want to come on

just talk about it. I'm down. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, I'll definitely, I'll let you know. Yeah, be safe. Keep your stuff hidden. You know, I'll send you an email after this with the link to all my other episodes. So you could get more information, you know, you could hear from more guys because I'm sure that will be helpful for you.

Sure. And if anybody has any, because I know you say that there's not much, there's not many, like, places where you could go or there's not a lot of information out there for you. if anybody that's by that has information for you right they should email me and i'll send it to you right sure yeah awesome to help you sort of navigate through what you're because you're kind of like in the middle of it yeah absolutely yeah i would really appreciate that yeah cool so keep me posted i hope you you know enjoyed yourself um i'm very curious of what you think uh after you listen to this i'll let you know when i'm gonna air it it'll be a little bit because i have like a gazillion taped.

But it'll be soon. And, you know, let me know afterwards how it went. We'll do. Thanks so much for your time. No problem. Thanks for calling in. Take it easy. Bye.

Bye. Okay, I just want to tell you before you go that my book, it's called Strictly anonymous confession, Secret Sex Lives of Total Strangers, is now available not only in paperback and ebook, but you can pre-order the audio book. It's still not going to be out until August 25th, but you can pre-order it. The book is basically 17 different stories taken from my show. I kind of picked one story from each category that I talk about on my show. Like there's a hot wife story. There's a cuck queen story. There's a cuck story. There's a gang being girl story. Like I said, 17 stories. And they're all

told in the third person. And they're all true. I took the interview and rewrote it. in the third person. And I wouldn't really call it like a total erotica book. Think like penthouse letters. It's more direct. It's not so over the top like erotica. I don't really like that kind of vibe, right? But these are true stories. 17 of them. They're really short. Chapters, easy read. You could read, you know, one or two and then skip around. You could read the whole book. It's available in eback format, paperback format, and finally, the audiobook is available. coming out August 25th, but you could pre-order it now. And if you buy my book in any format or pre-order it, I will throw in a complimentary link to my Discord. My Discord does not disappoint. Okay,

there's no way you get into my Discord any other way than getting the link from me. Okay, I give it to people who buy my book. There's tons of people in there. Everybody shares content with each other, and that's what you get to do there. You could post your own pictures and videos. There's tons of channels. We have lots of contests where you can win a lot of money. It's a super fun place to be. It's a total strictly anonymous community and you will love it. I will be giving anyone who buys my book access to my Discord. It's private, like I said. All you got to do is email me a screenshot of your purchase, whether you did the audiobook, the ebook or the paperback. Sent it to me at Strictly Anonymous Podcast at gmail.com. That's strictly anonymous podcast at gmail.com.

and I will send you the link to Discord. So anyway, thanks so much for tuning in. This is the strictly anonymous podcast.